planning board for Monday June 3rd 2024 at 7:30 p.m. announcement is made that adequate notice of this meeting has been given that is being conducted in accordance with njsa 10 Co 4-6 at SEC of the New Jersey open public meetings act nor would you call the role Please Mr matth present Mr Napolitano here Mr Shaw here Mr stanel here chman dmore here we have our board planner Mr Weiser our board engineer Mr kiano and our board attorney Miss Ste all right if we could stand for the Pledge of Allegiance please I Al to the flag of the United States of America and to the rep stands one nation God indivisible with liberty and justice for all all right I'm going to start by announcing that uh application number 24 colon 506 6 20 to 30 ladex urban renewal is going to be carried to what date next Monday June 10th all right this will be your only if you're here for that case this will be your only notice that this is going to happen so that case is going to a special meeting on June 10th normally we would not have a meeting on June 10th but uh it was requested that we have a special meeting so next Monday June 10th we will have that meeting now I have to ask the board for approval of move carrying the the case is there a motion to carry the case to June 10th motion to carry second all in favor I any opposed all right now are there any questions on this because this is your only notice yes is the meeting going to be here yes yes the meeting will be here so not be spoken of at all tonight no there will be nothing you can go home now if you are only here for that okay so 7:30 June 10th here 7:30 June 10th here yes thank you yep are there any other are there any other items that are not on our agenda tonight that anybody of the public any one of the public wishes to speak speak to or bring to the board's attention hearing and seeing none we will move on to our resolution for application number 22 col 532 180 Kingston Road LLC uh who have we got here that can vote for it Matt Shaw Danel and dmore do I hear a motion approving this Mr chairman I make a motion to approve the uh to to approve the resolution for application 23 colon 535 oh that's the wrong one sorry oh this is from last time I'm sorry sorry you're on the list yeah I know 22532 180 Kingston Road LLC yes do I have a second second second all right very good nor would you call the road please matth yes sure yes yes yes all right so we have approved that resolution that brings us to application number 23 col 534 New Jersey Manufacturers insurance company One silen Way block 302 lot 4.1 minor site plan with C variance relief to install a generator I'm assuming you didn't bring your Mas [Music] evening come on good evening my name is deed purcel uh I'm an attorney at Price me Schulman dimino here tonight representing New Jersey Manufacturers Insurance um so njm as you may be aware has been in Paran for quite a long while and is in in the process of moving its offices from 1599 Littleton to one silven way that's the prop property next door to where it currently um has its offices and as part of that move it's filed this application for minor minor site plan approval uh with bulk variance relief to permit it to install a generator on its new site at one silen um and as we're going to talk about that generator is really absolutely necessary for the work that njm does uh as you can imagine if there's a large storm uh there's a lot of people who have a need for or uh to contact their insurance company when there's a large storm a lot of times there's a uh power outages and what this generator does it allows njm to continue its work uh during those events uh this is a pretty straightforward application uh with respect to variances there's a a sidey guard setback variance um there's an imperious coverage variance a fence height variance and a drive a width variance uh tonight we're going to rely on two witnesses Bill vote who's going to provide our engineering testimony and McKinley MZ who will be providing our planning testimony um with that Miss sttinley are we um okay from a housekeeping perspective with our notice um the notices was the notices were fine we can proceive tonight and I think were there any waivers with f um let me a second uh we recommended that the application can be deemed complete there are a number in our report which by the way is dated May 30th um there were a number of items that were listed um as non applicable and we don't object to any of those there were um couple of items that we that where waivers were requested that we uh asked for testimony on one is the uh presence or absence of protective covenants or deed restrictions on the property um we asked for a general description of the proposed development which we're going to get not really a completeness issue per se um we asked for um some information on site illumination and that uh the applicant confirm that no changes to existing are proposed or if there are changes to proposed uh to what's proposed to describe that um and then there's some issues related to the contractors construction uh temporar trailers uh related equipment um but we'll assume that they'll be uh addressing those as part of their affirmative uh presentation okay I'm assuming you will do as the the planer asked correct all right is there a motion to approve the waivers outlined in arh memo arh Associates memo of May 30th do I have a wave motion motion to approve I have a second second ma all right sorry Jer all in favor say I I I any opposed all right sir would you like to swear Mr vote in right now or Miss merch to at the same time or do them separately you can do them separately if you please raise your hand do you swear affirm that the testimony that you're about to give will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I do please state your name spell your last name and provide your address for the record uh sure good evening um my name is William R vote Jr it's viz and Victor o g like girl T like Tom uh I'm one of the owners and principles of l2a Land Design LLC we're located at 66 Grand Avenue in Englewood New Jersey um I have a bachelor's in science and civil engineering from Sunni Buffalo and I'm a licensed professional engineer in both uh the states of New Jersey as well as New York um I've testified uh before the parcion board um on multiple occasions my most recent I have a I think I have four applications in front of your zoning board uh currently Mr chairman I ask that Mr vot be accepted as an expert in engineering any questions about his qualifications hearing and seeing none counselor uh Mr vote you uh drafted the zoning drawings that were submitted to the board that were dated December 6 2023 and last Revis May 1st 2024 is that correct that's correct and uh did you that aerial which is uh I did that's a Google Earth aerial of the subject property I can mark that exhibit A1 correct yep thank you very [Music] much can you review the subject property and the surrounding area to orient the board to the location of the site uh sure so what what I have on the left side is uh just a set of the site plans that were submitted as part of the application uh it's a seven uh page set of plans c01 through c07 they all have revision date number three dated 51 2024 uh the application is for a uh proposed uh backup generator uh at one silven way um this is located at uh this is lot 4.01 found in Block 202 um just for clarification your tax map shows a lot as 4.1 it's incorrect on the tax map uh so we just noted that it should be 4.01 so that's the that's just the discrepancy that um to bring to your attention the property is located in the r the research office and laboratory District um and the subject property is within your Highlands planning area uh we do qualify as uh for an exemption number four we do not exceed the impervious uh coverage that's allotted for that exemption um so that's stated as well in the cover sheet on the on the right hand this is an uh Google Earth aerial exhibit A1 uh it's probably within the last two years it's usually what their aerial photographs are from I have the subject lot uh outlined it's pretty much an L-shaped lot um North is to the right hand side of the page um to the north of the site uh we have silven way uh to the west of the site uh there is uh njm's current location that's 1599 Littleton Road which also has Frontage along Littleton Littleton Road which is uh US Highway 202 to the rear or to the south of the property uh there are other existing commercial properties uh I believe one of the properties uh is currently being developed um right now uh to the east of the subject lot is uh number three and number five s uh silven way those are under the uh same or similar ownership as uh one silven way the site currently has a threeory uh existing commercial building on there um njm current uh is housed in the adjacent property at 1599 Littleton Road they are going to move their offices and their operations to the third floor of one silven way can you talk about the access easements to the property uh sure so access to the subject parcel uh one silven way is off of uh silven way to the north that's a full access driveway um there are also two other uh access points there one Farther Along silven way to the east um that shared through common uh cross access easements uh through three and five silven way and then there is also uh cross access easements through 1599 Littleton roadway that's njm's current property so that uh cars can get out to uh Littleton Road that's a right in right out only driveway off of Littleton because it's a state highway bill could you speak a little bit about the parking situation uh sure um I'm just going to flip to the uh flip to the site and an exhibit A1 was prepared by your office uh yes and what is the date just today's date it's today's date but the arrow photograph is probably from sometime in 22 all right thank you um so I just I just flipped to the site plan that's c-03 so as far as parking um the amount of existing parking spaces on the property is 442 parking spaces that that comprises of 383 surface parking spaces and then there are 59 interior garage spaces that are within one silven way within the building um under proposed conditions um we will be losing five parking spaces for the installation of the backup generator uh we will have a uh total of 437 parking spaces um where 434 parking spaces are required so we're still having excess of three spaces uh for the overall property and Bill could you speak a little bit about the is there an existing generator on the property where in that's located yeah so looking back at the aerial you'll see to the western side of the current uh njm location there's this uh smaller rectangular shape that's along Littleton Road that's their existing uh diesel generator that generator will be relocated to the southwest corner of one silven way uh so just to the back uh left corner of the aerial image there's an existing uh generator that's currently at one silven way uh that Services the existing building and it's for tenant use if they choose to uh need it unfortunately it's it doesn't have enough load capacity for running the operations uh for njm for their entire floor so uh they need to be in operation 247 if you remember Hurricane Sandy they were one of the only businesses uh probably in this area that were operating uh throughout that superstorm so that is the uh that's really the main goal of moving that generator to this new location and it's the same generator it's a 1 Mega uh capacity and it has a 2,000g uh diesel fuel storage tank that sits underneath it now Bill are there any restrictions on the property with respect to the proposed generator use um no there's there's there's no restrictions uh per se um not not that I not that I know of and then it is in the highlands though correct it is in the highlands as you said this proposal would not exceed 125% of the lawfully existing impervious coverage that that existed on the site when the township opted into Highlands which is April 21 2021 is that correct that's correct um can you discuss a little bit more about the generator um uh any you know and maybe talk a little about the transfer switch is uh sure so um what I what I did is I actually prepared another exhibit just to help the board um visually see where the generator is going so if you look on just site plan CO3 I have an enlargement uh that's in the bottom right hand corner um I I'll mark this as uh exhibit A2 [Music] and what sheet was that from again it's from c-03 thank you so all I did was I expanded uh that enlargement I made it actually bigger so the board could see it um it's at five scale um and the only thing I did is I added color uh to help uh distinguish for purposes of testimony um does this have a a date on on that it has the same date as the set ofite plans it's revision three dated 5124 okay thank you so the uh proposed location of the generator again is going to be in that back uh southwest corner of the property uh currently what's there is uh an existing trash enclosure um we're going to create a brand new concrete pad for both the trash enclosure and for the uh backup generator the proposed pad for the backup generator uh will measure in width it's 23.5 ft in width and it is 43 ft in length and the trash enclosure pad is approximately 24 ft in length and 18 ft in width because of the grade change between the two properties um directly behind us is where uh Spencer uh Savings Bank is um that grade's a little bit lower than us it varies between 3 and 6 fet lower so the proposed concrete pad will act as a retaining a small retaining wall uh to keep the pad flat to the parking side of one silven way so we will have a a small exposed wall on the western side of the property uh between a foot and 2 foot 8 in what we're doing to enclose the um generator is we're going to build a sound attenuation wall um the sound attenuation wall uh will be required to be a minimum of 1 foot taller than the height of the actual generator that will uh block and attenuate the sound down to the uh required noise levels at the property line because of the location of the proposed generator we are very close to the side property line um I am uh the generator is at 9.82 FT and we're required to be at 25 ft um but out of all of the locations on the property this is the uh the best location um it also in proximity to the other existing generator that's approximately 58 ft to the north of the site it's in an area of the parking lot that is underutilized it's farthest away from the building you can tell from the aerial photographs that most of the parking is directly um in back or to the south of one silen way and as you uh go out to the West you can see that the spaces open up and there are very few cars that are back in that southwest corner bill can you talk a little a little bit about the transfer switches that are going to be proposed uh sure so when the lines get fed into the existing building they will go into an existing utility room that's on the ground floor of one silen way it'll go into a panel um those switches will have a transfer switch if if the if the power goes out that basically that switch gets thrown and it brings power from the generator to the panels that feed the build so it's should be a seamless transition between when there's a power outage um so we will uh add some notes to the plan uh regarding that um to also refer to the MEP plans that are going to be submitted as part of your uh building permit applications um just so that uh those two will marry to each other you just want to make a note of that just that so we're going to add the um the transfer switches to the plans to be approved by the or know the board will approve and as compliance will have the transfer switches we're telling you now um just the reason being is that you know njm is currently getting it fit out approvals for uh one silven and um this really needs to be approved the the even though the transfer switches are going to be in the building this really should be approved as part of this application and not the construction permit process the building permit process that's happening um with the fit out so I just want to make a note for the record on that um Bill how often will the gener be exercised uh sure it's typically it's once every 2 weeks for roughly 20 minutes and it's during working business hours so it it won't be disruptive to any you know non- business hours it won't run on the weekends for testing um so that that is the uh the current schedule is to uh operate uh once every two weeks or 20 minutes uh during working hours okay and has an acoustical analysis been done yes we did have an acoustic analysis done um that's why we're showing the uh enclosure on three sides of the generator and that's what uh distinguishes the height of the sound wall above it that was a report prepared by Lewis s goodfriend Associates dated January 30th 2024 that's correct and what that report shows is is that the generate that the generator will not exceed um the decel limitation set forth by the njd p and that's uh 65 DB that's correct at the property one okay and the copy of the report was provided to the board correct that's correct are there any external lights on the compound for the generator we are relying on all of the existing uh parking lot lighting that's currently oper in operation in the parking lot the only fixtures that are on the enclosure are the existing ones uh and they are at both of the uh access doors and they are just for Life Safety they are small um standard light fixtures uh just to illuminate the doorway uh egress and Ingress and this those lights will be blocked from views off property by the by the sound wall correct that's correct that's correct one one will face the sound wall to the west and the other would face into the parking lot and it would have no impact on the ambient light uh provided by the uh parking uh lighting are there any external that question will there be any ground disturbances or excavations uh yes um we will just be disturbing this area uh for the construction of both the concrete pad for the generator as well as the trash enclosure I'm going to remove three uh existing pine trees that are just uh directly behind or to the West I did speak with um with your Forestry Department um and to typically what they uh said is if I could find room to just put back a few uh Green Giant Arbor to help screen the exposed portion of that concrete wall and again that concrete wall is only 1 foot to roughly 3 feet tall um so just to screen that they uh they are looking at the sound wall itself as screening for the um gen generator and NJ would agree to that is that correct yes uh and then as far as a square footage it's 200 square feet additional improv coverage is that right yes if you uh if you see um the pad extends just a about about a foot and a half behind the existing curve line uh in order to get my clearances uh from the generator to that sound wall so I'm adding uh 200 square ft of new impervious coverage it's the Minimus um but we did add it to the table to uh show the coverage calculation so um so the maximum uh percent lot coverage uh for impervious coverage permitted for the zone is 70% what we currently have is 80.3% and then with that additional 200 square foot I'm going to be at 80.3 8% so slightly more but um the Minimus in in my opinion and Bill does the proposed generator impact site circulation or any other consideration of site plan approval uh no it it won't we we again we kept it in an area the lot that's uh fairly underutilized um we we are slimming down the uh Drive AIS uh between the generator and the head- in parking directly opposite and it's just to get in the protective ballards that surround the generator I still will maintain a driveway width of at least 22 fet um that's sufficient for backing up of of the maybe four or five cars that are opposite um the generator and it still provides ample width for any Vehicles emergency vehicles to uh Traverse the site typically a fire truck uh required to have 20 foot uh in in width um for their circulation and Bill could you reviews can you review the variances required sure um so again the uh I had the impervious coverage variance uh that I just uh went over um it's 70% permitted existing 80.3 proposed 8.38 the um the sidey yard setback for accessory buildings is uh required is 25 ft currently the existing generator is at 7.1 ft and then our proposed generator is at 9.82 FT so it's farther away than the existing one um but still a variance okay the last one is the minimum side and rear yard fence or Wall height uh what's permitted in the zone is 6 ft in height um currently we're at 6 ft um and we're going to increase that to 15.83% [Music] to add in another two you know two 2 and 1/2 ft roughly on there so that's where I'm getting to the 15.83% I have please go over that [Music] sure okay um were were there any ones in particular that you wanted me or just go through go through the the comments and your response okay um okay so the first one was the applicant should provide testimony regarding generator operation proposed location of the generator I think we stated that uh previously um applicant should provide testimony regarding the status of the existing generator adjacent to and to the north of the proposed generator uh again I I did uh go through that in my testimony um we are removing uh it says four trees in here it's actually three trees um and we're going to replace them with the arbor uh number four is testimony regarding the setback Wall height AC acoustical function and proposed generator sound wall barrier uh I believe I went through that um in detail with the board if there's any questions I'll be sure to happy to answer them and then number five the new generator will reduce the parking space Count by Five spaces the plans indicate that the site currently contains 442 parking spaces uh the required parking is uh is 434 spaces and the new Total will be 437 spaces again I went through that in my testimony uh and there was a was there a reference or a question about Belgium Block uh yes we changed the detail out to the uh the more robust uh rsis standard that's a residential site Improvement standards for the Belgian block that's that's not an issue it's already shown on the plans okay and Bill have you reviewed the board Engineers May 28 2024 memorandum I have and do you have anything to add that wasn't already addressed in the response to no I I I think the comments were all very fair and we can address uh any of the comments that are in either the engineers or the planner letter and njam agrees to all the conditions of approval set forth in that memorandum that's correct and then um with respect to the um staging of the construction and um the you know any temporary trailers could you speak to that there was a question uh sure I mean it it's all going to be done in one phase um njm is again they're moving to this new location they have to have this generator and their trash area in operation before they move in uh so it will be constructed um you know diligently and and and on time um if we do plan some staging areas I I would think we would use the again the underutilized parking in the existing lot this would be more towards South uh end of the property we would also relocate temporarily the trash enclosure uh again to that that that southern side of the property I think that's the most appropriate um uh for this location okay um thank you Bill Mr chairman that's all I have for this witness going I ask our engineer if he has any questions or no he covered all my questions very good the members of the board or have any questions I have one yes sir thank you Mr chairman uh thank you for Testimony just want to clarify something uh in one of the plans here I think it's uh co uh C3 I think and then is at the very bottom number 19 ongoing routine generator maintenance and test operation shall be performed during the day on Saturdays you you mentioned that it happens during normal business hours yes I I did notice that note it's it's incorrect that's on there it's a leftover note from uh we we did the original generator um or or portions of the original generator it's probably a leftover note from that okay so it's I do apologize no it's during the week Monday through Friday Friday every two every two weeks you got it and roughly how much fuel is used in one those tests it's a 200000 gallon tank um I can find out I don't know I don't know refueling doesn't need refueling that often then it it wouldn't not for the normal testing operations you know they'll they'll check it you know quarterly they'll they'll be under our main contract with I think it's Cummins um is the uh is the rep so they they come out and do a quarterly inspection and probably after every major storm event they come out again appreciate it thank you uh Mr meth uh two questions so first on the platform itself with the enclosures there's going to be no drop off open drop offs of more than two and a half feet correct that's correct okay number two you said 22 ft was sufficient for a vehicle backing up because I'm more familiar that 23 ft is the minimum required for a 90° turn uh well actually 24 is really the standard for for for a drive aisle um but with with I can certainly show a truck turning or car turning uh maneuver on there I I I can assure you that 22 ft is is more than fici for again these are we're talking about five potentially five parking spaces that may or may not be used so it's basically backing up to ballards it's backing up correct it's yeah well I think 23 is the actual Dimension if you take the design vehicle and then but they make it 24 for rounding um all right your three spaces over correct correct so if you took three of those spaces out extended that Island ripped them out and vegetated them you'd be able to eliminate your your impervious coverage variants uh if it's you're adding 200 feet correct if it's 200 square foot um yeah probably three spaces would would make the numbers balanced okay I mean I would I would suggest you do that just so that a we're not increasing impervious for a site that's already over impervious and B taking out three spaces that you're over on anyway that potentially are um not quite meeting our dimensions for 90° turns so so we we would agree to that to if so the the the question is would we agree to take um some of our additional parking spaces and turn them into extend the P the uh Grass Island um so we would just need to talk to the landlord and you know get that approved and then obviously we would have to have your board engineer approve that but that is something that we would um stipulate to okay so you're talking about the spaces that would back up to the generator not the little correct okay take out three of the spaces that have a substandard aisle your thoughts pH just right to the right to the right of that tree aisle it would be these three here um I I understand the balancing uh for the impervious coverage none of the storm water that's that's produced by this 200 foot is going off site it's all being directed back into the parking lot into the existing uh drainage facility I personally don't like to eliminate excess parking on a on a site um you never know what the change of tenant uh and climate is uh moving forward um I would prefer to keep the three spaces it's a DI Minimus amount of of impervious coverage we are adding uh vegetation back um I in my opinion it's more detrimental to get rid of those spaces than to than to put the green space in there if I if this was a bigger development I would understand uh your view of it I personally respectfully disagree with that um that's my opinion all right okay Stuart did you have any because he commented on some of the planning yeah I would like if I could just to confirm some of the things that I thought I heard um bear with me a second um so I know you spoke did you speak to any protective covenants or deed restrictions uh there's none that I am aware of other than the highlands planning area Okay um and those access uh cross access easements for Ingress and egress and part Market um you spoke to lighting uh you just spoke to easements there are board members an a couple of uh pre-existing non-conformities that aren't being caused or made worse by this application they're listed in our report um no easements are impacted At All by this development not that I know um are there going to be any changes to signage uh no signage is part of this [Music] application you spoke to the trash enclosures um for the sound wall proposed colors and materials to be used sure so there if you look on the uh on the plans uh on the last sheet there's a deta ta uh they're going with a system called quiet line it's a steeled uh panel with an acoustical membrane inside uh that steel panel is Galvanized and then it's powdercoated uh we're going to uh there's there's basically five five or six standard colors uh we're we're choosing a tan color so it Blends in uh with the landscape around it [Music] um and again like I like I testified to that that wall is roughly about 13 1/2 ft tall it's it's got to be a minimum 1T taller than the existing or the proposed uh generator height which is 11 foot 9 in okay um I would leave the satisfaction of that finish to the board um but that's all we have sure any other members of the board have any further questions are members of the public will have questions on this testimony at this time hearing and seeing none I think I have one more uh you're leaving the old one the old Generator or is that going to be removed yes this this is this this is staying the exist still going to be operating yes oh all right correct why not get rid of that and put build we what Bill testified with is that doesn't provide adequate capacity for njm so that so they both be operation that's correct okay is a lot of power huh well this the existing generator is uh is offered to the existing tenants that are in the building so in order for njm to operate on a full floor for 247 operation for everything that goes on in their in their company they need the same generator that they currently are utilizing good thank you all right actually I have a a couple of small questions sure uh if you could at least briefly go over some of the safety features to prevent spillage of diesel fuel uh and other such things um sure I mean this this will all be handled in the building department application it has to fall it has to follow all of the current regulations uh but there is a 2,000g uh tank that sits on the ground it's it's uh it has uh alarms that are associated with it it has um it's at least a dual wall if not more um there is um I can get the complete specs and I'm just looking for a summary I mean that's that's pretty much it uh you know the concrete pad underneath concrete pad underneath um spill containment uh is all within the within the pan uh of that 2,000g uh container and again it's the current uh one that is in operation right now so we're going to empty that one and bring it over inspect it make sure everything is Tip Top and then reinstall that thing again okay so you're gonna leave the old one without a a the old the old one is not under my control that that is that is owned by the property owner and offered to their tenants okay very good no fuel no fuel for it eh I think we have a maximum of 800 gallons in this town so I'm not I I know we usually allow them to have the 2,000 gallons and maybe the it depends on whether it's in a oper area ah okay uh just to go back you know with respect to the impervious coverage discussion yes um so obviously I think there's a if the board really demands that that be done I think njm would consider it um I think it would prefer not to do that uh given the dious nature of the corious coverage increase only 200 ft but you know certainly curious to get some feedback from the board on that we'll have some further discussions about that as we go along okay all right any other questions any members of the public have any questions hearing and seeing none counselor you can move on okay your next wit thank you uh next witness is McKinley Merz a planer [Music] you please raise your right hand you swear affirm that the testimony that you're about to give will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth I please state your name spell your last name and for your address for the record business address is 236 Broad Street in Red Bank New Jersey m m can you go over your qualifications and experience sure I made principal planner at higher buul and Associates again we're out of Red Bank New Jersey I have a master's in city and Regional tring from Ruther University I've been qualified as an expert in front of uh several boards across New Jersey uh closest to here would be Lane uh Branchburg I also serve as a board Planner on approximately 10 different boards the party Township and the Providence I've also been a front of the New Jersey Superior Court regarding affordable housing Mees Mr chairman I ask that Miss mer to be accepted as an expert planning any question on the uh Witnesses qualifications hearing and seeing none M Merz can you go over the surrounding area and the Zoning for the site sure the engineer testified to it so I'll go briefly uh but we are in the research office and laboratory Zone the RO Zone all of the properties as can be seen on that area to our Northwest and East are in the same Zone the properties to the south of us are in the Special Economic Development District 10 Zone with a single parcel directly south which is towards the uh lower left corner of that aerial that is in the affordable housing District 3A Zone I believe that is currently under construction which with what I would assume is a residential development uh based on the based on the zoning uh the property is 5.76 Acres it is developed with the existing three-story masonry uh building that's currently occupied by other office tenants the other buildings surrounding us with the exception of the property under construction uh are developed with other uh Office Park type developments and and tenants thank you P can you go over the Zoning for the site and then need variances sure the R zone does permit professional uh and business offices njm which already exists in the parcel to the West there will be situated in the subject property which is a permitted use uh the proposed uh generator is a permitted accessory use as it's customary and incidental to permitted office use uh as your planner indicated and was in his report we have a few existing non-conforming condition conditions just for the benefit of the record uh those would be uh lot WID at building setback line is required to be 300 ft where the existing lot is 23684 Ft the sidey yard setback for the principal building which again we are not touching that's remaining as is uh that is required to be 50t setback for one sidey yard 100 ft for both where we have a uh one of our side yard seic is only 30.1 ft combined making that 84.4 ft uh for the side yard setc for accessory uses which the engineer testified to for the existing uh generator that we are not touching that is required to be 25 ft where that exists at 7.1 ft the new variances requested uh again side yard setback for accessory use our new accessory use required to be 25 F feet we're at 9.82 FT from the sidey yard seac that shares the property line with the bank to the West uh the discussion we just had with impervious coverage uh we're required to 70% is the limit where 80.3% exists and we're increasing that by 8% or 200 square ft uh the Wall height for our sound barrier is permitted at 6 feet proposed as calculated in the way the engineer described we are at 15.83% above the height of the generator itself and finally the drve vial width which again we've been discussing the ordinance requires us at 24 feet with those protective ballards we are just under I believe the engineers report called it out at 1.4t deficient so closer to 22 ft and it's my opinion that all of these can be justified under the C2 flexible variants uh per the municipal land use law this one's also known as the benefits bir detriments variant whereas granting the benefits would outweigh any potential detriments associated with them uh so to run through that positive criteria quickly we are a permitted accessory use that's associated with a permitted principal use on the subject property uh in terms of the setback variance as the engineer talked about at length we really do feel this location is the most appropriate given the site uh that it's ex already developed it's this parking lot is existing the buildings existing we feel it's pushed back as far we can for safety reasons but also to allow as little uh encroachment into the parking area if we were to pull that away from the side Lot line to meet that 25 ft we would be disrupting many more parking spaces as well as a much greater length of the drive aisle so this is preserving the maximum parking spaces feasible I know we are talking about perhaps eliminating three more however even if we were to eliminate those three we'd still be within uh the required parking count if we were to pull this away uh to meet the 25 ft we would absolutely trigger a parking variance by having to eliminate additional additional parking spaces uh as to the sound barrier the height of the barrier uh this has been calculated to again screen the barrier I'm sorry screen the generator to the extent necessary but it's also providing an aesthetic barrier um for the most part we do have other commercial neighbors but they are developing a residential development to our South so this will provide not only a sound attenuation but also a visual screening of the generator itself and um that height is necessary to achieve both of those functions uh as to the coverage uh again I know we're the board is debating about asking us to eliminate that variance uh but but should we continue to require that um I would argue and I think one of the board members mentioned it really is a DI Minimus uh uh deviation that we have here 8% or 200 square F feet um and additionally we've agreed to coordinate with the Forester to replace trees to help offset um depending on how your deliberation goes we may be able to to gain some of that back if if if you please uh as to the drive aisle with the engineer testified that the 22 ft that will be in existence for those five spaces is sufficient for a backup uh again we're at the Far Far corner of the property where it's the least desirable places to park uh I did a site visit on May 23rd which was a Thursday right around 4:00 uh the was really right before everybody was leaving work there were enough cars in the parking area to Edge them back to that corner but the area surrounding uh the the proposed generator site as well as the the dumpsters back there really was devoid of of cars completely so it again uh we do not see that as a major issue but it would allow those parking spaces to be there should should they be needed in the future uh as to the uh the second half of the C2 uh testimony we're required to prove that the purposes of the Municipal Landes law will be Advanced by these deviations I know this is every board's favorite part so I'll speak quickly um we believe it advances purpose a which is to guide the appropriate use or development of all lands that will promote the public health safety morals and general welfare I think this is the most important one as was testified to this generator is needed for emergency purposes for life saving measures for njm uh We've referred to Sandy already they they've been in this location for quite some time and when Sandy had did not shut down once uh these storms are becoming quite a bit more frequent as we all know so we want to make sure that they can stay in pany and be able to function should another one of these storms hit at this point it's not even should it's when another storm hits uh so it really is going to continue to promote that that public health and safety uh additionally purpose G which is to provide sufficient space in appropriate locations for a variety of uses uh njm is a long-term tenant here they are permitted tenant and by allowing uh allowing them to build their generator where we are proposing they're going to continue to be able to stay at the one silen way office complex here and finally I to promote a desirable visual environment uh we are again this the generator is a necessity but we're doing everything we can to help Shield it um between the sound barrier itself adding adding the additional trees that the Forester has requested and cleaning up the refu and recycling area over there to make it generally more pleasing uh from a visual perspective as to the negative criteria we have to demonstrate that granting these variances will not substantially impair uh or substantially create a detriment to the public good or the township zoning plan uh the Township's 2020 master plan notes that the RO Zone uh is designed to Encompass large scale office and Manufacturing businesses again njm needs the generator to function so this will allow them to continue to stay stay in pany uh the we are proposing improvements to an already developed site where we need to work around the existing uh the existing layout and improvements the generator again is a permitted use will support a permitted principal use and will be screened from neighboring properties uh while we're reducing the parking count we're still within the required uh parking spaces number so we're not uh causing any detriment to the parking itself uh and finally uh the proposed generator will and its enclosure will have very little impact on the surrounding site I doubt anyone will even notice it once it's there I I didn't notice the existing one until I really got got right up close to it during when I was visiting the site uh and just generally the existing non-conforming conditions again as you guys heard all of those conditions are related to the shape of the property um we're not changing anything but just uh to be prudent I would argue that those all of those existing non-conforming conditions would fall under the C1 hardship variants where we don't have the capacity to expand the site and it's been in existence for for quite some time so your opinion that the board to Grant minor site plan approval with arange relief yes it is thank you Mr chairman that's all I have for mckin why I I really other than what I have uh spoken about earlier I have nothing to add I think the positive uh negative criteria are sufficiently before you all right the members of the board have any questions on this testimony at this time hearing and seeing none Mr kiano do you have any yeah I just wanted to add thinking about Mr M's comment about the concern with a vehicle standard siiz vehicle uh backing out to a non-standard Zone I mean it looks like you don't you're allowed in the zone to have compact spaces for employee vehicles um which is a 16t deep parking stall um it looks like from the 15 conditions you don't have you definitely don't have the uh looks like most of the spaces if not all are standard uh one suggestion would be to uh label those and redo your parking table based on having five compact part car spaces at that location just a suggestion the uh okay yeah the ordinance allows it it's a section 430 275 yeah for compact spaces so we'd have five so four 4 were required we have 437 so you're saying take five of the existing yeah this still counts toward the parking count you're allowed to have a certain number of 25% of your parking count to be compact spaces clearly this is nowhere near 25% so you uh you know you'll meet the requirement uh of that I just yeah again it's a suggesting that you don't if if you could avoid the variant for uh drive by or Lea and yet you know it' be limited to smaller vehicles that that that uh that can navigate that turn better Bill do you have any comments on that I I don't have any issues with that I would just uh say I would have to check the interior spaces to see if there are any compact spaces in there um I don't think I'll be anywhere close to the 25% but um I would just like to leave that as a something we need to uh just find out and present that on the revised plans you would agree to work with our engineer on making sure that this is properly cared for if if we make that part of it a condition of uh approval that would be fine I think it's a very good suggestion right so we should ask for the relief now in case you can't do the compact space correct yeah correct yeah with the provisa that if you can do it you will do it correct and you'll work with our with Mr kiano on making sure that it's done right that's correct good great okay any other questions from members of the board there any questions from members of the public hearing and seeing none counselor um thank you Mr chairman this is a pretty straightforward application um as McKinley stated it makes planning sense to place a generator at the edge of the property and not you know with a not right middle of the property in the middle of a developed um uh parking lot um the impervious coverage increase really is quite di minimouse is necessary um the driveway aisle width doesn't particularly impact circulation and it's if we can make the um uh changes to to Mark these for smaller cars as suggested by your engineer that certainly would would be helpful but certainly we've set forth the positive and negative criteria that's necessary for uh these variances I ask the board to approve the variances uh along with approving site plan approval all right there any members of the public who wish to speak in support of or in opposition to this application hearing and seeing none this closes the evidentiary portion of tonight's hearing is there a desire to go into conference or is somebody willing to move the motion Mr sha Mr chairman I like to make a motion to move um application number 23 534 New Jersey Manufacturers insurance company 17 way block 202 lot 4.1 minor site plan variance to install a generator approve and steinley do we have any uh there were a couple conditions agreed to that the transfer switches notes will be added to the plans that the applicant agrees to address the comments and concerns in the board Engineers report um that the applicant will work with the Township parks and Forestry um to install the Landscaping of green giant Arbor VY to screen the concrete wall um and the last one was was about the compact parking spaces that um the applicant will work with the board engineer to confirm the labeling of those five parking SP spaces across from the generator building to um the compact if that's feasible we'll proceed to do that [Music] yeah Theon Nora would you call the role please math yes Theon yes yes yes all right thank you very much [Music] so you can contact Nora for the details of when it's going to be uh memorialized and so forth move on all right that brings us to our next case I assume everybody's more than happy to continue sitting and move forward from here that brings us to application number 24 503 si6 Sven LLC preliminary and final site plan for Block 202 lot 1.9 uh for construction of a health and fitness club parking deck outdoor pool landscaping and driveway improvements on the south parcel and 280 unit multifam inclusionary residential building with Park garage parking amenities and site improvements on the North Parcel [Music] [Music] all set Mr chairman I am good evening Mr chairman members of the board board professionals and the public uh my name my name is John engino partner with the law firm of engino Taylor we're here tonight on behalf of the applicants Cano pipany urban renewal LLC and Sig silven Club urban renewal LLC uh the property which is the subject of this application is located at sixsen way it consists of approximately 18 Acres there is currently an obsolete vacant 200,000 squ ft office building on this site which was vacated by Avis uh both applicants are designated redevelopers for their respective portions of the property which is the subject of this application both application both applicants are seeking preliminary and final subdivision approval and both applicants are seeking preliminary and final major site plan approval from the board to approve their respective projects uh the subject property is identified as block 202 lock 1.9 I think the tax record say lot 1.09 I spoke with Dan ciss he says it's lot 1.9 uh the property is located in the silven way Redevelopment area and the application is submitted pursuant to the Township's Redevelopment plan for the silverway silven way Redevelopment area and consistent with the signed Redevelopment agreements the proposed subdivision will create two lots uh the first lot will be 1.91 we refer to that as the uh South parcel uh and it's approximately 8.93 acres in size the second lot which will be lot 1.92 will be referred to as the North Parcel and that's about 9.71 Acres the overall project uh consists of the removal of the office building pavement and other obsolete improvements on the site virtually virtually all of the improvements are within the existing developed area of the subject property we do get uh 10,000 square ft of additional area uh to be exempt from the highlands which which we're uh utilizing you'll hear testimony that the Redevelopment of the site for this application will improve the property from an environmental perspective over its current conditions uh last year based on the unanimous recommendation uh of this board uh the town Council declared the property to be an area in need of Redevelopment approved comprehensive Redevelopment plan and approved Redevelopment agreements with both applicants uh there are numerous public actions that have been taken regarding this project and just so it's in the record just want to enter into the records the Redevelopment agreements uh and Redevelopment plan um as A1 and ke kind of enough to supply that with uh with Nora um for distribution to the board now um with regard to the South parcel um the property owner and the applicant designated Sig silven seek site plan approval for the construction of a twostory approximate 103,000 squ ft luxury health and fitness club to be occupied by LifeTime Fitness pursuant to a lease agreement a separate Parking Deck with 393 parking spaces is proposed to the east of the health club but for the health club's use uh and on the uh on the south parcel and there'll be additional improvements uh which you'll hear about as well including an outdoor pool Landscaping uh driveway improvements Etc with regard to the North Parcel Cano who was an affiliate of Avalon Bay communities Inc as you know a public company Who develops owns and manages luxury apartment communities throughout New Jersey and many other states that for those Avalon Bay well Cano is the designated redeveloper and applicant for the North Parcel uh Cano is also the contract purchaser for the nor North Parcel and Cano sees preliminary and major final site plan approval for the construction of a 280 unit multifam inclusionary residential building now the affordable housing units from the project help rep place a proposed but never constructed inclusionary development at the former Kmart building located at 808 Route 46 uh the Kmart site was included in the Township's 2019 housing element and fair share plan and it was included in the Township's midpoint review dated June 25th 2020 however uh the developer uh of the Kart site s opted to do a retail facility at the location uh hence the need for uh the Cano project from an affordable housing perspective to keep parip in compliance with its obligations from the third round in that regard uh additional amenities and improvements are proposed including a private parking garage uh you will you will hear testimony that these improvements are permitted by and consistent with the Redevelopment plan uh with very limited deviation uh the Cano property will have Ingress and egress to and from silven way uh via an access agreement with Sig silven uh that easement has been prepared it's been agreed to by the parties it will be executed at their closing it'll be recorded with the Morris County clerk's office we can make those representations uh I'll share it with uh Marina for her review uh and approval we could probably do that even during the course of these hearing so it's incorporated into the approval wouldn't even be a condition uh we do have a few waivers that are being requested uh those are referenced in AR's completeness and Technical review report dated May 20th of 2024 and uh Cano was seeking um or requesting a slight deviation regarding minimum parking s Silman is requesting a deviation or sign design waiver potentially regarding the uh parking garage servicing Lifetime Fitness uh and I know there'll be some discussion about a request for a deviation regarding the sidewalk on silven way uh we've received uh several review letters uh just to make sure that we're all on the same page here um just like to call them out we have the uh planners uh completeness and Technical review number two by arh dated May 20th of this year uh we have the plannner completeness and Technical review number one the arh dated April 9th of this year we have the GPI review letter dated April 29th of this year we have the fire protection subcode report dated April 18th of this year we have the sewer utility report dated March 19th of this year we have the ppan Troy Hill fire department district 6 letter uh dated March 12th of this year received today um and then we have the water department memo dated May 24th of this year um we've also submitted our plans to several outside agencies including moris County planning board Mo Morse County Soil Conservation uh the D again it's our view and I I'm sure Mr weiser's going to come in on this is that we're exempt from Highlands count Council review uh because we're disturbing less than 10,000 uh Square ft uh or less than a quarter of acre in new impervious coverage um Mr chairman we always appreciate Advanced receipt of your professionals comprehensive reports uh so as usual to be more efficient we'll try to incorporate uh in our affirmative testimony uh you know to cover those issues that are raised uh in those reports to make this as efficient as possible now we have seven Witnesses uh for this application but something tells me we're not going to hear all of them this evening but you know you never know um so first we have uh the project engineer Mario anelli um he is our civil engineer from dubery and second we have our traffic engineer Andrew fisho uh from Stonefield engineering and design they are going to testify as to the site as a whole um because the civil engineering and the traffic kind of lens itself to the site as a whole uh and then there'll be you know architectural testimony with regard to both the Avalon or Cano project and the lifetime project we'll have separate testimony on the garage uh that I referenced that is on the uh on on the uh the South parcel or lifetime uh and then we also have uh our planner uh Paul greel who will provide testimony with regard to uh the deviations uh we do have representatives from uh Sig Property Owners uh representative here Rich travalini we have a cancel representative here Ron Liddell from Avalon Bay and we have some representatives from Lifetime Fitness in case any issues arise uh concerning uh those entities uh so without any further Ado Mr chairman I'd like to call our engineer oh we're going to get to the waivers here just ask a quick question is the gym for the people are going to live in this building or this open to the public the gym is open to the public um obviously there's some Synergy between the uh uh the Avalon Bay product type and the proximity to the gym so there's there's a natural Nexus there but this is a 103,000 sqt Lifetime Fitness uh it will be open to the public um it's not unlike uh their one down in uh Bridgewater if you've ever had a chance to beat there or go online and look at it and I think you'll see that it's a it's a state-of-the-art full service uh just making sure was it exclusive to the to the no no no no no this is uh this is open to the public so uh chairman as usual you are correct um let's go to the waivers and and the highlands Council and the highlands exemption so uh thank you Mr chairman as uh Council has indicated our report um was submitted report number two May 20 20th um we are recommending that the application be deemed complete uh there are number of waivers that are requested um there was a general description that we requested that we I think we've just heard um there are a number of other items that um let me go through floor plans for existing and proposed buildings they've given us the floor plans for the proposed the existing buildings are going to be um demolished same for the signs same for utilities uh site illumination a number of those things the ex they'll I'm sure go through uh the demolition uh program as well as the um the uh the development program um we requested a number of we def requested that rather than it be a strict waiver that it be deferred to testimony for a number of items I'm sure we'll get into that as well um other than that uh there's some issues related to the map filing law as well as um statements for the t uh for the township engineer regarding utilities all of those we would request uh become a condition of approval uh so the bottom line is we do believe that this application can be deemed complete and uh we also as uh prompted by Mr engino we do have a determination from Christine winter who is the Township's um Highlands uh professional cert certified professional that this development is EXA okay is there a motion to approve the waivers outlined in the arh memo of May 20th 2024 I'll make a motion for that thank youo I have a second second Mr stanel very good all in favor I I any opposed okay all yours please raise your right hand do you swear or affirm the testimony that you're about to give will be the truth the whole truth and nothing but the truth yes please state your name spell your last name and provide your address for the record um good evening my name is I don't think so last meeting we got to speak a little louder into that one first for me um my name is marel Elli um I'm an associate vice president with duberry uh manager of the land development services uh my address is 600 parity Road parity New Jersey um I can go into my qualifications I've been in front of this board before it's been a while but I've been F of this board um your license is still valid yes uh and you've I mean we offer him as an expert in civil engineering I unless you want the whole B deer I know Mr Rell has been before the board before I any anybody want the whole thing any questions about the men's qualifications to present before us hearing and seeing none C all right Mr Ryan Ellie could you kindly describe the civil engineering aspects of this project for the board sure um I do have copies of the exhibits requested to bring them want me to people want to see the exhibits we've got we've got a stack of papers like and this is only half of them we thought it would might be beneficial for the board to have 11 by 17s of the of the exhibit so do we have that one in here yeah yeah so here what's that that one's not in here it should have beened did you hand [Music] to I think it's on the volume somebody M okay go this button here this is on down view actually if you're going to go speak at the exhibits me hand these out I'm going to hand out packets of the exhibits for the site and also the rendering [Music] thanks so so this would be a should we just want these as A2 yeah that's fine thank you thank you than and Mr if you can just describe briefly what's in A2 for everybody I will can we get one more copy over here [Music] so the packet I just handed out to contains a number of exhibits I'll just explain to them really really quick uh the first one is ex hb11 that is an aerial of the existing site ex hb2 is a large scale aerial of the site or [Music] blowup c106 is in your packet we just colorize the subdivision C 103 is in the packet we just added some highlights and some photos to the site w101 is a Wetlands transition area that's pending at the D w102 is reparan Zone area plan w102 that is a plan that depicts the repairing zones of the site uh C15 it's a fire lane sketch through coordination with your code [Music] official and also I think that's it for now so so I the now correct so we're going to start with the existing site on the left there you have ex hb02 aerial of the site so what you can see from the aial the site is that this it's roughly 18 Acres I'm highlighting the white line that represents the prop on the left the sil way on the right North is to your right is where the existing ball fields are and you can see the existing building and the existing parking lot highlighted and you can see the scope and magnitude of the existing improvements um the site constraints on the right with the approximate size of the building Pro size is about 30,000 ft footprint and about 190,000 50,000 ft footprint 190,000 foot total approxim um the existing site has um as you can see [Music] roughly the existing site has roughly 749 parking spaces and the existing condition or about 6 Acres of pavement the site on the right I'm going to refer to some of the constraints that's uh kind of important to understand it's c103 again this is silv way running along the front here you have a stream that's running in the front that drains from the left down the page which is in the easterly direction and then on the right hand side you have the uh portion of Mirror Pond if you which is located to the uh I would say the east or Northeast of the site so what I'm trying to represent here if you look at these two exhibits next to each other is is that the site is predominantly developed in its existing condition uh except for the northern portion of the site which is wooded and has recreational fields and you can also see from the exhibit on the right 103 that the site is encumbered on both south and north of the site if you look closely at the uh c103 the green highlighted area that I'm showing here which is in front of the building if you look to the left which is ex hd12 you can see the existing stream that's running along parallel silver way what I'm representing on c103 is the Blue Line you see there is the FL that's associated it's right now it's at D and it's pending review um because of the that the type of stream and uh how steep the stream is the flood way in that location the flood plane in that location is actually equivalent to the flood way so the floodway because of the uh the when we model the site the DP is basically requiring us to expand the floodway to be the entire flood plane now just for a little bit of background your flood plane and your flood way your floodways are very highly regulated area within the flood plane rules and your flood plane which is really the flood Fringe is outside the flood plane but within the flood area so when you're in the flood way it becomes very highly restrictive to what you can do in there so when you what we did is we we remodeled it we noticed that the flood way is actually going over the Culver roughly a little under a foot um so the whole front of the site along silven way is encumbered by this flood way for the most part now it does tail off as you get to the West you can see the red line kind of peels off the blue but from here which is the Western Property Line Southwestern property line all the way to the Southeast corner of the site the floodway and the flood plane coincides so also that highlighted in green is the repairing Zone that repairing zone is a buffer 50 fot on the banks of that stream which is regulated and to protect vegetation to promote water quality that currently is 100% for the most part maintainable except for the area of the channel and by the culber so that area is like most office parks are maintained lawn and ideally from a DP perspective that does not promote good water quality because you know they want you to protect within 50 ft of the streams to enhance the landscaping and you'll hear more about that so along Sven way we have a reparan buffer that's encumbering the site and we also have a flood way and a flood plane if you look at the photos that I inserted on Photo one and photo two you can see especially photo two you can see that the two entrance ways at John just referred to there's two access points back to the aial there's an existing two-way driveway on the northeast corner and I'm sorry the southeast corner and also one on the southwest corner those uh driveways go over a existing covert that's roughly 16t wide 5T high and about 32t long if you look closely at the photo the width of the road is equivalent to the width of the cul so there's really no flexibility if you look at photo number two you can see clearly that the covert's wall is literally where the curb is for the drive um so but if you look at the other photo that same situation occurs on the other covert that's on the south west corner so the the flood plane elevation the road elevation in those areas range from like 309 310 and the flood planes about 310 3.7 so it's under a foot flood plane going over the cover and the drainage areas for so you know for these for this site it's draining roughly um 420 Acres of Upstream area so there's a significant amount of flow coming through this stream um we also uh we also delineated the flood plane for Mir Pond you can see from that the C13 that's much more that's actually north of the fields so it really doesn't impact anything on the site what's more important on the North side again to your right on c103 are the Wetland areas that were noted um there were two Wetland areas noted one in the wooded area one along the tension Basin which is really just not maintained so turned into a wetland and also we have met with d they think they're saying there's another Wetland that may exist in this northwest corner but it really will have no impact on the the constraints um all of this is now in front of the eBay uh we have submitted we've done teal review we're submitting comments to them uh they should be going in a week from today and we're expecting the permit to be decided upon on the end of the month so we we're pretty confident where we are with the constraints that and what I mean by that is that these Wetland areas we're very confident in the three foot I mean the the 50-ft buffer they've confirmed that for us we also confirmed the 50-ft buffer on on the repairing and to put it in perspective um in last July they adopted new rules in D for storm water management I'm I'm sure you guys are familiar seeing uh applications all the time these new rules basically have projected the the storms that we have to now handle as a civil engineer used to be 8.4 in in 24 hours with the new rules last July that was increased to almost 12.3 in so the the CTS probably operated fine under the old rules but with the new increase of almost 50% in flow it was it I'm surprised they're doing as well as to be honest with you they were pretty well designed at least when it came to their size um so the pending applications with the D include a uh blood housing area line verification for the flood plane uh Wetlands transition area waiver and L letter of interpretation just I indicated that uh that the Redevelopment of the site will predominantly be on the existing developed site correct that is correct can you show on the aerial exhibit roughly where the uh additional development will occur and uh testify as to whether or not the Trees of the ball fields will remain intact read my mind if you look at at this parking lot if you squared it off that's literally what we're doing you took this line which I'm referring to ex hbo2 on the western line of the pavement you extended that and you extended this pavement we're just squaring that off as part of the develop and that gives you 10,000 ft and keeps you under under the highlands exemption correct um we we are currently uh as you'll here we're reducing impervious coverage um so that has being had some comments that came in from some of your professionals but we're still going to meet the highlands exemption without a problem um one of the things you should point out about this site it's got over 6 Acres of vehicular P that is not being treated there is no detention Basin there's a ridge line that runs right about the building most of the site runs down to collection system in the parking lot and goes out a 36 in pipe right about where I'm showing here into the adjacent lot and then comes out discharges and ultimately gets to the same Brook so all of this pavement all six acres pluss of it is discharging directly into the stream really not getting any treatment whatsoever and also one of the things that the site does not provide the front of the site is maintained lawn it doesn't provide any water quality benefit at all to the front Stream So if we continue a little bit further um again just to emphasize the uh the rear of the site there are no wetlands in the south of the site the stream here was designated State open water only has a repairing and the most significant thing we have to deal with is the flood L um if you continue uh to talk about the flood plane and flood way what hurdles they had the the site is literally bookended if you you know on each side we have have a we have a constraint that's kind of keeping us within the existing development footprint um currently the site utilities are all but the drainage that leaves on that 36 in pipe it all basically gets handled through an existing existing utilities and silver um the there's an existing 12-in water main that's feeding the site currently um there's an existing 8 in sewer that's leeling site that we're going to reutilize uh the power the um the gas and the communications all come in from Silver and I want to reemphasize too we are not touching anything beyond for any utility work for any proposed work beyond the wood line for the most part where the edge of the parking lot is this field the way it is now is going to stay um and also the access to the field will continue to come through warrant so we're really not affecting the field at all uh you do know that for many years people use the back of that parking lot to access the Little League fields okay just that's not happen anymore um well we're not making an official connection between the two no there's like a path out there right but oh there's a path yeah but been trust me I've been in that field those fields more than I've been at home and I've been raking those fields and I know all about the wi of problems so yes so you're not going to have any access for people to park there and walk to the back to the field so correct okay um this the the the property as John has said is zon uh research office in labatory but it is located within the Redevelopment silven way Redevelopment which was adopted in November 11th 2023 and again just to summarize some key factors uh on the existing condition the 6.7 Acres of vehicular pavement that's untreated being discharged the repairing zones that are complet almost fully maintained providing no environmental benefit at all the front stream or the stream on the south uh mention the fact that we are preserving and not affecting the wood in the uh the wooded area by the fields or the fields themselves so that moves us onto the proposed development and and all what you just talked about is at the D right now that's the plan you have for them that they're looking at okay [Music] call this A3 if you can describe that when you get to a microphone [Music] yeah there's there's no room for parking for Far West anymore that's gone so the renderings I gave you I'm going to be really referring tonight to the first page which is an overall rendering uh this is a so yeah just describe 83 so what you have here is a rendered lights uh landscape plan uh just so you know there's uh there's mcal professionals on this site this landscape plan was prepared uh by duberry and so they'll be testifying uh when it comes to the courtyards and the Landscaping associated with the residential and I'll be focusing more on the um Landscaping when it comes to stor water put it on that's good that's so next to that the subdivision at some Point that's in your packet that I gave you so what you have in front of you is a rendered landscape plan on the left [Music] um we have an uh on the left is the landscape render uh that shows the site Courtyards and it gives you a scope and an idea of how many how much Landscaping that we're actually proposing at the site we'll get into that in a little bit why we why there's so much Landscaping not only from a aesthetic perspective from a storm water perspective um so as you can see from I'm referring to the rendering on the left uh you can see that the access points on Sven are being maintained the coverts are being maintained we're not touching or upgrading the coverts at all um it would be very difficult to touch those CTS because you would have to demonstrate Downstream no impacts so so fortunately the D has agreed with us so right now they're reviewing it and the cul are staying as this then the access points are going to be two both entrance ways are both full access they're in and out they're so that's going to be maintained so what is getting constructed then if you look at and I'll go through it uh quickly the the left side of this campus which I'm highlighting is what John referred to as the South parcel what you see here there's two buildings which is the lifetime building and the Standalone garage and an outdoor pool deck that includes two pools and a um a water slide you'll be hearing more about some of the programming that goes on there from the lifetime representative and then the line again roughly running with this road here is the north side the north side includes the entire remainder of the campus and the B fields so when I refer to the south side of the site that's really Lifetime and the north side is the residential so I'm going to start with just lifetime first as you see there's three buildings uh I'm sorry on an overall basis I'm sorry there's uh I just went through the three buildings on the overview of the site and the access you can see that we're maintaining it the key is is this Loop Road 18800 ft Loop Road that gets constructed that goes in runs a from south to North and then east to west and then South uh north to south that's about 1,800 ft Loop rad that will be the easement now I'm going to refer to the right uh that's the subdivision I'm just highlighted in color you can see that the green here is the north partial which the residential the pink color here is the South parel and what I've highlighted we've highlighted here in the dark color is that access EAS that access it's not just access it's utilities it's basically for vehicular and all the services water sore and everything else that the um the residential will require and all of that goes to back to Silver again nothing goes to the north so when we do the subdivision as John had mentioned there's existing one lot 1.09 is roughly 18 Acres the new lot for the South our lifetime is going to be uh lot 1.09 and it has an area of about 8.9 acres and the North Lot which is the residential lot is going to be 1.0929 point7 acres in area some of the key things I want to point out in the um in the subdivision are a couple of easements there is a 36in pipe that leaves our site right here I'm highlighting it that all the water from the majority of our existing site goes out that 36 in and that goes on to the Jon property there is a 30ft wide e that comes in from the Northwest and comes in actually is what feeds Miron there is a uh elliptical pipe it's a 3ot high by 6t wide pipe that's basically where Mirror Pond gets all of the runoff just about all run off uh the existing ball fields resides in an easement and there's also a 16t easement that runs along the frontage of svin the entire Frontage which is a jcpnl easement and there's also a 15t easement that comes in underneath the Culver that feeds some of the electrical equipment on site so those are the main easements that we have to consider when we were designing the site so from an overall perspective when we demo the site the site will be demoed everything basically on the site will be removed building um Mario take take take the microphone referring to uh ex hbo2 um that's the aerial everything you see there for the most part is being all the existing for most part the existing drainage is being replaced except to the culverts uh all the utilities the pavement the buildings uh we are being very conscientious though again with the wooded area at the North and the flood plane in the uh the area to the South by the existing stream um so now when you go back to the rendering of the proposed want to just talk about a little bit about vehicular access I got to get myself a pair of B folks I'm dying with this um so when you look at the South parcel this Loop rout that goes around provides access and again to Lifetime their garage which I'm highlighting the Standalone garage has access from that Loop Road and I'm going to this is referred to on a plan as Road a a driveway a so access to the garage comes in either at the um east side or from from the North side or from uh that Loop a which goes around from both access points so you can get there from either access point the front of the Lifetime Building is the front door is right here so when you walk out of the garage right and you park in the garage you also have surface spaces but you walk out of the garage you it's a short walk right into the front door of the facility um the garage is going to be about 46 ft high and and it will have five levels um it will have 393 stalls within it um and it we will also have 113 surface spaces for a total of 506 parking spaces for Lifetime uh again I had mentioned the outdoor pool deck which is shown on this rendering with the two pools and this area here which I'm highlighting that white is the uh is the proposed slide that goes with I I'll call it the the Southwest corner of the pool deck um there will be 11 total handicap spaces uh seven at the surface for in a garage for light servicing lifetime um and there's also proposed EVS there's going to be 21 there was a uh M uh one of the numbers on our plans for the EVS was incorrect uh we had miscounted the EV requirement for lifetime so it's not 62 as it's shown on our plans it's 20 21 um so those 21 will be fully within the garage which uh the EVS represent four 4% of the required parking so the finished floor of this building is going to be about 310 uh and the garage lower level is going to be about 297 um one of the things one of the items I like to point out is that there are some small retaining walls to accommodate the site uh there's an area located to the north of um lifetime that's really like an outdoor area and that's you can see there's a sidewall connection going to it and there's a small retaining wall that's got to run along there that's under 4 feet there's another small retaining wall that runs around the pool deck just to keep it level and there's a couple of small walls to create the entrance to get into the garage but for the most part the site is honoring the topography there's no walls really along the per perimeter was just to negotiate some of the top topographic changes in maintain vehicular access um so from a zoning perspective the all the bulk standards that are required for the uh lifetime the it it conforms with all the bulk standards required what I mean by that the setbacks the height the impervious coverage uh don't need I'm not going to go through each one of them but the bulk table provided and I believe the planner agreed that the bulk standards all met what was outlined in the Redevelopment plan um so that's really a summary and I'm going to talk more about the Landscaping as a whole once we get through the north side then the north side's a residential component of the site uh again it's lot 1.02 1.92 and it's about 9.7 Acres it's four stories and 280 units it has 144 one-bedroom 118 two bedrooms and 18 three bedrooms totaling at 280 it has a parking garage that I'm going to highlight the building encapsulates it basically on three sides so the center area here which you'll hear more testimony about is a parking garage within the Residential Building uh that parking garage has 462 parking spaces there's also six par parking spaces at the front door so let me describe that now they have a little background so when you're driving in from the main access road which I'm highlighting on the east or the West just a quick question is there any access for non-vehicle people like if they're bus stop things of that nature that they're not driving a vehicle in like how would how would if I I didn't own a car get in there for the residential both okay well there for the residential as you come around this turn right here there is a drop off that's right there and the also there is a there's a drop off located right about Midway through the building that there's a slip that's outside the traffic yeah but what if I'm not being dropped off by like uber like what if I'm actually physically walking because there's a tremendous amount of these buildings going back there right so obviously we're probably going to see more more pedestrians walking around back there so if I'm a pedestrian I don't I'm in the low-income housing I don't have a car and I'm going to be walking in from wherever I'm getting a bus stop now how am I getting in there without walking on what should be for vehicles only but so I I don't think is there any there's no public transportation2 [Music] we we'll we'll so so we're going to address the issue of sidewalks um you know in terms of uh public transportation connections to the site that's a different issue um sidewalks we'll get to though yes yeah I mean we just heard from uh one silin way which is basically across the street uh njm is moving next door someone wants to run over to the gym at lunchtime they don't want to drive their car to Lifetime are they going to be able to walk there it doesn't seem like they're going to be able to no we're going to address sidewalks it's coming whole area big area it'sing got a lot of buildings back there too right no understood sidewalks are coming it's a topic that will'll be discussed okay okay so continuing on the uh vehicular access there is a drop there's a loop that goes to the front of the the the main entrance to the residential which I'm highlighting on the uh south east corner of the building there's the entrance of the garage which lines up with the entrance uh the the road that runs in front of Lifetime Fitness and then there is also a backup slip because the trash of this building is inside the building um the parking like I said will be uh 468 total spaces uh rsis does require 533 um with the EV bonus associated it with the 15% uh the required is 480 so we are 12 parking stalls short and you'll hear testimony of that on that from the traffic engineer um let me say the traffic engineer has empirical data uh both from Avalon Bay and from Lifetime Fitness as to what they really need in terms of parking and so the traffic consultant will provide that testimony in furtherance of those uh in the one case uh Avalon which is slightly underp parked from rsis you'll hear testimony as to why that's sufficient parking for them based on empirical data and with respect to Lifetime Fitness being overp parked you're going to hear testimony as to why they need to be overp parked okay so that that will be from the traffic engineer just wanted to highlight that issue um so the EVS will be phased in as allowed and permitted over you know a third up front third and three years and a third and uh within six years uh there's nine ada8 stalls one on the site eight in the garage there's two Courtyards shown on this plan that you'll hear more testimony from the landscape architect uh and again I mentioned the waste is all internal to the site and there are some small retaining walls along the perimeter of the back of the site to try and uh prevent and maintain that limit of disturbance within the area that we committed to is which the existing pavement when you say the back of the site are you talking about the north north side of the site here has some small retaining walls that have to go in they're 3 4 feet just to stop us from disturbing wetlands and vegetation so um to understand the whole thing here is that we had two we had two really things that we're dealing with three we have the flood plane and Wetland issues that we have to deal with DP we have storm water we have to deal with and we have the highlands all of them are have competing interests to try and you know minimize the amount of impervious coverage that you can put on the site um the site has been designed uh to accomplish the storm water management through what they call land cover management so what we did is we reduced the vehicular pavement by from 6 acres to 3.4 we reduced it by almost 3 full Acres so from a water quality perspective we've improved it just by the fact that we've reduced three acres and the DPS agreed with that um we also the goal of the the planting that you see is to take the ex portions of the existing maintained Lawns and plant it and create a more natural uh I'll call it brush area for lack of a better word and what that does is it allows natural infiltration of the site it it actually offsets by the lawn runs off more versus the brush so between that and managing the land cover management we're able to meet what they call the hydrograph method which basically states that you are not increasing the rate the volume or the changing the timing of the runoff coming from your site so it's really the only way we could have done this site because the Highlands precluded us from increasing the impervious more than 10,000 square ft if we had to put a basin on the site you would lose uh that devel that same developable area as what you'd be dealing with you would lose maybe a third of that developable area to accommodate a basing uh we did some soil testing out there and we had some varying results so infiltration was not an option when it came to the D because we couldn't meet their strict standards so really the only way we could find to develop the site and stay within the existing limits of the of the current development was to really manage it through landscaping and managing it by maintaining the timing so what what does that all mean in layman's terms uh we're planting a I mean total almost 7800 individual plants on site uh that's how we change the runoff coefficient of grass and reduce it to a natural brush uh you're talking about 244 240 trees 1,600 ornamental grasses 2100 shrubs and 1980 uh perennials now let me explain to you one of the most important goals here was not only storm water management it was also to try to create the my landscape architect we have done these on four or five jobs now the goal was to create a um he selected the plants that were Native and nonivasive and he tried to design it in such a way to provide uh like a seasonal long interest so you would get color in Spring you would get you know you would get color in the fall and you would also get Evergreens in the winter so all of this area you see that's planted is basically going to be somewhat natural looking and it' be maintained obviously but it's got to be it's going to be natural looking in the sense that we've now taken that manicured lawn look and we've gone to something more natural and one of the benefits that we're showing here is that whole repairing buffer that was lawn is being planted and it's going to be planted the whole north side of the stream was planted with these types of trees to refurbish and establish that repairing buffer to something that would improve the water quality um so and by the way those plant totals I gave you don't include the plantings associated with the foundation planting on the residential that which will be covered by uh the other landscape AR just clear 7846 plants yes in total so those were required to try and slow down and then promote infiltration and do it again through land cover management nice thing is there's no Basin to maintain there's no Basin to fail there's no Basin to worry about clogging this is all self maintaining now again you do got to go out there and make sure it doesn't become a weedfest but you have but you know that's something that the owners will look to do because we've done up three or four of these they actually because of the aesthetic value it gives in the colors that that's part of the incentive to make sure that it's maintained properly um so when we we talked about circulation um we had met with the Fire official the Fire subcode official were you going to discuss lighting is signage yes let me get there oh page stuck I'm sorry can I interrup for a moment sure you're looking through that micho can you help me out understand something sure uh know this speak a little more you in a lot of these drawings the ball fields are within the uh boundary line is this lot own the ballfields cuz my assumption was PTW owned those ball fields no the the the ball fields on on file here at Town Hall somewhere that PTW owns all those fields in that entire area they don't the the ball fields are actually part of the subject property okay but there's an easement that encumbers them that protects them as ball fields and they will remain as ball fields nothing's going to no way that can be changed they want to expand their building they want to do something there's no way that that can be changed yeah that's not going to change we'll we'll stipulate to that I mean again you put that in there as a condition ofield like it's not even like you have the whole field so it's like that it's called the major field it goes like right through like you basically right past first base so there'll be a stipulation plays that those those fields would never ever be touched we can certainly agree to that as a condition of approval it's the case anyway but we're happy to put belt and suspenders on it is a very odd looking uh boundary line there that thing it is but it is what it is yeah that that's uh that's owned by the applicant okay there's that's duberry so now duberry actually owns those no no no s six svin owns it duberry's the engineer six svin owns the ball fields but again there's an easy Sil on the ball fields okay yeah he's meant for Fields not to be place okay correct sorry go following up on that if I may does the subdivision cleave off the ball fields no no no the subdivision we're just not disturbing what is existing there which is ownership is it would be now Avalon Bay because they will own that lot um but they will take ownership subject to the easement which permits the b ball fields and forbid uh Cano or Avalon from doing anything to change that situation uh we'll agree to that as a condition of approval as well again to put belt and suspenders on that uh you may want your board attorney I I think I've supplied that if not I can supply you with a copy of the of the title work so that you can review that um no nobody's going to come back and and with an application to uh endanger the ball fields at all we we understand those are sacrified and those eans for the ball fields were already in place before you they long existing the property correct yeah that's nothing new those have been in place for a while but yeah Pary never owned the little neither the Little League nor the town owns that property nor nor did they ever okay but Lake parity Park uh I guess that would be east of there is owned by the town yes okay that's this off the Bing line yeah and and right uh right field okay on right field they they may need to expand the parking lot I think so I mean it's all like like 60 spots there for that okay been there all right thank for explaining I'm sorry I skipped lighting um my page stuck so uh lighting uh we we were very with the site lighting we tried to be very conscientious uh we the maximum light pole height in is 25 we kept them all the 16 ft we also looked at you know around the perimeter try to keep it you know as low as possible with the F candles uh we have 57 uh light poles all at 16 ft there's 50 wall mounts at 16 ft they're all LED downward shooting you know they're they're they're meant to minimize the spread and any kind of throw to the property line that was a a very strong intent on my uh on our end and that is talking about the lighting that goes around the perimeter and also some baller lighting that goes around the uh the Residential Building um signage there are two Monument signs proposed on the site uh they're highlighted here um we're showing them it's the uh the Redevelopment plan envisions they could be as close as 10 ft to the curb um we do have to coordinate with jcpnl because it is an easement and they don't want it in their easement we're going to have to push it back problem is if we push it back that easement is almost 21 ft from the curb so now we're getting into environmental so we have to talk to them we had a marked out there was not a electric line at least in portions of that so they may allow it but again it's subject to us asking them um there's also a number of directional signs uh when you're coming in from the southeast corner there's a directional sign here to uh indicate to that Lifetime Fitness is to the left if you go straight as you're going down to the north there's a there's a a number of directional signs and delivery signs in that triangle area um and as you come up there's another directional sign right before the left to go to Lifetime Fitness um all the signs We Believe comply uh and the one thing that we're going to have to deal with with though is again the monument sign in the front if jcpnl wants us to push it back then we're going to be probably 20 plus feet away from the road which is going to have its own challenges but we'll have to deal with that um now to go back uh we did have a meeting with your fire department before you jump onto circulation uh we met with the code official and I actually had a call with them today and this is also in your packet uh it's referred to fire lane sketch for ation um it's really a markup of c115 so when we met with the fire department they they asked us for a couple things there was a letter that had like I would say 10 or 15 things most of them were pretty straightforward at fire striping you know move your hydrant put your FDC connection your knockbox all of that but they did ask if we can extend fire Lanes on either side of the building from the sub code so what we see here now is that we have a fire lane here and here that are go going up that's on the east side of the building and on the west side of the building on the west on the east side of the building is going to be 26 feet wide and on the west side of the building is going be 20 ft and that's because of the wetlands and he felt that was adequate that is going to be constructed with grass pave which is but that is impervious when it comes to the highlands in water quala uh the D has agreed tentatively not to include it for water qual uh for quantity but I have to discharge it through a natural vegetated strip for them to do that so these areas here add about another 9,000 square feet of impervious when it comes to uh the overall so now we're no longer reducing we're about even or maybe a little more than existing but still making the storm water work and still meeting the highlands exemption because we're you're allowed to increase it up to 10,000 square F feet so when you start looking at the impervious coverage on the site you can start to see that you know we're we did provide some we did provide sidewalks we provided sidewalks to his to the board members comment we have sidewalks located in the front of the residential building around most of the back of the building and either side and along the front and along the uh north of Lifetime Building now where we are are with the exemption and also where we are with the storm water pretty much on site every square foot of impervious we add we have to deduct that's really where we are because if I add an almost almost a two to one because I have to for me to maintain I can only offset so much with Landscaping I can only off there's not enough maintain lawn the plant and you got to remember this drains in two different directions proportionally it drains to the back and some of it drains to the front so when you I'm going to talk about the sidewalks in in three pieces on site if we put a sidewalk we would have to remove impervious somewhere that's literally where we are um then when you look at the silven way we do have a an issue with the I'm referring to c103 this area being designated in the flood West is really problematic uh and you have a portion of your driveway and into the road is in the floodway floodway is highly regulated you can't even put a chain link fence because of the trucks flow it you can't even put a uh if you were to put a fence or a barrier it has to be basically a split rail fence so you can't raise the grade at all you need a hardship waiver to do that you can't add fill so anywhere in that red line that you see there especially here at the corner is going to require a hardship waiver from the DP which is near impossible to get so because what we'd have to do is show why do I need the hardship waiver why can't you do it another way it's something called an alternative analysis so when you go through this alternative analysis they may turn around and says well you can put the sidewalk you know on the other side of silin well why do you need to put it here there's no buffer on the other side of Sil um that's the argument I'm going to have with them uh so also what I would what I think really needs to be done if you look at this photo here photo number two there's a large Transformer located right at the corner of our North uh Southeast Corner that Transformer went out and measured it today it's roughly 5 1/2 ft from face of curb to Transformer now I couldn't find JCP and El's requirement but PSG requires two foot from a Transformer to sidewalk so one of the things I started thinking about when I was you know looking around the campus you have areas that are have regulatory constraints you have areas that have Transformers what really wants to happen here in the area wants to be like a pedestrian master plan to figure out where these Transformers are like where these regulatory areas so you can build you know a comprehensive pedestrian access because to do to do it peace meal and and then have it go you know maybe to nowhere and then maybe have a problem where you can't extend it cuz even if we a were able to build a sidewalk Along silven on our side when you cross over the covert you have a Transformer that you're going to have to move and you know that may that's not that easy to do when it comes to the switch gears and Transformer and they're not going to let you pave a sidewalk more than likely right up against it it's usually a couple feet they want between the sidewalk or walking path in their equipment so putting the sidewalk along silvin on our side is going to be very difficult with the flood light it just very very difficult accessing the site from the is going to be very difficult because the covert itself is in the flood white I can't raise the grade in the covert I can't add a sidewalk to the covert can't even add a full protection for a pedestrian on the covert because I would need a hard CH now all of that to maybe one of those would be doable but all I have a question though so you I mean if if you're talking about and I don't disagree with you on a an overall plan for sidewalks and pedestrian axis because that does need to happen with all the Redevelopment that's going on back there but even if you had I guess the starting point for Access like sidewalks that reached or came closer to the street CU right now you have nothing like there's no pedestrian access going all the way out if you think about it in three pieces you have Sven you have access to s from silv into the site and then you have the site so like we said anything on the site we're going to have to reduce so maybe after we hear the traffic engineer and we hear some other testimony we can try to talk about what's you know what's the balance because that's just where we are I mean you know so we have to figure out the sidewalks we shown where the sidewalks are our priority and I think we have to figure out what we can offset those sidewalks to accomplish what the board wants the overall campus review I think is a really good idea because I got to be very honest with you you can run these along the south side of svin then you're going to go a little further as a Transformer 2 feet from the curve I just have one more thing on that um was could we put some type of condition that for future like when when there is a discussion on pedestrian access as more and more of these things begin to build hope that that is something that can come into play in the future well I do I I I do agree that some sort of master plan for uh pedestrians is necessary I also do not want the town to have to pay for it exactly yeah so so Mr chairman anticipating that uh I I think um we understand and and so we we would be willing uh the applicants would be willing to post escrow or or a sum of money with the town that would cover the cost of sidewalks uh that we can't feasibly put there on silven because of the testimony that was provided but that would be a start towards funding um I mean we're master plan we're going to have all of these multif family homes or apartments in this area and if we're going to continue to have desire buildings for people to work in they're going to want a place to walk I mean that's just you're going to have you may need some sort of Transit other than Uber to these things now that you've got what is it three or four different apartment building four apartment buildings all in this one complex this is now a residential area to an extent yeah kids riding bikes I mean just you could just generally correct so we so we understand have to have some sort of plan we have to I'm not entirely sure is this something we should be writing to the council and saying we need to do this and then they should be talking to uh the whole complex there well in in this Redevelopment plan it did mention sidewalks correct it did so our view is that we just we have a hardship in terms of feasibility of a sidewalk along the floodway when the transform Etc we understand the desire for sidewalks in this area as the area redevelops and we we support that um we would be willing to to put money up uh to help fund those improvements uh for our Prat a share of that uh we work with Mr kiano to come up with a with a with a number to do that uh with the expectation that as other developers come in to redevelop that they would be doing the same thing and as the town um if the town as the town as the case may be develops a pedestrian uh network of master plan that there would be funding in there from the developers to to pay for it rather than the taxpayer I mean I look at this and I say okay is the school bus going to come back in there to the building probably going to have to because there is no other place to leave them off um but people are going to want to walk to whatever whether it's other buildings I'm sure some sort of retail is going to start showing up perhaps within walking distance even if it's just Wendy's the the wigman's is just over a mile from the site wman Supermarket you've got Season 52 um a mile Capital Grill within a mile you've got Tommy's Tavern within a mile of here 1515 development yeah all that stuff there so you're you're going to have to have I mean the Temptation for people to walk of course even even if there are no sidewalks people are going to walk right but like I said we're willing to put up the escrow we just our view is as you've heard that we I agree I agree with you that a master plan for the entire area has to be done something has to be worked out among the group and we put up money for our share of the cost to that it's just the sidewalk on our site there is not where it's feasible it is across the street but as was testified to there's going to be other places on silvin where it's not going to be feasible on that side of the street so that's the need for the master plan and trying to figure that out and this is now this is my 34th year on a land Utility Board in this town and we I've never been a party to doing one of these things before so i' really kind of like to know what the proper approach for starting the ball rolling on this rather than just saying sure you got to do this and we're going to put in an escrow and then nothing happens until somebody gets hurt well it it it from our perspective it it would be um we'd have a developers agreement uh which would make certain requirement will be conditions of approval and if the board wants to recog mend uh a master plan pedestrian master plan for the area to the council can certainly do that um and that would make that would seem to make a lot of sense and like I said we would be happy to post a sum that would be represent our Prat share uh towards those costs and the theory being that if you did that with each developer as they came forward you would have money in place or recruit money if the town wanted to be proactive about doing the plan and fronting the money and then recouping whatever those are policy decisions for the for the municipality but that might be a suggested way to move forward on it well and I think that while the applicant before us tonight is being very generous in terms of offering up the escrow it may be more appropriate to put an ordinance in place requiring a sidewalk fee to fund this master plan uh in case we have applicants who aren't ex generous well or you can condition approvals on that but that those are yeah so outside of this application the board can consider contacting Council saying making this recommendation based on this concept that that applicants put forward I think we have to yeah I think I think we're well past the need for this as Mr meth and others have pointed out and I definitely agree with that something I I I was just jotting things down I know there was we have either one in two campus or one in four I the number seven campus is new uh say at the end the driveing way we got the 55 and older on Littleton Road across the street where the light is uh three new buildings on Sentry Drive which is right by the FedEx building pass those three and we have 1515 which is probably within half a mile walking distance so we got maybe write to all the all the owners of all those properties and all come together something but that's say like a thousand people almost thousand units so we're definitely going to we're definitely going to have to recommend something to the to the uh I think even the other build just here before one silven somehow connects the three in5 and I think they have like those rental bikes on their property also I think it's called The Arbors I that's that's called The Arbor that it's called okay you could like rent a bike and by their campus so with within their campus well I think we should uh accept suggestions from the board and from our professionals and from the applicants as to the best way to go about this but I think the ball should get rolling on itk yeah agreed so M Mr an getting back to access from the property to silven by Sidewalk aren't you required by Ada to provide an accessible route to a public way if there's a sidewalk out there yes aren't you required by Ada to provide access to a public way an accessible route I believe you are if you look it up I think there needs to be a sidewalk there you're not going to I think that my understanding is is that you need to have a public access to you're not going to bring and just discharge him into the street so I think if there is a sidewalk you should make a public connection that's how I I will bring the Ada regulation to the next meeting and show you where it says this well I thought I mean I because the way I've seen it interpret it and that's fine is the way I understand it is that if you have a sidewalk you're supposed to make a connection because if you don't have a sidewalk there's no connection to you mean the sidewalk that we've all told you we want you won't provide no I can't no I won't I can't provide it well I just wanted to add to that we you've talked a lot about I guess that's the easterly entrance where photo 2 is where it is restricted by floodway and and just for the board if you could repeat where you are in the D application you're you're inches away from getting your approval yes however we have this sidewalk discussion going on yes um and it's entirely up to D's rules you have another individual permit you won't qualify for General permits for a sidewalk in a flood way um you bring up the G the Transformer issue again that there may be some relief you may be able to get it between there but on the West Side photograph one area or the axis of photo one is unregulated you're outside of the floodway and you're outside of the flood plane on Sil so let's not just blaze over that you have act yeah right there and along the frontage of the you know along the RightWay of of Sil so you do have access you do have unregulated areas the floodway still crosses the Culvert true true but you have a 30 foot wide uh existing Culver yes and a and a 6 or 8 inch high curve along that Culver so you know constructing a curb or some other means of separating without obstructing flood water of separating pedestrians on that existing culber from let's assume it's a 24t wide uh travelway for cars and a six foot travel way for pedestrian going over that existing culber I mean my point is we can't say for sure if the D will allow it or not allow it at this time it's tonight's meeting we there there's there's no way to know what options you have to to let me understand what you just said though you're saying to con there's a 30 foot wide Road right correct convert part of that road into a sidewalk but I can't raise it so it'll be that great no it's it's obstructed already there's an 8 in curve there it's already obstru flow is already OB you're still flowing in the flood wi yeah but you're not obstructing the flow and again goes back you got still got to go for a hardship for it and that's going to not necessarily it but it does go back and I I do want to make it clear this is totally within the jurisdiction of the D that you don't know the answer and I don't know the answer how it will be received but they do want complete streets and they do uh uh want a public sidewalk to be installed so there are Provisions um for that but the question is how do you go about that uh as a condition of approval if you're 99% uh you you're you're just about ready to get your D permit you had mentioned any day now and in a month we expect end of the month um you there are Provisions to going for modifications for permits well we're going to have to go for modification no matter what so the fire Lanes came up you know so I'm going back okay that's good so I good for this discussion well it's good I mean because all these changes you see I'm going back because it's if I introduce that now they'll make me withdraw it and it goes back you stated earlier it would be a discussion on impervious coverage how much where you can take from where you want to add right so when we do these changes and there'll be more changes obviously so we as a board tweaks this plan we would go back as a one we would go back one time to the DP so I just want to make it clear to the board it's not that you can't do it because of D it's unknown at this point if we can do sidewalk going into the property or if we can do sidewalk on sver well let let me just add because what you mentioned was an idea we came up with right and one of the things I ran into is that you still need to put fall protection on that no it's the four protections already there it's on it's on no it's not it's those are two split rails that does not meet the guidelines of full protection you need a 4in spindle and I can't put that in because it obstructs flow so we can talk about it I challenge this I mean if I put spindles and i' have to raise it up above the floodway so there are right and how far you into the floodway there I mean these are discussions our friends of the D will absolutely be all over right now the other thing is we don't know the answer of that tonight correct and the other thing I just want to mention you we do have some area here but as you start going up and that's why the master plan is really important you may be able to fit a sidewalk here like I'm pointing in the the nor the southwest corner as you start going up silven you're back into the floodway so that's why the master plan I think is really important because you may be able to get out here maybe you cross the street and then you go and it's it's I and I want to add the the the installing the sidewalk and paying escro to construct the sidewalk is the easy part getting it permitted from the state is going to be the hard part so let me on that point Mr relli let me ask you a question if the township talk about the degree or probability of obtaining a permit from the D if the township is the applicant uh for the permit as opposed to uh this applicant being the applicant for the permit it's been my experience that D reacts and entertains more creative ways of doing things from a Township than they do from a private developer it's just the reality you're shaking your head because it's it's true is there some vehicle that we can do at this the application funds the discussion under a town application would you be willing to work with the township if that were became sure the next step property owner would work with the township to have easements for sidewalks and work with the the ship to to prepare that application absolutely our our view is again as testified to um and I don't want to put words in your mouth but let me ask you nil nil to none nil to none of a hardship variant if I was going for all these little hardships I would have a nil to none chance of getting so but you believe that the township would have a better chance much better chance because I think they would roll it into just more than this project they would roll it in and they would try to be comprehensive so we want to create options uh here if if the township believes as part of its master plan that it can get it can achieve permitting for a sidewalk uh on our part of silen that's fine with us uh we'll we'll post the money we'll assist we'll do whatever we need to do to be cooperative with that endeavor if the township believes that pursue to a master plan that in this area of silven that a sidewalk is better on the other side of the street because of the floodway issues and the Transformer and everything else you know that's fine too we're we're happy to to pay and contribute financially but what would kill the project is is having to uh seek to achieve a hardship waiver from the D that would kill the project and I remind the board too that the the Cano part of this with the 280 units is is a replacement round three project for the uh project out there on Mid 46 that never got built so there's a imperative seems to me from an affordable housing perspective for the township to remain in good standing and compliance with its affordable housing obligations here um but again we want to be cooperative and we want to you know work through this with you in terms of the best way to proceed uh to achieve the the goal of pedestrian access and connectivity that the board is seeking you had a point I just had a question so D won't let you change the driveway on that goes across the culverts at all it's in the floodway so you can't raise it if you're were replacing it in K it was damag yes but once you make it longer higher you have to make sure you're not impacting down stream are you blocking water it's it's very difficult if you're they usually want you to replace it in kind you I mean it's been there you know whatever it's been doing it's doing but to actually raise it now we can get creative too you know if it but going for a hardship waiver would be a problem unless there's no other way of accomplishing what you're trying to do so that's the key to a hardship waiver which is not going to happen here I mean I've been through this process before hardship waiver is at least a year and it would kill this it would kill this development no time frame associated with ask our professionals and also because he's so knowledgeable our applicant's attorney here what are the best steps to start the process of all rolling here towards getting the council to consider a master plan for the pedestrian traffic in this particular piece of proper you're asking me I'm I'm actually asking Andrew okay I don't know about the master plan part and that you know uh Mr Lino may have some insight on that but as far as the sidewalk on the property and the um access across the culverts existing or reconstructed um that should be part of a condition of your modifications now if you if they say no absolutely and and you do a good faith effort and you can document that you had the pre-application meeting or or the discussions with them uh but because it's two it's two different arguments it's a master plan on silvin and then there's access private access to silvin so um the modification discussion should be with d on sidewalk if at least one point of access from the site to Sil understood so onsite will be just making the drainage work like on-site that's what it's going to be we're going to have to make the drainage work and you talked about modificate possible modifications to to the cul so no no I said we're not going to modify the C no I'm saying you should H you you should have a good faith discussion with the D when you go back okay I see what you're saying gotcha gotcha when did you submit the DP application we just got a 30-day extension to June 30th so that would make it you know 3 months before June 1st roughly so it was after the Redevelopment plan on the property was adopted and put into place which required the sidewalks but you didn't present the sidewalk option to D no we did not because I knew it would be a problem crossing the C that's why we even though that was a requirement of the Redevelopment plan that is correct nice I have a just a quick clarification M steinley or Mr chairman may you help me out uh and Mr probably good point the this is a package deal right we're approving the fitness center the garage and the uh and the apartments not just the apartments even though it's being subdivided is that right we are approving all of them yeah it's it's all them that's part of the whole application okay all right Mr chairman to answer your question from the master plan side of it I think you need to define the area where you want the study to to address whether it's silven whether it's more than silven whether it's a portion of silven and then you make a recommendation to the governing body that they commission the the pedest I don't even know what you want to call it but The Pedestrian master plan for the area that you define well we have to I think we have to cover all the areas that now we'll have Residential Properties I I think that's a start now whether it would also include some of the other industrial and uh Office Buildings but certainly we have with these four projects plus another one plus two others that are across the street so in the immediate era what we have six six big apartment complexes that are suddenly going up M uh pedestrian access I think is is essential to consider and so we have to that whole segment of town has to to be uh looked at at least in some respects the master plan already covers it our master plan defines the entire grid of silven and campus and Dryden as a high priority for sidewalks okay it does it does already within the sidewalk section of the last Master yeah but then it doesn't really put a plan correct we we we need to do is to get the governing body moving we need to need them to come up with an ordinance and a plan and some other kind of drawing to move forward so we should we should send them a note recommending that they consider an ordinance yes that defines a pedestrian master plan for this segment of the whether it's an ordinance or resolution or you know some mechanism some mechanism yes regardless for this application there still is an issue about even if you're not putting sidewalk on the Frontage how are pedestrians going to connect to a possible sidewalk across the street um we're going to get together with your engineer we'll talk about some of these options like we said we're not messing with the DP permit now okay and we'll talk about what some options are you know and figure it out and then we'll go present our best options to the DP after after after the DP issues a permit please I think they're good because I understood yeah so you that permit in the next 30 days 20 days June 30th so so let's once we do that we'll we'll come up with some ideas might have to get a little creative and let's see what they come back with because we're we're not talking about a sidewalk along silver now and now you're talking about the just the access yeah access from this site to Silver so we can you know now you're talking about one thing and not two so it may be just a you know we we we'll we'll definitely the the DP will tell us straight up if they're going to entertain it or not I mean Dennis kto is very straightforward Mr engino just to say we're now past 10 o' we try not through with this witness at this time understood if if we could finish his affirmative testimony how much more affirmative Tony do you have so I'm fine with that okay okay I don't know how much public is here but if we could if we could finish with Mr ranelli tonight with questions that would be fabulous there's been a lot of questions already I don't know whether it is anymore but while it's fresh in the board's mindly ask but he may have to be uh responding to questions again next time understood so just picking up we've gone through uh I guess just to close you know uh we're going to revisit the sidewalks after we hear some traffic testimony in on the interior um moving on to utilities uh all the utilities will be continued to service through silven uh most of the utilties are going to have be Jack and board what that means they going to have to go under the Culver or under the stream um it's already shown on as part of our DP permit to ask to do that there's no way to get the utilities out same problem um the water is going to be a loop around that main Loop what I was talking about before there's going to be a new water line that's going to come in it's going to connect and it going to create another loop all the way around so it's going to be an 8 in connecting to the 12in fire department asks us to add another loop around this building with fire uh with uh hydrants at the end of each fire lanane with ballards to provide fire fading capability uh all the communications all the electric we still have to work with jcpnl um trying to figure out what they have coming into the site you know one of the hard Parts is the their conduit are going underneath the covert so they may have spares that we don't know about so we're trying to work all of that out uh with regard to asside agency approvals Mr Elli I indicated that mors County planing board has been submitted in his pending correct yes um moris County Soil conserv Conservation District is also submitted in pending correct yes and you've discussed the the permits that are uh that are pending correct yes okay well there's two other permits there'll be the tww for treatment works for sore and bwsc for water those are post approval correct those are postal okay and then uh so in your opinion you've kind of addressed the the key points of the uh professional uh letters that relate to your testimony is that correct I tried to pick up what I thought were yes I tried to pick up okay Mr chairman and uh if I can turn it back to the board for questions of the witness I'm trying to be mindful of the hour and we're trying to make some progress here I'm going to start again with our engineer since this is the engineer we have many many comments on the letter but most of it is housekeeping which I understand that the applicant will agree to addressing um the vast majority of the comments um I guess we should start with is there any comment that you don't agree with no most of them are housekeeping for the most part I touched on the ones that were requiring testimony but everything else was mainly housekeeping um just a little bit more uh the the area of the pool and the Life Fitness uh we noticed there wasn't a lot of detail there it's not the detail is not there I asked you provide it in test I don't know if I missed it what's what what's going on with the pool area and you know is is what there's is is that being constructed now it says to be designed by others area proposed P day so you will hear testimony uh one from the lifetime representative um and that will explain the operations right now what we showed there is the impervious coverage how it's dreaming like how the infrastructure is going to work but you'll hear testimony from Lifetime on the actual operations and programming that will be occurring on the pool that um did you provide testimony on the subdivision comment 13 uh about that just just for the board's knowledge that the uh northernly lot does not have Frontage and it needs you need a variance from uh for a lot not not having Furniture did you get any testimony in on that yeah I to explain that at the beginning of the meeting there's a uh an easement it's actually more than an easement um we have the form we'll Supply it to board Council for review and approval that will establish access to the public Street of Sven way and uh just a minor comment just modification of that easement just uh comment 14 just to square off that that easement um trying to see what else of major items um again you'll the traffic we'll talk about the parking the under you know below rsis for the residential and the above the required uh uh number of stalls uh for the U non-residential use because you there's an opportunity it looks like a a glaring opportunity to pick up some to reduce some impervious area you have3 or so surface parking spaces that you know uh five or 10 parking spaces um out of the 113 covers the increased imperious area on silen for example or could do the same for the uh for the sidewalk inside the site so it's a big issue about the imperviousness and the number of parking [Music] spaces yes um you'll hear from the traffic we've been working together with the applicants to provide dat yeah that that that could really help this this situation about the parking AG um I think that's oh if I have other comments will you be back next yes yeah okay that's all I have right now actually Tom can I interject one question all right I was are you gonna I going to go to Stuart go to Stuart you know Mr chairman given the the hour and Mr me's uh chomping at the bit to ask another question um with we have a couple of small uh issues that came up during the testimony tonight we can defer them to next time okay good the question's simple it's in the uh residential garage are the spaces going to be assigned my understanding they are not assigned okay so they're open to anybody but that that'll be we we'll get you an answer to that question understood thank you fair enough other members of the board have questions on this witness on this testimony and he's going to be coming back so hearing and seeing none are the members of the public who have questions of this witness if you please come forward identify yourself and your address and ask your question hi Allison kogan for fav Road I just wanted to confirm that there's no access for the residents of the building to get to the public park that's right behind it because it sounds like there's going to be now walls behind the residence between the walls and the Forest that leads to the public park there will be no residential connection or connection to the park from the Residential Building there'll be no connection any other members of the public who have questions in this witness no technically you're the owner of that you you're going to restrict access no we're not making a Formal Connection I'm just saying there are connections there now so are you going to block them off somehow no we're just not we're just not going to no the walls are small walls that are in certain locations it's not the whole we're not we're going to have residents say well we own this property we're allowed to use it so we can just walk through here the residents will be the residents will be renters first of all um no meaning they're renting from the owners who own that property right but we're just we're not planning on making any uh okay change whatsoever to what's there work all right any other members of the public have any questions hearing and seeing none counselor um Nora when do we have 17 June 17th we'll be back do we have the whole night got ask these questions depends on what you do next week she she's in she's the one that's in control I know that's why I'm asking nor all right so do I have a motion to uh motion to carry to carry to the 17th yes and and just so the record's clear that's with no further notice to the public this is the notice to the public to carry to June 17th at 7:30 p.m. here in in building do you understand that everybody from the public this is it this is your [Music] notice I've got uh who who who moved the motion okay and who second second stand all in favor say hi all opposed say nay all right before we go we had a discussion here about suggesting to the council that they come up with something for the master plan for the pedestrians in this vicinity [Music] um Mr chair is is can we can we does it have to be a public forum where we discuss this can we exchange emails with ideas or it has to be change emails on yeah you don't you don't do that no and this is an application this to talk to the about the Town Council isn't it the council so I can I'll prepare a draft letter with the recommendation to the council I'll have it send I'll send it to Nora to circulate to the board don't reply all you can send your comments to me and then we'll finalize it at the next meeting at the 17th not the 10th thank you very good all right so a motion to adjourn motion to adjourn anybody oppos