Right. Good evening and welcome to the special meeting of the Township of Parcanany Troy Hills Board of Adjustment. It is Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 and it is 700 p.m. Announcement is made that adequate notice of this meeting has been given and that it is being conducted in
accordance with NJSA 104-6 at set of the New Jersey Open Public Meetings Act. Roll call. We have Mr. Burkowitz here. Mr. Joshitz here.
Uh Mr. Quinn here. Mr. Willand here. Chairwoman Gyani present. We also have our board planner Mr. Chadwitz present. Our board engineer Mr. Lmanowitz here. And our board attorney Mr. Johnson here. Would you please stand and join us in
the pledge of allegiance? I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice for all. Mr. Chav, can you raise your right hand,
please? Swear or affirm that any testimony that you give tonight should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Yes, mine. Swear or affirm that any testimony? Yes, I do. I do. Is there anyone here in the audience that has something other to say
than what is on our agenda for this evening? I see none. Application 25 colon 48 Antonio de Benadetto and Pamela Ren 16 Ridgewood Avenue block 582 lot 28 zone R4 a C
variance to construct an open deck with stairs contrary to section 430- 10 I and section 430-35 column Mr. Denadto,
[Music] can you raise your right hand, please? Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing? Yes. Put your hand down. You can sit down. Make sure you use the microphone. Yep. Okay. And state your name and spell your
last name, please. Sure. Uh, is this a good speaking position? Uh, Antonio De Benadetto. uh last name D I space capital B E N E D E T O. Thank you. Why don't you tell the board what it is that you'd like to do?
Sure. So, uh my wife and I uh we have our backyard uh stairs and uh patio were kind of crumbling. Uh and we decided we thought instead of uh just rebuilding what is exactly as it is uh or just trying repairs that would not be
adequate uh to do something new which is to replace it with uh a deck. So it's a just to have a little bit of an upgrade. All right, ask a couple questions. Your plan shows this existing concrete
patio or whatever it is there. Say again. Sorry. There is an existing concrete. Yeah. So that so that's that's what will be steps and another concrete. I guess it's all ending. Yeah. So it's like uh concrete stairs be removed. Yeah. That's all that would be removed
and then and then that's replaced with you. Put a reg a regular wood deck over it. Yeah. Tracks. Yeah. And and it's not tongue and groove, right? There's space between the there. Yeah. There will be there'll be enough there'll be space in between the board. Burn holes on the water go right through. Yeah. Water should go through. And I see
from our the reason I ask these questions is not much over the uh it's actually reducing the real impervious coverage by removing the concrete. And we have a letter from October the 3rd from our engineering department that
you will um take care of and approve what they've asked you to do for the storm water drainage. Is that correct? Yes. Uh yeah, I I spoke with uh Paul uh Nihawk. Wait, I hope I'm remembering that name correctly. Yeah. uh and uh and he yeah discussed like uh what what
would make sense what will be a plan that could basically uh address the storm water uh to to code. Okay. Thank you. Uh would someone like to uh recommend approval of this application of Mr. Denadto's? I do have one question. Surely.
Uh how much how or how high is the deck going to be off the ground or is it going to be right on the ground? Oh uh off the ground but not very high. I mean, it's it would just go um forget if I have the if I have the height. Um uh the same height the same height of
the Yeah, 2 and a half. That's it. Yeah, it's the same height of that the that the uh the stairs go currently because it would it would just basically match and meet the the back door. Yes, I see your side dimensions here. Deck size is 16 by 27. The deck height
is 2 and 1/2 ft from the ground. The width is 36 in high railing and your stairs are five inches wide. Five feet, excuse me. Five feet wide. Okay. Would someone like to uh make a recommendation, please? I recommend it.
You recommend what? Approving. Approving. Sure, why not? Okay. He's going along with what the engineer said and uh the it's a no-brainer. Application 25 48. Antonio D. Benadetto and Pamela Ren 16
Ridgewood Avenue block 582 lot 28 zone R-4 recommend granting a C variance to construct an open deck with stairs contrary to section 430-10 I and section 430-35 column 13 and agreeing to do what the
engineer felt needed to be done and to remove the concrete and to remove the uh concrete that's there. Yes. Thank you. Second. Burkowitz. Yes. Josh, yes. No. Uh, Quinn, yes. Ready?
He's not here either. Willand? Yes. Granny, yes. Mr. Chief, we have another member here. Yes. For the record, Mr. Petty. Yeah, I'm here. I'm here. Okay. Welcome, Mr. Pedo. it's been approved and you
will be receiving a letter and at that time you can come before the uh the office and they will uh give you your permits. Okay. Okay. Lots of luck. All right. Thank you so much. Good night. Good night.
Application number 25 col 43 23 Granada Drive block 18 lots 21 zone R1. a Dvarian to legalize a two family home.
Yes. Good evening, Madame Chair, council, Mr. Chadwick, members of the board, attorney Rosemary Stone Dowy with the law firm of Ay Stout here tonight on behalf of the applicant of the owners of 23 rise. We're here tonight to ask this board to please grant us the D1 youth
variant for the existing technically motheraughter style dwelling that my clients purchased back on June 28th, 2024 without knowledge that the municipality in particular Mr. Certio
had already cited the predecessor entitle back in 2023 to come in front of this board to ask for the house to be approved as a two family. So with that being said, my road map for tonight is I have with me one of the
owners of the house, Mrs. Arana Lacotf, who I'm going to have her provide what is heard when she purchased the home. And then we have with us this evening our professional planner, Alexander Dowardy, to provide the necessary testimony in support of the D1 use
barriers. Okay, great. Can you raise your right hand, please? Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but truth? Okay. Can you state your name and spell your last name, please? Lotia. Lacotia. Is that how you pronounce your
last name? Okay. Thank you. Uh, Motia Fend as L A K H O P I D. Great. You can both have a seat. Thank you. Okay. Mrs. Lochia, you came across the property that you're
now the owner of, 23 Granada Drive, also known as block 18, lot 21, which is in the R1 zone back in 2024. Correct. That's right. Did you come across the property by seeing an MLS listing from a realtor?
Yes. And in that listing, it indicated that the house, right, had a maid quarter. That's right. Or also known as an in-law or nanny suite. Yep. And I believe and we have copies of this in the application packet for all the
board members. It specifically stated that the in-law or nanny suite has a separate entrance with kitchen and living room. Perfect for multi-generational living. Correct. That's right. Yes. Is that the main reason you purchased this home?
That's absolutely right. We have our parents and in-laws stay with us. So, yeah. Do you have what? I'm sorry. I'm sorry. You have one other family? My our parents, both our parents, they visit us quite often and they cannot climb stairs. So yeah, the intent was to
uh you know have this buy this house because it has a mother daughter suite. They say they visit you often. That's right. They don't live with you permanently. Well, they they're going to move with us uh next year. That's the plan. That's the current plan. But for now, um yeah, they come they visit us.
And when they visit you and they come from India, they're with you for months at a time. Correct. Absolutely. More than 6 months, right? But they haven't permanently moved in as of yet. Correct. That is correct. They plan to. They plan to. Yes. Do you live on the second floor and they
live on the first floor? No, the house is not set up as indicated in your memo. Uh, Mr. Chadwick and the floor plans that we provided to the board. Um, and also our planner will show you in a larger exhibit that might be easier to see. The in-law suite is on
the first floor as well as the main kitchen for the house, the living room, dining room. It is not top to bottom like your memo indicates. It is literally on the first floor downstairs side of the house.
So you're just saying the in-law suite is let's say on the left hand side all intact and then on the right is kitchen whatever whatever and the bedrooms upstairs. Correct. Correct. It's your Is there a door splitting the two?
There's actually two interior doors. two doors because there's a shared laundry on the first floor. So, you can close the door from the in-law suite to the laundry and then there's another door on the other side of the laundry as well. But, it is interconnected on the first floor.
There's no seal. It's not completely separate. There's that interconnection onto the first floor. So, it's one family in the two family dwelling. I didn't understand. I'm sorry. I didn't hear you. family. All family members are
in the same family. All people living there are going to be in the same family. Correct. So therefore, it will be one family, but you're looking to get us to approve a two family home. Well, unfortunately, under Paripany's definitions, you don't have a definition
in your ordinance, and I had many conversations with your zoning officer, Michael Rigeri. You don't have a definition for mother daughter like some municipalities do. So his position is since it has the separate kitchen and there is the ability to access the unit from the
outside even though it's interconnected that under your ordinances in paripony it is considered a two family. Our position is and the reason they bought it was for the motheraughter setup. It is not the intent to seal up any doors
or have it as a separate rental suite. It is to use it as what a mother daughter's intended to which is to have your family reside there. We do have other mother daughters in our town. Okay. Okay. And uh I think that we understand that
family needs for that. But granting a two family home that they can sell it tomorrow for a two family home then. Well, I guess my question would be do those other mother daughters in town have a full suite? We don't know. But yeah, no, they don't
have a separate entry and full catch and those are the issues on the two family definition as you found out, right? Okay. The what the ones the board has approved over time all go with a deed restriction that requires it to be
uh multigenerational. It would not be we would not require that a mother live there, a cousin, somebody of the family that is part of the household. Understood. And we would have be agreeable because the town is a
standard form of that particular restriction. We wouldn't have a problem with multi-generational family members living in the home because that's what they purchased it for. And it gets recorded. So if somebody goes to you go to sell your house in the
future, it's it's going to be discovered as your basic position was you didn't know it was illegal. Correct. And and I can add more testimony to that fact. Somebody did know that it was illegal
before you purchased the property. The prior property owner had a notice from his own officer. Correct. And whoever handled her closing didn't discover that. Well, whoever handled their closing, the predecessor in title, and we have all this in the application packet,
purchased the property in 1997. They received a zoning violation from Michael Rogeri in um 2023 and they were given time to submit their own application to the board to ask for
the relief. And apparently they did have an attorney who wrote one letter trying to argue that it was pre-existing and non-conforming, which obviously Mr. Rogerio said no because the zoning ordinance she was referring to was from 1972 and the house wasn't even built
till 1981. So he felt there wasn't a proper reliance on that. So rather than them doing the right thing and coming to this board and getting those approvals, instead they put it on the market as it was and they never disclosed it. And unfortunately my client didn't find out
until a letter came in the mail to saying you haven't complied with my letter from 2023. And that notice of violation came June 10th of 2025. Correct. That's right. You weren't the closing attorney. I was not. No, sir. So due diligence was
involved. Well, I mean, one of the things you do, you go by, you probably find out if there's any outstanding leads, violations, whatever. In fairness, Mr. Chadwick, um, you know, in the world of residential transactional attorneys, you know, some
attorneys put the burden on the realtors to do an ORA, some of them do them themselves, sometimes real. I I know, but um, in fairness, correct. uh whatever due diligence was done, it wasn't discovered.
Um the the multiple the multiple listing that was shown to your clients stated it was a two family house. Is that correct? It's in the application. It says in different spots, different things. At the top it says single family. In the
description it says in-law suite. Then it says nanny's quarter. Then it says perfect for multi-generational living. Then in the other comments it says um mother daughter. So it's all over the map on the MLS.
So John, what do what do towns do? They write an ordinance that says they do they do primarily what we've been doing. It's a multi-generational household of relatives, however it works.
Okay. We put the deed restriction in and that's how most towns handle it. Okay. Unless they put permit two families out, right? Right. Then it's not an issue. They wouldn't be here. And this family is willing to do that. Right. Could I ask a question? Yes. In terms of the configuration of the
house, you said that um there's a separate entrance. There's a door that goes between the two living sections. Do you know how it came to be that that other living area was built? and could it be returned to a full single family
residence if say for example that kitchen was removed? So to answer your question, yes, it could be. Um you would still have that configuration on the first floor which has that separate living bedroom area.
You know, there's nothing preventing you from having a wet bar in a wreck room. You know, obviously if the stove was removed, it's not considered a full working kitchen. Okay. Um I would also like to note though, and it's in the application packet, but we brought it again as an exhibit if the
board wanted to see it, that the uh tax assessor did inspect the property back on June 17th of 2002. Noted it was a mother daughter with separate entrance, noted that it was built in 1981, and noted it had two
kitchens. Right. That doesn't make it legal. And I know that the purpose of my question is to ask whether your client would be willing to have the deed restriction state that if they were to list the house for sale, they would turn it back
into a full um single family residence. I think that would be unfair to my clients who paid above ask to purchase a motheraughter home. I would like the board maybe to hear the planning testimony. We are the last property on
the Denville border. Um it's a huge property. Um there is no I mean the separate entrance is not really a utilizable separate entrance. There's no pathway to it. It's not lit. It's in the side and the landscaping. The parents
come in through the main door. Um you know the So then why wouldn't you do it? Why wouldn't you? Why wouldn't you? Why would you remove the kitchen and the ability to have multi-generational because this board is concerned that in the future this lovely family is doing the right thing but they sell it to
somebody who says you know what I'll rent it out for somebody else but even if in fairness that would be um an enforcement issue right yeah absolutely they would be on the deed notice they
would have knowledge of it and then they would have a really hard time coming in front of the board asking for approval. They would have to go to municipal court, pay those fines for what they were doing that's wrong. So the deed restriction that your client is willing
to agree to would restrict its ability to be rented on the open market. I I'm I'm I'm wondering how we write a deed that prohibits it to be occupied by non-family members.
I think you hit the nail on the head that this is a true motheraughter. It's not for rental advertisement on the open market to strangers. There's nonlockable interconnected doors in the house. So,
you know, her parents can't lock themselves in. They can still open the door and come right into their bedroom, living room. And I think those would be the things that would be written in the resolution. We could attach a copy of the resolution to the need as well.
I'm just trying to I'm just trying to figure out an enforcement mechanism to deal with that. I think language along the lines of there cannot be any locks on the interior doors. Those doors can never be sealed. that interconnected. How about we do this? As I said before,
there's been a standardized dean restriction. You can look it over and that's that's what we've been using. Yeah. And they and and the ones we have done have required it to be returned to a single family when they sell the
property. They they did. Yeah. The one we the one we did. And why would that be such a hardship if they go to sell the house to return to a single family? Why would that affect the market value? Well, no, but I'm I'm wondering they sell it to another household in the same
circumstance. Absolutely. Does that pro the restriction would prohibit that? Well, the deed restriction that it appears the applicant would agree to would have that same restriction in it. But it's my recollection that the ones
that this board has approved before have had a provision in it indicating that it would be returned that the kitchen would be removed if the house was sold. Okay. But that's not your class. I'm going to agree to that. Well, I mean, and also in fairness with the way variances work, it kind of goes
against the whole reason we're in front of the board asking for the relief because if they took the kitchen out now, we wouldn't be here. I mean, they're looking, but you get to use it for the purpose that you want it for, right?
Over the time you want it for, and then taking it out would in theory protect our interest in not letting it become a two family. That's where I have difficulty with because if the deed restrictions in there and it's written in that
mechanism, it doesn't allow for it to turn into a two family. Somebody's doing a bad act to make it a tune family. And that's an ultimate issue. That's why we do what we do because we know that there are people that will do that by taking the kitchen out. It does
make it harder. That's why I suggested it because that's what they've that's what they've agreed to. And it's terrible that your clients had an attorney that didn't do due diligence on their behalf. But you're asking us to make up for that in a way.
Our inclusion. Wow. And I think we're giving you a I think Mr. Johnson is right. We've done it a few one or two in the past and we asked them to take the kitchen out. I don't think that's I think it is a pain in the neck, but it is kind of fair. We're not trying to stop the client from
doing what they're intending to do. Exactly. Um the stove, just as I was discussing with Mr. Chad, the stove is what triggers this issue. Are they willing to take out the stove? You still have a sink. You can have a refrigerator, microwave,
a microwave, toaster oven, that sort of. And I'm a little concerned. The family is coming to visit. No, they're going to move in. Yes, they will move in, but at the present time, they're visiting for more than 6 months. Are you all having dinner
at the same time or is mom and dad cooking in that in that facility at the when they come to visit or do you all eat together? Cook together? It's it's both, right? Uh we both work. We have crazy work hours. So there are times when they're by themselves and
they don't feel like coming to the main, you know, main uh side of the kitchen. All right. Would you could walk through the door and go, but they're both 81 and 82. Would they be will your client very limited in terms of their movement?
I fully understand. I understand fully. Would they be willing to eliminate the stove, still have the sink, still have uh the refrigerator? I I Okay, I I just want to make sure I understand. So, now we've pivoted to a
deed restriction and return it and just remove the stove upon sale to now just taking the stove out. Because we took the stove out, we wouldn't even be here asking for any relief. But we're letting you use it for the purpose you want to use it for. allowed to use it with the stove gone.
You see what I'm saying? She's allowed to have her parents in there on the first floor. Okay. But the stove there will help them now. Right. But I thought, right, you're saying remove it down the road or now, Laura? Are you saying remove it now?
Yeah. I said, yeah. Well, then they don't need the argument. We'd like to keep the stone while we have the home and we will agree to remove it if we put it up for sale. Okay, good point. I think it might have to be both the
micro and the oven. I think if it has one or the other, it could be considered [Music] Well, the problem is that you don't know what I mean. Right now, that's your definition. That's what triggers the two families. Stone. It's stone. Did I Did I hear that? that the
combination of the kitchen and the interior the um separate entrance makes it the two family. No, it doesn't cuz the separate entrance allows you to still come into the main living area. It's not sealed on the inside. You would still But let me let me just finish cuz I
thought and again maybe I just the the separate exterior entrance to this to this nanny suite or whatever we're calling it. Is that part of the logic that it's now a two family? the kitchen plus the outside door. No, it's not under your zoning. Okay.
Well, cuz my where I was going was why would we just close in the door for the outside and now it doesn't have an independent entrance. No way. It's the stove. It's the It's the kitchen. Okay. Like I said, I mean, if if eliminating that side door
made all this go away, I mean, we could probably do that, but but again, you may have an emergency, right? It doesn't work. still going to have you're still going to be in violation, right? It's the stove that's Can we try one more time? So, you're
you're sometimes both working, parents are there, they want to eat. If they had a microwave and access to your kitchen just because they didn't have a stove in their own unit, they could certainly prepare food. I'm sorry. Get rid of the stove and you can go home.
But again, if we do that, we don't need a barrier. There's no That's right. That's why you could go home. Gentlemen would like to if I may then um you know I I would ask that maybe we did try to finish the presentation um
you know and uh and see because we're here tonight for the varian so the parents can have the ability when they want some privacy. They don't want to come out and be with the family or when they're out or they get up late and they don't want to be causing noise in the
kitchen to be able to make something in their own living area. So they want to live in a two family home. Yes. Right. Well, I mean it is a mother daughter because it is connected on the inside. There's no seal doors. It's not
completely separate. This is the true definition of mother daughter living. True definition does not but it could eas but it could without a restriction it could easily be converted to something that can be rented on the
open market as it as it is configured now. Right. So if they agreed to the deed restriction that Mr. Chadwood indicated that would cause the stove to be removed upon sale. Does that alleviate the majority of the board's concerns?
Well, that would I don't know. For me, it does. I'm going have to ask the board. How do you feel, Mr. Willings? Uh, yeah. I somewhat, but I guess the point being this is only when you go to sell the house, you agree to take the
stove out at that time. Is that what you're saying? Your clients will That is your deed restriction. Yes. And your clients agreeing to that? That was our question. if they agree to that is that what makes this better for the board. Right. You understand?
Yes. M Mr. Burke, do you have Okay. I I I do I do have a concern about the separate entrance. Uh I I think there should be something done about maybe removing the separate entrance.
You know, I'd like to before I get because most houses just have one front door, right? It does have one front door. The separate entrance is in theory if you walk through the grass through the back landscaping to come in off the side porch. So they won't be using that. The parents
won't be using that door. That's what they're calling the separate entrance. But it's interconnected. It's just the side door on the house. You know, there's no pathway. There's no lighted area. You're you're walking through grass to get to the side of the house. I'd like to hear I'd like to hear the
comments from our other board members. Of course. Santos. Oh, I I think I kind of agree with you all. If there is a condition that they are going to sell the property, then they remove that stuff, it should be fair. I have serious concerns that this is
going to be sold as a two-story house, but if we put a deed restriction, I'd be fine. Yeah. Um I know that this house was built as a one family house. They're switching it to a two family because of the stove. And because of that, I will not support
it even if the deed restriction because too many of these houses end up going to two families and they're sold that way. Could I try one more thing? Yes, please. Your clients have said their parents are
not going to be using that side door because there's no walkway to it. It's not lit. They're not they're going to be coming in out of the front door, right? So, what if you take away that side door? Okay. put the deed restriction on the stove. Would you be willing to do those two things?
Why do you need that side door if nobody can be using it? I I'm not sure if we can agree that because I don't know the fire code requirement for ingress egress to get out of that side of the house cuz that is the side door for the house. You see what I'm saying? Like, you know, I mean,
if that's possible, we're that could be a possibility. Does the bedroom have a window? Yes. Yeah, we're on the first floor. They all have windows. Yes. But also you're required to have doors for ingress egress too out of the house to
work and that's why you know if they want to live I'd like to hear from your planner please you know thank you but why do they need the stove they can cook in your kitchen they can cook cook in other in their own kitchen most of them in those houses two
ovens I have two ovens in my I keep them in my [Music] Do you swear or from the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? State your name by your last name. Alexander Dowry P O U G H E R T Y
Planner and you've testified before this board before many times. Your license is still in good standing. You're accepted. Thank you. for this evening. Uh I prepared an exhibit packet for orientation purposes where we'll pass it out to exhibit and
it consists of uh just uh maps and photographs uh 10 slides. Yeah. And one we'll just call planners exhibit 10 pages. Let me have one. [Music] [Music] When this house was built, was it built?
I don't know the answer to that. I suspect not supposed to take Go. [Music] Army. Yeah. So, exhibit one is just a uh page one,
sorry, is a um map, zoning map of of Parian Troy Hills outlined in red with the little stars approximately where the property in question resides within the greater uh township.
Slide two. We're looking at the property in question as described. It is on that Dville border off of Grenada, which is a nice culdeac, very quiet neighborhood here. Just to the rear of our property is the
uh OT zone behind us uh in Route 10. But nonetheless, I think what's important here is this is the last house on the missile border in the culdeac right next to Route 10. The next couple slides here in the
exhibit are photos of the property that I took myself on a site visit as well as some interior shots of the photo from the uh uh the initial listing. So page three, we can see the property from Cornita. Very well landscaped, kind of
up on a hill. Um really nestled back there. Like I said, nice quiet neighborhood. Beautiful neighborhood. We take the drone up on the site. We can see the property as it stands there. It's got a uh nice circle driveway, twocar garage off on the side. Um but as
you see in this photo is how the property just in in the public realm. You know, they're a fairly large residential house. Slide five for illustrious purposes. I've kind of outlined in red where where we're talking about within the the residential
dwelling that mother daughter suite. What's important, if you can see on that slide off to the right of the uh red hatch lines on the roof profile, you'll see there is a deck there. There is some stairs. That is where the outside doors, the side door is kind of located here,
but nonetheless, fairly removed from the driveway, fairly removed from the front door, complete opposite ends of the garage, not a primary access point. Slide six is that first floor interior layout outlined in red is essentially
the rooms we're discussing. You can see again we have that deck which is the the the entry point, that side entrance, but it really just consists of a fairly large open area with the kitchen and a onebedroom. What is important to notice that laundry room discussion. There are
the interior doors here that really kind of separate or allow access, if you will, to the laundry room or to the rest of the house. You can close the one door and have that that that peace and quiet or open the other. But nonetheless, you have to
utilize the laundry room. There's only one laundry room here. So, this is the primary laundry. Both of these mother daughters or the primary, you know, homeowners would otherwise use this laundry room. This is this isn't a completely independent standalone unit
in that regards. It's just really a door here to muckle the sound or go to bed early if you will. But nonetheless, this is the primary focus of conversation is this right side of the house. What's important to note when we talk about the distinction of a two family versus
mother daughter slide seven. There's only one meter on this house. There's always always been and and and and this photo here shows the meter. It kind of shows how you'd have to traverse through the landscape vegetation if you do park in the driveway. Um there is not a
walkway here. There's not a pave. There's not lights here. You have to go under the trees and and so forth. But it's not the primary access point as discussed. It's just a side deck where you have your your morning coffee or tea or or walk to the go to the backyard out of there or come in from the backyard.
But nonetheless, this is what's out there today. A one metered house with that side deck entrance. Yes. Is that an easy cap on the That's stairs. Those are stairs. Those are stairs. Yes, those are stairs.
Okay. Slide two, I'm sorry, slide eight are interior photos. And you can see by the numbers on the bottom from from the listings here. This is the interior. Here. I try to put them side by side so we can kind of see the true interior.
This is the extent of the mother daughter suite. Really is a very small uh kitchenette if you will. Um minimal uh counter space here just you know for the efficient basics. At the bottom right hand you'll see the the leather
chair pumping out. Um and then on the the right photo you'll see that that leather chair again and and the tile. So that's the extent of that open floor plan right there. And again, that side door right next to the cabinet. That's that side entry point with the deck. The
next two slides are the uh bathroom. Again, efficient shower, toilet, sink, and then the bedroom as it as it exists. And again, you can see that white chair and that door frame. That's the extent of this mother daughter. And again with the interior access
um when we look at the surrounding properties and the surrounding neighborhood again we are on that municipal border of Dville uh the top left photograph is the dead end of Grenada and you can kind of see the other residential dwellings there that is Dville um we look at the house on the top right um very well you know
landscaped and and lush with vegetation foliage you know there's nothing here distinctive um bottom left is boots on the ground taking a picture of that that culde-sac sack and the bottom right is a drone peeking up of what's behind us and again route 10. So with that being said
I just want to point that out for illustrious purposes but when we talk about the uh the idea of a mother daughter let's just say for purposes of conversation their parents bought this
house section 40 col 55D-68.4 for the MLUL. Certain senior citizens permitted to rent and lease rooms. We're not renting the rooms. They're asking for their parents to be here comfortably
on the floor. I know my grandparents go to bed early and they wake up early to have that door to be closed, have that separate portion. But make no mistake about it, if it was the other way around, their parents seniors could rent home rent their rooms out in their
homes. That's part of the MLUL. It's allowed by miscellaneous law. I don't want a two family residential neighborhood just as much as the board doesn't as a planner. This is a beautiful quiet neighborhood. It's a one-metered house with a very unattractive side entrance. It's not the primary entrance. Um when we look at
this project here from a planning standpoint, we are asking for a use variance because as council stated by definition, we don't have a definition of parcipany for a mother daughter. So inadvertently its omission makes it a two family. From a planning standpoint,
this is not a two family by what we would believe it to have a separate entrance. It's separate independent solely detached. Again, we have to use the common living room. I mean, a laundry room. And at the same time, we have one meter here. And we don't have that adequate travel, paving, entry
points, and so forth. And I think council put on the record, we have no problem putting on as a deed that is for generational livingings. And from a planning standpoint, housings are getting expensive for market. We see more commonly the need for multigenerational families where grandparents living with, you know, the
grandkids and and the parents and so forth, you know, senior housing and so and the likes of that. Having that ability is there, does it make it inadvertently a two family? No, there's not two mailboxes. There's not two meters and the likes of that. So, from a planning standpoint, the board's concern I hear from a planning standpoint, it
didn't and it's what's unique about this property. It's on the municipal border. It's close route 10. It doesn't change the density. it. The bedrooms are what the bedrooms are. There won't be more people living in here and and causing so forth. We have adequate parking if their parents do choose to drive. As you
heard, they're 82. I don't think they're driving, but for purposes of the um definition for the multi-dwelling, and I'll read it, and I do apologize um for the definition. I had the uh two family dwelling or uh ordinance up and and I
was going to read it into the record, but for the two family dwelling it reads um dwelling and single family. So single family is detached building design for occupied exclusively for one family. This is meeting that definition. This is
for one family. It's not to rent out the space to a secondary family. So I think we meet the definition of the town's code for a single family. And then for dwelling of multif family, a building used or designed as a residence um for three or more families living
independently of each other and doing their own cooking therein, including apartment houses, not including motel or hotels. That's for a multif family. The dwelling for two family, a building designed for or occupied exclusively by two families living independently of
each other. Again, this is a single family operation and they're not necessarily independent. They have the ability to kind of close off and, you know, go to bed early or wake up early or do their own thing. But at the same time, there is that shared laundry facility as well. The shared doors where
the council step stipulated there will not be locks on these doors. These walls will not be sealed up. I do think we meet the true definition of a single family but by sheer purely on paper we don't have a definition for multi a multigenerational or mother daughter uh
arrangement but it is not the intent to make this a two family but so excuse me and I I think you're very eloquent and for me I don't think your intention is to make it a two okay it's the next guy right and that's the problem you don't approve
to so I think for me I see I see what this stove is that would take about 3 minutes to disconnect and for me if I saw a deed restriction with the removal of the stove when they're ready to sell that
would be suffice to me to vote yes I just got confirmation we'll do that I got confirmation I don't know how my colleagues feel that would be okay for me we'll do the the silver removal I you know what I would like to add that in my neighborhood and I live in Powdermill I live on the other side,
but all around me um three houses directly right around me. Their families have moved in with them. They did not put in another kitchen. They they had them on one end of the house, but they're sharing the home. So, for me, I
don't understand why you need a separate kitchen. We just agreed to take the stove out, but I won't record. We didn't put the kitchen in. It's been tax and that's and that's that what that was the second part of my what I was going to say. It was sold that way to them. Y and that was wrong because it was sold
that way. We don't want this house to be sold that way and that's why we want a stipulation of no stove being in the house when the house goes up for sale. Right. And we did just confirm the applicant will do that. Okay.
So, we will comply with that. Yes. Thank you. And we appreciate your concerns. We understand. Right. And it's it's nothing about having families living together because they're all around me. They're living together because it's the trend now. It is. It's expensive to live. Yeah.
Proving the application. Yeah. And we're we're So, uh just one other Let me try this other entry way too. So, looking at the picture, there's no way they're going to be going in and out of that door as a primary entrance, right? So why the big battle to keep
that door there? And I don't know the fire code. Do you have a good point if the fire code says they have to have a door to get out of that side of the house? But as Mr. Joshua was you got windows, they have ways to get out if it's on the ground floor. So I don't think that that would be in violation of a fire code if they didn't have a door
on that side of the house. I don't know for sure. No, it probably wouldn't. I have the exact same floor lame house. the same house and the back door is to the laundry is to where the I have a laundry room. The back bedroom is beyond it.
If I took that door out, it would have no impact on my house. Right. Exactly. Yeah. My only thought is, and I haven't discussed this with my client, but given that the um parents are 81, 82, you know, climbing out of a window
during a fire may not be the easiest task. I don't know if I but the f would so could we put a stipulation in uh deed restricted to no stove and on depending on the code if the code allows the door to be
changed it gets changed and if not it doesn't. My understanding is that the deed restriction you're contemplating is requiring them to remove the stone upon the sale of the house. Right. Right. And and and that that and we will agree to do that. Right. What you're asking now
is a condition of approval of the removal of the door. For me, it would be the same. No, for me it would be the same thing. When they sell that door gets sealed as well. Well, if they're going to remove the stove and not and and eliminate the
concern of it becoming a two family. Um, I guess my question would be why would you need to eliminate the door under those circumstances? I think cuz some of the board members are more concerned than I am. I I'm not concerned with the door because like I said, I have the same house. So, I have
a door back there and and and it was built that way. So, the door doesn't bother me. The stove does. I would prefer that it would be taken out when the house goes up for sale and made like a wet bar.
It looks like I said that in there. You could put a cabinet in there and where the stove was and the house could be sold, right? and the applicant will agree to that. Yes. Are there any other questions on the left here from our members?
I'm good. And just to clarify, your applicant still agrees that it's only going to be used for multi-generational for multi generational living. It's not going to be on the open market. There's only going to be one meter. Correct. All those things consistent with your planner's testimony.
Yes, sir. Mr. Johnson, is that what you put in the resolution? I can put all of that in the resolution. Correct. and I can and then we'll draft a deed restriction and we can even attach a copy of the resolution to the deed which is not uncommon to do as well. So it's
definitely on legal notice to anybody that would purchase. They would never be able to come up from this board to deny that they would I have one of our members make a recommendation to approve this application with the restrictions that
have been mentioned by Mr. Johnson. I I'll make a statement. Um uh I don't have uh and I I'm assuming the board doesn't have any problems with the application as long as the stove that will be there will be removed at the
time that the house was up for sale because anyone seeing the house and seeing it in place could mistakenly take it as a two family. The stove will have to be removed at the time that you're putting it up for sale. And I don't see
a problem in it. I I understand and realize that generational everything has changed. Families need to be together and they should and um I uh have nothing, you know, I don't see anything wrong with that.
Um so based on that, I wouldn't have any problem in approving the application. And uh application number 25 col 43 Gonath Bara and Archana Lac Cochia sorry uh 23
Grenada drive block 18 lots 21 zone R-1 recommend granting a D variance to legal well we're not legaliz we legal that's what I was going to say we're not legalizing we're not legalizing right you are granting the use variance to permit
the use as a multi-generational home, right? Not as a two family, not as a two family, a multi-generational separate living area use under condition that there'll not be separate meters. There won't be separate mailboxes when listing in the future
and that there is a deed restriction that requires the removal of the stove stove when the property is listed for sale and any future listing listed as a one family multi-generational home. Right. Okay. Absolutely. But just as matter of procedure, we forgot to open it to the public. You did.
Oh, sorry. Sorry about that. Is there anyone in the audience that would like to speak on this application either for or against this application? I sold. Hold on. Sir, you have to come forward.
State your name, please. Yeah. Come to the microphone, please. Where's your back? You can use that one. Sure. Okay. Your name? Yes. My name is Kevin Zoo. I'm the property owner next door 24 Granada. Okay.
Yeah. I've live I've been living in the community for many years and I moved out to Granada at the end of 2019. I bought this property and then I moved out uh a year later and I I love this codac. I have my great neighbor near me and then
now I'm feel like uh you know I I need to speak out something because I'm not quite sure what they're trying to do. Be honest. They're trying to have when the parents both parents come to visit. Sure. That they have a location where they can
eat when they do not want to join the rest of the family. If if the family is out, they want to do their own cooking. Okay. But the restriction will be a deed restriction stating Mhm. that when the home is sold or listed
Mhm. the stove to the kitchen must be removed. Got you. And it will be sold listed as a one family multi-generational home. Okay. So my question is are they going to trying to modify the in-laws or doing
anything else? No. Additional. That's not part of this application. That's not a perfect thing. Okay. I just want to make sure that because I see the trend in our polomial community like you guys stay now there's a you know some family
they're trying to get a uh one family become like a transform to two family in a not happening here. Right. I just want to make sure that cuz you know I don't know what's going on here, what they're trying to do, but I want to make sure cuz uh the Jim the the previous owner
was our great neighbor as well and he showed me the house before I went into the house. Very nice house, very spacious. Uh I'm just trying to see if they're and the future the com the the the owner right now they're not trying
to do like transformation for the house. They're not going to adding anything because they're not this 4,000 square footage house. There's not they were doing nothing, right? Okay. I just want to make sure that and I'm sure they will be good neighbors also. Of course. Yes. We would love to see
your great neighbor as well. Sir, we we only want to see we preserve as a single family neighborhood. Sure. That's all because that's what it is. It's a beautiful neighborhood. Yes. Thank you. And my neighbor uh which is right across the street my neighbor
also consider us this well my next door neighbor marriage also consider they're unfortunately they cannot come right now but I just want to you can't speak for them before them as well. You can you can okay but you can but you can inform them as to what this board
has approved and what your neighbor is willing to do. Sure. That would be great. I appreciate so much man. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Enjoy. Hopefully your family will be coming for many, many years to come. Oh, we do move. We have Okay. Oh, we have to vote. You You have a motion. You have a
second. Write the or to write the resolution as Mr. Johnson just said. And I'll send it to the council in draft. Great. You have a second. We both seconded. Okay. Um, I'd like to respectfully ask
before uh we go through the roll call uh Mr. Gross uh was 10 minutes late into this year in. Is she able to vote? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. She got herself up. I I I I knew before I came in. I read all my info.
We have no objection with everybody. I'm just checking. That's all. All right. Thank you. Uh Burowitz, yes. Dro, yes. Joshitz, yes. Petty, yes. Quinn, yes. Will
turn on. Yes. Thank you. Enjoy. I'd like to take a 5m minute break, please. Yes. Before we start our next meeting. Thank you.
Should I go? Should I stay or should I go now? Two minutes. Can I have two minutes? All right. Uh good evening and welcome to the meeting of the township of Precipity Troy Hills Board of Adjustment. It is Wednesday, October 8th, 2025 and it is 8 p.m. Announcement
is made that adequate notice of this meeting has been given and that it's being conducted in accordance with NJSA 104- SEC of the New Jersey Open Public Meeting Act. Public meetings act. Roll call. We have Mr. Burkowitz
here. Mr. Gross here, Mr. Mr. Joskowitz here. Mr. Petty here. Mr. Quinn here. Mr. Willins here. Chairwoman Grani present. We have a board planner, Mr. Chadwick, present. Our board engineer, Mr. Lmanoitz, here.
And our board attorney, Mr. Johnson, here. Is there anyone here in the audience that has something other to say than what is on our agenda for this evening? I see none in here now. Miss Jolie, would you please do the resolutions?
Uh application 2533 uh 81 Ncomomas block 520 lot 3. Uh those who can vote are Burkowitz, Dross, Quinn, and Grani. Someone make a motion.
I move the resolution. Second. Burkowitz? Yes. Cro? Yes. Quinn? Yes. Briani? Yes. Our second resolution application 2443 HK truck 10 Fanny Road block 448
lot 161 17 181 1920 Burkowitz Joshitz Quinn Willins can vote. Can I have a motion? Motion. Second. Burkowitz. Yes. Joshitz. Yes. Quinn. Yes. Willings. Yes.
Thank you. Application 2503. Dean Mara 62 Upper Rainbow Trail Block 117, lot 29, zone R3, a C variance to legalize a patio contrary to section 430-35,
columns 9 and 13. This application was carried from July 9th, 2025. Mr. Mara, oh, there he is. Mr. Mayor, can you raise your right hand, please? You swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. You can sit
down. Make sure you use the microphone. Keep it close to you. Um, Mr. Mayor, you were here um already, correct? Yes. And it's my recollection that the last time you were here to legalize this patio, there was some conversation about a letter from the township engineer.
Correct. Yes. Now, it seems as though you've met with the township engineer and you modified your plans. Yes. Can you just briefly describe how those plans were modified? Um, I spoke first spoke with the one of the town engineers, Brandon, but Brandon does not
work for the town anymore. So, um, I spoke with Paul. He and I met approximately maybe a week or two weeks ago within the last two weeks. They came up with a plan. I believe you guys may have, right, that lets us um that let me legalize the patio that is already existing.
Okay. So, what did you do in the plans with respect to storm water management? just briefly tell the board what you did to address that issue. Well, what what is going to happen is I'm going to have to dig a 10x10 Well, I'm I'm going to either have to hire somebody or I'm going to do it myself. A
10x10 uh ditch uh 18 in deep um and fill it with 2 1/2 in gravel of some sort. I have it written down here and Paul sended me an email about it. Um, so I have to do that and then I have to make sure that some of the water goes into the drainage pit and some of the other
water will go out to the street. Okay. And you showed those plans to the township engineer, correct? Well, he Paul and I made them together. He was nice enough to help me do that. Okay. And it's my understanding that then the township engineer issued
another letter dated October 2nd, 2025. Are you aware of that? Yes. Okay. And I think the board has that letter. Yes. Okay, I'm sorry to cut to the chase, but I figured I'd ask those relevant questions. Are there any questions from the board
on this application and the changes from our engineering department that Mr. Maro will uh concede to? Are there any questions? See none here now. Are there any questions in the audience of Mr. Maro's testimony? I see
none in here. Would uh one of my board members like to make a recommendation to approve the application, please? He met with the engineer. He comply with the engineer's request. I'm going to comply with that. So, I'll be approving the application. Thank you.
Who will make a motion to approve what you want to put in it that those plans approved by the engineer become attached to the resolution. Okay. So when it gets down to zoning, they know what's approved. Right. Do you did you submit a copy of
the plans with the changes to Miss Jolie, the board secretary? Um, no, I have not. Okay. C, can you do that? Sure. Do you have a set with you today? Um, what I have here is Let me see what I brought with me.
Uh, yes, I have. Yes, I do. Okay. So you can you can we can mark those as exhibit A1 for today's purposes and you can give them to the board secretary before you leave. Right. All right. Yes. And um um Miss Jolie, may I pick up them? If I give you this
copy like I could come by like if I give you this tonight, may I come back like within a week? And we would hold on to that. Uh unless you want to Can you make a copy? Yes. Can you make a copy? Uh how big is it? What's that? How large? Um
fine. Make a copy. Okay. Thank you. Would one of the board members like to frame a resolution, please? Application 25 col03 Dean Mara 62, Upper Rainbow Trail, block 117, lot 29, zone
R3, recommend granting a C variance to legalize a patio contrary to section 430-35, columns 9 and 13. uh with agreement of doing everything that was discussed with the engineer and us getting a copy of the plans.
Thank you. Second Burkowitz, yes. Crows, yes. Joit, yes. Peddy, yes. Quinn, yes. Will, yes. Yes. Mr. Mar, your application is
approved. You'll be receiving a letter and at that time you can pick up your applications for construction. Application number 25 col04 Gina Simmons 20 Upper Rainbow Trail
block 117 lot 12 zone R3 a C variance to construct first floor additions second floor addition covered front porch with front stairs second floor covered deck colon balcony
com balcony over first floor deck front walk expansion an AC unit on a concrete pad. Contrary to section 430-35, columns 5, 8, 10, and 13, this application was carried from September
the 10th, 2025. Hello. Can you raise your right hand, please? You swear or affirm that you're about to give you the truth, the whole truth, and nothing else. Can you state your name, spell your last names, please? Starting with you, sir. Uh, William Watts. L U TZ.
Gina Simmons. S I M O N S. You guys can have a seat. So I don't recall how far you got in your testimony the last time. Did you get into things other than just the engineering report or did the engineering report kind of dominate the
conversation and then let you go under? I I believe we got into it a little bit, but the the way we left the last variance hearing is that we needed um some sort of formal approval from uh a town engineer saying that the storm
water management plan that was put together by um Tom Graham from Daer Walker was acceptable to the township which we have received. It it looks like that's been done. Yes. I I don't know if the board has any questions about their overall plans or not.
If that was the only issue that needed to be addressed. I think that was the only issue. Do you, as was stated before, does the town have a drawing of what you're going to be accomplishing with your storm water management? Yes, that was forwarded to the town to
them. Yep. And and uh Paul uh sorry, Dehoff. Yes. Thank you. uh has those plans and he is the one who uh drafted the the letter uh approving those storm water management plans and Miss Jolie has that in her possession.
I I believe so. I'm sorry. It was forwarded to Nora, but I do have a a unfortunately our printer was on the fritz, but I I do have a a copy on my phone. Do you have a copy? I don't recall receiving a copy. We will we will need that to give given to Miss Jolie.
Okay. Save is a prior application. So when it gets down to zoning, they will sign it off once they see the plans. Okay. And they know what you're just going to go with. Okay. Right. So So you're going to come in and and give Miss Jolie a copy of those plans,
which we will for the purposes of today's record anticipatorily mark as A1. Okay. So make sure that Miss Jolie has a copy of those plans of of the storm water management plan. Yes. Yes. Okay. Go. Is there anyone in the audience that has
comments either pro or con on this application that we've heard tonight? I see none of them. Would one of the members like to make a recommendation to approve this application? Please. Yeah, I'm going to recommend doing it. I think uh they went they did what they
had to do. They're addressing the storm water. So to me it'll be approving it. Frame a resolution. One board member, please. Oh, yeah. Did you open it to the public already? Yes. Yeah, you did.
Okay. All right. Application 25 col04. Gina Simmons 20 upper Rainbow Trail block 117 lot 12 zone R3 recommend variance to construct the first floor additions. Second floor edition covered front porch with front stairs. Second
floor covered deck balcony over first floor deck. front walk expansion an AC unit on a concrete pad contrary to section 430-35 columns 5810 and 13 uh with agreeing to do what is said on the storm water plan
that was agreed to with the town engineer and upon us getting a copy of those plans. Thank you. Approval please. Second. Second. Burowitz. Yes. Krauss, yes. Josh, yes.
Petty, yes. Quinn, yes. Willings, yes. Yes. Application is approved. We'll be receiving a letter and at that time you can go to the office and then we'll construction. Thank you. Thank you. Application 25 col 32
T-Mobile 1280 Route 46 block 712 blocks 43.1 zone B2. a minor site plan with a C variance to construct a permanent wireless facility.
[Music] Go ahead. Good evening, Madam Chair. Is it okay if I see you then? Sure. Definitely. Good evening. Is it I'm Is this on? We're going to be you have to get close. Very close. Got it. Yes. Yes.
Good evening, Madam Chair, ladies and gentlemen of the board. Jennifer Kerrick from Price Me Showman and Dr. Armenino on behalf of the applicant T-Mobile. Um before I get into our presentation and testimony, I just want to confirm adequate notice and the board has jurisdiction to hear this application.
My assistant provided the requisite notices to uh Nora. Yep. It's all fine. All good. All good. three. So, T-Mobile has filed his application to the ZBA for site plan approval with associated use and bulk variance relief and we're
proposing to deploy a permanent facility at block 729 lot 6.09, also known as 1280 US Route 46 East. This proposed wireless installation is the replacement site for the wireless
installation that was located at 1269 Route 46 East, which has since been decommissioned. Right now, there is a temporary, however, on that on that site. T-Mobile is proposing to install a permanent wireless facility consisting of nine panel antennas on the rooftop of the
three-story building with a center line of 36 ft. We're also proposing a 14t x 7 ft equipment gated compound to be located on the ground in the rear of the property behind the building and that will contain a total of two equipment cabinets with associated wireless
equipment. So, to just recap what we're seeking in terms of the relief, and I'll have my planner get into it in his testimony, but again, we're seeking site plan approval for the wireless rooftop installation in the B2 highway development district where the
property is located and where wireless facilities are not permitted. It is respectfully submitted that the location chosen for the rooftop wireless installation is part particularly suited along the route 46 highway and that the height of the proposed antennas is required to provide reasonably
comparative service in the vicinity. Additional variance relief required is for minimum sideyard stepback and also due to alteration of a non-conforming structure as a result of the height of the existing building. also proposed are certain deviations from the township
wireless code which again my planner will get into and we'll address during his testimony. I have three witnesses with me this evening. I have Josh Catrell of French and Purillo who's our engineer. I have Dan Czech of Purecon Solutions who are is our RF consultant and I have Tim Kron of TK Design
Associates who's who is our planner. Um I do believe we received all the reports. I have two reports from the engineer and I have one report from your board planner. Um I think that's it. I apologize. I did a second report but
unfortunately didn't get sent and that's my fault. Uh it's the only difference is a suggestion that you have a photo sim of what the bank of antenna on the back of the into the building which is your bearings the
residential unit would look like. We do have photos. Sure. We we submitted photo sims and my planner will present them this evening as well. Um other than that I think I can bring up my first witness. Great. Please [Music]
raise your right hand. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but I do. State your name, spell your last name. Please make sure you use the microphone. Uh Joshua Kotel. I'm with French and Carell Associates. Uh C O T R E L L.
Great. Thanks. Mr. Control, would you please give the board the benefit of your qualifications and experience? Sure. I have a bachelor's uh in science and uh civil engineering from Ruckers University. Have over 20 years experience in site plan design. I've uh uh been uh I I
testified before uh probably 100 boards now throughout New Jersey and I do hold a current valid uh professional engineering license in the state of New Jersey. Qualified. Thank you very much. Um Mr. to the trial. Would you just um
I'll wait till you get to the Sure. What you're presenting this evening was prepared by you, correct? Uh yes, it was for somebody from your Yes. Before we begin, do you want to mark that in? Was it submitted? It was submitted. We don't need to mark it. So, it's a revision like this is the revision.
This is the last one. What? Just say the date. Yes. I'm going to So, I'm going to refer to the site plan submitted to the board. Last revised September 6, 2025. And those were previously submitted. Great. then you don't need to mark it. Great. Okay. Um Okay. So, the existing site is
located at 1280 Route 46 uh block 712 lot 43.01. It's a uh two to 2 and 1/2 threetory office building. Um it's got several tenants located in it.
Uh there's uh access there's access from some it's a corner lot. So, there's access from Summit Street and there's also access from Route 46. Um, surrounding the area, there's a a parking lot. Um, to the west of the site is the uh I
believe it's the Longhorn Steakhouse restaurant there. And to the outback, thank you. Outback and to the uh northeast uh is the residential area. Uh, T-Mobile is proposing to install
antennas on the exist nine antennas on the existing rooftop in three separate sectors. Um, install equipment at the rear of the building at grade within a fenced enclosure. Uh, within that fenced enclosure, it'll be two uh cabinets, a
radio cabinet, a battery cabinet in addition to an electrical cabinet, and a fiber management box. This is not replacing anything. This is new. This is new to this property. To this property. To this property. Yes. Replacing what was on 1269
which is adjacent or 1269 is the Top Golf. Oh, okay. Um so we had to come off that site when they built the Top Golf and they didn't have an interest for antennas on their rooftop. So we had to find an alternative location. Okay.
Uh we're also T-Mobile is also going to propose since there's no access to the roof right now uh we're proposing a ladder uh which will be uh the base of the ladder will be within that fence new fenced compound. Uh the fence will be 6t
high with privacy slats. Uh it'll it'll mimic the adjacent to the east is a fenced enclosure that has two dumpsters inside of it right now. Um, so it'll be right next to that.
Um, just flipping over. Go to sheet A-01, which is just a uh larger view of the rooftop. As I said, there's going to be uh uh nine antennas in three different sectors. Uh they're going to be installed on a ballast steel
steel ballast frame which is rests on top of the roof. And then again at the base will be the compound. Um, also extending up to the roof will be a cable tray that we'll paint to match uh the color of the uh building facade. And
that'll come up and it'll carry the uh the cables from the equipment at the grade to the antennas on the roof. Again, this is just a larger view on sheet A-02. It shows the three antennas in each
sector. Uh the two equipment cabinets in the uh shade gray here. And then the utility cabinets over here. Uh we'll place some uh protected ballards inside the fence enclosure so you can't see them from the outside.
Uh the total uh size of the fence enclosure will be uh 14 ft by 7 1/2 ft. Um there's an existing grass area right at the rear which we're proposing to put the uh the equipment at. Uh there's no
vegetation that'll be disturbed. Uh no trees, no shrubs. Uh it's just grass right now. Uh sheet A-03 is just an elevation view um showing the elevation from the rear of the building. So you can see the new ladder going up to the side. We'll put
some safety railings uh at the roof. Um and then you can see the antennas uh the three antennas in one of the sectors also. And then the equipment upgrade. Um and that's pretty much it. Um access to the it's a
um remotely monitored site, so there's no permanent employee occupancy. a uh cell technician visits a site once every four to six weeks just for routine maintenance um diagnostics um and they just show up in a typical
SUV usually type vehicle um uh the only utilities that are required will be electric and then in then the fiber we're proposing to extend electric underground from a utility pole in uh in Summit Street.
Um there's no fumes, no toxic or anything like that. Again, the only utilities is electric and fiber. So, I'm not sure you're the right person to ask this question, but here goes. So, you're asking for only a C variance, correct? No, you're asking for
D D because it's not permitted the So, what's So, it's not permitted because of the actual structure um wireless Okay. So,
my question is this. Is there something going on in the state now where they are being classified as a like a business entity where they're getting taxed as a [Music] separate business
and therefore do they need a devariance for having another business in a certain zone? Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, I heard it. Just have I know what you're talking about. Okay. Is that true what I said or not? It doesn't doesn't really I don't see it
coming into play here because it's not permitted. We do permit towers and and these types of facilities in various locations, but most of them in town needed the Dvarian. So, if they get the Dvarian, it will
cover if it's classified. Won't make any don't make Okay. But the only thing they do have to pay is affordable housing development fees. Okay, we're well aware of that. I think everybody is in the state of New Jersey at this point.
I have a question on page A03. The height of the antennas are 36 feet. No, 30 36 that Well, I have feet. I don't have any inches. So the
okay the height of the largest tallest antenna is 8t high. So that's going to be so we usually leave it 1 ft below the bottom of the antenna and the top of the highest part of the building. So it's going to be 9 ft above top of the highest part of the
building. Okay. And you're stating that you're going to have a 6ft fence. Yes. At grade level that that's that's for the equipment compound. There's no fencing up there. There's no fencing. whatsoever. So, this
is close to um Ball Avenue Summit where there are private homes. So, you got the Dennis in the corner. You got a house in the back corner where Hawkins and Summit. Yes. Okay. That's the one that's 148 ft from
Yeah. to the property line of the of the home or to the house. It's it's about 148 ft to the property line. probably from the antenna from from the closest antenna. And what is it? What is the rule? 150.
150. That's that's um in Mr. Lamez Witz's October 6th report. That's um item E item 3E under general information, right, Tom? Yes. So, in terms of the bulk variances,
you've got do you are you familiar with Mr. man's October 6th, 2025 report. I am. Yes. Okay. So, 3A is the use variance. 3B is the um antenna shall not extend
more than 8 ft above the height of the existing building or 9 ft is proposed. Are you going to testify about why 9 ft's needed? I'm going to have my planner testify. Got it. Why that is needed? Okay. How about the rest of the ones listed in Mr. Lemanitz's report? The planner. Planner is going to testify about all
those. Correct. Okay. Not the engineer. But what a house. We don't want to make them do all the work. Pretty good size. Um, that's all I have unless you have it. Yeah, that's you covered everything. That's all I have for this witness.
I guess does the does the fencing on the ground level is that going to affect the uh number of parking spaces on the ground? So, so there's there's a space between the end of the parking lot and the building where we're going to put the equipment. So, we're not going to
take up any parking spaces. You're in a grassy area. In a grass area, correct? What I would probably propose, which isn't on the plan, are um kind of the uh the concrete bumpers in those spaces just so they
don't drive too far and hit the hit the fence. The building is occupied with tenants. It is. Yes. Just a question on the building height. How did you compute the average grade because there's no topography,
right? So, we just use kind of GIS equipment for that. Um, so we just it's an estimate of the great elevations there. We we don't have a topographic information. We really don't know how tall the building is.
It's about 29 1/2 ft. Um, you know, I I would say plus or you know, I could be within a couple feet or so, but I but we're not going to be over the 35t max. Okay. Are you satisfied they're not going to
be over the 35 foot max? I can't say because there's no I mean I don't know how accurate the GIS is. Um you know the ground is that I don't know I can't I can't say so what do you want to do?
I mean we would be happy to provide a topo you know if if board decides to favorably approve this as a condition of approval. Well, we could we could do um as a if the board chooses as a condition, I get that actual height computed per the
ordinance and if it if it isn't non-conforming, then we're fine. But if it then turns out to be non-conforming, then we may have to be back, right? We're good with that. You okay with that?
Anybody have a question about that? Any of the members have a question? Yeah, I do. Where do we show where can we see where you're putting the equipment on the ground in the photos that I'm looking at here? I can't see it.
Are they in the photo sims? I haven't seen them. Uh when the planner comes up, I'll go through the photo sims and print that out. But that's not a grassy area. Excuse me for the grassy area. Photograph 1B shows you
photo simulation post installation. That's the planner that I'll testify to that. He prepared those. [Music] I think the planner he's he's last but not least. I still have one other before him.
Okay. Are there any questions from the audience on the information just given by gentlemen? I see none in here. Do we have any other questions from our board members? You know, okay, please. For my next witness, I'd
like to bring up Daniel Czech of Pure Consolutions who will be testifying um as a RF consult. [Music] Well, that's why question. That's where it Okay. Okay, raise your right hand, please, to swear or affirm the testimony that you're
about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and state. Please state your name, spell your last name, please. Daniel Czech, Czech C. Mr. Czech, will you please provide the board with the benefit of your qualifications and experience for the record? Yes. Uh, I hold a bachelor's degree in
engineering from NGIT. Uh, I have experience running propagation analysis for several wires carriers. Um um I've conducted numerous uh radio frequency
emissions reports for uh FCC compliance. Um I've also appeared before several municipal boards as including uh Piscatoaway Union Woodbridge and this board as well. Qualified. Thank you very much. Um Dan, you
prepared what you're about to present, correct? or your office did. That is correct. Is that something that was submitted? Yes, it was. Okay. Pretty much everything has around this. Well, I don't know. Yeah, that's why they No, they don't report.
Did you suggest that they do something? So, Purecon Solutions prepared an RF justification report and in that justification report, there was four exhibits that were prepared. Uh, one of those exhibits was T-Mobile's existing macro sites within uh, Paripany.
Can you speak up, please? Um, so, uh, on this map we have in purple uh, showing the town's border. Uh, and then we also have blue macro on air sites that indicate T-Mobile.
You were all provided this in your application packages. Excuse me. So um we on this map show uh the blue macro onair sites. These are all existing T-Mobile uh onair sites with the exclusion of
NJ06490 which was uh recently decommissioned. Um and in Paripony there's uh about 12 on air macro sites. And uh on this map as well, we can see
uh in red I80 which spans um uh from east to west uh from north to south. Also in red we have interstate uh 287. In green we show uh US um
46 46 correct. Um, and then we also on this map show the proposed permanent site in pink and that is located uh across the street of 46 from the uh recently
decommissioned NJ06049C where there's currently a temporary site. [Music] So, T-Mobile is licensed to provide uh
service in by licensed by the FCC to provide service in the 600, 700, 1900, 2100, and 2500 megahertz frequency bands. And uh I have prepared some exhibits that show T-Mobile's coverage
from uh onair sites. So on this map, this is more zoomed into the target area where we have uh site NJ6 049C um located centrally on this map and we
have the existing coverage currently provided by all on air macro sites for this area. And uh in a green color here we see uh the reliable inbuilding coverage that T-Mobile is providing to this area in the midband.
And now if we take a look at the next slide. [Music] Now we have uh Tim Mobile's existing mid-band coverage without NJ06049C. This is now with that site
decommissioned. So we can see that there is an obvious reduction in coverage um most notably around uh US uh highway 46 uh some residential areas off of uh 46.
And um uh now if we move on to the next map where we have [Music] T-Mobile's existing mid-band coverage without NJ0649C,
but with the proposed replacement site, we can now see that the pink site marker here centrally located is now on air and is now replenishing the coverage that was previously provided by NJ's 06049
C. Thank you. Dan, you also prepared you also prepared a uh art a compliance report. Correct. That is correct. And that is dated. Yes. July 17th, 2025. That is correct.
And just for the record, the board was provided with a copy of this RF uh evaluation. Um, can you just describe to the board your results of the compliance with New Jersey and and federal?
Yes. So the EMF report that was uh provided uh was to evaluate the proposed sites uh compliance with federal and state RF exposure standards and the analysis was performed with uh the FCC standards for maximum permissible
exposure and the New Jersey Radiation Protection Act standards. And these standards are both conservative and they include significant safety factors and our methods follow worst case and cumulative approach when conducting these analysis.
Um so all the transmitters are operating simultaneously at full power and there is no signal loss uh along the transmission path. And our results of that analysis concluded that the site would be within 16.3% of the FCC allowable limit which is six times below
and 3.3% of the New Jersey allowable limit which is 30 times below. And both of these values were well below any exposure limits established by federal and state agencies confirming that the site will operate
safely with uh applicable regulations. So just to recap your testimony, this site is replacing the site that was at the 1269 Route 46, which is the proposed Top Golf site. That is correct. Okay. So in order to keep the reliable coverage that we have now, we needed to
find a new site location and this is what we were able to find within that vicinity that wouldn't um result in a disruption of service. Correct. That is correct. Thank you. I have nothing further. And how many people would have obstruction of service if you don't get in sight?
So, uh, according to the 2020, uh, census, uh, population data, uh, we gathered around 1,700 people would be affected. Would not be able to have T-Mobile service without this site. Is that what
your testimony is? Uh, well, that's how many people would be affected. They they might still experience some level of service. it just wouldn't be uh adequate to T-Mobile standards for your standards or their for for their needs.
That would be for uh the ultimate uh experience on their network. You know, being able to initiate a call whenever you would want to on their T-Mobile's network and, you know, not have any dropped calls or anything of that nature. And this also affects commuters along
Route 46, correct? commuters along Route 46 that will use their phone driving through the area. They wouldn't have service if they didn't if we didn't have the site put up. Okay. And this was the best location that you
could find for this application for these uh towers. Correct. I'll have my planner testify to that. Please. I have a question. Uh is are there any other wireless carriers going to be sharing this equipment or not at this
in the future? Never is a wireless carrier sharing another wireless carrier. They always have their own equipment. So if if another wireless carrier were to go up, it would be their own antennas and their own uh equipment. They'd have to come here again.
And yeah, they'd have to get board approval just like we are. Let me ask you a question. The temporary location is on the other side of 46. Top Yeah. Route 1269, Route 46. On opposite side where they're building where they're building Top Golf. That's Top Golf. Sister I thought you
said you leave that site. You left that site. But there's a temporary there now. There's a temporary there now until we can get a permanent site. Stay there. Yeah. But we got to get the temporary off unfortunately. We would love to have stayed at where we were located, but
there that just wasn't an option unfortunately. Are there any questions from the board on the testimony given? Is there anyone in the audience that has any questions procon on the testimony that we've just heard from this
application gentleman engineer J. Thank you. Thank you very much. My last witness is Tim Kron who will be testifying in his capacity as a professional planner.
[Music] [Music] We got something ready. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I do. You state your name, spell your last name. Timothy M. Prompt. K R O N K.
Can you grab a microphone, please? Sure can. [Music] Good evening. Good evening. Good evening, Mr. Kron. Would you please provide the board with the benefit of your qualifications and experience for the record? Certainly. I have a bachelor of science from the University of Massachusetts. I
have over 33 years of land use experience predominately in New Jersey. I am a New Jersey licensed professional planner and an AICP certified planner. I have testified throughout the state uh and been accepted in the as an expert in the area land use planning including both parcanies planning board and zoning
board. You're acceptable. Thank you. Why thank you. And just to confirm your license is still a good standard. My license is still valid. Yes. Thank you. Yes. Um listening to the uh prior
witnesses testify, uh I realized one thing. uh our other applications for the temporary facility actually went to the planning board and being in front of the zoning board I realized that the board does not have the history uh of the
temporary um that I I I was thinking that you may have. So, uh I do have an exhibit here. Uh it's actually a planning board exhibit um that for our temporary facility and I would just like to mark this. It wasn't submitted, but I would just like to use
this exhibit to uh refresh or um bring bring a little history to the uh story uh on how we got to the property we're at now. Okay. So, we'll mark that A1 for tonight's purposes. We'll mark it as today's date. Sure. Tenny.
[Music] Oh, look at that. A year and a half ago. [Music] Okay. Uh what we have here is a a Google Earth uh aerial photograph. It has a
date of April 29th, 2022. And um uh obviously uh predominant features on the exhibit A1 uh route 80 to the south, 46 paralleling it a little farther north. Um, we have the shopping
center ab budding Route 80. Uh, this property here is the Top Golf property. Uh, all these buildings on the property are now gone. Uh, we have part of Smith Fields sneaking in on the corner here and subject property for this
application is right across Route 46. Uh, as you can see in close proximity to the top grow property. Uh if you look at the uh building that used to be there, 1269, this was the original location uh where
um T-Mobile and Sprint were located on this rooftop. Uh when they had to move off of the rooftop because of the Top Golf facility coming in, we made application to the planning board for the installation of a temporary
facility. Now, on this exhibit, the temporary facility was labeled as a red dot in this corner. We ended up changing the application and it ended up over in the same uh proximity to Route 80, but in the back corner.
And um of course, when we did the temporary facility, we were looking for the same type of situation as we are now. We were trying to maintain the existing coverage that the carrier had and needed to stay in close proximity to
the original uh location of the installation on this building. The best way I can describe it is you have a big puzzle. It's the it's the cellular network of this carrier in the whole state. We're taking out one little piece
of that puzzle because we had this building came down and we have to find another way to put that piece back in in close proximity. So these type of applications and in replacing existing facil
replacing existing facilities or coverage is pulling out a a puzzle piece putting it back as close as you can to fit the coverage back into the network. And that's what we did on our original um uh application for the temp. We went
from this rooftop down to this corner. And since this temporary was only temporary, um we had to find another location in once again in close proximity to the original that we could locate on. Um most to to replicate the
coverage here. This was a two-story building. Um many of the other buildings like in the shopping center are all one-story buildings and those buildings would not be tall enough to replicate the coverage. There was actually one building that we had looked at a budding
Smith field um right behind the the new Wonder Building uh a flat rooftop building here that uh RF had approved for an installation. um but the uh property owner there backed out of the lease. So once we started
looking around once again in the close proximity to the original 1269 application, one of the taller buildings in the area happens to be the subject property at 1280. So without having to build a new support structure and be
able to eliminate this uh need for a tower in the area, this really came down to being our only option to use an existing structure to replicate the coverage that uh T-Mobile has been providing to this area for over 20
years. both coverage on Route 46 and 80 Smithfield and all the residences that the radio frequency engineer referenced. So, I hope that was a good summary to bring everybody up to speed of where we are and how we ended up at the subject
property. We got it. Okay, Tim, this is part of the visual the photo sims that you uh Yes. Yes. This exhibit is uh is um in the visual analysis package that uh was
submitted and this uh exhibit um it's the same only uh larger and mounted. [Music] Uh this is uh actually a Google Earth image. Um and this one actually has a
newer date. This is October 8th, 2024. Um and on this one, subject property is uh uh 1280 uh route 46 uh block 712, lot 43.01.
Um, in the center of uh the aerial uh as was described by the engineer, we have a building 2 and a half three stories. Uh we have the uh the diner the vacant diner property across Route 46. We have
the new wonder building and then this um um stretch of property after that that is the frontage of the uh the new top golf facility. Uh the uh yellow dots on here correspond directly to the photos
that were in the uh visual analysis um package. And I'll run through those uh photos now. We should mark that, right? No, it's in the package. It's part of the submission. Yes, it's the it's the same as the photo
location map in the in the package. Just the way it's in this. There we go. Okay. So the first photo exhibit is exhibit number one. Uh this is located right at the intersection the view location of Summit Street and Route 46.
And this corresponds the photo 1A and 1B in the package. Um the with the existing conditions photo on the left and then on the right the computer simulation where the antennas that would be visible from this location have been inserted into
the uh program via computer simulation. [Music] Uh photo location number two is over right at uh the intersection Route 46 and Graange Road looking back to the subject property uh right between the
New Wonder facility and the abandoned diner. Uh once again on the left photo 2A existing conditions photo and then on the right 2B which is the photo simulation of the proposed installation uh that would be visible from this
location. Um two sectors in the front are simulated and a very small portion of the third sector is visible um would be visible from this location and has been simulated in the photograph. These boards you're passing out are
these same picked. Yeah, it's just a larger version that we have. Yeah. You want me to skip the board? Whatever the board wants. We don't we no problem. I don't want to waste your time. You mean don't pass the boards around or
don't even through the rest of the photos. There's no reason to pass the boards around as Oh, okay. I'll but I'll go through them but it'll still present the meeting. So uh location number three is on the uh the aerial photo represented on three yellow dot. This is the driveway to the
uh top golf facility looking back towards the subject property 1280. And in this location 3A is the existing conditions photo and 3B is the computer simulation with the antennas from that location that would be visible.
Next photo location is photo four on Hawkins Avenue. This is in front of what would be the closest residence to the subject property. Uh this is actually 183 Hawkins. Uh looking back towards the subject uh property at 1280 which uh
when you look at this besides the antennas, you would also want to notice the large amount of uh evergreen vegetation along um along Summit Street both on uh the the uh east side and
along the uh subject property. And in 4B uh the computer simulation shows you there uh what would be visible from this installation at that location uh on Hawkins. And from here one antenna sector would be visible and also part of
the railing associated with the um the lad at the top of the ladder there has to be a little um return return on the railing. So there's a little railing there that would part of that railing would be visible and has been shown in the simulation. Uh also clearly you can
see here from um there is no visibility of the equipment compound itself. Any visibility associated with the installation is purely um due to the uh equipment on the rooftop. Brock, before you go on to your next uh photo, uh 4B
4B shows the equipment on the roof of the building that is going to be quite visible to the resident that is there and possibly even to other residents. Is it possible to uh
put some sort of a screening around that uh those u towers? I'm going to call them towers. the the type of I mean the the antenna the screening I'm sorry antennas I'm calling them towers but they're oh okay okay so you're saying the
antennas putting putting walls up um especially on a shorter building here it could be explored what happens here is you end up with a lot more mass than you have with the with with the
antennas I I I realize that the antennas are visible but if you just picture through that area and have a wall and a solid wall in front of it with the returns, you really end up with a lot more mass than you do with just the with just the antennas themselves.
I don't think it would be more pleasing to the eye to this resident that's there. Honestly, no. I think I think this is not this is not something that really stands out from this location being the closest residence. I don't think that's something that they're going to notice
most the time after, you know, after it's constructed. But I do think, you know, because we I mean, we'd end up with three large boxes on on this roof. This is not a big building and it's not a high rooftop. I mean, we'll explore it
if the board would like us to. We have other options. Um there is we do have the ability to paint the antennas. They're already a light gray and light gray blends in pretty well with the steel gray skies in New Jersey, but I mean we could we could do something with
that. And there's also something that um we use um that it's a reflective film. You put the film on there so it picks up the reflections of the clouds and and trees and stuff in the area and does a little better job of, you know, masking it. But um
yes, I really think the boxes do a lot add a lot more mass and make the building overall look bigger. It's almost like you're adding another story, right? Well, by the time you put three box three of the boxes and have to box in that whole antenna array. So the antenna location uh that probably
most concerning is the one at the rear of the building which is very visible to the rest. Yes. So you have three antennas. They're all the same height. No, they're all different sizes. As you look in the photo simulation, you'll see there's a large, a medium, and a small. Okay. And the large is located where
the large is the one on the right hand side there. Right. Exactly. We're just talking about, right? Yes. Sorry, I can use the largest one is next to the residence. Uh, the largest one is actually the third one over. No, it's on the right away from the residence. You have two out on 46.
Oh. Oh, no. No. Each Okay, let's let me back up. There's three sectors of three. Each sector has three different has three different that each one has a large, a medium, and a small. Got it. So, it's not that we can take the put the large out in 46. We have one more time. The the three antenna
sections of three. Yes. Okay. Why can't they be closer together up to roof 46? Why do you have to have the one way at the end of our end of the building closer to the residence? Well, that's to provide the coverage in the in that direction. But what happens
is if you take those antennas and move them farther towards 46, then the RF engineer is going to have to take them and and make them higher because um the beam runs into the roof. So if he moves if he moves the antennas back, he's also
going to have to move them up. So what what how are the antennas up front going to work then? They're they're shoot they're at the edge of the building. They're shooting the ones the ones in the front. If you look on the aerial photograph, you'll see there's three red boxes I have on the roof.
Okay? So, this one, this sector here is shooting down Route 46. So, it's right at the edge of the building. This one here is shooting to the west. Mhm. So, that one's right at the edge of the building. And so, that one's fine. This
one shooting northeast is at the edge of the building. So, the building is not obscuring it from this location. chance shooting northwest. Um, currently nothing there. I guess I could have the radio frequency engineer explain what's going on over there. But
this we're we're replicating what was on the um across the street and that was the coverage for 46 Route 80 in in Smithfield area. I don't personally as a planner I don't know what's what's up there but I we're trying to replicate
the old coverage and there wasn't. So, you're saying that these antennas are covering opposite than route 80? They're not. No, there's the No, this would get to Route 80 as well. It will. Yes. Mhm. Yep. The front two would get to Route 80.
Yes. Yes. The rear sector would not get to 80. Let's explore that question that was raised. You start sliding it back across the room. How how high does the antenna have to be elevated? Um, I think I better bring the engineer up for that
before I step out of my uh sphere of influence. He said he said he needed a foot clearance just normal installation. How high would these antenna these antenna are 8 ft? The biggest one is 8 ft, right? Yes.
Okay. So, let's So, they're asking for for what's the distance for you to move back that you're going to have to increase with every flight? Once you give him the microphone, make sure you use the microphone. There there would be some calculation that has to be done there. But uh Tim is
correct. Uh there there is such a thing as shadowing. When you do that is why antennas are mounted as close to the edge as possible just so that they're not obstructed. They're uh the antenna pattern for the most part projects outwards but also downwards. So by
putting it as close to the edge of the roof as possible, you reduce that shadowing. But uh I can't that's a desirable way to do it. Correct. For symphony I think has 50 eight different locations for antennas.
I'm sorry. Say that again. Something like that. Say that again. I'm sorry. 50 58 different locations in precipitas. There's a lot of them on roofs. There's a lot of them on and they aren't all out on the edge. Cor. Yeah. I mean Yeah. Uh I'm not sure if that count is
correct, but I I'm not a cuz obviously I only sign him. I get it. But all I what happens a lot of time I think you have to I think you have to provide that information because there's no question you that
house what information we had an application for the dentist on the corner years ago. We had meetings after meetings after meetings about the impact of the Dennis parking lot on that house. Okay. So,
we're going to put the antenna on the back corner of this building. And there's no question you can see it. So, what information are you looking for specifically? How far you could slide it back from the edge of that edge of that roof. And to
me, as soon as you start moving it back, it visibility drops a lot. Because I think I agree with you. So even I think screening would make a bigger magnitude than I think that's where you kind of shoot yourself in the foot.
Yeah. If you move it 10 ft over, do you have to go 10 ft higher? I mean that we need Well, that's I I really can't comment as to how far back or how high you would have to go, but yeah.
[Music] So the calculations you use to put this antenna location in that spot would loop replicate the ability you had to provide the service from the previous location. Is that correct? Take it down
from from the location across the street the temporary location. Yes. Yes. Correct. And so now if that to me I know looking across the street over at that map I can't see why that tower couldn't be moved over a considerable difference distance and still provide that same service area.
What about just the other corner? Yeah, just the other corner. I'm the the tower on the other property. No, the tower that we're proposing here on the far Oh, you mean the antenna? The antenna. I'm sorry. Well, you're operating right now, so
it's not critical that we get this done tonight. In fact, it would seem to me we should have a calculation of how w how high this antenna would be in the middle of the
you know to put it all the way back on 47, but once you get to the middle of the room, its visibility, I think, is going to be significant. Let's see. Yeah, we can look at that. I mean,
we also we have not looked at the uh the structural analysis for the roof either. I mean, that was only done for the section. And how do you know that point's going to work? No, no, the corn they the engineer did the work at the corners where you have the diagonal bearing between the corners. Yeah, we provided the structural.
He's not done anything in the middle of the roof for what they proposed. Now, we're not talking about a big load here. I mean, I would assume I think I'd like to hear eventually if the owner of that home is here and what their thought is. We're
projecting that there's an issue he might just say whatever and it not really being well he was he was noticed so he the gentleman is here. Okay. He's here. Is it inappropriate to not at this point? Okay. Let's see where the testimony goes and
then he'll have an opportunity to either ask questions or speak. Okay. I'd rather keep the record clean at this point. Um, is are you done? He's got to put it as planned. We haven't even gotten there yet. But I just wanted to make sure that he
was going to address Absolutely. Yes. Okay. Um uh as uh was saying the proposed T-Mobile installation was for the 9 and 10 sectors as depicted on the simulation. We are located in the B2
zone. D2 zone is a zone that does not permit wireless telecommunications. So we do require relief from the nature of a D1 use variance. Uh we also have a bulk variance for uh the municipal ordinance requirement that a um the fact
that we're over a twotory uh building here um in the zone the B2 zone that allows two stories 35 ft. We're over two stories approximately 2 and 1/2 um and we're altering a non-conforming structure. Uh so we need relief there
and also minimum sideyard setback of 24 feet is required uh from the equipment compound and 5.2 ft is proposed. Uh and I'll reference the aerial photograph once again. You can see um how this this
proper this building here uh somehow is subdivided off into a a smaller lot. The the overall lot is almost 3 acres. If you combine this and the outback, which are the lots that are in common ownership, so the 5-ft
uh deviation is from the compound to this red line here, which really doesn't encompass the whole use of this building since there is parking and driveways that uh are part of the combined lot. The subject uh lot with the building on is 20,000 square ft, but if we add the
two together, we're just under 3 acres. So those are the the the three uh variances we require. Uh the other deviations are under the wireless telecommunications ordinance. Um first uh proposed wireless telecommunications
antennas extend uh 9 ft above the height of the existing building. Uh ordinance has a 8ft maximum. So we have a deviation uh there. Uh as the RF engineer stated the antennas have to be 9 ft.
Uh the antenna was it the engineer or the radio frequency engineer? Uh there has to be a separation um of one foot off the highest part of the building. Uh as the RF engineer referenced, the signal doesn't go straight out. It kind of goes down. So even if you're at the
edge of the building, you need to start off 1T higher. Great. So your height of your antenna is always going to be at least one foot. Your antenna top of your antenna height is always going to be at least one foot taller than the antenna. Understood. Okay. Uh the proposed wireless
telecommunications antenna shall employ stealth technology. Um as we just discussed uh regular stealththing uh on a a smaller building here. really thought that we really thought that that would be um
impactful in terms of the mass that uh they would it would um envelop on the top of the roof. Certainly understand the concerns to the uh to the residents um on Hawkins. Um we do have the options of the the uh mirror technology filter
film uh that can be put on the antennas or or painting them. Is that what you were referencing, Mr. Lmanoitz? Yes. And it just it doesn't it just says stealth. It doesn't specify stealth spell stealth. Um you know Mr. Kron had
talked about you know different colors different whatever. So if the board is looking for that then we can it's certainly worth discussing. What is possible in terms of stealth technology to minimize its visual
impact? Do you are you? Yeah. Oh, you're asking me. Okay. Um, that that term really applies to polls, you know, freestanding monopoles and, you know, you they put antennas inside
of silos, inside of church depots, all kinds of things like that. That's really what that is trying to get to. But generically the term stealth on a on a rooftop your your options would come down to the painting the mirrored film or the the enclosure boxes.
What is mirrored film top? It's a it's a um film that goes over the whole antenna and it's basically reflective. So it picks up a reflection off anything, the sky, trees, other buildings and it's
always changing. So it it blends in more than a solid color ant big mirror. Yeah. Right. Well, it's a curved mirror. That's a good way to describe it though. But yes, it is a mirror and it changes all the time. So it's it might be worse.
Maybe. Yeah. It's it's it's it's a newer, you know, technology and especially on, you know, rooftops, we are uh doing it to it just the fact that it just changes and and picks up whatever the surroundings are and makes it blend in more.
Yeah. Okay. Um, next deviation from the wireless ordinance is the minimum setback required for proposed facility is I'm sorry, you I think you missed 3D. Uh, I think we determined that that one. Okay. That was the engineer.
Yep. That was the one that didn't apply. Okay. Okay. The minimum comment to that. No matter that the ordinance exempts antenna, we have a whole section that addresses antenna.
And this board has basically measured the monopoles or rooftops from the top of the antenna. uh even though John's right it exempts it but then you go to another part of the audience it doesn't
so it has a requirement for the height of we're talking about a foot so yes you have a requirement that controls the height of the antenna over the roof but your ordinance does not include the height of the antenna over the building height essentially it separates the antenna height and
building height right that's 3A in Mr. amendments is reported. Correct. Yes. Next is the minimum setback uh from a residential zone 300 ft is required. 143 is proposed.
Um and the same setback applies to the setback to the closest uh zone line which in this case is the R3 zone. Once again 300 ft required, 143 ft proposed. And those are our wireless ordinance deviations.
So, is it possible to locate this rear antenna in a location that would comply with those two sections of the ordinance or is it the lot's just not big enough to get there? No. Right. Yeah. The lot the lot is not big enough. We could not we could not meet those
anywhere anywhere on that lot. Correct. You could make it less, you could make it further away like we discussed before about moving it further back, but you're never going to comply with We are never going to comply. If we the as we'll see when we look at the
required increase in height um that the radio frequency engineer would need for moving it back, then you're also going to go higher. Yep. And so we're going to be we're going to be affecting the other um height above the roof uh requirement. So now there's
no way to make this site conforming. And once again, as I stated, the fact that we do have this little cutout for this building, you know, um makes the scenario, you know, worse that it's uh a subdivision around a building.
It's a it's a sub. So then it sounds like the only remaining question is whether you can move it back towards Route 46 and if you did that how how much higher would it need to be? That's the unanswered
question at the moment. Just is a is a I believe is a rule of thumb that I've heard the radio frequency engineers use before when they're not doing the full calculations. It's usually 1 ft higher for every 3 to 5 ft they move back. So it's that's just a rule of thumb. It's not an exact
calculation, but it's it's that type of thing. So just for for say if we move back 10 ft, it could be 2 feet higher. This whole area is pretty flat, right? Yes. Overall, yes.
Does that play into the calculation? I mean if it was uphill I would think it's more difficult disguise a method of disguising it lessening impact and use downhill. I can
see that equation possibly. Well, it it's it's really the calculation is to clear the edge of the roof. So it's yeah it's it's your if you you move move the antenna back and your roof is here you're moving back
then you have to clear this room. So you're you have to increase the height and those are the numbers that we're looking for or we're asking for. You're asking Yeah. You're asking for if you move it back how much higher would the antennas get? I'm I'm concerned about uh 185 Hawkins
Avenue. That's that's my house. That's the room that I'm referring to. Okay. Thank you. Is there any way to show us um what a reflective look would be like up on the building?
The antennas. Do you do you Oh, do you mean you mean to do you know I I normally if I had an application that was going to have them, I usually bring a manufacturer's brochure. The problem with doing photo
sims, like I said, they're continuously changing. So, I could do a photo sim and then, you know, then it looks a little different. So, but yes, and we could get you if we had brochures to look at, we look at if we could see how it really works
and if it does disguise the antennas. Okay. And as was stated, you're presently getting service now with the location that you're at. Correct. Okay. And how long how long how long is your
How long is your lease uh for the town? Well, I think uh it's more of a approval. Our planning board approval expires before our lease does. Correct. What is your plan? The planning board was very clear that we needed to find a permanent location
as soon as possible. Did they give you a date? Well, they said that we needed to file an application within 6 months of appearing before them, which we did. Um, but they didn't I don't Did the resolution indicate? Yeah, I think we have a I think we have a date in there.
Say you can't see where you're at. I'm sorry. Why does the planning board say you can't see where you're at? They're not saying it. It's just the Top Golf doesn't have any interest in having wireless on their on their building. Yeah, it's a the lease. It was the lease is only for to continue what was on the
rooftop in a temporary manner. We don't have a lease to stay there permanently. Did you What about the restaurant? Which restaurant? The Wonder. No, the long is it? It's Outback. Outback. Outback. Oh, Outback. Oh, Outback. Yeah, that's too short. Too short.
Yeah, it's too short. This their building's higher. This is like I showed on the other aerial, this is really there's only there's only two uh two buildings existing structures in the area we could use and one property owner said no and this one said yes. So this is the only option we have.
He made every reasonable uh inquiry to try to get this elsewhere and this is the only place. Correct. Okay. Yep. I'd like to see that. And of course, we went to the property
on the uh the the the building behind Wonder that I told you about. We went to that one first because that's actually in an O2 zone. So the other side of the other side of 46 is O2. So we'd be permitted there. Oh, that's why you're permitted at Correct. That's why we're permitted at Top Golf
and that's why we were at the planning board before and that was our first choice. This was actually our second choice because we were going into the the B2 zone where we weren't permitted. I'm hoping that the resident hears this and you know do you
that that's why I asked about the reflective. Yeah. To see if that could help. Oh, it defin it definitely helps. So, we'll have to bring you something. Okay. No, I just want to know if there's any other questions from the board. So, we can There any other questions from the board
of this uh of this? No. I mean, he he still has to put more proof. Oh yeah, you do. I'm sorry. Continue. I I'm My only question is if we don't know the exact design or heights, it's a little difficult for me to to wrap up at
this point. That's my only question. I don't want to don't want to put you through it twice. We agree. What do you want? You want to go forward? No. Well, do you Well, it's kind of difficult if you if we don't know, you know, the other your
other professional. Yeah, we're I'm the last one. Yeah. I think we'd like more information as to possibly moving the antenna. Okay. And the mirror technology.
And the mirror technology as Mr. Cro mentioned. Okay. How does the board feel? We want more information. Questions to the right. I I understand Mr. Johnson is saying, "I really want to hear from the objective or I should say I want to hear from the
neighbor and hear him because we're running around in circles. He might come up and say, "Well, if you just did this and then it's over." Yes. I just wanted him to finish his testimony for this evening. Gotcha. Okay. So, he's he will come back with more testimony, but for tonight, he will rest
on what he's provided. Is there anyone in the audience that would like to speak on the testimony that has been given this evening? Ask questions. Ask questions. Questions, please. Okay. And then ask for that.
All right. Are there any objectors to the testimony that we have just received? Please come forward. Raise your right hand. Yes. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Okay. State
your name. Spell your last name. My name is Raone Gomez. Good evening, everybody. First of all, can you spell your last name? Sure. I'm about to. Uh, Gomez is G O M E Z and I live in the adjacent property of 185 Hawkins Avenue. Okay.
Mr. Gomez, may I ask a question? Um, of course. Are you the original owner of this home? I've lived there for many years. 3 years since 1992 and I would also like to submit an objecting objection letter please as well to the to everybody on the board.
What is that? What is that? So this is uh a detailed objection of why I'm objecting as well as a photo of my we we all talk about perspective and point of view and I just want to see show everybody uh exactly photo from my backyard.
So did you take that photo? I took that photo. When did you take that photo? I took it on Sunday. And what does it depict? It depicts my backyard facing 1280 40 uh route 46. Okay. But there's you you'll recognize it by the brick. Okay. You can see the photo.
I'm fine in admitting as 01. I'm okay with that. But I think I know what I'm saying. Statement. Why don't you just tell the board what it is that you'd like to tell the board? But just leave that second page here so that we can mark the photograph.
Okay. for the photograph. We're going to we're going to let the board see, but in terms of your handwritten your written statement, why don't you just tell the board what they'd like to see? So, thank you again. So, as I mentioned, I've been in the property for 33 years at 185 Watkins Avenue. Um, so we respectfully
respectfully ask the board to deny this application. The proposal seeks multiple use and bulk variances uh that go well beyond the property that it was ever intended for. This is a commercial facility in a residential context, a permanent high
impact installation with no demonstrated hardship or clear zoning justification. I'm just going to make an objection to these statements. Okay. I I understand your objection. I think I won't get into detail, but Yep. I I I understand where you're coming from. Okay. Try to stay away from offering what may
be professional expert opinions. Okay. and just tell the board why you personally um object to this particular application. Sure. So, one perfect example is the difference in variance 300 feet to 146. That's from the antenna to my property.
We're not even talking about the substation uh that box, let's call it a a power station to my property line. That's quite close. So, visual impairment, what you see right now with the photo that I'm going to pass along to everybody,
that's a big deal from a backyard. The first thing you're looking at is is a power station and towers and are cell phone towers. Just my are you referring to the antenna cuz the equipment compound is on the ground so you're not going to see that. Correct. I'll see nine antennas and well three. You'll see three.
Okay. Three antennas. Why don't you Why don't you let them finish? Three large antennas that go above 9 ft. So there's a variance there from 8 to 9. It may not seem like a lot, but when you're in your backyard and that's where you look at the sunset coming over Route 46,
we've been encroached a lot from Top Golf and everything else around our neighborhood to put these massive antennas. That's massive from my perspective to have radio frequencies bouncing out through everywhere. I know I know I'm sure it's deemed safe technically, but think about living next
to that. Think about every morning getting up, having a cup of coffee on your deck, and looking at this power station, looking at these three beautiful antennas. I'm saying that sarcastically. So, I I know you're doing the very best to find a spot for
T-Mobile. I get that. I love great cell service, too. But I also like to have some semblance of of a decent view when I look in my backyard. I don't think I'm asking for that much. So that's why that's one of the biggest issues that I have. Again, the power station's another
one that's even closer to my home than these three massive antennas. That's another concern of mine. I would love to know how far that block of uh that station that's on the ground floor is from my property line. Your a car will be closer a car is
closer than that will be. A car is closer. park car is closer to you than that particular equipment that I know exactly where it's going to be. Obviously, I see it every day. That's really close to my home. Really close. Can I just ask you one question?
Your your your pro your house is by commercial property. Yes. You never know what's going to be built in commercial property. You never know what a town will approve, what they're going to apply. you you know you have to expect unexpected.
Yes. And in order to have the convenience of sell service, we have to have we have to do things like this. Um understood. Yeah. You know, and and that's why I asked them the reflective what how that would
create the board has asked to have them set back. So we're we're trying to do that. I can see that. trying to see but they're having a hardship on the case that they have tried to relocate and in the area that's why I asked him do you
meet Route 80 by being across the highway and he said yes so you know they're staying in the vicinity that they were I I totally understand that and that's you know that's where we stand right now I I also want to add because I I think
the the argument of living adjacent to commercial is is very strong in my opinion. My question to you is also no matter what they do, are you going to object? No matter to what? Say that again. No matter what they do, if they wrap it
in the wrap, if they move it 3 ft back and they now you only see 6 ft of the 9 ft, are you still going to object? It depends on what we come back with. Right. If we move it towards Route 46, that's then let's talk, right? Because that's not in my sighteline anymore.
Well, no, no. I'm saying you're gonna see it. I'm just giving you I don't know what they're gonna come back with. We see a lot of things. We're giving you an exercise here. If you're gonna come back and say, "I don't want it. I'm now it's the power that's an issue for you." That's not changing. So, if that's going to be an
issue, I think it's fair that if we know you're going to uh object no matter what, I'd like to know that. You don't have to tell me, but I'd like to know that. [Music] So, I will object to the antennas
without a doubt. Okay. If I can see them clearly honestly. No, of course. Of course. And I will object to the power station. Okay. Uh as well. Okay. Cuz the only thing I disagree with Mr. Cro is she said it's a luxury. These days it's not a luxury anymore. It's a necessity. You're working from home.
I I should say that. No, but but you're you're right on target. You're right. You're right. It is a luxury. It's a necessity for every necessity. It's the only phone that I have, right? And I live on top of powdermill. You know how hard that is to get an antenna to reach up the hill? Yeah.
Okay. Do you have anything else you want to say? No, I I just thank everybody for for the due diligence for trying to uh work on ways to make this more palatable because we have been encroached as you know by
the Top Golfs and everything else around the organ, you know, around our streets and this is really putting it over the top. It it's it's really really there there's a reason why Top Golf doesn't want it on the roof, right? I'm I'm making assumptions. Yes. Yeah. Probably because it's unsightly.
Objection. Yeah, I understand you're But that's a perspective. That's my perspective. I don't really know why. Top correct. I really don't. But chances are that could be it. Okay. But you don't know. I'm not 100%. I do have a few follow-ups. So you keep saying power station. Are you referring to the equipment compound on the grounds? The compound.
Okay. Because it's not Let's call it the equipment, but our layman may call it a power station. Okay. I just want I just want to know for purposes so we know what you're referencing. Got it. know the the box that's on the ground level the equipment compound yes that it's going to be enclosed enclosed
correct thank you for that you're welcome and can I pass this round to everybody so everybody you can hand it to north okay and just one other thing I just want to object to the comment about and you you know this is case law that you know the the safety and frequency and the harm
that a wireless may cause the witnessed that it's that it's deemed to be safe correct Yeah. Okay. So, that's 01. Norah, you got that? Okay. All right. You can step back. Okay. Do you have any other questions for him?
I'm good. I'm good. I just wanted that clarification. Thanks, everybody. Thank you, Mr. Okay. So, it seems as though you're coming back with two issues. The brochure on the reflective. Yep. And the what happens if you move it
back? Yep. I would suggest that maybe there's a couple calculations in there. Yeah, we'll do some we'll we'll regroup and see what we can come up with. Yeah, obviously the architect needs to tell you whether you can
Yeah, RF needs to perform the numbers and also the structure of the roof. That's what I'm saying. Oh, okay. Thank you. So, I don't think you'll need the engineer to come back and it doesn't look like you'll need the radio frequency expert to come back, but I'll need to testify to he's got to do the
calculations, right? Whether it's even feasible for for us. So, you need you need two witnesses to come back. So, we would need our planner and our RF and you do not need my just to confirm you do not need our engineer. I don't think there's any questions of
the engineer. No. Okay. I don't believe so. Okay. Dora, may we have If the architect says that roof is not con constructed to support those three antenna, then you may have to
have him come here and tell us that. If that's a justification for not moving it. Yeah. Yeah. Then I'd have to put that on the record. You're going to do that first. But I can't imagine he's got three antenna and some ballast. It's about 300 lb worth of ballast. Yeah. Right.
Okay. Somebody know? Yeah, we still have to perform the analysis. Yeah. Yeah. Do you know when your deadline is? What was the date on the planning board when they came to visit? Off the top of my head.
Okay. How much do you have any idea how much time? Maybe maybe Mr. O'Neal knows because he's representing the property owner. [Music] O'Neal top. Uh, do you know what the deadline is?
The deadline? Well, the ant, it's supposed to be a year. The anticipation is that they needed them off last week because they're doing site work where that antenna is. If the temporary antenna stays there, they can't finish the site work in that corner of the lot.
So, it's becoming a problem. So, as soon as possible. Yes. God, Nora. You're welcome. Nora, do you have a uh a date, please? How much time would you need? I mean, if you need more than a half an hour,
you're going into 2026 and I'm already starting. I I can't imagine. I don't I Let's do a half hour. Yeah, we can do it in a half hour. Half hour. Maybe we could do an early meeting like we did tonight. Let's see what she says. we're talking about. Yep.
Um um October 29th 7 p.m. I'm not here. Is that enough time? Otherwise, it'll be December 3rd at 7
October 29th. We we should be done this week. [Music] Regular meeting anyway then, right? No, it'll be a 700 p.m. meeting. So, I'll renotice then. You don't You just need a C. You don't need a D. No, we need a D.
Yeah, that's what I thought. Yeah, you need a D. Okay. So, I'm going just so you, Mr. Johnson, you're aware, I'm going to renotice since the meeting is going to start at 7:00 as opposed to 7:30, right? Can't carry it. Go ahead. Okay. Okay. You need a Thank you. Well, you need a You need a
Are you going to give the extensions, right? And you need a motion. May I have a motion, please? Motion to extend the meeting at 7:00. Thank you. And so she has chang
the agenda just references a C, not a D. Just for future reference, it's a what reference? The agenda just references a C variance, not a D. Yeah, I I realized that. That was my error. Okay. Uh application 24 col 66 Travali 13
North Beverick Road block 611 lot 6 zone B5 a Dvarian convert the lower level of a mixeduse building into two apartments. This application was carried from July 9th 2025.
Okay. Hello. [Music] Good evening everyone. Joseph O'Neal here at Paulo O'Neal Rogerio here on behalf of the applicants. When last we left you, we were trying to
make inroads with the township to buy a neighboring property for utilization as a partner. This process actually started with a prior application. My partner Bob Perafalo about two years ago sent
letters to the administration maybe three now trying to buy that property. I myself since May have sent two letters, a few emails and innumerable phone calls. And as we sit here tonight, there
appears to be no interest in selling that property to the So they haven't said no. Latest was the mayor was going to think about it.
So we have to proceed without imply. Um with that then I'd like to begin the application itself talking about the conversion of the two offices downstairs
into sir into apartments. Okay. Did the notice as it relates to this application? Well, I left it just I mean the parking lot
shown is not their problem and you're trying we're trying to get that. Correct. Well, it's not shown on our plan. We don't have a detailed parking lot in that neighboring lot because we don't have any rights to it. I didn't notice for it. Okay. It's not part of the application. That was my question.
If they had come back and even just verbally said they were interested in selling the property, then I would have noticed. We would have come up with some of them. There appears to be no interest. And Mr. O'Neal, I believe it's two separate small lots that are there.
Well, there are two separate small lots. I was only asking for one. Yes, I realized that. cuz I I originally I thought they were not conformed just standing on the lots but uh Mr. cease would be pressure. It would make a
conforming lot. And obviously what we want to do is something simple. We didn't really need a conforming lot. We're just going to be putting parking. We're going to approve it, park it, etc. Use it for parking. And it's being used presently with the tenants. I see I see a truck there and
some cars. Town came out to do inspections. They parked. Yeah. But I can't include it at the end. Right. Okay. Okay. You have no rights to it. Thank you. Proceed. So with that, you raise your right hand, please.
Do you swear or affirm that the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing? Yes, I do. Say your name. Start your last name, please. Uh, Yogish Mystery. M I S T R Y. Mr. You've been before this board many times. I know. Is your license still
current? Yes, it is. Architect. He's acceptable in here. Show us what we're going to be looking at. [Music] Is this what we have in the package?
Yes. With the date of 81324. Yeah. So, uh, what I have on the easel is a drawing labeled A1.01 01 dated 813 to 2024. And yes, this was the the drawing sheet that was submitted as part
of this application. Um what's depicted on the right hand side of the drawing is uh the existing photographs taken uh by our office of the four sides. It's essentially a rectangular uh building. Um there's it's two stories with a
basement that the upper two stories have uh four apartments each. Uh so on the first floor level there are two one-bedroom apartments and two two-bedroom apartments. And then on the uh second floor level you have um
I'm sorry there's two there's four onebedrooms on uh the first floor, four one bedrooms on the second uh floor. That's existing. Yes, it's existing. Okay, existing. Um,
on your on your unit chart, you've got I apolog I'm I'm I'm mixing this up here. There's two two bedroom two apartments on the first floor, two apartments on the second floor. Each one bedroom each each of them are one bedroom. Got apologize for that.
Um, we're not doing any anything to those apartments. Those are remaining as is. Currently at the basement level there are two office uh spaces. Um one accessible from the front, one accessible from the back. Um they are
connected internally currently. Um they when I went to visit this property, they were vacant. Uh the owner wants to convert those two office spaces into two uh studio apartments. Um again, one entering from the front, one entering
from the back, separate units. Um the footprint itself is 1,383 ft². Um it's divided somewhat in half. Uh the front studio unit would be 557 ft and then the rear studio unit would be
692 ft. Um and the there's a proposed floor plan showing uh one full bath, a kitchen area, uh living and sleeping areas, and same for the uh rear studio.
[Music] In terms of uh building codes, we would have to meet all the building codes including uh sprinkling those two units as well as providing any fire rating between uh this floor and the floor above. But you know, essentially the they'll be all residential units after
we convert these full ceilings. Yeah, the the ceilings are uh I believe like uh around 610 611, but you know, we did check that with the with the building department and that is acceptable. It's a change of use and
you're allowed to essentially keep what's remaining as a you know, existing condition as I can walk through with the Yeah. Anything else? Um you know, these are like functional spaces. uh they were being used as
offices. I think there's other uh buildings along North Beverick in in Lake Haywa that have where there's beauty salons or hair salons and so forth that you go down and you know um use them. In this case, we're trying to convert them to um apartments just
because uh the client has found it difficult to rent these as office spaces. Now, what about refues and things like that? Um they would be handled the same way as the other tenants upstairs. There ex you know exterior containers that would um
they would use as a refuge. For storage I have no further questions for this. Do we have any questions of the board of this information this testimony that has been given this evening? The square footage of these office areas
is how much? Um, the front area is 557 ft. The rear is 692 ft. And that that's large enough to be considered a studio apartment. Yes. It is. Okay. Is it? Right.
Okay. Very confident they'll be able to rent that as a studio apartment. Studio apartment. Yeah. And your What about the co- units or whatever? adding two to a four is that they'll they'll have to pay a fee. They
won't have to build bill. Okay. [Music] That's something we'll have to discuss what that might be. Sorry, John. This board determines that.
Well, they have a developer fee ordinance and commercial is pretty easy. anything commercial. That's that's this board's jurisdiction to figure that out. I think Mr. Dece does that as part.
That's what my understanding was that he takes care of that. All right, let's let him deal with that. That's my Did he He didn't Did he ever submit anything in this one? [Music] I don't see it. No, I don't see anything from him.
No, here it is. Um, he's got Yeah, there's a letter from him dated September 20th, 2024. [Music] Doesn't say anything about that issue, though. What What did you say, Bill? There's a letter from the tax assessor dated September 20th, 2024. But it
doesn't say anything about the issue we were just talking about. H see normally what municipalities do is somebody has a home and makes a major addition they charge them what the increased value of the home is. Well I would think the same
kind of process would apply here. It's got a certain value with four four apartments. It's going to have more value with six apartments. They pay on that additional on the right wall. Clearly Mr. Cassiss
clearly Mr. Cassiss knows what the plan is because he wrote that memo. So I I think it's reasonable to assume that he's going to address that issue. Valuation for Yeah. might be some back and forth about the valuation,
but the formula is the formula. I I do have a question. And the the plan shows in one of the apartments there's a little area that's utility. Is that going to stay utility or Yeah, there there is a a space that's dedicated for electric meters and some
utility space that's going to stay as utility space. Well, I I mean it's been downsized a little bit, but there you know we have electric meters that are on that wall that we're going to make a a closet for them in the proposed uh plan. Right. So, the utility area is not
calculated in the studio area. Correct. Um, I can't recall. I believe we we might have uh subtracted some of that utility space. There was still some space in between that. That's like uh not in the closet. Did you say meters or
Yeah, electric meters. Are they inside? They have to go inside to read them or or they Well, that's where they are now. electronically. They We'll take it off. They're They're in the process of changing those to cuz I was going to say how they get it
in there to uh do service on them. Well, they'd have a key. They have a key to a lock. It's not uncommon a unit like this. We're going to have to do that for the utility area. So, the tenants's not going to have
access to that. shouldn't have access to it. They sit there all night for a week trying to break into it. They might get access, but we don't want them to. This is where But you've got to give the utility company access to it.
Yeah. But aren't these doors? This is what they do. Are they going to be outside now? They're going to be inside. They're going to be inside. But how do they read them? They they're remotely read from the street. Now, there's a car that drives around
and read your meter. Yes. They don't get out and actually write the number down anymore. Okay. No, I realized that. Well, I think Joe just said they don't move them outside, right? You're moving you're moving the meters outside. No, stay me stay inside.
Understanding is you're changing them to those meters that you can read by Bluetooth on the street. Yeah. So, they only need to go into the meters to service them for whatever reason. But they could ride by and read them off with their equipment.
Yeah. Same as they do now with us. Okay. Yes. And they're behind. They're just behind doors in the apartment. Is that correct? You have to leave access for them. It'll all be in compliance with the electrical code,
but it'll be locked and inaccessible to the tenant. Okay. [Music] All right. Do we have any Are you No, I'm done. You're finished. Are there any questions
of this gentleman of his testimony that he's just given us? Is there anyone in the audience that has any questions of gentlemen of the information that he has just been given
to us? That's just been given to us. I see none. Think about it. I'm not sure. Yeah, I think that recognize it's still on the road. Oh, sorry about that. Hello.
Just swear from the testimony that you're about to give should be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing about the truth. I do. Just for the record, state your name, spell your last name, and you're qualified, sir. Alexander Dowy. D O U G H E R T Y. I'm here on behalf of my colleague John McDonald of Mcdana Associates at 101 Trapalter Avenue, sweet 1A of Morris
Plains. Mr. Your license didn't expire in those two hours. No, it did not. I would submit him as an expert for planning. You have appeared before this board very recently. Yes. Thank you. You're acceptable.
I just want to uh um before we begin with the use variance, the the electric meters are uh read from the street. they have that upgraded um just for for purpose of the board and uh for for personal experience with uh rental
properties and investment properties. Um I have rental properties where my utilities, if you will. Uh the AC condensers and the likes are on a second floor of an apartment in the attic. It is locked. I have a lease. It's very common. You are not to go up there. the
landlord is to have access to service you know the you know equipment and the likes of that. So um I suspect with talking to the applicant that is very common here. If there needs to be a service of those meters the landlord will have access to the unit uh for the
greater good of the uh overall complex but for purposes of this application. We do have existing office space uh below as the board is aware that is fairly vacant. We have seen a tremendous uh change in office space over the past
few years. Um so we're looking hopefully for the board to see this as an opportunity to make more efficient use of this uh this space and also to promote the underlining zoning in which we are in. um as customary with all use
variances in the planning memo to the board and the B5 local business district. Um residential is not expressly uh permitted has a uh principal use here. So we are seeking that use variance um as the architect testified to minor renovations to make
this habitable by uh uh residential standards and codes to convert this uh two office spaces into two studios. As a planner, I would testify that uh 500 plus square ft for a studio is is the average. It is spacious. Um anything less than 500 we kind of start to raise
our eyebrow at, but a studio is kind of that open floor plan, onebedroom layout, if you will. Um so certainly 557 and 692 ft are a standard studio size um that I see across the state. Um but
nonetheless when we look at this we do have a caveat where the site does not have parking though the public realm would otherwise say something different. Um there is not parking here but I would like to note as stated on page two of that report the RSIS requirement um for
the studios is 1.8 for the studio which would be 3.6 six round it up call it four spaces four additional spaces would be required however given that we are in that B5 local business districts for comparison um we would need nine spaces
if this lower level was like a barber shop. So when we talk about intensity or you know exacerbating uh issues that are there today um residential is actually the least intensive land use you could have other than a park open space and I
like to also think of storage lockers. You know, those self- storage facilities are pretty low intense. But when we talk about residential compared to an office or a business, they tend to bring outside and staff to these locations as a destination location. Whereas
residential typically only brings over a friend or a family. And you know, holiday seasons are like staff. Typically, it's it's more of an a calmer intimate uh use from a land use perspective. So, when we talk about the intensity of this property not having parking, we're not exacerbating that
that that issue by converting this uh office uh space below into residential units. Um but nonetheless, we are here for that D1 use variance. Um yes, I interrupt you here. You've obviously had a conversation with your clients.
Yes. Regarding this and they did indicate to you that they had been unable to lease this. Is that true? Yes. And all these I want to put a barber shop. I want to use it for storage. That's not working. It's not working. I I I know this neighborhood fairly well. Um but that's
why I opened with the uh we we've seen the market change uh from office spaces being vacant. Um and I would say that I think there is a complexity here that it is in the basement as well. Typically when we see retail office um and signage
typically they're in the public realm. They're right there at you know eye level. This is more basement. we can sign as much as we'd like, but the reality is this is a a basement, you know, kind of use here. I think there there is some practical difficulty in that regards. But, um, these have been vacant from my understanding for quite
some period of time. Um, you know, we're we have this space here. Um, there is a housing need when we talk about goal two of the master plan, which is the prong four of, you know, reconciling it with the the Medici test here on page uh 12.
Goal two is to provide a variety of housing types and densities and a balance of housing supply at appropriate locations to service the township's residents of various ages, household types and incomes. The development of new town homes or apartments units
should be directed toward established centers of development in close proximity to transit and business corridors. Again, we are in that that B5 district. So, we're putting a population here that would otherwise support the the underlining intent of that business district by putting that consumer
population with right in the heart of that zone. Um, again, making more efficient use of what otherwise has been historically vacant space in recent years. Um, again, the studios being a diversified housing choice and options. We go from single family homes to large
apartment complexes. these studios, these ones and twos and three families, we call that in the planning world the missing middle housing. Um, you know, they're they're harder to find. Um, so I would say that we're certainly advancing diversified housing choices for all types of of residents. Um, you know,
within the community, our our kids have to get out of a basement somewhere. Um, you know, where do they go? Um, you know, these studios are certainly um that transitional housing if you will. Um, but nonetheless, we are here for that use variance. I think when we talk about the site there
has residential here. Um certainly we can meet all building and and fire code for the architect's design. So we advance purpose A for the safety morals and general welfare. We I think we can certainly advance the uh um the intent of the zone to support that B5 business by putting that population here. I think
we meet goal number two of the master plan here. Again the site itself currently we don't have parking on paper. Um and that sit Yeah, we don't have parking. have parking period, right? We're not exacerbating that issue. I think if we allow or push for
the under underlying tint of the B5 zone, we would exacerbate that issue for parking and that parking demand. So, I think we're moving the needle in the right direction in that regards. Um, there is really no other alter alterations to the building. What's there is is what's there. Um, we're we
certainly bring up the code and fire code and building code for safety regulations. I do not see any substantial negative effect with converting these into studios. The site has accommodated residential um and I think it can accommodate residential going forward. I think this is uh when we talk about this
it's a much needed studios are hard to find. Question for you. Talk a little bit. Can I just ask one question? Absolutely. Even the bus. Um let's talk a little bit about parking because there are existing units there now. Correct. There's not a lot of parking on the site or even next to the site.
There's parking on the street. Is that correct? Correct. Now, there's uh it seems like a large number of tenants here do not drive. It's my understanding. So, there's there is good walkability in the neighborhood. There's public transportation in the
neighborhood. Yeah. That's when we talk about the walkability uh and putting the residents in that business corridor and zone. they can walk to go to the grocery store, the corner store, they don't necessarily have to drive. And that demand on the vehicle when you put populations in the business zone in that mixed juice
setting um is lessened than if you live on the outskirts of town and you want to drive to those those those uh those those shopping centers and and business districts and the like. Um you're already here. The client's going to be marketed as apartments with no parking.
That is correct. So that is itself limiting. People are going to understand if you have a car you really can't make this work and there is a significant number of people in the town that do not drive. Isn't that true?
That is but for purposes of of parking the residential use is less intense on parking than the permitted uses. We're definitely asking for the mayor. Correct. I just want to frame that you know these are not this is not part
parcel correct this is a completely different but it's still yes the only variance is the use variance is that right B1 right is that correct you're not asking for any bulk variances
in terms of correct they're not doing any modifications to the building right correct the bulk from my understanding are in compliance I'll defer to the board planner yeah park well you don't know parking Well, oh yeah, the parking variance has always existed. Yeah, but we're exacerbating it.
We're not exacerbating. I think we're less. No, we're exacerbating. We're not providing parking. We have no parking at all. You should have certain amount. It's zero zero. I wouldn't say we're exacerbating. Now, you put use in there's a parking standard.
Your point is that permitted uses would exacerbate it even more than this use that the demand would be much higher. Yes. Yeah. That is what I said. Yeah. No. is parking endurance for the nine with four additional spaces, but nobody's been in there for several
years downstairs. Yeah. But there's no spaces for the building at all. Can I ask a question? Has the um owners ever thought of maybe breaking up the area of the space in caged areas for
storage to rent to the current tenants that are upstairs for storage space down below? Um, and uh, you know, they could make up money that way. That was all considered when it was going to be an office and it just not
getting any any traction. Well, have they offered that to their tenants? As a matter of fact, they have. I guess we can bring them up to talk about that and uh, how the returns are really just not happening. So, after they they don't need any storage any of
their tenants. They they can't make any money off of this. So they have for instance I'm going to bring the client up. We're going to talk about one lady wants to store her dresses. So there is a section of this where is just a wall of dresses and
another lady wanted to well they're caged areas because that's what that's what we did up on in Powdermill. We caged areas for tenants that were upstairs to rent downstairs and put storage in there. I would like to point
I understand that but they just you're not dealing with you're not dealing with people with a lot of additional income to go out and buy more storage space. So they pretty much end up in a situation where they're gifting
pretty close to gifting the space because they're not going to take the whole space. No one wants to rent the whole space. So you have one corner of the space is dresses, another corner of the space is tools. That's just not working.
I would I would note that for the B5 local business district, the zone is is a district that promotes several types of businesses. So, it's not so much that I I think when we talk about that lower um office space that it
were would make the site worse. If there's an opportunity to put a business there tomorrow and and that call comes in, you know, that that business can move in as a permitted as of right kind of application and it doesn't go before this board. So when we talk about this
opportunity to make this a studio, I think it's inherent benefit to the overall underlining concerns of of intensity of this site um you know if you know the the applica applicant doesn't feel the need that the storage lockers are are viable uses there you
know this is an opportunity to kind of tone that that that site down a little bit from an asite permitted business moving in there with a site that has zero parking. Um that that's when I look at that and when we look at the 2020 master plan, you know, to find ways to
um promote um and encourage development of new apartment units in close proximity to business corridors that's expressly pulled out of that. This is that opportunity to do that as a studio. So I think we're when we talk about Medici the benefits and the site suitability here is there reconciling it
with prong 4 with the mass plan and intent to the zone. I think we are hitting that. Um, and there's no alterations to this property. Otherwise, um, I don't see any inherent negative effect of the studio going in there on the lower level.
I have a question on the, um, on the window wells. Yes. Are they going to be enlarged or they're staying the same size? And they are uh, the architect. Yeah. The architect, they designed it to code. So, whatever the requirements would be would would for us UCCC
inhabitability, they would otherwise have to comply. As far as them being enlarged, I can't tell you if currently what's there is to code. Could you contribute to this? Yes. Um, we are adding uh a window well in the front and a window well. We are adding a window well in the front
and a window well in the back. One for each in the existing in the existing basement plan. I see two window wells. We're keeping those. And you're keeping those four. So, we're going to be adding two more. Yes. One in the front, one in the back. Do those additional window wells trigger
any bulk variances? I mean, they're underground or, you know, like at ground level, I guess, and they're just essentially windows. Where are they? Do they create a setback? Do you have a you have a I don't know. I It's essentially a little I mean, it's
a well. It's a retaining wall. I don't know if that's considered a structure. I think you like have to be 3 ft by five or something like that. You have to be able to get out the window. Yeah, it has a ladder in it. Yeah, not necessarily. Not necessarily.
I just want to make sure that if there's a if there's a if there is an issue, we deal with that. I think I think the the sideyards would be B5 zone zero, aren't they? There's only the sideyard requirements
for the B5 zone. I believe so. These are underground in the in the stairwell itself. In the in the existing stairwell itself. I thought they were No, no, they're not in the existing stairwell. They're outside the building. They're outside. The ones on the side are already there.
Those that's existing. We're adding one in the front and one in the back. Right. And I guess when you're adding those egress and bringing natural light into the space as well. Yeah. And I guess what one of the issues we have is that in my October 2024 report um I noted that we don't have a
survey. So we don't know where that front lot line is and we still don't have a survey. Yeah. So we don't know whether this there was a survey. I don't know if it was submitted but I have a copy of it. I don't see a survey at all.
[Music] It was an old property survey. [Music] Yes, I see that. What do you want to do? They don't have it. They're like 3x4.
[Music] Do you have any other testimony? [Music] I guess the question I I'll pose to you is given this issue that's just come up, do you want to figure that out and come back or do you
want to proceed without requesting any bulk variances? Well, Mr. O'Neal, also we're beyond 10:00. That's why the question also could Could we make I I know you said you made attempts with the town. Could we make another attempt at the
town for the property? Mr. Joshua. Yes. I've been sending them mail and emails since May. I have not had the courtesy of a single response. Emiled me. They have not even licked a stamp to put it on a letter tell me to go.
Gotcha. And I personally Yeah. asked our attorney if he would look into this matter and he said that he would. But Mr. has not heard from him. Well, I've heard Mr. Lvery called.
Oh, you're talking about Mr. Ly. Mr. Ly. I mean, have you been to Neil? You came in and said to them, I wanted to know how to do it. I know you know how to do it. And there's nobody around. I know you know.
I'm the master of the Oh, look. It's Joe. The It's the old It's the guy that's nagging us, you know, like not available. can't get through the door. One instance, I actually heard a door open
and close in the hole. But when I got to the hole, it would so I don't know what that was. Cuz the problem the parking is a real issue. You I understand from your point of view, it could be worse if there was something else. But you're still making a problem a bigger problem. And then where do the
cars park at night? Well, there's there there's parking in the Could you park on the street at night? Yes, you can. Is there a old shopping that also a shopping center,
right? For purpose for purposes of of what the reality of what's happening out there. I think we know what's happening out there that they're parking on that those two vacant lots that aren't doing it. They're working in restaurants.
They've been doing it forever. Yeah. But what happens? What happens in the winter when it snows? Right. Well, they have Where did they go then? Well, they have they have the shopping center parking lot. Come on. They're all over the place. They're not driving cars as Mr. O'Neal
stated. I can't put in my application says I'm going to park over where the lighting was because nothing's happening. Yeah. I can't do that. I know that. I know that, Mr. O'Neal, are you willing to go
forward with uh carrying this application? Yeah, I think given the hour question, I appreciate that. Even I didn't know where else were. So, okay. I'm going to get smart on that. Can this be finished up in half an hour? Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
December 3rd, 700 p.m. What date? December 3rd. 7 p.m. Okay. Okay. A motion, please. Move. Second. Second. Second.
Motion to close the meeting. Motion. Second. I. All in favor? I. Good evening. Thank you. Good night, everybody. Not for us, but you guys. Are you guys good night tonight?
Are you here for education or cross? That's been empty since February. It hasn't been sent empty. I can't sell it. Can't can't lease it. They are not punishment.