followed by pledge of allegiance. Amen. >> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
Call the role. >> Councilman Foley. Councilman Gford >> here. >> Councilman Green >> here. Vice Mayor Grubs >> here. >> Mayor Stilman >> here. Thank you guys for all coming out tonight. That quickly brings us to item four, Life Pack 35 cardiac monitor
demonstration. Welcome Division Chief Colleen Pette. We'll welcome Chief Wolf too. >> Yeah. I was going to come up and say hi. Um Joe Wolfing, fire chief, city of Port Orange. This is uh Colleen Fitchet, our EMS chief. Um
>> I like this. >> Yeah, the uh French version. Um what we're here tonight is we kind of want to show you guys what when you approve some CIP purchases, they're usually big items for the fire department. This is one of these. This is a cardiac life monitor
that you guys um wasn't a part of the CIP, but it was a mid-year budget. But historically, we do have these in our CIP. And so what we wanted to do is kind of show you what when you when you spend a lot of money on stuff like this, what these actually do and what these mean
for our citizens. Um since January 1, we've run 142 chest pain calls. We've run 72 cardiac arrests since January 1. So we're a busy fire department. Um, I think Daytona and Deltona are similar.
Daytona runs a little bit more falls, but the amount of patient contact we have with these machines. Um, it's it's quite it's it's shocking actually how many times we actually use these. So, EMS Chief Fitch is going to go give you a quick run through of what they do
because the the technology with these new ones is incredible. Um, go ahead. >> Yeah, thank you guys. Um, so this is our new Life Pack 35 monitor. It replaced our life pack 15 monitors that were fairly outdated when I got promoted. Um,
so I came to finance and the city manager and ran the numbers and this this was the the smart decision was to to upgrade these monitors. So total we have nine cardiac monitors. Um, and I you guys have a little rundown here. All
five of our firet trucks, all ALS, right? Uh, Quint engines. We have one on medic 73 on battalion 70. This cardiac monitor stays in my truck. It's the training um but I can also use it on calls if need be. And then we have a spare monitor for special events. We'll
put it on um for at city center. Uh if we have a hurricane when we up fit another truck, we'll put it on that one. What's great about these monitors is it used to be a version one and then if we got in too early and they came out with a better model, they came out with a
better model. We weren't going to buy the better model. So software, this is all this can build out. So as they come out with new um software, new accessories and attachments, we can actually just keep this monitor, update it, buy the new attachment, and go from there.
So, most people don't know that our cardiac arrest calls our all of our paramedics run a call just like they would at the hospital. So, you might see some frustration like why are they still here? Why aren't they leaving? Um, we have the capabilities on scene to do everything the hospital does. And actually, our protocol wants us to stay
on scene. So, these monitors are the same exact cardiac monitors in the ER. So, when we do get to the hospital, we don't have to take the patient off of the pads or the monitor. We can unplug the cables and plug them right into the hospital's monitors. These are also interoperable with a lot of our AEDs.
So, if we use an AED on scene somewhere, this shows up. We would just unplug it from the AED and we would plug it into this machine. So, you can see some of the capabilities. Continuous monitoring of heart rate, blood pressure. There's some medical stuff on here, so I'll explain. Sao2, which is just your oxygen
saturation, carbon dioxide, what we breathe out. And then we can even do carbon monoxide. So we have um a special sensor that goes on here and actually allows us like outside of house fires, we pull somebody out of that or toxic um inhalation.
This is a defibrillator just like your AEDs, but what we do is we actually your paramedics read the screen, actually interpret the rhythm where in AEDs you don't have a screen, it just does it for you. So they actually look at the screen, interpret the rhythm, and then decide their course
of treatment. So defibrillates ventricular fibrillation. Um cardioversion is something we send electrical therapy through when a heart rate's too fast. We can cardiovert them and try to reset their heart. So it does that if a heart's too fast. Pacing. I'm sure most people are familiar with
pacing internal pacemakers. This is an external. So somebody's heart's going too slow, their internal pacemaker, intrinsic one in the heart fails or maybe even their implanted one fails. and we can actually take over by putting pads on them and pacing them throughout.
Um, and then this also has the ability to do a 12 lead, which is 12 different views of your heart looking for heart attacks. Um, and a 15 lead without moving any leads. So, that was another upgrade because about 18% of heart attacks are posterior and we never looked on the backside because it was
just something that we didn't have enough stickies to put on there. So, now we can look at that. Um, biggest thing though is we transmit this data to the hospital. So, if I always use myself an example because I don't want to put bad energy on anybody. If I were having a
heart attack and the medics identified that, what they would do is they would call the hospital and then they would be able to transmit this information to the hospital before the patient ever got there. That comes up on the screen and then those doctors will read that and determine if they're going straight to the Kath lab. So it it narrows the time
from onset to calf lab. Um one of the other things we have is CPR insight which is really cool. Um biggest thing on cardiac arrest is that we have time on chest. So compression fraction that's the most important part of CPR um in
cardiac arrest. So most of the time we'd have to stop doing compressions to analyze on the screen. And what this can do is through compressions, it can read on the backside that it's looking at a rhythm that we're probably going to have to defibrillate and it'll pre-charge the
monitor which takes a few seconds. So it saves time on chest. Um and then this also we have a new um report writing software. So all of the data that we collect on the calls we upload straight into ESO that connects to the report.
Uh, it sends it on the back side to me where I can see from the time they turn this monitor on to the time they shut it off, every button that was pressed in between, time on chest, defibrillations, anything that they record. Um,
and then in here I just have lifespan uh expandability. We talked about the software and durability. The we have a 8-year product protection plan on these, and the shelf life of these is about eight years is what you're going to get out of them. So
the it replaces if a battery goes bad, we know lithium ion batteries, these batteries are they're not cheap. They replace We just had the U maintenance done. Actually, it's right here. Five of 2026. Um we had one that just had a nick out of the the um button right here. They came put everything, replaced it.
Um so we're super thankful for that because it keeps the preventative maintenance up on these. Um I think that's about it. I can you want anything out of this? >> What what do they what does a unit cost roughly? >> Um about $47,000.
>> Okay. And and >> as we go to replace them, do we replace all eight at one time or do we >> them or >> That's a really good question and I can get back to you on. >> Okay. >> But I think it was paid out of I think >> we bought them intentionally to not have to do that. But there at one point was
you needed to keep the the old ones you had to because you had to keep the consistent like you were saying the version one. >> We had no choice which meant we had to spend a ton of money. >> Yeah. So we had some 2014 monitors when I came over um that we couldn't even get parts for. So
>> we were they were they were in the they were in the order but we wanted to put the preventive maintenance and that wasn't possible. And so it was a perfect time because they were they were kind of staggered. per time to um to to level the playing field but we could not initially with these because it is different tech technology what we did
was we implemented this it took us about probably three months because I wasn't going to say here's your new monitor give me that one um so we trained and trained and trained and luckily caught one issue before we put them on the trucks and we sent them back and made them we sent all one issue with one we
sent all nine back and made sure they went through them um and then sent them back to us. So these have been on the trucks since December. >> So recall that part of that was they're trained on them. So you want to make sure that they're all using the same one because if you're on a different truck, you don't want to have a version three
on one and a two on the other. >> In fact, I thought it was important to to have her here because since Chief Fitch came on board, Joe always talked about we we spent a lot of time talking about making sure our firefighters stay alive. So, we have a really good training tower, good training program, so that that our guys when they go in and and and do this, whether it's
firefighting or anything they do, one of the things we wanted to do was take the EMS side of it to the same level. This is keeping everybody else alive. So, our our firefighter training, make sure our guys come back safe when they go into facilities. She's responsible for making sure everybody else that lives here in the city stays alive and has made
tremendous positive improvements in this division since she came on board. So, in addition, the right kind of equipment. Some of this I put in when we did our end of year uh accomplishments list and we talked a little bit about it in the state of the city whether it's for children. So, you you've got a bunch of stuff for for for childhood monitor and
brain. And then so there's the equipment being upgraded, the the control of the medicines on the machines, the training of the people. Uh all of this is now if you have something go wrong with you, you want these you want our guys showing up to help you. This is this is what you want in your city to be protected with
this is what they're doing. >> Appreciate that. >> Go ahead. >> Now we've got to the point where with Chief Fitch in there, we can really concentrate on the community. Um what saves lives is quick response times and for the cardiac arrest patients is the CPR, the bystander CPR and
defibrillation. So we teach CPR to anybody that wants to teach it. We're an American Heart Association training center. So we we can teach people. We can give you a card or we can just do a friends and family type. We've been putting AEDs out into the businesses and city buildings. So, we're trying to get
out there to where when we arrive on scene, there's already bystanders working on these people that need help. And the faster they get the help with the CPR and the AEDs prior to our arrival, their better chance of their survival. We talk about, we call it
ROSK, it's return to spontaneous um circulation. And some months we do really good. Uh, one month we had a 35% roster rate for everyone in in our community. That can drop sometimes. Sometimes we just we do everything we can, but we
just can't save somebody. But if you look at comparables, um, when we hit that 35%, you know, that nationwide, this is as high as 7% in some locations. So that number right there was was leading us and me to look
at what we are doing because we we have to provide a level of service to the citizens that's worth them paying for and and that's what we're doing right now. >> I don't know that I have any questions. I think that stuff's really >> I can make it do a bunch of stuff.
>> I'm so glad you guys understand it. I I I will just say that, you know, throughout my time in the city of Port Orange under different roles and capacities, I have always felt like if you are in a medical emergency situation, you want our people to get their hands on you as quick as possible
and first and that's not a knock on other organizations that do similar things. It's just when you've seen it so many times and one of the things that the residents in Port Orange >> and it's okay you know sometimes you don't need to know everything just but it's there right and so you know I I
think that the EMS priority the priority on EMS we we've increased paramedics we the you know we we try to do our best to stay up with technology we we started the ambulance program which is we won't rehash that whole thing but you know there's still a need for more uh you know ALS services
throughout all of the Lucia County countywide and but yet we we have taken a lot of strides sometimes even against uh popular perspectives and they've worked out way exceeding all expectations. So, you know, what you
guys do with the EMS side of it, um it it is amazing and and we have a ton of residents who do know about it and they are truly appreciative. Um I hope nobody needs to use that thing. I never we know the reality is right. So >> to that point this doesn't have to just
it's not just going to be used on the cardiac arrest the respiratory uh if somebody just fell right or take their blood. This is this piece of equipment gets pulled out on every single medical call. >> That's awesome. >> So it's not something that sits on a shelf for oh there's a cardiac arrest bring in the monitor. This goes on every single call along with our jump box
along with our airway bag and then from there you know the call determines what else we bring in there. So, >> I know when I see when I see you guys get off the trucks and they got all the bags and all that, I'm like, man, oh man, whatever they're going to need, they they've got it. Somebody's carrying it. So, that's pretty awesome. Tracy, what do you got?
>> Uh, it's great to see. I mean, having that many units and all the departments and streamlining it makes it easier for the team to know what they're on, especially when they go from one department to another. It's the same. Um you you touched on one thing that just
echoes as far as the rapid response is. It's already transmitting to the hospital. I mean that that's incredible. Used to be you had to radio that and talk about it and but they didn't have the live image going on. So that's an incredible piece of equipment.
>> Yeah. >> So it's great to see. appreciate it, >> Sean. Thank you for your service to our citizens. And I've had the unfortunate but fortunate opportunity to call 911 three times in the last 6 months to my house for my parents and my aunt. And
it's been fantastic. Um, this is a quality of life issue. This is what people want when they move to Port Orange. They want to know that they're going to be safe and that they're going to be served. Uh, and we have a lot of people that need your services for all kinds of different things. And we're
just glad that we uh, our prior councils have provided you the financial tools to get you the things that are going to help our citizens. And I think that's really important. In light of today's decisions that were made at the state level, it's going to be under a microscope even more.
>> So, we we'll do everything we can to keep giving you the tools you need to help us. So, thank you for your service. >> Yeah, I think these guys pretty much covered it. And again, statistically speaking, when you look at how many calls you guys run medically, uh I think u putting you guys on the cutting edge
is important to to the residents and uh we all know that response times have gone down over the years through through our county and you guys have stepped up to to help that and uh and our ambulance and and those things. So, I think that uh you know, you can't put a dollar
amount to to what you guys are doing. And uh again, I'd like for us to to stay on top of those, make sure that we can keep them funded uh as the years go on and that we keep them up to date and that we stay on the cutting edge. So, thank you guys a lot. >> Thank you. You know, they recently uh
realized that they needed more paramedics, so they they made more paramedics. >> His last name's more. Anyway, congratulations to him, by the way. When you see that, >> please pass that along. >> There you go. >> We have one more paramedic. Right. I
like that. >> We have one more more paramedic. >> That's right. >> Oh, no. The other Thank you guys. >> Thank you. >> We appreciate you. >> Item five, public comments on consent agenda items only. Any public comments
on consent agenda items 6 through 13? Seeing none, council, can I get a motion to approve consent agenda items 6 through 13? >> Have a motion to approve uh consent agendas items 6 through13. >> Second. >> I have a motion and a second. The clerk
call the role. >> Councilman Gford, >> yes. >> Councilman Green, >> yes. >> Vice Mayor Grubs, >> yes. >> Mayor Stner, >> yes. 40. Moving on quickly to item 14, faith, family, responsible fatherhood lunch. I've got a proclamation. Do you want to
come on up? Who's receiving this? >> Yeah. >> Oh, there we go. >> Come on up. I'll read this proclamation and give you an opportunity to tell us who you are. >> Yeah, we've got quite a few other pastors in the room, too. >> They're all welcome to come up here with you if you'd like. Whereas faith faith traditions and
community values have long played an important role in the lives of many Portan residents, providing sources of strength, hope, guidance, and service. And whereas religious and ethical traditions have contributed to the development of values such as compassion, service, unity, and care for
others that support the well-being of the Port Orange community. And whereas families serve as a foundation of our community, helping to foster strong values, responsibility, compassion, and support for current and future generations. And whereas the month of
June includes the observance of Father's Day, a time to recognize and honor fathers and father figures for their contributions to their families and communities through guidance, support, and leadership. Now therefore, I, Scott Stilner, mayor of the city of Port
Orange, Florida, do hereby proclaim the month of June 2026 as faith, family, and responsible fatherhood month. The city of Port Orange encourages residents to come together to celebrate and support the families and relationships that contribute to our community. By
recognizing these values, we support families and promote community built on respect, understanding, and mutual support. So >> awesome. >> Can we come down and get a quick picture with you guys? >> Great. >> All right. council want to join us real quick and then we'll go ahead and have some comments with us.
>> Thank you all for uh for doing this proclamation. You know, we become what we celebrate and from6007 when the first uh English settlers came over here and set that cross in the ground, we set this land apart for uh for really the Christian faith and for the furtherance
of the glory of God. And um as the family go as the father goes, so goes the family. As the family goes, so goes the nation. And so on this America 250, it's not just the question on what type of a nation are we inheriting, but what type of a nation are we handing down to
our to our inherited children. And we want to have a nation that celebrates the gospel of Jesus. Um that we could all be forgiven of our sins and have uh being repented of our sins, have eternal life. And also that uh fathers need to be celebrated because most the issues in
our communities are really from uh fatherless homes or from people who have bad fathers or from really where the family family unit goes wrong. If we strengthen those family units, we can strengthen our communities. And so these pastors up here in solidarity and other ministry leaders are here to back it up
with this too. Thank you so much. Thank you guys very much. >> Appreciate you. Make sure >> I always feel a lot better when the clergy is among us in the council chambers. So, thank you guys again. Appreciate that.
>> Public participation on agenda. Where's Kim at? you're up. Good to see you. >> Good to see you. >> What's going on in the Chamber of Commerce? >> So, we have a lot of fun things coming up. So, one of the things is the mega
mixer and that is at Embry Riddle on June 11th and that'll be the sixth chamber of commerce is getting together. I always look forward to that. Lots of people and it's open to the public. We have the 2026 legislative welcome back
breakfast June 19th. And if anybody wants to look these up on the internet, you can go to the Port Orange South Daytona Chamber of Commerce. We have casino night June 26. That's a fun event. And that is a big fundraiser for Port Orange Chamber. For golfers and
animal lovers, we have the neighbors helping neighbors golf benefit for homeless animals and that is June 6. We have other golfing events. And let's see, oh, and the mega mixer, I want to mention the public is welcome to attend
that as well. We have several leadership programs in our chamber. And another thing coming up, we have summer brew and food fest and that is June 12th and 13. So, if you're a foodie or you like um beer, come on out. Thank you for your
time. >> Awesome. Thank you very much. >> Always good to see you. >> Thanks. >> All right, man. Was that the only one we had tonight? >> Yes, sir. >> Okay, that'll bring us to council member comments. Uh I'm going to go ahead and and start this off and go first this
evening. Um so, this morning I I try whenever I can to watch the county council meetings, um which are on live available online. Um they're they're pretty long throughout the course of the workday. I don't get a chance to catch
everything, but interesting thing happened this morning. Um a non-aggended u section or segment if you will of their meeting occurred actually prior to even them uh voting the uh and approving the agenda items. But they had the
county manager, Mr. director Wald and the chief financial officer uh for the county uh come up and give a presentation because of the recent proposal by Governor DeSantis to be handed over to the House and the Senate in Florida to discuss property tax
reform. Um and you could kind of get a sense of what was happening was they very quickly were seeing things that um were concerning. By the way, my comments are not designed for for or oppose of of what will be on the ballot.
But any in any regard, um there was a lot of information and I would encourage you guys if you get a chance to go and watch that section of the meeting from this morning. It's about 50 55 minutes long and there were some questions. Um, it was I was kind of like I feel like
I've been doing this for a long time and and and I I felt like there was a lot of complexity in the information and um and it is complex because the way that local governments acquire funding to provide the services
that the residents want. It is not the same if you know there's no oneizefits-all. So, you know, the big issue that is is being discussed or has been voted on sort of circles around homestead exemption properties, right? Well, it would be different if every single city in the entire state of
Florida all had the exact same amount of homestead properties because then you would say, well, that's pretty easy. Every city's going to have this x number. Well, that's not the case. And in fact, in fact, the city of Port Orange far exceeds the state averages for the amount of homestead properties.
Um I'm not sure where the county is on that, but the numbers that the county were were putting out were were pretty staggering. Um that with what was being proposed, they were anticipating about a $93 million um loss in revenue that is utilized to
provide services. And there are three top tier operating funds and about 125 million total loss which encompasses all of the county taxing sources that that involve property taxes. Um, and then he
went on to talk about different things that the the legislature and was was considering. And and the gist of this was they were trying to get a bunch of information to the county council to get consensus so that they could quickly construct a letter to send to the
Valuchia delegation of our House of Representatives and our Senate representatives to Tallahassee to go, "Hey, we see some concerns here. We want you to know about this before you guys move this forward." didn't take a vote. Well, guess what happened today? They
already voted. So, um, this this happened extremely fast and it happened in such a way that there was no time for local representatives at city and county levels in the state of Florida to really digest all this information with our
staffs and see, okay, well, what will this actually mean for our city? So, we still don't know. Um, so what happened today was the language was was approved and now this will be placed on the ballot in November for the voters to
decide um if if this is what they want to do. One of the one of the takeaways from what I watched at the county meeting this morning was it was described as and I'm paraphrasing a little bit is that this will be more than just property tax reform. This will
be a reform of how local local governments, city and county governments can provide services or not to their immediate residents. And that will look differently all over the state of Florida. Right? So you got roughly 420
different municipalities, 67 counties. What one city's residents want versus another cities can be completely different. We see that, right? You drive around the state of Florida, you see communities that look totally different. You can see communities where it almost seems like money's no object and other
communities that really struggle to provide just basic fundamental services. So, we don't really know yet. Um, our staff I've been talking with the city manager, our staff will will quickly digest this as much as possible. Um, and
we will look at this. One of the things I wanted to bring up tonight, um, and we can have further discussion on this because now the the timing part is has changed with the vote actually already occurring, but I think what we need to be able to do is take this
information, give it to our staffs, um, and have them schedule a workshop with us prior to November. I think we need to go through a a basic exercise scenario to say if
today if all of this was to be voted by the voters and the voters approve it, what does it mean? What decisions would we make? what impacts is this going to have on services so that the voters will be able to at least those who want can maybe go to our website and go well how does this impact Port Orange
specifically because this is where I live and see a scenario to say okay this is how much of a revenue loss it is these are where some you know possible uh funding if needed can come from and this is where it can't come from and this is what it's going to mean so
>> I don't even know all the terminology right now at this very moment as we sit here tonight to to uh how to even address all of this. But we do know that it is going to if it is approved by the voters and vote for it or not, whatever you want to do, but if it is approved by
the voters, it will significantly significantly change the structure of of how we fund municipal operations and provide services in the city of Florida as it will with every city in the state of Florida. That is without question. So, um, Wayne, did you want to weigh in
on any of that right now? I don't I don't want to try to put you under under the gun because I know your your staff is still trying to digest some of this, but >> we do have the PowerPoint that the county had this morning. So, we will send that to the council members and we did a PowerPoint back in January when we were going up to Tallahassee when when
the House was considering bills and it's close enough that the information we put together in January is still relatively valid. That was based off of current year tax. We started working on a graphic today that's based on the June 1 property appraisers tax roles. It's a little bit newer information, but we'll
get all of that to you so you'll have it to start looking from. It's fairly straightforward talking points on it. Just the estimates off of what we're looking at a little different scale than the county, but it looks like at at year two when they're up to the 250, it's about $10 million out of our our general
fund that would go would be lost because of this. And then I I as I understand it, the language will also include constraints on how cities could could try to to find those those revenues. If if the the city is like, hey, if it's
$100 today, we need $100 tomorrow to provide the same amount of services. There are some constraints, I believe, that are being placed in place that could be voted on. >> And I haven't read every single line of it. They did include a line that talks about changing the millage rate and it requires supermajorities and majorities
to do things above roll back. So it requires a longer vote. There were at one point stronger restrictions on it. They added some language in one of the amendments. Originally it was like it was this core services that was police, fire, infrastructure, but then they added some stuff later that said
constitutional officers of the county and operations of city government. So absent we Matt and I have to sit down and start going through the context of it. That sounds like it broadened it up that you can because it's somewhere along the lines if you can't use that the remaining tax dollars can't be used
to fund the city attorney or IT or HR staff. It's hard for the police department to operate without somebody making sure their computers work and and they can hire employees. So, I think they broadened it to say, look, you can you can support these departments as well, but I'm not sure. I haven't read it all the way through, but it sounds
like they did loosen that up a little at the end. >> Okay, good. Anyhow, all that to say because I have had a lot of business owners and a lot of residents ask me what does this actually mean and what would this mean for our specific community? And I hate saying we don't
actually know, but we don't know fully yet. Um, but we will we'll try to digest that and and figure out what all that actually means so that the voters can be well informed come November as to how that would impact our city. Uh, other than that, just a reminder, is Susan
over there tonight? >> Are there any are there any openings left for the golf tournament? >> No, golf tournament is full. >> The golf tournament is sold out. So, I was going to make an announcement that if you hadn't signed up yet and you were interested in playing in the annual mayor's tournament that supports um our
youth athletic scholarship fund to get signed up, but if you waited, you waited too long. So, we'll be looking forward to that. that is uh on Saturday, June 20th. It is a great annual fundraiser for an amazing cause. So, I appreciate everybody working hard that puts that on
every single year. Tracy, what do you got? Uh so looking going into the homestead exemption, what you're asking and uh the raw numbers so everybody knows is Port Orange has approximately 58% that would be affected in the homestead
exemption of that tax role and the county is 38%. So it's it's pretty detrimental. Um, want to give a shout out to uh the mayor and to uh Chief Marino uh police memorial events that uh
took place a week and a half ago. Um if you not been to one of those uh representation of fallen officers, it is very very heartbreaking but a very very beautiful event to honor
all the police for Flagler County. So thank you for the two of what y'all did. Uh the department did a phenomenal job u parading that amongst with all the other cities. uh Memorial Day event uh that was held here at the city uh memorial park on the
back side of city hall. Uh fly over and the event itself both are equally just amazing what happened. Um and then uh this past weekend uh
got to witness two, how would you put it? two near misses of ebikes uh flying down the center of the roads. Residents need to understand is school is out, kids are out, and they're out at
all hours. Um you need to be very mindset and wary of these uh things that are going on because they're not on the sidewalks, they are in the roads. Um, parents, do your due diligence to be able to educate the kids of how to ride and wear
a helmet. Um, we don't need to see any tragedy inside our city and the helmet will help save a lot of those accidents from happening. Um, but saying that, we ended up on Sunday afternoon having a
head-on collision in my front of my house at a stop sign of all things. People aren't paying attention. Car was parked at a stop sign and guy cut the corner short and head on into a vehicle.
Everybody's good. Um, but the saving grace is that there was no kids on eBags at that time. It's 3:00 in the afternoon. There was no rain yesterday. So, you know, people aren't paying attention. That's why I bring it up. Uh, thank you for Port Orange PD. the
officer uh in charge of that uh event was phenomenal. Um so thank you chief for doing a great job and keeping your staff up and going. >> That's it. >> Lance, >> I have nothing tonight, sir. >> All right. If you don't mind, we'll yield your time over to Sean.
>> I'll do it. >> All right. Thank you very much. Um I'd like to take this opportunity at this time to recognize uh a citizen of Port Orange and have it read into a record his obituary. Uh Allan Roland Crouch of Port Orange, Florida, passed away
peacefully at his home surrounded by his loving family on May 19th, 2026. He was born in Meville, Pennsylvania on July 17th, 1938 to Harry and Thelma Crouch. After moving to Florida in the summer of
1945, Allan attended Port Orange Elementary and graduated from Mainland High School in 1956. In October of 1956, at the age of 18, he received his real estate broker's license. At the time,
the requirements for a broker's license was age 21, but a hardship exemption was granted through the courts due to his father's illness and the family's need for help with the business. He became the youngest broker in the state of
Florida. In addition to his real estate career, Allan joined the Daytona Beach Fire Department in 1959. He was drafted into the Army in 1961 and served as a military policeman in Albuquerque, New Mexico for two years. He returned to
Port Orange in 1963, resuming his work with both the fire department and real estate business. Allan became the first lieutenant in the history of the Daytona Beach Fire Department and later advanced to captain. He left the department in 1972 as his real estate business
continued to expand and required more of his time. That same year, Allan was asked by the Port Orange Council to become chief of the Port Orange Volunteer Fire Department, where he had served as a member since 1959. He accepted and gradually helped transform
the department into a full-time paid professional fire department over the next five years. When the permanent full-time chief was hired, Allen retired to the Port Orange uh he he retired from the Port Orange Fire Department and
continued his work in real estate. In 1967, Allen teamed up with Harold Test and formed Crouch and Test Realy Inc. And I apologize, my eyes itching. Um, after Tustin left in 1982, Allan changed
the name to Crouch Realy Corporation, which continued until his retirement in 2005, I'm sorry, 2003. In 1981, Allan married the love of his life, Jacqueline Jackie Roar Price. He later became a US Merchant Marine Officer, charter
captain. Allan was a was awarded one of the first positions on the home I'm sorry on the honor roll plaque at Memorial Park in Port Orange in 1998 and was named realtor of the year in 2002 by the Daytona Beach Area Association of
Realtors. He was an avid fisherman as well known in the community for tournament fishing. Above all, Allan loved spending time with his family. Allan was preceded by his father Harry Crouch, his mother Thelma Crouch, his brother Harry Bud Crouch, and his son
Charles Chip Crouch. He is survi survived by his loving wife of 45 years Jacqueline Crouch, his sister Joyce Sotus, his children Deborah Zenbeck, Joseph Ray Price, M Maria Melissa Brown,
and his daughter-in-law Rachel Crouch. Allan is also survived by his grandchildren and there's many of them. His great-grandchildren as well. That's awesome. Allan was a loving husband,
father, grandfather, and friend. He will be greatly missed. And the memorial services for Allen will be June 6th and that'll be at Lman's funeral home here in Port Orange at 3:00. So, um, I knew Allan, uh, he was an amazing man and he probably helped I can't tell thousands
of people relocate to Port Orange and, uh, just a a good man and I'm just honored to be able to read his obituary into the record. Thank you. >> Thank you for doing that. >> Thank you for doing that. He was one of my dad's oldest oldest friends, man. >> That is a lifong.
>> That is definitely a life of of of service and success for sure. So, thank you very much for doing that. >> Anything else? >> Nope. All right, that brings us to uh city attorney comments. >> Nothing for you tonight. >> Mr. City Manager, all yours. >> So, Riverwalk update. There's not a
whole lot from the last time. We do have one of the companies that's been interested in it that is going to come back probably in the next couple weeks. They said mid June. They they've gone beyond just casual to the point where they're doing some bubble plans and some ideas. So, some of the stuff just to make sure it stays competitive and we're still getting the best deals out there.
I don't want to go into too much detail, but there there's at least one group that's moving to putting stuff on paper and moving forward. So, it may be that we come together towards late June and say to everybody else that we've been talking to, you've got until X day to submit or we're going to move forward
some other way because we can't just let them keep dragging it out. So, we we're getting to the point where I think we can do that and just say everybody has until July 15 and at that point we're going to take what we have and bring it to council. Okay. But so far what we've seen it it it is consistent with what we
talked about as far as mixed uses and and and a destination that people who live here would want to go to. >> Excellent. >> On the storm water projects, most of the stuff that this update's related to transform 386, these are the projects that the county is now in control of because they're the ones that are
controlling the funding through the federal government. It's mostly HUD funding. And because of that, all the reporting requirements and the compliance requirements of using federal funds, they wanted to control it so they could control all the compliance requirements. Portona uh the design contract for
Portona was approved by the county last month and their design is going to start this month. So they're starting to design the Portona project. So with their transform 386 money and what we got at least through the the the legislative budget, that project is almost fully funded. The gap is made up
we have in in our budget. Soona, if the governor allows that to go forward, should be fine. We we would be able to move forward with that at the county's pace. So that one it's a good good step forward in that area. And there was actually it was a TV story about it. We I can't remember which channel it was
that came out. Channel 9 channel 9 came out and did a story on the project. So it's already getting positive reactions. The other thing in that area, while it's not storm water directly related, there's a lift station on Charles Street in that area. And that was the other one that got funded through the legislative appropriation. hoping that the governor
supports us all the rest of the way through. But that would be two big positives for that area of town. The sugar forest project, which is one of the bigger ones, we're at the point of having 75% plans done now. So you typically hear about 30 60 90s with the plan. So 75 is an intermediate plan, but
you're far enough along once you've crossed 60s where you're looking at, you know, where the pond's located, you know how big it is, you know where the pipes are. So it's giving you like one last look before you get to those 90% plans. So, that one is making a good bit of progress. That one was funded from
legislative appropriations prior year. There is still a decent gap on that one, but not a gap that we can't make up. Um, excuse me. Powers Avenue design already kicked off on the P Avenue project. They're going to or the design meeting is on June 9th, so
it's coming up. They're getting ready to start P design. Sleepy Hollow is moving forward where the county is going to advertise for design this month also and start doing it later this year. Sleepy Hollow though has a bigger gap. That's the one where we were waiting on Resilient Florida money. So, as this one
moves forward, that one's going to we don't have the funding to cover the full construction of that project. That's definitely going to count on some Resilient Florida or other grant funds to to get us there. Um and then on the June 16th council meeting, Tim has an agenda item where the FE FEMA is now
starting to move forward with the projects to elevate and demolish houses. So on the 16th, we have one for elevation of 13 homes and a demolition reconstruction of one. So that's 14. So where we were doing one or two and we always said it's going to be like two to three years after the storms. So as
we're moving forward, you're now starting to see the individual houses start coming forward for either demolition or elevation. So, it's it's starting to it's kind of like the momentum's coming. You can see the rolling of the individual houses and the and the momentum on the bigger projects. Same thing with the the Cambridge pump.
So, that those bids are coming in. That's still on schedule to start later this summer, start construction on on the Cambridge. So, all of these things are now starting to to get there. Be great. We can go a couple more seasons without any hurricanes to let all this stuff get done and in place. We continue
to do maintenance the same way we we're still at. This is the year we've done more than we've ever done before. The the I think the the idea that they had of bringing in a consultant or a private firm to use their specialy equipment in the really hard areas has allowed us to
do even more in the areas we can get to. So, there's a lot of activity going on out there in the storm water world and the parks bond project. So, the update tonight, there's just two things on tonight's agenda. the the city center fields package, the construction contract was awarded tonight and the
authorization to apply for an echo grant for Willow Run. So that'll be the fields over here where we swap the land with the school district. Uh they will be anywhere from two to seven fields that are out there at a time. So this will get parking, restrooms, and those additional fields. And this is that efficiency created by building them
here. We already have a parks office building. We have all the other parks facilities here. So if you're a parent, at least you don't have to get in your car and drive out to one of the other fields. Hopefully, it gives you a better chance to stay in one position. And then the Willow Run Park when we they took the piece of property right behind
Horizon, but there's there's still more land in that area and uh it allows us to expand that and put the baseball fields and some things like that or not baseball fields, a bicycle there's a bicycle playground area that's going to go in there. So, the Echo grant would allow give us two more million dollars. So, we're basically able to leverage the
$30 billion bond with extra money coming from Echko as we go forward. So, by the time we're done, we may end up with $40 million worth of parks or 30 some some other number because ECHKO is going to continue to be able to add on top of what we have with the bond funds being the matches going forward.
>> Good deal. on the uh storm water projects, by all means, if there's anything council can do to to move any of those things or any part of any of those things along uh at a greater rate, by all means, always let us know and keep us and like the other one, some
sometimes I'm trying to summarize really complex stuff. So, if I get a team's message that I got something wrong soon, I'll let you know if I messed up. So, I'm trying to And then the last thing that I had I want to our new public works director started this week, Sean Moroni. if you want to come up, introduce yourself, >> come on up.
>> Comes to us from New Smra, but he he's also well known among our staff who worked with him for years from his time at the county and some of the other places. So, we're extremely happy to have him here. >> I know Juno is Good evening, Mayor St. >> He is. He is. >> Yeah. So, he's definitely the key one. I know Robin was looking forward to it,
but good evening, Mayor Stiller and council. I appreciate you all having me. Um, one thing I do want to say is I do appreciate um, city manager, assistant city manager, and the firing squad over here for uh, for trusting me to take this position on. Um, I've seen a lot of good things. I've been here two days so
far, but I've lived in Port Orange since 2010. So, I've seen a lot of good things so far that we're looking at and and obviously, you know, we've got a a clean slate on the uh, management side of public works. So, hopefully get everybody up and running. like city manager said, they're doing a lot of good things out there as far as
maintaining everything. Um, still got to get out and about and do my thing, but check it out. But obviously two days in, it's it's been great so far. So, I do appreciate everything, everybody's trust in that. >> We we are very happy to have you and uh hopefully the that you appreciate the
welcome because you are welcome and uh it's great that we are able to get somebody with a lot of local knowledge, not only geographically speaking, but as a resident and stuff like that. So, you know, that's something that >> doesn't always show up on a resume and it's not always out there, you know,
when you're when you're advertising for positions, but it is definitely a plus to get somebody. So, um I know you had a hard decision to >> Yeah, I wasn't looking and when they came calling, I mean, it's my town, so I mean, if I can do anything to help with this town, I'm I'm going to do it. I've been on the code enforcement board, been
on the parks and rec board. You know, try to do what I can, but this is a big uh a big gift to me and I do appreciate the >> and and I'll be honest with you, I I think there's value to in your local experience and your your local resources >> and so I would just tell you from somebody who's been in municipal
government for a long long time is uh we appreciate those resources and and I encourage you to use them. I think you're going to have a great team to work with and a great city staff and a supportive city council. So, welcome you very much. >> Thank you, >> gentlemen. Anything? >> Just let us know what we can do to keep
you uh to to to keep you moving. >> I do appreciate it. >> What tools and equipment you need to to keep things going. >> Absolutely. I'll give you a list. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, I'm sure. >> Thank you very much. >> Yeah, no problem. >> No, thank you. And I mean, it's looking forward to it. I mean, you live here, so you're going to take pride in the job
even more so. So, thank you. >> I love the grin on Juno's face. >> He's gotten half the emails and phone calls since I got here today. So he's Yeah, >> he can sit back and put his feet on his desk that stuff. >> Oh, yeah. He gets real quick with that. >> He's got it down. So, well, welcome.
>> Thank you guys very much. >> Thanks for taking the time. >> Wayne, anything else? >> No, sir. >> All right, that brings us to item 18. Report from Kipper Sports on Cypress Golf Club. It's a wet golf club. On the way in tonight, there was some hail
falling out there. >> Uh, yeah. I hope it I was at the golf advisor. I hope we didn't get hit too bad. >> Yeah, seriously. They were saying quarter size. I don't know. Somewhere new SR. I don't know if it hit Cypress Head or not. I'm Jeff Dayton from Cypress Head Golf Club. Good evening, mayor and council members. Good
to see you all. Um, so I'm here tonight to report on the February, March, and April financials for Cypress Head Golf Club. So, it's seems like a distant memory, but February was a pretty rough month. Uh, very cold. Had our maybe second or third Arctic blast of the
season. So, we didn't have a great month. We lost about 25,000 to the bottom in February, but then March came, good weather came, April was good. So, we March and April we picked up about uh 46,000 uh $36,000. So, year to date
through April, um we're our revenues are about 7,000 under budget, but our bottom line is about 15 to 16,000 under. So, we had a decent May even though it kind of fizzled toward the end. So we might might catch back up at when May's financials come out. So it's looking
good. >> So uh but yeah, through April our Ebida is about 15 and a half thousand. Rounds are are down by 1300. Um but they're over prior year by a by 300. So you know
again it was that cold winter so we're still catching up on but course is doing great. Our NPS through these three months the net promoter score was 89.4 four, which as we know is really good. Um, service satisfaction was at 9.7 for that same time frame. So, that was
great. Uh, the course conditions, you know, a lot of courses right around us are struggling right now uh because of the the winter was so harsh. The turf couldn't handle it this not used to this kind of weather. So, a lot of course are struggling. Darren Bachi and our team are really doing a great job keeping Cyber Head looking good. So, it's going
to be a great tournament. mayors when we it's it's looking great now and it's going to get better and uh so we're very pleased with the conditions. Um it's better than any of the course around here right now. Um and we got a 9.3 during that time frame. But uh the new golf cart fleet we got is is performing
nicely. We've only had one crash so far and it wasn't a bad one. So that's good. The new bunkers are performing great. Everybody loves the sand with the all this rain. They've been holding up nice. They haven't been eroding very bad. They've been easy to to reprep whereas before it took us two or three four days
to recover. Now we can get them back within the same day usually after rain. So it's really good. >> Excellent. >> And uh we won the best of Daytona again for public golf. Uh Cypress had finished second in two separate categories in Chicago in February for our true service awards. We lost out to uh Desert Willow
and one of them and another top fourth. We we are well recognized when the company is having a really good uh service uh program at the club. We did have the PJ hope for the first time which is helping our patriots everywhere. So we had eight patriots out
to the course and we we did a six week lesson seminar. They loved it. We're doing again in August. So it's something that through the PJ America that we help promote golf through the Patriots and get them involved in things. Um and it was great. everybody uh got better.
As far as tournaments go, we've been really busy. I mean, we've hosted many tournaments. We hosted Rotary Reed, no longer fileless, Elks, Bruce Creek, Academy Finance, just to name a few. But, but it's been busy. Um, it's obviously it's going to slow down now a little bit. May was decent. Uh, June's going to start slowing down, but uh it's
been it's been a great tournament season. And uh heading into the you know the final quarter we have uh the tea ground project uh that we put off the next year. We have a T line project that we're currently getting bids on. So we're look hoping to have that installed
by September to give an artificial tea on the back of the range so we can take pressure off the turf for golf tournaments or maybe if it's too wet or whatever. But uh it's going to be nice. We're not going to use them all the time because most golfers like to hit off natural turf. It's more healthy, but it's nice to have for situations. So,
and plus we'll be able to use it at night on occasion. So, we're looking forward to that. Drive tip and putts coming next Monday. We have like 120 participants in that. It'll be kids over you competing at a local qualifier. So, that's really awesome. >> And then, uh
June 20th coming up. So, we're all all set for that. Uh we did we had there has been a little talking about ebikes. You know, ebikes have been a problem on our course lately. fishing has been has ramped up and and we've, you know, we're trying to police that as best we can.
We're taking phone calls. I'm logging calls so we get repeat offenders or repeat areas that we can really have documents. We have a, you know, log in the golf shop. And uh the the fishermen aren't really doing a whole lot of damage. They're more or less just trespassing. They could have be a
liability. and the uh we still fight to keep them off the golf course, but the ebikes are really what's causing more damage with tear when they get on the greens and tearing up stuff. So, we'll just continue to do our best to police it and um that's about it. It's more good than bad. So,
>> good. We like that. Like that. >> Any questions for >> No, Jeff. I just think uh doing a great job. Staff's doing a great job. It seems like your your staff continues to improve and and and you know your course rangers now and and everything. Uh
courteous and the course looks great. Uh keep up the good work, man. Doing a good job. >> Thanks. >> Good to see you. >> Thank you too. >> Have a good evening. >> Thank you. >> Let's talk some more golf. Item 19, golf advisory report.
Golf advisory board report. You got your team signed up? No, you sold out. Actually, I'm I'm not going to be in town. So, this is the first year I think I've not made it. So, >> I give you a pass. Yeah. >> I just want you all to have a good time
and I want to make sure everybody every photo want to see in a newspaper. You >> bet. >> Okay. You're winning team. >> Um Jeff covered a few of the things that I was going to talk about. Um at the advisory meeting tonight, the uh the
item uh that came up was the pathways between nine and 10. There's really no good markings if you're new to the course. When you finish nine, you don't really know where the 10 is. And so they suggested they put in some markings to indicate which way to go. And the same
thing if we start in the back and start on 10, you need something to tell you how do I get to one. So we've advised do that. They're going to paint some symbols apparently on the cart paths to help direct people to the right direction. So if you're new, it'll it'll help them out. Um, fishing in ebikes did
come up. We're having a terrible time with fishing in the community at large where we're having people trespass across people's yards to get to a pond because they want to fish there uh without asking permission of the homeowner and they're getting quite upset. We are having some ebike issues.
You they're everywhere. I I'm I'm sure the council at some point's going to have to come up with some rules and regulations about what we're going to do with that. But they're u on the second hole. Yeah. It was, no, it wasn't two. It was on 11. Uh, a resident who backs
up to that hole observed an ebiker doing donuts on the green. He called the police department. They arrived and said, "Where are where are they?" He said, "I don't know." But he said, "We can't do anything unless the golf course calls us and tells us that they're on
the green. It can't be a resident." seems a little strange, but maybe it's something that can be taken up with the police department to determine what the right process is with that. Um there was a great deal of confusion about rates. Um there's a proposal for the uh cap of
rates, which you'll have to decide upon. And when that document came out, instead of showing the progression yearbyear, they took the spreadsheet and shrunk it so they only showed the beginning and the end. So what we're looking at was today's rates and a rate five years from
now that might be in effect. Tonight we first saw what they're proposing for next year which is basically a 7% increase over the current rates for everything across the board whether it's trail a trail pass legacy pass leg you know annual pass any of those things
that uh that are there. the uh the advisory council agreed that those were reasonable uh in terms of going forward as long as it's only a 7% from whatever they set for that year to the next year. Not if you only do two this year or two
next year, don't drive it by 15 or 16 or 18%. So that that's going to come up in front of you. Um, yeah, that was Yeah, the U Jeff is correct there in Lance's comments, I think, are appropriate. The course is really in good shape. There's a few
holes where there's some problems. Uh, you'll see an 11 for some of the the perimeter area um right next to the green and the green itself is struggling a little bit because of some diseases, principally from the the harsh winter that we've had and and too much rain at one time. And so you'll see some of that
that damage, but other than that, staff is great. Uh they run a great operation. The pro shop looks good. The improvements in the restaurant are noticeable. Uh which we're getting a lot of comments and feedback from people. So uh it's been a good great change. Any any comments from you all?
I would I would just ask you uh you can briefly talk to him about tonight but make some time to uh just touch base with the police chief on those issues because >> we the golf course is a little bit different similar to parks. We own it >> so our police officers are agents of the
city and and and things >> will will happen a little bit differently in those cases. All that to say though that you know >> I can understand why that's becoming a growing issue out there. And so sometimes when things just that weren't normal a few years ago start to become
more and more repetitive thing, we we will look at that and do some training and stuff like that, but only if we know about it, right? So we appreciate you bringing that to our attention. I would touch base with the police chief uh maybe schedule some time for him or his staff to say, "Hey, this is what we're seeing and we think we're going to see
more of it. We just want to make sure our police officers." >> It would just be a good change. Yeah. >> Right. And also we for Jeff's staff and maybe even for the HOA the homeowners because I do know like and you guys can correct me if I'm wrong, but >> some of the homeowner properties go
right up to the lake or the pond. So somebody may think that they're standing on the golf course property fishing. They're probably standing in somebody's backyard because I know I remember I've had those calls before. Yeah. So, uh, so again, some some training, some some understanding, some information that can
be spread amongst the homeowners, the police department, the board, and all that stuff. I think we can stay on top of that because we have in the past and so we can get on that. But your your your point is very valid. The the the ebike thing is, you know, really bikes. They're just really Yeah.
>> motorcycles. >> The other thing I learned from one of the residents, too, is our ponds happen to be one of the best fishing ponds in the area. >> They don't get fish. >> Yeah. Well, yeah. So, it's, you know, a reputation is preceding this time of year, >> Tracy. Yeah. >> Are you sure? >> Yeah. So, the question I would have is
the information that you did with the rate changes. >> Yes. >> Has that been redone and sent out that they see all of it? >> Yes. >> Okay. Cuz we're I know y'all probably got emails like I did today blowing up about it and it's exactly what you
>> That's exactly what happened is I got beat up. I mean I Rich you gota when you go to the meeting you got jump all over him. >> Yeah I'll tell you some of them were a little >> D agree. Yeah because you look at it it's like suddenly we had a 41% increase 43% increase. It's like something's wrong.
>> Yeah. And I'm going to go ahead and apologize for my team. You're going to have some green fixing later after the mayor's tournament. Okay. >> So, one of the issues that I was going to and again bring to the council about some of the fishing was is that there
are there are guys that are actually on the golf course and they are interrupting uh the business of golf. I mean, literally standing in the fairway uh daring people to hit them with a golf ball. And when it starts interfering with city business,
>> which is the the golf course, then that's where I have an issue. I don't >> trespass whatever, whatever. But when you're out there interfering with city business and we just we're talking about rate hikes, etc. We're talking about dollars to the city. That's why I come to to an issue and I've discussed this with with the chief as well and with SAP
that you know fishing's fishing. But when we're when we're interrupting business in the middle of the day and you got guys in the middle of a fairway, then >> you know that's a different story. But uh so other than that though, um are the are the rate changes coming in front of
us anytime soon? Do you know? They should be. >> Yeah. Well, I'm not sure how it gets delivered to you, but they should be coming forward. So, you can >> July's July's agenda. >> Okay. The only thing I would say is I don't I don't know why um we would if we would need to continue to raise cart
rates for residents. I mean, green fees I see change those things, but I don't understand why the cart rate has to change. >> Trail fees going up proportionally. Yeah, it's all 7% 7% creative custom board. Okay. And that's up to you to decide whether you want to support it or
not. I'm just saying the golf advisory board said we we concur 7% seems like a reasonable increase. >> Gotcha. >> But you may want to pick and choose some of the stuff. >> All right. Thank you. >> Yeah. And not that we're happy with seven. We're just saying it's it's reasonable. >> And it's the max. Keep in mind that
that's what they're saying. This is the most we can charge or that's what you're agreeing to is this is the most they can charge. >> Correct. It's a cap. >> Yeah. Right. Thank you, Rich. >> It's the max. to go along with your fishing. I did have during a tournament on a Saturday, there were two guys
fishing on the golf course on 17 that I asked to move because they were standing there, you know, it's 3:00 in the afternoon. >> Yeah. >> Anyway, thank you guys. >> All right. Thanks. Appreciate you coming out. >> You bet. >> All right. Moves us to the regular agenda item. Item number 20, an appeal
of the planning commission denial of a variance for 5968 Shady Creek Lane. Um, before we go too far into this, I'm going to have the city attorney go over what our role is
because this is actually a pretty unique thing um for us. I think in my entire time on council, I think this has only happened one time prior to this, maybe maybe two. So pretty unique. Um it is a change in what our responsibility normally is and the latitudes that we
have to operate within. So I want to um have the city attorney go over that and and also Matt ask you that throughout the course of this process if we get off track uh or anybody in the process is off track that you interject and stop that and put us back on track. Okay.
>> Yeah. So, like you mentioned, um not very common that you're sitting in an appellet capacity, but that's what you're doing here tonight. So, there's been a decision made by your planning commission, um who had the authority to uh approve or deny a variance. Um so, that decision has been made. So, you sit
now hearing the appeal of that decision. Um during that, uh your deliberation here tonight, there's really only three things that you consider. It's that planning commission decision. it's the factors that you've established by the code of ordinances as to what qualifies
for a variance. So there's uh and I'll go over those here in a minute. Um and then the the third thing is really uh just the the facts presented at that hearing. So so this isn't a brand new hearing. Uh you're not going to hear new evidence. This isn't a recommendation that you're hearing along with other
evidence. This is actually just a an appeal of a prior decision. So, it's based on what took place in the we'll call it the lower court. Um, since it's been a while, I I think it's important to know what those factors are, what what the factors uh the city has
established to determine whether to vary uh the code on a on a variance application. So, I'm just going to run through those very quickly. Uh, so just bear with me. Um so a special conditions and circumstances exist exist which are peculiar to the land structure or building involved and which are not
applicable to other land structures or buildings involved in the same zoning district. B special conditions and circumstances are not result of the actions of the applicant. C. Literal literal interpretation and enforcement of the development code regulation would deprive the applicant of rights commonly
enjoyed by other properties in the same zoning district under the terms of the development code and would work unnecessary and undue hardship on the applicant. Uh the variance if granted is the minimum variance necessary to make possible the reasonable use of the land building or structure. Uh E is granting
of the variance request will not confer on the applicant. Any special privilege that is denied by the development code to other lands, buildings or structures in the same zoning district. F is the granting of the variance will be harmonious with the general intent and purpose of this code and will not be
injurous to the surrounding properties or detrimental to the public welfare. And then G relates to really a B J. Harris criteria that's that's not in place here. Um, so as you hear from staff here soon, um, you're you're going
to be uh asked a question and that objective is to determine whether the planning commission's denial of the proposed variance is supported by the facts presented at the planning commission hearing as applied to those variance criteria that I just mentioned. Uh, if you believe that the denial is
supported by confident substantial evidence, then your decision should be to uphold the variance. If you believe that the planning commission denial is not supported by competent substantial evidence and or you believe that the planning commission misapplied the variance criteria to the facts presented at that hearing, then you should overturn the denial and approve the
variance. Uh so in a moment here, Tim's going to go ahead and give you a brief summary of uh his staff report. That's the same staff report that was provided at the planning commission. There's no no new additions there. Uh then we'll turn it over to the the appellant to provide his uh full basis for appeal.
And and again, I think you've already mentioned it. Um, you know, we're we're going to be c I'll be cautioning you on any sort of new information or new evidence that's being presented because really even if you hear that either from the public, from the applicant, even if if Tim were to provide something, I would tell you your your decisions bound
to on those facts that were at that hearing uh in front of the planning commission. So, I'll make mention that you'll probably hear that by the end of this that you know really it's you know the the facts that were presented to planning commission is what we're here to to consider tonight. So, unless you have any procedural questions about
that, um I'll go ahead and turn it over to Tim. >> Do we do we need any kind of motion on the floor right now or No. >> Yeah, I think um you know, right now the recommended motion so so our normal protocol would be to uh you know, follow for the the recommended motion right now is to um to uphold the the decision of
the planning commission. So, that'd be an affirmative motion and then you'll have an opportunity to either vote that up or or down. So, that would be the the motion on the floor. Um just and Tim's going to say this, but just to reiterate, uh the staff's recommendation was for denial of the variance based on those factors that I just mentioned. And
then the planning commission on on a 4-1 vote denied the variance, um and and you know, heeded that recommendation by staff. >> Can I get somebody to put a motion and a second on the floor to uphold the recommendation of the planning board?
do a motion to uh recommend the the motion of the planning board of >> just Yeah, just to uphold the decision of the >> uphold the decision of the planning board. >> Second. >> I'll second it for discussion. >> Yep. We have a motion and a second on
the floor. >> Tim Bourbon, can you just go ahead and briefly overview kind of what the variance request is for? Um, basically the request is to maintain an existing sixoot fence that is located within a secondary secondary front yard. Um, basically the way the land code states that if you are on a corner lot, which
basically it's two but basically a rightway on each side of the property, it's considered a corner lot. And by definition of the code, the corner lot has two front yards. So in this case, you have the front of the house which faces Shady Creek Lane and then you also have the side here which also faces
Shady Creek Lane. um by by the code that is considered two front yards. Our code states that you cannot have a six foot fence within a front yard. So what the code would allow is for the fence by code to be the green line which is in line with the front plane of the home.
Um the applicant has put the fence within this purple area which is a secondary front yard. Then the fence um was installed based off of kind of aerial photographs that we have was probably installed about 2016. um it was brought to city's attention through a code case. That work was done without a
permit. Then um once we started looking into it, did not find a building permit. The next step was to um get with the applicant to either revise the fence location or to basically request a variance and the applicant chose to seek the variance in. So that's why the variance was presented to maintain that
existing fence in its current location. Um so as you know Matt indicated the staff report was provided with you along with the applicant's appeal letter there that went over basically the case that was printed to the planning commission. Um planning commission basically upheld the staff's recommendation of denial of
the variance and the applicant um is here to basically present their case as why they feel that this variance should be approved. Can you just walk us through one more time the the foundational reasons as to why staff has
recommended denial of the variance? There's notice basically special cons on the property basically the special conditions or circumstances which is particular property there is typically that is as we indicated here you know there's a large historic tree there's a deep uh slope there there's
nothing in that case on that property um that would basically warrant basic that fence having to be pushed out further from the house on that thing um B with the special um circumstances as we said basically that um there is no special circumstances that we staff identified
um interpretation enforcement of land development code in terms of this fence requirement. There's basically multi-reasons for that. Then um one of it is to make sure that the fences are not located within the front yard to impede visual clearance. Um as indicated staff report this does not do that. Also
two basically to ensure that basically that this fence is not budding another property in terms of having to have a sixoot fence to someone's front yard indicated was not there. And the third is overall aesthetics within a community. That way we do not have in a local roadway network basically um you
know six foot tall fences along the road network there. That's in this case here because Shady Creek Lane is a local road that's traveled by everyone there and you'd have the sixoot fence um on that property. Then um that's there D. Um if the variance is granted minimum to make use of the land as we indicate in the
report the minimum necessary to make use of the property would be you know could have the sixoot fence there. It would basically enclose the yard as requested or could be pushed out to a 4ft fence um as we've done in other corner lots and granting the uh variance would not
confer privilege on the applicant um denied requested by other property. Then we have other corner lots which is in this listed in the report here um with that subdivision would the same would apply to them in terms of them seeking a um permit from us then on there then. So
basically that was kind of basis for staff's review of this one. Um there again you know the applicant provided information as why they disagreed with us and I think staff basically made sure that we included their viewpoint in the staff report um to give basically a fair representation to of this of this case
then. Okay. >> Any questions? >> Not yet. Any questions? >> No. >> No. Okay. All right. Can the applicant come on? Yeah. One second.
>> Welcome. Go ahead and introduce yourself. And >> Good evening, mayor and members of city council. Um, my name is Peter Francis. I'm here tonight to present this appeal. Uh I have provided the city with an appeal packet. I hope you had the uh opportunity to review it in detail. I'm respectfully asking the council to
reverse the blending commission's April 23rd decision and approve the variance before you tonight. Uh let me start by saying that the Bling Commission hearing was all over the place. The commission voted 4 to1 to deny an existing beautiful 10-year-old uh vinyl fence
that affects absolutely no one. They did so without clearly identifying which criteria were not met. The variance code exists for a reason. It provides relief when unique circumstances and hardships satisfies the established criteria. In this case, every one of those criteria
has been met. I want to go to slide two here. During the hearing, Mr. Tim Berman stated that staff's recommendation denial was based solely on code alone. He did not tell the commission that the application failed any specific variance
criteria which he mentioned today but he didn't mention that at the bling commission hearing. Instead the recommendation was based on the fact that defense does not strictly comply with the code and that's exactly what he said during the bling commission hearing by word solely on
code alone. But that's the entire purpose of a variance. every variance application comes before the city because something doesn't strictly comply with the land development code. If non-compliance with the code alone is enough to to justify denial, then every variance application that has ever come before the city
should have been recommended for denial. That's simply not how the variance process works. In fact, when we review prior variance var variance cases, we found that nearly every variance application over the past several years was recommended for approval by staff.
There were even two similar variances in 2016 that were unanimously approved. So naturally, we have to ask what makes this application different. The answer becomes even more clear when you read the staff report itself. Staff specifically acknowledged that this
fence does not create the types of impacts the code is intended to prevent. They confirmed it. They confirmed that it does not obstruct required sight triangles. It does not interfere with visibility. It does not create public safety concern. If there are no obvious
impacts, if the variance criteria have been met and if similar variances have been approved in the past, then it becomes difficult to understand the basis for recommending denial in this case. We had many meetings with the city staff including Mr. Mr. Bman here and
code enforcement manager uh Amanda when she was in that role. They all seemed they had no issue with that fence during our discussions. As a matter of fact, one employee even described it as aesthetically beautiful and looks great. This council again is being asked by
staff to uphold the decision that was based solely on quote alone and I'm awarding Mr. Berman's words during the hearing. The decision was produced by a hearing where I, the applicant, was denied rebuttal. It was decided without a single finding of fact and the ADA
provision written into the city's own variance ordinance was ignored. The record alone without anything else does not support upholding this denial. There's another issue that deserves attention. The staff report repeatedly states that
the fence is located less than 5 ft from the right away. That is simply incorrect. The fence is actually located approximately 7 ft from the rightway. The commission's decision was made using an accurate understanding of the physical facts. I also want to point out
something important in the staff report itself. In the recommendation section, staff acknowledged all the way at the end. They gave a leeway that if this variance were approved, it could be limited to an existing fence located within the secondary front yard setback
and not permit any additional fencing in that area. Members of the council, that is exactly what we're asking for. We're not asking for additional fencing. We're not asking for future expansion. We're simply asking to keep the same existing fence
that has been there for a decade without creating any safety issues, visibility issues, or have any impact on anyone. Um, moving on, I want to address exactly what happened during the public comments at the public commission hearing. as I wasn't as I wasn't given the opportunity
to rebuttal, correct misstatements, present further, or even have the final word that day. Four individuals associated with the HOA board. They came forward with a very clear agenda to weaponize this process
against my family. They misinformed. They made false statements and they focused on old, irrelevant, unrelated HOA disputes that have nothing to do with the variance before you today. And the purpose was to buy as a commission. Let me be more specific. One of their
attempts to buy as a commission was falsely claiming that we never received an HA approval for this fence 10 years ago. They stood before the commission and stated that the HOA never approved it. Yet, we have signed we have the signed HOA approval letter right here. I
provided a copy in the appeal packet. The individual who made that claim was serving on the board at that time. That approval was granted and he was aware and he's aware of that approval. But he stood before the commission and made that statement which had the effect of
mis misleading the commission about the facts. If the if the individuals associated with the HOA board speak again tonight, I expect it will be the same recycled HOA disputes, misinformation, accusations that have nothing to do with the variance before
you today. Now, with all that being said, let's take a step back and look at what the neighbors as a whole actually did. The city did everything required to ensure full public notice. There were large posted yellow signs, certified letters sent to adjacent properties,
public notices in the newspaper, and the HOA itself posted notices on both entrances of the neighborhood for all 103 homes to make them aware of the planning commission hearing. Despite all of that, only four individuals associated with the HA showed up to
oppose to oppose our application to attempt to influence the commission's decision. The other 99 as we show in this slide here, other 99 homeowners did not appear because they have lived with that fence
for a decade without an issue. They have accepted it and they do not view it as a problem. And I believe that speaks for itself. If anyone in this community had a genuine problem with it, I think we can all agree they would have said something back then. Maybe within the 30
within the first 30 days it went up. Let's give them the benefit of the doubt and say one year or how about two years but 10 years 10 years of silence is acceptance. The basic statutes of limitation for any HOA or real estate improvements matter is 5 years. This
fence existed well beyond that without a single word from anyone. Out of the entire neighborhood in the entire city only people associated with the HOA board attempted to speak poorly about this fence. The rest of the neighborhood did not bother to show did not bother to show up at the blending commission
hearing because they do not care if this fence stays it does not affect them. But this is why I respectfully ask this council to stay focused on the facts the various criteria the code and the law not personal disputes from the HOA
politics coming from the HOA folks. Now, let me talk about the inconsistency. In the staff report from the planning commission hearing on page four under the background section, it mentioned the applicant also notes that similar fence heights are commonly used in residential
and care settings for individual with comparable needs. For that reason, let's look at two examples from the city history of approving similar fences on corner lots. In March 2016, the city approved a six-foot privacy fence at a 5-ft setback
closer to the roadway than ours for purely aesthetic and privacy purposes. Commissioner Thomas Jordan voted in f in favor of that approval. Then in December 2016, staff through Mr. Burman recommended approval for a six-foot
fence located directly on the rightway with a zero foot setback. The hardship there was simply the loss of yard space and privacy. That application was approved. Both of these cases involved fences variances within secondary front yard setbacks like ours. Commissioner
Jordan voted in favor of both variances, but yet he voted against ours. From my perspective, that appears inconsistent. It raises legitimate question about why our application is being treated different. That is unfair, selective,
and inconsistent. Mr. Green, you may recall those cases as you were present and voted in favor of both approvals. I believe you were part of the Bling Commission at that time. I'm not sure if you remember them. Our situation here is different only in the
sense that our hardship is more significant and our justification is stronger as our application meets all criteria. Not only does our application satisfy the variance criteria, but the variance itself is less intrusive than the previous variances.
Our fence sits about 7 ft from the rightway, does not impact visibility, does not create safety concerns, and has maintained a nearly 10-year safety record with zero incidents. This fence also serves as an important medical and
safety purpose for a family member. We do have we do have our um medical necessity letter here which I have here in uh in case you would like to look at it. I can either hand it to
you or the city clerk at any time you would like me to. I'd also ask this council to carefully consider the language within the city's variance code that specifically references accommodations. This request should be evaluated not only under the variance
criteria but also with a consideration of the principles embodied in the ADA and the FHA as they relate to reasonable accommodations for individuals medical needs. Despite all of that, our application was denied. For that reason,
let's look at the application as a whole as it becomes very clear that every variance criteria criterion has been satisfied. When we look at the city's own history of approvals, one thing becomes impossible to ignore. Approving this
variance would not grant us any special privilege. In fact, we are asking for less relief than what the city has already granted to other applicants in the past. In addition, our lot is unique in configuration and differs from
standard typical lots where our lot does not border residential lots along the secondary frontage that would experience view obstruction or other impacts from the fence. In addition, there is a medical need for it. That directly satisfies criterion E. Now, let's look
at the physical facts further. Our fence sits about 7 ft back from the rideway. It is only 2 ft difference in height from what is allowed. That directly supports criterion D because the request represents the minimum variance
necessary necess necess to address the hardship while maintaining the safety and function of the property. We're not asking for additional fencing or any expansion whatsoever. We're simply asking to retain this existing structure that has already proven itself safe and
effective. Speaking of safety, this fence has existed again for nearly 10 years without a single traffic incident, visibility issue, public safety concern. It does not obstruct sight triangles or interfere with motorists. It does not negatively impact the surrounding
neighborhood. In fact, very few vehicles even travel through that this roadway on daily basis. Also, houses surrounding this fence have sold at a great market value while this fence
was already in place. In addition, surrounding properties right here on this slide have sold at a great market values if not over market um um I show uh almost every single property surrounding this fence was sold while the fence was
already in place. Nobody's going to buy a house where they don't like their view. So it's absolutely not injurious in that aspect as well. Those facts directly satisfy criterion F because they show the defense exists in harmony
with the public welfare and is not injurious to the surrounding area. This fence also serves as an important medical and safety purpose for a family member. This is not a matter of convenience. This enclosure provides safety, security, privacy, screening,
protected and protected outdoor for of the entire property that is necessary for our family member well-being. Those circumstances directly satisfy criterion C. Because the hardship is real, substantial, and unique to the family situation. The
property itself is unique. It is legally classified at asypical lot. Unlike standard corner lots, our secondary front yard borders a large HOA detention area rather than neighboring residential
homes. If you look at other corner lots within the same district, you may find one of the charact these characteristics individually. However, this lot has an intersection curved road and a large detention area. The combination of all
of these factors together on a single property makes this lot unique and different from a standard corner lot. These unique physical characteristics, layout and road configuration that runs around the entire property directly satisfy criterion A because their special condition not commonly shared by
others. And that leads directly into criterion B. Criterion B, it was not created by us. These conditions were not created by us. We did not design the roads, create the lot configuration, establish the setbacks or construct the subdivision. Those physical character
characteristics were established when the subdivision was designed in 1997 years before we purchased the property in 20 uh 2007. That same language was accepted to satisfy criterion B by the same commissioners under other
variance requests in the past. A contractor's failure to obtain 10 uh to obtain a permit 10 years ago does not change these pre-existing conditions and does not alter the unique characteristics of the land itself.
Um even staff report again staff report defense does say it says defense does not create the very impacts the code is designed to prevent. Staff confirmed it. So when we consider the unique nature of the property, the hardship involved, the minimal relief being requested, the
absence of any negative impact, the city's own history of approving similar requests, and a decade of approvening safe performance, the conclusion is straightforward. Criteria A through F are not only met, they're satisfied and
detailed in the appeal packet. Let me just conclude by saying the mature landscaping Um the mature landscaping outside um the fence will remain regardless of any decision made tonight. Removing or
lowering the fence produces no meaningful v visibility gain or no public benefit. And let's not forget this is this isn't a busy traffic road. Very few vehicles travel through this area which further supports the fact that that fence has not created visibility or safety concerns for the
past 10 years. It yields only one guaranteed outcome and increased safety risk for a family member who depends on this enclosure for protected outdoor access. We acknowledge that a building permit was not obtained due to contractor due to a contractor's error when the fence was installed 10 years
ago. However, that administrative error error does not change what 10 years of real world performance confirms. This fence works. It is safe. It harms no one. It raises the property value. It makes better use of land and it protects the family and member who needs it as
well as creates safety, security and privacy for the family. If this if this variance had been requested in 2015, we will be making the same exact arguments. The only difference today is that we have 10 years worth of safety data
supporting those arguments. Lowering or removing these defense serves no purpose. It serves no legitimate public purpose. It corrects nothing. It protects no one. It simply eliminates a structure needed for medical and safety
reasons because of an inconsistent decision. I trust you'll be making the right decision today by looking strictly at the facts, the code, the law. I respectfully ask you apply the criteria as written. Honor the city's prior
decision. Focus on evidence before you and say yes to approve the variance. Reverse the blending commission hearing uh decision. It is the right one. It is a consistent one. Thank you for your time and leadership and your commitment
to fairness. I would like to reserve my final comments after public comments. Thank you. >> Council, any questions? >> No. No question. >> Go to Matt. >> Yeah. Where we go from here? >> Um, so I, you know, there there are some
things I think I need to address before we get to public comment. Um, based on what was presented right there. So, if you just bear with me for a little bit, I think I need to address a couple of these. I might even need Tim's help for a couple of those comparators because it's important that you understand the full picture here. Um, so I'll kind of
start at the top. Um he mentioned there's there wasn't some you know presentation of criteria at at the planning commission meeting. I can assure you that the planning commission was provided the same staff report with a criteria by criteria analysis of staff
whether Tim you know went line by line and read that to them as relevant. It was part of the record. They had a record before them to to support a decision. So I I just want to make that clear. Um, code alone was mentioned a couple times that there was a quote that it was based
on the code alone. Well, the reality is this is kind of a code alone case in that the code says what the rule is for the fence. The code also provides the criteria for a variance. So, it's code alone in that it is governed by how we
apply the code. That's what we're talking about here today. Now there are facts that we apply the code to and again the staff did a you know a full job in in doing that. You may disagree with that but they did a full job in in taking those facts applying the code and then coming to a recommendation to
provide them to your planning commission uh members. Distance from the rideway was also discussed this five five foot versus seven foot. The reason I think even the applicant stated close to seven feet or the the reason
there's no decision on you know conclusively what that is is because there was no permit and there was no survey. So we don't you don't get to just stand on a sidewalk and throw a tape measure out and say that's how far it is. That's not how that works. The the public rideway
doesn't always go perfectly to to the edge of the sidewalk. So the reason staff actually went above and beyond and kind of giving this you know discussion as part of the variance to to talk about if it's within that period they want to be covered so that this applicant's not
having to come back and and address that issue because if you're one foot off they wanted to make it clear that it was kind of in the present location. So if that was a variance that we're we're going ahead and approve that as part of it. So, I think that was actually going above and beyond by staff to to make
sure that this application fully resolves the issue one way or the other. Staff doesn't have a an interest in this one way or the other. Um, you you heard about the HOA approval. Um, I can tell you, you know, he he said that your planning commission was led astray. I can tell you the
attorney for the planning commission gave them clear direction when this HOA debate went on. And we're, you know, we're public comment is what it is. And but but once that concluded, the attorney for that board said, "That's not the issue that we're here for today." And and brought them right back
to what the issue is. Ironically, he brings an HOA approval in front of you to to hear consider. The reality of that is I I I do believe that's irrelevant. I mean, even the HOA uh letter that was submitted as part of the application packet said subject to city permit,
which you know, we know wasn't wasn't pursued in this case. And then finally, the the medical necessity piece. Yes, there is a code provision that talks about an ADA accommodation as part of what you can use to vary. The problem that we have here tonight is there was
no evidence provided to the planning commission. And again, your facts are determined at the time of the hearing of the planning commission. That note, I I can't have you consider that note because the reality is it wasn't provided. So, all that we know is there's some person that has some condition where this should be viewed as
accommodation. that's not enough for you to to engage in some sort of u collaborative process to determine what the you know what a disability accommodation is or if it's even a disability recognized by the ADA. So that's again not something that you know would be within your consideration in making this decision. The only other
thing that I have you know if if it benefits your uh curiosities there were two cases that were compared as these are the exact same cases. I think you know Tim can can show you the you know through procedural history those are
somewhat unique. Um and so if if you want him to come up and give you some explanation of that if you had an opportunity to look at those but um I think the presenting it as these are the exact same cases that that you know this one is. I I don't you know that's just
not true in any variance case right that every variance is kind of you're dealing with a different flavor and you're trying to weigh those out and and staff does you know a great job trying to you know do that it's it's difficult at times there's multiple factors here you kind of you know even even as factors go
every which way you kind of got to figure out you know which which way to go with the recommendation so they did the the best that they could with the facts in this case they provide that recommendation I would tell you you know you may want to know a little bit more about those uh other cases if that's something that you're considering in in
terms of your decision here tonight. That's all I have. >> Jim, uh did you have anything that you needed to add to any of that? >> No, you wanted a clarification of the two cases. I'm good. >> Okay. Lance, start with you. Anything on
Matt's comments or Tim's comments or >> No, not Sean. >> Can you read section F back to me? Uh this is section F of the variance criteria is the granting of the variance will be in uh harmony with the general intent and purpose of this code and will
not be injurous to the surrounding properties or detrimental to the public welfare. >> Harmonious meaning consistent. >> Good interpretation. Any more questions for Matt? >> I don't think I have a question for
Matt. Jason. >> Okay. Public comment. All right. At this time, is there anybody in the public that wishes to speak to this? >> Come on up. >> My name is Mike Tremble. >> Thank you. And I had some I submitted an
email to you in support of you know the fence being left as is because my understanding is I live on the opposite corner of him and I don't see any issues with it whatsoever. Um it's wellkept. Um he takes care of his home pretty
well. It serves a purpose of privacy and like he says safety for I guess he has somebody there that needs it. Um, and I think the HOA has a little bit of a issue on that when he put in for it and they said okay and they let it pass. HOA
should not let that happen. But they did let it happen and like most of the other fences that I see in uh Sawrass Point are the same height. Granted, they're not, you know, where his is, but his does seem to be well enough away from
not encroaching on anything. many people walk by it walking their dogs. I don't see any issue I have when I walk by it. Um I think the fence, you know, instead of making this homeowner spend thousands of dollars just because something didn't
happen right at the beginning. And I think everything what I've heard so far should stand. Um and I think it should be permitted to say. >> That's all. Thank you. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Thank you. I need to jump. Hang on one second.
Okay. All right. >> Go ahead. >> Go ahead. >> Go ahead. We'll get to everybody. >> You have to come to the >> No. Yeah. You got to come up and introduce yourself. Okay. >> I'm so sorry I talk. >> My name is Judith Hy. I lived in Sawrass
since 2005. I had a similar situation with the fence that had was permitted when we moved in. It was already there in 2005 and we went to replace it. Um, and that was about five years ago and
the HOA said, "Oh, you're on the wrong property. You that it's needs to come back into your land another foot." I'm like, "But we have we have the permit that was done in 2000, the year 2000." And so the fence had been there for many
years. So regardless, um, I said, "No, I don't want to do that." uh you know um and I had different issues that you know medical reasons and so on and so they said well maybe we'll rent it to you then we'll rent you the space. So they were going
to rent me a foot of land that borders a retention area just because my fence was put in the year 2000 one foot. Regardless, what I'm saying is I don't think that these people that are running the HOA are really for the benefit of
the community and they just seem to find all these little things to harass us all. And these people have been awesome. They've been very helpful. have been community neighbors, never bothering anyone, always there to help. Their father has
come and helped me on different occasions for no reason. I didn't even know he showed up because we needed something. And the fence, again, like he says, has been there 10 years and it's beautiful. They maintain their property.
It doesn't bother anyone. So, I agree. It's just silly. >> Thank you for your comments. Good evening. My name is Mike Anders and I'm the bad guy here. Basically, I moved into this HOA about
five years ago and there was a lot of issues. So, I'm going to make this real quick. So, I'm trying to find out what the issues were because what can I do? What can't I do? I'm the one that found the fence problem which never had a permanent poll. So, uh, never had a
permit from the city. He went against the HOA. There was never a survey. It has caused problems with the HOA because it now people don't know which way to go, right? So, we're counting on the city to do the right thing and and have one set of rules for everyone. Um, and I
put a lot of effort into this because uh it just it it it makes no sense that that that one can have one can't. Now it's created other people are putting fences up and saying well he has I want. So now the board of the HO they're
having to fight all that. But just to tell you what I've been through, I've contacted everyone in the city of Port O from public works, code enforcement, city clerk, not this city attorney, but the other city attorney, the man, city
manager was contacted by my representative. Uh, and I I'm just here to make sure that the the rules are enforced. So, I spent four years on this and it all boils down to one thing. There was never a survey. There was never a permit pull. So, how long are we
going to continue to do things that are against the rule? You're going to set precedents. It's not. So, I I'm just asking that you you hired the the other committee that you follow their the recommendation. I mean, I just think
it's fair for everyone and then then we can all get done with it and follow the the set of rules that are out there for all to go through. And I'm not saying the fence isn't pretty. I have nothing against them personally. It's just that where do I stand at this for the city
and where do I stand with the HOA that if we don't have no rules then it's it's w it's it's wide open. >> So I I appreciate your time. Thank >> Thank you for your comments. >> Thank you. >> Anybody else? Sure. >> We'll get this gentleman and you come on up next. Okay.
>> That's all right. Go right ahead. >> My name is Tom Roberts. I live across from uh this family here on Shady Creek Lane across the street to the right. Um, I haven't been there 20 years, but I do know that this family does take care of that property really well. Defense to me is not an issue. I have children and um,
nieces and nephews that ride bikes in the neighborhood. Haven't had any issues or like, you know, close calls, anything like that because of the fence. The fence is actually behind some trees, which it doesn't really stick out. It's not an eyesore. Um, it looks great. The
property looks great. Um, I wish my property looked as good as his property does. spent a lot of time on it. Um, it's not my business what this family finances are and stuff like that, but I would hate to see them have to go through um replacing that or taking it down. Um, so I just wanted to come here
and support uh we don't have barbecues together and stuff like that. We're not in and out of each other's houses, so it's not like I'm here trying to support a friend or anything like that. Um, just as a neighbor, I just feel that um I feel it's on an issue. So, I just wanted to share that. So thank you guys
finally every day. I never have any issue and I have no problem with that. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Anyone else want to speak to it? >> Come on up, sir.
I'm not much of a public speaker. >> Well, that's okay. Neither are we. You go right ahead. >> But always try to save my mind. >> State your name for the record, please. >> Just tell us who you are. Introduce yourself. >> Now, I ride my bicycle around the whole subdivision.
I've ridden 2,000 miles and not went out of the subdivision. I have talked to just about everyone in there and I haven't found but two people that was against this fence and that it
makes no sense at all. That is fence is for a purpose and it's for a medical purpose and it would be a sin to do with a do away with that fence
when it it's not hurting anybody >> else and I guess that's about all I have to say. >> Well, thank you for your comments. >> State your name again, sir. Robert, can you state your name into the microphone and where you live?
>> Oh, my name is Bob Taylor. >> Thank you. >> I live there in Salt Car. >> Thank you, Mr. Taylor. >> Thank you. >> Hi, Al Vera. I am the current HOA president in Srass Point. I have received numerous emails and phone call
or text messages from neighbors behind his house asking me what was going to be done about this fence as recently as within the last month. Um I don't have it handy right now to me but I could bring them and show them to you if
necessary. The past president from this HOA is sitting in the back. Uh the issue that they got a signed he's here. he could testify to the fact that he did not approve this this fence. I don't know where they've gotten this letter, but I mean, from what he tells me, he
never approved it. Um, he actually stood up here the last time, and if you have the recording from that last meeting, I believe he said that he didn't approve it. Um, but there has been a lot of controversy about this. There's a lot of deception going on about this. Um, and I
just hope you can see it. Thank you for your time. Anybody else want to speak to this? >> All right. Okay. Come back to >> Okay. Go right ahead. Come on. >> So, my name is John Francis and I'm a family member of the property owners.
Let me just tell you that the guys who spoke at the planning commission hearing against the fence are all associated with the HOA board. We have Al Rivera who is the current president and Pete Torrent who is the current vice president. And then there's Mike Anders
who is a buddy of Al Rivera. Al and Mike filed complaints together about this fence. None of these guys were at the blending commission hearing to bring facts about the fence. They all just basically went on a rant that has nothing to do with the pyramid variance. Although the city attorney advised that
these topics are irrelevant in the end of the meeting, the commissioners were still negatively influenced and had this false impression about the family and their household. These same guys came here again today and trying the same tactics. Be Torrent lied about the HOA
approval when he himself was a board member at the time it was approved and he has lived directly in front of it for 10 years. He never said a word about it. 10 years of silence. Then suddenly it is a problem now. Mike Anders bought his house when this fence was already
standing. He looked at this neighborhood. He saw this fence and he chose to buy his home. Now all of a sudden he has a problem with it. This guy goes around the neighborhood. He bullies and intimidates neighbors. He allegedly called the city staff, yelled
and intimidated some employees about this fence. He also made at least one staff member cry in tears about uh because of this fence uh because of his actions. This guy is not a good example of a neighbor. When we have a HOA people who approved this
fence and stayed silent about it for 10 years and we have Mike who also stayed silent about it when he bought his house 5 years ago tells you that this is not about a fence for them. It was it never was. This is about their own personal hatred agenda towards the family. Both Mike and Ala live on the complete
opposite side of this neighborhood. Don't they don't even see this fence from their houses. It doesn't affect it doesn't affect them whatsoever. the intimidation, the false stories, the HOA drama, none of that has anything to do whether this fence meets the variance criteria. The city must stay objective
and focus on the actual facts. The facts of the matter is that this fence stood for 10 years without a single complaint. The fence does not endanger anyone. The fence meets all criteria. The city must stay consistent with prior decisions that were made when two similar fences
in 2016 were approved. One of them is not even allowed to be 4 feet according to code and it was approved to be 6 feet at 0 foot set setback. Most importantly, as I've mentioned at the planning commission hearing and it was completely ignored by the commissioners. I will say
it again tonight. This fence protects a family member with a medical condition. It is a medical necessity that falls under the ADA and FHA. Anyone with a medical condition should be allowed to enjoy their entire property and not just a portion of it just like any other person. The facts here are saying to reverse the planning commission
decision, stay consistent and approve this variance. I urge you to do exactly that. Thank you for your time. Thank you. >> Anybody else from the public want to speak on this item? >> Okay, that'll close public comments. Back back back to council.
>> Yeah, just I mean I kind of agree with a little bit to the last point. So that during that public comment you you may have heard you know disputes among HOA and owner and that I mean it just really does not come into play. So I do agree that you know what's before you are the facts that were presented at the planning commission. You have the
factors that are established by your code and you have to be able to apply those and and determine whether that planning commission did it appropriately with their decision to to deny the variance. That's what you're called upon to hear tonight. Um, if there is any rebuttal, I would recommend that you ask
to the the applicant if he does have a rebuttal. But at this point, we can turn it over to uh to your deliberation if he doesn't have any rebuttal. >> So, I come on come on back up for a second. >> If you have rebuttal comments, I do. >> I'm going to ask you to keep them
specifically >> Yes. >> to what the city attorney >> Yes. is telling us we can respond to because I I gotta be honest with you. >> The the acronym HOA has been said so many there's no relevance to HOA. I don't need to hear HOA anymore. >> I understand and that's not what I'm saying.
>> You have relevance to what the city attorney >> has directed the council on what we can consider. >> Right. >> Okay. >> Well, from the to do that. >> Yes. So, from the uh perspective here, >> this property is unique. Not because the
staff wrote it in the report, then it means that it doesn't meet the criteria. We provided the facts why it meets criteria. The two cases in 2016 absolutely do match similar aspects. As
a matter of fact, this fence is less intrusive than those ones in my perspective. and city staff has errors in the staff report doesn't mean it's perfect.
The criterias are met one by one. I explained them. There's uh we mentioned what what did we mention? We mentioned um solely on code alone. Well, when you mention it in front of the commissioners and say solely on code alone, it is
solely on code alone. You said it. You did not mean the criteria code. He did not meet the criteria code. As a matter of fact, he never mentioned that in at any point. He should have stood up and said to the commissioners, it does not meet this. It does not meet that. It does not meet this. >> Have you read the staff report? >> I have read the staff report, sir. But
he did not mention he said solely on code alone. He said that that's misdirecting. >> The staff report contradicts itself in multiple areas. We provided the facts. We provided why the CD criterion is met
in every single one of these six criterias. Staff report is not perfect. It did not it's not perfect in that one. They did not do I don't know what is it but it's not perfect. It's inconsistent. He mentioned at the blending Mr. Timberman he mentioned at the blending
commission during the presentation that he mentioned nothing. He did again he mentioned nothing about criteria. The staff report is all over the brace. It contra it contradicts itself in many areas. Um, another thing which which criteria was not met in the staff report that you mentioned for me? Can I ask you
that question? >> No. >> Okay. Well, most criterias we explain the facts, we explain why. I am going to say my final word here. Um, atypical area.
>> Yeah, that's that's true. One area he mentioned atypical lot and in a different area he mentioned uh special. Right. Right. >> Yeah. It mentions what it's different in both areas. It contradicts itself in many areas. It's not it's not it's not I
I gave you a full packet to review. I mean the staff report was not very detailed. It was very vague. It said applicant stated, applicant stated, they did not do due diligence. They did not check everything. Um, I ask you to take a look at the facts. Look at what just
happened at the podium from the HO people. You just heard a lot of angry loud noise from the same exact people. Okay? They spent time they they spent uh their time and their years turning personal neighbor disputes into a full-time hobby. They stood before you repeated
the same claims. But notice what they didn't give you. They didn't give you a single data point, a single traffic study, a single fact, or a single shred of evidence showing that this v this fence has harmed anyone or blocked
anyone's view in 10 long years. Most of the property surrounding of of of the of the fence approves of it. I don't know what's the problem with the fence. This fence is actually I have one more thing to say here. Um I I wrote it here. Give me one second to find it and
I'm I'm going to finish here. So, uh, specific to this land, um, the property is considered atypical lot under the city's own code definition. So, it is already recognized and I want to go to this slide here.
It is already recognized as a different from standard residential lot. The road configuration is unique. The roadway curves as we see here. This roadway curves right there. It didn't go up on >> where where I I don't know if it went up
on the screen or not for you guys, but I have the I have the slide up. I just wanted to show it. We have So, we have the road configuration right here. The road curves. There is an intersection here, right? The lot is exposed from all
directions. And then we have this big detention area pond behind. If we look at other corner fences, this f this corner lot here, it does not have that same specific features. This corner lot here does not have these. It's it just it does not
have all three. So, the road configuration is unique. The roadway curves around the property. The lot is exposed to the right of way from multiple direction in a way that most properties are not. Our secondary front yard borders this large detention area
um um which is not typical situation. You don't see that shared by many lots. Staff's report acknowledge and it states that the this fence does not create the types of impacts the code was designed
to prevent. If you look at other corner lots within the same district, you might find one of these characteristics individually. However, this is the combination of all these factors together in a single property makes this lot unique and different from standard corner lots. This lot is exposed from
all directions. The curvature of the road, the intersection and the back lot. We don't have any privacy that we enjoy like other common areas there. Uh like like this intersection, like this intersection here, this house has a fence in the back. He has he has a
backyard. He can enjoy privacy. This house, no. The 2016 had a lift station. It was approved and I'm sure other properties have other similar lift station and it specifically mentioned that few that report specifically mentioned that other
properties have lift stations and it was approved for basically aesthetics because the lift station had a fence around it. Aesthetics alone. This one serves as a medical need. And I did mention a lot of these things. I did mention the medical need in the other in
previously. I did mention HOA letter previously. I even asked the council, can I show you the HOA letter? One of the commissioners said, "No, I'm not interested because it's not really relevant. The HOA is trying to negatively influence the city
and they're trying to weaponize you. Don't let them do this tonight." Okay, this is a variance. There's a reason why it is a variance. We have oblied. We have made our application clear and we have done everything to meet the
criteria. It's met to show you that it's met. We've done everything. We spent extensive amount of time researching this. We're researching the laws, researching past criterias. We did. We gave you the facts. Doesn't
mean the staff report is correct. Staff can make mistakes. We can all admit that, right? It was not a perfect staff report. I ask you to reverse this decision. Let us live in peace because we have been harassed by some individuals here for some time. I I got
to stop it now because you're I'm done. You're on to >> I understand but I ask you to let us live in peace at this point. >> Okay. Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. >> All right. So So back to council. I I will just briefly because I I want to make sure that a lot of folks from the
neighborhood came out tonight and we appreciate that. We're not here to mitigate relationships between homeowners and their HOA representatives or homeowners and other homeowners. That is not our role. And while we appreciate a lot of comments of
fence looks nice, the property looks nice, it's been there, all those kinds of things, that's great. The the the community has the interest in supporting homeowners or having that relationship and that is awesome. But just I ask you to understand th a lot of those things
are not our role. That's not our what we can consider in this type of a hearing. Okay? So, but I do appreciate everybody taking the time to come out and and and voice their comments and speak. So, that's that's good. I appreciate that. Matt, anything else you wanted to add to
those council comments here? >> No, sir. >> Lance, I'll start with you. >> Well, I mean, I don't know um where we go with this as far as you know, the the code the code is the code. Um, and again, uh, sitting on the planning board for all the time that I've sat on the
planning board, um, it's always had to be, you know, a hardship or something very odd with the property, etc., etc. And again, um, personally, I don't see that here. Um, and so, uh, I just I
understand it's beautiful. I understand it looks nice. Um, but we have rules for a reason. And when we open the door for one, we haven't opened the door for all. So that's what we need to consider here tonight as well. So >> Sean,
so my opinion on the fence and where it sits and how look how good it looks doesn't matter because our job our responsibility uh tonight is only to determine if our planning commission made a mistake in their determination.
That is, I believe, our only responsibility, not our opinion on what how good the fence looks, where it's at. It's it's one one responsibility, and that's did our planning commission make a mistake. Not at a did they make the wrong decision on their opinion? And I
don't know how that planning board supposed to work. I've never sat on a planning board, but my question would be to staff and maybe to our attorney is uh they have the the a variance was brought to them and they get to make that
decision. Hey, I feel good about this. It looks good and I think we should give them the variance. Do they get to do that or do they just go buy the code? >> They're and the attorney for the planning commission did the exact same
thing I did. There's a set of criteria that guide that decision and that it was read out loud at that meeting as well that you are bound you. It's not just some does it does it look good? Does it feel right? It's not a gut feel. There are criteria that will lead your
decision. Those were announced at the planning commission meeting. Those were you know discussed by the staff in the staff report and those are what form the basis of the decision of the planning commission. That's their only authority is based on the code that you have set before them to provide uh consideration
of that variance. They they are bound to follow those criteria. >> But a variance doesn't it give them the option to say okay we're okay with the sixoot fence? Does it give them that option? That's what the var
>> so so fence yeah I mean to his point u you know there there's been multiple variances for fence height even under unique circumstances so it the variance process is in place for uh an adjustment for unique purposes of a code that if
applied rigidly to this circumstance doesn't necessarily you know meet what what the you know city was attempting to do with the there's unique circumstances all the time you heard of a lift station in a front yard is a unique circumstance um you know there there's other circumstances out there. So yes, have
there been variances approved? Absolutely. But you have to take them on a one by one basis and determine what's unique about this situation and that's what the planning commission attempted to do. That's what they they've applied the criteria. They followed staff's recommendation and that they've brought
that decision out to you on appeal and you got to determine whether that's going to be the right to answer. >> Okay. Um, and right now the code would allow them to keep the fence in the place if they dropped it to four feet. >> Yes. >> Correct. Right. >> No. >> No. If where the fence sits today, if it
was 4 feet, it would be okay. >> But it's still not within that either. >> I need to know survey. >> That's our you have to have a survey as part of the permit. >> We do not have a survey to show that that fence sits back 5t from the property line. So basically, if they dropped it to 4 foot, we'd have to make
sure that fence is put at 5 ft from the property line. As Matt indicated, the reason why that was included in the application was we did not have a survey and did not want to take the chance of a variance being approved and have my inspector go out there and find it 4'5 from the property line and tell them, "Guess what guys, you got to do a variance again." So, we were trying to
be proactive in that case, but I guess it was seen differently. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. So, if it was within uh five feet of the property line, they would actually be able to if they got a survey and then the fence was
set within 5T, it would be and it could be 4T. >> Yes. >> Okay. And it very well could be there now. We just don't know because there's no survey. >> Got it. >> Because Yeah. Um that's all I need to know. Yeah, Tracy,
I >> think the unfortunate factor is mistakes were made 10 years ago. We've run into this problem before as I've been sitting up here with HO approve HOA approvals are not city approvals
and we run into this issue. I I can't stress that enough that an HOA approval is not a permit from the city. If the permit process had been done and a survey would have been done, you would have known where the fence would have
been properly approved at. I know this. I sit on a corner lot. 30 years I've had a 4ft section of my corner lot being that way. The sixoot could be coming off the
backside of the house to protect the loved ones that you're talking about. It just comes off the straight line of the secondary front of the house. I know this code quite well. The unfortunate part is is the code is the code. It is
what we have to do as a board up here as we look at it. It may be something later that we look at and talk about other discussions for code changes, but that's not what tonight's about. You have
opportunity of 10 years of not having a fence pulled down. You have the opportunity to put the fence at 4T with a survey and a 6-ft inner fence in your yard to fix the problem.
Um, I hate to say I I have to agree with the variance board. It's a tough deal. I have real problems with people that own property and we're not allowed to use our property to the full advantage that
we would like to. So, I know uh this ain't the appropriate time, but might be something we look at for updating the code later, but that's not what tonight is about. Say >> good good point. the that was one of the
points I was going to make is that if it's you know council's pleasure to review a code that is a totally separate thing and certainly we could do that if uh that's something that the council has interest in doing that. Um I my my
comments are pretty simple. This is a this is a uh an issue that shouldn't even be before us because there's a process to go through to get a permit which requires a survey to ensure that any fence whether it's 4T or 6T is
in the correct location and that that is confirmed and that the permit allows for what the fence can be what it cannot be during that initial permitting process. If somebody wants to get a variance to do something differently in that
permitting process, then there would be a lot more discussion and and perhaps questions that were asked, but we can't really consider that stuff with this type of a hearing that's before us tonight. Is that correct? >> Okay. Um, so
from what I have read, from what the attorney has presented to us, um, I I don't see that the planning commission did anything incorrect. I think they they they based their decisions on the information that was provided to them.
Um, again, the HOA part of it has no bearing at all in my mind. Um, some communities have HOAs, some don't have HOAs. uh in this particular case, it seems there's some some feelings that don't have anything to do with the with the elected body of the city council
with regards to uh the HOA members or or or any of that. So, um I don't I don't really see any any any uh validation to that to be considered with this, but um I don't have anything else. Anybody else have anything else, Mr. City Attorney? Anything?
>> No, sir. I'll have the court call the role. >> Oh, so we have the motion the motion on the floor. Just to be clear, the motion is in the affirmative to uphold the recommendation of the planning board. So if you vote yes, you are upholding the planning board recommendation. If you
vote no, you are recommending that the recommendation be overturned. >> It's not a recommendation. It's an actual decision. So it's you're you're either upholding the planning commission's decision to deny the variance or you're recommending that it be overturned if you vote no. >> Okay. Everybody clear on that? Clear on
that? Call the RO, please. >> Councilman Gford, >> yes to uphold. >> Councilman Green, >> yes. >> Vice Mayor Grubs, >> yes. >> Mayor St. >> Yes. 40 to uphold the uh planning board's recommendation for item 21.
>> All right, that'll bring us to council committee reports. Item 21, city council committee reports. TPO, Vice Mayor Tracy Grubs. So tpo uh this month was really really interesting. Uh second month uh
on the TPO the tip proposal for the next 5 years uh we talk about budget cuts and homestead exemptions and all this stuff. It was interesting to see the TPO uh came in at $458
million for 2027 and over the five-year plan it's just $40 million short of being a billion dollars that's coming into Vian Flaggler County. Uh these are long range projects of five years. Um I want to give staff
some kudos. I'm getting into this and understanding this with Wayne and Tim. And one of the things is is when we go to tier one lists, they they tear out their projects as far as A, B, and C. A is being
priority and moving forward. Uh Clyde Morris Boulevard right turn lanes. Uh construction is fully funded and coming forward. Madlin and Nova and Swallotel and Dunl Dunl intersections are being done. But uh what's interesting is
understanding the importance of excuse me our staff having projects already designed and ready means that we've done our work to get the projects ready to continue on. So in tier B we have three
of four more projects that might actually come to fruition in the next year or two. And the reason for that is we have three other cities that removed off of tier A because they weren't ready. So having our projects ready
ahead of time from staff, it's pretty amazing that uh it allows us to get more done because we're already on the list for approval. So that was interesting to watch and how that process works. Um but
yeah, uh $963 million over the next five years and that's just approval, not all the funding that comes with each project as it goes. So on a floating average, it's about $2 billion. >> Wow. >> So that's where we're at. I I will say
one of the uh eye openening things being on the TPO board for the time that I was on the board um and there was some unfortunate consistency is that you project out these costs and you you you were projecting them thinking there's a
certain amount percentage-wise they may go up year after year after year >> and it was never even close. No, >> it was always so exponentially more. So much more. So it it is incredibly challenging for all levels of the
government to project what these costs are really going to be. So it wouldn't surprise me that that number is 15 20% off, right? We just don't know. I mean, we're watching what's going on globally right now and how that's impacting the markets for painting. >> Um
you just you just don't know. But it's very unlikely to see those trends and numbers start to come back to where you're pleasantly surprised going, "Oh, you projected, you know, X dollars a linear mile of paving and good news is it's 8% less than we thought." That's
>> I haven't seen that yet. So, that would be pretty awesome. >> Anything else on TPO? >> That's it. >> Uh general employee pension board. I was not able to attend the meeting, wrapping up a vacation, but I will get uh update and minutes on that and come back and report that to the council. Anybody else have anything else they need to add for
tonight? All right, have a good night.