--------- 10th and it is nine o'clock. We will convene the board of county commissioners regular meeting and the port authority meeting today. Um invocation will be led by uh pastor Steve Bowski of Open Door Church of God. Pledge allegiance uh by Commissioner
Alexander. Please stand if you're able to do so. Good morning, Madam Chair, commissioners, citizens of Putnham County. Thank you for the opportunity to begin today's meeting with a moment of reflection and prayer. Public service carries both privilege
and responsibility. Decisions made in this room shape the day daily lives of families, businesses, and communities across our county. Because of that, moments like this remind us that leadership is not only about authority, but about wisdom,
humility, and a commitment to the common good. Scripture reminds us in Proverbs 11:14 that where there is no guidance, a people falls, but ab in an abundance of counselors, there is safety. In other words, wise leadership grows through
thoughtful discussion, careful listening, and a sincere desire to serve others well. Today, we pause for a moment to seek that kind of wisdom and perspective. Let us pray. Heavenly Father, we thank you for the community we call home here in Putnham
County. We are grateful for the freedoms we enjoy and for those who step forward to serve the public good. Today we ask for your wisdom for these commissioners and for all who participate in the work of this meeting. Grant them clarity of mind, patience, and discussion and
discernment in every decision they make. Help them to lead with integrity, fairness, and a genuine concern for the well-being of every citizen in this county. We pray for unity in the midst of differing perspectives, for respectful dialogue, and for solutions that
strengthen our communities and serve future generations well. Bless those who work in public service throughout our county, protect the men and women who serve in law enforcement and emergency response, and continue to guide our community in peace and
prosperity. May the work done here today be carried out with wisdom, humility, and a sincere desire to serve others. We ask these in your holy name. Amen. >> Amen. >> To the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it
stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. All right. Moving into the approval of the minutes for the regular meeting. >> Madam chair, I move approval for the
regular meeting minutes for February 10th, 2026 and the county commissioner workshop meeting for February 10th, 2026. >> Second. >> We have a motion second. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. >> I. Motion carries. >> Workshop.
>> Did you do both of them? >> I did. >> Okay. I'm sorry. Hurt didn't hear that. All right. We will um recess the BOCC and convene the Port Authority meeting. Approval of the minutes. >> Madam Chair, I move approval of the uh Port Authority Board of County
Commission regular meeting minutes for February 10th, 2026. >> Second. >> Great. We have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. >> I. >> All right. Port authority. This is uh we are in the port of uh portion of our
meeting that's regarding port authority. Is there any public comment on anything related to the port? All right. Seeing none, uh any discussion from the board. >> All right. Seeing none, we will adjourn that meeting and reconvene the Putham
County BOCC. First up, we have National Safe Place Week. Do we have a representative here from that? All right. Thank you. And we've asked uh Commissioner Harvey to read the proclamation. >> Madam Chair, I'm going to go down front. >> Thank you, >> Madam Chair and fellow commissioners,
staff. This is Putnham County Proclamation number 2026-20, National Safe Place Week, March 15 through 21st, 2026. Whereas the youth of Putnham County will determine the future strength of our county and be the bearers of our
democracy. Whereas youth need a safe haven from various negative influences such as child abuse, substance abuse, depression, crime, youth and youth readily available resources to assist them when faced with circumstances that compromise their
safety. Whereas the Safe Place program is committed to protecting the youth of Putnham County, Florida by offering access to immediate help and safety for young people seeking assistance and guidance. Whereas designated locations where youth can get information,
immediate help, safe places found at businesses such as restaurants, convenience stores, movie theaters, community buildings such as fire station, libraries, public transportation vehicles. Whereas the success of Safe Place is based on public
and private collaborations between businesses, school systems, fire department, law enforcement, and a network of volunteers. Whereas Putnham County, Florida needs increased numbers of community volunteers serving as mentors and positive influence on young
people. Whereas the Safe Place program must meet performance standards related to outreach and community re relations to receive direct federal assistance as set forth in the Runaway Homeless Act. Whereas more than 1700 communities in 40
states administer the Safe Place program at more than 20,000 locations. whereas more than 49,559 youth have helped at a safe place location or received counseling by phone as a result of safe place information
received at school. Whereas since this program inception in 1983, more than 18 million youth have been educated through national safe place network safe place outreach efforts, familiarizing them with the safe place sign and providing them with information on how to seek in
order to stay safe. Whereas increased awareness will encourage more communities to establish safe place locations where youth can readily access the help they need. Now therefore by the board of county commissioners hereby proclaim March 15th to March 21st as a
national safe place week and call upon the citizens or the people of Putham County and interested groups to promote awareness of all volunteers involvement in safe place program and observe the week with appropriate ceremonies and activities done ordered
and adopted this 10th day of March. Madam chair I move this proclamation forward. >> Thank you. Is there a second? There is a second. >> All right. Any any comments? All right. All in favor say I. >> I. >> Motion carries. Thank you. Thank you, Miss Robinson.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Good morning. My name is Latoya Robinson, the residential counselor at CDS Family and Behavioral Health Services. Safe Place began in 1983 in Lewisville, Kentucky, when a local youth shelter partnered with neighborhood fire
stations to offer teens safe, clearly identified locations to seek help. There are now safe place agencies and sites across the nation, including Hawaii and Alaska. In 2024, 6,958
youth assess safe place support at a safe place site or via phone. It is our duty to protect our youth from situations they shouldn't have to endure. If we can protect just one child for harm from harm, the program is a
success. Thank you for recognizing Safe Place Week, but let's show our support the other 51 weeks as well. Thank you. Thank you, Miss Robinson. I I want to share a quick story with you before we take a picture. um during the cold weather shelter, we
had a um 16-year-old girl come through who was pregnant and I reached out to your agency and you guys were able to help her. And so I want to say thank you because it was a safe place for her to go and she was living on the streets and um she was unhoused and she had
circumstances beyond her control and um she needed help and you guys provided her that safe place and um I think she's going to be doing much better in her life and it sounds like you gave her a lot of good advice and counseling and for that I will always be grateful. So
thank you. All right. On three. One, two, three, and One more. Thank you all for that. Um, next we have up UFAS extension office.
>> Good morning, commissioners. >> Morning. >> Morning, Wendy. >> Always want to put a f smile on your face, right? I never come asking for anything. Um, I'm really excited to introduce to you our new uh youth development agent for 4. We think we are
we we found a real treasure in the rough and uh I want to just introduce Jeannie to you and let Jeanie Hal give you a 30 second presentation of who she is. >> Good morning. >> Good morning Jeannie. >> U my name is Jeannie Hal like she said
um I am uh a resident of Putnham County. I've been in the community um as an agriculture teacher and um I've worked for UF as an academic adviser and the agriculture um educator at um Interlockan.
>> Very good. Well, welcome. >> Yes. And we stole her from UF advising. So, she's been in the animal science department over there. So, we we brought her back to Putnham County. And Bobb's going to introduce our uh our speaker for the day. >> Okay. >> Good morning. So this morning we've
brought our one of our graduating seniors Jamie Dockery and she's going to give you a brief snippet of her speech beyond ready that she's going on to the district level with on how for makes youth beyond ready.
>> Good morning commissioners. Building a ready generation in a world of change for equipss youth with the skills they need for the future while meeting them where they are today. Becoming beyond ready represents the opportunities, experience, connections,
and moments of discovery that help young people grow into their most authentic selves. Full reach has played a pivotal role in helping me recognize the strengths that I carry within myself. It has helped me build essential skills such as public speaking, confidence,
resilience, and perseverance. Over the last two years, I embarked on my new journey, my public speaking journey. And while it is still intimidating, even after competing at the county, district, and state levels, I've learned to see it as something to
grow from and not something to fear. Each moment of uncertainty that I feel becomes a chance for me to push myself, to improve, and to step further outside of my comfort zone. With public speaking, confidence isn't optional. It's essential. Without 4, I may never
have stepped onto a stage, let alone competed. I certainly wouldn't have gained the confidence I now carry with me through every new experience. Throughout my 13 years in this program, I have watched my own confidence grow, as well as the
confidence of countless other young people that 4's lives have touched. I've learned that I cannot encourage confidence within others if I'm not willing to cultivate it within myself first. In a study of 6th to 12th grade students involved in Florida 4 clubs,
84% agreed or strongly agreed that 4 helped them feel more confident around people that they didn't know. And an even greater 93% said that 4 gave them the confidence to speak up for themselves in different situations.
4 has made me beyond ready for the next chapter of my life. This August, I will begin college to pursue elementary education, a passion that I may never have found without Putin County 4. Working with our large group of 5 to 12 year olds gave me the chance to help the
youth build their confidence, communication skills, and their comfort in social settings. Through my leadership roles, I supported their growth one-on-one. And it has become one of the most meaningful ways that I have been able to give back to the organization that has poured so much into myself.
This organization has shaped my values, my skills, and of course my future goals. One of the greatest gifts I will carry with me into the next actually all throughout my life is the set of core values represented by the 4 pledge. Head, heart, hands, and health.
I will use my head to make thoughtful, well-reasoned decisions grounded in clarity and purpose. I will use my heart to remain compassionate, empathetic, and loyal to those who support me. I will use my hands to continue serving others, contributing to my community, and placing the needs of those around me
before my own. And I will use my heart, I'm sorry, I will pri prioritize my health, committing to the choices that help me u maintain my physical, mental, and emotional well-being so that I can continue growing into the best version of myself. Thank you.
>> Very good. Thank you, >> Commissioner Harvey. You're recognized. Thank you, Madam Chair. I wish I could speak as good as you do. You did a great job at that. I do want to say, Miss Jeannie, I'm glad you're back. Um, I worked very closely with you at Analan High School and I look forward to
working with you in the future as you endeavor on this. So, you're a great person to have back in Putnham County and thank you very much for being here. Thank you, Mad. >> Thank you. It looks like you've got to build a good team as usual and uh we're proud of every one of you and uh Miss Stalker, you did an excellent job and uh
now that when after hearing you speak, I remember I pretty much know everybody in your family. So, I was like, I know this young lady. Um but anyway, uh great. I know you come from a great family, good parents, and um congratulations. since I've actually seen you grow up in the 4
program as well, not being there, but through the pictures and all the things that get shared and you did an excellent job and I know you have a very bright future. >> So, thank you. >> Appreciate it. >> Thank you. >> Oh, I'm sorry. I have Commissioner Alexander for comments. >> I just I wanted to acknowledge um how
courageous you must be to come up here and speak. Um as a senior in high school, that's something I could have never done. Um I most of my commissioners up here know that uh one on one or two I was I was
fine but uh coming into campaigning and becoming a politician public speaking was probably the most difficult part of my journey and I I just wanted to tell you that that uh that's pretty inspiring and I hope some of your peers can take notes from you. >> Thank you.
>> Congratulations. Thank you. All right. Next up, we have Lori Parker. >> Good morning. >> Good morning. Um, we recently recognized three exemplary employees for employee of the quarter and we are now awarding the employee or employee of the month.
Excuse me. We're recognizing employee of the quarter for Howard Hodges. >> Howard, >> he was awarded employee of the quarter. He does get a check and a certificate for this award. If anybody deserves it, Howard deserves it. He's a hard worker and we're glad to
have him. >> Good job. >> Sweet and short. >> To the point. To the point. >> Tim is a man of many words. Uh we we really do appreciate Howard. We appreciate the whole C crew at General Services. He's a great representative for the group. Uh anytime we need
anything done, they jump to it with a smile on their face. They get it done faster than what we want it to get it done. So, uh, really appreciate you, Howard, and we appreciate the whole crew. Uh, it's a very well-deserved, uh, reward for you and the guys. Thank you. >> Congratulations, Howard. Y'all want to
stand up? Go take a quick picture. >> Less words. All right. >> Nothing for Howard to say. July. All right, we just had to get we get through the presentations first so everybody can get back to work. Um, now we're going into our public works public
hearing regarding uh vacating a portion of Chimera Way resolution 2026-021. >> Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. Thank you, Madam Chair. I do want to um kind of set the stage for today. I've been up here since 2014 and we've heard
this case many times. had different interpretations from different attorneys um about this and different opinions from even our property appraiser. But um I've come to believe by meeting with the citizens of Georgia's Lake over the
weekend and thank you for having me out there for breakfast um that it's time to put this situation to bed once and for all. And you'll see the packet says basically that this person doesn't have an objection. Sheriff's Department
doesn't. Fire rescue does. The whole idea of Chimera Way is to provide access to the people that live around the lake and not on the lake to give them access to the south point of
Georgia's lake. And if you don't have access to a lake and you live close to it, you want that. And Lock and Lake Estates had many, many accesses. And years ago, uh, Commissioner Kevin Derser whittleled them down with the help of
the other board members to get to save a bunch of these lake access lots. I would propose this that moving forward today, and I'm just going to say how I feel, and I hope the other board members feel the same way. It's time to put this
situation to bed. Tired of listening to it. I'm tired of all that. The citizens deserve a place that they can go to. So, I would like us to deny any vacation of this. I would like for us to take this into the county maintenance system as a
class two road, which would only require maintenance if it really needed it, and treat it like a public a lake public access like we do the others. And then the residents and public safety can have that when we need to have it for
situations of public safety and enjoyment of our lake. But truly, it does not. In one of our bullet points, vacating a public asset access to a public water body does not comply with the goals and objectives of the Putinham
County comprehensive plan. So, Madame Chair, my proposal is to bring to deny this, bring it into the county maintenance system, make it a class two road, and put this thing to bed once and for all. Thank you. >> Um,
Mr. Attorney, um, we have a stack of public comment cards. Um, I'm think sure there's some for and against. Uh, this is a public hearing. Can we we we need to listen to everybody first? >> Yes, madam chair. >> Okay. All right. That's what I thought. All right. So, you were just sharing
your thoughts as to where you're at. Okay. All right. Very good. Um, Mr. Stout, if you'll come to the podium. You're the director of public works. >> Yes, ma'am. >> And what is your what is the what is the public works
um thoughts on this? >> Uh, regarding Mr. Harvey's recommendation >> both >> both >> the application in general >> application in general um you'll see that in the application because of fire rescue uh and the comp plan that public
works has recommended that the vacate not be >> uh approved >> therefore it would go against the comp plan on trying to preserve property that butts up to a piece of body water >> and madam chair I think the staff recommendation also looks at whether or not um the county has need for the
drainage inch easement to that as well as the public access. >> Okay. All right. Do you have anything else you want to add? >> No, ma'am. Not at this time. >> All right. Is there any questions or comments to Mr. Stout before I start taking public comment? Uh, explain the difference between class
2 and class three, please. Uh, class 2 is a county road that only receives maintenance when the road is considered not passable or in a condition that is not conducive for fire rescue and other apparatuses to get down the road. A class 3 is a private road where the
county would not do any maintenance on the road whatsoever, >> but has public access. Uh not on private well it has you can drive down a private road but >> is that why you would you would be in more in favor of a class two versus a
class three >> if it was a class three and the citizens wanted work done on that road. I would not be able to do work on that road. >> Okay. But if they never wanted I don't believe they've ever gotten the county to work on that. Have they that you know of? So, um, a class three would mean
that we wouldn't have any maintenance obligations. >> Correct. >> But it they could still use it, >> correct? >> As via an easement, >> Mr. Paliser, you're recognized. >> The um maintenance of this road if it was a class two, would this be a big
burden on your staff and and team to Is it far out of the way of of roads that you normally are in that area? >> No, we're we're in that area >> already. It's no big deal. Thank you. Okay. Are there any questions for Mr. Stout? Okay. Um, Commissioner Alexander, you're recognized.
>> Yeah, I've met with some of the constituents in the area. Um, and I've seen documentation of the road and the way that it's maintained currently. It looks like they do a pretty good job on it, but at some point in time, you know, it may erode to the point where we have to bring in heavy equipment, which they
may not have the ability to do. So, I would recommend the um the designation that Mr. Stout proposed. Okay. >> And we do use that. It has the potential for drainage as well as um fire service. >> Correct. >> Okay.
>> All right. Are there any other questions for Mr. Stout? All right. With that, we will um go into public comment. Public hearing. David Miner. Mr. Mr. uh Miner, you wrote on here Fort
Gates. That's not what this discussion is. Or do you want to chime in on Chimera? >> I want to discuss that, but I don't want to be here this afternoon. So, I wanted to >> But this is a specific public hearing. >> I didn't mean for it to come up. Can you call me later? >> Can you?
>> That's what I want. >> Okay. Yeah. Okay. Maryland. and toa >> only with the help of commissioner Harvey. >> Good morning madam chairman and uh good morning commissioners. I appreciate the opportunity to be here. My name is Mary
Lynn Pantene and for the record my address is 211 Varden Road Flora home. I'm here today because my neighbor Kevin Nelson has asked Putnham County in this board to vacate, close, or essentially give away Flora Homes Chamira Way to the
applicant. Chamira Way is listed in Interlock Lake Estates Unit 26 property plat map as a road that simply ends at George's Lake. It was officially deed to the county in 1970. It bears a street sign that was placed
by the county's road department. Uh Mr. Nelson, in fact, uh the applicant receives his mail delivered to 106 Chamir Way. When I bought my property 46 years ago, coming straight out of uh college and uh beginning my teaching
career at Interlockan High School, I was told that Chamir Way was our public access to the lake. I live just one block from this beautiful little country road that leads down to the lake. We don't live directly on the water, so this access means a great deal to my
neighbors and to our family. For years, we've enjoyed this lake spot. For all the time, I might add, my family, and particularly my neighbor who lives across the street have maintained Chamir Way by mowing and picking up any trash. The thought of losing this access would
be devastating to our community. On page 25 of your packet in the last paragraph, Mr. Nelson's attorney states that the request is for private use and is based on his desire to consolidate and better maintain his property.
However, we've been told by numerous sources that Mr. Nelson along with his investor, Mr. Vanic, are indeed planning a commercial venture. without knowing exactly what they are planning. We have to wonder if their future plans will be
compatible with our rural community. I did a property search of public land records to better understand the Nelson Vanic relationship in their attempt. It appears that their financial connection dates back to 2014 and is complic is a
complicated land exchange back and forth. In 2021, ultimately the Vanic Trust bought 17 a 17acre track to the west of Chamir Way and Mr. Nelson is listed as the third owner on this property. Additionally, the Vanex have
purchased recently a nearby lakefront home. So, it is very clear that both Mr. Nelson and the Vanics both have waterfront access, waterfront property. Their neighbors, however, rely on Chamir Way for their waterfront access. The uh
I urge you to deny this application based on the staff's analysis. The threat of fire in our neighborhood is very re real. We're surrounded by Etna State Forest and uh quite a bit of vacant property that is in timber
production and without adequate resources that might be available through uh this lake access uh it would be a real concern and threat to our community please. >> Thank you. >> Okay. We ask you uh to let this road
continue to be used for public good rather than the private self-serving interests of two land owners. Thank you kindly. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Um we I can't take comments from from like that. So just yelling out in the audience. I know what you mean. Um I can
I can get there, but um we I this is my whole stack of cards. Okay. Three minutes a piece. We're going to be here a good hour. I have no problem with it. Everybody has the right to speak, but we have to do it without outburst in the in the um audience. Um if I know Dr. Saviaak and I can ask him to come up
next. Thank you very much, Sher Wilkinson and the board. Uh my name is Joe Saviaak. I'm with the Douglas Law Firm at 117 North 2nd Street, Palata, Florida 32177. We very much appreciate this opportunity to share information with you which
could be helpful to this decision. The residents of this neighborhood have retained our law firm uh for their representation in this matter. Maintaining access to this lake is important to this community. You will hear from residents today. Many people
use this access point for fishing and boating. It is the sole point of access on the south end of George Lake, George's Lake. Removing this access negatively impacts the desiraability of off lake homes, effectively landlocking the community's recreational potential.
Your fire rescue department points out that there are no hydrants in this area of the county and they must have access to the water in that lake in the event of a fire in the area. Putnham County Fire Rescue objects to the county vacating this property. Vacation of
public lands is only supposed to occur if the road is of no use to the public. Clearly, as a gateway to Georgia's Lake, this road serves an important public purpose. As a staff report notes, public
vacating public access to a public body of water does not comply with the goals and the objectives of the Putnham County Comprehensive Plan. This road provides lake access for residents who do not own lakefront property, ensuring that the
lake remains a resource for all citizens, not just a privileged few. Your county engineer recommends retaining this right of way for drainage purposes. Your public works department is recommending denial of this request to vacate. Your
fire rescue department is recommending denial of this request to vacate. Many residents strongly favor continued access to this lake and do not want to lose their access to Georgia's Lake. In conclusion, this issue has persisted over time, but a successful solution is
possible to achieve today. We are especially grateful for your leadership and consideration. >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you, Dr. Savia. All right. Next, we have up Alex. >> Yeah, I know y'all are passionate, but we got to not be clapping
or booing. None of that. Alex Arnett. >> Alex Arnett, retired deputy sheriff from Duvall County. Been a resident here in Putham County for 40 years. >> You'll give your address to Mr. Arnett. >> I'm sorry. >> Your address as well. >> 515 West Hillsboro Avenue. I live on the north side of the lake just opposite of
where >> Oh, okay. I apologize. I didn't know that you as a retired deputy, you didn't have to give your address. My apologies. >> It's okay. >> Okay. >> Nobody's coming after me, I don't think. >> Okay. >> I appreciate the time and your
consideration as it's been well spoken before me. As the president of the volunteer fire department, we definitely would like to keep that access. It is a necessity. The dry hydrant we have plans to put in there will help us. We have one on the
north end of the lake and that would be also very critical to have that with the fire situations we got going today. What's going on these days? Other than that, uh it's pretty much been spoken. Please keep the access open for us and
the residents around there who do not have do not live on the lake so they can have use of the lake in the area that they paid good money to have that access. Thank you very much. >> Thank you, Barbara S. Samroll. That's okay. We We like quick
>> 56 Bellamy Road and uh everything he said and the attorney guy said. >> Yeah, >> that's it. >> Okay. >> Totally agree. >> All right, Dennis Axeman. >> She wasn't kidding. >> Time to hit the button. >> Yeah, we didn't even get time to hit the
button. Good morning, Madam Chair, commissioners, ladies and gentlemen in attendance today. >> My name is Denny Axeman, 176 Lake Drive. Just over 10 years ago, I left Tallahassee, a room very similar to
this, and I came and met a realtor on Lake Drive. And I looked at a piece of property, and I walked around it, and I went to this road, and I walked down, and I sat on this little piece of concrete sitting there, and I thought, "My god, I deal in politics every day
and I get to come home to something like this. This is wonderful." On my website, you'll see in my Facebook pages, this is a piece of paradise. It's the little hidden gem in Northeast Florida. This community is a family for the most
part. Almost everybody takes care of each other, loves each other. A friend of probably most people in here um introduced me when I went back to Tallahassee. He was up for a a hearing and he owns a lot of property on the river over here and he said, "Denny, the
thing about Putnham County, I grew up in North Park." He said, "Putin County is a God-fearing, loving county. We are a good old boy system down there." And I agree with him. This meeting opened with a prayer. Maybe we're not supposed to put those
two things together, but I'll tell you this. The Bible is very clear. There's a thing called the Ten Commandments. One says, "Thou shalt not covet." Which means you shouldn't want something that's not yours. The other says, "Thou shalt not steal," which means you don't
take from your neighbors. As a Marine, I have integrity. I believe in taking care of people to the nth degree. And Madam Chair, commissioners, I plead with you to follow those 10 command or two of those ten commandments to leave our
place right where it is. to leave access for my neighbors and let's take care of our community. Thank you. >> Thank you, sir. Thank you for your service. James Counio, good morning commissioners. James Cooney, 569 West Hillsboro Avenue. I
would ask that since um Kevin probably has his attorney here that we as a res residents of George's Lake uh also be given a little bit of leeway as far as time's concerned. Okay. I have before you the actual plat of Shy Way. You also
have that in your packages. I just got it blown up. All right. So, as the fire chief out at George's Lake and the community association president, we had a breakfast on Saturday where Commissioner Harvey came out and I have a petition right here of 53 names
residents that I'm going to hand u to ask you there for your record that are fully against this uh process. All right. I used to be the rightway agent for Putnham County, so I know all about this road and I've been here on the county side and I've been here on the
civilian side. Um, so I know this probably going to be brought up that the dedication and it's it's a private road easement. If you look on this plat map, every road in this plat is a 66 ft rideway with a name
on it with a street sign. And I'll turn the page if you want, but the second page of this plat shows the easement next to Kevin's house. Okay? They do not name easements when they do plats. They name roads and all the roads are exact
same width. Okay. So I will just remind you that state statute 177-081 prior approval of appropriate governing body a plat shall be reviewed for its conformity to the chapter by professional surveyor and mapper either
employed or under the contract to local govern body and cost which shall be uh born the legal entity offering the plat for recordation evidence such review must be placed on the plat which if you'll notice on that plat down there bottom it's been signed signed by the
board of county commissioners. Uh it's been signed by the clerk of court and it's been recorded properly. Uh part of that statute item number three when a tractor or parcel of land has been sub subdivided and the plat therefore bearing the dedication executed by the owners of record and
mortgages have a record interest and the land subdivided and when the approval of the government body has secured and recorded compliance with all park. All streets, alleys, easements, rights of way, and public areas shown on such plat unless otherwise stated, shall be deemed
to have been dedicated to the public for the uses and purposes there uninstated. However, nothing herein shall constitute as creating an obligation upon any governing body to perform any act of construction or maintenance within such dedicated areas except when the
obligation is voluntary assumed by the governing body. Now, this plat was accepted in September 28th of 1970. I'm sure they didn't they weren't as um its savvy and as savvy as we are today. So,
I'm assuming that this road was meant to be a road just like this is. Now, whether the commission wants to do maintenance, that's fine. I totally support Commissioner Harvey's idea of bringing this into a class two road and putting this again to bed for the fourth
time that I'm aware of. Okay. Um the only other thing I will say is it's going to be brought up probably by Kevin's people that there's been a huge issue with breakins and all that. I have a 20-year history from the sheriff's
department that I went and got right after the last meeting we were here on this where there's only his house was broken into, but there's only six calls on this list on his road and three of them are from visiting for follow-up
questions for that breakin. Did that breakin come from somebody on abandoning or doing something stupid on that road? Probably not. it probably came from our scrappers out there that do that break in everywhere else. So, I'll also leave this here for the record, too. All right. So, with that, I would just like
to say, and I'll cut it short, but I would like to have an opportunity to speak again if need be, but I fully support and the community behind me fully supports what Commissioner Harvey suggestion. Thank you very much. >> Thank you, James. Uh, James McDaniel. Thank you commissioners for taking the
time to listen to the residents and the concerns on >> not to be that guy. It's pronounced Chimera Way, not Chimera Way. >> Thank you. It's okay. >> So, I definitely urge the county commissioners to reject the proposal the proposal to vacate Chimera Lane. I've
lived a quarter mile away from Chimera Lane for 37 years. It's my entire life. I grew up running through the woods, running down the dirt roads, fishing and down the lake at Chimera Way. It's where I caught my first catfish. We take a canoe canoe out to launch it. Now, these
are all experiences we want to be able to give to our children and our grandchildren. But most of those places that I used to enjoy, they have houses on them now. They have fences. They have no trespassing signs. But Chimero Lane is different. The people own it. The
county owns it. The community owns it. It is something that we have to retain to give to the next generation so they can enjoy what we've been able to enjoy. If this were to go through, it would be very against the community that lives here. Mr. Nelson moved in and he was
welcomed in our community for two 20 years or more. His children went to school with my little brother and my cousin. He his wife is one of the administrators at our local public schools and yet we invited him and welcomed him into this neighborhood and
now what he wants to do is take away the public access that we have to this. When he moved into that property he was fully aware of what the situation was. He knew that Camier Lane was a public access road that people like to enjoy it. He chose to purchase his property anyways
fully aware of this information. So essentially now what he wants to do as a thank you to the community that welcomed him is he wants to take away this access to the public and give it to a few private commercial interests. And my last point on this is that Mr.
Nelson is not a good steward of the land that he already owns. There is a fence that surrounds his property that goes down Chimera Lane and it is dilapidated and falling apart. It's honestly a safety hazard. I'm not sure how someone who's not been injured as of yet on
rusty nails, screws, brackets, you know, the pieces that fall off of a deck or sorry, a fence. So, my question is, if someone's not taking care of the land that they own, why should they be entrusted with more land? Thank you. >> Thank you. Thank you for your comments,
Melissa McDaniel. Good morning. Thank you for your time. Melissa McDaniel, 145 East Corbin away. Live right across the street from Kevin. Kids went to school together. Um >> I'm gonna save you time. Same thing everybody else said. We love away. I do
walk my dogs down there daily. There is a generator that runs in my neighborhood. I sent you a letter about this. and you cannot hear oncoming traffic. There's a couple hard curves there and I walk at dusk and dawn so I'm afraid to walk. So I walk down Shamir
way because there's not traffic. So from a safety issue, from my perspective, that's the reason I like Shamir Way personally. But others stated the other reasons, the fire, etc. I won't keep you. Thank you so much. >> Thank you, Miss McDaniel. Tim Jenkins.
>> Good morning, Mr. Jenkins. >> My name is Tim Jenkins. I live at 832 Coral Farms Road in Florome. I also have a petition. Do I give it to her? >> Yeah. When you're done. Yes, sir. >> Um I'm a retired firefighter of 18 years. Um I was going to talk about the firefighting aspect of it. It's already
been brought up three or four times, so I don't want to beat the dead horse. Um I will say this on the back side of the lake if you have to have sustained firefighting operations the lake access out front is 10 minutes away. So that um travel time that's 20 minutes round trip
to send a tanker there it would take around 27 minutes to travel to the other side of the lake fill up and come back. So um yeah just for fire department access to intentionally close um access to the lake I think would be not a good idea. Thank you.
>> Thank you sir. Kevin Nelson. >> Good morning, Kevin. >> Morning, sir. >> 106 Kirway. And I'm not reszoning. Um, I am petitioning to vacate a part of Chimera Way. I checked when I did purchase. I
went through >> Y >> I went through and checked did my due diligence before I bought the property. I did notice that the plant was recorded in 1970 which is before the cutoff on
which is before the cutoff on the um dedication acceptance to dedication. So it was recorded in 1970. Um the items that Couno brought up were good as far as the
chapter 177 plat made for recording. Every plat of a subdivision offered for recording shall conform to the following. There's a few items he did miss and it said the location widths names and streets, waterways and other rights ways shall be shown as applicable.
Um location and proposed easements existing easements identified in the title option of the property must be shown and noted in the legend and their intended use shall be clearly stated. where easements are not coincided with property lines. They must be labeled
bearing distances ties with a principal lot, tracked or rightway. Parks and recreation parsons as applicable shall be designated. They knew they wanted to put a park in. They did put a park in. It's on the west side
of the plat. Um it is not on camera. the proposed the purpose of all areas dedicated must be clearly indicated or stated on the plot. So if it was access or anything like that, it should have been clearly stated or noted. I do have
some pictures, two quick pictures that I looked up real quick online and both of them clearly noted public boat ramp or some type of identification on the plat of what was intended to be used. go back to this notes.
Um, when the county and the lease agreement on the north side went sideways or whatever happened there, I was not paying that much of attention. I just know it went went and had trouble. Um, I did mention that I'm I'm surprised that the county didn't do some type of
collaboration with Etna Creek State Forest, which owns a large tract on the southwest part of George's Lake. They have a fishing pier and things like that there. Uh little nice uh park sign and all that type stuff. Um and then my
on the plat is listed as a rightaway which only serves two properties. Yes, I own one. I also own the other uh as tenants in common with the Vanic Trust. Um the goal was over time to reconfigure my backyard. Um I'm not going to lie
about it. I like it there. I wanted my backyard bigger. Um, but it it as far as what we were planning to do with it, if we were going to do something strange or commercial, that would require reszoning. We have not applied for any reasonzoning. I want to
make my backyard bigger. That track can only be split once. So, when it comes to and I talked to Larry about taking apart and putting an easement to replace Chimera Way, if you gave me what was listed at that I'm replacing because
I've heard it a boat ramp. I've heard access, which I don't even know if we have a definition for. I've heard park. If I'm going to replace it, I do want it listed and noted. And if people have um what do they call it where they have the
uh listing on the title deed access, I'd like copies of that because I am al also going to put a package together to have um to file a claim with my title insurance companies because they've clearly missed this then if this is access a boat ramp or anything other
than a rightaway. Um yes, that's it. >> Thank you. Mike McDaniel. McDaniel. Mike McDaniel, >> Mr. McNo. Good morning. >> Good morning, Madam Chair, commissioners. Now, this may take me a little bit longer than three minutes,
but I do represent quite a few citizens that have given me their time. I won't be that long. So, what I'm going to do is since a lot of people have already stated some of the things that I'm going to say, I'm going to just kind of go overview of
what this is about. So basically Chamra Way is a beautiful and valuable lake access point located within Interlock and Lake Estates unit 26 floor home Florida more than 45 years. This area has been consistently
maintained by nearby residents. As a result, there is no maintenance cost of Putnham County during all of this time. And we really don't want any type of maintenance there because it would break the the crust of the road. Uh like my
wife said, we walk the dogs daily and there is no problem on the road. And that has always been the complaint of Kevin Nelson about problems on the road. The road in question is Shamir Way was rep was represented to me at the time of
purchase in 1978 as a dedicated lake access to property owners within unit 26. This understanding played a significant role in the value and enjoyment of property for many residents. I own lots
25 and 26 and actually a lot more than that which is across from Shamir Way. So basically I can hear everything going on on Shamir Way. Um so when questions arose regarding
ownership and status of the road, our attorney at the time, Marcus Duffy with the Douglas Law Firm contacted county attorney, Mr. Richard Commando. This was a doc there is a documented email correspondent
uh summarizing the conversation and I can give you that if you want to look at it. I have a copy for everyone. This came as a result of a 1924 BOCC meeting. In that communication, Mr. Commando stated that Putnham County
does have an interest in Shamir Way. It will not be closing road or restricting lake access. However, he also stated the county would not be doing anything different with the road than it has done in the past.
We would like this designated as a class two road as mentioned by Larry Harvey and and you guys can take it into the maintenance system, but absolutely we really don't want any maintenance on it. We can cut a tree down if a tree falls.
There's nothing really to do there. So, we also talked to Klay Davis um Putnham County property appraiser. He reviewed the matter and determined that Shamir Way is a dedicated county road. This designation was approved by the
board of county commissioners on August 25th, 1970 when the plat platbook 5, page 50, sheets 1 through 4, which I do have available if anyone wants to look at it that was accepted. Documentation
of this approval is available which is what I just showed you. Shamira Way is 66 foot wide and approximately 1,038 feet long. This plaid is not that old and welllaid out. Now I know in the modern times this
plat may be a little old, but this is a welllaidout plat. It's not something like you'd see on 310 where you got one6th of an acre lot with no roads. Um so
in my summary just like to say that Shamir way has served residents of unit 26 and beyond for decades is maintained peaceful and a valuable lake access point. It is a dedicated road confirmed through an official plat
approval and supported by the county attorney's acknowledgement of the county's interest. And I actually asked Klay Davis about that and he said that the county attorney admitting that the county has interest in it basically means you own it. That's
his interpretation. This road has required no financial burden from the county, has not been associated with significant law enforcement issues. So all along I kept asking Kevin, why why are you saying there's all these issues? Because I
don't hear it and I don't see it. Well, we come to find out this is a a land grab and a business deal. This is really what this is. Um, it plays an important role in public safety. Preserving Chamra Way was open
and ex preserving Shamir Way as an open and accessible protects both the rights of property owners and the interests of the broader community. Please keep Shamir Way open to the public.
>> Thank you, Mr. McDaniel. Thank you. So, I have Michelle Wheeler and Bernett Willer. Um, both of you wrote on your cards. I give Mr. McDaniel my time. So, I I did I did let him run over because you said that, but is that if either one of you wish to speak? >> No.
>> Okay. All right. Thank you, Nells Parson. Good morning, Mr. Parson. >> Good morning, Nells Parson, 100 Tinsley Lane. Um, I sent sever all of you a email with some photos in it because I figured a photograph speaks a thousand
words and you can see by the condition of the uh right away that goes down to the lake there. It's in great condition. Um it as as some of you know I have spent over four decades uh managing public lands and I've always had an expression there's areas that have
public use and areas that have public abuse. In this case you'll see by the photos there it's been well taken care of. It's not been abused. Um those of us that live down in that area have always taken care of it. Uh my past experience also has been a wildland firefighter and
prescribed burner as Miss Wilkinson will attest to in the lands that we had. In fact, uh to give a little credibility to my um comments, I served as a technical adviser to Governor Child's committee on response to the 1998 wildfires. And the
things that we identified is what's been stated here as a point source for using as a water source when you have the wildland urban interface. I'm glad to hear a dry hydrant is being considered for this location because that expedites the drafting of water that I've done many times in places like this where you
need a clean water source. That's an 800 acre fire hydrant we have right there. We need to be able to utilize it and keep that access open. Um, by installing that hydrant, that may help also our insurance policies in that area. So, that would be a good thing to have. But, you know, to just wrap it up, I'll just
say don't fix what ain't broke. Leave it the way it is. Thank you. >> Thank you, Don McGibbon. >> Good morning, Mr. McGibbon. I reckon my name is Don McGibbon. I don't live out there anymore, but I lived out there for 20 years. >> Yes, sir.
>> I used to take care of that place. May get a little emotional, but I used to mow the sides the road with a push mode before I got a tractor. You know, I picked up many truckloads of trash down there. You know, anybody lives in West Putnham County, they know
we got we got some trashy people. >> Yes, sir. You know, it's a group of residents out there that clean up hallway grade every Earth Day and we fill a dumpster and it's all local residents. You know, county didn't cost the county any money. At one time when
Fallen Branch, it comes out of Georgia's Lake goes to Eden Creek, which is a drainage from Georgia Lake got plugged up from a hurricane. The water got high, the road got soggy. Local residents pitched in. We bought some clay and I convinced a grader from Hollow Grade to
go around there and grade it out for us. You know, we've always taken care of that road. I don't live there anymore. I don't know how it goes now. I was a a section leader for Florida Trail for quite a few years from Robin Dam all the way to Goldhead Branch. And we had quite
a few threwhikers that would come and camp out there over the weekend as they were going from one end of the Florida to the other. And uh I totally agree with Mr. Harvey. Just let's not give this away to private interests.
>> Thank you very much. >> Thank you, sir. >> Pretty much said by everybody else. >> Yes, sir. It's okay. Gretzo Griffin, you're waving in support of Okay. Um, Edwina Chitty,
I'm sorry if I if I butchered your name. I didn't mean to. >> Okay. Well, I I get the same thing, so I I feel for you. >> I really hadn't prepared anything to say today. >> That's okay. But I've lived out in floor home for 31 years and I could not be
happier. The place is remarkable. You have the forest out there. You have the dirt roads which we love. You have the the easement to the lakes. And some of those easements are in question. So that is the only easement that the pe my
friends and family that live out there have. And I say family because they're the residents. >> That's who I have. They look out for one another. They're kind and considerate. And we would appreciate it if you would not close that road. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you. Leslie Cheney, >> you don't want to speak. Okay. >> Um Dorothy Cooper does not want to speak either. >> Um
>> yeah, I'm going to get to that. Vivian Smith, just don't close it. All right. Um, and so what I'm doing is I'm going through your cards. I'm giving you an opportunity to speak and then I'll just tell you to wave in support of of not vacating it or vacating it in just a
minute. Diane Wjek. >> Okay. Samuel Fararo. >> Okay. Um, Miss Pat Mattel. Mr. Patel. >> I got it. Sherry Thomas.
>> Okay. CE Thomas. >> All right. Eddie Thomas, don't close it. Robert Bell. So, for the record, anybody who couldn't hear in the in uh for recording purposes, every name that I just wrote
read out loud uh was not wanting to vacate it. Mr. Bell, you're recognized. >> Uh my address is 112 Meadow Road, Floor Home, Florida. Uh I'm not for it. >> Okay. All right. Very good. Thank you. >> All righty.
>> All right. Miss Bell. Judy Bell. >> Jude. Okay, you're waving it to not close it. All right. Uh Robin Anderson, >> not close. >> Not close it. All right. Wave in support of not closing it. Terry Bryant. >> Not close it. All right. Uh Daniel
Thomas, >> don't >> close it. Um Kathy Thomas, >> don't close it. Margaret Cheney, don't close it. So, all of those were name were named in the record for not closing. Is that sufficient, Mr. Commando? All right. Thank you. Um, at
this time, I'm out of public record cards that are filled out that are for this subject matter. Is there anybody in the audience who did not fill out a card but wishes to speak who has not had an opportunity to do so? >> Save it. >> All right. Just save it. Okay. With
that, it comes back to the board. What's on the agenda today is the vacation of a portion of this road. So, I believe um I know Mr. uh Commissioner Harvey has made some comments. I would like us to make sure that we um
address what's requested in the public hearing first. Commissioner Alexander, you're recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. Um what I've seen here is an outpouring of support for access to a recreational area. Um
very familiar with floor home. My wife was raised in floor home. So, um I know how tight-knit that community is. Um and again, the gentleman in the teal shirt uh said he came here from Tallahassee. Um some of the things that you said
really rang true with me. Um there's a lot of things in black and white, but if it was all black and white and you know, they wouldn't need us. You could do this through AI. And sometimes when it comes down to the matter of doing what's right for the people and what's right for the community, I understand where you're
coming from. Um, we have a beautiful thing here in Putham County. We have great neighbors. Sometimes we don't always get along on everything, but we do support each other. And looking at what I can only envision is denying your access, denying
access to a resource for your community is is not a portrayal of that goodnatured attitude and appearance of our community. So, it's it's going to be very hard for me to get behind closing this road and
denying the kids, the grandkids, um the folks in that neighborhood the ability to go out and spend time together and create those memories. Then you also have the subject of the the value of your property. You know, the value of your properties is based on having water access in that area. So, who makes up
the difference there? I'm not going to pay for it and you know, it's going to have an effect there, too. So then you also have the aspect of emergency response. If Mr. Grimes over there and a retired firefighter tell me that we need a dry sump out there um to help save
somebody's home or somebody's livelihood, that's what we pay them to do to help us make those those determinations. So um that's where I'm putting my faith in that. So thank you, Mr. Grimes. >> Thank you, Commissioner Alexander. Uh,
Commissioner Newbuler recognized. >> I appreciate the this process. Um, you know, I'm District One representative. I had never been to Georgia's Lake. Um, I had the opportunity to to do that. I went completely around the lake, looked
at the access points. Um, that is a wonderful community. I didn't realize that 850 acre lake was uh it's it's it's dense out there. It is uh there a lot more people out there than I had imagined and it it's just a beautiful
community. Um we have a lot of lakes in South Putham that um essentially are are private. Um ownership around them has very limited access. Um I see the value of of keeping that south access open for
many reasons. All of them stated here. Um, I'm not a big fan of of changing our road designations, but I think this in this case, um, just some special changes warranted and, uh, I'm not going to belabor everything that's been said here
today, but, uh, I think it just keeps everyone's values where they should be. There is a slight possibility of some some insurance relief in this relief as well. So, that kind of spells out where I stand. Thank you. Right, >> Commissioner Pel, you're recognized. Um,
I'm going to try to take a little variation of what Commissioner Alexander said and uh, but he he was reading out of my handbook here, I think, uh, with some of the comments he made. Um, I appreciate the passion of of everyone here and how they feel about about that
lake. And and I'm certainly not for taking anyone's, uh, access away from from something so beautiful as Georgia Lake. That is a beautiful, beautiful lake. I have been out there and uh checked it out and it's u I wish I own property on it. Um but as much as that
is as important the issue of fire protection and the ability to our fire departments to get in there and get water uh during fire. Um I was at Fort Gates Ferry yesterday and they had had a lightning strike and as I was down there
surveying that area and situation um two division of forestry trucks came to the landing there to get water to fight fire right around th those houses at the uh at the uh Fort Gates Ferry um area. So I
firsthand saw the importance of having ready access to water to be able to combat fires like that. So, um, I certainly would not dare take that away and would endanger someone of losing their home. Thank you, Madam Chair. >> Thank you, sir. Uh, Commissioner, you're
recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. And folks, democracy in action, isn't it? People get up and get a chance to talk to your local representatives. You see us in the grocery store. You invite us out to your breakfast. You know, we're not hidden from you. We're there to help
you. Uh sometimes like Commissioner Alexander said, we don't always agree, but on this issue, I think we agree to the fact that the enjoyment of the public is very sensitive for this board right now. And you've heard that. Um
today, I'll deal with as our our chair lady has asked, the the recommended action is to deny the request. I'll come back at another time if that be the case and try to bring this into the county road system. But for today, um, I enjoy
all my citizens, no matter if we're opposed to each other or we're in support of each other. This is democracy in action. When you can come up here and talk to us and we hear you and we listen to you, that's what you elect us to do.
You don't elect us to do anything else but to listen to you when you have something to say. And uh, we listen to you. So, Madam Chair, thank you for the opportunity. You've heard my remarks in the beginning, but when you're ready, I'll be glad to make a motion. >> Okay. A couple housekeeping issues. Um,
did we receive a letter? Any letters or anything that we need for uh to put into the record? >> Um, on Sunday, March 8th, um, at 12:25 a.m., we did receive an email in opposition from a Ralph um, Beast Meer.
I'm not going to say his name correctly, and my apologies. at 118 Corbino Way West. Uh, and I have forwarded that email of an opposition to Miss Cuzac. So, it's in the record. >> All right. So, is that the only thing you have so far, Miss Laura, Miss Ashley? All right. And then I have a
copy of a letter written by Clay Davis um basically um >> saying that after reviewing there's some other stuff in the letter, but I'll read a portion of it. After reviewing the February 10th, 2026 board meeting and after speaking with the commissioner, I
think there may be some confusion as to the difference between a dedication and a fee simple ownership. A dedication does not operate as a grant of the dedicated property. Rather, the public has beneficial use of the property bearing a rei a reversionary clause of
on the plat. The legal owners of the budding lots take title to the street subject to the public easement. I think it's important to understand as stated in the above statute which is 177.081 paragraph 3 there is nothing that
compels the county to maintain the road if it is not vacated. I hope this helps to clarify the matter. So I'm just reading that into record. With that um we're back to the board. Is there any um further discussion? If not we'll enter entertain a motion. Madam chair, I'd like to move that we rec take
recommended action to not to deny the request to vacate the portion of Chamay and Enalark and Lake Estates unit 26. Second and we have a motion to second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. I. >> Motion carries unanimously.
>> Um I and I wasn't saying not to do the um Yes, I wasn't saying not to do that. I just wanted to make sure that we took what was on in front of us today and made a and and made a decision. So, Madam Chair, if you don't mind, uh, may I ask the attorney a question? >> Absolutely.
>> Mr. Attorney, um, I sent you a email last week, um, concerning my intention of what I wanted to do. I did get my road classifications mixed up from three to a two. Um, because three would be private property and two would be less mainten or hardly any maintenance at
all. Um, can this board go ahead today based on the uh points that Mr. Davis sent us in a letter and take this into the public system and classify it as a class two road. >> I would suggest that um because it
wasn't on the agenda just put it on a future agenda for discussion by the board as well as if there's any public comment. >> Can I make a motion to put it on the next? >> I think you just need consensus for that from your colleagues. Do we have consent? >> Good. Okay. >> All right. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank
you. >> All right. All right. With that, we're going to take a threem minute recess. Thanks everyone for being here. All right, let's reconvene the meeting. Uh, public comment on agenda items. This portion of the agenda is designed to allow citizens an opportunity to
bring matters to the attention of the board. It is not reasonable to expect that the board will engage in debate or deliberation about matters on which the board has received no prior information as part of the agenda. Please limit your time to three minutes. Public comment cards are conveniently placed at the meeting room entrance and should be
submitted prior to the deputy clerk who sits to the right of the podium. Again, this is on um agenda items. Yep, that's okay. So, it looks like everybody here that I've got a card for right now is not
anything that's on the agenda. Is anybody else is anybody wanting to speak to anything that's on the agenda? All right. With that, we'll go back to the board. Uh on consent agenda, Commissioner Harvey, do you wish to pull anything? >> Madam Chair, I have nothing I wish to pull. >> Commissioner Alexander.
>> Madam Chair, I have nothing I want to pull. >> Commissioner Newold? >> Nothing. >> Commissioner Palisier, >> I have nothing. >> And I have nothing. With that, I will entertain a motion. >> Madam Chair, I move that we approve consent agenda items A, B, C, D, E, F,
G, H, I, and J. >> I second that. >> All right. Is there any discussion? All in favor say I. >> I. I. >> All right. Before we move on, I want to um recognize Denise with um fact. Is she still here?
>> Here's Denise. Thank you for being here today. Also um Councilman Mark Swanson from City of Pomona Park. Thank you for being here today. And um oh and I also wanted uh our gentleman from uh the water management left, but
we I will mentioned that we are again once again under a phase two. it. The water management voted last week to um move up from a phase one to a phase two water shortage, which means um specifically a phase 2 severe water
shortage has been declared due to ongoing dry conditions across portions of the district. Below average rainfall, declining groundwater levels, and reduced river flows are contributing to water resource stress. for phase two water shortage. What that means for the water management is
landscape irrigation is limited to one day a week. All water users, including domestic utility and commercial, are encouraged to voluntarily reduce water use. Wasteful and unnecessary water use is prohibited. Residents, businesses,
and property managers are encouraged to proactively plan for extended dry conditions and and the potential for additional restrictions. Landscape irrigation again is limited to one day a week and um you can look at all of this on the
district's website. Um it shows um homes with odd numbered addresses and even numbered addresses and the non-residential properties. So all of this is on the district's website. So I'm just um making sure that our citizens know that we're under that recommendation from the water management
district. All right, with that we'll go into our new business um administration regarding the nursing homes. >> Uh yes, madam chair. Uh as you know uh some time back the board gave us staff
direction to go out and look at the nursing homes and then also possibly get a uh an appraisal done on each of them nursing homes. That's a very significant type of appraisal. It took a little while but the appraisals are now in. So staff is just looking for the board for
direction on what you'd like to do next. >> Okay. And um just for for citizens and for um knowledge the there's we the county owns a nursing home in Crescent City and one in Palaca. >> That is correct. We have two nursing homes uh here in Putham County that that
the county is uh county has and they're under management leases as we speak that under long-term leases. However, uh due to a rise of cost of maintenance and and those type of uh issues that we're addressing currently and and in the
future, we're looking at uh what is the best route for uh for Putham County to move forward. >> That's correct. And this was at the direction of the board. Um and so those two appraisals are in and um we're looking for have having discussion and
some direction um from this board. Uh Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, thank you, administration, for doing this. This has been something that's been going on for many years and finally bring this plane in for a landing about having a
conversation about our nursing homes. Um, I guess before I get down into the weeds too much, and I did ask the question this morning about this appraisal cost or appraisal prices of these homes, nursing homes, but I I
think I have my first question is before I go any further, can we even entertain the fact of selling these when they're currently under the lease that they're under? So, Commissioner Harvey, you you can always sell a piece of property.
However, whoever would purchase them would purchase them sub subject to the lease conditions and that that may affect the value of the property or what the county is able to obtain for that for each of those independently. So, with that in mind, um the lease, I mean,
the appraisal amounts that I got this morning, um would we have to at least list those if we decided to sell them at that current price of the appraisal? >> I'm sorry. Would you have to list what that they have a lease?
>> No. No. Would we have to list the the properties at the appraised value that we got that were I was given today? >> No. I mean the so the appraisal is a tool for you because you have a fiduciary responsibility to the
taxpayers to best manage the assets of the county. So that's a tool for you. Um there are many times where properties sell above praise appraised value below appraised value. So it's really just a guiding tool for you. You're not required uh to do anything based on the
appraisal. Now, when the county purchases property, there are conditions that go along with what uh you can do with appraisals. But when you're disposing of them, there's essentially a two-step process. You have to determine that it no longer serves the public benefit, and then we have to go through
a competitive bid process to dispose of the property. >> So, in that case, would we have to say that these properties no longer serve the public benefit if we're selling those properties? >> You do. That's part of the process to dispose property. How do you say that they're not serving a public benefit
when they're serving the less fortunate in a nursing home? And that's what my concern is. >> That's a that's a finding for you as the board. >> Okay. Thank you. That's all my questions right now, Madam Chair. I'm sure I'll have more as we go down. >> All right. Commissioner Pelister, you're recognized.
>> Um, at what stage of our lease are we in um time frame? >> 32. >> We had >> Yep. You want me to give it to you? >> Sure. I know we just renegotiated. >> They were redone in July of 2025. Oh, no, I'm sorry. They were redone in
um 21 with an expiration date of 2032 with the reite right to renew of two additional 10-year terms at the direction of the lease. >> You say 2032. >> It's the initial term. >> Wow. Okay. >> And we've but we've had these I'm sorry. Are you okay?
>> I'm good. >> Um we've had these leases. I know this one was renewed. We've had the same leie in that building in both of these buildings for historical time. Like when I say 20, 30 years. I need a verbal.
>> Yes, that's correct. >> Okay. >> Can I ask a question about that? As I understand it, um >> the nursing home in Crescent City has >> changed management over the period of time. Do they do that with transfer of lease agreements or or am I mistaken in
that in that process in that understanding? >> Yeah, I believe they have. So, we have a lease agreement with one entity and then they essentially subleasase it out to who manages each of the facilities. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yeah, it's been my experience that
sometimes they'll change names but the manage the lease stays under one contract. >> Okay. And and I if you remember, gentlemen, the reason why we got here is because we were looking at what we owned and um what we what we thought we might need and what
we thought we don't need. And it certainly when I got elected, my first thought process is why in the world is the county owning two nursing homes? how we got it. I understand how we got it, but then when we started getting the bills that are um high, at some point
you're at the tipping point of your return on investment. So, at some point, you're at that point where you're not making money, you're losing money or you're not making enough money to um to continue owning it. And so that's I think that's where we had gotten as a
board which said, "Hey, could you go out and let's determine the value of these buildings so that we could come back today and have a discussion as to what we want to do do with those." Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. For the sake of the public though, could we say how we got these two buildings? I mean, one was
the old hospital. Um, and as probably the public doesn't know that people try to give us things all the time, and some things we want, some things we don't. So, could we How did we acquire these two pieces of property?
>> Do we know that, >> Madam Chair? I don't think anyone sitting on this side of DIS has any recollection of of when those even came into the county. They they've been a process since way before I got here. Uh so uh I mean we can go back and do some
research on that but uh but sitting here today I I don't have an answer for you >> and that's fine. I'm good with that. Madam Chair, I think that well when you look at though the Palaca property, the old hospital, the nursing home there on Palm Avenue and we get it generates
$86,000 worth of income back to the citizens of Putham County. your comments just a second ago about the tipping point and when does it cost us money, you know, when you look at the valuation of that that you'd make more interest in the bank than you would uh generate on
on rents, right? Or or you could offset other projects that you really want to do. And then when you look at the Crescent City one, now I'm not saying they don't serve a public purpose, don't get me wrong, but when you look at the Crescent City one, and and let me say this about public purpose. They're
operated for a for-profit. So that's a whole different conversation here. So yeah, there might be a public purpose, but somebody's using them for a for-profit. So, when you look at Crescent City and the valuation of that and it produces 128,000 back to our
taxpayers, um I I I could use that money in the bank and draw interest. And I'm sure Matt could find us a better interest rate that would draw a whole lot more money than $128,000. So, I I'm very glad that we're having
this conversation today. Um, but I I'm looking at purely how long does this albatross hang around our neck before it starts really costing us and can we can we sell that and recoup the money back to the citizens of Putham County and use
it for something better or or help reduce our debt some. So that's my comments. M Mr. Chairman, >> thank you. Commissioner Pal, you're recognized. >> Um, I agree a lot with what Commissioner Harvey just said. Uh in addition to that though, there's certain things that I
believe uh private enterprise and this is one of those in my mind. Uh I don't believe that county should be in the uh nursing home business. Um I'm glad that it has been able to help folks in the past and and um provide a service, but I
think that time has come and gone. Um those buildings are getting old. um probably some repairs coming up in line that could be very costly and um I think this is something that uh needs to be in somebody else's uh portfolio. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you. And um you guys are touching on a lot of subjects and I appreciate the conversation. Um definitely um the public does have you know yes they they help people but we don't have control over the nursing homes. So that you know there's different than oh we've
got control over parks and Rex and and or our community buildings. We don't have control over these buildings. We lease it out to a private entity who then makes a profit. So you're exactly right and we don't do that for anybody else. This is something that we've inherited through the years. How we got
there whether it was nobody I don't know that but I'm sure we could be found out going through title search. Um, but at the end of the day, why why would we continue to spend taxpayers dollars if it's not making money for the county? Commissioner Alexander, you're
recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, speaking from experience, the nursing home on Palm Avenue was actually one of my clients in 2012. They had a major mechanical failure. Um, and we had to bring in rental equipment for that
facility to the tune of um, $8,200 a month that they were paying me for that equipment to be there. And I believe it lasted approximately 6 to 7 months. So, uh, just any minor what seems like a
minor repair cost could push us to the point we're in the we are in the red on one of those buildings in a split second. So, um, just wanted folks to know that that it does get out of hand really quickly and what we could be it could be appear it could appear that we
were doing a service to the community by helping provide a nursing home, but very quickly it can turn the other direction. So, uh, I I would be in favor at looking at at um disposing of both of these. >> Thank you. Uh, Commissioner Nibold, you're recognized. >> Well, I I agree with just about
everything I've heard thus far. Um, you know, there are instances in which the county is a landlord, so to speak. You know, we have properties that that we develop for for economic development purposes and we rent those out. But these spaces are are different than
that. They are complicated. They are, you know, in the health care space. They require a completely different this is different than a metal shell building in which you put, you know, an industrial tenant in. Um, these are complicated and I I would prefer us not to be in that
type of real estate space. Um, I you know that that nursing home I hope you know if this comes to fruition over time and there's a change of ownership there. I I hope a a nursing home stays in that space. It's a benefit to to the community. It employs folks. It um
um you know it's it's it's been there a long time. many of our residents um have no other option than than to be in these spaces and they are beneficial for their health health and well-being. But again, you know, these are complicated uh scenarios and I I prefer to be out of
that space. Thank you. >> Thank you. Um can somebody on the admin team or attorney walk us through? So, it sounds like um the board's comments all uh seem like that we no longer want to own these and now that we have an appraisal on both
pieces, um could you walk us through the process of what what would transpire next? >> I would say then there needs to be a motion vote that the property no longer serves a public purpose and that it can be declared surplus and then put through the statutory process for disposal. I
would imagine that admin would need some direction from the board as to if you'd like to set a minimum or reserve bid. >> Okay. So, once we let me I got a question with that comment. So, if we uh declare it surplus and we put it out for
bid, what if we didn't get any bids? What happens? It still just I mean obviously we would still own it. >> You can decide to put it back out to bid at a lower bid threshold. >> Okay. That was that was one of my questions. All right. Um, Miss Julianne, did you have anything you wanted to add
at this point? Okay. Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. You know, I think the words that we have to use are brutal. >> They are. >> Um, does it serve a public purpose? Sure, it serves a public purpose. We're not wanting to kick people out of the nursing home business. We're just
looking at these companies come in here and lease our take our buildings and these two buildings especially and they're charging their customers to stay in those homes and they're making a profit off of using the taxpayer building. My point is very simple. You
know, if they want to own it, let them own it and let them have the full comp compliments of of being in the owner. But right now, they don't have those full compliments. they have the ability to come back to us, which they do at times, and ask us to do things for them
that would is barely I mean, we're chipping into any any type of money we're getting back on the lease. So, you know, I I started out that way, but I I don't the unintended consequences in this business always comes back to haunt us, but we're not in the nursing home
business. We are clearly we own two buildings. They lease them out to us and they're in the nursing home business. We're not. And I don't want to be in the nursing home business because that's not my forte. My forte is to put the the buildings back in the taxpayer and let
them the consumer the capitalist market do what it does best. So that's my my last comments, Madam Chair. Thank you. >> Yeah, we we lease it to them. Um, >> chair, can I just because we keep talking about us being in the nursing home business, >> I want it to be abundantly clear that
when it's put out for bid, >> it could become a small hospital again. It could become an urgent care. It could become a rehab facility. >> At that point, we're out. We have no ability to influence. I mean, other than as citizens, um, what goes into that space. I just want to make sure that's
clear. >> I agree with that. Um, that's what I was going to say, too. and and um yeah, that's exactly where I was I was headed in that direction in my mind. Thank you. I'm going to allow Miss Avet Reyes to speak regarding the subject matter.
Thank you, Evette Reyes, PO Box 253, Boswick. I know I'm all over the place, but I've had dealings with both Lakewood and Radiant um with a family member and I agree. You should not be in that business. I had no
idea you guys were in that. I thought they were separately owned and I can tell you yes, they are making a profit from us and we're not directly benefiting from that from that profit.
And not only that, they they take property from their people if they can't afford to pay for it. So that's just my comment. Thank you. >> Thank you. A question. Are they um do they currently have to pay property
taxes? >> No, ma'am. They have not currently been paying property taxes. >> Well, I would love to see it back on the tax roll. All right. With that, um, is there a motion from the board, um, or
recommendation based on I'll I'll give you share with you my comments. Um, and if I need to pass the gavl, I will, but um, based on the appraisal, I would say would like to see that we um do a minimum bid for Crescent City at $10
million and the one in Palaka at 5.6. >> Madam Chair, I'd like to make a motion. Actually, if you don't mind, >> please. I'd like to put these out to put them out of surplus with the with Crescent City's location at the minimum bid at $10 million and the Planka
location at $5 million as is right now and that's my motion. >> Okay. So, and within that um we have to declare it a surplus. >> Yeah. >> Okay. That was part of the motion. Um you are you are recommending just for
clarity purposes um Palaca you gave it a little bit less than what it appraised. >> I think I was told 5 million this morning for Palaca's location. >> She's 5.6 >> 5 I'm sorry. So I'll amend my motion to be 10 10 million for Crescent City and
5.6 million for Palaca. >> All right. We have a motion on the floor. >> Second. >> We have a second. Um we're in discussion. Any further discussion? All right. All in favor say I. I. >> I. >> Um and and just for clarity, the motion
was to set that's the minimum bid. >> That's the minimum bid. >> All right. We declared a surplus and it is it works as a sealed bid process. Is that the way it works? Okay. All right. Any other questions? All right. With that, >> I have a quick question. >> Yes, sir. I thought you were were making the motion. Go ahead.
>> Um no, that that I'm good with all the motion all. So, Miss Holmes, they haven't been paying property taxes on those buildings. >> Remember, we don't control that. >> Do they receive a property tax bill as
an occupying entity of a public piece of property? >> Remember, we don't control that. So, it was my understanding that once a public piece of property became tenant occupied, they were responsible for property taxes on that property.
>> The way it's supposed to be. >> This is my understanding, too. I do not control that. The county does not control when an entity receives a property tax bill. >> Okay. Thank you. And that also goes for uh tangible
personal property. They would have to pay tangible p personal property taxes as well. All right. Well, looks like we just uncovered a rock. Okay. With that, we'll go into public
works for Rody Road Reconstruction under new business. Mr. Stout, you're recognized. So, we have uh applied for an HMGP grant under disaster relief funds for the Rody Road reconstruction. Uh we received an email uh not too long ago that it was in
the final stages of approval um for a funding agreement at the 7525% match. Uh then we received another email. There was leftover money from a previous disaster fund that will cover the 25% match. So, we are anticipating a 100%
funded project for Rody Road reconstruction if the board would like us to move forward uh when and if that funding agreement is received. >> All right. Thank you. Um stand by for questioning. Commissioner Harvey. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. And I'm going to
defer to our commissioner from that district naturally, but I have a couple questions. Um this was blown out. We put we closed the road, >> correct? >> Um >> blown out naturally. blown out naturally. Yeah. By the by the hurricane. And then that's a big hefty
ditch. I was showing my wife that the other day and she goes, "That's a big ditch right through there." Um, and it's been that big for since I was a kid. I remember as growing up. >> That's TwoMile Creek. >> Yeah, it's almost two miles wide creek. So, I guess my question is, and I'm
going to defer I'm going to always defer to the commissioner from that district, but I haven't gotten very many people asking me to open that road up. And clearly, um, the ones that did came back and said, "We're glad that it's closed and there's not a lot of through traffic
through there anymore." So, I guess my point is this, you know, does it serve the public purpose to open it back up and and receive this money? because I'm all for it if it does and I'm all for whatever that commissioner says. But, you know, um but sometimes people like
less traffic, especially the older you get. You know, you you kind of enjoy the little solitude. And um I don't want to I don't want to put gas on a very smoldering fire that probably could just die out and move away. But I I'll let that commissioner handle that. Thank
you, Mr. Staff. >> Comm Thank you, Commissioner Paliser. you're recognized. >> Um, this to me is an absolute no-brainer. You're giving funding to replace what uh, mother nature took out at 100%. It's not going to cost the
taxpayers, not a dime. Uh, I fully support reestablishing this road and uh, putting that covert back in place for um, ingress and egress through that area. Um, far as I think it benefits everyone. I I I've not received a call
of anyone that is uh in favor of leaving it closed and like I said the funding's uh 100% it's a no-brainer for me. >> All right. Um with that I'll make some comments. So when this first happened, was it two years ago? Yes, it's been
quite it's been a bit. Um >> that was the issue that was on the floor was when we we got a price on it, we would had to use local dollars. And then we got into the same conversation that we often get up here is what do you really need and what is it we'd like to
see? And in this case, we didn't need like it wasn't a necessity. We could people had to go around a mile to go around it. Not even that. >> Up Carol Road. >> Yeah. Up Carol Road. the next road over and um so we cleaned it up. We got rid
of all the things and we weren't willing to spend local tax dollars on it. That's that was where the board had gotten and I fully supported that. And I did get emails after it was shut down that said, "Thank you. It's quiet. Thank you. I don't have all the traffic coming in front of my I mean I got four or five. I mean, I didn't get like a bunch." Um I
also got some calls that said, "Why in the world did y'all close this road?" Well, we didn't have a choice. the road got they it all got washed out during the hurricane and that's where we got and then since then the city has put up they've had to remove a >> yeah they had a 16inch uh sewer force
man that ran across the top of the coverts under the road um and that was in danger of getting washed out as well which would have caused a problem um choose my words carefully uh so we went to the city and they did their due diligence um and they have since um
taken that force man and buried it under TwoMile Creek and come up the other side. So, if we do restore, remove whatever is decided upon, um the city has done a great job in in making sure that their um utility is not inhibiting us from doing anything. >> And when we first took it, when we took
it out, when we went out and had to shut it down and then take it out, I mean, you could you could stand in the holes. The holes were so big that somebody my size could have I mean, you would have fallen craw down in those holes. >> Yeah. You would have broken your ankle or something. the road was falling in
and there wasn't any patching it. >> Correct. >> And it would have been hundreds of thousands of taxpayers dollars and so we didn't want to do that. So to to get here today where we don't have any local dollars into this um unlike Commissioner uh Palisier is it's a no-brainer if
we're using other dollars and not our local dollars to to repair it. I do think it serves some public purpose as far as easier access for people's homes and um there ever since the barricades have been up there is has been some safety concerns regarding
>> people coming to a screeching halt who traditionally always went through there and it doesn't matter that you had signs on each end of the road and and the barriers and the reflectors. Nothing's happened. However, something could happen and we don't want that to happen. So, um that was a lot of happenings.
Anyway, um I am in support as well of um putting this road back in without using local tax dollars. So, if I can get a motion for that. >> You absolutely can. I make a motion that we um go follow along with the uh grant
application of proceeding in that direction to uh grant funding to replace and repair road. Second. >> All right. We have a motion to second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. >> I. >> All right. Motion carries. >> Thank you, >> Madam Chair, if we could.
>> Yes, sir. >> I just like to thank our staff for working diligently on that project because they have got an enormous amount of hours. I mean, that's coming from your emergency management department of a department of two people that put these projects forward that seek after the additional funding when it started
at 75 and they've qualified it for 100. They move these things through. There's another one coming that's right behind it, but they do amazing work behind the scenes that a lot of people don't see. I mean, they only watch, you know, you guys on the YouTube channel, but we got some very fine staff out there making these things come true. So, I would just
like to thank them publicly for all the work they put in to get to 100%. >> Thank you, Mr. Grimes. I agree. Uh, we do want to definitely thank them. Um, there's a lot of hard work that goes in behind this. We certainly wouldn't have we wouldn't be here today if it hadn't been for them getting that additional funding. So, that that that is a big
deal. So, thank you, Madam >> Chair Matthews. Yes, sir. >> Mr. Grimes, thank you for that comment. You know, you re you basically ended with 100%. But I love shopping where I get buy one get one free, you know, or
50% off or 75% off. You know, I'm glad that we have partners out there that saw the need and was going to pony up. U but 100%'s great. 75 would have been good. 50 wasn't so bad. So, I'm glad we got there and and I'm glad our staff really
really looks at these situations and what's available to us to save our taxpayers money and u and I appreciate that op. Thank you, m Madam Chair. >> Thank you. All right. With that, we're going into our code enforcement.
>> Madam Chair, is there anybody here for codes and >> Is there anyone here for codes enforcement? Well, Madam Chair, based on the fact that no one's here for any codes enforcement, the two that we have, codes case number 23-004167 is now in compliance. The total amount
of the fine was $20,437. The actual hard cost to the citizens of Putin County was $1,910. My motion is for the actual hard cost to be paid back to the citizens of Putton County in the amount of $1,910
if it's paid within 90 days for this case number. >> Second. >> We have a motion to second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. >> I. >> Motion carries. >> And madam chair, let me move on down to the next one. Codes case number 24-000042
is now in compliance. The total fine was $15,593.50. The hard cost back to the citizens of Putham County is for $1,63. My motion is to accept $1,63 to be paid within 90 days on this code's
case. >> Second. >> All right, we have a motion second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. I. >> Thomas, while you're here, um I'm I'm sorry to throw something out at you, but I have a couple questions. we see these cases come in front of us and when they um we often hear you know codes isn't
doing anything or codes isn't whatever um these these two things one of them was use of structure sanitary facilities care premises if somebody sees something and they want to report it um they call the number can you just sort of walk us
through the process a little bit for our citizens because I know we had last time we had a citizen that was that brought this up >> yes ma'am um they just call our code enforcement line um or any of our extensions directly and um they give us their complaint, their name and address
and we'll open the complaint immediately. Um soon as we do that, we send out a courtesy notice immediately which gives them 30 days just to let them know somebody made a complaint and it let them see what's going on. If it's
a if it's a violation, it gives them 30 days to correct it. We go out, we try to make it at 31 days, but we're pretty close and then we see if it's a violation. >> Okay. >> And so the goal is to have somebody bring somebody into compliance. That's
the goal. So if you go out there, the propertyy's trashed up, you know, there's uh then you go out, you're you're having a conversation with the land owner or the occupant and say, "Listen, if you don't if you don't clean this up, we're going to we're going to be you're going to be in code violation."
>> Yes, ma'am. That's pretty the simple way to say it. >> Pretty. Yeah. >> Okay. And so the when we say care of premises, give me some examples. That's mostly when the property is really trashed up. Care of premises. >> Care of premises is um trash and tree debris um inoperable in untagged
vehicles in the yard. Um just that's pretty much care premises. And if you get a complaint about one thing and you go on the property and you see several other things, are you then able to also uh you know give them
>> We have to write them up for every violation that we see. >> Okay. All right. All right. And then um use of structure. What is an example of a use of structure? >> Use of structure is living in a shed. We don't actually have a code against
living in a shed. So that's that would be that one. >> Okay. And then um and then I guess sanitary facilities would be when they're putting something on the ground that they shouldn't be. >> Yes. He was living in the shed. No septic, no way of being sanitary.
>> Okay. Um and unsafe structure speaks for itself. He went out there and found that it it's doesn't meet any codes. >> Yeah. Unsafe structure for us is um open and accessible. it's open accessible at all. Any broken windows or doors or anything like that, it's unsafe.
>> Okay. So, somebody's living in a tent on a piece of property. What's what's our what's the ability? What abilities do we have? >> Care premises. We have no code against living in a tent. >> Okay. >> So, it it would be trash. >> Okay. So, even if they even if you go to
a campsite that has a tent and it's decent, let's just say decent, right? there's not piles and piles of trash, then it's a then that's a decision that your code officer has to make since there's not a policy about >> it's still care premises. >> It's still care. >> It's a Yes, ma'am. If it doesn't have a
structure on the property, you're not allowed to have trash or anything on the property. >> Okay. So, >> all right. All right. Very good. Thanks for taking the time to do that. Uh, Commissioner Harvey has has a question or comment. >> Yes. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thomas, thank you for answering that. But let's go a little step further. Out in my
area, as Mr. Steel will probably come back up and say again today and I did ride the area. You have to notify the land owner. Right. >> Correct. >> So it's not just the person living in the tent on the property. They'll tell you they got permission. Your job then
is to notify the land owner and you cite the land owner that owns the property that these people are squatting on or something in that nature. Most of the time, and I'm not trying to put words, do they even know that they're somebody? >> Most of the time, they don't. No, sir.
>> They don't know. >> No. So, they The letter helps. >> Yeah, the letter helps. But here's the problem I have and and I don't want squatters and I don't want tents and I I agree with that. It drives down property values and it's bad. But a lot of these people are are out in the woods and they
think they're in the woods. They don't realize they're on somebody's Well, they might realize they're on somebody's property. They don't realize the lot size. Correct. And so we're going to find somebody who lives up in up north or down south or whatever because somebody else is taking advantage of
their property. And that's sad to me. And I'm I'm I know that there's an avenue to then for that landowner to go to the sheriff's department and request some enforcement actions, but that's the reality of what we're dealing with. Is that correct? >> Yes, sir. >> Thank you. Thank you, Madam Chair.
>> Commissioner Palis, you're recognized. Um just for a little bit of clarity because I get calls and they go, "Can you just call this in?" And and no, I can't. Somebody's name has to be attached to the complaint. I just give us a little detail about that. Me as the
commissioner can't call it in just for them. >> Well, the state law changed in July 2021 where we have to have a name and an address on the complaint. So, there's no way around that. No more anonymous complaints anymore.
um you as a commissioner I mean it's up to you it's your decision I mean it's just I can't tell you whether you can make a complaint or not you know because you're a person you also
>> and that's the point that I've made at a couple board meetings is the Florida legislature changed that a few years ago and the reason one of the reasons was because they you know they were having people that were just having neighborly disputes and they were involving codes and taking up a bunch of time. And the other part was the legislature thought
that people should know their accuser, right? That was that was part of the due process. >> It did. It did bring the code cases down. We we did during my time here, I found a lot of nonvalid complaints, >> right?
>> Hundreds >> because somebody was mad that >> mad at somebody and they didn't have to give their name. >> Their kids got into a fight at school. So therefore, they're going to Yeah, I get it. Uh, Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. So, when I read the statute, it said employees of the
county, right? That we couldn't you can't just ride by a piece of property and decide to turn it in unless you see a sanitary situation. Correct. >> Talking about employ no code enforcement officers, >> right? >> I can't make a complaint. >> I'm sorry. >> I cannot I'm not allowed to open a
complaint, >> right? >> Um, my wife can. Um, >> but when I read the statute, it says >> any employees, no other employees can. >> Okay. >> Um, like a sheriff's officer, they can they can do it. They can you they're they can be the entity. The officer can make it and he's the sheriff's officer.
Um, >> because I've had a legislator >> he can make it. >> I've had a legislator ask me to turn one in and I said, the way I read it, I'm an employee of the county, too. I sh can't just drive by a place and turn something in just because of that. >> No. Florida statute 162 says code
enforcement officers. >> Just codes enforcement officer. Okay. Thank you. >> All right. I know we are deviating a little bit, but I think this is a very important conversation to be had. Commissioner Newold, you're recognized. >> It is. It's an important one, and I hope my comments don't open a bigger can of
worms, but as I meet different county officials across the state, I've run into code enforcement officers from the panhandle to South Florida. And um that is, you know, one of the most common complaints we get from citizens. Hey, you know, why is this lot over here
that's got looks like a junkyard? Um you know, why aren't you taking action against it? And and I can, you know, I've called a few in or just ask questions about them. things that you would think would raise the community's eye which have never been turned in by anyone, you know, and and that
requirement that that you know, one of these prospective violations is turned in by a citizen. Um, but there are what are called proactive programs and reactive programs across the state. And some counties have and and these will
generally be large urban counties who have large tax bases who have stacks of of code enforcement officers. They choose to be proactive and they can wander around and just identify any
given code violation and go and then go act on them accordingly. But most rural counties who are constrained with um you know we have payroll issues. You know we're we're trying to be as fiscally conservative with all of our
constituents dollars. You know we have more modest code enforcement programs and we choose to be reactive. Um you know that's kind of a question for another day. But but that's in general that's why different counties choose different um
ways of doing business there. But that's a question we get every day anyway. Any any commentary on on that >> being reactive and proactive? >> Yeah. Any and you know I don't mean to put you on the spot but it it's >> No, >> I mean that's the only way we can have
this conversation. >> I understand. Um so while I've been here I went down south to all my classes and I've talked to almost every county down there. >> Our land mass is very large. You know, I just went to a class and they don't even
have a quarter of the land mass and they had 18 code officers. They're proactive. Um, that's, you know, that's >> Yeah, we have 850 miles square miles. >> Yeah. I mean, that's we're we're pretty large. Um, and the problem with
I mean, we need the code officers not to not be accused of selective enforcement. I I mean I could drive down I could open three 400 cases a day. This is that's >> sure and selective >> but I mean I know what I'm looking at
after a lot of years of I know the book like you know you know then that's not you know that's that's easy but >> yeah selective enforcement is a big deal and those those counties they may have half the land mass and five times the population >> and and it's an easier nut to crack.
>> Takes a while. Well, I mean, one time I had to go from I think I was on Bon. I had to go all the way to the other side of Georgetown. I the drive was an hour and one minute and I'm, >> you know, I mean, there's an hour gone, you know, and I didn't really have a choice. Yeah. >> I had to go from I had to go that one
spot and I had to go to the other one. >> So, that was a lot of driving. >> Yeah. And these are are things that our citizens bring up to us. But, you know, let's not forget that we have added staff to the code enforcement uh unit. um we will see improvement in this space
over time. We have a good team. They are are are conscientious in how they handle these these matters. So um >> it's helped tremendously and I appre I really we I really appreciate it. >> Sure. >> It it really has. Well, I applaud you in which in the way and the manner in which
you conduct that business and and although you know that is one of our biggest complaints, there's progress in the space and um it'll get better over time. So, thank you. >> Thank you, Commissioner Nibold. Commissioner Alexander, you're recognized.
>> Thank you, Madam Chair. I know you made a reference a few minutes ago about, you know, we're kind of going off topic or going off of the here and there, but I appreciate these conversations. Um, I think they're valuable. Um, the public needs to know, you know, these are
questions that we get posed to us in out on the street every day. It's a great learning opportunity for us as a whole, but it's a great opportunity for the community that's watching us in cyerspace. It also has taken time out of their day to come in and learn. So, um,
staff does a great job of explaining policy for us. And I think every one of these conversations is beneficial. And you know, I I I don't think that we are doing anyone a disservice. And you know, I'm probably the one that wouldn't say this, but the time spent in here is
valuable. And if we go a little bit longer because we had to expound on a topic so everybody understands, I think we're doing what we were hired to do. So, we don't need to rush through any of this stuff. If there are questions that people have, questions that my fellow commissioners have or staff, bring them
forward and let's talk about it. We meet twice a month. We need to cover as much stuff as we can. Um, it's a learning curve for everybody in here and I think every one of these conversations is beneficial. So, thank you. >> Thank you. I know you didn't come prepared and we didn't tell you we were
going to ask those questions, but thank you for the for the open dialogue. I appreciate your time. >> I'm going to take a point of privilege before we move forward and ask Mr. Mark Swanson from the city of Pomona Park to come up and introduce himself as the um councilman for uh town of Pomona Park
and say a few words if he would wishes to. >> Thank you, Mr. Swanson. I met you um before. Yep. >> Yes. We were was pretty hot on our uh Everyone's having a yard sale. >> Yes. >> So, I never thought I'd be here.
I was a lifetime Miamiian. I just came here and I got on because the mayor said, "Oh, I need you on the town council." And apparently it had been vacant for two years. And the humorous thing is maybe 20 years ago I was in
Palaca. And I said, you know, this is a nice little town. I don't think I could ever live here. Now I come and I'm like, gosh, look at this traffic in Palaca. The you got a rush hour 9:00. I can't wait till I get home to Pomona Park. But
I really appreciate it. I said, uh, Commissioner Peliser gave me some advice. Had a good talk with your chair. Uh, JR's been there for us. I look forward to meeting the other what amazed me and your code enforcement said it,
but that you all run in a district, but you're responsible for everybody and there only five of you. We have seven people. So anyway, anything I can ever do for you? Um, our issues are very similar to what I heard here and I'm
going to take it back to our meeting. You are loaning us your code enforcement officers. So, we're excited about that. I think what we've tried to say is the hard thing is the people that are there
that have always been there, financial trouble. So the grandfather in versus the new trying to get uh compliance. Also working with them. I learned when I rushed to get everybody the homestead
exemption by March 1, there's actually another set of exemptions and that's not due till June 1. So anybody who's a veteran out there, uh somebody who's the Save Our Homes >> that it was 20,000 back in 2001. So I
think it's $38,600 odd dollars and the people were fantastic. The office this is another thing I said in Miami this would have been a dayong adventure anything with your driver's license homestead they even had something where people were
getting paid for their spots in line. So it's quite a pleasure to walk in and I I really appreciate the professionalism and I'm also going to take back the comments because that is true. This is our job. We only meet once a month. And
so I think this is educational and this is one of my issues. I think we should be on YouTube. We'd like to acquire our water system, FGUA. And the next time our great representative, Larry, he is uh our concerned citizen.
He's not officially a representative. He got mad because I referred to him as a gadfly. And I looked it up and Socrates said that he was the gadfly for Athenian society. So that's a real compliment when you have somebody that they're
coming up and they're complaining, but that's better than them doing something else, right? Taking some measure outside. So that's all I have. If I can ever help you down in Pomona Park, my address 326 West Main Street, Pomona
Park, 32181. And on my card, it even has uh has my cell phone, which is the old uh 305 cell. So again, thank you very much. I'm here. I might sit in because I saw that ferry when I first visited and I asked,
"Well, when does it run?" And they said, "Not for five years." And I heard that you have a tourist development tax. They do that down in Miami. That's how they paid for the convention center. I think that's something that our community I can't speak for council but I know I and
Waka my wife works at Renegades. So uh you know we've we've come in very fast and I I'll repeat I've just really enjoyed it. The first time somebody said to me how are you doing? I'm like gosh do I know this guy? I'm like no he's just being and I've in the Wind Dixie
which unfortunately is closing May 31. It's going to take eight months to do the Aldi's. I've had to park farther away because so many people want to come help me with my groceries when I'm organizing. So that's what I'd say. And just keep up the good work. It's >> Thank you, Mr. Swanson.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you, Commissioner Harvey. You're recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. They didn't want to help you in Miami with your groceries, did they? Or they >> they won't take them off of you. >> Thank you. We're going to take a fivem
minute recess. Stretch legs. Going into our public comment time. Public comment on miscellaneous items. This portion of the agenda is designed to allow citizens an opportunity to bring matters to the attention of the board. It is not reasonable to expect that the board will engage in debate or
deliberation about matters on which the board has received no prior information as part of the agenda. Please limit your time to three minutes. Public comment cards are conveniently placed in the meeting room entrance and should be submitted prior to the meeting to the deputy clerk who sits to the right of the podium. Um so with that, first up we
have Mr. David Miner. >> Good morning, Mr. Miner. >> Thank you. Uh David Miner, 116 Sheffy Road. uh want to talk to you about the I know the Fort Gates Ferry thing is coming up this afternoon, but there's many things that coming from the commissioners and stuff that I'd like to see changed. Like example, I have
engineering on Fort Gates Ferry. They uh the engineering that was provided me years ago uh were like 14inch pilings and they're just things that are done on a big grand scheme and on a 14-inch piling you can't use big you have to use a bigger crane stuff like that where if
you drop down a lot of the sizes of stuff it will help out a lot of local people could bid on it instead of having larger companies out of Jacksonville or whatever uh come in. Last time I rented a a barge to handle 14inch DOT piling,
it was uh 30,000 a month. Well, that >> So, Mr. Mr. Miner, would would that would it qualify for DOT? Um would you be able to what you're proposing? Would you be able to put um cars on that landing? >> Yes, ma'am. So, example, a DOT 14inch
piling is rated at 176 tons. Okay. A 10 by10 uh piling is rated at 90 tons. Okay. Okay. So, instead of putting them 8 foot apart, only put them six foot apart. The point is you can drop the size of the piling. Just use more of them, but then a local contractor with
the barge can handle it. The other way to do it is is sheet piling. If you if you were to box it in, of course, you have to go through DOT or through D to make sure that it it's you get into a land lease problem and you may have to turn around and do a mitigation of
another piece of land because you're filling in wetlands technically. Um, but the best part about the sheet piling ideal is you can actually drive the sheet piling. It's not holding the weight of the vehicles up, but what it's doing is it's keeping from uh pushing out. And then you pour a concrete slab
over top of it after you've compacted the ground. Now, there's two kinds of sheet pilings you can use. You use steel, which costs more, okay? But it also doesn't crack if a boat hits it, okay? You can use vinyl sheet piling and and fiberglass sheet piling. Okay?
vinyls used around here. We used u uh fiberglass sheet piling in Guantan Bay, Cuba for uh 717 foot seaw wall on a Pier Charlie, which is a main pier down there. Anyway, the point is you can drop your cost depending on what you use. So,
whenever you send it out for bid, maybe you can get your local engineer or local contractor to put their two cents in and it will save money. Then it drops it down. So your steel sheet piling based on say 14 by30 landing will cost you around 50 some thousand dollars. Okay,
that's not the concrete, that's just the sheet piling, right? You drop down to fiberglass, you can drop it down to $35,000 and then plus your concrete and tiebacks and what have you. So, you know, people hear fiberglass or or or you know, what have you, you still maybe
need to put some pilings around it just for a bumper piling so somebody don't run into it because we know how wonderful everybody is at their boating. Okay. So, uh I'm I'm times up, I guess. >> Well, I So, I want you to do me a favor. You're you're everything you spoke about
was from a contractor point of view. Is that correct? All right. So, take that hat off for just a second and put on your taxpayer hat. >> Mhm. You have businesses in Putnham County and you have and you live in Boswick, correct? Out in the Boswick area. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Are you willing to spend your tax
dollars on a ferry down in down in South Putham? So, I'm just asking you an honest answer since you brought this up. >> I could care less about what happens at Fort Gates Ferry. That's just being honest. >> Fair. Okay. Fair >> from from and I do wear both hats. Okay.
Because I do pay plenty of taxes. All right. So the thing about it is is it necessary? No. Is it convenient? Sometimes I've been down there one time and and had to see actually had to see Judson Sap which lives across the river. I would have loved to had the ferry that
day but that was that one day in 30 years. >> The other problem that you have of that from from not a contractor but from thing but I have looked into it. So the the county doesn't own the property. Okay. DOT. Well, a lady owns the
property in California, but DOT has uh has the rightway on it. Have a has a uh an easement on it. >> Okay. So, we're asking taxpayers, myself, to take and fix something that has nothing to do with anybody else in
the county, but just a few people that are there that may want to go shopping down in uh Ocala. >> So, >> thank you for your comments. >> All right. Thank you. Mr. Steel, Dan Steel,
you're a famous singer, right? A guitarist. What are you, a famous singer? Famous guitarist. Come on up. >> Steely Dan. >> Silly Dan. >> Yeah, I'm I'm Dan St. Live 202 Lane Interlock in Florida. Uh code
enforcement hit on some of that out there. I was I travel the roads out there a lot and unfortunately I have stopped in front of people's places and they know my truck. Lucky not been shot at. >> Yeah, you're right. >> Um
I don't really I'd like to see if there's some way we could change that code enforcement where they could go out and see these places. And in fact, I've even offered to go with them and show them cuz I've been on most of the roads out there. And I'll show them where
these places are at because a lot of GPS doesn't work out there. The last time I said you got to get this other code that'll show you where the lots are at and stuff because there's not even street signs. Well, you got to stop in
front of the P house to do it. And everybody knows my truck. I mean, I got the only truck out there like that. Okay. So, and the other day I went past a place, they've got trash all the way out to the road. They've got a place where they park
their car to pull in there between the trash. Two places like that. There are several places out there that have got travel trailers for extra money, I guess, nowadays. parked behind their houses with no sewage what they're
dumping on the ground. I know one, two, three, four of them just with probably about a shout house. I could probably shout and they could hear me. And then the I did get one place there
on May Lane. Uh the lady I guess has been removed from the place. The shed is even on her property, but the trash is still there. Uh she's not there. There's a sign says no. Uh I think there something about no
trespassing sign there, but no one cleaned it up and that's all over the place and that it's going to get rats and everything else in there. But also another thing too and I got list there that the roads
are getting tore up by these four-wheelers. We got spring break coming. I wish the county sheriff's department or something would go to the schools or something and tell these kids that do not tear up the roads that
they're they're they're it's a gets a law for tearing them up public property and they do it all the time. You go out there to Citrus and Twin Lakes Boulevard, it's tore up bad. They do it. They do it every week. They do donuts in that road.
And I'll tell you, it's getting really bad out there. the roads are getting real bad for the kids tearing them up. >> But yes, we've got a lot of trash out there and I it I I'm interested in my part of the county. I keep my place up.
I pulled road s I got probably the best yard out there in my area of rolled sod and everything else and I want to keep it nice. But there's a house right there on the lake. I can see look at it right down the street. I think it's going for
$125,000 on the lake. Now, property value is getting bad because there's a place right next to him that looks like a dump. There's cars parked. And I think this is a code, too, that you're not supposed to use a county
uh roadway for a parking lot to use it for your own personal vehicles to park on it. I can take you to several places out there. that have got five and six cars parked on county property using that for their parking places.
>> Okay. Thank you. I will say that just because a cars in a road, you'd have we'd have to figure out the classification of the road because there's a lot of private roads out there and if they're private roads, that's different than a county road. And just because a road has a county sign, does not mean that it's a county owned road.
It's for 911 purposes. No, I mean there parking on the road right right off four feet off road back one place. >> My only point was you got to make we just have to make sure that it is a public road and if it is a public road you could call it in to uh Mr. Stout at and in public works and say they've been
you're say are they just in and out or are they like staying there for 24 hours 48 hours? >> Oh no these are fulltime fact goes within three feet of their back bumper of their vehicle. Mhm. Well, if they're in the rightway, you you can turn that in um to the to the county. Um
>> that I mean, someone needs to drive that. I mean, I don't care all you do. I'll drive you all of you around to look at that area out there because it's going down here. We've got a lot of new people coming in, too. I don't know if anybody knows that. I probably in the
last year, I can say I can put my hand on by about a dozen places have went in. >> Sure. Traffic's getting a lot more and we need some new roads out there. >> Is going to grow. That's for sure. Um, thank you for coming up, >> Mr. Grimes.
>> Yeah, if it's abandoned car in the road, they could call the sheriff's office first so they can do the red tag portion of it. Okay. >> And then if it's a car, they that the they have a towing program that they can tow. Now, if it's an RV, it's kind of worked out a little different because the tow companies don't want an RV, but
the rotational records that work for the FHP and the sheriff's office can go get a vehicle out of the rideway, but it has to be tagged. I think it's either 24 or 48 hours that it has to be done and then they they can process forward if it's a if it's a camper or something in the middle of the road. We had to go through the same process and then we kind of
have to go out and remove it. So, I just don't want them to call public works because the public works can't really do it. The first step has to be done through the sheriff's office. >> Thank you for clarifying that. Thank you. Uh, Miss Karen Chadwick. >> Karen Chadwick, 179 West Tricklin Road, Interlockan.
>> Good morning. >> Um, I'm just going to speak from personal experience. I I run a sightseeing charter service, uh, which I mentioned before. And uh so during the draw down at Kenwood uh we were really busy, me and another person that does sightseeing tours, we were running two
trips, sometimes three trips a day and um got to put a little money in my savings account finally. And so now with the water coming back up, we're shut down. Nobody's wanting to go out there when the water's up. Just sightseeing.
There's just, you know, nothing to see. Um just a bunch of water, some water lettuce. um maybe a couple birds. Um so I moved to this area in um I'm a Florida native. I moved here 36 years ago to work on the the Silver River Museum exhibits and I've just been here ever
since. I had my captain's license for um 19 years and I have these cards to give you that were signed on my tours. I asked people if they wanted to send you all a note and so I've got 73 cards. I mailed a few of them, but the stamps are
getting pretty expensive, so I thought I'd just turn them in. Um, I would have more, but I didn't think about doing it till the middle of January, so I only have 73. Um, and I have a question about the inspection report from 2021. The
back of it is so redacted, you you can't see anything. Uh, the previous greenway manager that retired a couple years ago sent me this report from 2015, and I didn't get it till 2017. I mean, I still have the email where he sent it to me. Um, there's nothing redacted in here. We
can see all the damage and the degradation, and it it's it's really I know this fence has been replaced, but it's pretty unnerving looking at this. Um, I'd like to ask for there be a workshop with the 2021 inspection report
to where we can see, you know, what it actually looks like. There's so much redacted in that report, you can't see anything. This even has the the inundation maps for that's showing how Waka is threatened with dam failure. Um I think people deserve to know if if the
county stance is to save Rodman, we need to really know what the condition is because this is you can see the cracks, the undermining, the bolts missing. I know with the um
right now the the farthest west gate, all the mechanisms to raise it up are completely gone and the and the little walkway above it is just a piece of plywood that's pretty weathered. It looks like it's been there for a while. So, um I'd like to ask for a workshop.
Let's see what the condition really is because this is Have you all seen this? The 2015 >> inspection report. It's It looks pretty bad. Um, also there's so much muck built up in there. I've been going out there, like I said, two or three trips a day,
except I lost my voice for a week, so I had to reschedule a bunch of stuff. Um, the muck coming up that's built up, backed up by the dam, there's big globs of it just coming up and roing up and disintegrating. Uh, it smells really
bad. That's because of the dam because the river can't flow. And it's it's really nasty. Anyway, a lot of people are asking me after my trips, where can we go to eat? So, the sightseeing tours do bring money into
that county, the the western part of the county. Um, and when the water's up and the draw down's over, it that's over. Thank you. All right. Thank you. >> All right. Is there anybody else wishing
to speak on public comment? All right, back to the board. Um, commissioner committee updates. I know we went through that last week, but is there anybody here that just has anything that they want to add regarding their committees? >> I have one. Yes, sir. >> Quick thing. Um, last week I attended
the Florida Association of Counties Trust meeting in Tallahassee. Um, that entity kind of oversees the auto and liability insurance for a collection of counties. Um, our representative is
is their representative is here today. I I I hated to be the bearer of bad news, but um you guys all everybody carries insurance, counties carry insurance, and it will not be to anyone's surprise that we will be seeing a uh increase in both
our auto and liability insurance for the coming year. So, sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but there it is. But that is a a good organization. It's wellrun. Um, I'm learning the ropes there and proud to represent Putnham County on
that in that space. So, thank you. >> All right. Anybody else have any committee updates they want to share? All right. Appointments. Any appointments? Commissioner um, Alexander. >> Commissioner Harvey. >> Madam Chair, I have none. >> Commissioner Newald, >> I have none.
>> Commissioner Palier, >> I have none. >> And I have none. All right. Clerk of court comments. >> Thank you, Madam Chair and commissioners. Um, just as a quick update, our customer service building is close to being done. Hopefully, uh, we'll be in that early next month and when we do, we'll we'll have an event,
invite you guys down to see it. Very good. So, thank you'all. >> Long time coming. I'm excited for it. I remember seeing it before and I excited to see it afterwards. >> Thank you. >> County Attorney Commando. >> Nothing, Madam Chair. Thank you. >> County Administrator Suggs.
>> Uh, yes, ma'am. Thank you, Madam Chair. Uh, just a couple things. one is uh want to pass along a compliment kudos to Commissioner Newbold. Uh I see we have Miss Denise Foggles here still today and I just want to share that in the earlier
conversation they were very pleased with the work that you're doing commissioner. So thank you for that for representing us. So uh thank you. Uh secondly, also uh Miss Ferguson, please stop me if I shouldn't say anything, but I just want to remind everyone to be mindful of uh
opening up your emails and your attachments. I understand that one of our counties was was uh hacked uh via cyber uh this week. Uh so let's all be mindful. Mr. Richie, uh please put us a reminder email together for all of our staff as well as our constitutionals if
you would please. and uh you know because we certainly don't want to have to deal with anything like that. So uh but thank you for uh for bringing that to my attention, Miss Denise. And also uh uh lastly, I just want to get some board approval. Uh you know, we've got a
lot of wetlands around the county and we've got one particular set of wetlands uh just south of us at Pico Road. You know, we've had a lot of folks here recently for for whatever reason parking in the wetlands. Uh, I've had to go and ask some folks to leave the area myself.
And so, uh, you know, I'd like to ask the board cuz I was talking to our public works folks, if we could put up some type of, uh, barrier at this point, whether it be ballers, whether it be a chain link fence or whatever with an open. We don't want to discourage anyone from fishing out there. They're allowed
to walk out there, but vehicles are absolutely not allowed. And I don't want the county to get themselves in a position where we have to answer for that. So, uh, uh, either by cons consensus or motion, if we could just get some direction so we can put something up there to make sure that we
honor that opportunity to keep those folks out of there. >> You just need to support. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Okay. Thank you. >> Absolutely. >> And and just for clarity, are you referring to both sides? >> Uh, no, ma'am. The side that we on as you drive down to the uh boat ramp,
it'll be on your left hand side. >> Okay. All right. So, we've had people parking get notified. >> Yes, ma'am. It's it's it's getting more and more um um ramped out there for that. Uh I had two vehicles that particular day when I got a notification. So I went out and had a conversation. They and they promptly
moved. They understood. But >> uh for us to stay uh uh out of out of harm's way. Let's go ahead and block that off if we could. >> Okay. And then you would just have like a little opening for a walkway. Is that the idea of it? All right. >> Yeah. We'll I'll get with with public or we'll figure out the best way to handle that.
>> Did y'all wave in support? I want to make sure. Okay. All right. Sounds like you got that. Thank you for bringing that to our attention. >> Thank you. >> All right. >> Well, you were fussing at me. I could hear you. >> I didn't fuss. >> Commissioner comment starting with Commissioner Alexander.
>> Oh, man. Good day. Good day. Um, again, I want to thank everybody for spending the time to really dig into some of these topics. I think it is critical for the public and also commissioners and staff to understand why decisions are made, the process in which they're made.
Um we've got the fair coming up which is very exciting. Um again the um madam chair volunteered me for the um mental health consortium and they will be using my booth this year. So if you have any questions about the services that are
needed or services that are available in our community regarding mental health, they will be available at my booth in um I forget which building that is J.R. which building the exhibit hall. Anyhow, Maltby building. They'll be available over there and they can provide you all
the information you have on or need on mental health. Um there's a guy sitting in the back of the room looking on his phone right now. I want to say thank you. Um Sam has been working diligently with me on a grant for another boat ramp
to offset some of the congestion that we have and also move some traffic away from some of the wetlands that Mr. um Suggs discussed earlier. We got our plans in the mail last night pretty late from Hansen Engineering which is very exciting. um
we are he has definitely set forward set forth a more strategic approach this year and I think we're going to be in pretty good standing on that. So um you know I want to give credit where credit is due. Thank you Sam. I appreciate your help on that. That's all I got. >> All right, Commissioner Newbold.
>> I don't have a whole bunch. Um but thanks for the the push on the fair the 20th through the 28th. I think we also have a a tractor pool down on the south end of the county kind of coinciding with that. I'd encourage folks to to go to to both. Um if you can fit that in,
um while you're at the fairgrounds, you know, take some time to to wander around and and look at the improvements that have happened there in the past year. um the board, the the the board president, the the manager out there with help of
of our county staff. Um the prisoners that work in cooperation with us. I mean, there's painting, there's new building faces, there's new pavement, there's new electrical. I mean, the place looks fantastic and I encourage everyone to go out and enjoy it and uh
pray for good weather. So, that's all I have. >> All right. Thank you, Commissioner Harvey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, so I guess me winning that eight billion dollars from my Nigerian cousin the other day on
the email didn't really work out, right? So I'm still here. Remember I brought that up and everybody Yeah, but I guess it didn't come to pass. Um, yesterday I did attend the Florida Rural Economic Development Association. I should have
reported that under the commission commissioner uh comments. Um, I'm actually back on that state board. I was on there before and then took myself off for someone else to come on that someone else has left. So, I'm back on that. That's a pretty robust board and um it's
at the World uh Equestrian Center down in Ocala. They put some new buildings there. There's going to be a rural summit that's going to happen in November. It's not going to compete with the Florida Association of Counties. So, I'd encourage everyone to be there. It's going to be a really, really good summit
this year. in November and I'll get you more details as that comes. Um, this Friday's busy GP opening. Um, we've been invited to that and as soon as that's over, as actually as quick as I can get out, I'm going be speaking at the town
of Enarkin. They have renovated the twotory old town hall there at Commonwealth and Francis Street and or Atlantic Avenue, I'm sorry. And what a tremendous they went out and found all kinds of old um items that can go back
in the building that looks like it was there from the beginning of time. And it really is a beautiful facility. So, if you're I know some people will be out of town, but when you get a chance to go to Analock and go out there because I remember as a young boy riding my horse
from Francis down the old Gainesville Highway and going out there for Fourth of July and that was a really, really good time and a long horse ride back to Francis as the night was ending. Do want to say a great job on County Road 315
South. Um, I tell you, the contractor is doing a tremendous job. They started actually past the school. Uh, they have already went to the county line and started coming back and they're at the deer farm. I went by there yesterday
morning. They had lights up. I think I went through that intersection about 6:45 and they were they were really going to town and getting that done. Um and also congratulations to the previous commissioner, the current commissioner in that district about getting those
millings put down on those dirt roads. Uh tremendous impact in that area. I have one complaint. I will tell you that you always have to have a complaint. Correct. Uh one guy wanted the road widened and I said, "Sir, you're five years late to the party. These decisions
are made." Well, it doesn't meet DOT standard. I said, "Well, DOT's paying for it. They approved the design, so it must meet DOT standard or they wouldn't have done it. So, um, but everybody wants a wider road, no doubt about it. But I think the job that that contractor
is doing is tremendous. And they're using a little foresight here, too, which is very unusual for contractors, I in this business, I will say. But, uh, they're not even going to do the school until spring break and then they're going to do right in front of the school where all the traffic's at. So, it's
just a breath of fresh air that we can work with these contractors and tell them what we need and see what they're doing. And madam chair, that is the end of my comments. Thank you very much. >> All right. Thank you, Commissioner Pollister, you're recognized. >> Um to
highlight what Commissioner Newbol said about the fair uh starting very the 20th. That's uh going to be a very busy week. Um that weekend is also as he said the tractor pulls which I understand haven't been here since 1979. That's going to be exciting should draw a lot
of people out that uh from all surrounding counties around. Um but the the fair is a big deal and um there have made great improvements in the property over there. It looks tremendous. Um they've got a good group over there um
calling the shots and making things happen. And I think uh it's a good board all together in place over there. Um Larry is uh Commissioner Harvey is also right. 315 is looking really good. Um I'm excited about that. That has been a
rough road that uh is it definitely needs some TLC. Um, I would like to um if we have any updates on our VA IT um design and construction property um moving forward over there,
can y'all give us any heads up? >> It it's still in design with the architect. We have not gotten any >> for the >> for the proposal. >> Okay. Um, also at two o'clock today, we're going to be having our uh workshop on the Fort Gates Ferry and hopefully
put this baby to bed or be bringing it forward for new and uh improvements for uh getting this thing back operational. I don't know what that answer is going to be yet, but it should be a good uh a good meeting. And those that can attend, I encourage you to do
so if you have some input on this. Um I think that's it for me, Madam Chair. >> Thank you. Um, a couple things. Um, first of all, I appreciate this board. Um, we, um, work together to get a lot of things accomplished with our staff. We couldn't do it without staff, but
but, um, we continue, as far as I can tell, moving things forward. Um, I want to discuss a couple things. Um, M. Miss Chadwick, you brought up a was it a 2015 structural report? Okay. As you know, there was a 2021 done after that. And so
I don't know what the 2015 would why you wouldn't be using the latest I guess but but either way we don't have the ability to unredact a report as you know that you can go and get that from the state or D or at least try to um there was money that was spent even after the
structural integrity report which listed this the Kurpatre dam as satisfactory and and overall satisfactory um structural which is the highest rating it can receive. I've said that multiple times. Um I can even give you the page it's on if you need to. Um anyway, and
money was spent by the state for the for the issues that were shown in that report and the money was spent to repair that in FD FD's budget in 2223. So as we all know, the Kurpatrick Dam and the fate of Rodman is in the state's
hands. It's not in the county's hands. It's up to the state. Um and so we have one week left. Well, actually is not quite when we went March 13th. It could be >> it could be extended, but on paper it looks like session will end March 13th,
but as we all know that we don't know. So, but other way either way it is up to the state to make the decision. It is their asset, not the counties. Um, we weighed in as much as we could and the citizens have weighed
in and sending me cards while I appreciate it probably needs to go to the states and so the decision makers on that. Georgia Pacific um is going to have a dedication this Friday uh for their um new structural not structure I
got structure on my mind for their new improvements out there. And um we're going to do that I think is it 9 9:00 on Friday out there. >> That's what I have. I have >> So the groundbreaking begins at 9. All
of you have um a few minutes before that so that you can accommodate both items. You you received an email that's for commissioners and our staff only. >> Okay. All right. >> But the groundbreaking is at 9:00. >> The groundbreaking is at nine. But the at the end of the day, I just want to say thank you publicly to Georgia
Pacific for their dedication to Putnham County. Um that's one of the second largest um plants in the country. And um I took somebody by there the other day um on Saturday. We were going to go pick up a little bit of furniture and I was telling this gentleman about it and he
says he said, "You mean to tell me they turn trees into toilet paper?" And I said, "Yes, sir, they do." And he was he didn't quite understand that process. Um but he um he was a little surprised. But anyway, uh George Pacific, we want to
thank them for their long-standing partnership with the county. Um they have a huge economic impact in Putnham Putnham County. Uh job creation, infrastructure improvements. They're a big tax base to our county and we I just want to go on record and say how much we
appreciate the fact that they're going to continue to be here and serve um Putnham County and and help our um county grow and and make great changes in Putnham County by investing in us. And they do a lot of things too for nonprofits and other other entities in
the county. And with that, I don't think I have anything else to bring in front of the um board. Is there anybody else has any more comments? All right, with that this meeting is adjourned and we will have a workshop at 2 o'clock. is Part: 2
very secure. for the thumbs up from the back. Good afternoon and welcome to the Putham County Board of County Commissioners special workshop to address Fort Gates Ferry. Today is Tuesday, March 10th. It is about 2:08. Um again, sorry for the
late little bit of lateness, but we got we wanted everybody to have an opportunity to get in the door. Um, if everybody could silence their phones, I would appreciate it. We're going to call the meeting to order. We'll have an invocation by uh, Commissioner Harvey, followed by the pledge of allegiance by Commissioner
Pelisir. Please rise if you're able to do so. >> Let us bow our heads. Gracious heavenly father, we thank you for today, a day we've never experienced before in our life. And, Father, as we go into this meeting, let us minds be clear. Let our
thoughts be directly from you. Let us gleam it directly from your throne room of the things that we need to understand today. Father, we thank you for our citizens in Putnham County that have come out to hear this this situation. And Father, we look forward to having dialogue. But Lord, let everything be
done indeently in and decent and in order, Father. And we thank you for that. We ask everything in your name. Amen. >> Amen. >> Please join me in the pledge. I pledge algiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic
for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. Uh before we get started, I will say um if you would like to speak, um there are blue cards in the back against the wall. You're welcome to fill
them out. Um this isn't as formal as the normal county commission meetings. However, we do want to maintain decorum and um we will maintain contor contor decorum and um civility. So there's no
personally attacking or yelling from the audience or doing anything like that. Um we're going to the purpose of this meeting is to have good dialogue, but we have to have an order to do it in. So that's that's that. Uh before we get started, um Commissioner
um Palisier, did you have any comments? you're the one who uh asked for this meeting. We have two presenters today. Uh before we get into anything else, but since you since you asked for this meeting, then I didn't know if you wanted to start. >> I'll be very brief. I have a few comments. >> Okay. >> Um it is in my district. U it does
travel across the St. John's River to District 1. Um so it's not the ferry to nowhere. Um I I see an importance of u us getting to the bottom of this and where we stand and ownership of the land and the ferry and grounds around it. So,
uh, I thought it was important that we finally put this, uh, item to bid either in a positive or a if depending on how you view it, negative way. But, um, I do want to come to some resolve that, uh,
best suits everybody. And, uh, I I think we can do so today in a timely manner. Um, we've u we've got some things to show you from the uh my perspective that went out and did a little research and um I think all of us have here a comment or two to make about the thing plus
those from the audience. So I want to hear from everyone. Thank you ma'am. >> Okay. At what time did you want to add your your whatever it is you're doing just further down. >> Uh it I guess if um Yeah. Yeah. I can go later. Sure. >> All right. So we have two we had four people that requested to be on the
agenda. Lester Roberts, Dale Jones, Travis Roberts, and Angie Wright. But, um, Travis and Angie are the two that want to do the presentations. Is that correct? Okay. If y'all want to come forward, um, you're welcome to do so. Uh, I think Travis
wants to start and then Angie would follow. And Lester Roberts or Dell Jones do not wish to do a presentation. Is that correct? Okay. You'll still have time for public comment. >> Um I have one in each copy of the My
name is Travis Roberts. >> Yes, sir. Just pull that to you so we'll have it. Yep. Thank you. >> Okay. Travis Roberts, 110 Yansancy Circle, Sassy, Florida 32189. Um do I give these to you >> just to Miss Ashley right there >> and she'll make sure we got them.
Thank you for letting me speak today. Um, I've been through going through this for eight years, okay? This has nothing some of the stuff I'm going to talk about has nothing to do with this county commission. Please do not take offense to it. >> Okay?
>> Just like in my business, I've had some people that didn't make wise decisions. Okay? D, as each one of you will see in your folder there, and I didn't have enough to make for everybody in here. There's been some questions about the barge, >> okay?
>> If we owned it, if we didn't own it, if the county does, I put a picture in there. And there was also some questions about fundraisers. The fundraisers, as you'll see on there's a couple pieces in here. It shows Dale and myself. In 2022, we were happy as all get out. I mean, we
were jumping up in the air like, you know, a little Irish jig. There's a picture of the barge. Too windy. Or not too windy, the barge. This thing is over a hundred years old. It is completely redone. There's the pictures. So, if there's any questions in anybody's minds. >> Okay.
>> Um, the >> Oh, did you And you said you own that. >> We own the barge. >> Okay. When you say we, you're meaning who? Is there like a legal entity or >> myself and Dale Jones? Okay. >> And we also own the names of the
historical Fort Gates Ferry, the Fort Gates Ferry, the Colonial. The state this year asked me if they could put it on the colonial register since they said it's 275 years old, older than the United States. Um
the Dale, Captain Dale has been running this thing for 28 years and there's never been an issue with his captain license. It is current. Insuranceancurances are still current. His Twick card is still current. As a matter of fact, it's all
till 2030. I did not put that in there because it's for public record. I didn't want him getting credit card frauded, but if you guys need to see it, more than happy to show you. He just got credit card frauded not long ago for five grand. So, >> but Mr. Jones would is the is the captain and would continue. What you're
saying is he would he's the captain. >> He is the captain. >> Okay. >> Right. The other captain, Richard Hackett, the other partner, passed away a couple years ago. So that's why he's not here today. >> Yes, sir. Thank you for explaining that. >> The
you know, anybody there's a woman named Cybil Lunging. Does that name ring a bell? In 1777 when Paul Rier rode out, she rode before him. She rode for 40 miles
where he only rode for 20. as history teaches us, which goes to show that 20 to 100 years from now, nobody's going to remember us. We don't know who our great great grandparents were. We don't know much about our society. The history has
been so jumbled up. The one thing that hasn't been jumbled up is Fort Gates Ferry. The thing that's been operating according to the state for 275 years since 177175. I want to see this thing 250 years from
now, still going 275 years. But what we do today is going to determine our tomorrow. The property has always been ran by prescriptive or proscriptive and it's there are the same words. They mean the same thing. Why that works, I don't
know. But as you'll see on the property deed over there, which is the second page, >> this is from the county tax collector. Okay? And it shows that this road has been being used for that on the tax scrolls.
And that this is from the tax collector's office. That's how they label road 29 on the west side. In the letter that was written to the lady who owns the property, it says southside. That came from Taylor Engineering years ago when Taylor Engineering came in. So
if there's any confusion, it is the west side or in your documents if you see south side that is the west side. The north side is the east side. I just want to clear that up. The um the ferry Dale's been doing that and it
takes a lot to go across that river. If you don't know what you're doing, you're carrying a couple cars. Years ago, the and you this is going to be on the next page. It looks like this. It's the history. FDOT did a had a company out of
Sarasota go through with all the barges and ferry landings crossings in the state of Florida. Turns out at the time in 2010 there was five. Right now there's only two that we can find according to FDOT. Now they did this because they wanted to know what the
environmental impact and how it saves lives. So they wrote this whole report in here. the report I put didn't put the whole page in there because it's like 80 pages. But if you go back where it shows in here,
it says that in 2010, and I'm not bringing this up to bring up old history, but on this page where it shows a tug and stuff, in 2010, now granted, this thing was written in 2012. Two years before this, in 2010, Putham
County was given $816,000 for to redo Fort Gates Fairy Landing. Now, if you go back and look, there was no grants for Drayton Island in 2010. But yet Drayton Island's things show
that there was funds co-mingled between Fort Gates and Drayton Island where a lot of the monies and this is not any of you guys in here. I want the audience to know that. This had nothing to do with this board of county commissioners. Not even Mr. Harvey, you've been on since
2015. Didn't even have to do with you way before you got here. So the thing with that is they wanted the impact and find out where the monies went. As of 2024, there's still over half a million dollars sitting in an FOD
account for Fort Gates Ferry. $216,000 of that was used. Now, in one of the meetings, there was a comment made that I have and my family have been receiving money from the county. Not I have never
taken one red scent from Fort Gates, not in a time of being a partner, not in time of volunteering, anything. So, I just want to clear that up because when you get a few thousand calls saying, "What did you do with the money? Did you steal it?" I just want to set that straight for the record. Never have I
taken a scent from them. Even though I'm a partner, I have put money into it. My thing is I want to see this thing done. We can't go back and get that money. Now, that money that was lost, how we got to this point was in a few years ago
after Hurricane Irma hit. And in this thing, it says that the letter that was written here, it says that the landings were destroyed due to storms and hurricanes. And that that is not true. What happened was if you look in here in
the pages, you'll see pictures of the landing in February of 2013, and you can see that both of the landings are rotted. At that point in 2013, instead of FDOT shutting it down, they went ahead and allowed the county
to reduce the tonnage weight on those landings. It went from 20 tons down and over the years to 15 tons all the way down to bottoming out at four tons. So, by the time Hurricane Irma got here, the landings were pretty much shot. Okay?
So, I we can blame it on the storms. I can blame it on whatever I want to, but in the end, it doesn't matter. The things decayed. They were rotted. They hadn't been done since 1960 or 1968 when Glattus hit and it was fixed in 10 days. When I came into the meetings and I got
involved with Fort Gates because I had ridden on this thing when I was a little kid and I was always fascinated by it that and one Hon Island down in Dan. I've always loved boats and fairies and not the fairies that fly around just to clear that up. Just the fairies that are
water. I love water. But they when I came in a few years ago, granted this is for you guys, there was a thing to do the landing for $4 million. And I looked at it and I'm like, well,
that's kind of nuts. This is a 18 by8 landing made of wood. Governor Rick Scott had written a letter saying that Fort Gates Ferry had to he said it needed to remain historically correct and that the landing should be made out
of wood. For some reason, the county at that time decided to be a good idea to not listen to that and paid a company, Taylor Engineering, out of Jacksonville, $250,000 for a drawing, which I thought was a lot
of money because I've had houses built. Drawings don't cost $250,000. Not for this thing. My thing at the time and still has been that we need to save taxpayers dollars. Even though this grant was for $4 million,
um the residents of Putnick County are still responsible for 20% of that, which is going to be $800,000 and about $11,000 per resident. I got with a couple of the county commissioners. You were there. We
got with Jeff Ross, Terry Turner. Terry Turner respected the fact that he said, "I wouldn't take that ferry across the river if you gave me a brand new truck." Okay, I can drive around quicker than you can swim. I made him a $10,000 bet that I could jump in and swim it before
he could get drive around. He never took me up on it. Wish he had, but I always respected Commissioner Turner because I knew exactly where he was coming from. So, we sat down. We had workshop after workshop after workshop. And I asked the county at that time
instead of spending because you're not going to be able to justify spending $4 million on a 16 by 16 ramp. One of the other commissioners at the time and I'm not going to mention names. So we can use stuff we can use the extra money on other projects. And I pointed out to him
that our Mr. Nemits, okay, it's all in public record at the time was told by the federal government and by the state to quit co-mingling funds with Drayton Island and that is up for public knowledge. It's anybody can print it
off. At the time they went ahead and said, "Well, we're still going to go ahead for this grant." They wanted $200,000 for a sign that said Manatee wake zone. Okay. I asked him at the time, I said, "Can I
find if I can find and get it done cheaper, will you allow the citizens to do that?" They said, "Sure, we'll do it." I drove to Tallahassee. I drove to Lake City. Got with Roger Lou at F DOT. He agreed at the time if we dropped it back one board, it would no longer be a
bridge. The other side is owned by Putman County. Maybe the property underneath isn't, but that landing is. I did a video a few weeks ago. You guys might not like it, but it was the truth. I showed the landing on there and I told people, don't take my word for it. Look it up yourselves. There's a bridge
number on there and it is Putnham County, supposed to be maintained by Putman County. Now, you guys weren't there, so I can't hoot and holler you for not keeping it maintained. But the fact is, just like with any business, the ball got dropped.
So when I asked the county commissioners if I could see if we could do a different procurement route, they said, "Sure. How much do you think it would cost?" I said, "50 to 60 grand." At that time it would have cost us about 45,000. But COVID came in, prices went through
the roof, and we wound up getting it done for around 60 grand, a little less than that. But that was a far cry from the $4 million that was supposed to be done or even $250 or even a hundred,000. But the taxpayers did not get stuck with
a big bill. Instead of $11,000 a piece, they got they getting nailed for about 75 cents from what I've read and what I've seen. Now, this landing in Fort Gates Ferry, it is if if I lo if we lose
it tomorrow, how's it going to affect me? Probably very little. I haven't seen much of my grandkids. I haven't got to go on vacation in 10 years. So, it's not going to really affect me. I've mentioned in several county
workshops that if a fire hits on 19, this is a public safety thing that there there's going to be trouble if the people get cut off from 19, unless they have a boat, they've got to jump in the river. Over the years, Fort Gates Ferry, how important is it to the local
community? Is it just a historical fact that nobody cares about? Besides Paul Newman filming a commercial off of that thing for Nissan that they did, the Japanese did not allow or Chinese did not allow them to film anywhere in the United States. You know
where the one place they picked was? Fort Gates Ferry. Why? I have no idea. But Paul Newman filmed a commercial there in 1982, which Car and Driver magazine, if you guys looked on the Putman Way or on um the Fort Gates Ferry page, you can look at that video. And
the guy even went back and did a follow-up video and talked about how great Putman County is for having a ferry year that Paul Newman went across. Besides the ferry or Paul Newman being there in the 1980s, the University of Florida along with the fish hatcheries
and stuff went out and they built birch baskets and oak baskets. And some of you have been here all your lives. You might remember it. I wasn't here during the 80s. So, but the reason, one of the reasons we're the bass capital of the world is because Fort Gates Ferry did
not charge a thing. I have the captain's logs and this is how I know it. They went up and down the river with students from the University of Florida and put these baskets out and made estuaries because when the state had come through and the county, they sprayed um the
shrimp ga grass along the edge of the rivers. So it destroyed the estuaries because of these birch baskets and stuff and Fort Gates Ferry dropping these baskets all up and down the river. We are now the bass capital of the world. We have some of the best bass fishing
and you guys waste your time up here. Go down to south on the south part of the river. That's where the fish are at. But you know besides that if there's been number of times when the forest has caught on fire and we have the best firefighters here and they should be
thanked every day for their service but one day they're not going to catch those fires just the other day and I believe Mr. Walt might have been over there when the um fire lightning started and there was a brush fire that happened there.
Luckily, our firefighters got it out. But what if they didn't? What's their escape route out of there? There is no escape route except for Fort Gates Ferry. A number of times, Captain Dale has drove across the river and got people's I always call him Farmer Dale now instead of Captain Dale because he
goes over there and rescues his chickens and cows and horses. We're over on the other side trying to help get these things off. But that that could have all been gone. The things we take for granted, birth certificates, our kids pictures, everything. these people were bringing these out there.
If that happens again, they and they're cut off from 19, they're done. Unless they have boats, but that little bitty boat ramp there is not going to do a whole lot. And half the people over there don't even have boats that live on the water.
But, you know, we had a plane crash there, a few planes now, three to be exact. A doctor just was flying out of there a couple years ago. Plane crashed, went in the water. Fort Gates was right over there and the FAA for some reason got
there. We called them. When they called 911, they wanted to speak to us. Is it contaminating the water? Yes, it was. Can you get it up out of the water? Yes, we can. We got the barge and hooked up and pulled that plane out and kept millions and millions and millions of
gallons of water from being contaminated with jet fuel or airplane fuel. That saved it. But the the history of this thing, some of the people that are here grew up staying down there at the Gateway Fish Camp going across the
river. I talked to a lady yesterday. She had been married there in 1941. She got married there and had nothing but praise. I tried to get her on a radio show last night and I couldn't. I'm not here to jump up and down and scream.
I'm just here we're We don't make really any money. When you take that old boat and you push a car or two across the river for 10 bucks, by the time you get across there and back across, you've already used up two gallons of fuel. you
know, at gas right now at five 10 bucks, you know, five bucks a gallon. The stuff we run in, it's a little better, a jet 1A fuel. And I don't want to see this piece of history lost. My son is sitting back here. He's 13. He wants to drive the ferry one day. Now, that's going to
be a problem for somebody in the county commission or or for our families because I'm not related to him, but his grandkids wants to drive it across. They can figure that out after I'm dead. I don't care then. But I have a book that I've been working on. It's Putman County. I've been a
writer for 42 years. I've got several books on the market. They all do well. The Putman way from the videos that I've been doing about Port Gates and showing the history and the people that have died waiting on it to get done. Dale's mom was Captain Dale's mom would sit out
there. She just passed away two years ago. Every day she would sit out there. She would tell stories of when kids would paddle across the river and come over there and she would sell them those little root beer candies, but she would always take the money and stick it back in their jacket or give them a drink and put the money back. But that was her
thing. She died not seeing it come to fruition. My brother, a lot of people, there's plaques that we let people put on the dock out there. There's probably eight or 10 of them that people that's where they wanted their stuff from and where they wanted to be laid to
rest. Of course, we can't bury him there, so we allowed them to put a plaque there. For 28 years, Captain Dale has been pushing that barge across the river without an incident. For 270 years, that place has been used as a naval outpost, as a British
outpost. Colonel William Gates was a British soldier. He got commissioned by George Washington to go fight in battles. He went out to Texas and fought for United States. But where did he start? started here before Florida was even a state.
And this thing 500 yards behind me is an Indian mound from 1250 AD. That's that's how much rich history we have here. We have a boat that's sunk right over here by Rotor Haven's Boy Ranch. That the first and only steelhole
boat sunk on US soil by US citizens. when we have the kids come from the schools and Miss Gilliard that was the principal down at the elementary school there says when is it going to be open again they would like to get the kids down there because this stuff they don't
teach in schools and they damn sure don't teach it about Pman County and on the national scene these are all hidden gems that we have here that our children should know and with so much history being destroyed every day we need to keep this alive you know why it's been
running this long and why it hasn't taken. I don't know. I keep asking myself why why why can't it be just up and running again. We're not I'm not going to be a millionaire off of it. I want to keep it for the history so that my grandchildren can go down there. I
have a brick. We're going to use Watch the video of me doing it about granny and my brother and them. I have a brick. We're doing brick fundraisers to help with some of the grounds and keeping up the maintenance and stuff. And my brick says me in loving remembrance of me.
Nobody else. People 100 years from now are going to be looking at that brick going, "Who was that?" Me is these people back here. The people that have to take the ferry across. 25 people take that ferry a day that work that live on
the other side of the county. This ferry isn't just used for the historical or You know, for people that like to see a tourist thing, these are people that work live in other counties that come here to work. The people that come to play golf
at the Oaks Golf Course down there that that from over there, we had 29 of them. No, it was more than that. It was 49 people came over to play golf from the other side and they drove around to do a golf tournament to help us out. There's 29 people bring money to this
county. There's more than that. There's people and that's just 25 people a day work here that use a bar to go across. There's a lady out here and uh Donna, she takes the bar across the river every day because her mom and
her dad her dad has a bad heart and her mom has Alzheimer's. She has to be over there every day. But instead of taking her 18 minutes to get across the river and to her mom and dad's house, it's an hour and a half. if our EMS, our forestry, and in these
letters, and I didn't give you guys, I can email them to you. The forestry said that it has put a big hurting on them because when a fire breaks out on the West Bank, the East Bank takes them an hour and a half to get their brush trucks around. Those things only use I
mean, they only go like, 45 miles an hour with all the water in them. They can jump on the ferry, go across the river, refill, and be there in 18 minutes. The ambulances that can't get back there, you know, there's one lady when we were over on the other side of the river a
couple weeks ago. She couldn't even get an ambulance back there to take care of her. So, they finally showed up, I think three hours later after she was already at the hospital. But, it needs to be back open. it it's a for public safety, for people, for the economy, and to
preserve the history. So, and I'm sure other people were going to have stuff to say. And like I asked you guys on the air, please be respectful. If anybody has a right to complain and scream, it would be me. I've been doing this for eight years. If I'm not doing it, be respectful this
time. So, but do you guys have any questions or >> are there any Are there any questions for Mr. Roberts? >> Not at this time. >> You You said you have a letter from the forestry. >> Uh, yes, you have. >> All right. Please make sure and provide
that to to us whenever you get a chance. >> We'll leave it. I can get them to make copies of >> Yeah, that'd be great. Okay. >> All right. >> Thank you for your time. >> Thank you, Miss Miss Angie. >> No, thank you. I can do it.
All right, give me a second, please. Bye. Pocals can use them. Angie Wright, 114 Yansy Circle, Satsuma, Florida. Um, I came today. I was going to bring a presentation and I think I can't say anything more than Travis. I mean, he said the most of it. You guys have seen
the paperwork. Never once said we blamed you guys. We've just asked for answers, asked for someone to hear us, someone to listen. But I come here today because I have sat there for the last 17 years that I've been there. Well, no, excuse me, 28 because I'm I came in 2017. So,
it's actually been longer than I realized. But I have watched my father who raised us that you're a man of your word, a person of your your word is your handshake. It's who you are. >> And I have watched my father go from holding his head up high to holding to
just giving up hope. That's one of the hardest things you'll ever see. And it's not just my dad. It was Travis. You guys think that he's frustrated, but it's more than that. He has fought when everybody fought the fought against him. He stood up for what he believed in. And
that's what I see because all of us believe the same thing. We just don't always know how to voice our opinion. I stand here with all of these people. I have watched tears from people that don't know how to come to you guys. Because if you're shutting Travis down, then you're not going to hear them
either. All we want, all we're asking is what's right to please help us get it back open. We've already done the one side. Travis and I have worked so hard. We've gone to FDOT. We've got the drawings done. We've done everything together to help this county. And we're offering our assistance once again
because it's done once before, it can be done again. And that's all we're asking. We're offering our help to make things easier, to make things cheaper. But when when you guys talk about the the the Fort Gates Ferry, it's all of you as well. It's not just all of them. It's
not just me. It's all of us together. We are the community of Fort Gates Fairy. We should be trying to preserve it and save it and make sure all these people in the future have the have the ability to go back to it. And if I've said anything out of turn that upsets anybody, I really truly ask for
forgiveness. But when when when I look at sometimes people I'll walk and I'll say hi to some commissioners and I feel like I don't exist and I know all of these people have put their voice in and feel the same way. You know what Jesus came in a robe and sandals and he
preached the multitudes. So I don't know who anybody could look down at anybody or how anybody can make anybody feel like that. But that is why everybody has come the frustrations we have. And we ask you to please understand that that's all they are is not being feeling like we've been heard. >> Yes, ma'am. That's why we're having this meeting today.
>> Thank you for your time. >> Yep. Thank you. I do. Um Mr. Roberts, if you'll come back up. I know this is a passionate issue. We do. But we do need to try not to clap or boo. I had to say that this morning. No clapping, no booing. Try not to. Um what is it you're We're just going to get
down to the brass right here. What is it you are asking specifically from the county? Because there's a lot of layers to this, right? So when at the end of the day >> there there's different layers. What I would like to see >> is to forget about the grants. >> Okay. >> Okay. We can raise if the county will
allow me it won't cost the taxpayers anything. I'll be happy to do, you know, I got voted 19 times best ribs in the state of Florida. Here's the funny thing. I'm allergic to pork. I've never tasted them. Mr. Suggs has been up there
and had them at um Hitchcock's. You know, that was to get the barge and the boat redone. Of course, the boat. One of the reasons why I never come and said to the county um that I wanted them to pay for the
barge that the landing came across, and I'm being fair here, when the landing came acart during Hurricane Irma and punctured the barge the attorneys had contemplated, and the reason I keep saying attorneys, nine of
my best friends are attorneys. We all went to high school together. And this may no disrespect to you, sir, but I don't like attorneys. I don't know anybody likes attorneys. But what I would like to do is see that to save the taxpayers money. I said we
saved them $11,000 before. That wasn't me that saved them. County commissioners had to vote on that. But we can raise the money through brick sales. There's all kinds of stuff that we can do to get the monies up to rebuild the landing to get this thing back up and going where it doesn't isn't a burden on the
taxpayers. 60 grand is not a whole lot. I mean, we're going to bring in more and tourism tax than that. >> So, you're wanting the west side rebuilt. That's what your ask is. >> Well, we can raise it outside or if the county if they want
>> Okay, but is that I'm just trying to get down to what exactly you're So, that's what you're wanting. Is that done? And then are you're not wanting an operational agreement. You're not wanting repairs to your boat. You're want once the west side is done or southside, whatever you want to refer to it as. I'm just trying to get down to
the to to what we're asking. >> What personally I would like to see, but I would leave it up to the citizens is that Dale and I take over on the thing because he's the best captain for the job. Years ago, they were trying to take Drayton Island and Fort Gates Ferry and
make it as one unit. But then the lady down there said, "It can't be done because one, we don't own the landing at Fort Gates. We don't own the barge. We don't own the boat." Plus, then she came back and said, "Well, as a matter of fact, I can't do it. That's
seven days a week. We can't run four over here and three over here. So, it wouldn't be feasible for that." >> Well, Travis, I know why you got I know why you got a show because you're a talker, man. You're a talker. >> I do radio. >> I know you got a show for a reason. But for eight years, in fairness to me, I've
gotten three minutes at a time >> and had a lot to say and a lot of solutions that would save the county. >> What I would like to see >> is if they would turn that the Fort Gates Ferry over to Dale and myself, give us a lease for our state lease till
2044. Give us a lease till 2044. >> Who state leases till 2044? >> The um Upland lease. You guys only have You guys have one lease on there. There's two leases to that to Port Gates Ferry. >> We have the sub with the submerged. >> You guys have a submerged and then there's an upland lease.
>> And the upland lease is with who? >> With the state of Florida for which side of forestry >> for the forestry side? The road >> um the road coming in and the property from basically 15 ft from the water up the rest of that where Gateway Fish Camp
is sitting at was all originally under state lease until 2044. Okay. All right. So, what you're asking today or what you're what you would like to see out of this is that the the south sidewest side, the forest side be repaired, but
you would be willing to take that over as far as if we're able to work something out um in a contract that says you can you can have it, run it, whatever. Is that what you're looking for? >> Right. >> Okay. All right. >> And let us keep the $10. I mean, you know, So we
>> but you're not asking for the county to pay you and and I'm not being again you were very direct with me. So I'm going to be very direct with you and I hope you respect that. At the end of the day you're not looking for a contract from the county that says we're going to pay you this much money to operate your ferry. You're asking to say you want to run your own ferry. It's either it
either makes it or it doesn't. Is that what you're saying? Well, that and I would like the county if the county is going to continue to own the landings is that they're not going to be responsible for repairs of it, but that they help cover the insurance, at least half of
the insurance on the landing if it belongs to the county. We will cover the other half. That's what originally the $1,200 that was being given to Fort Gates Ferry. That's what that was for was to cover insurance in case because the county had went from being insured by an
insurance company to being self-insured. And then the state came back and said, "No, you have to have maritime insurance, which is a a um a company, I believe, Mr. Ar, you were here at the time. I believe it's out of Boston because the county pays the premium to
them and then we were picking up after the premium was paid of $4,500 or $5,500. Then Fort Gates, we were paying the other half, which came out to a little over $1,200. When they came down and saw the damages that were there and that
they were condemned, they jacked the rates up. >> Okay. All right. Uh I think we have some questions or some we're going to be asking um staff, but that's what I wanted to get from you was what the ask was for today. That's what your ask is. >> Yes, ma'am. And also I would like to
make a suggestion that instead of trying since we don't have a whole lot of money in this county um is that instead of wanting to purchase or lease the other property over there since it's been run through prescriptive rights is maybe get
with the lady and ask her maybe if she would be allow up to giving use to the ferry for just for that as long as they maintain the road, which the forestry already does that, >> but that none of her property be
encroached on. >> Okay. All right. >> Just the road be used only the road that there's that's an easement. It's 30 ft 15 from the or 30 feet from the center of the road to the left, 30 feet to the right. It's always been that way. Well, since 1939 when they moved the road from
a wetland over to that spot. >> Okay. All right. Hang hang tight. Um, I wasn't really into commissioner comments yet, but I was going to go to our staff first if you is that okay, commission, too. >> Okay.
>> All right. Um, Mr. Commando, a couple questions that we're going to have um on this issue. Obviously, we have the eastnorth side, which the countyy's already uh repaired, and um then we have the west
side that's not been repaired. um what what kind of what can we do here if based on what he's asking for and if you have any additional information you want to bring regarding the different layers of this I we'll welcome your comments. >> I appreciate that. Thanks. This is kind
of a team sport with the four of us over here just because there's so many different layers that we've been looking at. I mean I I think the first thing is to have the legal access and the ability to to actually make any sort of repairs. As the commission knows, we've reached out to the property owner uh for part of
land that we would need. But the other part is we would need a lease with the state in order to um in order to do any sort of improvements and to continue or to reestablish the repairing rights that would allow the the landing on the side
of it. So you are you're saying we do not our submerged land lease is no longer >> that's that's my understanding from looking at the leases. Yeah. The easements. >> So the submerged land lease is expired. >> That's yeah I don't have anything that
shows that it extends past that. So >> and that expired when I >> think it was November 2021. >> Okay. So it's been a few years. >> Yes. >> And is that on for both sides? Is it for both sides? >> I believe
>> that's just this. >> Yeah, if we can just stick to Waka and Ocala side. >> Is on the Waka side? >> Yes. >> But do we still have a submerged land lease on the Ocala side? >> I if we have one, I haven't seen one.
>> Okay. So, you're saying they're both expired, >> right? >> Okay. All right. Do you have anything contrary to that? >> Um, no. They've both been expired. She's correct. All right. So, we can agree on something. Yay. We're making progress. >> Um, okay. So, then beyond that, um, on
the on the, um, we'll lack aside. Do we have a map? Is is do we have any maps that we wanted to Can we pull up a map for everybody? So, >> I have one if you need them. >> Yeah, I think we have a visual one that we can we can get there. >> I'll go to this. >> Okay.
>> All right. Um, one of the other things that the state required back before you guys took over is that once the ferry was open that or before the ferry could open back up is that a brass plaque or like the
one that shows it as Bartman Trail, Mr. S shaking his head. Yes, he remembers. um the state and historical society of Florida, the 1930 in 1939 they set up a historical
uh group to take care and oversee this. Their one thing out of Tallahassee was that they put up a plaque there that tells the historical value of Port Gates, the date it was established, which they said we've already went over
that. And I had also made the thing to them at that time is that the county commissioners that were involved in it at that point that they be recognized on the plaque on this placard that's got to be three foot by three foot that they put each and every one of you guys'
names on there because then history shows it. You guys are going to be the ones that save it or lose it. >> And I only thought that was fair. I don't want my name on it. I don't care if it's on it. So, okay, >> that was the other thing that the state had required before it could be open in
a grand opening. >> All right. And and your business and you're a you're have a a legal business entity. It's not a nonprofit. It's a legal for-profit business. >> It's an LLC. >> Okay. It's an LLC >> and you can find it on Sunbiz. It'll be
under Travis Roberts and Dale Jones or Dale Jones and Travis Roberts. There's four different names. >> What's the name of it? Port Gates >> historical the historical Port Gates Berry and Gateway Fish Camp. >> Okay.
Now, the one thing that might help you guys on the other part of the as far as the insurance on the land up top there and even on the submerged land lease. When I got with all nine of my rocket scientist attorney friends, they
suggested that any historical sites, not just there, but any historical sites that are in Putin County have a sign put up on it and it relieves the county of any lawsuits if somebody walks on there and trips and breaks their ankle. I have
not seen one of those signs around. >> Well, that would be nice. We put those things everywhere. And because they're auto tourism, look it up under the auto tourism. Angie, do you have the >> Yeah, I think there's some there's additional requirements by state historic lands that have to go through
that designation approval process. I don't know that it relieves anyone of liability, but >> well, under the statute, I forgot what it is. We've got it. I >> I'll tell you what, today's purposes, that's kind of a second third tier priority for what you're trying to
accomplish, right? >> Okay. All right. Is there do you have anything else you wanted to add, Mr. Commando, while we're waiting on a map? >> Probably. I I think some of them are going to be in relation to what the commission's questions are. >> Okay. Does any of the commissioners have questions for Mr. Commando?
>> I I do, Madam Chair. >> All right. Thank you, >> Mr. Commando. >> Yes, sir. >> You said the uh submerged water lease expired in 21. >> That's my understanding. There were there were a number of easements in the ability to use those properties um that
expired. >> Is that a big deal to to reestablish those leases or is that just a formality to get them or do you >> I think it's more than a formality. I think it requires a conversation with FD and I don't know what conditions of any
they would have as as uh requirements for a future. That that would be a stumbling block for sure that we need to get those reestablished. >> It would be. Yes, sir. >> Okay. Question for you, Mr. Roberts. When I talked to you Sunday when you called me, you said you were going to go meet and talk with the lady from
California. >> Mhm. >> Where is >> That's why I was saying if you guys ask her nicely, she would probably just let you use the land because it's always been in prescriptive rightway.
um that she doesn't care. >> I mean I mean you can sit there and say that but we can't use that. I mean you got to have we got to have something like >> her. But that's why I said if you guys could reach out to her and just ask her if she would be willing to let you use the lease. >> Yeah, that's what we've done.
>> Yeah. Um I don't know if this is the time or place, but I would like for Mr. Commando to read the letter uh that we wrote to the lady and then her response if we could if this is the right time. If not, we'll sub postpone public record. I think did this gentleman want
to speak? I It's okay. Come on up. >> I just don't want anybody yelling from the audience. So, if you'll just come up from the podium and and and speak, that'd be great. Come up to the pod. >> I don't want to say a whole lot except that the lady that owns the land is here. >> That's what we're asking.
>> Well, Miss Belinda, she doesn't want to talk. >> Okay. She doesn't have to talk, but she's here. >> Yes. >> Okay. She doesn't She doesn't want to talk. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Bring it on. That's what the workshop's for.
>> Hi, my name is Sher Austinine. >> I live on Belinda's land. >> I need everybody to be quiet for a second. Yes. Yes, ma'am. >> I live on the Ocala side where the ferry lands. >> Okay. Um, number one, the letter that you sent was very vague.
Um, it's our understanding that you're only interested in the submerged water lease underneath the ferry apparatus and the boat ramp area. Is that correct? >> Well, the submerged land has to be with the state. So, that has I don't believe
that has anything to do with the land owner. >> But, Linda does not own >> We can start with That's not correct. >> Okay. >> The land That's not what the letter said. >> All right. So, let's pull up. >> What did the letter The letter said? They were interested in purchasing or
leasing her land on 101 and 104, >> right? Which is >> that's her entire piece of property. It's not just the land that the ferry landing's on. >> You point to 101 and 104. >> We've got households there. There's four mobile homes on her entire property. Uh
there's people living there. There always has been. and the ferry apparatus and the boat ramp is not included in her property through whether you want to call it right away of occupation or prescriptive or prescriptive rights
whatever for as long as the ferry's been operating. They've never had to ask her permission or anything because she doesn't own that uh road, the ferry or the boat ramp. She owns land on either side of it. >> So So
The the question is when you come down the you don't have to go over on her property. We don't have a survey. You're saying we don't have to go when somebody gets on and off of that at that location that you don't have to go on her private property at all. You're you go from the National Forest Road straight onto the
ferry. >> Straight onto the ferry. You don't her land is on either side. She's never had anything to do with the ferry. Never had to give permission. never, you know, they they they totally in her surveys, the surveys are on this side of the
road, on this side of the road. They're left out completely. And anything you can find countywise or otherwise says by right away by occupation or by prescriptive rights. They've not ever had anything to do with that land. Their
land is on either side. You don't have to cross it or anything to get to the ferry. So, she's kind of confused as to why she's even involved in this. >> Sure. Okay. This is why we're having this discussion. Um, and and it's because we ask I mean we asked the question. I mean, it's not staff's fault
either. >> We ask the question. So, Commissioner Commando, >> right? So, we keep talking about prescriptive or prescriptive rights and Mr. Roberts is correct. They mean the same thing. And it's generally a concept of adverse possession. If you and the
three terms of art are if you openly, notoriously, and continuously um own a piece of property or I'm sorry, act as though you own a piece of property, >> then over a certain period of time, then it becomes yours. >> The the one caveat that's not included
in the letter that I think was written a few years back by the Hein Law Firm was that you cannot adversely possess government property. So with the federal easement that was then later transferred to the Division of State Lands, you can't gain prescriptive rights over a
piece of property that's owned by the state. So that doesn't solve all the problems. >> Well, it it solves the problem of her not being involved in it at all. She doesn't own that land. I I don't understand why she's even involved in this at all. It sounds like you have a
problem with the state. Maybe >> we have multiple problems. That's kind of what we're talking But I mean, but Belinda is is she doesn't own the property that the ferry apparatus sits on or the boat ramp is on. She's on either side of it. Always has been.
>> I understand you've said that. >> I I don't understand why y'all need to even ask her anything, you know, about the ferry. She wants to support the ferry, you know. >> Can you zoom in on this? >> So, I I work for the commission and the direction I got from the commission was to reach out to the property owner to
ask about her interest in either leasing or selling. So that's what we did. >> Scroll down. >> Scroll over. >> Can I can I interject, please? >> Madam Chair. >> Yes. >> Okay, let's get to the long and the short of this. She doesn't think she own it owns it. Doesn't want to own it. We
feel like she may want may own it. >> Can we just create a document where she seeds the property over to us so we have legal ownership of the property that she says she doesn't own? >> But the property that's being described is owned by the state. But there's 15
feet that that you said that shield >> go to the end where the where the actual landing is. >> Correct. Can she can we create a document that seeds that 15 ft over to create one contiguous piece of land from the forest road to the submerged land
lease that we will potentially acquire and be done with this. >> I mean, we can >> I kind of thought that was the way it was already set up. >> Well, if either it is or it isn't, but we can make that happen is what I'm asking for. So we can get to the end of this. >> Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. She just basically wants to be left out of it because she's
never had any decision in the very end. >> And if that gets her out of it by creating a document because it's still in question, but at that point it seeds it over. Would that be acceptable? >> Well, we'd have to if you could write put that in writing asking >> specifically what you're asking for
because the letter that you sent her was very vague. It just mentioned 101 and 104 and would you be interested? I understand that and that's what we're here to do is kind of air these things out. But >> Commissioner Alexander, >> the this will clear it up quite a bit.
>> If we knew the exact width of Forest Road 29, what the forest road forestry people say their road width is. That'll clear it up. I went out yesterday >> with Mr. Richie. We shot some video. We took some measurements and they were they're basically there's a a boat
landing and a a docking facility, not a bridge, a docking facility there side by side. >> If it's within the bounds of that Forest Road 29, then it will not concern her whatsoever. >> Exactly. And >> but I don't know the width of Forest Road 29. >> If you look on the survey thing, they
have a 50 foot uh >> if that be the case, it would it doesn't concern her at all. Then in my in my opinion, >> that's what we've been saying. >> I'm not Mr. Commando, >> right? So the re part of the reason why is because understand that with the state or with an easement use lease from
the state for part of that property they require us also have what is called sufficient uplands interest and it does exceed out into that property. >> I don't understand what you just said. >> Okay. We have to show that we have
access to some of that property in order for the state to then lease us. As the commissioner asked before, is this an easy task to just get a lease or get an easement agreement with the state? No, they have other requirements for us as well. >> But for us to conform to what the state
requires, we have to have a certain portion to contain that area and that may it may bleed over into her land. Correct. >> Correct. And that was the conversation back in 2020. >> Correct. So again, that goes back to the question. Would
I I can't remember her name, and I don't mean to be rude because I tried. >> That's okay. >> Yes, ma'am. Miss Sherry answered anything. >> Would the person you're representing be open to signing a document allowing us to do that because she seems to be in favor of that so we can move forward
with this process? Number one, if you could put that in writing, let her have a lawyer look at it, make sure everything's on the up and up. But it would be better if we didn't need that because I still don't see how she can
give you permission to use something she doesn't own. >> Okay, I think we got I think we understood that. Okay. Um, thank you for coming up. I'm >> Okay, so you will somehow put it in writing what you want. because we're
still kind of confused as to what you want from her >> and you know we can't even show it to a lawyer to meet back with you until we know exactly >> what is it and >> and you had you referenced a survey uh Travis have a survey of that area like
not a not a plat map but an actual survey. Is there a survey? Does somebody have a survey of that area? >> I have one from 92 I think. >> Okay. It might be that we just need to sit down and look at that. >> Yeah. Yeah. I have I have them with us as a >> Okay. All right, >> look at that. >> Okay.
>> And I wasn't trying to be contentious. We just our goal is to find a resolution for this. Mr. Travis has been working on it for eight or 10 years. And um I've only been off in an office a little over a year, but you know, Travis has voiced his opinion. The commissioners have
heard it. Larry's heard it for many years. And I I would like to finish it up and figure out what we got to do to move forward. Either we can finish it or we can't. >> Well, we we would like that, too. >> Yes, ma'am. Belinda, the land holder there. She She's not the hold up. She
never has been. She has no horse in this race. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> We have somebody here from the US Forest Service that like to speak. No, not you, Mr. Turner. Let me get the Forest Service lady behind you. >> All right. Listen, I know how you are. >> Can I say something real quick that
might help out? >> Sure. in 1985. This is one of the documents that I had that I had given the county before that showed that in January, I believe, I don't have my glasses on. And uh 1995
and 1992, the state set that easement just for the ferry. So >> on the on the Ocala side, >> I'll get some copy on the Ocala side on West Bank. I'll get copies of made. And the reason I got these >> because of her. >> Okay. All right. Come on up. I'm not
with the forest service. I'm a volunteer with the forest. >> Okay. Well, okay. >> And and I'm on the list to speak, but I just had a little suggestion to solve this impass. I have a survey made of the property you're exactly referring to and if it's acceptable to owner of the two
lots on each side, she can sign a quick claim to Yeah. that particular parcel and say, "I don't know if I have any rights, but if I have some, they're yours." >> Right. I think that's where we were getting there. Yes, ma'am. I think that's where we were headed with that. But but let's go back to legal counsel.
Um I have a question. Can we just give Mr. Roberts like whatever ownership the county owns? Can we just like surplus it and and I mean what's our process? Because I just assume the county
if Mr. If if there's a the historical Fort Gates Ferry wants to own run it and own it. I I mean I don't necessarily from my perspective have a problem with that, but I don't I mean what's the
advantage? I guess let's talk about a couple things. Let's talk about a couple things. So Mr. Grimes, I'm going to pick on you. I got your attention from the is there truly a a need and I know there that Mr. um Robert spoke
several times about safety. Have you ever put a ambulance or firetruck on that ferry? >> Our current fire trucks or ambulances will probably not go on the ferry. >> Okay. >> Because of the length of the tailboards and the way they're designed anymore, the length between the I mean our
ambulances are just that much longer and we really struggle. The water's got to be 100% right um in order for them to load and even get on Drayton Island today. And I'm we I I have never um involved in fire rescue for over 20 something years in the county have ever
put one of our fire apparatus of an engine or an ambulance. Now, I'm not saying a brush truck won't go, but an engine or an ambulance to go do structural protection on on the um west side or the Ocala side. We've never done. >> Okay. And in your opinion, is there when
we when the statement was made there's no escape route except for the Fort Gates Ferry on the 19 on the Okala side? What's your thoughts on that? >> Well, there's probably a lot of truth to that. If they get cut off on force road 29 to get out, I mean, there is no other way other than the river. Um, I don't
know that the ferry is going to haul what you said six cars at a time across. I mean, we're going to have to do an operation. I mean, the sheriff's office has four or five boats. The fire rescue has four or five boats. I mean, across the county. Um, the sheriff's got a couple helicopter. I mean, we would get
people off of the off of there the safely as quick as possible. Um, but I don't I mean, I can't predict something that would happen down there either. >> Sure. Sure. >> Um, but I mean, we'd had to come up with a plan real quick. Um, but we all have apparatus staged along the river um that where we could be there in a few
minutes. Um, I sure wouldn't put a truck to try to go save the side from the the we lack aa side to try to get to the for side with any amount of speed. I mean, Mr. Roberts, how quick can the ferry get across? Right. Um, can it get across any faster than I can send a truck down Highway 19?
>> Depends on where it's at. >> Correct. I mean, which is probably going to be about the same amount of time whether I'm sending units from town or units from the south portion of the county. >> Um, just never had to run through that opportunity. I mean, I hope and pray it never does happen that we have to do that, but Um the fire zone that it's
actually contained in is actually the response is out of the south side of Palatka. Um so that's it's it's a long ride. I mean it's truly is from the amount of citizens down there. I mean Salt Springs is what we call for our mutual aid would come out of Salt
Springs. Uh they have we call usually when something happens there we call Marian County. They go down there and pick them up. I know some of the residents at one point had an agreement with Shan's care um many years ago that they'd come in there and pick them up if they had a medical emergency on the um Fort Gates. So I don't know if that agreement is still in place or not. So
um just a lot of things I mean but Marian County's unit out of Salt Springs is much faster than any of our units would ever get there. >> Okay. And we and like you said we have mutual aid that we were we work together. >> That's correct. >> Yeah. Okay. All right. Um any other questions? >> Mr. Commando, you said something earlier
about the certain amount of land on one side of the landing or whatever. Did I missed that part? So, repeat that, please. >> So, looking back over uh some records that took place before I got here, the Department of Environmental Protection
was looking for sufficient uplands interest before they would enter into an easement with us. So, that is still something that would have to be addressed, I imagine, from their part. >> Okay. And if Mr. and and if um the Fort
Gates group owned it, they would have to work that out as well. >> Well, they can negotiate with with them. They can negotiate with the land owner. They can negotiate with the state. I mean, they could negotiate with anyone else involved on either side. >> Okay. And for clarity, the um the other
side, the um the Waka side, Miss Young was not used with any grant money as far as the landing itself. engineering >> engineering engineering >> engineering was was completed with grant funds um when we received the DOT
dollars um and the federal dollars um in order to redo those landings. However, when the bids came back, there wasn't enough funding to cover the project and that's where we diverted into an alternative plan. >> And then so local dollars is what brought that up to speed with the help
of Mr. Roberts. >> That's correct. the county um when we diverted and returned the grant dollars, the remaining funds, we allocated initially 50 and then ended at just over 70 through the through Mr. Roberts's um project management.
>> Okay. All right. Commissioner Alexander, you're recognized. >> Um one more caveat to that. Mr. Roberts, one of his requests was that we would pay for half of the insurance for the ferry. If we turn that over to him solely,
is that something that we would want to enable the or, you know, encumber the county to doing? >> I think you got to figure out whether you can turn it over to him first. >> Yep. Yep. And that that's something you need to ask. Is it is that feasible to even turn it over to him if we have to pay for half the insurance because I
don't know that we can pay for half the insurance for a private entity. >> I agree with that. >> No. If Excuse me. >> Yes, sir. No, what I was saying or trying to say is that if the county turned it over to us, we would be more than happy to pay for the insuranceances
and keep everything up to date to go in there and spray water sealant to keep the landings and stuff >> intact. If a board came loose, we would replace it out of our own pocket. If the county is involved in it >> and they're going to come down there and say, "Well, this isn't done or you know,
not if this isn't done, but um oh, you've got to start doing this now. you can only charge this much or you have to charge this much. Where it stands now, the county regulates the passage fees that go across there. I don't want to see the fees go up for the residents
over there. So, I wouldn't want the county to come in and say, "Well, you got to pay $15 now. Let us keep it at $10." And that and then if the county has no involvement in it, I mean, they can come down there and inspect it. I would love that. We still would have to go through an inspection, but at that
point, the county's relieved of all >> Well, so before I mean, I don't know that we're ever going to get back to where we were before, right? So where we were before was there was a contract with the county and similar to what you just explained and this county and the
operational side of it there were told you certain things you had to do like limit the fee and then in return you were supposed to provide the service of going back and forth and blah blah blah. Right. Okay. But we don't necessarily have to have that. Right. Well you can operate your ferry without the county if
there's no the contract at this point is expired. We do not have a contract with you. >> Exactly. >> Okay. So that's expired. We can all agree on that, too. >> Well, there's a a clause in the original in the agreement that because we have a $9,000 SBA loan on the part of the
wetland lease for the boat house that's there. We took that. I didn't feel that it was feasible enough to charge the state or the county for it. So, we took that SBA loan on ourselves with the on the condition that we have an extension
of 10 years on our lease so we could at least pay it off. I don't want to pay $90,000 on a lease that's not there. >> Well, we haven't you haven't operated in eight years. So, eight out of that 10 years is gone. Is that what you're saying? >> No. I would like for them to go ahead
and when it stopped when we stopped service, I would like the contract to pick up from 2017 to 2026. So those years that are lost in there, it wasn't really a contract because we weren't allowed to make any type of monies or
repairs or anything to keep anything up and running. >> And that was $1,000 a month, $1,200 a month. >> The No, we still had to keep insurance. >> I understand. But how much was it the county was given? >> The county was originally 800 and then they moved it up. Mr. Liry moved it up
to 1,200. So you're now you're saying that you want the county to go back and pay you in a rears. >> No. No. >> Okay. I thought that's what you just said. >> If if the No. If the county if they will turn it over to us, let's just call a squash. I don't care about the eight
years that's passed. I don't care about any BS or anything like that. I would say that just let them go. And you know what? If you'll just turn it over to us, I don't even care about my office. I'll smash that thing to the ground and
rebuild it myself or go down to birds because for five years I've been promised or six years that the county was going to take care of something that press Tomkins the county engineer caused. But to this day there's mold in there. The state says I have to have a
aund square foot office. I don't have that. But I would even be willing to say you guys are not going to hear from me again unless it's on a different subject. But as far as Fort Gates Ferry, at that point it's a squash. Let let me just take care of what's down there. Let
me keep it restored and keep the buildings that have been there. Some of those buildings were built in 1899 and put there. >> But the county doesn't own those buildings. >> I'm sorry. >> The county does not own those buildings. >> Oh, the county does not own those buildings. >> Okay. >> But I'm I'm saying let me keep that
piece of history going and keep it right where it's at. >> Miss Roberts, I understand you, but we're not preventing you from doing that today. We're not preventing you from doing that today. That's where I don't understand. >> The count on as far as my office. >> Yeah, >> I own the office. The county caused it
to flood. I had black mold in there in the ceilings. The floor is completely ruined because they build it this much higher. I have pictures of it. They built it this much higher than and then they threw the asphalt and the dirt against the vinyl siding on the building. Every time it rains, it comes
right in. And the way the thing is sloped pours right into my office. The county built you an office? >> No, the office was already there before that. >> Oh, you're saying the road caused the flooding. >> The road caused I got >> because they raised it up a foot higher than my office.
>> Okay. Mr. Commissioner Harvey, you recognized. >> Thank you, Madam Chair. This is a question for staff. Um, this morning we we went out for some buildings that we owned. Uh, we surplus those. We probably
can't surplus this, but we could enter into anou, couldn't we? >> We don't. We don't own it. >> No, I'm talking about the Waka side right now. We own that side over there. >> I'm sorry. I thought you were talking about his office.
>> No, no, I'm just talking about the whole Let's look at the whole thing on the Waka side, the Ocala side. Couldn't we enter into anou with their historical Fort Gates ferry and say it's all yours now. You deal with the landings, you
deal with this. I mean, Mr. Roberts has already said that he's willing to raise every penny. There would be no county money involved in it. Um, he's already said he'd take care of the insurance. He can set his own price if there was anou for running the ferry. >> That's what I'm saying.
>> I thought he said he wanted us to handle insurance. >> No, no, no. He just said no. He takes it over. >> He takes everything over. So, could we enter anouou and just support his cause on the on the Ocala side for him to get whatever upland agreements he need to
get, whatever submerged land he needs to get, we'll support that as a letter of recommendation, but give him anou to to do whatever they want to do with the ferry down there. And then there's no more subsidiary or subsidized money from
taxpayers to offset a ferry. If they if it cost you $10 to take a car across it, so be it. If it cost you 20, it cost you 20. But the county would have no dog in this hunt at all whatsoever. And we would just enter into anou with Fort
Gates, historical Fort Gates, and let them go let them go for it. >> That's what we're saying. I would also like to add let's see let's see if we can get >> I don't know if it's anou but whether it's a lease orou I think the same end can be accomplished.
>> Thank you. Thank you. >> We put in that lease as well that we will not charge our first responders to take them across the river. The >> and that's one to >> that's that's something you could do. I mean we don't want to we don't want to
get into your operation of your business. is when I die, I want the next group, whether it's my children, and I don't trust my kids. My son made me one time pay him $20 interest when he loan me. >> Where's your children at? Are they in the audience?
>> Please stand up. You're not trusted at all. Yeah, for sure kid. >> So that for future generations though that it will not if it when I pass away, Dale passes away just so we keep it for our first responders with as much crap
as our sheriff's department takes. We had an active shooter took them three couple or three hours to get back there. If they want if the ferry had been open, they could have been over there in nine minutes. It's exactly what it takes to get across the river. On a calm day, we can make it about six minutes. But in
that thing that to keep it for future generations that the first responders or EMS Roberts, it's your business. You can do whatever you want if you want to leave it for. That's where I'm at with this that where I've been at this whole time
with this issue is that you are a private citizen with a with a with a business and you can run a business however you want to run your business. I don't want to be the county shouldn't be in your way. If if what's in your way to operate today is that we haven't
resolved the issue on the OALI side, then whatever rights that we have in that side or both sides where I'm at is that we can just somehow give it >> I don't know if give it the right word or lease it with the for a dollar. I
don't know what the right I think we're going to have to have some guidance from our legal counsel to come back and say this is the document whether it's a quit claim whether it's a t I don't know what it is. >> Well, we may be able to deed it with a reverter provision. So, you may be able to deed it to them to operate the ferry
and at any point in the future if the ferry ceases to operate for a period of time then whatever our interest >> that's what makes sense to me. My what makes sense is to me is that you just you have a passion for this and you want it. your community wants it. And I've even seen where I think it was you, Angie, that said you felt like you could
get the community behind it and support it. The only issue I've ever had with this is is spending hundreds of thousands of dollars potentially of taxpayers dollars for this particular project. That's where I was struggling with it because we have bigger things. And and I'm not dis diminishing your pro
your the ferry. What I'm saying is we got roads that need to be done. We got water that needs to be supplied. and and if I'm if I'm happen to prioritize as a commissioner, it's not on my top. However, do I think it personally? Is it cool? Is it important? Does it have historical value? Absolutely. And then
that gives you the ability to go apply for an historical grant and I'll write you a letter support. I'll right now if you tell me that you're applying for a grant, I will write you a letter of support for a historical grant. I have no issues with that. But my issue has always been how we're spending taxpayers dollars because we're the stores of
that. And that is a challenge, you know, for us. And so, if you're willing to take it over, I think that we can have our legal counsel figure out a way to make that happen for those two landings. And then, again, we don't have a submerged land lease, so you're going to have to figure that out. Whatever it is
with the adjacent owners, put the boards on, don't put the boards on, it'd be yours to to worry about. Are you Are you saying that your company is willing to do that? >> Yes. >> All right. All right. Yes, sir. Commissioner Alexander.
>> All right. With that being said, it sounds we have we have a resolution, but we can't reasonably expect our attorney to come up with the exact verbiage and everything that we need to do today where we can hold a vote. But what we can do is provide staff with direction
to configure a document that would cover both parties and allow you to do what you would like to do. So, I would like to propose a motion to give staff direction to >> Okay. All right. That's right. >> Yes. >> All right. We haven't heard from
speakers. That's a very valid point. >> And commissioner, I mean, being that we're in a workshop, traditionally, we don't take votes. So, staff direction and consent. >> Staff direction is all we need. >> It just is not reasonable for you to be able to do something with that. >> All right. Did you give me a card? Are one of these yours? >> Yes, I did. Judith York.
>> Okay. Thank you, Miss York. Okay. >> Okay. Thank you for acknowledging protocol here. Judith York, 142 Drayton Island Road. Been here for 26 years. I wrote the grant.
Me and Lisa Grant, her name was She's passed away. >> I remember Lisa. >> Okay. I wrote the grant. Her her and I did. We did it for Drayton Island. Then Liry put in Fort Gates
and he copied ours. Three hours before the close of the deadline, I get a call. I fi follow up with that. I call Washington to see and find out that Liry sends in the wrong form. He
sent in the appro appropriation form, not the one for the grant with the highway. I fax over the form. Signature page was the same. It got awarded. He took the credit.
Somewhere down the road as we were administrating that he wanted to join co-mingle funds from Drayton Island to Fort Gates. I initiated with FDOT and the attorneys
and Nancy Harris at the time that something was wrong. That's the day he resigned and they all conceded that he was trying to co-agleal funds from Drayton Island to Fort Gates.
Okay, clearing that up. Okay. >> We never got any >> the under under historical grants. I write grants. I came from Tampa and wrote grants. Under the grants, you have certain
protocols you have to file. So that's where that $200,000 report came from. Just giving you a little history real quick on the grants. >> So you had to do that. Now, you have to have an administrator in your county that does that. There's a lot of rules
of the road when you have that grant package. I went down and got the package so I could follow it. I actually even said, I'll volunteer my time to help administrate it because obviously we don't have somebody that understands how
to follow the protocols on that. That was denied. You chose Taylor Engineering 200 something thousand. Yeah, that was way out of line. Having a concrete built
ramp way out of line. We advocated wooden ramp for Drayton Island. Historical value. Same thing copied for Fort Gates. I'm very strong believer in historical preservation.
Putnham County has a lot of it. They don't embrace it. Yet, if you were St. Augustine or down in Miami or somewhere, you might just say, "We've got a gold mine here." And we'd run with it. But you don't have the staff that can see
the visions. And under that particular grant historic of that we got from the road department, you had a lot of parameters. You could do not just build, you could acquire equipment, you could you could you could buy property.
The vision wasn't there. It ended up going away because they couldn't see it. They argued it. Argued it for Fort Gates kind of got dropped to the side. Drayton Island was a necessity because of all the residents,
not 30. There's a lot more. And bottom line is FDOT came in. The promise was FDOT, can you step forward? FTO finally said, "Yeah, we'll do it." But now if you do FDOT,
and as your attorneys know and public works knows, it's FDOT their way or no way. So that's why it became a $4 million project, which is unheard of, but it is. Fort Gates could be done for 50,000.
Could have been done that. Now you have a submerged land lease that's expired. I've had it. I'm also was a former parillegal for People's Gas of the state of Florida. You have to do your due diligence. Whatever project you're involved with,
if he's going to do if you're going to give him this property under your own protocol, you have surplus property, you got to go out to bid. You got to say if you don't own it and you own it under lease on both sides,
per se, well then you've got to notify the other owner that you're getting your lease from. If you're doing a submerged land lease, you have to file an application nice and thick, both sides. Submerged land lease is now going to tax
you. If they approve it, they're going to tax you. whoever is going to be governing that piece of property is going to be taxed yearly. So, there's a lot of due diligence done on this and a lot of
different uh contracts. So, if you turn around and say, I'm looking at this piece of property in Waka or over on here on on the on that fish camp. It's my understanding that's
from DOP is that uh Putnham County does not own that. It's my understanding, >> correct? >> From from previous due diligence. So the fish camp and where it ends, the road ends, that is actually owned by another
entity and Putnham County can't just give it away. You can transfer, but why would you transfer if you currently now have piece of property? It's waterfront.
If you're a real estate person, you know, you'd have to start saying, well, what's my best use? I'm going to push. Let's preserve our historical structures. You got a a gold mine sitting here to preserve. Okay.
Who's the best candidate? I don't know. I've got this here and I can operate it, but maybe we need to put it out for bid. Let's see. Maybe somebody steps forward. Maybe Travis is the only one, but
you're custodian. So you got to put it out to bed now because somebody may come around a Morris or whoever may say that's how much how many how many feet of waterfront property are you talking about right there?
Are you using it as a park? If you're using it as a park and he's got it well as a park and as other counties do and they use their parks and they have vendors that help ride it, I mean operate it. Well, then what's it in for the what's in for the county? Usually
there's a concession fee that the counties do and you can you can go over to check out Dan and Dillion Springs and you can see what Valuchia County does and St. Augustine. There's vendor contracts involved. So now you have a
lease. Now you have a vendor contract. Now there's submerged land lease. Well, who's going to who's going to apply for the submerged land lease? D is going to turn around long know whose jurisdiction is it?
Can he say he's the owner? No. Who's the lease? Well, DP who does submerged land lease. Okay, but he subleasased it now to Putham County. Okay, Putnham County wants to do a dock submerged land lease.
Well, then Putnham County has to do an application for it because from there then Putnham County can turn around and subleasase it now to the next entity. But again, DP is going to want their yearly tax who's going to pay for it. So
this this gets all into these due diligence things. And I'm only saying this because I've been there, done that for, you know, the state of Florida, People's Gas, and had to do that and all my due diligence, all my property, all
my abstracts, all this, so I could hand it to the law firm that helped write all these things for People's Gas for the state of Florida so that we didn't get in trouble and we could transfer risk. Something happened. So, you're a small entity. you're putting a lot on this
attorney who doesn't have a big team behind him and it's not just as easy as saying here's a quick claim and here's this. It's a great resolution. But my thing is right now is go back to basis.
Here it is for you. Here's your land. Who's the identity under what contract do you have? And then what are your parameters that you can extend it and use? So what's your best use? If your best use is to keep it going and you get
something in return, whether recognition or whatever, that's great. But you have to figure your dollar value. And it's not as easy as saying, "Well, let me write this over." And it's going to be somebody else's problem because down the road he's going to be paying 2,000,
3,000, maybe more a year for submerged land tax. Then there's going to be a liability issue. Then all of a sudden, you're going to have hurricanes. Who's gonna take who what's going to happen when it tears down? You know, here's the mess.
And bottom line, you've now entered into a a secured lease with somebody and didn't put it out to bid. Can you do that? I don't know. We've been through an awful lot of transparency and a lot of audit over those past years. We've had, you know, a
lot of employees that stepped aside because of those quick claims and easy business deals. So, there's going to have to be a lot of paperwork that makes sure that everybody's eyes dotted, tees are crossed, everything's fair.
It may be Travis. It may be historical. We want to bottom line is we'd like to preserve it. Well, how do we do it? piece of property on one side, piece of property on the other side. First thing
is ownership. Figure it out. Who's the ownership? What what real estate? What contract can we do now to transfer it? If a submerged land lease has to be filled out, it's going to be a lot easier for Putnham County to fill out the submerged land lease than a
individual because that's what they're going to ask. Well, what what's the impact? holds this a little bit easier for a county to do that. And again, somewhere down the road, the D is going to ask for monies. Well, who's who's paying for it? Or if the county owes it,
maybe D lets it go as an individual. They're not going to let it go. They're going to collect tax from it. It's as simple as that. Okay. Now, you got the fish camp. Who owns it? Well, it's part of our lease deal with that we have.
Okay. Well, okay. You've leased. Is there a lease in place right now? It's expired. >> That's correct. >> Okay. There's there's a piece of property waterfront that has cabins and docks. I don't know how many square foot how
many running feet. What's the best use? What's the best use for that lease? Do you want money? >> Well, you know, uh Travis wants to run run it. You know, there may be you may find five others that would love to run it. I know Lisa
Grant and Dan Hayes wanted to run it. They bidded for it one year back then and then I think they backed out because it wasn't going to be as feasible for making money. But that's the whole thing. You got fish camp there dockage
that's going to be pretty prime here soon as that development gets taken place in another five years or so. prime real estate right there. What's the best use? Putnham County may turn around and say, "God, let's get rid of it. It's easy."
Putham County may turn around if you had a more vision and could see this. What a great little park. Bass capital of the world. Hey, let's lease out this park and find out who wants to put in little cabins
and operate it. And oh by the way, if they want to run the ferry operation too, no problem. Let's get a ferry operator. Let's put that out for bid too. Certainly all the years you do it every year for Drayton Island. Even though we nobody responds because nobody
wants to for that kind of license wants to they don't make enough money. And the money that you gave him gave Dale and them beforehand, the $1,200 a month was supposed to go towards insurance.
Hurricane hits. You know, from my understanding, the $1,200 a month he was supposed to pay for insurance for his boat. >> For the boat. Mariners's insurance was not for the landing. It was for the
boat. just as you insure the barge right now. So that money was supposed to go towards the boat. The boat sank. They had no recovery insurance. Nobody in Putham County that was supposed to be
monitoring your insurance policies bothered to collect a deck sheet every year to make sure because they didn't they didn't know. They just just didn't know. don't we don't have ports that we use and are around with a lot of boats
we didn't know. Karen's given them a lot of information. She's helped them bring in come them come in compliance with the Coast Guard changes and all of these things. So, she's been a great help for
her whatever little 34,000 a year that goes to operating the boat twice a week that also has to go to repairs and now gasoline, believe me. And you I've been with her. You get calls 247. She does. And she's helped out. And if
there was an emergency, right now the county does own that barge, which part of the grant, the 80,000 that you want to say went to a private. No, the 80,000 went for you to partially purchase your barge that the county owns
because you pushed. You didn't want to use the grant. You didn't have enough administration that understood how to operate that grant. You wanted to give all that money back. So they pushed for FDOD to take over the project. FDOT takes over the project and turns around,
"No problem. We'll do it. We got We need a You want us to build a landing that can hold a 70,000 ton vehic vehicle because that's our bridge standards. If we're going to do the project, that's
our bridge standards. You think 70,000 is actually coming over to the island?" No. But that's what you wanted. FDOT, that's what administration wanted. They pushed for it. FDOT said, "Fine.
Where's your barge?" Because your old barge won't hold 70 tons. So now you had to buy a barge because you wanted FDOT to take over the project. And that's how that happened because you don't have enough staff that sees the
vision and sees how it tumbles down when you start doing all this due diligence. So come on back to this whole project. It's as simple as who owns this property on both sides. I think you really should
establish these landings for your own selfhistorical preservation somehow. We need to keep it going. Who operates it? Not sure. But you definitely I think both landings need to be fixed. >> Okay,
>> there seriously need to do you need to do that. You need to embrace your historical preservation that you have for this county and go for it. You know, as it is right now, we have a bronze we have a bronze emblem on the wall and you certainly don't see Drayton Island or
Hog Island on there and I guarantee you Drayton Island's full of rich history that St. and Augustine would have loved to have because Epili and Kingsley had his place on there, but Putnham County doesn't even recognize the the necessity
of what southern southern Putham County does for Northern. But I think if we go back to our due diligence, if I was handed this file and I was still in business with with the utility, I'd be going, "Oh Lord, let me get make sure I've got all my ducks in a row so when I
hand this package over to my attorney, it's Here it's gone. Okay, here we go. Do we own it? What can we do with it? Now, what's our best use and where we go from here? But I do think you should establish it. Whoever pays for it, it's
a simple wooden dock. Let's we could get that. We can raise those funds for that dock and let's move forward with it. But it's how we proceed from this that is fair to the county and it follows your protocol. So somebody doesn't get in trouble because they
gave something away and then turned around and got you guys are gone 10 years later somebody goes who the heck did this? So it's a lot of put on the attorney but due diligence and protocol is number one prior. >> Thank you Miss York.
>> Okay thank you miss before you leave just a couple questions. You've referenced DOT several times in in this discussion. It sounds like you have some experience in this space. Um, can we do you feel it's it's possible
for us to return these structures in a historic space and DOT still sign off on those? >> No. >> Okay. So, and so where does that leave us? You can't you you can't ask for do funding for them to fund a bridge
because they have their own standards. >> I I understand that. So is it necessary for de if we build it to a historic state >> and intend to operate that? Do we have to get DOT inspections and do we have to
get their blessing in order to make that happen? >> You will probably because you're carrying vehicles and you're carrying it from one road connection to the other. I wouldn't I wouldn't I wouldn't say that I know that you have to do that. I
think on a liability side >> if you're doing due diligence, you would want to know you would want your stress test on your landings to make sure what was my maximum tonnage just like you would do if you were building your own private dock. you know, you know, you're not going to bring
>> uh a concrete truck on it, but you can bring in vehicles and and he can only he in that barge, they can only bring six passengers at a time. That's how the Coast Guard rule is on that. Okay? Six passengers, not 20 motorcycles,
six passengers at a time. That's under that that rule. So, between the Coast Guard's rulings, your weight standards, who who who applies, who where do you get that? It's going to be from DOT and then from your own attorney in your own
due diligence, you're spreading your liability. who you know and if somebody's operating and licensing themselves and they're saying Putinham County and they're using all that well now you you have to make sure whoever is operating your waters in that sense are
they are they licensed and are they properly insured and also another thing here too you have to remember under your own ordinance which you don't you don't you don't use this under your own ordinance all fairies landings
and and boat ramps should be governed under your port authority. >> That's another aspect question. >> Just one other question, Mr. Roberts. If you ended up being the vendor here, are you comfortable navigating that DOT inspection space? and and
>> well, it wouldn't be under DOT inspection because just like with this side, it would be under county inspection because by cutting the landing back by one board, the east side is no longer considered a bridge. That is through EPO and I met with Mr. Roger
Lou and the state officials. >> I I'm acknowledging you. I said yes. >> Okay. Okay. I'm sorry. I got >> um it is no longer a bridge. So, the has no more dog in the pipe. The other side, however, is but with the drawings that
we had done, that cuts it back by a couple of boards. It's no longer a bridge. Now, it is a landing. So, once that once it's turned over, I go to I go to FDOT, meet with U, Mr. Lou, and then
I say, "This is our thing. Here's our plan." Just like I did on the first one. And he says, "Okay, the east side is no longer bridge." And I did that with the blessing of Mr. Harvey and the other commissioners at the time. Now, the other thing that makes historical Fort
Gates so historic is the boat that I and Dale own and the barge that we own. >> If you bring in another contractor or go to put it out for bid, I take the boat. I take the barge. It's no longer historical because I have taken those historical artifacts with me that way
owns. >> Okay. All right. All right. Let's not we're not going to get into a personal debate. >> But if the land the land if it's no longer a bridge, it falls under a landing which is under the port authority. >> Okay. So let's look at this. This is the map that we're talking about on the Waka side. So obviously one side of the road
is the Waka State Forest. If you'll click on the other that is owned by this is the property appraisers Jeremy Smith, David Smith. Correct. All right.
>> Okay. All right. And then if you'll the road point to the road. Yep. Click on it. Maybe closer to the water. Okay. >> Yeah. Click right there at the end of the road. Nothing's
popping up. >> Okay. So, you're right. I mean, we do have to determine ownership, but just doing a quick glance at it, it doesn't >> in in a good year. >> In a good
um in a good year, if we have drought like we have now, we have property. If if it's a wetland year, which is every year that I've seen been there, the the 6 acres is not even, you know,
it's not even a half acre is not there most of the time. >> And so you're referring to uh Miss Knox, you're referring to this area um >> on the on the east side >> on the east side where you see those cars and those on the aerial that side. >> Right. >> Okay. >> On the west side.
>> And that is not owned by you. that is owned by >> that is what we have the lease till 2044. >> Okay. This is where the confusion is. Go ahead, Mr. Commander. You had something to say. Okay. So, that's where you had the lease till 2024. >> Till 2044. >> 44 >> with the state.
>> I'm sorry. >> With the state. >> The the lease that we have on the dry part of it is till 2044 with the state. >> Yeah. Okay. That's what my question. >> They regulate every I can't cut down a tree. We've had five dead trees. I couldn't cut them down until the
Department of Forestry came over. >> So there the account there's no county ownership on that side. >> Okay, that was my point that I was making. >> The other thing, if you look on the map there on the east side, the seaw wall has never been taken care of. If the county turns that over, they no longer
have that million-doll responsibility. They don't have the responsibility of the landing of taking care of it. I've worked for eight years, actually for 10 years over there. And the county doesn't have to maintain. They don't have to cut
the grass. We even cut the grass going all the way down the road by Mount Royal. We take care of the place. There's not another person going to come in and say, "I'll work for $2 an hour and do all this other stuff." >> So, the only thing the county has an interest in legally is the Fort Gates
Ferry Road. Is that correct? >> It's a landing. actually >> and the landing itself, the wood bridge, the wood that's no longer a bridge. >> That's my understanding. And I'm sorry, I'm looking at whatever was just handed out to us. >> That's actually the attachment to the
management agreement for the submerged lands with the board of trustees for internal improvement trust fund. >> That's on tiff. >> State lands, >> right? Okay. State lands. Okay. And that that's the lease that was a
20-year management agreement that expired November 21st, 2021. >> Doesn't it also say in there um that we had a 10-year extension after 2021 >> because of the loan, the SBA loan?
>> I don't see that. >> It it was a revi a revision that was put in All right, let's let's we got some other speakers that we'd like would like to speak. So, if we'll just um move on and see what other people in the community want to say about this issue and then
we'll come back to in a little bit. Uh Mr. Swanson. Oh, we never mind. We're asking to take a couple minute. We're going to take a few minutes break. um trying to limit this to three minutes and then we're going to uh go into
commissioner comments. So, real quick, um Mark Swanson, you got three minutes. >> Watch in hand. Mark Swanson, 326 West Main Street, Pomona Park. I do not speak for the town. I've stayed as a citizen. Look, I'm I'm not going to get into the weeds. I would just say think
creatively. I mean, come on. The history Confederate soldiers took it apart before the US. How many places do you go that you don't take the best way? Right? Does do the cable cars in San Francisco? Does that make sense? Uh, look at what
Amtrak charges you to bring your car. As a kid, I went on something the Alagash River Waterway. It had a turnpike. It was a lumber company operated the road. I was 12 years old. They charged us $30 to drive two miles. So, I just think
with the things that are coming in river to sea, when I went down here, I looked at this and the answer they told me was, "Oh, we're the second poorest county in the state of Florida." Well, this is exactly why you need it. It's a It's not going to hurt the environment. It may
provide some other services. You've got three of the five municipalities, right, that are down there. Pomona Park, Walaka, Crescent City. So, I would just encourage you, I'm not so sure the different vendors and who is this that,
but the idea itself, the concept is good. And as I was just saying to Mr. Suggs, a lot of the stuff you do really would is operating a school, does that make sense? >> We don't operate schools. I know you don't, but to have a school system,
right, to take kids for eight hours, uh, to operate parks that you don't charge anybody, to have a parks and recreation that basically does it at cost. So, I look at the ferry as the same thing. Thank you. >> Okay. Um, Giovana, did you already I
know you already spoke. Did you want to have a couple more words? Okay. >> Yeah. I was just jumping in on that issue. Okay. And I'm speaking as a longtime resident of Salt Springs and a volunteer with the Forest Service. I was out on patrol last Sunday as I'm most Sundays. And I can tell you the number
one question I'm asked when I assist visitors, tourists, uh is how do I get to the to the ferry? Uh when is the ferry going to reopen? Uh and why isn't open yet? That is a I I think you guys are sitting are giving away a lot of
money but not keeping that thing open because the interest in the ferry is humongous. The connection between Ocala and Daytona that's a very viable connection. It's a big tourist route that we are trying also to establish because of all the historical points of
interest connected also with the forest. Another thing is our community in Salt Springs has a lot of family and and business interests on your side on the Platinum side which right now are interrupted and we really would like it to be restored because they're they're
historically it's uh it's there and another thing that you may want to consider is if you reestablish the ferry um that will allow the Forest Service at this time of very little funding to request a high higher level of maintenance for 29 29 Forest Road 29,
which right now is being downgraded. So the folks that live in the Forest Gates um forgate community have a terrible road, terrible road. They they're losing tires. They cannot really uh even go get their mail. And by the way, these people
in for gay community, they are paying a ton of money in taxes compared to the rest of Putnham per capita. Some of these folks are paying $14,000 a year in property taxes and they get no mail service because of the roads, very little or non-existent 911 service,
very no fire service except from the forest service. So, please take care of them because otherwise they may ask to join Marion. You know, after all, they're not getting a heck of a lot. So I think there is a lot of public interest in this route for historical
reasons and very good business and economic reasons and I hope you will do whatever you need. I'm not all the other considerations are above my head and I'm sure that you have good counsel to address those but please do take it seriously. We cannot go another year without it fair.
>> Are you a resident of Putnham County? >> No. No ma'am. I'm a resident of Marion in Salt Springs. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thank you. All right, Miss Copley. >> Brenda Copley, 756 National Forest Road, 75G, Fort McCoy, 32134.
I'm here just representing the Fort Gates community because nobody knows where we are. People are are having medical emergencies down in our area. We call 911. Um we had a gentleman on Thanksgiving eve who had a seizure
called 911. They said they cannot come and get him. Come and meet us at the Salt Life Church on 19. Um we've had incidents where the sheriff's department has been called up for uh issues and they take forever to get there because
they don't know where we are. I've spoken with the fire services and we've tried to get the maps straightened out, but we have a real public safety issue with the 29. They don't want to come down that road. It's in terrible shape
constantly. And I understand the Forest Service doesn't have the funding to take care of it, but somehow we've got to solve this problem because it's not acceptable that we cannot get emergency care. We had a fire break out on after
uh after lightning strike on Friday. They're still out there today trying to control it and it's like seven acres away from the nearest house. So it it can potentially be a real problem. We have no evacuation route there and my
understanding with the Black Bear Byway is there are standards that require that that be an evacuation route. So there are a lot of things. There's a lot of complications here. I understand that. But we need that very open and we need that road maintained. Nobody ever told
us when we bought the property that we wouldn't be able to access it because it's not navigable. So I'm here encouraging you to please help us do that. >> And and Miss Copley, this is your um this is your second home. Is that correct? No, we are we're resident
permanent residents here now for two years in April. >> Very good. Thank you. >> All right. Is there anybody else who's wishing to speak on this subject matter who has not filled out a card? >> All right. Coming back to the board for commissioner comments. >> Madam Chair.
>> Yes. >> There's been some uh misunderstanding about the road and the landing and that kind of thing. If we'd get Mr. Richie to take his post over there. um over here rather we're going to run through a set of slides and
uh show some pictures and and we'll give some description of what you're looking at and where people will understand exactly. >> Can y'all hear him good? >> Hello. Hello. Hello. >> Thank you. All right. There you go. >> It was turned on. >> I know it is.
>> A little decor. It's getting late. You can't reach me with that thing from there. >> Over there. >> Okay, back over here. >> All right, while he's getting ready, I'll give you a little idea of what we did. We went out yesterday with a tape
rule and we pulled some measurements on the width of the road and the width of the landing. The width >> You went out there. We didn't go out there. >> We me and Mr. Richie. >> Okay. Just clarity. >> Yeah, that's who I'm talking about. >> Okay. >> I also went out there separately. >> She's fed and she's testy. I don't get it. >> I just don't want anybody to misconceive
that all of the commissioners went out together. That's >> We did not take a We did not take an unsupervised field trip. I went out separately. >> Me and Mr. Richie. Richie and Mr. and not whoever. There we go. All right. Our first picture I think will be the one that we
took the width measured the width of the road and he took some pictures of the tape and it's when I say the width it's just usable part of the road. The road could be wider than this. It's not an exact measurement. It's just a reference
of some sort. All right. This is a picture of the landing. The width of the landing which is that shows 12 feet. That's the depth of it from the uh the docking facility. I'm not going to call it anything, but the docking facility
from there to the to the edge of the metal ramp is 23 feet. >> And you're on the west side. >> Yes, we're on the west side. There's the tape rule. You can see it on the far side laying there. The yellow thing. It's 23 feet from the lip to the very back there. I just moved the tape up
where it would sit. There's another view. The end of the tape there. Well, here's the steel. Will he slow down? Why don't you go out with the what you can see at the basically where it disappears. There's a 10 by 12 foot metal ramp that flips up and down that
allows the cars to bridge over onto the uh ferry. And there's the metal ramp we're talking about. It's 10 feet one way and 12 the other. I can't remember which one it is. 10 ft deep and 12 feet wide. That's what it is. There's 12 feet wide.
>> Move on there. That's standing right at the ramp. That that metal piece you see there 45s up to where he can come in and and dock his uh ferry and then you lower it down on it and it's a flexible part that you can drive up on and get onto the ferry. All right. Next next picture.
the wall on your right that you see going out into the river, that's basically what he kind of brings his uh tug up or ferry up against and slides up there to keep him from drifting around. It gives him a stable barrier to keep the uh very straight as he comes in.
That's the device. Very primitive, but that's what he when operational and the cables mounted to it, you just hand crank it up and hand crank it down. That's the width of the road, 38 feet. I think we show a picture. That's me
standing there. And it's just a basic distance from there to the other side. There's the pole to the other side. Handsome guide there. >> That's not what I was looking at. >> All right. He's standing out on the end of the ferry there just taking a shot of
the river. All right. This is heard them talking about the pumping water for putting out the fire there around 75G. This is what we watched. That's the where people can launch their boats to the right and then move their boat and trailer truck and
trailer out of the way. And to the left is the ferry. So, here's where the stop. Here's where the discrepancy was as about the width of the whole road and whether it's infringes on uh Miss um uh
Lynn's uh property or not because we don't know the actual true width of that road right there to know if it does infringe on her. It may not if the forest road is 45t wide or whatever. I would not think it would infringe on her property at all. But we wanted to give you a picture
or idea of what you're looking at there. All right. Next, I'm just showing some pictures of the timbers that it's currently there. These timbers are pressuret treated. This thing's been repaired in the last 25 or 30 years or it wouldn't have this pressuret treated timber on it. That
would you can see doesn't show up really well in the picture, but it's green. You can tell it is pressuret treated. They're just four 4 inch thick timbers. There's a beam underneath. That's 8 in thick. That's what's supporting those 4in timbers.
That was a hole in it there. There's a side view from the uh boat launch side. All right. I'm down underneath by the edge of the water and I'm shooting at what supports all this. Granted, that beam in front of you there is bad. All right. That's that's the pilings
that go into the uh to the water. Mr. minor, I'm sure, is looking at that and taking that all in to see exactly what's there. >> Okay, that's it. Um, I asked Mr. Miner if he would hang around. I know this is not anything binding by no means, but you get a basic gest of what's there and
what you see and that type thing. Um, and that would have to be to be satisfactory. This would be have to be brought up to DOT standards. Correct. Okay. Do and would all that have to be totally pulled out and replaced.
Come to please. First of all, I understand that y'all don't want to be the one responsible for building it. But in order to do that, you do have to take and have engineering and you have to have a contractor do it. You can't just not just anybody can go out there and just start working on it. >> Understand?
>> Okay. Um, most likely all those pieces do need to be taken out and replaced because the fact is even if you only have one or two are good, you still got to take the whole top part off. >> I understand. >> Okay. >> Okay. Just out of thin air, could you
give us a a number of because that's 16 by 23. >> What what's there? And I'm And I think there's four rows of five pilings each. if it were put back and um >> you're not going to do it for 50,000. >> No, no.
>> I mean, I heard that number earlier and I was just shocked. Um >> probably about 120,000 >> and I absolutely do not hold you to any >> I understand about just something to put in our mind. That's all. >> Yeah.
>> Thank you. >> So, what is so come forward. Don't talk from out there. Sorry, Madam Chair. >> I was just trying to see where you were going. >> Before any numbers are discussed any further, we Commissioner Harvey and I
had talked about this before in some of the other meetings. And at that time it was thought to not bring any monies as far as what it would cost to do anything in a public meeting because that would give the other companies because I know
what we paid in the past that's already for public record. But before we say any more numbers because it'll give an unfair advantage to some of the companies. You know, if we say it's going to cost a million, they're going to come in at 9999,000. And and then one other thing I want to
clear up while I'm thinking about it, it said the insurance was not regulated. It was That's why I mentioned with Commissioner Harvey that when they paid the the premium up front, the county did on the landings. If at any time we would
not have paid that since the county had written that and we were responsible perhaps they would have gotten in touch with the county and said we never got our payment. So just to show the audience and the citizens that there was transparency in that the county did
above and beyond on that. and the the blueprints here. One of the things that was suggested by our county engineer is that some of the pylons there when he went out and that would be um JT style when he went out there and
looked at those, his suggestion as an engineer was not to remove some of those, but put a uh case on around them and bring it up at a certain height. I'm not going to say what it was. Um, but to pour those quesons with concrete to
preserve those other ones and to wrap the new landing on the east side with an ABS plastic so the river worms would need it and it would give about another 30 years of life. So you might want to question him about that. So
I just the reason I wanted to show the pictures that we took is just to give everybody an idea so everybody knows. I'm sure Mr. Commando has never been out there and seen it or I think he hasn't. So, wanted everybody to have a kind of an idea of what we were uh dealing with and how width and length and that type
thing. That's all I have at this time. >> All right. Commissioner Harvey, you had your light on. >> I'm I'm going to wait. Thank you, Madam Chair. >> Okay. Um, Miss Ovette Reyes. Thank you. Sorry, I know I missed my
spot, but I just want to let you guys know that I understand their passion because they live on that side of town. I don't want my tax dollars to go to Fort Gates Ferry. I have me personally, I would like other
things to be addressed first before this fairy that will benefit only a few people within the county if we're going to be honest. It's not going to >> y'all don't please don't comment. >> I didn't comment when y'all were
commenting. Please respect >> M. Re. Anyway, so I understand where you're coming from and I know that it's on your side of town. It's on my side of town as well. >> But I don't want my tax money to go to
it because we have bigger issues within our county that will benefit everyone, not just the chosen few. Okay. >> Thank you. >> Thank you for your comments. All right. Back to the board for commissioner comments. Um we need some direction. Um,
I know we mentioned earlier about speaking with um with with the county attorney. Um, are there any comments from the board? >> Madam Chair. >> Yes, sir. >> I'd like to go back to my original comments that I made before. Um, I'm all
about the ferry. I think it's kind of nostalgic, but at the same time, we have to be mindful. People in West Putnham pay a fee to maintain their own roads. So, if a private company is wanting to
do this, I'm going to clap and wave and do all I can to support that. Um, so I would I would like for us and and Miss York brought up some good points. There's no doubt. But I would like for us to it's going to take a little while.
Let me We're going to take a few bites of this apple in my opinion. But I think it's time that we direct staff to look at coming up with some type of guidelines of what we can do, what we can lease out, what ourou what our requirements are, what's an insurance
requirement, all that good stuff, and then put it out there. And also the submerged land leases, who's going to get that. There's a lot more here to do than just us talking today. But I think this is a great talk. I will say that. I
think it's a great start from where we were at. I'm going to offend most of y'all for just a second and I apologize. I've had one call in my career other than a few of y'all that come to the county commission meeting. One person called me and wants that ferry back
open, but I represent the west end of the county. So, it's a little different society, right? And I don't mean to offend anybody, but when you think that, okay, there's 40 people in the room and or 50 people and everybody feels that
way in the county, not everybody feels that way. So, this commissioner is all about private. If the private industry wants to do it privately, I'm all for that. And I will do anything I can to help. I'm like Commissioner Wils, I'll
write the letter tomorrow. It doesn't bother me. But I would like to see us direct staff to continue working on what we can do, what the parameters are, and if there's anybody out there that's willing to go that distance. And if it's
Mr. Roberts, fine. If it's somebody else, fine. But it's going to have to be a bunch of steps, a lot more steps. And I heard the Black Bear Highway. You know, I remember sitting here in this seat when we our public works director,
John Dovich, talked about paving 29. We didn't even own 29. We got a grant from DOT and we checked the box that we owned it. You know who owns it? The forestry department does. And some of y'all were in this room when Carl Bower stood right
over there and he says, "I don't care. They're not roads to me. their service accesses to get to my timber. That's what the man said in this room. And it was offensive to me. It was. But I grew up out there. I hunted the breeding
grounds. I took the ferry across. My best friend owns mother owned the frontier dance hall when I was 18 years old. I grew up in that area. So I know all about that. So I'm just going to say this. if a private company is willing to step up and do something, this
commissioner is all about supporting that. So there there's my comments, Madam Chair. >> All right. Thank you. Uh Commissioner Peler, you're recognized. >> Um I do see some of it the way Commissioner Harvey does. I think there's a lot more to this uh onion as we peel back the layers and keep finding
out about submerged >> submerged leases and and the width the legal width of Forest Road 29 and I think all that's going to play into this. Um, I see um I I do have some historical value there that that that
concerns me or that I'm interested in, but more than that, the uh the protection of those people's homes out there in the event of fire that the uh truck can get there and pump water and uh get it up there and put up a fire
break on those lines to keep that fire from taking over those homes over that on that waterfront. Um, again, I think there's things we're far we're way not near to the end of this. We're a lot closer to the beginning than we are anywhere else. So, it's going to require
some more effort. But, however, in the event that we do decide that, hey, it's going to fall back on Putnham County and and that it's it's our baby. I am very willing to use some of my discretionary funds, if not all of them, to make that
fix one time and be done with it. >> Okay. Um, are you working with um, uh, if you don't mind a question? Are you working with somebody at the forestry regarding some of those roads? >> Okay. I thought that at one point I thought you had said that in one of your commissioner comments.
>> Not on this issue. >> No, I'm not talking about this issue. I'm saying in general. Are you working on some kind of where we used to have a maintenance agreement with with a forestry? I thought you were working. >> Yes, we are. Um, up on far cemetery road. Um there's a little community up
there. Um Fort and I got Fort Gates on the brain. Um it's around 7. What is I'm trying to think of the name of that little community, but um it's was a town at one time had a post office and all that. Um
got the same name as a town in Connecticut. I don't know. It just escapes me. But, uh, anyhow, um, we're working on getting some some road work down there, which and I I I don't want to hurt your feelings down on 75G, but your road is I 95 compared to what these
people have. Their road is terrible. Absolutely terrible. Um, their trash trucks are coming there and keep them torn up and they're, you know, you got to have four-wheel drive. You just don't get in and out basically in certain spots in that. So, we are working on that. We're asking for a uh centralized
uh trash location pickup out there. Um hopefully we're to get that that'll get these garbage trucks that are tearing the roads up off of the main drag where once it's fixed it won't repeatedly be tearing it up. But yes, we're working on that. Um have the forestry folk that I
talked to are not really super in favor of the uh >> of gates. They're not very they're not they didn't jump up and down and say, you know, they hated it, but they're not really so much in favor of it. >> But u so but I'd like to know that the width of Forest Road 29 would give us a
big step in the right direction as to far as Miss Lynn goes is what um whether it would encroach on her or not. >> Okay. So one of the requests you're going to have for staff is to determine whether or not the the ownership on that side on the Ocala side you want to
understand completely whether we engage in our with our current surveyor or we find some survey on file that says that whether there's >> yes I would think we I would think the forestry service could tell you without a doubt a center point and what the
width of the road is. I mean, we certainly can ask. >> I think we can read a legal legal description. Okay. >> And that'll give us a lot of >> So, if you'll start a list over there, Mr. Suggs, of what we're going to be requesting, that that sounds like that's on the first subtly list.
Okay. U Commissioner, I'm going to go to Commissioner Alexander. Do you have any Commissioner comments? >> No, ma'am. I just I'm happy to see that we're going to follow through with what I started to say earlier. we would need to move forward with legal counsel as far as determining where we're at with
the ownership and what our next p next step forward is. Um I would like to applaud Mr. Roberts. Um right, wrong or indifferent, the man has passion, passion for history and he's developed a following. Um didn't always agree with
his delivery, but um people don't always agree with mine either. So, I look forward to getting a resolution from our legal team and then we will move forward. >> All right. Uh, Commissioner Nubal, >> I'll be a little bit repetitive all the way around, I suppose. But I do
appreciate all of you being here today, Mr. Roberts. Um, yeah, I guess a little sometimes we get a little bit nervous about what we might encounter here, you know, together. Um, you did a nice job. a little winded here
and there, but I appreciate your uh the way in which you've presented yourself. I learned a lot here today. Um done a little bit of research with county staff. I' I've been to to both sides. Um I appreciate the historic nature of of the the structure, what it possibly
could bring to our county over time. Um I see this as an opportunity. Uh it sounds like we've made a little bit of progress here and that there's a willingness from our side, a willingness from from the public side.
It it may turn out that this has to go out to bid, but in the end, I think we're going to come up with a device to move this out of the the public domain into a private space. And um I'm willing
to help monetarily with with my funds to make that happen. Um yes, ma'am. >> Yeah, that'll be fine. Go ahead with your comments. >> Um anyway, uh
I appreciate the discussion today. I feel like we've made progress. I know it's not fast enough for anybody here, but uh we're moving in the right direction and uh hopefully we can come up with the will and the way. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Miss Andrew.
>> Oh, I'm sorry. There was a quick clarification that when they said that that our contract expired, our contract did not expire because we of anything on our behalf. We have the boat and the barge ready to go. It was on the behalf of the fact that there was no landing to go to. So that was why the contract
expired. So there was not because of our inability to do the service. Thank you. >> I don't disagree with you. >> Okay. All right. Um so I've already shared my comments. I do appreciate the historical um portion of that. Okay. We have somebody else.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Come on up so we can get it on record. >> If it would help y'all. Miss Lynn has a survey along showing the right away by occupation of 50 foot. If you >> Yeah, that would be really helpful. Okay. Who should we go out to the car and get it?
>> Mr. Yeah. Mr. Suggs or Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> So, that would be very helpful. I think that, you know, it's easy for us to sit up here and say as commissioners, we want we want we want we want, but I think if we're asking, not that I think, I know we're going to be asking staff to
do something. So, I want this board to come up with clear direction for our staff because it's unfair to just say, "Here's the here it is. come back with this resolution. That's not what that's So you have several things that can happen with this landing. We the landing
is is repaired on the Waka side. It's not repaired on the Ocala side. So, what we've asked about is is there is there is there a way that we could um allow another entity to
use it, whether it be temporarily, long-term, whatever. I do agree with Miss York. Uh there probably has to be the we we need to look at our policy and procedures on um is it a surplus? How do we how do we if it's not a surplus, do
we send it out to bid? Because she's absolutely right. It could be that there are other people interested in it. But then what are the parameters for that, right? Because it's it's not just using the landing. Um it's um to Mr. Travis Roberts point, he owns the ferry and the
land and the B barge or his entity does or somebody other than the county. And so, you know, would it still have the same I mean, I don't know the answer to that. Is it the same significant if it's if it's if it's does it not become Fort
Gates Ferry? Is the Fort Gates Ferry the the landing or is the Fort Gates Ferry the ferry or is it all of the above? So, that those are questions that I don't really understand. Um, but what else? I want I'm asking my commissioners to give direction to
staff. >> I So, I have a question regarding that. saying that we did put it out for bid. Um we we want to make it equivocal for everyone and what Mr. Roberts has offered to do in his bid per se is to
rebuild the ferry as part of the uh contract. So is that so is that what we ask is is what we're asking is do we send out a bid that says this is for somebody would have to be willing >> to provide a boat provide a tug provide rebuilding of the dock and operate it
there thereafter as well as providing the insurance he has offered to do all of that. So if we're going to put out a contract it needs to contain all of that verbiage in my opinion and also we still need to establish legal ownership of that area. So I think those are the the main things that we need to address.
Yeah. The first step is >> one the first step is definitely makes making sure we understand the legal ownership because you have three layers. You have the land. >> Huh. >> Yeah. It's it's the land, >> you know, >> the merge land too. >> And I'm getting there, y'all. It's the
land itself, the dirt that's on that's dry. It is the It is then the the landings on both sides and then it's the submerged land leaves. That's right. So, there's three layers to that. >> So, I just want to clarify. Is that what you were going to say? Okay. >> All right. >> Yeah.
>> All right. Mr. um are there any other comments from commissioners to um our administrator and staff? >> County attorney. What are your comments? >> Nothing. We have good direction from the commission. We can uh move in on a path forward and bring it back to you once we
have the concrete answers that you're looking for. >> Yeah, it sounds like there's some research that needs to be done as to procedurally and what our options could be on this option. Yes, sir. Commissioner Alexander. So now um you know me still being a new politician you guys are great at this and that's why I
lean on you guys. So the next step do we hold another workshop on this to discuss this or do we bring them up before the board or where do we go from here? >> I think any it would come back in front of the board for comments and if it did it would be publicly noticed. >> Okay. So it be during a regularly scheduled meeting not another workshop.
>> Right. >> Okay. All right. >> And then and then a deter so at some point in the future we have to make a a decision. >> Yes ma'am. one way or the other. >> Understood. >> County administrator, do you have any comments? >> No, ma'am. I'm good. Thank you. >> All right. Um, before we close, is are
there any I'm going to give this one last opportunity because it is a workshop and I want to be fair to everybody. Is there is there any other public comment? Yes, ma'am. You're welcome to come up. Please state your name and address. >> My name is Pam Olsen and I live in Waka.
>> Hi. >> Hi. Um, and I support I I support the ferry. Um, a lot of people in Waca, I've been a big advocate of um the ferry. Um, we need to preserve this history. I
think it's super important. It'll bring uh tourism. Um, people love history. Um, it's great for our community. Um, there's a lot of benefits to doing this. Um, and I know you're working I'm glad to see that you're working toward trying
to do this. Um, my one question is you have that forestry road is that's road 29. Um, is there an interlocal agreement with the state or the forestry to who's maintaining that road for the people that live there because you're
collecting some tax dollars? Is it self-maintained or >> No. So that is a that is a forest road which means it's owned by the forestry which is the federal government and uh we do not have an agreement with them in place as a matter of fact they got mad several years ago 10 years ago or so
when there was an agreement and that's what Mr. Commissioner Harvey was referring to because the forestry will tell you today and they will tell you yesterday and tomorrow and all the days going forward they don't care about the people. They didn't build a forest service for the people. They build a
forest service for the trees and the animals and if people choose to live in there then that's the choice they make. We as the county have sat down and tried to negotiate with them over the years and there is no interest at all from the federal government. >> Well, maybe someone needs to step up and
change their mind because you know that's what happens. I mean, >> we are trying and we continue to have every time there's a new legislature, um, we sit down and try to have the conversation, but the but the people who manage it, they're doing what they're told. That is their that is their
mindset and, um, they have limited funds that they that they operate on and so they're they are fully responsible. It is their road. We have no say so in their roads. Well, if there's some way to contact whoever is in charge of that
decision making, um I think it's time for the people to maybe u have a conversation with them and and change the >> Everybody's welcome to do that. Yes, ma'am. >> Thank you, Sure. >> Yes. Um, I'll say this since I've been in and out of office back to and fro.
This is about the third group of uh management uh at the forestry level and this is by far the best group that we've had so far. They're more receptive to talk to you. They seem to care. They seem to have an interest. I know before
I felt like I was just ramming my head against the wall, but Mr. Suggs and I have met with Miss >> Serak Sakaric. >> Close enough. Um, anyhow, she's a very nice lady and she seems very concerned and more eager to help than than anyone
I've ever had from down there. So, I'm I'm excited about what we may have from her. >> And Pam, I wasn't trying to be pointed. I was just being that's the way it is over the years. It's very they've been very direct with us about those that particular issue. I used to work for the reason I know it is because I used to work for Representative Payne and when I
worked for Representative Payne before becoming an accounting commissioner I was in the meeting when Cat Kamock was there and Cat Kamik was not were in Congress then she worked for Ted Yoho's office and that was the conversation that was had and it it's continued to be had. I'm glad to hear that that
Commissioner Palisier is trying to tackle that as a newer commissioner. So yeah, but I please don't think I was being appointed. It's just something that's just like I'm a very direct person. So, I apologize if I come off strong. Um, M. Mr. Roberts, you have one more thing before we close. >> I might set the timer on you.
>> Last time. Go ahead. I just wanted to thank you guys for allowing us the opportunity to come here and petition our government. That's the one thing that's in our constitution. Very first amendment. So, I know I'm hard on you guys on radio shows. You guys are hard on me. It works out.
>> That's true. >> But, thank you guys. I think it's been a very productive meeting and I look forward to it working with you guys. And just so anybody knows that's listening, the boat is not for sale. If it ever gets shut down, it is getting donated to
the other boat in the Smithsonian. >> Okay. >> Two of them in the world. >> Okay. >> And there's a barge for sale. >> Thank you, ladies and gentlemen. >> Thank you. This meeting is adjourned. Thank you for coming.