--------- meeting to order and also let you know Commissioner Palisier is out today. Little health issue that arose. So if you will please stand. The re invocation will be led by Roger Phillips Ba Baptist Church and the pledge of allegiance
would be done by Commissioner Alexander this morning. Mr. Harvey, I was uh making a comment to you as I came in. you you talked about my shirt and uh so uh this was a gift uh that was given to me and it does make me a standout of sort I guess and so I'm
proud to wear it. Um, I was privileged to be able to visit uh in the country of Ivory Coast uh in West Africa and just have gotten back. And so uh I'm uh the reason that I bring that up though really is just the opportunity to travel
outside of the United States uh to to be involved in places that um are more challenged than we are in this country. And it gives us a great reason to uh to be thankful for the country that we live in. And so that's why I say that
although I uh was glad for the opportunity to to visit and to work with other pastors uh in Ivory Coast, uh it's a pleasure to be back here and maybe especially so since it's a Memorial Day weekend and we're celebrating that great holiday uh and thankful for the freedom
and the uh the independence that we have as a nation. So, I'm very thankful uh to this whole uh group of folks that are standing here for your willingness uh to help us to to live in a country that's uh something we can be very proud of. And so, let's pray together. Heavenly
Father, I do thank you Lord for the privilege of being here today uh for being able to say just a few words here this morning uh in thanks uh in appreciation uh first of all Lord uh for a country that is free. Uh it's not free
by accident. Uh it wasn't a mistake. Uh was very intentional and there was a great price that was paid. And so, Father, as we stand here this morning, uh help us to soberly reflect uh on the great uh privileges and blessings that
we have uh as a result of the payment and the sacrifice that was made u by many thousands, even millions of people. Father, help us to uh to recognize and to stand with pride uh as we look at our flag and as we look at the uh manifold
blessings that we uh experience uh each and every day perhaps uh me included that we take for granted. And so, Father, I thank you for this privilege. Thank you for this assembly. And I pray a blessing upon the proceedings that are here. Father, there are folks gathered
here uh in the room uh today uh that are dealing with a lot of issues and uh one uh in particular that I had the privilege of uh finding out a little bit about is uh those that are involved in drug court. And so, Father, uh pray for that organization. I pray for uh that uh
effort that is going forward to help people uh to deal uh with an addiction. uh my own family has been touched um by that and uh Lord I'm thankful that uh my father was able to uh uh to deal with
this addiction not to be cured from it but he was able to manage it and so father uh for these that are struggling and perhaps that way and others that maybe I don't even understand father I pray that you would uh just bless them and guide them lead them give them
strength and power Lord that I know that you are able to do be with each one that is gathered here this morning. And father, help us to stay focused uh on the on the reason and the cause that we've come. In Jesus name I pray. Amen. To the flag of the United States of
America and to the stands nationy andice for all. Thank you, Pastor Phillips, and thank you, Commissioner Alexander. Appreciate that very much. On our first item of business is the approval of minutes. The chair will entertain a motion.
I move to approve the minutes from the April 22nd board meeting. Proper motion. I second that. A proper second. Any further discussion on the minutes? Seeing none, all in favor signify by saying I. I. I. Opposed like sign. The eyes have it. Our first presentation
will be Judge Elizabeth Morris. If you'll meet me up front and um commissioners, I'll be right back. Doesn't have to be this quiet. No, you know they're not that quiet often. No. And when I when I start drug court, I say good morning. How are y'all this
morning? And they say good morning. Okay. You go, how are you? No. Putnham County Proclamation 2025-033 Problem-Solving Court Month. Whereas problem-solving courts have been
restoring lives, renewing, reuniting families, and making communities safer for more than 30 years. And whereas problem-olving courts provide focus and leadership for communitywide partnerships bringing together public safety, health professionals, and
combating substance abuse, mental illness, and other issues. present in the judicial criminal judicial realm. And whereas research shows that the problem solving courts improve treatment outcomes and do so at a lower cost than any other justice system strategies. And
whereas since its inception in 20 2002, 252 individuals has completed the requirements of the Putnham County Drug Court Program. And whereas judges, attorneys, treatment and rehabilitation professionals, law enforcement, community supervision, personal
research, researchers, and educators join to form the healing communities. And therefore, be it resolved that the Putham County Board of County Commissioners declare that drug court month be established during the month of May. Done, ordered, and
adopted. Mr. Commissioners, I move this resolution forward. I second that, Commissioner Harvey. Thank you. All in favor signify by saying I. I posted like sign. The eyes have it. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you.
Okay. Well, good morning and thank you um for having us once again. Um, I love to make my annual trip over here to talk with y'all about drug court. I was just looking at it last night and even I was amazed at this. This is my 15th year
leading the drug court um since Judge Nichols retired in 2011. And this is the most rewarding aspect of my week, my job, my day. Um, this is my heart. I love these people. I love this program.
You know, I love working uh with these folks to try to help them change their life and become productive citizens again and enjoy just the day-to-day stuff that you and I probably take for granted. Um, so they work really, really hard at this program. I just want to
tell y'all a little bit about the program for people who might be watching us, for Commissioner Newold, Commissioner Alexander. I'm not sure how much y'all know about our program. It's a four-phase program. It takes people somewhere between about 15 and 18 months to go through the program. That's if
they don't have any hiccups. But when they come into the program, they're allowed three years to go through the program. And some people, you know, graduate after two and a half years, a couple years or whatever. And that's fine. We like for everybody to take it at their own pace. But it's a uh phase
one of the program is pretty intensive. I mean, we ask you to change your people, your places, your things. Think about that. If somebody came to you today and said, "Okay, starting tomorrow, I want you to change the places that you go, the people that you hang around with, and the things that you do, I would be hardpressed, you
know, to do that. I'm setting my ways. I have my friends. I have my activities, you know. So, same for them. You know, they've got their friends and their activities. Some of them aren't productive for them. So, they've got to cut those things out of their life. We, you know, make them come to see
probation every morning. Um during phase one, they check in for drug screens at the hospital randomly. They now call at 5:00 a.m. in the morning to see if they have a drug screening at 7 a.m. So, they've got a really short window in time frame that they've got to deal with
that. They do a lot of counseling both group and individual. Um and I think that's probably one of the most important aspects of our program is the drug court treatment and we partner with Stuart Marchman um to do that. So, that's a really great program. They also run the residential programs that we
sometimes send folks to when they're having difficulty in you know maintaining sobriety in outpatient. So um that's another environment. I'm just the leader of a team. Okay. Um but I this is a team effort and without a team
effort this would not work. So I want to introduce to you um the team members that work with me and I'm going to just start right here. That's Mr. Sam um Frasier. He is with the he's an assistant state attorney. Then we have Mrs. Samantha Earl. She is assistant
public defenders. So we have a buyin from you know both our prosecutors and our defenders. We have Miss Susette Young Jackson. She is one of our drug court counselor. She's the lead drug court counselor. We have Miss Jackie Pollock. She is our drug court manager and she
excuse me drug court coordinator and she works closely with our folks every day. Then we have Mr. Pete Tuck. He is our other drug court counselor. And on the end we have Miss Vanessa Struck. She's with she's a probation officer and she works with us as well. Did I miss
anybody? Oh, Kristen Green. She is with Steuart Marchman. And we also have Nancy Russo in the back with Stuart Marchman. All right. So most of these people and most of these people sitting in the middle um here are drug court participants and a few of them would
like to just speak with you and tell you what drug court has done for them means for them you know how it has changed um their life. So I'm going to just turn it over to them and let them talk because what they have to say is much more important than anything I have to say. All right, who wants to go first? Okay,
come on, Nikki. I'm really nervous, so I wrote a few things down. Um, basically, I'm not going to go into a lot of detail on the bad things. Basically, a horse accident introduced me to opiates when I was 12 years old. That is where my addiction started. This was the beginning of a
very long, dark road for my family and I. You see, I'm the only addict in my entire family along with being the only child. This put a lot of pressure on the entire situation. Throughout the years, my mother did everything in her power to help me, but I was never willing to do the internal work. Eventually, the drugs
consumed every aspect of my life. I hated myself and everything around me. I walked away from everyone I loved because it was easier to run away from my problems than it was to face the pain in their eyes when they looked at me. I left my family, my kids, multiple jobs, my morals, and my values. I clung to
everything bad for me, and only that. I used to curse God when the sun would rise because I was still around to see it go up. Shame and guilt had completely taken over my life. This has sent me into a dark druginduced depression. This of course led to countless felonies followed by even more warrants and
violations, pages and pages of mugsh shot and finally prison. I was alone and broken with absolutely no hope for a future. My problems just kept accumulating and I had no idea how to fix them. So I kept doing what I always did. I ran from everything and everyone
that truly mattered. In 2019, while sitting in jail, I made one call. I didn't know at the at the time that that one call would change the whole tra trajectory of my life. My dad was diagnosed with stage four pancreatic cancer and only given six months to live. At this point, he hadn't talked to
me in years. That's when God spoke for the first time. I knew I had to do something different and I knew that that I couldn't do it on my own. This is where my recovery journey started. I got out of jail. I got clean. I joined church and I got saved. I went home to my family and I let go of most of my
friends, most of my places, and most of my things. I started repairing the life I had destroyed. At some point, I started to learn from my mistakes. Each one has taught me something new about myself and my path. I have failed more times than I would like to admit, but somehow, I kept finding the courage to
get back up. On May 28th of last year, I was arrested on 10 possession charges just one month after relapsing for the fourth time. The sudden loss of one of my favorite people sent me spiraling spiraling back to a place I swore I'd never go back to again. God spoke. I
knew prison wasn't the answer. I knew at the end of the day it wasn't going to change anything. I knew what needed changing was me. The one thing I thought I could never do was maintain a sober lifestyle in this town, which is exactly why it was the one thing I had to do for
myself. So, I asked for a chance and I viewed it as an opportunity. After hearing all the horror stories of drug court, I knew it was the one thing that was going to test my limits. I knew if anything was going to help me, it would be that. I am proud to say that I have taken full advantage of this program and
have allowed it to do what it is intended to do. I have allowed it to change my life. I will soon advance to the final phase and I hope to graduate in October and I plan on staying involved even after that. Drug court has given me the ability to operate at a deep deeper
level in life. It has given me the opportunity to focus on myself and to learn who I really am. I no longer get anxiety when I walk into a courtroom. I even look forward to my monthly appointments at probation. I take pride in following the rules and doing things just as I'm supposed to. I have a whole
team of people that believe in my future and are willing to help. Treatment has taught me the tools to redirect a thought before it becomes an action. It has taught me how to be honest with myself and given me the confidence to completely let go of the things and people that were holding me back. It has
taught me how to stay consistent in my recovery and how not to act on my emotions. It has taught me how to fight for myself and how to cope with the losses of life without allowing heartache to completely derail me. I've spent countless hours in Miss Susette's office. Some days crying, some days
laughing, and yeah, even some days arguing. I've always been stubborn, but I'm learning to be receptive at the same time. She has spent almost a whole year teaching me how to get out of my own way. And somewhere in the midst of that, I learned to like who I am. Today, I am a present mother, daughter, and niece.
Today, I am someone that can be trusted and depended on. Today, I stand firm on my faith and let God clear the path ahead of me. Today, I'm a beacon of light in the recovery community, and I do my best to do my part. Drug Court has taught me that I no longer have to run from anything. The only way to get
through it is to face it. That's why I'm standing in front of you today. Today, I have goals, a career, responsibilities, and a purpose in life. Drug Court has given me the opportunity to shine from within along with the tools to succeed on the daily basis. Today, my family listens when I speak, and they no longer
have to question my intentions or fear our future. And for that we will be forever grateful. Thank you. Thank you. And that gentleman is why I do this. All right. Who's next? Ward or Jess?
You did an amazing job. Okay. Yeah. It's all yours. Good. Good morning everybody. My name is Ward and I'm an act I'm active um addict and recovering alcoholic and
addict. Um I'm active in drug court because this is the last line. I've been to rehab, been to jail, and I've been doing drugs for many, many years. finally woke up to the fact that, you know, those people that I was hanging
around, I thought they were my friends. No, they're not. They're my associates. And I don't deal with them. My friends are right behind me. And um with it care of God and this program,
it's giving me my life back. It's actually makes me feel good to wake up in the morning knowing that I'm going through this program. Um This program is something that um wish I'd have known years ago. I wouldn't be here right now.
But there again, this is the way it is. And I want to thank each and one of you all for help this program staying on its feet and get get funded because it's saving my life and many other lives.
Thank you very much. Thank you. So Ward and and Nikki are current participants in drug court. The next person who's going to speak to you is Jess. And she's a recent graduate of our our drug court. So she's finished up and she's out living her own life, but she's here today to talk to you for a few
minutes. Come on up, Jess. This is kind I wish I'd went before Nikki. Her testimony was amazing. You'll be fine. But um so, you know, none of us um woke up one day and said, you know, I want to be an addict. Drugs are what I want to do. Um you know, I partied as a
teenager, you know, just having fun. And then I had some medical issues and some trauma and the drugs just, you know, fell into place and all of a sudden it was my whole life. Um I I woke up every day and um just prayed that it would be
over. Like I 100% thought that I would die an addict. Um when I was offered drug court um I only did it to get out of jail. I thought no way was this going to work. There's no way. Everyone told me don't take it. You know, you're going to fail. But I wanted out of jail. So I
took it and um immediately I put myself in a coma. uh you know got high when I got out and that was it. I said I'm going to I'm going to do this program to the fullest and it has completely changed every aspect of my life. Um I
now you know I have two jobs. Um I have my son full-time. I do everything you know at a responsible um part of the community, you know. And sorry. No, you're fine. Please. But uh
drug court 100% saved my life and it is I I recommend it for anyone who wants a change and for anyone you know it's it's possible. Good. Thank you. Thank you. Your honor, our chairman just walked in,
so I'm gonna pass the gavl. All right. And move to my seat. Okay. Okay. I'll bring my certificate up so that she can sign it while she's Good morning. Good morning. Judge Morris, this is my first exposure
to this. Um I've known Jess for about 30 years. Very proud of her. Yeah, we're we're very proud of her. We're proud of all of our graduates and you know, you've just heard the story of three people out of this program today, but every one of
them sitting behind me has a story, a similar story, you know, or a story that, you know, mirrors a lot of uh what's going on in the day-to-day life. And, you know, again, I ask y'all to continue to support us. Um, I know we've
always had good support from the county commission, and I so much appreciate that. That's why we come here every year and talk with you and, you know, let you know that we're still around. Let you hear uh what's happening with the tax dollars that y'all are spending on drug court and how Putnham County is getting
its payback, you know, out of that program. The recidivism rate for folks who have been through drug court is much lower than people who have not been through drug court. Um we have about a at least a 75 to 80% um deal where these people don't get
arrested again. they don't have any problems again. So, we can't ask for, you know, much more than that. But again, we thank you for having us and if you have any questions or any comments, be glad to hear them. I just want to say thank you. Thank you. Appreciate it. All
right, Commissioner. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, your honor, let if you'll stay there for just a moment. You know, I'm so glad that cameras weren't around when I was growing up here. And I'm and I lived the life that I could have been sitting right where you're at. I'm not going to
lie to you. Never got arrested. I think by the grace of God, I got out of certain things sometimes. But I'm going to tell you, I think the best thing that happened to me was I was 23 and wondering, Lord, what am I going to do? and I got married to a very strong woman
who there was and and we were poor so that was like you know there was no playing around. So I'm just saying you've got four commissioners five of us that sit up here all products of Putnham County. Some of us told that you'll
never amount to anything. Me being one of those you'll never amount. I was able to stand in the Oval Office of the President of the United States with my family and pray for our president, Donald Trump, the first time he was president. I'm going to tell you, the sky's is the limit in Putnham County.
I've always said this county, you can recreate yourself. Anytime you want to hit that button and recreate yourself, you can do that here because we understand. We truly do. And there's no amount of money. I mean, I know you you need more. Everybody needs more, right?
But 252 lives were changed in this program. That amounts to something. That means something and you can't put a price tag on that. So, your honor, thank you for stepping up and I appreciate all of you that are here in the audience today and some of those that couldn't be
here and the partners that we have that work with you to invest in people's lives to make you better. But it is like you said, you have to look in the mirror one day and you say, "It's on me. It's not on them. It's my fault that I'm where I'm at. Okay. And what can I do to
get out? And there's tools available in the tool chest to help you with that. Your honor, thank you. You'll go down and this will be your legacy when you finally retire, whenever that is. You'll be going, "Yes, I I I made a difference in hundreds of lives of people." No
doubt. And I thank you for that. I agree with you totally, Commissioner Harvey. This, you know, I hope this will be my legacy. I want it to be my legacy. I enjoy this. You know, I tell y'all every year how much I love this aspect of my job, more so than some others, but you
know, I I do it all. But this is my real passion right here, and these folks are my real passion, and I love working with them, and I love working with my drug court team. They're amazing. So, I got to ask you what Commissioner Harvey said. Um, you know, when I was elected,
you didn't elect an angel. You elected somebody from Putnham County that cared. Um, all of us up here have our faults, but we have all found partners in our lives that have supported us. And it takes that strong team and somebody that's going to support you and lift you
up. Um, I've been married 26 years. Leota, how where you at now? 36. Larry, so it takes a it takes Yes. It takes a lot of support and you need a teammate. If that's one piece of advice that I can give all of you, take it to heart.
We're so proud of this program. Thank you, Judge Morris. Would y'all like to get a picture or are you in the middle of your uh No, we can get a picture and then we're going to have to scoot out. Uh my folks need to get to work and I've got hearings as well. All right. Thank you. Come on up.
There we go. Stage. Stretch it a little more. All right. One, two, three. I'll see you back at the office. I'm not going to talk about it here. Congratulations. If you need me to step in, I'll be
Well, we have families, too, right? Thank you. We appreciate everybody being here today. We're going to move into our planning and development public hearing. All right. Uh, thank you, Madam Chair. Uh, for the record, Michael Graves, Planning and Development Services. We
will begin with reszone 25-0000003. Uh the applicant, Michael Thompson, is requesting a zoning map amendment from agriculture to commercial general on a 3.8 acre property located at 878 North State Road 21 in Melrose to allow the development of a large vehicle
storage facility. The surrounding zoning includes commercial general C3, commercial retail C2, and agriculture AG. Uh the subject site is has a future land use designation of commercial. The vacant parcel has approximately 240 feet
of road frontage on North State Road 21. And according to the National Wetlands Index wetlands layer and FEMA flood zone layer on the GIS reference map, the property does not appear to have any wetlands and is in FEMA flood zone X. Uh should the applicant's request be
approved, the applicant will then submit to development review committee DRC to satisfy the additional development requirements, the DRC shall review plans to ensure a development is compliant with local, state, and federal development regulations. Other agencies, including but not limited to the Putham
County Public Works, Emergency Services, and St. John's River Water Management District will review plans to ensure the development will not adversely affect affect surrounding properties by complying with each agency specific regulations associated with new development. Uh here you can see an
aerial at the time of application the two it was two separate properties indicating that blue line there. Uh it has now since been combined. Uh you can see the future land use is commercial here and the surrounding zoning is uh agriculture and mix of
commercial. Staff recommends approval of the request to amend the zoning map from agriculture to commercial general. staff finds that the proposed resoning is consistent with the goals, objectives, and policies of the adopted comprehensive plan and meets the location requirements of the commercial general zoning district uh provided in
the land development code and comprehensive plan. In their April 9th, 2025 meeting, the Putnham County Planning Commission unanimously recommended approval of the same. Any questions? Thank you. Are there any questions for the board? Commissioner Harvey. Thank you, Madam
Chair. I do have a question. You know, uh, I'm all in favor of this. Let me say that. But going from Agg to C3 is a very intensive jump. Uh, it's a big leap. C1 would have been good. C3 only allows us to have the truck parking. Is that the
deal? Uh, C3 is the lowest zoning district intensity that allows for truck parking, RV uh, storage and uh, boat storage as well. Uh, the idea is that this is for the storage of RVs, boats, and semi-truckss. And C3 is the lowest
intensity that that can be in. Okay. And it's going to be properly buffered and all. Yes sir. It will be required to have on the side of the agriculture a 20B buffer on uh the as you can see on the map there the west and south uh east and south sides. On
the north side where it is commercial too, it will require a 10A buffer. Uh this is for all intents and purposes an extension of the commercial general mini warehouse storage facility located across the state road 21. Okay. But at the same time again the the zoning runs
with the land. Yes sir. So once this is done it's going to be C3 and anything allowed in C3 is going to follow that land. That is correct. Uh but any development will need to meet those buffering requirements as well as make sure that it's not going to be too uh
hazardous to the local community. Uh as mentioned before, the DRC will ensure that uh any kind of storm water will be taken care of, buffering will be taken care of, uh road impacts, since it's a state road, the Florida Department of Transportation will weigh in to make sure that any like additional turn lanes
or anything will be established. Good. Thank you very much. Thank you, Madam Chair. Are there any other questions from the board? All right, this is a public hearing. Is there anybody who would like to speak for against this resoning? All right. Seeing none, we'll back to the board. Madam Chair, I'd like to make
a motion to approve the REZ25-00003 Thompson ordinance 2025-013 by title only. I will second that. All right, we have a motion and a second. Any discussion? All in favor say I. I. Motion
carries. All right, going into reszone uh the next one. Thank you again, Madam Chair. Once again, for the record, Michael Graves, Planning and Development Services. This is reszone 25-0000004. Uh, the applicants, Robert and Margaret Mara, are requesting a
zoning map amendment from commercial neighborhood C1 to residential R2 on a 2.8 acre parcel located at 130 Smith Lane in Crescent City to allow the development of a single family home. All surrounding zoning is residential, too.
The subject site is a future land use designation of rural residential. Uh it is a vacant parcel that has approximately 140 ft of access from Smith Lane. According to the National Wetlands layer of and the FEMA flood zone layer of the GIS reference map, the
lands do not appear to contain wetlands and is located in a mixture of FEMA flood zones X500 and AE with AE being a special flood hazard area. Uh should the applicant's request be approved, the applicant will then be eligible to obtain all proper permits,
including build permits and site work permits to establish their home. The property will also be eligible for all the all other developments allowed by Wright in the residential 2 zoning district subject to appropriate reviews and permits. Here you can see an aerial of
this very familiar property. uh the future land use the zoning uh staff recommends approval of the request to amend the zoning map from commercial one to residential 2. Staff finds that the proposed reszoning is
consistent with the goals, objectives, and policies of the comprehensive plan and meets the location requirements of the residential 2 zoning district in accordance with the land development code and comprehensive plan. In their April 9th, 2025 meeting, the Putnham County Planning Commission unanimously
recommended approval of the same. Any questions? Are there any questions from the board? All right, this is a public hearing. Is there anyone in the audience who would like to speak for or against this item? All right, seeing none, we're back to the board. I'd like to move to
approve this reszone request REZ2500000024 for Robert and Margaret Mara ordinance 2025-014. All right, we have a motion and I believe it's 04. Um, and a second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I.
I. Motion carries. Thank you. Before we go into the impact fee, we're going to take a a fivem minute recess. [Music] All right, we will reconvene the uh board of county commission meeting and the planning and development public hearing.
This is a public hearing. Um we have been informed that the uh consultant has had some travel delays. Um in the meantime though we will be able to listen to anybody who wants to speak regarding the impact fees and uh then we
will have her presentation at 1 p.m. today and you can also either speak then you can speak now and then or you can speak e one or the other. So, is there anyone um miss Madame Clerk? Madam Chair, do you need a motion to
move that to one o'clock? Yes, madame cler I mean Madam Chair, I'm sorry. Um I make a motion that we move our impact fee report to one o'clock certain today. Second. We have a we have a motion and a second. Any further
discussion? And I apologize. This is one of those things that happens in life sometimes. Um all in favor say I. I. So we will hear from the consultant and she will go through um all of the um presentation at 1:00. Again, anyone who speaks now is welcome to come back at
one if they want to. Um first we'll hear from Brandon Smiley. Good morning, council. Good morning. Brandon Smiley. I am an investor and home builder that has put a focus on trying to provide affordable housing to the Putnham County community. I am currently in opposition
of implementing impact fees at this time. The cost of construction is extremely volatile and if you combine that with current interest rates, the market is uncertain to say the least. The challenge of providing affordable housing is second to that of actually
affording it. I can stretch a dollar with the best of them, but I draw the line when it comes to jeopardizing my quality. I would like to find alternative methods to give back and invest in this community. But impact fees at this time would have an extremely detrimental
impact on my business and the local small businesses I support. That's it. Are you currently building in Putham County? Yes, ma'am. You are. And do you fall under the category of affordable housing? Um, I believe so. Okay. It's under 300,000. Okay. All right.
Thank you. Thank you. I ask a question. Yeah, you can ask a question. Thank Thank you, Madam Chair. Um last week in our Putham County Development Authority meeting um broached the topic of maybe some type
of grants for businesses to offset um the impact. What if that came down to workforce housing? What if that was an an idea? Would you still be against impact fees if there was some type of
a you know grant program for workforce housing for certain individuals? Yes, sir. I would absolutely be open to um anything of that sort. I was a little nervous that I would, you know, being a smaller business than let's just say like the bigname home builders like Dr.
Horton or whatever, I was afraid that I would fall into that category of just eating a bunch of impact fees for properties I already bought. Thank you. But I'm open to any sort of collaboration with the county. I'm not saying it's going to happen. I'm just saying it's an idea that was broached the other day and it's, you know,
something that might could be considered for workforce housing. Yeah. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner Alexander. Commissioner Harvey, can you define workforce housing for the gallery? You know, I wish I could. I can tell you that when I was when I was starting out,
workforce housing was $25,000. you know, I'm hearing reports of 300,000 is that an affordable house wouldn't be for me even in my market today. And I don't mean that bad. I'm just saying. Um, so I don't know what that word
means. And but I know that we've got to help those who help us. And I'm thinking the firefighters, the police officers, the law enforcement, the first responders, uh, the nurses, the doctors maybe. I don't know what that means, but there's got to be some level that we can
say this is what workforce housing means to us. Absolutely. Absolutely. Because you know most people don't know what the um county commissioner salaries are. So we are below most salaries in this room. So we
are very aware of how difficult things are to afford and the cost. So we understand that before we make any of these decisions they won't be made lightly. Understood. Thank you. Thank you. David Miner. David Miner, 116 Sheffy Road. Uh, I've
talked to a lot of people about this thing and and I understand where we need the impact fee, but I also have know that there's some other counties and done some different things where they can uh give an exemption for somebody that's owned a piece of property like 15 years and they've been paying property tax on all that time and the fact is
that they got nothing for it. So, you know, I'd like to see some places where there could be exemptions on it. You know, if they bought it for an investment and they've been paying property tax on it and, you know, they've done nothing with it and really get no service for it. So, they've got some equity in in in the big ball of
things helping pay for the county. Um, I don't like the impact fee, but I understand where it's necessary, but I also would rather see y'all look into other things. uh a lot of people just not going to be uh it's not going to help them out. And the fact is we've
already got places that uh nobody pays property tax because of the exemptions and stuff like that. I know this gets out of your wheelhouse, but the fact is if everybody paid something on property tax, that would resolve y'all's problem of paying for these uh water treatment sewer treatment plants such as that,
you'd have a bigger bank account to to work with and everybody could share the cost. If that didn't work, even another penny sales tax on everything, not just gas, but on everything and go to that I did some figuring on that would give you a whole lot more money and everybody
that would be involved in that, even people that's from out of town, here on vacation or here visiting or stuff like that. Would we individually see that money out of our pocket? Probably not until you, you know, buy big purchases and stuff like
that. But I understand where it's needed, but I'd like to see us look at other avenues and if you have to do the impact fee than some exemptions in it. So, okay. Thank you, Michael
Woodward. Good morning, sir. Good morning, Madam Chair, commissioners. Michael Woodward, 517 South Francis Street, Interlockan. I want to express my support for the initiative to institute impact fees in Putnham County. Uh I will support impact
fees no matter how you do them. Uh but as we've heard from a couple other people, there may be some adjustments that can be made about how we do them that uh could be helpful. Some people say that impact fees are just another tax. That's not true.
They're a way to keep taxes from going up on everybody by ensuring that the development that creates the sort of impact that requires the extension of additional additional capital infrastructure pays for that itself rather than making all the rest of us
pay for it, subsidize it upfront. Sometimes you'll hear the argument that uh well, anything that increases the tax base is going to is good. Well, that's not really true. It's somewhat true with commercial development because eventually commercial development will
pay its own way. Uh in the meantime, we still would the rest of the tax base would still have to dig down to subsidize the upfront costs for the infrastructure to provide the services. But for residential development, it's
never true that residential development uh by adding to the tax base creates a fiscal boon for the county or the existing taxpayers. It does the opposite because residential development always costs more on a year-to-year ongoing
basis for the services it requires than what it pays in taxes. So that's before you even think about the initial hard hit of the investment in the additional infrastructure required to extend services to that
development which that development and the people who live in that development will demand and are entitled to from day one. What I have suggested briefly on a previous occasion and just want to reiterate is that you consider a tiered
system of impact fees on residential development. The majority of the counties surrounding Putnham County have a tiered system of impact fees, a tiered scale, so that
smaller houses pay a smaller impact fee compared to larger houses. The justification for that is that statistically larger houses tend to support more residents. They have more people in them. Now, I know we all know
the exceptions. We all know the little house that has a family of 10 living in it. And we all know the big two-story mansion that has just one old lady and a lot of cats. But statistically, the data shows that on average bigger houses have
more people. And it's really the people that create the impact. It's okay. Go ahead. You might not think you you might not think so in some cases like with fire or something like that, but actually most fires are caused by the people who live in the house through cooking or leaving
devices on chargers or using hair dryers or whatever. So the fair thing to do is to have a tiered scale like most of the counties around us do. They do that for a reason. There's a reason they do that
and that would be consistent with the goal of supporting more affordable housing such that the smaller, less expensive houses would be paying a lower impact fee than would the larger, more luxurious ones. So, uh, that's what I came to say
this morning, but if you have any questions for me or any arguments to push back at me, I'd be glad to respond. Thank you, Mr. Woodward. Thank you. Mr. Benji Bates. Good morning. Benji Bates, 3400 Crow
Avenue, Palaka, Florida. Um, just to add to what Mr. Woodard said, "I did look and there was a national study by the American Farmland Trust and that showed that um for every $1 in tax revenue that residential development cost um it uses
about $150 to $1.75 in public services. In contrast, commercial and industrial development often generate $2 to $3 in tax revenue for every $1 in services it consumes." Um, I'm here today on behalf of the Putnham County Chamber of Commerce and our board of directors uh
voted for full support of the impact fees. We know that growth is coming to this community and without a structure in place to management, the cost will fall on the backs of residents and businesses that are already here. Um, again, we don't want to slow growth. We want to grow in the smart ways. Our
board also unanimously recommends that the county preserve the ability to set aside a portion of impact fee revenue for the future targeted economic development efforts, specifically those that bring highways, jobs, and expand the tax base. We're asking the board to
maintain flexibility when a formal policy is in place and the right opportunity arises. Um, communities don't rise on hope alone. They rise on infrastructure planning and the courage to invest in themselves. Passing impact fees is part of that. So is planning for what comes
next. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Moving back to the board. Um again, we will have um the pres presenter here at 1:00 this afternoon. And um I guess that's all we have for now. Is there anybody else in the audience who would like to speak
regarding impact fees? All right. Again, uh we will um have our impact fee report has been rescheduled for 1 pm today. Moving on into public comment on agenda
items. This portion of the agenda is designed to allow citizens an opportunity to bring matters to the attention of the board. It is not reasonable to expect that the board will engage in debate or deliberation about matters in which the board has received no prior information as part of the agenda. Please limit your time to three
minutes. Public comment cards are conveniently placed on the meeting room entrance and should be submitted prior to the meeting to the deputy clerk who sits to the right of the podium. Madame clerk, do you have any public comment cards on agenda items at this time? All right. Is there anybody who wants to speak on agenda items? Both consent or
new business? All right. Moving into um consent. Um is there any commissioner would like to pull anything? Um Commissioner Alexander? All right. Commissioner Newold, Commissioner Harvey, I have none. And I have none. Madam chair, I'd like to move
consent agenda items A, B, C, D for approval. All right, I'll second that. We have a motion and a second. Any further discussion? All in favor say I. I. Motion carries. All right. New business. Who's handling the first item? I am.
Yes, ma'am. Thank you. Thank you, Commissioner. Um, we had an opportunity um to purchase some used floating docks in good conditions and have proposed um utilizing those docks at three of our locations, Drayton Island, Boswick Boat
Ramp, and Veterans Memorial Park. As these are our high utilization areas that do not currently have um these types of assets or facilities for our patrons, um we did receive a cost per location that's outlined. The sum total
of all locations is 619. So just just under 62. Um and that will be a single source procurement for the same entity that assisted us with Pico Boat Ramp as well as direct owner purchases through metal um pullback manufacturing to allow
us to save that sale those sales tax dollars. So we're looking for um feedback and approval to move forward from the board. All right. Uh Commissioner Alexander, you recognized? Absolutely. I'd like to commend staff. Excuse me. You guys have enough trouble hearing me without the mic
on, but definitely want to commend staff. Um, that was a very strategic purchase. Um, I I bought docks. I live on the river. I know how expensive they are. That is a fantastic purchase for those three for
$60,000. Um, just wanted to tell you guys thank you for working hard finding a strategic way to spend our dollars. Mr. Harvey, thank you, Madam Chair. And I I also want to say the Veterans Memorial Park that's on the east side of the bridge over in East Palaca. You
know, we did a lot of work on that that um road going into that because the hurricane wiped it out. Um there was some issues there. But I will tell you that place, you can't drive across the bridge without seeing lots of people over there using that. I think this is
just going to be an asset for our community to have it over there and another opportunity to enjoy the St. John's River. So, I appreciate that and I'm in supportive of all this. Thank you, Commissioner Newald. Yeah, just I want to pile on with the support. I
appreciate the strategic placement of these throughout the county. I've already had two calls from different parts of the county um that kind of got wind of this and we're very appreciative. So, thanks for giving a lot of thought and uh to the project. Thank you. Thank you.
Um I also want to say that this is a good this is a good project. Um, I know I had somebody reach out to me about the one in Boss Week. There was some concerns. Um, yes, you can put a boat in at Boss Week. I've done it myself by myself. So, I can assure you if I can do
it, anybody can do it. And um you do um might have to duck depending on the on the height of the water whenever you go under the bridge, but you can uh definitely put a boat in there. And um a floating dock will be a great asset to that small area. And and especially
Veterans Park. Oh my goodness, Veterans Park is going to it, like Commissioner Harvey said, it gets utilized all the time and people will definitely be using that that part of it. So, I'm excited for this and and I appreciate all the hard work that went into it and the forethought. With that, back to the
board. Madam Chair, I'd like to make a motion that we approve the uh floating dot project of [Music] $61,913.14 resolution 2025-035. I'll second that. We have a motion second. Any further discussion? All in
favor say I. I. All right. Moving on to sanitation. Mr. J. Tilton. Good morning. Good morning. Morning. Wanted to bring to you all have a conversation about um as we're looking to uh optimize our operation and the different things that we do. One of the
things that we're looking at is wanting to close the Huntington and Inarin drop off sites on Mondays and then extend the hours the rest of the week to allow folks to come in. This will allow us to do a couple things. One, um it'll allow us to give our employees a two-day uh a
two-day weekend, which is something that we really have to focus on. If you look at our turnover rate, especially in the sanitation department, um it's it's staggering, be honest with you, with what it is. As someone who came from corporate America who actually measured those metrics, um we need to take every opportunity we can to try to get our
employees a little bit better. Um, and so the other thing though when you look at we are the only county in the northeast Florida area that actually has universal curbside pickup and have those sites open six days a week. Most places or all places that offer universal
pickup in in our North Florida area, they're only open four days a week. A lot of the ones that don't offer curbside pickup at all, and that's their structure for picking up their garbage, is only open five days a week, and we have ours open six. Um, but we understand that we don't want to necessarily take away from our ability
to serve our citizens. So, that's why we want to extend the hours. It allows us to work towards our 410 initiative and have that schedule set in place a little bit better. Um, and we also feel like that there will be a little bit of savings. Garbage just doesn't pile up. I've found in the business if you're if
you're off a day or whatnot, you're not going to double up the next day for some reason. It just kind of levels itself out. So, we do feel like we will set have some savings, especially with the initiative that we put in place with the pre-cressure dumpsters and stuff to allow us not to have to haul as many loads going forward. So, I wanted to
bring that for you to today. We do feel like it's a will be a benefit and are recommended that we do this. Um, but of course, I wanted to bring it into your commissioners to have this discussion and get your approval. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Tilton. Commissioner Harvey, you're recognized. You knew I was going to talk about this. Come on.
I applaud you for doing this, but I will say it it concerning to me as you well know the perception is that West Putnham gets dumped on a lot out in the woods and we do. And what would that perception be if we closed on Monday? I
don't know that. Sure. I like the idea of extended hours. I like the idea that you're trying to fix the scales out there that's been needing to be done for over 12 years that I've known about. And let me let me on those we are so we had a contractor that said I can fix them
because those those scales have been here forever. I mean they they were here in the early 80s. Um he we have parted ways because we couldn't meet he couldn't get that done and we were looking at a new scale. So it might be I have to come back and just replace them in some form or fashion. Well I think
we're going to have to join the 21st century in garbage collection and and and believe me this is not a convenience. It's a collection site. And I've made that very clear in my career. It's more convenient to pile it up by the road and let Waistro pick it up. But that ain't going to happen in some of
this stuff. Sure. And my concern is only on my concern for Monday is that we get a lot of out oftowners that come down and then they do they go to the dump on Monday after they spent the weekend remodeling their place or something. I don't I don't know that if they do. I
call it the dump. I'm sorry. I remember driving the truck down to the bottom of the pit when I was a young kid. So, but I don't mind this. I do want to ask when is this going when would you we would want to put it into effect July 1st so that we had plenty of time to put signs
and everything like that. Why wouldn't we just wait till the fiscal year starts in October and and do it then? And that would give us a lot of time. I'm just asking. I don't commissioner I don't understand what would be the difference between starting now and starting I mean
the time is the time is are you are you wanting some sort of study or uh because I mean the day Monday is not our busiest day but it's not our slowest day right so I don't know that it will make that much of a difference uh and especially now when we're trying to align with our
410 initiative it helps us to go ahead and get in that direction you probably already know your customers on Monday anyway sir so with a flyer with signage and that's why we were wanting to, you know, the the 1 of July that gives us what 30 days, you know, plus 35 days to
get that out, have those discussions, let them know what we got going on and then and then that we will be, you know, we're extending hours. If you look from an hour perspective, they lose a half hour during the week is all that we're losing time open is is a half an hour. I don't have a problem with I trust you
and I trust your ability. I trust our staff. It's just a matter of perception that you know what's going to happen. And and again, you know, it's hard enough to clean up Putinham County, West Putham included. And um there's just so many opportunities to go down a dirt
road, pull off into the woods, and dump it and leave. And I have no doubt that we're going to show up one day and stuff's going to be thrown out at the gate. But I'll handle that as as our department always does. And that probably would happen. And would that be the worst thing in the world? Probably not. But we don't encourage that. I
understand. But, you know, if it's, you know, I always say people don't go to the the collection site or the landfill and return full. They want to be empty by the time they go home. That's right. So, and and I understand that. So, but you know, let me let me say this while I
sell the floor. I was telling a young man the other day, we were talking about roads and I remember I had an old Ford pickup truck. Uh, column shifted on the column. when you threw the column shifter on the seat as you down the road because you didn't need it anymore. Just stuck it in when you did need it. But
the whole community put the garbage in that truck. All my neighbors did. And on Saturday morning, you go to the dump and you'd unload your truck and throw all the neighbors garbage in the hole. And then then you'd come back and get the bed springs and you'd drag the roads out
there around your neighborhood because they needed to be drugged. They've been a week now since we did, you know, so times have changed a lot, but But we still that's with the old days there. I'll just end with that. But I I do appreciate it. I understand the concern
and if we can give our residents enough time warning, then I'm I'm sure I'll be for it. So Yes, sir. Thank you. Commissioner Alexander, you're recognized. Thank you, Madam Chair. Mr. Tilton, what uh what are the hours currently? 8 to 5 or 8:30 to 5. 8:30 to
5. Yes, sir. So, and the new hours are going to be 7:30 to 5:30. Okay. So that's going to give folks an opportunity that work a regular shift and regular job time to come in in the morning before or potentially after work and get a window there because a lot of
the people out there in those areas are are workingass folks that work regular jobs. So um that sounds like a win-win to me and like you said you're going to publicize it. I'm sure Laura's going to put something out as well. Um yeah, I think I think that's a great idea. I
think it's good and it's going to like you said align with the 410s that you that initiative you guys are pushing and currently you said those folks only had one day off a week Sundays. Yes, sir. Well, what we do is we have they have a Wednesday or Thursday off, right? But they never have a two-day weekend. Yeah,
I remember those days when I was in the car business. It's rough on your family. Yes, sir. Yep. So, yeah, I think that would definitely contribute to your retention as well. So, okay. Those are the questions I had. Thank you. Yes, sir. Mr. Suggs. Administrator Suggs. Thank you, Madam Chair. Just wanted to
uh have a follow-up conversation and sounds like I probably uh don't need to from what I'm hearing now, but I'm going to tell you this absolutely falls in line with what we're trying to do with the retention plan. Uh we've had really good.
chair and I appreciate Commissioner Alexander and Mr. Suggs. It's always how we craft the message. Correct. You know, um if we say we're just going to be closed on Monday to enjoy a two-day week, nah, that ain't going to work. If we say we're going to be open for
extended hours and for before you go to work and after you get off work, that's a good point right there. So I think it's always about the message that we craft because the unintended consequences that we have in our business is a lot. Sometime we try to do
what we think's the right thing and we find out that oh man didn't think about that. But I do think the message is we're going to be open extended hours. We're going to let our employees enjoy a two-day weekend and we're going to be more accommodating to your to the needs
that you have. I think that go because to be honest with you, we're not in Spain where we shut down at two o'clock. We don't get a siesta. Yeah. For But I'd like to because it's too hot to be out there two o'clock. Is that a motion? You want that to be I second.
Does the employees want to be No. But I I appreciate I do. And I think the message if we craft it properly, people will accept that message and understand that we're not trying to take something away from them when we're giving them more opportunity to to be better. So, thank you. It'll be crafted as such. And
I think it's a cost savings like we talked about where the equipment, the gas, and the hauling back and forth and and also um for our um for our staff because like you said, maybe it would reduce the the turnover rate. I think that's very important. And um for some for those who don't have the package, I
do want to let you know um Mr. Tilton has given us some information about what some surrounding counties are doing. I think it's fair that the public knows this. So Klay County has three sites and they're open Thursday through Saturday only and 7:30 to 5:30. So we're still
doing more than them. Elatchua County is open Monday, Tuesday, Friday, and Saturday. Um closed on Sunday and Thursday. And then Marian County, who does not offer any kind of curbside pickup, is open Monday, Wednesday, Saturday, Friday, and Sunday. So they're
closed Tuesdays and Thursdays. So what we're doing here is not unique. There's other counties around us that um close more than one day a week. Um so I feel like that we're falling in line a little bit, but we're also extending hours to our citizens. And I think that's very important to what Commissioner Alexander
said is, you know, somebody's getting off shift work and they they know they've got their trailer loaded up at the house, they can drop it off and then go home, take a shower, and go to bed for the day. And for somebody who's um got off at 4:00 4:30 and they still have time to run to the dump, I still call it
the dump, too. Um the landfill, and uh get get their business taken care of. So, I think it's great. And I do obviously will always care about our um our employees and and our citizens. And I think that's what we're trying to do here is take care of both of those. So
with that, it's back to the board. Do we need to make a motion on those, please? Okay. I'd like to make a motion uh that we do approve the Monday closures at Huntington and Interlock and Solid Waste and Recycling Centers per Mr. Tilton's
recommendation. We have a motion on the floor. Second and a second. All in favor say I. I. I. Motion carries. Thank you. Thank you very much. You didn't slip that yesterday. You thought it was going to be a lot worse than that. Moving into public comment on miscellaneous items.
This portion of the agenda is designed to allow citizens an opportunity to bring matters to the attention of the board. It is not reasonable to expect that the board will engage in debate or deliberation about matters on which the board has received no prior information as part of the agenda. Please limit your time to three minutes. Public comment
cards are con conveniently placed at the meeting room entrance and should be submitted prior to the meeting to the deputy clerk who sits to the right of the podium. I think I should be able to say that my sleep. Um, do you have any cards? Is there anyone who would like to speak on anything that we have not
spoken on today? Any miscellaneous items? All right, moving into appointments. Commissioner Alexander, do you have any appointments? I have none. Commissioner Newald, yes, I have one. Um, I would like to put forward the name of John Maluda of Waka for the planning
commission. Planning commission. What was it again? John Maluda. Okay. All right. And you'll get with um, Miss Laura. She has. She has it. All right. Mr. Harvey, do you have any? I have. All right. And for the library board, uh, district 2, I believe
you received the care the Karen Lang application. Okay. Okay. I'd gotten an email that you had, but we'll go we'll circle back. But that would be my recommendation for district two. All right. Clerk of courts, Mr. Clerk Reynolds. Good
morning, Madam Chair. Um, I'd just like to take a a quick moment real quick to uh to thank county staff. Uh, a member of my staff, Mrs. Julie Mlan, our our project manager, uh recently met with uh county staff and the building and permitting department in regards to our um customer service building upgrades
that we're working on and and she relayed that they were extremely helpful and and um extremely beneficial to meet with them. So, I just wanted to extend my my thanks to them and and my thanks to uh Mrs. Mlan. So, that's all I have
this morning. Thank you. Thank you. I do want to say real quick that your um what is it your your on your website that tells people if something's been recorded? What's the name of it? Uh it's we call it the property fraud alert system, but it it really it just detects
a name if anything's recorded with it. So that happened to me and I had I I looked something up real quick and it wasn't me. It was another person similar name. Similar name. But anyway, it caught it. And so I just want to say that was it caught the it was the other Leota Wilkinson and Boston week, but it
caught it and and I was like very taken back. I was like, "Yeah, this thing is working." So, good job on that. That's good to hear. Thank you. County attorney is not here. Um, county administrator, I have no further comments, Madam Chair. Thank you. Thank you. Commissioner comment starting with uh to my to my
left, Commissioner Alexander. I have no comments today. Wow. Okay. Well, we're coming back at one. We'll be back. We'll be back. Okay. Commissioner Newold. All right. And uh
Commissioner Harvey. Well, you know, since we're going to wait till 1, I'll wait till 1. So, all right. Thank you. And I have none either. All right. With that, this meeting is adjourned and recessed. This meeting is recessed and we will reconvene at one o'clock to hear um impact fee. Thank you. Part: 2
Go right into presentation. It's basically service. Awesome. Is it Jacksonville? treatment uh supply uh storage uh and transmission costs for
water and waste water. You know, that's kind of my question, but you know, we're going to have to have additional pump trucks and such like that. And some of those are in excess of $100,000. So yeah, those those would typically be through through user rates because they have smaller lives. Usually the vehicles and equipment are not included in the in
the fee calculations because because they have shorter service lives. Mr. Harvey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um along those lines, we are actively putting in water and wastewater piping
right now. Would this been would this impact the people that are connecting at this moment or is this just new construction only as when if you adopt these fees any
time that there is a a building permit um issued and and that's when you would the fees are paid that's when they would pay. Okay. the building permit is is so you've got a home there and you've got a septic and you've got a well and you're
wanting to hook to our system, you would not pay an impact fee, but your neighbor building the house right beside you would pay that impact fee. No, people connecting to the system would pay the impact fee. So, you would pay it? Yes. Yes. If you're if you are connecting to
the to the system and and um you know and usually uh utilities will have a mandatory connection policy that says that if you're if you're uh if a if a if a transmission main or some main is is within a certain amount uh a certain
distance you have to connect to the system. Uh but yes, you would you're you would pay into the capacity of that system. Well, in theory, that sounds really good, and I think state policy or law makes that happen, but it doesn't
happen that way. And we're out running pipes right now, promising people to take their well and septic and bring it into our system, and now we're going to go out there and say it's going to cost you $8,000 or whatever that case may
be. I I don't Unless I'm missing something here. Commissioner, I think that the difference would be that the program that we have going is for existing residents who are on a septic system and
that we're trying to encourage to come off of that septic system. They wouldn't be assessed an impact fee because they're a current resident resident. That's we're not building a new structure. We're we're taking the existing structure off and changing the
venue by which they're disposing of waste. Did I hear you say hookup and not new construction? Right. Yes. If if if there's a Yes. Typically, unless unless you have a legal way of of of saying that you know that that you
have the you don't have to they don't have to pay an impact fee. Um that would be the and then then yes they would normally pay an impact fee to buy into the capacity of the system. Mr. Suggs. Yes ma'am. Just for a little more clarity if I can. The county currently
has a connection fee in place uh impact fee connection fee whatever. But there's currently an a connection fee in place. uh for those folks that we've been running the lines and the backbone to the board at one point though waved those connection fees because we were
trying to get those those services online get the septics and all that off the off the river so to speak but there is a connection fee already in place for those folks I guess what Mr. Harvey is saying is asking is are we going to force those
people which you said with if it's in within a certain distance of that lane to pay that impact fee and abandon their well and septic tank are they compelled to do that if we in it if if you if and I I'll ask the the the legal do you know
if the county has a mandatory connection policy I don't believe we do uh it's a state law but I don't think that the county has has gone down that road. Uh that will be a discussion if they would like to look at that later. But like I said,
uh previously uh those folks that were putting the infrastructure in place through the grants and all that, we've waved those connection fees at this point to try to encourage them to go ahead and tie into the system. And those connection fees are I know we've already established that at last year at the budget cycle, but I can't remember what they are. Do you have that or can you
find that? and uh to our audio. Um I'm getting a text saying that the people who are watching this cannot hear us. So I'm not sure if you can do something with that on for the IT department, please. Um existing lot of
record they were getting rid of their septic tank on the current lot is what you guys waved last year in your fee schedule so that somebody that had a a septic system that was failing or whatever they could tie into the system at notional cost.
you guys did wave that portion of it last year, but they wanted to make sure that it captured new construction coming in because otherwise it's like giving somebody a new septic system, right? So, that was that was a caveat that you guys have put on there. That's where that fee was waved. It's the same fee that he's approached now is what's currently in
our fee schedule is $8,000 a hookup, which is what is currently in our fee schedule. Now, we have waved it for the water management district when doing the subject to sewer conversions. um by the agreement we're not allowed to charge them that because we got grant funding. That's correct. And I as part of the
exclusion of the grant, they won't allow us to charge the resident impact fee um or a connection fee. Um so we're saying this same. So So that's where that originated from was just trying to get all those septics off where it had to be waved from the water management district, but it is in the state statute
or the D says if there's sewer in front of your home, you have to connect. So, the way they've been enforcing that is is if a resident's sewer system has failed at their home, they won't issue them a new
permit to to put a new septic system in in front of their home. They'd have to join into our system once it's established and in front of their residence, but that's what it says in front of your the in front of the residence. I believe that's also the same way the city of PLA does it. So, if there's an existing functioning sewer
and septic, then they're going to be allowed to continue until such time it fails and then they will be That's correct. Yes, sir. That's but the the rules you're supposed to give them 365 days when it comes in front to do it, but nobody's enforced it. Sure. Sure. Commissioner Newald,
um, so if initially these impact fees are are set and accepted, what is the the process for changing that fee? either reducing it or or or making it greater when that's
necessary based on additional growth. Well, the the greater I think would need to be you would want to have it have supported for support for a for a for you'd want to have a a study support it uh just just you know for for for to
just to make sure that it's defensible. But as far as any user rates or impact fees, you know, I always tell that, you know, commissioners are always in in charge. You can always choose to lower uh lower. You just, you know, can't
um uh you can't uh increase them without, you know, a public hearing. Without a public hearing, a new a new impact fee study and within four years. Correct. Is there a four year something? What's a four? Not for water, wastewater.
um those those requirements don't um aren't applicable to water and wastewater fees. And we've gotten a lot of illegal opinions because there's a part in the the the the Florida impact that says, you know, this section does not apply to
water and sewer connection fees. And by connection fees, you know, we've gotten lots of uh legal opinions that that that actually refers to impact fees. So you can the the water and and sewer impact fees can be um you know increased or
decreased as as needed. Um you can decrease it at at any point but any ines you would you would want to you know build some sort of support for it. Do I am understand correctly that there are limits to which you can raise it at any
given time. Not well for for just about every impact fee except for water and wastewater because there is a section in except for in that statute that says this doesn't apply to water and sewer. Okay. Connection fees. Okay. I'm sorry I missed that.
Okay. Are there any other questions for the presenter? All right. I really don't not not related to water sewer. Okay, that's fine. We we've still got another presentation. I think you're done. You're good. Okay. Yes, sir. Thank you. Good afternoon, Commissioners.
Negan Camp with Benish. Good afternoon. Uh, as Brian said, you you saw this presentation in detail in April. So, this is a quick summary of it. Um, again, just in terms of
background, the county is continuing to experience growth. So, that's putting pressure on the infrastructure and your impact fees were placed under moratorium in 2006. So this uh in addition to utilities, we are
reviewing the five service areas. By definition, impact fees are one-time capital charge to new development. They cover the cost of new capital facilities. They cannot be used for maintenance or renovation, but they do free up general tax dollars. So they
indirectly help those programs as well. They help implement capital improvement plans. And their main purpose is to maintain the level of service. They calculate the cost of growth and they are most needed when there are high growth levels and limited alternative
funding. Is that better? Oh, a lot better. So, in Florida, impact fees were governed by case law since 1980s. So it basically the key requirements are that they need to demonstrate that fees are
proportionate to the need created by new development and the fee payers receives the benefit. So it's achieved through benefit districts as needed and also list of capacity addition projects either in your capital improvement plan or in terms of a master plan. But just
to show that what will be built with these fees once collected. Uh in 2006 we had the impact fee act passed. Since then it had several changes. Some of its key requirements are that the fees be based
on most recent and localized data. There's a minimum of 90-day notice requirement once they are increased or adopted. If there's any challenge, now the government has the burden of proof that to show that their fees are correct. Um, and this is the limit you
were referring to. In 2021, we had um House Bill 337 passed and it placed limits on fee increases. So, this applies to existing fees. So it doesn't apply to you currently but once you adopt your fees it will apply. So it's
so basically it requires phasing of increases and it limits the increase to 50% and also fees cannot be increased more than once every four years. There's an exception clause that says if the community demonstrates extraordinary
circumstances those are discussed at two public workshops and the increases approved by twothird of the governing body then increase can be more than 50% and phasing doesn't have to be according to this schedule and the fees can be increased more frequently. Now we have
one bill that's out there that that's unrolled. It's not signed yet. uh but if it is signed um it becomes effective October 1st it makes uh the use of this extraordinary circumstances clause a lot
harder and it requires unanimous vote of the governing body. So if approved if signed the the bill itself becomes effective in October that section becomes effective in January. And then last year we had House
Bill 479 passed. In cases when in a city when both the city and the county collect for transportation impact fees, it requires that they enter into an interlocal agreement and basically to show that there's really no double charging. Um and it also requires
studies to be completed adopted in 12 months and also they need to use data available within the past four years. Uh as far as the uses of revenues again they cannot they are for capital capacity addition they cannot be used
for maintenance renovation. So examples uh may include obviously under transportation new roads lane additions intersection improvements dirt wave on collectors and above rightway purchase roundabouts anything that improves the
speed of travel. Basically transportation level of service is measured in terms of speed of travel. So we are adding capacity if we are uh funding an improvement that improves that speed of travel, reduces the congestion. In the case of fire rescue
that could be new stations, ex expansion of existing stations, land, new additional vehicles and capital equipment, not again not replacement but additional law enforcement. Uh your law enforcement includes only the vehicles.
So it would be the new additional vehicles and capital equipment. Uh in the case of government buildings again new buildings expansion of existing buildings land parks and recreation examples would include again
parkland building of recreational facilities. The study is using what we call a consumption based methodology which charges new growth for the value of the infrastructure that it's consuming and it guarantees that we are not charging new development for existing
deficiencies. And the basic formula looks at cost to add capacity. That's your the value of your inventory. Um to the extent that taxes and other revenue sources are being used a portion will come from future development. So that amount is subtracted. So we are not
charging him twice and that net cost is multiplied by demand which is measured in terms of travel for transportation and population for other fees. So again just to kind of show you a summary um this these are example land uses and
this chart excludes water and wastewater. So you can kind of see single family is about 7,700 and the larger portions are roads and government buildings. Um this is this was in response to a question and we can talk more about it
during Q&A but we were asked to potentially develop a example of a tiered single family. So typically uh single family residential is charged per dwelling unit and we can have size categories that differentiate basically
smaller homes lesser impact. Uh it's as far as I know I never seen a schedule where it's exactly per square foot. It's just because it's hard to justify by increasing one square foot there's a bigger benefit.
Um and then this chart shows all fees including water and wastewater. So that would be about almost 16,000. And again the larger ones transportation wastewater followed by water. Again, the study addressed the five service areas in addition to
utilities. In each one of them, again, we documented the inventory, reviewed the service area, level of service, estimated the value of that inventory, accounted for any alternative funding that's being contributed to the same type of projects, calculated the demand
and the fee. And I just have few slides just showing the results or I can even stop here and go to the summary. But in the case of fire rescue, single family home is would be about $920. And in these comparison charts, we
wanted to include the study date so you have a sense how old some of the studies are and then also the assess portion which is the policy option of reducing the fee. So this group of counties charge anywhere from 230 to about
1,260. And then a couple more. These are 670 to 780 for single family law enforcement. Again, yours is vehicles only. So these two counties also have vehicles only. That's why they are included here even though they are
not necessarily surrounding counties. But for single family, this fee is calculated at $150 per home. And these counties range from 155 to 183. government buildings. Uh again your in
your case government buildings include general government buildings, law enforcement and jail. So we try to make that comparison. Um the single family home amounts about 1418 and and these this set of jurisdictions are charging
anywhere from 610 to about 1674 and these are from 500 to about 1,900. Parks and Recreation. Yours is about 440. This group is ranging from 312 to about 2500.
Can I ask a quick question on parks and wreck? I see it's assessed on all the the residential, but there no capture for lodging or recreation. Um why only for that residential
section? That's typically the um I guess best nexus the residential uses when we get into non-residential it's hard to say you know if you build the office there's going to be a higher demand on park system we just don't have enough
data if we had the usage data or something because their impact will be lesser than resident residential residential obviously some jurisdictions include hotel motel so that could be added it's not it's it's lesser like maybe one-third includes it,
two3 doesn't include it. Um, so that's one land use that can be added if interested. But um, okay. I I was just trying to logically think that, you know, some people that come and stay in our county will do that for the, you know, for for the recreational activity
for the outdoor amenities that we have, the boat ramps and the those types of things. just seemed semi-logical for to capture those folks and I I get uh um you know hospitals and nursing homes and probably
not going to be a lot of use from from that impact. Anyway, just a just a thought. Thank you. I have a question while you're on this slide. Um so why the difference between mobile home 1300 feet and multifamily? Why the difference in cost? Because I see Elatchua County
like has 543 for both multif family and mobile home. Charlotte County is 246 and 249 only $3 difference. So, so I don't understand why we would charge a mobile home higher. That's based on the persons per housing
unit in your county. So, uh basically we have data from census showing by type of home, how many people per housing unit. Uh in the case of Elro County, it may have been the case that they have a combined residential and just by tied. I
gotcha. So that's why it's exactly the same. Uh St. John's County is the same thing. It's all combined by tiered. Um but when you like Flaggler County has separate. So there you see a similar you know it's closer to single family. How many people in a per home
and this mobile home is all mobile homes on lot or in a park like so it's not just home parks. Yeah. Okay. Okay. And then transportation, the single family calculated fee is about almost
5,000. And this uh I have few slides. Klay County has a tier um multiple schedules ranging from 800 to 7,300. And then these counties range anywhere from 1,600 to about almost
11,000. Uh and now we did also review impact fee benefit districts and uh developed a suggestion basically to district option reviewing any natural barriers, developable area size, travel patterns,
development patterns and looking at where the improvements are and facilities are and that's needed only for transportation and parks. All the other ones are countywide service area. So like government buildings, everybody comes to court, everybody goes to jail.
Um fired, they travel with their trucks. Um same thing with law. So this is again, let me get a transportation question again real quick. Um and maybe you hit it and I just missed it. I see in in this
um you know a mobile home under transportation has about a $1,700 fee whereas a single family detached home or be almost 5,000. Why that such a large discrepancy between so
in the case of transportation mobile home on lot is charged same as single family. We have trip data for mobile home parks just the parks separately. uh we don't have persons per housing unit data. So
that's so the fees you know in the case of transportation when we show mobile home it's only the mobile home park. Okay. So that that lower rate is only in a park setting. Yeah. If it's on a single lot like a mo then it would be charged same as single family. Okay.
Thank you. So so that makes me think of something. Um when you have land where um developers put in mobile homes and the people own the mobile homes but the developer owns the land and the trailer is or the mobile home is real property.
There's no they wouldn't have to pay an impact fee. It's whoever is pulling the building permit would have to pay the impact fee. Okay. To put that mobile home. Yeah. Okay. So it would fall under the mobile home parks in this situation where they're because they they don't own the
land. Yes. Okay. So So each individual lot will have an impact fee. If you're in a mobile home park, it's usually the park itself when in the initial development pays the fee. So it's one per one impact fee for the entire lot.
Yeah. Yes. But it's per dwelling unit. So it's if they have 100 sites in that park, they'd be 100 times 4,000 or whatever. And so that example I used was that one coming in East Palaca where the individual people will own the mobile homes. Yeah, that was my question. If we
were going to charge them $4,000 a piece or $4,000 for the So again, it's at the building permit or at the co depending on the earliest uh we are allowed to collect is at the building permit. So, whoever is pulling the permit would pay
for it and then they can pass it on or not. That's what I was hoping that it would be per dwelling unit and we could charge them the same amount as a single family residence. Yes, it's per dwelling unit. Okay. So, I that's just the summary.
again you saw these um oh and then in terms of the permitting we did a range you had um reviewing your permitting past couple years past four five years and then uh
estimated potential revenues so it would range anywhere from 1.7 million for all of these fees combined to about 6.3 million a year depending on the permitting activity And I think with that, I'll be happy to answer any questions.
All right, we'll start with Commissioner Harvey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Um, I'm going to pass out something in just a moment, but this morning, one of our citizens asked us if we could put money up from
the impact fees for incentives for business businesses, and would that be allowed? So impact fees are just for capital expansion. If you if they meant can we
reduce the fees for some businesses. Is that what they were looking for? Let's say you want to bring your business to Putham County and you need an incentive to get here. Could we use that money for incentives? You you cannot use impact fee revenues for incentives. But if you are trying to
give that business an incentive, you can wave the you can pay the impact fee for them through maybe economic development dollars or you may have a fund for it. So the impact fee account is whole. The idea is those who pay the fee should
receive the benefit. So we can't pick and choose and reduce unless we reduce everybody equally. But there are counties who buy down the fees for certain type of developments because they really want to encourage them. Like St. John's County was buying down
non-residential fees, impact fees with their sales tax. So they were basically putting whatever incentive they gave to that out of town developer through the from the sales tax back into the impact fee account, the fund. Those who paid the full fees still receive the
facilities that they paid for. All right. So, let me let me clean this up real quick. So, let's just say we took a h 100,000 make the numbers easy to understand. A h 100,000 of sales tax money and we could buy down $100,000 worth of impact fees. Is that what
you're saying? Yes. To incentivize. Yes. Okay. So, all right. But the monies have to come from other revenue generation other than the impact fees. Yes. Now in your presentation under
transportation dirt to pave would be um allowed but only on collector roads. Correct. So the immediate basically it needs to provide benefit to a larger radius not it cannot be just immediate neighborhood only the homes
there are benefiting. So it just it could be even neighborhood collectors, minor collectors, major collectors, but it's just connecting one neighborhood to another, that neighborhood to an activity center. So it just needs to provide a bigger bet than just the
immediate neighborhood. Can you bond impact fees? Yes, impact fees don't get you a good rate. So they are usually the secondary pledge but you can pay for debt service if they were uh for if the bond were used for capacity projects.
Okay. So the uh the numbers that you're providing with us, you guys are providing us those are suggested values for an impact fee for this county based on your studies. And as a commission as a whole, we are able to tailor those
numbers to what we feel might be more effective to our county. So, we may not want to charge this here, but we may want to get these dollars here or um structure them to better suit economic development at a different rate. Do we
have to abide by your No. No. Uh we don't have that kind of power. These are clarify technically defensible maximum rates right these schedules and it also shows the proportionality between the land uses so
the commission could adopt for example government buildings at 70% across board for all land users can adopt transportation at 100% or some so you can switch uh the adoption packages as long as they are less than so what you
provided us with is a legally defensible right but maximum that we can structure based on that if we had to take it. Okay. And you need to be sure to treat all land uses equal within the one service area. Correct. Or buy down with another revenue. So residential would
fall into one silo, commercial would fall into another silo and we could structure it based on that how we solve it. So within a service area, residential and commercial all should be treated the same. So for example, parks or I mean law for um let me pick a
government buildings. You may say, I'm going to adopt a 50%. So both the residentials get 50% discount and non-residential. We can't pick and choose unless we are back filling with another revenue source. And there's a public benefit for doing that. And I
think that's what's going to be important to remember is if we choose to lower then we got to come up with those revenues from another source. Yeah. My question was, could we lower say if we wanted to focus on commercial development, could we lower that to make it more appealing for commercial
development within that silo? Okay. Give me just a second. Commissioner Harvey, I know you have the floor. Yeah. Would you pass these down? Yes. Everybody, these are some questions that I asked. I sent an email and I can only share them in the public meeting and the red question, the red responses are from the
consultant. But let's let me go to my question, my last question basically. It says, "Hypothetically, do we have to adopt impact fees across each line item? So all the ones that you're promoting here, fire, rescue, law enforcement, government, buildings, parks, and
wrecks, and transportation, those are the ones. Do we have to adopt every one of those?" No, we don't. Okay. Um, and then what about churches and nonprofits? I mean, they they are charged. They have impact. They affect
facilities. They use roads to get to church and they they may have an incident where fire rescue has to go. Yeah. They the legal attorneys do not recommend re reducing waving fees with again you can say you can establish
public purpose and say we we will buy down their fees. Well, I think let me let me just where the world I live in different than the world you live in. and and it is there's no doubt you sit behind the desk and you do the numbers and I get that. But I'm
elected by the people. So what they're thinking is impact fees and I had this happen over the weekend is I can't wait for impact fees to come in. Law enforcement is going to get more deputies on the street. Doesn't work that way. Law enforcement has so
many please forgive me not so many. Law enforcement has been taken care of so well in this county that their impact fee is low. And you tell that to the average person there at the American Legion and they go, there's no way. I want more deputies on the street. Well,
impact fees are not going to do that. And that's the key that people don't realize here. Yes, we it might buy a car, but according to some of these numbers, it might buy one car a year. you know, it might outfit one deputy, that's it, but it's not going to pay
salary. And I think that's what the perception is. Now, I I'm all for development, paying for development, don't get me wrong, but it's not what people think it is and that's the reality. And trying to tell that story
is very difficult to tell. It really is. Yeah. The law enforcement and actually fire rescue too, they are very operationally heavy service areas. Um it's you know what in some jurisdictions like that what it costs to build a fire
station is what they need operationally every year to staff that station. So those two um I mean impact fees help a little bit but their main needs are usually operational. So if if you've got counties out there that are buying down
impact fees for commercial businesses to incentivize them to come to your county. Why don't you just not charge impact fees on commercial businesses or why don't you deduct that to a very small rate where there is no more incentive
incentivizing. You're just giving them a good rate to come. It it's because of the legal requirements and case law. So it it requires that everything uh the fees be proportional. Those who have the impact pay for it. So we can't just from
a legal perspective um we just have to show you what you you are you know what it says and then you are the board so you can decide how much risk you want to take. But commissioner if I may on your on the discussion about churches if an I want to make sure I understand if
there's an existing building then that building if they're tearing it down and redoing it they would not pay an impact fee. Correct. Correct. And if they're expanding their, let's say they're going from a 2,000 foot building to a 3,000 foot building, would they um pay for the
difference in the square footage? Yes. Yes. Okay. And if they are changing use, again, they pay the difference. They always get credit for the existing structure there. Okay. Okay. So, that was that was one of my questions. But if you want to build a new 10,000 square foot church, you're going to pay an
impact for that if it's brand new. Yes. Yeah. Okay. Yes. Absolutely. because they're going to have an impact. They're going to have residents coming in. All right. I'm Were you Where are we at? I'm sorry. I think I'm done right now, Madam Chair. Thank you. All right. Yeah, that's my my whole thing was just
trying to find a way to make it more appealing for commercial investment that, you know, that's actually going to pay for its own versus focusing on residential development. We are going to have to have some other way of funding it because I believe it was like a dollar$ dollar$ dollar50$ dollar 75 is
what they the load that the county will bear for residential development versus a commercial development actually pays money and puts money into the coffers to help support the rest of the community. Commissioner Alexander, you're going to have to start speaking up. I can't hear you and I'm two people down. I got to get I got to get some water. Okay.
Sorry. All right. Um Commissioner Harvey, you had one more question. Well, I think what Commissioner Alexander was picking up, we had some presenters earlier this morning that basically gave some dollar amounts and um I think with Mr. Woodward over here that
basically residential is never going to pay for residential. Okay. But commercial doesn't drain government as much as is not as taxing on government as residential is. Okay. So I think if
you're looking at trying to justify do we want to slow the growth down in residential that we know that's coming okay because it is coming and we want to keep some rural characteristic then maybe maybe
residential impact fees are good. If we're if we're on the side of the fence that we want more commercial growth, then maybe we since it's not so much of a drain, maybe that we reduce that amount or or whatever that amount is. I
don't know. But it it seemed to be very residential was up here, commercial was down here, and that from what the presenter said this morning, again, you can absolutely buy down the fees. So, if you feel like that and and just like
nearby St. Johns County was buying 40% of the fees for all non-residential with sales tax. And if they are generating that much tax revenue, you can use some of that to buy down their impact. It just impact fees
are not taxes. So they are based on the impact of each development. And again by law those who paid their full share and didn't have the same benefit of discounts need to receive the facilities
they paid for. So if we are reducing the revenues from one sense that we are not going to be able to build the same facilities with that fund. So but you are able to buy it down as a policy because you feel this is a good contribution to the community and
something the community needs. All right. So let me follow up with this. Okay. Does your firm help us in identifying if we were to say we want to incentivize this? We don't want to charge that because right now our sales
tax, we use it for parks and wreck. We use it for dirt to pave. We use it for wastewater and water expansion or debt of that. So, does your firm help us walk that through and say, "Here's some of the monies that you'll have available. If you do this, this, and this, and you
pass impact fees for that, we can we can help you." Again, anytime you give somebody a discount, you have a revenue loss obviously, no matter from what fund. So like sometimes what we look at when we give credit in the formula you
know how we talked about to the extent you are using some taxes we that kind of tells you tells us on average how much the county allocating from other sources for say transportation or whatever. So that amount can buy down the fees but of
course anytime you reduce something you know you have you can't make up for it somewhere else. Yeah. So yeah, we can definitely put some scenarios together, I guess, if if that's what um now I got to get my head wrapped around.
Impact fees are collected say in East Palaca, okay? Because that's where our wastewater and water is. And what if we build out that facility and can no longer expand that facility? How do we
justify impact fees? Okay. I'm sorry that was not in your I'm sorry I got that was in your will the uh Brian Mans from um go rates. I mean, the the
uh the Florida the the the Florida statutes actually have a a requirement that once you're at 75% capacity utilization, you need to start communicating to the Florida to the FD plans for for uh for expansion. So, you
you got to let them know what how how you're going to address this this this capacity utilization. So you're you're you're not going to you wouldn't um you know get get to 100% um if you got up to 100% capacity you you've you've had
planning you're you're pretty much built out because you you have to have planning discussions with FDP long before you get to any uh um capacity input capacity utilization endpoint.
Um, also if in many ordinances include language about if you don't use the impact fees for six to seven years, you need to reimburse them, right? So there's a time limit how how long you can just keep it in the fund. So So there's that. Also, it's sort of a
safety net. You know, if something like this happens and you have nothing to use it on, then you have to reimburse them. Reimburse to the person who paid it. Yes. Not to the masses, only to the It actually goes by with land. So it could be the current land owner. I need to ask
legal. It it impact fee stayed with land. So it it you know you may have a different owner and say they built something else there. They get the credit for the impact fee paid for that structure. So it could be that that address receives the So basically what
you're saying the state of Florida says this cannot be a slush fund and sitting there collecting interest and not doing anything with it. counties or municipalities, you got to do something with this money if you're really going to charge an impact, right? Yes. Thank
you. Thank you, Madam Chair. So, I have a question regarding um accessory uh buildings. So, accessory buildings such as sheds and barn, they would be exempt for existing land owners. So, if somebody has a house already and um
they're adding a shed or a barn and it's not a dwelling unit, right, they would be exempt. They are you they are usually it's um the measure is area under air. Say that again. Uh the area under air is Oh, heated and cooled air. That's what
you're saying? Like under air. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Just making sure. Okay. So, had a barn dominion. What if you had a Well, then that's a unit of if you're having a barnuminium that's a living quarter, then that becomes a dwelling unit. So it has to that's based on if I'm understanding it correctly dwelling
unit is based on whether somebody could room there live there that type of thing. Correct. Right. Okay. So sheds and barns and things that would be used for um we have a lot of a land in our area. So people who are bu building a you know something to park there. No.
Yeah. All of that's exempt. Okay. Or not not not charged a fee. Okay. All right. Okay. Are there any other questions from the board? I do have one. Sorry about that. It's okay. Yeah, I
have a question, too. So, in the queue right now, we have some big developers who are looking at Putinham County to come in. I don't believe they've pulled any permits yet or anything like that. So would these would these be already in
the hopper and they would not be charged impact fees or is impact fees at the time of permit or certificate of blocky? You that's a policy decision. The earliest you can collect by law is the permit but
some jurisdictions wait until the co. So you can do either uh once the fees are implemented there's at least a 90day period once the fees are adopted. there's a 90-day period before they become effective. So, that also gives everybody some time. Some jurisdictions
put that 90-day period to a longer time period. Um, otherwise, anybody who's going to pull the permit after the fees are in effect, they would pay. Wouldn't you think certificate of occupacy if you waited that long? Because if I'm
building a house and there's overruns and overruns and and now I'm really stressed out and all of a sudden at the end I want a co and the impact fees $15,000 and I'm going I ain't got that kind of money. What have you I mean have
you ever experienced that before? Uh I haven't heard that the development community typically supports the co but they are because at that point probably they are not paying. Um I think what what is negative about that it takes the government some time to
build facilities. So the later you get the revenues it takes that much longer to get sure the facilities but the people show up sooner than that you know so it may be better to collect that building permit that seems to be more common but you are also absolutely able
to collect that co or later than building permit. So, do you have to treat residential and and commercial the same? Could you collect the commercial at CO and and the residential at permit? I probably need to check that with legal. We usually I think you want to
treat everybody the same as much as you can. Just curious. Thank you. Yeah. Yeah. Because that that would lead into another caveat on that as far as a single family home builder owner versus a large corporation. you know, it might be a struggle for them to come up with it up front until they secure a certain
number of draws. So, there's a lot of questions. Well, that's why she's here. So, what please let's and if you have them, please let's count right now. So, we were we were talking about a a net gain on the commercial and residential impact
fees. So if we did, you know, hypothetically speaking, forego a certain number of the commercial residential or commercial impact fees, would those have to balance out like a balance sheet over to the residential side or can we forego some of that or So
if I understand the question correctly, if you are discounting the commercial, can you put that on the residential? Is that the question? Do we have to or can we make it a more appealing environment for commercial development by lowering the fees for the commercial side and not going with your
recommendation? Yeah, if you are lowering the you are able to lower the commercial fees independently of the residential fees independently of the residential as long as you are backfilling that delta with another revenue source. So if for
example you charge 50% of the commercial fee and that was $150,000 you need to take $150,000 from sales tax put it in the impact fee fund and you have to do it with all commercial not just certain commercial that right is that what is that what we're talking about? You could do
certain because some jurisdictions for example really want to encourage industrial right so they only discount that land use okay uh some medical office but it should have a public purpose it shouldn't be one development within one category gets a discount but
second one doesn't it should be you know right we really in this industry so we are discounting anybody who comes you know right no that was my question but you said that we can set the impact fees at whatever we want to So if we don't
use the recommendation for you on a commercial side, we can set it wherever we want to. Do we why should we have to fill that? Yeah, you can set it up at anything you want across the board of all land uses. You can say we are adopting it at 50%. So everybody will be
charged half. But if you are wanting to residential to be charged say 100% but commercial at 50 then you have to buy down because you are not giving the same benefit to residential and impact fees about their impact and proportionality and equity between land uses. It's
not other community goals. So it's just pretty yeah it just it open to me it kind of opens a box though who's going to make the determination on which industries they feel are proficient or beneficial for the community and we're going to buy down this fee for this
development but not that development. Um so again like if you have target industries you know like you the county needs industrial or county needs I don't know more offices anybody who comes under that category would get that discount and the
county would basically fill back that discount with another revenue source. So if you pick industry and that industry comes in and they have two jobs and another industry has 200 jobs you're giving them both the same discount. No, actually you don't have to. You can put
some layers on the employee categories. It just it just it cannot be the Mr. Smith's development gets $2 and the same exact development with, you know, Mr. John's get doesn't get it. It it just but you can you can absolutely put limits saying, you know, industries that
generate this much jobs will get a bigger discount and this is how they need to show it and if they don't generate it by X year, they have to pay back the impact fee. Yeah, there are you can definitely do that kind of tiering. It sounds like a pretty complex algorithm.
It needs tracking. It does need staff time. It needs, you know, tracking, but there are examples. So, Sure. Sure. I just we I'm just trying to avoid what appear to be preferential treatment for businesses that may be competing with existing businesses or we have two very
similar businesses coming in, one getting a different level of um treatment than the other. So we would probably need to establish that very firm, very straightforward before we determine any of that or we just don't
go down that road. That is Harvey. Thank you, Madam Chair. Thank you, Madam Chair. So, let's make this real simple. We got a business that wants to come in. We're going to impose impact fees. We're going to reduce them at 100 100 employees that, you know, if they employ
100 employees and their impact would have been $20,000, but we're going to reduce that to 10. Okay? Or or nothing. I don't pick a number. It doesn't matter. Do we put that money back in the fund from
another source day one or do we wait? And is it based on objection or is it based on reality? Whenever they pull the building permit and they pay their portion of the fee that whatever you use, that's the time you would put the rest of it in. All right. So, we have
what we call a development authority here and some of us serve on that. We talked the other day or I briefly mentioned doing some type of grant out of some funds that we have. Can we use a development authority to back fund that? Yes. Yes. Okay. Thank you.
So do we have to have that conver have to implement that program in the beginning or is that something that we can change later? You you can't change anytime you are reducing you can't change later. There are only restrictions if you are like if you adopt the fees at 50% and you want to
increase 75% that has to wait for 40 but anytime it's a decrease you can adopt it any or you can implement it anytime. Yeah. I mean, we got to remember um why we're talking about in impact fees and what the purpose of it is. And
if the purpose is that it's growth, paying for growth, whether it's industry or uh residents, well, they should, in my opinion, should be treated the same. If we then later on come back and we say we want to do some kind of incentive program, I think it's a separate discussion and a separate I really just
think it's separate. I appreciate the conversation, but I feel like that that incentive program has to be separate. And if that if we're tying it back to, oh, we're going to give somebody a grant from the development authority or whatever, I just feel like that has to happen at a different different time. I
think that we need to focus on are we going forward with impact fees or are we not. No, I I agree. These are just questions that I have so that they're good questions. Don't get me wrong. I'm just like I feel like we just that's where that's where I'm at. Yeah. No, I I just want to make sure that we don't
miss something from the get-go that we should have addressed initially and it's going to catch us to bite us. So, yeah, that's the purpose of it. Okay. Any more questions? There's a lot. Go ahead. Keep asking. I'm sorry. I do have a lot, but I'm going to try to
bring this home. So, right now, let me let me ask you this if it might be in your wheelhouse real quick. If we were to eat the elephant one bite at a time and go, you know what? Do we really need waste water and water right now? Can we go ahead and do
that one without doing all of them right now? And then while we're still deliberating, we go, "Yeah, we want this one and we want this one." And we move it. Can we take a little bite at a time or do we have to try to shove the whole ma apple in our mouth? Well, there's
there's the one year. Yeah. Yeah. One year. Okay. So you you can do that in the sense that you can this month you can't do water waste water next month something else but the also just remember that the fees need to be adopted within one year of the study.
Sure I know that so we are sort of so I'll let you guys opine on that the time we re-engaged you to do it we have to have those fees in place in one year and that's what we we've come up with. Yeah. So as long as you don't or that that deadline too much. Bless
you. Um then I think you can take some time but it's going to be within months. It's not going to be two years later you adopt something. I get that. I just Yeah, I get that. But I think waste water and water um I think most people can agree with that. I have some some other ideas but about the hookups but
because we're asking people to do it but that's a whole another I'm not going to fall on the sword for that one. I'm just saying that that actually probably water and waste water is the only one you can adopt even two years later, right? Because they are not right. You don't have don't have the restrictions of the
Florida impact the act all the so so you're you can you know water and sewer you don't have all these restrictions. I just don't want to send the wrong message. That's the key that I keep going back to is you know we're getting grants and we're getting well we're getting grants to help take septics off
sewer. We're trying to get people to hook in and I don't want to lose that message that that's important where people go, I'm not hooking up. Because we do have some people that go, I'm not hooking up. And you can say, well, the state law says that you have to I ain't
hooking up. I mean, and what do you do? Force them? Take their home? I'm not. Well, I I I think we established through earlier discussions that that the the people that are you that you got you got some grants to to to you to handle the
handle those hookups and the fees would not apply to those. I get that. I do. I was Yeah, but they're not going to hear that. So, I understand. I know. I mean, that that's it's all it's all about communication. Yeah. Thank you. And if
they were I mean, so let's get that. Let's make sure we understand if they're we're going to hook up today and there's grants available, then they would get that. We've already established that. If they're hooking up in the future because they don't want to hook up now and it's three or four years down the road and we
have impact fees in place, then they would either be paying the impact fee or the connection fee and they're very similar in in price. So, it wouldn't matter. If we didn't have impact fees, we would still have the connection fees for those residents. Mr. Grimes, can you help with this? Absolutely. And I and
the data that he brought back is almost identical to what our impact fee would be. Whether it's we're going to call it a connection fee or we're going to call it an impact fee, whichever one we want to call it, we're already charging the same amount of money. It's $2,500 to hook to our water system today and it's
$8,000 to hook to our sewer system is what our current fee structure is in place today. Um, so that's whatever we're going to call it. We already have those fees. you guys happen to wave it trying to encourage people to get on to the the sewer system. So, um and that's
that gets updated every year with our fee schedule. What's the average cost for a new septic and well system in Putham County? Not sure. I mean, I think it varies by location. Uh we got one at a county building we're building uh was 10 $10,000 last week roughly for the
well. Um and the well we just paid 15,000 for. So you had $25,000 in water and sewer at that one facility. Yes, sir. Okay. So, let me let me clarify something, get it straight in my head, Mr. Grimes.
If we get a grant and we've already run a pipe past your house and you haven't built, we're not going to be able to charge you an impact fee or a hookup fee for that for your water and sewer based on the grant that we got. Correct. You're saying if the if if we ran the
pipe past your house, if it's already there right now, already there and there's no house, right? There's no house. Okay. And and we got a grant to run that line. Uhhuh. Then we can't charge you a connection fee or a impact fee. Correct. Because essentially the grant is paying the the impact into the
to the plant. I mean, it's it's just it's the free dollars that you got coming in. It's one way to look at it. I mean, like right now, I'm going to use septic sewer phase four, right, that we have today. the backbone infrastructure and that is $4 and a half million dollars roughly and that's what our
grant was and they said well go ahead and get started in your backbone you can apply for additional grants for hookups into the system right we just have to wave the hookups I mean that's part of the grant from the water management district or D whoever it's coming through these days says you cannot charge these fees to the to the
customers so they have at that point they got a decision to make they can hook to it when it's free when it's coming by them or if they choose not to and when they're septic it's not if when their septic fails, they'll have to pay the fee then. So they I mean the resident has a choice to make at the moment. Those grant fees won't be available
forever. That's correct. So once once we run through there the grant program, whatever whenever that grant hits today for the amount of dollars it does once that grant funds is gone, it's gone. And then if they decide six weeks from now that we oh I should have signed up.
Okay. So again, you've got a vacant lot on a on a piece of property that water management gave us a grant to run that sewer pipe in front of your property and you choose not to build for two years from now. You're going to pay an impact
fee or a hookup fee. Regardless only because we haven't clo once we close out the grant, it's closed and now you got to hook up and you got to pay the full fee. That's correct. Because I mean at that point at that point there was nothing there. There's no home to use the the service. So, I mean, we wouldn't
have I mean, the tap might be in the main when we're push hooking it in there, but why we we wouldn't use a credit for a vacant lot that has no use. I get it. I'm just Yeah, I'm just I think but but they won't allow them to put a septic in that same vacant lot. You'll have to hook into the sewer
system by the D. I think the key word here is what you just said. Once the grants closed out, then that's it. you've had even if I didn't want to build I might want to go ahead and start building to avoid that but I don't have to. Right. So we currently today at
public works we have a list I think it's about 180 190 people that says when you do put it in front of my home I want to hook in. Right. So we would take those monies from the water management district and go as far as it could go and then eventually you got to hit stop. Right. So I mean or we can go out and
ask for more funding. that water management says apply for funding, right? You know, as we're in construction, apply for additional hookups. We could apply for additional hookups to completely maximize our our wastewater plant. I think when these guys are talking about it's brand new construction or, you know, when when a
grant is not in place, right? I mean, that's whenever you got to start looking at your impact fees to be able to buy into the upgrades of the plant. Like we mentioned that first presentation was how much capacity we have left at the $8,000 per hookup into the plant is how much capacity we have left. We're just
taking infrastructure and in change for it. With that example you gave, an empty lot with the sewer run out front. I mean, when you look at it, it's going to be less expensive for you to hook into that county system than it is for you to go put your own water and sewer in. So, there are going to be people that are
going to be chomping at the bit to get that. Now, there going to be some people that are going to say, "Yeah, but my taxes are going to go up." But, but you don't have to replace that that sewer ever again. You know, it's it's not all bad. It just looks like big
dollars. Hey, real quick question. Do you have to have a building to hook up? Can you just go ahead and run your tap with the future with idea that I'm going to build here in two years? Just a just a thought. What are they what are they basing the capacity of the use on? Right. I mean, we got we
got to I mean because it I mean a permit goes by the amount of bedrooms they had to design the system whether it's a one horsepower pump or it's a two horsepower pump or you know that it's based upon the design. So I don't think anybody I mean we're not going to go put a vacant lift station on a piece of property and just you know it's not like we're going
to build it and they're going to come. Hey, believe me, that's going to come up. You know that 100% it's going to come up. But I mean, why would we why would we spend the dollars that is given to us by an grant authority to not remove a septic tank from the river, which is what our our goal has been was to remove them from the river and the
the the the creek for environmentally being environmentally friendly, right, to those. So, there's nothing there. So, we did discuss some things regarding the incentives and and businesses, but one of the things that got asked this morning was about um an exemption or a
waiver for um an affordable housing. And um we know that affordable housing is defined by Florida statute, but if you can just expand on that, it sounds like it would be similar to what you spoke about regarding you still have to pay, somebody has to pay that. that that's
actually a one exception to legislation made. You the local governments are allowed to reduce or wave impact fees for qualified affordable workforce housing without having to backfill. Okay. So, you can absolutely reduce it. It it has a a definition by the statute
again like your average median income, what percentage it can be up to 120%. Um and as long as that's tracked and all the way uh other jurisdictions designed that for example they gave a bigger discount if there's a commitment of say
30 years maybe they waved it 100%. If the affordable housing commitment was only 10 years they waved it 50% and then you know after 10 years we were referring to if a developer comes in and they're bu building a multi- multi-unit
dwelling unit facility. Yes. Okay. Yes. So, so they have to keep it at the affordable housing levels and then after 10 years for I'm making up numbers here but I mean after 10 years they can sell it at market value and they don't have to pay differential or they get bigger
discount and the commitment is longer if they break that uh agreement then they have to pay the fee. Okay. And but you're saying that if we were to do something like we don't have to backfill that with another revenue source. That's the only exception. Yes. And you
mentioned workforce housing. There there's two different definitions for one for affordable and one for workforce. Correct? Actually, it's only one section of the statute they refer to in the impact fee act and it goes all
the way to 120% of the average median income. I can get that to you, but uh it's usually at 120% is considered workforce at that point. So, and is that for um large builder projects? Is that
for a single family dwelling? It's single family or rental any housing. It it just has to be um if it's the housing price has to be less than 30 like the mortgage has to be less than 30% of their income. Uh if it's rental again,
so it's a relation to their income. So, a a modest tiny house, right? No, it's based it's their income. It's based on their income. Yes, I get it. Okay. Yeah. Um Okay. So, I want to talk a little bit
about addressing affordable housing. So, I want to share with you um I should have made copies. I apologize, but there's an article from News for Jax regarding addressing affordability. How does Northeast Florida's housing market align with the definition of affordable housing? This was published on May 14th
of 2025 just to give u my colleagues um a little bit of information. So um it talks about affordable is defined as spending no more than 30% of your income on housing. And this data was from the University of Florida's Shimberg Center for Housing Studies. And it shows the
typical single family home in Florida cost around $400,000, a 66% increase over the past years, over the past 10 years, even after adjusting for inflation. So what the interesting part about this is according to Northeast Florida
Association of Realators data from tw April of 2025, there are three most affordable counties in Northeast Florida and Putnham County is number one. Our average home price in Putham County is $242,495 with an affordable
affordability index of 107.5. Previous month was 111.5. Um the next county over um that's closest to us is Baker County and their affordability index is 86 and their
average average home price is 305 305,000 and then you go up to Duvall County and their average home price is 320,000 with a 77 uh of affordability index. So even with
impact fees, Putinham County still has we are still really well situated for affordable housing compared to the others in the state. And then I pulled some data from the Palaca Housing Authority and there are 442 units that
Palaca Housing Authority manages for public housing and they offer 402 vouchers which gives them choice their choices home housing choice vouchers and those are um they serve Crescent City, East Palaca, Interlarkin, Palaca, Pomona
Park, Sonteo, Satsuma and Walaka. So, just some information I wanted to share with you guys because there is um 844 um affordable or that those are low cap cost to zero cost to residents units um out of what we have. So, I just
wanted to talk about that if we're going to talk about affordable housing. Yes, sir. Thank you, Madam Chair. So, in saying all that, and I appreciate you sharing that with us, as the builder that came up this morning and said his average home was
300 and something, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but it was something. What would be an affordable house? And that was a question that you asked me this morning. What would be an affordable home for workforce housing? Would it be 243,000 or where we set that limit at
for Putham County? Would it be 180,000? The formula for that looks at average median income of this region and says they should not pay more than 30% of that amount for housing and then
so basically then you're back fill like solving okay if I have this much per month this is the mortgage I can afford this is the house price I can afford so that kind of a and and if again as far as the legislation goes looking at you
know if you are at 60% of median income, 80% of median income. So there are like income levels that are allowed to reduce this fee for and then we are back solving what they can afford and then that's the price of the house but it just needs a calculation. So
commissioner for an 80% AMI area median income the house would be around 293,000 for Putnham County for Putnham County and that's for workplace or affordable housing question. It doesn't make the distinction. It's
based on income and the ability. You have to have a 640 credit. You have to have the ability to secure and get a mortgage. Okay. And you're basing that on a $49,000 median income somewhere in that area. Um this the current HUD rate
for our county is a family income of 855. So close to 49 individual and we do have programs in Putham County for down payment assistance. Um I said on Ahack, we also have um rehab and a couple of
those homes are actually being completely rebuilt. Um so the question then would come back to this board is do we want to um as we move forward or if we move forward address some kind of reduction or I don't know if the
right word is waiver is the right word waiver for affordable housing. Yeah you can do either reduction or waiver without backfilling. Yeah. Okay. All right. So I know that was discussed earlier. I just wanted to bring that up. Well I I appreciate that and I do want to have that conversation. I want to
keep our firefighters, our law enforcement, you know, but I can tell you our law enforcement, they don't make $85,000 a year. So, they're going to have to be married. Their wife's going to have to be working to make that work out. Um, but I would like to see that. I
would like to see us and even with our other programs that we have like our shift down payment assistance, we can help them get in. But, you know, sometimes you can set people up for failure if they if they're not having they don't have the income to support that. So that's my point there. But I do
like workforce housing, whatever that means. But it's going to be based on how do I make and how much can I afford to put towards the home payment. And but I do think we ought to look at our law enforcement, our firefighters, our nurses, you know, people that are
central service that we rely on. You know, there are programs like Hometown Heroes, stuff like that. Go ahead. Um, just so we're clear, it's not per person, it's per household, per family. So 855 is generally assumed to be a twoinome household.
All right, we got we went down a rabbit hole. I know some of that didn't necessarily have to do with your presentation. Um, are there any other questions for the presenter? It's a it's a lot. So basically this is just your numerical recommendation of the impact is for our
community. Yeah, we actually don't even call it a recommendation. We said these are the technically calculated cost of growth the full cost. Recommendation can be I mean it's up to the each jurisdiction is different. So your options are growth
pays for itself, existing population subsidizes growth or level of service degrades or a combination. And that's what I wanted you to say. I wanted people to understand that there could be the potential degradation of services or your existing population
pays for the growth or the growth is financed by the growth. That's right. Thank you. Right. Are there any comments or questions from staff all right? All right. Thank you for your presentation. I don't think we have
anything at all. All right, board. What's your pleasure? Say that again. Oh, thank you. Um, this is a public hearing meeting. Um, if is there anybody who would like to speak regarding this public hearing
item, please come forward. Good afternoon, Mr. Woodward. Good afternoon again. I'm taking you up on your offer for a second bite at the end. They're allowed to we want we want participation. Shall shall I introduce myself again or do you remember me? I think we're good. You're on the record. Okay. Thank
you. This has been a wonderful discussion. I've enjoyed listening to it. Uh at times it kind of veered toward the old saying they used to have in Tallahassee. Uh don't tax you, don't tax me, tax that man behind the tree.
Uh we we can all we can all think of folks or businesses that we we want to support and encourage. And uh but I think I I I think Commissioner Alexander hit it on the head just a few moments
ago that if we take the calculations that your sultans came up with that represent the actual cost of the growth and we discount those. Whatever amount we discount it, we're putting it back on
the backs of the taxpayers, the existing tax base of the county. So somebody we'll be the ones behind the tree. Um because the consultants numbers show the net impact of development including
commercial development. I I don't know if you remember or not, but one of the slides that we were shown showed that the calculation of the uh amount of impact to be attributed to commercial development was already
giving credit for the revenue that the commercial development would be expected to pay in other forms. So they were already given that credit back. Yes, it's true. Over time,
commercial development will more than pay for itself. No question about that. But uh and maybe we could look at that slide again because I think it's very important that your your consultants were already uh factoring in that credit
with the number they came up with. So that reduction that you may be thinking about providing to commercial development because of the future projected revenue may already have been done. So maybe we can get that uh get
that clarified. Most businesses that build new buildings in which to operate expect to pay impact fees these days. That's that's the world we're in.
and they're not afraid of them. So, there may be uh plenty of good policy reasons for uh giving this one or that one a break, particularly when we're looking at affordable housing or something like that. But, uh let's just
just keep in mind that somebody behind that tree is going to be paying for the cost of the growth. Yes, sir. Thank you. All right. Is there any other public comment? Were you waiting on Laura to jump up in front of you, Benji? No, I got it. I
just Well, I guess in theory um I was probably overly vague this morning. We truly understand um that impact fees cannot be discounted in waves um and they would need to be applied proportionately for using those infrastructures. really what the chamber
was recommendation I think what a lot of this leads to we've kind of talked to staff about is really the creation for a county incentive program um to really define these to have this defined what are the incentives what tool do you have
and yes impact fees can be a tool in an incentive program and really our thought was we don't want to box ourselves out of there um ultimately I think we need that incentive program and again you guys get to define that it's based upon our targeted industries. What do we what
do what does this community want? What are we willing to do to get it and have that formalized incentive program for that? And yes, impact fees could be a tool and part of that incentive program based upon that. Um but um so that's that's really I was just you know kind
of being vague about it. Um but no, I think businesses do but I think we also part of that exercise is to look at what our surrounding counties are doing. you know, what are those targeted industries we want to we want to go after? What might they being offered by our competitors? And are we willing to have
something that allows us to compete for those businesses? And again, when you look around Putinham County, largely when you look at expansion, it's been existing businesses. We haven't had a lot of new large investment from outside sources.
And that is something that we're looking to bring more of that into the community because again, new tax dollars, new growth, impact fees, advalor taxes, jobs, that's what helps grow a strong tax base. That's what helps you guys be in a position in the future to help
lower those because if we don't have the impact fees, if we don't have the new business coming in to invest in our community and provide that, we need to grow the tax base. We need to grow the taxable value. So, we do understand that yes, you can't discount them, that the money would have to be funded from the
general fund, another legally appropriate source. Um, we just want to see that the county remain competitive when a project offers, you know, we have that extraordinary long-term value. We want to be in a position um to win that new business to bring that um competitor
or that new company to this county. Commissioner Harvey. Yes, sir. Thank you, Mr. debates for but I guess my question to you is what is that number and I think that's what we've got to look at what is the number what are what
business are you looking for and what number do you want us to put up I think that would be based upon the what are what are I mean the county's long-term strategic plan and then the targeted industries well I mean we've been very minimal at getting new tax new
businesses coming to town but we've done really well, keeping the businesses with the incentives that we gave, but they're based on a case-byase basis. And previous boards have took a lot of heat over giving those incentives, saying, "You don't really need to do that.
They're not going anywhere." Well, we didn't want to take that chance. So, I guess my my question is, is it us putting a h 100,000 a year? Is it us putting 200,000 a year up? Is it us partnering with the development authority? Is it us partnering with Elevate Putnham? what is the number? And
I think that's where the chamber is going to have to come up and say, "This is the business we're looking for and this is the number we're looking for." And maybe there's a partnership. And I do agree it's two separate issues. It's not one connected to the other. It's two separate issues,
but what is that what is that sweet spot we're looking at? What do we need to do for that incentive program? That's what this commissioner wants to know. Yes, sir. And I would say add to that, you know, you you said what what does our surrounding what are our surrounding
counties doing? So I would ask the chamber to find out for us and let us know if we're going to sit down and have a conversation about an incentive program then what if we can I mean I don't know if it's readily available but if it is can we figure what the other counties are doing. Yes. So, I think
that if we're going to have the conversation, we have to have have all of the the information. And if if um and and I know you're trying to figure out all the tools that we could use, and I appreciate that, but I do still feel like it's two separate things. Well, Benji, my crystal ball is still
broken, but a lot of us can see what's on the horizon. So, it's it be a very exciting time to be the leader of business development in Putnham County. um if there are any businesses that are on the fringe of coming in and they needed that little swift kick to say,
"Hey, if we do it now, we might save a little bit of money or a large amount of money even." So, could be a great tool to go ahead and push them over the edge and bring them on in. Thank you. Thank you. All right. Um I do have a one other
question. I believe I know the answer to this, but if you'll come up. I just got one question. Um, I know Mr. Miner had spoke earlier and I just want to clarify this for the public. Um, our children and our locals that live here if they're building on
property on family property would and not causing an impact to water and sewer only an impact of fire protection or other services. They I guess um they would still have to pay all of the impact fees, right? If they're building another structure on the same property.
Yes, impact impact fees are attached to the structures, not not and it's a one-time payment for the life of the home or the structure. So, there'll be different families, you know, different people will live in there. So, it's one time. So, it is attached to the structure and that's kind of how it's
measured. So, yes, any new structure would pay the impact. That's a dwelling unit. That's a dwelling unit or if it's commercial per thousand square foot. Yeah. Right. Right. Okay. All right. Thank you for asking. Thank you. I just
wanted that clear clear as mud, right? Um All right. Back to the board. Madam Chair, you're looking for an adoption of the next meeting for the impact fee. Is that correct? Yes, sir. I will make a motion that just because I
need a little time, but the next meeting would be June 10th at 9:00 am. I think we want to do a five 505 meeting. Is that correct? If somebody could help with that. Do we need a five a five? Okay. June 10th at 505. I'm good with that. All
right. So, we have a motion on the floor to read the second um ordinance for impact fees on June 10th at 505. I'll second that. All right, we have a second. Is are is there any discussion?
All right. I just want to say that um you know, these things are hard. These are hard discussions when you're making change in the community. It's not these aren't easy conversations. But I can assure you that the vote we take on this impact fee affects the next vote that
you're going to be making on your local taxes. Every vote is connected to something else and and has a direct impact to our community. And I've always um you know, I wish we could say, hey, I don't want my kids to have to pay the impact fee. I don't want your kids to
pay an impact fee. But it doesn't work that way. Um that's not a choice that we get to make as a board. No. Um, but I do think that growth needs to pay for growth and we are starting to see growth. And the argument that that we wouldn't get new houses or new
industry is just not true because we're the only county in all of Northeast Florida that doesn't charge it. So, uh, the city of Palaca said at one of their meetings they have 800 permits open right now. Their impact fees have not slowed down the city of Palaca. No. And it's not as though we're not subjecting
ourselves to the same thing because it is my intent to build a new home within the next two years. So I'm not just handing this off to the community. I'll be subject to it myself. So well with that being said, um we have a motion on the floor. All in favor say I.
I. I. Any opposed? Like sign. All right. Motion carries. So um is there anybody who wants to make comment from the county commissions? Madam Chair, if you don't mind. I do. I was an honor this week to Maybe
it's the older I get. Maybe it's the more like Mr. Howard Griffin said, there's less sand in the top of the hourglass than there is in the bottom. Um, but putting flags on the veteran graves this week was just probably some
of my highlights of my career. Done the wreaths. I've done flags before, but this year it really meant something to me. and even yesterday welcoming people to the Memorial Day uh presentation at the American Legion out in Enlarkin um where I brought greetings from every one
of y'all and Commissioner Lasir was there but everybody can't be everywhere and we know that but I think it's the older I get I'm more appreciative of the fact for the men and women who didn't get to celebrate Memorial Day. They went out and they defended our country and
they planted trees that they never sat under and and here we are able to do that and live in that freedom. So, it just really struck home with me this year more and more and and I'm so honored that this community steps up and looks at at these graves of the veterans
who gave it all for our country and uh for our lives and for our freedom. and um it was just powerful to see that on Facebook and all the pictures and all the involvement from all of y'all. Um really touched me this week and it it moved me u more than I've ever been
moved. So I just want to say that I did say yesterday that I was never going to say happy Memorial Day again because it's not a happy day. It's a solemn day and it's a day that we should reflect and and the Bible says we need to build memorials uh to to pass that down to our
next generation of what God did, but this is a memorial for what people did that we can benefit and we can live in a free country. So that's my comments. Thank you. Thank you. Any other commissioner comments? Just one final little touch on
the next month's discussion. I would like to see a little more information on a tiered approach to the to the residential. I think it's worth looking at. Um I realize this this is just a one-time fee and you know these folks pay at the for ages and ages but um and
there is a reason most other counties are doing this. Um it seems to make sense. Some of our others are by square footage. So, I I don't want I saw some of those other comparisons looked pretty detailed and complicated and cumbersome. I think we can come up with something that's not terribly
cumbersome. Yeah. Just a thought, but I'd like to see a little more information. Yeah. And I think there was a slide in there that showed that a little bit. It's just a matter of what we choose to adopt, right? Um Commissioner Alexander, do you have anything? All right. All right. I don't either. With that, um
this meeting is adjourned.