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Oh, I think you probably already >> Hi, Melissa. >> Hi. How are you? >> How are you? >> Good. >> We wait a few minutes for >> All right. It's 7 o'clock, so we're going to call the meeting to order.

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Welcome everyone. Uh, we have a forum. I'm going to call the July 22nd select board meeting to order. Um, this meeting is being broadcast on RCTV on Xfinity channel 9 and FiOS channel 31 and also live on RCTV's YouTube channel. At this

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time, let's join in the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nationy and justice for all. Okay, Jackie, please let us.

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>> We have present in our room Sal Vermonte, Karen Rose Gillis, and Chris Haley. And online, we have Melissa Murphy. And Karen Herrick is expected to join us shortly. Uh, shall we do a roll call vote since we're both places? Do we need to do that? >> You have to do a roll call.

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>> Join online now. >> Oh, Karen, just join online. Great. Um, so we're going to do a roll call vote. Melissa, >> yes. Yeah. >> Uh Karen Herrick Herrick, >> she might not be connected yet. >> Okay. Okay. Uh Salar

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is here. >> Karen Har, are you there yet? There yet. >> Oh, hold on. I had to make >> I see her on her. Sorry. She's Sorry. She's She should be good. She should be good now. >> Hi, Karen. Her hair, do you? >> Okay. Yeah. Thank you. There you go. [laughter]

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>> Welcome. Welcome. >> Right now, we're going to go over the meeting. It's pretty short agenda. First, Bri, you're going to have an overview of the meeting. Going to have public comment at 7:05 and we're going to discuss and vote on the

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override at 7:15. So, right now, overview of the meeting is we're going to talk about the override. Um, any public comment in the room? Um, sure. Why don't you come up?

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Name, address, two minutes. >> Hi, Maryann Downing. Um, Heather Drive, writing mass and I'm a chair of the finance committee and my memo is in the packet. I guess I could be saying I'm I'm speaking on behalf of the finance

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committee being chair, but the purpose of my memo was also to uh let the public know what the finance committee deci decided as a recommendation, not a mandate to the select board. I don't probably need to read the whole thing

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in. I'll just read a few highlights so for the public who may not have access to the packet but may be watching. after considering um financial data from the town manager and the town accountant and after having here he heard about financial conditions you for several

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years going into this. The finance committee recommended that the town has to come up with a way to address the shortfall. We went back and forth about whether there should be a single amount. The town manager had recommended several amounts which can be seen in um the

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packet for Wednesday the 15th. And in the end, we lined up with two possible options. One that would use pretty much um the 3 million of free cash, the amount that's approximately equivalent to our regeneration every year, and one

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that would match the current shortfall of 9.8 million. So, the two numbers we were recommending are 7 million and 9.8. Those are not outer boundaries. Those would be for what we call a tiered override which I'm sure will get explained. The town managers explained

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it before. Some of our neighboring communities have done that. Stone and Melrose. They give we wanted to give the voters a choice. There was a consensus among finan members that giving the voters a choice and having them understand what goes with each of these

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options especially given this short time frame where November is one of the times being proposed that might be the best way going forward. So again the 7 million and there was also enough of a difference but still a modest tax impact

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with both of those numbers. Nonetheless, we recognize this override is not likely to last as as long as um sorry. Yeah, that's the end of the time. As long as other overrides. [laughter] >> Somebody's taking over. Maybe there

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>> somebody's taking over stage. Well, anyway, you guys can read more of the memo, but just to give you the background, the motivation was to give the voters a choice in two different ways to address the override that both would leave us in good shape. >> Thank you. I reserve the right to call

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her back if we have any questions. >> Anyone else for public comment in the room? >> No. Um, is there anyone online that has their hand raised for public comment? >> No hands raised. >> No hands raised. >> They want to raise their hands.

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>> Nobody. >> No. >> All right. Um, so I guess at this time Jane, if you could give us a wonderful summary and lead us into this discussion. >> Sure. >> Thanks. >> Uh, thank you. I want to thank the

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select board for making themselves available tonight. I know it's very hard uh at the end of the summer. We planned these meetings out long in advance and um adding this meeting to give um town staff the time that we needed to come to Fincom, come forward with um the numbers

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that we're looking for um and prepare um the select board to be able to take this vote now in anticipation of potentially putting it um on a ballot for November, understanding that the deadline to get that to the state um is August 5th. So

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that's why we're meeting today um to if the select board chooses to um put it on a ballot for November, then we need um a week to mail it and put it all together. Um if the board is not prepared to make that vote tonight, we do have some runway to to still achieve that by the

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deadline. Um but it's because we're trying to um you know make that November window if the board wants just so that we're clear. Um, so I'm going to read the um executive summary from my memo that I presented last week um to the

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finance committee um just as a just to level set where we are and for anybody in the public who's joining. Um this memo is available online um and it will be on our um override web page that should be launching in a day or two um with some of the information we have and

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then we'll keep going. So, Reading faces a significant and escalating structural deficit. Um, 6.475 million in FY27, the present fiscal year, rising to 9.8 million in FY28, and

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reaching 11.4 million by FY32. The proposed FY28 operating budget assumes the passage of a Proposition 2 and a half override to maintain stable services and avoid severe reductions. Without an override, the town would need

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to revise the FY28 budget, implement broad service cuts beginning in FY28, and make substantially deeper reductions in FY29 to achieve a balanced budget. The deficit has been driven by years of increasing reliance on free cash,

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stagnant departmental budgets, and substantial post-pandemic cost inflation across labor contracts, utilities, waste management, health insurance, and other core expenses. Free cash regeneration has now inverted, leaving the town unable to rely on reserves without

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jeopardizing its long-term financial stability and bond rating. To address FY28 needs, I have made a recommendation uh for a $6.5 million override, which would still be supplemented by $3 million in free cash tied directly to

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the capital plan. If that override were to fail, approximately 67 se the equivalent of 67 municipal and school positions would be eliminated. Capital investments, including an ambulance purchase, would be deferred and major service reductions would affect every

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department. The library would lose Sunday hours and facing staffing reductions severe enough to risk state descertification that would result in the loss of aid, grants, and interl borrowing privileges. the school department would be looking at significant cuts um in in their

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staffing across teachers, par educators, custodians and and more. Um our police and fire and library staff and DPW would be facing cuts um as well as positions in this building. there

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would be no way we would be able to um sustain not having an override and maintain our level of service. So, the choices ahead will shape Reading's fiscal health and service levels for years. Clear understanding and thoughtful engagement across our boards,

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committees, staff, and residents are essential as the community considers how best to preserve the high-quality services and financial stability that it values. So, that is the executive summary. The full memo goes into a lot of detail, but

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we have all read this information several times and you have benefited from a a robust conversation from the finance committee last week. I want to thank the finance committee for their thoughtful discussion, their considered

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questions. Um it was it was a robust evening and um and hard work was done and I'm I'm grateful for the work and the thought that they put forward and uh the preparation that they thought Um so uh Jax if you want to pull up on the

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screen the um initial override tiers that was recommended this document we have a slide deck for that. >> Oh the slide deck or the graphic? >> The slide deck. You made three slides to match. There's the graphic. Um

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which we will tailor if if the select board were to choose a tiered override or whatever you choose. We will update information for the public so that it's clear. Um, there it is. Can you make it so it's just Yeah, there we go.

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So, just to walk you through this. This is very, very small. I'm going to have to read it off my laptop. It's the same. >> It's the same information in the memo. Yeah, I just made it so we can see it on

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the slides. Let's see. Here we go. Okay. So, if we were not to have an override, um, as I already discussed, we would end up with a $9.8 million budget deficit in

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FY28 and we would have to, um, eliminate the equivalent of 67 positions across the town and schools. And we would also be wanting to use $3 million in free cash. If we weren't using $3 million in free cash, um then the cuts would be

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bigger. They would be, you know, that much more. Um, additionally, part of the reason for people just to understand what the rationale is behind that $3 million just really clearly is it is it would be tied to how much

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capital we pay for in our budget. So, um, we do presently about 5% of our budget is paid in capital and debt payments every year. And this is a a wonderful way that the town continually reinvests in its infrastructure. Um,

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that we do that off the top. That is a priority in many other communities. They don't pay for capital projects until um the fall town meeting after the uh Department of Revenue has certified their free cash. Okay. So, how much

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money you have left over after the end of the year, what you've earned in interest payments, that kind of thing in in e, you know, revenues that come in beyond your um your estimates, then your free cash is certified, then they pay that toward capital. We frontload it. We

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do it up in the beginning uh in our in our April town meeting. Um, and we do that as a policy to make sure that we're always continually um, maintaining our infrastructure, which is, you know, it's a great policy, but we don't tie the use of free cash to that specific

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expenditure. So, that's why the $3 million is in here. That's a port, that's most of what it's not all of it, but it's most of what we pay for for our capital. So, it's a responsible use. Um, and it's not beyond our our capital. So,

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um, one-time monies, free cash to onetime expenditures. So, that's the rationale. So, beyond that, um, in administrative services, we would cut board and committee funding to $20,000. We would, um, eliminate the administrative

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services director role. We would, which I'm currently not filling, um, community services. We would cut elder and human services programming back to $13,000. That's what it is right now. Um, we would cut the meals back to $15,000. That's what it is presently. We would

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not hire a therapeutic recreation instructor. Um, we would eliminate the volunteer coordinator position in DPW. We would cut recycling um to bi-weekly. Um, we will cut parks improvements. We will cut fence improvements. Um, we will

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eliminate the assistant town engineer position. Presently, I'm holding that position vacant as well. Um, we will remove trash bins from parks and fields. That will reduce seasonal employees. Um, in the fire department, we will cut ambulance

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um service. We'll cut the purchase of a new ambulance and the associated equipment that goes on the ambulance as well as a simulation mannequin. Those are capital purchases. We will defer those, but they will they will be planned out into the future. They will not be um on the schedule that we had

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planned. Um, we will cut rodent mitigation back to $30,000. We will cut Sunday hours at the library. Um and with the additional positions that we would have to cut um that would jeopardize their certification. Um with police, we would cut overtime. We would uh cut one

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cruiser and we would reduce the crossing guards budget. Um the school department has a $917,000 community priority that's built into the FY28 budget that we're bringing forward. Um the FY28 budget is 3.75%

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[clears throat] budget in order to get the school department to the 5.25 that they're looking for in order to maintain their services. Um that's that $917,000. So that would if there's no override that [cough] would be cut [clears throat] um which would bring the school

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department down to 3.75 plus the additional layoffs. Um in technology we have um cuts to wireless devices uh Microsoft licenses and IT support for night meetings. Next slide please.

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Thank you. So if we um pass a $6.5 million override, this is part of the conversation that the finance committee had. Um and uh just as a reminder, one of the members um as referenced by Miss Downing um wanted to have weekly

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recycling put into back into this budget. So that's the difference between 6.5 and the seven is the weekly recycling. That's about $450,000. So if we um if we were to pass a six if the community were to pass a $6.5 million override, we would say that's a

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partial restoration of services. I would still plan to cut between three and five positions on the town side. Um we would still need to use three to 3.3 million in free cash to augment these operating expenses. Um but again that would still be tied to that capital and then um but

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it would maintain services across the town. So um we would restore board and committee funding to $25,000. We would restore the administrative services director role. We would increase elder and human services programming to $43,000. That's a $30,000 increase. Um,

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and we would increase meal services at EL in the Elder and Human Services budget to $25,000 or a 10% a $10,000 increase. We would hire a part-time therapeutic recreation instructor and we would restore the volunteer coordinator,

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uh, which is a part-time position. Um, at DPW, we would still have under the $6.5 million budget, uh, rather override, we still would not have weekly recycling would be bi-weekly. Um, we

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would restore parks improvements. We would restore fencing improvements. Um, we would restore the assistant town engineer role. And, um, we would restore trash bins and in in the parks and fields. So that would you know if we cut those things that would affect fields

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and you know ball fields all of that stuff would be impacted. Um in facilities we would be hiring two new maintenance staff and two custodians for our new buildings to be able the facilities department is really thinly fund really thinly staffed and for

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example we have one custodian that serves four downtown buildings. That's that's a lot going on. Um so and we have four maintenance people to maintain 1.1 million square feet of um town and

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school buildings. So and those that's going to increase with two new buildings. So those are the folks the maintenance folks are the folks that fulfill all the work order requests in all the buildings. So you know that's all different kinds of work that needs to be done. Um,

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>> real quick, uh, the YouTube feed has the Zoom feed with, uh, all the people on the right hand side. So, it's cutting off the entire right side of the memo that you have up >> the the YouTube feed on RCTV. >> Yes. So, we have to make this not full

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screen and then scoot it over to the left of >> show >> the picture >> and then it'll be fine. Even though it looks great for us >> in the room, right? >> Yes, >> that's helpful. And these slides will be available online.

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>> Yeah. >> So, who does that? >> Jackie like that. >> Yeah. But then scoot it to the left of Karen right now >> if it's possible. >> So the YouTube it's it's on the right

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hand side. Okay. >> So you see Karen, but on on YouTube it's RCTV, Select Board, ROM, Podium, Melissa, Jackie, and Karen. Okay. >> All on the right. So it blocks that whole side off. Like even >> can you like minimize the screen

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>> just like so it's smaller and then just scoot it over. That work? >> I don't know because you're sharing your screen. I'm not sure. >> I would just hate to like the whole column is cut off.

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>> I mean it's sharing the window not the screen. So >> right. >> Why do you have the preview on one side? Maybe if you minimize that. There's no preview >> on the left hand side. >> Left the slides. >> Yeah, I'm thinking

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you could drag it, but you can't apparently. I >> the wind is sharing the window. >> Focus on content like teams. >> Maybe if you pin it. I don't know. You right click and pin it. Just show that. I guess the

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>> fix for this is why is our CTV show on the Zoom instead of the cameras in the room? >> I guess because usually it's not like this. >> I can't speak to that. >> Okay. So, >> I don't want to hold it up anymore. It's just I know people at home are going to

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be watching and the whole right side of the screen's cut off so you can't, you know. >> Yeah, that makes it challenging. Well, we will um post these slides first thing in the morning. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Yep.

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>> Jax is still devising something. It's just gonna have to be full screen. >> Yeah, just keep it. It is what it is. >> Okay. >> Okay. Uh let's see. Back to So, under health,

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we would restore road mitigation to $50,000 where it is presently. Um the library would restore Sunday hours. Um we would restore overtime to the police department. Um one cruiser. So right now, if you remember for FY27,

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um we had a cruiser that was struck and totaled and so insurance bought a new cruiser. So in order to um do some savings, the police chief said, "We won't buy two cruisers in FY27. We'll just buy one." We would like to restore

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the the department to two cruisers annually because that is we run these vehicles 24/7 literally all day all night um around the clock every day. So uh we we do get our money's worth out of these cruisers but so it would restore

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an additional cruiser um and it would restore the crossing guards number. The community priority would be restored in the school department budget. Um and then in technology we would we would have Microsoft licenses we need for our employees. Um the wireless devices that

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includes um iPads or ruggedized um tablets that our DPW uses for work order fulfillment. Um and um it includes the wireless devices that speak to our SCADA system that maintain the um connections

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for all of our sewer systems and so forth. It's not just cell phones for employees. There's a lot. We wouldn't have by the way the sewer wireless devices just regular but that's includes that's part of that contract and then um I'm sorry that budget [clears throat] item and then uh we would restore some

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IT support for town for night meetings. And then we had put forward um as an upper tier um $1 million. So our structural deficit is $9.8 million in FY28. So, in order to eliminate the structural

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deficit and restore financial health, we would um at $11 million, we would do that, but we would also be able to add um we would increase elder and human services programming to $63,000, so an additional $20,000. And we would increase meals to $45,000, which would

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be another 20,000. Um and we would hire full-time therapeutic recreation instructor for DPW. We would restore weekly recycling at that level. We would hire two laborers. Um those two laborers would be helpful to um to address more of the grounds and the fields and uh

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work that we have around the new buildings. Um for fire, we would hire um up to four new firefighters, which would help us reduce overtime. And the police department, we would hire three new police officers. Those would be on the night shift. And again, that helps to decrease o that significantly will help

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to decrease overtime. Those pieces there come up to $1.2 2 million. So if we take $1.2 million off that 11 million, that's that 9.8 million that the finance committee recommended. Okay, just to tie it all together. So without any of the

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frills, 9.8. Um, so that is where we are. But if we did pass that 9.8, the same thing is true. There would be no cuts to services, expenses, or personnel, no free cash usage in the first year following the override, and we would

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maintain services across town. So, in this scenario, we would be investing in capital in our budget without using free cash to support it, which is a great way to be um if if we can get to there as a community, but we do typically

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regenerate about $3 million. We've never not regenerated $3 million um in free cash. And then a lot of that right now is attributed to um interest income because our town treasurer does a magnificent job of making sure that we are maximizing our um our interest

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income on our investments. So So that kind of takes you through what's at stake. Um we have uh been preparing for this work for a while now. This is not new news to everybody in this room um

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and for many people online. It's not new news that we have been coming toward an override. Part of the reason it's now, right, and why it wasn't done previously is because the um the structural deficit

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has grown. So in FY27, it was 6.475. in FY28 between what was put into the um the operating budget and then what was um ultimately added to the FY26 budget over the course of two town meetings, it

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went over $8 million in, you know, free cash subsidizing. So, with our free cash reserves dropping every year, we're not regenerating as much and we're using more. We This is an unsustainable scenario. We will soon if

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I have $12 million regenerated at the end of next year for instance and I use about $10 million to plug the structural deficit the in FY29 there's $2 million left in free cash with maybe another three that's five that doesn't we're you know

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we're sunk so we have to address where we are in our budget it is critical that we change the way that we use free cash as a community and I proposed those policies. Um, our finance committee gave us great feedback on that last week um

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when I did that and support for that and they're going to take that policy up in their in their future meetings. We need to change that and we need to um, you know, bring our budget back in line. So, my initial recommendation was to go for

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that $6.5 million with a sustainable amount of free cash. It doesn't solve our financial problem forever. it. Um we'll we'll be back in a in three to five years looking for probably another override. However,

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um recognizing that um the the U borrowings for the two new buildings are hitting homeowners at the same time right now. You know, I understand that that's a big a big bite. So, you know, a more conservative approach to an

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override now I think is reasonable. um in 2018 when we passed the last override um it was for $4.15 million. So, and it it was supposed to last about

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3 to 5 years. And between conservative budgeting practices, not increasing our headcount, um a number of other management techniques and COVID and ARPA funds and CARES Act dollars and those things, we've been

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able to go further um than than was anticipated, which is great because we don't want to be bringing these things back. But the finance committee has been trying to to help by plugging this um structural gaps and recommending these higher level usage of free cash, but we we can't do that anymore. So, and then

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previously, as we've been coming through this process, free cash has been sustained pretty high. It was $19 million a couple years ago, then it was $17 million, and then we used eight. So, you know, last year we used about half of what we had last year and we're going

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to regenerate, you know, probably three or four million dollars this year, but as you see, it's just going down sort of geometrically. So, we we have to address it. Um, we have to address it now. It's hard to go before the public and say we need an override when you have $19 million in free cash. But we can see now

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that the that with the high cost of inflation affecting us across all of our all of our lines, all of labor, as I said earlier, um and what's affecting we understand, you know, everybody across the economy is hitting all of us too. So

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um that's why in my 6.5 I am maintaining some staff cuts. I did institute a hiring freeze um last week and I explained that to the select board last week and that is we will have a priority for public safety. Um we will be doing

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some hiring um but as we have attrition as we experience attrition I'd rather not hire somebody for 9 months and then have to lay them off again. These are people with families and mortgages and you know car payments and you know

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obligations in their own lives. So I would rather leave that empty uh that position empty if I can um than to have to do that. So that's sort of the rationale here. Um we will still be working very hard to maintain level services with fewer people but that

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means there will be impacts. So that is my summation. It was very brief um compared to the finance committee uh summation. I hope that answers some questions for folks. I know sometimes the terms that we use like free cash um

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the the terms that we use in municipal finance um don't are hard to understand impenetrable um we will do our very best um should the no matter what the select board decides to do is if you want to do an override in November if you would

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like to bring one forward in April um or don't have an appetite for that now we will still continue to do our best to um educate the public um through through words, through videos, public information forums, etc. And to that end, I would like to announce that we

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will be doing our first u public um webinar on the override topic on August 6 at 7 p.m. So people can join the webinar and or watch it on YouTube. And that will be myself and Dr. Turner um

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and our finance uh CFO Sharon Angstrom will be um your headliners, I guess. No. in in uh in that webinar and then um anybody else from the boards who want to join us. >> Oh, great. >> Thanks. >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you, Madam Chair.

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>> Uh I think we're going to take turns going around all of us if that's all right with everybody. Um I think we'll start with Melissa or Karen online and we'll just kind of go around the room a little bit. Is that all right with you guys? Uh Melissa, you're in the upper right upper left. Why don't you go

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first? >> Sure. Thank you. Thank you, Karen. Um, thank you, Jane. Thank you, Fincom. I appreciate everyone's hard work and to all town staff that, you know, hours and hours and hours have been put into this uh discussion to get where we are

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tonight. Um, the way I look at this is that we need to be very cognizant of what can residents take on. um they just approved two major building

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projects that I think are great investments for our town and you know will benefit us for years to come. With that being said, I'm really concerned of what people's tax bills are going to look like with this override and I

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really want to be cognizant of this. Um, so when looking at everything that's been presented at FINGCOM and to select board over the past couple weeks, for me, I think the best approach is to pick one number

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and I would support 6.5 million and be very transparent and open with residents of why this is needed and it is, you know, a structural deficit. We have, you know, increased health

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insurance increase just you know regular inflation that everyone is seeing not just renting right >> so I really think that we need to be and we also had the trash contract and you know everyone listened to me say I don't want

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to go to bi-weekly recycling but that's that's what we need to do and I think that you know Jane mentioned only three to five positions may need to be cut or services other services can be restored. But I think the responsible thing for us

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to do is put forward a minimum number for me. I think that's 6.5 million as of right now um to the voters to approve. With that being said, we need to still trim the fat. We still need to go

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through and look at our services. Where can we make savings? And I know that has been done over the years, but I think everyone kind of needs to share the pain a little bit. And I've heard from many residents that

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really cannot absorb this into their finances. And that breaks my heart. And I think, you know, going any higher than we absolutely need to do, I don't think is responsible.

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I also don't love the tea method. Um, I've said this in previous meetings. I think that we need to come to a consensus of what the town actually needs and not like like to haves. Um, and so for me, the 6.5 million, we'll

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still need to use some free cash. We'll still need to make some cuts is the responsible move, next step, I should say, and to put it on for the November ballot. >> Okay, Madame Chair. Um yeah, I'm thinking

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about both [laughter] chair chair in the room, chair out of the room. Sorry. No, no, that's good. That's good. I I didn't want to interrupt. Um we do have some of the slides that if anybody has interest, we can show um what those impacts look like at different levels. Um Jax can put

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that up. We also have if anybody's interested in if a multi-year phase in of an override, what that impact would look like. And that is what's interesting about that is if if we were to do that that softens um that impact

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over three years or two years depending on you know what's the appetite there. So we do have those slides and we can put them up if there's interest for that. >> Okay. >> Yeah. And I think that's actually an interesting thing that I hadn't thought about before. I know we talked about that phase in but what would that phase in look at like at a lower number? Not a

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I know we talked about it at one of our meetings for a much higher number than the 6.5 million. >> Well, what does do we have? >> We have that J. We'll put up that slide on the screen. >> J, do you know which one that is? >> The impact spread over another one year. >> There it is.

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>> Got it. Just a second. She's the monster. Okay. So, we have um so Melissa, we have on the screen. I'm going to make it bigger. There we go. um on the upper right hand side 6.5 million over two years. So in

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year 1 it could be 5 million. Um and then that expected impact on nine the average valuation right now in FY26 is $944. Um that would be about $566 over the course of the year.

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>> So over over 12 months um in year one and then year two would be 1.5 and that would be $169 for the year. So that impact is $736, but it's taken over two years. Um, so that's a little bit

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easier. That may be a little bit easier for some folks. The select board could say we'd rather see it be like 4 million and 2.5 million, something like that. >> Um, if you look at 10 million over three years, the upper left hand side, you can see a $4 million impact would be $453

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thou $453 on the average valuation. Yeah. >> And so the way that Oh, sorry. Go ahead, Jane. No, I didn't mean to cut you off. Um the mechanism by the way this works just for the finance committee people in

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the room who are um more maybe into this but just so people understand if the override were to pass and we said we're going to do a phased implementation over two two or three years then it would increase the levy limit by the total

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amount that is the the amount to which we can raise taxes to. Okay. um it would increase immediately but the CFO would only charge that first four million, five million, whatever that number is. So people could go to the Department of

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Revenue website and see what the excess the term is excess levy capacity and that is what's left from the override that we haven't charged yet. And so they can see so it's it's shown it's transparent. It's an independent third um you know body that is um people can

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go to to see okay well they said they would raise it by this much you can see it in the levy limit increase and then the excess levy capacity would be the remaining 1.5 or 2 million or whatever. So that's just the mechanism by which it works.

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>> Hi. >> Yeah, thank you for this. I mean, I'd be open. I'm not sure if other people um what the I I'm open to this if other board members are as well, but um so I'd be curious to hear what others have to say. >> I just Maryanne Downing Finch chair. I

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just wanted to add to the phasing with the excess levy limit because I didn't put this in the memo, but when I researched this, Andover, I guess apparently does this and it doesn't what I've learned and someone please correct me. It doesn't have to be just up to the

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CFO because the select board you select you can you can direct it I guess because you're selecting the tax rate every year. So, say Sharon's not our CFO, and we hope is our CFO, but you guys can you guys could also control how

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how fast it how fast it phases in. >> Yep. >> So, I just wanted to let you know >> through the setting of the tax rate. >> So, if we plan on 5 million for one, let's take 8 million. If we're going to do four million one year, one the next, and three the next, we could adjust the second year to two million if we decided

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we wanted to do that. >> You could. >> Okay. I mean, >> the CFO implements it, but you guys set the tax rate. So, you have the ability to control that phase in even if we didn't have a CFO who propo proposed this. >> That's Yeah, >> it's a tool you have.

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>> Yep. Miss Danny is correct. Um, when I and when I said the CFO would implement it, she literally fills it out on a tax recapitulation sheet. It's part of the work that she does as a finance um director. But yes, because you set the tax rate, um, that's where that control comes in.

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>> Okay. You could be doing that right now. You could be under under taxing us, though. That never happens. >> No. >> Melissa, do you have anything else you want to add? >> No, thank you. I appreciate it. >> Thanks, Melissa. Uh Karen Herrick,

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>> sure. Thank you. Um um yeah, thank you again. The the financial forum was terrific the other night. Um it's a great watch. I appreciate the collaboration uh with the finance committee um and staff and um I did hear [sighs]

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which is a little awkward um you know loud and clear that our new superintendent really hasn't even had a chance to dig into this and that's why um it's a big bucket with no detail um but I think we're all clear that um if we do nothing it's going to be pretty

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devastating and so and um you know I concur that that we need to mitigate this as much as possible. Um and um the policy changes that Jane has brought up um we invited

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the Division of Local Services into give us um policy implementation and best practices back in the spring. A number of us attended. Um so this is Jane's policy of putting um limits around free

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cash spending is exactly you know what most other communities do like less reliance on free cash and I think it would be a good thing to nail that down. Um, you know, one thing we didn't talk about, although I brought it up in finance committee meetings about

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increasing the stabilization fund because when I look at how we got here, we we just have overall policies that when times are good, our our free cash balance floats too high and we make decisions because it looks like it's too

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high. Um but meanwhile now that we've run we've run the balance down we're our AAA bond rating um which gives us the best borrowing rates is jeopardized. So one way to avoid that in the future would be to um

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take this opportunity to to create a stabilization policy where we regularly monitor the amount. It's at a percentage of the budget and um the stabilization fund for people that don't know um first

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of all doesn't have a label free cash. It's a stabilization fund. I think all of town meeting and and most people recognize that is not money that we touched unless we absolutely have to. And there are also, you know, higher thresholds for getting money out of there. So, so I think there'd be a lot

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of good reasons to to do something more than we've ever done with a stabilization fund, which is we created it, we funded it once, and we ignored it, and it's been coming up on a decade. I I forget how long. >> Um, I am fine with providing two ballot

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options. Um I you know I love recycling and I think I would rather put forward um 6.5 as a lower option at this point and I have brought up the phase implementation or or rather you know Sharon brought it up

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and and I've been very excited about that since she brought it up and I appreciate um Sharon um digging out all of the details and the implementation of how we could do that. So, I would like to um

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definitely have that on the table. However, we vote tonight about putting and I would like to put something on the ballot for November. I I take FinCom's um recommendations seriously. We received letters from school committee

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members. I I think uh and I understand staff would really like us, the town manager and the CFO would really like us to do that. So, I'm in support of putting something on the ballot for November. I'm um I'm I'm I'm fine with two tiers.

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I think if there are two tiers on the ballot, given um what Melissa noted, people's budget constraints, I think the the lower one will have the better chance. Um but people like choices, including

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myself, so I'm fine with that. Um so um two options on the ballot, putting them on the ballot in November um with the understanding that we would have a a serious discussion um about a phased implementation to to mitigate

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this and soften the blow and you know whoever hasn't seen the financial forum the other night should really take a look at it because I I you know kudos to Sharon Angstrom for you know she's really laid out that we have now borrowed about

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50% of the debt we are going to need for our brand new Kllum school and our brand new um recal center and and she is going to be watching the cash flow. So part of the mitigation strategy for not

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pummeling the taxpayers would be to um keep a close eye on the cash flow as she described it so that she borrows at the last she asked us to sign off on borrowing at the last amount possible so she can be as on target as possible.

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Other um town meeting members know that in in the past you know we haven't really paid so much attention to that and then we have excess debt on the books for years. So we a have to pay for that debt and then we have to figure out what to do with it. So I really appreciate um these kind of measures

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being taken to just every every measure possible to mitigate the impact. And I do think that I I think that doing nothing is is just going to be catastrophic. And um then

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the next when after we vote tonight, if we vote to put ballot questions out there, then the next challenge for this board, our other appointed and elected boards and town staff is to really communicate this well to the community. Why why are we doing this? Why do we

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need this? And and we have a great start already. Um, appreciate the detailed specifications because I know the last override in 2018 when people start getting very specific about what you're going to lose um that's that's when they

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can make good choices. So, I hope I addressed all of the questions we have in terms of um the decisions we need to make tonight. >> Thanks, Karen. >> Did you want to say something? >> I have one thing I want to say. I'm I promise I I might have something to say after each member. I apologize.

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certainly may. >> Um, so Miss Heric made a made a good point that we haven't heard a lot from the school committee yet and and that's important. I know that they have been going through a major transition with um Dr. Milishevki leaving and Dr. Turner coming in. I do want to assure the

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public and the boards that we have met with uh school department staff. Um I've been working closely with Dr. Turner since before he came on board and we were working with Dr. Milishvky and um Mr. Little Hail, their business officer, um their finance director. I beg your

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pardon, Phil. Um as we've been going through this, so since we all met in um in April and May to start talking about this work, um and so I we that's where we got their 5.25% budget. Um Dr. Turner

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has shared with me some of the information from his presentation tomorrow night to the school committee. people will have a chance to hear how they're what they're going to be looking at. But what he said to me is that um if there's three to four million in

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reductions to the school department budget, some of the impacts would include um the risk of lower participation in extracurricular activities, an end to the one-on-one technology program. That would be where every student has a computer. Um that would go away. Um

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there would be um let's see less student behavioral and emotional support. There would be a reduction of counselors and administrators. There would be higher class sizes throughout the district. Um they will be at risk of losing programs and high impact supports in all of their schools and slower response times from

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the administration. And what that number sort of looks like is um they would also see an increase in fees. um they would see about I think they said 40

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uh let's see trying to find it on his slides. Well, I think he's updated his slides. Um the number of reductions in staff um was something along the lines of somewhere between 20 and 50, but I think that number is being worked on. So, I

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know people want to know like how many people um would be cut. That feels more real than some of these other items, but um I know that the the um school superintendent has been working diligently with town staff all along.

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This isn't they are looking at it. Um we have met with them and I am um encouraged by their faithful effort. >> All right. Thanks. >> Thank you, S. Um, so obviously I would like it not to be an override, but since we have to, I

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would be um I think I would be in favor of the the option of the 6.5 million with, you know, bi-weekly recycling. Um, I'd also be in favor of the two-year tier uh implement implementation.

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Um, I really think the two the two um option choice is not good for us because I think as leaders we should really put one forward and be able to explain it and defend it in detail. I feel like if we put two out

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um residents might, you know, get confused and it would it would, you know, maybe not pass either one. Um, I was talking to residents for the past week. Most people were in favor

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of the lower of the two options. So, that's why I'm leaning towards that. Um, I'm really afraid of of driving like long-term residents out of town. People are voicing residents are voicing their opinions that they can't afford it now

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and if this goes into effect, they might have to leave. And I really, you know, really don't think that's right. So I feel just putting the 6.5 out there, it's might not, you know, fund everything we want to. But in my

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experience in business sometimes, you know, a little bit little bit less and people um they find, you know, they find ways to make things happen. They don't, you know, it's if you give to people too much, they spend it, right? So, I'm not

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saying we're giving them too much, but we can find ways to cut um to be in our budget restraints. Um I and I also think we shouldn't just stop there. We should find new revenue

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streams and cost cutting after that. So, um yeah, I would be in favor of the 6.5 option, bi-weekly recycling, and tear it over two years. All right, Chris.

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>> Thanks, Karen. Um, I think that Karen brought up a good point that she likes people to have choices. Uh, choices are usually good. Um, but me sitting up here, I feel like I do not

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have a choice. Who do I want to alienate out of this town? the seniors that are going to get pushed out because they can't afford it or the uh the schools which predominantly are 60 to 70% you know of the budget. who like

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it is a difficult position to be in to just be like not pit one against the other but like it's you're going to do something for everybody and um it it's just I

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I know something has to be done because the prop two and a half we can only raise two and a half% every year things go up way more than two and a half% % like we all understand that some things go up 5 10% 20%. Um

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so those kind of numbers can't be sustained. So eventually you're going to need an override. It is what it is. It doesn't matter you know who's running the town, who isn't. Um it's just I I I keep getting back that we have to reduce the denominator

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and the biggest denominator is the school uh the school aspect of it which impacts I have you my two daughters in the school I don't think anyone else has kids in Reading public schools anymore you still do S I thought Salvie Junior

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just graduated I don't know so Sal still does um but like it's it's very difficult to just come up with with a number. I don't want

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people to uh lose their jobs. Nobody wants that. I don't want um uh seniors pushed out of town because behind them come families uh with, you know, double incomes, tons of kids, uh which is me. and we put more

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strain on resources compared to you know someone who uses two gallons of water uh you know per quarter that we've heard from before. So like it it's you can't make everybody happy and it's just I I don't feel that I have a choice

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in here. I I've said before that I think the override if we put on here would fail uh the first time around. 6 and a half does seem a little bit better than like the 9.8 a region 11 was in my opinion never happening. Um,

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Marblehead's been cited multiple times of what they did. Um, they got 15 million. Uh, Marblehead doesn't have a school and a recal center that's only half on our taxes right now. What's going to happen next year is when the other trunch of that hits, people are going to think we passed an override

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with an out without an override even happening. So, I don't know what I'm supposed to do up here other than just be like, "Let's go with six and a half just to get along with everybody because I I I I

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just don't see it. I I wish that these schools put in a lot more um time, effort, and energy that, you know, Jane brought up that all this stuff is happening behind the scenes, but I don't see it. Jane does, you know, and I'm

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sure school committee does because it's on that aspect, but I just don't see it. I got the school committee packet for tomorrow night myself. In there is a one-page memo from Sean Brandt with obviously all the negatives about what would happen about cutting teachers and

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losses and all that stuff. I agree. Um, but that's it. Jane's presentation that she just referenced is not in there. I have nothing to start citing here. And I'm supposed to vote on a a a one of the more significant votes that the select board is is supposed to take. And I'm

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just supposed to vote on it. I I just it's I don't know. I'm not happy doing it. And and it doesn't seem that I would be the deciding factor in it anyway. Um, so I'm not really sure where I'm supposed

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to go with this. I I just know that I can't get calls from people saying that they can't afford Medicaid and Medicare and they're on this strict budget and stuff's getting cut. Things that I don't have to deal with currently now. Uh, I will have to in the future eventually,

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but it just hearing these stories is not good. And that's without Kellum Enrique's second or third tunch, whatever, coming on to it. I just I just don't see it. I don't know. It's not great position to be in.

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So, I don't know what I'm going to do. >> Sorry. >> That's okay. Um, >> can I see anything here? >> Sure. >> I forgot to thank Fincom for all their hard work. Thank you. I did watch the the three hour and 40 minute meeting the next morning. [laughter]

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>> Five people. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> So, um, thank you for all your work. I can't thank the staff enough because they've been working for a really long time on

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this and [clears throat] it's all in the background and Jackie and Matt, you know, all the documents and all the prints and all the screens and it's I would hate to have us be back here in two years having to do the same thing again. And that's what I feel like

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is going to happen with the 6.5 if we don't do I'm going to use a 9.8 as a figure just to if that's what's going to get us out of this mess. Um it's not a mess. It's nothing that any of us caused. It's just life taking its toll

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on us. Um I don't think six and a half is going to help us a year or two from now. And I'd like us to be more um mindful about the impact on residents and town staff, not just for the current moment, but for what we're doing next

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year, the year after, and the year after. And that's why I'm leaning towards having two numbers on the ballot and the higher one or maybe the lower one being a tiered approach so that we can avoid us all being back here again with the

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same discussions and and there's never a right time. It it's never going to be the right time. But it's I just don't I don't want us to have to go through this again. And I want us to be able to provide the services that we are. And I

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don't I don't know why I don't see all the fat that people are talking about because we've gone through so many iterations of documents and spreadsheets and I know there's places you can cut small things here and there but I don't to me it's the people and I don't consider the people to be the fat. So I

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think a lot of them are already doing more with less and now we're asking them to do even more with even less. And so instead of five people there'll be three people doing the job of five or six people. And so I think being mindful of that in addition to all this that's part

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of the discussion of of 6.5 then then what are we going to be I don't think it's going to help us in the long run a year or two from now based on everything that I've read [clears throat] and gone through. So I don't

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I do definitely want a three tiered three day three-year option to ease it in. I think the way it's outlined was to be in conjunction with the second trunch of recal and killllum. So the bulk is the first year, it's lower the

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second year and it's a little bit higher the third year or however we decide that we're going to do it so that it can soften the blow. But I I think they've done a great job explaining what services we're going to lose and what we're not getting anything even with the

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9.8. We're just keeping it the way it is. And so I don't until somebody can actually show me what the fat is, I I don't I don't see that. Does that make sense? Um to answer your point, when we have

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left the budget for the most part level funded for years, you know, in some cases since the last override, >> um you know, there there isn't excess left. That's why most of our regeneration is coming from um either uh

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local receipts that exceed our estimates. Um and we are we're very careful about how we estimate that. We don't intentionally underestimate what our receipts will be. Um and then also our interest in income, the the amount of money that we're turning back to the

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town every year from individual buds has gone way down. So um and we see that kind of showing up in overtime budgets increasing because salaries haven't increased. um overnight budgets haven't increased. >> They have to call up. >> We're not posted, but there's a quorum

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of Fidcom members, so I feel like just want to call the >> Why don't you uh go right ahead? [clears throat] >> All right. >> Point of order. I think I I don't think you can do that. We have an open meeting. >> They're not posted. So >> I know we're not posted. I didn't know we were all going to come. >> So that's

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>> I love that they're here in person. Um so just don't deliberate. >> Deliberate. >> No deliberations. Okay. >> I would not say >> I would not say anything. >> And I'm just curious if any income members are online, too. >> No. >> No. Okay. Well, live here is good. Sorry. >> Okay.

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>> Just to let folks in the room know, Dr. Turner is online and we do have some school committee members online as well. >> Um, can I make one more comment before we um take public comment if you are planning to do that? >> Uh, sure. We took public comment at the beginning, but we can certainly take it

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again. Um, go ahead. >> I'm just anticipating that you may decide to let school committee members or the superintendent speak. Um >> the only thing I wanted to mention and and um and you know appreciated hearing your perspective is that um I feel like

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I need to keep saying this that communities are not doing overrides the way reading is. A lot of communities are not doing overrides the way reading is anymore. It's not like this like we agonize it over for a decade or make it they are doing regular smaller

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overrides. And if we think about how that works in practice um because your your point may be perfectly well taken. This override isn't going to get us very far. So we may be looking at another one in year three or year four. I don't think that's a bad thing. Um and what it

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does is the amounts are smaller. It's less work for staff to clearly say this is what we're trying to pay for or this is what we're going to lose. It's it's less work overall and assuming we survive the next three or four years. Um

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and and you know it's it's a big it's a big ask of everyone then debating about you know 100 bucks $150 and you can clearly see what am I going to get for it and the voters get to weigh in and that's really what it

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should be about. It should be the community members. I mean, we can put it forth. Staff is planning for what they think we want and we need, and then ultimately, when the voters say, "Yes, you're right, and I'm willing to pay for it," then then I think we're doing our job. So, I just um I think we're going to we're

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going to need to change our mindset. Unless something dramatic happens at the state house like corporate fair share act, unrestricted supports the operating budget. It's not just, you know, but I don't know of anything like that that's coming. So, thank you.

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>> Thanks, Karen. Um, >> Madam Chair, >> yes. >> Um, I wanted to add something based on some of the things that all of you said. >> Um, when we get to FY32, at that point, we will have fully funded

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at 100% our pension liability. And so there is the potential at that point to free up, you know, several million dollars annually um that would otherwise be going just to the pension liability. Some of that will go to OPED

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and we'll we'll invest more in OPED, but that will free up some free cash. So five years from now, we may see a little bit of a loosening compared to a tightening. Um so it's something to give you some information on. It doesn't change. right now the projected 11.4%

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>> [clears throat] >> um deficit that we would see at that time again if we stayed at a 3.75 budget, you know, if if the community passes a $6.5 million override um or whatever the select board puts on at a

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lower level, you know, to Sal's point, we will have to [snorts] I say this sometimes cut our garment in the shape of our cloth. So there may be continued, you know, reductions in FY28, but they aren't devastating to our to our services. Does that make sense?

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>> Does anybody have any more comments? >> So when would the uh the recal and kill them fall off the like that that exclusion? How many years is that? So, uh, if memory serves, um, the Kllum School borrowings are a 20-year

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borrowing and the recount borrowing is a 15-year borrowing. And, and just so that part of the conversation, um, the CFO mentioned last time is she borrowed about $50 million for the kilum. So, that's most of what we're going to be

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borrowing. That's a maj um and I think she borrowed 20 million for the recal project which is a $27 million project about 28 million that's the total value of recal the kilum school project as folks may be learning

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tonight uh came in well under budget $14 million under our even revised 90% construction document. So anyway, what that's starting to look like is instead of an $86 million local share, because the MSBA, state agency that helps fund

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schools, is taking a big portion of the cost on um instead of 86 million, that borrowing is starting to look closer to like 6065 million. So that that number is coming way down. So we'll find out soon, you know, in the next couple of months from

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the MSBA where where we land there. But that is really good news because that's $20 million we don't have to borrow basically. Do you know what I'm saying? So that is so when we go to do that second trunch um which is the the final borrowing as Miss Heric pointed out

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we're going to borrow at the end of the project. Um we'll do that last issuance of debt. Um it's a lot less of a bite that people will feel compared to the first trunch that they're been when they're opening their tax bills in July.

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Okay. Just food for thought. >> I think I would like to open up to public comment again in case people join us online or anyone in the room. >> Maryanne, >> I would not say anything. Maryanne,

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you can't. You have five people. >> I'm not I'm speaking as a resident. >> I'm speaking as a resident. I I'm speaking Maryanne Downing, 13 Heather Drive, resident of Reading. I have a I wanted to ask a question. A

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question um or just follow up on Miss Herrick's comment about lots of communities doing smaller overrides. I want some examples of that because I'm not really see other than Arlington and they're not small overrides. What are the communities that are doing these

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more frequent? I feel like it's more these bigger overrides that everyone agonizes over and tries to pass just like us and they're hard and anyway that's I just don't know are they western mass because I'm not f maybe I'm not following it as closely so any more

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information on that would be good perspective to the residents thank you >> thank you question is there anyone online with their hand raised >> Tom Weiss name and I just asked him to unmute.

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>> I'm trying to I did unmute but I can't think of myself on camera so apologies. Um Tom Weise 181 South Street member of the school committee but speaking on my own behalf since we have not deliberated as a school committee yet. Um, a couple of things that I would like uh the board

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to consider um as you think about this. One is I I' I'd ask that you be very strategic about it. Um if we put one option forward, I don't want us to plan that it fails

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and then that option is then something that has to be lower come April. So we can't put 6.5 and then come back in April at five and still have a m a bigger structural deficit.

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So if you do 6.5 and or seven and 9.8 you give some options maybe there's a better chance the lower option passes. Just think strategically about what you would do. Not that you're planning for a failure in the fall, but if a failure happens, what happens in April?

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So that that's just one question. Um, and I'd suggest you maybe think about that more than tonight as well. Um, that's one thing. The second thing, and I said this at the the FINCOM meeting as well,

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>> is we in the schools, and now I'm I got to be careful. I would suggest that the town consider and I will suggest tomorrow night at the school committee that we consider what that 917,000 for the schools actually

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covers. Uh a plug number does not sell. A plug does not mean anything to anybody. The reality of what that number is as someone who built the model is that number is refilling

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the lost money from FY27 that was a community priority over 5 years for full day kindergarten. Now whether the rest of the book the school committee agrees with me or not, there is a conversation to be had about 917,000 meaningful day kindergarten yes

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or no. Food for thought. There's a lot more that Dr. Turner and the team have put together that we'll see more of tomorrow. I haven't seen those details yet. To Mr. Haley's point, understanding more of that to feed into a decision tonight

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might be good. Um, I'll take the blame because I thought you guys were making your final decision on August 4th, not tonight. Um, and I ask that we meet as soon as possible before August 4th and soon as possible is tomorrow night for us. So whether or not you're willing to

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delay your decision tonight to get more information from the schools, I'll defer to you, but I ask you to consider that so we can understand and think about the marketing around this as a greater from a greater perspective. Um, yes, there are a lot of potential people in play. There are also a lot of

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other strategies that have been outlined. Miss Wellman outlines some of them at a very high level, but seeing the details will matter and what the school committee is willing to say push forward may matter as well as you consider your positions. Um, so two things or three things. One, think

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strategically. Don't think don't just think about November, but what happens if uh two, we're going to have to put a number or name to that $917,000 number. It's just too big of a number. Otherwise, nobody's going to buy it with

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that big of a number. And three, um, yes, we've had some challenges in getting ourselves uh, from a school perspective to put the details behind our ask, but that is what what we're doing tomorrow night. So, ask yourselves if you want to see that before you make

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a decision for what numbers you want to put on a ballot. Uh, considering you don't have to have the state review until August 5th. So, thank you for your time and I apologize that I'm not there in person. Thank you. So that Hi, come on up. Name and

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address. >> Ed Ross um 16 Kensington A. Um just to follow on um from from Mr. Wise, I thought he brought up some really good um points um specifically on thinking strategically. Um and I think um this is you know kind of one of the the pieces

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that I um didn't quite have the ability to articulate and he and I think he did it really well. I think that strategic piece of it is looking at something not only um short-term for November, but also um going forward and some of the members have already kind of mentioned

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this um this evening um and I think that is the you know the key thing that um supports a multi- option um out there. it it does give that optionality and and and I've heard um uh the town manager

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and the uh chief financial officer also mention h you know that goes along with the tiered approach is having those numbers gives the um staff the ability to know and have clarity and transparency as what they're what

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they're going to do. So, you know, um, and I and I know, uh, Tom Andrew has said this, whether they look to hire staff, um, they may still hold the position because they know they have the revenue there. Um, and it just gives clarity as far as how to be able to

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budget. Um, and I know, you know, many of you, you know, have that um responsibility in in your private lives. But I think, um, and the other thing I'll say is I I I get the sensitivity um, and the consultation, but

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one thing I will say in being slightly critical, this is why we elected you. Um, you're here to make some tough decisions. Um, and, um, it's it's to be expected. Um and um I I think taking some time as Mr. Weise had mentioned as

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well is is is probably a good thing. It sounds like there is some time um to be able to do that. Hopefully you kind of with that you can look at what's been discussed this evening um and you kind of give it that you know kind of proper

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weight. Um I I I strongly believe that um there isn't any fat um that that's that's in there. Now Mr. Weise just mentioned it. Um they they've already the schools have already

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done things to get to budget this year. They've robbed you know kind of future years to fund this year. Um that's not fact. Um that is um a

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reality. Um this is dire. The the town's in a in a in a an acute position. We're we're not alone. Uh other towns do the same thing. All the towns are going to be in a similar situation. But um it

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this is ends up being a a a community that needs to be educated. It starts with our elected offuh officials um um and and and kind of cascades from there. There is a lot that's going to be on your plates uh to

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be able to do this. Um so, you know, please give it the weight it deserves. Have some, you know, um decisions to be made. Think about it clearly and then back it up. I think these these are

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these are important things. It's an important time. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Do you have something else? >> Karen, can I just ask a quick question? >> Of course. Melissa can go first. >> Sorry.

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>> That's okay. >> Just I just want to confirm something. I know that um Tom and Ed both had asked um for some additional time, but I just I I want to get a clarifying answer from Jane. I don't really think we have

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additional time with having to have the answer by to the state and having to send it to them with town staff writing it up. Am I correct in saying that Jane? >> So, um I appreciate the question. Uh let

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me let me work backwards. we have to turn into the state by August 5th an email copy of the questions that we want to put on the ballot and a hard copy certified uh version from the town clerk. Um once the board makes their

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vote, the town clerk will certify that number. >> The town clerk has to be the person that certifies that vote. The town clerk is going on vacation next week. So, um I can't remember what day she's going. >> Just told me

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>> from the 30th. Okay. >> So, um she has to certify that. Then we mail that to the state house um to the division of elections. Now, we can also hand deliver drive in the hard copy and hand deliver it to them, which we've

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done in the past when things go missing in the mail. Sometimes that happens. >> If she's out of town, >> if she's out of town. H >> Yeah. [clears throat] She's out of town. >> I'm just gonna confirm what Karen was asking. Yeah. So, if the if we're looking at a calendar,

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>> so we could have a meeting out of town. >> We could have a meeting on the 28th. Maybe. >> So, she leaves the 29th. >> Today is the 22nd. >> She leaves the 30th. >> She will be not in on Thursday the 30th. >> She leaves the 29th. >> So, um,

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so if you met >> 29th >> on the 28th, >> she could have on 29th. What do we have on the 28th? Um, if you met on the 28th for this purpose, the town clerk could certify it. Um, and we would have it to take into the state

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house. You would probably mail it and I would still call them on the on the fourth and make sure they have it. If they didn't, I would drive it into them to make sure. So, um, so you you could take the time to do that. Um, I have not seen separately. Uh I have not seen the

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um the school committee present or the coming from the school department anything higher than what their original 5.25 ask was. I mean really what's dire for them is if there is no override and what what those what those pieces look like? What is that $917,000?

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What does that impact look like? and and how will the school committee deliberate on where where that effect will be is if there is no override. Um so if the there is that is all part of how we communicate that out to the public.

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We've already starting working on some some joint uh dates and times so that we can pull together public um we have a schedule but working with um the superintendent's office to pull together those joint forums. Um and we'll do that online. we'll do it uh in person. I'll I

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think there's a Saturday on there that we'll be in and doing that. Um and uh we'll have all of that information to to put out kind of how the school committee wants to break down um the consequences of no override and and the other details that would be included in in their

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budget. So, um I think that the the select board can act tonight with some of the numbers that you have before you if you are more comfortable waiting. you have some runway to do that and staff will make that work. Okay.

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>> So, I guess I'm thinking I feel out of respect for Dr. Turner and the transition and the big 917,000. Yes. >> Uh I apologize. Um the town clerk is on the Zoom. If you want to call on her to

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ask, she's there. >> Hi. >> We have many department heads on the >> clerk Jem like to add to the discussion which would be great. Jackie is gonna ask her to unmute and then she'll be >> I just made our co-host. She should be good. >> Okay, she's good to go. Oh, yep. She's a co-host now. Go ahead, Laura. She may

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not know that I'm there, Laura. >> She probably walked away from her computer just now. Um, okay. So, >> okay. Well, she when she comes back, um, she'll know that we're looking for her.

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>> So, I guess >> what information we looking for from the school committee. >> So, I guess out of respect for them and us not having seen anything other than what we vaguely have been presented, um, which and don't get me wrong, we've been presented for months what their budget

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is and that we went through with Dr. Milichsky. It's not a huge surprise, but I don't feel like we've had a chance to get a second run from them. You know, Jane and staff has gone through a lot of different iterations of her budget. And so, I think for them and for us, I think

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that we need a chance to see what they're talking about because that's my opinion. >> So, I I was just thinking if it was going to be over 5.25 or under is that would what I would want to see. >> I would like to see if they can get under. >> Right. Exactly. because we you know we

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kind of got everybody else >> all departments to cut >> and I'd like to see hear the discussion right >> does anyone else online Melissa or Karen do you have a comment >> Laura's online

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>> I mean I agree with it would be nice to see I mean I I'm not sure I and I'm not sure that Tom can answer this right now or not so I don't want to put anyone on the spot but I guess I just don't know what else we're going to

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Jane. Am I wrong in saying that when you asked for budgets from departments, the budget that came from the town was the 5.25%. >> From the school department, correct? >> School department. Yes. Okay. So, I guess I'm not I'm not sure what

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um additional information we'll gather from them at their meeting tomorrow night besides what they think what they'd be looking at if an override didn't pass at all.

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I mean essentially they have given Jane what they're looking for for FY28 and it's a 5.25% unless they're planning on you know cutting that piece. But even if they cut that 5.25% I think we're still

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in that minimum of $6 million number. So for me, I'm not sure that the additional night gives us any more information beyond the fact of what what happens to the schools if an override doesn't pass. What are

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their cuts going to actually look like? So, I'm not sure that the extra time makes the difference, but I mean I I can I'm happy to wait the week if I just don't know that it really is going to look differently for us.

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>> Okay. Car. Uh >> so Laura Jem is available and unmuted. >> Okay. >> So she can speak. And then also wanted to let you know that Dr. Turner will be avail he's on the Zoom. Um he's attending to a family issue at the moment and he'll be available to speak in 10 minutes if you want to ask him

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some questions. >> Okay. >> Or yeah. So anyway, >> uh hi Laura. Do you want you have any comments? >> Hi. >> So I just wanted to just make sure that it's um understood that I can do whatever needs to be done on

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the road to be able to certify this um if need be. So if you can't, you know, don't come up with a decision now, um it just has to be handd delivered. So I won't be able to do that part. Jane or somebody will have to go into Boston, but um we can I can do whatever needs to

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be done. Um you can so you can certify it and get us a hard copy uh while you're at >> So what will happen is I will um I will sign it certifi certify it as a true test copy and my staff will then put the

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seal on it and then hand hand it to you and then at that point you could take it to Boston. So I can do that from the ground if need be. >> Thank you very much. Appreciate it. >> Appreciate that. Yeah, >> Chris. >> Thanks Karen. Um, yeah, I I kind of

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somewhat agree with Melissa. What more are we going to learn while simultaneously saying the same thing? Like I would love to hear from the schools in general because to address an earlier comment, yes, people elected me to make hard decisions, but people didn't elect me to make hard decisions

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without knowing 70% of the town's budget what it's going to actually be used for. uh in this scenario. Uh that's just, you know, me blindly voting once again to get along and just go ahead and go through the motions, which I don't know

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if people pay attention, but I don't do that. So, um, but just to clarify a point that I would like to see the difference because, uh, during my time as chair with Matt, I, you know, I said,

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you know, we have to keep the amount to 2 and a half% plus new growth. The town ended up right around 3.75%. Which, like I said, you're never getting two and a half. It's not happening. Uh, everything just goes up. Um, so I'm curious to see how the schools end up at

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5.25%. Because that is significant when you're 70% of the budget and you move 1% like that compared to um the town side. That is fairly significant. Um, and I know that the town had to cut and do lots of

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different things to get down to 3.75. And I would love to see why the schools can't do that because, you know, if if Matt and everyone presented last year that, you know, we got to do four and a half or whatever, we probably would have

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been like, it stinks. But, uh, I understand, but that wasn't the case. So, I kind of want to see what the schools have to say, what the answer for that is, unless Henry in 10 minutes can explain that, you know, where I'm going

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to understand it. But I mean, we we just I don't know. Uh there's nothing wrong with more information to make a in informed decision. So when I have to justify why I was okay with a $6.5 million override, um you know, it has to

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get done like something does. Whether six and a half's the right number, you know, is still debatable. >> Yes. Okay, Tom, >> is he unmuted? >> I just saw some time. >> Oh, okay.

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>> Yep. I'm here again. Thank you for letting me unmute. Um, for as I said again, I'm speaking on on one person's behalf, not six people's behalf. So, I'll just say that and you guys can take it with a grain of salt. Um, first things first, to address the 70% or 65%

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comment, um, you can look at our budget for FY27. that tells you where the money is going. We're not fundamentally doing anything different. Um, if anything, the the big difference of what's happening here again is to close the funding gap

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that we had to solve in FY27. Uh, which again was because we took an $837,000 level funding budget cut in FY27. So while the town was able to do 3.5 3.75 whatever it was the schools were at

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2.8 or something like that in FY27 the represent the the repercussion of that is to try to get back level and again my contention is to get back to the community priority of full day kindergarten. That's the 917,000 that we're talking

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about here from my perspective. The rest of it is standard salary related stuff. You know, most of our staff, most of our cost, somewhere around the lines of 85 to 90% is staff related. You know what that means? You know the

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investments we've made over the years to increase performance that we've seen happen over the district over the last four or five years. [clears throat] That's continuing that that related spend. We can go through that in more detail and we will go through that in more detail, I expect, tomorrow. Other

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things that that I've asked for tomorrow, but I don't know if we're going to see it because I haven't seen materials yet. And so maybe Dr. Turner can address this when he comes on is what other revenue sources can we look at? We've talked about a few different revenue sources. We've talked about

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increasing, you know, uh fees as an example, whether that becomes sports fees or extracurricular fees for drama and band and things like that. That might be an additional revenue source. Uh we've talked about whether or not we can increase advertising, right, which

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would include a bylaw change to allow us to put permanent advertising at RHS on the football field like Wakefield does. We've talked about other things as as ideas to close gaps, right? That might be on the table for tomorrow. We've

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talked about and we have actually proven over time that we can bring in more people from a special education perspective in district right? Not just our own kids who are which is a big thing we've been trying to do but also we have a revenue source

331
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of other kids from other districts coming into our programs. So can we do it more there while maintaining our staff levels or slightly increasing but making it a net positive from a revenue perspective. There are other conversations that we've been having over the years as we've been

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continually talking about and as Sean and I talk about regularly. invest to save, right? We've done that for the last and I see Sean is coming on now. We've done that for the last four or five years. So, you know, whether you want to delay, I

333
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don't know if it's going to affect your 6.5 number, frankly, I don't know if it is. So, I'm not going to promise that, right? But there will be more information about how the schools are going to address some of these things. Whether that information impacts your decision only you guys can determine

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right as you go through this but I think it's important that to say that you know already what the money is going to be spent on because it's not fundamentally changing what the money won't be spent on if we don't have the override that's what you will learn

335
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right that's what the difference will be that's where the you know 40 heads that have been discussed about would would come from and that's what Jane gave a quick summary of earlier that we will have more conversation on tomorrow. So again, whether you want to vote tonight or not is up to you. If you do,

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again, please do it strategically. Um, but there are other things that we are planning to discuss tomorrow. At least I hope we are um as a result of our last conversation and you can watch that a little bit if it helps you as well where we are starting to discuss this conversation at our last I think June 9th July 9th meeting. So again, thank

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you for your time and your deliberation. I appreciate all your work. Thank you. Thank you, Tom. I see Dr. Turner's on. Good evening, Dr. Turner. >> Good evening, everyone. Thanks. Thanks for having me. Um I don't I don't have

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much more to share than what Tom Wise said, but I can share that um tomorrow we have a very in-depth presentation um that um is focused on considerations for the FY28 budget and um what the

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impacts would be for if uh uh there was no override or or an override vote failed. Um and so that's the focus of of the of the presentation. Um uh Jean um mentioned um some of the impacts that we talked about um they are considerable.

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We have different levels based on um just you know what what the decision that that you make um or the the waiting of the um impacts on the town side and the school side and there's been several recommendations made on how decisions will be made. Um [clears throat]

341
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um but even with a um a million dollar um reduction on the school side, it would still impact there still would be positions that would be cut. So there's there are some ways in which we could um look at non-personnel

342
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funding um and um that uh would cover some of our cost but would not cover um it would not cover enough that we still would have to look at at staffing positions. Um the first recommendation that we would make

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would be an increase of of fees um to what Tom had um was ask was asking about. Um we do open the question to the school committee about uh the ways in which we uh the district has generated revenue such as um tuitioning of

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students and also um uh our school choice program. Um but there are you know those those are those come with um They come with some ways cost but they also come with um significant educational questions as well. Um our

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non-personnel question uh uh topics uh come with some inherent risks. So if we made cuts for FY28 on say somewhere in our um how we are prepaying in terms of special education um out of district

346
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placements. That's a one-time payment. And so therefore it would um lead to significant impact on our FY29. So um it's not as if like it just it solves the problem. It just pushes the problem down the road or the challenge

347
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down the road. Um we you know we we will have in our presentation um some some information about um what is generated by our fees such as in athletics. um you'll see that that there are um there there are losses um that we still make

348
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even with um our um fees fee structures. Um and so we will have to look at everything on the table. Um and so that's um sort of where we are and as we go higher from a million dollars to $2 million to sort of what was presented in this presentation of you know $4 million

349
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um you know we would be looking at significant um reductions in uh staffing um but I but um to Tom's point there is a lot in our presentation that will answer some of your questions um but it is focused on if the override fails or

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if there's no override vote. Thank you very much. >> I see Shan Bryan has his hand raised. >> Thanks Karen. Um so first you know just apologize for not joining the meeting earlier and um you know we were under or I maybe misunderstood and you know

351
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thought this vote was going to take place a little bit closer to that uh August deadline. So my apologies that we're kind of scrambling here a little bit. Um, you know, I I want to just agree with everything that Tom and Dr. Turner just said. I think uh they were spot on in their comments. The other just couple things I'll add. Um, you

352
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know, Tom's right that, you know, we we spend a lot of time thinking about and talking about sort of invest to save opportunities. I do think it has to be acknowledged that those usually have, you know, more of a medium-term impact than a, you know, a near-term uh than a near-term impact. So rarely are those opportunities ones that are going to,

353
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you know, provide a buffer for us in FY28. Um, you know, Dr. Turner talks about some of the non-personnel options that we have in terms of in terms of cutting the budget. Um, and he used the phrase kicking the can down the road. You know, when you start talking about things like delaying equipment refreshes and that,

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you know, that sort of thing, you know, they'll get you some savings in in year one, but you usually end up paying for that on the back end, right? So, um, so I, you know, I just think those things are worth keeping in mind. Um we've when you look at the positions that we've added over the last you know however

355
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many years you want to go back in the majority of cases they're doing they're doing you know one of two things that I see is related. They're either directly impacting the quality of instruction or they're freeing up teachers to focus on instruction. And it's not a coincidence that we've seen some of the improvements that we've had

356
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in terms of um student outcomes as a result of that. And um you know I it it's just it's hard to picture a scenario where um substantial cuts to personnel which is as as Dr. Turner and Tom both alluded to would have to be on

357
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the table in almost any sort of failed override scenario. Um you know where substantial cuts to personnel wouldn't you know wouldn't be a significant part of the approach there. Um it's just what the numbers tell us. So you know as I said in my note to you all earlier today I I don't envy you being in the position

358
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that you're in. Um, but I do feel pretty strongly that we've been really responsible with the budget. This is a structural problem as you all know and um, you know, we need sort of a strong stance on what it's going to take to get us back in in a good structural place.

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So, thank you. >> Thank you, Sean. So, anyone else have their hand raised? No. I guess can we go around the group again to find out um if we're comfortable having a vote tonight

360
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just to make sure we're all on the same page and then talk about what we want it to look like kind of getting back to the basics. Melissa. >> Um, I could go either way whether we vote

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tonight or hold another meeting next week. For me, I don't see my opinion changing of where I stand on what I think we should put forward, which would be that 6.5 number. And um

362
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um spacing it out over two years, but I could go either way whether we officially vote on that tonight or not. >> Okay. >> But I do think that Dr. Turner and Sean and Tom kind of solidified my thoughts on the fact that I don't think we're going to learn

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a lot in terms of what the numbers should be from the school committee meeting tomorrow night. I do think we'll learn of what those cuts may entail if no override is passed, but I'm not sure numberwise when it comes to putting a number forward for residents. I don't

364
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believe we're going to learn much um from that meeting tomorrow night. >> Okay. Thank you, Karen. >> Um I'd love to see um an opportunity to go a little bit lower than 6.5 million for an override. Um, from a process

365
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perspective, um, I haven't been really comfortable, um, with this big bucket for the schools that isn't really as detailed as we have on the town side. And I realize there's very good reasons for that. So, I I'm open to a quick

366
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meeting next week to wrap this up. So, >> I guess I could go either way, but listening to listening to the school board and um knowing that they're probably not going

367
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to come off that 5.25%. Cuz 2% of that budget is million and a half dollars, which would make a huge difference. Um if it's going to stay the 5.25%, 25%. Yes, I'd like to hear more detail about

368
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it, but it's not really going to make my decision any different, I don't think. I'm I'm happy to come next week. No, no problem at all. >> Chris, >> thanks, Karen. Uh, I'm fine with next week.

369
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>> Um, okay. Do we have a feel for whether everybody wants to just have one number on the ballot or are they comfortable with two numbers on the ballot? I just kind of want to have a little bit more stuff to think about. >> Melissa

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>> Melissa, >> I'm still going to stick with one number. >> Karen, >> um I'm open to two numbers. Whatever the board decides. So, >> I think I'm still sticking with one. >> Chris,

371
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>> if I voted, it would be for one. >> And I would like to see two. >> So, we've got a nice mixed bag, don't we? >> Mhm. >> It's kind of like the trash vote. You know, >> it is the trash. >> Wow. >> Wow. >> Too soon, Jane.

372
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>> Too soon. Right. >> We made it through the trash. >> You did a great job of the trash. >> And we'll make it through this. We will. Um, all right. So, it seems everybody's more inclined to wait until next week. Um,

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does does that mess the town the room? What do we do? >> Time to post for 2 P uh for the 28th. Do you want to do the 28th? We have I don't see anything else on the calendar. Um we will also post the

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finance committee and the school committee um as precautions. So >> yeah 28th is open. >> 28th is open. Okay. >> We can also do Monday too. >> I won't be taking Monday off. >> Oh yes. >> Sorry. >> So what is wrong with doing this on our

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normal August 4th meeting? >> Laura already said she can handle whatever >> you're really pushing >> that that makes it tight. So if >> I mean we're either going to do it or we're not like >> I don't want to say >> we can do it tonight too. I mean you know it's not we're not going to get any

376
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more information than what we have other than some for the school committee but the school committee it's really just what we're they're going to lose. So I don't think that that impacts our decision on an override or not. >> I agree. Yeah. I think like I said if they were going to come down 2% off the five and a quarter that would make a big

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difference to me. >> But we're still going to need an override >> right. It might change the number a little. >> If we were going to do a $5 million override, I could see that passing. And I haven't said anything about anything passing, but I think that easily could

378
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once you start breaking that, you know, is what it is. >> Well, that's a number that I don't have any data for. Do you know what I mean? So, that's to me, >> you know, just speaking not speaking for the school, it would be cuts across the board.

379
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>> Yeah. Um, even and so that 6.5 million includes three million in free cash. I don't think speaking entirely for myself, but also based on my significant amount of conversations with our CFO, we're comfortable at $3 million in free cash being used. We wouldn't want to see

380
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any more than that. So, it would it would necessitate, you know, there would be cuts that are happening. 6.5 is sort of, you know, stable. anything below that is is just additional cuts, which may be something that the that folks are comfortable putting on putting on a

381
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ballot and that's okay. So, I understand where people are at with that. Um, just but just to give you the sense that that's that's what that's going to mean. There may be an appetite for something to pass and it's short term, but it it

382
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helps us in long term. you know, if if the community votes for $5 million for us, we will be happy for that to take that. It's not the ideal number. It's not gonna, you know, but 5 million is better

383
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than zero. >> That could also be our our backup plan for April if 6.5 doesn't pass. strategically thinking like Tom Wiser. >> I see Sean Bran had his hand up. >> Thanks, Karen. Um, consider this, you

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know, average resident public comment here. Um, not school committee position per se. Um, if if you do land on a number that's below the six and a half million that Jane's talking about, I would I would really encourage those of you who are thinking about one number to consider a tiered number in that case. I

385
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think residents, many residents might be frustrated by only being presented with an option that reduces services, right? >> Um, and so presenting an option that does provide a true level services budget minus weekly weekly recycling or whatever else might be, you know, might be impacted there. Um, and then one that

386
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does represent some cuts feels like a sort of more appropriate tiered offering in my p in my opinion. Um, you know, I many residents would be frustrated by you're only giving us the option to experience significant cuts both on the town and school side.

387
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>> Thanks, John. Melissa, >> thanks Karen. Um, I Sean, I'm not trying to disagree with you, but we've heard the select board has heard from many residents. I've gotten phone calls on my cell phone.

388
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I've gotten emails that I know other select board members have gotten. People cannot absorb these increases. they between the two debt exclusions and what we're looking at at even 6.5 which is approximately $800 on that average

389
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single family home people cannot absorb this and I think that I haven't spoken actually have not spoken to one resident that wants options to increase services

390
01:48:45.760 --> 01:49:03.520
right now not one and I think that you So, yep. Do some people not even realize this is happening? 100%. Um, they'll probably realize it too late, unfortunately, no matter what we do to get the message out. But people cannot

391
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absorb these costs. And I just we I just don't think it's responsible of us to put forward a number that isn't also hitting us as well because we are slamming residents with these tax increases. And so I think that the

392
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responsible thing to do is to take the cuts on, you know, we have to cut some stuff. And I know everyone says there's no fat to trim and maybe that's not the appropriate term to use, but you know, I think that we have to fail it as residents are going to have to

393
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fail it. And if if that comes down to, you know, not opening recal as much as we thought or, you know, Sunday hours, if if the library chooses to decrease their budget with Sunday hours or people, that's what it is, or DPW or police. Like, I don't want to see these

394
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cuts. No one does. No one wants to have recycling twice a week, but we have to do something that, you know, if we're gonna ask residents to put the money in, we have to do something as well to for

395
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them to trust us and to realize we really are looking at our numbers very closely to try to get the, you know, biggest bang for our buck. Sean, I see your h they say your hand is raised. >> It is. Sorry. Yeah. And Melissa, I

396
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wasn't suggesting in that case you you'd have a number that increase services, which I was what I think I I just heard you say. I'm saying what I'm suggesting is if you're going to go with a number that's below the 6 and a half million, I would see that as a as a strong case for going to a tiered one and having the

397
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second tier just be that one that represents stability. And to use Jane's words, right, you know, that that represents sort of the ability to offer level services. Um, then you're saying, you know, we get it. A lot of people in town, you know, can't afford, you know,

398
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would wouldn't say they can't afford a million or two million or three million, let alone five or six million. Um, I worry, you know, I think there are a number of residents who you wouldn't have heard from at this point because they're not in a position to be emailing you who would be frustrated by being

399
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told we're not even going to try to maintain the level of services that we currently offer and we're only presenting an override option that requires cuts that may be significant to some people, right? That may be really significant to folks who are anticipating using recal frequently, for instance, right? Um, so that was my

400
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suggestion was if you know if you're going to land on say a five million number as your starting point. If I were in your shoes, and I'm not, so it's easy for me to say this, but if I were in your shoes, >> I' I'd be leaning more towards a tiered override where the second tier was at that six and a half number.

401
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>> Okay, fair. I just want to say I apologize. I misunderstood a little bit of what you said. So I do understand better what you meant by that and I appreciate that clarification. >> No worries. When I'm speaking off the cuff, I tend to stumble. I probably didn't say it as clearly as I would have liked to. So, thank you. >> Yeah. No, thank you. I appreciate it.

402
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>> Thanks. >> So, I guess um personally I'm 5 million scares me because I haven't seen any figures behind that and what it would eliminate. And I think that level service is not providing anything new or

403
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fancy or am I misunderstand? I'm not misunderstanding that. So, I think I've had plenty of conversations on both ends of this topic where some are like it's just a fact of doing business and everyone's impacted personally. Like if I told you my health insurance issues,

404
01:52:34.239 --> 01:52:51.119
you you you'd cry like I do. Um so I don't we're not getting anything fancy or new by 6.5 or eight. So I don't you know I'm more concerned about the services that are not going to be there.

405
01:52:51.119 --> 01:53:06.719
So if there's police overtime or or staff cuts or you call an ambulance and it's not, you know, all that kind of safety for everybody here, all the stuff in the background that we don't a lot of us don't see every day, but that's the stuff that I'm more concerned about.

406
01:53:06.719 --> 01:53:23.119
Yes. S. >> So we went 6.5 in the first try and it didn't go through >> and then we went five in the second try. What is taking another 1.5? What's the possibility of taking another 1.5 million out of free cash? And what does

407
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that look like >> if you want to take another one? Well, >> to make to make up for the 1.5 that the residents don't approve. >> So, >> I mean, I wouldn't advise doing that because >> I'm just wondering

408
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>> fiscally, we're we're at a fiscal cliff if you imagine. We're at a fiscal cliff and going forward without doing something different about how we how we behave around um the use of free cash and reserves um and how we budget um

409
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would have something of a devastating effect. One might imagine if you fell off a cliff. So, we're on a fiscal cliff. I think that um if you were to do an additional 1.5 million, you know, that's 15 jobs based on the

410
01:54:11.599 --> 01:54:28.480
average would be probably the best way to that that would now you're looking at taking the police department staffing back to where it was before the last override. And as I've said previously, we haven't done a staffing study at the police department since before Jordan's

411
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Furniture was built. We know for sure that we have more housing. We know for sure we have more traffic. We know for sure we have more businesses. So that work is underway. That staffing study is underway. That takes time and that's being done internally. We're not spending money to do that. But um so now

412
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you're you're you're putting potentially not having not identified where those cuts would come from, but you're potentially putting the police department back before where we were. So that's stacking calls. We're already stacking calls. So that's when calls come in, you know, they have to

413
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prioritize which ones they're going to first. Um >> more over time, >> you're looking at Yeah. or fewer people on the road and we just we diminish we reduce the number of officers we put on the road. >> Um and there are there are ways to do that. Um but it it means slower response

414
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times. Um and that's a factor. It means some of the [sighs] the other things that we have to do take longer. Response times take longer. the the nice tosses in the elasticity we have and the work that we do is difficult to manage.

415
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>> So I get the impression that nobody wants to make a decision tonight. Yeah, I think that's what >> which is unfortunate because I feel I feel that just pushing it a week or two because >> are we going to be in the same boat next

416
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week as we are right now? >> I feel >> I mean maybe we're not going to come to a consensus and maybe it goes 32 or 41 or who knows but it is what it is and whatever direction it goes is the way

417
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that we have to support it. So, if it's 4-1 and I'm the one, I back the board. That's the way that it goes. You know, I I I I voted, but this is the board's decision and we're going forward with that and, you know,

418
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so I don't know. It's good to have a healthy mix for once. You know, we're we're kind of semi all over the place, right? I was going to disagree with Melissa for the first time in forever. But then she corrected herself with Shawn because I kind of was liking

419
01:56:43.199 --> 01:57:01.040
Shawn's angle with that. Um because it is a choice, but it is showing that you know when people say uh the town has to make cuts and they're not doing this and they're not doing that, then vote for the five then like because it's been there and the six and

420
01:57:01.040 --> 01:57:17.040
a half still has cuts too, >> right? Um, but both of the numbers like Jane just mentioned are better than zero and we run the risk of zero. [clears throat] So I don't know. >> So I guess I agree with I can't remember

421
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if it was Tom or Sean about options. So I really do feel strongly about having more than one option on the ballot. Um, you never know which way it's going to go, but I think that it gives people a choice. And I do agree with the sentiment of, you know, if you're only

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going to give them the lowest option, that's going to decimate everything. I don't think that that's really doing our job. >> Yeah. Like I wouldn't I wouldn't say let's do five and uh vote on that and call it a day. No, because there is no

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options. But a five and a six and a half, maybe the town's not going to like it. The school isn't going to like it, but they're going to like it better than zero. Or maybe they get the six and a half. I mean, it's it's up to the residents to make that decision. You

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know what I mean? Like, I think the angle that this is going, it it doesn't seem as if we're going higher than six and a half as a >> So, I can't convince any of you to have six and a half. I [laughter] not I I I haven't seen a a like Melissa

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briefly mentioned, I haven't seen a single person other than an elected official like Erin or Tom or whatever saying that they like support the override. Every single person rails against it every chance they get. And

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negativity is is always the the dominant people, you know, the positive stuff usually doesn't hit as hard, but it is overwhelming. I've been hanging out with different people. >> I the people >> they might not be here uh anymore. >> They're not in this room. Um I just feel

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like people understand how devastating it is and I think it's I don't want to say it's a fact of life at this point and I think it is kind of a fact of life because so many other towns are doing the same thing. So, I don't think that we're out of line by trying to be mindful of

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five is definitely not I I really am against five and even 6.5 is the lowest that I would go, but I think that we need to give another option for the people that um don't want to see all these cuts that are here. Um Melissa,

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>> thank you Karen. For me, the reason I think we need to put one forward, one number forward is because our turnaround time on getting this information out to residents is so tight. And I think putting two numbers will be confusing to

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many. I think you also could create an environment where you're pitting things against each other and I don't want to see that happen. I think we were elected, you know, by the residents of this town to make these tough decisions. And I truly feel the appropriate approach is

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to put one number forward and to give full transparency of why that number is the right number. That's why I think one number is the right way to go. I think that, you know, putting two numbers, we're kind of like, well, what do you

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think? I mean, what were we elected for? We're elected to get feedback from residents and the feedback I've gotten so far is that most people don't even want an override, never mind the minimum of what I think could is appropriate is

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6.5. Um, so I would love to hear from those residents that are, you know, fully in support of this and understand this, but what I've heard is the complete opposite right now. So I think that for me the reason one number I think is the right approach is because you know it it shows that we've we we

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understand where that structural deficit is and we and then we have to help the residents understand the structural deficit and I think if we go forward with two numbers it gets confusing. You have the possibility of starting to pit things against each other and I just

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don't want to see that happen. So, as far as 6.5 as being the figure, and that does not include um every week recycling, are you open to having it being seven and including the weekly recycling? Because it's because at the beginning,

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everybody seems to be in completely irate about the the prospect of every other week recycling. >> I agree. I feel like that was a mixed bag in that conversation that we had um at that meeting. And, you know, I've talked to people afterwards and some people are good with it and some aren't.

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And you know, I'm not. But I think the approach has to be everyone has to give and take. Um, for my family, no. Does every week recycling I mean, does every other week recycling work? Probably not. It's going to be a struggle. I, you know, but I think again, it's a give and

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take. And I think we need to give and take for everyone and across the board for all departments and services. And I think that you know giving two numbers and just causes more

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confusion and it's really not putting forward our best foot of the structural deficit that really is creating the problem right now and you know [clears throat] how can we increase our revenues but that's a whole other discussion. >> Anybody else? Karen, do you have

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anything you want to add? No, I think we're good. Thank you. >> So, do we want to wait until next week or do we think that we have somewhat of a consensus this week? >> Do you hear a motion? >> What? >> Do you hear a motion?

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>> Do I hear a motion? >> Motion to adjourn. No, [laughter] >> not so fast. >> Okay, I'll withdraw that motion. >> Um, >> I was going to second it. >> I'm sure you were. [laughter] pause. >> It's very rare. >> Um,

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>> right. Because everybody can say no if they don't want to do the motion. >> Right. >> So, who would be reading the motion? >> I don't even know what we're voting on. Like, >> you seem to want to see if there's a vote. If there's no nobody makes a motion, then looks like you need to

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schedule a meeting. >> Part of me wants to avoid scheduling another meeting because it takes a lot out of people's time, staff included, and residents and whatever. So, I feel like um that's kind of what I'm trying to approach here. >> I think we've decided that the school

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committee's meeting isn't necessarily isn't going to impact the number we have or how we're going to make our decision. I think that there's a consensus on that. So, I don't you know, I mean, dragging it out till next week. Do you feel like you'll get more information between now

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and then to change to make a decision? >> I don't. Chris, >> do I have to be honest? Because I'd be honestly saying that I don't think I've I don't think I've received really any information, but that's >> Well,

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I I I I just haven't and I haven't really seen anything. Uh not that I've, you know, actively gone looking for things, but it would help me justify whether or not the position I I would go with this is essentially it. I just need

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to have the facts and figures to be able to make an informed decision. And if if I'm wavering between five and six and a half and then after the meeting tomorrow, I'm like, "Okay, I could go with the six and a half just uh single number and that's

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it." I mean I mean that could change absolutely. But beyond that, like I don't know. I I I think I think all along the denominator has to change and when you scale it out five years and it ends up being some astronomical number

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from now to the five years from now is I don't know how anyone's going to afford any of it. Um and then five years from now Birch Meadow is going to have to get replaced or something. Who knows? There's always something. >> Well, we're only going to focus on what's in front of us now. >> Yes. So,

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>> I feel like there's like the denominator is not going to change our decision tonight or next week. We have to work on the denominator in the future. >> Yeah. >> It's not it's we're not going to change it tonight. >> This isn't up to me. It's up to the group. Anyone can do whatever.

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>> See how it goes. >> Yeah. No, I I said earlier I'm not really comfortable voting on an override with a $917,000 community priority placeholder with no data behind it. I that feels

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irresponsible to me. I would I don't want to have another meeting, but this is um and it's this has been a tough timeline to get this done. So, personally, I would I would love to see if we really need that five five and a quarter um percent and the community

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priority or if if something changes. And um that's, you know, I would rather I I think where the select board is going to get some flak for voting on like an undefined placeholder and an override and it may in fact doom the override.

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I'd rather [sighs and gasps] spend a little more time and have a quicker meeting than tonight and just have all the facts and the deliberation finished in front of us. >> Okay, Melissa. >> Uh, just quickly, I think I if I understood Dr. Turner and Tom and Sean,

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I think the 917,000 priority was full day kindergarten. And I think that that's and I believe they used some funds uh because their budget was level funded this year for that. And so I think you

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know I I don't think anything changes. I think they kind of told us what that priority uh community priority was was the full day free kindergarten. I heard that in language in the budget and in but that is a placeholder that is

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not as specific as everything else the town side has done and the 5.25% isn't specific either because they haven't even discussed it yet. All right. We can just vote on that if you want. I have motions. If it fails, it fails.

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>> I would rather wait the week and I agree with Karen. >> So, >> which is Yeah. I'd like to get a little more detail into it. I mean, we might as well. >> Why not? >> All right. I guess we're going to wait till the 28th. >> And I'm fine with a Zoom only meeting or

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something. Like Karen also mentioned that, you know, it's not going to be two hours. We're going to all agree to at least watch the school committee meeting, try to send some questions in advance if we have anything kind of thing, and then just, you know, some public comment and

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and vote on Tuesday. That's how I would see it. >> Do we have to vote on this? >> Motion to motion to adjurnn. >> Second. >> Then okay. All in favor? >> Roll call.

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>> A roll call. Karen Herrick. >> Yes. >> Melissa. >> Yes. >> S. >> Yes. >> Chris, >> yes. >> Karen, yes. >> Thank you everyone. >> Thank you. >> Drive safely. >> Good night. Goodbye.