The study session of the Independent School District 535 School Board is called to order at 5:30 p.m. on Tuesday, October 14th, 2025 in room 137 of the Edison building. Present at this meeting are school board members, superintendent, a non voting exeicio
member, and assistant school board clerk, Miss Anne Kramer. Miss Kramer, will you please call the role? >> The board acknowledges this site and all RPS sites are situated on the ancestral land of the Dakota people. We honor the Dakota nations and the sacred of all
indigenous peoples. At this time, we offer the opportunity to say the pledge of allegiance. Item 2.1 is approval of the agenda. Are there any changes to the agenda? >> It has been moved and seconded. All those in favor say I.
>> I. Any opposed? The agenda has been approved. The agenda and documents for this meeting are available online at schools.org. Item 3.1 is a monitoring item, religious holidays and 2027 2028 RPS calendar
design. >> Thank you, Chair Nathan and board members. As board members will recall on a number of occasions, uh we've had uh two that I recall uh students come to comments to the board and urged the
board to consider um not holding school on certain religious holidays. And in both instances, it was a student whose uh family and presumably that student practices the Muslim faith and they were talking in particular about the holiday of Eid. But
board members um in discussing those opportunities um suggested that we should take a broader look at our calendar and religious holidays. And so we've waited for a point at which we are early enough to influence the development of future school calendars,
which of course the board ultimately app every year to have a conversation intentionally in a study session to present you with some ideas and options in responding to that. Um when we began this process, I actually thought I might
be here recommending that we um not hold school on certain holidays. Um, as you've seen if you've read the presentation or as Will Ruffen the second will outline for you now, that is not in fact uh our recommendation and we
can talk more about that. Uh there are two primary reasons. One that RPS actually now does not uh hold or not hold school on any religious holidays that our district chooses to recognize. Christmas is a federal holiday and so
that is not an RPS decision. religious holiday. And the more I looked at the complexity of recognizing the religious holidays of certain faiths and not others, the more I got concerned about how in a wonderfully diverse district
like ours, we adequately uh embrace all of those traditions while of course keeping the separation of the church and state that is foundational to our system. And so working with Will and Carl Bachan and reached out to some other colleagues across the district. We
have a different proposal for you here that I think does recognize that in particular the two faiths that we've heard about most often. I mentioned the two public comment um experiences that came to the board. I've also had discussion with uh local rabbi and
members uh of the RPS community uh practice the Jewish faith about some Jewish holidays. Um, and so we have a proposal here that I think would recognize the importance of allowing students not to be in school on those days without cancelling school and
establishing a precedent that might be complicated um, over time. The final point I would make before I turn over to Will is that um should you want to revisit the idea of not holding schools on uh certain date not holding school
for students on certain dates, we would certainly be pleased to bring you back a specific recommendation along those lines. The recommendation after a lot of thought that I have brought here is the one that will uh has helped to develop and he's going to outline for you. Now, should you choose to do that, I would be
strongly recommending that if we do not reduce our instructional days, we would need to add days later calendar year. We we simply can't go lower in our instructional minutes. Um, but that is not the proposal that's before us tonight. So, I want to thank Will for the leadership that he's shown in
helping uh think through a complex issue and let him walk you through our thinking on this. And then uh our goal tonight really is just to get the the pulse of the board on this issue and then certainly I'll work with the chair and vice chair in figuring out next steps if any um that would come to a
regular meeting. >> Well, thank you. So, superintend A number of students to them to saycluding allowing the students to make up any
missed work without penalty then I think that's where the problem lies because the responsibility is still on the student to make up the work so they would then have to make up any previous work that they missed and stay current with their current work and for some
they mention that that's a pretty heavy burden so here's some of the again like superend we have prominent faith uh traditions that our students in RPS follow. It's the Muslim and Jewish faith. So, we're recognizing that within
our school district. We're also focusing on equity and inclusion and ensuring that our students aren't missing any major work or being penalized for their absences. So, if you think about it, if there is a school on that day that they're off that was
aience that's just an experience that they have to That's unfair for those students. And then lastly, it provides clarity for our staff. So all of us will be on board with the same expectation. So what is the proposal? Here it is.
This part I will read aloud. The superintendent recommends that RPS adopts the following approach to religious holidays that are not federal holidays for the 2026, 2027, and 2027, 2028 school years.
When the following religious or cultural holidays fall on a school day, teachers and schools will not schedule or administer major assessments or events which include test and quizzes, major student presentations, due dates for significant projects,
schoolwide assemb And it's important to note that no action needs to be taken by the board tonight um for us to implement this approach, but the school board could adopt a resolution that would solidify and
support the superintend So what are we talking about? So for the next couple of years, we're looking at Rashana, Yanapour, Eurap and Alhada. So the first one, Yamapour, occurs towards the beginning of the school
year, September 21st, and the latter falls towards the ending of the school year May 17 on May 17. The same pattern holds true for the following school 2027 202
is held in October and then we have following the same pattern being held So, how do we get input for this? There were individual conversations had with staff across the district just to kind of gauge their thoughts on what if
we were to do something like this. The proposal was actually sent to district leadership last month. So, that was central office staff, operational office staff, and building leaders asking about if they foresee any concerns or what the potential barriers
may be to adopting this proposal. There were only a couple of responses that came back and they both were about if further conversations need to be had with Minnesota sports high school for students who are participating in events that happen after school.
And then lastly, here we are today with the schoolboard study session. And the decision was to put it as a study session so that we can actually have a conversation about it instead of being limited to time during a regular board session.
Upon research we did find that there was an alternative approach that some districts in Minnesota have taken that's canceling school altogether. Hopkins, Minneapolis public schools and MO public schools around the year 2022
2023 have all decided to cancel school on those days. And like superintendent said, I think we should note again if RPS does adopt this approach, the superintendent would be recommending that we add on to the school.
Here are some of the challenges to that approach. The dates are estimates. So the actual date can fluctuate depending on the lunar calendar. The Islamic calendar like I said is lunar which means the months begin based on the actual
sighting of the crescent moon. So with that the day can fluctuate a day or two in either direction for families trying to adjust on a school day that's been cancelled. that could provide some challenges in real time.
So before I end, here are some points that I think we should consider for the conversation tonight. Does this proposal align with the values of RPS? We recently just think it align with two of them. One
being supporting the whole student and the other being building belonging and connection. Another thing we will have to consider is how will we get the word out to our RPS community considerations.
What if other faith faith groups decide to offer a proposal as well? How will we walk down that path? And then lastly, the board's feedback. thinking about your immediate questions or concerns or any suggested
modifications to the proposal. I will now stop here and open up first. So first start my first classes. How do you measure what's being taught that day of that instruction? Right? So
depending on what class is in at that time or the complexity of the chapter they're in, even though they're not given a test that day, there's no way of us saying that we're not putting a student behind because we're having teachers continue to teach. I just don't see a way to have school
and and not end up in the situation where So that's my first concern. Secondly, I don't think it's the staff because those holiday staff that
don't have to be there should also not have to be there. And are we able to allow that number on that day? Um because my concern my my consideration would be we're creating a
situation where kids I feel we may end up in a position don't have enough staff to staff that day because they should also accommodation or we may end up in a position where we have teachers that are teaching important things on that day which is
also not Um my suggestion I think that creates the situ And as far as the holidays that don't have a set date, I mean what is often done is an observation day. So like if it's on a Sunday, you know that you know
that following day, that Monday, I understand that there's a rotating holiday, but that other district as close as possible. I mean, obviously uh to Mr. But I think that adds more to the
well aware that their calendars don't sync up and I think I would rather give them the day off and you know maybe we missed the mark but it's not an intentional miss you know
you know thing and I would respect saying okay we'reing your holiday on this day because we do have other federal holidays that we have an observation, you know, day like MLK day if it falls on a Sunday
or what have you. So, I don't I don't I don't think that would be an issue. But those are my list of concerns that I'm going get out the way. Um, but I think those are things that we should seriously consider. And I guess I mean are we just what is the instructional
quality going to be for the kids that are in class while teachers are trying to skirt around not teaching anything too important or not teaching anything that can be viewed as a bias because I taught this really important thing on on another holiday. I mean I don't I'd
rather not have my kids at a play day you know and have the additional educational Yeah, thank you, Director Whitehorn. There's there's a lot there, and I hope I hit those points. Um, uh, we would not have a play date. Our our staff would
continue, as they always do, to provide instruction, and if a kid misses, uh, instruction, uh, our staff are very good at helping them make that up. That's different than a test, field trip, or assembly. Uh, so you're right, it would not be a a freebie, but we do have many
students now. We immediately excused absences for anyone who calls in those days. And so they make that up. There's an important point. In terms of staff, we did apparently I was somewhat surprised. This was a longstanding request from our Rochester's education association to provide staff with time
off for religious holidays. And I was very pleased to immediately accept that in our last round of negotiations with them, which the board subsequently approved. So staff absolutely have the chance to take that um off. Um the point about
And this is very specific to Eid uh a holiday that moves. We didn't do a formal survey in part because of course we don't keep records of kids religions. But the feedback we got from equity specialists and others was actually in fact that the observed day in quite a
few of the conversations I had which is about a year ago was that it was not appreciated as a recognition. It was an observed day not on the day that it was on the day because that there's literally millennia of tradition about
when the forces of nature identify that date. Now, that I couldn't speak and obviously I'm not, you know, of that faith, but that that was a real point of division as whether you could have it. It's on a Monday even if it's actually happening on another. So, there was a complexity there and as I mentioned, if
the board would like a proposal for the uh days off, that absolutely is something that we can put into motion. and it's different than the initial proposal I'm bringing you tonight, but I have a lot of sympathy for all the points um that you are making. This is a
it's a challenging call. I think we're we're we're good on the staff piece because uh we absolutely respect our you know rights of our staff to be gone. Um the instructional you know the quality of we would have to trust our teachers to have high quality learning but not
something they're giving a test on uh for that. Um, and then there is that additional point of should we move to the date specific a real divergence of opinion as to whether you would do that. I know one year Minneapolis literally said uh I don't know if Will will if that's how they've handled it, but they
literally said you're not going to know what day is off until we know when the holidays scheduled and um you know that does have a lot of dominoes for transportation, food service, things like that that you uh usually schedule really far in advance. But thank you for
those really this I I understand the other side of this totally about the teachers. Um I think this is a really smart teachers as Dr. said know how to help work made up. We have kids sick or gone
for sports or other things all the time and teachers know that part of their responsibility is to ensure that that child gets the best education they can um and and to help them with that. The idea I think what this does is show
those communities that we respect and honor their their faith and their uh wanting to cate or um you know to practice their faith and we should do that for every child and every
religion in this community. My concern about saying take these days off is that I think you alluded to this then when does it end? Does that mean that every religious group will say we need these days off and it's just going to get to
be really tough I think to schedule our school year. Um, but I think this is a a very specific way of saying we respect you. We respect what you believe. We honor your request and we will do
everything we can to ensure that you're not penalized for being gone. We want we'll ask teachers also to respect that and your fellow students to respect that that on these days we're not going to plan a major project, big test or whatever. So, I think it's a really good
compromise. I appreciate when we know what the actual day is, you because some of them may be gone. >> Does the district currently have uh is there sort of any precedent for having days like this where there are certain
days due to whatever else is going on in the in the school system where we instruct staff to not have field trips or schools. Thank you, Dr. Cook. We certainly do that on exam times, so that's probably the closest to it. I'm not aware of um
any other days where we essentially say don't schedule tests and things like that. We did find other districts that have done this and have instituted this approach in Minnesota and nationally. I also do
point there are other districts that have long days off. It was in looking at the fact that there are other districts that have essentially taken this approach that led me Carl and others to take a look at it
discuss tonight. But no, we don't have um I think extensive precedent. I don't know. I often go to Jackie as like historian. I think I'm not misspeaking that we don't have other other examples of kind of test free field trip free
days right now. >> Um so that that's that's helpful context and I I I certainly appreciate the proposal. I um my reservation with it right now is I think the last thing that we want to do as a as a board
as a system is to signal that school is not important and that there's days you don't have to be there. We struggle with that already. Um and Rasha Shaa I believe is a two-day holiday. So on the years, you know, the next couple of
school years that happens to fall over the weekend, but um and the one Eid is I think almost always in the summer. I'm not totally sure, but um you know, if it's four days, that's it's kind of a lot. And then to the point of some of
the other uh directors here um just to take an example from my organization which you know every organization has to be sort of responsive to the the cultural observations that are relevant to that entity and in mine um observations in the Hindu faith they're
very important because that's a a huge constituency um in the the place that I work um and so next Monday is Diwali which is extremely important and um and we'll c recognized uh in lots of places in the world, but it and including in
Rochester, I'm sure. Um I I just I struggle a little bit with this idea of picking out particular religions to recognize. Uh certainly Christianity is also widely practiced and um in a way for the calendar
purposes that we're maybe fortunate that most significant uh Christian holidays happen to fall on Sundays or or days when school doesn't meet anyhow but not all of them. Um Good Friday is recognized in plenty of places. It's not
a state holiday in Minnesota but there's plenty of places where it is. Um, and it just I I don't know. I I'm not sure. I I I appreciate the points and maybe this is a sensible middle ground, but I have real reservations about
um constraining what the school is going to do, what we're going to offer for students on particular days. And to the extent that sends a signal that, hey, this isn't really an important day, it's kind of like a it's a school day with an asterisk. You know, show up if you want, but if you don't, no harm, no foul. I
don't think we want to be sending that. So, um I I'm I would uh hesitantly support this proposal, but with real reservations. >> Thank you. Well, a couple things.
One, even though I think the presentation couple students brought this forward and testified before the board and yet I'm sure they were small amount of
possibly hundreds of RPS students who actually participate in their expression of faith similar as I do the young
presenter from a couple more meetings ago when she about the Christian flag and had questions about that in regards to other display flags. Uh I do appreciate within the presentation
under the rationale I think I want to make sure I have this correct uh points to consider point three future considerations I I thought that was important because uh it's not that we are saying these are
the Uh but in essence this is a result of these particular students or faith groups um reaching out uh to RPS for consideration.
I will say growing up and attending schools in the state of Alaska uh the Christian holidays uh we didn't have spring break. It was Easter break. We didn't holiday break. It was uh it
was Christmas and somehow we kind of took the price out of those holidays. But that being said, um I do think that by uh having the option available to I
don't know if we're waiting to hear back from other uh religious or cultural groups within our community or we will assume a role advocacy and reach out to them. I don't know what the intent is or plan if there is one regarding this but
I would uh probably to implementation if this were to reach that point for consideration and possible voting. Would like to maybe hear results of that outreach if at all
possible. And then finally, um I do recognize that presently and perhaps if you would my superintendent or I don't want to
obligate me, but uh could you possibly speak to what actually happens uh real time for those students who want to participate? What are they doing presently or what's happening or occurring?
Yeah, thank Dr. Barlo and I do want to my colleagues if there's anything you want to add. At present, we um immediately excuse any uh parent who calls in their students for any holiday. There's no required. Um
since I've been here, we have disseminated that pretty aggressive. Said you can be excused for these holidays. Um And as I mentioned as as of our last contract with REA, the same applies to staff. So essentially it's a
immediate excused absence. The student is gone for observance and the parent doesn't call. In my experience, uh our staff in following up, we always ask why did you miss school? And if they say it was
furthest, well, you know, we need your parent to just say that. rental excuse is still in place. Um, but we have been very aggressive in trying to make sure people know that it's an absence. That's our current state. In terms of additional
public input, it's important to know too that this was um bringing this to you in this study session was my effort to be responsive to the two points folks. So, um, and I always believe it's my job to give you a recommendation, not
just present a problem. So, that's why there's recommendation here. Right now, we haven't planned further public input on this question. Though, that doesn't mean we couldn't do that. It really is looking for the board
to say how much is this something uh would like to be directly engaged in. Obviously, if we're going to have days off, you approve the So, in that instance, you are the deciding and we aren't yet at the point where we're bringing you a calendar.
Um, if we chose to take the approach I've outlined here, that certainly is within my authority as superintendent to direct staff not to do tests, field trips. As Will mentioned, the board could choose to endorse the resolution, but that would not be required. Um, and
so it really does come down to wanting to hear. It's a study session. So obviously you're not voting tonight, but the fraud directions that you're interested in taking as I just want to be really clear. This is one where I understand both
sides of this mad as a followup. Um then in that presently they are uh excused absences. Uh with that uh students are able to while they perhaps could not
make up a field trip uh they could make up whatever academic rigor they may have lost out on and or testing that they were looking forward to participating in. And so is that not working when the
surveys or inquiries went out to our students. Were they they was there any indication that having excused access was not working for them? If so, I would be curious as to why it wasn't.
>> Yeah, thank you. I have received no uh feedback from students or parents that that is not working. This recommendation is to take it a step further so that in the case of tests, field trips, major assemblies. They um
they aren't missing those things because those things in our current uh situation could happen on those dates. The kid would be a student would be excused and have the chance to make it up. This proposal would essentially say
that those things are not happening. Again, I do think it's really important. There are many, many, many, many valuable ways of learning that do not involve It is not true that should we take this approach, it would be a freebie day. I have to be honest. I'm going to ask not
to suggest that further. I think it's insulting to our staff. Um so be real honest about that. We don't need to suggest that if we tell an educator with whom we are entrusting the education of our children that um they can't give a test that they're going to think well
then I'm believe our educators can understand that tension should we take a question a little bit more about how those schedules are done. Do coaches and advisors take into account
>> and will and Carl jump in. the state high school league is largely um agnostic to these things to date and so we don't control those dates and so that's one reason why extracurriculars are not addressed in this because at least in terms of those things um we
also didn't include you know all extracurriculars or I didn't include this will agree because students are choosing to do those extracurriculars whereas the school day is compulsory and so a student is choosing to be in theater or go to after school
enrichment. Um, and the parent presumably um and then they could choose not to go that day quite clearly. They wouldn't be missing something. Um, I would hope that the state high school league would be attentive to things like this on these dates, but that's
something that um, to my knowledge, there's not a formal approach to and we also of course don't set those dates, which is the the driving force behind our extracurriculars, but not all.
And I guess I was looking more for you if there's a sports team if they miss practice on Tuesday, they can't play on Friday or something like that. If that kind of thing is considered by >> Yeah, that's a Thank you, Dana. That's a great point. We did talk about that. We would make very clear that the
requirement that um some teams have that if you skip school, you can't go to practice or play in a game would not apply. That this would be like an excused absence in which case they can always play. It's the the teams that have established
a not in school, you aren't suiting up um are unexcused absences. I find this conversation very Eastern spring. So we
end once again for a student who wanted to add that history I take personal privilege to answer some questions that I have. Um, what are we hearing from staff about
these guidance that it makes sificantly their current practices? Um as will mentioned we uh sent out this proposal to administrators and received very limited feedback most of which focused on the question of extracurriculars actually. So this is
not something that we have sought um broader feedback on also you know same question but of course um by design this is a study session in which we're not asking you to take action tonight and so that would always be
something where we asking you to that presumably there would be certainly more analysis and potentially more feedback. But um for the purposes of this discussion, we wanted to responsive to the previous discussions the board
has had about this and bring you uh an option to look at rather than just coming and restating the problem. Um so I hope that answers question. I I I I would not be able to accurately assess perspective that our staff might have.
I'm confident that they could implement this. It's the approach take effectively. It's well within the realm of all of our teachers to plan a high quality day but not give it to us. >> Then my next question was we made the
recommendation for the next two school years and I think I understand that that might be because those are the next that were created. But why wouldn't we establish the
the guidance? We could put it in a policy 503 or procedure 503A and then just change the dates of the holidays, right? Like why just the next two years? Are we
thinking of doing it for a pilot or why not why not just make >> um the calendar is always an annual decision and so actually in giving two years it was an effort to give somewhat more clarity in advance than when we bring you a calendar proposal year to
year. Um I think this would give us a chance to see if this recognition is meaningful to the people who participate in that those religious traditions to see if there are other religious traditions that you know haven't come forward in the limited feedback we've gotten to date that led to this
discussion that we should consider just mentioned one of them. Um, it would also give us the chance to consider this tied to what frankly I hope will come out of our next strategic plan, which is a significant rethinking of how we use the
calendar in general. Um, we are still in RPS right now very constrained by time. Time for kids, we talked about it, type of literacy, time for staff development. It's a constant concern. Now, time's money, but I I think there
is, I hope, the possibility of significant creativity in our school calendar and our school schedule tied to the academic agenda, our next strategic plan. Um, and so this could be something that would be considered as part of that
larger. I know that uh we've shared with the board that we engaged this year in what we called interestbased bargaining with negotiating team from the Rochester Education Association. And the way that works is you all brainstorm the big issues that are out there and then you
decide which ones you can tackle and which ones should be in the contract. The lack of time was a unanimously agreed upon gigantic problem on both sides. It was not something we decided we could address with the contract that
you have now approved. But nobody around the table thought oh we've got the calendar that meets meets our kids educational needs that meets our staff's needs that you know um so I think that's a somewhat less practical reason to to
put this in place for a couple of years. Um, as it might be folded into some larger reink, how we calendar out our schools. >> Okay. So, I just want to I want to just make a small clarification. So, when I was speaking, I was speaking to a larger
number um superintendent. So I wasn't saying that the educators would not have something for the students to do, but my thought process was more along the lines if I have 30 kids in my class and 16 are not there is it does it even make sense
you know for me to do whatever I did have planned and and having been in instructional classrooms some of us have where for different reasons a majority of a classroom calls off the teachers are very versatile in giving those students something to do but sometimes it turns into more of a study hall or
you know you can ask some of your deeper questions. So I'm not saying that the instructors will not be doing anything on that day but depending on what attendance looks like I would anticipate that instructors would pivot right because it it just is the the logical
thing to do if you have x amount of students who you got to in essence retach the lessons lesson to right so that's why I made the consideration of staff um and not there will probably be plenty of classes that are full and just
go on as a normal day. Um, but they may also be situations where there are classes where there are a significant number of students that are out. Um, so my solution based in this, so I do apologize for calling it a freebie or what have you, but that was more my thought process is that some classes may
end up being more study hallish depending on the number of students that are participating in that religious practice, which we don't have an exact number on per class. Um, and also with the educators thinking in fairness, right? So you don't want to have some,
you know, you want to kind of keep it fair. But anyway, that was my that was what I was implying. Not that staff cannot accommodate um for makeup just in the event that makeup is not the most logical answer. Um but my thought with
all of this being that we are very data driven is do we have the numbers so how many students actually miss on I mean we should be able to pull the attendance for these holidays and in the event that there I don't know I don't know what a
good percentage is 27% let's say 27% of kids call in on these days does it then make sense to say well we have a significant number of students that are already not here because of the holiday. Why would we keep the school open? Now,
not saying that I agree with everybody's point of, you know, there are several other uh religions that are not mentioned, but again, to the point of me really trying to be staff friendly, you know, if the percentage of kids is smaller, it's a lot easier to catch up
one or two kids than I got nine or 11 kids in this class that are all going to miss, if that makes sense. So, I guess my thought is, do we have the numbers? Do we know percentage-wise how many kids are missing for these holidays? I think that answers all of the questions that
we would have because we know what day those holidays are and we'd be able to see, do we have 35% of RPS students not attending on that day already and how much staff are we already not having on that day? I
just think that's one way to come to the conclusion on what makes sense as far as having, you know, having it be open for >> Yeah. Thanks, Trar. We we certainly could pull that. I was um I don't want
to pull it on the fly and and do it too quickly. As we saw um at the last board meeting in um uh focus on the language access plan to language may be a proxy in particular for Somali students being
faith. Um we're certainly talking about far less than 27% students who would identify in that group. But we absolutely could pull what our absence dates have been um on those dates. That's something that
and we could do that as part of a next step process if the board would like us to. You know, I think it's important for that last percentage is we won't know if that data is accurate or not because what students
are struggling with is should I go to school today or not? If there's a test or there's a major activity, they're deciding to go even if they are practicing that faith. So, whatever the numbers come back, we will still not or not because the students have an
individual struggle that they're going through in their heads or with their families and there's no way to accommodate for that. Can I? So, a caveat to that could be we pull the younger students numbers because the older students would have a little bit more control over whether or
not they're attending for holidays test or sports, but maybe we get a a better idea. Um, you know, we pulled and I'm just throwing something out there, you know, the younger kids who maybe don't have the level of commitment as, you
know, some of our high school students have with maybe games or like you said tests or projects that on those days whereas I know younger students of you know five six seven you're not going because we're celebrating you're not you know you know what I mean maybe we are considerate of the populations just like
how we have the other numbers we see certain trends with older students maybe not younger students so maybe I would like to see that data for um the age groups and those dates that I think that would be the data for us to
know and it may also show we have spikes in other religions that we're not considering. You know, there may be a spike of kids that are off for the Hindu holidays or something. I think that we could base our decision a little bit off of the data that we have since we
already know are we actually are children actually losing instructional time. No, I think it's important to remember that our students and their families have been doing this for years. On those
days, kids are gone and they're gone for good reasons. And I think what this does is just say, and we respect your right to not attend school on that day. I I have real concerns about cancing school for everybody because
not only are we short then on the number of instructional days but it throws especially families with younger kids it's chaotic then they have to figure out what are we going to do with our kids on these days so um
students families and the students themselves have every right whether it's good Friday or rash shana or any other religious day to have an excused absence and to worship the way they want to worship. I think what this does that's a
little bit different from what we've done traditionally is just give teachers a head up in advance. It's going to be these two days this year that you can expect students are going to be gone. Um we know that you will help them get caught up just as you
always do for any reason when kids are gone, but just maybe you can So, it's not adding extra pressure to those kids because you're not going to have them schedule a presentation for them that day or a field trip. It's two days and I
think it's absolutely reasonable, respectful, and a a good compromise. Um, so as I look at the uh the events that are listed and I look at the days for next year, um, I see that
one falls on Friday the 5th and then we September the 21st on May the 17th which are the seasons of homecomience. I think with homecoming um no because that's tied to the games
with prom. Uh potentially that broadens this proposal from the academic to the not just extracurricular but like cultural and things. So we certainly could take a look at that as to whether
that would be something. I don't think That would be pretty rare that that would be happen but it's not possible. When I say homecoming, of course, I mean your homecoming is the game and so that is
>> affect here we've been very attentive. tried to avoid it on anything we've scheduled centrally. This is kind of a thing was saying taking it to the classroom even if even if we don't do anything we
would continue to look as best we ever can >> I just want to add that We got here today because of the students. It was the students request that got us here today sitting around trying to figure out how
we can throw a wrench in everyone's night. But we got her because of the students and today tonight is exactly what was supposed to happen. We need to see this from all angles and figure out how we can serve our students. So to me
listening to the conversation is a success because all of those angles were mentioned. But we have to remember that we got here today because of the students. We try to empower the students and give them voice advocate for the things that are important to them. That's what's been
happening over the last couple years and now we're actually doing something. I just wanted to cement us in that we're here because of our students. We haven't had any
other faith communities raising. So, we're here because of our students who found it brave enough. inner voice and that strength to come to the board table. >> Um, thank you Will. I appreciate that point. I think that I might suggest just
so we don't leave this hanging that this has been, as Will just said, an incredibly valuable uh conversation. I think that um I would suggest, Madam Chair, that we take this as an executive committee back to um think about the best next step. Um obviously not the
discussion director wonder about additional input from various director ask about some data. Those are very specific possibilities. Um so we might debrief on this conversation and then uh come back to
the larger board with a sense of what proposed next step might be. And of course um board members uh can and I know you will provide feedback to the chair on whatever that possible next step might be and then can always uh make a motion
in a meeting should you so choose. But I think said at the outset of this presentation, the intent here was to hear what's on minds and things about um so I know sometimes we have study sessions that um
frankly like the one we are about to turn to on world language that have a pre-identified action point. Um, this one it was authentically a study session for us to really have really since I've been here the first discussion among
board members of this issue to give us a chance to have some sense of the issues that are on board members minds as we might um move this forward further. And so I I agree with Will that for for those of us on the staff it was a very
productive opportunity to hear and I think as an executive comm So anyone listening or even hearing about the next month or two months? >> No. >> Yeah.
And we have a longstanding tradition. Well, there was one that predated me in Rochester working just with Rochester Education Association on that, which is super important. Since I've been here, we brought the Rochester Principles Association into that discussion. And so we always would convene those two really
important groups from their perspective, which may or may not have anything to do with the issues. So, um, I know that one of the things that chair and vice chair are eagerly waiting as my proposal for the board agenda in 2026
and that uh is coming together and so this will be on there and so we can make sure that this discussion to the extent that it makes sense uh based on the board's preferences happens before you're being asked to make
>> yes timesing I I just um yeah, I just wanted to uh tack on to Director Marvin's point because I I I also agree that cancelling school on these days uh really the school district getting into the
business of deciding which religions to recognize in any way makes me a little anxious. I just I don't think it's great to be doing it at all. Um but but yeah, I mean for the impact on families, I I certainly completely agree and I think this is a very thoughtful proposal. I
can absolutely appreciate where it's coming from and it's an effort to honor the requests of these students. Um and it's probably doable with two or maybe four uh days that would be recognized in this way each year. It's just really easy for me to see it very quickly
growing to 10 or 12. And you know, looking at how busy Hill parking lot is every single day in the fall and in the spring. Um, if you got to take 10 or 12 days out of that, I mean, it's it's it's going to be
anyway, it's just easy for me to see that happening. So, that's my uh I think why I have some qualms here, but um appreciate the proposal and look forward to next steps. >> Thank you. >> Our next agenda item is a prep for
action agenda item. World languages plan board is scheduled to take action on this at the October 21st meeting. Please do >> first. So, uh, madam chair, board members, it's, uh, I know I don't need to introduce these folks, uh, to you. We
have Natalia Benjamin, our director of multilingual learning, and Heather Wilman, our director of secondary education, and Martine Hegel, who's a principal on special assignment, uh really providing invaluable leadership and helping us address an issue that um has been looming on the horizon, uh for
several years. Um and so we do have a proposal for you now on our world language offerings um that uh a tremendous amount of work has gone into. The board has already heard uh even a couple years ago from Natalyia on a really exciting vision for world
language articulation, but there has been a looming question of specifically which languages we offer based on student preferences and enrollment. So, we have the recommendation for you tonight. Um the last thing I'll say before I turn it over to this great team
is that I do anticipate that as part of our new strategic plan, additional creative will happen about the courses that we offer um actually at every level but especially at the high school. And so this is a a near-term proposal that I
think is driven by some important enrollment trends that uh the team will outline for you. I don't think it's the end of the story. I think there are other options to be thinking especially leveraging technology about additional study in world language but we have a
decision to make that the team will outline for you here now. So, thank you for your work and turn it over to you. >> Thank you so much, Dr. Good evening, members of the board. Am I not? >> Okay, can you hear me?
>> There we go. >> Uh yes, thank you so much and good evening everyone uh for the opportunity to present the next phase of the world initiative. Uh together with my colleagues, we've been working on a
datadriven student centered plan that strengthens our world language programs across Rochester public schools. We have submitted a proposal that responds to three urgent needs in the system, declining enrollment in specific world
language courses, the need to diversify our language offerings, and ensuring equitable inperson access to world language learning for high school students. We have listened closely to students, staff and families. Their
feedback combined with enrollment data and our research guided every step of this plan. So, uh this uh initiative just
uh this initiative supports three pillars of our district mission and vision. academic excellence, equity and access and global readiness. Equity means ensuring that a student can study a language. And global readiness
connects language learning to our mission of preparing students to thrive in a multi-interconnected world. And then ultimately this proposal ensures that our programs serve today's students while building sustainability
for the future. Right. So, um I'll share a little bit of the historical context. Um as you know, if you've been around for a while, we've tried a couple of things in the past. So, we had Mandarin that was offered. We
also had ASL previously and we had some problems with nutrition. We had more numbers at the level one level and then sometimes it would fall off. We also had disruptions. So we tried um something we called it hybrid um and we
had teachers that would be online but they also have students they travel to the sites and ultimately felt like that wasn't necessarily the best model. Um and then we also have really
struggled with what's the vision for languages. I think there are folks that are in the camp of And then there are communication and connection. And so we really had to think about what is our
vision and then how can that help us prioritize. So last year we had a group of um parents, community members, students that came together to exp exp or um what other districts have done when they're
adding a a new language. This was also shared extensively through different conferences where those districts presented. And so through that work um there were some key uh findings that they shared with us. One of them was
that they studied the results of the CL to identify some of the needs um to support students in languages. They also spoke about the the the importance of community engagement. A lot of the requests that came from languages were rooted in community advocacy and
community groups that were um looking at that. Where some of the districts have found success was really in looking at the population of students that we had both of different languages but also of the staff members that spoke those languages
because that um that spoke to the to the linguistic wealth that And so they based some of their decisions on those pieces. Um I will talk later a little bit more about resources, but those two things were tied together because then the districts
were able to build the the resources for um human capital in licenses and supporting those people to uh obtain their licenses in the languages that were being offered by the district. As well as significant um investment
development and professional development because oftent times the languages that were selected uh are less commonly taught and the resources are not as available. So those are some of the lessons we learned um from other
as well. Um so one of the questions that that was uh sent to us was what was the the range of the data that was looked at when we looked at the enrollment and nutrition. And so the report of the team from last year will show the um the
numbers from 2019. So it really is over seven years plus one more year of registration. So it's a it's it's a trend of over eight years. Um and so you can see in the graph um There's different levels like Heather
mentioned where you may have more consistent enrollment at those level ones and twos and then some students just um choosing not to continue beyond those levels. So, moving on to the fact that we did quite a bit of
um research on what it looks like for select section reports and declining enrollment patterns that we saw and the increasing number of course information. All of those things we did u gather
student perspectives and so student voice is reflected here guided this proposal uh through a district-wide survey nearly 55% of our students said they are interested in taking a language and what
we saw is that American Sign Language ranked at the top uh emerging choice. Students expressed also strong preference for in-person learning and requested a wider range of options beyond the ones that we offer such as
Spanish, French, German, and Latin. Uh so their feedback uh somewhat confirmed the importance of variety in our in our system, cultural representation and equitable access to meaningful face-to-face instruction. We also have
engage and Natalia has shared a little bit of that parent perspective in several ways. Informal feedback uh through schoolbased communication went out and parent inquiries about course offerings particularly around continuity
and access to languages. We had a survey input through the district's world language stakehold uh holder survey uh spring 2024 >> uh u which included responses from parents, students and staff. And then
what we want to do now is continue this uh engagement uh for our next step ending uh board uh support to share with them broadly. uh uh host community listening sessions during parent uh teacher conferences
coming up and uh gather additional uh structured input before implementation of of the initiative. So uh based on enrollment interest and sustainability, we recommend the following adjustments
with the superintendent's guidance to phase out Latin entirely starting in 2627 school year. Phase out German three and four retaining German one and two online to allow current students to complete
their sequences. Continue French one and two advanced levels offered only when enrollment meet thresholds. Continue Spanish 4 at sites with sustainable enrollment. Explore consolidating
advanced sections. These steps we believe balance student access staffing feibility and responsible resource use. To clarify, students currently enrolled in Latin will be able to complete their sequence. The proposed phase out
timeline ensures that Latin will be available so that students beginning Latin this year can complete their upper level courses. After this current school year, Latin will no longer Latin one will no longer
be offered to new cohorts of students. So again, we will honor the commitment to those currently and to complete their language language sequence. Okay. Uh so the student survey
identified ASL, American Sign Language as the clear front runner for our new language implementation. And like I said before, we also recognize significant interests in Arabic, Mandarin Chinese, Somali, Japanese, and Korean that reflect the
cultural and linguistic diversity of Rochester. The plan takes a two track approach uh phase out uh Latin and upper level German, adjust French and Spanish, and then begin ground work for ASL
implementation as the next I think it's important to name that um there's a lot of interest from our students and we have limited resources to to allocate for that and so one of the um things that Dr. Pel asked of us
is to also look at curriculum availability but also availability of licensed staff members um So again, the the team that met last spring um worked diligently to figure out those pieces. We we created a table so that we could
rank the the languages that the students had already identified as them and so we ranked them um based on are there programs that are available to obtain those? Were there curriculums that were available? Were there other um
technology that was available to support that language learning of the students? Um and also available So based on that we ranked those those languages and then we tied the numbers for a total I want to say 21 points and so it gave us an idea of where those
resources were currently. One thing that I do want to name is that um that data does not show the current work that Minnesota is doing to develop and support uh one of those is a heritage
portfolio pathway through Pel that they are currently implementing. We have several staff members from our district that have participated uh and are currently participating in that program. Um and so I am saying that because what that means is that When a district wants
to develop and support those language that are specific, there are avenues to to license staff members and to provide those supports so that not only do they have the the knowledge to be great language teachers, but also that require lensure so that we can hire them um and
not have to go through a tier one lensure, tier two lens position year after year. And so there are great there is great work that is being done in the world language uh field to to support um not only staff to
get that lensure but also to develop um curriculum and resources for those languages. Part of that is being done through u grants that the humanity center is putting out and also that u the Minnesota Department of Education is
doing. One example of that is that we're currently partnering with the University of Minnesota and the human center to develop some lessons for less commonly taught languages and that's paired with some of the work that um that happens within the ethnic studies realm. And so there's a lot of parallel work that is
happening to um to build resources that historically haven't been there when it comes to So our implementation timeline for world languages we uh have uh we want to follow this uh we phase timeline. We
kept it simple for a reason because we know that there might be some uh different things that we need to consider based on principles and schools and our parent for some student input. So uh
this is this is what we are proposing fall 25 which is now phasing out Latin this is this proposal for decision and then engage assess and communicate with our uh families and uh we have started
already the registration um guide uh in the winter and I apologize it says winter 2025 but it will be winter 2026 uh explores options for ASL, community engagement,
curriculum, multi articulation and materials for training. And as Natalia is sharing, there some of that work has been in in place already lasting the previous years. So we'll just continue
uh spring 26 curriculum implementation, professional learning and new language launch. So uh with this timeline we want to ensure careful planning uh community input and alignment with our strategic
priorities. All right. Um implementation will be grounded in research request two focus areas. Uh one of them uh will be the world language program design uh that is going
to be based on equity partnerships and proficiency based instruction. And the second one is our ASL stakeholder engagement where we want uh to follow up with implementation learning from other districts engaging community partners
and launching a sustainable model. The goal here is to build strong systems and sustainability plans that can support both ASL and future editions if you so choose. >> All right. Um so there's clear alignment
with many of the district initiatives that you've heard about. Um when we think about post-secary readiness, we know that um our our students are much more likely to get jobs if they are multilingual. Um, we also know that
communication and adaptability are are things that our employers are asking for. Um, we also see a strong connection to deeper learning. When you think about true mastery, being able to speak that language with, um, strong facilities is important and connects to that deeper
learning work. >> Just like Dr. mentioned two years ago when we worked on the world language articulation piece uh and really thinking of what high quality instruction looks like in the world language classroom. Um and also looking at the 2024 actual proficiency
guidelines that were just published. Um really thinking of how do we align our instruction to um the communicative practice and really getting our students to speak, read, listen um and write the languages. not just necessarily know
about the language but actually the language in those specific named languages and so um any new initiatives for new languages we want to make sure that they're aligned across the board and I think that also drives um the
updating of current languages that we have so that all of those practices to add a personal note to this that global redness is really important to me because uh uh speaking many languages is uh something that really make you come
alive in different ways that you don't think about and you don't know. So that global readiness, not only just develop, you know, students for career pathways and college readiness, but just being able to be
bilingual, bitate or bicultural when they are in those classes is something that is beautiful. Um, okay. So we are seeking this evening the board
support with superintendent's guidance to approve the phase language changes for Latin, German, French and Spanish. Approve the direction for newest ASL program. Endorse the continuation of engagement with students, families and
staff to refine implementation details. And we believe that these steps will ensure clear communication, continuity and alignment across all schools. So we thank you for uh sharing this time with us and for your continued partnership.
Uh this initiative represents a thoughtful datadriven evolution of our language programs. One that prioritize equity, engagement, and sustainability. And we welcome your questions. >> How many students Right.
>> Thank you for your question. Uh we we partnered with Dr. Ruck to help us with that. Uh the survey was administered uh grades 8 to 11 and um
about oh I want to say 800 to a thousand students to the survey. >> Thank you for all the work you're doing in this. I know it's disappointing to have to discontin some of the language offerings that
we've had. Um and I understand though that if students aren't registering or if you can't get the correct they can't be offered. My specific question about French is that if you can guarantee that students can take French one and two, but not they'd be able to
teach take three and four depending on enrollment. Is that going to sort of be the death for French? A ninth grader comes in and says, "I want to have four years of a language." And you're saying, "Well, maybe French." But
>> uh I don't think so. Actually, we've seen that increased in enment this year. And so um the the current model is that we have French one and two in person and then three and four were combined
online. Um Mayo, I believe had enough enrollment that they were offering um the three and four in person and so we anticipate that we'll have enough enrollment to be able to offer that. the the online version, it just becomes not
sustainable um by the time we we keep doing that. And so that's why we're suggesting to not do that online, the three and four for French um so that we can focus on those inerson pieces. I think the second part of that is the the human capital and and making sure that
we have the teacher available to teach those courses. So I I don't anticipate that that would um hurt the French program in that sense. Uh, excellent presentation. Thank you. Um,
I remember years ago hearing Latin was a bad language a number of times. But I appreciate the data analysis which was engaged to bring us to this point of of discussion and at
some point a decision. Often we're left with uh our emotions or thoughts based on well I remember when I was in middle school, junior high school back then, you know,
languages were required in in junior high and and even into high school. Uh but that was then this is now. Uh while there is a interest among
uh a percentage of our students, we know that not all of our students choose to pursue foreign language and uh again I'm I'm thankful for the thoughtful approach you guys utilize because it gives to to me
as a member of the board uh the capacity to make an informed decision as I look at the information you provided. Uh my question two part question
with the current online offering are there are out of district students able to participate in our online offerings and if so do you know what the
percentage of students that might be >> I'll talk to the percent participating. >> Thank you. And then finally, I heard reference to in terms of uh trying to uh
principal Martin you had mentioned u some effort possibly being expend expended at upcoming parent teacher conferences can you speak to that a little bit more I only have to tell them so I wasn't sure as what the purpose of that might
be >> yes we wanted to have Q&A with parents to number one Let me back up a little bit. Uh to inform them of uh the initiative and uh
to clarify what that means for each language courses because we've received some email concerns about what director just explained. So we wanted to have a chance to share with the parents. Uh and then
number two is to get feedback from them about about what they what they would like to see with this implementation sign language with ASL. We do have a population of our district who is very
familiar with that and so we would like to engage to see what the recommendations. And final comment in response to that, thank you for uh your thoughtful consideration.
Oftent times uh we the board and administration may hear from uh parents who are who are reacting to what they may read in a media source. And and yet rather than wait for
that, you guys are actually giving parents the opportunity to get it from not the cat's mouth but from the mouth of the professionals. I appreciate that so much uh because it it makes
everyone's job uh easier and I think parents then will have the opportunity to actually rather than emotionally process you know why how come and I thought this and I thought that you know you will give them an opportunity to actually talk listen to the experts and
see the d So, thank you. >> Um, so just real quick, so it looks like this is something that we're going to kind of be moni monitoring because some of these continuation of some of the higher advanced classes are contingent on enrollment. Um, so with that, I would
hope that there's an assumption too that we'll continue to look at this like American Sign Language is very popular, but should another language be requested I'm assuming we'd be open to looking at that. Um, and then I guess, uh, from a
parent perspective, if you are gungho on your child having a certain language, um, kind of, uh, taking off of what director Barlo say, is there are there out of district options for those students? Um, I don't know, K, you know,
are there are we um, able to give those families clear direction, you know, if you if you do want to that and could we say well this is a way your child. >> So one thing that we did last year when when we were looking at all the options
was almost catalog what's out there. So we looked at the courses that were being taught from other districts. We looked at the courses that universities were offering uh as high school credits and we looked at any uh PSO options. Um I
guess the short answer is yes there are some options. um and they are limited in a way. Many many of the options that are available are are level ones and twos and I think that speaks to
um where we're at currently as far as being able to offer a variety of languages because of the enrollment. That would be my my guess of why some languages are only offered at those two levels. Um there are other options that we can look into to
sort of guide that one-on-one. Um and I think as Dr. Pel mentioned, right, we can look at some things down the line um that I hope we can implement for our students. Um it will require some some creative thinking and some implementation and professional development. I also think that as we see
the future of world languages and the access that our students have to to just immerse themselves in languages, we're going to see the field evolved and in less um learning about the language and more doing the language.
>> And I'm sorry I probably didn't ask the question, but what how often will we be reviewing this? Right? So we have the data. How how often will we be reviewing the data or is this where we kind of wait till it dies out. I would hope maybe we could be more, you know,
proactive about it if we are um since we're aware that we're having an issue with language um that we would have some kind of monitoring system. I don't know if we look at it every year or every two years like how how will we measure the success of the
removal or the program? >> Um yeah, thank you uh Dr. Whitehorn for that question. Um, at the next board meeting, the board uh will be approving reviewing and approving the course registration guide, which is your official approval of our
authority to teach something. And so that is what is this is ultimately leading up to including American Sign Language in that guide. The ability of our schools to actually offer the class is dependent on enrollment. And so
you're absolutely right. This is a constant ongoing um question and um we do have courses that are in the course guide that our schools don't offer not necessarily world language because you don't have enough kids to run the section in which case um we don't offer
it but it remains in the course guide it remains an offering. I think we could certainly commit to keep the board apprised of our enrollment numbers on world language. Um uh as Natalia just mentioned, there are a number of options that I think we need to do some more
homework on. Um uh the the the decision to go online with many of our current offerings was made my first year coming right out of the pandemic. And um for some very self-directed learners, online
learning can work great. I also spent time in uh the language labs where we had kids learning in Rochester online who were really not having the kind of vibrant world language experience that uh we heard about in the task force work
that Natalya led a couple years ago. It it they it a kid who is not a self-directed learner trying to learn a world language totally online never with you know room. So we just have some I think important thinking to do about for whom uh modes of learning other than
place-based classroom instruction are really successful. But we need to ask that not just about world language but about every subject area. There are certain kids for whom technology embedded self-paced learning is very effective. the challenge of moving German, French and Latin online in
Rochester was unfortunately it engaged a lot of kids in that kind of learning for whom it wasn't effective and the kids would tell you um so that's where this uh effort to bring back in-person language learning uh has really started to gain momentum but there is a type of
student for whom this this kind of learning is very effective and it opens a lot of possibilities I want us to do and we've had a robust discussion about this I want us to really do our homework. Um, which the team is very committed to do. And so if this is an issue of ongoing interest for the board,
I would love to put this on future board calendars and keep you apprised of that. There's a whole exciting movement that I actually really asked the team not to put before the board tonight because it really deserves a separate discussion of uh exposing kids to what are often
called their heritage language. So learning the language that is their family's linguistic tradition which they may not actually otherwise have the opportunity I think that is something that as we get into the exciting work of of the next strategic plan which is
really about what we teach there's an exciting opportunity to think in those terms but again we have to remember for which kind of student is fully online learning and then there's even one layer deeper which is is it synchronous or asynchronous are you interacting ing
with someone in in real time or is it actually all because there's a lot of classes that are proliferating that are totally asynchronous where the kid is just clicking through screens you're watching videos and things. So, um I I would love to we've had mentioned
already tonight um it's on me to present the chair and vice chair and then by extension the board with a a proposed agenda for the board's work in 2026 that's coming soon. And so if continuing the discussion of world language is of interest to the board, we'd love to um put that on and keep you updated.
>> And just so I'm clear, I'm sorry. >> Um this doesn't have any contingency on clubs though, right? So if there's a group of kids that want to continue with the Latin club and someone wants to man, they can there's other you know those.
>> Yes, we have. clubs need an adviser, but as long as we have an adviser, absolutely we can do that. >> I I just wanted to add a couple things because um access to language learning is is
something important to consider. And and the reason why I want to add this is because we when we're thinking also and and this is not the topic of tonight, but when we're thinking of the language revitalization work that we're doing in access to the kota no in Minnesota um
that is something that that we can directly connect with the universities and colleges. That is not something that we would have the capacity to lift based on enrollment and interest that we're currently seeing. Um, we are committed to lift the indigenous language and
culture course that is in the guide currently that we are expecting to launch next semester. But for more in depth at Kota and Lujiwa languages, for example, we want to partner to offer those as a PSO option for our students. uh because we have several tribal
colleges and universities that offer that where it would be a synchronous opportunity. And so those students who have that desire could could access that choice. And so being intentional about how do we partner for that um for that
option is important. Um that would be hard to do with everything language under the sun because those opportunities don't exist um across the board. Um, and I think when we think of how do we engage with adding languages,
I think well the the enrollment drives what we offer at Rochester public schools. But I also would love to see a dynamic process where um we have those language communities in partnership with us. And I think that's work that we are beginning to do in the English learning
world where we can partner with those communities that are majority language within Rochester and surrounding areas. so that we are in closer communication with them. So if they come and say hey we have this percentage of students in our in our schools and this percentage
of students and we would love for those languages to be offered so that we can be in conversation and then bring those opportunities back to you um so that it's a dynamic process and we don't have to wait right five 10 years to to review what we're doing in world languages and so I think there are a lot of
opportunities to to be more responsive to um to our students needs and interests. Um, so I I had a uh a couple questions here just on clarifying the the recommendation so I understand it better and then also because it's a study session um some more curiositydriven
questions. But um first off on the proposal um I got a little mixed up at at one point. Um is the proposal to retain German one and two indefinitely or is the proposal to also phase those out
>> to retain German one and two online based on the enrollment for German one and two is strong enough that we can retain those indefinitely as you said. >> Okay. but subject to enrollment. >> Subject to enrollment >> and I guess that was the other thing as
I was reading through this in in my head and sort of building off of superintendent's comments just now. Um I think all of our courses are contingent on enrollment. So is that different in any way current in the current state for foreign languages? Like do we do we have
sort of a a commitment that we'll offer French through four like regardless of enrollment for students that want to take it? >> I can maybe speak to that. I think all of our courses are we look at the enrollment and I think last year it was
close to 25.6 or something like that to offer the course. Um so the course doesn't run unless we get the kids signed up for it. Um so I think that's that's similar. I think world language has been just an area where
we've seen that level one and two and then we see that attition. So it's a little bit unique in that. I think right so I think
yes it's all based on enrollment I think in our practice that we need so that people are aware They know that for most classes, but we have typically offered. >> Okay. Um and then so yeah, that that
clarifies it I think for me anyway. Um why I guess uh why is the recommendation to continue with German one and two? I I know the we don't have the enrollment numbers on here, but I know the enrollment is low. Um why is that the recommendation?
So when we look at the trend um and the number of students in level one that hasn't changed a t students that cross the district is enough to have
it and so the numbers support that enrollment doesn't drop at one and two and so it also gives them that option um to keep that language also that when um the Latin and German students did a
survey group last spring um and asking why why are you taking this language and so forth um there was a strong heritage of language that supported their choice in taking that and that explains why um
that's a solid across the years to keep those when we were looking at the language offerings across districts and other places We discovered actually that many districts offer just level ones and twos for some languages. Um and so that
we didn't have to do one through four and that that year one and two is sufficient to to meet some of the um some colleges that ask for that requirement and also we have enough data to say our students are enrolling in
this. We don't need to completely get rid of it because the interest of our students but also >> well Dr. Cook it's a very astute question because the charge to the group actually initially was to retire German
too in Latin. So my um agreement to bring this revised proposal really came from looking at the issues that team just described for you that we do have a contingent. I one possibility is connection to German heritage. I think as I've been talking to a lot of our
high school students, they are relentlessly pragmatic about college entrance and it's I want my two years. I'm not taking anything more. They'll tell you we're in the age of Google Translate. Like pretty soon I'm not going to need to learn a thing. I can just talk. but they looking they're
looking at colleges. So whether it's heritage, culture or pragmatic, German seems like a good way to meet my I was persuaded. Um uh I think that um that will play out as you were just noting based on the enrollment trends um and
where those things go. So that was the the pivot that um I agreed to from the initial my initial read of the data was that German was doing slightly better than um Latin but on a downward trajectory as we actually recognized
that German one and two was a different creature from German three and four. Uh that was a shift in my own thinking one of several as part of this project. >> Okay. Um no that that that is really helpful. Um, and then the the last
question I think is um the interest in ASL uh we've seen that in previous board presentations. I know that's been kind of a theme and I was just I was wondering if we have an idea of where that's coming from because like the interest that you mentioned in uh
Japanese and Korean makes tons of sense to me just because Japan and Korea are prolific exporters of culture and language is such a a great way experience culture and the and the other languages. I think we can recognize that there's some cultural significance in
our Rochester community for uh for some of those. But um what where do you think the interest in ASL is coming from and how do you u yeah just any thoughts you have on that? I'd be interested. >> Okay. I I think that uh there's
well let me say this. I think there might be a misconception that American language is not a cultural, you know, like a heritage language. Um, and so it is surprising when students want to learn this. So uh the language is
actually gaining prominence in the community not not just like in Rochester but in the United States and also uh because it does help communicate nonverbally you know so it becomes like
an expressive language that uh our students are interested in learning um and uh and find fascinating There is also the death and heart of hearing culture here that we don't
recognize but is very much a part of our district and uh that gives them a chance to be visible uh and our students who interact with the with uh def and heart of hearing uh
peers uh often times assigning to them uh and and I've seen this experientially. So I think that uh American sign language is on the rise um for some reason in our to recognize as a
cultural you know language because we have communities who depend on that kind nonverbal expressive one one thing that I've encountered
communication from parents is when they've asked about ASL is also because it is a visual language it supports our students who might struggle with dyslexia who might struggle with other
very heavily grammatical spelling of other appealing um to students who want to interactions of learning language. >> I'll just say Director Cook, you
mentioned Japan and Korea. I I was actually a licensed Chinese teacher in Minnesota and Massachusetts and so I had some hopes uh and they died with our student interests and I respect that actually. I was social studies primarily but I did I
was licensed and you know I I it was fascinating to see where the number comes but one of the things that I ultimately said to the team we have to make a bet here like when someone starts a business and we have to recruit students into the intellectual adventure of learning this language and the
cultural adventure and at some point there's no guarantee that we have to actually and so uh for all the reasons that the team just described from the survey to other things you know I was persuaded that this is a good bet, but um uh it'll take a lot of work to pull
this off, which is one reason why I've wanted to really focus this discussion uh on the decision that I hope you'll make at your next meeting about investing in ASL and in essentially the big other issues, retiring Latin, which I think as Mona said, I want to amplify.
We we could have just done based on enrollment, but it's been a long-standing tradition uh in Rochester. And so I think it was important to explain it to you as our leaders and uh do it with some clarity. So that's the decision for us, but there's a lot of
other exciting things that I think uh to director White Horn's point might await beyond this decision. But uh this is a really important decision uh because we are going to have some heavy lifting to do to build out the curriculum, find the teachers, and build student interest. Um
and the clock's ticking in terms of meeting the ambitious timeline that Martine walked us through. I guess just my that was my final question um was promotion of this right if we're adding a language how are we I know you said there'd be some engagement with parent teacher conferences but you
know how do we prevent from having to continue opening a language and closing the language and I guess to add to that with the languages that we are closing how are we promoting those or were we kind of just letting them fizzle out right Um because oftent times when you
hear back on these things people go I didn't even know they still offered that class right because the interest had dropped. So you know sometimes you kind of end up with this snowball effect. Interest is dropped but um you know people just feed off of that
and and are unaware of what is actually offered if I'm making sense. So I I guess what have we done to ensure that we have been you know that we have been expressing that more so than just you know when your kid gets their sheet do they want to take a language pick a language are
we doing anything in district to promote um like she said for our children are we doing anything to promote the languages or we just Latin is a good language I mean not that I'm saying we need to have it but I mean what are we how are we bringing this to
the students so not only are they thinking of it as an option but you know we also I don't want to be a district where we get down the line and it's like, well, why don't you guys offer this because this is a very, you know, good class and my my kids need this. You know what I mean? How are we asked the
question there, but maybe let me just resolve the first part and then turn back to the team. Um, we I would not be bringing this recommendation if we had not tried very hard to build enrollment in those classes. Um, we tried very hard, but I think to director Barlo's point, what is it? Latin's a dead language and now it's killing me. That's
what some people say. Um, it was wonderful. was passionate but we just couldn't generate the interest. The same was true of upper level Germans. So um we really did uh try both through outreach to families and kids to build that. Um even the move to going online
was something I did reluctantly. In terms of looking forward for the the future looking work on should the board next week approve the addition of American Sign Language. How are you thinking about that forward-looking task of building students? Well, this is anecdotal because I was just at Mayo
High School um talking with a teacher who's a big champion of unified um Colin Thomas who you may have have met before and he was just pumped about the idea that this might be a possibility and he said, "I have kids that are going to be
ready to really promote with one another um what this course is." So, I think we're kind of a preview of our our um course guide work next week. We're trying to do a lot more promotion of these are the courses, these are the opportunities that you have and even
earlier than high school because we know that our parents and our students need to start thinking in middle school about what the possibilities are so that they can kind of see where they're going. So, I think those are probably two two ways that I think we'll promote with students
to students because I think they listen more to one another. Um, and then also getting the parents as a parent of a student who enjoyed their four years or the interest in the language.
I also know that there were a number of students who took because I think in the past few years we've really increased our direct offerings in courses that include medical terminology. So perhaps for those students who may have taken Latin because they wanted to
prepare medical school, we're offering other opportunities for them to get that knowledge. I don't know whether that led to a different language, but I think we're helping our offerings.
So I feel like there's still opportunities for those students who may as an opportunity to get into medical terminology, but we have those health science careers. >> And madam, I know we're ready to move
on, but I know principal Hagland used to before she became a principal, you used to teach and could you just share briefly your experience or what the students were like, their level
of interest? I know shathan reference why some were enrolled, but were there any there for the love the >> Yes, of course. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for sending me to my pass.
I appreciate that. Um, yes, I I taught Latin uh in the district for two years. I taught it at Wood High School for five years uh before that and it was a wonderful time of my life.
Uh I always promoted the language uh as what you shared chair Nathan uh something that really increases uh your ability to do multiple things. Uh it does uh open a door in the classics for
students who wanted to continue with that and um the students were there for the love of the language. Um even though they would to medical field and I made this uh they were there for the love of the language. Um they
we had field trips, we had uh trips to Rome, we had several things that were happening that were enriching the students culturally uh taking the language. So it's it is not easy for me to say retire a language that I used to
uh teach but I do understand the practical reasons behind that. With that said, I I appreciate you saying that there are other ways that the language is alive. Um the for me uh any woman's
languages bring it back to Latin. So French, Spanish, German are being taught. So uh in by proxy Latin is alive because these languages are rooted. You know, Latin is the mother tongue for
cousin. German It's the mother tongue for Spanish and French and many others that we consider. So yes, thank you so much that it was all of your hard work. Next item is our ABCD. Uh the current
version is in the agenda item and on the slide we have our upcoming agenda items. We have a special session on October 21st uh for our field trip fees. This is also including a public hearing on October 21st. Following the special
session, we have a regular meeting with two focus topics, attendance data, and initiatives update and our philanthropy strategy. Our prep for action is of course registration guide and our policy committee recommendations from the October 9th meeting. And then we're taking action on both the language
access plan and the world languages plan. Uh we have a special session on November 18th which is our annual comprehensive achievement and civic readiness report immediately following a regular meeting with two monitoring items. The annual inventory of fixed assets and
comprehensive achievement and civic readiness prep for action on the 2026 2030 strategic plan proposal and action approval of audit report for fiscal year 2024 2025 and the course registration guide. Any items board members would
like to raise for consideration for future agenda? Hearing none, um you heard about our meeting through October 21st. We also have uh meetings on December 2nd. December 16th and um December 16th is
our troop and taxation meeting. That meeting starts at 6:00 p.m. That's a special meeting. Note the difference in time to be followed by a regular meeting. and hearing. No other business. This meeting is adjourned at 7:27