e e e I was surprised they said yes all right uh this meeting is being in accordance with the open public meetings act uh annual notice of this meeting was public the Union County local Source in the New York Star Ledger said notice was posted in the municipal
building and a copy is on file with the office of the barel clerk um Fire EX Lo locate in the directions I'm indicating if you're alerted for a fire please move in a calm orderly manner to the nearest smoke free exit proper notice have't been giving the B clerk is directed to include the statement in the minutes of the meeting please call the RO
councilman Petroski yes here I mean sorry got it councilman Johnson is absent councilman signarello here councilman Rina here councilwoman Lions here good evening councilman Patel here mayor signarello here you have a quarum mayor uh please lead us in the opening
prayer followed by the Pledge of Allegiance Eternal God grant us thy help and all our duties and perplexities we ask for thy guidance give us thy protection in our dangers and Sorrows grant us thy peace amen amen pledge allegiance to the flag of
the United States of America to the Republic for which stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty all um okay there no Communications for riew this evening there are no proclamations uh may have motion to approve meeting
minutes pending any corrections so move second all in favor I I may have a motion that bills and payrolls be not read and pass for payment so move second all in favor I I may have motion to open the public portion on agenda items only oh so move second all in favor hi
hi uh if you'd like to come up and speak on agenda items you may do so now how you doing George Ramirez 500 East clav uh in regards to the storm water what item on the agenda one second
[Applause] here 278 three storm water control so it seems to me that the uh the sewer situation the lawsuit that we basically settled for the 4
million you came up here and said that you know that you wanted to be super clear that there's never been any legal agreement for the burrow and Elizabeth yep that you search far and wide there's no documentation at all of any agreement yep
and uh that apparently is a handshake deal now it's come to my attention that a Mr John guro was able to find 14 different articles in regards to all of this yep so I don't understand I mean if there's no documentation of an
agreement how is 14 articles well sir there's a difference between an or yeah hold on one second so just I have the special attorney for this and our our attorney is that your only question is there anything else you want to ask uh yeah for now that's it okay there's a a big legal difference between a newspaper
article and a legal agreement that gets passed between two entities or two parties corre so so this went in front of a court in 1918 no no no let's go back your question was to the mayor and to the council you
said there was no agreement but there were 14 or 19 articles describing the situation that had happened answer to is none of those articles say there is an agreement and an article is not an agreement correct so there the article
as we sit here today okay so let me reclaim my time again can I reclaim my time again just let basically the Articles talk about how we went to court with Elizabeth yep back in 1918 yep correct correct because we weren't
supposed well we had set the runoff onto a ravine by elur yep and then there was a b big issue but it went to court it went to in front of a judge multiple times yeah so Bill I don't know do you have a microphone working yeah so can you hear me well I'm going to have you
talk more you know openly about this and exhaustively but do you have any immediate reaction to this no I mean I concur there are articles about um a lawsuit but there's no documentation that of a settlement which was reached
in this present case uh where there is documentation there's no documentation there's no contracts there's nothing documented What was decided or what was um settled quote unquote so when let me finish and then I'll let you finish no
problem um when you say there's no legal documentation that's correct there there's articles written about it but there is no documentation setting forth what you know is thought to have occurred all right so the mayor said
there's no documentation at all not legal or whatever but my question is it went in front of a judge in 1918 right correct okay what was the outcome that's what the Articles say what what's the outcome of that we do not know exactly what the outcome of
that was because there are no documentations obviously we're living in a different world now uh so but there there's also two things and and Bill I talked to your partner Mike about this which I think are important given the time right so two things to note from 1918 first off is um there was no NJ DP
then right so anything that would come afterwards in terms of fines would bring up a new issue that any potential judge could have even talked about then right we'd be living in a new world to Bill's point the second thing is correct me if I'm wrong there was a constitutional change in the state of New Jersey
between then and now right so even if there was I'm not a lawyer here right but I'm learning pretty quickly even if there was some judgment back then right it would be we live in a new Judicial System since then absolutely so I'm not saying be completely null and void but it'd be a pretty tough leg to stand on
is that a fair summation absolutely well when there's just like in in construction and everything if there's an agreement and then something changes it's usually grandfathered in but again but again what you just did was say if
there's an agreement correct there is no existence of an agreement no one has been able to find the agreement the Articles do not ever say that the party came to an agreement the word agreement is not in the 19
articles you may want to read it in there but it's not in there so you're saying that out of all of the times that this went in front of a judge that this for like six years in 1914 and 1918 and unfortunately record keeping it was not
the same as is now right so that could have settled that could have been just a paper order that never got filed it could have just been dismissed there's a lot of different things as we sit here I'm sorry George but your time's up you can come back afterwards just to be
clear say it one more time we have not been able to discover an agreement and those articles do not help us go down that path any further because they do not stay there there there's an agreement all right we'll continue later not problem thank you George uh would anybody else like to
come up and speak on agenda items yep come on man expensive equipment uh Tim kley just here to talk about the uh the trees ordinance what's that 27 278 five yes sir is that it right yep so you know just as both the
resident and as charl Charlotte ter 213 Charlotte terce thank you so I guess as a resident as chair of the environmental commission I've talked to Andrew about this one a little bit because you know he's on our and in our commission meetings I know and I would encourage any residents here and I appreciate you calling this out last week this does
potentially you know at the behest of the state put some burden on TI on residents on homeowners B deal have trees in their backyard so I would encourage anyone who's here to read this ordinance first of all I think the burough is going to do their best to minimize the uh the impact on residents but you know one of the things I maybe
we can use some help from Council from residents you know local organizations and I've seen this in uh nearby by towns like Cranford they've got programs to defay the cost of trees for residents who want to plant them in their own on their own private property right so if you read the ordinance you know there's
an opportunity to just pay into a fund rather than replant a tree Y which will go to the town that'll go to build that'll go to plant more Street trees and won't go to plant more trees on residents private property so just wanted to call it out you know in the meeting and happy to work with with anyone on Council who wants to help
would love to start a program through the Green Team through environmental commission to you know create a fund of some kind that you know residents can buy instead of paying $2 $300 to plant a new tree in the backyard or pay $250 to go into a tree fund they can pay 30 bucks and get you know get a dog wood or
pay $100 get three dog Woods to replace the oak tree they took down no I love it um I think it's a great idea and U sadly I think you know you could feel it I talk to Andrew about this all the time not to be like you know a a tree hugger but like you could feel it when the
especially in 90 degree days you could feel the heat now in some of the areas where we produce this sheet so I think it's a great idea I think that's the purpose of the fund um we have a member of the environmental commission that I'm sure can work it out in detail with you okay cool sounds good but I'm supportive
of it uh would anybody like else like to come up and speak on agenda items I'm seeing no one may have motion to close the public portion on agenda items only so move second all in favor I
uh okay reports of departments uh may have a motion to Ken Andrew do you guys have anything you want to say you good okay may have a motion to accept the reports of Department as submitted so move second all in favor uh wait Andrew can we do this one or we have to the hearing on okay we can
do the hearing on it uh Mr clerk please read ordinance number 2780 by title Mr Mayor ordinance 2780 is an ordinance for second reading and public Hearing in ordinance amending chapter 40 section 35 of the code of the bur of Rosel Park entitled driveways uh may I have a motion to to open the public hearing on ordinance
number 2780 so move second all in favor I I uh would anybody like to come up and speak on this ordinance I am seeing no one may I have a motion to close the public hearing on ordinance number 2780 so move second all in favor I I so we need to oh you wrote
this down already may have Mo motion to postpone further consideration of ordinance number 2780 to the regular meeting of July 18th 2024 so move second all in favor I uh okay please read ordinance number 2783 by title yes mayor ordinance 2783 is an ordinance for
second reading and public hearing an ordinance amending chapter 31 of the code of the bur Rosel Park as mandated by the njd entitled storm water control may I have a motion to open the public hearing on ordance number 2783 so move second all in favor I would anybody like to come up and speak on this ordinance
so George yeah well I just want to clarify something you can come up just in case but so this is an ordinance based on overarching things that we need to implement from the NJ DP it's not really Germaine I don't think conversation is Germain has nothing to
do with the the the the lawsuit the lawsuit but it's got it to do with the storm water which we're talking about storm water yeah but it's not it's you I'm going to put it this way I'm just going to let you know up front if you start talking about the lawsuit in Elizabeth I'm going to cut you off why because the ordinance has nothing to do
with that this is a regulation that is passed down from the D to deal with storm waterer management whether or not there was a law suit we would still adopt this ordinance so you're going to prevent me from talking about storm water in general I'm going to allow you to talk about this ordinance which I'm
not going to allow you to go down and start talking about whether an agreement exists and newspaper articles from 1902 okay feel free sir all right okay anybody else I am seeing no one may I have a
motion to close the public hearing on ordinance number 27 uh 83 so move second may have a motion to adopt ordinance number 2783 so move second is there any discussion please call the RO Andrew second
yep councilman Petroski yes councilman signarello yes councilman Robina yes councilwoman Lions yes councilman Patel yes by votes in affirmative mayor the ordinance is adopted please read ordinance number 2784 by title yes mayor ordinance 2784
is an ordinance amending the code of the burb Ros law Park establishing a new chapter 21 as managed as mandated by the njd entitled privately owned salt storage may have motion to open the public hearing on ordinance number 2784 so move second all in favor I I anybody
like to come up and speak on salt storage Hot Topic seeing no one may have a motion to close the public hearing on ordinance number 2784 so move second all in favor I I may have a motion to adopt ordance number 2784 so move second is there any
discussion please call the RO Andrew councilman Petroski yes councilman sella yes councilman Robina yes councilwoman Lions yes councilman Patel five votes the affirmative mayor the ordinance is adopted okay please read ordinance number 2785 by title yes mayor ordinance
2785 is an ordinance for second reading and public hearing an ordinance amending chapter 26 of the code of the Barb roel Park entitled trees establishing a new section two as mandated by the njd entitled private tree removal and replacement okay may have motion to open the public hearing on ordance number
2785 so move second uh all in favor I anybody like to come up and speak on this Tim anything else cool may have motion to close the public hearing on ordinance number 2785 so move second uh all in favor I may have motion to adopt
ordinance number 2785 so move second is there any discussion Andrew please call the rooll council Petroski yes Council signarello yes councilman rabina yes councilwoman Lions yes councilman Patel yes six votes confirmed five votes confirmed of Mayor the ordinance is adopted okay all
matters listed within assist are considered to be routine and non-controversial by the council and will be approved by one motion there will be no separate discussion of these items unless a member of the governing body so requests in which case the item will be removed from the consent agenda and considered in its normal sequence on the agenda as part of the general orders
Andrew please read all resolutions list on the consent agenda by title yes mayor resolution 15824 is authorizing renewal of Alcoholic Beverage Control license number 2015 33913 oldie dings LL doing business as dings Irish pub and restaurant for the 2425 licensing term
resolution 15924 is authorizing a program agreement between the bur Rosell Park and Raymond and MOA Nar in connection with Rosell Park Housing rehabilitation program case number rp-5 6 21 and 02 for the Improvement of the
property located at 323 Sheridan Avenue known as block 1014 Lot 8 of the municipal tax map resolution 16024 is authorizing renewal of Alcoholic Beverage Control license number 2 15 33155 liquor 157 LLC doing business as
Deluxe Enterprises Inc Deluxe event planning and Rentals LLC for the 2425 licensing term resolution 16124 is authorizing renewal of Alcoholic Beverage Control license number 2015 33167 spanga food Inc doing business as cost as Restaurant and Pizzeria for the
2425 licensing term resolution 16224 is authorizing renewal of Alcoholic Beverage Control license number 2015 33126 C CDR Group LLC doing business as Casa del re for the 2425 licensing term resolution 16324 is authorizing renewal of Alcoholic Beverage Control license
number 2015 31171 American Legion Post 60 Inc doing doing business as American Legion Post 60 Inc for the 2425 licensing term resolution 16424 is authorizing the burough clerk to auction unclaimed bicycles resolution 16524 is authorizing
the bur clerk to auction Vehicles no longer needed for public use resolution 624 is directing an immediate stop to the acquisition and installation of a Rick Barry statue as authorized by ordinance number 2776 and further directing any and all actions necessary to formally repeal the
appropriation resolution 16724 is authorizing the tax collector to issue a reduction and will refund on four sewer utility bills in the amount of $474 resolution 16824 is authorizing the treasure to issue one check toing $418
42 payable to one lean holder on one property resolution 16924 is authorizing the open-ended purchase of regular 87 octane unleaded gasoline from National Fuel Oil Inc pursuant Somerset County cooperative purchasing system contract number CC
4524 with a 0898 0839 per gallon upcharge sorry could all read it resolution 17024 is establishing the processes for management and replacement of the American flag resolution 17124 is authorizing change
order number one to jock Mel Construction LLC for the project Rosel Park Housing rehabilitation case number rp-5 in the amount of a $4,700 increase to the reflect a total contract amount of $24,600 resolution 17224 is cancel canceling the
appropriation of $150,000 for the acquisition and installation of a Rick Barry statue at gazebo Park and other property from ordinance number 2776 and resolution ution 17342 24 is amending resolution 14224 and reauthorizing a
shared service agreement with the burough of kennworth for the position of superintendent of Public Works and the use of the Department of Public Works equipment and vehicles okay so I'm removing 166 and 172 do any members wish to have any other items removed from the
consent agenda okay may have motion to approve the resolutions remaining on the consent agenda so move second all in favor I may have a motion to adopt resolution 166 oh can we do can we do them together yeah you just need to ask for a motion
okay can I have a motion to adopt resolution 16624 and 17224 so move second is there any discussion so I I just um councilman Johnson brought this up unfortunately he said he's going to be late or not here I didn't get a chance to connect with him
about this um so I uh am wholeheartedly in favor uh I heard you guys about redirecting funds and not spending money on a Rick Barry statue um I do want to just mention the implication of this means we put out a bunch of money in the
budget this year if we take this out that means we can't do anything with those monies right uh what I'd rather do is US kind of sidebar and talk about what else we could potentially use 150k for right like uh there's Girl Scout Park that needs to get done there's sidewalks that need to get done maybe
Michael J myy Park is up for Rehab you know a couple streets in the second board so I again I don't want to use it for Rick Barry anymore but I don't want to see that money go away I'd rather thank you all right feels good I got to thank you card I'm getting a clap you're
welcome thank you anyway we heard you um but I just this would take that money's away I'd rather a sidebar talk about what else we could use it for and reallocate that versus just chopping it out um so I would ask you guys to vote these down and again once again for everybody on the record we're not going
to spend it on a Rick Barry statue but if we if we thank you but if we vote if we vote Yes for this that means we can't spend it on anything I'd rather us vote no on it tonight and we could figure out what else we could spend it on that the
burrow needs um any questions from Council does that make sense to everybody okay cool um uh Andrew do you want to call the rooll yes Council Petroski no councilman signorella no councilman
Rina no councilwoman Lions no no councilman Patel no five votes the negative the resolutions are defeated never been so happy to hear no in my life as mayor that was smooth um okay uh I'm gonna go a little bit out of order because we have Bill here and I want to
use my time uh to to talk about some of the sewer questions that have come up so I'm going to yield my mayor's update for you and talking about this um can I have a motion from Council to go out of order and pull up the or can I just do the mayor's update out of order or do I need a motion
no you're you're fine can I just can I just pull them up yeah you can Mr lawyer you can just do it okay cool feels good to be the mayor come on up Bill uh okay so I want to do this before public portion because I'm I'm sure there's going to be more questions about
this and more discussion um look uh I don't want this meeting to go on forever and I've talked a lot about this um there's been a lot of consternation about the sewer bill this year uh nobody's happy about it um in the meantime since we've done the settlement and since we've increased
everybody's sewer bill there's been a lot of excellent work that the public has done in terms of research um and obviously we did our research beforehand but we thought it would be in everybody's best interest to have our special counsel have an eyeball through it one of our special council is right
here tonight uh so I have a memo for Council I know we just got it out today sorry I would have liked to got it out earlier um but I thought it'd be good to kind of just have you verbally talk it through as our lawyer some of the things that you found there you know why they're potentially relevant and
probably most likely why so there's three things I think are important to hit from my perspective as mayor right so first off we settled this right so a lot of it unfortunately For Better or Worse only would have come up had we gone to court right is one thing that I think we need to talk about but candidly
based on I think a lot of your views are I don't know how effective they would have been in court anyway I'm kind of bar still in the lead here but the shows yours Bill okay um you might just want to actually do you want to go over there might be more because there's a mic
stand over there yep all right everyone can hear me yeah all right you might want to go a little closer just just to be safe better yeah all right um yeah so you know you you you brought up you know the points about the settlement and and what you know
would have come out uh had the case proceeded uh eventually to a trial before and you know whoever was at the meeting last time you know trial is not before a jury trials before a judge in equity Court um the Articles have all been can you just explain what that means by the way because I think that's
important absolutely so you know there's several types of courts in uh New Jersey and Superior Court um one of them is an equity court and what does an equity Court do the is it has special powers in that it can
award um it can basically the easy way to say it is make you do something right a uh Superior Court Civil Division jury can't make you do something other than pay money they can give you a piece of paper with a judgment on it a equity Court can make you do something force
you to do something so uh it's Equitable relief uh and what the Elizabeth was asking here not only monetary damages because an equity Court can award monetary damages um but asking the court for the burrow to disconnect from their
system um so ultimately a judge would have been tasked with uh that decision whether or not we uh the burrow had to remove itself uh and then secondly all the monetary issues uh attorney's fees
on the other side uh pass charges for treating uh the uh uh systems water and uh future as well and any punitive damages that you know I I don't
necessarily just to make that concrete I'm sorry to cut you off but um I've had to learn a lot on the Fly here sure so this means in this type of Court it would been one judge that would have just he's judge jury and executioner there correct right so part of why I think it's we can talk about what we
talked about in Clos session is that was the risk and correct me if I'm wrong the judge had overtly said like he was ready to move on this pretty quickly correct and and that's one of the things I should have brought up these Equity courts move a lot quicker than uh you know if anyone's been involved in a
civil lawsuit uh you know they're surprised when they first get involved that those cases can drag on for years and years and years you know average is about three to four years before you're seeing a jury that doesn't happen here your complaints filed you're you're
probably at a decision Max 12 to 14 months so just to make this Crystal crystal clear had we chosen to go forward with the lawsuit there's a multitude of potential outcomes right but what they were asking for is a specific route off of their system a
specific rate to be paid forward and $40 million in Damages from the rear right correct now we could have gotten a judge that could have said they could have landed exactly what our settlement was and said four four million's fair and you know Rosal Park can pick the path we
could have got a judge that said you know $30 million is fair and Rosell Park you're compelled to pay this right which is why you try to work out a fair settlement because you try to minimize potential corre downside damage correct yep and and as pointed out in the
memo that judge uh I think it was put nicely in the memo that judge was not going to in insert a payment plan whatever decision was made onto monetary damages it was going to be a judgment uh and it would be have have to be paid yeah um we in this settlement we have a
period of time to pay the settlement so you know courts don't get involved in oh how much money is available and what when can it be paid they're just going to say these are the damages this is what's awarded Fork it over Fork it over yeah uh and if not it's a judgment go
and force the Judgment yeah so um so just to be clear then even if a judge said hey $4 million is fair we could have had to pay all four million this year and the situation would have been markedly worse correct yep okay um so then the other things I think
are important to hit on so obviously um you've read the documents right and there was a bunch of work you guys did even before any of these documents um your findings none of these are we keep rehashing this and rehashing
this but what I've always told people is there's no legally binding agreements any of those documents they reference discussion and debate about it but nothing legally binding that we would have been able to hold up anyway correct and my read of these these
articles indicates there likely was no agreement um there's definitely nothing indicating there is an agreement as to what were what's that issue this is an Overland drainage issue basically that
there was a dispute over that was being blocked that went to court based on the Articles what's in the Articles a lawsuit was filed but that was the law was filed on that specific topic of the concrete blocking correct correct the
obstruction that was put up by um Elizabeth suit was filed by the burrow and you can't surmise what happened but there is no reason to believe that an agreement was reached to the issue in
hand here connecting uh Rosel Park system to that the the resolution in that case would have had to do with the blockage which was eventually resolved the blockage was removed this is not the issue in this case the the the connection is the issue
in this case and Bill and maybe Joe talk to us a little bit about so when we go into these negotiations there's a thing called Discovery right so that means we need to search Andrew needs to sweat it out and search through all our documents to see if there was any agreements or anything pertinent to this that's disc
discovery on our end same thing on Elizabeth there was no hard agreements that came up in that right we know this but obviously that's a big boo boo if you were hiding something right so that is not something that a burrow or a city would want to do the consequences of
hiding something like that would be astronomical I've never seen it uh I've been doing this long enough hiding an agreement that is germine to this issue uh yes that's correct that would be a big boo boo let's put it that way
borderline criminal yeah correct right uh and then the last piece in Bill the floor is yours I just want to make sure that we're again I've had to learn on the Fly here so asking the questions that I've had to ask so it's clear to everybody and just anybody who's here on this topic we're also going to do we're going to drag Bill back or or Mike back
to do a special town hall on this to talk about this um uh you know even if we were to go to court and these things were to come up we would hire an expert to go even further than the public did and find up all these documents is there anything that you see
there that really would have given us a healthy at bat to say we have claim to just free flow into this system absolutely not I I I I think the opposite um everything you see there is about a dispute that that is irrelevant
so the judge sure would have taken everything into consideration but there's nothing in these articles again they're articles as uh Council pointed out earlier that says there's any agreement to the issue at hand that we're quote unquote freeloading into their system y
again as pointed out in the in the memo and you mentioned it earlier the uh the is regulating this and one of the things I think everyone should know and it's in the memo is they're coming down hard on Elizabeth because they still have this
combined system there's not many left there they have this system and and they're coming down hard the judge has this in mind he knows this this is not his first sewer case and it won't be his is last so he's going to keep that in mind that these things need to be alleviated because the government's
coming down on Elizabeth so they need to get out because if they don't get out then Elizabeth can't correct their problem so um no there's nothing to to the long and short of it is there's nothing in those articles that changes anything whatsoever our read of them got
it Joe bill is there anything that I didn't cover that you feel like at the top of the house should be covered uh just uh you know pointing out that in terms of the monetary you know what judge could have done I think it's also important we picked well we negotiated the route right the judge could have said that route doesn't make any sense
we're going to do this route and the cost of that could have tripled y so we you know part of the settlement is how again going back to the time frame he also could have said you're out in five years years yeah I'm sorry years whatever so you know we negotiated the
time frame and we negotiated the route something we could work with that wouldn't have been option judge could have done whatever he wanted now that doesn't say no one's standing here and saying well maybe he he could have given a route that Elizabeth couldn't you know they wouldn't have been happy with sure anything can happen but it's a gamble
yeah um do do you guys have any problem with me opening up to the the council for questions while we have the professionals here council do do you guys have any questions for either Joe or Bill while they're here yeah I do uh where that 4 million come from was that from when they installed the flow
meter hear me now what $4 million where did that number come about was that from when they installed the flow meter back in 2011 and comparable to that I can handle that so so this because Mike and I were at the 11th Hour going back and
forth on this so we kept going it was a dance right they started at 4 million 40 million we said how about two right they went to 30 million we said how about three right um where we landed was we thought a fair number was 3.5 based
on based on the usage since they put in the meter right and our biggest risk in all of this bill back me up on this or correct me if I'm wrong is they would have the strongest case based on case law I should just get my JD I could do this
thing based on case law that once they put in that meter that's where they had the strongest case because they basically said Rosal Park this is a problem we can prove it a problem now right so we put that number at 3 right they weren't budging down to 3.5 but if we were to go from when that
meter would have been it is 3.5 right so four is a shade over that but the the calculation was actually 3.5 okay mayor could I just add in just just for both the public and the governing body just to be clear the going in position when we you you know when we decided to start
to negotiate a settlement the going in position of the burrow was Zero correct sorry going the going step before the going in position was look you want us off the system system that's fine we don't really feel like we owe you anything in AAR that was not palatable to effectuate a settlement another and
it was not deemed probably you know legally uh defensible defensible in a in a court if you were not going to reach a settlement so the going in position just to be clear was we don't owe you anything we owe you zero and one other thing and when we do the town hall we should have the engineers here too but
one other thing kind of related but somewhat unrelated they were actually also uh they had a flow rate for us which we disagreed with so um we did an analysis based on our Engineers saying like hold up the flows that you're estimating from
Rosell Park are way too much so we another thing that we were able to cut in half was I think they wanted like whatever we're paying right now in flows they want to double that right so another piece of negotiating we had to rig them roll through right the amount that was going in they were saying was
way more than what our Engineers actually yeah we calculated yeah go ahead I have a quick question can you just describe um because once we found out about it it was a closed session and then it just seemed like we blinked and it was I think the next uh
session we were uh able to speak about it and the town found out can you go into a little bit and let the town know really what the legal aspect is of that like why we have to be confidential when we found out how that's all you know because I understand um the public
obviously we represent everyone everyone is upset and rightfully so um but it's I just want to make it clear we didn't sit here behind the scenes doing something that we kept it under wraps can you please just explain a
little bit I'm attorney to your right as the the man who yeah the easiest way to explain that is it would be like if we were playing cards against Elizabeth but we had to show them our cards right but they don't show you yours so you're doing a negotiation and you it's it's
virtually impossible if it's would be crazy to sit here and have an open conversation oh you want to pay him 2 million or 3 million they would know that right and then you would go into court and they' like no you said something else right so so the law Pro
provides for that understanding to say there are the ability for a council to meet in private close session to have open and free exchange of ideas without the fear
of you know worrying about public or the other side no and so that process can get you to a conclusion right um once that's done all that is back open on the table again uh but that's really the purpose of it it's not to keep the public out of it it's really to protect
your public your citizens of Rosel to allow you to bargain and negot Rosel Park sorry um to to bargain negotiate from a stronger position so it's to your benefit it's to the resident's benefit I I understand that I just wanted the
public to understand because it was there was talk out there that it was you know all other aspects of the lawsuit are are public right the complaint was public uh our answer was public court filings are public things that set in court are in public right the public has free access to that reporters report on
it and things of that nature absolutely the terms of a settlement or the discussion about whether or not to settle litigation strategy what experts to hire how to approach a case communication communication you need to have that not be discoverable to the
other side thank you now's your time Council anything else J do you have another one I have one no just um I'm happy to hear about the special town meeting yep Town Hall that's a great thing the transparency for the public I think is is absolutely vital and that's all I want to mention
cool thank you okay uh who who came out with the 11 years was uh we did yeah I mean yeah honestly it was just based on they had a I think they originally asked for they were to their credit amenable
to a payment program because they know we're a smaller municipality I believe they had us on a seven or eighty year payment program and then uh you know oh you're talk I'm sorry you're talking about the payment program yes yeah that that was something we negotiated that we could live with I thought you meant I I
was hearing different numbers I thought you meant the time to get off yeah I could just and again I think it's I think it's important to understand that all this was you know it's a it's a totality of negotiations right so for the public and the governing body as a reminder so we went in with the lowest
payment possible over the longest period of time right so uh and I obviously want the highest amount of you know the most amount of money over the shortest period of time because they want their money right away so this was kind of like a melding of all of the negotiations
a where I think we probably got to the4 million first and we nailed down the term after they wanted a little bit on on the time period yeah and we got a little bit more I think there their second after we made an offer of a
monetary offer they came back with an astronomical number over three years or four years I mean it was you know unheard of so it was kind of a negotiating you know what can we live with and push back to make it a little bit longer and this goes back to this goes back to
Rosanna your question to an extent is you know even if we were able to which I I think we did touch on because we talked about this in closed session Q4 of last year like we talked about you know in a in a macro level there's a there's a lawsuit hanging over it's it's
on the agenda right potential litigation um part of why we couldn't communicate this is because we didn't know the number right like we were communicate we were negotiating this till the last minute so um you know that that 11year
payment up from I think it was eight was what we had at the moment or at like a week before we adopted or settled we had it at 8 and then later that week we got it to 11 right so it was very very fluid as if you've ever been in a lawsuit you know negotiations can be right or
settlement so any any uh any other questions from Council okay thank you just stick around for public comment in case somebody else thumbs up about this thank you thanks okay uh all right so with that uh we'll
do what's up Council reports yeah Council reports yeah I got it uh okay uh councilman signo you want to start I have nothing to report last two weeks just uh uh so I'll just say be vigilant with this heat right all you
know stay hydrated you're going to the graduation high school graduation bring a bottle of water wear light colored clothes like your mother told you other than that be safe have a good weekend end of my report uh councilman
patoski thank you mayor U first of all I want to send my condolences out to uh John Gonzalez family John was a 1974 graduate of Rosal Park High School um he excelled in uh wrestling and football uh
also uh John dou Jenkins who was a fixure in this town if you grew up in uh uh in when I grew up um dou was always at the uh parking lot directing traffic and everything and uh
um like I said he was always around he hung at Charlie's uh store and um you know so uh said I uh I haven't seen him in a couple years because he was in a home for the last uh
probably 20 years so um my condolences go out on a personal note I uh my daughter's dog Maddie uh we had to put to sleep yesterday um again like the old saying is uh dogs are like family and they are
it um you know I uh I know when I used to go visit my daughter uh he used to be so excited to see me so uh um he will definitely I mean she'll definitely be me uh Miss uh June 7th I uh I worked the Feast of
St Anthony's uh at the beer tent uh I'm glad they had four good days of uh weather and um I actually seen Rosanna there yeah it was good um so uh on the eth was the pride flag and raising ceremony at the
library um on the 12th was the recreation meeting basic they're getting ready for next year um and everything there won't be a meeting until uh September unless uh emergency comes up
on the 15th I attended the jth uh celebration um on the 17 I attended the Historical Society meeting um again they won't be meeting in July and August so today I was at the uh Joint Sewer
meeting uh we upgraded and uh voted to replace an elevator which was installed in 1970 uh they couldn't get any more parts for this elevator so they needed to uh uh get a new elevator and we also uh
voted on repairing the gear boxes um at the Joint sore uh to let everyone know for the month of July Duncan donors on 47 West Westfield Avenue will be the business of the month um if you need to contact me
you get me at J Petroski at Rosal park.net 908 666 7821 that's my report mayor thank you thank you councilman councilwoman Lions good evening everyone residents mayor council happy summer uh
it's officially here um I also attended as you said the S St Anthony Feast uh played a few games there was great music and food so I I love seeing everybody out um I also attended the juneth uh celebration and it was just just that's
an awesome celebration uh to be out for and um it was it was a beautiful night to do so uh yesterday I went to a library meeting um and I am here to actually announce that they are having a summer reading program they do have
prizes and treats I also want to thank councilman Jay for the Dairy Queen treats that uh you uh get for them each year I appreciate that um and so if you know uh a child that's in school um they
really books and badges well no I'm sorry that's something else but definitely go out they have something for everyone they have um just donations uh from people that are just literally waiting for you to come and grab it's
it's awesome some awesome prizes there so um if you go on to their website or reach out to them 98245 2456 also an announcement um coming up uh July 1st is our fireworks so please
definitely come out for that that's going to be a fun fun night there's going to be food trucks uh if you guys know the pizza truck that I brought around last year they're going to be there so I'm just plugging them in um they're really great um also the Rosal Park walking Club started last week I
did start a couple days um with some of the ladies so we will be resuming and going out definitely in July and also at the gazebo open mic is coming back to Rosal Park we had some awesome talent
show up and out of that we actually have two of the young girls they are singing at the events we also have a karaoke team that's actually a business in town that actually came out from that um and is building and I see them around so
they're awesome they're called play um so we definitely want to draw a crowd if you don't sing come out with a lawn chair hang out bring snacks we be there it was awesome the community gets together it's every Wednesday through July we want your support we want you
out there so please come out to that thank you that's my report thank you councilwoman Council Mel good evening the Independence Day firework will be July 1st starting at 5:00 p.m. just a reminder the municipal
land use board meeting for new class 5 retail cannabis sale at 1 West Westville Avenue uh will be on Monday 24th at 7:00 p.m. at the Bor Hall lastly uh thank you asyc for the thank
you cards uh or letters and that's all I have so have a good night and cap pel at Roso park. night thank you thank you councilman councilman rabina thank you mayor good evening Roso Park on infrastructure in the Fifth Ward
if you noticed no parking signs on West kfax over the past few days this was related to an emergency call by the Rosell Park School District to American Water regarding Water Service to the hershaw athletic complex Fieldhouse which encompasses the complex's bathrooms after discovering this week there was no water to the Fieldhouse
according to our business administrator American Water went out to evaluate and found the disconnection at the meter and subsequently found the service line to be made of galvanized steel per new state law galvanized steel is no longer allowed to be used in the state to convey water in order to make sure the bathrooms are operational for the
upcoming rphs commencement certain Construction work was conducted today to reconnect the water meter with the main using acceptable materials excavation was limited to one small patch in the street and one small patch behind the curb near the chain link fence by the Fieldhouse and note
the water company understands that they are obligated to come back and conduct an infrared patch of the area that they excavated as we all try to keep cool on this first day of summer happy to announce that we've partnered with the township of Clark to extend reduced cost family memberships at the Clark pool a
rate of $555 is being extended to Rosel Park families for 2024 same rate extended to our neighbors in Garwood visit Clark poool website and under membership click on family Garwood 2024 for this special rate neighboring
communities are charging between $775 to $900 for non-resident families so I appreciate Clark providing Rosel Park residences continued courtesy and I'm happy to host in conjunction with the Rosell Park fire department our third annual community cool down sessions coming up July every Tuesday Tuesday
with the exception July 2nd it'll be 6:30 to 7:30 at wolfield across from the high school at 180 West Webster Avenue bring the family and beat the heat during rpfd pump and water hose trills last year I co-sponsored family swim night at Orange a pool in Cranford
and due to its success the burough has agreed to fully fund it this year and give back a family fund night to its residents so looking forward to making this another successful year big thanks to the burrow save the date August 7th checkin is at 8:00 pm but please feel free to get there by 7:30 the flyer and
signup sheet is already posted on the Burrow's Facebook site this evening registration is ongoing until August 5th please be sure to sign up and note no walk-ins will be allowed in addition to organizing bike clinics bike pedestrian safety events in our schools public safety sessions and
listening sessions as well as advocating for the recent chili cookoff benefiting our middle and high school students I take pride in initiating and leading various Community initiatives over these last three years and to these include our cooldowns swim nights and the collaboration with Clark and Cranford
pools my primary motivation for becoming involved was to affect positive change and enhance Community through building relationships and Partnerships this includes alliances with entities such as the greater Union Township Chamber of Commerce uni County through the kids dig
in Grant and our neighboring communities securing grants for trail creation and funding essential equipment for our First Responders has also been a priority matter of fact I found the grant for our Volunteer Fire Department through NJ American Water last week that we just submitted the application today to purchase three natural gas leak
detectors for the fire department to replace dated equipment currently being used and I pride myself on my accountability accessibility followup and follow through for my constituents before this Administration I observed a lack of Youth activities in our area and a business community that
wasn't thriving as it should concerns I sought to address and shared by many of my colleagues within a short span our Administration has responded with a multitude of programs especially for our seniors and families the library underwent a comprehensive renovation and a recreation program led by director
reer offers a diverse range of sports and activities tailored to our Burrow's needs under the guidance of director Shaw our community center has flourished into a hub that not only promotes health and safety through exercise classes and informational sessions but also Fosters
Community G engagement through games meals and day trips for seniors and residents alike none of these achievements would have been possible without the unwavering support of my colleagues to whom I extend my sincere gratitude for endorsing my initiatives and contributions to our community regarding infrastructure I'm
also pleased to report significant progress with approximately 70% of our bur resurfaced and over 92% of the fifth w m and paved a testment to our commitment to enhancing our community further Investments are underway including the rehabilitation of parks open spaces and our train station
promising continued growth and Improvement for all residents on June 14th I convened with the special Council to discuss recent historical documentation which was discussed this evening I maintained confidence in our mayor and the administration to uphold ethical practices prioritize the concerns of our
constituents and navigate these difficult decisions judiciously also on the 14th I participated in a meeting of the New Jersey Trails Action Network focusing on grants and advocacy efforts aimed at developing trails and Greenways my commitment to this cause predates my
tenure on this dayis the adage that state government moves slowly holds true but as they say Rome wasn't built in a day I persist in ensuring our initiatives remain at the Forefront closing out that day I attended the cegs end of year celebration at the sensory
friendly playground at loretti Park thank you to my wife and ceg co-leader Jackie Garcia and co-leader Katie McDermot Miss Gil Gallen and the Board of Education members who came out to support and continue to support the 20% of our total student population with different abilities it was great to see
so many children using the play and exploring the raised beds still waiting for the fresh Mulch and weed didn't to get done but I'm confident it'll happen soon additionally on the 15th I had the privilege of attending the juneth event at myy Park this noteworthy occasion provided invaluable education and
historical perspective for which I extend my gratitude to councilman Johnson and the diversity inclusion committee it's so bring to reflect that just 160 years ago in this land of opportunity many endured inhumane treatment and were denied their freedom and rights the Civil War a tragic
chapter in our nation's history serves as a reminder of our collective learning growth and resilience in the coming weeks I look forward to seeing a mural that will Grace the S side of Sunrise document Solutions in the Fifth Ward marking a welcoming entry into Rosal park for travelers draining West to East along
what will soon be the raway valley rail trail and as summer unfolds let us cherish both the small and significant aspects of life such as family time and health which are precious yet un certain may this summer commence with the creation of new indelible memories in
the company of cherished loved ones want to say thank you to Robert Tommy grella Danny from the asyc for the cards thank you very much fifth W I can be reached to J rabine Rosel park.net 862
23619 mayor Rosel Park that concludes my report right out in time thank you counsilman uh okay I have no report um mayor signell at Rosal park.net if you have any questions uh public portion may I have a motion to open the public portion on any subject
so move second all in favor hi hi they wish can come up and speak may do so now you look happy oh I'm Frank Tesa 479 Ragin drive time for another haircut I know it's getting long I appreciate that thank you though I put some gel in it for you though no you didn't come on you
woke up councilman I apologize to you privately I'm going to apologize to you publicly I went past the park at the wrong time thank you very much for your efforts I appreciate it I'm a former law enforcement
officer and I'm a little passionate about these things okay I appreciate your pass thank you thank you okay first of all how are you I'm okay okay little tired I'm going to defend you today oh it feels good uh but I might run out of time I do no you'll get extra
Oh I thought you'd say that I'm just kidding I first thank you all for repealing that ridiculous statue in case you don't know it I spearheaded the resistance against that it was ridiculous we listen sometimes no you
don't I listen to this one no you listen to everybody else why I prompted to come here he could talk to me councilman at large I tried to tell you about that statue you wouldn't listen to me you threw a hissy fit you threw your
arms up in the air you turned your back on me and you pretty much called me a liar research things research look his parents might have been great people so may have alab bones I don't know okay now my question is is that correct uh is
what correct uh never mind my question is the $150,000 yes I hope that's going to rway Valley I understand it's not private business business yep but when I did a budget if I didn't use the money I moved it elsewhere without any problem yep I'm
assuming you all have to take a vote yeah so just real quick and is there any other questions or can I I got more but go ahead don't let me run out of time just super quick on that that's capital budget so we need to spend it on something like a like roads or so potentially it could go to that I
understand okay you always look very professional thank you thank you councilwoman don't ever tell me to calm down don't ever tell anyone to calm down that's the first thing you're taught in a Business Administration Management
course don't ever do that again please I'm Italian I got a big mouth when did I tell you you should know that last meeting well the meeting I missed oh yes you did don't do that again to anyone okay please I have a
problem with my sore tax bill yes all right $1,600 I don't use that kind of water yes Trump Tower doesn't use that kind of water got gold toilets there ah they got gold mine aren't gold they
porcelain now I do have a sprinkler system yes that water does not go into the soore system yes it goes into the ground now if you're and I'm saying you're but I'm generalizing sure if if you're putting if if you're you're
calculating this on total consumption I already pay for that water it's illegal to charge me twice correct counselor not necessarily oh baloney charge for sewage it doesn't go in a soore it goes in the ground but uh just just to let you know
I I hear you and I think something worth looking at like other towns do uh would be to potentially base it off of winter months right where that's more accurate of that might be more reasonable okay I don't mind paying for what I have to pay for sure I'm not complaining about that
yep I'm just saying there are many people in the buau who have sprinkler systems that water does not go into the sore it goes into the ground and just real quick we we haven't really had to Grapple with this because we haven't changed the rate in 13 years better
we're going we're going to so I I think that makes sense we had that suggestion unfortunately I got to cut you off after this but I do hear you and I do agree with you I think it makes sense to look at the rates like Cranford they look at the I think just for the winter months wait a minute now I got to reclaim time cuz he talking to me I can't I can't do
that I got to defend you I I appreciate that I I got I got to be fair to everybody but I appreciate you today uh your hair looks good today what's that your hair looks good today it always does thank you sir take a lesson I appreciate it all right thank you have a
good night you always look professional thank you you represent this burrow very very well he does he's a good guy he is there we go here we go Andrew Round of Applause and I'm sorry I apologize again okay it's okay don't ever tell me to calm down all right all right all right
next next up that's okay there's time they'll come up don't worry good evening everyone I am Deborah Salters yep I have spent many years just address for the record oh oh I'm sorry uh 263 Rich Street um from York New Jersey okay yep I've spent many
years in Rosel Park and Rosel I've driven for the school bus company out here and uh before it became so beautiful i' I've been a many years oh wow just getting compliments left and right feels good all right and um and I also love the way that you all do
business it makes sense right um i' I've been to many county meetings a city meetings as well as my own and this it feels good it makes sense you don't see the chaos behind the scenes but I appreciate that absolutely but I love how you answer and not that they would
give you much choice not to but I I love the questions and the interaction so I'm here because I am running for the district 10 seat vacant by Donald pay got it okay and I think it's disrespectful for people to put their names out and they don't engage with the
people I'm on the I'm on the streets all the time in every city um they call me warrior for the people CU I'm fighting for everything affordable housing our our jobs everything you know so um when people have a need they call me it's something my mother did I wasn't trying to do but it grabbed me by the ankle and
it's just what I do called to it so I'm here to introduce myself um and let you know that I'm not a stranger to your town um but um I I love what you have done here and I love the way that you interact with the residents you know um
and you take what is said by the gentleman here I love his tenacity and force and you don't take it personally understand what you know what the job is so I I I do want to commend that because it's not everywhere you know um and you answer questions and I love how you and
and this was just something seeing how you are very transparent about what you put in the actual agenda so that's it I am Deborah Salters I am running for the vacant seat for district 10 um in your county Union County I am 5e and I'm all about the people and all
about the business cuz the business makes sense thank you for putting the people first very nice to meet you thank you and just it's a good PSA while we're here so Andrew when's the special election this July 16th got it so and just to add a bonus so we have early voting this year right we have an early
we have an early voting location at the Cassano Center starting on Friday before and it'll be Friday Saturday Sunday closed Monday open on Tuesday you just gave that to a republican candidate but it's all good hey could vote for you in
the general I guess um yeah so just uh everybody uh we've had early voting in the U in the US in New Jersey for a while now uh I've been advocating to get an early voting site in Rosal Park uh they're I don't know where they are countywide but the closest one used to be Union County
College and the amoi center in Rosel uh Board of Elections was the Board of Elections that does it was gracious enough to give us an early voting location in Rosell Park uh so I hope you guys use that in the Cassano Center yes Mr woodriff yeah Mr 134 Bender Avenue Rell
Park uh good evening folks just a brief comment that this is not really a contest we are solely interested really in what is good for Rosell park it seems that what is lacking is a real
dialogue your constituents are looking for transfer and looking for nothing more had nothing to do with politics and solely trying to get trying to establish what is best for
the town for the residents and for the business Community as well I don't really believe that folks really give a WAP whether you're a Democrat Republican or an independent I do have I do have some comments though
relation to our fiscal situation recently there was an ordance passed wherein the town were going to receive from octagon Edge Towers $1 million
yes our recent budget balance sheet at the end of the year showed a surplus of 3.4 million yes our budget this year indicates a $2 billion Surplus but 11% of our
budget is taken up by Debt Service only 2.2 million that's okay on debt right now of roughly roughly 16.3 million which is a significant increase
now we have to pay from last year somehow by ordinance 2776 the gross appropriation for roughly 3. million and additional Bond debt of
1.6 somehow those numbers do not articulate with what appears to be the financial situation and money's available to the town at the year end the bance sheet indicated 6.9 million 6.7 million in
cash and investment but they were appear appears to be a definite lack of nominal amount of interest earned on that money that was sitting there this also tends to
be it seems to we are comparing apples and oranges and is unclear what these sore fees are actually going since the budget sets forth 490,000 for the rway valley
$889,000 to the Joint meeting and the city with Elizabeth per agreement would get 800,000 and also those or your own figures show a $600,000 dedicated Surplus for S
utility I do have one or two suggestions though that you might consider and I think the town folks might be willing to go along with it perhaps we could expand our rec our recycling program because our fees and costs are direct definely
related to the amount of storage and garbage we dispose of so if we're able to recycle more our fees will go down and I think our town folks would be appreciative of having to pay less monies there's also a reserve for
uncollected taxes of over a million dollars perhaps those Rees could be added for our use it would also seem to be helpful to include the recreational trust activities as part of the budget since
this involves substantial monies and not everybody sits and watches the website for these reports uh unfortunately mil I got to cut you off but I'm I'm happy to just respond to a couple of those things um so just I be I'll keep it really brief I
what to come on Joe and then you you can on the floor am I'm credulous that we have a Canabis site here which handles hazardous substance with no apparent oversight by us and they are handling
a hazardous substance and has been established as such by the federal government yeah by the FDA I really I really I realize I realize that is a private business but quite frankly we have no oversight at all to ensure that
they are complying with the requirements for potency for people that are using it okay yeah I really got to cut you off but just really quickly on recycling so I love recycling I was taught to recycle it at very early age unfortunately
recycling is actually one of the most expensive things in our line items right now um in during the pandemic basically without going into the full Spiel China stopped accepting a lot of our recycling we used to make money off recycling we know longer do that we have to pay um per per pound but it's it's not what it
used to be kenon it's gone up by a f it's probably almost doubled at this point since 2021 ballpark ballpark yes yeah um on the uncollected uh taxes I I just I'll defer to Ken I mean I think that's part for the course probably state standard of what you're using for
calculation there the reserve for uncollected taxes is a state calculation uh formula that is needed the burrow has to pay the county and the Board of Education 100% of the taxes uh that they're owed whether we collect it or not right so that calculation is to
ensure that we have proper cash flow to make those payments that's what it is so when we talk about it every year we do say for those people that do not pay their taxes on time it does penalize everybody else well I'm impressed with the fact and just I'm sorry mil I gotta cut you off but and just the last thing
I'll mention is on the Octo on Tower sale so unfortunately that was negotiated after we had set a budget this here and too late we the state mandates we set a budget by a certain time uh those are monies that we can use to lower taxes or we could put to the
Sewer fund like we could do a million things with those but that's will be used uh to try and lower uh but quite fr the burden on either end I'm sorry I can't it's not back and forth anymore I really I hate to cut you off but I really got to be string about this it seems a little Rich ridiculous though
and we're having deficit financing when we already have 16 million dollar that we owe thank you with money sting around thank you uh would anybody else like to come up Patricia almea for F3 Colonial Road okay
um last meeting you told me last meeting you guys mentioned where I was during the Cannabis vote first of all I had no idea that these meetings existed like me no one knew that these uh dispensaries were going up for vote
until they uh notified me that they were going to put one in front of my house okay I have a question who's the one that represents us for Colonial Road Ragland and Bender Avenue that would be the first word councilman CG
Johnson he's not here right because I had a question for him why didn't he let us know what they were planning on doing why didn't you mention anything about the dispens I'm Bender like you did with the one on
Wills Fargo so I canot how you told everyone to come to the meeting y so I cannot I cannot speak for councilman Johnson but what I can say is I announced this one because the people told me that they want more transparency around it and I cannot undo what I did in the past but I wanted to improve
going forward and announce the ones going forward that's why we want transparency we've been able to we like to we'd like to know the moment they resubmit their application uh so that we
can all be informed not just let three people know because that's what you did last time assuming they do reapply which is a question we do not know we they'll reapply right now it's still in the hands of a judge um I will do the same like I did with Chestnut Street and I
will put it on my Facebook page thank thank you for that especially our neighborhood now I see that a lot of peopleon Road colon colonial Road Regan Regan Colonial Road
there's no signs saying that it's one way well we should we can fix that that's something if you don't see any signs we can fix that that's a separate topic but we're happy to address that Andrew if you can take note of that and the people coming from Regan is going the other day almost somebody HD me HD
my car we will take care of that immediately that has nothing I mean as children around and we don't know we know we don't expect the car coming from the other side I will have the police go out tomorrow and look for missing signage and we will address that okay thank you yep very welcome good
job sticking around yeah go for it all right George Ramirez 500 East Clay uh so again pertaining to the Sewer did you guys have the newspaper articles before you settled on this case okay he's one of the attor he's one
of the attorneys at uh ask question yeah go sure can you hear me yeah we did not have all the newspaper articles you didn't have the newspaper articles so you made a decision without having all of the information at hand I would not answer that to the affirmative we we did not make a decision with not having the information we did not have the
newspaper articles we had from my understanding Rosel Park put the drainage pipe going into the Elora section of Elizabeth correct from Rosel park into Elizabeth
yes that's that who connected that pipe we have no idea who connected into that pipe was that Elizabeth we don't know well it's in Elizabeth territory correct before it was draining out to a ravine who connected the end of
that opening to a pipe we don't know where is that where was that pipe connected to to the Elizabeth system yes which means we had our pipe there first then Elizabeth came and connected into
that pipe because flooding was occurring around the Elora section correct corre you can't make that assumption yeah okay all we know is that rosell's system was connect R I'm sorry Rosel Park system
was connected into Elizabeth we have no idea who made that connection Howards was there first again you can't make that assumption well there's no connection it was in going out into open air you're talking about 1900s correct correct so there no there is no your
your basein that on your interpretation of news articles from over a hundred years okay I know you're trying to drag on the time but I'm not trying so let me reclaim my time so the pipe is
discharging openly into a ravine on the Amora section of Elizabeth based on the articles that was happening and I'm sure I could find diagrams and maps and all of that if somebody looked into deeper we did based on that now second third question doesn't Elizabeth have the
burden of proof that we did something wrong in a lawsuit no Elizabeth has the burden of proof to prove that we were using their system we were draining into their system which would uh as a lawyer I could tell you would have been as easy as Cas we might be draining into our
into their system without correct we might be draining into their system but that might be because they connected our system into theirs correct you said maybe that yes but we are we are using their system without compensating them
but that may be because they connected our system into theirs they made the choice to connect into that system and and that would have been irrelevant based on the passage of time and the fact that we were getting a benefit so if they chose to connect into our system
how are we in the wrong for this because we're using their system which they chose they knew in order to mitigate the flooding that was occurring in the area they said you know what let's take on this system so and we can you're assuming that sir Council just so well
it's logic and if by going by the Articles so have you read the articles I have every okay so going by the Articles that's what it says so the problem with that is the other assumption is that Elizabeth then if they connected to use
your story yes they could disconnect tomorrow okay then where would our storm water go well that's going to have to be you think they're that any court of law is going to say okay yeah connect tomorrow and then boom just connected and that's it no there's got to be you think the court of law is going to say you get to
freely continue to collect connect and have someone else P don't we have to disconnect anyway we have to disconnect anyway we have to build a $20 million never like when I try to answer a question We R do George sorry thumbs up thank you yeah I mean I just look I'll reiterate a
lot of these are hypotheticals that we do not know we do not have the proper documentation but once again a judge could have flown in our face and said yep you have to pay $40 million which is why we settled right um
anybody else want to come up to speak I am seeing no one may have a motion to close the public portion on agenda items or uh public portion so move second uh all in favor I I okay may I have a motion to adjourn so move
second all in favor I thank you everybody