Hi everyone. >> Have a little >> Yeah. >> Anybody been skiing? >> Yeah, I broke some trail today. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. I did the loop. I went out to the loop. You know when you go past the little
lumber yard, you go by the gate. When I got up to the lumber yard, nobody had broken the trail, so I broke it all the way up towards Brushy. >> Did you do the lollipop? >> Yeah, that's it. The lollipop. Yeah. Um I was pretty exhausted when I got back. >> Good.
>> But it's broken. You're welcome. >> Thank you. I did the other kind of ski. >> Oh, the easy kind. >> The kind that doesn't involve you being exhausted at the end of the day.
>> No, I have not done that in years. >> So, Molly's coming, right? >> Yeah, I think so. Jim did um email me or maybe he emailed everyone. He's he's out tonight, but I'll give Molly another minute.
All right. Well, maybe we'll just get started. I'll call the finan to order at 6:31. Let's see. I think this is set to automatically record, I believe. >> And don't forget the um the AI minutes,
too. >> Yeah. Uh let's see. I think it I think I set it to automatically. >> Yeah. >> I generally don't need it, but it can be helpful.
>> Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Um so first order of business is to review the um proposed FY27 budget for the police department. And we have our acting chief Devin.
>> Is it Pellet? >> He's not acting anymore. >> That's right. Official, right? >> Congratulations. >> Thank you. our official police chief, uh, Devin Pelletire. Um, Chief, thanks for joining us. I'm going to pull up
your, um, a budget you prepared, which I think is going to be a lot more straightforward than last year's. I know police budget last year was
complicated discussion. Let's see. I may have made a fix to it. I'm not >> Okay. So, you can um you can alert me to that as we walk through it. >> Yeah. >> Um
>> and I'll make the changes like in real time uh on my document here. So, okay. So, first of all, just let me know does this look like the >> Yeah. I know there's >> the um for fiscal 27 budget amount for
chief salary that's going to be 84412. >> All right. 84412. Okay. Because now obviously that was a placeholder that was in there before. So I'm assuming this is the uh >> this is the exact amount in the in the contract. Yep.
>> For fiscal 27. Yeah. Yeah. Um, >> and the only other thing that changed is for operating, uh, I would like to bring it to 25. >> Okay. Okay.
>> So, that doesn't change the formula at the bottom, does it? >> Yeah. I think this is not set to. So, let's do that. Is that the total you have on your end, Devin? 274 618. >> Yes.
>> Got it. Good. Okay. Um, just a quick question on the holiday pay. Is this the because I I've got a note here that this was a placeholder. Is that Are we sticking with that amount for now? >> Yeah. I mean, you know, it
contractually, um, I don't expect that, uh, it will be that amount. I'm just not sure what amount to put in there. I expect it to be less. >> Okay. >> I'm just unsure of really what we should
have in there. >> Okay. Can you um I'm trying to wrap my brain around this. I knew I I know I knew the answer to this at one point, but can you um remind us what that budget line um
refers to? Is that holiday pay for um the entire staff or is that for particular? >> It's just for the chief. Um I believe >> Yeah, because uh holidays aren't worked
into the contract. So essentially um it would be pay on top of your normal salary to work a holiday but also contractually um you can use that time for time off. Uh so so yeah I the as far
as any holiday time that's for officers that's absorbed under the police officer wages line. So I believe it's just reserved for the chief. >> So this is just for the chief. And just just so I'm clear because it's it's helpful to have have a clear understanding of what this this
represents. So this is compensation for any holidays that you end up working or you can also utilize this budget for
um sort of flex time that that that kind of a thing or >> Yeah. So, so in if I worked the holiday, um, I'd get compensated from that budget, but in lie of getting financially compensated, I'd have the option to to take the time.
>> I wouldn't come out of that budget. >> Okay. Got it. Okay. Thank you for um for clarifying. Okay. So, um I think this is the first time you've joined us for one of these reviews. So, um really
appreciate you taking the time. Um and basically what we typically do here is ask the department head to kind of walk us through um the budget kind of line by line and just give us a kind of brief
explanation of particularly if there are any uh changes that um from from the previous year's budgeted amount and that that can be in the positive or negative ction. Um, so,
uh, you know, some of this is going to be very straightforward, so it's not like we need a long comprehensive explanation, but just it's helpful for us to kind of walk through your thinking and rationale for for each of these these amounts. So, um, would
you like to kind of get this started by just I guess going from top to bottom here? >> Yeah, absolutely. Um, you know, I think we we talked about the chief's salary. That's, you know, contractual. Um, and and the holiday pay that that's a placeholder. It's kind of arbitrary. Um,
I really just use the fiscal uh 26 amount >> because I'm not sure what to put in there to be honest with you. Um, as far as officer wages, I I took a deep dive into that. Um and one you know cuz the contract there'll
be an additional 3% raise for the officers. Um but we should well we will be able to stay within that number. So that that wouldn't have to increase uh for fiscal 27. Um then we're into a new contract. So, who
knows what for fiscal uh 28, but it'll be tight. Uh but it's it's very doable uh to to meet that that number uh or underneath it and still leave leave a little bit of wiggle room for emergencies um you know, forced overtime
for for different things, arrests, etc. Um, then in longevity bonuses, we don't have anybody eligible this year uh for longevity bonuses, so that's not an issue. I see Susie has her hand raised. >> Susie,
>> when you're doing um officer wages, um what is the staffing model? How many people are you um intending or or do you see in the in the department for this FY27? Thank you for that question. Um, so
essentially we we have the two full-time positions coming out of that category. Um, and then part-time positions. Uh, I it's increasingly harder to find part-time personnel. Um and when we do,
uh it's tough because it's expensive, um to, you know, equip them with the proper uniforms and maintain training and everything else. Now, there there's occasions with our our most recent part-timer, uh Jill, where uh Jill Bankraftoft, Officer Bankfra, where it
works, uh great because she works for another neighboring town. So, she has a lot of she has all the basically all the equipment. um and just needs a few things. Um and her training is done through New Salem, so that's not an
expense on us. Um I would say that's not the norm. Um we do need another full-time personnel, uh full-time officer. So, so essentially you're really looking at two full-time uh
positions coming out of that salary line and then still having some room uh for emergency overtime. Um you know, different events where we have uh uh every officer working like Halloween. Um and
you know, I I don't anticipate being able to keep a large part-time staff. um you know it would be I you know if you know I'd only hire a part-timer if it's ideal for the department and ideal for the town coverage wise. Um so what I
see is it at least within fiscal 27 is really focusing on getting that uh full-time position filled for that. So, it'd be essentially two part- timerrs and I'd say a max of or two full-timers, sorry, and probably a max of two part-
timerrs. >> So, are you thinking that this line won't cover that third full-timer when you um when you hire? No, we we don't have a third time or a
third full-time position uh because we haven't been able to fill a full-time position because my salary is also been coming out of the police officer wages. But now that I'm into a salaried position, we can hire another full-time
officer. Um so essentially with me and uh two other officers, >> okay, >> is is how that how it works. So we were kind of stuck with with two two people because we weren't able to utilize the the salary line. Um so that we will be
able to stay within that with hiring another full-timer. >> Okay, I get it now. >> Great. Thank you. >> Um and yeah, so longevity bonuses not uh we don't have any eligibility this year. um
operating um it's getting everything's getting increasingly expensive. uh you know I was looking at you know I've gone over the last 3 years of um of our budget of the ledgers and you know just
for subscription fees alone uh whether that's uh sis which is criminal uh justice information is required um our IMC platform which is our report and everything which is required um what
else there's many things um um the AT&T for our wireless internets, we're almost at $10,000 just with just with subscription costs with with that. Um additionally,
you know, with the body cameras, uh that added another $4,000 a year. Um that's going to be essentially we have the option in three years. I think it's it's a good option to get uh new cameras and
sign another three-year contract, which would not and it wouldn't increase it. It would just lock us in for another three years at that $4,000. and thinking long term that that's the best option because the position we ended up in before was we had body
cameras that got outdated and the software got outdated and then we ended up in this position where we had to re completely reestablish a body camera program. Um so I'd like to prevent from
doing that again. Um, I I think that staying with the same company has benefits. Uh, there it's a good camera and we could run it till the last till the end of five years. Um, and then just pay the licensing fees, but ultimately
with the way technology is, you know, the cameras aren't going to be supported anymore and that's that's generally what happens. Um the additionally with hiring that new full-time officer, we have to equip that new full-time
officer. Um bulletproof vests are a big thing. Uh you know, they're about $1,200 a piece. Um they expire every five years. U mine mine's about to expire. Um Officer Magguiires is about to expire.
So we have replacement costs on them. um you know, equipment in general. There's there's uniform equipment allowances within our uh within the union contract that um you know, we need to be able to fulfill having decent equipment for the
officers so that they can do their jobs. Um and yeah, and essentially, you know, hiring another full-timer is is a is a big expense. Uh and then you look at training and everything, too. So, I
think in order to keep up with the times, you know, we have to be able to have that be able to buy the equipment that we need and and do the training that we need. Um, as far as cruiser
maintenance, I plan on reducing our fleet. Uh, currently we have four cruisers. Um, I don't believe we have a need for four cruisers. uh you know, one of them is not really patrol.
I I it's inspected and everything, but it doesn't have a computer. Um it has some issues that I don't think are cost effective to fix. So ultimately, and I don't have a time frame on it yet because I'm running a costbenefit
analysis on whether auctioning it is is the way to go. Um, if I auction it, um, I'd like to put the money for that in an account for a new cruiser down the line.
Um, however, it may not be beneficial because if there's only a small amount of money to be made, I also have to spend money to get that cruiser stripped of our decals, um, the radio taken out, all the equipment taken out. So, that's something I'm actively looking into. Um,
as far as the budget line, $6,000 is a good amount to maintain three cruisers. It's not a good amount to maintain four. Uh, you know, you're looking at tires, extremely expensive. Um, brakes, everything. Our cruisers have been
really well taken care of under under my leadership. Uh, it's something I'm serious about. Uh, they're all inspected. They're all had recent on oil changes. Um, I make sure that we're sticking with the same company because that was a short uh kind of a shortfall
in the in in the past where we were with a lot of different companies. Um, so I really want to keep those maintained uh because they're they're driven, you know, they're used frequently, so the better you maintain them, the the more
they'll last. Um, it's tough to make them last anyway because they are utilized quite a bit. Um, and you know, mileage, I don't want to get too far into the weeds, but mileage, um, opposed to engine hours is a big deal with
police vehicles, and police vehicles have an exorbitant amount of engine hours compared to mileage because they're always running, idling when we're doing traffic and and that. Um, community policing, I'd like to keep that the same. Uh, I'm looking forward
to some new programs. Uh we did the community giving tree which didn't actually cost any money um out of community policing which was great. Um however uh we have a uh I want to do a female self-defense class. Um it's been in the
works. Uh so I I have money budgeted for that. I just have to we have the instructor. I just have to set the date uh and get that out. So that's that's a very helpful line to do some good events with. Terrific. Okay. Um, that was super helpful. So, usually
what we do now is just see if any FinCon members have kind of questions or clarifying nature um uh or you know require additional information. I had one
question for you which was I'm sure this is on the capital plan which I haven't seen but of the of the three cruisers that you envision us um kind of maintaining as as our
operating fleet. I understand the timing of that is still in question, but um which is the of those three is the oldest vehicle and when do you at this point in time anticipate that vehicle
turning over just so we could have kind of in our sort of documentation just a rough sense of when we might see a new capital need for for a new cruiser. Well, you know, I'd love to bring it this year, but I'm not going to because
I know we're in a tough fiscal year. I do plan on bringing it in fiscal 28. Um because our current the to answer your question fully, >> um it's a 2018. Um it doesn't have as many miles as uh most cruisers do
because it was used as a Chief's vehicle for a while. Um I mean, I think it's still up around 80,000 right now. Um, I don't know the exact number, so don't quote me on that. But, >> um, that's the one that would need to be replaced soonest. Um, and I want I think
staggering the replacements is extremely important, too. Uh, in the past, we got before my time, we got like three cruisers all around the same time. So, they all kind of went around the same time. So, right now, we have our our the
truck is a 2025. Um, the Chief's vehicle is a 2022 and that's a 2018. So, ultimately, I'd like to keep those staggered um, you know, through the years. I'd be happy to talk more about that in the
>> That's great. That's a good heads up for us. Um, okay, Susie. >> Um, Devin, do you know if any of these lines can roll over into the next year? I'm I don't know what the rationale or what the conditions have to be, but do
any of these um unspent lines move forward? >> Uh so one of them did and and so on fiscal 26 actually this is another correction. Um I did add um not to this sheet but to a different sheet uh this
478 in community policing did roll over. Uh, I asked for a carryover for 26 mainly to fund that female self-defense class. Um, you know, it could be that there's there's a good amount of money left over in that. Um, as far as
carryovers, I know you can't do it with wages. Um, and I I I think it's to my understanding it's kind of up to the accountant. Um, for if you have a good justifiable
reason to carry it over. Um, I think most of the time that's okay. Um, however, I don't think it's something they routinely like to do. >> We'll find out. But it but it was
>> it was for the that 470 into fiscal 26. >> Okay. >> Or not um whatever the balance was was. >> Yeah. From 25 to 26. >> 525. >> So it was probably 420 52, right? >> Yeah.
>> 522. Correct. Yep. >> All right. Any other questions for Chief? No. pretty clear. So I I have just um a couple of comments. one is
uh I I really want to express uh appreciation for your um clearly have sort of taken notice of some of the discussions we you've been a part of about the fiscal challenges
we're facing um for FY27 and to to bring us a budget that um you know has a you know a little over a 3% reduction from FY26
uh is you know just is really helpful. So um I I appreciate you um being mindful of the of the challenges and then um I just thought the your preparation for this was great too. like
that seeing your your notes here um in the budget document is really helpful for the fincom and I'm also you know I I'll just to be frank I think your plan to
um reduce the fleet to three from four to three cruisers I think is also kind of a sort of positive development from the kind of perspect perspective we we have in the fincom. So, um I I
appreciate you um kind of pursu pursuing that strategy. So, thanks for all of it. >> Absolutely. I just I want to optimize what we have, you know, um within the parameters that we have it, you know, and I think
>> um you know, I it can be with without another, you know, full-time officer. I I don't want a cruiser sitting um there, you know, that it doesn't do anyone good. There's extra registration fees, insurance, all of that. So, um you know,
I wanted to go through this and really see where we could uh where we can save money and that sort of thing, too. >> So, that's great. Um oh, I just remember I did have one clarifying question. So our I think I if I understood it um
understood you correctly before when you were talking about your operating uh expense budget. The the subscription that we have for the body cameras is a program that incorporates the cost of
both the hardware and the software is built into the subscription. Is that is that right? >> To my understanding. Yes. To my understanding. Yeah. And I I've read through those those documents um for the body. I was actually on on the phone
with him today because I was discussing um the fiveyear down the road mark because you know I want to get ahead of that. Um so but to my understanding yes. >> Okay. So, so also on to piggyback on that then your understanding is that if
we if we reup with this company again assuming you you continue to be happy with the the equipment and the service. If we re-up with them in five years that that whatever the the new subscription
fee is it will presumably include the cost of replacement hardware as well. Is that >> it would be it would be three years. So in three years we'd get the option of >> Okay, got it. >> Having a three-year contract and and extending our
>> Okay, got it. >> Yeah. >> All right, that that's helpful. Susie >> and Devin, is there a general sense of when you will try to get a third um officer in? >> As soon as possible. Um it's posted on
the website. Um, I'm actively looking. Um, we've also posted on Indeed. I've gotten some, uh, applicants. Uh, most of them don't have a police academy. Um, that's it's too it's so expensive to
send someone through a police academy. So, it's not only expensive. I mean, lever lever just sent two people through and they got one because as soon as one graduated you got I mean you you know uh how how it normally works and and the
other individual left. So, ideally, I'd like to get um you know, someone who who already has a police academy. Um and that's mainly what I'm looking for. So, I'm willing to wait a little while if I have to. Um, but I do have one
applicant so far that does have a police academy. Um, and he seems a little bit uh I haven't met him, but from his resume, he seems a little bit newer to the line of work. So, that could be a good option, too. You know, we just kind
of have to wait to see what our candidate pool is and go from there. >> Good. >> Great. Good. Okay. Any any final questions or comments for the chief?
Okay. All right. So, I've um I've I've updated all the changes you walked us through here. So, um we'll make sure that those get reflected in the uh the overall town budget that we'll be
working on over the next couple months. So, >> perfect. >> Thanks. Let us know if anything changes. >> I appreciate it. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> All right. All right. So, we've got uh
roughly half an hour until the library uh joins us. Um >> I I think it's likely she'll be early. >> Okay, great. So, we can we can we can
switch to that um as soon as as soon as we see Maryanne. Uh maybe what I'll do next is ask if um Haley, do we have any update on a highway department um transfer request
um that I think we discussed last last meeting was um likely was going to be needed for for this year. And I think the superintendent was going to be working on
a exact request, but uh is that something that had he's brought to you yet or >> not yet. So I was out most of last week at MMA and then obviously Dave's been on the road. >> Yeah. >> So I'll check with him on that. >> Yeah. So we can we can table that till
next day. And I and just so you know, I I was talking to Dave about um capital planning and um I didn't want to bother him with this. >> I'm trying to get him to get the February 1 deadline for the capital planning >> and I had that conversation with him
Friday and then I realized I probably should have mentioned it, but I didn't want to go back to him. >> Yeah, >> I'll do that. >> Yeah, >> thank you. >> That's fine. I'm assuming that they it's um if it was urgent that we deal with it tonight, we would have we
would have heard about it. So um okay. Uh let's see. I guess the next thing we can talk about um >> give me the fiscal manager. >> Yeah, let's do the fiscal snapshot.
Okay. So, this is the last one that um Haley put together for us. So, let's take a look. No. 113. All right. So, this is basically an end of last calendar year.
All right. So, Haley, do you want to walk us through this? >> Yeah. So, I tried to incorporate some of the feedback that I got about, you know, more specific accounts and what the expense is versus the total budget. So,
you'll see that breakdown of probably what is that, eight um some of our more our biggest accounts. >> Um so, you know, we're about 43% of the way there or at least the end of December we were >> um you know, the schools are a big chunk
of the budget. the employee benefits um snow and ice removal that we are going to be running a deficit on if we are not already. So >> that's been eaten up. And then what I did want to call folks attention to and I mentioned in the trends is the
maintenance and the supply lines. So, you're going to be looking at highway supplies, highway maintenance, fire maintenance, and then the general uh maintenance for like the I guess like that the administrative side of town. Um, so those are already at pretty near
capacity. I know that highway maintenance I think that was what Dave had was going to be asking for the transfer from. So you can see uh I didn't mention them here, but there are several accounts that are totally zeroed out, but that's because of that front loading. So things
like the computer maintenance and the dog office or things like that. >> Um you know, again, we our budgets are are very small, so there's not a lot of contingency room when something goes wrong. Um, and that's why I think you see those
maintenance budgets being so high. And, you know, we're we're not even halfway through the year yet. We haven't >> there's more storms coming, unfortunately. Uh, you know, mud season is coming. So, I would anticipate that we'll see more transfers uh need to
happen by the end of the year. And then just looking ahead um you know and um Chief Pelatio kind of alluded to this is you know how do we make like that master plan for maintenance for vehicles and for buildings. So I would really um like
to see us kind of get a a big meeting of the minds with you know school committee capital planning building so that we can kind of assess you know what do we need to do what do we need to plan for in five years versus 10 years um and how can we align that to grant cycles so
that we you know if we know oh okay in two years in the fall this grant is going to be open for roofs I'll just throw something out there um so how can we position ourselves to be ready when that happens. >> That's great.
Um, so I think I just want to make sure I'm um since this is a sort of a template that we'll be >> looking at. Um, >> no, this is not >> you know periodically or I think we said every once a month maybe I think is what
we said. Yeah. So this middle category, so just to be just so I'm clear, these represent the eight largest sort of budget um uh lines or uh categories in in in the operating
budget. And for each one of them, we're seeing um a percentage that represents how much of their current fiscal year budget allocation has been spent through whatever the date of the of the report
is. Is that correct? Yeah. >> Okay. Good. That's that's that's great. >> Okay. So, yeah, it's very clear. Um, I think uh I I I I'm assuming the school
line only being um 36% spent is just is just kind of a function of how we essentially get build from the district. Is that right? I mean there there's >> Yeah. Um Gail had said that they do more of like a quarterly basis. So that's why
you're you're going to see that being different. And I think the does it a different way. >> Okay, got it. Uh, CZ, >> um, I know that Lenny told us that the, um, fire department frontloadads their highway maintenance. Um, and I I do
think that that was true. Dave said some of that, too. So, it doesn't mean that they're necessarily um, going to run out of money. Some of it is front-loaded the same way. unemployment benefits and some of the other ones like the computer maintenance.
>> That's true for Lenny, but I think it also showcases that if something goes wrong, he doesn't. But for Dave, I don't think there's as much of the front loing except with the greater where we had already budgeted >> uh funding for that. >> Yeah. Okay.
George. >> Yeah, I was looking at the budget number. I don't the 8 million50 I don't think is our FY26 budget. >> I'm just wondering you might have >> including all the things.
>> Yeah. So that comes is that the total number that's on the expense reports that >> Yeah. Okay. Yeah. that the accountant does. So yeah, she she puts other things in there. Okay. Yeah. When I first saw it, it just kind of struck me. >> I wonder if that is if that is something
that we should be like mindful of like if if this is going to be sort of mis I don't know misinterpreted by especially if we start making these public >> which I think we may want to do but
should we call it something else or yeah >> I could just pull out parse out the operating expense um and then just and then instead of writing total budget just do total operating I mean, is that would that is that going to be a pain in the neck for you as the
person who's going to be updating? No. >> No. >> Okay. I >> I'm going to say what did you just propose to do? >> Oh, I said I can just parse out what's operating expenses if that's more helpful compared to like the everything
because that's how you know that's what I'm basically doing for each individual category and like that middle piece. >> Yeah. I think I I guess the only the only sort of pro I'm trying to avoid is a member of the
public or or I don't know it's sort of you know press p you know is doing some story or whatever and they inadvertently um sort of pull this number um and assume that that's our operating
budget which is obviously not doesn't track with the you know the budget that we pass at an annual town meeting. So I think trying to either think about maybe we call this something
else but um or if you could yeah extract from Gail's reports the the you know the the the sum of the categories that do track with what's in our operating budget. >> Okay.
>> I think that would be probably the best. What do others agree with that or Yes, if it's not too much work, Kaylee Susie, >> yeah, it does appear in looking at the um 1231 report, the line the the uh
column called allocated is this number 8050. But there's rolled over money, retained money. And so, um, yeah, I think that because the public mostly interacts with us around the operating budget, we should be using operating budget
numbers. >> And will that change the uh year-to-ate expenditures and remaining balances that you have? >> Very slightly. >> Okay. >> But for the most part, the expenses just look at the operating. So,
>> but I'll play around with it and um >> and yeah, cuz I I totally expect to go through a couple more iterations of this. It's like the one we want. >> I like the way it's presented. >> Yeah, >> I like the graphics.
>> I like the color. It's a calming color. Yeah, >> I wouldn't mind getting it in advance of the meetings, but certainly if that's >> Yeah, that's >> that's on me because Haley uh Haley did share this with me before the the last
meeting. So, yeah, I think Haley once we and I think we're there basically um we've sort of >> settled on a format and a template, I think what you can do is when you're when you prepare these, you can send them to the whole the whole committee. Okay,
>> that just saves us a step. All right, Susie. >> Um, so this format then I can assume that there's no single lines, not in like gross categories, but
no single line that is sticking out. Um, which is what we used to see, um, like when they're legal went off the rails and stuff like that. Um, so there's not a general government one here. Um, and so and there are some expenses that are
not so much in a single department like um, police, fire. So, so I'm asking if there were any um, specific lines that were um, red flagged.
>> No, this year thankfully we haven't had the same legal issues that we had last year. So, those expenses have gone definitely down. Um, the biggest flags are like like I said, it's either when we have to frontload something or we like wait till the end of the year, but
that's not really a typical. So, I didn't want to include like too many of those. >> Yeah. >> But I think, you know, so having couple having like tweaked this around a couple times, like it's definitely the schools, the employee benefits, and then like maintenance type
repairs. George. >> Yeah. The only thing I would ask is, and I do like this is a great format. I really do like it. And these are clearly the lines that we always need to be monitoring. But um could we somehow build into this the flexibility that if
there is a line that we don't normally look at like I and Susie kicked this off in my mind like legal if legal was going south would you be able to have a mechanism to just pull that one out because I assume you're looking at the whole thing and you're you're obviously
updating these lines but you might spot other stuff that should be brought to our attention. So that's I would >> if yeah if there's an option to do that >> and then I would probably I didn't totally understand that question but I would probably put that under trends if it was something like that. Um perfect
>> or depending on that maybe there's space enough to make like its own separate item. >> I think it would be sufficient to just put it in that that that trends box there. Okay. Um, and again, you know, that
the the I think the trigger for you to put something like that for an individual line in that document should be the following, at least from my perspective. So, it's not about the size of the line, but it's
>> the fact that it's either si significantly over spent or underspent. relative to what we would have expected. So it doesn't fall in one of these categories of like a front-loaded contract or something or subscription.
But so I think yeah and and that and I think the the you know the the the regular practice or routine of you going through these once a month will be I think helpful because
you'll see like something that wasn't you know what hadn't been alerted to you by anyone but like hey why is this one line you know only you know spent at 5% there's There's no obvious explanation for that given what it is. And so that
could trigger for you, okay, an email or phone call or whatever. You get the explanation and then you can sort of summarize that in a bullet point here for us that that kind of a process. >> But I do also like these big picture
trend things as well. So I'm not I'm not suggesting replacing those, but just like you know you can >> Yeah. Like augment it a little. >> Yeah. Exactly. Uh Susie >> in um in our meeting um on December
16th, we started talking about that. It was called set a range and threshold of overspending for expense lines to trigger researching and reporting uh to the committee the issues impacting that overspending. And so, um, yeah, we
didn't set any we didn't set thresholds, but I think that was being left up to Haley what that would be. But I think your point that when things are underspent, like the um, mosquito one, the invoice never came in
>> and that and I don't even know where the status of FY25 is. Um, but it could be that, you know, if if it was underspent well into the year, that could trigger like looking into it. And um, and also as we plan
FY27, if we see that there's budgets that are not being utilized, we might be able to save money um, in the next year if we know that that seems to be a reasonable place to save money. >> Yeah.
>> Great. Okay. Um, anything else on this? So, this is really terrific, Haley. I think we should um I can't I think we should be posting these like in the same place on the website where we post >> the you know the more detailed
>> uh expense reports. I I think there I think in many ways this is actually going to be more um I think of more interest to the public than like looking at you know the the detailed ledger reports. So um
>> okay >> that that's my view. Is that anybody disagree with that or >> a good idea? Okay. >> So I I'll just change those totals then and um I can have DL put it on the website. >> Awesome.
Okay. Um, so I think we've got our library team in here, including Maryanne. So, why don't we get started a little earlier on the library review, budget review? Um, so maybe we can
Maryanne, did you is there anybody else that's not in the meeting that you're expecting that you think we should wait or >> um, let me see who's here. Um, Um, I think we're good. There are three library trustees here.
>> Um, that I can see. Um, so I think it's fine. >> Great. >> Okay. I told people um that we might start at 7:15. So, >> great. Okay. So, you shared with us um both a budget document and a memo and
I'd like to share those. Do you is it your preference that we look at the the budget first and then talk through some of the issues you outlined in the memo? Is that >> Sure. >> You want to do do it in Okay. >> Yeah, that's fine.
>> Okay. Uh >> whatever works for you, AJ. >> Let's do that. >> Okay. Let's see if I can get this a little bigger. Okay. Is that readable for people? >> Yeah. >> Okay.
>> Well, I have it in front of me. Okay. >> All All right. Um so, um Maryanne, you've done this many times. you want to just uh kind of do your typical sort of walk through line by line and give us
any sort of background or >> okay >> context that we need. >> Right. So um so I think um the first thing I'll start with is the salary lines. We meaning the library never put
increases in the salary lines. Um, and we leave that up to the town. Um, so the salaries that are in there are the same salary amounts that were budgeted for this current fiscal year. Um,
>> so we'll just we'll just apply whatever the approved COLA increase is. Those >> Okay. Yes. And then we usually count on that for helping us meet our required two and a half% um budget increase in order to stay
certified by the state. Um uh so um and then we have um so acquisitions um that's all of the new materials that we buy. Um, we're required to spend in
order to say certified by the state, we're required to spend 20% of our appropriated budget on new materials or acquisitions. That can include um technology for patron use up up to 10% of it can be technology for patron
use. Um, and there have been years when I've been able to um do that. It can include things like things that would be in our Library of Things collection like guitars or ukuleles. Um, so last year I was able to
meet that expenditure requirement in part because of a grant that I had. I had a grant from the American Library Association and I bought some things um for our for our Library of Things collection um and and some technology
for teens and I was able to apply that to our materials expenditure and meet that requirement. I don't have that grant this year um so um or next year. Um, cereals are magazines. Those have
historically been paid for by the friends of the library. Um, office and other supplies. Um, uh, you know, we're going to need more supplies in our larger building. Um, uh,
we have more people coming in. We'll have more materials, um, more space, more things happening. And so we're going to need um more supplies than we've had than we've used in the past. Um our CW Mars membership that has a little note beside it and
that is the actual when I made this budget that was an estimate and that is the actual assessment. Um and then um and then I have spent as in fiscal year 23 I spent $20,000 on programs. I'm I'm
anticipating that I'll spend uh at least $18,000 on programs this year and at least that amount next year. Um and those we did add some money to the library budget to um to that operating
expense allocation a few years ago um for fitness programs and then we added money another time for story time. But most of the programming money comes either from grants or from the friends of the library. Um and then we get down to the annual town meeting allocations.
And um and so for the salaries, we've just put in the same salaries as this fiscal year. And then we asked for um another 500. And I don't know what
happened to those notes. um uh in the acquisitions line um or the operating allocation. Um and I just want to make sure that that that math is right because then we also had this year somebody had a $150
longevity bonus. Um, and then that gets added to our appropriation when the town gives us longevity bonuses and then we have to account for that both in the 20% and in that 2 and 12% increase.
>> Um, and so I don't know if that's um I just want to do that math because it's not looking right to me. Um, and I think in the editing um things got messed up. But anyway, it's
just it's either that 23256. Yeah, that's 500 more than the 22756. Um, so we know that the town's having a tough budget year. Um, I often ask for a,000 or more additional money in that
line. I didn't want to ask for nothing, so I just decided to just ask for a little nominal increase. um and to, you know, hoping that there would then be salary increase increases so we could then meet that 2 and a half% um between
that $500 and whatever the salary increases are. >> Um and then um we get a little bit of money from dog tax um and then we'll um
uh we get some state aid. I had been not spending our state aid. This year, I'm spending the state aid or anticipate spending a lot of state aid to meet some of these unanticipated um budget needs for the new library. Um and then we get a small library and
network grant from the from CW Mars and the state that helps pay for our CW Mars assess assessment. Um, so the trust fund is outlined in the notes and um and the trustees have budgeted $4,454
from the expendable trust, the interest from the trust this year and then they're budgeting $4,000 for next year. Um, I'm hoping that we'll get about $2,000 in u cultural council grants. Um,
I have a $4,600 grant from the New Salem Academy for this fiscal year. I'm hoping for around the same amount next year. The community network for children helps pay for our weekly story time. Um, and then the friends of the library always
kind of help balance out our budget needs. The recreation committee has been contributing to our fitness class programming and then sometimes they contribute to library programming in other ways and the Council on Aging contributes to our programming.
So that's our budget. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Um >> Brad's the treasurer of the >> Okay. And >> hi Brad. I see your hand up. So why don't we go right to you? >> Okay. There's a really minor things.
Somehow this report got reformatted. Um, >> the >> is there is there a better is there a better version of this that you want to send me now that I could I could pull up or is it is are the are the formatting issues minor enough that it's not that big a deal?
>> Um, I'm not sure I have your email. >> Okay. Um, you can you can send it to finets.org. >> Okay. Um, I'll set that up. But the the main thing is those notes. Note one, two, and three. >> Yeah.
>> Uh, note one goes to director's salary and assistant salary, >> right? >> Note two should be on the total salaries line and note three is down at CW Mars and they refer to things at the bottom of the page.
>> Yeah, I can see the details of the notes down here, but I get it. Okay. So, >> so tell me again the address I should send it to. Fin. >> Yep. fin sheets.org. Okay. >> Yeah, it's funny. My printed one doesn't
have those columns in that way. >> Um mute. >> All right. Was that um so when you Brad when you mentioned that there were some formatting issues with the version we're looking at was it just about the
placement of those notes. >> You're muted Brad. >> Oh, you're muted. >> You're muted, Brad, if you're talking to us. Uh the the row numbers on the left are a little wonky, but I don't think that
matters. >> Okay. Yeah, >> those are the two places I saw. >> All right. Uh All right. Your new document hasn't come through yet, but >> I I think we're okay. I don't It doesn't sound like those are >> It's minor stuff. >> Yeah, those are major issues. Um okay.
So, let's open it up to >> questions unless you Brad, did you have anything else >> that you wanted to share? Is there any context? Okay. So, George. >> Um, yeah. So, Maryanne, just to be clear, so when the state requires that we spend two and a half%,
it's the total expenditure line. >> Well, so, so the state requires that the libraries of town appropriated budget increase by 2 and a half%. every >> so line 22
when we look at with ATM operating allocation 22756 to 23 256 needs to increase by two and a half is that what you're saying >> no the whole thing >> um I think it's line 23 >> needs to increase by two and a half%
it's called the municipal >> with the right >> yeah Right. >> Cuz Maryanne was saying that the the cola increases >> Yes. Yes. >> end up sort of providing some of that significant amount of that additional. >> I knew that. I just had a little brain
fart there. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I mean, I'm just looking at this. The salaries are the big part of it, but it looks like you're going to be close. >> Well, we'll see. >> Well, we won't know, I don't think, until we know what the colas are and we can double check. >> Going to be about two and a half%. So if
that 8615 was two 2 and a half% higher then it would be 881 165 plus 23 256 gives us 111421 divided by 108771 right
>> 2.4 four. So, we're close. >> We'll have to keep an eye on that. >> If So, so you think the colas are going to be about two and a half%. >> I'm thinking two and a half to three. Um, we'll know in in two weeks. We'll know. >> Okay. >> All right. So, maybe we can look at that
once we know what that is. We can do that math >> and then >> we if if we need to, we can make up the difference in the in that operating allocation. um which on mine is line 18,
but I think your numbers got wonky somehow. So, um >> Okay. I just we just need to All right. Just be aware of that. We don't want to get caught cut out. >> No, I mean there there have been other towns that have had to have a special
town meeting to allocate like 50 bucks to the library so that it stays accredited and we don't want to have to go through that, >> right? All right, I'm going to share the the new version just to make sure we're >> we're all looking at the same thing. Uh,
okay. So, this is the version Brad just shared. >> Yeah, that's the one I have. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I mean, it's the same same bottom line, so I'm not >> Right. Okay. Yeah. Okay.
Um, excuse >> is there a reason that the um, where was it? That line 17 the salary loc allocation is less than FY26 showing there
>> because of that $150. Um, >> there's no longevity >> longevity bonus. >> Oh, okay. Sorry. >> Yeah. Okay. >> And and I'm not aware. So So the town
puts in the longevity bonuses and I'm not aware of any um I'm not do one and I'm not a I'm not aware of when the other two staff people >> have they been there for more than five years.
>> Um well one got one last year. Um and um and then I don't off the top of my head I don't know how long I don't know I don't know which of them got it. Um I think it was Cynthia. Um and I don't know how long Kristen's been there. So
you know um so Kristen started after co so five years could be coming up. Um, so but I don't know whose job it is to know that
>> to keep track of those. >> I town administrator, personnel board, treasurer, >> treasurer. Yeah, all the all the above. >> All right. Well, >> okay.
>> It's a It's a small amount, but it would be good for us to just verify whether it needs to be added to the FY27. >> Yeah. And I would I think you know, we'll do that, right, Haley? We'll we'll do that when when you're creating the budget. We're going to see what the
total library two lines are. We'll just make sure we >> let's just make sure we're thinking about it. Uh Susie, >> um do this might not be the right place to ask or discuss it, but I can we can
make a place to discuss it. Um do we know how the budget for the new library came in? Um I I imagine it's not even all assembled yet, but um like the general sense is did it come in under
budget, over budget, um blah blah blah because that's another part of our town budget that people think about. So I don't know if we should talk about it at a different format or it also is about when those numbers would be ready,
>> right? And so we um we're we're not done yet. Um we held out um half of the landscaping from the contractor's
bid um in a that was our strategy so that we would have bids that we um could afford to sign. Um and so we um
so first of all the construction's not fully done and built yet and then um and then we still have um you know some landscaping and some
grounds work to do. So, um, so but we, um, haven't spent all of the contingencies, um, yet. And, and do you know like when it all
shakes out, does the state end up being having their grant not as expended? Does the town's um, override not have to go that far? Do you know how that part shakes out? Well, so the so the state
um is paying 75% of the actual eligible costs. Um and then um and so if the actual eligible costs are, you know, whatever those are is how much the grant will be. Okay. Um, and
then the ineligible costs plus the 25% of the eligible costs are the amount that the town will pay. And um, and we it's likely that we won't know the end
of that until a year from now. >> Okay, >> that's good to know because I somebody asked me already. Like I said, I don't think it's known yet. It's not over yet, right? Um but um and I think we just should wait to see what happens. But it
you know somebody was saying well maybe we won't need all the tax money. It's like we don't know that, >> right? We don't Well, yeah. I I think we Well, I don't I mean we don't we don't know yet, but we aren't we're not done.
And we have to remember that we when we voted for the tax money, we voted to to for the it was for the construction and furnishing and equipment of and equipment equipping of the library. So um so we are, you know, we've bought a
lot of the furniture and equipment that we need, but we haven't bought everything. Um and we're we're still waiting. um you know there are some uh potential change orders that aren't set settled
yet. There are um so we are we're still working through all of that and and one example there's a library that the they had substantial completion and they moved in um
let me see if I can think um last August um and they still haven't finished not August 20 It'll be like a year and a half before they are finished. So, not last
August, the August before that. >> Um, so, um, so it'll be like, you know, it's been a year and four months already and they're not done yet. So, >> okay. But I I guess to to um Sus's question,
I'm assuming there's like um there's like some kind of reconciliation process where >> right >> the the funding agencies and that it probably I imagine it takes some time after the right >> project for that all to kind of come together, right? So okay.
>> Um got it. >> Uh April. >> Yeah. I just have a a question about the janitorial staff. I I do not remember is that being covered in any other places or is that reflected in your budget?
>> So we added funds last in this current fiscal year funds were added to the town hall janitorial so the town building's janitorial staff. Um okay. So that and so we're getting four hours a week of
janitor service and it's not part of the library's budget. And that is that's a pretty typical thing that happens in small towns where the sort of the janitor and facility staff are town
departments and not not under the libraries budgets. >> And you're not doing the sidewalk shoveling. Well, I am I am but um but I I'm doing a lot of shoveling um but um
but we are working on that. So that there was also money budgeted for um for snow removal. Um and we're still um still we're still figuring that out. So >> I think it's a good segue to look at the
memo all the other expenses. >> Yeah. So, um, Maryanne put together a memo to supplement the library budget and it talks about this very topic of what are some of the ongoing
operating expenses associated with the new building and kind of where do we where do we account for that in the budget? So, >> right, >> let me let me share that now. Um, okay. All right. I guess before we get to that, um, you have some notes in here
about the use of the, um, library trust fund, right? >> Right. Right. So, when, you know, when we went out to bid, we knew that we would likely need more funds in order to
be able to certify that the, you know, that the accountant had the funds for the to pay the contractor's contract. So, so the library had a small trust fund. The principal was about $73,000.
The um the trustees did a process. It's called sigh prey where they petitioned the state to be able to you know to say that the p purpose of that trust fund which was for the care and maintenance of the library um had been fulfilled and
they petitioned to be able to use the principle of the trust fund for construction of the new library um and so the state approved that. So, so that money has to be applied to the construction of the new library and the
treasurer is going through a process to liquidate it. Um, there's still some um there's still some interest in the uh in the expendable interest. Um, and so that's what h so there was the principal and then the trustees spent from the the
interest um a little bit every year. So there's about 33,000 remaining and the trustees are planning to spend 3 to 5,000 annually from it until the balance is depleted. Um, and so we've been
using, you know, some money from the expendable from that interest account to support the library's operating budget. And that is um that's going to come to an end um you know, depending
um depending on how much they need to spend. Um that's going to come an end to an end in you know, seven to 10 years. Um uh so that's one thing. Um does anybody have any questions about that?
>> Well, so to be clear, Mariana, I'm sure this I know the answer, but just to make sure this is this is not the same thing as the new library fund that we used to fund out of the
operating budget like used to be $25,000 a year, right? Okay. This is totally independent of that. Yeah. Right. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Um Okay. So, then we get into all of these questions about, >> you know, so we're in this bigger
library and it's got some expenses that are the same expenses that we had in the old library and some expenses that are new expenses. And um and so in the old library when we were using the
composting toilet um we would get we would get the supplies for that restroom um from the town hall supplies. So toilet paper, paper towels, hand san Well, I bought my own hand sanitizer. Um
but but all of those supplies um came from town hall and then and then the janitor maintained it. So we um and and I've I you know I said for this new bigger library that I would handle sort of this first
you know this first six months out of library funds. Um but like we just need to know are we going to be responsible for that? And if we are, then we're going to need funding somehow. Or is the
town um is the town going to purchase enough of those supplies to stock the larger library that uses more of those supplies? Um and and in a lot of small
towns, these are things that are generally covered by like a town maintenance account. Most libraries aren't most small libraries in towns like Shootsberry aren't buying their own supplies like this, like cleaning supplies and restroom supplies. Um, so
and the library, so the old library had a panic button. It's still there. I have to call and cancel it. The new library has a panic button and the monitoring for that is $420 a year. Town Hall pays the bill for the panic button at
the old library. Is Town Hall going to pay? You know, I don't know what account that came out of, but is is that going to continue to come out of a town hall account? Um, the utilities will there's
just electricity. Um and um and then maybe the the water the water monitoring could be called a utility. But um but you know the town hall will pay for the electricity and we should um if it ever stops snowing make most of our
electricity from the solar panels. Um, so you know, one piece of equipment that I hadn't anticipated, um, and so I just put it in to kind of just point out the the sort of new level
of of things is I I had to buy an AED device, which was $2,400. Um, it has a 7-year warranty and then it has batteries that need to be replaced annually and pads um replaced as used.
Um, the pads are about $100. There are adult pads and and pediatric pads. And then the batteries are about 60 bucks a piece. Um, and that's and and 60 bucks in some ways sounds like nothing, but
when I but like I I sort of I mean we collect we've been collecting bottles and cans to fund the library, right? So, a nickel at a time. So, $60 is a lot of nickels. Um, and then um and then like
the snowblower. So, the town hall, the town had a snowblower that's been being used for some of the um snow removal at the on the sidewalks at the library. Um and the highway department will maintain
it probably um and that'll eventually need to be replaced. So, just a piece of equipment that we'll just have to keep in mind. Um I don't know how long a snowblower lasts. Um and then um and then there are these, you know, we're
going to need more ice melt. Um and um and we um we haven't been using as much of the sort of ice melting stuff that you buy because you can't put it on concrete um until the concrete has cured for a
year. So I bought some, but I didn't know that. And then um and then we are using it on on the the walkways that are just by tuminous pavement um and in then some areas in the um in the parking
areas. Um but um but you know but I but we won't use as much of that this year but we'll need to use more of it next year. So, we've been using sand um untreated sand that the highway department gets and that is that creates a really terrible mess. Um so, that's
not a good long-term solution. It doesn't cost the library anything, but um but the ice melt um is something we'll use like for next winter. Um let's see. Um let's see. Um, oh, so this
library is going to need periodic septic pumping and um, and I don't know if it'll have to be done every third year. I don't know how often it's done at town hall, but I just had that done here at my house and it was $500.
Um, and um, and you know, and then there's just we'll probably need to have the carpets cleaned. I I used to have the rugs cleaned at the library at the current at the old library and that was paid out of a town hall account. Um the
company that used to be in Amoris would pick them up and clean them and bring them back. Um and um so window washing um you know the library has those big beautiful windows and um and it's uh I
got an estimate from a professional window washer because that's not something that can be done. You know they need um equipment to do it and the estimate was $1,250 and the trustees are committed to
covering that. um until the until the trust is expended. Um and then the broadband committee wants us to have um internet and security and that's that's a $100 a year. Um that $300 was an um
was an estimate. Um, and then I just put in here, you know, things like we've got a water bottle filling station and we'll need paper cups and filters and um, and we assume that'll be part of the library budget, but it's just an expense we
didn't have before. So, there's a lot of little expenses that add up to a lot of bottles and cans um, collected. Um, so the building has a fire alarm and the monitoring that is $540 a year. I just
want to know should that be part of the library's operating budget or is town hall going to cover that? Um, and then a a a a need that I that totally took me by surprise is the water testing and
reporting and that's $4,000 a year. Um the the library's well is a public water supply and that's how much the elementary school budgets and that's how much the estimate is from the certified water operator. Um they come the the
well is tested for bacterias monthly and then um all the other things that water is tested for you know throughout in a schedule throughout the year. So, um it's, you know, metals and and
contaminants and all of those things. Um so um and then the HVAC system has 16 filters that need to be changed twice a year and that is um we we got an
estimate from the company that installed the system and that was $5,500 a year um to maintain it. the building committee is talking to um talking to them about sort of having
some kind of service contract for all of the buildings and that might affect it the following year, but we already have a contract for the first year in the building. Um we thought it made the most sense to go with the company that built the system cuz they were the most
familiar with it um as we kind of work out the kinks of it. Um but so those are all the different things that um that I'm thinking about and we're thinking about as we have this new building. Um
>> all right. So I I have um I'll give you sort of my kind of off the top of my head sort of recommendation around how we deal with this. But I'm I'm obviously wanting to hear other thoughts from the the pink.
But I think what we what we kind of need to do is um look at I think three uh sort of I think maybe three lines
that are in the town buildings budget. Okay. So um or potential lines. So So I'm going to just kind of name them now. So um there's 81 is custodial wages. So we've
already we already have a precedent for this because we did it in the FY26 budget. We we budgeted additional hours. I think you said it was four four hours a week. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> And I I assume that has started. >> Yes. Um, and and is that
I'm going to I'm going to assume since you didn't say otherwise that that seems like the right amount of of time to allocate for for for that person's work. Um, so
>> I have a question. How much time does the janitor spend in town hall in a week? Um, so how many hours a week? Does anybody know how many hours a week? >> I want to say
I want to say it's like 10, but I have it in a spreadsheet back in my office and you can confirm that. >> Okay. So, because I was, you know, at first I was thinking that 4 hours was fine and then I I just sort of had a
thought one day of um of just sort of comparing it to town hall. And we can we can do it for we can do this for a year or a year and a half and see how it goes. Um uh I mean, if we were going to have somebody come more frequently, we'd
probably need another to hire another janitor. Um but um but if a building, you know, like I don't know that town hall is is any bigger than the current library. I think the new library. Um I
don't know the square footage of town hall, but I don't think it's I think it's about similar size. Um, I >> I I would approach this question in in maybe a different way, which is not not to think about, well, what is the kind of how many hours are spent at the town
hall, right? >> How does that compare to the new library in terms of square footage? What what I would I I guess what I would suggest is you take some time to ascertain whether the
four hours that are currently allocated >> is sufficient to maintain the building, right? Independent of what >> what that person does at at the town hall. And >> right >> and then if if there's you know and then come back to us if the
answer to that is well here's what here's where here's it doesn't feel sufficient and here's what the consequences of that are like here right here's what here's what we would like the the the the condition or or the
building like what you know sort of detailing how how is the the sort of current plan falling short of what the building actually needs. >> Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a good idea. And I think like what we can do is >> sort of, you know, so we've got six
months of this fiscal year to see how it goes and then um and then but then, you know, maybe I'll maybe I'll take three months and then see how it goes and um and see how much time, >> you know, I'm spending
cleaning. um if somebody only comes in twice a week, we we asked for that amount because that is about the amount that other other libraries of similar size have budget janitors. So >> So that's a useful reference. And just to give you some some additional
context, the the FY25 budget for custodial wages was $8,51. So we we added I think it was $5,000 for which is what these four hours
amounted a week amounted to which is about 60 which was about a 62% increase in that um in that in that line >> right >> so that that might be some sort of help helpful context as well
>> but I think to speak to some of these ongoing sort of maintenance and supply needs needs. I think what would be helpful is if we look at sort of what is the um so there's a line in the town
buildings sort of category of our operating budget for electricity that's line 83 for internet that's line 86 and and for supplies that's line 87 and
so what I I think what seems to makes sense to me is for you to sort of um kind of pull these different, you know, um bullet points you have here and essentially give us a total for those
three lines based on the recommendations that you've outlined here about sort of what the what what the what the corresponding >> sort of allocation or need is for each of those three lines. And then we can,
you know, and that what what we can do then when we're putting together our FY27 budget is add those additional allocations to to those town building lines. Um, and I think what those could
what I think the kinds of I I think what those could include are, you know, restroom supplies, cleaning supplies, utilities. That would be the the electricity line. Um, uh,
ice melt. Uh, >> is there a line for like service contracts? Because some of these are supplies, but some of them Yeah. are not so much. >> So, what there is is there's a line for equipment maintenance. I don't know if that could be like the septic if that
would be appropriate for the septic pumping. It's not exactly equipment maintenance, but I'm trying to think of >> we have like a m like a building maintenance account, which I think would be the better. >> I guess that I guess that would be the other line. Yeah, you're right. Is the building maintenance line, which is
uh where is it? I'm trying to remember which line that is. Uh where are those buildings? >> Yeah. And is that like where the carpet cleaning would come from?
>> Yes, I think that would be the carpet cleaning. Um probably this this panic button monitoring >> the water testing. >> The what? >> The water testing. Okay.
>> The water testing. Did you say septic pumping? Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And then yeah, maybe the the fire alarm monitoring as well. I don't know >> in the window.
>> Do you know where the panic button comes from, Haley? Do you know what button what line that comes from? >> I do not, but I can email Gail. >> All righty. And then um and then so the internet comes out of line 86. Okay. Um,
>> so sorry. The the the other the other line is this town building repairs maintenance line. That's line 224. >> Is that building maintenance? >> See, I think that was designed more for
like these repairs that um, you know, that are that are determined to be necessary, right? on the the uh building um committee uh evaluation that they they
did. >> So what's the number for the building maintenance line? >> That is not finding it. >> I I don't think we have one actually. >> No, we do have it in our expense reports. So I've been trying to figure this out. Um yeah,
>> using this form. It doesn't match up with our expense report. So, we'll have to get back to that because >> okay, >> somehow it's not obvious. >> Okay. >> Um, >> but those were separate. The the line
224 was not where because that was the whole thing with Becky used to handle getting repairs done at the town hall. And I know that the fire alarm and the elevator and all that was quite a hubbub. Um and I believe it came out of
what was called um building maintenance or building repair. That was not the last line. >> Okay. So there is under um in that same town buildings uh
section of the budget there is wait where did it go? Uh so there is a repairs line which is line 88 and then there's an equipment equipment maintenance line which is 82.
So, I don't know if either of those might be >> appropriate places to look at, especially if like something like the panic button at the town hall is is already being built out of one of those lines. That that would be the
>> So, maybe that's what we could do is we could find out what line >> Yeah. >> that was coming out of and then the panic button and the fire alarm could come out of that line. >> Yeah. >> Okay. I think I think I think Right. And I think um
>> yeah, I guess the other one that comes to mind is this this carpet cleaning that you're recommending be done annually that I imagine something like that is done at the town hall periodically or >> No, there's no carpets. >> Oh, there's no carpets.
>> No, there's carpets upstairs. Yeah, they're >> we did I never >> I did have um Yeah. Well, some of them are getting kind of thin and we're afraid there might be asbestous in them. >> Um, but I did pay to have the town hall professionally deep cleaned and I would
certainly say that that is something we should continue to do because it did make a huge improvement with the dust that we have. >> Yeah. Okay. >> And what did you what line did you use to pay for that? I you well we had also in tandem the the basement cleaning the
basement project >> so that we had set aside some funds for that but it was only we paid less than $1500 to have it deep cleaned and they did everything. >> Um >> yeah so I guess I guess my my request
Maryanne would be if we could so it's very helpful to have the detailed notes here. If we could now take these notes and have you sort of tabulate the the you know the the amounts that
you are recommending we add to the FY27 project and then if you could link them to specific lines and it may require a little bit of back and forth. >> Yes. You know >> with Haley just to figure out where do you where do you pay this one out? Yes.
>> But um >> so and I think I think I I don't I don't know if you were explicit about this, but part of the the implication of doing this is then it it it reduces the need for us to
increase our new acquisitions, right? Because that's based on >> right it's two it's twofold. So, you know, if if you if all of these needs are suddenly the library's responsibility and and the town decides to to increase the library's operating
budget, >> then that two and a half% goes up and then um and then the materials expenditure requirement goes up. So, >> um and and these are things that are
often paid for out of, you know, general town accounts. So it's not like we're doing something that isn't common practice. >> Yeah. >> I mean I can the only I I mean none of other departments outside of the
elementary school include these things in their in their budget and and I guess you know the issue with the school is that that's a very different >> obviously different kind of a different scale of budget. Right. >> So, um, yeah. Uh, so I get I get why
you're recommending it. Um, I think we need some like concrete guide I guess, excuse me, we need some concrete guidance on what are actual estimated amounts, >> right, >> that need to be added to specific lines in the
>> in the operating budget. That's one thing. And then I do think in the interest of sort of transparency, I do think we probably need to be clear in in in the way we usually do this is by adding notations to our budget. I
think we need to be clear that we're increasing, you know, the the um town building supplies line by this increment >> um to you know to account for the new
expenses associated with the new library building. Right. And >> because I think I think you know the town I think residents sort of understandably expect to have some information you know shared with them about what this is a brand new facility. It has it
has new new costs associated with it. We want to be able to sort of provide that that transparency. So I think the the way we annotate >> the operating budget is probably a sufficient but you know we'll figure that out before town meeting. Mhm. >> Uh, sorry. Uh, let me go to George.
>> Yeah. Uh, I just wanted to ask, um, so which line items in this section that we're talking about are not going to be funded by town hall will be the library? I mean, are we going to try and add all of these? I just for the minutes, I want to get this documented.
>> So, I think there were a couple that you see >> recommended would be part of the library budget. So, I guess three. I think that um well I think the internet security could just be part of the library budget. Um >> so you said that one you said >> but that's going to be $100, right? Um
and um and then I and then the window washing it's it's a lot. And >> um and so I could see that we could that we could cover the window washing until the expendable trust is fully expended and then we can see
>> Yeah. you know, and then, you know, so then we um you know, we add some things to the li to the town budget now and save that, which is, you know, for
for our town that's an unusual expense. Um and and you know so um so but I think that everyone's going to want those windows to be cleaned on an annual basis. Um you know in other places they
would clean the windows four times a year, right? But that's that's not going to happen. Um, so, um, so I think that and then, um, uh, and then, you know, paper cups and things will be part of
the library budget. Um, and, um, let's see. Um, um, let's see. Um, and then just that equipment, you know, when those things like a new snowblower or a new AED
device comes up, you know, we'll come back to you, but I just wanted to say there are these new equipment needs >> that we may need money for, but we don't need money for those right now. >> Those would be more like capital. I mean, >> right, except that they're not really
>> No, they don't qualify. I know, but we generally have been using free cash for those. >> Yes. But um so really it's mostly um you know mostly we're just sort of figuring out where these things fit into um oh
and then the the ice the ice melt um I so I've always bought ice melt for this for the spear library. So I put that down as part of the library supply budget. >> Okay. It's in that memo. It mean question. It's already done. >> And then Yeah. And that's part of why I
asked for 1,500 more in the supply line. Um or I 1500 more because I think ice melt's going to be a big amount. So AJ, at this point, the new maintenance and supply needs section,
everything there is what you're thinking we're going to absorb in the town hall budgets >> except for I guess the ice melt. >> Okay. Mar just said >> it's it's um it's it's varied. I'll go through
>> Okay. and I'll make once I figure out all the budget lines and kind of get some good guesstimates um or estimates then I'll I'll separate it out. Um okay, >> that'd be good. >> Yeah. Yeah. And I think George for for the minutes I think we can I think it's
probably sufficient for us to say that at a future meeting we'll we'll discuss concrete um amounts for each of these lines that are part of the the building. >> And I don't need to be specific about
these lines. I'm just going to say that there was a section of what were the new needs to be funded by the library and what are >> well so I'm having trouble reading this is a little small but it says new maintenance and supply needs those are all going to be
>> no >> by the town except for the one the ice melter >> ice melt and >> there's also internet >> windowashing >> and and water bottle >> water bottle okay good all right >> window washing >> window washing will be covered by the
the library trust. >> All right. No, I've got this for the minute. The only the only request I have at this point, the only thing I would say is could I please have a copy of this? >> Yeah, this is >> Email it to me. >> Who's in our >> This is in the the FinCom drive. >> Oh, perfect. Thank you. >> Yeah.
>> All I need to know. >> Okay. Uh Susie, >> the other thing that's going to happen in FY 26 and 27 is that the the MN Spear
Library used um heating and electricity. Um and now with a net zero building that's working towards really reducing those costs, um the numbers that show up in FY26
and possibly 27 will be a change of use um for the MN Spear building, which I'm on that committee. It's going to take a long time. Um there's a lot of discussion still going on. We don't know what that is, but I feel like the
library needs to get um a number. And I I don't think the library does it. Maybe Haley does it. I think there's been some um checking into the costs of heating and electricity
which are in the town operating budgets for the MN Spear building. And I think it would be good for the town to know that those costs have been reduced, >> right? >> Um, from the library's existence um, but you know, it may pick up again depending on how the town
chooses to use the MN spear building in the future, but I feel like they need to have the um, credits for that. >> Yeah. Yeah. that that would be a good thing to communicate at town meeting when we when presumably there'll be some you know
opportunity to talk about the new building and and um kind of what what it takes what it's going to require to operate and where are we realizing some savings and yeah okay um
all right I think she's good uh so Maryanne you you've got a little bit of homework. Uh, and then you'll get back to us and we'll we'll then kind of reflect we'll make sure that that gets reflected on these other non- library lines in in the
>> Okay, that's good. We just I just needed some guidance. So, I'm Yeah. Um, so good. Um, good. So, I'll work on that um you know, tedious task over the next month or so and then I'll
send it to Haley and you >> and then if you have questions. Yeah. >> Um you know, I'm I'm happy to come to another meeting. Okay, >> that sounds great. Good. >> Okay. >> All right. Any final questions for the
library team? All right. >> Okay. Well, thanks for joining us and >> All right. Thank you. Thanks for everything you do. >> Congratulations on uh >> Yeah. >> Have you been yet? >> I haven't had a chance to come yet. I was You have to come back.
>> I was I was out of town the the opening weekend. I was sad to miss that. But yeah, but no be swinging by. >> All right. Okay. Thanks everybody. >> Okay. Bye. >> Okay. >> My leave button. >> Okay.
>> Okay. All right. Oh, great. Merryill's here. Um, hi Merryill. >> Hi. >> So, um, we've got a quick item to discuss and, um, I'll fill everybody in. And, um, so I, um, you you guys may
recall at a previous FINCOM meeting, we we talked about sort of some like long-term sort of planning kinds of questions. And one of them was the in anticipation of us knowing that
we weren't exactly sure what the timing was, but that at some point our current contract for our trash and recycling um hauling would be expiring. And then there's a question of well what do we do
at that point? And um and you know we wanted to sort of think about that as sort of openly and sort of creatively as possible. And and that included even you know sort of big ideas like well
what you know what would it mean to present residents a couple of different options. one being, well, here's what, you know, it's going to cost under a new negotiated contract with maybe a new provider or
maybe a new contract with the existing provider. Um, and you know, here's here are some potential alternatives. Um, and in the context of that that discussion, I think Merryill had uh came to a select
board meeting that I attended to talk about this. And um, so a couple things came out of that. One, she alerted me to the fact that we actually had um, our current contract with Cassella actually has an extension year. Could you could
you give us a kind of a just a summary of sort of how that contract works and when we actually are looking at needing a new contract with a new provider? >> Sure. Our current contract with Cassella ends June 30th, 2027,
but we formatted the contract so that it's a five-year contract with a one-year option to extend. They don't at that point give you a price on that one year, but it's there as an option. And I
will say that uh it makes a big difference whether we're starting looking at an RFP for a new contract for 2027 or for 2028 because I've been attending some curbside contracting
um group meetings with other towns sponsored by DP and they say you should have 18 months to two years to develop your RFP and go through the process. That said, uh so I've been thinking
about it a lot lately and today um I met with Haley Bolton and Mary Glavin who's our new chair of the recycling and solid waste committee and we talked about some of these options and I told them how
important it is that we have to find out whether we can extend the contract by a year and I've been in touch with Cassella asking that question. And the last response I got was, "We can't tell you till October of 2026." And I basically said to them, "That's too
late. We need to know sooner." So with Haley present, I said, "Let's call them." And we did. And we talked to the person who handles the municipal contracting. And our current current contract has an annual increase of 5% of
the cost of the contract every year. Mhm. >> And I said to this guy, "We need to know now. We're willing to go with the 5% for a one-year extension. What's your response to that?" And he said, "I think that's doable. I'm going
to talk to my bosses and I can probably get you a signed contract for the extension within two weeks." So, that's great news actually for the town because it takes some pressure off. Um, regardless of that though, we don't want
to miss out on the opportunity to be working on a new RFP. Uh, so and it's not too early to start that even with this one-year extension. It gives us more breathing room. The other thing that Cassella said was they will more
than likely, well, they basically will extend this one-year contract for trash bags pickup at the curb. After that one year, for a lot of different reasons, mostly because of labor issues,
uh their own staffing, injuries, etc. They're going to want the town to move to uh uh toers that are automatic dumping so that they don't have to have people um doing
that, you know, going out and hauling them. It's just too difficult. So, if in fact we have to do that, and I will say that I looked at our responses from 2022 when we went out to bid last time, Cassella was the only contractor of the
three that bid that gave us a bid for bags. And they're saying now they're probably not going to bid bags. We did uh design the last contract so that it had the option of bags or automated so we could compare and the bags were
cheaper. Now um I don't know if that'll continue to be especially with you know the injuries that they have to deal with. So anyway, at our last recycling and solid waste meeting, we had a subcommittee formed to work on the
contracts and it's me, Mary Glavin, um, and, um, Gail Fly Shaker. Um, and in the past, we've always done these contracts and RFP process just within our own group, and we've never had an
issue with that. In fact, our contract now is a really good contract. I will say but nonetheless um we thought we would extend to the finance committee because you had you know so many concerns about costs. Um if you want to
appoint someone to our committee we would welcome them to join in. Two things related to that though um one is that we have put in for a grant for technical assistance with D. So if we
get that uh they will fund u some expertise for people who will you know help us review the contracts etc. And then the other thing is just that we um you know we think we have a good group
of people ready to work on it. And uh the biggest thing is looking at how well it's not really part of the contract so much. It's outreach to the community, but how these toers if we have to go to that >> Yeah. >> will affect the town. I guess the issues
with that is how do we structure that in the contract because we have 33 gallon bags that that the pay as you throw bags that we use. Now the totters come in three sizes and the smallest size is 32
gallons which would be comparable to what we do for the bags. So there's there's issues related to that. The whole idea of the bags is that we really push to promote recycling versus trash. >> Yeah. >> That people throw out. Um, so we
wouldn't want to transition to toers to really encourage people to throw up more trash and and less recycling. >> Yeah. >> So those are the kind of issues I think we'll need to think about >> when you structure an RFP. >> It's interesting. There's a couple
things, right? It's like it's one exactly as you said those the bag process sort of builds an incentive for people to produce less garbage which is good for the
planet and good for costs. Um and um but that but the reality is that not and not every household is of the same size and generate is going to generate the same amount of trash. And so it did it does also
u produce some revenue actually I can't um um for you know for people who who need additional bags I'm assuming that gets complicated in this new to system there isn't >> is there an opportunity yeah
>> so it would be complicated u right now that money that we get from raising the bags goes into the recycling revolving fund >> and we spend that to buy more bags. So, it's, you know, it works out pretty well. >> Uh the thing with the toaders are you
could either have the contractor to supply them, which is many towns do that, or DP also does have grants, but it's not every year, I don't think, >> for them to provide totas to the town. >> Yeah. >> Now, if we were able to get the grant
for the totas to the town, >> that's hard to say. Anyway, if we could do that, then it might be a cost savings to the town. Yeah. >> To go with the toters. We're not buying bags. So, this there are a number of issues to look in. And that's I guess
where the fincome expertise and crunching a bunch of numbers would be helpful. >> Yeah. Okay. All right. All right. So, bottom line is is you it would be it would be helpful to have a FINCOM rep join that group to that's working on um
not only preparing the new RFP, but I guess eventually reviewing applications, although now that's looking like that may actually be a little bit of a ways ways off if if all if all goes well. But um okay. Is there anybody
that um would be interested in from the fincom that would be interested in working on this this issue um in working with the the recycling committee on it? I know we've all got lots of
easy >> I'll have to think about it. But I do want to say I was on the um fincom back in the late 80s, early 90s when we when the town had to consider had they raised
was there enough money in the tax levy a portion to um trash collection to sustain the costs that were happening at that time. because of course the contracts go up and they were going up
by maybe more than the kind of revenues that we were able to increase in the levy. And that piece um is what struck me when we got the Cassella contract which was well organized and good but the cost increase is not we we just took
it into our budget. we just absorbed it and that was probably not a healthy thing to do um because that was a big operating increase and there was not any evidence that we had really increased the revenue through two and a half to
help pay for that. So there's a there's a lot of thinking that is sort of um still out there >> and um so I guess you know working on the RFP um is one part of the track but there's
some other things that we need to think about in terms of should this be an override um vote um and as you started off this discussion AJ are there other options
um that are less expensive and have other benefits that people might want to choose. So, how do we look at more than one picture? And how do we make sure we have all the pieces of the picture like
the expense, the community involvement, the community failures, all those things? How do we figure out that about different options? And um I don't know if I have the endurance for this right now. I got a lot of other stuff going,
but I really feel it's a basic part of this adventure and looking at what trash for Shootsberry should be following this contract. >> Yeah. >> Can I I can never find my little hand
thing, but >> go ahead. So the recycling solid waste committee has every time we have a contract and in between looked at the issues that you're talking about Susie. We've looked at
buying our own trash vehicles. We've looked at toasers in the past. We've looked at single versus dual stream. And we also our last contract we had. Yes. the tra the the new contract we got in 22 was a
lot higher. The contract we had last time bankrupted the company that was proposing it literally. So we had an unbelievable deal last time and we could not expect to keep that. Our contracts are comparable or better than some of
the other towns that have these contracts. And I mean, you can spend forever looking at different options and you're going to end up, I believe, where we are now. Um, the it and we're a volunteer committee as
well. So, you know, we we looked at what it would mean to have our own truck and hire people to collect trash, and it just there's so many regulations. It just made zero sense.
uh some of you know we we can look at some ways to structure this RFP so maybe we can put in options there that will be helpful to the town but I I also believe that you know there's a lot of residents
in town who don't feel like they get a lot from their taxes they maybe don't have kids in the schools whatever and this is something that is a huge benefit to everyone in town to have their trash collected
uh and and taken and giving people the 50 trash bags or whether it would be a toer is something very tangible and positive for the residents of the town that they can hang their hat on and feel like they're getting some service. If
you start pulling all that stuff from people, I think you will have rioting in the streets. And at our committee meeting, you know, after we met with the select board, I mentioned to the group uh that there had been a proposal to look at a transfer station to the town
and every single person there started rioting. They basically voted no way. This is like you can't imagine how difficult that is to even consider doing. Do you want it in your backyard, Susie? I don't think so.
And that's the response you're going to get from anyone in town. They tried to do it near Lake Wyola, put in a transfer station back in the 50s and that went down in flames. So, I mean, there aren't a lot of good options out there. If you
keep putting pressure on this issue, what's going to happen is you're going to see dumping illegally all over town and it's going to come back to bite us all. So yes, you can spend time thinking about it if you want, but I really believe
that what we need to do is focus on the issues related to putting together a strong RFP for the town that pro protects us and includes what are our different options that are going to be most palatable to residents. >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Fair enough. So I think in in I think in any scenario we need to have the best possible contract, right? Because we we because because of the options that might be available for the
town to pursue, one of them is going to be a new contract with a with the current provider or a new provider. And we want that to be the most advantageous contract to the town as possible. So, um, so yeah, it's and and even if even
if what we end up wanting to do is present the town a couple of a couple of options, one of them is going to be that option. So, so we need to have the best possible
um RFP process to generate the best bids that are going to provide the service that's needed for the town and that are going to resolve some of the issues that Merryill raised with with a likely new kind of process because the one we're
using right now is is kind of getting outdated. Um so yeah, all all of that stuff needs to be sorted out. um separate and apart from thinking about are there alternatives that ought
that ought to be not necessarily recommended but like presented to to the town like this is it this is what it's going to cost to go down this path and that may be well supported by the town and um if it is we will pursue that but
here is an alternative that is less ideal in some ways but might have this other benefit. Um and so it may be a simple matter, well not a simple matter, but a matter of presenting um residents a couple of different
models and getting, you know, sort of public input on what what's what the preference is. And it it I you know I have no reason to question your assumption Mel that that in all likelihood the feedback will be
it's important and it's worth the cost. Um, but you know, I think we I think from the thinkcom's perspective, we we want to make sure we're thinking about this um thinking about um what are the realistic
options that are available and giving that information to town residents to to to make the call about what we ultimately pursue. And I I'll just say that, you know, that's fine, but I've already I'm a volunteer. I I do get a small stipen,
but it doesn't come close to the number of hours that I've already put in on this and will have to put in on this. So, my I guess my feeling is I personally don't want to spend a lot of time looking into a lot of other things.
I want to focus on what I believe is the direction the town's going to go. It's just too much to ask to looking at at everything in the world. >> Understood. >> And I also am on a monthly meeting with
DP and people from across the state who are in similar position to mine for developing uh a curbside RFP, contracting RFP. >> Um I hear the issues they have. I hear
the you know the approaches they have the options they have they talk about different aspects of developing it and I think that's very helpful in in moving forward with the RFP process. So >> correct.
>> Um, so I would just say if if someone from FINCOM wants to work with us on the RFP process, >> yeah, >> we would invite you to do that. >> That that's >> we do not want to spend any time on that looking at lots of other options because
we just don't have the time and energy to do that. It's too we, as I said, we have looked into other options in the past and there really aren't good ones that we have come up with. >> Got it. Okay. So, let me do this. Let me
um I'm going to give our committee um until the next meeting to sort of think about their interest in joining you. And so I'll be in touch with you about um who you know a FinCom member that might be interested in working on this and and
should join your your RFP group. >> And and as I said, we've never had one in the past. Yeah. >> So if no one wants to do it, I'm fine with that because we have input from DP. We have the folks on these other committees and we have, you know, a
strong group working on the actual document and and I this is about my fourth >> Yeah. >> Paul that I've worked that I've worked on. >> Yeah. No, I I think I've I said this to you at the select board. I appreciate
that we have a very experienced uh volunteer that's kind of over overseeing the the process. So that that's much appreciated and I appreciate the invite. Um so let me um let me follow up with you and and I'll I'll bring it up with
the fincom again at our next meeting. See if >> if anybody's interested in working on it. Okay. Thanks Mar. >> Thanks for your time. >> All right. Byebye. >> Good to see you. >> Yeah. Okay. >> All right guys. I'm gonna um
jump to an ARP's budget followup. So um there's a few things to to sort of update you on here around the regional budget. Um the first is something that I just noticed
uh earlier today. There is a um a regional uh uh school committee meeting to happening now. Um and one of their updates was a
um discussion of the the budget. And so they I happened to see there were a couple documents posted. Um so here's one. Um, so this this is the timeline that I guess the
uh the regional school committee is anticipating in terms of dealing with the FY27 budget. And you'll notice that um >> could you blow it up just a little see that
>> that it doesn't appear that there's in the in the in the timeline here um a plan for another four town meeting. So I think what's happening is they are
um going to be uh basically discussing Okay. So then there's this was another document uh that was posted. They're going to be discussing um ways to achieve
budget cuts as high as$2 million $60,000. And um I think uh as part of that process they they had committee members um provide feedback on kind of what
their priorities are and kind of what are their sort of stayaway areas of from the budget that they were hoping would not be um impacted by these cuts. But you'll notice that the budget that
at least is attached to this memo, and I'll share these documents with you, is the budget that yeah, that includes $2 million worth of cuts required and is the one that increases Sheets's
assessment by.74%. So, I'm not suggesting this is what they're going to pass, but it's at least the the the the budget model that they're proceeding with right now in terms of their discussions about kind of
what cuts might need to be required. So, I'm sure this is going to be a fastmoving, but I guess what I wanted you all to know is that this appears to be the budget that they're at least looking at at this point. And two, that
there we should not anticipate another four towns meeting because it doesn't appear to be in their their their timeline. Um, okay. So, so CZ, go ahead. So the other group that formed the fiscal sustainability, they're not on
that timeline. Do you know if how that intersects? >> Yeah. So that group is not talking about FY27 budget. there. That group is really um thinking about sort of policy that
can um potentially be used to sort of help the future sustainability of the of the school the the the regional schools. >> Great. Um, okay. So, that those are a
couple quick updates and I'm sure I will at some point look at the recording from tonight's meeting. But, um, so I'm sure at our next meeting there'll there'll be an update about what they talked about tonight. Um the other thing related to
this that I wanted to mention is that you all may have read in the newspaper about um developments in >> Pelum. >> Um and this is another sort of fastm
moving issue. Um I attended a meeting last week of the of that fiscal sustainability committee and at that meeting um John Tricky the finance committee chair um for Pelum
mentioned um that there are I'm actually going to pull up my notes now um that there are really serious concerns about um how they're going to sustain the element elementary school. Um, and I'll give you a couple
of details. One is that they um, they basically have determined that they have $135,000, which is the equivalent of a 2 and a half% increase in their tax levy to spend on all increases across their budget.
That's kind of how they're approaching their budget this year. So they've basically level funded all departments um and they're asking their departments to absorb um to they to to absorb their
cola increases out of their operating costs. Um they don't want to utilize the little bit of excess levy capacity that they have right now. Um, and they're
expecting that, this is at least from John Tricky's mouth, they're expecting all of the increase in their regional assessment to come out of the elementary school budget. So, and then the last thing is that I
guess there have there's a group or or there's been some process that has determined that there's $6.5 million of capital needs over the next five years associated with this elementary school and they do not he does not think
that there's support available to fund that via an override. So all of these issues are kind of coming together to create something of a of a crisis in Pelum regarding their elementary school. And at that meeting he said, you know, I
think our the path that we're likely to head down is to send our kids to Shootsbury Elementary or um you know the the new Ammerst um
elementary school and close the ele elementary school. And I have heard him talk about this as a concept in the past, but I think it's fair to say that there's a different sort of level of urgency that they're dealing with now.
And then following that meeting, as I was talking with Anna Herod about, well, we ought to think this through and make do some followup. I it turns out that that this the Pelum school committee met last
Thursday and there was a proposal presented by the superintendent that they that the new middle school the sorry the new sixth grade academy at the middle school absorb um the the current
fifth graders from from Pelum. Um and so so the sixth graders from Pel next year be be a part of that group and and kind of as almost as a step towards the the the the scenario
that John Tricky was talking about where um all of those Pelum students would eventually attend um I think in Ammerst mind an Ammeris uh elementary school.
So, um I, you know, came out of that meeting and and these this these developments feeling like there's um an opportunity for Shootsberry that ought to be examined, carefully considered. um
to put some details on it. There are currently 61 um students at Pel Elementary that are Pelum residents. Um there are 67 additional students that are choicing in
to Pelum. It's not clear what the obligation of any receive any receiving town whether that's Shootsbury or Ammerst what obligation they would have to absorb those additional students that are currently choiced in to Pelum. I
think that according to John that's a topic that's still being kind of investigated at this point. But um you know the the the I think the the obvious point for Shootesberry is is is this is you know is this an opportunity
for us where you know the marginal cost of absorbing these let's say at least the 61 Pelum students is um you know assuming there is capacity um
significantly lower than the cost of you know whatever assessment revenue we would receive from from Pelum. And I think I think there's some good reason to think that that would be the case because you know again assuming that we have the capacity at
the elementary school without having to create lots of new class groupings right which I think is probably likely but again needs to be that's a question that's one of the questions that needs to be answered. So
um now this is all moving fast. It's all complicated. You saw in the newspaper understandably Pelum families are not happy that this was even floated as a possible um you know fix for or a
solution for for FY27 or or beyond. Um, but it does seem to me that this is if if if this is the path that Pelum is likely to go down that we ought to see
if this is um something that could be beneficial to to Shootsberry. So, um, but with all that background, um, there's a meeting that has been pulled together by Haley for tomorrow that includes the principal,
um, uh, >> hopefully a member of the school committee, although I think I saw an email that he might not or he's going to be late to that, Haley. But anyway, you I'm sure you saw it. Um um uh the superintendent um I think Caitlyn the finance director
actually I think the superintendent wanted her to join that discussion so I think she's going to be there as well. Uh I'm going to join that that conversation as well. And so there there's going to be a discussion tomorrow about um I think does this
sound like an opportunity for Shootsbury? The way I'm thinking about it is it's not just a way to kind of stabilize the financial the operating picture for for the for the elementary school, but there may this this this
could be an opportunity to improve the experiences of all all students as well, right? There there may be, you know, sort of special programs and specialties that, you know, are kind of hard to see
how they would be sustainable right now given the the the current revenues, but maybe if there's additional revenue with 60, you know, plus kids coming from Pelum, maybe that becomes more more likely. you know, there's sort of
supplemental programming, staffing, you know, we we ought to think of this not just as a something to help the financial picture for the elementary school, but maybe something that actually, you know, creates
opportunities to have an even better experience for students. So, that's how I'm thinking about it. Um, it's a it's a complicated issue. There's a lot. I'm sure there are risks that I'm not I'm not part of the school committee. I
don't, you know, I'm not I don't work at the elementary school. So, I'm not I'm sure I'm not there are risks that I'm not thinking through. And that's why it's good to have the the principal and other school folks in bring to bring them in on the conversation um tomorrow.
So, um anyway, so that's kind of what's happening on that front. Um, Haley, did you want to add anything to that or does that >> No, that was a pretty comprehensive update. Um, you know, I think it's just very preliminary and just very much
wanted to see could this be a benefit to both towns. >> Yeah. >> In some way. >> Yeah. And you know, I think the other thing to mention is the the reason why I think I felt a little bit of urgency to get this the ball going on this is that
I think I do think Ammerst sees this as a something that could be potentially beneficial to them. And so I I got the impression that that Amoris would be, you know, very open and excited about the possibility of absorbing these
students and they think they think they have the capacity for it. Actually, John in at that meeting last week was like, you know, I'm not sure if if if Amoris has the capacity to take on um these these additional students and Shannon Bernac, the finance director for the
region was there and was jumped in right away and said, "Don't be so quick to assume we can't do this. We we've done a little bit of thinking about this." And um so I think you know I think um that to to me that sort of creates a
little bit of of urgency to sort of get these conversations started because if this is something that's a real possibility and again I don't know that I mean it's early so it's and it's complicated but if it is I think we would need to get moving on on on some
on on this pretty quickly. Just to be clear though, they're definitely going to be having um there's definitely going to keep Helm School open at least through FY 27 28 >> 20 FY7. >> Yes, correct.
>> Exactly. Um, so there there is there is at least a, you know, there was a a thought a proposal to potentially move the sixth graders uh out of Pelum Elementary and bring them into the middle school, but but that's that's it
as far as FY27. >> Can I ask a stupid question? >> No. >> Yes. There's no there's no Yes, you can, but there's no stupid questions. Yeah. Um, so you said like one of the things uh that they're talking about are the capital projects for the elementary
school and not wanting to take those on. Yeah. But if this if they like dissolve the school, the building still exists. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Absolutely. I you know that's that's um >> that's a Pelum problem,
I guess. But I don't I don't Yeah, you're absolutely right. I mean, what what happens to that building and and um you know, I haven't heard John talk about that at all, but >> housing. >> Yeah. >> Uh Susie,
>> um I am glad that there's this opportunity. It will involve a lot of people sorting it out and it's really hard for our small town to be able to do that very nimly because everybody has jobs, etc. The thing I'm most concerned
about is that um the Gazette article didn't cover the fact that state aid is part of this picture and they just left that off. They just had the other kind of um specific to Pelum, but the fact
that rural aid got cut, the fact that Chapter 70 is not supporting schools um feels to me that in some ways Pelum is a canary in the coal mine and we need to understand that. And so I have drafted a
letter um to send to the gazette which I will just sign it myself and I won't say I'm from the finance committee but um I have been collecting those postcards um and talking to people in the library and it turns out that that's a good PR
opportunity to bring this issue in front of people and I feel a little sad that this may be seen as only Pelum's problem. Um and and we um heard from the governor at the
MMA and she mentioned that um she's proposing rural aid go from um 12% which is where she put it last time down 25% that she'll put it up to 20 million and
um and 20 million is about a third of what the reports say is needed and and I just feel like what Pelum is up against is something we all need to understand. Um we're going to try to get ourselves
out of FY27 in one piece. There's the uh Western Mass roundt in South Hadley trying to figure this out, but we are all under this underfunding problem. And I am glad that we might have an opportunity to steer through this
because even though Pelum will put together a plan for FY27, it seems clear that there will be people who will choice out of Pelum or some of the people that have choiced in may choice out for FY27. So there may be some sort
of immediate >> um change that we would benefit by. But um to me the significant thing about this is the funding um for schools is so inadequate and
there are many other small rural communities who are right here at the edge with this. So I'm going to send in my letter um probably on Thursday. Um, and I guess I want I think we need to look at the all the pieces that are in
this picture and understand how um we will steer our truck through this. >> Yeah, April, >> I hope we have all-wheel drive. >> Well, one thing that had been discussed over the years is regionalizing the
three little schools. And you know, I I wonder if if perhaps leverage should be part of this conversation as well. Um being as Susie points out that that this may be the canary in the cold mind and maybe there's a way that the three towns
could work together. I know that's adding a whole other layer, but it's just something to think about. >> Yeah. Well, well, that's true, April, but there's at 4town meeting, we saw a lot of people really like the idea of regionalizing. So, I think it's I think
you're right. I think it could very well be one of the solutions that >> So, additional funding with that. Sorry. So, so, so there was a um I don't know if Susie or George if if you guys were um involved in this at all, but wasn't
there a um a a one of the regional studies that was done looked at um a the three towns creating their own >> Well, it was more than a study, >> right? >> That was that that committee that met a
number of years ago and nobody that got stuck. The parents didn't support it, right, April? Wasn't that what it was? >> Yeah, basically. >> What's been told to me about that was that ultimately
>> families from Leverett and Shootsberry didn't support the proposal. Pelum, I think, might have actually, but but it was Lever and Shoots the kind of families were just too, you know, >> they like their elementary schools and they want to give up control. And the
other issue was, you know, um there was an issue about an off-ramp if we if they wanted to get out of it. And there was also an issue Shootesbury wanted to consider it, but they didn't want to jump in in the first year and the other towns didn't want to give us that option. So there were some sticky
points. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> All right. Well, I guess you know what's changed is the the the financial sort of context and climate, right? since since that study was done, it probably
um probably felt like not not a not a supportive climate in terms of state aid and whatnot, but I think the the picture is probably very different right now than than it was. That was how long ago? 10 10 years ago or something like that.
>> Yeah, not quite 10, but getting close to it. >> Everything's 10 years ago. >> Yeah, that's right. Honestly, it might have been it. might have been 20. >> Yeah. Okay. Um Susie, I see your hand up. >> And also Lynn Grismer at the end of that
last four towns started talking to me about there are different um models for regionalization. Now I don't know if that was just a lack of information compared to what people had known. Very hard to pass knowledge forward um in
these very many changes that happen. Um, so there could be more to learn about them or there could actually be some different ones. I didn't realize cognitively that um, Wendell and New Salem are a region in our U28. They have
a regional budget. Um, it has a different format. And so I'm going to go up and talk to Caitlyn about that on Friday to understand how that works. And so this could all get very complicated
um if say uh Shootsberry and Pelum were to regionalize but Pelum is not part of U28. So a lot of dancing here and um perhaps um
it will end up being something altogether different. Um maybe it'll be a choicing. Um who knows? But because there's so much to think about, it seems very hard to get anything. But maybe some people that want to jump into
Shootsberry for FY27 because they don't like the way it's going in Pelum. >> Yeah, George. >> Yeah, some of those school choice kids probably would and some of them may even come from Shootsbury and Wendell and it would be easy for them. Um, just want to point out about regionalization and what
happened 10 years ago. Just so everybody understands, there was a lot of money associated with that because the state was going to give us um, a big chunk of money. I think it was like 350,000 and that was going to help all our towns with the budgets. And so that's one of the reasons why school committee members
were very much in favor of it. And when the two towns turned it down, there was some real animosity because other towns saw that the savings they could have reaped from it, they weren't able to get. And they blamed us. I mean, they certainly blamed Shootbury. I can tell
you that firsthand. >> So that was $350,000 not not for like technical assistance, but actual like operating. >> I think that No, it it was a carrot that the state is giving towns. >> Wow. and additional aid for funding your
school if you regionalize. Interesting. >> But wasn't wasn't that also considering Ammerst the pre you know Ammeris regional being prek for including Ammeris in that region you know we we had that there were a couple of different but again you know these
should all be on the table. >> Yeah. Yeah. I think you're right April. What at least what it's been explained to me is that there were sort of two different studies that um may have happened kind of sort of overl I don't know if they were overlapping but one of them was a
four towns K through 12 regional concept and then the other was a regional district the elementary district that included the three nonmer towns but >> yeah that's the regionalization I think >> so it's time to look at it again.
>> And just one thing I might I'm going to say is, you know, the way funding is happening in Massachusetts and and small towns like ours, I just think the state is going to push us to regionalize and more more things than just education, fire, highway, and you know,
the cost of equipment, the cost that it takes to keep our highway department with all the adequate equipment, it's just getting too gray and towns are going to have to start sharing. We'll see. But I just If things don't change with the funding from the state, I don't know what options we're going to have,
>> right? >> And it it's not necessarily bad to look at regionalizing, you know, >> more work. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. It >> we've got young people. >> It's it's both I think you're right, April. It's both risks and
opportunities, right? Like there are >> certain Yeah. certain opportunities that come from just having a school that serves >> 180 students as opposed to 120 students. And you know, certain things just and
and the you know, even justification for >> certain kinds of capital improvements become a little bit >> easier to obtain um because you've got a larger school body that's and the revenues associated with that that are
supporting it. Okay. >> Yeah. Anyways, >> wh >> will So, there are going to be some updates to share at our next meeting. I believe at least John told me, although I didn't see it I'm not I I didn't see it posted, but I think John said that they are having a follow-up meeting this
Thursday of that of the special appelum school committee to to pick up where they left off. So, I think they're going to be um multiple updates about this at our next meeting. All right, it's pretty late, guys. Um, is there anything else
that I I know we we got a couple other things on the agenda, but maybe we ought to just um table that for uh I guess it was just the fincom communications update and then seeing if you guys had any other
>> and we have two minutes uh two meeting minutes we'll have to review the next one, the 7th and the 13th and then we'll have this one the 27th. >> Yeah. All right. We will make sure to get those done at at our next meeting. >> But what about Jesus Christ? What about
um the fiscal summit being scheduled in on February 10th? >> All right. So, let's take a look uh at the schedule. Let's see. >> We need to and you know to have that summit. We need to sit down and look at
where we are in >> Yeah, exactly. We We got We have to There's There's There's work to do. We got to incorporate all of the budget that we've now discussed um into a a a draft budget, I think, that we can
share. Uh >> well, maybe we're not going to have the regional school committee one on March 10th. >> Yeah. >> And we can't really move capital planning up. Um so um and we're not going to do the
elementary school. So I >> maybe February 10th is for having a draft budget prepared with the numbers that we have and our discussion about some of the possibilities
and then try to do um the fiscal summit February 24th. >> Yeah. put capital planning on March 10th. uh review draft FY27 budget
just plan for fiscal summit and then do it's it won't be too long before we start meeting weekly again. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I think >> maybe this looks like our our our schedule for the next few couple
meetings, right? Does that sound right to folks? >> Here, let me take a look. >> Um, so on February 10th, we could um look at um potentially a a draft of the
FY27 budget. I think the good news is that I think Haley, you've been like keeping things like uh you've been like starting already track tracking um kind of these new budget that we've been getting from departments and incorporating them in in a draft. So I
think we'll we'll be able to do that um on the the 27th. There's going to be a lot of assumptions, a lot of placeholders. Um will we have cola? Um >> you said two policy sorted out by then, short.
>> Um, yeah, I can have we can have cola >> for February 10th. >> Yeah, >> close. Um, that's cutting it close. Uh, I don't know when the CPI comes out. Um, pretty close. >> Well, at least I tell you what,
>> at least have like, you know, a pretty good >> I'm going to use December's index. If January's comes out, I'll I'll change it. >> Yeah. >> Okay. April, you wanted to see the process. We should talk about that maybe offline. >> And also the um uh bud the uh salary
scales for fur cog for FY26 has not come out yet. So that's so our personnel that's sort of hanging out there. >> Can we just um meet the other half and and not change the rest of them this
year? Yeah, that's kind that's what I was thinking we would have to do because it's $10,000 >> more or less that we have we set aside. >> Got it. Okay. All right. So, I think we have a plan.
>> Sorry, Haley, were you gonna say something? Yeah, I was going to say if we if we we are going to go to once a week meetings, but is it possible like on select board meeting nights? Can we pick a different day?
>> Yeah. Um well, let's let's discuss that at our at our next meeting. I I don't I don't think we're going to need a meeting between now and um and the 10th. So we we can we can talk about um
um and especially since we don't have any budget reviews to do that night, we'll have a little more time, >> so we can look at this at this schedule and >> Okay. >> see when we might need to add additional dates to it. >> Okay. All right. Um
anything else urgent uh to get to before we adjourn? >> Okay. >> I think that's >> Thanks for staying late, guys. Um try not to make this a habit. >> Uh I will make a motion to adjourn the fin comment 9 11.
>> I'll second that. >> I cash I >> Moer I >> Moss I >> Good night. >> All right. Good night everybody. >> Say