call the meeting to order. Um, and I guess we can start off with attendance and I'll go down. Uh, uh, sorry, Ellen, I'm let you catch up. Are you keeping track of attendance? Okay,
yeah, go ahead. Okay, so Norm is not here. Okay, let's see who that is. Okay, let's take it. Hi, Dick. Um, looked like we were getting bombed. Uh, bunch of people
trying to get on we don't recognize and have a feeling it was uh, you know, the uh, the old attack thing again. So, okay, Norm's not here. He may show up. Uh, Mike. Oh, Malcolm Devet. Yep. Mike Debay.
Yep. Dick Renellis is uh he's there. He's just not on off mute yet. Scotty here. Eric Mueller here. Paul Murphy. Yep. Paul Yokum. Yep. Ken Phillips is not here. And Dick Gran's here.
Thank you, Dick. Okay. So, I think I think it's Yep. Can you hear me? Hello. We have a quorum. So, we have a quorum and I think may show up if he can get off the plane. Uh
so, so let's start off first. Uh take a look at the meeting minutes and see if they're acceptable as written. Uh somebody noted that there's a typo on the agenda um because it says 911, but
this is actually the the 9:25 meeting. Uh any Okay. Any updates? Anybody want to make any changes? I read from minutes at home. I didn't see any errors in there. I think
nothing motion we accept it as written. Okay. Uh a second. Paul, you're going to a second. All in favor? I. All opposed? I Okay, so I've got to go through and do
the roll call on it. Um, so Malcolm deb. Yes. Yes. Mike Debay. Yes. Dick. Hi. Hi. Eric. Yes. Paul Murphy. Hi. Paul Yokum. Hi.
Okay. Good. Exactly. Uh, next thing would be the Concom update, but Norm is stuck on a plane. So, and the one after that is the master plan. Norm also stuck on a blank. Um,
well, maybe I should mention the since it was in the notes that I was going to go there. Okay, we can admit. I'm sorry. Well, it says here Scotty Graves will be speaking at the next meeting to explain that handpicking accumulated debris in the mass part of the canal should be
allowed to keep a continual flow of water for the health of the lake. Okay. Yeah, please, please, fellow. So I went to just you know for those that didn't know I went to the concom meeting as it was uh you know my my idea I ran it by Dick he said thought it was a good
idea so I went to the concom meeting and basically waited an hour and 20 minutes for my turn in any in any event I'm I explained that uh the most important thing is to keep the water
flow flowing whether it be large or small and uh that I felt that handpicking uh should be allowed. And uh make a long story short, uh they did not want to go back to the mass D on any of
this stuff because they were afraid they'd muddy the water. So they basically just said, "Let's leave everything the way it is." And yes, we're okay with that. Uh, we did agree that if it was whether it be the DPW, whether it be somebody with a piece of
equipment that Concom should be notified in advanced to give their stamp of approval if it comes to that. And, uh, outside of that, uh, they thanked us, all of us on LMC, uh, for our efforts at
keeping the water flow down there. And, uh, so it was all good. Good. Excellent. So, they weren't to make an amendment. In other words, they said if it would be too messy for us to go back and try to amend it, let's just we're okay with it. And that's how
we left it. That's excellent. Okay. Okay. Uh so then I'll I'll move on. Uh the next thing on here, Canal Brook, great book, the NRCS work. Uh so um you know, a number of us were here at that
initial meeting. Um Dick, I I I think that meeting was pretty useful. Would you agree? Oh, yes. Yes. Very. We was uh par engineering, NC uh NRCS
uh from town. We had myself, Eric, Nicole, um, Norm, and Sabrina. And, uh, let's see. From We had Safia was on.
Um, I'm trying to think of his Oh. Oh, god. Yeah. And so we have and then we had uh two people from Graanby, Connecticut. So we
had one from Sfield, two from Grandby. Uh nobody showed up. They were they were invited, but nobody was on from Westfield. But it was uh it was good. There's going to be regular meetings like this. There's Yeah, they're scheduled for
Yep. So we'll we'll be doing this regularly. that, you know, had good interactions. Uh, subsequent to that meeting, Dick has sent additional information to them. They are they're very interested in hearing what we have to say. They, you know, they do need to look at the recommendations from the
previous thing. And we had a we had a good discussion about, you know, that the idea that we really don't want to see them concentrating on like a 100 or 500year flood where they wind up, you know, with
a a very very expensive proposition, you know, because we have regular flooding and if we could do something about the regular flooding that would make a huge impact. And then we also made the point that if we had Canal Brook restored and even better that and
Greatbrook, you know, when we look at major floods, those are from events we know are coming. They don't like suddenly wake, we don't suddenly wake up one morning and have four feet of water. It's that there's a hurricane coming our way. And so if we had the ability to lower the lake, we could do that
proactively. So we don't need a solution where you have to be able to deal with a 100 or 500year flood the day it happens. So you know so the so it it was it was a good a good set of discussions. We'll see where it goes from there. Cool.
Eric, I have a question. Yeah. In the meeting they said they were going to start putting the notes from the meeting and everything. I think they call it a SharePoint. Yep. Yep. Dick, have you seen anything on SharePoint or access to it? I included the the uh
minutes. You have copy. I emailed them. Yeah. No, he's asking for the link to the SharePoint site. Yeah, we we have that is so we can send we can share information literally and
eventually it was not set up at the time they sent out the first minutes uh of the meeting. They just emailed those. Yeah, Dick. What they said was they were going to set it up and they took that as an action item and I wondered if you had received anything on the setup of it or
how do we get access to it? Well, I am I'm out on the cape right now, so I don't know. All right. Uh, let's jump to our take it as no and we'll look for it on our next because we have a meeting in next Friday. Friday after that. Friday after that.
Okay. Yeah. Okay. So, let's jump to our favorite topic 159 Birkshshire. Um, what page is that on? So, it starts on 37 goes to 44. Um Dick, do you wanna I mean it it looked to me
like um Concom decided uh that they're not involved. Yeah. um which I still I really do not agree because if you look at uh I I dug out
all kinds of documentation as you can see and and uh some of that I emailed also because they were in color. Uh but that is a well-defined inter it's an intermittent stream but it's well
defined and it was defined back in the 1800s when the railroad was built because the railroad accommodated it in a 3 foot by 4 foot uh culvert granite culvert and it it takes water as I explained
there's also a in the deeds for the for those houses that are on Sheep Pasture Road. The first about five or six and you can see them on the maps. Uh so it's it's number one Point Grove and then it's I don't know what it's high numbers
because uh sheep pastures numbered from south to north but um it's like 280 something or whatever. And those first five maybe six houses are have in their deeds it says water course. And if you
look that up that is a that is a a definition of a space that has to be maintained for water to flow over in those yards. So they accommodated the water from there and then they also accommodated that same water course
continues on through the property that was Edgewood before Edgewood was built. So you know, so if if Concom is not involved in this, that doesn't mean the thing goes away, right? The the right you know the right
thing to enforce. It's just Concom's not going to be involved. But uh John Goddard is the he he's our stormwater guy for the town and and uh
interim director uh and I also spoke with the planner and as far as I know and that meeting occurred uh last night I believe was the planning board meeting. I do not know the results
of that because supposedly an updated plan was going to be presented and that's about the fourth or fifth time that an updated plan was going to be presented and I and they they had not as of Wednesday when I checked nobody had
received any updated plan yet. So uh if it was presented I was there till noon time. So is if it was presented to them, they got it in the afternoon sometime or at the meeting. Okay.
But we're we're staying firm about there should not be a detention pond. And if you're going to have a detention pond and a and essentially a weird, you know, a they were going to do it with stone,
just stone loose. Yeah. And I think I've got everybody understanding that that's a recipe for disaster because they just rock and roll when you get a heavy flow. They're gonna wind up underneath Berkshire Avenue Culver,
you know. And the other thing is you can't it's both at a state and federal level. You can't just build a detention pond. There's process for doing that. if they want to build a pond, they need to follow the process
and they'll either get approved or not approved. And that process includes, you know, notice of intent and and um and uh design, you know, design studies and I mean there's a whole thing to it and that is where this discussion would come
up about how you want to build the detention pond. But at the moment and that's and that's exactly what Borne Consulting Engineering did for the pond that is across the street. You know, it's in the Oldtown Beach. Yeah,
that was they did all the analysis for flows and and where it came from and how much and uh in you know major storms, what does the flow look like? So they did all those calculations and they're
the ones that designed it with the u gabian baskets which have not now that's been there 20 years as of this year. It's 20 years and they haven't moved. Yeah. So that clearly works. Okay. All right. Um I think there's
Can I can I bounce in here real quick? The planning board last night was asked for a continuance by Derek Hail, the guy at 159 Brooks. So they hit me. Okay. Okay. Just let just to let you guys know.
Thank you. Thank you. Who was that? Clifton Clark. Okay. Thanks. Thanks, Clint. Okay. Uh the next topic we're going to talk about, which we brought up before, had to do with uh wake surfing and
specifically uh impacts uh with regard to wake surfing and erosion. Um so I did a little fishing around um and actually this has been studied uh there's a publication that you guys have a copy of um from the journal of water resource
and protection uh published back in 2022 um where they they did a careful study of the impacts and the there's a lot of stuff here you can look at. The general summary is the following. uh so long as the further away from shore you are the
better and the deeper the water is the better. But if if you're as shallow as 10 ft, which we're not, if you're as shallow as 10 feet, then if you're 200 feet from shore, then the impact of wake surfing is no greater than the impact of
of winds, you know, you know, just just waves that you erosion you can't avoid just because you have wind. So, and and part of the reason to understand that is when you look at the impact of erosion, it's it's
a combination of how big an event impact is times how often that thing happens. So, wind of course takes place much more often than wake surfing takes place. And so the total amount of time you're
exposed to wind is much larger than the total of amount of time you're exposed to any you know boating activity on the lake. So so the long and the short of it is there the recommendation from this is if you're in if you're in only 10 ft of water then you want to be doing this 200
ft from shore. the if you're in more than 10 ft you can be closer but that moves how much closer you can be moves very slowly. So we've got like 20 ft of water so we can be closer but it's not like oh so now you can be only 100 feet.
It's it's not like that. It doesn't go. So, um, what I wanted to suggest, we have rules on the lake that are not actual laws. For example, counterlockwise.
That's something the police will not take it for it. It's there's no law that says you have to go counterclockwise. It's it's a rule we have that is not a legally enforcable rule. It's more of a an encouragement. And what I was going to suggest is that we consider adding to
that body that uh wake sports and in particularly wake surfing should be done 200 feet from shore and no the police can't can't ticket somebody for it but basically try to communicate with people the idea that
you know you need to be staying more towards the middle and not along the edge. Go ahead. I got an opinion. I don't disagree necessarily with it other than the fact that we're making another rule kind of thing. It's not really a rule. Yeah. Yeah. And we got those all over the place that
are enforced now. So, we don't need more of those kind of things. However, however, I brought in another study and Norm had one earlier. This is from state of Wisconsin and it's got references on the back that are 20 pages long. Yeah. and they came up with a different
answer for foot and it varies between 10 feet and 20 feet. 20 is a common number you see a lot ranges from 200 to 600 feet away from the shoreline, right? And it does talk a lot about the fact that depending on your how depth and how it changes, it makes a big difference. Yep. So,
yep. I think I was going to send this to you, Dick, yesterday and I said I want to carry it and I'll email it to everybody on the committee so you can look at it and it's got a lot of um links to go out to different things so you can look at it. So one of the things you look at both sides of the argument make any decision.
So if you read the paper one of the things that they note is that the because I know that paper that's based on measurements. And one of the things they note is there's a lot of problems with those measurements. Yes. and and it said in here there's a lot of problem with these studies too
this guy says. So I mean you got opinions all over the place and I think as a committee we got to at least look at both sides of this before we make any decision on where we go. Yeah. Are we trying to make a new rule here against wakeboards or something? No. So the the the there was a discussion brought up that there are
some lakes that have in the northeast that have banned wake surfing. I've seen it. And one of the there's a number of other issues that I have with that. One of the other issues is it becomes a thing where people are happy to vote to ban something they
don't personally do until the day comes that you want to ban the thing they personally do. Exactly. And if you look at the numerical, the other thing that was pointed out, not in this study, but I found online is actually in most small lakes like ours,
tubing has a much greater effect on erosion than wake surfing. Yes. because there's way more tubing done than weight surfing. So if you look the total impact on erosion is given by the the basically the coefficient of impact
times the amount of time strictly speaking it's the time integral of that. Yeah. And so if you look at that there's drastically more time on our lake spent tubing than there is wake surface. Same with the wake boarding, not not surfboarding, but wake the wake boarding
wake boarding. Same thing because there's so much more of it, right? So the so one of the issues when and I I spoke to Ken about this a while ago also and he said in general he's not a big fan of banning specific activities on lakes, especially public lakes. And
he he said, you know, you wind up with a situation where a particular vocal minority can drive an entire decision and then two years later a different vocal minority will now go after the next thing,
you know. And you if if if you're if you're trying to make the argument based on erosion, then there's a lot of things you'd have to ban first if you want to have the biggest effect. The biggest effect on erosion in our lakes is water level. Yeah.
High high high water. So talking about high water again if everybody I think will agree that the erosion that has taken place especially in the last four or five years where we
have lost a lot of our shoreline into the lake. It only seems that we should be considering a a new lower level as an established level of the lake because 6 in or eight or nine in lower
than the 2244 wouldn't kill anything. You still have plenty of passage through the lakes. Plenty of passage through the lakes sit with a few with a few exceptions. with a few exceptions. However, the benefit of
95% of the homeowners would have their beachfronts backed and we'd have a whole lot less erosion taking place. When we bought our houses, we were But it really but in all fairness, it really becomes a problem when we get closer to 225.
uh when you know when we have extended time with high high water and and boating and that's when we get the damage and if we had Canal Brook cleared so that the water would stay at 224.4
4 to 224.5. Uh you know, you wouldn't have the erosion that we have regularly happening because the lake sits above two to three, four inches above nominal.
Yeah. And I think I think suggesting, you know, let's run it some number of inches, whatever that number of inches. Are you suggesting that for all summer or just in the winter? I'm suggesting it make it a few inches, two or three in 4 in. It would help immensely.
Right. Three in puts the boats on the cove on the bottom of the lake. I'll take pictures. I don't buy that. I'll take pictures for you, Scott. I don't buy that. The last rainstorms we got, my neighbor's boat's floating again.
I'll just go take the pictures. I'll prove it to you. Wow. So three inches is enough to three inches is enough to cause that problem there. Oh yeah. Yeah. Where you live on on North Pond, right? At the left when you go in the left side's always very shallow. Very
The problem is we always about two or three inches higher than we when we get to the lowest point, we immediately go up. Why don't we keep it a couple inches lower and then we can always go up by shutting it by shutting the gate. Right. That's the thought,
right? And and and the last couple of years that's looked good because we've had steady rain. Exactly. But we never know. We've had plenty of rain, plenty of years, no rain. And then Yeah. But that's but that's the thing. We have constant the three of us have always kept it three inches probably two to three. Not really in We've been about an inch
high most of the summer, but we struggle. We Let's be honest, we struggle to try to get it down to that 224. Oh, yeah. It is. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. this year all summer long only once was
it down below that and that was only a month ago and nobody brought it even up at the meeting. But we don't because we always go till he'll turn the gates. If it starts to get to there it's already done because we do that. We automatically if we get to that nominal point we
immediately shut the gates. What I'm saying is maybe we should go the inch the other direction. Yeah. Yeah. I understand. That's just a thought. That's I'm not talking 3 in or whatever you're saying cuz we're constantly as soon as we get to that nominal point, we immediately go
up. We shut the gates and we bring it up and we go up an inch or two inches or three inches and we get ourselves in trouble. But let's get back to this thing. This is We started with this and we're all over the place. What is the bottom line on this? What are we trying to do with this?
So I I think this was brought up for discussion. Oh, okay. Okay. I didn't know if we were trying to vote. No, no, no. This was brought up for discussion said okay you know let's let's come back you know you know and again it was brought up in the context
of erosion which is why we went to the discussion about water all the different things the one thing that I don't like about any of this is that we're trying to get another rule in here against you know boats with ballast tanks that's the bottom line people don't like boats with ballast tanks and they're saying you know they see you
surfing they see me whatever and I don't think we should even touched that in my mind unless there's been complaints from the general public. Yeah. Has there been has anybody heard come? I've continued to look into it.
Oh, yeah. No, no doubt. We should because but there's so many other things like the tubing and and people, you know, wake surfing out there all the time. This all those become more problematic when the when the lake is high, right?
You know, no question. The higher the lake, the more erosion. Yeah. Yeah. No question. Agree. Study looked at erosion on the shoreline because of levels. Yep. And the wake boarding and the surfing and and the whole thing. It also looks
at the invasive species because wake boats carry ballast tanks. And the big thing with ballast tanks is even when you empty them, they pump out. So that means you're going to end up with a residual in the bottom of them. At the end of the year, we take our boats out, we drain them. So you don't freeze up water in your tank if anything's
outside. But that a bigger nuisance fisherman are for moving right now. Now in our in and in a lot of lakes that's true because there's a lot of of ballasted boats that are coming into the their public launches. Actually
we don't have many other words. When I look that the boats that I see out there with ballast tanks I know all those all those the only person I see on our lake surfing is you. Yeah. I've never seen I've seen one other one on our like I think well Bill Pond I see one or two but that's
there there's a couple others. So there's uh directly across from me and then the person who used to own what was Nick Aayod's place, they've moved and they've got a they've got a boat and they serve. The point I brought this in not because I'm pushing this one over anything is you got to look at all sides of this
thing because there's going to be different opinions no matter where you go and everyone I've seen has a different It should be 20 feet, it should be 15 feet, it should be 10 feet, you know, 200 600 feet offshore, you're taking out the whole length. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, I mean, you know, you got to look at everything, but the 200 foot thing is good. I like
the 200 foot thing to keep the people out. My problem is where I am on the lake, I could I could be I knock people off the boards with a paddle as they come by my dock because where I am. Yeah. So, if they stay out 200 feet, then it's a whole different world.
Yeah. Yeah. If you can encourage people, but they don't. But how do you do that? Like he said, that's the You got to get a buoy out there again. And that's the only way because I I took my raft in the other day and I had somebody come across my house. They were well inside where the raft was and they were like that. I said I could have hit them with an ore.
Yeah. Yeah. That's the That's If I was standing on the end of the dock, I could have whacked them with a paddle in there. My booty got run over. That's the problem. They went out there and they just rot. So I mean there's nothing. They backed up over it and they Anyways, I I will send this out to everybody. Okay.
Or Dick, you want me to say everybody? Yeah, we'll send it if you get it to me. Yeah, if you get it to me, I'll get it out. I just want to get it out there for people to see. We have one more topic to talk about, which I brought up before, which is our
our geese and duck problem. Um, so problem. So, I don't we're not the only people who have the problem, okay? We're not the only lake that has the problem. We're not the only community that has the problem. And what I'd like to
suggest is, you know, are I'm going to look into it some, but I'd like to see if anybody else is willing to do some research online, but you know, what have other people done about this? I already called the state on a couple year last year I did it and I chased it around and
I'm not chasing it again after the answers I got out of the state because his answer to me was shoot them because they official I know you can't but the state the official answer to me was they called it addling the eggs or something they bought twist them or some
goofy thing and it's supposedly they die they don't hatch and you I asked the state guy in Boston did this help no I said Well, what's a solution that works? He said, "Shoot him." Yeah. And I said, "You can't do that, right? It's not big enough." Right.
And he goes, "Well," he said, "Put your back against your house and shoot him. One shot, nobody will know where it came from." Oh, that guy from the state told me that. The state told me that. I'm not getting into this conversation. I'm waiting. So, I I You know, I know it's been done with deer and I hear it's been done with
ducks and geese is um putting out food that's laced with birth control. Well, it's better than stuff that'll kill them because then we don't get animals getting, you know. No, no, no, no, no, no. Not uh basically it makes it so they it's bird control. They don't reproduce.
They don't reproduce. Um you know that that's been done in areas that have big deer problems. That's been done where they put out feed that's have birth control in it and then and you don't get them all. Of course, the geese are not eating in the lake. The geese are eating out in the farmer's
fields and bringing it back to the lakes. They're over in Griffin Road. Do you see them over there? That they probably eat it. Hundreds. They might. So, look, I don't know. My My thing is can can somebody pick up
that thread and see, you know, poke around and see is there does, you know, have people done this? Is it successful? Is it expensive? I don't know. Well, you know, it might be something too because they do go to the fields to the
farmers and maybe it's something that we could work if it's uh like a feed type thing, maybe that they'd be willing to help out. Technically, they're got to be in here. Shoot them. The only suggestion I made at the last meeting uh was that, you know, we've
enabled a few of the people on the lake, including Saunders, to keep open all winter long. And my suggestion would be not to allow that. Granted, sometimes the lakes don't freeze at all, but most winters they do. And yet around in those
areas, it's a big wide open area and it, you know, give some more. I think you got to get curtain to I don't they, you know, last year we iced in, but not for very long, but for the three years before that, we didn't ice in at all. You're right. You know, we we a lot of years
now where we're not icing in. Yep. Yeah. That's I could never The climate is No, the climate is is not in our favor. I I'm sorry. I could never understand years ago why he made an issue about that because because his buddy there had
the big he he himself rather he has a big monster forklift that he picks pontoons up with. He could easily pick up all the docks and bring them in. That's a lot of work though. Well, sure. But it also would have him maintaining them and putting a few few bucks in them docks. Yeah. No, I get you.
But what I got a question for. Where did you hear about this where they feed him uh birth control pills or whatever? So, this was poking around online. So, I did a little poking around. Was a serious thing or a joke? No, no, no. It was a serious thing. You know, there a lot of places where
they're having big problems with this are schoolyards. Yeah. You know, my mom was a school teacher and that was a a pro. She's she's passed away now, but she retired many years ago and you know it was grade school, you know, and the kids would come in and covered with it, you know, and it was is a health issue. Yep.
And the town would want to get rid of them and they, you know, okay, well, they can't shoot them where they are and how do they get them out of there and and so that's that's one of the things that apparently some of the towns have gone to to try to decrease the geese and duck population. They claim they claim
by the way if the geese has ducklings here or what do we call them geese or whatever babies here this is where they will come at that's because they're magnetically tied the other thing that I was surprised read about I had no idea I'm looking up
beavers the other day and when beavers have babies how many do they have not one or two more more, many more. I was surprised by how many they can have.
So, you know, I think if this is something we're not gonna I don't know if we're going to solve it, but we're certainly not going to solve it fast, but if we can start to look into it and see what the options are, maybe we can start to pull something together because I the problem the problem is it is is
prevalent. you know, it's widespread across the lake and I think it's actually getting worse over time. You know, it probably Well, it is because they're their numbers. Just remember that they stay where they're born. There's more of them. Make no mistake,
there's more and more of them every year. And they have they have six to eight babies each year, each pair. So, you know, uh, and one other thing before I forget, occurs to me, you know, but this is always, you know, you bring in
predators, right? You know, it's eagles and it's, you know, I don't see anything on that chat. Yeah. The health officer would have an opinion on this. I mean, the town beach and obviously it's not used in the winter,
but that's an area in the summer gets closed because of Yeah. the geese. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right. It doesn't seem nothing. There's nothing there. So, if we can find, you know, it we aren't the only people dealing with
this. So, there there got to be, you know, there have to be things out there that people have tried. And maybe everything they tried didn't work, but I I got to believe there's there's stuff out there that people have tried. Yeah. Eric, there's one other thing I don't
think you covered was Somehow I think we skipped over it unless I missed it was the proposed changes to the LPP. Oh, you're right. You're right. I did miss it. Sorry. Yep. Let's go back. Uh,
so Dick, you want to you had been looking at this? Is there anything there we need to comment on? Well, I sent everybody the I emailed because when I scan it comes out just black and white
and so I emailed the color version as it was marked up by U Concom and D and so everybody has that and if you you know please take the time be at least if you haven't already before the next
meeting so we can get our comments collected and and decide are is everything that they proposed okay or are the things in there that uh are not. Yeah, we got to get our or in the water now.
Were interested in it looked like they did. Yeah, it's page 23, right? Is that what it is or no? Right around 23. I but like I say, you you have it at home in an email that has it in color.
Oh, okay. Yeah, it's easier to read. So, I think and I just reproduced it in black and white on the scans. Right. One of the big things was to to just make it clear that doc rentals is a
commercial activity. Okay. Right. Right. Commercial activities are not permitted. and just making it clear that doc rental is a commercial activity. It's a well that's what the proposed change is. Right. Right. And I I won't for what it's worth. I
won't vote I won't vote for that. I'll vote for the other two items that were on there. I'm behind that. What were the other two you're talking about? You had to be not more than 75 ft out was one of them. Oh. And the other one is one other thing in there. Going back to the wrinkles, I I
think the state defined commercial as a marina being 10 boats or more. Well, that isn't exactly what they said, you know, be because we had gone back to ask like, geez, it seems like this is commercial.
And they didn't come back and say, no, that's not what we meant. What they said was, "Well, we do have a, you know, uh, you are required if you're going to have a marina to apply for a chapter 91 license and a whole thing like that." And we did ask, not me, but the the
royal, we asked, is it okay from the state's perspective if we define commercial to include dock rentals? And they said, "Yes, there's no problem with that. You can absolutely do that." And and you'll see had some comments though because she left comments the one that Dick sent out
to everybody. Y it had it was in written with the comments form, you know, connected to it. Yeah. And she she weighed in on that and basically she said they're going to stick with the 10 votes. That's what I got out of reading her not I got out and most people only have four or five to tell you the truth.
So it's not really considered commercial in the state side. There are only a few on all three lakes that have four or five boats on their docks. There are many I was going to count them. Well, there's many that would have two pontoon boats
on a dock. I see a fair amount of that more than anything else. Yeah, I agree. You also see ones that advertise that have four or five that advertise dock space for rent.
Yeah, that that that to me commercial or or when a guy buys a piece of property on off of Bircher Avenue there and then advertises he's got docks that he's renting out four slips at 2500 a piece or whatever it is. That's a little
different. That's a commercial activity, but you're not going to get the average. It's a rental property. He's not living there. Right. Yeah. And and Right. And in some cases that average Joe may not even be charging. He's natural friend is whatever he's getting beer for it or right so they so that's not a commercial
activity but the people who are you know who are posting on Facebook that's a whole different you know you know I'm renting docks the reason I'm not for it the reason I'm not for it is because to me again it's like another rule that next thing you know it'll only be then another year or
two down the road when you won't be able to allow your friend to keep his boat on your daughter or your son or family or somebody else. I just see it as another right now when we deviate from chapter 91 which is what was voted on at the
town meeting. Yeah. We have to adhere to that. Yeah. We can't deviate from the original chapter 91 without going back to the town meeting. So the, you know, with regard to the the
thing about, you know, having uh, you know, your your brother or whatever on there, you know, there are categories in here for that. And so forth. No. And non-lfront resident. In other words, you no, no question. I'm just
saying it's another rule. That's my my son's boat was been on my dock, which he sold for for three or four years. And obviously, I don't charge my son rental, right? And over the years, I've been approached many times about would I consider renting one of my docks out,
and I said, "No, I don't want the liability." Yeah. So, I'm not in the dock rental business, but I still don't want to see that because God forbid if I ever did need some additional income to help pay my wonderful taxes in the town, I might
consider that. Yeah. And I think as a 136 feet on Lake Congaban with three docks under 600 square feet if I was desperate for money, I should be able to do that. Not have a marina, but one or two docks.
One or two boats, you mean? Huh? One or two boats? One or two boats. Yeah. My taxes are brutal. I took down a 9,000 foot building. My taxes still went up. I mean, it's crazy. They went up after that, huh? They went up after that.
After that? Higher. Higher. Almost 12,000 I'm paying in property tax. Huh. That's a lot of money. Yeah. Yeah. For a retired guy, whether I'm rich or poor. For anybody. Okay.
Okay. We good? I think so. Anything else? Commission. Yeah. I'm heading to Florida now. soon. Before we get off the subject, what's our deadline for getting comments to the Conservation Commission? Because we obviously owe them comments if we're
going to give them to them for this for the L for the LPP because that's who wrote it, right? That's who's Y send them send them to send them send your comments to me and I will collect them all. They don't do it till next. Yeah. The collection is what's our
deadline next the next meeting or just trying to keep us honest. Yeah, I want to make sure we have I want to I want to assemble everything for the next meeting. So, if you get them to me within one week, then I'll have everything nicely buttoned up for the next meeting.
Okay. All right. I'll make a motion. We adjourn. We adjourn. I'll second it. Uh Scotty second it. All in favor? I opposed. I We're