s o'clock on Monday June 24th called to or meeting of the pwn of Southwick board of appeals in attendance tonight we have Paul greguar Dan Tobias Bill Liss Chris mastriani and Wendy GGO Mike parent is absent and informed me that that was be the case the uh this meeting is hybrid it's uh being broadcast on zoom and also recorded on zoom and also recorded on on uh first order of business is to review the minutes from the meeting on June 10th so let's do that and we approved we approved one bill already so let's uh review the minutes and U take take no time get us right now I I said g that looks pretty good I good Joby of course it's always difficult and tell what's missing tell you can tell what might be wrong but not what's What's missing outside sometimes maybe that was int intentional okay come to you e good you think Paul motion put a motion accept minutes present June 10th 2024 motion accept the minutes and a second um all in favor I meeting minutes from June 10 are accepted okay first public hearing scheduled for 7:05 and 707 so I'm doing pretty good is a application from 11 chagar drive I'll leave leave the uh public notice please find below the legal notice for the following hearing for publication in the Westfield news from the board of appeals town of Southwick notice is hereby given of a public hearing to be held Monday June 24 2024 at 7:05 p.m. to hear the petition of Andrew Brom for property located at 11 Shagbark Drive Southwick Mass the applicant is Seeking a front setback variance of 11 ft at that's been adjusted in order to build a garage on the property this will be a hybrid meeting to be held in person in the land use conference room at the Town Hall and Via Zoom SL Andrew should come on up and have to talk to us about your project yeah we haven't hav yet we don't have enough others list yet okay the eight two I got you okay how you doing good how are you good good let us know what you want to try to do two story not two story two-car garage uh 24 by 28 where a shev you off as your facing garage be off side of the structure I do have the plants okay letting somebody in here yes okay yeah okay4 by 24 you said right 24 by 28 28 there's an over so there's a shed Ro cop I can leave with yes so those are double sided if you okay so if this is elevation looking at your position the house the house left right yeah okay correct so it'll be approximately 12 feet off of the house okay it'll be 12 feet off the property line that's one one set so oh oh it's a so it's that's just whole set set of plans if showing you the picture I guess yeah this is all the floor and all that okay yeah that's GNA be footing footing so uh this probably give you a better y the structure okay one the side of structure there will be left Corner stick built uh no it's prefab it's prefab okay y tell know Foundation uh that'll be a yes okay yep yep yeah okay okay yeah fo Foundation underneath the garage uh just peers underneath the shed okay uh I went out to look at look at the setup with with Andrew and uh I told him that despite all his detailed Dimensions here you're not alone measuring the actual dimensions have to be the variance has to be from the uh property line and the my best estimate of where having curve the street curved and the property line curved makes it a little difficult to to get a precise measurement so the best guess that I I could make was that the front of the requested garage would be 44 feet from the property line and that would make it uh [Music] 70 70 plus feet from the uh street so he's actually would need a front setback variance of 31 ft and for a or setback of 44 feet the house is about the best I could estimate it's about the same distance as as what his proposed garage would be plus or minus a foot and uh the the reason it's angled the way it is is I think I don't want to put words in your mouth but to be parallel to the property line and then and then kind of be offset from the street as same as the house just for for appearance aesthetic appearance St Aesthetics so so that's that's the adjustment to the the numbers you you have seen on that on his uh handmade sketch so Sidelines are good right sideline is fine yeah the other uh he'll he'll need a lot area and a lot Frontage variants uh just because of the nature of the sizes of the Lots there and how they don't line up with what the bylaws are in R20 house front line how much uh it's about 42 feet about 40 42 42 right and the garage garage about 40 I'm going to call a 44 so the garage a little for the back of the house yes it's it's no it's no closer somewhere between zero and two feet farther away like I said with a curved Street in the curve property line I would be happy to the house back without a surveyor I couldn't do my calculus to to figure out what what it the angle plus yeah exactly sign and cosine extent or whatever whatever you need so um but as Chris said I'm looking to match match the house and match the street uh it'll help also make use of the existing uh cut in the curb with the driveway Shifting the driveway over Shifting the driveway well I'll be I'll be yes the driveway now comes into the end of the existing house uh there was an addition put on prior to my purchase which they built over the end of the driveway they added a an addition off the end of the cape um they simply knocked out the driveway put a foundation over the top and built off what would have been the exit from the kitchen so right now that ends the driveway ends at my living room um and I just looking to shift it it makes it tough James no there was no exact to my to my knowledge there was no existing garage uh based off the other houses on the street standard Cape Bo so but I would be Shifting the garage obviously to meet or Shifting the driveway to meet the garage yeah but it would be easy to make use of that curb cut because i' just be Shifting the go will you be coming up and just widen widening it over to uh it's still must be um as you come down shag bark I sit directly on the corner so it if you were to continue stra setad of curve you'd almost end up in my garage with that curve utilizing the same curve cut correct yeah can't have no utilize y so that would that would help prevent having to sweep the driveway and make it more of blowout okay purpose purpose storage Vehicles utility space work on projects that's the reason for slightly bigger than Standard 24 by 24 is to have the extra space for prision no garage there now no it's how far from the house 12 the overhang about 10et I I know it's I think it's about 10 feet I think I'm 10 feet from the house to the shed room um I know I am 12 feet shed roof and 13 off 13 off the property and the shed roof uh post would be approximately 12 feet right off the reference right so that's so your your existing ends is the end this is the end of the exting and this would be the over that would be the overhang y that'll be a space weather protector as well yeah what are we looking at here with this spted line so that's the overhang so yes that this is the end of the thing yeah that's the existing driveway yeah uh this is the overhang that would be the shed roof off the side of the garage and this is the garage footprint well I'm looking at 28 ft and this is 24 the garage is 24 and the overhang is eight yeah saying show this shows 28 feet long correct and this is 24 Sor this is 24 here and this is a it's 8 feet yeah it's not the scale so it's just out of a yeah way out of proportion that's Ching the are but they and then you get this little overhang shed so this this that dotted that dotted line in between is the shed rout this spacing here is going to be a high shape because of the nature of the C of the property so it'll go from 12 feet uh out to 26 feet right so you're not going to have a connection to the house no there not it's going to be completely separate more questions I asked I asked you the question of why not attached garage and you you had a good answer so uh I had discussed in an attached garage previously if I go if I were to go with an attached garage I then have to bring out fire rating have to fire rate that wall and bring out my my my smoke detectors and that tie that all into the house system so that would require carrying out the alarm system and you plan on siding it with which you've already partially sided the house so this actually as because it is free um it will be sided with cement board be listed in there um but it is a it is built offsite actually built I believe in Pennsylvania and then once the foundation is in they'll come out check the foundation and they they build offsite and then assemble onsite uh it's through cloer Farms mhm come up in halves yeah put that beam in the middle you know yeah okay I did draw by to St out sted out area looks pretty well laid out not crowding neighbor or space best you can for those lots that you have available for sure yeah um you have the calculations I know we had to do area plus FR train and a three yeah okay want I read it questions you have questions Paul your side line is 13 feet yep yeah I want to make sure I had enough room yeah I don't want to crowd be a motion all right I'll make a motion to Grant uh three variances to 11 shagar drive for the purpose of uction of a garage a lot area variance of 11,720 square feet a lot Frontage variance of 32 feet and a front setback variance of 31 feet that was that's all that's necessary one second uh voting numbers are fall yes Bill and uh votes yes so you're all set go thank you right hold do we have those with the I don't have an elev you do that I think this is this is the elevation set keep those pictures okay all right got you bet luck that now the only thing you have to do is wait 20 days before you get into from you know just in case somebody step forward and not a problem but then you can go forward the building per so y absolutely all right good luck dat on that yeah okay Cam I usually do that but so yeah this is the so we'll have to do the second that's just that's so I just have I just have to sign sign okay next next public hearing is at 7:30 okay got any similar station perfect wend do you want to Le any extras of those so you have sheets in the future yeah I'm sure you know who's gonna vote no true pretty much there's an 8020 rule here probably only only members right so you always know but in case may have to refuse um did you say r one I I don't remember deal this the the 19 oh okay that's why all right I know you were talking about Lemont but I I don't remember um I can do I can do that fortunately that was direct yeah I can vote on this one I it's the other one certainly I can't that was direct all right yeah this one was kind of th so it's probably okay yep wasn't I'm sorry I'll fill in five minutes by talking about the the next meeting on July 8th will we have a a new application for 11 Feeding Hills Road where they're looking to put a shed in the backyard and then we have a continuation of two lakem drive or Street or whatever it is and they they want to put the a new house where there was a house several years ago the question that we asked about that in required the continuation was the uh precise location of the step the existing sep septic system that they were planning to reuse and if that was feasible because on the drawing that they supplied that said that they were going to tie into the sewer which only exists out at Point glow road so uh they they seem to uh have gone back to now wanting to uh use the existing seic system they had a sketch of that but it it wasn't shown on the official site plan so they have to uh fix that uh before they come back on the 8th and I received an U an inform inquiry from somebody on Shore Drive I think it's 15 or 17 I'm not sure but it's a sliver of a Conor lot it's and uh the the guy I talked to wasn't sure of what the variance procedure was he thought that you asked for variances and then Drew up some plans and I I explained to him that know you draw the plans and that determines what variances you were looking for but the lot is 50 ft by 150 ft so I cautious with him that said that uh if you're thinking of putting a house on it I don't think that that's G to happen so uh he said okay that's all I need to know and uh and that was fine so somebody might have told him that maybe you can put a maybe you can put a house on it but uh you have to be a very thin thin house yeah but it's a Conor lot too so he's got it he's got he's got restrictions on on both of um and then we have a kind of a partial U application that they need to come up with the butters list it's it's an application but it's not on the schedule yet and that's for three George Lumis Road I think if I remember correctly they they want to build a house where one had burned down um I don't remember how long ago that might have happened but this is 2003 oh was that what it said that's what he says oh wasn't there a time 23 I'm sorry 23 yeah got two years to do it that's relatively new so okay fire and that SC up the uh the plans right so uh so he's looking for some font setback off of George Lumis but he has not specified what that Dimension is so uh I will contact him well before he gets he gets on the schedule he'll probably won't be on the schedule until uh 20 July 22nd anyway you should be re reusing the old Foundation two years too okay right within oh within years all right well we what time but if we can't I don't know what the what the fire so we can't do have a date on the fire or just a year but he should have till 25 anyway still can't be any bigger than what was there okay existing Foundation Sol the subject in October 2023 the intention of remodeling and then they will fire right before the remodeling could take place so yeah this got to be on the same Foundation as long as he know yeah bet he's trying to go bigger that's probably he's trying to do guarantee he's trying to make a little bigger well since there was a fire maybe we can no no no that happened that was on H same thing yeah okay on the button all [Music] right I don't see anybody else an I believe oh he's gone Y no is there is there he is good evening everyone nice to see you it's it's 7:30 and we are uh continuing the public hearing for 55 Foster Road anatol's joined us on on Zoom so hopefully the technology will uh allow us to uh get through this um he Anatolia sent a revised um site plan uh today and I forward it to the board members to uh to review so an why why don't you uh walk us through what what you did uh here let's U maybe I can try to share the screen I never done this but I can try right and maybe I can go over that plan can you hear me so share to you hello yeah what do you want to do yeah uh can I share the screen and try to you okay can you see you can see the screen now right okay yes yes you bring up yeah you have a file there you can maybe bring it up we should be able to see it here okay you see now he yes coming up so no you want a laptop say again you're on a laptop right H yes I am on the desktop screen you see I gotta go see I see I see your screen but you not see my screen right right hang on see side side but you're screen sharing but I don't know your video is on you um that's TR that's right yeah okay uh what's it oh yeah I think was there you go there you go okay very good okay I don't know if we can make it any bigger but we got the gist because we haven't s in front of us too can there we go this you're GNA get I got so I [Music] can I got suggested what do so he kind of resized all this to try to sneak it in more but get the septic to deal with too yeah okay this okay I will I will zoom in so there you go yeah just do that a couple times you can blow there you go yeah yeah that's what you're looking at there okay um yeah so I um I did um a lot of changes to this to this plan so I changed the the shape of the proposed um alteration area which is require 5,000 square fet so I change this this corner so because I need to move the house uh more to the to the back that's why I did that and I narrow it uh so this was 61 ft I make 60 ft so it's total 5,000 Square fet over here yeah I move the house like like you see over here so 50 ft from the property line so originally I was trying to do it in for 40 but it's very tight for septic system because because of the slope and we need to move back so basically what what I did the house going to be T Tor by Tor plus this like bump out little 15 by 10 fet 15 by 10 fet yes uh so and instead of using the backyard on the back so I make on the right side is going to be like side yard one 20 20 ft and what else yeah so the sepy going to be here and the reserve area so and in this case we're not going to have any issue with the with the septic system so that's that's what I'm proposing at this point so the driveway is over the Lee field uh yeah the driveway going to be over the Lee field yes septic is now to the right okay that's going to be like um I have the design that's that's going to be Chambers that's not like uh regular Le field but it's like concrete Chambers which which can be uh installed under the driveway yeah that's what I got uh let me any questions if anything better I should done um but I think this house already getting much much smaller than uh I proposing originally yeah so the garage system yeah so an toia you still have a you have a onecar garage there in the in the uh lower left hand corner yeah uh yes I I think we can I still can fit the one car garage like maybe 16 I mean uh not 16 like 10 f Garage door so not not very big I'm sorry yeah and uh saying on the on the slab propose house that's only because 10 ft but I was talking to Engineers so what what can be done for example uh you can do Foundation full Foundation I mean full basement only when we have 20 ft from the Le field to the house but I ask him what if you will do uh your 10 ft of the house on the slab and the rest like 20 ft full foundation and and he said it's it's it's okay it can be done that way the buffers on for the first level okay anything better I should done over here or that's the best what can be done in this painful lot you've you've Shrunk the house which which is okay but you know we're not really negotiating Dimensions here our fundamental problem is is is still the hardship and the suitability of the of the lot to to have any kind of house there and and that it I don't think you you can get past that unfortunately it's uh you know you've you know you've made this effort and time time and and and money I'm I'm sure but the the rules that we have to play by is is the hardship and the in the build buildability of of that lot and I don't I don't see that you're going to get a uh a favorable the the favorable decision that that you're looking for now I'm I I can't speak for everyone else here but I I I don't think that that the situation has has changed despite the the effort that you have there I know other people can can give their opinions yeah conservation you're you're beyond you're you're even still touching in the 75 foot buffer but the riverfront goes up to over 200 and that's in front of the house you're building in the zone that whole lot would be in that zone yeah so this is the uh the green line that's 100 fet buff on yeah yeah so so the r Ru what they have for example assuming there is the no River Front so they R what they by doing anything behind 100 ft I have to apply for the noi but if I before so I don't have to but in this case that the we have the river front right get it we can't control that's why I am and then you disagree Paul or you agree do you agree or disagree with what you I mean much has changed on what can be happening that all I think from a comfort we have to look at it as you say build aity and lot I mean slope Etc that's all never going to change in our prw right it's it's severeal I want to put on on the record that I I attended the Conservation Commission meeting a week ago uh tonight remotely I was too and uh I was late Unfortunately they they declined to even hear the continuation because they're waiting for us to make a decision they continue yeah they continued it but they're not going to they're not going to make any decision until we make our decision so it's it's uh that's that's just seem to be the the way that that it's it's getting bounce back and forth so we we need to make a a determination tonight and uh I I think that the the uh the only options are what were available to two weeks ago is that to to withdraw the application or have us vote on it but that it doesn't look good to uh no to be approved it needs to be unanimous and I I don't see that happening so uh you need to decide whether to to to withdraw the application or to uh to have us vote on it so you guys didn't see this like the hardship on this slot the Topography of the lot so if the lot uh will be without flat or uh no River on the back so I don't have to come here because I didn't have the hardship at that point but at this point uh the Topography of the lot and Wetland and the stream on the back that is the making this in the hardship yeah you the land is what the land offers an it's not a hardship because it's there we can't change that um you're trying to build an envelope that really doesn't have the ability to build on based on the current zoning laws yeah that's I I think that's that's why the Z Board of appeal exist so people can come and ask for for you did and we' reviewed it pretty thoroughly I believe um and went to the site and listened to opinions from the conservation gentleman even though they won't take it up and vote they they felt strongly the same way that that really is not a project that that could support yeah but uh Conservation Commission didn't say anything about the about the location of the house or anything they just will need to see the uh because cences and septic design approvable right they will if we did our approv they would that would bounce it because it's in the wetlands so even though they're not giving you the that knowledge that's what would happen I think would would you'd like us to do is to approve some variants and then plead your case to the Conservation Commission but it's that's that's not how it works we have the the rules that we have to follow we can't we can't make we can't approve that variance because of the the lack of hardship and the and the the property is just not is not conducive can't have can't have a a house on it that's that's that's just the the the way that that that our board has has to has to make the determination on it I know that's that's not what you want to hear but I'm that's that's a that's the only way that I can see it right so the choices you want the draw we're going to put it the V yeah but why why you not see this like the hardship for the owner who was paying the taxes for this lot with it I just try to help her and uh you know help everyone is is the owner is the owner going to buy this house say again is the owner going to buy this house and live there no the this case I have the agreement for choice and sale agreement sign so if I will have the variances granted then I will put choice so he will get your money back which she paid like I don't remember how many years three years or so I think she paid more than money which uh which is which is selling for right you imagine that lady is is your grandma or your or mom who was owning that lot and paying the taxes on it and now she cannot do anything with it I don't think that's that's right oh she bought the lot in 1974 for $4,500 um so you know um there's that's you know that's that's her that's her complaint and well that that's her hardship to to reconcile that you know what what she can or can't do with the lot it's that's that's not really for us to to to take into consideration it's your application that that we have to vote on and and uh we're we're prepared to vote on it if you don't want to withdraw I still I still don't understand what what is the other issue with with with this except the hard hardship like like you don't take it that hardship which is exist the Topography of the L and and another uh what what what is the other issues can I can I ask can I move the house more back and get like 55 ft from the road or something else what we what we're saying is there there are no Dimensions that you can that you can come up with that that are going to change change our opinion of of this project that you know to put it bluntly that's it isn't we're not negotiating distances here we're negotiating that whether there should be anything on that property and and it's our opinion that that it should not be there should not be that's not I I I don't know just just uh I I noticed on I mean on the first meeting when we have I I heard you Chris you're saying I don't have the issue to having the house 40 ft there from the from the street that's your your word that's what you said and then and that if you will told me that's on the the first meeting you don't have the hardship you don't you know don't have a chances but you give me hope and after that I go and apply for anai I spend the money you created that chance because you wanted to pursue the conservation they put their answer up and said we're not going to deal with it basically so we are so Cho two choices I guess do you want to withdraw or you want us to vote I don't know um and also what I want to mention William on the first meeting you was mentioning you was playing on this slot when you was a kid that's correct respective to what the application is I know the lot yes but um so we're V we're going to deal with your application Handler you g to re re re remove it resend it or you want us to vote on it yes we what what I what I trying to say from the beginning you have the have the huge not liking what I trying to do here with the slot this this was noticeable you even go and take the picture and how you act on the on the meeting on the Conservation Commission meeting uh that's that seems like you have personal interest so I think we have some uh conflict of interest over here since you the broker in South a real estate agent and I I think he was looking on this SL and somebody I recuse my vote 19 that's fine I'll recuse you still have a voting member here so it's still going to go to vote or you're going to withdraw one of the two I'm going to recuse right now I put officially they I'll recuse from this vote you it has to be a unanimous vote to approve it right but I'm going to recuse he just brought up something that has no bearing on it but I'm going to recuse because I am an agent in town okay so I'll recuse the vote that's fine so I officially put it on record an I'm not voting on this application Paul gregar Dan and and uh Chris will vote on it two choices do you want to ascend or you want to vote yeah I I have only one one choice I'm not going to ask for continue even even last time when I was asking for continue you should told me you should vot against it and not let me waste another more my time I don't know why you guys playing these games you forced it you forced it I asked but but if you knew for sure you're not going to vot why you say let's continue what if I ask you for continue now what you will say you will vote Yes or you will no no there's there's nothing to continue yeah I'm not going to ask for continue so I just will let you vote and uh if if you guys uh have own opinion instead of uh William influen you with his u i I don't know how to say it but uh that's how it sounds like even when I start with the 19 faster Road William you was telling you cannot do anything there is the Wetland there's no chances that was the same situation yeah okay guys yeah we're we're gonna we're GNA have a vote then I make I make a motion to deny the application for 55 Foster Road a yes A yes vote would be to deny the application we have three voting members Paul gregar Paul Paul gregar votes yes D Tobias yes dant Tobias votes yes Chris mastriani votes yes we have a unanimous decision to deny the application for 55 Foster Road can you uh remind me what U uh what is the r rules about the appeal appealing the decision you you can the owner the owner can go to land for I believe to uh to try challeng it to challenge to challenge the uh our decision that that's the only that's the only Avenue that I I'm aware of to uh to challenge what the decision that we've made so you can you can discuss that with her okay guys thank you very much y okay thanks sorry it turned out this way an but uh that's that's way the way it happened okay yeah thank you very much have a good night still on there just yeah this is this got yeah that's why I just give okay so this is my draft you got it yeah okay you shot way [Music] going we didn't sell it so count that we listed it we didn't sell it he took down and he bought it after okay I went through all the picture business uh yeah there they in a little interlude there so no else has anything else put a motion to adjourn second second all in favor I adjourn the meeting at 11:56