e e e e e e e e e and welcome to this meeting of the beach doip
committee and I'll call this meeting to order and would you join me in the Pledge of Allegiance please I pledge aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the repic for which it stands one nation
under God invisible liy for all thank you may we have a roll call please member kurman here member Looney here Vice chair Stevens here chair Rosenberger here we have a COR thank you
all right we have to have a motion to approve the agenda I'd like to add some items to the agenda okay what would those items be John
um first item would be the procedure for uh getting information between meetings um there's been events that occurred heard such as the uh first reading of the ordinance uh and a zero tolerance uh
actions on the beach uh for enforcement uh discussions at City commission meetings and um no information was provided to the the beach stewardship committee uh ahead of time um and so the procedure for information getting to IO
to get to us doesn't seem to be being followed that was put in place by Jen McMahon previously so a discussion about what the procedure is to get Beach stewardship in the loop on decisions again I think needs to be this discussed could this be discussed under the uh
stewardship goals plan uh well that would be a little more of a long-term discussion I think this is more of a tactical discussion for even before the next meeting as just what we need to do what happened and what needs to happen you know immediately versus our our our our
bigger picture I mean this is a look back and like what do we what do we ask for what what has to happen right away um might be the reason to separate it out okay and then my second I I recall the conversation and I
recall Jennifer um taking the action item to do that I don't know if it's yet a completely new discussion but yet another ask of when there are significant items happening on the beach that the beach stewardship committee is
kept informed yeah I'm not trying to have the whole discussion right now but yeah that would be most of it um I I agree with you I remember the conversation she wrote a memo and yeah um and then the other staff changes and
a lot of things have happened not making excuses I recall the conversation yeah and then my my second item would be a discussion because I mean I know we have in our agenda to talk about one of our our standing items at the end when we when we do the quot report is things
about you know how many warnings and so forth but um switching to zero enforcement I mean sorry me zero warnings uh we got zero warning on the fact that there'd be zero tolerance and having a major shift
in uh how all of our ordinances are considered I think is a major uh shift of philosophy on how this speech has always been considered um and so I think a discussion about how that came about uh
and something I emailed about 12 days ago when that was announced publicly all of a sudden um so something a discussion about this um new new uh philosophy of of beach enforcement that became
effective February 14th uh with zero warning uh I think we need to talk about so that's that was the other item to talk about the new Zero Tolerance
policy okay we'll need somebody to craft a motion for that I just I mean this is just this is just an item for discussion today is just to talk about I'm in agreement we can have a a quick conversation about
how it happen yeah I think that would be good and we'll do that at the end okay Al do those okay so we have a motion to do that well it's all part of the motion for the consent agenda right is it for I
move that we um uh accept the um amended agenda to include the two items one of one a quick rediscussed the um Beach stewardship
committee apprised of appropriate matters and the second on um code enforcement on the beach I second that okay all right we'll move forward do we need a would you like
roll call yes please member Looney here member krisman yes John Stevens yes um chair rothenberger yes motion carries thank you all right and we need a motion to approve we do it's my my bad first of
all we've got audience audience comments so how many people do we have I have a couple comment cards but they are specifically for item 4B so I was holding off okay to that all right I do not have any for General
okay all right so could we have a motion to accept the minutes for our November 13th meeting I make a motion to approve the minutes from our uh November 13th 2004
meeting I didn't read it second it yes second can second second that member kurman yes member Looney yes Vice chair Stevens yes chair rothenburger yes motion carries okay for items of discussion the
first one is the beach stewardship goals plan and I'm going to ask iako to kind of walk us through this and we'll have a discussion on it right so you recall that the commission at the end of last year had said for all the subcommittees
if they wanted to propose a goal plan to present to them with the resources they were request what the goals they were wanting and consequently I reached out to each one of you and asked what we what would you like to see accomplished in this committee so I prepared this
document however it's it's a summary it's very flexible you can delete you can add what you feel may be necess Neary so um you know I started off with our pretty much our mission statement is
copied right out of the ordinance and one of the first goals was uh keep a copy of this document yeah it was included in in the agenda packet I did not didn't get it I did not get yeah I don't believe it made it in I
don't think I saw it really that's not good is there any way we can project this or something onl don't know well I don't know how to bring it up to you then I'm glad it wasn't just
me okay well what the first item that we suggested was um keeping the committee informed on matters related to its Charter obviously which is very important so our goal here is to ensure that the committee is regularly updated on matters relating to beach preservation and maintenance that are
brought before the city commission so as far as the action steps that would required to achieve this uh regular staff updates from whoever that your staff leaon will be um they would provide routine briefings or summaries of issues related to beach preservation
and maintenance that are on the city's commission agenda so um that would require monitoring I guess what's put on the agenda to give you a heads up remember the agenda is maybe published only a week before the
meeting so um that's the only way that I would become aware that it's going to be discussed and then I would have to forward that information to you but again that's also available to you anyway directly right so I'm not getting any advanced warning on this being added
to the agenda um as far as public meeting agendas go relevant agenda items should be highlighted and discussed during monthly committee meetings so again the frequency that we meet that's something that has to be determined because we
only meet four times a year now and if we want to accomplish these goals it's going to require a greater commitment and how much are you willing to commit to do this what what are your thoughts I think we need to decide the scope of our plan and then and then figure out how
much fre that's a question at the end okay um so these discussions then we'll ensure that the committee stays involved in ongoing policy debates um information sharing utilize the city's website email updates or other communication platforms to share detailed reports proposals
analysis with committee members in advance of commission meetings that's basically what you're trying to achieve um as far as resources obviously you need a dedicated staff person to help you accomplish this uh we've requested for attorney time any legal staff for
reviewing and interpreting policy ordinances and recommendations and ultimately the city commission would have to review and approve you know just moving forward um the second goal was developing a holistic Beach strategy and plan for
restoration renourishment preservation and protection of the dunes and beaches the goal here was to develop a comprehensive Beach management plan to ensure the ongoing Health preservation and Improvement of St Pete Beach um actually auction steps would be
to maybe conduct a full review of the current condition of the beaches dunes and overall ecosystem um engage stakeholders in involve experts from Coastal management environmental science and Wildlife Conservation to help craft a strategy that would address restoration and
preservation you recall I think it was a year ago exactly February 24 we had um the ocean Alliance come do a presentation for us about looking at a long-term sort of solution to beach
preservation um if it's groups like that that you would like to come be involved then we could invite them the implementation would require a multi-year strategy outlining specific actions for Beach renourishment restoration erosion control and long-term
resilience um monitoring and Reporting establish clear metrics for evaluating the health of the beach and dunes and the effectiveness of interventions the resources again would be staff industry experts the attorney
time um and the city commission to you know review and approve and uh the staff to implement obviously the execution of restoration and renourishment projects uh the third goal was Beach ordinance um the goal here is to review
and support the process for the first reading of the new beach ordinance which already happened on 28th of January and which addresses key regulatory changes for Beach protection and access um the action steps would review and discuss the beach ordinance in detail
and highlight key aspects relevant to the committee's objectives um which would be like access protection measures and environmental standards now throughout this past year we had we've had numerous workshops with the commission and um I've actually lost
track of how many we've had I try to get get a list going but I mean this has been a ongoing three-year process I believe at least at least right get this moving so um it would also probably require consultation with
experts to ensure that all aspects of the ordinances are backed by sound environmental legal and operational Frameworks and then um you know someone need to present these recommendations provide a summary of the committee's recommendations to the city Commission in advance of the second reading which
is going to be taking place on um March 10th next week okay that's the second reading thank you for that update yeah we didn't know y um I think the person leading that for the city has been the senior planner
Brendan Barry so he's been making adjustments to the ordinance presenting it to the commission as you as you saw previously so uh that would be the staff person for that would he be you know I've asked this question be before would
he be the owner are the he's the staff lead now the single point pushing the ordinance there yes I believe I was told he'd be here today to go over provide the new draft um it's I did ask him this morning if he had made any changes and for the
second reading and he said there there are some Rees but he's not he not ready to present that yet to us so I'm I'll wait till later to talk about that okay the same sort of resources would be required um staff and Industry experts the the attorney time commission to
review and of course some sort somebody somebody from the staff to implement these changes the fourth goal we had was to complete the sea turtle lighting ordinance uh adopt the Florida state model um which I believe is underway
now um at what point how far long it is I don't know it's probably with legal at the moment so may be a good point to ask them where it's at uh so our action steps would be to review the state model and ensure it meets the unique
needs of St Pete Beach um any public consultation engage with local residents businesses and Property Owners to inform them of proposed lighting changes and gather feedback and Implement a time frame for the phased implementation of new lighting regulations across public and private
properties same sort of resources staff attorney time City uh commission and someone to implement that the fifth goal I have down here was public beach access to ensure adequate public access to beaches for both residents visitors while while maintaining Environmental
Protection standards um the action steps may involve mapping and Analysis identifying all Current public beach access points and access their St accessibility safety and impact on local ecosystems I did
include a map I think hope you have that of the what I could find was our all our public beach ja es did you see that in the package I saw that but it was missing some yeah so that was the latest map I had for all the beach accesses public beach
accesses there are some that I believe we missing strategic enhancements um based on the analysis identify opportunities for new access points improve signage and safety measures and of course public engagement hold public meetings to
gather input from residents and visitors regarding ing access and improve improved ideas same kind of resources that we would need for that the sixth goal we had was further education opportunities for residents and visitors regarding
Wildlife dunes and Beach protection increase public awareness of the importance of Beach and Wildlife Conservation with a focus on Dune protection and Wildlife Conservation so the action steps could include a public awareness campaign launch a series of educational campaigns
focused on preserving Wildlife protecting dunes and respecting Beach ordinances which I think is c one of the campaigns you see now about zero tolerance right um collaborating with local organizations working with local schools environmental organizations Community
groups to create educational programs workshops and events um we do collaborate with ke panel's beautiful as you know now um for our beach cleanups and things like that so um Outreach material we could develop
accessible engaging education material including brochur signs and online content to reach a wider audience resources needed for that was staff commission to review and someone to implement that I did include also a
timeline um to achieve these goals again it would require a lot more time to meet together to discuss all of these things um so at the conclusion I just said that this is the beach stewardships
committee's goals they're ambitious but with careful planning resource allocation and collaboration the committee could achieve meaningful and sustainable outcomes for the preservation and enhancement of St Pete Beach regular communication between staff industry experts and the city
commission will be the key to ensuring the success of these initiatives I wish I had a had a copy of this for you which I will get you a cop thanks IO yeah you're going to have a go around can I comment on
that sure so first of all I'd like to really commend you on what you put together I mean I think that that was a I mean I'm I'm more of a visual person but listening to that I I thought that was really a very good capture of of a lot of good ideas and and and I know I
wrote some things to you and I feel like you really captured a lot of what I wrote and probably a lot of what other people wrote or what you've captured in your role of this time so I really thank you for putting that together it was terrific um as I thought about it more
um I think that we have to do some soul searching in our role because one of the things that's unique to beach stewardship is we don't do for instance a form one or form six um we not even a form that talks
about whether we've spoken to any uh influencers ever get their title there's a form that you have to fill out if you speak lobbyist um because we have really no Authority we we just we just talk and listen to people and but we don't really
have any Authority whatsoever well we're we're an advisory thing we don't make the rules that's the Commissioners right but when I look at for instance even the historical uh uh commission um you know
they actually approve things and and I started to think about well you know maybe we should be in the middle of something maybe the same way people are now applying to the to them and saying you know make my building a star you know maybe we should be in the loop when
someone says Hey I want to put out 500 chairs on the beach maybe we should be in the loop in in in different things and maybe we have to meet you know decide should we be meeting monthly or or you know six times a year but I'm not saying we should I'm just saying these
are the questions and if you take on these different responsibilities then you have to realize you're going to be a form one or form six and is that the role of this group the other so that's just one set of questions the other thing is how do we communicate with the
commission um the Comm commission right now doesn't even think they should ask us questions you know oh we' we've had meetings so we'll just we don't need to ask again when the the new version of the ordinance comes out they don't ask us but then also and I forgot to put it on the agenda but I'll just say it now
how do we communicate to them so I've communicated to them a couple times like when the new ordinance came out and I said hey I have to dis speak for myself and tell you what I think about this new ordinance but then is that a shade communication so because I wrote a letter and I sent it to them and then I want to make sure it's not a shade
communication so I sent it to the city clerk I said hey make sure this isn't a shade communication make sure this gets at least into the next agenda or the public documents for this next meeting but then it only got sent to the other you know Beach stewards but it didn't
get published and that made me even more concerned because that makes it really a shade communication because I never would send it just to the other stewards I wanted it to get into the public document that went out for the meeting so now I'm I'm I'm saying in the record that wasn't my intent to have a shade
communication I wanted it to be part of the agenda that was published so I've sent it to the people that have spoken to me from the public and said hey I just want you to know i' I've sent comments in um so you know that's the question is like how do we as stewards get our
information to the Commission in a way that makes it not a shade communication um so that we are influencing the commission you know and it's a two-way street so I guess that's my other category uh what would be a more effective way because right now I
don't think it's it's working um and and and that's maybe it's a rhetorical question but that's the other thing we have to address you know how do they get to us and solicit our input because that's not happening and then how do we even unsolicited give them our input and
either individually or I could have tried to do an emergency meeting but I was out of town I didn't know what was happening until I mean I saw it like Friday and the meeting was Tuesday and I didn't even have time to look at it till till Monday or Tuesday wrote my email before the meeting they didn't have time
to read it and that was the first reading I mean how's that how do we do an ordinance that way and now I I end up writing them something for this meeting yesterday because I was trying to find a copy of that ordinance but I don't want to go into that till the ordinance section but so it's just really not it's
it we we need to come up with a uh a smoother process and then and then what else do we want to get our fingers into but the deeper we get into the process the more the more we become more entrenched in the organization and more
decision-making we have to be cognizant back in all right so I think you're you're asking for a further expansion of the committee's mission I'm I'm saying we have to decide if we do that if if do we want to do that or or do we want do we should it be appropriate or should we
stay in this role and and stay non authoritative how far can we go and say non uh say advisory and be effective you know maybe that's it how how far how much further can we be effective in a nonauthor ative
role and but can we make that work maybe that's the thing to try if I may um I don't disagree with anything you say but I also look back excuse me allergies are just killing
me the scope of our Charter is very limited it's for the overseeing renourishment of our beaches and I don't I meant to print out it but it's I think John has a copy can have keep me Keep Me
In bounds if I if I get it wrong public renourishment of our public beaches which the city doesn't really have any say in that that's done by the county and some the like that when we had pass the grill was getting
renourished we didn't get updated on that nor in many cases did the city know what the county was doing so we'll put that aside and the second one is and Dan keep me chair please you're right on
second one is the preservation in maintenance of our public or city beaches correct the way I read that is that's upam and passag gr the way I that's my interpretation of of what a
public a city public beach is right so when you're talk and you know chairs and all that and I know just going off the example you brought that's not a city public beach again in my interpretation of that
so um not to be debated here and maybe it's you know in our next step we should have a workshop or something where we discuss should we come back with a recommendation to the commission that
they may accept or deny of what we think a our should our Charter stay the same or should it change and if it changes to what and in that we can have discussion about advisory versus
non-advisory I don't know when um vice mayor malland was reaching out and he used the beach stewardship committee as an example in his I think it was December 10th or something where they were talking about work they were talking
about committees and all that was it in his mind or the commission's mind in doing that that hey we just asked the beach committee to reconsider its purpose and um its scope and inserting itself
into making decisions versus advising decisions I just don't know if that was the intent of the request for us to come up with goals it could be could they might be open to it or not I don't know what the process is for us to hey they
open for us to reinvent ourselves or and potentially put some more bureaucracy in the city in terms of decision making and getting things done which sometimes that's a good thing and sometimes that's a bad thing um but I
would think we need and it's not it's not something I think we're prepared to I'm not prepared to decide here but I would put that as as a step if if we're going to do that we should maybe I'll call our our appointees saying hey we
had this discussion do you want us to go down this path and if they say yes hey let's go if they say no we stay within the charter then we can have a good debate about what preservation and maintenance of is it the city public
beach yes it is City we can we can have a debate about what that means but then we have to stay in those boundaries because right now we have some guard rails and we and if you look at the beach ordinates there's a lot of things in my opinion
that are outside those guard rails that we we could get input to but it's really out it's outside of the curbs of this current committee's chart in my opinion basically it says that we are to make recommendations to the city which that's
advisory and that's what it is now yes a state if I could um just to yes I don't want to change our Charter is written in the statute because there is actually the ordinances that created us and I didn't mean to try to step out of those bounds um so you you you're saying keep
certainly I yeah I wouldn't want to stay then we can debate what the G was yeah I want I would want to stay within the statute as written but um to respond to the public thing I I was thinking about that and there are plenty of of places that are considered public that are
privately owned um you know the whole concept of in easement uh you know and the whole idea that we even were involved in the ordinance um or you know any you know ordinances relate you know in the city manag as the ordinances and the ordinances relate to things that are
um you know relate to the whole Beach um and and and you know uh the tax assessors even told me that you know he he treats all of the beachfront all of the all the all of the properties along the beach he he treats them as beach
front um and doesn't tax the Sandy Beach he he treats all the hotels all those properties as beach front because he considers them beach front he's not taxing the places where the chairs are or anything uh just the Marshland because he's treating it as as public so
that's you know you're it's it's used by the public that the ownership is a separate question that but you still could consider it a public resource so that's where you know I would debate it different but okay that's the guard L we're
talking about to me is pass and upam Beach but that's not what was written which they could have written so all right anyway can yield to an attorney to then attorneys could probably de it for years in cour is not
city public beach as a resort conversation for us to be getting it that's what they'll probably debate is it's not city public beach it's in my opinion so I that's the usual customary we can go down the at a at a workshop
but to for me to for me to AG agree we would have to come to some consensus with City public beach otherwise we it's the preservation and maintenance of of those right because you have a lot of Eminem would be the same question
obviously and that's right well you can go up and down it doesn't matter to any of it but okay could I suggest I know we'll probably be talking about this at the end on your things but we could move to item four because I know we have people
here to speak on that and uh mean b b yep if we are finished with item for a can I have a motion that the committee does accept the goals plans as stated I'm not prepared without even having a
paper copy of I would be more than happy to schedule a workshop I would well I be willing to participate in a workshop where when we go and flush those out and agree just with the
administrative miss here I don't think we're prepared I don't feel comfortable in voting for that yeah I'd like to see the input that everyone's pres I mean I mailed my input in I think maybe other people mailed
their input in and I don't want to have shade communication so I didn't see see other people but I'd like to see what the input was from the other people we could discuss that in a workshop okay I mean okay well I took all of your input and I produce this document as a summary iine we in there so all right okay so that's fine
if we all included if we're all happy then yeah let's look at the final version okay may may I I I I suggested we have a workshop and we discuss it um I didn't want to say that hey that I agree with
that final versions so I agree I would say it's a working session it's a great start and thank you for putting it in thank you AO okay so that brings us back to 4B and those people that want to speak I have Joe Smith
uh for the record Joe Smith 1825 Main Street Western Florida um I I'm well we the beach ordinance or actually maybe I'm not because it seems like I can never get a final copy of what it actually is and so uh my ultimate suggestion is that I would really like to have a some kind of Workshop where
we're happy to discuss with you and add whatever input we can from the hotel Community uh I'm the owner of Tradewinds if those of you don't know me um really I think there's some misguided Direction on the beach ordinance that I've seen so far so for example are you aware that
the fire department will not drive their vehicles on the beach they so if we're creating setbacks and drive AES for safety for the public and for those people on the beach in our cup process we are very specifically told the fire
trucks the EMS Vehicles will not go in the beach we actually have to build out Hardscape so that our fire trucks can get around our property to get to fires to service people very explicit instructions from the uh fire department so if we're trying to solve for dryy vials there are no dry
vials because it can't be done because no one's driving there there's no emergency vehicles that are willing to do that in St P Beach so I it's very important that we know that even if we get to the point that we do have setbacks and there are these Drive ISS which don't exist anywhere else in Florida um the problem is is what are we going to do hire more sheriffs and tax
the people more so that we can have sheriffs patrolling up and down the beach to make sure that no one sits in these Drive ISS I can the only thing I can figure that we can do as a community is put up rope and stanions around these whole these areas which is going to be miserable right I I mean I don't want
more tension with the residents but if we start roping off all these huge areas in the beach to make sure that no one sits down in the drive VES no one gets out of our areas with alcohol uh on you know service areas I don't know how this is supposed to work I don't think any of us know how it's supposed to work but
that's going to result in either a really ugly same beach with all the hotels putting rope all over the place or a request for the sheriff to put more sheriff on the beach that ultimately results more taxes to the residents so I'm not sure how this is really supposed to work I don't I think we need a
workshop and I'm happy to participate in it if I can add some value in this to to figure out how we can work together um you know we do have Solutions we'd like to put on the table that we think can help with some of the objectives as we understand them that would be alternate to what's being contemplated in the
beach ordinance I just need to talk to someone I just don't have anyone to talk to at this point you know um the the unfortunate part that I really don't want to get into but I think you should know about it is if you actually do these setbacks the 15ot setbacks and the 75 you're talking about losing space
that would accommodate 1,200 chairs on the beach which everyone might say well good um the problem is is that can result in 150,000 less room nights than Beach which would be reduction of over $30 million in hotel Revenue you can figure out the hotel taxes and everything from there it might result in
$10 million less in chair rentals um this is obviously not going to go away right no one loses tens of millions of dollars of Revenue and that's just from the large Resorts I didn't even count all the resorts it would affect so the problem is is like I think that before making some kind of advice to the
commission we got to sit down and figure out what the effects are to everyone and really understand the impact because none of us want lawsuits of the city last time they're la of the city was $12 million in legal fees you know this is actually multiple owners it's be far more than $12 million and that's not even the hundreds of millions of dollars
in Damages that may result I don't want to go there I really don't I love St Pete Beach we all do things because we want to be here we want to be United unfortunately some of these things I think are just not fully vetted fireworks we justess make sure that we can do fireworks We Do It free for the
community right as long as it's permitted and the city Says Yes Trade wins is setting up appropriately and taking the right SA measures hopefully we can do that the way I read the ordinance it looks like maybe no one could do fireworks I'm worried about things like that I'm worried about people closing their blinds there's no
way I can control my guess from closing their blinds every night now I am putting Turtle tint on the Windows as I call it so if I put Turtle tent hopefully I'm waved from that requirement or I don't know how the other hotels that are smaller that can't afford to spend the million dollars in Turtle tent that I'm going to do I don't
know how they can afford to do it so I'm just really worried about what this means um you know if you know want to know what we want from a beach ordinance we want no tents right we have tents get blown up by the wind knock into people
both our guests and not our guests and people get injured right and even people you know logging you know just carrying tents onto the beach they're hitting people as they turn around with their tents and whacking people and they're you know um doing damage to property and
people I think that it's not good for any of us residents hotels whatever if these big tents are set up that's something that I don't see in there that I think is really important that we put in there um you know I think there's there's lots and lots of things I can go into that really you know would be
important to consider but you know I don't want to take up you know uh all of your time but I think it's really important that we sit there and get a workshop going so we can go through all these things um I really really don't want to result to some of the Alternatives I've mentioned today but
like if this is rushed through like we're all talking about you know it's being rushed through um by the way this is all private beach right we have easements that we've given under the CP that will go into effect soon that we allow people on the beach but still private beach so I'm not even sure what we're talking about here are we talking
about you know the the the the city government saying on private beach when the you know scope of this committee is for public beach I'm just so confused about what the what the goal is of this ordinance what the goal is of this committee how can work together and talk
about you know getting this right so I would recommend delaying any decisions we get a workshop going we sit down I'm a flexible guy I know the other Hotel folks are flexible people and I'll chat about what can be done if after that Workshop you're just really dead set that there's a method and a and a way
forward then okay that is what it is the next steps will unfold but I think it's really important that we get that Workshop going and that there's really no need to rush to a decision on March 10th unless there's some other alterior motive which I hope there isn't and I I don't think any of you do but others in
the community may have that so I appreciate you listening to me thank you very much and again I'm I'm waiting and and available to any Workshop that you guys come up with thank you thank you very much thank you can can I just say one one thing I mean I appreciate a lot of the things you just said and whether
it's the scope of the committee or not the city commission you know believes that they have the authority to put these ordinance in place so you know whether we're just helping to try to you know create a forum or not to discuss these things and it's in our chter or
not you know that may may not you know be appropriate but um the city commission is still trying to make these rules and so they're the ones that I think really have to hear what you what you have to say because they're the ones that have the authority on March 10th to
to do that second reading if that respect is more of a legal one I understand however I think like the fire trucks and EMS not going on the beach I think that has to be something that this committee contemplates because if the whole goal as I understand is to create
Drive vs for safety right that's what I've been told right the setbacks create Drive V so you can put emergency vehicles on the beach this is what the mayor has said so that you can access people in in in trouble in Danger heart attack or whatever on the beach the problem is the fire department won't do
that they will come out obvious and and walk out and address someone but you don't need Drive vs if they're going to walk down to the beach so the whole premise behind the intent of the setbacks is basically void are you referring to the ones between the
properties that go out I I'm told and and correct me if you have a different understanding I'm told that creating setbacks in between Lots creat space which would be like a drive a where a ambulance or firet truck could drive out on the beach get closer to the person
person in distress and be able to treat them more effectively the problem is I don't know anywhere else in the State of Florida that does this number one I don't know how we enforce it right because even if you have those setbacks like what am I supposed to do someone sits there and I'm supposed to call the sheriff and say hey someone's on your
drive aisle come and get them off because they're going to be angry with me right if I go to them and say hey you need to move even though I might be fine with it it's my property but I might say you know what just leave them alone just let them enjoy their their their afternoon I can't do that anymore more because now this has put me in a
position where I have to call the sheriff I have to remove them and then I'm going to start saying look it's costing me additional labor monitoring this I need is more sheriff on the beach to monitor it yourself because this is the city's ordinance then that's more sheriff and there's more I pay taxes too
I'm just paying for it also right along with the residents so I think there there are alternate ways like I mean I think we should be working together on maybe a Hardscape that goes up and down the beach Like a Beach Walk that can be used by fire trucks and ambulances I'm doing it as part of my cup um I think
that's a bigger solution to getting in emergency vehicles to better access everyone guest in the public than is creating dyve balls on Sand that the fire department is very clearly said they won't use and they won't go on I mean they were very very clear with us to the point like we need to design and spend money to make sure that they don't
go on Sand not even an inch so I just think you know look just that one premise alone I think makes us all rethink about what are we doing here and maybe I just don't understand understand I mean do you all have a different understanding what the setbacks are for I I I know we're not supposed to do
a question and answer but um I wasn't even sure that that was the sole reason for the the I hadn't even heard them refer to as Drive outs I I just thought they were you know separators so that they they but but I think that a point you did make was that I think that for
every action there's a reaction and and and just like you pointed out that you'd have to put ropes around things I think it's very enlightening for you to explain what the reaction would be to some of these things in our ordinance and having a constructive conversation for us to understand what the impact
would be of some of the things in the ordinance so that we can make sure that the city commission understands what those impacts might be and and and would adjust by the way I would talk to residents of C Market in places like that because if they start understanding there are swas of beach that are left
with we can't put seats on them we can't service them I believe that they won't be happy because why because remember I have a bus stop right out my property to them that could mean like this is turning into up on beach which for them that's a bad thing right they don't want
big swats of of of empty Beach that I can't control that now is accessible to a bus stop and they're like no I mean they've told me this they like their private beach they don't want us sitting on the beach and we have made sure that our guests Do not sit on their Beach but what we're doing if we don't rope it off
is creating these like kind of vacuous areas that I don't really have authority of the sheriff time to react is dangerously slow and all of a sudden we're creating this like no man's land which is I think just dangerous and I don't think the residents that are on the beach want stuff like this is my
guess again I would do maybe like a study and talk to people but I I realize it's not a Q&A session so I appreciate the the conversation but luy again maybe in a different format in a workshop it can be more of a Q&A we can talk and again during the cup I think Al saw I
gave like public areas and Vista areas for the public and private elevators for the public I did all kinds of things so we're really flexible in trying to address an objective I just think that I haven't heard especially the Comm say I haven't heard what the objective is so I'm scratching my head saying how can we
go forward or recommend going forward the ordinance if none of us are clear what the objective is I just that's to me is kind of 101 what did you say your relationship was with the trade wins I own it so wow I mean here we have the owner of the
trade WIS coming to a beach stewardship meeting I mean I think this sort of shows us the importance of of this ordinance to the trade winds and and and and the and the importance of of working together here so I mean I I I I I I
really appre I really want to thank you for for coming and I I think that I I I hope that the city you know I I'm just trying to figure out how can we make sure that that we are having this dialogue blog I mean I don't know if this is the meeting to have it or how do we just make sure that we move forward I
mean I I'll tell you like in the cup uh the city was worried about the lack of visibility from Gulf Boulevard to the beach and I came with the solution of doing a rooftop public you know accessible area that everyone could come and enjoy and get better views than from Gul Boulevard and it would be accessible
for by the public that's a solution that no one saw on the table but those type of solutions we can we can work on and say hey tell me what the objective is and maybe I I have a solution you go wow that's better than what we're asking for but I don't know because I don't know
the objectives but if if we talk openly about the objectives I'm sure we can brainstorm about better ways to make it a safer Beach if that's the objective or if the objective is hey making sure that there aren't drunk and disly behavior on the beach I'm for that I don't want people drinking on public beach either
you know I mean selfishly that's better for my business right I serve on my private beach so um we're aligned more than you might think and I don't think maybe a lot of people out there understand that we just need to communicate and we bring that alignment together and come up with Creative Solutions right because I think that's
where we're I think that's where the residents I think are sort of stuck in the middle because you know the hotels have always provided a service in a way of of maintaining decorum and and and at the same time now you know you you you have to have the
defensive measures that you don't want public drunkenness but you know then you try to say well we don't want a lot of people I've gotten feedback they they want to be able to have a drink on the beach sometimes but you know now we have we trying to do things and say well zero tolerance and
and we have all these different things that are going on because we're trying to avoid one extreme but when we and can you imagine how angry the residents you I have a point of order um point of order yes we uh we kind of broke protocol with not sticking to three
minutes and also our a discussion that doesn't diminish anything I just heard we also have a timetable and any other people that would like to speak and I think we need to be fair with the others that will follow but we need to move on
and my apologies I didn't mean to take your time I'm sorry no no my apologies we can discuss in different format I apologize but last thing I'll say is imagine how angry the residents would be if I have to register all of them and put a band on their wrist because they just want to cover the trade ones for a drink they just want to walk across the street and have a drink trade wi now I
have to register them like why do you need my information I'm like the city requires me it's there's a lot to work on here thank you very thank you very much if I IAC there was one thing he said that um I I remember differently I unfortunately witnessed a individual
having a heart attack on the beach there were several police squads in their full SUVs that respond it and um the Medics actually came in on a group and a Gator with a gurnie or whatever you call it
and when the police when they showed up took over from the police and CPR and all of that what he said that um what can you find out what the fire department would use when they're responding are they using Gators or do they bring their EMS Vehicles so they do
have a a marine unit so they have a boat and they I do believe they have a a gator of sorts to tow a trailer um you know longboards and stuff that they all use for their Marine rescues um but I do know that the smaller trucks are able to get out onto
the beach just I just wanted that's the first I witnessed something different I saw police units and you know EMS there on a on a I think it was a gator but I wanted to make I would like to know for sure what is their policy and that should inform you know the safety and
access but I do know that the police were there in their Cruiser right respond because they were the they were actually there first and they do bring their cars in Need access and I've seen SUVs just driving patrolling on full size SUVs that's what I meant by
cruising so the sheriff's able to get out there the smaller uh EMS fire trucks are able to get because that was the first I had heard that okay sorry we can continue okay uh the next comment I have is Travis Johnson
good morning uh Travis Johnson for the record representing 5500 Gulf Boulevard through 6000 I'm not the owner of trade wins but I have been part of the management group for 25 years so I'll save you a little bit of time since my my uh boss here took took a lot of it but um very
informative yeah first I want to thank you for your service here obviously this is an important issue um I hope everything that you bring up to the commission is heard it's a shame if that's not the case um you know the made a comment at the commission meeting that after public comment that you guys need
to speak up we've been speaking up on this issue for two years as many of you know right countless hours we're talking today both properties are sold out yet we're here again spending time on this issue um as Joe mentioned it's just not fully ready to go right there's a lot of
uh in there in The Proposal that we agree with but there's a lot that hasn't been well thought out so Joe's comment about a workshop is a great one there's most of which again we agree that we can support but things like moving every item off the beach daily is not the
right thing to do that is going to do more damage we've given some suggestions about maybe moving it back um but that constant many properties don't even have an area to put this or a lane to get these items off the beach right and as
you know we have a thousand rooms we got a lot of chairs um that's a big one and then this escalated from you know we were collaborating talking through Turtle season and then all of a sudden it went into above and beyond Turtle season why at the meeting no logical
reason was given is to why right other than somebody wants this to happen and unfortunately folks are following that right and so we just want reasonable you know the beach is our number one resource right it's the backbone of our community we want rules we want to help
support those rules right we're a steward of the community but they have to be reasonable they have to be logical I ask of you to bring this message up and be heard to the commission um to make sure that that we're getting that um a reality I'm coming on the beach today I'm sure you've saw seen this
right we're welcoming people back we're rebuilding a lot of properties are open and what's our message a flashing do sign saying don't do this don't do that don't do this or you'll get arrested or sighted mom is watching at our property par their children build a sand castle
they step out one foot outside of a Zone and they're they're going to get sighted for for drinking a pina colada like come on guys what are we doing why are we doing that setbacks what's the reasoning you know we're all about making logical uh movement forward and working together
and collaborating but oh man a lot of this just doesn't make any sense and there's no reasons that have been given to us that make sense right um Joe touched on a lot of a lot of other items I would just end with this we need to be very careful right there are a lot of options out there we have been
awardwinning beaches we have visitors fortunately flocking to our destination for many many years what I've seen in the last few weeks even with the enforcement that unfortunately has been pressured to happen they're they're going to go elsewhere and talk about economic impact what about when they go to the other
communities and other destinations in Clearwater Beach and Treasure Island and Madera Beach right so let's just be very reasonable I beg of you to to use some you know logic and to pass that message up up the chain thank you have a great day thank you again for your service thank you
Ed Sheed morning guys sheets 5776 AV for presenting postcard n 6300 Golf Boulevard a couple things for clarification since I have been working there for a while yes police SUVs are allow on the beach four-wheel drive Gators are allowed on the beach for
four-wheel drive fire trucks and ambulances will sink and will not get out uh so the we have our easement to allow all that EMS and you know basically all the police to get out there then they use their Gators and then you know part of our thing for our
setback is an SUV a gator a firet truck ambulance they're all about 8T wide so a 30 foot wide Zone in between every property really only just crunches in especially the small properties we're lucky to have enough to have a pretty big footprint other properties aren't so
lucky so the 15 ft which they did discuss bumping it to every property makes it 30 ft which which is a pretty large space same thing with the 7 50 to 75 all that does is just shrink people's Footprints shrinks down Revenant you can have no more weddings on the sand no
more anything and just to have an open area we've been running it for the past couple years with 50 plenty of room for the police to patrol plenty of room for everyone to go by no issues really that we've seen on our side so the second thing would be the removal of the chairs um last year we worked you know we
obviously we bought postcard in the ownership did a couple years ago so we got in it's basically a new team so we we worked with the city we worked with the commission the turtle commission to have a plan for us so because we can care for the beach our plan which we implemented was to pull the chairs back stack all the chairs every night pull
them back not all the way off but back basically to kind of keep that open area and then the Cabanas Cabanas are a safety we anchor them we drill them into the sand uh to make sure that they don't fly away like these tends to so that was our plan Turtle commission endorsed it
for us we we operated like that anything like to take all that work and then move it another 300 ft basically into our parking lot cuz there's no other place to store this stuff just as a hardship we consulted with our Sun Coast waterports for our property alone you're
looking at another $150,000 in payroll just payroll not to mention the Lost sales because also we have a set time to operate 9 to5 Sunset comes down people get off the beach now you're working in the dark now you're running heavy
machinery now you're up the the the sand you're leaving holes you now have to in the dark pack we just think that it's just not common sense what we would love to see because we look at the site map we have a 75t easement for for people to walk through we don't have the concern
of oh the public can't get on our beach we have a huge Lane for it what we would like to see is individualized PL site plans for each property because every property is different we're different we're not trade wins we only put out a 100 chairs a day 26 Cabanas 100 chairs and then we
add more as we see fit now to bring that back to zero all that's going to do is just create a huge line in our beach we're not going to be able to help our guests and each time a guest comes up well now you're waiting for whoever's in front of you whoever's in front of you because it does take time to drill down a cabana for you to sit into or pull out
two chairs so we just hope there's Common Sense type plans for every uh everything we would love the setbacks to be 15 ft and 50 and just keep the beach rolling and get us back to work thanks guys thank you very much I apologize I think this says Sean thank you good morning I'm Sean
Kowski 5250 golf Bullard I am excuse me the managing director for bellweather and beach comr resorts um I I think you've heard uh today you if you watched the city commission meeting on January 28th you would have heard it us as a
hotel group there's some frustration here and it's really about the communication two-way or lack thereof right um Joe mentioned it Travis mentioned it but I want I want to dig into that a little bit more and I kind of felt some frustration on on your side too of not really knowing the
information of the beach ordinance right so I watched I rewatched the city commission meeting this morning right um and I wanted to make sure I had these facts straight so June 2024 there's a workshop I don't know who was in involved in that workshop for the beach
ordinance at least my properties weren't I don't think the hotels were on 1112 2024 there was a St Pete Beach business meeting I was at that meeting nothing mentioned about a beach ordinance no no communication regarding that um on 11:13
I think you guys had a beach stewardship meeting I didn't watch that but I didn't see the beach ordinance on the agenda on 1 128 we had a first reading so that kind of Blindsided us as a hotel group so we had to react quickly um the only opportunity we have to speak
is this forum right now right so I have six minutes three minutes at the first ordinance reading three minutes here and then maybe three more minutes at the second but it could get past that time nine minutes and it's not two-way communication that's what we're asking for it's two-way communication and find
a resolution um I think Mr kurman you mentioned it to Elise we need to sit down and talk as a group and we can find a solution but since the first reading we haven't had an opportunity to speak outside of
public comment um the setbacks so again what's the public purpose for that we heard about EMS think about if we we currently space our Cabanas in our seating areas because we want safety access we can't put them on top of each other but if we squeeze those setbacks we're forced to squeeze
our chairs even closer so now it's a double-edged sword we're not creating space because we don't have enough seating it currently is um the business impact as we study as we know there's a business impact study happening right now has to be presented before the the
310 what is that business impact reading no one has talked to us about how should we look at this what's the financial U metrics what is Hotel occupancy what is The Guest Survey there's a lot of stuff in the business impact to tell us what the business impact is without speaking
to us and giving an opportunity for input that's a challenge now we do have a media on this Friday with Fran to go through that so that's great keep in mind there's 5 days until the next reading how can that be adjusted the feedback given from us and an accurate business
impact study being done and then um you know my main recommendations would be again meet with us we want to have two-way communication this is a great opportunity but again it's not two-way we'll find a solution we want to find a solution we have to look at this on an
individual site site plan basis every hotel is different it absolutely is my hotels are very skinny it's really going to restrict my hotels and and ultimately my revenue and then also take a look at the guest room blinds language it's Crossing guest privacy issues if we have
to go in and close the blinds at night doesn't make sense thank you for your time thank you Kristen Simmons good morning everybody my name is kesten Simmons I'm the director of catering and sales for postcard in on St Pete Beach thank you for speaking with us today and
hearing our concerns um one of the first statements that I would like to make is just um instead of positioning our hotels and cities as separate entities and the management of the beach resources I really encourage a beach stewardship partnership where um we can
redefine how both parties collaborate on sustainable Beach management and our guest experiences and this could allow us to enhance that Turtle protection effort that we are trying to present and as an opportunity for hotels to align with the city on these common goals um
you know another point that I would like to make is that um we could tailor regulations to the different Hotel needs by um not all all hotels are the same their proximity to the beach um their guest experience offerings are even different so could we create an Adaptive
Beach zoning that would allow those regulations to be based on on those hotels specific operational needs um and that way the location of their property is considered it's not a one- siiz fits all um another thing to consider is you know with the 750t
setback how that could impact our weddings which is you know a thriving portion of our revenue on our beach and how that would impact in taxes I mean if a hundred weddings alone just in small food and beverage minimums we could have a $1.5 million impact just from those
weddings alone moving to another Beach um I would like to provide an update on kind of what we're doing at our property now uh we have actually opened up our beach access so we've created a safe zone so that people are able to go from Golf Boulevard down to the beach um I'm
hearing great feedback that the residents are very excited to have that access back as well and we're also maintaining and cleaning the beach on a daily basis even though we are not currently open or servicing food or alcohol at our property so we definitely do align on a lot of our Miss
and we would just like to as you've heard repeatedly um to have a voice in that in consideration of what our hotels would like to do to kind of create that bond with the city and the residents to create a great experience for our guest and our
residents thank you thank you thank you um I cannot read this first name looks like Harvey morning everyone good morning my name is Parker Harvey I'm the director of rooms for the Don CeSar 3400 Golf Boulevard I tried to send this letter last night to
aako unfortunately the St Pete Beach website still links to C Mills when you click on your email address oh so I sent it I figured it out I think and sent it to you this morning okay I'm going to read a few portions of a letter from James bue the president of bue Brothers they manage our beach operations at the
Don CeSar in the beach house Suites they do have a they have 36 years of beach operational experience here in Florida our primary concern in reviewing the new chapter 95 is the safety issues be considered in the final drafting of the
city's new rules based on our extensive experience we know that the more times during the day and greater the distance we have to move the equipment the greater the chances there for accidents to occur and injuries to happen to our employees and patrons this is especially true when the beaches already occupied
and the chance for children and others to knock into equipment that is why we respectfully ask that any new rules not prevent us from pre- setting up equipment on the private Hotel beaches in which we operate it allows to store Beach equipment in a designated area on the beach overnight that has been
approved by the city staff storing in place hotels are currently permitted and have been allowed for the last for at least the last 10 years to preset up beach chairs loungers and amenities for hotel guests on the beach front directly adjacent to the hotels and to reset
equipment neatly and secured in place with the exception of beach umbrellas which are placed nightly in umbrella boxes located in the beach area this process allows equipment to be available for the hotel's visitors and guests with minimal movement displacement and most
importantly traffic back and forth on the sand from the staging area to the designated amenities amenity areas of the beach area the current process allows employees to avoid setup before the temperature rises significantly allows employees to avoid walking back and forth across the sand with heavy
equipment which has the potential to create damage to the beach itself and allow Staffing at the beach area appropriately while while operating in a fiscally responsible manner cities and municipalities which have moved from a preset up process to a
single use saw a significant uptick and employee injuries related to The increased operational Tempo that is required under the single Ed process including an increase in heat related injuries related to these operations which were not consistent with other
similar properties we Ser we service which were located less than a mile away from the single use operations this is why the city of Holland Florida abandoned plans for single setup last year following a beach renourishment e effort after contemplating such change deciding
instead to return to allowing preset up to avoid significant disruption to the patron Beach experience it and less degradation of the beach itself in addition moving equipment while patrons are already visiting the beach and occupying loungers and sand chairs has the potential to create a
situation where an accident or injury could occur finally the single use process required a requires a significant increase in Staffing which was not sustainable for long-term operations as a result when confronted with realities and and dangers of single
use programs all municipalities have allowed a return to preset up operations so thank you very much Ando if you could yako I'm sorry if you could forward the letters the letter to the rest of the beach Steward stewardship committee absolutely thank you very much thank you
all for your time appreciate you Leslie Price Rob is on good morning Robert Su on Plaza Beach Hotel 4506 Golf Boulevard our fam's owned this hotel since 1988 the
property's been there since 1951 and we have always welcomed our neighbors onto our property we have no issue with that except for when they're encroaching on Pro things that we don't want them to do for example setting up a 10x1 in front of our cavanas so our
guests are the ones ones that are paying the high dollars to stay at the hotel our guests are visiting from other parts of the world they want to enjoy the beach they want to see a beach by you guys enforcing not you guys by the commission enforcing a 75t setback from the front we're now limited to where we can put those Cabanas if we were able to
put those Cabanas further up front then we can allow for some tents or the residents to go behind the Cabanas because it should be the people that are paying the most money get the front view as opposed the other way around where we're having the the cheap seats in the back and the more expensive seats in the
front so that's an issue altoe uh in addition to the 15 feet setback on each side my property is only 136 feet wide six uh 136 ft right yeah so taking 15 ft from one sign 15 ft said is 22% of my property that's a lot so imagine
somebody coming to your property looking at your home looking at the survey and say we're taking 22% away from your property so put yourselves in my position and what would you do you won't go down you wouldn't just stand still you would fight so we are fighting it I
am fighting it so if this passes on March 10th I will fight it and I will fight it to the death without it doubt and it will be lawsuits so I want to encourage this group here as Dan said you guys are advisers advise the
commission not to go forward with this to make more time to really evaluate this ordinance because this is a very big orance if it does pass on March 10th I'm not threatening I'm just saying the facts I am going to fight it just like you would fight it if somebody attacked your home and your family you would
fight it I'm going to fight it and we the hotels my hotel and I'm sure the other hotels will join we have hundreds of millions of dollars to fight this hundreds the city themselves doesn't have that kind of funds they don't have the funds to rebuild a fire station they had the opportunity to buy Leo Park Leo
Park was for sale for 5 years I ended up buying it for $3 million cash I have that kind of cash I've got more cash so the city could have done it and could have had parking for the residents but they chose got to buy it the Beach Haven just sold last month Beach Haven sold for $65 million if the city was really
concerned about Beach parking and beach access they should have bought the Beach Haven that would have been a golden opportunity for the city to buy a property have more Beach for the residents but the city continues to fail us and that's the problem with this commission the mayor continues to fail us Lisa continues to fail us there are certain people in this District they're
failing us and that's unfortunate so I urge you guys to advise the commission to table this so we have more time come together and figure out a solution forcing things on us is not the way to do it sitting down and negotiating is the way to do it so thank you for your
time thank you this is the last card Brad Cochran good morning thank you for allowing me to speak today Brad Cochran 5300 uh Gulf Boulevard serata Beach Resort um again as a lot of of statements excuse me statements have been made you know I'm I'm talking about
the the you know the removal of the Cabanas daily nightly off the beach onto the beach um currently the way we handle those beach chairs is we stack them nice and neatly they're locked up at night time um very little impact guest can't guest or non- guest beachgoers cannot
come out to our beach take a chair move it off the beach think of the impact that moving 200 chairs 50 umbrellas Cabanas on and off the beach daily we talk about um sustaining our beaches and and the dunes and and what what that
looks like think about what the impact is of moving all that heavy equipment on and off the beach again it's not just um a danger to the guests it's a danger to the associates and it's also a danger to the um residents who would be coming and going to the beach um then we think
about the economic impact right um the economic impact isn't just the Sera and what it costs us the economic impact is are the guests of the serata that that come and and go to a lot of other places on the beach in St Pete Beach whether it be a restaurant Public's grocery store
um a re a retail clothing store all of these things are what our guests at the sarata come to go to the beach to think about I don't think anybody's thought of the economic impacts that that these decisions with this new beach ordinance are going to cause um our guests like to come out you know
it's was also mentioned that you know we can only put out beach chairs on demand guests don't want to as was previously mentioned from someone else guests don't want to come out and stand there and wait in line to go to the beach no different they don't want to wait and and if we had to set up our pool deck the same way they like to come out they
like to sit down they like to be ready to go to the beach think about the summertime it gets hot who wants to stand in the hot sand in the middle of the summertime again we put out small rows of chairs at a time we don't set the entire Beach up um I I think all of these things need to be taken into
effect um again I talked about the uh locking our beach chairs up at night um there was a mention of the film on the Windows you know we've had been asked by the city to do several things whether it's lighting the film on the windows I I believe the film on the windows that
we put in place was well over $100,000 uh at the serata um the the um limit was to have for for the film was to to to allow no more than 45% Li out we took that a step further and and
and set it at 27 so we our Windows only allow 27% out but a lot of times you know those these things that that I just spoke to you about are not taken into effect it's always well what is the hotel not doing what about the things that the hotels are doing um for the
city um and at the end um you know as a as a business I'm not the owner but as a as a general manager every decision I make at the hotel we have to think about about all the impacts right the logistic impacts the economic
impacts we think about all those things before you and I just think that this new beach ordinance is being rushed um it has wide impacts for a lot more than just the the hotel on the beach so um I thank you for your time today and appreciate you allowing me to speak
thank you I I would like to say that I I have considered when I've gone and observed the beach for instance that I've I've looked at the Sara and and used it as an example of where the chair
model has worked because I've seen often times not many empty chairs out there so that was the model that I saw work where it seemed that the only people that had their chairs out were people that you know wanted them and that perhaps it was
when hotels bundle chairs with rooms or where people just in human nature because if the chairs were free with their room would just call each morning and say you know tomorrow I'm gonna want a chair and so the chairs would just sit out there empty all day if they were bundled free with a room um and and so I
think that what's happened if we're looking at what the problem is that that I think the city is trying to solve it's a sea of empty chairs that are just always out at a hotel that's
caused um the the cause the desire to try to reduce the number of chairs if we're trying to you know honestly talk about what problem is trying to be solved I mean I think it's just terrific that there's people from all these hotels here and I'm I'm just trying to throw out what what what what's there um
I I think I've read um in some of the documents have gone back and forth that if hotels have you know tint on their Windows that's of the sufficient type that that would is supposed to be an exclusion to not re ire the blinds to be closed you know the blinds being closed
is if a hotel doesn't have uh that I also and I you know this is part of these shade documents that I said where I've written letters to the commission and I wanted to make sure they were public um you know we talk about that there's been you know
uh uh this has been going on for three years well you know we had many meetings and we provided a lot of input to the legal staff and and and to the staff that was here that was going to provide updates to the ordinances that I still
don't see in the ordinances um and and I think I I wrote a letter uh and the letter that went to the other Beach stewards and I sent it to the city commission when I found out they were doing the first reading and it was a reminder of all the things that were in the public record that were sent in as
comments to earlier City commission meetings or earlier Beach stewardship meetings of all the comments to the earlier drafts of this ordinance and it was all of your all of these past Communications about how people didn't want to bring in their chairs and all
these comments before on a lot of the things that people have spoken about today and it was a reminder but of course the city commission probably didn't get my email in time because again it was short notice for the first reading um but it for for that many
other reasons I would like to make a motion um that we we do as a city as a beach stewardship committee uh suggest or request to the city commission that
they consider shelving the um be the beach ordinance uh temporarily until we can have what I would call the town hall and I'm calling it a town hall because in the past at our workshops we told the public they
could not speak at a workshop that a workshop was when we just had our own discussion that this actually be a town hall where we have a constructive discussion with the public or with some even subset of the public maybe as even the hotel years at this point to talk to
them constructively and discuss the issues and and how we can work together to um to focus on their area of what needs to be done because maybe we also have solutions that are set seate and that don't affect pass a grill this
maybe is just a large resort District uh discussion um of of what needs to be done discussion I mean I definitely feel that there needs to be more conversation before a second reading I don't know what the second reading is going to look
like um and as a as a committee I mean I can individually email all the Comm commers and tell them what I've heard today and what the concerns are or we could as a group try to have a a workshop or we as
a group discuss I don't really know things are very rushed at this point and sometimes when things get rushed they miss things I feel but I do know also that I'm new to this committee but this beach ordinance has been a two or a threeyear
process so there has to be an end in sight it can't just continue to go I feel that our our responsibility here to me has been to protect and preserve and so when I look at different things my question is how does this
affect the nesting sea turtles which we know is you know certain months of the year and how does this affect the dunes so there are things in this document that are going to affect both of those so I think those are the areas that we can focus on our
recommendations as far as regulating how many chairs and how much is you know what's the the tax for that that's just not really I don't know how that's preserving the beach necessarily those are just regulatory measures that are really out of our
scope well I I should just add that there there was a plethora of mistakes that I reviewed with Mr McConnell that are still not even corrected where for instance even with regard to the birds they literally crossed out the word or beaches from where you're not allowed to
feed the birds and they just seem to have not paid attention to how our chapters are organized someone got the idea that where they were trying to cons solidate they they they just removed the word Beach from any other chapter so the
alcohol chapter the birds chapter even the dunes chapter removes removes the word beaches from critical parts so this is this was really done halfhazard and I've gotten to the point where i' I've suggested that the new attorneys might want to just really look this over and
write it their way because the way this was redlined they they did not just change the chapter number to say it's no longer Parks the parks chapter it will now be the the uh Beach chapter make a
chapter 95 they cut and pasted the text and so everything in the whole section was crossed out and everything in the new section was underlined and when they did that they changed words and when they did that you can't tell what words they changed I went through it carefully
saw what they changed and they actually made small changes that I think were many cases mistakes some of them might have been deliberate changes some of them may be may have been inadvertent changes when I look at them I don't think that people realize some of those changes that were made with regard to
Dunes now all of a sudden you can start raking things with machines you weren't allowed to before I don't think that was deliberate so there's a lot of things in here that I think we're taking away protections that were were not intended to be taken away so I I really think that there's things that really need to
be looked at very carefully and and and and for those are some of those other reasons that I was mentioning that this should be looked at and I haven't had time to do the new redlining because I can't even get a new version of this in word to start comparing what the current version is to look at because the first
reading wasn't available to the public because they had a different version that they were looking at at the city commission that was in than what was in the agenda and I got that copy uh two days ago so so I have enough time to look at that
yet I'm torn on it so first you know we we use words and rush and like that but we've also I've only been on the commission a year or this committee for a year but was involved like that the conversation has been going on for years so I get the
one side of it is hey we've been talking about this for years what are you doing this isn't right red this shouldn't be a surprise to anybody like that so I get that point I also realize that we've gone through the process between our last official workshop and this we've
gotten a new attorney we've been hit by two hurricanes and that and and in that handoff there's been some administrative things that you just highlighted and great detail about what's going on um
I'm not an attorney nor am I do I play one on TV as I always look at these is we should be working with the attorney staff in making here is the intent of what we want to solve and then they put it into language that's appropriate for
an ordinance that will hold up in court sometimes you know in in my work in this in the last year and I'll say it to I think the commission and us we got into wording versus intent so that's just one
observation and now I think that the new attorney staff has was directed hey let's get things we got to get start getting things done again this has been going on for years they they've did a job and I the presentation that's in here is probably the best presentation
that that I've seen so I'll give them kudos for that but I also agree that um because of the churn that has happened a another opportunity for comment from
both residents business and us as a committee would be I would be comfortable in recommending that now I am not recommending that this goes on for another three years I pull my fingernails out it's kind of like the
turtle light we were assigned we were assigned to get that done and we gotten zero with that that ass side so I think between you know I would be willing to you know for us to discuss even
potentially making a motion that hey for what we heard here we have businesses that would like a one more another opportunity to be heard um and you know I have some I I
went through the new draft and I've marked it up um I have no intentions of us going through line by line here now that I actually know we have an owner this time and Brandon's it you know I will send him by he which he may or may
not take um I'd be doing it as a member but not for the committee why like that but I think um with all of that making sure that we are be we recommend that the city be as transparent as possible
with where we're at get another cycle of common end and there's still no one's going to be happy with everything in it and that's where you know maybe a negotiation but there's there are things that will go in this that you may or may not like and
we're going to have to deal with that and then you know the the I won't use the word threats but um enthusiasm for hey we're going to fight this let you know that's a part of the process but um I think we need to make sure at least I
the city needs to be as transparent as possible um one more sign one more thing of of feedback and then take that and then move forward with a second reading or a final finalization with that um I
would I would time box that into a few months not six months or a year I would I would not that we get to recommend terms and duration but that's mine but I'm really Tor right we've been talking about this a city for years I I think
the one thing time to get something done but I do believe it needs to be done in a way that's transparent and not everyone's going to be happy right I I agree with you definitely yeah I I think it's important that we we like you said we we we think
about what what we're trying to accomplish and I think we also have to relate it to some of the other things that are going on like this new at the same time they just came up with this new code enforcement ordinance that they're reviewing which we we have on the agenda no not not the zero tolerance uh
initiative pilot that they're doing they also have an ordinance that's about to go to Second reading for code enforcement which is that like second strike it you you you lose your your your ability to to to sell liquor on the beach uh for six months so it's a whole
code enforcement uh thing that's going to add new teeth to everything so instead of warnings you know it's it's it's it's it's changing things so when a lot of the ordinances were done originally people said well you know don't worry
about it you know it's still the sheriffs don't really you know they use judgment well this new code enforcement rule is saying no no no we don't want to do warnings because tourists take advantage of the fact that we do warnings uh because they're only
tourists so they know the word's gotten out that they do warnings so now we want to start enforcing and so now we have to also rethink our ordinances because now we have to realize that's there's a new philosophy and and so that's another
reason we have to rethink our ordinances a little perhaps because if now the enforcement model changes you might want to rethink how you write your ordinances because now you don't have that luxury that we had before for our ordinances um
not to confuse it but when you when you change your philosophy of enforcement you might have to change your philosophy of how you wrote your ordinance um I don't know if I agree with that you got a rule and there's consequences just because there's consequences I wouldn't change the rules well but we Chang the
consequences but that's conse you you were saying if I may um hey we should go back look at the rules because now we're going to hold them accountable for the rules because they said don't worry about the consequences I yeah I don't know if I agree with that I did I didn't agree with it at the time but they said
don't worry but okay yeah um anyway so we have a motion on the table uh to to either as a group or I I said it as a group that we we uh I don't know who would actually write something like that uh when we do a motion is it that
the clerk or ioko would would would write something to the uh City commission how would that go if we actually did a motion you would formulate your motion I would need a second and then I could prepare this these minutes and send them to the city Commission
okay so the motion was that we going to consider a motion to postpone read or have yeah I don't I'll go back to language I used is
I think we should encourage we should advise the commission right that we believe that um an additional round of feedback from the community be considered
before passage of the beach ordinance committee that's perfect can that be the move so I I make if I John if I may please go ahead uh I
make a motion that um we advise the commission to consider an addition add round of public feedback before the is it the second reading is the final before the second
reading of the beach ordinance and the and the May perhaps the ordinance be made available to them or maybe not I'm not going to put that in motion I'm trying to high level succinct we I'm trying to
be succinct here so I make a motion that we advise uh the the commission to provide one more round of feedback from the community business and residents uh before the uh second
reading of the beach ordinance okay that's my motion I would second that I second that thank you member Looney yes member kurman yes Vice chair Stevens
yes chair rothenberger yes motion carries all right well and our next our next issue is actually the beach ordinance and um I know what's the beach ORD that was
the beach or was it that was it I think that we've uh there's the quarterly report right the items that we were going to have a quick discussion with John y so if we could get the report from you and then we'll well deal with
John's on the on the beach ordinance I mean I we we are going to do the second round but I I I'll just say that I'd like to see the the thing I'll just wait till we do the discussion on the item okay that's
fine okay thanks so for the beach report it's attached to the agenda it's pretty straightforward um I can tell you moving forward though I'm not going to be able to prepare such a report because I don't have access to this information any longer my roles
change I don't know what the activi special events are necessarily going to be going on board how many weddings there are going to be so I'm not going to be able to provide that information moving forward I do have access to the um Sheriff's Department violations so I can report on that to
you um that's pretty straightforward as it is who has that information now what stuff you lost access to the parks and wreck department they can't give you or whomever if it's you or some someone else I'm assuming I could request it for them to give it to
me I suppose yeah like me you like I'm not sure who who your liaison is going to be moving forward is what I'm saying okay so but I can try and gather whatever information I can and continue reporting this if I'm still
here and that's pretty straightforward you can see there's a lot of uh warnings issued and not too many citations but with this probably leads on to your new um discussion item about zero tolerance enforcement policy or they're
wanting to get stricter on issuing more citations I suppose for versus issuing warnings do you know anything about the citation on somebody that got out and drove on the beach I don't know I just heard about the incident I don't know
much more about that all right yeah thank you yes it is all right so now uh John will pick up well so I had an opportunity to talk to one of the sheriffs or deputies or what have
you and and he had said that you know he issues a lot of of warnings that the city had asked him to start being much more strict and this is before the announcement um and I had i' had been at a city commission meeting I don't know how many people watched the meeting but
there after the renourishment of passag gril there was a discussion because there was complaints about too many people walking on the dunes in pasag gril and and so at that meeeting there was a
uh a plea to start enforcing and being strictor because there were just people you know were going crazy and going on the dunes and didn't care and they said okay let's be stricter but then by the end of the conversation it came out that
the dunes weren't yet marked and and then and then I went down there and I saw that you couldn't really tell they were Dunes because it was just sand and then more sand um so I could understand people going on the dunes because they didn't look like Dunes they were just sand um and and I
think that sort of came out during the meeting too and so I I sort of felt like we were just sort of getting mad at people and you know they they didn't necessarily you know realize that it was just you know steeper sand um and and
and and and so now I I feel like it's sort of snowballing um and it sort of feel like we're sort of not even in the loop because here we are you know I've studied calini and I don't know if anybody knows who that is but you know
calini uh is a social scientist and and he for instance researched how in Hawaii they had used they put up signs and they said you know there's this much pounds of black sand is stolen every year and
so don't do it but you know what when people saw that sign they went that much is stolen every year I'm missing out and it actually caused more people to steal the sand and and they studied how you know when they did the carry out of the garbage and they and they took away the
garbage pales it actually caused people to litter more and there's all these psychological things and and so he studies all those things but anyway it's it's good to not just always assume that you know the the common things work and it it takes it's helpful to like discuss
it among other people and you know we're a board that we volunteer to do these things because we think we have input and I just wish that we have an opportunity to to be involved and be in the loop um and and so I was just shocked all of a sudden to to see the
announcement that on the 14th we already had a pilot program to to to do something new and I don't know that you were consulted or anyone else was consulted and I just don't you know how do these things happen and
um and you know I understand that I did a a Google on on zero tolerance and I see that in Fort Walton Beach and Miami they just started uh uh or they they have zero to policies but it's because they want to make sure that there aren't you know hordes of high school kids coming down for spring break and of
course we don't want to be known as the one that doesn't have you know protection against the hordes of high school kids for you know spring break getting drunk so you know you have you always have to have your defensive measures too but you know we just have to make sure that you know can't we just
be in the loop and and that's sort of the summary of my other thing too it's just like how do we make sure we're in the loop yeah so I think you have to remember that most of these initiatives are driven from the commission they would like to see certain actions it's relayed down through the city manager
who then implements that right so that's how these policies get created and next thing you know there's a zero tolerance policy being yeah takes life of its own yeah okay but but you know it's a sensitive time too you know and and like
like like someone said people just see a new welcome message at the beach and I don't know if that's so anyway um everybody's got well intentions and we're all trying to we're all trying to do what we can to to help do what we're trying to accomplish and
just I'm also torn on the Zero Tolerance um you know I see your point and yes it sounds harsh but I also I'm on the beach every day I see dogs on the beach every day um I see
people in the dunes every day U since I've been back two weeks week and a half I've been traveling I've seen a material change change in good behavior and I do it I've seen less footprints in the
dunes now down in Passad roil and I'll give the city compliment they put up a rope and post fence that actually marks it but before that was there and before the Hurricanes I either I in the volunteering programs I do with sea
turtle tractors and Beach ambassadors where I would walk the beach and clean not a day go by that I didn't see people up in the dunes um up at upam beach they had signs all over the place when they had that new new sand put up there and you saw
Footprints and people there every foreign day so for us to say hey we're being harsh they didn't know and I I do agree with the new ones there's not plant life on that yet but be even when there wasn't plant when there was plant life there's people in the dunes so at
some point we got to say enough is enough and start holding people accountable um I I I walked up on beach last night just because I always I try and do the public beaches uh right before this so I have like that um they
do not they have up uh as you're going close to the secret garden they have some rope and post fence there it's just demolished um upam Beach needs to be re uh renourished in the worst way but I get the the issues with easements and
all of that um where we did planting there uh last year of new Sea Oats uh the volleyball courts have gone west and the benches there there are less Footprints but there's not a open and post fence there and guess what there
are footprints so um for dogs on the beach um I actually have a view of the beach and I watch and when before this went in place uh I'd see multiple dogs every morning out
there not on a leash and if you're a service dog it needs to be in service on a leash so I know this is not a service animal because it's not an leash so I'm all the time I've seen zero okay since this has gone into effect so it is having the intended effect now back to
your point I think it's harsh but at some point we're all adults now and I've never seen a kid walking in dogs out there um it's it's time for us to get serious so I as I am torn I am in
support of these the enforcement of this um because why have a rule unless you're going to enforce it if not let's just take it off the so that's my my point of view I've seen a material change in good behavior I for dogs I I I I um you know
I understand what your thinking is and even for Dunes I mean I certainly for a contrast I mean I had people last night telling me they heard that the sheriffs are going to be walking around with some sort of wand to sniff the drinks to see if there's alcohol in the drinks I I
don't quite believe that um but uh I think they might consti issues but you know black helicopters going to be on the be watching you something I think that's a bit of you know because I me residents like their yetis but you know no one likes to have the rules
enforced against them exactly everyone wants rules but they don't want them to be held accountable to the rules well I think also coming across the bridge and seeing the sign it definely makes you think why am I here like do I want to be on this beach you know am I going to walk out with a cooler and is someone
going to stop me and say let me see what's in your cool those are those are I mean that's a concern however I think if we educate the community on why we have these rules then you'll start to get Buy in so you have to have buyin on why do we not want
dogs I mean there's you know you automatically oh there's the turtles there's lots of other things there's parasites everyone walks up and down the beach Barefoot I mean if someone's dog is carrying a parasite and they leave behind you know just because you picked
it up mean that there isn't some remnant you know these are things you don't typically see here but it could still happen there's lots of reasons for the rules and I think if there aren't good reasons then why do we have the rues so I think you know you have to go back to buy in and we need to
educate the public and the residents I I talked to a resident was like I pay taxes I should be able to walk my dog down the beach and I kind of just you know shook my head like okay but so I think you have to have Buy in because if you don't have Buy in then people are going to try to break the rules and they're going to get angry and you know
I don't want to get fined because you know I've done something that I don't think should be a rule on the beach so I think we all have to have reasons for things just I agree the other thing when I did the walk every public access point
has a sign that says no alcohol no dogs stay off the Doom has all of that and it's been there for years yes okay but that gets back into the the um to your point about um engagement I
I'll use it as that Community engagement and one of the ideas for the goals of the committee a whole community outreach and engagement that should be a part of that here's the rule but here's why we have the rule you might disagree with
the why you might not like the rule but it's the rule yeah and let me just ask and it sort of still ties into this uh this question so I wrote another letter to the city commission uh before yesterday's meeting and I want to make
sure it's not in the shade so I want to send it to the other Beach stewards but I also want to make sure it's not in the shade so what is the process so that it's you know available to the public and you know appropriate if you have any
Communications at any time that you want shared with the board you can always share those with liaison or the clerk's office and we forward those off immediately to to the other stewards whoever you request but then how does it not be a shade communication how will the public ever see
it it's part of the public record that could be accessed doesn't necessarily it needs to be published everywhere it's accessible as a record if so then the how would the public how would the public ever see it they would they would have to rec for that instance they would
have to request any Freedom of Information Act which I know you know how to do that I okay so so that's just basic okay so it's not part of the it's part of the published okay very good it's still public it's public yeah got it okay thank
you all right anything else you good I'm good thank you those my items okay I have one thing to bring up I think we need to uh find a person for
yes the missing spot yes definitely Brad Brad has missed a few meetings and uh might reach out to commissioner Marriott right and ask him because our rules maybe ask commissioner Marriott
to engage with our missing member y thank you thank you okay thank you that is the end of this meeting thank you all for coming yes thank you
for coming