You guys know >> good evening and welcome to the October 20th, 2025 meeting of the city's senate zoning board of adjustment. My name is Scott Wiggins and I'm the zoning board chair. Please rise and join us in the pledge of allegiance. to the flag of the United States of
America to the republic for it stands nation indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. In accordance with New Jersey statute 10 col4-10, adequate notice of the special
meeting has been provided to a newspaper record. It's been posted here in city hall. This meeting is a judicial proceeding. Any questions or comments must be limited to the issues that are relevant to what the board may legally consider reaching a decision and decorum appropriate to a judicial hearing must
be maintained at all times. For the benefit of the interested public, this meeting is being livereamed on the city's YouTube page, also broadcast on Summit Government channel, which is Comcast channel 34 and Verizon channel 30. Transcript of this meeting is also being taken using video and audio. So,
we need all speakers to utilize one of the microphones in the room. Please note that the fire exits are to my right, your left, and at the back of the room where you entered. City has a listening system to assist the hearing impaired. If anyone needs hearing assistance, please obtain the system at the deis and
return thereafter. Miss Sans, please call the role of the members. >> Vice Chair Zon >> here. Mr. Yugo >> here. >> Mr. Malay >> here. >> Mr. Nelson >> here. >> Mr. Curran is excused. Miss Chief >> here. >> Mr. Fes is excused. Mr. Chantuli
>> here. >> Mr. Nearing >> here. >> Chairman Ly >> here. >> You have a quorum. You may proceed. >> Great. Annie Ball is the zoning board's attorney. Mr. Ball advises the board members of matters of law and is the key interface with the applicant's attorney. Mr. Ball is not here tonight, so his
associate, Mr. Stazinski, is going to do an amazing job in his place. Um, our zoning board attorney does not vote on the applications. Jessica Sans is a city employee, is a zoning board secretary. Our board secretary works with the applicants on
preparing these applications, planning our agendas, and keeping our meeting minutes. The board secretary also does not vote. Also present are experts who are hired annually by the board to provide input. Tonight we have Marie Rafé from Collier's Engineering. Also present is Ed Snikis from Burgess
Associates and he's our board planner. These experts are seated at the table to the right of the board, the public's left. They also did not vote. Our board consists of seven regular members and up to four alternates. All members can participate in the hearings tonight, but only a maximum of seven can vote. Most
applications require a simple majority to be approved before we enter into executive session to vote on these applications. You'll be advised of how many votes are required. Each case will begin with the applicants or their attorney giving an overview of the application process to date the
variances that are required. We then hear from any additional expert witnesses the applicant may have to help explain the application why these variances are needed. The board experts followed then by the board members may ask questions of the applicant, their attorney, and their expert witnesses.
Due to recent cases running excessively long, we strongly encourage applicants and their experts to give brief and concise testimony so we may get to as many cases as possible in any in the given evening. Once the board members and the board professionals have completed their questioning, the public will have an opportunity to ask
questions. This is not the time to tell us what you think about the case. That opportunity comes at the end of the hearing. Please be careful as how do you you phrase your questions. They should not be proceeded with a statement about the case, but should be a direct question to the witness. Also, before you ask questions, we ask please that
you clearly state your name, spell your last name, and provide your address. It's important that a court reporter be able to keep a clear and accurate public record. After all the witnesses have been heard, members of the audience then have their second opportunity to speak and then at that time, you may express your opinion, positive or negative,
about the application. Then the public hearing is closed. We enter into executive session. This is where the board members discuss the case and then vote. You'll be able to listen to our executive session, but you will not be able to participate. I ask that each applicant andor their attorney present
come up and give a brief synopsis, their anticipated testimony tonight, including the number of witnesses, whether or not they can finish the presentation within 30 minutes. So, starting off tonight, can I please have representatives from 30 Ridgedale Avenue
>> tonight? We will have two witnesses and this should be a pretty straightforward application. It is just for a garage, which is required under the ordinance. So, we are just proposing a garage. >> You say that now, but you'd be surprised. >> I know. >> All right. Great. Thank you so much. >> I do believe it will be under 30 minutes. Okay. And I'm also your next
one. I'm on 15 Middle Avenue and that one is just for a sideyard setback where we're going vertically up. It's not exacerbating the sideyard setback or any of the existing conditions and I will have two or three witnesses on that but I agree that we can keep it under 30 minutes. >> Perfect. Thank you so much.
>> Next 57 Hobart. >> Uh good evening. Uh I am representing the applicants uh for 57 Hobbart and I do uh state yes we will make it uh a short and concise uh meeting uh under under uh 30 minutes. Uh the uh variants
that we're requesting are for the uh lot coverage and building coverage for a uh rebuild of a deck. >> Great. Thank you. We'll get to you soon. >> Thank you. >> And then finally, wait. Yes. Finally, 8 Irving Place.
>> Hello, I'm Joanna Gamley. I'm the homeowner of 8 Irving Place. Um, we are proposing to add a modest only 56 square ft uh bathroom to our first floor. Um,
and definitely we can be under 30 minutes with our presentation. Do you have any expert witnesses with you tonight? >> No. >> Okay, great. Thank you so much. We'll talk to you soon. >> All right, so let's circle back to 30 RGale, please.
>> Good evening again. My name is Amanda Wolf. On behalf of the applicant, I have with me Guang Yang, also known as Jay, and he's going to tell us about the proposal, but I'm going to give you some background first. The property is 30 Ridgedale Avenue, block 4204, lot 35 in the R six zone. The property consists of
9,912 square ft. Right now, there's no garage, which is a violation of the current ordinance. So, we are seeking to construct an 11x5 22 foot onecar garage. And we're also proposing a front vestibule. I think it was already approved, but we just wanted to be clear
that it was still proposed, but not constructed yet. Um, we will be removing the existing non-conforming shed. I actually I think we already did that already. So, that's one thing down. Tonight, we only have two variances, both of which relate to the sideyard setback because you assume you're putting in a garage. So, the sideyard
setback is 3 ft proposed, 8 ft required. The combined sideyard setback is 29.16% proposed, whereas 33% is required. We do have an existing non-conforming driveway setback of zero feet where two feet is required. Overall, we are reducing the
impervious coverage because we are reducing the driveway. And we contend that the request of relief can be granted pursuant to NJSA405D-70C2. And with that, I will turn it over to Mr. Yang and I will have him sworn in. Can you raise your right hand, please?
State your first name and spell your last. State your full name and spell your last name, please, for the record. >> I Yan. Y A N G. >> Thank you. Do you swear affirm the testimony you're about to give will be the truth? >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> And Mr. Yang, when did you purchase the property?
>> Um, February 2023. >> And why do you want a garage? >> It's for security and safety. There there's currently no garage on the driveway. >> And in your observation, do other dwellings in your neighborhood have garages? >> Yes. >> Okay. Okay. And what is next to you on
the side where the garage would go like your neighbor? Do you have landscaping? What are you adjacent to? >> It's uh mostly landscaping. >> Okay. And have you discussed the project with your neighbors? >> Yes. >> Anything positive or negative to say? >> They don't really care.
>> Okay. >> Gotcha. And has the location of the driveway changed since you purchased the property? >> No. >> Okay. because I just wanted to clarify that is a pre-existing non-conforming condition that we did not exacerbate or cause. Um, and what is your plan for the area
that's behind the proposed garage right now? It looks like it's driveway, but what will it be? >> It's going it's going to be open area landscaping. >> Okay. So, that'll be a further reduction of the coverage. >> And that's all the questions I have for Mr. Yang. >> Great. Board experts, do you have any
questions for Mr. Yang? No, not for this. >> Okay, same. No questions. >> Great. Thank you. >> Board, what questions do we have for this witness? >> I assume we have the expert. You have a >> Yes, we have the contractor with us. Unfortunately, our architect was sick
and could not attend, but we do have the contractor to help go through the plans. >> Okay. >> Um I I do have one question. Um, and this has to do with the because of the sideyard setback um of three feet where the proposed garage is is that's going
to put it very close to, you know, the neighbor's property and the neighbor's house. Um, it's not required to have an attached garage, just required to have in a garage. So, I'm just wondering um why not set it back further on the
property so that it's not sort of in the middle of the lot and right next to the house. >> Mr. Yang, did you discuss um having a detached garage with Mr. Wan House? >> Uh I'm sorry. >> Like instead of having it attached to your driveway, did you propo ever consider having it back here somewhere
else? I think uh due to the elevations in the back it's it's very difficult because in the back of the the yard it's there's actually a slight hill. So it's it's uneven surface in the backyard. >> Okay. And I believe it would also have
added a little bit of ex uh impervious coverage too. Not that that would be a problem but it might require variance. Well, yeah. I think that I mean I was out there today and I thought that the primary the greatest elevation is on the side of um is is where the patio is
which is raised and then where the driveway is is lower. Um other questions, how long has this construction been going on? >> Since uh April this year. >> Um okay. I just noticed there was a lot of, you know, it's a little hard to get
a sense because there's an awful lot of debris on the driveway. There's no dumpster. I don't know. Um, but it seemed to me, so I can't tell how how far back the peg gravel went because there was just stuff kind of everywhere. Um, but it seemed like it went far
enough back that it wouldn't necessarily be adding in pvious cover to push the garage back. So, I don't know. That's understood. >> Something to consider. Um but I don't have any other questions about that then.
>> I have a question. >> Sure. >> Mr. Fay's report you said no top topography has been provided. Um has that been resolved? >> Well I I'm thinking that the contract was >> okay but also um there was a discrepancy
inconsistency between the rear elevation and side elevation. >> Yeah. So I and I think that has been cleared up because I understand that that was already approved. >> Okay. That's not part of this application. So I put that in the letter because things didn't match up on the
architectural plans, but I think we're okay. >> Is that is that right? >> Yes, that's my understanding that it's just a mistake. >> Okay. And and that you're not asking for any um any permission for any of the um modifications to the back of the house?
>> No, this is just for the garage. >> Okay. Yes. You also asked for a calculation on coverage that's been provided. >> No, I do not have that. >> Go ahead. >> So, you're also asking for front step and vestibule as part as part of the um
>> my understanding is that was previously approved, but when I reviewed the permit, it doesn't really say that it was approved. So, I just wanted to raise it in case for some reason it was not approved. Now, it will be, but we do not exceed coverage. There's no variance associated with it. We're just proposing
it for aesthetics and safety. >> Okay. >> I just have sorry just clarification. Did you say that um February 2023 also 2025? >> February 2023 I purchased the propert.
>> Okay. Okay. Thank you. >> Okay. Questions from the public for this witness? Seeing none, why don't we talk to your next witness? >> Okay, thank you. You can sit. If I can have Eve come up. And as I mentioned, unfortunately, our
architect was unavailable this evening. So, I do have our contractor. His name is Abe Whitesman. And if you'd like to swear him in, we can do that. >> Could you raise your right hand, please? Say your full name and spell your last name, please. >> Abraham Whitesman. We ei ma. >> Thank you very much. Do you swear or
affirm that the testimony you're about to give will be the truth? >> I affirm. Yes. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. And how have you prepared for this hearing? I know you probably reviewed the plans and we had a call. All that. >> Yes. That's about it. >> Okay. Can you describe the property for
the board? And if you could address the topographic in the in the back if you can. >> Um, so so for this application, we're only applying for the garage. Um the sorry I don't know if you could all see this.
>> It's the same c same plans that you already have but for convenience. >> So basically what happens is if you were to keep going through the driveway and keep going all the way towards the back it slopes up very steeply. Um and so building a garage there was probably
less than ideal. Also, currently, um, the neighbor has bushes or hedges that are probably about 10 or 12 feet high, um, on his property that block his, um, probably view of
most of his garage should it be constructed. Um, also, I think one of the issues is just convenience, being able to pull into your driveway and then enter your house instead of having to trek further into the house.
Perfect. And can you describe the architectural style? I don't This is made for Mr. Zev, so I'm not sure if you can describe the architectural, but >> it's a basic onecar garage. Um, it has a sloped roof,
uh, garage door, door out the back to access the backyard. Um, we'll have a concrete floor, some lights, siding. >> Okay. Will the exterior of the balance
of the dwelling match the new garage? >> Yes. >> Perfect. >> Hi. And we already discussed why this is appropriate location. Is there a basement in this garage? >> No. >> Okay. And what are the dimensions of the
garage? yours >> garage will be approximately um 22 ft long and 11 and 1/2 ft wide. >> And is there an attic above the garage? >> There's there's going to be like like a
dormer with collar ties for additional. It's not a separate floor. >> Okay. And the H the historic preservation commission recommended that the prop this is on the front vest of fuel. I'm not sure if you can talk about this, but the proposed shed roof over the
vestibule. They were suggesting it should be a gable roof. Do you know if that's possible? Why or why not? If you don't, totally don't. >> Um >> I don't know if the board members can see. >> Can we introduce this as exhibit A1? >> Yes. And it's a photograph of the
property. >> No, >> no, >> this is a photograph that the architect handed me of a house style that he's trying to achieve, which I don't know if you can see it has instead of having like a shed roof, it has just a a black
roof in the front as a stylistic approach. [Applause] >> So, if you want to pass that around, you can do. And that's exhibit A1. Um, >> okay. And can you just confirm that we're actually reducing the total lot
coverage? >> Yes. >> Perfect. And that's because of the reduction in the driveway, correct? >> Correct. >> Perfect. And then just to confirm, the area behind the garage will be used for landscaping, correct? >> Yes. For landscaping. >> Okay. And can you tell us where the HVAC
condensers will be located? >> Yes. Um, I apologize. >> No worries. >> Um, okay. If you're looking at drawing A1,
um, where it says first floor plan. So, on the first floor, the west side of the house is living room. So, there will be two condensers to the left of the living room.
[Applause] >> And you mentioned some lighting. Can you describe the lighting that's proposed? Is it just like little fixtures outside the garage doors? Okay. >> Just just for convenience and safety. >> Perfect. Um, do you have updated lot coverage
calculations for tonight? >> I think they're on the front page. >> Okay, perfect. So, our >> If you could both just try and speak into the microphone. >> Sorry. >> Sorry. >> Thank you. >> So, according to the zoning analysis,
um, the lock coverage is That's the maximum. So, the maximum is 40%. >> Yes. >> And we're at >> 3,004%. >> Yes. >> Um, we understand that we have to make a number of revisions to plans pursuant to
Mr. B's comments about the grading plan. So, there's positive drainage patterns. As far as storm waters, do you know if there's an existing storm water management system? >> Um, no. I believe everything is just based on gutter runoff.
>> Okay. Thank you. And we can certainly work with the board engineer to come up with a storm water management system as necessary. We agree to a condition of approval as the same. Um, we address the inconsistency. There was a comment about the first floor plan shows a door from the guest
room and a sliding door from the breakfast room. They wanted to update it to indicate the means of egress from the first floor doors to the rear stair. >> Yes. So, Mr. Fay, could you just help us understand that comment? >> Yeah, that was when I was thinking that
this when I was looking at the architectural plans um my understanding is from um the owner that There is no plans proposed for the rest of the house. That's not part of this application. It's just the garage. So, you can strike that comment from my
letter that it's not applicable. >> Thank you. >> There was also a comment maybe you can help us with the location and rear steps of Mandor. >> Yeah. So, um, if you look at the site
plan on sheet A Z, there is currently a um, the asphalt driveway to the left of it. I guess that's actually the Yeah, just to the to the left of the driveway, there's a wall
and that goes all the way to the back of the house, but You're you're you must be removing the wall to put in the garage. So if you do that, I don't know how you're are you rrooting the driveway or
are you taking down the wall? >> How that's working? >> Sorry. So that wall is comes out approximately 2 feet into the driveway. >> Yeah. >> So um we moved it back so that it would be flush with the side of the house. So
that it would be widening the driveway by that amount. >> Um I'm not sure I understand because I I see the asphalt driveway on on sheet A Z
is is on the property line from the front of the property all the way to behind the house. >> Correct. So, you're which way are you widening the driveway? >> I I think that stone wall is moving
towards the house. >> I I have a picture from today. I don't know if that helps. >> Right. Yeah, that would definitely help. Yeah, because you'll see it's flush with the side of the house. >> So, they >> It does bring up another question though. Um because there are stairs that land in the wall, but do you want to see?
>> Right. Yeah, that's all of it. Go ahead. >> Yeah. >> So, what you're saying is you're moving the wall. I can show it to you if you want just so you don't like >> looking at this. >> And I guess I can send you this as an exhibit later if you need it. >> Um
>> Okay. So, there are stairs from the front yard that like kind of don't go down it. It's a ball. >> Yes. >> So, are we moving those stairs? >> We're going to reconfigure those stairs so that they still go into the driveway just at a probably a slightly different location just because we had to move
that wall back about 2 feet. So that might require extra coverage then because you're going to make it longer then to do that. >> Okay. But our total law coverage we're up to 40% is permitted and we're only at 30.1. So I think we would have sufficient coverage if we did need to do that.
>> But I think we need the final totals. What's clear to me from these uh submitted exhibits is there's not much difference between the survey of the existing or what were the existing conditions which is something that we
need and then what's the final outcome right um what are the changes to the site I I believe you're going to address uh the drainage as it occurs on the site right that needs to be on the final site plan and then the location of the move
wall, the additional lot coverage. I I think that all needs to be right, Marie, >> shown on on the final site plan. >> Right. >> And I guess that then that leads to the next point that um if you're moving the driveway over, widening it in one area,
um from looking at the picture that Missan had, it looks like you're going to have a gap between the new concrete masonry wall and the driveway. So, was there what what are you putting in that area? Is that going to be grass? Is it going to be curved?
>> So, it seems like the existing driveway is not in excellent condition. So, we're probably going to be replacing the black top with new black top, right? >> So, probably that approximately two foot gap would be replaced with black top.
>> Okay. So would would your client be interested in amendable to actually moving the driveway over two feet so that it's because part of the ordinance says that the driveway is supposed to be two feet off the property line. Am I right about that? >> Okay. So what if you move the driveway
over so it lines up with the garage. It covers that gap that you currently have. doesn't actually add any more impervious coverage because you now you've taken the driveway and moved it over to >> and you've maintained the same width that they've lived with since they bought the property.
>> Yeah. Confer with your client, please. questions. What happens here? >> Well, I whatever they do to show up. >> Yeah. >> Not this one. >> Well, the only difference is they put this little square. >> Yeah.
>> So, kind of lazy if you ask me. >> Yeah. But these stairs can't be here. They might go to the the final condition. >> Mr. Yang, he would prefer that it remain the same width, wider actually, but if the board feels strongly about it, we
can certainly consider that recommendation. >> All right. Well, we'll discuss it in an executive session. Um, >> Marie, Ed, do you have additional questions for this witness? Where is the um the drainage on the
house going now? >> Um I believe it's I believe it's currently just runoff gutters around the perimeter of the property. >> Okay. Um and right now I think you said before that you didn't know where the roof
gutters would be going to in the future. I I believe that is the plan unless something changes that um we didn't add anything to the lock coverage or the perimeter. So whatever was going down before is going to continue in the same way.
>> Um do you know what the height of those masonry walls is um next to the the driveway? I think it's about um four feet. >> Did they change um no the height at all?
>> No, we in fact we actually reused the same block >> and just took it and moved it over. >> Correct. >> Um are you taking any trees? >> No. >> I think that's that's all I have. >> Thank you, Marie.
>> A few questions. Um, you addressed the issue of the AC unit. Uh, will the applicant be screening the AC unit in accordance with the regulations? Screening it with landscape. >> I, >> Mr. D, do you have to put any
landscaping around the Hback? >> Okay, >> it's required. Thank you. >> I don't think you could even see it from the street because of the current landscaping, >> right? But the neighboring property is also to be screened. It's no problem. >> Okay. Um, the relationship of the garage
to the rest of the floor plan, you heard one of the earlier comments regarding why is it being located at that location? I know the architect's not here. Typically, this is a question for the architect, but why is it positioned where it is in relation to the floor plan of the building? Is there anything
there for the board to consider? Um, >> windows. If >> I had to put put a guess, there's currently a full-size door entrance from the driveway into the basement. >> So, the architect is reusing that same
door to be the entrance now into the garage instead of reframing something or creating a new opening in the masonary foundation. So that door existing door is to remain correct and that's the access from the garage into the house. >> Correct. >> Um the building itself or the garage
will be three feet off the neighbor. Is that right? >> Correct. >> Yes. >> And will there be it seems like there's an overhang to the roof itself. How much will that be? [Applause] >> I don't have the I don't have the
framing detail here. >> Um I would assume it's probably going to be I don't know 12 in 16 in less than 2T. >> Yes. Um the driveway offset the way we were just describing things. I know you left it to
the board for review discussion. Um there seems to be a concrete wall what's referred to as concrete wall on that side. The border I'm sorry concrete on the neighbors property line. I guess that's along the subtly property line on
the right hand side. Um what is that concrete border? Is that a curb? >> It looks like Yeah, it looks like a curb. Maybe it wasn't out at the site, but that's >> it's from what I recall, it's probably about a three or 4 inch wide curb that goes along the driveway.
>> Okay. >> And I guess the property line is somewhere there. >> Okay. So then what would be the corresponding width of that driveway as a result of the expanded width? Is it about another two feet wider than it would exist today?
I'm not sure the survey >> trying to see if you're asking for a functional relief as a result of the two offset. The board typically tries to address any nonconformities with anything new. So, >> so, so I what was the question? The question is is how wide would the
driveway be as the result of the new width compared to the old width of the driveway? >> Um I think well if we're expanding the wall and taking that same distance from the other side it would probably remain the same and that is
>> but yet your client's asking for a wider driveway. Correct. >> Leaving the zero set back and just making it wider. >> Correct. >> Okay. It's also just um practically the neighbors bushes or hedges um they go
all the way to almost to the curb. So if someone is driving to make a right-hand turn into that driveway, it would make the maneuver that much easier. If they had just a little more sight and especially when you're backing out or something just in general maneuvering is
easier on on two feet, especially if it's already existing. Okay. Um, I think that's all the questions I have. Thank you. >> Questions from the board. >> Tom.
>> Yeah, a couple. Um, so I I know we talked a little about AC locations. I heard you say in general where it's going to be when you read the condition of screening. Are you committing that'll be in a permitted location that you won't need a variance for the location? >> Will we need a variance for that? Yeah,
you're you're committing to put it in a permitted location. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> And I'm a little bit vague on and I I guess maybe because it is kind of vague. Um Marie, on the on storm water, what do you what do you need to give definitive
opinion about what if any they need? >> Well, um I think um I'm satisfied that they're not increasing the coverage enough that it would trigger any storm water mitigation. So they dry well or anything like that.
Um, you know, and what they testify to is that the, you know, the water is going to continue in the same patterns that it already has. I'm okay with that. I mean, you know, there's always the provision that if they um, you know, discharge water onto a neighbor's property, they're going to have to
remediate that. I mean, they're saying that they will be um, discharging in the same place they have been before. >> Okay. And just for the record, I want to get make a comment that the forester noted that he believes the proposed location is the best location for garage
that further back would damage a neighbor's Norway maple. So I just want to put that out there. And a question I don't who asked this question, maybe our attorney. So there was a showing of a picture between the vice chair and the engineer and suggestion that that might be an exhibit. is that
>> we should probably get that as an additional exhibit if we're going to if it's going to be uh considered by the board as part of the application uh for test for the purposes of the uh of the decision. If it's not going to if it wasn't considered like it's not going to be part of the decision making then not
going to be necessary >> and I asked because I don't recall that ever happening before. >> Yeah. So, like I said, I think it was going to be used for consideration. >> Okay. Okay. That's all I have. I have a question >> else >> on the survey. Um I don't know what
direction this is, but in the rear of the property the border there's a it says pipe found bent. Is that supposed to be the property line? I'm confused with that. It's like it seems like it's outside like I'm not sure what that's
indicating. Usually you're right. That would indicate a property line marker, but I'm not sure why it's over there. >> It might be a different property. >> Yeah, it might just be the property boundary between lot 13 and lot 14. >> That's what it looks like.
>> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Yeah, those two. So, with the construction of the garage and the overhang, is there any room left over between um the edge of the new garage and the
property line to put in screening, landscape screening >> between the between the end of the garage and the neighbor's property? >> Yeah. >> So, there's probably about three feet. >> So, if we needed to so put like bushes or something or
I guess >> I think well it's less than three feet with the overhang. There's an overhang for the garage roof. >> So the neighbor currently has bushes or hedges on their property that's providing a sort of screen if that's >> um yeah I don't know what happens to
that those bushes once you start excavating foundation for a garage. I don't think we can sort of rely on that because the root system is going to be probably disturbed. Um so there's probably going to be some loss of there's going likely a loss of
screening. Um separate question the the patio in the back um all this work is being done on the house that seems to be in a bit of a state of of disrepair right now. Are there plans to redo that patio?
I believe the at some point probably after we finish construction, the owner is going to put back or rebuild in kind what what's there without expanding it. >> And and then there was related to that,
just trying to see what the coverage is here. That guest room, is that a sliding door that goes out back towards the patio? doesn't really show up quite on the drawing, but >> on the
>> No, those are two windows. >> Two windows. Okay. >> There there's a >> casement windows. Okay. >> I'm sorry. >> Yeah. So, it's not an means of egress or doesn't need to be a landing or anything underneath that. >> No, there there are two windows and then
next to it is a swinging door. >> Okay. And the swinging door lands on the current patio. No, it swings into the guest room. >> Your question was where does it go? >> Yeah, where does the person walk out? >> Oh, I'm sorry. I I apologize. It goes Yes, I apologize. It goes onto the
patio. >> Okay, thank you. >> Any other questions for this? Don, go ahead. >> I'm just a little confused about the driveway. I don't know if we need to beat this uh thing to death, but um you're removing the wall where the garage is going to be attached to the
house and then you're going to have between what's the the front part of the house, there's going to be like a a twoft space before the driveway or you're widening the driveway there. I'm a little confused on that.
>> So, currently, if you um if you had a chance to look at the >> I was unable to do that. I was out of town till >> Oh, no. that >> I didn't see the picture. Okay. >> So, um, in the in the survey, there's a, um, retaining wall that goes up about 2
feet into the driveway. >> Um, so that, um, we removed that retaining wall um to widen it so that there could be hopefully a garage. Um,
and now that space will be filled in with probably a black top or whatever sur the owner. >> So, you've already moved this wall back. >> We we moved correct. We we moved the wall back towards the main front yard.
>> All right. And then you mentioned that there's a door in the garage. So, right now the door is at grade level. >> Correct. You can >> that takes you downstairs into a basement. >> Correct. You can you can walk straight from the driveway directly into the basement through this door which will be
reused as the entrance into the garage. Yeah, I'm a little little concerned about the location of the garage, just that it's, you know, we're um we talked about we can't move the garage back because we're worried about roots
of a tree, but yet we can put it where you're telling us that there's other vegetation. As mentioned before, there could be roots. So, I mean, I would like to see the garage move back myself. Uh you can always >> Well, let's get into that in an executive. Yeah, no worries. Thank you.
Thank you. >> Any other questions for this witness? >> So, would you mind if I please >> question I um I heard discussion about plantings on the side of the garage. Um and and maybe I missed Did you talk about that? Was it like plantings? What
ended up happening with that? >> I It seems like they don't have enough information that maybe it's possible, but we don't know which species or how big they could grow. would would it actually provide screening? Um, so I think that was an incomplete answer.
>> So what um you ask the applicant or the contractor um how how does the applicant reach their backyard with lawn mowing equipment or anything like that? >> That's a good question >> right now. >> So right now Oh, they
>> Yeah, >> right now they I guess he walks down his driveway to the backyard. >> Okay. So if the garage was put in place and there was screening put on the side of it or some vegetation. How would he reach his backyard?
>> So, he can go through the front door of the garage and out the back door of the garage to reach the backyard. >> Is that back door wide enough to lawn mower or is that not being stored in the garage? Is there >> Let me ask is there is there access on
the left side plan left side of the house? >> There is. How would how would somebody get to the backyard >> from the driveway? >> You have to go up the stairs to the front lawn and the left side yard
backard. >> Correct. >> Okay. So there's there's no access for some real type of equipment or something >> I suppose without picking it up. Yes. >> Okay. >> On the plan I don't see a door in the
back of the garage on the renderings. >> No, the next the next page. Next page. >> Go back on the renderings. >> Yeah. Yeah, but we just found it. It's >> You see it? >> I see it on the renderings. >> No. Um,
>> it's on the basement floor plan. >> See it? >> So, how do you get the >> I see it on the left. >> Yeah. >> One more to the back. Anyway, >> there's a fence and >> maybe we can put in a double 36 door.
That's and then we can just go straight through the garage. >> Well, is that >> I just wanted to make sure that everybody was thinking clearly about like I didn't want to have some requirement that you had to put in landscaping without having thought about the implications of that. I was just
trying to make sure that everybody >> seems like they could go around on the other side of the house too to get to the backyard. >> Well, but there's a wall on the front foot >> incline. So, they can't they can access it on foot, but they can't get along.
going up there. So, that's all I was I was just >> It's a good point to point all that out. Okay. >> Even if he wants to finish the patio later on, he can't even get equipment in the backyard. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Something else to consider. >> Just a comment. I mean, the drawing is
really raises more questions than it answers. >> Yeah. I would like to see a a the uh proposal the uh plot plan with the proposed garage dimensions all that kind of stuff. >> I think this is going to be a more robust executive session than we
initially anticipated. All right, any other questions? Seeing none questions from the public. Questions only. Seeing none. Okay, >> comments from the public
>> comments. What? This is your last correct, right? >> Yes. >> Um, any comments from the public? Anyone like Yes. >> Oh, >> wow. We have an esteemed guest tonight. >> Joe Steiner, 34 Avenue. uh when we moved
in and I I I'm doing this in this point of of of it rather than in questions simply because uh when we moved in in 1996 uh between 32 and 34 uh we had a wonderful uh big rainstorm the next
weekend uh one of those hurricanes and we uh our sump pumps worked forever and uh we had problems and what we did was uh we installed a drainage situation.
Um, and ever since then we haven't had a problem. We were with the that was when we had the older house next to us and as you know it has now been reconstructed as a new house. Um, and it has additional drainage
issues u remediation for it. Uh what I would hope that you would do is to retain and I don't want to hold them up from getting this thing done. It needs it needs a garage. Uh I understand their their desire to do it and uh they've
talked to their neighbors. So that's important that they've uh that they've uh they've got uh the neighborhood in there. Uh but I would like you to retain restriction uh >> jurisdiction >> your jurisdiction. I used to say this
all the time jurisdiction over drainage >> uh for two years from the certificate of occupancy. Yes. And the reason I say that is it's been 2 years since it's been bought. If you do it from two years from today, we may still have the same driveway. I hope not. But uh if we could
do it that way, if that would be agreeable to your client, I think that would go a long way to making sure that whatever is wrong, whatever happens with drainage, we have an alternative to make sure it gets solved. >> Great. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mr. Sire. Good to see you. >> All right.
I think that's going to be hard to top in terms of public comment. So, >> was that a comment or a question? >> Because he wasn't sworn in if that was a comment. >> Oh, uh >> Oh, sorry. >> Say it all over again. >> Can we swear him in?
>> Yeah, I'll just swear. >> Mr. Siren, can we just swear you in? >> I'm sorry. I know that you know the reason I'm not there is because I can't hear well anymore. No worries. >> Do you swear from the testimony you just gave? That's true. >> Oh, I forgot to do that, didn't I?
>> Yes, I do. >> I swear it's the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. >> Great. >> Thank you. >> All right. Excellent. Is there anything you want to say in summation? >> I would just like to say that we're here really because we just want to have a
garage. Almost all of the other dwellings in our neighborhood have garages. It is a requirement in the zone to have a garage. The only variances that are being created are the sideyard setback, which is three feet where 8 feet is required, and the combined sideyard setback, which is a function of that sideyard setback. Um, we do think
it would be a benefit to the neighborhood to have a garage because we could store our vehicle in it, so it's not out in the air being visible to everybody else. It will also help with safety. There has been car thefts lately in various areas, so that could help. Um, I understand the comments about the
plans and we can certainly work with the board to revise them or resubmit as necessary. Okay, >> great. Should we enter into executive session? >> Who would like to begin? >> Where are we on conditions?
>> Oh, can we get conditions and number of votes? >> Of course. >> Thank you, sir. >> Simple majority vote. As for conditions, uh, we have updated final site plans with necessary information that was discussed during the uh, board hearing. Based upon those site final site plans, the applicant has stated that they're
willing to work with the board engineer to update any stormware management system if it becomes necessary based upon those updated plans. Uh in addition, just standard compliance with the recommendations by the board engineer. And finally, landscaping around the HVAC system. >> We want to add the two years.
>> Did you say that? >> Storm water jurisdiction. Yeah, >> you want to add that? Yes. Yes. Then the board's going to retain jurisdiction for two years for the storm water management system. to the uh >> certificate of occupancy >> from the area. >> Okay.
>> Who's ready to jump in? >> I'll jump in. I um I appreciate what the forester says about the maple tree in the back. Um but I think, you know, we have to we have to balance what the what what are the
positives we're seeking. And I do have a concern about how close this is to the neighboring house. It's not just it's really a twoft offset when you factor in the overhang and it's right next to the house. The area where the shed is
depicted on the current survey. to me, you know, that looks like a probably a better spot because it's set back from the house and it's not going to be um have it creates such massing next to somebody's house. So, I mean, that's,
you know, that's a concern. I have another, you know, I I realize that it appears that none of the um coverages have been exceeded, but then the plan doesn't actually show us where the driveway is being retained and where it's being removed. There was reference
to a decrease of impervious cover, but it's actually not shown on the drawings. So, at this point, I I can't support this um application. Sorry. >> So, let me comment on that. And I'm not
still not sure how I feel about the application general, but moving the garage back and we're told it would damage the neighbor's tree. I don't know if that neighbor's here tonight, but just keep in mind if we move the garage back, we're being told it would damage the neighbor's property.
>> Where? So, >> so I was >> and it would also lose connectivity to the house, right? I think >> the location seems to be centered on the idea that they smartly you would retain a a a giant hole that's already there
that has the door to the outside, right? And connecting to that door, right? you don't mess with the structural integrity of the house. Um, seems like a smart and economical way to address the issue of connectivity to the garage. So, I think that's something we have to factor in.
>> I tend to agree with that. However, the the applicant is relying on the neighbors for screening. We're not we're we're worried about a root system for a tree. I get it. I love trees, too. But, um, I would have liked to have seen a a survey with the proposed garage on it,
the dimensions. Yes. >> Um that would make a big difference for me. Uh I was unfortunately not able to get to this to any of the sites for tonight's meeting because I was out of town till about 3:00. Um but I have a when I built my house, I was not allowed
to attach the garage to my house up in an R six zone. So I had to build it in the back. That was 30 years ago. Things change. I get it. But um I just think moving it back a little bit, yes, you lose the connectivity to the house, which is a big thing. I get it. My garage is not really that functional for
me, but we use it for storage mostly. Um, but I just didn't think it's so overbearing on the on the neighbor. I just, you know, neighbor doesn't seem is not here, so they don't seem to care. But, um, it's just I don't I'm I'm troubled with the location. It's really what's bothering me the most is the
location of the garage. You convince me. >> I know the big thing is the garage door. I mean, the door into the house. That's a big thing. I wish I had that. Um, I'm just I can't I can't overcome the two feet to the boundary to the border of the
>> What about the increased coverage that comes along with extending the driveway? >> Well, they have plenty of lot. They have plenty plenty to go. I mean, they're I don't have the numbers right in front of me, but they're well within their their lot coverage.
>> It's it's a >> I just can't overcome how close it is to the the problem. That's all. That's fine. >> And I would say just with the coverage, if they put it where the shed is, they're not actually increasing any lot coverage. If they if they set it back here, then it's it's not right next to
the neighbor's house. And yeah, I think an a garage where you can get into your house is a nice to have, but that's not the requirement. So, it's not a requirement in the ordinance. And many people probably most probably have detached garage. So, um,
that it, like I said, nice to have, but I feel I am really focused on that house next door that's just right there. So, yeah. Um, >> I was thinking the same thing in terms of garage, the ideal place would be
where the shed is. Um, the forest was very vague on saying that's the best location, but I I don't recall where exactly the tree was. Um, if he's talking about way in the rear of the property, would that would affect the tree roots? >> I'll read what he says. He says this is
the best location for the garage to place it further back on the property would damage the root system of the neighbors. >> But further back, how far? Like >> he was saying, >> yeah, I'm saying it's it's it's it is it is a little vague because there are multiple. >> Well, that's kind of where I think that a proposed survey of where
>> show the root show the overhang of the maybe I'm getting too picky, but show me where that root ball is. So that okay if boom >> if we go that route and I don't know if legally we can do this I again is the odor 32 Richdale here >> 32 Richdale not here okay
>> no >> that that would be a fundamental change at least from that neighbor's point of view especially the forester being on record saying we might might be damaging his tree um the neighbor seems to me should be notified of that if the application
would does change in that in that manner I >> I agree and I I don't I would not presume that the neighbor doesn't care just because they're not here either. Were there any number of reasons why somebody could not be here >> and and if they saw that it was not going to impact their tree, they that might be part of the reasons why they're
not here. >> I thought there was a discussion with the neighbor neighbor city didn't care. >> Yeah, but that was maybe based on location where he said it's nowhere near my tree. I don't care. But if it's farther back and then we don't know exactly what farther back means or I don't even remember exactly where that
tree is. >> But that I believe and again I have another picture. Um I if it is their tr there is a tree that is let me just find the picture um
behind the neighbor's shed. Okay. So the we on our drawing we don't see the neighbor's house but we see their shed. So, there is a few feet behind that shed there is a tree. I can't tell if it's a maple tree. It's covered in ivy. Um, but
I still think that you could put a garage in line with that shed. You're not impacting the tree and it's still further back, not right next to the house next door. I I mean, I think that there's there's possibility here. Well, I want to get that revised forers's opinion, too. If if we're going to go
that route and ask them to come back with a new location that I I want the forers input on that new location, too. >> Yeah. And there's an elevation drop there, too. I think that might not It would be helpful to see that on the drawings. Like, we don't have any elevations, so you can't even see that
the roots might be five feet below where this driveway is going to go or, you know, we can't tell. >> That leads us back to the front walk, too. like is what's on this survey now what's going to be there or is it going to change a little bit? A lot of the lot of little little in my
opinion a lot of little details are missing. Maybe it's not a big deal but show me what you're going to do. This gets back to the drawings. The drawings just really aren't very good just flatly. Any
[Music] other comments, Mr. Malay? Um, >> we want to ask them to come back with a revised site plan. >> That was going to be my next Can we ask them to do that?
>> I mean, they can agree or or not. I mean, >> I I think you understand where this is headed, right? >> Yes, I do. I understand that the board is not probably going to look favorably on this application. So, if you can just give me one minute to consult with. >> Yes, please take your time. >> Sure.
>> Oh, >> yeah. We could do it at the end. >> Yeah, let's do it. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Just I'm sure we forgot. >> Yeah. No, no, we'll we'll deal with it at the end. Tom, >> sorry. That's my bad. I missed that. >> I thought that was part of the point.
>> I know. I'm by the numbers. I see it first. I thought we'd address it first. >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. I skipped right over it. >> It's okay. >> So, should I send this to Jessica?
>> Yeah. Just to your point before we're going to be that >> I just I just emailed it to Jessica. >> What What do we call it? It's not an applicant. It's not >> call it applicant. >> Uh board one. >> I've never heard of that before. That's
all. >> I guess. >> Yeah. Typically that's not how it's done but there was an objection because there was no objection I think objector >> okay sorry about that >> no worries >> we would like the opportunity to discuss it with our applicant a little bit
further and maybe come back with some revised plans if that's what he determines is warranted so when would our next application day be or next >> what's looking promising for >> January 8th 2026 >> January 8th
2026 six. >> Okay. So, we will accept that. No further notice required. Correct. >> Yes. >> Okay. Perfect. >> Well, >> except for >> the neighbor in the tree like >> by that because if we move it back and
they don't know that their tree is being threatened, >> can we require notice just to that one neighbor? I mean, >> I don't know. >> But I I thought we just established that if it's if it sounds as if the board is requesting that it it go in alignment
with the current shed, right? Is that right? >> That's mine. >> So there's there's no root system next to the current shed >> because there's a shed on the other side of the property. >> Okay. >> Is that is that >> No, for a garage, we're have to put in
footings and dig down. I apologize. For a for a garage, we're going to have to put in footings and dig down. Also, the terrain sharply goes up after the driveway, >> right? >> So, I I don't know much about tree
roots, but I do know they go everywhere. >> Um I I don't know ex for sure. We're going to have to cut out. We're going to have to push back. We're have to excavate. We're have to dig down and put in footings, put in waterproofing. We're going to have to have a clearance from the footings so we have access to put to
waterproof around the garage so that all the water that's going that's coming from this hill doesn't go into the garage. Um in addition, we're also going to have to do that on all three sides because again the further we go into the driveway, the higher the elevation
becomes. So there's going to be much more excavation. Um, I don't know. I I'm not familiar with all the um trees back there, but a lot of that stuff is going to have to be supported. Um, it could be
that the existing stairs and paver area is also going to have to be somehow supported. I I I just I haven't looked at that or studied that just because again, we need clearance to be able to walk around and we need to either put up shoring or something else to support
everything else around it. Um depending on on the topography of how far away the neighbor shed is, we might have to support that as well. If we push further back and again just dealing with the change in elevation. >> So in your opinion from where from where
the garage ends to where if we move the garage back, what's the difference in elevation? >> Are we talking four feet, five feet? Are we talking a foot, two feet? Um, in your opinion, >> in in my opinion, you can feel it as you're walking down the existing paved
driveway. >> As soon as you what? So, this shed this it says in the drawing shed removed. So, I actually at the beginning of construction I removed the shed. >> Correct. >> And the way the shed was was set up in
the front there were probably two or three cinder blocks to hold its weight and in the back there was zero. There's maybe I'm sorry there was probably bricks that are two inches and the whole garage the whole shed was maybe 12 feet long. So in those 12 feet we went from
two or three cinder blocks in the front to one brick in the back just to make the floor of the shed >> usable. So how high the cinder block laying flat how high is usually 8 in >> 8 in you're talking I don't remember if
it was two or three >> foot we don't need to get into detail I'm just I'm just so approxim it was it was either two or three cinder blocks in the front. So if this is 8 in 16 24 somewhere around here in the front 12t
back it was on a brick. >> I I think we're getting a little ahead of ourselves. But the the issue it's clear to me now that we are speculating on way too much in terms of um elevations
there. There's no dimensional um setback on this existing survey between the house and the lot line to the right. So, and there's probably five or six other things that I think Marie and Ed
and the board would agree that just add up to um too much speculation on our end. And I think that's doing a disservice to you and to the board, right? And so we we just need more complete materials in
order to make a decision. Um, and unfortunately that's going to include an investigation of what happens if you move the garage to the back. So if if that's something that your client does not want to do, I would come to
January's meeting prepared with information explaining how negatively impacts the the neighbor's yard or what this the slope interference is or what kind of retaining you have to do in order to build the garage. All right.
So, uh, I don't think we're telling you where the garage goes tonight. All right. But what we are saying is there's some preference right now to see it moved. And I think to best serve your client, you need to come up with two
scenarios. One, your pref your preferred scenario, why that works best for you. And two, uh, documents showing the board's preference and why that does or does not work. All right. I I think that's the only way we're going to be able to
properly vote on this application, unfortunately. >> Understood. So, when we come back, you're looking for Would you also like to graphic plans? >> Yes, absolutely. >> I I think we need much more photographic evidence. >> All right. We need section cuts through
the site that the architect should be able to prepare without issue. um and a much more detailed uh the survey is lacking in detailed and then it looks like there's a the survey just had some minor information added to it but I
think we need a proper site plan uh with the final layout of all the um hardscape right Marie we we need dimensions showing the width of the driveway uh its relationship to the lot line its relationship to the house what's
actually paved where the paving giving stops. I I could go on and on and on, but I think you see that this needs to be much more complete. >> Understood. >> Do Do we agree? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> If I can add to that impervious coverage calculation. >> Thank you. Yes.
>> And do you also want to see the locations of the trees? Do you want >> Yes, absolutely. And I Tom, you bring up a great point, but I've never heard of this before, but Mr. Styer, maybe you could jump in. I I I think we do need to
do a special notice just to the neighbor. >> I think something has to be done, right? >> I I I don't want you to put you through the expense of noticing the whole neighborhood or the 200 foot radius again. But I think if you could by certified letter
let the neighbor know that there is going to be an additional hearing and some of some of your uh investigations or solutions might impact their their site their lot in other ways. >> Okay. But okay. that my question if
you're going to notice to the one neighbor I mean the neighbor behind if the if the garage was to go back where the shed is and it's higher than the shed it could affect them also so I don't think they should be I mean I'm not sure how far that the house is back there but I think >> the house how would it affect them I don't >> the hill is so massive you wouldn't even
see it from their house >> yeah I I >> if I could also offer as long as the setback conforms to the rear yard they would not have any issue with us anyway >> because there's no variance. Well, it it
it's interesting because I think t typically if you have a detached garage now, I don't know if it will become back proposed detached, but then your setback it has to be all the way back, right? Like it can't be in the middle of the So, it's it's tricky. >> So, admit this a very unusual situation. Question for our attorney. Is there
anything about notice to one person and not everybody? Is there any concern? >> Not that I'm aware of the notice to one person. Technically, I'd say if you're going to renotice, I'd re notice, but I I understand that the board might consider that a bit excessive. >> It feels excessive. >> It feels excessive.
>> Feels excessive. >> As long as we're protected legally, >> how many safest I'd say is if you're going to require any notice, require notice. >> So, can everybody hear what he just said? >> Yes. >> Okay. I mean, we can certainly agree to
renotice one or two or three people, but I think that >> to Mr. Suzinsk's point, did I get it right? >> Yes. >> Uh, I think that might be a violation of the ML just be giving preferential notice to certain people and not >> That's my concern. >> Then everybody just renotice everyone.
>> Reotice every >> I'm sorry about that. >> Unfortunately, >> because I I think you have a you you have a long list. I forget how many you have. Okay. So, we will be back January 8th with notice. >> Yes. >> Appreciate it. >> Thank you. >> Thank you.
>> Do we need a a vote to carry? [Music] >> We can give you one through. >> Yeah. >> All right. Great. Uh, can I get a motion to carry this case to January 8th? >> So moved. Second.
Jessica, roll please. >> Vice Chair Zan, >> yes. >> Mr. Yuko, >> yes. >> Mr. Malay, >> yes. >> Mr. Nelson, >> yes. >> Miss Chief, >> yes. >> Mr. Chantuli, >> yes. >> Chairman Lett, >> yes. All right. Seen you in January.
>> Yeah. Yeah. I hate I feel >> Yes. >> That's fine. All right. I don't know. Ask do it a lot though. >> 15 Middle Avenue, please. >> You have to do it a lot. >> One turn doesn't.
>> I never tried it enough. >> Oh, you're getting your chair higher or lower? >> Yeah, I had to do that. >> I've been trying for seven years. I can't get your >> No, she just said you spin the chair around. I didn't know that. I thought it was >> I should have asked you a long time ago. >> Yeah, I was sitting on the ground. I was
like, "Oh, that's how you do it. >> We're going to do it at the end." I think, >> Mr. Siner, great to see you as always, sir. >> See you later. Take care, guys. >> Thank you. >> All right. >> Sorry about that. Amanda Wolf again
on behalf of her being. So, now that I have this notebook, the applicant is 15 middlebrook LLC which is operated by Pervian and Daisy Ray both of which are here. The property is located at 15 Middle Avenue which is
designated as lot 6 in block 382. It's in the R5 zone and consists of approximately 8,223 square ft. The applicant started construction on an addition and thought that they had all the approvals that they need but unfortunately they were issued a stop work order on February
20th 2025. In March 24th, 2025, the applicant submitted for a zoning permit application, but it was denied because the plans were missing some information and the combined sideyard setback was non-compliant. The applicant revised the plans and resubmitted for the variance application. And here we are tonight
seeking a variance for an existing non-conforming condition, which is a variance for the combined sideyard setback and a proposed driveway expansion. Again, with the driveway, I'm sorry. Um the minimum combined sideyard setback is 33% whereas we're proposing 27.42%.
And our driveway width 18 feet is permitted and 20 feet is proposed. We contend that the request to relief can be granted pursuant to NJSA40 55D-70C1 and C2. And tonight I will have testimony from the property owners and our architect.
Um so with that I would ask that be sworn. >> Great. Thank you. Raise your right hand, please. Say your full name and spell your last name, please. Provid R A Y. >> Thank you. You swear the testimony you're about to give true. >> Yes. Thank you. >> Thank you. When did you purchase the
property? >> Uh July of last year, >> and when you did the expansion, what was the nature of what was proposed? >> Well, you just wanted to raise put another floor on top of keep the existing foundation and just raise it. >> Okay.
And you also want to expand the driveway, correct? >> Yeah. Yeah, it's part of that. Yes. >> Okay. And what's the reason for that? >> Uh we can have family existing structures very small. >> Understood. And have you spoken to your neighbors or heard anything from them?
>> Yeah, my two of my neighbors are here. >> Perfect. >> They should be concerned about. >> And then I actually have an exhibit for everyone. Maybe, maybe not. Have an exhibit. Okay, I take that back. I don't have an exhibit for you right
now. Um, but would you say that a number of dwellings in your neighborhood have been modified? >> Yeah. Yeah, bunch of them have been modified. They have done a similar kind of modification. >> Okay. I don't really have any further questions for him only because this is
an existing pre-existing non-conforming setback that we're just exacerbating vertically, not horizontally. So we are not changing the footprint. We are not exacerbating the the setback. So I don't really have any other further questions for Mr. Ray, but if any of the board members do, that's welcome.
>> Uh we'll go with our board experts first. Do you guys have any questions for this witness? >> Do you have any uh technical >> architect? Okay. The architect? >> Yes. >> You want to wait for the architect? >> Yes. >> Okay. Your interior garage is is that
existing? It's a 9 foot 6 in I think a garage >> by 19. So that's existing. So it's a pre-existing non-conforming condition. >> Correct. It's very narrow. >> Thank you. No further questions. >> Thank you. Questions from the board for this witness.
>> I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> Have you contacted your neighbors regarding this? >> Yeah. Yeah, my neighbors are here as well. Thank you, >> Alison. >> I I just have a question. Um, it says uh
that you thought that you you So, you're working with the contractor? >> Yes. >> That the contractor did not tell you that. >> He did not unfortunately. >> Is it a local I mean local contract? Just had no idea. >> Um, >> he just did not know. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Did Did you want to dox him tonight? No,
I just want to know how, you know, I mean, I, you know, you hire somebody that supposedly works in the area that knows the knows our laws and regulations and I would just think that, you know, they would be >> I don't think he has built anything in this neighborhood before.
>> Any other questions, Don? >> If I'm not allowed to ask this question, let me know. Are you going to live in this house? >> Yes. Okay. Anything else? Okay, questions from the general public. Seeing none. Okay, great. Let's hear
from your architect. >> Thank you. >> I don't have a full set. So, >> no worries. Our attorney will swear you in right hand. Please say your full name and spell your last name, please. >> Uh, Robert Charles Watts House, spelled
W A N T H O U S E. >> And the testimony you're about to give uh, sorry, do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in the truth? Can you provide qualification for >> I've been uh before the board a number
of times. I've uh, been a licensed architect since uh, 1986. We will accept your >> uh no I I haven't kept my license up for that. >> Should have could have got it for 50 bucks.
>> Will the board accept this expert? >> Yes, we will. Welcome. Please proceed. >> And Mr. Monos, can you just describe the existing conditions of the site? They have a picture of the existing house. You want to see that?
>> I'm sorry. I'm just looking for my exhibits that I had >> here. I I have I have copies of yours. >> So, if we can mark this as exhibit A1. something. >> There's a picture of the existing dwelling on the top and then the
rendering on the bottom so you can kind of see >> directly what it will look like. >> Thank you. >> Oh yes, please. >> Thank you. It's not exactly like existing. That's funny.
>> That will make it a little bit here to describe the existing condition. >> Yes. So, it's a a a raised ranch possibly you'd call it. Uh very two small bedrooms upstairs. Uh not really practical in today's
lifestyle. Uh so we're uh also in the exhibit you'll see a number of neighbors have done similar uh u additions. uh like to think ours is a little more aesthetic than some of them
in the neighborhood. U and I'm sure they're they'll meet the needs of the new homeowners. >> Okay. So, you can can you describe the number of bedrooms proposed now versus what was there before? >> Uh there were two bedrooms upstairs. Uh
we're proposing uh three bedrooms. uh with a two baths which uh there was a a very small bathroom up there. And then on the first floor we're there's going to be a a guest bedroom uh sloff.
So it'll be a total I guess five bedrooms. >> And can you confirm that the non-conforming sideyard setback is a pre-existing non-conerforming condition? >> It is. If you look at uh the our first floor shows all the hatched walls uh
dark their existing walls that are remain. So the the perimeter of the first floor is all existing. >> We are canolvering a small uh like a bay window just to to break up the front facade in in the lower bedroom.
And we're adding a uh a a a little covered roof over the stew. >> Do you know the storm water management currently drains or if there is storm water management? >> Uh my understanding is that it's uh the
lead is uh drained to the grade. And is that the proposed condition? >> Yes, it is. >> So, if you could just take us through the basement, the first floor to the second floor, what changes we're making. >> Well, the basement is existing.
>> Okay. Uh there was a uh a side uh butler door that's going to be uh reinstalled uh to a a better insulated door. And uh
we are opening up the plan uh on the first floor, more open uh uh floor plan. Uh relocating the stair that was right near the front door that that
made it very claustrophobic and relocating it in the back near the family room. >> And on that first floor, can you just tell us what the size of the proposed It's uh 4 by 6 and a half. >> And if you could describe the second
story. Uh second story we have a uh three bedrooms uh with a a master bedroom suite with a their own bathroom and a uh
two other bedrooms uh with a shared bathroom. >> And is there an attic proposed? Uh there's an attic uh with a pull downstairs for storage. >> Okay. But no usable space. >> No usable space. >> Understood. >> Okay. Are you proposing any lighting on the exterior?
>> Uh there would be a light underneath the uh the can front canopy. I think we're showing one on the a light also adjacent to the door. >> And is there any tree removal proposed?
>> No. Okay, we talked about storm water management. Do you think that this will be a more functional layout of the dwelling? >> Oh, yes. Uh the the the house was uh very old and um the kitchen was had to
be redone. There was a lot of interior work that needed to be done. >> Understood. And do you think that architecturally that the proposal is consistent with the neighborhood? >> I do. >> Okay. And you referenced those two photographs that we included in exhibit A1 as well. >> Yes.
>> Okay. And do you think that architecturally the proposal will result in any substantial detriment or substantial impairment of the master plan? >> I do not. >> And that's all I have for Mr. Whouse. >> Great. Thank you.
>> Marie Ed, what do you have for this witness? So, um could you talk about um some of the increase in imperous coverage that's happening on the property? Um there's looks like there's um an overhang from the second floor
giving expanded uh front porch and increased driveway. Could you talk about that? >> Uh I think you you nailed all of our additions there. I'm looking at my coverage here. Here we are.
So, um the the total uh lot with the building including the deck, the driveway, the walkways, the cover porch um equaled uh
21 a little over 2100 square feet, which would be 25.8 8% lot coverage. >> Do you know what the increase is over what it was before?
>> Uh it it would likely be under 200 square feet. Uh I don't have it in front of me. We're extending the uh most of the addition would be the uh the extend the
enlargement of the parking uh driveway. >> When I look at the the previous plans, I think it said that the driveway was 331 ft and now it's 647 square ft, which would be an increase of 316.
>> So, the driveway is increasing by 316 square feet, I believe. So, yes. Is there any um impervious coverage that you're taking off the property anywhere? >> No. >> Okay. So, anything that is over um is
any increase in impervious coverage that's greater than 300 square feet requires storm water management by the um ordinance. So, it needs like a seepage pit or something like that. >> Is that something we could work on?
>> Yes, it is. Um all I have >> Mr. Chairman uh with regard to the driveway itself, do you know what the setback will be at the 20 foot width that you're proposing? Will it comply
with the two foot setback requirements? >> Yes. >> Okay. So you'll have minimally two feet there. What is the R for the additional 2T compared to 18 ft. From your perspective, what's being requested tonight? >> The uh to keep the existing curb cut uh
and have a uh easy way to pull into the drive with two larger SUVs side by side. >> Okay. Um, what is when we look at a variance for
this combined sideyard setback, recognizing it's a pre-existing condition, but obviously you're expanding it on the second floor. I think you offered testimony with regard to the master plan itself, but yet the purpose of that regulation. What is it about the facade that you're proposing
offsets impact to the mass and scale of what's being added to that side of the building? Um, is that something that you could offer some testimony as an architect for the board's understanding? We uh we added a uh a gable uh to the
front of the building uh that would tend to uh and bring it that the visually bring it uh make the house appear smaller. Also, we set back uh the second floor uh in uh
back from the garage door to to make the uh elevation a little more interesting and then just to to make it appear a little bit smaller. >> Okay. Uh with regard to the canal lever
you mentioned, was that for a bay window you were indicating? >> Yeah, that's that that's the the the double window in the uh in the guest bedroom and then also the window on the second floor >> and that's on the right hand side.
>> That is correct. >> Okay. And so that also complies with setbacks. >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you. No further questions. questions from the board for this witness. >> Um I have I have a few and some are um
>> just the F related to F just to make sure we have this captured right. Um the the basement I'm sorry I missed it. Is it's unfinished or is it >> unfinished. >> And what what's the height of basement? >> Uh it's uh 74 at least I would assume.
>> Are there any plans to finish it? No. Uh, not that I know of. >> Okay. So then that let me count and then um there was and I I'm probably looking at this wrong but one of these sheets um
I'm not sure A200 there is um and this is not related to the driveway or anything like that but just there's a place next to the stairs that says twostory space in this area and that's on the first floor but on the
second floor. It shows it as like laundry, not an opening. >> There is a uh if you look at this where the stair is, there is a um about 2 feet or so where uh further. So
So it's like a sixoot opening around the stair. So it it it's >> uh Okay. So like just a wider stair. >> That's right. So you can look down. >> Okay. And then um the driveway I guess 18 feet is the maximum that is allowed
but this is 20. And I was just wondering um having done this at my house recently I don't know these pavers are these raised Belgian block or is it planned to be flush >> flush >> because I was wondering if you could maybe put them sideways and move it in and that gives you space that you could
park and drive on to reduce the width a little bit to make it closer to that 18. I don't know if that's um possible. Mr. >> You know, with two SUVs and having to
judge that in if it's a requirement that that uh we we would I'm sure meet meet it. But it's uh it's something that the extra two feet really uh when you
open up doors and and things, it's it's a little better. That's all I have. Thank you. >> Anyone else? >> Seeing none. All right. Questions from the public for this witness. >> Seeing none.
Okay, great. >> I don't have any additional witnesses, but I know there are neighbors here. >> Okay, great. Is there anything you want to say in conclusion before we let the neighbor speak or? >> Um, I would just say that this is kind of a minimal application. We're not exacerbating the non-conforming
condition. We're just going up vertically. I understand the board's concerns about the drive with. We just think that it would be helpful for two larger SUVs to navigate. We're not changing the curve cut, but we are still providing associated with it. I do think that
there will be benefits to this especially providing appropriate parking for house and it will be a more comfortable living for our applicants and it will be a better improvement. >> Thank you. >> Uh anyone from the public would like to
comment on this application? >> Yes, I would. >> Please come up. We'll swear you in. Thank you. Raise your right hand. State your name, please. And we're yielding your address. >> Ronald Martin, 17 Middle Avenue Summit,
New Jersey. >> Do you swear affirm the testimony you're about to give the truth? >> Yes, sir. >> Thank you. >> Please proceed. >> Yes. Um, I've been on Middle Avenue for 60 years. I'm the longest resident on that block and um, I've done re renovations at homes. I own number seven
as well as number 17. 17 is obviously adjacent to this property. And in regards to the driveway being uh broader, uh that would come right up to my house on my property, no towards my property, and I have absolutely no problem with that uh wherever it may be
with the size of the driveway if uh permission is granted for him to go ahead and to do so. Um it's definitely enhancing the neighborhood, bringing beautifification to our neighborhood. Uh the home has come along uh very very nicely and I know that a lot of people
are very very happy with it and um I have absolutely no problems with uh what the family is doing with this uh residence here. >> Excellent. >> Yeah. >> Thank you so much for your testimony. I appreciate >> you're very welcome. >> Okay. >> Yes, please, sir. Come on up.
>> State your name, your address, please. >> Jeffrey Stewart, 19 middle. >> Thank you. And do you swear from the testimony you're about to will be truth. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Just have a brief statement. Um, as I said, I live at 19 middle, a couple doors down from 15. Um, my family and I
have lived in Summer for about 3 years. We just moved to 19, uh, just under a year ago, uh, right when this construction started. Um, and we've really come to appreciate the character of the community and this neighborhood. Um, and although we're new to the
street, we're generally excited to see nearby homes being renovated and modernized, uh, and while this house isn't yet finished, uh, the plans look to be welldesigned and carefully executed. Um, as an architect, uh, it is my opinion
that given the pre-existing non-conforming conditions of the building, the design and scale of the renovation are appropriate for the property and consistent with the evolving character of the neighborhood. I don't see any negative impact of the requested variance and I think the
project will be a positive contribution to our street and the community as a whole. >> Great. Thank you. Two architects for the price of one. Well done. >> Okay. Any other public comments?
>> Seeing none. Okay. Um so can you tell us our um conditions and number of votes to approve please? >> Approval. So the conditions are excuse me the standard compliance with the conditions recommended by the uh board engineer and then uh the applicants
agreed to uh the condition of storm water management as appropriate due to the increase in the impervious coverage. >> Okay form of some kind of Steve educate. Uh the votes are a simple majority. >> Okay. Thank you so much. Let's begin
executive session. Who wants to kick it off? Thank you. Select someone. I can support this application. It's, you know, it is a a pre-existing condition as far as the sideyard setbacks are concerned. Uh I'm familiar with the neighborhood. Uh used
to hang out there when I was little. So, but anyway, um that neighborhood's up and coming and I think this is just going to enhance it that that the positives definitely outweigh the negatives and I can certainly support this uh application. >> Great. Thank you, Tom. >> Yeah, I can support it as well. I mean,
it's definitely having walked that neighborhood a couple times over the last few years, it's definitely keeping a scale uh keeping the size and scope is keep is in scale with the neighborhood. Um, and I I think it's a reasonable application. Um, I think the testimony of the two witnesses, uh, the two two
neighbors is is a very positive, uh, thing for the application because I think they see that their neighborhood would would increase in value. Um, I'm happy we're keeping we're h having storm water management that we picked up on that 300 foot increase and we're going to have to address that possibility and I I support the application.
>> Great, Marian. Um yeah, I think I was just looking at my pictures because there was one one thought that I had when I was uh visiting the site today was um with the the potential impact of of having like
reduced sideyard setback in this case on one side of the house there's a garage by the neighbors have a garage and on the other side of the house it well it's the garage from this property. So there is sort of a buffer. it's not like
expanding the whole house in both direct where it's impacting another house directly. Um so I think that sort of helps minimize the any potential negative impact of what could be considered with that um not having the
meeting the sideyard requirements. And you know um I think I'm not sure it's it's kind of strange to call it um the existing house the picture that we have here because it's not exactly what's existing. the house has been built. Um I
don't know where that uh but you know continuing finishing the construction I don't see any um I don't see any negative impacts and clearly um it's great to have the support of the neighbors too. So >> great thank you.
So, normally when we get cases that are uh asking for forgiveness rather than permission, the board gets very excitable. But I think it's a a testament to to the strength of your application that this is not the case.
And I don't see anyone really upset about that at this point. And um we very much appreciate when neighbors give testimony and it was obviously very positive and supportive and I also agree that I think your your witnesses did
themselves credit talking through uh the design and the application itself. So with that I am happy to support it as well and um ask for a motion to approve. >> So moved. >> Second. Jessica, can you please call the
role? >> Vice Chair Zon? >> Yes. >> Mr. Yuko? >> Yes. >> Mr. Malay? >> Yes. >> Mr. Nelson? >> Yes. >> Miss Chief? >> Yes. >> Mr. Chantuli? >> Yes. >> Chairman Ly? >> Yes. >> Congratulations.
>> Good luck. [Laughter] >> That one was hard to protect. >> Hey, you're batting 500. I mean, that's pretty good in baseball, right? No, >> I remember last time.
>> Yeah, but one one turn you got to go. >> Noted until somebody. >> Yeah. I wonder if that's what happens. Do you guys want a fivem minute break or do you want to power through? >> Take a five minute break. >> Okay. Allison says five minute break. So
It's It's just incredible. All right, we are back in session. Can I have 57 Hobart, please? You okay? >> No worries. >> Hi, welcome. >> Hello.
>> Our attorney will swear you in. >> Could you please raise your right hands? State your full name and spell your last name for the record, please. >> I Stephanie Guom. G I L L A U M E. John Gom U I L L A U M E
>> Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to give will be the truth? >> Yes. Thank you. >> Welcome. Please proceed. >> Thank you. >> Hi. Good evening. I'm just going to take over. >> I thought they were going to do an opening statement. No worries. We'll get you covered, too.
>> Yeah. Same thing. Please state your full name and spell your last name. >> My name is Greg Hassai. Last name HS AJ. I I am the uh licensed registered architect representing the applicants at 57 Hobart Avenue. >> Thank you. Do you swear affirm the testimony you're about to give will be the truth?
>> I do. >> Thank you. >> Before we begin, if I may. >> And then could you just please give us a brief uh description? >> Of course. Uh I've I've been working under a licensed architect for 11 years. Uh I have u I've been licensed for four
years now and I I also have my own practice. >> All right. And have you been before any boards previously? >> Uh yes, this year this is my fourth zoning board meeting. Uh not in front of summit like to accept this. >> We would welcome please proceed.
>> Thank you so much. Uh before before we proceed, I' I'd just like to hand out um a clearer version of I understand there were numerous comments about the calculations and and how they were they came to to be and just wanted to hand this out maybe just shed shed some light
um as to you know any misconceptions or anything that might have happened to >> That's fine. We'll just hand it out. We'll mark it as A1. Thank you, sir. >> Thank you. >> I promise it's not meant to complicate
things. I hope it helps it all. >> We will be the judge of that. >> Yes. Do you want to mark these as A1 and A2? >> Okay. >> So noted. >> All right. Great.
>> Okay. Please. Um uh thank you. uh as as you look on uh the documents that were just handed out, I just wanted to give a brief uh explanation of the property itself that we're dealing with, there are currently four non-conforming conditions uh for what I was able to to find. Uh the lot width, the side
setbacks, building coverage, and the lot coverage. Uh the variances were asking for especially are the building coverage and the lot coverage due to the uh deck that we are proposing. There is an existing uh wood deck that I have advised the applicants not to use due to
its condition deteriorating condition and the uh hazardous stairs that are discharging into the shared uh driveway. Uh as far as uh calculations, the existing deck in addition to those
stairs uh total up to 255 square ft. uh the we're proposing the removal of that entirely and uh building a deck that's 495 square ft with a total difference of 240 square ft uh total. Uh the uh the
applicants are also willing to remove the 330 ft play area if the board uh wishes to do so uh to offset any of that uh coverage uh for the larger deck. The
difference that you may be seeing uh as far as this plan that the site plan that I handed you versus the original submission includes the generator uh is the it will be existing uh and remaining in its place after speaking with the uh
manufacturer and the installer of the generator. Um we meet all the clearances for that generator. Therefore, it can remain. And the secondary staircase that was uh proposed on the fireplace side of
the covered deck will also be removed uh just due to budgetary constraints. uh as to uh the history on the on the property. I'd like uh the to introduce uh the applicants, John and Stephanie,
to just give a little insight as to what happened as far as timeline uh since their purchase of the house in 2018. >> All right. So, 57 Hobart Avenue was basically our dream home. It still is.
We moved there from Jersey City with two children. We loved it. It's a great place to raise a family, a wonderful block. We've lived there for eight years. Our kids have grown up there and we have a wonderful relationship with our neighbors. Block parties, the
children all go to the same school. But sometimes when you move into a property, as you grow into the property, you see some of the things that you potentially need. So unfortunately for us um I would say about two three years ago we had a
major squirrel infestation >> which completely destroyed this beautiful historical home. So when we moved into the home it had existing wood siding. It had an asphalt roof um and this beautiful magnolia tree at the rear
deck. And basically this magnolia tree was the conduit for squirrel invasion 2.0. We literally have PTSD from this. They invaded the the roof by climbing up the tree. They nibbled over the past say about
2year period. They nibbled through the entire wood exterior of that home. They gained access to the attic. They were scratching through the walls. We literally have PTSD from that. If my husband hears a sound at 2:00 in the morning, he's up. He's like, "Oh my
goodness, what is happening?" So this forced us now as a result to undergo um all these changes in the home. So um we started off by doing just some exterior changes. Of course keeping with the historical theme of the block because it's a beautiful block. We don't want to
make any overly like unnecessary changes, but it's all things that will be for the improvement of the block and match the aesthetic of the other homes on the block as well. And just for functional purposes now with this rear deck or the rear um the rear porch, we
really would like to match the aesthetic of what our neighbors have. Like for instance, our neighbors to the left have a deck that um runs the entire length of the back of the property, meaning the the length of the house. Our deck, it's not really functional. We barely use it.
Um it's the wood is very warped. the stairs are just kind of unsafe for the children. So, we have a very good relationship with our neighbors at 55 Hobart. Between us, we have five children collectively between the ages of eight and 13. As you
imagine, these children love to play in the driveway. They like to run and play. We're very careful with each other backing up the cars, but the stairs for this old deck go directly out. Sometimes the children don't pay attention. They don't see. So, safety is a major consideration here. It's not functional.
We don't use it. Um, and that's why we're asking for this change for the variance. >> Great. Thank you. >> Anything you want to add? >> I think she said everything that I would have said. >> Great. Um, board experts, do you have
any questions for the architect or the applicants? Um I so I I want to clarify that in our engineering letter's engineering letter on um comment number seven, thank you Mr. for noticing this
for us. Um there is a typo error in there where it says that um 18% is proposed um and 35% is proposed that should actually be permitted. So I just wanted to clarify that. >> Okay. Um,
so aside from that, um, I, you know, you provided the, um, updated lot coverage calculations, so I appreciate that. I was given them actually in advance of this meeting, so I was able to look them over. I have, I have no problems with the calculations there. Since it's less
than 240 square feet, I sorry, it's less than 300 square feet. At 240 square feet, there's no storm water mitigation um, required. Um, I do have one question because as I was looking at it closer at the back deck
where you have um the stairs that you're proposing to go down, there's a footing underneath there and it looks like it conflicts with the driveway beneath it. Is there um is there a a conflict there or is it >> um it's I just I haven't uh gotten to
the actual foundation yet, but I I will carefully uh with the main support team and and we'll support it without the need of a >> Okay, that one's just >> great. That's that's fine. So, you're actually >> I know I didn't know exactly what
>> you see where I'm the upper portion. >> Yes. So then when I was looking at the elevation view from the back the back elevation it looks like coming downirect so it's not
>> no I I I'm in communication with the uh contractor as well and we already discussed this that there will be an overhang on the on uh landing of those steps and again it's not sized or anything it's just very preliminary um the
secondary sheet. >> So that that would be something that the applicant could work with the building department on that. >> Thank you. >> Um and I think that was I think that was where do you um where's your storm
water? Um are there any changes with the storm water from the building from the um the deck? Um >> so currently um I'm sorry. >> No, that's it. >> Oh. Uh so currently there there is a uh storm water management plan in place
currently with the two again I apologize because the block and lot number covering where the two inlets are. Uh and that's uh my mistake. Um there's two storm water commercial grade uh or industrial grade inlets. They're already designed from the previous design dated
about four or five years ago and the applicants can can attest to that. um where the existing shared driveway was actually a gravel driveway and the work um the improvements part of the site which was four years four or five years
ago um included a a storm water management plan for all the services to empty this drywall system which is under the block and lot number. >> Okay. So there is an existing um drywall system on the site. >> Yes. Yes. And we do plan on installing
two leaders from the from the cover deck and they will be uh attached to schedule 44inch piping underground leading to that that primal system as well. >> Um have you investigated what the size of that dry well is and if it can
accommodate the extra volume that you're collecting from the covered deck? >> I uh No, I I >> Okay. So that would be one thing that you're going to have to do. >> Correct. You don't want it overflowing and going somewhere else. So,
>> correct. >> Okay. So, you're not although you're not required to put in storm water management, I I appreciate that you want to, you know, pipe it on the ground. We just want to make sure that um that it has enough volume. >> Of course. >> Ed, do you have anything for him?
>> Okay. Um yes, a few quick questions. Um we also had for some reason a typo in our report as well. I just wanted to point that out. It seemed like we have the same virus. Um, but yet we uh have 51.2% on page two for the maximum lot
coverage. It should have been now 56%. Although it leads me to a question. You had indicated you were willing to remove the play area on the property, but you didn't take any credit for it yet, right? No, this is again if if um if need be if the board would like to uh
complete that and I spoke to your owners previously pre >> what would the delta be if the the play area is removed just out of curiosity. >> It's about 330 ft. >> 330 negative. >> Yes. So what would the percentage come
down to then? I guess is my question. >> I was just about to do the computation. I think it's around 2.5 2.5% comes down to 52.7%. Okay.
>> Can I ask what the material I I was there I didn't actually I saw like a I saw like a little uh jungle not a jungle gym one of those domes that looks like it's resting on maybe some building material in the meantime while you guys So what is you couldn't tell what the surface is of the play area? Look all I
saw was grass back there. >> Yeah. No, it actually is more elaborate play structure than that. That's one of the kids play structures, but we took apart like a commercial, not a commercial, but like a regular playground structure and it was on like a squared mulched area directly in front
of >> Oh, so it was mulched. So, it's it's it was already impervious. It was like pvious rather. It's not >> impervious. That's what I was going to ask. >> Oh, so I apologize. I I actually have it that 330 listed under the uh the impervious uh conditions,
>> right? So it already exists as >> correct. >> So then it shouldn't count towards >> you said it was a roof structure. >> Is it a roof structure? >> I didn't understand the playground. >> Not a roof structure.
>> Something you can climb through. >> What are those little domes you can climb? >> Geodessic dome thing. >> I think what we're driving at is that it doesn't already calculate as imperous coverage. And it was and it was considered pvious. No. Or impervious.
>> Uh as per my calculations, I have it listed under impervious. >> All right. So then that so you should already >> the percentages should be lowered by >> Yeah. All right. So they're at 52.6. >> So the variance condition is requesting 52.7. >> Okay. Great.
>> Thank you. >> On this on this um sheet that just came out, it says there's a wall next to the play area. Yeah, >> I didn't see a wall. I believe that's a typo. >> Oh, okay. >> No, there there's no no wall. Applicants
can attest to that, but I I don't believe there's a wall or anything >> uh any barrier around it. >> Did did you prepare this site plan or did was it taken from the survey? the surveyor uh prepared the the survey and then I added my details uh the
architectural details to it >> and that's listed in the note on the plan right >> it was from Auster incorporated >> okay my last question is regarding the rationale for the size of the deck it's 18 by 27.6 six
>> the rationale for sizing at that size just to give the board an idea. So essentially to to you know host any family gatherings um again a 10 foot uh 10 to 14 person table uh will not fit in a uh I believe the existing deck was 10
by 10 ft by about 14t 15 ft again just to host uh larger family gatherings. Okay. But the minimum sideyard setback will be maintained.
>> The Yes. 12 ft. Yes. The 12.45 will be maintained. >> Uh actually now it's Yeah. The other the fireplace side will be around 11.4 I'm assuming. >> Okay. You have the generator at 10 foot >> off to the side where it's set back.
>> Generator uh and generator was permitted. The generator work was permitted back in 2018. >> It was we had it permitted through Summit in 2018. 2018 uh as well as the the drywall and the the asphalt pavement
was I believe that was completed in 2021 >> 21. >> Okay. And there's a one tree to be removed >> based upon >> the the magnolia existing again which >> conduit >> by my observation is is already uh dece
diseased and uh not in the best of shape at this point. >> And then any lighting improvements? Uh there will be lighting uh ceiling mounted um no flood lighting. Uh potentially some landscaping lighting that's close to the ground. Uh nothing
that's going to be directional or flood light uh flood light direction towards the neighbors. And that covered deck will be open except for the wall I guess for the fireplace area. >> Correct. Okay. So therefore it doesn't count towards F. Typically if it's
enclosed screen portrait count towards F. Yes. Okay, great. Thank you. >> Um, back quickly back to the the tree that's being removed. I believe the forester stated that there a replacement tree would be required. Do you have a
location for that? >> Not per se. There there's a little uh there is concern about the replanting of the actual um inind magnolia tree um that the owners can attest to a little more. Um, and I leave it up to to them.
>> I I think they can just I don't think the species matters to us. I think you just work with the forester. >> Okay. >> To to let him know your concerns about magnolia trees specifically and they're apparently great attraction of squirrels. >> Yes, they are. >> And not spot.
>> I'm sure he'll be amanable to whatever you propose, but I would just work with him on a location and a species. And just to be clear that he you need a permit to remove the tree too as in this report. Yeah.
>> Great. Um questions from the board for these witnesses. >> Um I just have one. So just uh the driveway that you you did with your neighbors. Um, so that because normally when we're looking at like a lot coverage in your
property is already over lot coverage, but this is something that was already granted a variance. There was a var because I don't remember seeing that in there, but there must have been some variance already granted for this lot coverage if this was done recently. >> Everything was >> or did this go before zoning because
typically it would have to, right? >> Before zoning. This was in 2021. >> Okay. So it went before zoning and you did storm water management. So, we're not looking at a property that's like has, you know, excess storm water that's not being controlled. I guess that's
already being managed. So, it's really just looking at this porch. Um, and I just want to clarify that. So, okay. So, >> I don't think it said maybe I missed it that there was a a variance. So, that's good. That's in there.
>> That was my only question. >> Great. I just have one. Are there any plans for use under the deck? >> Not >> like pave it or I mean not pave it but bel mud. Well, not grass but dirt. >> It won't be able to be grass.
>> Yeah. And be grass. That's for sure. >> Gravel. >> Not going to grow. >> Counts as imperous cover anyway. The deck. So that's >> true. Okay. And and go ahead. Explain to me why so big. Say that again.
>> Why the Why is the deck so big? >> Just because it's not functional now. We have the children. Children are growing up. We want to be able to like have them have kids over. We don't use it at all right now. We can barely >> hold like a sixperson table on there and
we don't use it at all. So, we just wanted to make it more functional for the family. >> Would that would a deck 300 ft work? I could, but I want a nice >> um Well, just to piggy back on that, do
you think that um one of the reasons why you might um want this deck to be larger than maybe what somebody else would have is your house is elevated in the back. So, it's not like typically somebody might have a patio in the back, but in
your case, you would have to step have a smaller deck step down to a patio. It's not it's sort of a functional is is that you know part of it or >> just a functional >> more functional. Yes. >> And it will also act as a contained play
space for the kids too. >> Yes. >> Okay. Then a larger deck would make sense. >> Okay. Any comments or questions from the audience? Seeing none. Any comments from the audience?
Seeing none. anything you want to say in summation. >> I I think we covered it. Just again um my point of view as the architect you know life and safety is number one and again uh I've advised them uh to keep
off the deck as well as the children um it is is not structurally sound um with the even the the footings um the load the main support beam uh any of the decking and to replace that is is a
necessity. I how you replace it, but it needs to be replaced. >> Okay. >> Mr. Nering. Yes, of course. >> Um the air conditioning units are under the the deck that's going to be replaced. >> Yes. Uh the again we we spoke to the
installer um to make sure that they comply with the intake requirements from the top of the air conditioning units to the bottom of the decking. Uh they did come out and also measured it as far as where the deck would be coming out to and confirmed that they meet all the clearances required clearances. Um
>> place to have units that's all. >> Correct. Yes. But because of again the site setbacks and and cost of moving them they the owners opted to move as existing.
>> Great. Thank you so much. What of our conditions and number of votes to approve? Well, simple majority as far as the voting is concerned with regard to the conditions. There are three of them. There is compliance with the board engineers memorandum. There's uh the applicants have agreed to investigate to
ensure that the increased storm water capacity uh increased storm water management will uh not exceed the capacity of the existing drywall system. Uh thirdly, the applicants have agreed to uh in accordance with the city's ordinances to replace the the magnolia
tree uh to some kind of other tree uh with and to work for the city forestry to do so. >> Great. Thank you. With that, let's open the executive session. Who wants to be in? Don't all speak up at once. >> I can I can start. Um
I can support this application. And I think that um I you know I'm pleased to hear that the when the site is sort of over lot coverage that the storm water is already being managed. That's generally my one of my big concerns is
>> um adding more to something and exacerbating a situation, but that doesn't seem like the case here. Um I did see the deck. It did definitely look like it was in disrepair and certainly I understand the safety concerns of having that shared driveway. Um, in fact, your
neighbors park diagonally in a way where they're actually pulling out into where those stairs let out. >> So, it it truly is, you know, um potential safety hazard. Um, and so that's, you know, I can appreciate
wanting to relocate the stairs and, um, you know, I I don't really have a I don't have an issue with the deck. I think we've actually realized that the the ask is I don't know how much what are we asking for an increase in imperous cover now?
Like half a percent or it was 52.8 total now from what was it 50? >> It's actually reduced. >> Reduced. Okay. So you're actually reducing because the play area doesn't count and that was >> actually the 53.6 included the 330 play
area. >> So therefore >> all right have to do another computation. >> Are we removing the play area? >> Well it's just it's not impervious. It's mulch. I don't >> So that's not a condition this board is
just wanted to clarify. >> Um >> so so what what is the actual number then that we're going from and to? >> I'll work on that. I think we're going to 52.8 from where? We're not sure. >> Yeah, 5. I thought it was 52.7
>> or I wrote down 52.7 anyway. >> It Yeah, it was 75. So, I was rounding up. >> Okay. >> Well, I mean, while Ed's doing that, I I can support the application to pending its numbers over there. The changes are all in the back. It doesn't affect the streetscape. Sounds like a lot, you
know, that what they're asking for, but when you really get down to it, it really isn't. It's just a bigger deck and it's in the back and the scale of the house is in keeping with the neighborhood site can support it. >> Chairman, the calculation would be uh existing is 50.4%.
And it's going to 52.7. >> Okay. >> So, it is increasing >> which makes sense. >> That that makes sense. Um I I too can support this. I agree with my colleagues. Uh this this scale seems reasonable to the
size of the house, especially if you're going to use it for gatherings and for the children to play in a sort of an elevated spot away from the driveway. And that that's that's all I need to hear to to think that this is the right move and it makes um all the sense in
the world. So with that, can I get a motion to approve? So I'll second >> Jessica roll please >> vice chairan >> yes >> Mr. Yuko >> yes >> Mr. Malay >> yes >> Mr. Nelson >> yes >> Miss Chief
>> yes >> Mr. Chantuli. >> Yes. >> Chairman Ly. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Congratulations. Good luck. >> Thank you for your time. >> Thank you. >> We all expect to be invited over for a party on the deck when it's done. >> Thank you. >> Have a good evening.
>> All right. We have one more application here tonight and then we have some board business in terms of scheduling that I missed at the beginning. So, we will deal with that. after eight Irving please. Welcome. >> Hello again.
>> Thank you for waiting. >> Thank you for having us still. >> Can you please state your full names and spell your last names? >> My name is Joanna Gamn. G M Y. >> My name is Premis Gum. G M Y.
>> Thank you. And do you swear or affirm that the testimony you're about to give will be the truth? >> Yes. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Please proceed. Tell us a little bit about your application. >> So we did in we've been >> Can you speak into the microphone? Yeah. Sorry.
>> Yes. Um we've been in Summit for last six years um at the same street. Um first we rented there and then in June 2021 we bought our property. We moved there with four daughters
and uh this we love the house, we love summit. Um we have good relations with our neighbors. Uh this year um in our house the water leak happened and it damaged the let's say interior of the
house. So, uh we were forced to make a like a big renovation um including floors and um furniture also the kitchen. Um up to this point uh on the first floor
we had a bathroom in the kitchen. However strange it sounds, it wasn't our doing. >> H but that's how it was planned. H having four kids also like the little ones who never close the doors. My
sliding sliding kitchen door uh were touching the countertop which for me was like super disgusting basically. Uh so we decided to take to ask for the opportunity to relocate the bathroom. So
at the beginning I've said we will ask to add the bathroom but the truth is we would like to add some square footage only like it's a small addition of um 56 square ft just for the size of bathroom
because I've tried a few architects and we like really couldn't find better place for the bathroom um on this level. Uh we would like the bathroom to be accessible with like four four kids. We
never had any problem until this year uh when 2025 when one of our daughters had a bad knee injury. And uh we realize how important it is to have um accessible bathroom and the same
with patio. We uh we would like to exchange the existing gravel into pavers. So when was this time when our daughter was on the wheelchair, we could push her and the space could be usable
um and like easily accessible for everyone. Um so we have many nonconforming um conditions at our lot. Irving place
is an older part of the city. The house was built in 1908. Um it's R5 zone. For example, the lot area size required
is 5,000. we only have 4.2. Um therefore therefore there is so many uh existing not conforming uh conditions. We ask for variance for
uh lot coverage because we are not now at 65%. We want to in fact decrease uh this lot coverage but it will still be not conforming. Uh we want to reduce our
gravel and the pavers we want to exchange it with will be uh less than the gravel currently there. Um yes. Um >> yes, just adding uh because you know we
really increasing you're asking to increase the floor area ratio by the the mentioned 56 square ft um space for bathroom um which will ultimately increase slightly the floor area ratio. However, obviously with the architect, we worked
to decrease overall coverage ratio so at least we can gain some of this permeable uh surface on our lot back. >> The floor plan because it's an old house. Uh the entry you can you can see you have the documents there is like
diagonal path uh towards the kitchen and the living area. That's why this first um let's say entrance the faire that's like not very usable or practical space. Um
and there is really not a great sp like space for the bathroom. Maybe that's why the previous owners decided to put it in the kitchen. Uh the addition will be rear only modest.
Um all our neighbors uh were informed and they uh understand our needs. [Music] We will also uh leave the the character of the house. So the the
little bathroom is planned in a shape of bay window uh just to stick with the uh character of the architecture in there. >> Great. Thank you.
>> Great. Ed, what do you have for >> um Can you confirm that your shed is in >> Yes, it is. It is. I saw the comment and emailed the architect and um actually have it um have it confirmed with him
that the that the shed the 101 square ft that's the shed uh area and it is included in existing building coverage. >> Okay. Thank you. I can present the email as well and his calculation if >> well I I think it is in the calculation.
I think I took a second look at it after yes my letter went out. So I'm I'm just confirming for all of you on the it is it is in there. >> So thank you. >> Great. Thank you >> Dan. >> So as you know there's a decrease in coverage and um doesn't there's any
storm water mitigation that's required for this project? >> No. Even though there is snow, we still have um like we've never had any problems with storm water because we have the uh the pipes h underground that
uh redirect redirect the uh water from the spouts into the city sewer. We also have on our very small lot eight big trees uh which are great help like natural way of uh managing the storm
water that has always been sufficient and now we only decreasing the coverage so I think it should all be good. Are you making any changes to the downspouts on um because you're changing the back of
the house where the bathroom? >> Yeah, we will be adding so obviously I'm aware that this 56 square ft uh will need um the you know the drain the the spouts. So they will be done uh to
according to the coding like to the code and um in the best possible way to you know to address the water and the drainage. >> Thank you >> Ed. >> Thank you Mr. Chairman. Um, your direct
testimony really addressed a number of my questions and I think provided a lot of uh support for your application. The one thing though I do note is what's unique is that you have two driveways >> on the property. Is that right?
>> Yes, it is. So also um that's something um pre-existing condition and um on the street um many of the driveways are directly next to each other. So with our neighbors some of them are as narrow
that they don't have any like line in between because that's the only way to use it. Our driver driveways are around 9 ft each. So super narrow but still possible for a use like for one not too
big car. Um this is >> there's another house on that street that has two driveways, right? >> Yeah, >> honestly like maybe. Yes, >> I'm pretty sure. >> Yeah, I think a lot of these houses used to be two families. So like almost
almost all of them have drive waves on both sides because then you usually kind of share it with your neighbor otherwise. >> So for us our left side sorry left side left side driveway
>> um >> it's well we only can uh use our cars nor let's say normally us and the neighbors because there is nothing there in between. There is no fence or >> zero. >> Yes. >> Okay. >> And most of the houses would have
driveways like this way. >> Yes. >> Yes. It's very dense there. The houses are like really close to each other. >> Mhm. And so the addition is really just in the back of the building. >> Yes. >> Really where it is. Just for the first floor. >> Just for the first floor just to have
easily accessible bathroom on the first floor, not in the kitchen. Uh you mentioned the lot area doesn't conform to the zone but also the lot width doesn't conform as well. Correct. >> Yes. Yes. We have many unconforming conditions.
>> Thank you. No further questions. >> Thank you. Um questions from the board. >> Just was there a bathroom there originally? You're just redoing. That's all you're doing, right? >> Well, yes, redoing. But we want to redo it in different like I really don't want
to cook and see that toilet. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> It's adding on in the back over there >> and moving it out in the kitchen. >> Um I just had a question about the pearavevel. >> So pearavevel when it's a driveway we
count it as imperous cover. Um in this situation and I'm just wondering because of storm water because this is actually it's a small lot that's over on coverage. um when we is that the
use of that pearavevel is that considered impervious as a back okay >> it is because you can't differentiate between the two and that's why it's included. >> Yeah. I'm just, you know, potential concern for you even though you're not having um storm water issues
now because that there is percolation through the pearavevel when you put the blue stone that's now um solid and that that may end up you know creating some water having effect of having more water in your yard than you're used to now. Right.
>> Like still all the water like reaching falling on the house is direct directed with the pipes under the ground into the city. So that's how our like spouts are directed.
It's do they dischar discharge at the curb to the >> Yes. street. >> Okay. >> They might they might they might have the old um clay pipes that go underground. >> Yes, >> because they're old house.
>> Yeah. >> Yes. That was also done before. Like we bought the house with this pipes under. >> I was born in the house right across the street. >> Yes. >> That's great. >> Yeah. So, you know how dense it is.
>> You might have to recuse yourself. >> Any other questions for this for these witnesses? Seeing none, any questions from the public? Seeing none, um, anything you want to say in summation?
>> I think we we love our house. We would like to just make it a bit better for our family and that's why you are asking for this small change. >> Great. Thank you. Any public comments? Seeing none. Okay. What do we need for conditions? And
>> so as far as conditions are concerned, uh I didn't hear any aside from the uh compliance with the board engineers memorandum. >> Uh outside of that, uh as far as the votes are concerned, since they are asking for a F variance, which is a Dvariance, we're going to need five votes. >> Okay,
let's enter into executive session. Who wants to begin? >> All right, I can start. >> Uh this is a very simple ask. I mean they they there a lot of the the lot a lot of the properties on that block are non-conforming. The lots are too small
anyway and this isn't really a big big ask. Um so I can support this. Uh it doesn't affect the neighbors and you know improves their life improves their lives. Um and they're actually reducing the lot coverage a little bit with the with the um the pavers as opposed to the
pgraph. So I can support this application. >> Great. Thank you Don Tom. Yeah, I I can spot it as well. It's an both an undersized and narrow lot which creates a kind of hardship and the the small ask has no negative impacts that I can discern on on the neighbors or the
neighborhood as to noted scale with the neighborhood. Um it's in the it's in the rear so not impact the streetscape. Um, and just as a personal comment, I maybe it was an architectural trend early 20th century, but I grew up with a bathroom in my kitchen, too.
>> So, I don't know if it was a trend then, but an old brick house. Anyway, I can vote to prove >> pipes are a lot closer closer. >> Yeah. Um I I would just add um I can also support this in that one um one thing that I see as a positive as well
in is the move to the blue you know having the blue stone pavers in the back versus the pear gravel. Like I think that's an aesthetic improvement and to the extent that the houses are all close together if your neighbors happen to be looking you know seeing it's going to look better from from the people who can
see into your backyard I don't know who can um it will look better I think than the you know pee gravel it's just a nice aesthetic and you are reducing the lot coverage by as as was stated so I too could support this. Can I just say one
thing and I also I also like the design of the um the extension on the back on how it is that little b little window. >> Yeah. >> So I can support the step. >> No. I I concur with all my um board me
fellow board members on this and also to the usability, modernization and improvement of the general quality of life by putting in a a modern bathroom out of the kitchen. It's definitely
going to uh make it more usable for sure. So with that, can I get a motion to approve? >> So move. >> Can I get a second? Second >> second. >> Jessica, >> vice chair. >> Yes. >> Mr. Yuko. >> Yes. >> Mr. Malay.
>> Yes. >> Mr. Nelson. >> Yes. >> Miss Chief. >> Yes. >> Mr. Chantuli. >> Yes. >> Chairman Ly. >> Yes. >> Congratulations. Good luck. >> Thank you. >> Thank you very much. >> Okay.
Last bit of business. the continuing saga of beacon unitarian. It's going to be carried until what are we thinking?
>> Did you want to do 128 for the special meeting? >> Is there is there an appetite for a special meeting just so we can try and get this to the finish line? Yeah, I will raise a concern that if we don't finish this this year, there might be a problem with board turnover and I don't
know if anybody's leaving, but so there's some incentive there to try to finish by the end of the year if we can. >> Tom, no one's allowed to leave. >> I did I didn't say anybody was. I have no idea if anybody is, but >> it's a it's a valid comment and thank you for bringing that up. >> Can I can I ask you another question on
that one? Can is it possible that we could take a vote on those individually instead of lumping all 15 one vote. >> I think that was >> we discussed that. >> Can we discuss that without the applicant hearing?
>> I don't I don't know. >> I asked Andy >> few months back. >> He said we could but it we had we had to do it. >> Okay. >> Something that we suggest to agree on.
So, I I would feel much more comfortable revisiting that topic um when we're back in front of um >> yeah, >> their council and Andy. Um and then we can revisit what was stated in the last time, which I believe there wasn't too
much of an appetite for that. I understand. Um >> I didn't I didn't raise the question. Yeah, I just asked Andy. >> That's fine. No. And it's been brought up to me before and I I think it's worth revisiting that discussion. Happy to have it again. But >> we I mean
>> I think we probably shouldn't discuss any of the >> two three at a time. But >> weigh in, please. >> Yes, please. Thank you. Uh look, I just say that we should probably discuss this among with the applicant's attorney here only because this is their application. They're requesting
almost like the conditions set like this the board to consider and then the board can you know make suggestions back and forth that they can agree to or change their application but you without their kind of input I'm not sure why at this point >> why don't we do that
>> all right so can I get a motion to carry to 128 >> so moved >> second >> Jessica can you call the role please >> vice chair please >> this is this is going to the final meeting. >> We don't know. We don't
>> we can't I I can't >> predict >> predict >> but we have a list. >> We might have eight hours of public comment. >> No, I know. But in terms of all their >> testimony >> testimonies experts they can they come back with another expert or all the experts I mean it seems like all the experts have already um spoken.
>> I don't think all the cross-examination was completed yet. Was it >> by the opposition attorney? >> No, I don't I don't believe it was. >> Okay. But that if they were to bring another expert in, they'd have to >> and the opposition's going to have his own experts. >> Okay.
>> There's a plan. >> So, I think I think you know the answer to the question, >> but we we will try our best. >> Okay. Right. >> We can't we can't. >> Yeah. Yeah. If we can get there, we will try. I think it's in everyone's best
interest to try and wrap this up. Tom brings up a good point uh before the end of the year for various reasons. Okay, great. Um, Jessica, what business do we have? >> Wait, we have to vote on that. >> Oh, wait. Yeah, sorry. Uh, so did we get
a second? >> Yes. >> Okay. >> Vice Chair Zon? >> Yes. >> Mr. Yuko? >> Yes. >> Mr. Malay? >> Yes. >> Mr. Nelson? >> Yes. >> Miss Chief? >> Yes. >> Mr. Chantuli? >> Yes. >> Chairman Ly? >> Yes.
Okay. And then we have some resolutions for memorialization. >> Okay. >> Up first is 23 Baltus roll place zoning board application number ZB-25-2298. The eligible members to vote are chairman Lyz, Vice Chair Zan, Mr. Malay,
Mr. Nelson, Miss Chief, and Mr. Nearing. Could we get a motion? >> So move. >> Second. >> Thank you. Chairman Lyz. >> Yes. Vice Chair Zan, >> yes. >> Mr. Malay, >> yes. >> Mr. Nelson, >> yes. >> Miss Chief,
>> yes. >> Mr. Nearing, >> yes. >> Okay. And next up, we have 45 Edgewood Road, zoning board application number ZB-25-2301. The eligible members to vote are Chairman Lyz, Vice Chair Zon, Mr. Malay, Mr. Nelson, Miss Chief, and Mr. Nearing.
Could we get a motion? >> So, >> second. Chairman Leakett, >> yes. >> Vice Chair Zan, >> yes. >> Mr. Malay, >> yes. >> Mr. Nelson, >> yes. >> Miss Chief, >> yes. >> Mr. Nering, >> yes.
>> Okay. And then we have a corrective resolution for 44 Blackburn Road and 72 PR Prospect Avenue. That is the Oak Null School zoning board application number ZB-24-2234. Everyone is eligible. Could we get a motion?
>> So moved. >> And a second. Second >> vice chair on >> Yes. >> Mr. Yuko. >> Yes. >> Mr. Malay. >> Yes. >> Mr. Nelson. >> Yes. >> Miss Chief. >> Yes. >> Mr. Chantuli. >> Yes. >> Chairman Ly.
>> Yes. >> And there are no minutes for memorialization tonight. >> All right. Great. Can we get a motion to adjurnn? >> So moved. >> Second. All those in favor? I I
>> Thank you guys. Appreciate it.