Good evening and welcome to the August 4th, 2025 meeting of the City of Summit Zoning Board of Adjustment. My name is Miriam Zan and I'm the vice chair of the zoning board. Please rise and join us in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you. In accordance with New Jersey statute 104-10,
adequate notice of this special meeting has been provided to a newspaper of record and has been posted here in city hall. This meeting is a judicial proceeding. Any questions or comments must be limited to the issues that are relevant to what the board may legally consider in reaching a decision and
decorum appropriate to a judicial hearing must be maintained at all times. For the benefit of the interested public, this meeting is being livereamed to the city's YouTube page and also broadcast on Summit's government channel, which is Comcast 34 and Verizon channel 30. A transcript of this meeting
is also being taken using the video and audio. So, we need all speakers to use one of the microphones in the room. Please note that fire exits are to my right, your left, and at the back of the room where you entered. The city has a listening system to assist the hearing impaired. If anyone needs hearing
assistance, please obtain the system at the deis and return it thereafter. Miss Sans, please call the role of the members. Vice Chair Zan here. Mr. Yuko here. Mr. Malay here. Mr. Nelson here. Mr. Kieran
here. Miss Chief is excused. Mr. Feskins is expected but not yet present. Mr. Chantuli here. Mr. Nearing here. And Chairman Ly is excused. Do you have a quorum? You may proceed. Thank you. Andy Ball is the zoning board's attorney. Mr. Ball advises board members
on matters of law and is the key interface with an applicant's attorney. Mr. Ball does not vote on the applications. Jessica Sans is a city employee and is our zoning board secretary. Our board secretary works with applicants on preparing their applications, planning our agendas, and
keeping our meeting minutes. The board secretary also does not vote on the applications. Also present are our experts who are hired annually by the board to provide input. Tonight we have Marie Rafé from Collier Engineering and also present is Ed Snikis from Burgess
Associates, our board planner. These experts are seated at the table to the right of the board, the public's left. They do not vote on the applications. Our board consists of se seven regular members and up to four alternates. All members can participate in the hearings tonight, but a maximum of seven can
vote. Most applications require a simple majority to be approved. Before we enter executive session to vote on the application, you will be advised how many votes are required. Each case will begin with the applicants or their attorney giving an overview of the
application process to date and the variances that are required. We then hear from any additional expert witnesses the applicant may have to help explain the application and why the variances are needed. The board experts followed by board members may ask
questions of the applicant, their attorney, and expert witnesses. Due to recent cases running excessively long, we strongly encourage applicants and their experts to give brief and concise testimony so that we get to as many cases as possible in a given evening.
Once the board members and the board professionals have completed their questioning, the public will have an opportunity to ask questions. This is not the time to tell us what you think about this case. That opportunity comes at the end of the hearing. Please be careful as to how you phrase your questions. They should not be proceeded
with a statement about the case, but should be a direct question to the witness. Also, before you ask your questions, please clearly state your name, spell your last name, and provide your address. It is important that our court reporter be able to keep clear and accurate public record. After all
witnesses have been heard, members of the audience will have their second opportunity to speak. And at that time, you may express your opinion, positive or negative, about the application. Then the public hearing is closed and we enter into executive session where the board members discuss the case and vote.
You will be able to listen to our executive session, but you will not normally be able to participate in our discussion. Uh, I ask that each applicant and or their attorney, if present, come up and give a brief synopsis of their anticipated testimony tonight, including the number of
witnesses and whether or not they can finish the presentation within 30 minutes. Um, and I guess before we do that, we just want to make note that we are um not hearing the case for 80 Elm. Um, that one has been moved to October
6. So, uh, can we first hear from 475 Springfield? Hi, good evening. Hillary Als from Dempsey Dempsey and Sheen representing the applicant 475 Springfield LLC. Um, we have four witnesses tonight and I would say it's probably going to be
about 45 minutes. Um, but, uh, we will wait for Mr. Feskins uh, so that way we can have seven members hearing us. So, if the other application wants to go first, if he's not here, that's fine. Okay. And so then we have 25 Essex Road.
Yeah. I guess we will start with 25 Essex. We don't assuming um how long do you think your application's going to be? Um I'm Jack Kelly. I'm their architect. I'm here with Mr. and Mrs. Oor and I'm the only witness. Um so I would say 20 to 25 minutes.
Great. Okay. Thank you. Um could use a chair and I will swear the applicant in if you could each raise your right hand. Do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matters the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth?
Yes. Yes. And one at a time, please state your name. Spell your last name. Celia Oor. O R O U R K E. James Oor. O R O U R K E. Thank you.
You want to spare me in or uh we'll do that once we get to you. So, if you want to get started, give us an overview of the application. Okay. Um my husband and I along with our three kids, uh we have an eighth grader and twins that are in sixth grade. All
actually going to be at the Summit Middle School in September. We are looking to make some improvements to our house. Um, first we'd like to improve our kitchen, just really integrate it better into the flow of our
house. Um, currently we have no mudroom. So, our kitchen family eating area kind of also serves as our mudroom, which is challenging at times with the soccer, hockey, lacrosse, sports equipment. So,
we're looking to make those improvements to our house. Um, we're also looking to currently our driveway runs from the front to the back of our property and curves around across our entire backyard to our detached garage, which is up
against our two neighbors fences in the back corner. Um, we would like to remove some of that, remove that asphalt and reclaim a lot of that for our backyard. um area currently. The way the driveway
is, it's our garage is unusable because backing down the driveway is so difficult. So, we always park our cars in the driveway. Um, we also see it as a safety issue when we back out of our we're kind of
right on we're on Essex right at the corner of Witridge and when we back out of our driveway um we're backing we're very close to the corner where there is a four-way stop sign. Unfortunately, not everybody always
feels the need to stop. Um, so we've run into, you know, kind of a safety issue up there at times because we're so close um to that corner. So, in the plans, we would move our our
driveway would be moved further away from that corner. Um, and that's I think the the gist of the of the improvements that we're looking to make it
and we'd be removing the detached garage um, which is up in the corner. Any questions for the applicants? Yeah, just one. You can leave it for your architect if you want. I mean, but it really has nothing to do with the design of the house. Did you read the forester's comments?
Uh, yes, Mr. Linton. Yeah, I had actually been in touch with him separately aside from this because we had an issue with a tree on our property. So, I had met with two tree companies and they while they were looking at that, we kind of had them
walk the property and both of them um flagged the two large beach trees that are in between our house and the house next door. One of which is is beyond saving
uh and the second one is not in good shape also. So their recommendations were that we had to remove both trees. I reached out to Mr. Linson to get his opinion on the whole thing and he said
because he ca and he came by and we had a email conversation and because of the um the one tree is not able to be saved and because the way these trees have grown they're two very large trees and because they've been growing alongside
each other for so long they basically have to be considered as one tree and we actually have to remove both of them unfortunately and aside from any of this project and he also has a suggestion for some um
replacement landscaping along the property line of lot 18. Um so I think we might want to get a plan for that as a condition if that's yes we definitely plan we we planted the there's currently screening there now
that we planted because we wanted the privacy from our neighbors. So, we will definitely be working on that. Okay. All right. Um, and would we want to see a full a landscaping plan be submitted,
Mr. Yuko? Well, I I don't plan necessary, but some general description or because he's he's Mr. Lson is definitely looking for something. So, something would be acceptable to him. Okay. And is that acceptable as a condition of
the application getting in touch and seeking approval of the city forest? Absolutely. Screening. Yeah, I'll continue the conversation that we've that we're already having now. Are there any members of the public here for this application? So, no questions from the public then.
Um, so then if there are no more questions from the board, we can move on to the architect. Mr. Kelly, do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matters, the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth. And please state your name. Spell your last name. Jack Kelly L. And I know you've appeared before us a
number of times, including recently. Any changes to your credentials since the last time you were here? Any questions from the board? I imagine they will accept you back once again. Thank you. Thanks for hearing our case. Just to just put a pin on that landscape
plan, there's a patio in the backyard. So, we're going to develop I'm not, but someone's going to develop the landscape plan for the property, including the screening with their neighbor and uh the garage is coming down in the back. So, we'll have to do something there and there's going to be a patio. So,
there'll be there'll be a landscape plan we'll file that. Okay. So, we are the O works, as you know, we're on 25 Essex Road. The house is located in the R25 zone and their lot area is 20,074.
So they are about 5,000 square ft shy of the standard for our 25 which causes one of the variances. Uh the project consists of an addition mostly in the rear on the right side of the house for an enlarged kitchen, a new mud room and
a new twocar garage attached garage. As Celia remove the existing nonconforming detached garage that's in the back. Um, it is too close to their neighbor. So, it's non-conforming in two ways. It's too close to their neighbor. It's only 3 ft from the neighbor. Neighbors
everyone. And it's too small. It's too narrow. Um, you you would be hardressed to get two cars in there and get out of your car. So, as she said, they don't use the garage at all. Um, it would involve driving across their backyard.
You the site plan, which is right here. Um, for some reason, the driveway is on the left and the garage is on the right, which makes no sense. So, they're driving across their, well, they don't, but you could drive across their rear yard to get to this garage, and then you have to back out all the way across the
yard and down and out onto the street. So, we want to solve that problem by attaching the garage to the house, number one, moving the driveway to the right side of the property, and we're going to create backup space so that they can make a
safe turn and they can drive out. Also, it's so much more convenient to have a attached garage so you can come in the house as she mentioned. Also, we're at the mud room. So, the sequence works from garage to mud room, kitchen to the rest of the
house. Um, and then as I said, there's a patio in the backyard which is which is so we're here for two variances. The first one is sideyard combined where you add the left side yard and the right side together
and you divide it by lot width. If you look at the site plan on B1 you'll see that the shape of the block um is own the trapezoid both property lines the left and the right both taper in from the front to the back. Um when you
calculate lot width um in summit you measure it at the front yard the line of the front yard set back not the street but the line of the front set back and that distance is 138 ft. So you the rule
is you take 40% of the 138 that gives you 55.5 total side yards. So the left and the right should add up to 55.5. We're a little bit of that we're providing 49.5.
So we have 24 ft on the left and 25 ft on the right. The minimum setback in this zone is 17 ft. So we're well above that, but due to the shape of the property, uh the combined sideyard mass doesn't work.
The original house complies, but where we are at in the rear, the lot is just is much narrow. In reality, um I have a drawing I want to show you in a second. The area that's you don't have this drawing, but I'll
leave it for Jessica. So, we will mark that as A1. Sorry, please don't. just so you can see. So we highlighted the area that is causing the variance in blue.
Um so it's kind of this triangular wedge I would say of the garage that is exceeding the sideyard combined. This is only 107 square ft of the house. So that is only 4% of the house. 96% of the
house. So this is space that so it's it's I think fairly insignificant and again it's it's a it's a it's a C1 variance where the shape of the lot
is causing I think the pluses outweigh the minuses there of attaching the garage tearing down an structure taking the driveway out of the rear yard putting the driveway on the other side of the house
and allowing them to drive forward. [Applause] Our second variance is for building coverage. Uh in this zone the maximum allow is 14%.
We are at 14.5% so which amounts to 101 square feet. I think 100 square feet on a 20,000 square foot lot is is fairly insignificant. And again, there's so
many positive aspects to this proposal. Uh that the 100 square ft I think could be could be the new garage we have sized appropriately so that they can put two cars in it and have some
storage for bikes and kids sports equipment and whatnot. So the new garage is is about 100 square feet of the one we are touched on now. It's a big improvement for them as well. And not only just taking the building
away from their neighbor, but giving them a nicer backyard without a driveway in the middle of it gives them an opportunity to have a nice living space. As Mrs. So mentioned they won't even use the garage because it's just completely. So I have some positive criteria and
sort of summary. The proposed additions and roof plants will blend perfectly with this house. It's a beautiful tutor house. It's over 100 years old. Um and we We've done a peaceful job to integrate the new work
into the context of the house. Number two, we're providing a storm water management system for all of the new roof areas, the new kitchen, the new garage and plus the engineer designed it so that um it will take the water from
the rear half of the original house. All the water from the middle of the house or the roof of the house down in the rear will be be taken into the storm intervention system as I mentioned. Number three, we're removing a non-conforming structure and we're removing a driveway which cuts
across the back. Number four, the new garage is sized appropriately for two cars whereas the current one is not. Number five, we are improving safety as Jim said uh by
moving the driveway away from the intersection of Widge. Um, as I said, an attached garage is preferable. If raining was coming, you can just pull your car in the garage and build the house.
And in summary, I think these are major improvements for for not only the buts and with two minor variances. Any questions from our board experts?
So, um um I just have a few clarifications. Um um is there do you know where the storm water from your roof leaders is going to right now? It's okay.
No. Um, I know there was a comment from I I think it goes out the Well, we have like some pumps going out to the driveway. No, but yeah, I think it it um it goes
down a pipe and there's two um pipes that go to the street. The house is old enough. Okay. So, they're um they're reducing their um their impervious coverage, but they're still putting in a seepage pit
and it looks like they're taking more than half of the um proposed lot house coverage that's going into that seepage pit. So, um you know, they're I looked over the calculations. They look like they're adequate. The whole house is not going into the seepage pit, but it is an
improvement over what was there before. And um I you know, it it looks like it's a it doesn't look like they're changing uh too many of the drainage patterns that are on site either. Looks like things going down to the street or still going down to the street. I don't I
don't see any uh see any problems with the drain on the property. Uh just some quick questions. You had offered the uh proofs based upon the hardship or the overall shape of the property. Yes, you were basing it on. Okay. Because
for Okay. Because the shape of the property itself is a trapezoid as you mentioned and it tapers towards the back. Therefore, you're measuring your lot width in the widest component of that lot and that caused the additional combined yard setback requirement. Is there any flexibility in the
architecture uh that why do you need that additional small sliver of space is it something where the efficiency of the kitchens and things of that nature it just becomes much more efficient in the arrangement of the building? I think so. Um we are actually eliminating
if you look at the existing conditions We are eliminating for dining room. Um you can also see from that drawing. So we're eliminating the formal dining room and making a kitchen. Um you'll see that
this sun room which is on the right is kind of its own its own element architecturally. It's panled. It has two stories. That that little piece on the right is all panled and it has lots of windows. a different element of the
house. So, we kept the kitchen, sorry, we kept the mud room and the garage tucked in that corner pointing at the door. So, we tucked the mud room in that corner. And um and then the garage
it's in. Okay. And you place the garage towards the back of the building as well. Yes. Okay. Um, again to improve the flow, you know, to get out of your car, where do you want to go next? And then go in the kitchen. And effectively, the movement of the
cars allows for a turnaround movement in the driveway compared to what they have today. Yes. A thousand%. Yes. Um, yes. With regard to just for the hardship and the offsetting of the negative impacts, um the applicant has
agreed to offer some landscaping I guess along the I was going to say the right hand side. I need a north arrow. Um that's I guess that's the southwest side and they'll be putting something in that. Yes, because the screening that's there will be coming out and the the screening
is important for the old works as well. So they're they're going to either either we do some sort of screening or fence or something just in order to screen the parking in the garage area. Yes, because it's driveway to driveway, right? And so again, it's important for them and their their neighbor.
Okay. Uh that's all the questions I have. Thank you. Questions from the board. I have How far is the driveway, the proposed driveway from the property line? Okay. Then because when I was over there
today, it was kind of hard to picture that. So you going to be able to safely put screening in two feet and contain it and all that other kind of stuff that goes. Well, it may be a fence. I don't know. It might be a fence. It may be a fence. Or we going to have a fence. Something that's going to grow taller.
Yeah. Uh and can the garage be reduced to 22 by 20? 20 feet deep as opposed to 22 feet deep. The average garage is what 20 by 20. Well, the standard in summit now is 20 ft in width.
That's why their current garage is 19 ft in width. Um because you say that that blue area is 100 square feet roughly 110 square feet. I mean I can't take 100 square feet out of the garage. Well, no, but if if you did 40, it's less of a less of a headache. you know,
two feet by 22 is, you know, 80 something, 84, 94. I guess if the board felt very strongly about it, I'm just curious. I think it's I think it's insignificant in in terms of what I said that 96% of the house complies.
If it's insignificant, then could you do it? It's insignificant numerically. Could you do it? Because then I would move the driveway further away or or you could maybe keep the driveway where it is but or make it n make it farther away from the property line so your neighbor
so the neighbor's not uh so impinged upon. Well again we were trying to give them some storage space for they have three kids that have bikes. They have you know you have a garage. Thank you.
Mr. Does anybody else have questions or not not really a question, but I I'm Can you sure? It's not an over garage. It's a pretty standard garage. Yeah. And that's really the point I wanted to make. I mean, it's not it's not that large a garage. And I think the point that Apple's trying to make is
that 100 square feet in the context of 20,000 square foot lot is a small difference. Whereas to take 40 square feet out of the garage, it'd be big big change for the garage. Correct. But it would it's not in the context of 20,000 square foot lot, it's not a 100 feet is not a big variance at all.
Also, one other thing, this this garage is 100 ft from the street. I mean, it's not invisible. I know I know people will see it when they drive by, but it's it's probably behind the main body of the original house. It's over 100 feet to the front corner of that garage.
And also the two foot setback for the garage, that's permitted. That's not for the driveway. For the for the driveway. I'm sorry. Driveway. Yeah. Mr. Naring, a couple questions and comments. Mr. Lson had a lot to say about the the
landscaping. And I think did we just agree that we're going to need either the drawn or written landscaping plan is going to satisfy M? We agree to that. Okay. Anyone else? I just I have uh two questions. What is
the width of the lot at the back of the property at the street? You said it was 138 ft. No, that's 138 ft is where you measure, right? Okay. And what is the what's the width
of the back of the property? I'm going to give you the front and the back. Looks like a 100. It's 100 in the back. And so just just curious if your whole lot and it's not what the setback requirement for would it still it would
still be it's 49.5 ft right for regardless of the lot width that's about is that right? No. This so what would be the setback the combined sideyard? Sorry not the setback if if the lot was 100 ft wide.
Yeah. I mean, this is based on I'm just curious because we're, you know, it's further back and I'm just wondering if there's any room here for some interpretation um in terms of where where you're actually falling with the combined
sideyard here because you have 49.5 ft, but what is the property width in that location? I'm just curious because it kind of feels like maybe maybe You know, there maybe there's more
sideyard than it than it appears. Like to your point about talking about it. You mean are you saying if I could measure this width of the lot there? Yeah. I'm just curious what would be, you know, what would be your combined sideyard.
It says the minimum is 49.5. What would it be sort of the average length of the lot if it was a rectangle? And and I guess while you're measuring that, my second question is given that you're two feet off the driveway. Um
I'm just wondering why the screening wasn't part of the plan. Um I just I I don't I don't I'm not super comfortable with we're probably going to put up a fence. I don't think there's any option besides a fence here because you only have two feet. And I don't think offense is bad screening,
but I I feel like this plan is is missing a an important component, which I I know you want to address sort of after the fact, but usually that's part of it. And I think that's um you know, that is important for the neighbors and I feel like that should have been part
of the plan. So if you want to I I just don't think we're going to see any plantings here in two feet. So at a minimum, we would have a fence. It it would be our our goal to have some sort of green. Um I know it's very small, but I you
drive around like some of these beach towns that have these tiny little lots and people like managed to get some green trees. We would work with we've worked with landscapes by Sharon. I don't know if you Yeah, we um for the the screening that's
there, we put in almost all of it. um all those all the arbor arborites and I worked with the landscaper to um figure out what fit there. We also looked at other stuff for the back fence and I looked at different variants of evergreens that would fit in smaller
spaces. So already had some ideas came up with this specific tree for that but and that's what we put in that wall of trees that goes up to that point and then hits the big trees. Yeah, we want the screening and and I think we're we're pretty, you know, I think we'd be
in sync with our neighbors, but I think um that that's our that's our plan. And again, at a minimum, it's the it's the fence, but um we worked pretty carefully with with a landscaper um to to put the existing screening in. We put it in, not
our neighbor. So, I mean, like I said, I have been in touch with Mr. regarding the trees as a separate and I will be happy to continue that conversation with him and make sure that what we're doing is is good with him.
There's something known as a living fence also. It's a fence within ivy. Yes. Some some kind of ivy or some sort of plant that grows the fence which is green on both sides.
So, so between the retaining wall and the property line that's 2 feet. Yes. Did you contact your neighbors and are they aware of your plans? Our neighbors. Yes.
We have a nice relationship with our neighbors. We've lived there for 10 years. Um, and don't live in a way that we want to make enemies with anybody next to us or in our neighborhood.
And we didn't have any negative feedback at all from anyone. And some real positive with taking down the garage and um feedback. We can answer your question. Sure. Thanks. If we take the lot width
at the rear of the house, the new rear of the garage where we're building the structure, it's 111 ft. You take 40% of that, it's 44 ft. So, yes, we're providing 49 and a half
if if I could measure it there. Right. Right. So, but you have to measure it in the front. But isn't there, no matter what the width is, is there a minimum you have to meet? Even if your yard's 500 feet wide, yet there's, excuse me, if it's 50t wide, still because it's an R25 zone, isn't there a
minimum you have to meet? You would have to have the set combined% 40%. Thank you. Any other questions? And just confirming, we don't have any public here, so no questions from the public.
Okay. Is there are there any closing. Any any other information before we go into executive session that you'd like to share? Um, like I said, we've lived in our house for 10 years. Um, we love our neighborhood. We love our house. Despite
the challenges of living in an old house, um, we love a lot of things about an old house. We're trying to just make some improvements that will kind of improve the flow and the way that we live. Um,
as Jack said, still keeping the the architecture, you know, going with the whole look of the house, um, the period of the house and paying attention that that we're doing it in a in a
graceful way maybe. Um, and like I said, we are not interested in making anybody around us upset or mad. We want the screening as much as our
neighbors do. We want we want privacy as much as our neighbors do. Um, we'd like to just kind of bring our house a little bit more modern. It's kind of
Still, the people before us made some improvements, but it really still has the layout of a house from 100 years ago. So, thank you. Um, and I guess we'll go into executive session right now. Anyone,
anyone want to start? Review the conditions. Yeah. Oh, yes. I'll just mention um we have C variances. So four votes are required to approve the application and we have two conditions. One is our usual compliance with the conditions noted in the board engineers memorandum and the second is
that the applicant shall submit a landscaping plan which shall specifically address screening along the southwest side and that that is correct. Right. Southwest side was the one that we were looking at. Yes. Okay. Um that shall be submitted to the
city forester for review and approval. Okay. All right. See, anyone want to start? I'll start. Okay. Um, overall, I think it's a it's a thoughtful plan. Um, you know, putting aside absence of the landscaping plan as
part of the package, which would have been very helpful, I think. Um, and taking a bit of a leap of faith on what that fencing would look, but absent, you know, no your neighbors not being here to to oppose it. Um, I can be supportive. I think you have a
pre-existing um or undersized lot and I think you're going to end up with much better flow and um improved safety for the lot. So, I can support it. Yeah, I I I agree. I mean, I I'm glad you agreed to the condition of the landscaping plan and I'd also like wish
we could know more details about the fence, but I'm sure we'll do something nice. Um, the design you're proposing, as has been noted, maintains the nature and character of the existing style of the home. Historic Preservation Commission approved the design. Um the heart there's a hardship created
somewhat by the shape and the size of the lot. It's small for the zone and the the shape makes it kind of an odd makes it kind of function as an even smaller lot because of the shape. Um and I'm happy you're addressing storm water management more than you need to. That's a good thing in Summit. We get a
lot of people who just barely do enough and we're never sure if it's going to make it worse. Even though it sounds like it won't, but you're you're doing more than you need to. Um, getting rid of the non-conforming detach detached garage is a major positive and also the safety issue of locating the driveway is
a major positive. So, I I can support it as well. Anyone else? Yeah, I I can support this also. Um, I think it's well designed. Um, there is a hardship with the size of the lot and
again like uh Tom said, removing the non-conforming garage is a good thing. and they've done done a good job on the storm water management. And I mean it's a little tight on the with the garage side, but
um I mean I mean 22 I I don't think is my garage is 24 and I have a Tahoe and you can it just about fits. So, so I think 22 is I would it's it's good design. So, I can
support it. I can support it. I think I agree with everything that Mr. Mr. Yuko said and especially like the idea moving that driveway away from it's a real safety issue. I think that's positive. So, I can certainly support this application.
Okay. Well, I would I would share my opinion, but I think we probably have heard enough to take a vote here. I'll move to approve. Anyone want to second? Second. Okay. Second. Vice Chair Zan. Yes.
Mr. Yuko. Yes. Mr. Malay. Yes. Mr. Nelson. Yes. Mr. Kieran? Yes. Mr. Chantuli? Yes. Mr. Naring? Yes. Motion carries. Yes.
Yes. Good luck. All right. Congratulations. Thank you very much. [Music] I do not and I did not know that Tom accusing himself. So [Applause] Um, we can take a moment.
Can we just take a couple minute break to try to reach our board members? Thank you. All right, we will reconvene here with 475 Springfield Avenue. And before we get started, I'll just note obviously we're down to six
members. We were expecting seven. So, we will proceed, go through any testimony, um, and if it does get to the point where we're able to vote this evening, it'll be the applicant's decision on whether they want to vote or whether they would like to carry it until the next meeting when we will have a false
board for that vote. Perfect. Thank you. Okay. Uh, good evening. Hillary SS from Dempsey Dempsey and Sheen representing the applicant 475 Springfield LLC and the prospective tenant protected tomorrows regarding property located at
475 Springfield Avenue block 1911 lot 3 in the CRBD zone. As you will hear in greater detail during the presentation, Protected Tomorrows is a specialized educational and advisory organization that assists individuals with special
needs, their families and caregivers. Protected Tomorrow is seeking a use variance to operate on the first floor of the existing building at 475 Springfield Avenue. The proposed use is a compelling use that is multifaceted with aspects of the
many permitted uses in the CRBD such as personal service, instructional, financial, and retail sales and services. It is also a use that can be universally considered of value to the community because it fundamentally serves the
public good and promotes the general welfare. The presentation tonight will begin with Mark Jagger, the developer and owner of the property, followed by Aaron McCann, a representative of Simplicity Group, Mary Anne Ellert, founder of Protected
Tomorrows, and concluding with the planner, Paul Griel. Uh, if there's any questions, I'm happy to answer them or um I can call the first witness. Any questions? No.
Okay. uh Mark Jagger. And if you could raise your right hand, do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matter? Is the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? I do. And please state your name. Spell your last name. Mark Jagger. Ye A ge rer. Thank you. Thank you. Um and what is your relationship to the
property at 475 Springfield Avenue? I am the owner and developer of the building. Um, did you as the owner file the application that is currently before the board on behalf of the prospective tenants simplicity protected tomorrows? Yes, I did.
Um, and can you give the board a brief background of the property and how this application came to be before the board? Certainly. Um, I had the uh pleasure to be in front of this board about two years ago seeking the original site plan application for the 475 uh Springfield
Avenue office redevelopment. um that work has been completed. Uh I was fortunate throughout the process of uh having gone through the planning and the entitlements and then eventually the construction of um meeting the folks
from Simplicity Group which was a Summitbased financial services company. uh and uh they relocated within Summit to the 475 Springfield Avenue building and occupied this past March and April uh all of what we refer to as the office
space uh at 475 Springfield um which is uh all of the permitted use space as we've been discussing. Uh, Simplicity approached me a few months ago to ask um whether or not we would work with them
in uh considering uh having this protected tomorrow's affiliate affiliated group um occupy the remainder of the building which is the space that's the subject of this application tonight. Um I thought it was
a very compelling use. Uh I thought in my interpretation and my understanding of the use that uh it would be permitted under the current zoning definitions for permitted use in the CRBD. Um I approached uh the zoning officer to have
a conversation about it. Um and it was his interpretation that it was not permitted uh as per the definition of retail sales in the CRBD. He didn't really comment on any of the other types
of uh areas of use of this uh proposed tenant. um as as Hillary pointed out uh whether it be institutional education uh all types of other services that they provide uh families with special needs
uh children. Um so his suggestion was given that he in that initial discussion and a subsequent discussion and meeting that we had with simplicity group uh representatives themselves that we bring the matter forward to the to the board
of adjustment as so that's what brings us here this evening. Excellent. And are there any changes to the building contemplated as a result of this use? No. Okay. Um I don't have any other questions.
questions from our experts? No, I have nothing. Uh, just a quick question. You had mentioned that you felt it might be a permitted use. From what standpoint did you feel that there was a permitted use? When I read through all of the different criteria that met the permitted use
standard in the CRBD zone, I thought there were several elements of it that were consistent with what my understanding was to protected tomorrow's uh business platform was. um whether it be education, whether it be
um sales and and and some retail elements, um some element of financial services, etc. that when you look at all the different standards, I thought there were elements of the business plan and the business program that that met could could be
defined certainly as meeting some of those when the zoning officer, you know, respectfully disagreed. Just regarding the overall outline of your testimony that's going to be offered through the various experts, are you going to be defining that a little bit more as far as what their overall scope of services are?
The board. Okay. Thank you. Yep. And then um our planner will go through each of those. Okay. Thank you. No further questions. Sure. Any questions from the board? No. Is there any public here regarding this?
So, no questions from the public. Okay. So, we can Okay. Uh I do have one question. Oh, sure. Is their building fully occupied and this is the only space that's unoccupied right now? That's correct. Okay. Uh the next witness is Aaron McCann.
If you can raise your right hand. Good evening. Do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matters the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? I do. And please state your name. Spell your last name. Yeah. Aaron McCann. MCC an Thank you. Um, what is your occupation
title and by whom are you employed? Um, so I'm employed by the Simplicity Group. I'm a partner, I'm an executive member, I'm a board member of of the Simplicity Group and I manage the wealth division. And what is Simplicity's relationship to the property?
So, um, currently we're a tenant of the property utilizing the office space as described by Mark. And are you authorized to speak on behalf of Simplicity? Yes. Um and then can you just tell the board the connection between simplicity and protected tomorrows and why the
proposed use was one simplicity wanted to be associated with? Sure. Um so first uh as Mark mentioned um Simplicity is a financial distribution business. We support independent uh insurance agents and independent financial adviserss across
the country. Uh we acquired um Protected Tomorrows in 2024. Um, and we're deeply committed to supporting its mission, um, both its continued success and its future growth. Um, the more I've learned about Protected Tomorrows and the work that
they do, the more excited I am to to present the opportunity for the town that that I that I reside in. Um, I've lived here since 2003. Um, I would I would tell you that Protected Tomorrows offers, you know, vital education and planning services to
families and caregivers uh with individuals that have special needs. Um, it's a dramatically underserved market. Uh, we we are building out the team as aggressively as we can to meet that demand. Um, and we're looking to um
serve folks not only in New Jersey but across the country. Um I think bringing protected tomorrow to summit you know will help us address you know some of the critical need. Um but I expect that it will become like a tremendous asset for our community. Um you know we
provide invaluable support and resources to families who desperately need like specialized guidance. Um establishing the site and summit will make our town you know more vibrant, more inclusive um and really supportive place for people to live and and to visit. So, I'm super
excited. I can't wait for you to meet Maryanne. It's it's as compelling of an opportunity as as I've seen in 30 years on financial services. So, very excited about it. I don't have any more questions. Questions from our experts? I have no questions.
Um just you had mentioned that you provide support for and if I'm mis uh stating this please correct me support for financial insurance groups or you actually provide those types of services or advice to your actual clients. So the
majority of our business is a wholesale business where we we are um kind of we have affiliated agents and advisers that leverage our services um to to do their job. Uh in the case of Maryanne, it's a
unique um and differentiated offering because they are a retail organization. They're supporting you know community members themselves. Maryann will describe um you know the uh you know some of the the the data around the area
and the need for this. Um but there's an opportunity to work with nonprofit organizations as well as corporate benefit programs. Um so it's it's wide you know the opportunity set is is large. No further questions. Any questions from the board?
What percentage of that 147475 do you occupy now? Uh 100 100%. Yeah. Why do you feel you need a floor space? Just because approximate the rest of your business or you need a No. Um Maryanne will describe in greater
detail, but access first floor access is incredibly important given the the nature of the people we're serving. Um just I just have a question about I there so Simplicity Group is the parent company of um protected
protected tomorrows. Um and so basically essentially you're here because you want to subleasase like almost you know this two protected tomorrows as opposed to just having protected tomorrows come in and they have
they're also here. She's the RX. So, um, Simplicity is here to explain why, um, how they they got involved with protected tomorrows and why, um, why they're bringing them into summit and then she'll explain why this is the
right location for this type of use. Okay. Thank you. And just a reminder to all our board members, to everyone, please speak directly into the microphone. We've had the uh, request for that reminder this evening. Okay. Okay. So, the the um the next
witness is Mary Anne Ellert. If you could raise your right hand, do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matter, the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? I do. Please state your name, spell your last name. Maryanne Ellert. E H L E R T. Thank you. Okay. Um and what is your occupation
title and by whom are you employed? I am a financial professional as special needs coordinator. Um I was the founder of protected tomorrows. I'm a partner of Simplicity Group. And I are you authorized to speak on behalf of Protected Tomorrows? Yes, I am.
And can you share with the board what protected tomorrows is and what they do? I'd like to give you a little background of how it um how protected tomorrows came about and what we do and I think that's critical to understanding who we serve. So I am a sister, a mother and a
daughter of dis special needs family members. Um I grew up with a sister who was four years younger than me. At the age of six my parents sat me down and said your sister has cerebal palsy and you will be her caregiver forever and that was I thought the one most wonderful thing that happened to me
because I didn't know what that meant at the time. Um, but as time went on, I grew into a professional in the financial industry. Over 20 years in the mer mergers and acquisitions business around the country and then at one point I married someone with three little
boys. They had disabilities. Um, he felt it was beyond him and so he left me with the three little boys and I became a mom of children with specialties. As my parents age, I also became a caregiver for my parents for the last 20 years of their life. So
at the point when I became the mom of these three boys, I realized I couldn't be traveling around the country doing my business in the acquisition business. So I started a company like my own to to help families who had special needs family members
make it in the world. It's compelling. It was um listening to family stories and realizing that this was going to make a difference on the planet from my perspective. So my original mission statement was to help everybody on this planet who has a special need um rich or
poor and that's where we started one family at a time. We work with families who have special needs children be it developmental disabilities. It could be down syndrome could be autism. We work with people with mental health issues. We work with um spouses who may have um
L Garri's disease or Huntington's disease. You name it, we will work with those families. will help them a be happy and secure and as well as being safe and that's our main mission. But what happens is it's not just about the
person with the disability. It's entire family and so we need to make sure because the parents and the caregivers are critical to these families, right? They have to make sure they're financially secure. They've got to make sure they're taken care of into the future. So what we do today is we help
families. It might be a spouse. It might be parents. But it's typically parents who have a child who could be at any point in stage of their life. So many times families are coming to us and telling us their child has an issue and they're looking for a doctor. Sometimes
it's somebody who's coming to us and their child's going into school and they don't understand the school system and how do they work with that school system. It could be someone who is their child's in the school system and they're reaching the age of 22 and
they're going to be leaving school. And the parents at that point are like, "Okay, now what?" Right? Everybody I meet, no matter where I'm at, knows somebody who has somebody with a special need. It could be mental
illness. It could be our spouse. It could be our child. It could be our grandchild. So as we started to work with families and our off our main offices when we were I was with protected tomorrows only I was in a suburb of city of Chicago and we would
work with people and help them just guide them. We provide personal services to them to help them be whatever they need us to do. So it might be stepping in and help them find a secure environment. It might might be helping to put a plan in place. But typically
what we're doing is creating a future care plan for that person with a special need and we're helping the family make sure that that person is safe for the rest of their life. It's a journey. It's never no one family wants the same thing. So people are coming to us and
looking for us to help them through that planning process. For a family that's in that situation, if you could think about it, it's it's difficult. So you have a child who you don't know if they're going to make it
without you. And so when people come to us, the first thing they say is, "What's going to happen when I'm gone?" It's sometimes I get emotional about it because I have still have three boys, two of them who need support. Uh my sister passed away at the age of 39 from
a seizure in her sleep. And so it's personal. And as over time we found that more and more families are in this situation and they want to meet with us personally and help them through that process. So we take them one step at a time. We help
them with their life planning. We find services. We help them apply for government money. We'll get them SSI. We'll help them get Medicaid. We'll help them get whatever service they need. We'll find count services. We'll put a care plan in place. But once a care plan
is in place, we need to work with the whole family. So we help the family do their financial planning. We help them put in place their estate planning. We help them find attorneys. We help them find whatever they need to be okay. Now,
in our in my business, in the financial business at at the time, there's no training. So when you're working with a financial adviser, they don't know what a special needs trust is. They don't know what a group home is. and they don't know that that child with special needs cannot have more than $2,000 in
their name or they could lose all the funding that they get from the government. So, we're an educational organization. We go out to schools and we teach at the schools. We help families as they come to us one-on-one. We will help parents who are um up to
their um eyeballs in fear and they're looking for clarity. Now, when I first started doing this, we've been doing this for 35 years. When I first started doing this, I would talk to families one-on-one.
And here we are 35 years later, and I still hear the same questions. Every family gets afraid. They're unsure of where the next step is going to, you know, what the next step is going to be. And so, we hold their hand. We become a personal support to that family. And now
as some of those families I've been working with for 35 years, they're coming to us and they're are going, "Okay, now I'm 85 and is our plan going to work?" So we're becoming more and more involved those families and we're educating the next
generation. So in my case, I have three sons, three stepsons now. Two need care. Who's going to do it for them? Their other brothers not. So now we are starting to form and find organizations around the country that we can partner
with that will become guardians for those people that will be able to be caregivers into the future. And that's just a journey that every family goes on. You don't know when your child's born and you hope they're going to be healthy. You don't know if they're
going to be in an accident. You don't know if your spouse's going to be diagnosed with Lug Gerri's disease or whatever. There's just a multitude of diseases. And so helping those families one-on-one is critical. Nobody's the
same. So the way we operate is we have we have many different ways we get in touch with people. A I'll speak at national disability groups. We go into the school systems. We partner with the schools. So in the school system here
you have about 4,000 children in the schools. 450 of them have disabilities. Those 450 families are looking for help. We have people in Summit who are our customers today. We
have um I looked at our database. We have a thousand people around this whole big area that have reached out to us. And we won't help just people with wealth. We will help people no matter who they are. So, we have
found a way to help people with less dollars. We have helped people I have clients with 50 million and people with 50 cents. I don't care. When I started this, I said we're going to help every family. And we do. We have found we have a parent university where people can
just come online and listen to us and get help. We have a hundred people in this area who are connected to us through the parent university program that we run. When people contact us, they say to us
all the time, I wish you were closer to us. And so I've been lucky enough to be involved with simplicity that now we can do that because my mission is to help any family who needs help. We can work with the school districts and go in and
help them understand at the school level because they they have transition programs. children here with special needs can stay in school till they're 22 years old. What after that? Do you think the parents really understand what they need to do because when their child turns 18,
they've got to apply for Medicaid. They've got to apply for SSI. They don't know how to do it. They can't find attorneys. They can't find the resources. We do that for them. We will hold their hand. We will help them get those services. And we will give those
parents peace of mind that that child's going to make it and be happy and successful. It might be in a group home. It might be staying at home with siblings. But what we also know is when parents think about it, they don't
always want to give siblings that responsibility because it's it's life-changing. Okay, so schools is one place. The other thing we know is companies have employees and companies want their
employees working and present. So imagine if you're an employee and you get the phone call while you're at work there. Your child's at school having a seizure. Are you present? or you're at work and you get the phone
call that your mom who has dementia is walking down the middle of the highway. Are you present at work? So, we go to those companies and we become a resource. So we can go into the companies in your community and help
them understand that we can help their employees stay to work. One and two that we can help people with disabilities work and have jobs. There's many types. When you think about disabilities, there's many types. There's disabilities you have not heard
of. Clestra syndrome, Angelman syndrome, the typical ones, Down syndrome and autism you've heard of. There are thousands of rare diseases that children can be successful in life. They just need a dream team to put around them to
make sure that as parents age, these children can grow up and have successful lives. So, we also partner with not forprofits. So, we are partnered now with Angelman Syndrome. We're working with Special
Olympics in Illinois and we they intend to work with us around the country. So when a family comes to us and they need those kinds of resources, we'll have access to that. Um the epilepsy foundation many have reached out to us now and so that's the importance of
simplicity to me because I was working in office and our office is not an office. So the interesting thing about what we do is I ran it out of my home for many years and one of my um significant clients who has us working
with two of his children with disabilities said never lose this flavor of your business. Coming to your home made all the difference to me because going into an office didn't feel like I was going to get what
I needed. And this was somebody who is a CEO of a major corporation. He wasn't somebody who was looking for a handout. He said, "I need help." And his advice to me was, "As you grow, make sure that you're in the community and you're in an area where people can walk in to see you
without an appointment and know that the people you have behind at the counters can help families. And it's not an office, it's a home. people come to us in our office to our uh positions that
we have now in Lincolnshshire Illinois and when they leave they've been working with us families stay with us they've been with us for 35 years and they come and they say this feels this is the place where we feel the most safe and
you've helped our h family be able to know that in the future our child's going to be okay. But the other thing they do when they come and visit us is they go to lunch and they go to get a haircut or they go to the beauty shop because we're helping them find a normal
life. And so, um, if you have any questions, I'm happy happy to answer them. In your community though, you have people here looking for help already. And we would be honored to be able to do that and help your community be more inclusive, to help your schools, to help
your companies, and to bring the people together. So, I I just have a quick question to kind of go along with what you were just talking about. Why um then is this location um and on the ground floor so important to protect us?
Families are afraid to plan. Somebody's we were asking some families. We did an inquiry on some families and so why don't you plan? They said, "Well, if I do it, I might I might have to die. I'd be ready to die." That's it's truly the comments we get. But going someplace to
ask for help is scary. going to an attorney office. I mean, the number there's a very small number of special needs attorneys who even know what a special needs trust is. So, they're at risk. These families are at risk because CPAs don't know how to do
this. Um, the attorneys don't there aren't a lot of attorneys who do this work. They're afraid to go to an environment where there's going to be offices, especially a lot of the families don't want to go into an office and get help. They want to go into an area where they
can walk in. A lot of people are in wheelchairs. They want it to be accessible. And so it's important to be we want to be in the communities where we can be very very accessible to families at a first floor. They walk into a into a city and they see us and they will come in and talk to us.
And they can also see you through the window. They're going to see an inviting seating area kind of a right. We can make all of our offices have been designed to be like a home. And so they come in, they're sitting with us. they can have a conversation. If we need a private area, we'll have a private area. And it's easily recognizable, easy
identifi easily identifiable if you know they're they're driving and obviously they're stressed out and they're trying to find where they need to go. Um there's handicap accessible parking in the area. Yes. Right in front. And we also have maintained the name Protected Tomorrows
because we do have a brand. People know that what it means. And so we're protected tomorrow's a simplicity company versus the other way around because people have recognized Protected Tomorrow is now be a service that they um really want access to.
Um and how many employees um would you have in this location at any given time? I would expect we'd have three to five people as employees. um our groups are to work together and they the people we have in the offices in a local community like this would be a special needs
coordinator. All of our employees at the entire organization have either worked in an organization that supports a disabled or we have family members ourselves. Um and in general, how many clients are usually um anticipated on the site at a given time?
At one time we'll usually have one family, maybe two. depends how many that if we have two special needs coordinators and once in a while we'll have we have family meetings. So not only do we eat with the the mom and dad of a child, we have the child with them and we also in grandma and grandpa because everybody needs to understand
what needs to get done in these situations. And your hours of operation 8:30 to 6 and we also work by appointment because we recognize a lot of people can't come during work hours. So you have appointments and walk-ins? Yes. Um Monday through Friday, but you
accommodate outside of those hours. Yes. And on Saturdays. Okay. Um and what about is there any signage proposed? Um I think there's signage proposed, but it hasn't I mean it's in the works. Um and it will conform to the ordinance, right? Yes, of course. I don't have any other questions.
Okay. Questions from our board experts? Um could you just elaborate on that um the ADA spots that are outside the building? How many are there? So, so if I could just jump in, they're actually um they're across the street right
outside the tier garage. Okay. And then there's also two in the shopper lot on Woodland. Um and then there's obviously on on street parking right in front. Okay. Um you've indicated you provided the uh sort of financial services or
guidance for caregivers and also possibly the individuals themselves that might need this. Um also you had indicated educational is it really just educational as to the financial aspects of managing? Um
no the educational part is learning about what an IEP is in school. It's learning about what um a special needs trust might be and what you should expect. it'll be educating the rest of the family because they're going to become caregivers. So, we educate, you
know, we help families write these little things. So, one example, we have a a young woman who became in charge of her brother who's disabled. Her parents passed away. It's her job. There's money
in the trust. There's everything else. Everything's in place. And she came to me and she said, "I'm so mad at my mother." She says, "I'm so mad at my parents." She says, "They did everything, but they didn't tell me where to buy buy my brother's pants." It's a true story.
Her brother has autism. He needs Velcro pants, and he doesn't like scratchy pants. They can't find them anywhere. That's what we do. And that's educating parents as to how to write the story about this person you're going to leave behind. And educating the siblings as to
those minutiae things because that's what makes life better. So where to get resources and things of that natur and you have quite a few um resources in the area and there's many surrounding you as well. Um it was mentioned before too that
retail was part of your activity. Can you describe that? So the other thing that we do is we help we provide hope to parents and many parents help especially the dads form businesses around special
needs and there's John's socks and John is a disabled person and he makes socks and we help provide those kind of materials in our facilities. Um there is a company not too far from here. It's a division of people within Special Olympics and they take um leftover
scraps of material and they make purses and they are sold and help support those organizations. So we will be able to provide those all those things from around the country available to people to purchase as well. I think you've answered the question regarding the need for the first floor space. It's more for accessibility.
Yes. Um for your clients. That's part of it. The other is just um not only accessibility, but being in front of them in face. They're not going to go into a a building and look around for a space. They're going to say, "Oh," because remember, it's so compelling to
them to not want to do this. It just is. And so once they get there, you want them in the door. You want them helping and not being like, "I have to get an elevator. I have to go through this space." We find that the most important thing we can do for them is be easily accessible. Not just from a physical perspective, but an emotional
perspective as well. And I think I've heard through the cross examination or the test direct examination was that you'll keep the windows open and it'll be a viable storefront in the standpoint of people seeing inside the building. Yes, we want them to see inside. We want
them to know what's happening and see materials that have to do with um the kind of things that we can provide. Yeah. No further questions. questions from the board. Yeah, I I just have a question about um
the hours of operation. Um I think you said it was 8 to 6. 8 8:30 to 6 is our typical hours, but we do work by how how um it sounds like you could have appointment hours all hours of the night
after six o'clock. How how does that work? That would be somebody making an needing to make an appointment because you know sometimes people have crisis modes they need to talk to us about and they want to come in. I'm trying to get an idea on how often something like that would take place. I mean most most of the retail businesses
in town you know they close six six o'clock. Um we we just want to be available and so if somebody called and said um I'm working and I really need your services. I want I don't want to turn them away. So we would make an appointment with them but it would be by appointment. We don't keep the we don't keep the lights
on all night. We would do it by appointment after those hours after typical working hours. But you can't can you give me an example of how how it goes how you do it now? Like how how often you say does something like that happen? Once a month. Once a month.
It's not that often. Once in a while it'll happen in a phase of of um I think during COVID it happened a little higher where people wanted to come to see us because there was crisis having to do with that. But typically it might be once a month. Yeah.
Just a couple. Um, a little troubled about the locations of the uh, ADA spaces. How do you envision someone who needs some access to get across the street from in front of the parking garage? Now, I haven't I haven't been able to walk the property, but I there probably
are curb cuts, I would expect, in that area. So, they'd have to walk down to the crosswalk and come across. Yeah. But if they're in a wheelchair, they typically can get around. We have do have people who many of our people aren't physically disabled. They are developmentally
disabled and I would say um 80% of the people we see are not in wheelchairs. Okay. And then um for your financial services are you would you be referring them to your parent company who would then refer them to people who associate with the business or do you do all that yourself?
We do all we do our total we do total packaging ourselves. So you don't you don't refer it. We have a teams we work in teams. We have social workers working with a financial person side by side. Okay. And do you um when you say educational
services, do you see yourself doing educational um seminars at this location? We would do small groups here. If we're going to do a large group, we probably would do it. We're doing those in the school. The school's inviting us to come in and do them. We would do small groups of a family. If we found four families
who wanted to talk to us together, sometimes they would come in and do that. And would that be during those normal business hours or would that be on a Saturday, Sunday outside of normal business hours? When a group comes in, it depends. If it's a group of a family, two or three families that will usually be doing
normal work work hours. But if the school say the school wanted to come in and bring in 10 stu 10 of the families or something where there would be 10 parents, that's usually on a Saturday afternoon. Would that would be on this location or in their school? No, that would be on this location where
we'd have maybe 10 people in the in a room. Okay. The bigger groups with the schools will invite us to go into their transition programs. Those are usually in the evenings where we're going into the school and they they run those typically. The schools run transition working with the summer school system or not?
Um, not yet. I do have several clients already in this town that we're working with, but not in the schools yet. And I uh Maybe you don't know the answer to this question. Maybe maybe one of the other witnesses can answer. There used to be a small parking area in the back of the
building. Does that still exist? I didn't walk back there. Yes, it exists, but um there's no handicap accessibility from the back. I was looking for a back door to this. The back door goes downstairs. Yep. Okay. So, the main So, they would all use the in right in the front. And again,
there's on street parking right right in front of this building. We know how the parking is in Summit. I'm a little concerned about well there's the shoppers lot and then there's the tier garage all in close park. I'm not saying the additional park I'm just worried about right you know somebody needs a spot and they can't if they need an ADA spot and they
and we knew that there were people coming we even will go out and help them. So if we know somebody's coming in who needs access who needs accessibility but I will say that still a very huge number of our people people in wheelchairs
um aren't necessar they're physically disabled but they can live work and they can live and that's a much smaller percentage of the people that we see and and maybe you can't answer this question but when you get a delivery of supplies I don't know what you need papers you know staples whatever where
do you anticipate there maybe this is for somebody else along the I I think it would be typical to any other office, you know, any other retail, personal service, anybody else getting a delivery in CRBD. Y um I have a couple questions. Um what um
how far radius do you expect to draw from? You you referenced other offices. I don't know how many offices you have around the country, but there was some reference to sort of a a large draw. I would say we know that there's a large population here. Right? We're just not
going to come at the same time. But we have people in our Chicago office will drive an hour or two hours to come and see us, right? Because we we are the only company in this country that does what we do at this level. There's people who there's the ARC here of Union
County. We work very closely with ARCs. They actually bring us in to speak for them to their participants and the families they work with. But we are the only ones who do this full service. So people will come from outside this area to come and see
us. And then my other question is uh regarding the expertise. I mean it's a very broad um offering that you have right to a diverse group of people um and only
three to five employees. I'm just can you tell us a little bit about the roles of the employees? I mean clearly one of them is financial. You mentioned a social worker. Just wondering how this team is assembled to provide those services on site or are some of these people offsite or
so in our operation in Chicago we have now 15 people and we're continuing to add to those now that we have the capabilities. We'll be hoping to open offices like this around the country but on our staff we have researchers, we have social, we have a psychologist, we have social workers and we have
financial people. We're continually adding two more people started this week. Um and we are we have an entire training program. We're going to be looking for people in each area that we build offices and have um availability to families. So we will be training them
and we'll be building offices and um we call them homes wherever we can um find the right city and we don't want to be in big cities. We want to be in local cities where people can actually come and find us and being in the middle of a downtown. It's very important for us.
Thank you. Um just where exactly would the retail portion of the business be as I look at the plan versus is it right in the front? Is it from a definition? It's the whole space. So
So I think that um again the floor plans that you got are more kind of illustrative, not set in stone as to how it's going to look. Um but uh the planner can talk a little bit about how the retail will be set up. Got it.
You LLC, a for-profit, nonfor-profit organization? We are for-profit. For-profit. Do you um is there maybe I'm jumping ahead too far here. Is there a strategic plan for if you outgrow or you have to hire more people for this site?
We have a plan for exact we know how many families we can serve um with with X number of people. So as we expand, we will find other places around the communities to continue to grow. Yeah. Okay.
We know that the need um is significant. We know how many families in Union County. There are 750 families that are impacted by disabilities in Union County. So we but we but our job is we
don't have to do everything oursel. We need to find the arcs and we need to find those organizations like our house and all the other organizations that are around here. We partner very closely with them because we're not providing group homes and we're, you know, we're finding the resources and putting them in place. Are you working with our house and
we're just starting to get to know people in this area? Okay. Any other questions for the board? No. Okay. Move on to the next witness. Sure. Paul Gel. Good evening.
If you could raise your right hand, do you swear from the testimony you're about to give in this matter? Is the truth, the whole truth, nothing but the truth? I do. And please state your name. Spell your last name. Yes. Hi, Paul Griel. Last name spelled G R Y G I E L. Thank you. And I know you've also appeared before us a number of times,
including relatively recently. Any changes to your credentials since the last time you were here? No, I've been a licensed professional planner since 1999. My license has been in good standing that entire time and as you mentioned I've been before this board and numerous other boards on regular occasions as an expert planning witness. Any questions or would you like to
accept him back once again? I think we'll accept. All right. Great. Go ahead. Thank you, Mr. Ball. Okay, floor is mine. So, just brief. Yes. So, we've heard a lot of testimony already, so I have a long outline. I don't intend to go through the entirety of it, but I do do want to hit some key
points because as we've heard, this is a rather unique use. I've been a planner in New Jersey for over 25 years now and I've never really encountered this mix of uses in one space. So that's the crux of the the case that we're making from the use fair variance point of view about the suitability of the site being
in the CRBD district in downtown and how this particular use can fit in to this location but also enhance the surrounding mix of uses and not undermine or have a negative impact on the master plan zoning ordinance and downtown plan. Uh just briefly for the
record with regard to the site and surroundings as we heard that's an office building that is fully occupied. We have the one space left which in which a a synergistic you know related use is proposed but one that also um makes sense in terms of the aspects we've talked about with regard to
parking on street and in nearby public lots. But also the train station is a very short walk away as well. Uh it's close to some neighborhoods from within the city of Summit. So for the closer in population, it's very convenient in that regard, as well as providing before or
after visits the ability to visit other locations within the downtown. So you again, as you're well aware, have a diverse mix of uses that also, I think, would have some benefit from having a use that brings additional families and others into the district. Um just with
regard to the permitted uses in the CRBD zone again I don't want to read read down the entire list but from retail sales which was what the zoning official mentioned as this not falling into we understand that but there actually is now we've heard there's a small aspect within the facility. So one way to look at it is similar to other uses right
nearby. So you have uh for example nearby salons right next door in fact uh where you have you know a small component of a waiting room and then products and other you know items being sold at retail that sort of ex are accessory to that overall use. So for
that's one example uh real estate offices uh you have some higher traffic uses and you have lower traffic uses. Again, the intention here is to maintain a storefront that appears as it is now and is inviting and provides a space for active uses within this context. Uh
again, other uses include retail services. So, there's a very broad definition there and I won't get into too much detail, but if Miss wants me to, we can discuss the finer points of the ordinance, but it it says including but not limited to certain types of other types of uses. uh and there's some
exclusions in retail services. We don't think we fall into that. We think we actually fall into that category providing a service uh to the overall population. Uh personal services as well as you've heard and financial services. I would note financial institutions are allowed to be on the first floor facing
the street if they have direct customer services as part of the operation. So it has to be a bank that's having people being able to come in and interact. Again, we fit within that category as well. So in summary with regard to the overall permitted uses there's a wide range in the downtown. There's a wide
range that exist and I do think from a planning point of view we can demonstrate that the use frames can be granted uh that the site meets the positive and negative criteria. Uh with regard to that aspect the positive criteria the site is particularly suitable because of need for a firstf
flooror location that's visible and accessible that is also convenient to transportation and other nearby uses. Uh I do think that again we've heard some testimony with regard to trying to be a welcoming environment that actually again is very consistent with other
permitted uses and existing uses in the CRBD. Um so I think that for those for those reasons and others we would advance certain purposes of zoning including the public uh health safety and general welfare purpose a of the land use law. uh we're providing services for a
population that currently is somewhat underserved and in a unique setting and an environment that uh makes sense in this section of summit. In addition, uh purpose G providing sufficient space in appropriate locations for a variety of different types of uses. Again,
downtowns evolve. Um, in my time as a planner, I've seen a, and I'm sure you've seen as well, a broad shift in what's a typical type of use downtown in that old-fashioned retail. The larger seal fonds and stores, the department stores have gone away, but you have more
specialized experiential uses, your West Elms, you have um, innovation foundry, you have things like that that didn't really exist back 10, 15, 20 years ago. And I think that this category of use certainly fits into one that I've never thought about to put in a master planner
zoning ordinance. I would imagine your your city's planners haven't as well just because it's very unique and specialized, but it fits within the broad category of types of uses that fit in the downtown setting. Uh with regard to the negative criteria, I don't think there substantial detriment to the public good uh for a number of reasons.
I won't rehash everything I've said before, but essentially we have a use that is not at all out of character with surrounding uses. It's busier than some other ones. So, for example, a coin store, a rug store, you know, larger scale type of uses like that. Don't get many customers, but they fit in the
downtown setting. Other ones are busier. You know, burrito shops and other types of things where people are coming going regularly. Downtowns and the zoning ordinance even talks about this should have a mix of uses that um bring in different types of people uh different different times of day and night throughout the you know, throughout the
year as well. Uh so I think that in that regard we are clearly within the overall realm of the types of uses that make sense in downtown Summit. Um in addition it's just a very unique use uh that is going to provide services that I think are are not provided currently and
hopefully this will be the example for other communities to follow in terms of having this type of use in its downtown location. Um in terms of the master plan and zoning ordinance, again there's a lot of language here. I could read verbatim, but really just um I will point to a couple goals and objectives. as Mr. Snikus pointed out some in his
review letter uh with regard to the master plan. Uh but goal four of the city's master plan talks about promoting a city that is welcoming to residents of all ages, races, ethnicities, abilities, and income ranges. That is specifically addressed here by trying to provide uh to a more inclusive community in that
regard. Um and again, the overall CRBD intention to have the mix of uses is clearly in line with what proposing. Uh so with with regard to the master plan and zoning ordinance, again, I do think that we certainly fit within the overall
scheme of the downtown area and would not have any substantial negative impacts by utilizing one storefront and appropriate location for this use. And with that, I believe concluded my direct testimony. Okay. Any questions from our board
witness experts rather? I do not have any questions. Uh just one question with regard to the negative criteria the variance that's being uh requested the what is the purpose if you could describe the purpose for the limitation
of office or that sort of financial institution that may not have a customer related c uh counter type of thing along the frontage. What was the overall intent of that from the master? Sure. My understanding in my experience and and for Summit as well certainly
specifically is to have activity and not have storefronts that are you know essentially blank windows no activity uh with people walk if you were to have multiple types of uses like that in the downtown it would deaden the streetscape. So the idea is to promote um
just again that when you look inside it's more active there are people there working it's a welcoming environment and you see that in this proposed use how so in this case yes in this case we have something again similar to silver vine that's a real good example just right next door but many types of even um you
do find more actually doctors or medical offices or dentist offices even in downtowns now where you have a waiting component up towards the front again I think of this as more of being you know an active desk at whether it's a realtor's office, which is permitted, or a bank where you have um a lobby space. So, for example, there's a little coffee
service, there's some seating right there in the front portion of the of the facility. So, I think it would look very similar to many of the existing uses in the uh downtown in that regard, having a waiting area, having customer service, having amenities for people coming in the door.
Okay. Um also, as permitted uses, we have instructional schools and studios. That's correct. How is is that somewhat similar to what's being offered here in the sense that people are coming here for certain instruction and guidance? Certainly. Yes. I may glossed over that in my test direct testimony, but that
was another one of those uses that certainly had there are some components of it. We heard about the instructional aspects for the families and individuals. So that um again doesn't fit directly into a box of only being a school. That's I guess the issue here is you have a piece of this, a piece of
that and of you know the dozen or plus the dozen plus uses permitted in the downtown. We do have aspects of about three or four of at least of them. Okay. Thank you. No further question. Great. You're welcome. Questions from the board. Well, I I what I'm still having a hard
time understanding what the retail end of this is. Well, I mean retail businesses, you you you sell a product. What what are you selling? Well, my understanding from the testimony is that there would be some small type of products that could be utilized for individuals um what's it
sock business the the materials literally for that. So again, I picture when I go get my haircut or go to certain businesses where you have a small ass or gyms have this sometimes you're selling certain related t-shirts or or water bottles, whatever. I don't know the specifics other than what we've
heard from the testimony, but it would be just a small retail aspect of it. We're not trying to say we're a full retail store, certainly, but there'd be a retail component that's very small. That's what you're basing this whole plan on is being trying to you're stating that you're going to
you're looking for a retail. Oh, if I could just clarify. So, we're we're not saying that we are retail sales. We are saying that we are personal service. We are financial, we are retail services, uh, which include social workers or social services. Um,
we are instructional, we are quite a few of the uses that are permitted on the first floor in the CRBD. there is a component of retail sales um that Miss Eller alluded to which would be you know
um if there's certain special needs families or families that have come up with some kind of a sock that say certain individuals prefer to wear so they sell those socks in the store or um I what were the other things that you would mention
there are jewelry items that are made by people with disabilities So things like that that they could have. I didn't hear what she said. Um she said jewelry items that are made by individuals with special needs. So there are things that they can um have in the store that they can offer for
sale which could also be located by the window so people could see these different types of retail um products, but their main aspect is not retail sales. Just to clarify that because I think I misunderstood Miss Ellert's um testimony
with regards to that. I I think what I understood, so if you could clarify, was that you might help someone who was trying to start their own sock business, a disabled person who wants to sell socks, maybe they're selling them on the online on the internet, that it wasn't retail wasn't happening in the store. I
wasn't I wasn't expecting socks and earrings and a variety of things in the storefront window or is is that the expectation? I just want to clarify because what you said sound a little different than what I thought I heard. So add a microphone.
Yes. So one of the things that we find that occurs in the world of disabilities is people create small businesses and they sell items. We represent sometimes we'll show those items in the store and they could buy them. So there are lots of and we would
find local organizations that do that. So some of the not forprofits have it. Um, the Ark probably has things that they represent for things made by people with disabilities. So, we would want to encourage those kind of organizations to include us in allowing to present their
materials for sale to really help. Mostly, it's made by parents who have created a not for-profit to benefit their child. It might be um all kinds of there's if you ever went to like a farmers market, you would see people with disabilities and their parent who
are representing things that they sell. You can go online and find all kinds of those kind of items. So sometimes those people come to us and it's a positive for the parents to see that that's a possibility. And so we would represent those items in our store for sale. So,
but it's not something we actively pursue unless somebody's approaching us and say, you know, this particular company. So, we had a podcast once just about all the companies in this country that sell things made by people with disabilities. It's hope. It's about
allowing people to see that a person with a disability can create something and put it up on for sale. So it is possible that it you wouldn't just be serving the families that are your say clients but that uh Summit family that
says oh you know uh protected tomorrows is here and I heard that they they're selling things uh you know made by people with disabilities let's go in and see what they're selling and support it is possible that you would have members of just the general public coming in for that. Okay. Yes.
Okay. Just question on that, a followup if um sorry um so lots of young people, kids um shopping around town a lot of times just coming in, stopping by. Um maybe they're shopping, maybe they're just
hanging out. How would you how would that factor into I would think that would be a positive. Yeah. If young people came into a store and they were curious about what disabilities were all about, we would love to have conversation with them to teach them.
And again, they can have those those products if there is a product, you know, by the window so people could see them when they're walking by, which again furthers the intent of what the CRBD is all about. Okay. From your experience with other locations, do you usually target
downtowns like uh busy downtown historic areas like here in Summit? This is our first location outside of our main location at this point, but we do know that families all around the country are connected with us and they
are telling us on a regular basis they would like and we are near a downtown area where our office is where people can come right up and drive up and come in and talk to us. So, we would like to honor those requests from families all over the country to say we would like
you to have a facility where we could actually meet people face to face. because Okay. So, do you anticipate a family from California traveling to New Jersey to visit your store or your office? Um, if they were vacationing, they would they might come from California, but I
doubt it. We're hoping that families who will come here will be from this area in most cases. Yeah. Because I'm a little you know, when you say all I get all around the country, but you're building in Summit, like how did you pick this location? Is it because of your partners or Yes.
Um, so any other questions for the Miss Eller or the planner here? Where do currently where do the currently where do the employees in the office building park now? That's a Mr. Jagger question.
Yeah, I mean I think Matt I know the answer but I'm just trying to figure out there are six spots under the building and then there everyone else is in the parking deck. Employee parking parking. Yeah. And then uh you you're anticipating the same for the employees of of this agency as well.
Yeah. Any other questions for the planner? Okay. Seeing none and we don't have any questions from the public. Is that the uh that was my last last witness. Anything to wrap up here? Um sure.
So just uh quick protected tomorrows um as we've stated is comp comprised of many different aspects of permitted uses for first floor in the CRBD. Um as stated in the testimony given tonight protected tomorrows is particularly suited for this specific
first floor location. um promotes the general welfare by providing a variety of services to individuals with special needs and their families which will help them obtain positive outcomes in all aspects of their lives. Um and will benefit not only the special needs
community and their families and caregivers but the city of Summit surrounding communities and the state of New Jersey. Um since this will be the first of its kind use in the state. uh there's no detriment to the public good and the use at this location furthers many of the goals and objectives of the
ordinance and master plan as Mr. Gel testified to and as such I would ask the board to vote in favor of the application. Thank you. Can I just ask real I should have asked this before. Go ahead. What what's the how many clients does
does um Protected Tomorrow serve now? Do you know like nationwide? add a microphone. I'm sorry. I should have asked that before. I apologize. Um, we've had over the past couple years a total of about 850 clients in the last
couple years that we have served. Thank you. Okay. Okay. So, all right. So, I'll note it's a D1 use variance. Five votes are required to approve. Obviously, we only have six members here tonight. I will note that I
have not noted any specific conditions. There is no engineering memo which we usually condition the applications on. So um unless any other members have a particular condition they want to Can I ask you a qu if if if um
protected tomorrow's outgrows the space and decides they want to move somewhere else would the um uh future occupant have to to obviously meet the current requirements for the master I mean the zoning for the type of use and all that. So they they may not just continue this
use onto the next tenant or would they have to come back before? So they could continue a a use. It sounds like there isn't any other uses that fit this specifically, but if there was another exact copy of that business out there that they could come in and
rely on that variance that was granted. Um otherwise if it's a separate use they would need to either comply with the existing permitted uses in the code or submit for their own barrier. Um so at this point I guess I'll look to
the board members and see does anyone want to provide any input on what they're thinking before we formally go into executive session um to guess give any hints to the applicant on Well, I think can we
I would say let's start executive session is my thought and then we could pause, you know, and resume next time if we didn't want to vote. But I think I'd rather say what people are thinking in executive session
than Sure. Just as long as we're clear that we're not going to force a vote. We'll go through our thoughts in executive session and then leave it up to the applicant on whether we'll proceed. Okay. Okay.
All right. Um, anyone want to start? I think it's within uh the uh general idea of uh CRB and uh I I think that it does some help as long this is uh
specific for this tenant only. So if that will be a condition I think that will be a good idea. uh if they change or they have a different uh tenant they have to come back to the board.
Uh I don't see any uh negative impact on the town. Uh so that's my opinion. I think I could uh support it. I can support this, but I really don't
see I haven't heard a convincing argument why it needs to be on the first floor. Sorry, I just don't see it. But I think it has a beneficial use for the town, the beneficial use of the space, so I could support it on that basis. Um, anyone else or I can jump in. I think, um,
you know, I I could support this. I think that um in terms of the positives um you know I think it does re do you know a couple of things. It the reinforces the city is like a mixed use
mixed core with a variety of businesses in town. Um I think it uh in the master plan there's some reference to recognize the city's role as a regional center and I think that with this sort of we'll call it innovative type of business. Um
it it does that because it offers something a little different that um would maybe be a draw right for bring people to downtown Summit. Um, and I think one of our, you know, master plan
is, um, to encourage private investment for uses that are consistent with our community needs and desires. And I think that, um, it, you know, there is there's this need exists in our community, exists in other communities to, you know, offer this
type of help. So, I I could support it. Um, I think the retail part of it is sort of the least compelling aspect of this application if I'm being honest. Um, but I think that the other um
the other aspects of it are much more much more compelling. So I I could support this and any other notes? I think that's it. Anyone else? I can support this application as well.
Well, I just it it's um reading through this some of the you know forward facing offices. I mean that that's if you think about a lot of the buildings downtown. I mean it's you're kind of defeating the whole purpose of
that ordinance. But I can support this uh application. I think it's it's well thought out and uh I think it will definitely provide a benefit to the town and if if not the county and the region. Yeah. Could we make it a condition that if a different tenant came in, even if
they said they were a carbon copy of protected tomorrows, let's say there's someone else who says we could do this and you decide you need a bigger space that they actually have to come and present to the board so that they could demonstrate that they're I I would like that too.
Yeah. Yeah. I think we've done something similar in the past. I Technically, you know, variances run with the land and it's tough to legally say you can
restrict someone from relying on a variance that was granted. Um, even if the applicants were to agree to that, I question if it was challenged at a later date, it might be stricken as being invalid. Um, you know, we can ask the
applicants if we want to see if they'd be willing to do it. I think the uniqueness of this particular use kind of prevents any future business from trying to claim yes, we are an exact carbon copy and therefore we can rely on it. But that's just based on the
testimony we've heard tonight. Mr. Snikus, do you have any um advice on that just as a planner? Yes. What I've heard tonight, at least from my perspective, is I've heard a variety of uses that are being offered, whether they're financial services, educational, instructional uh guidance
for individuals or psychological services that are are provided for these people with special needs. Um, I think the board can rely on that. It'll be interesting to write it and word it such in the resolution so that we can because it's so unique in this instance. But I think if we touch on the actual
activities that they perform at that location, I think those are enough to establish at least a record as to what the board is considering for approval of the application if you're seeking to approve the application. Um, and touch on those issues. Um, something else you
could also consider, and I was going to offer this, but I it's up to you, is that I know the applicant was willing to provide at least an open window or open storefront kind of experience to that. And that was part and parcel with what I believe in looking at the intent and
purpose of that uh restriction in the zone is to make sure it's an active use and it's not just walled off or screen windows or what have you that doesn't keep an active storefront that people walking by feel like it's active and and energized in the downtown. I think that
was the intent of the master plan is to try to keep things energized. Although uh excuse me, I'll I'll caution myself to stop testim testimony here, but uh the other thing I would look at is the diversity of uses as you've talked about. I think that's another significant feature for the board to
consider. Thank you. Um so we've established that this will have a storefront app appearance to at the front of the building. That's what I think I heard from the applicant and I'll look for them just to validate that. Yeah. So I think uh to address Mr.
Snik's comment so that during the if this was approved obviously um through the building permit issuance process right the zoning ordinance requires a certain amount of storefront to remain open and trans translucent. Yeah. So transparent. So, um I think
that if if for some reason it wasn't as has been represented here tonight when a plan was submitted, it would get called out by the zoning and the building department before an issuance of a permit to build. So I think that all of that would certainly be taken clearly into consideration not only with the
design and the layout of the space but the way that the actual storefront well so maybe that is a condition is to make sure because I I'm not sure that that's actually what would happen that I think that maybe needs to be a condition that it is a the approval is contingent
upon it being a storefront appearance is that you know just because the design is as you said this is a tentative design and anything can be Sure. Um modified. Thank you. So condition would be that the applicant shall ensure that the first floor
maintains a storefront appearance. Is that acceptable wording to that condition? I mean does that include like the place next door where you look in and you see a waiting area and then you can see some products and things like that. Is that sufficient?
I mean that's ex identical to what is next door? I I I think of a storefront as clear glass and not with offices or conference rooms up against it as you would see on an upper floor office space so that you can see you know what what's in the
window itself I think is probably variable depending on the nature of the use but that it's clear and that you can see in there's some welcome desk with a person sitting behind it basically. Yeah. Okay. Um, so I guess similar to what we see in a real estate
place. Yep. Right. Y um I guess I'll just ask if anyone because before we vote if there's anyone who is not in favor that you would, you know, share that. Um because I think it's important that we know everybody's
opinion on it. Um right. I mean I can just share um based on what we've just discussed there. I'm supportive. That makes sense. Okay. Okay. One more question. Um suppose down the
road Mr. Jagger decides that he's going to rent this to an insurance company or some place that's not permitted right now by code. I assume that we can restrict that usage. So that person would not be able to to rent that store space.
Right. So, an insurance company or anything else that would fall clearly into the uses as described in the code that prohibit first floor um locations, they would have to then separately come in for variance and uh go through this whole process.
You said the variance goes with the property only for this limited, right? The variance is particular to this. You know, these uses as have been described in the testimony. It you know, something else that's separate that's currently prohibited. you know, would separately have to come in.
Okay. So, all right. So, Miss Ols, I think you've been counting the number of votes. Would you like to proceed this evening? Uh, yes, please. Thank you. Can can we take the role or vote here? Motion. That's right. Need a motion
to carry this car. Not carry to have a vote. Just to be clear, that's a motion to approve. to approve. Yeah. Sorry, I'll second it. Okay. Vice Chair Zon. Yes. Mr. Yuko is recused. Mr. Malay.
Yes. Mr. Nelson. Yes. Mr. Kieran. Yes. Mr. Chantuli. Yes. And Mr. Nearing. Yes. Thank you very much. Congrats. [Music] Yes. All right. We do have some
resolutions tonight. First up is 18 Thurman Avenue, zoning board application number ZB-25-2285. The eligible members to vote are Mr. Yuko, Mr. Malay, Mr. Nelson, Mr. Chantuli, and Mr. Nering. Could we get a motion?
Some moved. Second. Thank you, Mr. Yuko. Yes, Mr. Malay. Yes, Mr. Nelson. Yes, Mr. Chantuli. Yes, Mr. Ner. Yes. Thank you. Next up is nine Sherman Avenue zoning board application number
ZB-25-2290. The eligible members to vote are Mr. Yuko, Mr. Malay, Mr. Nelson, Mr. Chantuli, and Mr. Nearing. Could we have a motion? So move. Second. Second. Mr. Yuko, yes. Mr. Mole, yes.
Mr. Nelson, yes. Mr. Chantuli, yes. Mr. Nearing, yes. Thank you. Next up is Nine Valley View Avenue, zoning board application number ZB-25-2289. The eligible members to vote are Mr. Yuko, Mr. Nelson, Mr. Chantuli, and Mr.
Nearing. Could we have a motion? Some moved. Second. Thank you, Mr. Yuko. Yes, Mr. Nelson. Yes, Mr. Chantuli. Yes, Mr. Nearing. Yes.
Next up is 136 Pineroveve Avenue, zoning board application number ZB-24-2276. The eligible members to vote are Mr. Yuko, Mr. Malay, Mr. Nelson, Mr. Chantuli, and Mr. Nearing. Could we get a motion, please?
Second. Mr. Mr. Yuko. Yes. Mr. Mai, yes. Mr. Nelson, yes. Mr. Chantuli, yes. And Mr. Nearing, yes. Thank you. And then we have a resolution of extension for 185 Oakidge Avenue,
ZB-23-2188. Could we have a motion? Did some moved? Did we already They already had two years, right? No, they had a one year in the original resolution, one year it was extended and so they're
asking for one more year. Now, uh it they were at the time where the board only granted one year to get a permit as opposed to our current practice of getting two years. Um they also advised that they have actually submitted that application for the permit and they're
just waiting on the city to process it at this point. So, I think they probably don't even need the total year, but they're doing that to be safe and to be compliant. Okay. Could we get a second? I'll second it. Thank you. Vice Chair,
yes. Mr. Yuko, yes. Mr. Malai, yes. Mr. Nelson, yes. Mr. Kieran, yes. Mr. Chantuli, yes. And Mr. Nearing, yes. Thank you. And last up, we have the minutes for memorialization. We have
July 7, 2025. The eligible members to vote are Mr. Malay, Mr. Nelson, Mr. Yuko, Mr. Feskins, Mr. Chantuli, and Mr. Nearing. Could we have a motion? Make a motion. Second. All in favor?
I. Any opposed? That's all. Do we have a motion to adjourn? We entertain that. So move. Second. I just have one question. On these dates, are these all Mondays? I didn't look at them. Uh the 4th is a Thursday. September 4th
is a Thursday. Uh September is it th Okay. See you on September 4th. Yeah. Um enjoy the rest of the summer. and and Kurin, there's a sheet here just to if you want to check your availability for
the upcoming