e un mute he's asking um I'm not sure he says we're good oh we're good all right great um I just see my picture though just out of curiosity which is not a fun thing to [Laughter] see if you can hear me just hang on one
sec yeah that's Nelson report you no sorry that's it comes to all our softball games Mr wilfor Pete Wilfork goes to everything remember Pete wfor he was he was this he was the guest speaker at one
of our graduations he's MLB MLB kid one one of Jason yeah it's one of Jason he comes to all the softball yeah it comes to all the soccer games and basketball games too it's nice Jason's number one fan like he really is Nate do you see a
promote to panelist option up there he's not really accept should hear the I know but he's but he's not right anytime I touch technology all right like that here we go I'm sure this
this feels great we're watching the clock for a half an [Laughter] hour that's fine sorry that's okay and take off the catam Moji off of Jason too
right try now n there we go thank you all right um the school committee meeting of um Thursday October 24th at swans high school has begun if you are able please stand for the Pledge of
[Music] Allegiance pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America to the Republic for which it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice
okay welcome everyone welcome nice to see a lot of people here in online um my name is Glenn Pastor I am the chair of the the current current chair of the swans school committee and we are here um to meet and interview Mr
Jason Jason kalishman for the position of superintendent of schools um before uh I begin a couple house keeping items first and foremost I do want to um although most everybody knows here just for those watching on television or in
the audience who have not been here just want to formally introduce everybody to my far left is Karen Marshall uh next to Karen is John jantis on my far right is Suzanne Wright and closest to me is Amy oconor um thing I will tell you is we
have 46 years of experience serving on this school committee um and I think that's going to be very helpful tonight uh I will remind everyone who is in attendance please shut your phone off uh even if it does vibrate it definitely
picks up on the microphones we'd appreciate it um a couple more just to let everybody know how this is going to go um the interview should last anywhere from 60 to 90 minutes or so if it needs longer we will certainly do that um
we're going to alternate asking questions um I'll make an opening statement Amy will ask first followed by Karen suzan and John um our student reps um are on their way for what I understand they will also ask questions
I'll introduce them at the time um we will have uh after the interview I should say we will have a five minute recess just to let everybody take a deep breath we're going to come back we will have public comment okay we'll talk a little bit more about that so um with
that um for For the Love of learning community comments reports and discussions superintendent report we're going to table all of those for this evening we're going to go right into um school committee chair and the interview Mr kishman on behalf of
everyone sitting out here in front of you thank you very much for uh first and foremost raising your hand and then for uh coming to this interview um we're excited to to learn more more about you more about your thoughts about the district and with
that ladies and gentlemen Jason kishman he thanks everybody for having me so my name is Jason kishman I'm the principal of swamp Scott Middle School I have worked in the district for 13 years four years as the assistant principal of the Middle School in the last nine as
principal I grew up in Swampscott I live in swamp Scott I am a swamps Scot high school graduate and I want tonight to be about you learning that I'm far more than just that while I'm really proud of all of those things um I think you'll see that there's a lot more to me than just that
and ultimately Prov to you that I'm the best candidate for this position great um excellent um I know that you brought some materials for us you want to talk a little bit about that this is just to look through either my resume um I wasn't sure of the format at first so there's a slideshow that you could peek
through just uh my most recent evaluation some letters from families over the years and some important correspondents including our latest needs ass survey results okay great um so with that why don't we start the
formal process okay and we'll start with Miss all right well you've done the the littlest part by just introducing yourself but why don't you jump in and talk to us about why you see yourself as the right person to be the next superintendent for Swan yeah I'll be
honest with you I probably went from never thinking I would be a teacher to certainly never think I would be an assistant principal at some point during an assistant principal I started to figure out I could be a principal and then over the past few years I really started to think about um
having a little bit more say and I I feel like I've had a really um important impact on the middle school over the past 13 years and I'd like to see how I could improve the wider lens of the elementary in the high school as well so
um yeah it was definitely a a you know change in mindset as far as the whole career in the first place but I've been doing it for 23 years and there's no place I'd rather be and nothing else I'd rather do great thank you very much um
Karen what do you see as the most important skills for a superintendent I think the most important skills are to be a an excellent Communicator to be a strong collaborator because I don't think anybody can do any
of it alone I mean we're talking I talk to the students all the time about how they might not like it might not realize it but they are a team and this is certainly a team game here and um you need to be a creative Problem Solver all things that I feel like can I can I just ask a followup
with that sure um of all those skills that you mentioned what would you say are your strengths and weaknesses I think collaboration and building culture is a um is a strong skill in mine I think the Middle School culture speaks for itself
not only for students and staff families um you in my job you have to be a creative Problem Solver because it's not black and white and you're dealing with kids and you have to sort of navigate in the gray so it's a collaboration culture and and being a creative Problem Solver of my biggest
strengths right great thank you Susan um I I want to just follow up with um this question as well I I um we we sent out a survey not too long ago to to people and and um the greatest area uh or the greatest skill that that the community who responded wanted was communication
so it's really great that you're saying you know being a communicator and listening and collaborating I just want to share the other areas with you um the importance of working with the community um there's certain characteristics of strong and um inspiring and a role model
um supportive to the teachers um having high high standards um financial and budget experiences and prior experiences um as a superintendent teacher were all really important to the community so I I'm glad you're speaking to some of those things um um what would you what
would you say um just broadly speaking um are some of the biggest hurdles in education like could be here and and broadly speaking Yeah I think education's changed a lot I mean forget about 23 years ago when I started but even the past five years um I think that
being in in a lot of ways for the better and some ways for the worse but for the better I think the the focus on social emotional learning and the well-being of our students mental health I don't know if we thought about that 10 15 years ago to be honest with you and now it's at the Forefront of everything that we do
um being mindful of what we pick for curriculum and making sure that everybody has access points that we have a inclusive environment for not only our the work that we do but the building itself so I think that you know the
phones are definitely a hurdle as you know from the high school but you know earlier and earlier those things are becoming things that happen on the weekend or at night via phone um end up leaking into school so it's it's one of those things that we are Ando and I deal with a lot I would say you know if we
didn't have to deal with things with the phones we would have a lot more time on our hands so those are some of the ways that it's changed I was going to ask a followup to that and this is really about the phones I mean we have had a lot of discussions here about cell phones in school and all I have to do is
is read and there are more and more districts not not only in Massachusetts but around the country that are just doing an allout ban yeah what is your thought about that I would love to see swamp Scot become a district that signs the pledge the wa till 8th grade pledge and I don't
know if anybody had their kids in middle school years ago I used to send this stuff out and people weren't ready for it and um but I think now that we see the the data and the research on what phones are doing to our kids just the the anxiety provoking the body image issues
um you know the the cons far out way the pros and so I would love to see the band just for the parents to to come together and say well I'll wait till 8th grade would be fantastic I don't know if we need to ban them from walking into the building I think that there's ways you know at the middle school they have them
often in their backpacks if they're caught with them sneaking in the B which I'm sure some get away with you know we can't be everywhere but um they get a detention they have a consequence and then we start back over again so um yeah I think that it's a challenge
but we definitely need to see the kids not having their phones with them at night not going to bed with their phones staring as at Tik Tok because if we're going to say during the day that mental health is a top priority then we need some help at night as well with that one great thank you John thanks Jason coming
back to communication and just given how important communication is for the superintendent role I'm just wondering what methods You'll Think of using or will use um to engage faculty students staff and Community yeah so do you see
my weekly scoop do you check the scoop so every Monday we send the scoop sort of like a memo from the middle schools important dates reminders and anything else that we have coming up um I know that's just one school but I would Envision sort of having something similar to that that you know I don't know if it would be weakly because you
know you don't want to inundate parents either I I I have kids in two different schools here and you know between what we send out at the middle school and the elementary school um I don't want to have parents overload but I think there's important communication to be had with the teachers with community
members um the kids I think we can figure out something where this's there's some sort of scoop coming from me can I can I ask how how how are you going to reach community members beyond the school Community yeah so I think one of the things I pride myself in is I try
to be everywhere I am not sporting events I'm at the plays I'm at the concerts I am trying to be you know I try to be visible and I think that lends itself to meeting people that necessarily don't necessarily have to do with the school they just might be in an
event and I would certainly want to reach out to to folks that want that have any concerns about the school district because I think one of the worst things that you can have out there is misinformation you know he said this or she said that or this is what's going on in the schools and they don't know and I think that's something that's always been frustrating for me over the
years so I would love and welcome you know whether it's a difficult conversation or not um sometimes just like making sure that the community members are on the same page as I as we are and um and making sure that they have access to me so beyond just being everywhere I think we'd have to work with Town Hall to send let people know
that Beyond just this because I do think it's tough to reach the people beyond the school district um but I'm sure we can work together to figure something out would you be open to uh holding Community meetings of course I mean we did four curriculum nights a couple
weeks ago like same thing you know I'm happy to do those I love those well but not not necessarily for the parents but you know for exactly no I hear you like I have no problem doing that that' be great okay yeah great John I'm good for now great um my
question is really going to focus on just the current the current team in place yes um you know we are we have been very lucky the last 10 plus years to have a superintendent who um also started as an educator in the community
has grown in into what I would consider an amazing superintendent and we were very lucky to have um so you're going in with a strong team can you talk a little bit about the current administrative team and where you see just the executive team of this District
going forward I mean I think we're to your point we're tremendously lucky lucky to have Pam some of the hires that she's made um and because of the positions that are in place all throughout the district I mean we are positioned to go to go from really good
to Next Level to amazing in a lot of different areas I'm not just talking about Athletics I'm I mean academics Athletics you know the Arts social emotional check-ins with kids mtss systems I mean there's things that we can do because of the uh the leadership in place that works hopefully
collaboratively with the teachers because they're the rubber meets the road and and the most important if we're going to be successful we need quality teachers but leadership wise I I can't remember a time where we've ever been in a position with such strength in the leadership category great can you think
of a place where uh could be it could use Improvement the leadership team well or is there anything in particular that you um find or would find useful as a superintendent I think that I mean we
could all do a better job probably with you know I think I talked about this before the family Partnerships and getting everybody on board having families realize that the we need them just as much as they need us and we have to all be on the same team I think I spoke about how you know admittedly I
shot away from that for years and then miss AO showed me the light um you know with the parent coffees and and like I said before we had four curriculum nights this year we want people to come in we want them to share our concerns their concerns we want to be part of the solution and help them because we have to all be in this together I mean
somewhere along the lines we went from an education we went through from teacher um and the parents on the same page against the kid and now it's a little bit skewed so we need to everyone needs to realize that all the teachers are here for the betterment of the community betterment of the kids they
want their kids to to be loved and respected and learn in their classroom and let's believe half of what you hear when you go home and we'll figure out the you know work out the details and work together before people jump to the conclusion that you know we made a massive mistake and if we do make a mistake we have to own it and fix it so
I think that that family Partnerships across all levels we we probably all need to improve on great thank you are there are there certain certain skills in your leadership team that you that you're already thinking about capitalizing on
certainly I mean I mean Miss Raymond's right here I would say that you know I'd have to lean on her and we've worked really well to together for 13 years and I think one of the things I respected about Pam is that you know she always says that you know she doesn't want people just to say yes and agree with
her and I've always you know I remember when I was assistant principle at those leadership meetings and kind of be like can I say something or not um but over the course of the years you kind of find your voice and and be able to disagree without being disagreeable and to sort of share ideas and throw them up on the board and see the pros and cons and if
you can't collaborate and communicate like that and be scared to disagree um you can't be scared to disagree or else you're not going to want to improve the district and get a going so are are you going to are you going to feel any pressures or hurdles transitioning from a member of the team to sort of leading the team and how how like the Dynamics
and how you're going to how you're sort of going to uh what your what your leadership style there is going to be yeah I I appreciate the question I I don't see see it that way I mean I don't think that there's going to be any issues I'm very you know
um comfortable in uh my opinions and how we collabor orate in how you know that you know I wouldn't be a top down person I would want to hear feedback if I messed something up um as far as just sort of
being you know principles to people and and on the same page and at the same level I I think that I've probably the last five or six years really had Pam's ear and she leaned on me on some things and I leaned on her and some things so I feel like my leadership has grown within the leadership team so
I wouldn't think anybody in the room would think it was a stretch if I sort of had a bigger Vision you know apprciate that okay Amy I I lost my place uh you've been outspoken about
your dislike of high stakes testing like mcass uh can you talk about then how do we measure success and does this mean that you put less emphasis on data and more on just what you see and
experience so thank you for asking that um I think that's a little bit of nor I I understand high stakes testing I understand the ncast if um just for those you who don't know our eighth grade just finished 22 percentage points above the state average for Ms and
exceeds in English 21% over Ms and exceeds in math 14 in St I mean we value it what always bothered me was the over testing so for example before we had Chromebooks before we had the network to to cover the test it took 22 days at the
middle school to test 5 through eight that's where my frustration was and I think that would be everybody's frustration I mean think about time on learning we're testing for 22 days um so we have that down to seven now so I think you know we all need to be have
measuring sticks and see where we are I mean I'm all for formative assessments we use the I ready data to see where kids are growing and where they are at we use the mcast I my other issue with the mcast to be honest with you was really has to do with some of our special needs students
as a requirement for graduation that I thought was unfair frankly and um so it came from a place of sort of wanting to protect my students and give them still learn let them still learn a high school diploma you know um so I value the
teacher grades they're the experts I value the I ready formative assessments along the way and yeah we look at m caspit one day data point so that's where I think I it was always one data point to me not this massive you know it's way more than anything else if that makes sense so I
mean I will say personally for my own children um I value their report card far more than I value their MC score that doesn't mean I don't want them to strive to do well and we'll do what we have to do to get them where they need to be but I mean that's always been our top priority so as a followup to that if
it's not uh inappropriate what's your stance on the uh the the mcast requirement that's on the ballot I'm a I'm a yes guys can I follow up with this absolutely I'm I'm thinking um I had a conversation earlier today with Amy and we were talking about rankings and
ratings for different districts and and talking about how how people get concerned that our ranking seems to be dropping instead of going up and we're looking at the problems in Marblehead right now and their ranking is still ours and it seems crazy so so just given given like the discussions about this what what are the metrics what are what
are some metrics that you think are that we should be focusing on that that show that this district is successful yeah well I think when you look at those met metrics you know number of kids in AP classes who's taking the AP exam I mean we want to have more kids taking AP
classes and that might hurt us ultimately kind of like I when I talked about algebra we have more kids thinking algebra than ever before in eth grade does that hurt our mcast it absolutely does because they don't teach one second of anything on the incast for and that's our top percentage of students and then not getting one reminder not one review
of anything adcast related that whole year it was still 22 Point 21 points above the state um so I think that you know the metrics we have to use our our kids I mean this this it's few it's it's several different things one
it's our kids happy are they in school are they successful with their I ready how do their report cards look and are they growing with mcast all of that I think that the rankings drive me crazy too and I think we have to take a fin look at a really close look at what do they want and then let's make adjustments because there is no reason
why we shouldn't be a top 50 or top 25 or whatever it is now mind you I always get AGG because these people who are ranking have never been into the school you I'd love for you to walk around the middle school and tell me where that's right because I would argue it's the best middle school around not just because I work there I I truly believe it is um but if that's the game we have
to play then I think we have to look at what they're asking and then sort of make adjustments so that we are on the rise okay great thank you Karen Switching gears a little bit um have you faced a time when your student need has
been in conflict with a teacher need and how would you handle that student need I mean I think that happens a lot yeah it depends on the situation it really you know you have to get all the information at hand and listen not every
student has the same background and the same coming to the table with the same um situation as the person next to them so it really does depend I mean Fair does not always mean equal and so you know why didn't you get detention but you did and why did this happen but she
didn't it's not necessarily always the same thing because you have to remember where kids are coming from as well now I pride myself on trying to support the teachers as much much as I can and I think if you to a person it doesn't mean we agree on every single issue because we certainly haven't over the past 13
years um but I think to a person if you ask the teachers of the Middle School school you know do I have their backs I would say they say yes but I also have the kids' backs too right yeah so do you find you can somehow come to a resolution that works for everybody
98% of the time yes I mean and certainly when those times when we can't come to a resolution it's ultimately my call so thank you suzan um I was just
thinking um uh some criticism of of uh you being a superintendent is sort of um I've heard that um you know you live in this town you have kids in this town you have friends in this town your kids have friends in this town and how
how are you going to balance um getting to 95% without favoritism or without sort of I I I'm thinking uh student and teacher things and also your ability to evaluate you know your friends and your your friends who also are your
colleagues yeah so I would say that you know is I feel like um it's important to mention that I haven't lived here my whole life you know and and I yes I have strong Connections in town which I think is a real benefit I also taught in the
inner city in Jersey City for two years I came back and worked in Wakefield I worked for the ABC program in Topsfield I coached at Masco after gaining all these experiences you know I chose to come back here and raise my family here because I do love this town um
I think that you know part of my job for the last 13 years has always been I have to do what's best it's like a business I mean you can't mix friendships and business I mean I would always do what's best for the school for the kids for the teachers that's my job sometimes do I
get it wrong absolutely um and when I get it wrong I try to fix it but you know I try to treat everybody as fairly as I can and look at the issue and there have been disagreements with people that I'm friends with I've had you know friends that are union reps that you
know will disagree on situations but um always respectfully and and I would never be compromised by somebody else's opinion if I think if I ran the school that way it wouldn't be as successful as it is quite frankly you know when I said earlier that I realized pretty quickly I could
be principal I mean I think some of those things were let let me get involved in the hiring process and let me make sure that it's not just somebody from down the street so I get when people say that but I'm more than just a president I think if you looked at my resume and if this was a national search and you looked for my resume I think
you'd be pretty interested in having me come in for an interview based on what's on there so okay thank you CH so Jason I think I think we can all agree that the role of superintendent will come with many challenges and I I
guess just to help us you know kind of understand your thought process can you talk about a challenge that you have faced in a professional role that um what you felt was significant and how you actually addressed that that challenge
um yeah I I mean I would say there certainly Staffing challenges which have you know we used to have hundred you know 120 100 applicants for a job and now we have two so that you have to be really creative and you can't just sit back and wait for the phone to ring you
have to go recruit people um I think the student challenges the students have changed like I said we have to be really mindful of um how the students feel walking into the building how if they're ready to learn you can't learn any material if
you're you know anxious or or depressed we need to be mindful of representation if you walk around the middle school we try that what what's on our walls matters um the music we listen to in the morning matters like all these things how we talk to the kids matters and um
so I think the shift in education over the past five or seven years has been a good thing because we are completely um entrenched in worrying about the whole student teaching the whole student so back to the metrics Suzanne from what you were saying before
about the metrics used to be a successful school I mean that's not measured um and I think that's incredibly important that well maybe it is measured I mean you look at The Chronic absen ISM rate in the in the state it's over 20% at the middle school our chronic absenteeism rate if you take
out excuse absence is 7.32% so what's that tell you kids want to come here so somehow despite all of the challenges covid and learning loss and and the phones and and not being able to find people that filled positions even though we've been lucky we've had we've been
able to retain staff and our kids want to be here every single day so now we have to do that at every single building that we have staff that loves it here that they want to be here that they feel like we have their back they treat it as professionals we're treating the kids the right way how would we want somebody somebody treating our own
children and that gets them there and that 7.32% in middle school I don't know if you remember middle school but I'm sure you know I don't know if you wanted to be there that much but it's it's I think it's a testament to the teachers in the building and I think we can certainly U figure out a way to do that
for the entire District so that I'm going to follow up with that if you don't mind um you know the yeah the statistics at the middle school were actually incredible um we definitely have a t issue at the high school and and we're not alone many many communities are far more challenged than
us yeah how do you see a high school with old older students connecting with those students and especially the families I mean it's families in this community yeah how would you start working on that problem
yeah I mean I think you know what part of our new and I love this the mpss system for attendance is we're meeting monthly and anybody that gets on our radar we start calling right away it's me Emily guidance we we want to be on it we don't
want anybody I want to improve on the 7.32% the high school would have to do the same thing I think you know I know the high school schedule is a Hut button topic but I think that's something that might be a hindrance to kids being in school as much as they should um if you know if they think they have until 11
off and well I might as well just stay home I don't know all the details I'd have to look at that but I know that that's the perception out there and sometimes perception is reality so I want to make sure that the high school kids are in school um and it takes you know all the boots on the ground I people need to be calling we have to be
going to houses if need be making phone calls but most importantly if you set the culture where kids want to be there every day again and feel respected and feel valued and have something that they're interested in listen we have Taylor Swift Club at the middle school like whatever it takes to get you out of bed in the morning if that's what it
takes you know let's let's have it and we have to have strong music and arts we have to have if it's Athletics if it's an after school club if it's your math teacher or your robotics teacher those are all classes and things that we want to have as many things that if kids if that's what gets kids up and excited
about school and getting them there we need to offer them great thank you um I so my next question is actually going to cover special education um those who know me it's near and dear to my heart I absolutely agree with you um mcast and
special education does not work yeah um having live that part um Gene genetically I should say uh special education students are on the rise both in SW Scot and elsewhere yeah um what is your thoughts on that and and how do you
see I don't say better outcomes because I think we do an amazing job here yeah how do we get more more more better how do we get more better outcomes for our students yeah so I would say a few things and as much as I you you know how much I love the middle school and I talk
about one area of weakness for us is right now we have we need to get our special ed numbers down below 20% I would say and to do that we have to look at our schedule and we have to have built-in systems of support that mtss systems that give kids what they need
we're already looking at a tweak for next year we're not talking about a massive overhaul of the schedule but we're talking about little tweaks here and there that can give kids what they need so they have access to the curriculum that's going to help them and constantly measuring that data so we're looking at again at I already we're looking to get an m as of looking at
those formative assessments the teachers given in the classroom and using that data and then making an informed decision having targeted groups where um kids can really make have an impact where the teaching can have an impact and kids can make improvements all right can I ask a
follow up on that of course so um you raised a really good point with that Jason I guess you said you wanted to look at the data um is part of what you look at just feedback from The Faculty just what they're seeing in their classrooms and you know is would you be
open to listening to you know what that feedback would be and also just use that with the data so so just say so twice a year we send out there like a Jessie principal survey that you send to the staff um it's like the worst time it's like you know Thanksgiving when
everybody's ready to you know go crazy and then in the spring but you have you have to send out to the staff they give you honest feedback it's Anonymous um about what's going well what's going what's not going well so I'm always open to feedback I'd love when feedback is face to face so you know sometimes an
email or in um surveys like that you don't get you really don't have understand the the feel of it and the the root behind it but if people AR uncomfortable with face to face I'm I'm totly okay with surveys being sent out and feedback is important positive and negative I think yeah great before I um
continue I just want everybody to introduce Sam Sam is one of our uh student Representatives Sam thanks very I know you had a school S no thanks for coming we appreciate it uh Amy how you doing sorry we're jumping around so
um I'll leave this one actually I'll I'll I'll TOS this one over to to you number 14 all right um thank you um in in lots of communities or in quite a few communities lately um including what's happening in Marblehead and Melrose
parents are raising concerns about how the me go program um is is working in um in its entirety actually and um you know are and other minor civil rights issues with other minority students uh with
meico students and other minority students you know how they're being treated relative to their white peers yeah I was just sort of wondering um what our issues are here and and how you can how you can affect that yeah so
that's a very important issue I would think that um not just Meco students but all of our students of color in marginalized groups um we need to be mindful of you know the mechos students obviously it's a long day it's it's really hard to get up get on the bus get
to swamp Scot um you know and and perform and make friends and then have to get back on the bus and do the same thing over again the next day um I have I started my career I chose to teach in the inner city um I then like I said before I was the resident director of a
better chance I don't know if you know that but it's it's like a it's a it was a program where students from the Bronx and Harlem went to Topsfield I lived with them my wife and I lived with them um I was I went to parent conferences I coached some of the kids in baseball we helped with homework I met their girlfriends talk about navigating like
teenagers before I was ready I mean to navig I'm still not ready to navigate teers but um and that's those are the things we were doing and it was such an opening experience for me as far as just um equity and representation and um like
I said before some of the things we pride ourselves on the middle school is just what's on our walls how do we treat people what books are we listen are we reading we started last year uh sorry a few years ago we started a book club where once a week I think Ashley superintendent andas joined the book club where two 8th grade teachers um you
know read books about marginalized groups and we had diverse authors so we're not just reading de old dead white guys as everybody says we were actually on The Cutting Edge of that I know that's become sort of like the theme throughout the district but the middle school has been doing that for a long time and um I think it comes down to
again about everybody feeling valued and respected now I do think the distance sometimes can be um the Crux of the issue so if you have a um student of color
that their families from Swamp got they see us in the community you see me get drop off every single day sometimes just the not seeing that face to face that's another reason why being visible is so important that you don't get the whole picture um and we want everybody so we
have to do a better job getting ourselves out there to the Meco Community making sure that they see us see who we are and mistakes are going to happen certainly um as with all of our kids but knowing that you know we need to gain trust back that um their kids are in the right
place that they are valued they are respected and hopefully that they're here for a long time and and can and can bring a lot to our community and hopefully we can share them so so if there's a parent who's saying to you um my kid doesn't feel like they belong here they've been here for you know
seven years and they still don't feel a part of this community or they still feel um yeah like like different how do you how do you rectify that or how do you help that parent or help that child you know s years is a long I mean seven
years is a long time to be here and still not feel part of a community but I know there are high school students that are experiencing some of those feelings yeah I I think you know sadly there's probably students from Swampscott that feel that way I mean I think that there's kids that don't make connections with teachers or coaches or they peers
and we always have to be mindful of that and trying to you know make connections with those kids we always you know find the kid that you know that looks like they're not happy or that they're sad um I would say over the course of my career I've had hundreds of Meco families
through the district and I I'm sure that I would venture to say the vast majority of them feel pretty good about their experience um just like thousands of swamp Scout students that the M vast majority feel pretty good but you know did we um do we do we do a better job
with a small percentage I think so but I think we're constantly looking to make kids and families feel feel connected I've come like I said I've come along recently about the family part of it I always felt that the kids needed to be connected to school um but I think the family engagement piece will be
important too can I ask a followup to that um you know I think I don't want to speak for everyone up here but I think we'd all agree that we'd like to expand the metco program one I mean one reason we certainly have the room two I think it it offers all of the students um a
unique perspective on what their surroundings are when they get to the real world not just here yeah what are your thoughts about um trying to add all levels of students from elementary this you know big big new elementary school we have which definitely has the room all the way
up I think like anything the younger the kids get here the better I wish Nan came here sooner um I think it's also you know important to yeah I I think that the the earlier we get the kids the more they'll be in the culture like you know
Suzanne said that the kid's been here seven years and doesn't feel comfortable that's that's that's a mistake we have to fix that but if you're here from kindergarten or first grade second grade straight through my guess is that a lot of those kids feel connected here um and when they don't we have to recognize
that with counselors and teachers and coaches and see what we can do and and admin and see what we can do to make sure that they they feel connected great thank you do you have a question I'm going to jump ahead actually actually um so something kind of similar so a
superintendent when problems don't get resolved they escalate to the highest office y um and often these problems involve our most vulnerable students in their families I know Martha and I have spoken about this um they often feel like Outsiders and unheard um can you
discuss a time when you didn't handle something as well as you would have liked and what you would do differently now yeah the first thing that comes to mind is how I handled um the start of the GSA at the middle school so the late great
Sandy moltz GSA is uh the G Alliance y everybody else so um when that when when Sandy came to me uh I mean eight or nine years ago whatever it was I thought we weren't ready I thought the kids were too young
and she just kept on coming at me kept on coming at me and finally I said yeah let's do it let's do I was waiting for backlash that never came and now it's such a thriving um program at our school open mic nights um kids another place where kids can go to feel connected to
other kids is what we want so when I looked back on it I was like oh my God I should have done that year one um because anything that we can build into our school where kids want to come every single day is the ultimate goal and I was late with that one and she was right
I'm going to push you a little bit okay can you think of times when it didn't go where you would change how you dealt with a particular family or particular student that you maybe would re rescript if you could I don't I don't know if this is
what you're looking for but I'll answer this and then if it's not press me again okay so I think and this isn't about our most vulnerable group certainly when I say the sentence but I think of algebra um what algebra so e8th grade algebra
there's a criteria you get a 9 average you have you know exceeding on mcast you have the teacher recommendation you have the I ready and I used to kids would miss families would come in and I'd say you know sorry you didn't you didn't make the team and I would say that to
them and then finally um we started having discussions because I thought that was sort of like being strong and supporting the teachers because what I didn't want and what I thought was going to happen is that the kid that didn't earn getting in ended up complaining that the teacher's bad and that you know
it's all the teachers fault that I have a CD so that's where it came from but I didn't let families in and then it's on on me at some point like all right we're a public school and we want kids to be challenged and we want families who care that's part of what's great about being in swamp Scot we have
you know um the families are engaged and they have opinions so we started allowing the overrides with you have to do the summer packet okay as much as I hate packets I I do think it is valuable for the override students um and now
like last year we had 75 kids taking algebra and some of the kids that were overrides were a students and some of them Rose to the challenge so again when I look back on it sort of thinking that there were certainly kids that probably could have um gained a lot from that
experience and um and benefited and families could have benefited do I wish I could do that over again of course because I think we should have allowed overrides from the jump yeah Karen I think that's a really good Insight I like that one um so let's talk
budget okay um so the budgeting process is one of our greatest hurdles at the moment um how would you prioritize funding to align with District goals yeah I know this is easier said than done but I mean we cannot afford to lose
teachers we cannot we are not this like we don't have all the bells and whistles um I think my top priority would be teacher retention the I mean if you lose somebody you're not getting somebody back and anytime anybody leaves at this point to be honest with you I used talk
about change when people used to leave I I would be like ah hit that to me and now and now I don't blame anybody you know if if people it's a really hard job with um incredible expectations that are almost impossible to fulfill so if we
have Allstar people I don't want to lose them so the budget has to keep that in mind that we cannot lose teachers and yes do we have to build programs for the kids um yeah but I I would say our top priority would be making sure that our teachers aren't aren't
cut absolutely so how do you balance that at the same time that we also recognize that we need um social services that you know we were just talking a few minutes ago about you know having therapy and those people that are dedicated to the multisystems of support
yeah so how do how do how would you balance that and here's the thing I know that as I ask this question there's nobody who has this answer yeah I think it's going to be a challenge to and you see this in towns all over the Commonwealth that you know how do you pay teachers what they deserve and keep
these systems in place and have the mental health staff in place and then not fire every two years later when you can't afford them you know and that that's really what the challenge is and that comes with creative thinking and creative problem solving that's something that our leadership team would have to to tackle because I do think
it's a priority that we it's you know we're not operating under this we have all these things that are extra so it's really tough to like trim the fat there's not a whole lot of fat here um but it's I think it's advocating for more money from the town making sure that the community knows about this and
and making sure that um we don't make the grave mistake of of eliminating teachers and by teacher I mean staff I mean like counsel as well anybody that's directly impacting kids we can't lose yeah I'm going to follow up with that
too and you talked about aacy and um we we are facing and we are not alone facing a a school budget challenge um the town also has other challenges they have other contracts they have fire they have police they have DPW and then they
have probably their largest expense which is the the school district um and I agree with you there's not a whole lot if any fat left to go at the same time you as the leader need to guide and help the school committee to fight for literally every dollar yeah and
sometimes fight when a room full of people disagree with you what's your thought about making presentations in front of town meeting making presentations to us and more importantly we are very lucky right now to have an amazing business manager yeah how would
you go about working with all of us to get the budget that our students need and deserve yeah I work closely with Mella right now she is incredible and she's such an amazing resource for the district um I'm completely comfortable talking in front of town meeting or at
you know Community forums um or presenting at Town Hall to making sure that people understand the the connection between their property value and schools that are great and just because we have and of course we have this brand new beautiful school that doesn't mean we're all set and I think
that's I hope that's not what people think that oh well they just got the brand new $100 million school and now we can just you know not worry about the schools for a couple years as somebody who lives in the Middle School um um you know I I know about the challenging issues with um that we're facing there
and you know it can't stop if we want the this to be the town that we all want it to be for our kids to grow up in and have the educational system that we all moved here for then we we're going to have to fight for the money and work collaboratively with this I I'll frame it this way I don't want to fight before
I haven't before I have don't have the job or don't even know who's over but I would like to work collaboratively with the town to make sure that um we're all on the same page and I know we're probably not going to get everything we asked for but you know why not ask for everything that we do need great perfect
so so so um so as the leader of the school district um do you have some ideas about um relationship building with the lead of the Town side and and and the chair chair people of the of the boards yeah I mean if I were to get the
job I think that would be one of my first so like and you would do it how I'd want to meet with them I'd call and say I think we should meet I'd want to introduce myself talk about my values I think another thing a little side the box is I do I would love to establish
another SEF because I think that those are valuable and J just wrote everyone oh sorry swamp SC Educational Foundation meaning that if you have um swamp's got educational fundraising uh Foundation that's fundraising for
funds that if we could fundraise privately you know given a number or whatever $100,000 that's $100,000 that we're not spending on something else for the budget for the operating budget so I do think we have to show the town that we're willing to think outside the box to make connections outside of the um
town government and um and I think that will help too like look we're not just coming to you for the money we're we're coming we're going a lot of different places for this money and you know hopefully that will help um build a relationship and show that we're willing to to go above and beyond to get what
the kids need great yeah thank you Susan um um can you talk about teacher evaluation and um how you would continue or um update our evaluation program to to um uh and talk about staff
accountability sure and um your IDE ideas and what you think we need yeah I would say that it's probably people have probably said this I I'm I am definitely a stickler with um the evaluation system for our non-pts teachers I mean I think
it's really hard to get pts to the middle school I think wa you're non what you're non non pts so you're non-professional status teachers so but how about okay I'm just starting yeah so um and because I would say the evaluation system for the way it's set
up you know I I pride myself I try to be in the classrooms every single day sometimes multiple times a day so I know what's happening in the classrooms that doesn't mean it's always AV valuative and you know I have to be mindful of that but um I always put our focus on the nonprofessional status
teachers because um that's where you have a little bit more say to be honest with you a little bit more wilgar room so for the professional status teachers and for you know we have to have what do we think is important like what do we want to see and make it really
clear also with the evaluation system sometimes it's like show two-way Communications families it's like oh here's an email from a parents like check the box so I will say that sometimes we have teachers who are outstanding teachers outstanding Educators that our kids are lucky to have them or lucky to have them and that is the case in the middle school I will
say um and across the district but you might not be great at the uploading of the proof vice versa you might have somebody that's struggling that's great at uploading the evidence so I think we really need to make sure that's practical that it's meaningful and it's not just sort of
like a um you know it's not just something people can throw together and if you're great at uploading info that it looks like you're this great teacher because on paper things look one way but when you're in the classroom every day and you see what's happening you know the truth so I'm you know very confident in
um how I feel about the teachers in my building I know strengths and we discuss weaknesses and work on them together and that's never having those conversations has never been difficult for me I I mean I think that's the only way to grow as a school and vice versa I always welcome
people into my office if I've made a mistake um I want them to tell me okay but as a superintendent you're you're here and you have three three building principles right so how how how are you managing how how are you you know you're not going I mean you can go into
classrooms and you probably still will go into classrooms but you won't be doing it as you're doing it now and so you need to you need to manage um an elementary school a middle school and a high school and and I would argue that your your experience seems to be in the Middle School primarily right and the
high school is is a different beast and and there's definitely issues that um need to be tackled so I'm just sort of like how are you how are you getting your administrators to to evaluate as um yeah well in some ways as far as you
know right I know the Middle School like the back of my hand and that's that's just the facts of it that's that's what it is but you know Sor worked to be for six years um and so I think how she we talk about the same things and the same
values of what we're looking for for an evaluation we ask we lean on each other with certain things um miss a I'm working with every single day you know obviously the high school I'm not hear as much um so I would have to get in there and see what are the issues but I do think that if I'm in charge of the
leadership team and I'm in charge of the principles we have to get on the same page what are we looking for what are we expecting and what are we going to do when we're not seeing it and and there in lives the rub I mean that's what has to happen so okay um before I move on Sam do you
have a question um yeah I mean it was touched upon earlier obviously teacher retention is something that's very important to me you know many students at the high school and I've met parents at all levels seeing is how many people are here now um OB obiously it's bargaining season for the teachers this year I kind of just wanted you to you
know touch a little bit more on like your values as far as you know how you plan to approach I know um so Conor asked you how you plan to approach balancing that with other aspects of the job but um you know can you talk a little bit more about your values of far as like teachers and how that's going to
how that's going to work with throughout the three schools yeah like I said I mean teacher retention is vital and not just teacher retention outstanding teachers that's who we need to retain um people that care about the kids and are excellent at
their Craft um and I would work with the union and the town government and like I said trying to establish an SCF to make sure that we have enough funds to make sure that not only we keeping the teachers but also building programs and having everything else that we need I mean it's a lot of stuff I mean these
the Promethean boards don't pay for themselves and the Chromebooks and um all these things but you know we can talk about you know technolog is important of course it is we can talk about um you know all the things that we need to run a successful school but it it's really
hard to do it unless we have the right people in place yeah so yeah I've always valued what teachers bring to the table I and I've always listen this the middle school has a really good reputation I would say and it's not because of me I
mean if I could have all the ideas in the world and think that you know this is great we should do this and we should try that if I don't if there's no teachers there in imp menting those plans and being on board and establishing a culture in the building and smart enough to to challenge the kids that need to be challenged and get
the kids who are struggling up to where they need to be I mean the school's not where where it should be so I think that that is the most important thing that we can we can figure out thank you yeah and I know it's not going to be easy to do it but
great can I follow up absolutely sorry um so to that end it is as Sam said we're going into bargaining so um how comfortable are you joining that process and and digging in there that would probably be new um yeah i' love I'd love to be part of that process
okay yeah obviously you're working with the teachers and we do it as collaborative collaboratively as possible but it can also get very awkward at times um so do you feel like you're prepared for that yeah of course you know I've never shot away from difficult conversations I mean I
remember being a teacher in picketing I always thinking like like uh and then having it happen here where you know the teachers come in um work to Ru or whatever or or picking up front and it's always uncomfortable but I think if
everybody knows where you're coming from that we're we all want the same thing U for the most part that you can come to some common ground yeah and I look forward to that process yeah go ahead so um kind of going back to the previous
question Jason so um I've heard you mention the word culture a number of times I've heard culture collaboration culture sure and you know as as the superintendent I'm just wondering what attributes that you think would make an
effective culture kind of systemwide you know I know you've talked about the Middle School culture but just kind of thinking you know kind of big picture what what attributes are important to you to establish that culture I mean I think again effective communication effect that creative problem solving because going to have problems we're going to have to work
collaboratively um and communicate well I think the visibility is key and you know the kids and the teachers need to know that you respect them and you know the teachers are professionals I want to treat them as such and the
kids we're here for them and I want them to know that so um it's frustrating listen we do three times a year we do these safety and respect talks at the middle school with the kids we want to talk to them about everything in between the phones and if we have a shelter in place and all these things and the words
we use now does that mean which stops all mean things that are said no but we try to get ahead of it as much as possible I'd love to see that happen in every single school um I'd love to see you know because if the kids feel like this is their this is their Harvard like
this is their this is how how we're going to get to it this is their private school because it it is in a lot of ways like there's so many opportunities here and and so much um so many great things that happen here and so many talented people that I want the kids to feel how lucky they are and I know it's not easy for a 13 14 or 15y
old to to think wow so lucky to be in math right now right um but long term the goal is I want these kids to be creative problem solvers to be able to collaborate in a Workforce to be well adjusted and happy and have whatever
career they'd like and then to look back one day and say wow I was so it because it's not it's like delayed gratification which we're not Creed at right now especially with the phones but I want them to look back and say wow I was so lucky to be here I was so lucky to go to school in swamp Scott K through 12 um
and that is sometimes it's delay but we have to ship away at that college piece by piece grade by grade I remember when I first started the preschools connected to the to the middle school and um it was my first year at the middle school and there were kids holding hands and
skipping down the hallway to the bathroom right by the office and I'm looking at them and I'm thinking that doesn't look like the seventh grade you know and how do we get maybe they're not skipping and holding hands but how do we get them to want to be here how do we get them to to have that sense of
love that they want to come to school every day um and that's the challenge so that's how we have to build the culture with that in mind with the bottom with the um with the idea that happy kids and engaged kids and happy staff that want
to be here every day that talented is how we're going to build the culture and kids that feel valued and respected as well sorry can can you talk about help help happy staff because how how how you change the culture to sort of increase morale in a building right now that doesn't have great morale that's tricky
yeah I think I'd really I mean I have to get in to the buildings and see exactly what the issue is and I think um I think the first priority would to be get in spend as much time in the other two buildings as I can um not to
leave them school out of it but I I'm I know what's happening there so I'd have to get in the other two buildings and see what the issues are and how we can help to solve them so it's tough to answer until I get in there I guess or if I was lucky enough to get in there um if I got the job but
that's so it sounds like you have a process in mind like a concept of how you would approach you know addressing you know of course yeah you need to get in there you need to get in the classrooms you need to talk to the teachers you have to have meetings with the teachers and make sure that they're they trust you enough to have open honest conversations um again listen the
Middle School wasn't always so and not that we don't have our moments we certainly do but um you know a very um complicated building I think where we have not compli but we had a lot of people have really strong opinions about
things I mean moving advisory to the morning instead of the afternoon was like an act of Congress starting morning music was not easy you know there was you know people emailing me really upset about some of these changes um but over time you show people that you really care that you have good ideas that you might not get them all right
but when you do you try to fix them and then they want to get on board as well can you talk a little bit more about these changes and and the kinds of emails that you got was were they from teachers were they yeah so when we moved so advisory for those of you don't know so advisory now was in the morning okay when I got there it was in the afternoon
then it was in the middle then we rotated it and um actually I was at Lun juty one day and an eighth grade student came up to me and she said you know see in my old school in Connecticut we used to have advit in the morning because that way if kids were late um it didn't
really impact learning and then if we had a test or quiz that day we could we could kind of review it that is a genius so the out of the MTH of so yeah so when we started though everybody thought that we were going to all the kids would come at
855 that didn't happen because they want to be here so um so that's when advisory ends but what it did did was you know yes there's still kids who are tardy but do they still have the consequence for being tardy absolutely but are they missing math instruction are they walking into your English class and disrupting everything because they're
late no which has been great so that that took a little bit but it was a culture change it was a schedule change um yeah so I I think why would why why would the why would that why was that difficult for teachers I think change is difficult sometimes yeah I like I said
morning music the first time I played so the morning music came from we had some students who work chronically tardy and um I thought let's just let's see what happens if we play music in the morning see if it just like changes the energy in the building and people emailed me who made this decision you know why
didn't we we told about and you know a small portion of people with it but I got some emails that people weren't happy I like you know if you want to pick the song you can it's all right whatever and then we've been doing it ever since and then you know Miss Sor stole it at the elementary school and they all think it's her idea
so it is interesting to hear that that would have been controversial yeah I would think that that would be John uh Jason changing gears a little bit I I know you've you've mentioned you know phones in the Middle School a
couple of times I think just kind of technology is a larger issue I'm just wondering you know what your thoughts are and how that can you know enhance the learning environment districtwide going forward if you got the role well I think you know
in some ways it's dangerous as far as enhancing the learning envirment I think it can go both ways I mean we had Cliff Notes I guess right and uh kids now could just go on AI and they could type up a paper pretty quickly I would imagine so I think we have to be really
smart about um figuring out where we can the kids can benefit how it can enhance learning but also having safety measures in place to make sure that we're not just you know we have to keep academic Integrity in mind so it's really it's really tricky I mean one of the things we decided in the
middle school was that we want the vast majority of like writing pieces to be done in in in school um I don't know if that's happening at other other um schools or not but it's definitely a challenge and um we need to be certainly
you know luckily Miss Mackie nolles does an amazing job sending teachers things to look out for and and informing our students but maybe we do need to talk to the students more and engage them in the process a little bit more because that's not really about phones what you talking about you're talking about the work right and yeah so yeah we need to use
the use the technology um and take advantage of the technology but also be mindful of like it's it's easier to cheat than ever you know I mean we had a big um text message rain a few years ago it's like just everybody there 50 kids on it like
here's the answer number one through 10 you know and just every nobody but so ultimately we had to talk to the kids once we got they got caught was like well who's this benefiting yeah you got your homework done but like you all just failed the test because none of you know what you're doing so I think it's informing the kids having honest
discussions with them finding ways that technology can help but making sure we're being really safe about it and smart about so the kids are still independent think thinkers as well I want to follow up with that I mean I don't know if you've read but there's a a lawsuit going on right now a high school student Holliston Holbrook um
could be incorrect on the town and uh this particular student was assigned a a large project and they weren't explicitly told not to use
AI they did use Ai and they were marked as cheating um it was hangam by the way I sorry yeah um and so they were marked as cheating and this particular student um won't be allowed on National H Society there's a lot of Ripple down effects yeah um what's your thought
about Ai and you know we you talked a little bit about it but can you expand that I'm really thinking on on a high school level yeah High School I think it has to be part of um you know the handbook and really clear expectations syllabus handbook what are our expectations how can you use it I think
we need to teach I mean it it would be I don't think it would be smart to run away from it I think we have to use it as a tool but be really clear to the kids so they know in a in a syllabus in a handbook what's okay and you know and I think the reason that in that story if I remember correctly it was because of
like the the numerical F that the kid got correct kept them up you know the 60 would have kept him in National societ whatever um I think in that case we need to be really reasonable too we're not why yeah he was fa he was I'm sorry the the the child was failed right right but
it was um I think that we can I'm all about test corrections I think we you know you might not get it the first time if we fail or or if somebody um makes a mistake we have to I'd like to see what they can do and I think we give the kid an opportunity you don't bury the kid
over over mistakes let's let's let them write their own essay or whatever it was and see if we can grade that one great um so I want to ask just a little bit about graduation high school students going to college going to work going to the Armed
Forces um we are a community on a healthy average that many of our students do attend two or four year college coming out of high school uh we are lucky there are though a ever growing number of students yeah who after graduation go to the workforce go
into Armed Forces maybe do a different type of schooling as the leader of the district you have competing forces you have people chirping here and say well we need to get as close to 100% colle you know kids going to college as be possible and you have people who are
saying well my child is not a college student but he's a good student how talk to us a little bit about your philosophy about that I think that we have to offer what's best for each kid and if
you know if you want to go to an Ivy League school you should be able to get that from SW high school if that's your goal if you want to go to the military or have some uh be an electrician or a plumber you should be able to get to that from s high school so I think we need to have options while not lowering
any expectations in any sort of area we need to have options for everybody and um I think that that part of our mission should be getting kids prepared for whatever it is they they want to do in life and if it's um going to the
workforce I think that's great if that's their choice I don't think everybody has to fit in the box and do the same exact thing that's why success is such an interesting to measure we can talk about mcast or we can talk about the the rankings of high schools the way I would measure success is do we have Smart well
adjusted successful students who are um are made you know whether it's in their career or in college or in the military that are um have all the tools that they need to be successful is really what we're looking
for great H um want to shift gears a little bit can you talk about a difficult relationship that you have professionally um and without you don't obviously have to say who it is but what what is what makes it difficult and how
do you respond to this person to get what you need to get done yeah I can say this that sometimes um intent and impact Emily and I talk a lot to the kids about this but intent and impact are things that we need to be
mindful of too so for example I again I think this is what you're asking but if it's not what you want just let me know afterwards so from the time I got to the middle school and I don't even know how it started it was like we you're the system you go to the math department meetings always so I
just that was my thing I went to the math department and then when I became principal I went to all the math department meetings not realizing that I was kind of alienating everybody else because our Focus was like how are we going to get the math scores up how we going to get the math scores up what are we doing with algebra should we override should you know this that should we have pods to start the classes do we need
exit tickets whatever it was and I think that if I could do it over again I would have been more transparent with other department heads because I think they felt slighted and how come you never come to the other places so I think when you talk about strained relationships or
anything that um along those lines I think I have to be self-reflective and say all right how did we get here what was my role in it and how do I fix it because ultimately like again I want people to want to stay here and teach especially when they're
talented and so I I'd have to mend that relationship does that make sense yeah I I think I I'm trying to get at a little bit more of like what kind of what kind of person it do you sort of rub up against what what's difficult for
you really depends um I TR let me just think for a second sorry take your time because I think in turn that also talks about where you're you know where your own personal biases yeah yeah biases and you know what you wish you could do better
sure um I think I think I can say this because he retired that you know Mr Butler who I love we we butt heads quite a few times I think he would agree if he was sitting right next to me he would say we had some probably overthe toop shouting
matches that got really heated about certain things and he is um strong willed and really smart and had strong opinions about what whatever the case may be um
and it festered and I didn't you know we we literally was like we broke up in high school like I would walk by him in the hallway we weren't speaking for a couple weeks you know and then we and then we'd have sort of a yelling match and then it was okay and then you know to his credit um who he
used to be my teacher by the way I you know we sat down and talked about it but it would happen you know we'd have arguments and disagreements on things about what you know policy or protocol or what we should do with certain kids or um or why a kid's missing his class
or whatever it was um so we have a lot of disagreements from the Middle School I think that's part of what we've established if people disagree with me that's okay I don't have all the right answers and sometimes I'm wrong and and come into the office and let's talk about it um so I am okay with things like that as long as it's coming from a
good place um as long as you're passionate about the student learning about the kids but he and I about yeah that's what you're looking for and and it wasn't always easy but I knew he was a great teacher and he I think he had a lot of respect for me and it ended
up being fine so you got to be able to disagree and then move on too so do you think that you guys were butting heads because he was strong wed absolutely or and so am I okay yes absolutely I I want to duil on that let
in a similar way the five of us are pretty darn strong MH um you as the leader sometimes have to make decisions that we will wholeheartedly disagree with yeah
but as as I say all the time the only person we hire is the superintendent although I can always will make the argument about the business manager but that's for a different day um so how would you you talk to us because at the end of the day when you're sitting up
here as superintendent you're really running the show right you know we are here to ask questions to offer guidance but at the end of the day you're running the show this is your District the the it stops with you good bad and different
it stops with you yeah so how would you go from and I think we're asked earlier but I really I want to I want to tease this out a little bit because it's really important you go from a principle of one building to you run the show not only do you run the show in the other three buildings but you run the show
here with the five of us who are elected and again we're all strong willed we all have sometimes our own agendas course but you know we we vote and the majority does a rule here right so how would you not only deal with us but just deal with this whole it's kind of a different
world yeah and by the way before you say that it's absolutely not a negative because we have a current superintendent who kind of did the same thing they you know superintendent angelakis grew into the role she didn't know what she didn't know initially
yeah yeah I mean I am all for healthy debate and I don't I've never shot away from difficult conversations or shot away from competition or you know anything that could be construed as negative I actually don't look it as a negative if you have your five opinions
and six Sam and seven with no like I I think we all need to come to the table and talk about those things if we disagree sort of like what happens every single day like we can all collaborate in school ultimately it's my call right and so I would say the same thing here that um you know you can all have your
opinions and I can have mine but it would be my call if I got the job so and I and I'm comfortable with that I mean I again it's I don't think you can have the job that I've had for the last 13 years and and you can't make everybody happy and I couldn't possibly pull every single person in swamp Scott
with every single decision I make on a day-to-day basis right um nor could I call the five ofu it just it couldn't work that way so I think that respectful dialogue and and hopefully disagreeing without being disagreeable is things that we can sort of lay as a foundation
but as long as the core values of are we doing what's best for kids are we are we moving the district forward if that's at the Forefront of everybody's mind then let's talk about it and hash it out great thank you thank you can I absolutely so Jason and I appreciate
that response I I think what I've been hearing through glance question and some of the others is you know what would what attributes make would make you effective if you were offered the role you know if you were here or you were in you know you know administering over the
the three schools um so just coming back to that concept of you know what would what would make you effective um you know I know the current superintendent um participates in some I don't know if it's regional consortiums local consortiums the other
superintendents and what I've heard you say you know you mentioned misso coming to you with hey I got some some ideas and students coming to you with ideas others coming to you with ideas and you know it's like all right let's talk about it and I think that's that's a great attribute to have um is that something you know that that Consortium
you know I know again the current superintendent does participate but you know going to that and you know with with that mindset that you've talked about here and saying I want to I want to bring back some things that I think would help this district and being open to do that and you know coming back
talking about those things of course I would say as a principal I'm I'm part of a round table as well and it is so valuable just to see people's ideas what are they going through how did you start um an enrichment block how did you do this uh you know there's a million
things that come through there mostly now it's like does anybody have a math teacher does anybody have a science teacher but it's been invaluable so I would love to be um part of that same Association and I think that branching outside of just swamp would be naive to think that all the great ideas here I think there's very talented people in
the room um and like I said before Pam has put us in such a great position with such a strong leadership team but I mean there's amazing out Minds out there as well so I would like to tap into um all possible resources to make sure that we're hearing ideas and talking about
them and seeing if they work for us now some ideas sound great on paper and then when you implement them they're either not practical or you rob Peter to pay Paul and you didn't realize that something else you know went down a level because you
added this program or this situation and then we have to be smart enough to say all right we tried it it didn't work let's try something else and you have to be able to admit that or else again how do you grow and how do you take risks if you think that you're locked into them always great thank you
Karen um how would you work with all stakeholders in developing and implementing School Improvement plans across the district yeah so School councils are vital for that we have um I think getting participation what my
guess I don't know if this is true my guess is as the as you get to high school maybe the participation like maybe it's like PTO where you don't have the same amount of people sort of jumping to be part of your school council but that goes to um we need the community we need people on board um to
get the message about what we need um to to identify strengths and weaknesses in the district and when it is a weakness how do we solve it and you can't do that in a vacuum so you have to have um all stakehold stakeholders at the table and
we need participation and part of that that family engagement piece that I talked about before that the more we can bring families in and the more we can have them as part of the solution if they're upset about something then let's hear them out and see if we can come up with a solution or if they see something as a relative weakness okay let's identify it let's see if it's actually
actually isn't a relative weakness and let's try to make improvements so I think we it's vital Not only would I um want to do that I think you have to do that because it's vital to make any sort of change true no can I ask you a question about that of course so I I
know some of the people on your school council not everybody though do you who do you who do you pick to be on your school council and how do you pick them so we just send an email out and say who wants in yeah and then when nobody
responds we start following up with some calls so we've really had a lot some people you know one of the people doesn't even have a kid there anymore so we just have um do you invite people onto your Council who you disagree with or who you could I mean a lot of time I
don't even they don't even know who I am you know so when they start and so it's part of same with the PTO like it's I think the reason why it's good to have those people come in here is say all right like I'm going to come to a PTO meeting we have random people show up at a PTO meeting it's not a lot I mean usually it's the same three four five but sometimes
somebody new will come in and I love that because it's like okay so now you can hear about our values what we want in the district what we're doing for your kid and um how we plan on being successful and if you disagree or have an idea or heard something I want to hear it you know that's I think the
parent coffees that we talked about before as far as the families in I think the first one had like 40 people and the last one had like one but that's okay you know people are you give them the opportunity to come in and have discussions and if we disag agree again I'm
not it's okay to disagree as long as we have a plan in place that we're being respectful and we also um are doing something about it I just don't want to like argue for the sake of arguing I want to have a plan in place that and and the school councils are really important in that role just want to do a
quick shout out to the uh elementary school PTO I had an opportunity last Thursday to um visit with them there were 45 odd 50 people there it was it was great it really was um suzan um I have a have a quick follow-up question then a real then a then another question
but when talking about technology didn't touch on um Elementary School at all and I just want just just a basic philosophy of of of one kid should have those iPads and and what amount of screen time should they have in elementary I think in short and kind of what we have right
now I don't to be honest I don't know how often they're on the iPads during the school school day I'd have to get in there and talk to the S board I would say that I personally wouldn't want them to just be I mean I get nervous about the M school be in all Chromebooks to be honest with you I mean despite the I
mean never mind the cost of how they break and things like that but it definitely is alarming I would say the further we can push that I mean whether you're on a iPad and kindergarten or I think we can wait till they're a little bit older I wouldn't want them on there all all day I think they need paper
pencil I think they need to be Hands-On I think they need to be you know we want kids to want to go to recess and not want to be on their iPad so um you know I feel the same way as a parent like I wouldn't want my kids on screens all
day that's I just wanted to hear that but I want to I want to switch to the the high school and and talk about discipline and your thoughts about um um discipline at the high school and um social justice and and um some
alternative types of discipline rather than expelling or or really punitive things yeah and advis yeah I think suspension I mean if you look at our suspension rates um there's I mean we've found that there's no discrepancy between you know
different groups and it's very minimal like I sometimes spending kids is what did you just do like you're now on your iPad or on PlayStation or whatever it is at home you know I want kids in school so unless it's really severe I mean of course if
there's a fight or something you you can't be here if there's something that's racially charged or anti-semitic or homophobic like you can't be here right now you got to go but let's come back let's do the work to make sure that it's not just punitive that you you know we have the knock questions at the
middle school where if a kid does something like that they have to when they come back they have to answer all these questions that we have about what was the intent what was the impact how would you be done things differently did you realize the words you said and you know am I I'd be lying to if I said sometimes they weren't just like buzzing
through it but I do think it's valuable and they need to sit for a second and you know discipline is nobody's looking to be punitive I mean it's the same it's like you know has timeout ever worked for any parent or is that just me that it doesn't work
for like timeout doesn't really work so I would say detention and and things like that you have to have detention because you have to have people respecting the building if you show disrespect to the building or disrespect to the teacher or disrespect to a classmate is a consequence but that's not the end goal the end goal is to like why did that happen and how do we not do
it again how do you learn so that to be a valuable member of the society and not do it again so you know I am certainly I would much rather kids be in school than suspended do I think you need detention to to make sure that everybody's doing the right thing sure yeah um and then
you have to you have to look at your suspension rates and you have to look at your detention to see all right are the discrepancies there which I think you're alluding to right is that like are are is one group of kids being punished more than another um I think that's something that you you'd have to check and look at the data on
that great thank you uh Sam do you have another question I was going to ask about obviously right now um being the Middle School principal you have you know a very strong connection with all the students um I think were you to take
this position at a greater level but especially with the high school how would you sort of I don't want to say initiate because obviously you have experience with all these kids but it's it's at a different level um how would you sort of you know aim to maintain a good relationship with students obviously you have me and no El as
student Representatives but you know more generally um what do you foresee in like sort of that area of your job yeah well I think that strong connections with kids is so important I think we I need to hear your ideas and what's
working and what's not working I would love to meet with every class several times a year just you know how we used to do that theater you know back in same thing you know let's let's talk about some of the issues let's talk about expectations um I'd like to be really transparent and um open about what I see
is um our values and work with you indell and other student leaders to see if we're all on the same page and then make sure that the students are part of the process but also you know I I I know myself I would need to still have those uh those meetings and
making sure that kids know who I am and want to come to me with problems and I want to be part of the solution not like oh I'll go to the principal like no that's this is why I chose education I want to help um in the in the process K to 12 one of the things we say always is like listen they're all our kids um if a
kid has something that happens when they're in 11th grade or 12th grade or or kindergarten they're all our kids it's all our problem it's it's the things that we want to just like you know when the high school won the Blue Ribbon thing we all celebrated it was all of us you know when the eth grade had tremendous mcast scores this year
that wasn't just the eighth grade that was k to8 um and the same thing when kids are going to colleges or choosing the career that they want to or going to the Armed Forces like we should all celebrate those things um because they're all our kids but back to your question I think that those meetings
with each grade would be really important I agree yeah great thank you s John so Jason just I want to come back to something you said a few minutes ago about um you said if something wasn't working you know will admit hey it's not
working and make a course correction and I think that's a great philosophy I don't want to put words in your mouth but I think kind of with that response I think what I'm hearing you say is um as part of kind of your tone from the top you're encouraging your senior
leadership team the principles to escalate those things that may not be working that as appropriate but you know up to the superintendent level for discussion is that I hear that correctly of course I mean listen like I said before I mean I know without getting in
there so much that I know the hot button topic is the high school schedule like we made a change and I'm sure there's pros I'm sure there's some cons I've I've heard from both ends I think we need to look at that again and see how's it impacting time on learning how's it impacting attendance I mean change for
the sake of change isn't what we want to do we need to look at what we've done is it working and like I said not be afraid to say okay it didn't turn out quite how we thought let's let's get back to the drawing board yeah great
um I think what I what I have learned from um superintendent angelakis and uh folks before her is a superintendent can't do it all there's only so many hours in the day yeah and the delegation of duties and
responsibilities even though it does rest with you at the end of the day yeah is is vital I mean you you can't attend every meeting right you can't meet with every parent I mean I I I will say one of the things the the chain of command where if there is a challenge is
really important yeah uh talk to us a little bit about you know how you would delegate those duties down I mean I think my expectation level would be that the principles handle things sort of how I handle them now that you know they're going to have to be the um have the
final say at the building level if things escalate of course you know I would have to get involved but I think you know being a principal is a really difficult job and there's a lot of responsibility and sometimes you you're not same thing you're you're saying things that people
don't like or that's not popular and that's part of the job so um I would be really clear about expectations about about the fact that you know the chain of command starts with them and then would escalate up if if need be
okay great and if I have the right sorry I was say if I have the right people in place right and you know Pam has set such a great team up I I don't foresee that being a major issue but certainly you know I like to get my hands dirty and get involved in things so if if need be I'd get involved sure um if we could
everybody one more question a piece so I see one of the advantages of hiring from within the ability to to spend between now and uh the time that our superintendent leaves as sort of a
really long Runway yeah so um and and also just grateful for the fact that we had so many you know to the to the so many so such a strong team that said in your eyes what would
you see over the next eight months or nine months as where you want to what do you want to develop in yourself for the role do you mean as a leader or just as far as the um like the ins and outs of things yes both yeah ins and outs of
things I mean honestly I I I've been coming to school committee meetings for like years and and I love doing it it's so interesting but sometimes the process stuff from like when when are you allowed to speak and when is it a vote and things like that so that but that's small stuff I mean I'll figure that out
um I think delegation is going to be um something that I would really need to work on and see how Pam does that just back to Glenn's question before um I think she does an excellent job of putting people that she trusts in positions to make decisions but I also
know you know how I how I am and I would I think I would have to let you know step back a little bit in certain areas to make sure that you know I'm trusting people to to make those decisions and and and be that's an important part of the leadership is not just trusting people to do it but allowing for risk
you know allowing people to take risks and not necessarily being punitive when it doesn't work out of course right of course I mean that's similar to I mean you know Emily orori or whoever was the assistant principal at the time the same thing like you know the first year
together we're working together you're getting to know each other and then each year it's like the Rope gets bigger and and and now I mean I'm Emily could run whatever she wants to run so it's so it's it's not uh but it takes Trust it takes time it takes collaboration it
takes like really showing each other that you care and where you're coming from and when you disagree having those open and honest conversations that then you say all right you know I I trust their judgment and it's going to be fine Ken so just just to summarize so
your answer to her question is that for the next eth month your eight eight months let's say your priority is to see um to to sort of see and understand um um using your team well yeah what she takes on what she pass up right but I'm
just so so how about getting yourself up to speed on budget stuff like how familiar are you I mean I know you've seen the budget obviously but like how familiar are you with like how it works and and and the cost centers we use and how Cheryl does things like how comfortable are you with with sort of
that I'm comfortable but I mean obviously there's room to grow and I meet with so a few years ago I was asking all these questions because what happened was I think so my first year as principal I think we had cuts and we had to get rid of teachers and then I was like well that's over and then it happened again and again and again I was
like I need to really understand where this is coming from so then I started you know um you know calculating my own retirements and what what we've saved in hires and sending them to Pam and finally she was just like you need to go you need to go meet with Cheryl and she's been invaluable I mean just
learning the process um going line item by line item to see what's important um and what we can afford quite frankly so I mean I'm comfortable with the process I'm comfortable with um I sat in those presentations and I afterwards I would look at her slideshows I mean I don't
know how many times she presented the budget last year but every time I was like oh I learned something new um so I think that's there's going to be a lot more of that as well and working with the town government to making sure that that we're getting what we deserve and what we need yeah so you can commit to
already starting to sort of do that work alongside yeah yeah and and to I already have started with with Cheryl but I think that would be a prime example of something that I would I would use for the next eight months for great Karen um what support do you
think you would need from us from the school committee that first year if you were to get the role I would say just I'm not implying that anybody's dis I would just say like honestly if you're upset with something or if you have a different idea instead of talking about
like come see me and let's figure it out and um I I guess transparency I guess I would want transparency that if there's an issue come talk to me and if there something that you a decision I made that you weren't happy with let's let's talk about it and see why it was made
and how we could have done it differently but transparency and just having an open line of communication would be a huge step okay yeah cool and I think oh sorry God no no I was just going to say um you know typically you come to the meetings or you have um most of your contact would
be with the chair whoever the chair is at the time but um it's usually sort of up to the superintendent whether they want to hear from other members or if you want to keep it through the chair um but I mean the first year I would think would be a little bit interesting
because there's such a learning curve and you know I would hope that whoever came into the role would lean on the on the committee as much as they needed yeah I mean I would I I would guess that I would want to hear from all five of you and and obviously
you go through the chair and go through the right channels but if somebody has an idea or a question or let's let's talk about it yeah I think that'd be a really good thing again just going back to just the just a vast knowledge that all of us have um
suzan [Music] um um so I I feel like I I feel like I know what your answer is going to be but I think um um I think that maybe if you
can talk about some situational things but how do you handle the blatant and blatant both blatant and subtle instances of bigotry or anti-Semitism or gender bullying some of those I mean yeah so I don't know what you think my
answer is going to be but let's let's see what happens so I um I think that everything we do has to be incredibly intentional setting expectations with kids making sure they know um their intent and their impact um have we
despite the fact that we do those safety and respect meetings three times a year despite the fact that there's a massive Holocaust unit in the eth grade the the fact we take them to DC to the Holocaust Museum do we still have things that happen of course um despite the books that we read and book club and what we
put on our walls and the the back to those meetings again do we we have racial incidents absolutely do we have um you know unfortunate things that happen despite best efforts of course that's going to happen and I think what we have to do is
um is keep having those meetings and keep having those discussions about expectations and and what's right and what's wrong um and making sure that um when things do happen students again understand
their impact on the Society on the school on the individual that they harmed um but it's it's all encompassing it's the books we read it's what's on our walls it's how we talk to each other it is um hearing from families so I
think that do I do I think that every single middle school kid say or even high school kid that makes a mistake or I shouldn't say makes that makes a really bad mistakes and says something homophobic or transphobic or racial or anti-semitic do I think that means they're those things not always you know
not most of the time I think they make Angry mistakes and say things they shouldn't say um but they need to but that's not good enough that's not just like okay well then you're then it's fine because you didn't mean it I think that they need to do a lot of work and say and about the impact and um
restoring the harm that was done which sometimes quite frankly is impossible to depending on what happened how about how about the how about the victim like what what is how you how are you handling um not not just the perpetrator but the person who's who's been victimized by by
the behavior yeah I would say that probably every single time something happens since I've been principal I'm calling the families immediately meeting with the kid you know I don't want any surprises if something happens at school you're not going home and telling your mom or dad like I want to they can hear from me
first um and one expressing how we don't stand for what just happened um that's not part of our values that's not part of what we do here um you you can hear teachers all over the Middle School saying you know we don't do that here we don't do that here but when it escalates to that level um the kids know that they
messed up a lot of the times but the victim and the victim families need to know that we're here to support them we want to give them whatever time they need whatever resources they need to get back in school be able to learn and try to work through the process of what has happened because it's really hard
sometimes I mean individual it it depends on the individual what happened like I I you asked that question a million things un like have gone through my mind of things that have happened the last 13 years that God I can't believe that after all the time we spent on talking about what
not to do you still did it you know um so I think that's important too to really make sure that the victim feels supported even though a mistake was made okay Sam do you have a final question I have no further questions all
okay thank you John so so Jason this I'm actually kind of following up on a couple of the more recent questions so just in the eight-month Runway if offered the role that you would have uh you talked about some of the things that you'd be doing
and Karen had asked about you know how can the school committee help um you know the future superintendent to be successful um I think in your responses I I think part of what I was hearing is um you're open to new approaches and um
and I think what I heard you say is even how you know presentations to the school committee or what you're presenting or how it's presented um you know during that eight-month runaway you're kind of open to you know if you have thoughts on you know ways to improve that process
you're you're willing to share those correct of course yeah and like I said working with Pam I think probably since I started especially once I gained her trust I mean I think that we've talked a lot about different approaches and and different ideas and sometimes she's like
no no no because I you know I might not know what the repercussions are or something else you know as a building principle for the last few years but we should do this or we should do that yeah but this means X Y and Z so I'm certainly open to discussing new approaches with Pam um like I said part
of her leadership style that I really respect is the fact that she's open to that type of dialogue and um and I think it would be really important to have those discussions great um well then I think with
that what do you have for us do you have any questions I do anything to add for us so I think I know what you're going to say but what are the most essential qualities you seek in your next superintendent what do you think the
top Karen what me on the spot um a good leader um someone who especially if it was someone internal such as yourself someone who can learn for the next seven eight months but then
still be their own person once they take over right um that's what I would be looking for um I am looking for somebody who uh rallies our employees and makes this a a
place where they want to come to work M so that our kids want to come to school yeah um and and I think it's I I would also want to see um somebody
who um really brings sort of challenges themselves to always be looking at well are we doing this because this is how it's done or are we doing this because it makes sense
um because I think that that's one of the that's one of the the difficulties about hearing from within is is that you know we've all we've all been here a long time so I'm looking forward to somebody who can challenge themselves as well as all
leadership great Suzanne anything anything think Dad I think I think along with that um and and being inspirational or or a a role model that that um you know as the as the leader that other people are seeing that you're the hardest working person in the district
and and you know they follow suit but I also think um a really important characteristic is is um the ability to know what you don't know and to surround yourself with people who have opposite talents that you have and um different
knowledge that you have and that you truly rely on them and I think you're you're starting with a great team I mean if you had Dr bacon and Mrs Raymond and U Miss Stella to to guide you um I think that the ability to listen to that
advice always and and then your principles as well but there's there's a really solid team here and I think to continue to surround yourself with people that that challenge you that are there are smart people that challenge you that you listen to yeah I think is is a a very
important characteristic a leader really agree John so Jason I think um it would be someone who sets a strong um tone from the top so everybody understands you know what your
expectations are um and I think also uh a key attribute is uh someone who's willing to listen um listen to different ideas maybe not popular ones but uh has that capability to listen right I just and I mean I will do
completely agree with Suzanne is really know what you don't know and you know just be willing to just be a sponge to learn and at the same time you're learning is a leadership quality that we require what else you have for us well talk about measuring success
here how do you measure success in this role and we can talk about school measurements and all the metrics but what do you view as success with your next superintendent all right I'll take that one um it's really interesting that you asked that question we we are in the midst of scheduling uh a goal session
for us and that goal session will lead us to review really in total the survey that we sent out and then that will lead to setting your goals and um that's something that we as a group really just haven't done for a while I think could be part of co could be part um just the
experience that bam had and I I think and I think Amy will agree that we we've fallen down by not doing that so I think for for me it's setting goals and and and expectations that a you can meet and Achieve but it's going to what the
district goals are so to me it's I wanted I want to have success with as many children as possible whatever they do whatever kind they are they feel welcomed respected and have that ability to find
something you're mentioning the the club the Taylor whatever that is on all levels from you know prek to senior in high school to the special ed students who stay until they 22 everybody has a stake in
in what the goals are so that's important to me anybody else can I add to that a little bit so you know there's a pretty um there's a pretty well-developed process for um all superintendents on how to evaluate for
um uh for success and it does begin with you know a a pretty um you know a grid that we come up with collaboratively with the superintendent um that focuses first on what those goals are that we've
set and that has to be a collaboration um but then so ties in so what what kinds of things are going to identify as success in that so you know for example uh you know I'm thinking about one of the goals that we set for the
superintendent a few few years ago was especially about helping all sorts of kids and so one of her goals was to um to reinstate some of the um more Hands-On learning in schools so uh you
know like building the um you know the after dark program um so that was actually one of her goals um because we really have to it has to be a measurable thing uh and not subjective and then you know a year basis go through that and
you know I think especially for those of us who've been here since preo because things really took a dive during Co in terms of um evaluations and getting back to that and you know there're it's also very different evaluating a first year superintendent than evaluating a 10th
year superintendent so um you know I think that what it says to the school committee is that we have to re bring back more rigor um because you know we'll be all we'll be back at one right right right anyone else want to answer
that question no I agree with yeah okay in the committee's eyes what are the positions biggest challenges and and the biggest opportunities just repeat the question one more time in the committee's eyes what are the positions biggest challenges and biggest opportunities could be the same thing balancing the
budget to meet the goals and what everyone needs yeah yeah I mean I I agree I budget is just I think our biggest challenge yeah um and as I said earlier I I understand from you know the
town side but at the same time that's not our that's not our responsibility yeah our responsibility is to teach the community students yeah and it's not inexpensive yeah so it's it's to me
that's the biggest challenge is is budget um and then um you know making sure you go back to the high school you know if if there are some things that haven't worked let's change them and that goes to all to all grade levels
course but I think it's I think it's exacerbated at at the high school because I think we hear about it the most I mean because at the end of the day that's really what you hear about you hear about high school graduation you know High School sports and so it's just more out there for for the committee and the community at large I'll tell you what the I'll tell you
from the survey this is the the this is the community response what what's going to be a successful year is going to be a an updated clear plan for the middle school and what that's going to look like because that's a building that needs to um yep be taken care of um
communication and transparency is uh going to uh be be valued in a successful school year um the high school this having a strong High School leadership smaller class sizes Civics teachers
morale there the high school came up uh quite a few times in in what a successful year would look like um and um and then uh teachers and keeping class sizes small so those are the four
things that that you know sort of we look at from the survey that the that were important to the community that will ultimately also be important to us right right AB right yeah I think um it's funny you said maybe they're the same thing
because that's exactly how I thought of it they they were actually the same thing and I think think by that I mean um you know if offer the role Jason that you know succeeding a longtime successful superintendent that's challenging but there's also the opportunity to make the role your own if
you were offered the role so I think you know it kind of it cuts both ways right I was going to say the same thing transitions are always tricky but they could be really great there's a lot of opportunity in there that we can't even we can't even see right now yeah you
know what I mean well especially because this the district is stable right right and is chaos that we're seeing in other districts right and and and there is chaos across the country we're we're very lucky yeah um so with that any last
thoughts or comments for us well I guess um I would like to thank you for your time and I really enjoyed this conversation I think that hope hopefully
you realize that over the course of 13 years here and 23 years overall in education that um I have a vast amount of different experiences at in different locations with different types of students in different areas and you know my goal was always to come back here
when I chose to come back here and raise my family here was about the schools and when I chose to take the job um it was about making the schools the best possible schools that could be and if it wasn't good enough for my kids it wasn't good enough for your kids and we are all in this C together and I want this
community to realize that we do have a gem of a school system and we have to keep it that way and keep improving um and I want to be part of that solution and part of the uh process to make sure that swamp public schools are not just on the rise in some Metric from Boston magazine but on the rise that you can
feel it in the fabric of the community um each day when kids are going to school and they're coming home happy and learning so thank you for your time and um I appreciate great thank you so much so just for everyone in attendance and on on um the
zoom going take a quick um it's 7:57 so we take maybe a 7 minute break uh we're going to come back we are going to allow um Community thank you public comment um if you're in the room and you do want to
comment I do ask that you sign your name um on the paper if you're online just please raise your hand uh we will get to you we'll talk about just how we're going to handle that again Jason thank you so much and we'll see everybody in about five minutes
e e e e e e e e e e
e e e e e e e e just make sure that everybody great all right we are back thank you for everyone
in the room who uh stayed with us uh again anyone who is online uh please raise your hand uh I do want to say that um if you do want to make a comment in the room please sign up online uh I will ask that we keep our comments to a
couple minutes two minutes three max um if you do make a comment ask a question of the school committee we we generally do not reply we' like to think about what you had to say and don't want to give an offthe cuff answer so why don't we start with uh in the room Suzanne can
you just you have the list thank you Bru short just identify yourself good evening everybody it's a special pleasure to be here tonight to support the candidacy of
my friend and colleague Jason kalishman as the next superintendent of the swampit public schools I'd be remiss if I failed to use this forum to formally express my respect appreciation and admiration for
our current superintendent Pam angelakis as someone who's been kicking around this district for over 30 years it's especially poignant and exhilarating to ponder what I'm confident will be a seamless transition
of the stewardship of our district as a former member of the SMS faculty and during my current Tour of Duty as dean of students at the swampit elementary school I've had the unique privilege of working with Jason in his
varied leadership positions first as assistant principal later in his current role as principal and most recently as one of my own professional mentors without question Jason has been an impactful leader in the swampit
public schools I'm a tad biased but because of Jason's leadership there is little doubt that the swampit Middle School is the flagship School in our district and a model to which this new swampit
elementary school will emulate Jason is at heart a highly skilled educator well-versed in Educational Theory instructional practice and most importantly strategies
to address the social emotional needs of every student he demonstrates his interpersonal strengths or shall I say his charm during his daily interactions with students and teachers alike he's
worked hard to create a nurturing learning community and he's knowledgeable about learning styles and he demonstrates his respect for the art of teaching and the uniquenesses of every child SMS
continues to be a warm and welcoming home away from home for everyone long before schools across the country were scrambling to address learning loss and crafting plans to re-engage students
in the postco era Jason had already embraced the prerequisite focus on social emotional Wellness for his middle school students his prioritizing greater awareness and responsiveness to the emotional health of students challenged
the Middle School faculty to reexamine our classroom practice and philosophy these efforts have translated into a vibrant child centered school always visible and accessible
Jason is rarely confined to the four walls of his office truth be told if you want to find Jason you best look in classrooms or hallways or the gym or the cafeteria there you will find him doing
what he does best making connections and building relationships ever supportive to faculty and staff his door was is always open for dialogue conversation or
consultation he shows good judgment and wisdom when he speaks and when he is silent when appropriate he's flexible and accommodating and when necessary or required he's resolved in his decision making those of us who know him well can
attest to Jason's wonderful joy-filled sense of humor to his credit he uses these qualities as an effective tool for communicating with students and for creating a positive Learning Community his appreciation for the whole child
well explains why students and parents hold Jason in such high regard as evidenced by Jason's putting his candidacy forward it's no surprise that his high expectations for his students and staff mirror the goals he
sets for himself he his resume well documents his willingness to establish new goals for himself and to explore and apply his considerable talents in various
venues over the years Jason and I have frequently mused about the state of the world the state of the Red Sox and most importantly the state of public education during one of our many afternoon chats I can recall asking Jason what he believed
to be the most consequential ask of a good building leader without missing a beat Jason named the impact of the selection and retention of good classroom teachers I would argue that he put that
conviction into practice and the results are noteworthy and laudable so in that spirit I respectfully ask the swampit school committee to follow Jason's lead and give the same thoughtful care and
consideration in selecting our next superintendent of schools there is no doubt in my mind and in that of many many others in this community that there is no one more capable of carrying the Baton forward
than our own Jason kalishman thank you thank you Mr poers uh Mr Ford so hello um I'm not GNA be quite as eloquent as Mrs Powers but nonetheless uh I have I'm currently on my fourth
child at the Middle School uh I have just introduce you sir please what's it just intr yourself pleas introduce yourself oh Joe Ford thank you um I've had a child at the middle school for 11 years straight uh currently and sad to
say I'll be leaving the middle school after this year at least my my child my children will be and up until this year I was a PTO president at the middle school so consider myself to be a pretty good um source of what it's been like to
interact with Mr kalishman on a regular basis there probably isn't many parents in the town of Swampscott that have dealt with Jason on a regular basis as much as I have and I just want to say that I think
we have a unique opportunity to hire somebody from within um I've hired a lot of people over the years I owne my own business I've hired hundreds of people and what I say is that
we can teach somebody how to be a superintendent in my case be a painter we can't teach someone how to be a good person generally either they are or they aren't and we have somebody here who you know through the you know the last two
hours has sat in front of all of you you know that Jason is being sincere and honest when he answers you because you've lived this with him you've lived all these experiences with him he's not an unknown he's not some somebody that we are have to be afraid of that came in
here and pulled the wool over our eyes we we know if Jason is being sincere and I think that he sat through the previous two hours was probably a little uncomfortable in the beginning as anybody would be But as time went on he felt he looked really comfortable he was
sincere and I just think that we would be doing the the children of Swampscott a disservice if we do not hire him I just I know a lot of people are have well I don't know a lot of people but some
people have mentioned lack of experience why don't we hire somebody that has superintendence experience I think we have a great support staff here to help teach Jason he's willing to take on a challenge that not many people would um I know that i' I've spoken with him
about my fear of him being in his own town that doesn't seem to be a concern of his uh which I think is very courageous he knows what's I think he has an idea of what's coming his way and he's willing still to stick his neck out
and I I I just can't say enough good things about my experience with Jason uh collaborates with people he's grown over the last you know 11 years that I've seen him he is willing to admit when he's wrong um which is hard for people
to do not a lot of people will sit in a room and say I was wrong I'm sorry it's it's a very simple thing in theory to do but not a lot of people can do it I've experienced him doing it I've witnessed him doing it and those of you that know me uh know that if I had a problem with
Jason kalishman I would I would have spoken up and you know for me to be here um publicly just tells you how much I think this is the right decision and please please just make it happen that's
all thank you Mr Ford uh Mr woodfork my name is Nelson woodfork and I've been living in this town temporarily for about 50 years um I've had four kids go through school system
one three of them went from from first grade on up and one was a child we brought in at age 16 the system has done very well by me and my family I've known Jason probably longer than anybody else in this room currently starting off with
little Le baseball and watching him go through that with he's the same age as my second child um all the way up through high school basketball as baseball and watching him grow athletically and then coming back as a coach where he had to collaborate though
you're the bottom line when the head coach on baseball strategies when he took over the team that was an interesting process in a full circle he also decided to reinstitute something that his high school coach decided to do which is to open and close against the
prep even though there are several divisions higher than us because he was willing to take on that challenge um that says something the delightful thing was listening to him tonight on the other side and watching how he has grown
over the years to become who he is leading the middle school and I'm an old social worker so the acknowledgement about me mental health needs was right on target as far as I was concerned um because that's a TR
tremendous problem I've worked both in the private and for the State uh in in that aspect so the last thing I want to say because the hour is getting late is is when I go to games now and I love going to games as some of you know I
don't know these kids he knows all about them I'll say who is that and he will give me both their strengths and weaknesses more than just athletically as as human beings so he does get to know those kids that have come up from the middle school and
sometimes I just need to know who they are so that when the Ford kids appear I get background on them so that's all I've got to say I think you've got to make a tremendous decision but he's a great candidate thank you thank you thank you Mr or Fork uh Miss
Miller hello my name is lean Miller and I have a daughter in 11th grade and I have a daughter out of District in ninth grade my daughter that went out a district went out for sixth grade I am not going to be a popular person here tonight but I am going to
give you my honest opinion here I also am in charge of uh helping run the CPAC okay so I have one in special ed so there are two types of families within Swampscott when I moved here my
younger one was in first grade and my older one was in third grade and I learned very quickly there are two types of families in this town they're the generational families and they're their new families and they are never to mix and that is how our family has been
treated and that is not just my family every family that I know that has moved here that has started their children after kindergarten or even in kindergarten with the younger ones have not been accepted into this community the way the generational families have
and you know what I'm talking about when I say generational families now as far as the culture that Mr kishman was talking about at the middle school there is a culture and I can tell you I know several kids that have gone through that school my own daughter as well as my
younger daughter's friends because I'm still involved with them because I'm involved with Girl Scouts as well and the kids that are now my younger daughter is now in high school so all her friends are now in the high school and I asked them how their year is going
because I've seen all of them and they're like it's wonderful I am so happy to be at the high school it's so so much better than the middle school I was you know had difficulty in the middle school but now I'm it's just so much better in the high school and I'm
going to tell you all these kids are in the honors program I'm not telling you that this is kids in special ed although I do know kids in special ed that are still doing better in high school okay there is definitely a difference between what you heard here tonight and what my
family has experienced and what have others have experienced in the middle school okay okay so I do want you to take that as a a an issue of caution he asked what he could have done better when my daughter was in fifth grade we were in covid and it was the year that
everybody was hybrid and she was sitting on her Zoom everybody was zoom and the teacher one of her teachers was standing there and a new student was coming over from Nahant and the teacher had said oh I think the
child is on na my daughter was on an IEP she still is and she was so angry like you can't say that the whole nine yards I contacted the school and I my daughter did as well and I did get a response it
was not a pleasant response it was it was dealt with internally my daughter never received a an apology and I think that was a real Miss on that part she really felt totally isolated within that community and so I I really do caution
the whole thing I want you to see it from Another Side I know you're seeing a lot of everybody loves them and everything that's generational family so I really do want you to see the other side of what goes on within this school district um as far as special ed goes huh I've
got a lot to say but um I do want to also some of it is I want you to think about how you deal with special ed in the Middle School more than anything because the schedule is so set students
lose certain classes to gain their special needs that's a miss and I think the school district really needs to work on that because you now have my daughter was taken out of social studies or
history to get her extra help but now in eth grade she had to take an mcast for social studies she didn't get it in fifth grade that's what part of it was on on that's a misstep and I think that I know it's something that has to work on you know one of the things is they
all need access to all the curriculum and that curriculum is taken away from them okay so I I I know you're working within a certain amount of hours maybe that's something that needs to look at as well I don't know I don't have the answers I'm just telling you an
experience that is is happening in the school district and that's what I just want to say thank you you thank you thank you thank you Miss Miller um Miss Arrington Katie when you're done just toss your email address here when you're done absolutely thank
you Katie Arrington um I have two children I have a kindergartener and I have a freshman um here for the Long Haul um and I come I've emailed I've come to this
because as a generational family I'm not for kishman as our next superintendent if you have a special ed child which I have my freshman and I have my kindergartner
then if your child is a normal learner kishman's your guy if your child has needs I'm sorry he's not I do wish we had a more diverse pool of candidates I understand the pros
and cons for having an in person p in person that knows this town I want the best for this town I don't know that principal kishman is it Emily's Auto is a star at the middle school I'm sure if she stepped into that
role it will be the middle school would Thrive my child who was here and wanted to speak but was nervous worries about his sister because he
felt ignored we spent all of middle school trying to get an IEP and services for him and he was denied and that okay but he then felt ostracized and
ignored by principal kishman he is thriving at the high school and is it perfect at the high school schedule whatever no but he has found his stride here through the principal through the guidance
through the 504 team and I think this environment and this group is better and I don't know that principal kishman cares enough about the other Learners in this
town thank you thank you m Aron yeah if you could just for our records um just let me remind everyone if you're online and you'd like to ask a question and test our technical abilities please raise your hand um
prior to that I do want to to say we we as we walked in um another Resident uh Joe caponigro who wanted to speak um had to run out he did give us a letter uh in support of Mr kalishman I'm not going to read the whole letter but um basically
goes on to say his support and I just want to say publicly thank you to Mr Cerro for doing that um anyone out there I see no hands going once going twice
okay oh oh I'm sorry just um fill out the little form there for us you can do it my name is Kristen bariselli um I have two children at the high school I actually just wanted to address the process um I was the parent
representative excuse me for another local public school system that went through a superintendent search and I know it's messy and it takes a long time and the pool of candidates is like a
drop of water in a desert um I do think there is some due diligence um to a superintendent search um I think it's lovely that there is an internal candidate but at the same time
um I feel like a search needs to be opened thank you thank you very much you just yeah fill the form thank you um I I just and um thank you very much for writing that um um to um Miss Miller and
Miss Arrington it's never easy to make a comment that you think's not going to be popular um thank you very much for making those comments and um I I just want to speak for everybody here we appreciate all the voices out there and
um thank you for doing that I know I know how difficult it is um especially from uh being a parent of a special education student I I get that so I just we just we just wanted to say thank you thank you very much guys I appreciate that um all right anyone else in the
room all right I don't see anyone online um I want to thank everybody for listening for joining us um and then I would like a motion to adourn I'll make a motion second second all those in
favor we are out for