[Music] Hey, Good evening, ladies and gentlemen. Uh, it's great to see everybody tonight. I'd like to call the meeting to order and
welcome everybody to the September the 2nd meeting of the Temple Terrace City Council. It's good to see everybody. Uh, if you would please uh silence your electronic devices and we'll have a pool going as to whose phone is going to go off here. Um, if you would please stand and join me in the invocation and the
pledge. Lord, we ask you to bless our meeting tonight. Grant us wisdom as we strive to make the best decisions for the good of our city. We pray for all those affected by the mass shooting in Minneapolis. May they feel your comfort and the support of all Americans.
Help us to always remember that you are the source of all that is good and to be grateful for your many blessings. Amen. >> Amen. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you everybody. So, um, the fun fact or historic fact regarding Temple Parish or the district falls on the mayor tonight. So, I will
bore you, but I'll bore you briefly, I promise. So, I know our fire department set the standard pretty high with a PowerPoint presentation and all. I don't have that. So, what I do have is kind of interesting and I'm glad our historic preservation uh group is here tonight to kind of share in this. So, if you'll
bear with me, I'm going to read this. I don't like to read to people, but this is short. I promise you don't have time to go to sleep. And it's interesting and paraphrasing loses something in this. And so this is from the Temple Terrace Sentinel
uh dated March the 5th, 1945. So I want you to remember what was going on 1945 and March it was the then the throws of World War II and which had been occupying everybody's thoughts now for at this point for four or five years.
And so that's the backdrop. This is 1945 language. So there's a couple words I'm going to clean up, but rather than that I'm going to read it in the So don't take offense at, you know, this is 1945, 80 years ago. So people talked a little differently then.
So this uh article says t terracers are giving eagerly to the Red Cross. Mrs. AMC Jobson, chairman of the Red Cross drive in Temple Terrace, announces that Temple terracers are giving wonderfully to the Red Cross. The drive is not over
and Chairman Jobson urges everyone to be ready with their hearts and pocketbooks open. Whether you have a boy in the service or not, you will want to give generously to the Red Cross. At a Red Cross rally in the city auditorium last Tuesday, I had the privilege of hearing
Eddie Rickenbacher. You know who Eddie Rickenbacher was? >> Yes. >> Eddie Rickenbacher is at the city auditorium in Temple Terrace, right? Remember that Eddie Rickenbacher, the Eddie Rickenbacher. I had the privilege of hearing Eddie
Rickenbacher discuss the wonderful job the Red Cross is doing on the fronts as he saw it when he made his tour of the battlefronts. He pointed out that it has taken 7,000 men in casualties to take only half of the 8 square mile island of
Ew. You can imagine how costly it will be to take the Japanese main islands. Lost my spot. Where is it? There it is. Rickenbacher also pointed out that there would be a 10 to 15year war with the Japanese in the Pacific and in China
before we defeat them entirely. Speaking as a man who had spent 28 days on a raft without food or water. He says that there isn't enough that we can do to help the Red Cross in the wonderful work it is doing. As you know, the Germans aren't feeding American
prisoners as required by the Geneva Convention. It is the Red Cross who sees that food is sent through to our boys in prison camps. Give all you can to the Red Cross. So, what I find there's a lot interesting there, but sometimes when you read these things in
the way they were first written, what's not said is sometimes as important as what is said. And Eddie Rickenbucker seems like an afterthought in this article. But folks, Eddie Rickenbacher came to Temple Terrace and spoke at where was his city auditorium? That was um the Moro Club Morocco. Would that
>> Club Morocco would have been the name >> would have been it. Yeah. So, um we talk a lot about famous people that have had contact with Temple Terrace, but not a lot of people talk about Eddie Rickenbar. If you don't know who he is or why I'm making a big deal about him, Google him. Don't do it during the meeting, but >> All right,
>> Mr. Mayor. Yeah, >> he was the leading ace, American ace in World War I. uh 26 victories. He flew for the hat in the ring squadron. >> Yes. Remember the restaurant 94th Aero Squadron? Y that's the squadron that he comm >> and he was a big deal during that time.
>> Yes. Yes. And went on to be president of Eastern Airlines. I mean big just on and on. A race car driver, you name it, he did it. So I have a another one. Z wake up from that one. So this one is uh we'll do trivial pursuit here since we have the historic preservation board.
This is a two-part question. What two intersections do you think got the first traffic signals in Temple Terrace? You can shout it out. It's okay. >> Nope. >> Glen Arvin. >> That's one. What's the other one?
Bullard and Glenn Arvin is the answer to one. >> White. >> Nope. Not White. Bullard and 56. >> Bullard and 56. Those two, right? And it's I think Glenn Arvin was first, but
I it's really not nailed down in the article I read. Now, what year 1948, late 1948, those two intersections and it the way it reads, it looks like Glenn Arvin was first in Temple Terrace
Highway in 56. It wasn't Bullard yet. It was still Temple Terrace Highway. So those are the first two intersections. So So there you go. Nobody got all the right answers or I was going to give you a coin, but you can't. I don't have three coins. So very good. So that's my fun fact, or at least my facts, right? I
don't know if it was fun or not. You be the judge. So um on to business. Our first item of business is an appointment to the school support committee. Uh there's one vacancy on the school support committee and we received one application from Miss Jessica Ferguson. Is Miss Ferguson
here? I don't see her. Uh, council members, if it that is acceptable, is there a motion to appoint Miss Ferguson to the school support committee? >> Move to appoint Jessica Ferguson to the school support committee for the term of from September 2nd, 2025 to September
2nd, 2028. >> Second >> motion um second by council member Fernandez. Any discussion? If not, all those in favor say I. >> I >> I opposed. No nays. Thank you, Miss Ferguson, for your service.
>> Next is another board appointment uh to the police pension board at the May 8th, 2025 quarterly pension board meeting. The police pension board voted and reappointed Thomas Zerillo to serve as the fifth trustee resident member of uh
of the pension board. Uh the the appointment has been made by the pension board but has to be confirmed and ratified by the city council. And so is there a motion to that effect? >> Move to ratify the appointment of Thomas Real to serve on the as the fifth trust the fifth trustee seat uh for a two-year
term extending from February 1st, 2027 um up to to I'm sorry to February 1st, 2027. >> Second >> motion and a second. Any discussion of the appointment? If not, all those in favor say I. I >> I opposed. No nays. Mr. Zerilla, thank
you for your service. Motion's passed. >> Um, council members, has everybody had an opportunity to review the minutes of our August 19th meeting? And if so, is there a motion? >> Move to approve. >> Second. >> Second. Any discussion or corrections to the minutes?
>> If there was one typo on page 12, I I've already um let them know. >> Okay. Any other discussion or corrections? If not, all those in favor say I. >> I. >> I. >> Uh. Any opposed? No. Nays. Minutes are adopted. Next are persons wishing to be
heard on items not listed on the agenda or items on the consent agenda. Uh there is a threeminut time limit imposed on each speaker. We do ask that speakers come to the podium and begin with their name and city of residence. Um our first
require we have one request to speak and that is from Mr. Lo, Mr. Loe. >> Good evening. Charles Loe, Terrace Park. We got an interesting challenge today quite a bit. First of all, I want to talk about the uh Joe Latino Center or the St. Vincent Depal. Uh he a year
about a year ago, the former chief told me about it when they were talking about the homeless. And over the year, I've been keeping up with them. I've been giving them food. And I've also learned about them more. I gave some contacts to the city clerk uh for people that need
help, but also people that can give help. It also has various crisis numbers and all that. So, if anybody needs that information, needs help or can give help, they should be thinking about talking to them. They are different from the Metropolitan Ministries. The next
thing I want to talk about is the town hall meeting on September 15th conducted by the police department on public safety. Uh that'll be from 6 to 8:00 p.m. on Monday, September 15th. And uh it's to me again it's another
opportunity to do two things. Uh one would be I hope to talk more about the 52nd and Fowler traffic light and number two to talk about hope that people will get together and um and you know get together diverse people and renew their
contacts. Of course, the senior expo is coming up on uh September 19th for both also at Bitefoot uh from 9:00 a.m. to noon. And um uh it's they've always
always do a great job on that. So uh and that combined with the fact you're all going to be doing the final budget hearing on Tuesday night, uh September 16th, you're all going to have a busy week if you're going to be involved with everything. I did read an article in the newspaper,
the Beacon, that kind of upset me in tomorrow's Beacon about HART, and I had a four-word comment for it. Home rule for Hillsboro like in Miami Day County. Uh, you know, really, we have the population here now as a county. That
would be just as much as Miami Day did back then. So, uh, it seems to me that I don't feel the state should have the right to control heart. and uh or our bus transportation or any issue that mounts to a local matter. I also do want
to remind people about tomorrow's uh budget meeting. Uh I will not be at it, but it will start five at 5:05 p.m. uh tomorrow for if anybody has any questions on the first reading of the budget. Let's see if there's anything else I left out. No, I think it's about
it. Uh good evening everybody. >> Thank you, Mr. L. Are there other members of the public who wish to address the council? Seeing none, council members, is there a motion to approve the consent agenda? >> Move to approve. >> Second. >> All those in favor say I. >> I.
>> I. Opposed. >> No. Nays. Consent agenda is adopted. Next order of business is a second public hearing and second reading of ordinance 1582 amending chapter 12 article 11 entitled historic preservation. I will open the public
meeting and ask Miss Bolo, our senior executive assistant, to present. >> Good evening. >> Good evening. >> Good evening, mayor, council, charter officers. My name is Jeannie Barlo. I'm the city manager's assistant. I'll be
presenting an amendment to the city's historic preservation ordinance on second reading. Let's review the National Park Services objection. The National Park Service stated that a provision in the city's ordinance which outlined a local designation process for historic
districts that required 100% owner consent was incompatible with the purpose of the local preservation program and did not allow for adequate public participation in the program as required by the National Historic Preservation Act. As a result of the National Park Service objection, staff
is recommending the removal of section 12160 A2, which states the following. The consent of all property owners of each property proposed for designation here shall be required prior to any action by the board on the nomination for historical property designation. And the written consent of all property
owners within a proposed historical district shall be required prior to any action by the board. The city can allow for an objection process. The National Park Service permits an objection process for single property owners and more than 50% of
property owners in the district prior to designation. With this in mind, staff is recommending adding section 12160 A3, which states the following. No individual historic property or site will be designated without the written consent of the property owner. And if
the property owners of more than 50% of the properties within a district object in writing to the proposed designation of a district either before or during the public hearing, then the application shall be withdrawn and not considered by the historic preservation board at that time.
The city can also allow for modifications of a boundary of a district. There are provisions in other historic preservation ordinance which allow the governing body to modify the boundaries of a proposed historic district to exclude the properties of
those who object to being in the district. Staff is recommending revising the language in section 12160 E2 to add the following. A decision to approve the designation of a historic district over an owner objection shall be by a
majority vote of council. Modification of the boundaries of a proposed historic district is not a reversal of the historic preservation board recommendation so long as the modification is within the area that was properly noticed. The proposed language provides the council with two options.
The council can decide to approve the designation of a historic district over an owner objection or the council can decide to modify the boundaries of the proposed district to accommodate the objecting property owner as long as the modification is within the area that was properly noticed.
And the city is going to is adding an an appeal process. In regard to an appeal process, staff is recommending adding language in section 121605 to state the following. An objecting property owner may appeal the city council's decision to the circuit court
in and Florida Hillsboro County, Florida. Such appeal shall be by writ of cersiari and shall be filed within 30 days of the public hearing in which the city council's decision was made. Offering an appeal process for historic property designations will allow for due
process, promote fairness, and offer an objecting property owner the right to challenge a decision regarding a property's historic designation. So, in response to council request to research the St. Petersburg establishment of historic districts,
staff contacted a historic preservation planner with the city of St. Petersburg to discuss the creation of historic districts. It was explained that an application can be filed by a property owner, any St. Petersburg resident, andor any organization of the city,
including the city council. The designated area would undergo a thorough survey and study to determine the age and significance of the building, sites, or structures within the proposed boundaries. This involves gathering information on the neighborhood's history, architectural styles, building
types, and the overall character. As part of the application process, a public information meeting is then held for the owners of the parcels to be included in the proposed district. Between 15 days and 90 days after the public meeting is held, a ballot is
mailed to each of the property owners in the proposed district requesting the owner return a signed ballot to the city via US mail indicating either support or opposition for the application. If evidence of support for the historic
district is received from 50% plus one of the property owners, the application is subsequently submitted to the city council for consideration. The c the application for district designation requires a simple majority vote of regardless of whether there is
opposition from one or more property owners located within the proposed district boundary. So, in regard to property rights, shouldn't historic district designation be voluntary rather than mandatory? At first, this would seem to be a valid
point. Shouldn't ordinances allow for voluntary historic district designation. The National Park Service has indicated that such ordinances, however, would be inherently weak from a preservation viewpoint, for it gives owners in a proposed historic district the right to
determine whether their property and others in the proposed district are historically significant. Individual owners may not be the best people to make this judgment for the entire district. It is important to realize that in historic buildings in a his
proposed historic district are historic. whether or not that fact is recognized by all the owners in the proposed district. The National Park Service supports a consensus in the local historic district designation process to include either the owner consent process
or the owner object process. The difference between the two approaches is determined by how silence or nonresponse by property owners is treated. In an owner consent approach, silence or non-response has the effect of a vote
against designation. In an owner approach, silence in owner object approach, silence or non-response has the effect of a vote for designation. Historic designation remains a voluntary process
for individual property owners. Although the National Park Service does not allow for 100% owner consensus in the creation of historic districts, it is important to remember that individual property designation is 100% voluntary.
Individual property designation is also much simpler process than what historic district designation would entail. Creation of a district is an extensive process which would include a public awareness campaign, research, documentation, and surveys on all the
boundaries within the proposed district, establishing and justifying the district boundaries, preparing the B boundary map, holding public hearings to gather community support for the nomination, and finally mailing out and tabulating all the ballots to the individual
property owner within the proposed district. The entire process would take from 6 months to one year to complete. This concludes my presentation, but our historic preservation officer, Marissa Robinson, would like to present additional information on this issue.
>> Welcome, Mrs. Robinson. >> Good evening, Mayor and City Council members. Marissa Robinson with Community Development. When the historic resource survey was completed in 1988, there were 69 Mediterranean Revival buildings surveyed and an additional six buildings
were reported as demolished at that time. Since then, 11 more historic buildings have been demolished within the city. This does not include properties that were not included at all in the survey, including those that were the St. Andrews apartments, which there
are approximately three to four apartment buildings with eight um apartments in those. and none of those have historic resource surveys and they were all demolished as well. I also wanted to give a quick update on the interest in the program. Miss Barlo and I have a meeting scheduled for tomorrow
to meet with somebody about designating their house. They are excited not only to have the opportunity to designate, but they are also excited about to be the first to designate their property locally within the city. And any questions Miss Barlo and I are available to answer.
>> Thank you, Mr. Robinson. Are there members of the public who wish to comment? >> Yes, Mrs. Donahghue. Good evening. >> Good evening. My name is Sheri Donahghue. I live in Temple Terrace and thank you for having me here tonight,
Mr. Mayor and council members. Um at the last meeting even though the entire board was in the audience uh we had not met to actually discuss our support of the application for the CLG. Uh but Mrs.
Barlo had been keeping us up to date every step of the way. So once again, as you know, sunshine rules prevent us from gathering, but we definitely were being informed. So we had a meeting that was already on schedule and we added a workshop to that meeting and at that
meeting we had a robust conversation about what this meant and how it would be how it would be applied in our city. And obviously the word voluntary kept coming up over and over again. But what we're really here tonight to support is the application and the change in the
ordinance so that we could become a CLG. Because, as you know, you've heard it over and over again, without the CLG, we're just a town with a lot of old houses. And so, we need to apply for this. We need to qualify for this. And
then all the goods that come with it, all the services and the opportunities for enhancement will come after. So tonight we urge you and I was lucky enough to be the board chair and so my signature is on this letter but I can
tell you that all the members who are here tonight and maybe one or two weren't able to make it were in complete agreement that we support the amendment as amended. So thank you very much for your consideration. >> Thank you Mrs. Donahghue. Are there other members of the public who wish to
comment? Seeing none council members are there questions not discussion. Just yet questions for uh any of our staff. Council member Fernandez. >> Yes, I have a I have a a few questions.
So when I don't know I get I maybe for Miss Barlo might be the one mo the most knowledgeable. I don't know but you can tell me if you're not. Um, so where I have been concerned about the voluntary
aspect of this, uh, right now I think if your home was built or the building was built in 1974 or earlier, you potentially qualify and that would make that would create
districts. So I'm thinking of Cresttover and Rolling View that that area. Those houses were built in 1972. So that so that's where I'm concerned about the district. But can you explain
if if a h so if we have an area like just let's take Crest over and and Rolling View because they I know that they were all built about the same time. If you have homes in that area that have seen renovations or remodeling that's
inconsistent with 1972, like h how how would they how would a a historic district go about being created in the city of Temple Terrace with neighborhoods like that or streets where
we have the mid-century modern that were all built at the same time, So the difference is you're talking probably about national register districts. National registered districts require that the um structures be have
their historic integrity but other criteria in the ordinance outlined for local designation there's a through uh E here and it's significant to city history associated with distinctive elements of social
political economic or scientific uh properties uh associated with the lives of persons significant in the city or states or nations past properties or districts would embody the distinctive characteristics of a type period or style. So it's not about the
actual integrity of the structure, the historic integrity of the structure. >> Okay. So, it's I what I'm trying to establish is u how likely areas of the city might
qualify for a historic district designation. >> The district designation would have to either be by the property owner or the city. And as we've said repeatedly, Mediterranean revivals don't qualify the way they're designated. But it would
just it would just take a lot of work if it was going to be city initiated or from the applicant from the property owner. It's just a major public awareness campaign. I mean, if you have the owner objection pro uh process or
the owner consent process, it requires a majority to, you know, speak up one way or the other. And it's just it's a lot of work. You'd have to do surveys. You'd have to I mean just to update the survey that we already have in place for the
1988 the Mediterranean revival survey that we already have would I got a quote of over $100,000 to update it. So it's just expensive. It's time consuming and if you get properties that don't
want to do it it's just it's a failed effort. So what I'm asking is if we take Crest over and rolling View and we say okay based on the time period those houses would now qualify for some
historic designation they that that enclave was built all at the same time. So every house would qualify at the same time. But there's nothing politically significant that happened there. it was just a bunch of families lived there. It
used to be in Orange Grove, but it's not anymore because it became single family homes. But so, so if you have that that type of building enclave and you've got where people have added on, so the
historical structural integrity probably isn't there because they've added on over the years or remodeled, etc. But then also maybe there's one house or two houses that have any kind of historic like I lived on Crestover from 1972 to
84. Okay. Um you know you could say oh a city council person grew up here. Whatever that's the historical significance but but what I'm saying is there might be only one house that had some kind of historical significance to the city.
Would you be able to create a district in that area because of that one house? >> I think that would be really really difficult to do that. I mean, why wouldn't that one house just want, you know, single property designation? Why
would you go after the entire district? Why wouldn't you just do the one property that wants to be design? Well, and that's that's what I'm just trying to make sure that I understand because as you know, I am very pro historic preservation. I've made there's no
secret about that. But at the same time, I'm also very pro- owner voluntary participation. So, what I'm trying to get at is for me to reconcile where the park service is saying we need
to have really more uh less voluntary participation essentially. But if we're looking in our city, is this really going to have the impact that I'm concerned about? That's what I'm I'm trying to ascertain that
>> I I would highly doubt it. I mean, that's just because of all that's involved with putting a historic district in place. If you don't have a lot of community input and community support, how is it going to work? How is it going to unfold if you don't have the
support that you need? And then can we because right now I believe that our our uh code is really based on owner descent but could we go to an owner consent model?
>> Either either way is acceptable by the National Park Service for CLG certification either way. the owner um object is required for national registry um district but either way is is acceptable for a
local designation district. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. I I want to clarify that just a little bit. So, with our the ordinance we're looking at now, if one home if someone moves into council member Fernandez's childhood home and says this
is great and it hasn't been and they want to apply to be a historic >> house, they can do that individually. Yes. >> With the ordinance, we're going to pass. Yes. >> Not create the whole district. Even though on the corner of Rollingville and Crestover, I live there. So, that's two in that district. >> That's true.
But anyway, so this the ordinance tonight takes care of an individual that wants our house in there. >> Correct. >> But we don't have to create or go through the work for the big district. >> Correct. >> Thank you, Vice Mayor. >> No questions. >> Council member Kravitz. >> I just have one.
Um sorry for the gotcha. Just letting you know it's coming. I looked at the um reporting on this back in 2024 in the temple terrace beacon. I just wanted to read this section, make sure that John Cody got this one wrong. Um, it says
that ordinance which made historical preservation a public policy was fueled by the efforts of Marissa Robinson, an administrative assistant for community development and city manager executive assistant Jeannie Barlo. It led to the city on May 1st being accepted into the certified local government CLG program,
a partnership with federal, state, and local government focused on protecting historic properties. Is that incorrect? What he was talking about was that we got cert we got approval from the state. The state gave us a thumbs up on our
application and sent sent it we had to um the mayor had to sign the agreement on behalf of the council and once that was done we sent it to the National Park Service. So that was the date that we got officially recognized by the state. >> Okay. >> As a CLG.
>> Okay. Got it. Um that was my question for you. Thank you. So, um, correct me if I'm wrong. I just want to shed some. These are good questions that you guys have over here. But am I
reading this wrong? Uh, Genie on the paragraph D. It's a well, paragraph D is what? The criteria talks about there's one, two, three, four, five, six different criterias. But in concerning a district,
the first paragraph says, "Properties or districts which are at least 50 years old meeting the following criteria may be designated as historic properties or districts. But my understanding is that
those homes in that area would have to all of them would have to meet these criteria." >> That's what I That's what I'm trying to >> So So just like your ne your childhood home. >> Yes. Unless all of those homes were somehow impacted by that same meet these
criteria, you'd have a good cause for that property, but not for a district. >> Right. And that's the only thing that I'm just I'm trying to get >> Yeah. >> clear is that doesn't sound like it it does not sound like we can create a
district >> really with any of our areas. Yes. So, I do have a question that really wasn't really a question, but um we could in light of what we've learned
in the past couple of weeks since first reading, we could flip the requirement like we had a speaker Joe Ferrell that came and gave public comment. We've since learned that we could flip that from being 50% plus one
have to object to being 50% plus one have to request. >> We could flip that in this ordinance. >> They're both acceptable by the National Park Service. >> So, Mr. Mueller, what would be the impact tonight or the or the mechanics
of that if the council chose to flip that language so that the onus became 50% plus one on the people who want to make a district as opposed to causing the people who don't want it to have to do something to prevent it?
>> Then we would not have second reading tonight. We would have a first reading that would include that new language and then second reading would be at her two weeks. >> Okay. I don't have any other questions. Any other questions? Thank you, Miss Barlo, Mrs. Robinson.
Thank you very much. Okay, council. Um, I'm going to open it up for discussion prior to a motion. Well, I'm going to close the public hearing and ask the clerk to read the title of the ordinance first. An ordinance of the city of Temple Terrace, Florida, amending chapter 12,
article 11 of the Temple Terrace Code of Ordinances entitled historic preservation, removing section 12-1160 A2 and adding section 12-1160
A3 regarding consent of property owners for a proposed historic designation or district revising section 12-1160E2 regarding modification of the boundaries of a proposed historic district and
adding section 12-1160E regarding an appeal process and providing for sever forility repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinances in conflict here with providing authority to codify providing
an effective date. >> Madame clerk, councel, what's your pleasure? Council member Fernandez. >> Uh f first I do want to comment because I've been involved in in this discussion since my previous time on council and it
was council directed to ask staff to put this together. So, uh, staff didn't, uh, take the initiative and bring it to us council. This was part of our council goals in past councils. And I, I am a
full supporter of historic preservation, as I said, and my only concern is making sure that we don't infringe on property owners and and their personal preferences. So at with
a change to owner consent and with the understanding of how a district could be created in this city. I do support the changes that we've discussed. >> If if we flip the
>> Yes. You want to put that in a motion or you want us to go down the day as >> I say go down. >> Okay. Council member Chamber. >> Okay. So we're discussing before the motion. We are because it's >> sounds good. So, uh, I'm support U the last reading and I fully more support it
with the change in the ownership. So, I'm good with that. My question, I know you answered that, but we've made changes between first and second readings before. Uh, is this more significant, which is why you want uh to maybe make this the first reading with
changes? >> Yes, I find this to be a sub substantive change, a very substantial change. the fact that uh during first reading it was the idea that it would take a majority to say no to stop it and instead we're flipping it and it making it a majority
to say yes in order for it to go forward. >> Okay. >> So in abundance of caution I'd like for it to go back to first reading and second reading. >> Okay, that's all. >> Yes, I I've been a full support of this ever since it came back up before this council. um as I voted in favor of it
last meeting and and and and before. However, I do like the concept of flipping it so that the the new verbiage of of um the 50 plus one to to to make it happen. So, uh um
would this motion be this sec first reading then? This would be the first reading. Was that said in that or would the We have made a motion. So, the Okay. Uh yes, I agree with that. I think we should move forward with it with the new the the flip verbiage.
>> Yeah, I think that's a really excellent change. So, I really welcome that proposal. I think that goes a long way toward addressing several of the points I was going to raise. So, I'm not going to mention them now anymore. Um, uh, thank you for the suggestion. Fantastic. Um the other points that I
might want to still work on if we're going back in and doing surgery on this is um adjusting some of the majority requirements. So it's one thing to say you have to get 50% of the people in a given area to agree. Um we might want to raise that threshold to something like
60% so it's not just 50% plus one so it shows greater support in a given area when they come and bring their proposal. Uh, and I think that would go a long way toward addressing some of the concerns that the other property owners might have. Another point we might want to
look at is how long we give people to collect themselves. There's a notice period here when an area is um identified for designation. Uh, it's 8 weeks. So I guess the
structure might be hypothetically that either the historic preservation board or city council says all of you are about to become an historic district. Why don't you go and collect signatures now and see how many of you support it and then if it's a majority it proceeds.
I think that would be a really good process but we might want to give people more time than 8 weeks to do that because you can't really canvas that many people in 8 weeks. um you know take probably if you talking about 50 houses it might take you anywhere from 15 to 20 hours because you don't always get
everyone when they're home. Um and uh the other thing that I'll say is given our record in reaching people which hasn't been super great lately with mail uh I'll just mention the PAS thing briefly. Um, it would be a really good
idea for us to make sure that everyone in that particular district gets the uh mail that they're being sent here with proof of receipt because that's one thing that's not actually in here. So, if we're looking at an area with 20 or 30 houses or whatever it may be, it's
not a big deal to make sure that all of those people get mail where they have to prove that they've gotten it. You have some receipt from the post office. just send it registered and then you'll know that they've been properly informed and we'll be able to support our position in the end if it becomes an issue. So I
think those are some of the points that I've raised uh uh that I'd like to raise on that. I think it's a great idea to flip it fully in support of that. Um so if someone wants to make a motion along those lines and otherwise I'll do it and if you want to integrate the extended notice period I think that would be
really cool too. So, >> so the the notice the time periods in the ordinance and I know you weren't here, they were subject we had a lot of discussion at the time when this ordinance was passed. We didn't like the time periods either, a number of the time periods, but they were given to us
by the state. So, we don't really have the flexibility to change them. I I agree with you. I didn't like the time periods either, but we won't we'll be right back here again. Um because the state they gave us the time periods.
>> And uh any thoughts on the form of notification? Is that also mandated by the state? That was just sent by simple mail. >> I don't know. >> Did I miss something? Because I took a source. She said that was certified mail return receipt requested. >> Browse here for a minute.
>> I don't remember. >> Did you say that or am I >> That was in St. Pete's. Oh, that's where I heard it. Okay. All I see here is notice of said hearing shall be provided in accordance with this chapter. So, I'd have to dig around a little bit more. But,
[Music] so anyway, I think uh since we're probably not going to actually rewrite the actual statute right now, like I'm not going to be just dictating stream of consciousness style. It's probably going to go back to the city attorney or to
staff for a revision just like we did with the fence ordinance. So I think it would be a good idea to sort of capture our broadstrokes thoughts on this and then give that back as a general direction so that it can be executed. Uh so to summarize I would go for reversing
the rule about the consent instead of it being you have to object it's you have to consent. Strongly strongly support that. Fantastic. And the other one would be to make sure that the notices are sent to the design or
the prospective design by um some form of registered mail. Those would be my two big items. And then uh I don't think getting into all the other weeds right now is so great. So if we're going to go back to a first reading anyway, then we'll have a chance
for some more discussion on this, which I also think is positive. So those those would be the two main items. Should I make a motion along those lines? Would you all like to support that? >> Can I can I add just to take the
verbiage of the notice from the St. Pete >> Sure. >> code at least. I mean, because that already says in that the the methodology. >> Yeah. >> You might request. >> Sounds good. Is there an impact that we're missing? Mrs. Borlu,
>> I I would think if you put things in the ordinance like that. I mean, you can obviously, but perhaps it might be make more sense to put like standard operating procedures and adopt it by resolution. This is the way that this is
going to happen. And if you need to tweak it and make changes down the line, you know, what works, what doesn't work, it's much easier to um revise a resolution than it is to come back with an ordinance. to comment on that. In 20 years when
someone want will registered mail be around we don't know. So >> well if I can chime in a little bit on that just through my experience especially through code enforcement uh certified mail return receipt normally does not get picked up or at least it's
very rare that it gets picked up. I just want to put that out there. Um, now people do like to, you know, pick up their FedEx and their, you know, other ways of delivery where you have documentation that people have picked it up, but I'm just letting you know that,
you know, return certified mail, return receipt is not necessarily, you know, people are not necessarily >> Yeah, that's true. But it is better than just plain mail. I mean, we really did have a serious problem with a lot of people never getting any of that
communication previously. Council member Fernandez. So, can we get I mean, we haven't made a motion yet, but in the instruction, can we just give instruction to make sure that it's some
form of notification that is documented so that we have the the city has the option of using FedEx or UPS or the post office, you know, receipt or some sort of process
that has a documentation versus giving a very specific methodology. I I I mean I'm just asking because again we don't know what will be available as time goes on. >> I only get a little worried with that
instruction and then if we do write something up what we think comports with that instruction but it doesn't then we're going to have a problem at second reading. That's all. So you were earlier prepared to make a motion. Are you still prepared to make a motion? >> I am or or council member Kravitz can I
mean I I just want to make sure we're giving the instruction that is going to be the most useful for staff to come back with >> discussion >> what we've got. >> Council member Chambers. >> Okay. Thank you. So we we've talked it
with the eight weeks we're going to leave in there because that's state mandate. Uh we're going to probably leave in whatever the uh notification method the city's recommending, not do certified mail say it or any of that. What about the 50% plus one?
>> We >> right now that's the way it is and I can support that because >> everybody voiced >> the opinion that they wanted to flip the 50%. >> No, but his proposal was to go higher than 50%. >> We can't. >> We can't.
>> We can't. Okay. And that's what came back. >> That's that I'm good with that. So I was just trying to address all the questions. >> Did you do it at the August? >> Why don't you go ahead? >> Okay. So I would like to move that we
adopt on first hearing, public hearing and first reading of ordinance 1582 amending chapter 12 article 11 entitled historic preservation with the modification that it requires owner
consent to designate a historic design historic district designation. That would be 50% plus one. >> 50% plus one. >> Second >> motion and a second. Discussion vice mayor >> discussion adding a documentable
method of delivery. Does that cover everything or >> I mean what's the suggestion for the best way to create the >> So I I don't I don't foresee us doing
because we don't know what's going to be around like FedEx or anything like that. I think the registered mail is a standard although maybe not as well received as it used to be in the past because people don't deal with their mail the same way that people did let's say 30 years ago. But that's still in statute in in some places, isn't it?
Registered mail. That is sort of the go-to. So I I believe I'd suggest just going with that. Go with that and we will >> use that. >> Second as a stance. >> That would be certified. We already have a second on that. >> Okay. Further discussion of the motion.
Council member Kravitz. >> Brief comment. I just want to point out that um you know I'm kind of working at cross purposes with myself here by making the suggestion that we go with a more reliable mailing method because once you flip it to being everyone has to consent. If I don't want it to become a historic district then I don't
actually want people to get the mail because then they won't know that they can consent to anything. So I'm just trying to make sure that all of our tees are crossed and our eyes are dotted. But if you if you want it to be a historic district, everyone should support a more stringent mail form because it'll be more certain that people will actually
get the notice. I yield. >> Discussion. >> I no I I mean my my only request is that I do want I I do want to make sure that we have a documentable
mailing process. I also want to make sure that we're structuring the language so that that whatever is the prevailing documentable process is that the city is
able to use. So that's I so that's what I'm asking for the suggestion the language suggestion that m that maintains regardless of what the name of that specific documentable mailing process is that we are using that so
that we can ensure that it's getting delivered to the households that we're requesting. So, let me just throw out a suggestion. I I don't not sure if we do it here, but in my past community, we because we had issues with registered mail that was being left unc uncolcted, we would still
send a regular letter as well. So, we would do both. We'd send a first class mail letter. We'd send a registered mail letter because that was what the statute required. >> Uh but knowing that people don't take the effort to go to the mail to the post office to pick it up, at least they we made the effort of sending them the uh the the first class letter as well. So,
I mean, whether you want to incorporate that into this or just have that be the practice going forward, we could do that, too. Again, we it's hard to guarantee that everybody will will get noticed. I imagine that when we get to this point, if we ever get to a point of historic district, that there'll be other means of communication out there.
You know, there'll probably be whatever the future of social media will be, whatever the website will be, whatever it might be, that will probably be doing that as well to get that information out to residents. Um, but obviously here you want to meet an ordinance requirement. So, if you leave it as registered or certified, I'm not really sure anymore
what the difference is between >> the two. Um, that would probably suffice. >> I'm sorry. Go ahead. >> You We're looking for a method of we want it to be mailed so that we know it got delivered. Yes. Correct. That's the key. Yes. So, perhaps we use a method of
delivery that shows that the delivery that the letter was delivered. >> Okay. >> And I can we can work on that language. >> Okay. Okay. All those in favor say I. I. I. Opposed. >> No nays. Ordinance is adopted on first
reading and will appear for second reading. Next council member 16th. >> Will appear for second reading on Tuesday, September 16th, 2025. Thank you ladies.
Next item is first reading and first public hearing of an ordinance approving reszoning application RZP24-01 for 306 Bullard Parkway. This is continued from July 15, 2025. I will
actually this is a continuation this hearing remained open from July 15, 2025 and this is a continuation of that hearing. Uh, I would ask anybody who intends to speak on this matter to please stand and be sworn in by the city clerk. Please raise your right hand and repeat
after me. Do you swear or affirm that the testimony you will provide the board tonight will be the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Please answer. I do. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, Madam Clerk. Uh, Mr. Mueller,
would you please pull the council for exparte communications? >> Um, I'd like to ask the council members if they have had any exparte communications on any of the matters that will be coming before the council this morning for this evening. If you've
had uh verbal communications, if you could indicate who those were communications were with and when they were made and the substance of those and if it was written communications, if you could indicate who they were from, the substance of those written communications, and get a copy to the
city clerk for the record. >> I have none. >> I've had none. >> I've had none. >> I've had none. >> I've had none. Thank you, Miss Robinson, our deputy director of community development, is here to present. Good evening again. >> Good evening, mayor and council members.
Marissa Robinson with community development. Tonight for your consideration is RZP 2401, the modification to plan development located at 306 Blur Parkway. This is an aerial view of the subject
property. It is at the intersection of Ridgedale and Bullard Parkway with access being granted on Ridgedale Road. This is the general area map of the property. It is approximately.77 acres. It is currently zone plan
development with the proposed uses of being office and residential. This is the proposed master plan for the site. Everything indicated in red are future improvements which include the buffer landscape buffering fencing uh
bicycle rack and proposed uh additional parking if needed based on the use. The applicant is requesting one waiver. Applicant is requesting that the waiver wave the traditional 2-year uh submittal requirement for a final site plan.
seeking approval to amend the required period from 2 years to 5 years and staff has no objection to this request. Conditions for this application include the uses which are professional office, medical dental office, daycare, portrait studio,
public building, public station, school, veterary clinic, healthc care facility, single family dwelling and a bed and breakfast. These proposed uses will provide the owner with greater flexibility for the property in the future. Conditions are also pursuant to the
waiver. The final site plan must be submitted within 5 years of approval of this resoning. All future changes in the use are subject to review requirements of the land development code. All non-residential uses shall conform with commercial office zoning districts as
described in the land development code. All residential uses shall conform with the res residential 10 zoning standards as described in the land development code and all uses shall meet parking requirements as described in the land development code. Minor modifications
may be approved subject to section 12-380 of the land development code. For all standards that are not specified herein, the land development code standards shall apply. Staff is recommending approval of RZP
2401 for the property located at 306 Bullard Parkway with conditions as presented. The applicant is here for any questions and I will stand for any questions as well. >> Very good. We'll go to public comment first. Are there members of the public
who wish to comment on this? Not the applicant or replicant representative is here. Good evening, sir. >> Good evening, honorable mayor and honorable council members. My name is Gordon Schiff. Um I'm I'm um the attorney for the applicant. My address
is 4155 West Cypress Street in Tampa. I have with me tonight Todd Amadan who's president of Landmark Engineering and Surveying and he is our expert who's put together the site plan and worked with your staff uh regarding this resoning. Um and it's really a resoning
modification as Miss Robinson suggested. Uh just to summarize because the staff's done a great job in their report and also in their summary to you. Uh th this is an existing PD approval on the property. We are essentially taking a 30-year-old PD and updating it so it's
uh can go forward in the future. Um these are minor amendments but important amendments to make sure that it has enough flexibility so it could be a viable use. Um one other thing to mention to you, you did get a planning commission report. uh the Hillsbor County uh city county planning
commission did re or did find this consistent with the comprehensive plan and that's an important finding. And finally, I think I should just mention that if you have any questions, I'll be here to um answer them and I'll let Mr. Amadin say just a few words. Thank you. Appreciate your time.
>> Good evening, sir. Welcome. >> Good evening. >> Todd Amidan, Landmark Engineering in Tampa. A few words indeed. Uh prepare the site plan worked great with staff. Although it took us a bit, we worked through this uh modification conditions and we're happy with the results and I'm here to answer any questions you may
have. >> Thank you very much. >> Okay. Um council members, any question for staff or for the applicants representatives? >> I have one just the extension of the
site plan review or the final review two to five years. I don't remember. I don't remember anything coming before us before with that length of a time frame. Anything in particularly? >> We've never had a previous application to my knowledge that has requested that
waiver, but I will defer to the applicant to um state why they have requested that. >> Again, for the record, Gordon Shiff, appreciate the question. It's an existing building with an existing uses and it's a little hard to predict the future. So, uh, we wanted to build in
enough flexibility that if something comes along, we don't have to come back for another reasoning earlier or something like that. We just wanted enough time. So, we talked to staff early on about that. They they we all came up with five years. It's maybe maybe it isn't perfect, but you know, it seemed like a reasonable request. So,
that's why we're making the request. >> Okay. >> I have a question, Miss Robinson. Um, so this is a resoning application, but it's not really resoning. It's still PD, right? It's just the it's the acceptable uses within the PD designation. We're
broadening what they can use it for. >> Yes. Yes. It is a um modification to plan development zoning classifications do go through the a reszoning application. >> Okay. >> So even though they're just modifying the PD and modifying the uses that are proposed, it still has to go through a
resoning process. >> Okay. It's just a broader range of allowable uses, but it's still PD. >> Yes. >> Okay. Good. Other questions? Council member Fernandez. >> Yes. Um so sorry it's for you. Um when we've added when we're looking at adding
the allowable uses, it's residential behind this property and there's a school um right I mean within a few hundred yards. How does that impact the
allowable uses that we are considering adding? Are any of them I mean they didn't seem terribly incompatible with the neighborhood, but are any of them considered even remotely incompatible with a neighborhood?
>> No, they are all within the commercial office zoning district. all the uses that they are proposing and commercial office there are abuing properties that are also zoned that >> okay so if we change if we agree and make this zoning modification what would
be allowable on this property I mean could they come in and and bulldoze the building and just and build on the property now like you know a completely different use like u commercial on the first floor and residential on the
second floor or what what They would again have to come in for a reasonzoning application in a site plan application if they were to propose that. >> But that but this zoning modification doesn't necessarily allow going to that type of development.
>> No. >> Okay. >> There was a slide on that. >> Yeah. I just I'm just wanting to make sure that it's >> because this that it anyway that it's just very clear. So, okay. Thank you. >> Other questions?
Seeing none, I'll close the public hearing and ask the clerk to to read the title of the ordinance. An ordinance of the city of Temple Terrace, Florida, approving the amendment to a plan development for 75 plus or minus acres of property lying
north of Bolard Parkway and east of North 56th Street addressed as 306 Bolard Parkway for RZP-24-01 providing for amendment of the official zoning atlas map of the city providing for severability
repealing all ordinances or parts of ordinance in conflict herewith providing for an effective date and pri providing for correction of typographical errors. >> Thank you, madam clerk. Council, is there a motion? >> Yes. Um move to approve first reading of
an ordinance approving reszoning application RZP 24-01 for 306 Bullard Parkway with the condition as uh presented. >> Second. >> Motion second. Discussion of the motion. >> Yes. >> Yes. Council member Fender.
>> I just want to clarify for the record that it's.75 acres, not 75 acres. That's a big difference. >> That's it. >> Okay. Discussion. If not, all those in favor say I. >> I. I.
>> Opposed? No. Nays. Ordinance is adopted on the first reading. Will appear for a second reading and public hearing on Tuesday, September 16th, 2025. Thank you. All right, council. Any carryover council business from previous?
Okay. New business or board reports? Mr. Kravitz. Council member Kravitz. >> I have a Davis Road update. So, I reached out to u one of my contacts over at commission and I have the following information about Davis Road. So, there
is going to be some potential localized pavement repairs after my inquiry in this year, excuse me, in 2026. And I can report that a full resurfacing project for Davis Road is planned to start project development in our fiscal year 27. That is a direct quote. So, all
of the individuals who were having a difficulty with Davis Road might be expecting some relief soon with hope with hope that that will go through. Um, and I have a second item which relates to uh short-term rentals. An update from
Manatee Fire District. I thought this was extremely interesting. The district began to assess vacation rentals as commercial properties, not as residential. Property management company sued them, but it was unsuccessful. So, the property
management company lost the lawsuit and these uh uh short-term rentals, Airbnbs were re-qualified successfully as commercial enterprises, which as I've repeatedly said, I think they are. Um so, in this instance, Manatee Fire
District did not actually back down from the lawsuit. Many of the counties and municipalities do typically back down because they don't want to risk it. It's too troublesome for them. but they didn't do it this time because community was so solid behind it and they won. So, I think that that's a really interesting
thing that we should explore because we also have a lot of people in Temple Terrace who operate Airbnbs in our residential areas and as I've said again and again and as you know I've spoken with many many people who don't like them. They complain about the noise. They complain about the throughput of
cars. They complain about the street parking. um all that is a burden. And of course, they also don't comply with I'll say this diplomatically, they don't comply with our fire protection rules quite in the same way that long-term rentals do presently. Um and the other
point I have about short-term rentals is from Penllis County. Penllis County has been using uh decibel meters in some of their police cars to patrol the Airbnbs. And decel meters are able to tell how
loud a property is at any given time. When they go over a certain number of decibb, then they get dinged. They get an infraction because they're causing too much noise in a residential area. Um, this is very limited in Penllis because they don't have enough decibel meters and they don't have enough
police. Given the size of our city and given our police force being out occasionally being a little bit smaller, it might be worth looking into. I don't know if this would be a major um point of enforcement, but I could imagine a scenario where an individual might call
in, report a noise violation, and then we might send a police car down ad hoc to take a decibel meter reading. And if it is a short-term rental, uh it would be good to ding them in my opinion. So, those are two things that uh I can
report on and uh I'd certainly be happy if there were support to look into re-qualifying short-term rentals in Temple Terrace as um commercial enterprises. So, I'm going to make a motion on that today. So, I'd like to move that we instruct our city attorney
and our city manager to explore re-qualification of Airbnbs as the commercial enterprises that they are. >> Second. discussion. >> Yes. Uh my biggest question would be
h you know how how do city staff identify them and how you know how do we go about doing this in a legal process because somebody could have their own personal residence and periodically
short-term vacation rental versus doing this where it the home is empty and it's always like that I mean because I've stayed in I've actually stayed in a short-term rental where it was a family member's house. I mean not my family
member. It was it was it was a family's house and they rented it out and went and then but they lived in it the rest of the year. So it really was a residential property versus a house where nor you know you go into it's empty and it's always turning over. How
do we identify that? >> Council member J. >> Sure. I I don't know if we need to go into those details right now. We're just asking the city attorney and the city manager to explore. Can we do uh designate these commercial? So, I don't
think we need to worry about all that right now. We first need to figure out if we can do that or not. Um and and a comment, our police now, whether it's rentals or not, if there's a complaint about noise, they go out with their cars and they have decibel meters and they
they do work with that. And I'm gonna look for a yes or no from the chief back there to my knowledge. You don't have Okay. Do you do >> so? >> Sorry, >> Chief. >> Good evening. Rob Staley, please. Police chief, >> we we probably should stick with the
motion on the floor. We'll get back to the meeting. >> We'll get back to that noise. >> That was just a comment that active motion on the floor that's been seconded. >> Thank you, Mayor. >> Vice Mayor, >> I do have a question that goes along with this, but what what does the commercial designation get us?
taxes. >> I mean, just in the with with regard to it being a short-term rental and how we can enforce, >> right? What what what what benefit is it to this to that to happen? >> I can probably answer that better once I've had a chance to research it. Um,
but it sounds like if the is that the Manatee Fire District? >> Uh, you said >> Yes, sir. Happy to send you that article as well. Yep. >> That would be great. Yeah. um >> just give me an opportunity to look into it and see if there you know what the benefits would be. >> Okay.
>> Um see if you know what what type of change that did make. >> Okay. Okay. Thank you. >> So I forward to that. >> I think we got the cart before the horse here. I think what the first step to my mind would be to ask our city attorney to take a look at the case and see if
the fact set lines up with our but we've gi the motion is to instruct them to begin process of doing this. We don't know what the fact set is in the case yet. Why don't you can you just read the case and report to us? Yeah, this seems viable or it doesn't because I I'm vice
president of Sun Coast League of Cities, which is all Penllis County except for me. These guys have been fighting Airbnb stuff since 2011. I can't If it's this simple, why have they missed all this? There's got to be something. Maybe it's new. I don't know. But maybe there's something that they've discovered that
everybody else has been missing. But I don't really want to waste a bunch of staff time until we know what the case says and whether you think that this is I mean I'm not against the idea if it's viable, >> but I don't want you guys to go down to step 15 on a process if it's not viable.
It's that's my opinion. But council member Kravitz just want to clarify. I believe my motion was to instruct the city attorney and the city manager to explore the requalification. >> So u I wasn't instructing them to actually begin the process. Oh, okay.
Thank you. >> So, you and I are in agreement. >> Okay. I don't know that we need a motion to give you instructions to read a case, but there's pretty innocuous. >> Okay. All those in favor say I. >> I. I.
>> I. >> Very good. Other new business or board reports? So, you wanted to talk about the noise. Go ahead and ask. >> Chief Staley, could you come up and report? Council >> member Chambers, you have it. I'm sorry. Rob Staley, chief of police. Currently,
we do have the ability to go out and enforce noisewence violations. Uh, and we do have noise decibel meters. >> Yeah. Thank you. >> Anything else? I'm good. Council member K. >> Just a brief comment. I was only reporting on um what the other county
was doing. I was not casting any aspersions on our officers, just to be clear. Other bis new business or board reports. Okay. City manager report. >> Thank you, Mr. Mayor, members of
council. So, a few items this evening. Uh the first one is just to follow up on the the motion uh about the virtual town hall regarding the PAS issue. Um as I mentioned in a council update from I believe a week ago, uh have a
suggestion. Uh if you looked at the CHA, the consultant that's handling our PAS water treatment solution, they have a schedule where they anticipate that they'll be presenting us with a final plan um after doing their pilot and gathering as much
information and we'll probably also have more data from the city of Tampa and Hillsboro County in terms of some of those partnerships uh by the end of the calendar year. That's their projected schedule. They also projected in their schedule to um be participating in a town meeting at some point after that
shortly or thereafter. So what I would suggest if the council is amendable is that once we get that final plan and the data from all the other research that we've been putting together that we actually convene an in-person town hall uh like we did uh a few weeks ago and
that we also simoc cast it using Zoom or a comparable platform where people can have input like they do for the TPO meetings. Um and that we do that some point shortly thereafter this. I would suggest based on the schedule it probably end up being sometime mid to late January uh to get around the
holiday period which is always a tough period of time for for folks to attend some of these meetings. Just a suggestion like to get your feedback on that >> council. I'm okay with that. We'll have more more to talk about. >> I I think we need to have data before we
have the next meeting. So this schedule would mean that they have the results of their analysis and they are going to be presenting solutions and then we would have the town hall or would would this just be that they would have the results that we
would be announcing but not necessarily any any suggestions for solutions? >> Sure. Based on the work program, they would actually have a final plan uh by the end of the calendar year. At least that's their initial work schedule. um they they they're going to take 3
months to do their pilot. So I I would think it'd make much more sense to have the pilot done >> first to make sure that's completely done and the solution that they're going to present to us is one that can work. Uh we're also going to have to do some financial analysis of what that might mean because they're going to give us a number I would imagine a cost and we're
going to have to figure out okay how do we pay for that cost. Um concurrently like I said we're working with the county to see if we can buy some water from the county or at least present that to you. obviously the bulk water rate that you might want to consider and what that might mean in terms of making a connection to the county's nearest
pipeline. So all that data it's just going to take a while to compile all that and I think it'd be worthwhile to get it get it all first then present it to the public present it to you first and then present it to the public in a town hall.
Council member Kravitz, >> I have an unrelated question for the city uh for the city manager. Um in the past two weeks, have we received any more document disclosures from Blazing Paddles? >> So, actually, we have retained services
of outside legal counsel. We just had the meeting this afternoon. We're >> Can we iron out the town hall thing first and then hold that question, but let's What are we doing with the town hall, guys? I'm fine with the plan. >> Okay, we're good with the plan. Okay, I'm sorry. Now you go ahead with the
blazing. >> All right, thank you for that. So the question Yes. So we have um outside legal counsel uh we have also uh going to be engaging the services of a um financial consultant who's done work in vetting these types of proposals uh to
get that analysis done. Uh we plan to reach out to them. We've been keeping them on hold until we gather these these these entities first. So, we'll be reaching out to them this week to let them know that this is what we're doing and then move forward from there and bring that information back to the council.
>> Okay. So, there there hasn't been any active no movement from >> Well, not not we haven't reached out to them. They've been waiting on us. >> Oh, okay. >> Based on the the >> I wasn't sure where it left off with them. I was just curious if they were providing any of the documents that they were missing. >> No, I assume they will provide all the
documents that we request in order for the sale to move forward. And have there been any other interested parties for the uh property downtown in question? >> Uh Mr. Pauly, I know we've kept it on the market. I'm not sure if you've got any updates.
>> Good evening, Greg Pauly, director of community development. Uh thank you for that question. Um, if I may back up just a little bit, uh, we actually, um, through our broker communicated with the Blazing Paddles,
uh, group, um, to, uh, hold steady until we were able to secure outside legal counsel to assist us. So, that is why we don't necessarily have any additional documents at this time. Um, as the
manager mentioned, um, the three of us, the ma the manager, the city attorney, and myself met with outside council this afternoon, and, um, it seems a very promising and positive uh, relationship moving forward. Um, with regards to uh,
any additional interest, um, as of this time, I have not received any additional uh, leads. Um, as the manager alluded, we have left the properties listed. They are available for interested parties to make inquiry but to date uh we haven't received anything new.
>> Interesting. Um if I could just propose a topic for discussion. I think it would be really interesting to incorporate into the listing something along the lines of that the city is willing to provide a uh financial inducement or credit for an
interested uh developer who comes in with a really persuasive concept. Because to date what we've done is we've kind of let it go and then the developer will come in and they'll give us a low ball estimate like 1.4 million. It's one that we previously got. I think if we
said it's 2 million but we'd be willing to offer inducements of up to x amount whatever that may be. um if the developer comes in and provides us with the community amenities that we want, if they work with the space in a way that we really like, um that we can then put
a number on that and give them that as the incentive. Um does anyone think that that might be worth pursuing? Because I think we might get a broader pool of applicants that way. >> I I'm I'm not opposed to that idea. I think we might be smart to
I don't know that it's a great time to do it when we have a nibble right now and we go back out and say we're that just a lot of things going on at the same time. But if this doesn't produce fruit, I'm not I think that's worth talking about. I think that's a workshop
probably better than a council meeting. But but yeah, I don't think that's a bad idea. I I don't think that's a bad idea to say we're willing to talk about P3s or we're willing to talk about some incentives to do. >> Aren't we doing that now though?
>> Well, we are. I mean, >> I think to some extent we have >> that we advertise it, >> but we could probably hone that. I I don't think that would be so bad to talk about that with our broker and our staff.
I just don't know if it would be the time now when they've made an offer. I know you don't like their offer, but the rest of us do. I'd like to see this run its course before we change the listing. >> I would like to see it run it course. >> I don't think that's a bad idea, though. I think that's worth it worthy of a
workshop. Seems to me say we if we could get >> Yeah, if you want to clarify it. Sure. I mean I think we have requested u in conversation with the broker here.
We have not necessarily done an in-depth back and forth where they give us the suggestions of the best way to market it, how to make this more viable. But we have I know I have asked what should we be doing? What should we be asking for?
what should we be looking for or or presenting this property to make it more viable to get what we're looking for? But we haven't necessarily had a workshop where they've come in and said, "Well, you all need to ask for you need to market it this way or that
way." But hopefully it has been communicated to them. I mean, they've they've received the communication that, you know, we're open to to some different ideas. Um, >> but I don't know. >> So, yes, I would be interested in in
having a workshop with them because I don't know what they're thinking from from their point of view, if they've incorporated what we have tried to communicate in their marketing strategy, but I know
they're they're definitely trying to sell it, but it's a matter of what's going to give us the most value. >> I think so. Council member Kravis has a point because some developments have happened over time. It's been a while since we had a workshop with um we've changed our guidance a little bit too
with the we want some outdoor >> Yes. >> um you know um activity kind of space and so um I don't know if it's not a bad idea after the after we see what happens with this if it's not a bad idea to regroup with them and say okay we're starting to we're getting lots of
offers. We're just not getting the kind of stuff we want. Right. And I'm I'm totally in favor of it, too. >> We've had we've had offers in the past that have relied upon these financial incentives offered by but they came from the developer and the hotel. The motel
for the hotel, for example, was one and some of the other projects down there that uh did bring forward financial incentives were requested. Uh obviously didn't take them because it didn't work out, but um yeah, but let's let's let
this one play out first. Council member Kitz >> sounds good. Um I think in this scenario we have to kind of think of ourselves as the developer. So but I agree with what everyone else has said. Um there is one other property right now that is not
under contract, not even under prospective contract at the moment, which is the Curry Bowl. Uh so I think it's much less critical than the property that we're uh that we were just mentioning. But nevertheless, it would
be a good idea to maybe find ways to integrate it more solidly into the overall downtown concept with the walkability and whatever else we might try to plan there. So the same idea that I just brought up might also apply to that in a smaller scale. So I think if we do want to have a workshop like that
with the U realtor, then I think that would be a really wise move because sometimes if you price a property wrong, you just get the complete wrong type of interest in it. And when you price it appropriately, then all of a sudden all the pieces click really quickly. At
least that's my experience. So, um, uh, I don't know what the process would be to have such a workshop, but, uh, if it just requires a motion, I'm happy to make a motion to that effect, but otherwise, uh, open to suggestions here on that. So, you're talking about a workshop
while the paddle project is still pending >> for the other property that we have downtown, not for the I know I I I took on board what everyone said. You don't want to address that property as long as there's interest in it. We do have one other property downtown that is also for
sale and we could apply the same principle to that which is to offer an enducement for someone coming in who's willing to develop that in a way that we find particularly pleasing. >> You guys want to do that? I don't want to meet with them twice. But >> well, I think it would depend on when we
can even schedule this. So >> yeah, I mean >> based on when we schedule it, we may have some knowledge of what is is going forward with the Blazing Paddle project. >> Yeah. And and there may be some merit to
having the workshop done before the Blazing Paddle thing because then it would apply to that piece of property if that deal falls through. But >> um it also could hurt that deal too. So I I am uh I'm just willing to wait to
see what happens before we do that. It's a good idea to have that workshop. >> That's my concern is impeding the deal that's already um that's my concern and what happens at that deal will have an impact on what
how to market the second parcel. If the paddle thing goes forward, >> your marketing strategy may be different for what you're looking for on the second piece. if it doesn't go forward and it becomes something else now you're looking for something entirely different on that piece. So
>> I I just I mean it's up to the council. I think we should wait. I think I'm not opposed to having a workshop with the broker and I think that might be a good idea, but I don't think it's a good idea yet. That's just my take. >> I prefer to wait.
Well, my question would be, what if we just scheduled the workshop for late October or early November? >> They may not know anything yet. >> They're not going to know anything. >> That's my concern. We can wait. Once we
know something, then we can schedule one. >> Oh, well, okay. I mean, I I would like us to have something where we do have a strategy, but I I do understand that our strategy might change depending on the
outcome of the these negotiations. But um you know that's my that's just my concern is I want to be where we're a little more purposeful
with our marketing in case so that we don't miss something. But I do feel like we're I mean we're accepting. I think the brokers understand they can bring us a lot of different projects and we're considering things
that we had not considered in years past. But so I I don't I mean I I I'll do whatever the majority want, but I don't mind having it earlier and having the strategy to go forward,
but I don't want to impede an existing project that could potentially go forward. >> Well, and that's what I'm afraid of. If you were the potential developer of the paddle ball thing and we meet with our broker in public and start talking about adding incentives to the other property,
How are you going to feel about buying? You're like, "Wait a minute." >> Yes, I agree. >> Um, I already have a $600,000 incentive and that they're offering it $600,000 under list, so they shouldn't be too unhappy.
>> Okay, city manager, we were still on your report. >> Yes, sir. Thank you. Um, so second item I have is actually speaking of workshops. Um, so as the council's aware, next year, uh, my recommendation
to council is that we go out to the um to the voters in November for a general obligation bond for a public safety complex yet to be determined whether it's a police station standalone or police and fire combined on the property. We're researching that over the next couple of months. Um, we have a
bond bond council. Dwayne Draper is our bond counsel and he has uh suggested that uh we may consider doing a council workshop on the whole bond process. It's not something this community has done in quite some time, maybe ever. I'm not sure about >> We did have bonds. >> Yeah. Back in the day. Okay. Um but
there is a definite process. There are timelines. There's a way to do this to make sure it's done correctly. We have to get it on the ballot and all that. Um there's certain votes the council has to take in terms of u resolutions or ordinances as well. So, I would recommend that we look to schedule this
workshop as soon as possible. Um, so I just want to see if the council's amendable. If you are, I can have Genie work with you on finding a time and date that will make sense. >> Of course, >> I have a question. >> Sure.
>> So, we are also looking at a wide variety of funding potential for water treatment. And I know that that's a totally separate fund being an enterprise fund and this would be a general fund
obligation. >> General obligation approved by the voters. >> So is this would we be able to go out with two different bond issuances if we needed to issue a bond for the water treatment?
>> Yes. They'd be separate. So the the general obligation bond is the voters would have to approve it. Uh it would actually show up as a separate millage rate on their tax bill on their trim notice and their tax bill separate from the city's budget. The
water system because it's an enterprise fund. It will be a revenue bond assuming we go down the bond market which I anticipate at some point we'll have to that revenue bond will be secured by rates by what the rate payers pay. We'll have to do a rate study for that. It's not a voter issue. It's a just you do
the rate study. Uh you determine what your rates need to be basically as collateral for the for the future repayment of this of this debt to the water system and then then uh this the council will have to take a vote and do grow through that process. But then it's
a the bond is only the collateral is the the future rates. The geo bond the security in essence is the mill the millage that's separate on the on the tax bill. so that they'll be paying that over a period of whatever the term is going to be of that general obligation bond.
>> So the potential bond issue for water treatment requirements would not need to go on the ballot. >> That is correct. >> Okay. I just I want to make sure that we're not >> at cross purposes. >> It's not equivalent to corporate debt.
if the uh um water system were to issue a bond, is that why it doesn't need to go to the ballot? Just asking. >> So, so general obligation bond, it goes to that goes to the voters. It's basically you're on the tax bill. You're on the property tax bill. Remember our utilities, our enterprises. They don't
go in the property tax. They're paid by the rate the customers through the rates. So, they're separate animal together. So, you're issuing a revenue bond based on the future revenue generated from the rates that the customers will pay. So that's the way it's set up. It could be I'm not familiar with whether it's I don't want
to say it's corporate debt or not because I've never been in the private sector in that fashion. >> Thanks. >> I I think the workshop would be beneficial particularly because we're probably going to be having some discussion about the water in the future
too and we might gain some general knowledge about the bond. >> Yep. And he can speak to that as well. Direct bond side of the house. I I'd like to have the benefit of that workshop before the water estimate comes in and then we I I I mean I don't know a whole lot about bonds. I
mean I know generally how they work, but I've never been in office since we undertook a bond. So um I I think it would be beneficial unless you guys disagree. >> Okay. I'll have uh we'll reach out trying to get some dates. Okay.
>> The last item I have is I'd like to invite uh Kevin Woodard to come up. He's wearing the right shirt for it, too. >> You're walking billboard. >> Good evening. >> Thank you, city manager. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Council, always appreciate annually getting to come and talk about
one of our favorite events. And after a meeting like this, hey, let's get excited and let's keep celebrating 100 years uh of history here in Temple Terrace. And the keepers of our history are our seniors. And um I'm privileged to work in the senior programs for the city of Temple Terrace at the Omr
Lightoot Center. And we have our 36th annual and yes I know Mr. Chambers you remember all of them very well. 36th annual senior expo. Uh senior expo is a very important um event that we have.
It's fun. uh brings community together and I think our goal is to always bring our seniors and the the seniors in our community surrounding Temple Terrace very important information that they need to have in a in a neutral environment. It can't be stressed enough
that um it's difficult for seniors these days. A lot of highressured um you know type sales type events and things like that um where they might not feel as comfortable talking to um up to 10 or 12 individuals that could represent
insurance needs for them. Uh we schedule this event every year so that we coincide with all the new legislation for Medicare and Medicaid and so that all of our insurance providers actually have their printed material and things as we enter enrollment period for seniors um in October and November for
Medicare and Medicaid. But this is much much more than that. U very pleased this year to have Generations Club as our title sponsor. This is an adult daycare provider and where we can only provide
certain services for our seniors and we call ourselves a senior activity center. Um we we want to encourage our seniors to get out, be active, improve their health. Um there are so many seniors and families and caregivers that are in situations where they need an actual daycare type facility and they're going
to be on hand. They're going to have a complete room at the center and they'll be able to talk to families and caregivers about how they could provide daycare services for seniors that do things that we can't provide um as a city staff in Tipple Terrace. So, very
pleased to bring them on board. Um we're going to have Eminent Fitness. There's a local guy. Micah is a personal trainer. He trains seniors. He does a fit over 50 class on Fridays at Lifeoot Center. He's awesome. Come and talk to him. uh
visiting angels. So we have national representation um as well as our sponsors MC ICE will be there to give everybody a little treat at the end of the expo and dedicated senior medical services is a big provider in Hillsboro County and around the Bay Area. Uh they
will be there as well. So we have uh some wonderful sponsorships and we're going to be doing some important things here. Axiom Health is actually going to be on site and they will be doing a limited number of cognitive care evaluations for seniors. So, it'll take
about a half hour if you sign up that day. Um, but we know there will probably be a demand for that. So, we have them coming back on October 23rd. So, come to Expo. If you can get a cognitive evaluation during the expo, that's fantastic. If not, you can sign up for
the 23rd and come back. They're bringing a mobile bus to our facility to do these screenings. So, you can do it uh right at the Lightoot Center. Um Alzheimer's Association will be there with their brain bus. Um ARP has partnered with us to bring in Shred 360.
I know a lot of seniors out there are going to be excited for this one. Uh you can bring in three kitchen bags or three boxes of paper materials. Please don't bring hard drives or things of that material that need to be shredded. uh but they will be stationed in the east
parking lot and you'll be able to bring three bags or three boxes of items to be shredded and uh fraud through mail addressing and things like that is a huge issue for our seniors. So this is something where you can have a little peace of mind and get some of those
documents um that you'd like to have shredded done in a a secure manner. So um lots of fun over 40 vendors. I will be there Friday, uh, September 19th from 9:00 until noon. Um, please don't come
park at 7:30. I got to get the vendors in and get them set up. And I know my seniors, they'll be there. So, I hope you guys can come out. And, um, I really do invite uh, more than just seniors to come to this event. Families, caregivers, please take advantage of
this opportunity. We have senior law there. Um the city represents always very well there. Um many of our departments will be there to answer your questions um from the city and Hillsburg County aging services will be there. So wide variety of things for seniors and
their families and caregivers to take advantage of. So I really appreciate the time to be able to get the word out about that and hope everybody can come. February 19th um 9 to noon September. >> September 19th >> September. If you say it wrong, then
people remember when you get it right. >> Thank you, Mr. Word. Mr. Beu, >> that's all I have. Thank you. >> So, while we're on the city manager report before we move on, I I neglected to bring this up under new business, and I should have, but the city manager's
contract is up for renewal in October. And so, um, we need to begin the process of that. And so in years past, the council's directed me to meet with the city manager and bring that back for
council review and approvement, but that's up to the council how you want to proceed with that. >> Do we need a motion? >> Yeah, I would think so. >> Move to move to approve that the uh mayor and city manager meet um for
preparation of the uh re contract renewal for uh Mr. Bay and bring it back to council for ratification. >> Second discussion. wouldn't mind adding a provisor to that that uh the new contract should include
an appropriate raise given the increased cost of living and the demands of the job >> or does well does that need to be in the contract because we always do um con we do consideration of increased pay based on
>> we we will we always talk about his salary. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. But I'm saying we do. Does it need to be? >> No. No. >> I can't negotiate if you put in there what exactly I'm going to >> The scope of it would be up to your discretion presumably.
>> Yeah. >> Well, that wasn't given in my motion. >> Yeah. >> Well, because I just know we always do the discussion and >> right based on the evaluations, etc. And >> right that doesn't need to be in this motion
unless the council wants it to be in this motion. >> No >> motion stands. >> Okay. All those in favor say I. I >> I >> opposed. Nays. Okay. City attorney's report. Nothing to report to Mueller. Nothing.
>> Okay. Council, anything else? If not, we will be adjourned. [Music] [Music] [Music] Heat. Heat. N.
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