afternoon Good evening everyone It's 6:00 p.m I'd like to call this meeting to order It's March 31st 2025 and it is our council workshop meeting Maryann can I get roll calls mayor Young here Vice Mayor Story here Council member Brandon
Council Member Painter Council Member French here Thank you All right Our first agenda item today is a update on electrical bicycles from the TPD Thank you Mayor Vice Mayor Council So obviously we come before you
to talk about a hot topic issue is ebikes As you all are well aware it's not just aquesta issue It's statewide Uh unfortunately legislation didn't catch up to what they thought it would become and it's become uh very prevalent in all
our neighborhoods Unfortunately as you may of you most of you know is Jupiter unfortunately had a young man who uh passed away from an ebike accident So I prepared uh you all have my PowerPoint just some key points I kind of want to go over because there seems to be a
misconception as far as what is the TP doing in response to uh the ebike uh issue So in 2024 we had 99 total ebike events uh 39 contacts with groups and individuals 10 education contacts two
warnings were issued and three citations Citations were for not having a light at night or a bike helmet Uh just so you all know when I say education contacts uh we do have a flyer You all should have the flyer that we provide to uh to the residents to riders only as well
which is on US1 that sells a lot of bikes and ebikes as well So uh we also go into the schools and provide these flyers to the to the kids and chief I'm sorry can you say the number of contacts you had for 2024 for 2024 it was 39
contacts 99 total calls and contacts Thank you So in 2025 what you will see is there's a big increase because what we've told our residents is to call and let us know you know when when there is an issue Uh 2025 year to date we've had
129 total ebike cat events We've had 29 contacts with groups and individuals 14 education contacts That's year to date So you could tell we we increased our education Uh we've issued five warnings issued three citations and we've towed
an emoto as well Uh part of the problem is the parents are buying these young kids emotives not realizing that they're illegal to be on the roadways Uh so one of our officers uh found one and we towed it and called mom I will tell you
that individual came from Juno Beach all the way to Tqua down US1 and mom didn't even know that he was down here Uh so when we called her she was happy and she was taking the e-oto away from him regardless She said she was glad that we contacted her So what our officers are
doing is whenever we do stop one of the children we're calling the parents If there's an issue in regards to a violation we're calling mom and dad and letting them know come pick up the kid or pick up the bike as well Uh we've had two two uh crashes this year year to date uh with ebikes
One was a ebike versus a FedEx truck on Lighthouse Circle in Old Dixie Uh thank God there were minor injuries And then we recently had one about two weeks ago of a ebike down by Gallery by Gallery Square North A young man was eating an
ice cream riding his bike and he hit an elder gentleman Uh thank God he didn't need medical uh attention Uh and the young man actually wrote a an apology letter to him and to the PD department Uh some of our high travel ebike areas is Constitution Park Gallery Square
North uh Dova Road obviously because of the park uh the Publix Plaza all along to Questa Drive and as well as the country club Again biggest issue we're having is parents not knowing and ebikes Uh e-os obviously like I said they're
illegal They can go up to 70 miles per hour So one of our when our residents are saying that ebike is going fast most of the time it's in actually emoto that they're not supposed to have on the roadway Uh the enfor enforcement approach has been citations warnings and
like I said we have towed an emoto uh parental contact u made Uh obviously fleeing is is a felony even on an ebike Um I know early on we had a a young man that took off Uh the officers did not pursue because god forbid they would
have pursued this young man who you know it could have been very tragic So it is a felony though We weren't able to identify him though Uh and you know we're big in we're big on education We put out a video on Facebook and all our social media You know we continue to
have conversations In fact uh I can tell you it's it seems like every other day someone will come into the lobby to discuss the ebikes and and what's going on A lot of people take our flyers Uh we actually had uh one resident say she took about eight or nine flyers She was grateful that our flyers are so
informative I know they seem a little wordy and long but she actually appreciated because it kind of delineates exactly what the law is because you know to be honest a lot of law is convoluted in regards to what can be done So uh you know it's we just want to provide as much information that we
can to our residents Uh obviously and I've had this conversation with parents it's a big issue with the parents right so the kid says "I want this bike mom dad." And they're buying an emoto and not even realize it With an ebike you know especially after Christmas we
always get an uptick in in more come uh January you'll see a lot more kids with them Uh so it's becoming a lot more uh pervasive in regards to how many people have ebikes Not only here a lot of the kids that we stop are from Jupiter or
uninccorporated as well So the parents just obviously need to help work with us on this part Uh you know we're going to continue to do what we're doing What I you know what I say is and I often look at the Facebook and I'll see messages people say that the police aren't doing anything as those
are numbers that we're keeping track of through the CAD Uh I've had conversations with the North End Police Chiefs We're all in the same boat in regards to you know uh just being an issue with these kids They inex inexperienced It's a motor you know it's it's It's going a lot faster than a
usual regular bicycle So you know it's it's something that we're all aware of We're all on the same page Uh no one on the north end and I don't we didn't contact everybody in Palm Beach County has any additional ordinances other than what the state laws requiring Uh you
know uh I know when we had ours where we had them just going staying off the sidewalks I know Jupiter not I had an issue but just had concern because there's they didn't have that and some of the kids were you know the people weren't can I ride on the sidewalk here or here I can't so you know it gets a little confusing when when you talking
about some people to be quite honest don't even know they're uninccorporated where the village is you know uh so that that's an issue in regards to education part but uh speaking to the north end chiefs you know we're all on the same page in regards to about educating our youth and when there is a violation you
know we we we take action Like I said uh I've gotten plenty of calls where kids are riding without lights When the officers get out there and don't see a light at times they're issuing a citation At times uh they'll just say "Okay here's a warning." But call mom and dad and say "This is why we stopped
your kid." Uh I will tell you uh there's a a young man that we've stopped sever several times Uh I got a nasty email from dad saying he wanted to make a complaint because he felt that our officers were harassing him Uh it wasn't that the officers were harassing him is we get called we're responding the kids
in the area You know he wasn't issued any citations but he's in the area part of the complaint that he's weaving in and out of traffic which you all have seen by the time we get there they're you know riding perfectly but nevertheless our officers are going to have a conversation with him So that parent wasn't happy I will tell you that
parent uh what a week later literally his son was then in Jupiter and received a citation for I forget what it was for but he received a citation and then he was doing a records request for our stuff because we had stopped them earlier So you know it's it's one of those we're stopping them Our officers
are stopping them You know most of the time people might not see it but when we get called like I said there's a large uptick which I told our community keep calling When you see something dangerous please you know by all means let us know and the officers are going out and and taking action So you know I think from the PD side uh again we're doing a good
job of addressing as much as we can Uh you know if you all want to do something more and you know I'm fine with it Jeremy and I always having conversation in regards to what are other municipalities doing what are other cities doing how are they addressing this and you know I know out in the West Coast there's different things that
they're doing Like I said in Palm Beach County in the north end there isn't much Uh there was a meeting that our PIO uh went to uh and it was brought up that maybe Palm Beach County why we do some kind offormational video in regards to ebikes and to be honest that's great but
we were ahead of that you know our video came out even before that you know kind of educated and Jupiter I know followed suit shortly thereafter we put out a video so uh you know I think that uh it's one of those it's never enough they don't see the officers out there but the officers are out there and companies
because when they do something legal because at the end of the day you know statue allows the ebike on the road So you know there's only so much that you can do in regards to enforcement But uh I I think they're doing a good job of that and educating uh doing the chief's corner and in our pamphlets as well We
have a great working relationship with our business community that has some of our flyers and they distribute I know the golf courts I forget the name of that golf course that we have over there by Rico's but they've also got our flyers and uh as well as riders only in the other plaza
So that's all we have in regards to that Like I said I just want to make sure that you know council's aware and you know that it's not that the officers are ignoring it We continue to educate continue to enforce when you know when deemed necessary in regards to a
violation But most of the time if they call by the time the officer gets there like I said they're going to be on a straight and narrow But when the officers are out there on their own they're taking initiative We came out of a council meeting I don't know if it was last month It wasn't It was the day of the accident in fact where the tragedy
happened in Jupiter and I think uh someone had had text me that there were a bunch of kids and Kurt was out there talking with a group of about 10 kids right after the council meeting So you know the kids that were stopping are good kids We're they're listening in regards to be careful to just be mindful
of the roads when you're on the sidewalk You know give the right way to the pedestrians Uh and I will tell you I know one is it two explorers Is it one one of our explorers that we actually stopped as a result of an ebike
encounter We actually signed him up for the explorers program So which is good because he's part of one of the groups that everybody knows So you know we have the ability to uh have him do extra push-ups but uh he's uh you know he's part of that group So he knows where we
stand and the importance of ebike safety So you know that was something that Kurt did a good job with that of recruiting him into it That way uh you know the PD can know who the individuals are and stuff So he's a great kid Like I said the kids that were stopping are very respectful They stopped yes sir no sir
yes ma'am no ma'am and the officers Ariel acknowledge Ariel Ramirez and Kelly Deafonte are doing a phenomenal job of honesty and Steve Huskinson a great job of honesty getting out there and having uh conversations with these kids So
thank you chief council open up the floor for questions or comments staff question and it is in regards to golf carts When and you don't have to answer today When did the village put in that 16-year-old age limit to drive golf carts because I
can't imagine it was there all the time The 16 You mean to match the Florida state standard the state used to be 14 but the village has always been No the state was 16 The village was 14 Correct me if I'm wrong Keith No but that changed a year or two ago The statute
changed I know that I'm just curious historically how far back the age limit on that goes That's just for data purposes Um I mean I I've said to you guys before I feel like you guys are stuck in a rock and a hard place Um I think everyone up here supports you guys
and doing your job following the law enforcing the nicest way you can do it And unfortunately if you guys don't get responses you have to start you know getting a little bit harsher And the only thing I'd ask for you because I have a feeling this is probably going to go to the state level at some point is
just make sure your officers for us um keep really good data so that way it's not just we see a lot we see a lot of kids how many kids just make sure you guys find a way to keep data how many stops you do and like you just said are they respectful when they're stopped like what else are we dealing with and
that's really all I can ask from you guys and that way when we get asked from higher ups from like state levels we can at least speak for our municipality on what we're seeing specifically so that way if anything does have to change we can make it a very compromised decision rather than
just saying bam Now and one of the things that we did with Northcom because again it's it's an issue statewide but the Northcom uh and the north side of Palm Beach County we actually have codes specific codes to electric bikes to help us gather the data So when we're going into a meeting it'll help us gather that
data that much easier by just punching what the code is and it'll it'll come up So you know uh I know I don't think Jupiter was doing that at first I know for a fact they're doing now because you know my PIO went to the town hall meeting but it's something that we've been doing keeping track of specifically ebikes because I know it's been such a
you know a major topic But on a positive note at least the ones I see especially the ones that hang out my house they're all wearing helmets I don't see as many wheelies Well and I will tell you and it's funny in German and I talked about this and it's most of them do have their helmets That's you
know that's one positive So And thank you for for saying that I just remembered one of the things we do besides the bike helmets that we provide free to residents or or people that want any bike We also were asked by one of our residents if we could go to Limestone because uh Jupiter wasn't
doing it at the time So we actually sent our officers out there and gave some helmets out to the kids fitted the kids at the school and gave them helmets I saw that Yeah So we we've we've had a large increase which is a positive right we've had a lot of parents coming in and saying "Hey you guys give away free helmets You know can you fit our kids
and stuff?" So we have in fact we just placed another order because we get that through a grant Uh you know we just have to keep a a good list of how many helmets we've given out And uh we just got a new shipment of I think 80 more helmets So you know it's something that we're constantly putting on our Facebook
and letting our residents know because our residents I was on vacation She actually sent me the email saying "Hey Gus can you guys uh go to Limestone because some of the kids uh don't have access I called Jupiter they don't have they don't have it Can you guys do it i said absolutely So you know it is something that we do provide as well because at the end of the day God forbid
it does happen You know the helmet at least will will play It's a start It is So it's my positive note That's it I got a few comments and questions Chief the you and your officers are doing a phenomenal job No criticisms there You
guys are really doing a great job Like Council Member Brandon said you're you are stuck between a rock and a hard place sometimes but you guys make the best of it So please continue to encourage your officers What they're doing is phenomenal Even the criticisms we talk about the different citizens of 99 calls is do you have reporting on how
many different citizens are calling you know sometimes one citizen calls 30 times verse I don't have that on me If I if I look further I could you know give you I will tell you we do have repeat callers We do have certain people you know in certain areas that that call often uh in regards to uh ebikes And I
I'll give you a call We had one in the country call I don't know if it was yesterday I think it was last night uh where a citation was given but uh they said there were 10 ebikes uh and a golf cart It when officers got out there it was actually just bicycles I guess maybe because it was dark out it was just
bicycles but it's someone that that calls you know has called more than once and stuff So we do have repeat callers I I don't know have it on there something that we can look up and I can get back to you Understood And I think when you mentioned two crashes um I think it's assumed when you mention a crash it's
the ebik's fault but a lot of these times I think with the FedEx truck too it's that was actually the vehicle's fault not the ebiker's fault And so I think that right now the ebikes do have a negative uh connotation behind them And you know sometimes it is the vehicle's fault you
know at the same time And so and as as said it before in other comments I'm an avid cyclist uh you know firefighter paramedic and a parent So I do get this ebike um issue from different ends And it's not all negative Uh ebikes have actually been a
phenomenal innovation for a lot of areas And just like if it was uh bicycles cars skateboards we're going through this as a community And I do think that with community engagement education um as you're doing that we can really get to the right answer and keeping everybody
safe but keeping this different form of transportation uh that's out there Uh I haven't noticed our kids doing like street takeovers bandanas or anything like that I don't know if you guys have No we haven't had those kind of issues at all So that's a different issue Takes it a different level if that does become
an issue And I think our kids really are for the most part very polite They're just on fast bikes Um the emoto I support you the if there's a zero tolerance or getting rid of the emoto 100% that is not the same as an ebike conversation and I think you've done a
good job with the flyers I know I saw at riders only you had the emoto specific and it's really surprising how many parents and cyclists don't know the difference all right so that purchase their kid an emo emoto who have no helmet that you guys are giving them um
it's a very interesting um issue there And I think really it's the parents that really need to take some more responsibility here Uh it's it's not PD it's not us it really is the parents There has to be some more education for them and however we can get that
um I think best for the whole community One of the other things I thought was interesting is that we're talking about ebikes and the danger but I also noticed the amount of cars and being my job the driving and texting And I can assure anyone here that driving and texting is
much worse than this ebike issue but the conversations are about the ebike issue Um so it's an interesting thing to me to spend so much time on that ebike issue and those same people are driving and texting putting those ebikers at risk as well Um ebikers could be kids I think we
keep saying kids but it's elderly that have issues walking We have people going to work on ebikes Um just recreational using them properly And so I think we have to remember that when especially if we make any changes in the future that it doesn't just affect kids uh it's going to affect everybody who uses an
ebike Most of them probably doing it the right way Um let me see here I noticed you guys April 12th you're going to do an education event at Constitution Park with writers only or you planning on it no Did I say that right
no You have something skateboarding Skate That's a skate st Yeah Okay I want to say if not maybe it's a good idea to invite somebody like riders only or whomever can educate the skateboarding kids there because usually it's both right and they're they're not ebiking on the
skateboard park but they're using their bike to the skateboard park like it being an X bike Right Yeah And I think sometimes when the wheelies are going on people are confused as an ebike or just somebody's really good on the bike right and sometimes they're just good on the bike It's not it's not an ebike
Uh social media wise is there any has it been discussed to push out that social media instead of just posting it maybe putting some funding behind it to push it into those age group and parents maybe before the summer before Christmas Really push it in front of their algorithms to make
sure they see it we don't have to rely on them going to um to Quest's page if they don't follow Okay But we can push that in front of them maybe with some funding It's usually a very lowc cost option An idea i'm not sure if you thought about that yet And then uh bike racks Is there
anything wrong with putting some additional uh information at the bike racks we So I will tell you that one of the things we've done is we've actually gone to the bus stops I don't know if you all have seen us and I've had the officers speak to the parents handing out the flyers and having conversation with the parents while they're as well
as some of them if you look right here on Questa Drive if you have the bike rack there uh you know we'll go out there and we'll wait until they get on their bike and provide it for them as well So we have done that as well Okay Thank you And my last comment was um if there's any interest from
uh from your side what we I've seen in the past is big awareness group rides So what happens is PD blocks the front blocks the back and you ride through town US1 Beach Road Questa Drive but PD's blocking both You invite everybody out and they get to ride on these roads
that normally you wouldn't be able to because there's so much cars and danger and congestion Um and it looks like that's been a great event of awareness for other municipalities kind of doing a Tquesta group ride that's escorted by PD It's it could be families kids you know
all together I know I had a quick conversation in passing with councilwoman Brandon in regards to she does a her bike um in the country club on July 4th a bike ride so maybe we can put something together for that I know we had a quick conversation on it that's just for the name that's just for the that's
not yeah I'm intrigued by that US1 makes me nervous about that but no you lock it down the other road I'm intrigued by that you have something that you're interested in I'm happy to head it up or use my resources and and do so and Um or any more questions on how that works
it's been done in big cities No it's no problem That was my last set of comments Thank you for all your hard work Chief Thanks Chief Um what you've heard already tonight is kind of echoes what I say and I know that you're doing a great job because I see more kids with helmets I see more kids with helmets buckled I
don't I see more safe riding Um and I think it just your data proves the point you know you quadrupled or whatever you've done with your your incidents and your contacts So keep it up You know there's a lot more people that are riding them safely now But my biggest concern is these younger kids that they
don't know They don't know they're on the wrong side of the road You know they could be going 15 miles an hour but they're on the wrong side of the road and they're coming and they don't understand the ramifications And I just refer to my house on Dover They all go to the stop and shop and they are there's going to be a
massive massive catastrophe there That's a lot where they the gang of six or more always seems to cruise down You know we have someone a resident that calls her often So we have great dialogue Kurt's been out to his house a couple of times and we've had conversations We've actually put our officers out there and spoken to the kids while we're out there
So just the the fact of park the proximity and stop and shop So you get a higher volume of of kids on bikes You know it's I don't think anybody when the ebikes were designed or came on the market I don't think anybody thought they would explode like they did you know and so we're just playing catch-up So keep doing what you're doing I know
you're doing it It's easy for me to defend No the our police department is very engaged and very active So just keep doing what you're doing you know no complaints from here Um yeah I'll kind of echo what Vice Mayor said I know sometimes it's hard because I think people don't see what you guys are doing and and I get you
know comments like that but then I'm able to be like well we've done XYZ and let them know like how much that you all are out in the community um educating people and making sure that you know the ebike riders are are operating safely Um a couple questions Uh Council Member
French brought up distracted drivers in automobiles but my question is is there any law or would you you know pull over or make contact with the ebike rider if they're you know uh on their phone while operating their ebike as you mentioned
the ice cream like one was had ice cream because that I see them all the time They're not paying attention at all and they're on their phone I'm like "Oh that's really dangerous." So how do we educate them on that level too yep Uh I know with that juvenile we did we had a conversation and part of it is because they're not old enough to have a license so they don't know the rules of the of
the road So we do when we speak to them we we talk about not going the wrong way about not being distracted So the the guys and gals are having those conversations with them And then what about technically how many are allowed to be on a bike because you see a lot of times how many seats they're on a bike Yeah However many seats were on the bike
that's legally what it's like making the contacts and you see multiple on a bike Kurt and I stopped someone that it was one seat and they had two people on there So Kurt and I like honestly and that's a good thing right so the fact that we're so small is whenever we're out there you know assistant chief or myself or Kurt we'll we'll see it and
we'll stop them and have the conversation and then someone's walking alongside the bike But uh we do Yeah And may I don't know maybe add that to our our flyer or messaging just about you know don't operate while distracted with your phone or maybe just adding that to
messaging um because I know you're out there talking to them but maybe if that's on um the um you know imaging and flyers we're sending out because then like you said the kids are getting it but then the parents are seeing it too at that point and that way everyone's on the same page And then um I do think
kind of keeping engaged on um offerings not just in Dquesta but elsewhere in the north county I know there was um an event at REI that the TPA was doing that I you know sent to Jeremy and be like hey like put this on our social media and let the community know that you know Palm Beach Gardens isn't too far away
Maybe someone would want to go to REI for that educational course So kind of keeping a pulse on maybe other offerings that we can at least distribute on our platforms to um keep people engaged and informed And then um I just I don't want to open a can of worms but I want to
make a uh just get this on record is make sure we're all clear because I you know have gotten these questions Technically by the state law can we do anything more restrictive than what we're currently doing i think it's more of a Keith question
Following the state law is is what we're doing right now Um I I've provided uh a memo and I've updated it a couple times on this and the one of the biggest questions um comes down to age
restriction The statute is silent on it I'm aware of a couple of examples out there that have not been judicially vetted So some which means somebody's adopted an ordinance that's not been challenged yet where they have said um
they define ebikes within the broad umbrella of micromobility device and then they say um that definition only talks about the the ones that um only go up to 20 miles
an hour So it doesn't capture that class three ebike but then they'll say no no no one under 16 can ride a micro mobility device So there's a couple examples of that out there Again it's not been judicially tested I don't know logistically what kind of challenges
that would uh pose to law enforcement in terms of actually enforcing it and then what do you do with the kid if so there you strictly speaking
um that's a question mark you know you used to have the sidewalk restriction I mean that's something that's allowed but um we don't do that uh for variety of reasons since council made that policy decision So so you know there are other
things but um right now we follow the state law and that's what I can offer you especially in terms of the age restriction I would put a question mark on that It it it perhaps you could others are doing it
not been judicially tested Okay Thanks for clarifying that But for um I want to be clear that I think being aligned with the other municipalities on this and kind of a unified front is going to be better on this case because like you said you have so many kids that are not
kids any ebike user that are you know crossing city lines and we want to be consistent on messaging and and make sure everyone's clear Um but I you know that that question does swirl around there like are we doing everything that we possibly can do and I believe we are
from a statutory standpoint especially if it's a question mark You know we are have always kind of operated we you know like to operate in the bounds of the state law the preeemptions We don't ever want to necessarily set ourselves up for lawsuit there Um but just want to throw
that out there so it's on record All right I don't have any additional comments Is there any public comment yeah Julie can Julie can you come up to the podium and that's okay State your name and address for the record Julie Bowmont 94 Fairview East How often do
you want to Hey Julie Can you just address council and talk in the m talk in the mic and then we'll How often should you uh call the police about having an interaction with a bike or I don't mean hitting somebody It happens
all the time to me but I've never called anyone Do you want to hear about it chief can you come up with an answer thank you Absolutely Julie just for the simple fact like uh Councilwoman Brandon said it just in regards to statistics so
we could say we have this many calls So anytime that it's a negative where you know maybe they didn't hit their their horn as as they went past you on the sidewalk we do want to know about it because then we can document it and have those stats ready So when we make an argument if we make an argument at the state level then we'll have that in
order So any other public comment i think you're staff but come on up Greg I do You can comment as public Yeah I'm sorry I I love it All right let's do this So um yeah Greg Corvett
Parks and Rick Um that was cool I will have to say that since these guys have started like really paying attention to it it's gone down a lot I mean a lot Um because there was an issue
at a food truck and it kind of grew and then these guys stepped in and I I've seen a big because I'm kind of in it somewhat so I kind of see it and I kind of hear it and it's gotten to be a huge improvement and I think it's going to
get better California is probably getting ready to ban them So whatever happens in California is going to trickle down to the East Coast So I think when it happens there there's a big thing that's going to happen in 2026 So we'll see what happens in
California too So um that's just a a couple thoughts but I mean he he's exactly right The kids are very respectful They do wear their helmets Um I'm in the Viking world I see it all the time My wife drives an
ebike She loves it So it's a fine balance I bet these guys are doing a great job Thank you Okay Any other public comment all right Thank you Chief We appreciate the update and thank you for everything you guys are doing Thank you
Next agenda item two discussion on the Dequesta Park master plan and a work authorization for the engineering services with Kimley Warren Thank you mayor The you guys having your backup the proposal from Kimley Horn As you guys know we got an appropriation
from the state um which is a 6535 matching grant up to I think $680,000 from the the state Um we have $250,000 set aside in our capital budget for the matching funds um as part of the
sertax um infrastructure sir tax fund Um we uh have also we've engaged Kimley Horn to do the the plans for this that this was part of what we applied for in the grant was put together construction plans So in front of you guys do you
have 100% construction plans um the the cost for it the the proposal Um as part of an opening meeting that we had with Kimley Horn um it was myself Greg and and Jonathan Heg from from Kimley Horn
We discussed and we had the the master plan Um you know I know that Greg has um discussed a couple of minor changes to the to the plan So we're really talking about two things tonight Are we okay with the master plan i know Greg has
some feedback And then are we okay with the Kimley Horn proposal and um and moving forward and we'll bring that back to to council for consideration discussion and consideration Um just off the top of my head and Greg is here can help answer those questions But you know a couple of
things that um that were not part of the the parks master plan was we had two sand volleyball courts I think there's an opinion from I think a lot of people that play pickle ball over there that we need more pickle ball courts So I think Greg has uh discussed u putting that in
into the plan The other thing is as you guys know the the gentleman who was living out there in the park has passed away The trailer will be moving So that was always kind of like you know do we do we change that in the master plan or
leave it We left it at the time However you know we're looking at uh making a putting a maintenance shed out there as part of the master plan And so that will need to be you know updated in the master plan And so those are two of the things that I can think of off the top
of my head that uh we we talked about in the introduction meeting with Kimley Horn when we were doing this I mean I've asked Greg to to come and talk and you know if there's any other feedback that he wants to provide but um or we can just take some questions however you
guys want to handle it Thank you Jeremy Um I just before we uh get into discussion can you tell us what the uh major changes were from the proposal we saw that was dated March 3rd the new one that's presented tonight
dated March 13th yeah the March 3rd you know we didn't bring that to council pulled that off the agenda but uh to get to 100% plans instead of 90% plans we pulled the survey geo tech work and environmental off of that um and then
replaced it with 100% plans So those were the three differences So at some point in the near future we will bring um the survey the geotech and environmental as separate contracts and we won't we won't subcontract it through Kimley Horn So that was the major the
major differences Okay Thank you Um Greg do you have anything to add before I open up for council discussion or no Okay All right Council I'll open the floor Uh whoever put together this plan and I know it's more than one person Just the
plan itself is phenomenal job I mean I was looking through it trying to find alternatives and different ideas And you know I think it's tough sometimes on council We're not in every meeting every email every conversation So keeping up with this each change on a project this big uh is tough But as I looked through
it uh even looking for issues uh really great job on the plan itself overall Um at first I was like "Oh there's no there's no sand volleyball courts." You know that's going to be that's a big thing right now And boom there's sand volleyball courts Uh and whoever put together this summary for us uh on the
changes and some of the items up here great job as well and made it really easy to digest what's there and every question I had was answered in that plan Um my only addition or something to think about is uh an ability to have a large event at Tquesta Park So if
there's um one of the events I know I've seen downtown West Palm they call it a um forgot the name of it cold something event but it really needs a large amount of space which we have there but parking might need an issue and I'm not talking about a huge event but just something where maybe we can convert some space to
uh more open space or parking some way to convert it I don't know exactly what that looks like and I can send you the event um to reference that but that might be an idea for such a large space in sequesta since we don't have it in constitution part but phenomenal job
with this uh plan and summary thank you so if I can just add um you know this plan was was developed through I mean many hours um and I sat through many interviews with Neilsa and um and Neil
NZ consultants developed this master plan through public comment and you know many hours So I think it was well done I think we had you know the the community helped develop this Um as far as the layout of it one of the reasons why we you know put the multi-purpose field up
front and move the baseball fields the back is so that we could have some more open space in the front and and be able to have some events out there because right now we have you know baseball fields with you know the the cages in in front So it makes it very difficult you almost have to like walk all the way
around the fields to get there So I think that was that was part of the the design is so we could have events over there knowing that at the time two years ago that we knew that Paradise Park at some point would be sold and developed and um so that's one of the reasons why
we we laid it out that way I think Thank you Yeah that was I didn't know that was accessible for events in the back That's phenomenal Thank you I guess my only question would be I mean do we absolutely think we need more pickle ball courts and if we did make more pickle
ball courts where they go where the sand volleyball are they going to be fenced because that closes that off My biggest pet peeve with that is because this was spent so many hours and the community was involved in this decision and it was
really a compromise of fitting everything in just to kind of change it and we're losing one sport and aspect I wish pickle ball courts were more versatile compared to a volleyball court because once it goes in it's kind of
there So I wish it had more versatility Um that's that's kind of where I sit I'm not loving removing the volleyball but other than that everything's fine Yeah I agree with what council member Brandon said Um if that was community
input to have the sand volleyball then you know whatever we can do to keep if it's just one of the two uh and the pickle ball doesn't appear to be going away Um so if we could I know the times I have been there there's a line you wait you're in a queue forever So if
there's any way that through the design process that we could figure out another place to put I don't know two more or four more it would be great But um so maybe like one of the sand volleyballs gets turned into So I think
I I think I already have the solution Um if you look at the two tennis courts um that are on the south side right there what we can do um actually we can do it right now um is convert the one
tennis court to two pickle ball and that'll give us um eight which is pretty good And then the other side would be stay completely tennis um with like a hitting board um you know
some sitting areas for the tennis players So make it very appealing for the tennis player too as much as the pickle ball side So um that's just a thought but yeah that'd be great And the the trails that are identified here are
these hike they already existing They are not all of them Well yeah that's true The ones that go all the way around are already existing but the one that cuts up the middle that one's not there The shell rock path is not there It used to be kind of overgrown but I think when
we made this that's when park and wreck was cut or whoever it is that goes out there and kind of cleans up the entrances so you can see them better The the scrub or whatever the area there is is that are we procluded from clearing any of that where are we
talking about here like just around the walking trail the dark green areas You talking about like right here so interesting You know when we first um and I think a couple of council members were here we first you know developed a master plan like we had some more fields
out there and we really had cut it out I mean I think there was a lot of kickback to do that And so we quickly changed and and and made sure we actually added some scrub js and some green than what's currently there I believe And so um I
wouldn't recommend that we do too much with that just because we we did get a lot of feedback from that I would say more way more feedback than that with them with the volleyball courts Um but that was a big issue to try to keep it as natural as we could but still make it a an active park too So
um yeah Jeremy's great And um the other thing we have a Florida trail grant that's in the system right now We're just waiting to hear from them So we could improve the walking trail with
mulch signage um you know more accessible than it is right now So uh that grant actually would make a a huge improvement to that trail So
no I mean I like where we're at with this thing and thank you for all the work that's been done I'm glad that we're able to get the 100% plans over the 90% Um you guys are able to rework that and and how Kim Horn sharpened their pencils a lot So thank you for that and I'm excited to see it move
forward Um one other comment you were talking about all that scrub that's in there So I would say at least 30 or 40% of what's in there is um non-native
So there's a lot of um uh Ken who's working for that overseas Constitution Park he's working with the state on um exotic removal for this park Um so
You'll see I mean it's it'll be scary if we do take out all those exotics because it'll look it'll look like you went in there with a like a you know and just trimmed it up because there's a lot of Brazilian pepper in there I mean a lot So um but once you get in there and you
take out all the exotic species and everything it'll look a lot different Yeah Look nice Those Brazilians once they once they get in there just to piggyback that So part of our we had to update our parks plan with the
state supposed to be every five years We we had fell behind a little bit here and there like before I got here it it became pretty uh it was very challenging just to work with the state but we but we did and part of the agreement that we
came to is that over the 10-year period or uh that we would remove the invasives and so we came up with a plan where we do it you know do it in phases and then in the short term can end up working with the state and getting the grant to
hopefully do it um without us spending you know a ton of money and so you know kudos to to to Greg and Ken for for doing that on their own unprompted Appreciate that And hopefully we get that get that done where we don't have to spend a lot of money over there
removing invasives because it was going to be pretty expensive to do that Okay Um a couple things So I would uh I am very much in favor of keeping the volleyball courts Like council member French said I know a lot of families
that um children are really big into volleyball and and this is um a regional park and we have you know from day one sent that message to state It's not just a Questa it's regional it's Martin County it's Palm Beach County using it and I know I know families in Martin County and Palm Beach County that say
it's very very tough um finding available volleyball courts to play So I don't think we should get rid of those I am in favor of more pickle ball If you can figure it out without increasing the impervious area or footprint that is currently shown I think that would be fine Um this already got brought up as
well the um the new trails So the the connections are new but also enhancing the um loop I think that was part of this plan I think the the intent originally if I remember correctly was to even have some potential trail
lighting and some nature signed I don't know that I saw that in Kimley Horn's proposal but I would really like to have um the new trail the enhancements and maybe we do solar lighting you know so it's not we don't be running um power out there or anything but I would really
like to see that included and then you know any other landscaping enhancements that need to be done or it's done separately under a you know another grant that we have but um at the end of the day that needs to be picked up one way or the other and then I wasn't clear on the structural and MEP for some of
the buildings um I know the new proposal says through 100% plans but in the project assumptions it still says like the structural MP is not included for some of the structures so is it or isn't it it's not included by Kimley Horn it's a prefab building so the manufacturer
will provide the MEPs for that So Kimley Horn is not they're not going to do it as part of their work but when they get the building the prefab and all that the manufacturer of that prefab will provide that MEPs for that They they do the MEPs too That's what I was told Okay
So the reason why it was exclus that that is provided by the company that they're going to get those from So it should be like a plugandplay Yes um structure Yes Sometimes MEP is not maybe just I'll go with what you said they
said Um and then I know the security systems and any off-site improvements are excluded Would we contract with um like a communications um designer separately and do that under the grant too yeah Yeah I mean I think if we if we
wanted to to do that I mean I think we need to have a conversation about that I mean I know there's not a lot of parks that you know are full security full cameras everywhere So I mean if that's our intent we'd probably uh I don't think that's going to be included in
this grant because this grant's not for purchase of stuff But I mean if we're going to design it I guess it would be kind of considered as part of that Um well and just a communications in general So usually security communications just low voltage I guess in general would we have any other low
voltage needs out at that park I don't I'm not sure what you might know better I don't know what we have a constitution for any kind of low voltage needs um but again if that if if we do need that let's try to you know
capitalize on that grant money and whether Horn does it or we can surely you know um contract with someone else direct for that I think that would be helpful Mayor when you mentioned security is that you're mentioning is that lighting cameras automatic gates or what is that
not lighting but I would I would think mostly just cameras I don't think we'd have an automatic gate I mean we there was a caretaker there Um so I don't know you know that person no longer there Is that is manually closing that gate every night how do how does that work
i don't know Greg can answer that Yeah The um Questa PD is helping uh with uh opening and closing it Okay Yeah See I guess manual gay Do we have any cameras at Constitution Park we do Yeah So we would need And what about any
other low voltage needs is there I don't I know we don't provide Wi-Fi to anyone out there Like so there's it really would just be cameras probably Okay Yeah Yeah I mean you could um there's going to be electricity at the front of it and it's probably mainly at the entrance and
um I believe somewhere in the middle of the park where the ball fields are if there's uh like a concession stand or like a press box type thing or whatever somewhere right there would be but to get it all the way on the perimeter and everywhere could be you know that could
get pretty expensive I think So does that answer your question yeah I mean I think I would leave it up to staff's best judgement on where cameras would be needed or not Um and then oh you bring up concession I mean what are there going to be is there going to be a point of sales there we would need um commun communications
there for that probably Right Right So again like those kind of things just start thinking about them and so we can sign someone up to start that design Um so we can use money for that Is there a concession in between those fields there was a plan for concession Am I making
that up it's a little blue circle right in the middle right there Oh there it is Yeah Okay Yeah I wasn't sure You're gonna have I mean you're going to have splash pad out here There's a pavilion out here There's a you know concessions and there's going to be power in the middle So But we'll take a look at that So I
assume we probably have like a low voltage uh engineer or design consultant we've used in the past right Yeah So we could we can do that separate from Kimley Horn Okay that's all I have Anything else
nope Thank you Any public comment Marca marsh Neielson to Quest Pines You would agree with me that if I was renting a house it would be extremely unwise for me to spend money to upgrade a new kitchen since when I left the house I would not be taking the kitchen
along with me The improvement would stay with the property The present Equesta Park lease ends in 2055 approximately 30 years from today That seems like a long time However given the scope of the project and what would be involved regarding funding plans etc I would
venture that a great percentage of the contract time would have elapsed before construction would have been completed As with my fictitious kitchen all permanent structures would revert to the state if a new contract was not signed We've had this contract with the state
for many years beginning with Roy Roode However in light of events last year regarding the state's attempt to pl to place three golf courses in supporting services at Jonathan Dickinson I am very apprehensive that the village can count
on a shared vision with the state Gail's Gail Herald's House Bill number 80 and its companion Snider's 209 are at present winding their way through the session As reported in the post quote "Golf courses tennis courts pickle ball
courts ball fields and other simil facilities are excluded from state parks Our residents voted for a lovely plan which would enhance the recreational opportunities for everyone However I do question whether they are aware that the
park does not belong to Tqua that we are responsible for the maintenance of every facet of this park and we cannot discriminate as to who uses the park and that the state could easily and swiftly take the park back I believe that in
light of last year's events and proposed legislation to QuestU should reassess our commitment to expensive enhancements of Toquesta Park and explore other opportunities Thank you Thank you Thank you Any other public comment yes Miss Watkins
Good evening everyone Pat Watkins 167 River Drive Uh obviously you know with the recent events of Jonathan Dickinson that does call into question My question is have we even researched whether or not your even proposed new plan would be
grandfathered because it's in the works before said leg legislation happened that's the first thing It's always been a concern here and I know I've mentioned this to you all a few times Toquester Park doesn't belong to us And my
question about this I I know I was here for all the the things that that brought your presentations together I don't think the public was ever seriously made aware of the fact that the more you do in the park the more increase you have in maintenance fees that are coming to
our residents even though they don't own the park It's a beautiful plan I'm glad it's modified from the beginning when it was much bigger I'm sure it'll be enjoyed but when you offer to the residents what would you like to see you're going to get Disney World And I
just don't think enough focus was put on presenting to them a realistic picture that what you do over there is going to have a financial impact on their property taxes or something Thank you Thank you Thank you Any other public comment
um you know one thing I don't think we answered for uh Jeremy is the elimination of the caretaker building for maintenance area right did we address that i don't Do you need direction on that one or No no really It's more of an update I mean the the
the building is coming out um at some point I wish Doug was here but he couldn't make it tonight But I mean the building is in the process of being removed by the by the family So um unless you want to put another carry building We're going to replace it with
a maintenance So it's more of an FYI probably but um you know unless you guys have different direction I'm fine I just want to make sure we address all your proposed changes Okay All right Moving on Agenda item three Uh a presentation on backflow
prevention and cross control connection cross connection control Sorry Marjorie Good evening Marjorie Craig utilities director See if we can get the the presentation up There we go So this isn't as fun as a park
um but it's really important to our uh our water system So uh we've talked about backflow prevention and cross connection control compliance uh it was been part of our dashboard for a long time and as you may have noticed pretty
much all we've ever been able to get is about 50% it might be 48 one month it might be 51% or 52% So we we took a look at how could we increase that compliance But first of all we'll talk a little bit about uh
give you an overview what is backflow prevention what is cross connection control what do you know why do we do it um what are we doing now and what can we do what are the options to impre increasing compliance So backflow prevention is
kind of what it sounds like You want to try to prevent anything from going back into our water system and contaminating the public water supply So the backflow prevention devices help uh keep that from happening Uh they have a a a valve
or something that keeps that uh something uh or any kind of contamination to go into our water system or an air gap You can also have an air gap So a complete separation between the two systems Um these devices
are private They're they're um on private property They're owned by the the customer and um they require testing A non-resident residential device or commercial device requires testing annually and a residential property
requires testing every two years So there's some nice pictures of a potential of of backlo devices And then uh what's a cross connection cross connection is between any type of maybe a different system Could be a the
portable water system and a reuse system Could be just a regular irrigation well It could be uh potentially a swimming pool So different there are many different sources of potential contamination industrial
systems heating cooling systems and sprinkler and fire systems as well So there are different regulations that regulate this and uh make sure that we maintain compliance We've got some tech technical guidance through American
Waterworks Association We have state law and then we also have our own local law and those are all attached in the workshop materials as well So what are we doing now um we have a company that helps us with our compliance from the
standpoint of mailing uh notices out to customers They also collect the reports from the customers um and load it onto uh our site So the testing is still is the responsibility of the owner the property owner whether
it's commercial or residential And failure to provide results to the village can result in the portable water or the fireflow lines turned off You can imagine how difficult that is to turn off a fire line or someone's uh portable
water So when we um before we had the contract with Aqua Aquabacflow we actually had uh a much lower compliance as well And this goes um just through the current practices that we have Um the
testing has to be done by a certified tester Um those credentials have to be submitted with the test results And if your backflow prevent fails you have to test it You have to either repair or replace it and retest it within the 30 days And then if you do replace it
you've got to submit the type make model and location of the backflow device And we have there's a specific form that has to be filled out That's a a state comes from the state and from the technical guidance And then failure to meet requirements can result in water service
disconnection So I'm not aware I brought my brain trust with me as well I'm not aware that we've ever turned anyone off for non non-compliance and also talking to Jupiter They have a very similar process as we do and they also they have
like a a red card that they'll issue um uh hey we're going to turn you off but um they weren't able to find anyone that they'd actually turned off either So it's a it's a constant struggle to get uh people in compliance
with this and we need to improve our compliance So what is our current compliance and again as I mentioned this kind of can go a little bit back and forth It's it's right around 50% Might be 42 might be or
48 might be 52% Um we've got a total of 792 backflow devices and of those we have um 564 commercial devices Is that right
Dennis that is correct Those are testable devices So that leaves us with 228 uh residential devices Um we have the 30 60 90day um and you can see the the 50% we we've got to improve that We
we really don't have any options So we've looked into what could we do um and no matter what else we do you know it's all it's all about awareness and getting people into compliance and rather than beating them up Um the goal
is to try to get people to come into compliance rather than punishing them if possible So um we want to enhance the customer awareness and um we want we looked at a company called HydroCorp who
has also handled this public engagement program with Cooper City Penro Pine some other smaller locations Now they also can provide other services as well um and they can provide on-site cross connection control uh visual surveys
manage the program and um one of the challenges that we continue to have is all tests are due the same month because we do have to submit an annual report to D Um so that's something that we we will
bring forward to you regardless of the other additional compliance options So here's one of the particular options and we could I could have not shown you this option but I do want you to know it does exist and that I have managed
utilities that have done this Um and it's typically for commercial properties because of the uh fire line testing and the importance of that Um where I had staff uh that were they were on staff and they
actually performed the testing Um there is a liability of course as I've already mentioned it's private property it's a private device and an increased operational cost and we just don't have the bandwidth we don't have the staff um we don't have enough of them to have a
full-time you know staff member do that um and the repairs would still be done by an outside company and a contract would be required I'm going to move on from this one Um the second option still maintaining the customer
responsibility for testing and um we still coordinate the reporting through aqua backflow and that we add fines to the water bill So right now we do not have a mechanism to add fines to a water bill Um we can threaten
to to disconnect them but we can't find them And so this is one one of the options that we had come up with We'd have to revise the ordinance to allow the final um imposition and then formalize the compliance process through
the building department They would have to have resources available to be able to do the compliance because in our code um it it continues to reference the building department for compliance So it's not something um they'd probably
have to to add resources for that And then the third option would be to hire the company um the hydro corp to actually perform the testing Um this contractor specializes in it There are
other governments that are doing it Um when I looked at the prices it's actually less for the customer uh than probably what they're paying in general but you'd still have to have have to add it to the water bill The
rates do not include that cost It's still on private property They're still a liability and they do have insurance and so forth Um but it have to be added to the water bill in some way So when you say added to the water bill for option three would that be just for
this specific person or would this you know bringing on a contractor be distributed to all the users no No it would just be Well there's two ways we could do it We could do it for only the people that are in non-compliance but then there would be no incentive to be in compliance right
or it' just be the ones that have it's only a pass through for the testing component to have the private company conduct the testing and then post it Um but that you know the advantage of that is that your compliance would definitely
go up But the disadvantages are it's a liability It's still a private owner You know it's private property It's owned by the customer Um and we probably still want to have a
we probably no matter what want to add a um a fine to our ordinance because there may be people that don't allow us on their you know property and so forth So this is just an example of the option number three and that's the letter that
um Penrook Pines sent out to their customers introducing that company uh saying that they would be conducting the testing for the customers So with that just the next steps want to continue with the uh proceed with public
awareness and then want to discuss with you the uh testing and compliance approach and then we'll have to revise the ordinance as needed and then longer term and after a while I'll come back before you because
we really need to do some customer surveys to see who who maybe doesn't have a backflow pre that should So there are people that have backflow preventers but we may have customers out there that should have a backflow pre that don't currently And to
and to do that that will take um a lot of education a lot of outreach before we start down there that road Any questions thank you Marjorie Council comments or questions i do have questions Okay so
first question for the public Where does one find their backflow piping this whole like device where would they even go on their property to look for that it would be on the other side of your water meter Okay So
David do you have any more information than that right after you want to come up here So I say that because you keep mentioning the word educate inform and I totally agree because the importance of having that unless the house has been redeveloped I guarantee you the average
person has no idea where to look for that because how many times do we have I agree with you someone say you know something's leaking and we all say go outside and shut off the water the main valve So just where would just where would someone find a general placement of that yeah just to answer the question
David Tanokco with the utilities it's they're mostly installed above ground Um I've not seen one right after the meter And the reason for being right after the meter is because you don't want to have any connection on the private side that bypasses the protection So you want it right after the meter So any connection
the customer is going to do five years down the road to you is not bypassing that assembly We that's you know the main point we want to protect the system with So perfect So if we start doingformational stuff to inform residents that they're supposed to be in
compliance like pictures of like some of the average placements of existing ones would be very helpful Secondly I mean a couple years ago the hose nozzles at my house were like from 1960 and I had them replaced with the levers which is
magical by the way That you know I had to pay that plumber per hour and that was lovely And then plus the devices So when I see this thing this makes me think of like you know a sprinkler pump And I mean what if someone's not in compliance or they don't have one they have to install one Do we have an
average cost today with inflation of what one of these would cost someone i haven't heard that yet in your presentation Again they're probably going to range install from 500 to probably $1,000 based on the Well hang on So just the
device or is that including like a plumber's hourly fee i would say including installation the device plus the in the initial installation Okay you're going to average and and that is determined based on the degree of hazard and then that determines the level of protection that you need They have like
three different variations of protection So if you're a low moderate hazard you wouldn't be required to install this device You know high you know extremely high then it's the highest level of protection that we want So for me as we discussed the options real quick can I clarify one thing sorry to interrupt
Does that I would assume a permit is needed for this work and does that cost that you just said also includes a permit fee i would say yeah Okay Sorry No mayor That's a really good point And we can come with a more detailed uh estimate He's just doing that off the
top of his head And if you really want something that's more specific we can bring that back to I was just asking for a ballpark because that's a ballpark I replace nozzles and I look at something like this and I'm like so I asked that I'm glad you bring that up mayor because
I see most mo most of those options you were giving us said 30 days to come in compliance or I have a problem with the 30 days because that's a hefty fee for someone if they have to pay that within 30 days Two they have to go through permitting That's a lot of stress
sometimes Secondly we don't have a lot of plumbers in in our country anymore So I mean just it needs time because even with something broken and it's not a pipe that's filling your house they don't come right away So I mean that's my concern too is the availability of
actual plumbers that know what they're doing who are going to take this on I know one guy in Jupiter and you probably know him because apparently Jupiter's been sending him to all these houses to do all he said that's my job right now is just doing backflow backflow backflow He's like I'm so booked just from backflow Yeah we we have two things One
is getting the people that have the existing backflow preventers in compliance And right now we only have about 50% of those folks are getting their backflow preventers tested That doesn't mean that the backflow preventers don't work It just means they're either not getting them tested
or they're not submitting the report One of the two And we need to get those folks into compliance The separate issue is doing a survey to determine who should really have a backflow preventor that might not Um and right now we are
focused on getting those folks that have the backflow preventors into compliance Right so if you if you have a backflow preventor and you have not conducted your testing and you're not in you know you get a 30-day notice you get a 60-day notice you get a 90-day notice
just the same as Jupiter Woods just the same as St just where where I've worked that's pretty standard Um and then if your backflow prevent if you find that it's not it's you've tested it it's not working or you need to replace it then having the we don't really have an
option there We're supposed to turn someone off if they um if their backlo pre is not like actually not working Okay I know it's so this is not my favorite I know And I know that the towns are working on too I'm just so as
we look at the different options my concern is the timing of when we're really going to get on people to have it done by because of just permit cost and availability of plumbers Um and then just being sensitive to the cost I mean
someone might need 30 days That's a lot if it's Christmas time That's it for Got it Yeah Marjorie why aren't these installed when it is known that it needs it why is it installed on our side where we have the the knowledge the control
the testing all of those items where it's left up to the resident because it seems like even if we fix it short term the long term of the continued testing is going to be a tough thing to accomplish And just like you said with a customer survey that number is going to jump up pretty high I would imagine And
and you're never going to be 100% But if it was on our end we would know what we have We'd know what we're dealing with if it is such a health and safety issue Um I guess less and less wells are out there but you have the the pools that are on automatic pumps to fill Um
especially the higherend homes that are coming in So yeah my only my only first question is why not on our end especially back not located on our end yeah why don't we just have that on board anyway that way we have control Um
and I don't know the answer to that You'd think I'd know that but I don't That's not answer anything I know the answer to Just the way it's always been designed Well it's private In my experience I would I mean it's always been determined on the level hazard If
you have a property that doesn't have irrigation any of those things that are considered you know hazards then there's no need for them to install anything Uh so how do you break that down now to charge customers that do need it and include it in your water bill I guess
versus the customers that don't need it may pay for it because now you're establishing rates across the board Uh so I think it has been left on a casebyase basis as to who needs it and needs to pay for it That's probably why it's designed that way and I can probably check into that a little bit
more It's because the hazard is on the customer's side and not on our side Yeah I'll say just just some to give you some insight Uh not just in Florida but other states that I've worked in um every job I've ever done you know for what I do
for my professional career it's always um on the the owner side Always I've never had a project where the backflow is installed by the utility company It's on their side I think that's in that might be industry standard I'm not going to say nationwide but I've worked in two states and it's always on the owner side
So I I again that's just my personal experience through my profession but that's my experience as well I've never seen it Good question Yeah it's a great question I you and I'm thinking private owner if they want to make a muck of their own yard that's that's their business But if you're affecting me or
the neighbor you know I don't really want to leave leave that up to the to the property owner if if you're saying this is a health and safety issue Um so there's anything we can change like that in the future especially with the you know the amount of renovations we have that would be great And then that should increase your percentage You have
control over that Um so when we So you're talking about hiring a company to test but which seems a little bit easier of an issue We also need these installed where we have logistic issue cost issue
When does the person want to maybe they can't afford it but they need to have it especially if it's an older home it has the well they can't redig so there's there's a chance there is someone on fixed income that now needs to still might not have it or have to pay for the
testing Um but again it's a safety issue This is which creates a different this is not a citation for other things when do we step in and just fix it for the safety problem and if we have to place that fine on their utility bill lean or
whatever that may be for the for the neighbors It's a great question Some uh utilities have it incorporated into the utilities rates and we do not So everybody's paying for so everyone would be paying for it
because it's for the general safety of the entire system So in that case it would be what she was commissioner Brandon was saying that person everyone would bear the burden for the risk that the one owner is causing through a pool
or a medical device or an irrigation well okay that's not well no I mean someone saves money up with having a sprinkler on a well and then we have to pay for the Yeah Okay And no that was my uh Oh incentive wise
is is there any discussion for incentivizing hey these three months if you get everything up to date we're going to wave the permits I don't love Wayne permits but Wayne's not here So Wayne yeah he's not here so he's uh
um we can take that back and and uh talk about that I my guess is that would be a decision of at a higher level than mine I think most residents you put this out that even if they walk outside to look for the backflow they there's no way They don't know where their meter is They don't
know where water turn off is that they're going to have to hire somebody just to come out and find out right i Well um in the case of the commercial customers they usually do know where it is and they know where the fire line is In the case of the residential customers
uh it'd be kind of a mixed Some people will and some people don't Do you have a larger concern of the commercial over the residential or is it equal where do you think the I mean you know it's hard to say because the the what he said about risk is right and it's the
way I approach everything in utilities What's the risk um is it is the risk higher for a commercial customer than a residential well not if they're overcoming their the pool system pressure and pushing it you know it just it kind of depends on the situation
Yeah it depends on what actually the type of business it is Like for example building that all they have is a bathroom that's a low hazard So that's now if it's a highrise building now you have back pressure So now that becomes a high hazard Now if we lose pressure all
that water get up in the system And we don't have any dry cleaners I don't think in the village But I mean that would be another one that would be we do I'm sorry I don't get out much enough in my office So I asked all those additional questions because you know
you kind of throw a safety uh grenade this way and how much of a safety grenade are we dealing with here and that's I'm trying to gauge that If you're saying we need to act now right we have a brewery here in the village would be a higher location and they do have a backup there So that would be an
attempt higher So you guys have identified all the high hazards and we can kind of work back from there Yes Okay I understand Yes And um remember our service area is twice as big as the village So the v as you already probably I tell you almost every time up here the
village is two square miles and our service area is four square miles So when you're looking around it's not just those um customers that are in the village you know commercial customers It'd be some of them that are else in our service area
Understand Thank you and for answer those questions If there's any guidance you need for incentives please um let us know if we need to support the no permits for a certain amount of time and if there was any additional language to support new construction a certain amount of renovation to have a backflow
vention on our side I would support that also Okay So this is for every it's for residential and commercial Yes And we have a total of 792 We do Doesn't that seem low based on the four square miles
of property that we provide water to well we have um as you probably already know about 6,000 customers or connections Mhm So it could be could be low I've owned a home since
1988 This is the first time I've heard of this of a backflow preventor Well I've known a backflow I didn't know it was my responsibility to get it tested every two years I've owned a home since 1988 So wow Toquesta and Palm Beach Gardens So at least talks about it Palm Beach Gardens
never did I didn't know about it Um we We measure what matters right typically and we've measured this for well my two years two and a half years on the council Um so it matters
So I think my role as council is to the health safety and the well-being of our residents So this matters So I don't know the best way to go through it I mean I'm sure you've done research like what what are our neighbors in the north county doing uh sounds like Jupiter's
pushing people places or something I'm not quite sure But how to go about it i mean does every home have one no If I have a sprinkler if I have an irrigation system on a well do I have a backflow pre on my I I don't know yet but eventually we're we're going to be
conducting surveys to look into that Is that a survey of a customer or survey of an industry expert a subject matter expert yeah it's a survey of a customer Okay And we would we would take it you know basically street by street and
say I Rick I need I need you to go in your backyard because my meter's in the backyard So I need to go to on I need to go to the backyard look around for a black boat black backflow pretor That's part of the survey process That would be part of the survey process Okay
I think it's if it's important to the water quality and the water safety um I think there's be a lot of surprise people It's It's not my fault I mean this is I know this makes me uncomfortable I know But I also know how important it is to do this and that's
why I'm here and I have my my um brain trust here because we're all living it Yeah So you're saying it is important your recommendation It's very important I recommend that we do this I recommend that we move forward with a public um engagement for sure and I recommend um
that we uh enact a a fine on the bills and that we look into further um with our legal expertise to see the benefits the potential benefits of having a private company conduct the um
backflow uh pre testing and what you know what the implications are You know the problem with that is then it's put on the bill and there's probably some confusion My water bill is high That's not it's not because it's the water bill
in in the sphere of backflow prevention and crossconnect I know zero So I will defer to you and your staff of subject matter experts because I don't know enough about it But if it's important to you and it's important that we measure this which we historically have then it
matters and I'm want to make sure we take care of things that matter So that's my comments I appreciate that and I know that we will get higher compliance if we have the the testing conducted but I also know that that is a whole other you know it is owned it's on
private property and owned by the public So creates its own challenges Thanks Um I'm and this predates you but I'm how do we get to the point of being so not
in compliance with a lot of properties is is it because it's they're older homes i mean I know we updated our you know created that manual and approved it in what was it 2021 it's been updated since but uh backflow prevention and those devices have been around for a
very long time They've been co in code for a long time So how did we get to this point because I think we'll like if we have to answer questions if we start imposing fines or have to pass through a contractor fee like h how do we get to
this position so that we can explain to our homeowners because like is it their fault that they don't have one i don't know I just I want to be able to justify because I do think it's very important I've this has been a bugaboo of mine since it's been on that um report because I'm like why do we see this
every month and it hasn't changed for a very long time like what's the point so this is a big deal but I'm trying trying to understand how we got here so like I'm able to communicate that to our constituents I think that's a great I think that's a great question
Um I would I've been here you know two and a half years and we've been trying to increase the compliance and our current methods are not working So I don't you know my understanding is before we had the company that assists
us with the 30 60 90day and the here load the your backflow uh prevention device test on the website Before we had that the compliance was less Is that correct Dennis that is correct So it was less than Well less than 50% 30% He said
it's uh around 30% And so um we're doing better than we were but we've got to get that number up And but beyond that I I I don't know how we got where we are today I don't you know and I'll just speak to before I got
here you know speaking with our previous utility director It was a conversation as we were doing meters it kind of came up about backflow and as you guys remember and I know Miss Brandon you know the meters were painful you know all the stuff that we went through so as
we as we just you know determine we weren't doing testing we weren't getting those reports um that's right around the time we started having the conversation about getting aqua backflow because we were having we had the issues with the meters we decided not to go like you know full bore full enforcement we just
try to monitor try to get compliance Um I I can't speak to why they weren't doing it before I got here I don't know that I mean I would venture to guess because they didn't really have a utility director before I was here I mean the um but um we weren't doing a
good job of it We identified it um four years ago five years ago Um and and really just now getting to a point where we kind of got through the water meter issue We we've tried been doing it through the aqua backflow is trying to bring some compliance through some notifications It hasn't you know we've
kind of you know got stale with that And so that's what now we're bringing some options of how do we get compliance So we don't know the answer to prior to five years ago why why we fell behind This is you know this is water Water's
important Everybody knows that I mean it's one of those things where you know we we know it's important We got to do something So we're trying to bring some options awareness Um I think it's easy to to say we can take a six-month bite at this and say you know we can start
notifying people and say you got six months to come into compliance My guess and I'm not a utility director I went through some other city My guess is most of the most of the houses probably that need backflow probably have backflow We just don't have them registered and we
don't have we didn't have that device to give to Aqua Backflow so they can send the notifications So we're missing a part of that because we don't know which houses or which properties have the backflow which will part be the survey My guess is most of them will probably
have them but that's just me guessing on Marjorie has probably more experience than I did My other city we went through the same exercise This was nine years ago so this is nothing new you know nationwide My guess is most of them probably have them just not we don't have the device registered So they could
be marked as non-compliance but could be brought into compliance very easily They might not even be on our compliance non-compliance list We just don't even know They're one of the what 5,300 that we don't even know if they have one or not And they may have one or they may
not And it may work and it may not Right Um so to kind of gauge the best what council thinks the best option is um and maybe understanding how staff would tackle it Um like how how big is the
risk overall like if you have one home has an issue is it shutting down the entire water system well you may recall the city of West Palm Beach having a systemwide boil water notice some years ago by having a backflow um
contamination crosscontamination Like one house could do that Um there are no absolutes It can Okay Um in the case of West Palm Beach it was at the plant So when it happens
at the plant it sent it out to the entire system So I guess just from like can we can we peacemail and focus on areas or uh properties that would be more higher risk to shut down the system you know instead of tackling everything
at once kind of um phase it by you know level of risk Um we can I'd recommend going ahead and implementing the you know the increased compliance right now the engagement the increased engagement and going ahead and adding um the uh
fines to the bill Um as far as the surveys to determine are there people out there that have them or don't um we do that a little bit at a time We'll we'll come back to you with an approach Um and then is there anything we can do
to our code to require like if they don't have one and need one if they do a small remodel they have to install a backflow at that time is there anything we can do there to to try to bring more people into compliance too i'm I'm sorry Can you say that so like I
right now someone does a remodel um and say they touch they're touching any kind of plumbing in the house they don't have a backflow and they need one or a pool remodel whatever Is that I mean do we would we require them to put a backflow in then anyways if we determine they
have a well or a pool or something like that then the answer to that question is yes But I don't think it's it's not required If not is it yeah the building department when they inspect the property So there's a remodel Yeah If they're touching any plumbing that would require it they
would be required how many times once twice how many times once twice multiple times Multiple Okay And actually complied with it That's a separate issue Okay We we That's a separate issue Okay
We we circles here We know the non-compliance according to devices we have Yeah if they have a backflow preventor and they have not performed the testing they've gotten a letter Then they've gotten the letter Okay So my question was so if someone needs a backflow and they don't have or my good assistant
back there Jay has told me safe water safeation they will help us We'll start with that And my recommendation in this situation because you guys are hearing this for the first time is let them is let us go back talk about some of these things like waving the fees but let us
come back with a plan for you I think that's the best option at this point if if you guys and I think I mean I know staff is not in favor of option one I'm personally not in favor of option two which is basically what we're doing now but imposing a fine I I I I think that's
still going to be a lot of work for you Um probably even more and I don't know that it's going to help that much Um so which le is option three but maybe you guys can analyze this some more Um yeah I just I I don't know that option two is
the right answer Option two will take more resources and more time Um I agree And so for me now hearing everything that's been discussed I don't like any of the options I think you guys are over complicating it because there's so many
of these that we don't even know that aren't registered Is it there is it not is it compliant has been tested I am not in favor of finding anybody all of a sudden when they like Mr Like vice mayor said like no one really knows these things It's like you know the AC guys
teach you change your filter every whatever months No one talks about this in your plumbing until something breaks and you need a plumber and then you can't find a plumber So I am not in favor of just finding people I'd rather find a way to tackle and figure out the answers to the ones we don't know of And
if they're not there or they aren't being tested just tell them test it and then we can charge you the $14 whatever in your account But I am not in favor of just blindsided people with things on their bills and I think you should just keep it super simple If we survey I think the survey has to be
delicate um because FPNL sends out stuff too about electrical this and that you need to put the surge thing and what do we do we throw it away So I think we need to approach that very carefully and make sure it's very personalized much like how we do with the FPNO undergrounding so people know one it's
for real two it means business three the this is what would happen if you don't comply but before we start you know attacking you about it we're educating you first and then see and then then once you have it registered then you can go through the process in my opinion of
we've sent you sent max x max x max x max x max x max x max x max x max x max x max x amount of letters but for these people that we don't even know these missing links things I don't think we should be coming at them I think we should find the answers first Oh no That that's like a separate issue I know I'm just They're kind of bleeding together sometimes It sounds like So that's where
I stand I don't want to be finding anybody yet unless they have been in the process of being a registered backflow meter That's different for me Agreed So that I think that separates it These were the ones when I think she was talking about let's put a fine on the
book so we can is these 700 people that we've noticed three or four times that haven't that haven't come into compliance still out of the 300 or the non-compliant is I don't know the color those ones I get that's the ones you stop not the 5300 that we don't know we
wouldn't just start saying you don't have we don't have your register we're going to do it but I would say even this at this point you know let's not we won't go the fine route first let us come up with a plan let us educate let us get this company on board that's what they do they they survey they they'll do
it they'll do it the right way I mean that's what they do for a living We don't do that for a living So I mean I think it's a better approach And this that company I mean that would be an expense that we're not we're not passing that through to anyone at this point right that would just be an expense Yes
you would We would Oh the bill The bill So for for the testing No no no What I thought to survey the property about pass through yet Okay So the survey of the property so we really know what's outstanding what's not out there That is just an expense that we cost is higher
and then our part the part the company would receive is the $15 You can break that down better if I can I'm sorry Every year and I have that backflow pre uh pre tested then I come back to the
village and I go to um our site and it cost me Marjorie When we hire this company is it kind of like we did for the medical transport hire a third party let them handle it Let's see what our percentages are and then go from there
or are we still hands-on with it so the the the company itself still charges that's um the part that would be we we still have to charge if if the private company would have to charge money to conduct
the test right do we know that amount um for Cooper City it's like $80 for a test Now my understanding is they're paying a lot more than that Um if they go to a plumber to have that test conducted $100 whichever it may be whatever it is
now this company will come out and test it for you That's an option Yes And it seems like that takes it off of you guys a little while where we formulate a plan customer survey how do we address the issue the unknown issue out there
Yeah that's the survey is a separate thing that has to be done and are we hiring this company to just do all of that or only that first testing so what I heard the manager say is that we're going to we're going to huddle up We're going to come back to you with our
specific plan and the specific plan is going to right now we're going to continue with what we're doing trying to move people into compliance uh where they're they own it they're and encourage them to have the backflow preventor tested and then we're going to
um have the private company um step up the public engagement component and also look at conducting a survey to try to determine who in the in our service area either has a backflow preventor and we don't have a record of it or doesn't
have a backflow preventor and should have a backflow preventor And if they don't does that company install it or now they're on their own to go find it we have to bring that back to you Understand okay I think that idea does sound like a good plan We have to dial
it in Yeah And normally these surveys are conducted very like street by street very slowly Okay great Any other council comments or questions i have none Thank you I have
no uh thank you for the thorough update and no it's fantastic to see some momentum on this So uh it's a long game and we're getting started but it's a lot better than um just seeing that that uh
stagnant uh graph and not taking any action We'll bring some more stuff back to you Okay And is there any public comment you'll pass Okay Julie come up and to the podium and state your name and address please My name is Julie Bowman I'm 94 Fair View East Um I didn't know
this was going to come up It's so interesting I've been bad Several years ago I got my first letter from Aquaflow and I thought it was a scam because I you know I gave it to them We We know nothing We were as
confused as you all And uh he came back and said "You don't have a backflow and my I have an older home So I do have a pool I do have a well My well I've let go but it wasn't hooked to
anything in my house And my pool had no connection to my house either Um I fill it with a hose It does not have any drainage other than what I make happen." Um and he says "I guess you know you don't have one so you know whatever."
And I called um I called uh this was a couple years ago so I don't know exactly who I called here in Tquesta uh whatever department and I said you know I don't have one I don't you know know what to do And they they didn't have anything to tell me So I
thought okay I don't need to worry about it I didn't know I need to worry about it Again education Um so I think it'd be great with Jeremy finding out what's going on here in a survey to people because uh I have no clue even where it would go because my
meter is right out by the street and it would be very odd to put um anything in back of that where where it's located So I don't know how that would be Thank you Sorry Thank you That insight's very helpful Any other public comment
if I can just lighten the mood while Jay's coming up Um my my other city we it was it was interesting when I got there they were very specific prior to me getting there They were very specific about these backflow devices and they actually put in their code exactly where
you had to put these and it was like right off of the meter And so you would see all these backflow devices right in the middle of yards and people were just furious that they had to have a backflow device right in the middle of the yard
So we we worked it out and and changed the code but it could be up closer to the house so you can put in some landscaping all that But it was pretty obvious that people people had backflows that didn't have backflows because it was right in the middle of the yard So we obviously don't didn't have that written in the code because we don't see
a lot of them But um we'll we'll get it worked out So well and I mean that's a good point If you look at some of the newer construction homes there you see them in the front yard right there So that's something else staff should definitely consider That's how I asked cuz you don't see those in like our neighbors on the older homes Just the
newer the new construction homes Very concerning Most people don't have my neighbors in my neighbor's yard See yours is opposite Mine's out front Oh so much more to discuss We'll have we'll have another workshop on it All right Jay thank you for your
patience Agenda item four discussion on zoning code update Can you pull the PowerPoint up sorry So good evening Uh Jay Hutch community development director Um so typically planning departments do an annual glitch list It's just a you know we we kind of track
things as I as I roll through it on each individual one The first one is that are allowed So what this means is you know it's it's kind of ambiguous but um potentially somebody could pack several people in a house um that are unrelated
and rent it out So we're the only municipality in North Palm Beach County I could find that doesn't have this Um Jupiter and Gardens limit it to four Lake Park North Palm Juno several others limited to three Stewart actually limits it to two and Atlantic Beach where I
previously had worked also limits it to two Um I would recommend capping this at some number Um ideally three Um just to be on the safe side Um and it's this is just something good to have on the books So this is like for a three-bedroom rental home three roommates Three
roommates Even Even even in a five-bedroom house you could only have three unrelated people there How do we monitor that it's It's difficult to monitor Um it's it's really kind of But if we have it we could you could Okay good story In college in Tallahassee I
was living with seven people in a house in a very single family neighborhood and we had a pool party outside in an inflatable pool And uh the next week we had a code enforcement officer come by and ask one of my complain We were able
to look at water bills You know if you see a lot of unrelated people you see really high you know there's an average 6,000 gallons per month If you see 36,000 gallons for a single family home you know that something's going on So there are some tricks that we could find
out And of course it's not a problem The housing market's still pretty strong but if there were a dip like we saw in 2008 you start to updated its landscaping code in in a few years back And the exhibit maybe it was part of the strategic plan I'm not even sure but um I know the EAC has been kind of wanting
to look at this for a few years So staff did some research pulled together a lot of information about green building incentives and and presented to the EAC Um we also looked into joining the lead for cities program which uh June Berlin Colony had done It turns out it's a
cumbersome and kind of frankly seems like kind of a waste of a of a program So they didn't do that uh or the EAC didn't recommend to go forward with that But we do have some ideas for green building incentives So common green building incentives are property tax abatements or exemptions expedited
permitting and inspections reduction of permitting fees grants or rebates density bonuses and height bonuses Yeah the people have spoken So we know we know that there's no no desire or appetite right now in the community for density or height
bonuses Um and then we you know it's kind of difficult for us to do property tax abatements or grants or rebates Um but in speaking with Wayne at the building department um he committed that we could do expedited uh permitting and inspections and that we can do a
reduction of permitting fees And his idea on the reduction of permitting fees is the projects are going to generally be more expensive anyways So you're going to have a higher permit fee So um giving a reduction in that will somewhat defay the cost of the additional improvements you'd have to have to
become green certified Yeah there we go Um and we can offer this for for single family homes and commercial projects Um frankly I don't think we'll see a ton of people utilize it There's very few leadcertified homes um really around
It's it's cost prohibitive Um there are some newer programs that are a little bit more feasible but it's typically being done more for um for like subdivision projects right so Alton is has a few that are certified um because it's easy for a home builder like Coloulter to say
"Hey we want to offer a green building project." It's it's more difficult for a custom home builder to do it or to have a resident say "Hey I really want to be lean lead certified." So um I don't think we'll see a ton of them but you know if it's something you could you could potentially see if the the
Paradise Park project were to get redeveloped or 250 or 300 Beach Road if those shift or you know that countyline townhouse project maybe maybe you could see something on on some of those type of projects Probably not likely to see it in single family homes but you might you might get some kind of green
friendly eco-friendly people that will take us up on it Here's a certification cost estimate This is just an estimate but LEAD is about 15 to 40 It's it's very expensive Um it's actually you know like 2010 or so it was really a popular
program but it's it's kind of become too too cost prohibitive So now there's some new ones There's the Florida green building certification national green building certification and energy star I know everyone knows Energy Star through their appliances but they've actually have their own certification program which is also a little bit cheaper and
it's a little bit more easy to attain Similar thing certification on a small commercial project 50,000 150 for lead it's going to be even higher when you're looking at a big big uh commercial project So what we've done is proposed a
reduction in building permits based on the certification type and tier Um so lead lead platinum is is far and away the best So we are proposing that at a 10% building permit fee reduction Um and then the Florida Green Building
Coalition and National Green Building Standards top tier is is we have it at 75 and then as you see it kind of slides down Energy Star only has one certification type So we thought that that was kind of more in line with that that third tier So we're we're kind of
you know giving a bigger incentive when people are doing that that was more detailed for the EAC but it had it's like a combination of you can meet it from a combination of different things So it's typically you have to get to a score of out of a 100 maybe like 70 out
of 100 So it's low water um energy efficient appliances um stuff because we have a ton of information on its list they the leader in education advancement and evasive plant management in Florida the leader in education
advancement and evasive plant and uh Steve Parker who is our village species when people are coming in and doing this recent species when people are coming in and doing this recently came up with the cypress project that came before you recently where we we took took a site plan to them um and they made a
recommendation for a formula business that needs a special exception it would still go straight to council But when it's a part of this requirements all over the code and it's kind of confusing to keep up with there's some things that require public notice that may not even be in the code Um like a comprehensive
plan amendment doesn't have a there's nothing in the code about that So um some codes have this where they have a master list of all the public notice that's required And then also the state recently um created this legislation where we can use just kind of cleaning that up I think it's a good good bit of
housekeeping to do Number seven outdoor seating So this is an issue that has actually popped up for us a few times lately Um our current code does allow outdoor seating but it does not require any type of landscaping screening or physical separation from adjacent
parking areas or streets So when people come in with with restaurants and outdoor seating we do our best we put our best foot forward to say "Hey can you put some planter boxes in can you do something to separate your your outdoor seating from the public realm?" And it's
tough if there's nothing in the code So this is an example of one that where the Greek restaurant is someone's coming in and they want to put outdoor seating in and we're trying to get them to do something in between the exhaust sprang on you while you're trying to enjoy your food Not great So we are recommending
using basically taking this language from Palm Beach Gardens They have a really good outdoor seating code and it basically just says that um fencing or screening is required to separate public uses um to separate from drive aisles and they actually also have it um requirements for ballards So I had to do
this when I was working on downtown at the gardens They want to put safe put ballards in to protect pedestrians um for obvious reasons nowadays Um and if there's a courtyard development it gives staff the ability to wave it right if there's a courtyard that's internal you don't need to have have that
separation So I think this is a good addition to our code Number eight uh PRD waivers This is something that recently came up when we were looking at the PRD code for that county line um project So our PRD code which is plan residential development um
does does not allow waivers Our plan commercial code allows waivers Um so we recommend essentially taking the same language from the plan commercial code and and putting it in the uh plan residential waiver code And really the whole idea of having a plan development
is to be able to get waiverss to to get some sort of to create unique design and do something interesting So not having a waiver section there is kind of counter to the whole idea of having a plan development And that's all I got
Thank you Jay Council Any comments questions i have a few comments and questions Uh first on the how many unrelated people in a home I'm comfortable with placing two people I think your examples of Steuart and Lang Beach are great Lang
Beach is a beautiful place Two people opposed to the three On the the green incentives I think it's great The research you guys have done in the AC is phenomenal Like it's an incentive not a mandate I'm a little concerned with um the cost for village buildings that we're going to
renovate or maybe we add um on Bridge Road if we're adding a building renovated building water plant or here at station 10 what's the going to be the increase in cost to if if we're incentivizing people are we going to be going to a green building as well and if
so what's that cost um the businesses have the option which I think is great and does this corner us into having to make that decision to uh create energy star building which is very expensive Uh and in my experience I mentioned it at one of our
workshops the maintenance costs on those can be extremely high So there there's really good parts of a a green building that make sense and there's others that you're checking a box and it's going to cost you a lot of money for a long period of time and the workers inside are going to be frustrated So I I do
have a concern on that and if that pigeon holes us to That's a great question And in our research we pointed out or I noticed that a lot of cities do mandate that all other municipal buildings are hit some level of green certification but I did not recommend
the EAC adopt that Um and I know we're I think we're looking at doing some stuff at the utility department right now that's kind of low low frills type stuff So I didn't want to pigeon hole them either Um so I don't I maybe a Keith question but I don't think we would by
incentivizing offering incentives I don't think we would be mandating that we have to do in our own municipal buildings Okay And I would definitely support that 100% On the notifications if we're no longer using newspaper but well are we no longer using any newspaper okay Yeah
Okay That takes that question away And then plan residential development Um if it's a mixeduse plan or building how does that affect if we have a commercial waiver but we don't have a residential waiver but there's a building that is
commercial and residential how does that play into it they would do they do the they would do the PCD So the plan commercial development is is the mixed use section Okay understand So a mixed use would still have the waiverss that
we already approved Correct Okay The residential development I'm not 100% comfortable with the waivers because I almost like to hear some examples on what that looks like so we can establish a little bit of a intent or spirit behind the policy that we create Great question
I forgot to mention in my presentation that that you cannot get them for building height density any kind of concurrency management or environmentally sensitive lands um so an example of one would be in a in a
residential development Um maybe on one side you're next to um single family homes and you want to have a thicker landscape buffer there You say "Hey we're going to put a the code requires a 10-ft landscape buffer there We're going to put a 20 foot landscape buffer in
here where it abuts the single family homes but where it abuts the commercial homes we're going to seek a smaller you know a smaller landscape buffer there So you're so it gives some flexibility for design Okay Um or trying
to think of some other ones I mean that's the big one Sometimes it's for lot size right they may somebody also may say "We want to offer large lots um at the front of a property where they're most visible or along neighboring properties." So we'll we'll have 15 foot
wide lots there but internally maybe we'll have some town homes or some some smaller more narrow lots So it gives it just gives them ability to to have some some flexibility there But but again you don't have council doesn't have to grant them They have to they'd have to prove
through the development process that it's a it's a public good and it's ultimately going to lead to a better overall project or a better design Understood Thank you Yeah Uh great recommendations I'm supportive of what you've presented So no questions Thank
you Do any of these trigger any comp plan amendments or is it all stuff that wouldn't Yeah this is all just zoning code stuff Good Good to hear um on the green building item So with that energy the energy star
program I mean based on what I guess I would need to know more than that to see if I agree with the tier placement because I know I mean I've built uh large mixeduse buildings that have achieved silver gold and platinum lead certification and it's a lot more
than what you listed for Energy Star So maybe that tier should be less I mean I think it should kind of be apples to apples Um but maybe research a little more what the Energy Star program involves Um I I just based on what you
said it's not comparable at all to a lead platinum building or legal legal building I I struggled with putting it in tier two or tier three Like I had it in tier two and then moved it tier three So yeah it's probably maybe closer to tier 2 So if we
come back for adoption I'll I'll bring a slide that kind of shows all of those certifications and kind of what what they require so you can get a feel for for what's involved Okay And I I am in favor of um the reduced permit fee Would that be in a form of a credit though
after they prove that they've achieved their certification how would that work it's it's tricky Um the other cities that have done it have some sort of escrow program where you I think you put the money or we put the rebate into an escrow and then the refund isn't issued
until the certification is proven Okay Because someone could say Yeah because someone could say while they're getting their building permit oh this I'm going to go lead platinum and then not do it take the credit Or you can try to do it and still not get certified So that's um so yeah I would want to make sure we do
it where it's it's only received once the certification's received Y um I know Wayne said he could do that this so I'll leave it to staff but I personally am not in favor of um expedited permit or plan review or priority inspections
strictly because of the state preeemptions that we've received the past couple years and potentially more this year that are putting pressure on our building departments to turn around permits and inspections So I'm hesitant due to the state preeemptions that
holistically we have to do for everything but if Wayne says he can do it I guess at the end of the day I I'll defer it to staff And the reality is we can't really even offer that much here compared to other places So Chicago is a a good example of a city that offers expedited permitting expedited plan review but they're a huge city where it
takes you a year to get to get a building permit and forever to get things through So they offer it and say "Hey instead of waiting a year we can get you through the door in six months." here We already get you through pretty quick So it's going to be two months to like one and a half months So it's not
even that big of a of a carrot that we're even going to be able to offer people But you know it sounds good It'll hopefully you know nudge them It'll it'll hopefully nudge them You know I just there's might be more estate preemptions this year too That's why I
just throw that out there Um and then on the landscaping code updates I think that's great Um I know I know staff is looking into potentially listing appropriate plants that could go in the swailes So if that could be done as part of the landscape update uh I think we we
should do that Council agrees All right that's all I have Any other council questions comments okay any public comment all right with that can I get a motion to adjurnn so move Second All in favor