WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=EmI_7gysJqU

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: EmI_7gysJqU):
- 00:06:12: Meeting Start, Roll Call, Pledge, and Agenda Approval
- 00:08:13: Rearranging the Agenda and Urban Forest Management Plan
- 00:09:19: Consultant Introduces Draft Urban Forest Plan Goals
- 00:11:47: Community Engagement and Goals Translation Discussion
- 00:15:52: Urban Forest Plan's Six Goals: Establishing Basic Systems
- 00:18:50: Public Landscape Trust Fund Concerns and Key Strategies
- 00:21:18: Monitoring, Accountability and Funding Program Discussion
- 00:26:52: Staffing Questions for Public Trees and Spending Money
- 00:31:13: Reminder of Feedback and Opening Public Comment
- 00:32:18: Public Comment: Mary Spar - Modifying Tree Ordinance
- 00:33:40: Public Comment: Mary Spar - Ordinance Updates Needed
- 00:43:33: Public Comment: William Klein - Million Dollar Grants
- 00:45:32: Public Comment: William Klein - Budget and Training
- 00:52:52: Public Comment: Kay - Commends Plan and Questions
- 00:55:01: Public Comment: Kay - Questions Designation and Tree Inventory
- 01:00:17: Public Comment: Kay - Concerns of Tree Team Can't Be Stopped
- 01:01:07: Public Comment: Kay - Concerns on Southern Live Oaks
- 01:03:30: Public Comment: Kay - Question on the Residential Tree
- 01:09:12: Public Comment: Don Perez - Expanding a Private Program
- 01:13:33: Public Comment: Continue Discussion Garden Club
- 01:15:26: Board Discussion: UFMP as Comprehensive Framework
- 01:16:19: Board Discussion: Need Topography in Titusville
- 01:19:38: Board Discussion: More In-Person Comment
- 01:25:55: Board Discussion: Starting Temporary Positions
- 01:27:16: Board Discussion: Need a Volunteer to Start and FTE
- 01:35:18: Board Discussion: Tree Canopy and Mitigation Funds
- 01:40:15: Board Discussion: Need Urban Forest Ordinance
- 01:44:53: Board Discussion: Excellent Goals in this Plan
- 01:47:00: Board Discussion: Get Feedback from Utility
- 01:49:00: Board Discussion: Getting Additional Comments
- 01:53:52: Board Discussion: Land Scape Ordinance Again
- 01:59:23: Board Discussion: Annual Budget Fund
- 02:04:34: Board Discussion: Budget Out General Fund
- 02:07:19: Board Discussion: Clarifying Budget and Report
- 02:15:26: Board Discussion: Add to Public Utility Feedback
- 02:17:01: Recess, Wetlands Tabling, Staff Reports, Adjournment


Part: 1

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How about if I turn the microphone on and we can all get started. Um, so let's see. First things up is a roll call. Can we have a roll call, please? >> Chairman Mjack >> here. >> Vice Chairwoman Thompson >> here. >> Member Berdett

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>> here. >> Member Tucker >> here. Member Miller >> here. >> Member Delgado >> here. >> Member Nico >> here. >> Alternate member Young. Alterate Alternate Member Rosa. >> Well, looks like everybody is here.

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>> Good deal. All right. So, we have a quorum. Um, would you all please join me in the pledge of allegiance? >> I aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under

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God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> All righty then. Next up is approval of the minutes. I'll entertain a motion. I'll move to approve.

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>> Okay. >> Second. >> We have a motion in a second. Is there any discussion? I did have two minor corrections that I saw that actually I'm shocked that I even noticed them. But on page three and again on page five, there's reference to the uh wetlands

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property on 405 that we looked at. It's listed in the minutes as 405 Mars with an S and it's just 405 more m >> M >> and it was on page three and five ony.

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Any other recommendations? Okay, hearing none. All in favor say I. >> I. Any opposed? Passes unanimously. On to petitions and requests from the public present.

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Anybody have a petition? >> Stan. Nobody. >> Oh boy. Okay. Well, then old business and new business, huh? Well, I think we should do again what we did before. I think we should put the

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wetlands and rearrange our agenda, right? So, so that we get this taken care of first and if we have time later, then we can talk some more about the wetlands. But let's uh >> yeah, I would move that we rearrange the agenda to cover new business before old business.

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>> Second. Any other discussion? All in favor say I. >> I. Any opposed? Passes unanimously. Good. On to new business. Urban forest management draft plan. Who's like to uh

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take over. So we are going to present we have our consultant here Liz who's going to present to you our draft urban forest plan. If you recall EOC environmental group was selected to conduct an urban forest management plan. Um many of you

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attended the workshop that we had several months ago, provided input, there were surveys that were conducted and this is the result of that. This is only a draft. This is just for input only. Uh the next step after this is potentially bring it back to you with some changes or refinements at your next

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meeting which is I believe May 13th. And then the intent or the hope is to be able to bring this as a presentation to our city council at their meeting in June 9th. With that, I'll turn it over to Liz and she'll go through her presentation. >> Sure. Do you want me to stay right here for the presentation or you want me to

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get up at the >> Whatever's >> Okay, I can stay here. >> Need to turn the microphone on. >> There you go. >> Okay, there we go. I usually can talk loud enough without the mic, too. But anyways, thank you guys for granting me a slot in the agenda. I'm very happy to

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be here. Um, and to echo what Brad said, this is very much a working draft. Um, we did not hand you a finished plan saying, "Hey, here we're ready to go." We are truly looking for feedback. Um, there's a reason that we don't have the executive summary because we want to

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have everything finalized to be able to do that at the end. So, very much looking for feedback today. Um, so appreciate giving you guys giving us the opportunity to do so. All right. So, let me make sure I can read one. Okay. So, we're going to go

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over tonight um I'll be 15 20 minutes maybe. Uh so, going over what we got out of the community engagement. Um how that actually translated into the plan itself. Um what the draft plan features, so the goals, objectives, and some of

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the implementation. Uh the monitoring and accountability part. And then, of course, time for questions. Um, and I did want to in case you guys couldn't see the giant poster board in the room. Um, if before everybody leaves, they can take a chance to grab a sticker and on

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the left it is what we heard. So, a few different facts from the community survey findings. Um, if you can put a sticker on what surprised you the most. I know which one surprised me. Um, and then on the other side, it's how that actually translated into the plan. So on

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that one, if you could put a sticker by something that really gets your vote as to being the most important. Um, and then we also have comment cards. So if you wanted to reinforce something, something we missed, um, something else on your mind that just isn't there,

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please add it to just an index card and we will review them for feedback before getting another version of this draft plan together. And I'll plug that at the end, too. So, all right. So, here's a brief overview of the community engagement. So, 92% of

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our respondents on the survey said trees were either extremely or very important. Um, I've done quite a few of these surveys. That is a very high number. We're usually in the 70s or 80s. Um, now, right when we did the community survey, we had a lower response rate

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than we had anticipated. So, I think it's important to draw attention to that. Um, and that was right when you guys had the historic flooding. So certainly a reason that filling out an online survey was not top of everybody's priority. Um so city had a great idea is

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to put a very small version of that survey up on flashboat. We were able to get gosh almost 250 responses to that. So we were able to kind of reinforce some of those findings and also a couple of small areas where they diverge.

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Nothing crazy though. Um so the majority of people wanted more trees, right? Um in flash vote 40% wanted a lot more trees. Uh majority supported the city funding trees, tree care and planting.

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Um and then the last one um we did not have a high recognition rate. People didn't really know how to report concerns with trees. Um so that's a major feature in some of our engagement and outreach and education. All right. So what we heard from the

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survey now you see the word perception up there. So we gave some renderings and then asked people questions and one of them was do you think the canopy has increased, decreased, stayed the same or I don't know and you can see almost half

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of the people thought canopy has decreased in their neighborhood since they moved there. Um and then you can see the other big portion was about the same. very few said their canopy has increased over time. Um that being said, when we had the pictures

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showing different canopy cover levels, your survey won't respondents overwhelmingly chose the densest tree canopy um that exists, which kind of blew my mind. That's not something we see often. Typically, you see it land more in the middle like people want some trees but not to live in a forest. Um

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usually it's like me that wants to live in the forest. So I thought that was pretty impressive. Um, when it all came down to it, the top priorities, I don't think any of these are a surprise, storm water, runoff, shade,

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and heat, and then um, wildlife and pollinator. And wildlife and pollinator seems to make it in the top for a lot of cities. So, you're right there with them. And then obviously the storm water and shade and heat are a very local thing for you guys. Um, you don't see

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that featuring as much in a Minnesota survey. So, All right. So, here is the vision. I will not go through and read it, but just know that we had the workshop a lot of you parttook in. We had three vision statements developed. Um, in my mind,

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the three were very similar. And when they were put to vote on, you might have to correct me on this. I want to say it was on social media of some sort, but it went to an online vote, uh, so the whole community could choose their favorite, and they were very close. I think all

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three got 30% or above. The winner had like 37%. So they were all in line with what the community liked, which I think is important. All right. So how we translated this, we took what we heard not just from the community survey, but um in flash vote,

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but we also did a strengths, weaknesses, opportunities, threats assessment with the city staff um that echoed a lot of things we saw in the community survey. Um, and it translated into these six goals that we're going to go over briefly.

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All right. Oh, that's really hard to read from here. I'm sorry. Um, okay. So, the first goal, basically, in the survey in the SWAT, we realized that no person, no single person on the Titusville staff is responsible for managing public

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trees. That maintenance is completely reactive and complaintbased. um there's really no staffing or budget or formalized systems on how to run an urban forestry program. Um and that is

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unfortunately common that you guys are not an outlier in that at all. So the first goal is really establishing some basic systems and designating somebody in charge for of city trees at least temporarily so that we can get to work

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on the rest of the plan. Um the second goal is really building that program. So that one assuming we have goal one underway and we have that foundation ready um this starts working towards

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proactive management. Um and it's been proven proactive management is more cost-effective. So in the long term even though you have an initial outlay you will save money in the long term. Um, for example, if somebody calls you and complains about a tree and you have to go and remove that one tree, it might be

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$1,000. If you're doing annual work, that one tree might be 3 to 500 instead, right? Um, the third goal we came that everybody wanted more trees, more canopy, a lot more trees. So, growing

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the tree canopy, we heard that people were concerned about the loss of tree canopy over the years through development and everything else. So, I think that's a pretty foundational goal. Um, okay. So, now we're on to the second half of the goals, which is goal four, preserve and protect what you guys

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already have. Um, so making sure we're strengthening protections for public trees, reducing development loss, making sure deferred maintenance is taken care of, and the trust fund is used to offset some of that canopy loss. Uh the fifth goal is about health and

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benefits. So those top three community priorities. So making sure that the program is supporting those three priorities. Um the last goal is making sure that we have that integration with the community. So that stewardship and

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access that people can get to their green spaces, they can see trees out of their window. They're able to participate in programs. um because those programs provide a lot of value to the city. Uh but you guys have a great volunteer base and that's something I

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consistently heard is we have all these volunteers ready but we're just kind of waiting for a little bit of more direction, more help, more formalizing of that structure. All right, so I know this is going to be a topic uh the public landscape trust

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fund. So we heard that the concerns were the funds were used for general beautifification. That's the perception, right? Rather than tree planting, tree canopy growth. So, we have a couple of key things that relate to that. One is

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having an expenditure policy that really prioritize canopy replacement and urban forestry as a whole. Um, the other one is related to what feeds into that trust fund, which are the mitigation fees. um so that we make sure that private tree

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removal funds are actually able to go back on private property. Um this is something that a lot of tree mitigation funds struggle with that it just goes back to public property and eventually you can't have a city that just has all

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street trees and no trees on private property. So setting up some of those programs at the outset is really important. Um and then we did get quite a few questions on this um through the city staff's outreach. So that features a little bit later. Um I tagged them on in

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the end of the pro slides. All right. So our key strategies. So going through each goal. I won't read these one by one, but I did want to put up there. These are some of the prime things that we're going to look at for each goal. Um these are specifically

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what you would call action. So like the doable items somebody has to accomplish. Some cost money, some cost staff time, some cost both. Uh which is part of the implementation. And here is a brief overview of the

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implementation plan. So the overall urban forest plan covers a 20-year horizon, a planning horizon is what they call it. um the actual implementation, so developing an actions, who does what when that only covers five years. And

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that's intentional. Um because doing these day-to-day actions 15 20 years out is quite frankly like a waste of everybody's time because things are going to change so much in the next few years as you go through this that in the

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general planning world um a lot of I think even the grant language on this had it working on the Florida urban forestry primer and this is how they do it and that's the reason why. Um, but we should also note that at the bottom the

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progress report. So that starts in the first year and that's an annual thing that gets presented to you guys. Um, and it's a brief overview of what happened in the urban forestry world in Titusville in the last year. Some cities

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the staff prepare it, some actually the council prepares it with staff facts. So that's something you guys if you wanted to you know take a bigger role in that that could certainly happen. Um but no matter what it would come before you for review.

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All right so a lot of plans do not include this portion the monitoring and the accountability. um you get a plan, you start doing things and you hope it goes well, right? But what happens when things don't go according to plan, which is I don't know 95% of the time at

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least, um you have to have some strategies to deal with it. So for every objective basically we have an adaptive management trigger so that it says if this is not happening if the city has

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not been able to do this on time what happens? Um so if we have a net public tree loss what happens? So city staff goes back, reviews planting plans and presents updated planting plans to the

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city manager who So every single thing has a trigger that is associated with that. Um and then as part of that annual progress report, those are kind of your indicators. So if things are going well, it'll show us on track to you guys. Um

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needs attention is we have some issues but we're working on it. not started is we just surely have not even begun yet. Um but I think your all's role in that is very important that knowing that that plan is going to or

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that progress report is publicly presented and publicly available not just to you but to every citizen is an important checkpoint in this. Um because speaking from personal experience I as a city arborist I'd gone through the

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day-to-day motions. I knew what I was doing, right? I knew I planted this many trees, pruned it, but it was invaluable to see that on a couple of sheets of paper in front of me to really truly measure how good a job in some areas and how other areas needed improvement. Um,

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so nothing like staring your work in your face. All right. And then last, I did want to reiterate this is just a draft. So tonight we're looking for honest feedback. So questions, feedback, um places we kind of are off the mark a

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little, we want to know that. Um we have plenty of time to make changes, make amendments. Um and you guys are really getting a look at the same time as the city staff. So we've been working throughout with the city staff, but you received the draft pretty much the same

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time they did. Okay. So nothing is set in stone at this point at all. Now, I had a few questions. Lily was able to compile some feedback and I kind of divided them. It seemed they kind of ran along the same three veins.

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So, one of them was funding. So, how do people fund these programs? You can see right there the majority of programs, 72% across the country are funded by the general fund. Okay. Next, you see other I could not tell you what in the world that is. um assessment districts,

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grants. Um another one, storm water utility tax. Most cities have about you see 1.4% of that storm water utility goes to trees because trees are an important component of storm water. And you can see your community already recognized that value. That was their

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top priority. Um permit fees usually factor in there. Trying to think what else would apply. Um tree memorials. Uh those are usually very popular programs. So there's a lot of little things you can do, but at the end of the day, it generally is the general fund that

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pushes an urban forestry program. Now, down below, I have a couple of benchmarks, and these are all pulled from a national study of urban forestry programs. Um so across the country I think about 500 different communities of

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different varying population sizes uh submitted their responses to the survey. So we were able to develop benchmarks based on your population for the most part. Um so you can see for you guys the general benchmark for a city your size

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is spending that 63% of the total city budget on urban forestry program. That's salaries, tree pruning, planting, leaf cleanup, um everything. So you guys are significantly below that. Um per capita

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forestry budget, same deal there. Um your typical city of this population is going to spend almost $14. Yours was just a nudge over five. Um and then the primary funding sources you are

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right on par with everybody that you are using. I think the the one caveat with that is that you're mostly general fund if not general fund plus grants. Um so maybe diversifying and looking into other other elements and funding mechanisms that might be available to

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you. Okay. Staffing was the other thing we got some questions on. So you can see right there, typically your person responsible for public trees in a city of your size

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is a city arborist or city forester. Um, right now in Titusville, it's public works director and that is only typical in small cities um where city staff wears a lot of different hats. That is not not the the norm for cities of your

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population. Um we can see but typically it does land under public works which I think is good to note. Um a lot of cities also have it under a parks and recreation department. So it could be either one of those. Um

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you guys are right in line in the south where the city actually is responsible for public trees. There are a lot of places in the US where the adjacent property owner is responsible. Um, and then you can see we generally have the estimate that there's about the equivalent of one full-time employee

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managing public trees. Um, and that's pretty far below the benchmark for a city of your size as well. So, and that doesn't mean it's just one dedicated full-time employee. That might be four people that each work around a day a

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week, right? Um, so typically there's a lot more physical labor going into public tree management. Um, and then off to the right, that's just a quick snip of some different job positions that might be in what you would fall under

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that staff managing public trees. So it might be your city arborist, it might be an urban forestry manager, it might be a foreman, it might be a pruning arborist. So, um, doing a lot of work inhouse can save you a lot of money compared to

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contracting out. Um, equip equipment operators, seasonal workers, laborers, um, office support. So, that clerical admin side is also important. And that doesn't mean that has to be what you guys have for job titles by any means. It's just an example of what exists in

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other municipalities. All right. And so, here's what they spend their money on. Tree pruning, tree removal, tree planting, top three always. Then you get into staffing cost, right? Admin, supervision, supervision. You get into

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storms, watering new trees, training, inventory, treating trees to make sure they stay safe. Um, office, you can see education's in there as well. A couple other random things, nursery maintenance, you have one. So, there's a

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lot of different facets that go into this urban forest program, but you can see that the top three are what you would expect. Planting, pruning, removal. All right. And the last one, I think this is the last slide I have. Let me think. Um,

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landscape trust fund. So, I think there was some feedback on the draft about what would some example language be? And actually, the city staff had that same feedback. So, in the last couple of days, I pulled together a few suggestions. Um, and of course, all this

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should be vetted your typical public participation process. Um, but basically adding an exclusion to say it can't be used for ornamental flower planting. It can't be used for general beautifification. It has to go

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specifically to these things, tree planting and establishment. and it has to go to a lot of cities actually have it for acquisition of land as well or easements. Um sometimes they include staffing and equipment, sometimes they don't. But those are just some examples

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that you can include and some may work for Titusville and some some may not, right? Um when I was a city arborist, ours was only for tree planting and tree maintenance. it couldn't fund anything else, but it exclusively said that I

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knew what it could and could not be used for. Um, and I actually did clarify that with our city attorney when I took over and said just to be clear, what's maintenance? Um, so making sure that that verbiage is clear about what it can and can't be used for.

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And that is the end. Um, and as a reminder, make sure you use a sticker voting and fill out a couple of uh note cards if you have some further thoughts. But I can take any other questions you guys may have cuz I didn't get through all of the ones that Lily sent me today.

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So, >> well, I guess that brings it back to the board. Anybody have any questions now before we open the floor up to public comment? >> Should we do public comment first? >> We could do public comment first if you like. >> Public comment first.

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>> I hope we do. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Hey, Lily. Do you have some cards for us? >> Yep. Mary's bar. >> All right, Mary, you're up. >> And thank you for taking the time to drive all the way here. >> Great. Let me hold on. Let me Sure. It's

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not. >> Oh, okay. Yeah. Yeah. I have your email. I haven't had time to fully go through it, though, so just to warn you. >> I'm Mary Spar. I live in Coco. I've been wanting this urban forest

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management plan since uh Peggy Brusaka uh announced that it was going to be a long-term goal. And that was in 2019. So, um I'd like to get it right. And I

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started looking at plant eggs and uh everything was going just fine until I came on one little section that woo it kind of scared me to tell you the truth. It did really scare me and that was that

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the urban forest management plan is going to be modifying the tree ordinance which was passed on September 28th, 2021. And that tree ordinance required

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over two years of work from you as a tec people sitting here in the audience many many citizens many development interests just all kinds of citizen input

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and it's a fact that three ordinance is a compromised ordinance and inadequately ely considered change to one part could have the effect of upsetting the delicate and I mean delicate balance that

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community development director Peggy Busaka and multiple stakeholder holders work so hard to achieve. So, uh, Peggy, um, was able to get the vote to be unanimous

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in spite of the makeup of the city council at the time, and this was a monumental effort. Now, I don't feel that it's necessary for the urban forest management plan to modify

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that September 28th, 2021 free ordinance. In fact, there's a better way of handling it. The urban forest management program could have its own ordinance with higher standards than the compromise

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tree ordinance. It could do things the best way to do them and not be bound by our compromises. So, um I'm going to go through some of the

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uh provisions that were suggested about ordinance updates. And my suggestion to the consultant is um redo this section so that you're

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thinking of the best um ordinance that you would have specifically for urban forest management. And um so you have the administrative updates uh to include construction

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protection enforcement with specified penalties and the preconstruction photo period inspection establishment monitoring period. That could all be part of the tech manual that could apply not only to the urban

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forestry program, but also uh in general to um to tree planting because it would be in the tech manual that could go in your ordinance. And then soil volume minimus by tree class

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that could go in your ordinance. And there was a lot of debate about this kind of stuff in 2021. We have compromised language there and uh strengthen soil quality and

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compaction provisions. Um, this is something you could show us to see how good it could work because that particular section which uh would be appropriate in the tree ordinance and

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kind of uh tangentially touches on it um is a compromised section. So then the smaller stock planning standards, you're going to get a little resistance. uh you do not want resistance from the

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development community, the landscape architects etc. So if you could just try your smaller stock planning standards for your ordinance and we've heard some statistics about

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that and then the species diversity requirements maximum 10% single species s may I >> how much more time do you need? >> Uh I'm going to say

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two and a half minutes. make a motion. >> I'd like to give you five more minutes. >> Okay. Well, I don't think I would take all that. >> All in favor say I. >> I. >> All right. Mary, please continue. >> Okay. Um, so the species diversity

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requirements 10% this this night nice neat 10% 20% 30%. I've heard that before. I've definitely heard that before. It is not well suited in my opinion to Titusville's natural species diversity.

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I just don't think it's appropriate here. It looks a little bit arbitrary and I would suggest that you don't use this for the urban forestry management plan. And then the expanded canopy credit for

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storm water tree integration. First of all, I don't think that the urban forest any urban forestry ordinance should get into canopy area credit. Canopy area is

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the heart of a a requirement requirement for canopy area is the heart of the tree ordinance. That's what we got in exchange for some um compromises, which I'm going to

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go into for a minute. But we tried our best to put in everything we could think of about storm water tree integration and that meant the LI language was found in two places.

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um section 30-31.5D 6 and seven. So I'm not sure why that would need to be changed, but anyway, you can certainly do it in your ordinance whatever way you want. We do have

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provisions for that. Now the fee and l rate that is funding the landscape trust fund. Now, I suggest that you leave what's in the ordinance

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for the developers that are developing property in the ordinance. I realize that it the amounts have not changed, but the way the amounts were used

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in order to get the requirement for tree canopy area which is essential. The development community wanted two things. They wanted the fees they had to pay

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reduced. And there was one person who was super insistent on it. And um the other ones felt the same way. So we figured what we want is trees, not

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money. So we low we in we changed the fee that was kind of used as an incentive if you don't burn your trees you cut down was a

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reduction to $75 per cal caliber per inch. Um, we changed that to be um 75 um dollars. Wait, I said it's Yeah, we

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changed that to $75 per caliber per inch. That's what you'd have to pay. I I think I misspoke, but um there will it was used for $75, uh you know, per whatever if you don't

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burn your trees. So, if you want to figure out how to increase the landscape trust fund in some way, just please do not mess with the tree ordinance and the provisions there. And personally, I I really think that

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it's might not be too smart to depend on that landscape trust fund uh for all your money. I mean, we've seen it. We have seen it as uh you know it's um these

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um you know gateway pro gateway planning the there and then there's another gateway planning and then there's another gateway planning and all of a sudden we thought we'd have this money you know to maybe have public works

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planting some trees. No, it kind of dried up for a while and now it's we got a lot of money, but we need to start looking for some alternate sources as well. That's my opinion.

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Anyway, um I have on this paper um that about the fee and l rate. Let's not stir up a hornets's nest. Okay. Do I have I think

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>> who married? >> Sure. I'm gonna uh >> Did you leave your notes with the >> I did. Great. Got a copy. >> Thank you. >> Okay. >> Okay. Good. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Next card, please. >> William Klein. >> Welcome, Bill.

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William Klein 3 Indian River Avenue, Titusville. I been out of the uh seeing some of the things that was being done at the beginning and I just received this uh report this past week.

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So, I haven't really been able to study it in detail. But what I'd like to say is Titusville has received more than a million dollars in grants and studies on excellent projects to plant trees and improve and protect the environment.

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However, they have all failed. Several because they were too ambitious or because the monies collected for the work was spent on other projects instead of planting and maintaining trees. The present 118page Titusville urban

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forest management plan is too ambitious, too complex, too labor intensive. It need they need for tree identification. You know, people need to be able to identify the trees which I don't think the staff knows at this time

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and it's too costly to succeed. Also, the present plan has failed to use the Bvard County UFAS extension document native keystone species to grow in Bvard County. They have not used that in order

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to select the best trees for a maximum benefit and minimum maintenance requirements for success. The plan allows planting of 50% non-native trees which minimizes their environmental benefits. Uh, the plan looks good in a lot of

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cases, but it needs a lot of work and I don't think Titusville is actually ready for the details. Um, see, I'm missing some stuff here. What I suggest is Titusville needs to

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complete the following steps before they start Titusville's urban forest program. pass an adequate annual budget item for urban forest program and write rules to prohibit using the money for other programs or projects.

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used the tree mitigation fund that was written back in 1996 and it was to collect mitigation funds from the developers to go into a tree mitigation fund and only for that. This

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has been taken I should say stolen and used for the gateway projects. They have not, Titusville has not kept records of the tree mitigation fund since 1996. Even the past few years, when I ask to

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see how much money has been collected, how much money has been spent, what is your balance, I get no answers. So, I have never seen any documentation for the tree mitigation fund.

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Also, Titusville has this $2 per citizen tree city budget, which is for being an urban forest or a tree city. We don't use the money for planting trees. We use the money for taking care

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of roads, to remove trees that needed for the roads, to cut trees away from the roads. There are some years we haven't even planted one tree. We have almost 50,000 people, which would be $100,000, but not a dollar has been spent some years to

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plant a tree. So, there's a lot of money in the tree mitigation fund and in the Tree City USA fund that should be able to handle a good project. And I think we need that before we sign papers to have

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a tree mitigation. I mean not a tree mitigation but a tree planting urban forestry program. We really need that program but we need money to fund it and we need to have the money available to pay people to do this

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work. I think we need to hire and train staff to be able to identify trees and train them on how to plant main train paint trees like the urban forestry program which has a lot of good statements on go

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out and take an analysis of the trees determine what trees are available what the percentages are of all each type you know they state how many% should be in uh trees but I think the people on staff. And I'm not criticizing them

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because even I couldn't do it. I couldn't go out and look in the forest around Titusville and tell you what every tree is. So, how would I follow this program? The people who are doing the program must be trained so they know what the

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tree is there. Whoops. Excuse me. I'm getting too Can I have a little more time? >> How much time do you need, Bill? >> Oh, maybe two or three minutes. I'll make a motion to give Bill three minutes. Second. >> Okay. Motion a second. All in favor say

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I. >> Any opposed? All right, Bill. >> I think we should thoroughly review the Titusville's urban forest management plan and make major corrections to start a step-wise program that can be performed by the available staff.

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you know, because the program that's been presented is a very good program, but since I think it's beyond what we're capable of doing, maybe we need to look at a little something lower to start with and do stepwise to gain this plan.

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Plus, what I think we need to use is the Bvard County UFS extension native keystone species to grow in Bvard County. We need to document and select the trees and follow the advice provided for the best soil, light and water

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requirements for the location where the trees are to be planted. These trees should have the best survivability and the least required maintenance. So if you use the trees that are adapted to this area, don't use outside trees.

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Don't use trees that you see a lot of times at some of nurseries that aren't for this area. We need Bvard County, not just Florida trees, Bevard County trees that will survive if there's a cold winter like we just had.

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I need we just need to start a project in the our project in all the areas that will receive the greatest benefit first. So as we start the program, what areas need it the most and work on those and build from that. We need to reduce the

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complexity and the many details of the pro proposed program for the first startup projects to do something that will be manageable. Then add more details is the desired based on success of the completed projects. See some other projects I've seen that have

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failed around here is you can take a look at Dre Field. They spent over a million dollars on grants to put in around 10,000 plants. There were over there were about 500 trees planted

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there. And because they only put them in and they spent the money. Granted, that was great, but they didn't maintain them. They used lawnmower to cut over the trees that banged into the trees. Like I went I can provide you with total

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details of the total number of plants planted. That's what I'm missing right now because I thought I had it with me, but I'll give it to you. only about 50% of the trees planted survived after two

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years and now I think more have died. Another project that's had problems is in Scobby Park. They have done three different shoreline restoration projects.

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They might have been nice to start with, but in some of them, what happened is the lawnmower people ran in, you know, they planted a lot of mangroves right along the waterfront, which would be good. >> Yes. >> And they destroyed them. And this has happened twice and we've got it a third

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time going again. >> Thanks, Bill. >> I can give you more details later. >> Not a question, but just for your edification. Uh we spent a couple of years working with uh Kimberly Gibbs from the Florida Native Plant Society uh

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to add uh Brevard vouchered native plants to our planting list. Bill, the Bvard Keystone species surprisingly includes a few species not native to Bard. So they may be keystone but not necessarily to Bard and we considered

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that when we included that into our planting list. So the trees are there. All the right kind of stuff is there. It's going to be incumbent upon us going forward to figure out which ones and what mix and how we go about doing that. No comment. I just wanted to make that statement. We'll talk later afterwards.

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We got more people to go. So can I have the next card, please? That's it. No more. >> I turned in a card. >> I couldn't believe that Kay wouldn't have turned in a card. >> I was hearing from here and I turned in my card. >> I motion for K's card to magically appear.

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>> I found it. I'm sorry. I'm stepping up to the plate >> and give me a bat, too. Okay, >> let's have a >> Sorry. >> K, Maryland Avenue, Titusville. Here at long last, we have in hand the draft of the urban forest management plan

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provided by the city's selected consultant, Eioene, and what an impressive job they've done. Yes, it's a little bit long and maybe we could work on that because it's very hard for anybody to comprehend a 120 pages or

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whatever it is and to really take it all in. But it >> Yeah. Anyways, the tree team has advocated for a UFMP since the adoption of the 2020 tree protection ordinance and even before. We are eager to see this plan implemented in our community.

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We appreciate that the tree team will play a role in the UFMP and are ready to collaborate in the ways outlined, including volunteer tree planting, participation in the adopt the tree program, and the residential tree assistance program. So, thank you very

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much, Liz. Thank you for this opportunity. I'm going to be asking you questions because that's what I understood that the that this meeting was for, to ask you questions. So your question sorry with the the count I'm >> okay it says provide the consultant with

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feedback comments and questions about the draft lens I have questions. >> Okay. >> All right. Number one and I just now changed the order of my questions. So on page 72 that's what has this beautiful different

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colors. Um page 72 under number one under that little rainbow this timeline it says there are three actions that must begin immediately as other goals objectives and actions depend upon them. designation of a coordinator tree

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inventory procurement and the LTF of landscape trust fund policies um needs to be um specify that it will be used for the urban tree forestry program and bill it also says that it will uh

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require an accounting every week of that landscape trust fund. So there's a lot of details in here. There's a lot of things that we've been working on that really weren't mentioned in here. But my question to you about this, these three different things, designate an urban

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forest, coordinated launch, public tree inventory procurement, and adopt a landscape trust fund expenditure. You're saying that this must be immediately done before the the plan can roll out any further. So, how will the consultant ensure the city immediately undertakes

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these three elements so as the plan can move forward? Well, I can't force the city to do anything. >> Yeah, neither could we. >> But what I want to get across is I think a mistake a lot of cities make is they're like, "All right, let's put some

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trees in the ground." And I think to an extent they've relied on volunteers, but you need to have one of the worst things you can do is for the city to start investing money in tree planting without somebody actually in charge. So, who's going to water it? Who's going to take care of it? Who's going to inspect it?

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if it has to be removed, where is this time and money coming from? And so, somebody in the interimm needs to be responsible for getting the ball rolling. Um, >> and if they can't do that, then we really can't get anything done. That is the truth. >> I've heard the mayor say he will not

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hire somebody for that role. And I've also heard say that Sanderell is not too interested in it either. So, now I'm really concerned. So, I don't know who's going to say, "Okay, today this needs to be done. Tomorrow you need to do this." you know, >> and somebody, that is the point, somebody has to do it. I'm not going to

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tell you who it is and who it has to be. Um, and to be fair, if it didn't come across that public works, the public works director, it is, it would not be normal for her to be the person responsible for public trees. >> Okay. Oh, she could delegate something to do it.

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>> And here's the thing, like a lot of cities have different ways they build up their programs. So, it might be a temporary partial reassignment. So, um, they're just saying, "Oh, city staff doesn't know trees." I've met plenty of city staff that is incredibly

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wellqualified with certifications and training and advanced arborist credentials. So, I know they're they're in here somewhere in this building. Um, now, do they have time to do it? I can't answer that question. >> Could they have two hours a week to

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spare to start? That's what we're talking about is this small reallocation to get the ball rolling. So, if somebody can take that on, if it's the city manager that has to assign that to staff and if in my opinion it'd be better that

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all the people that were involved in trees came together and worked it out themselves as part of that staffing plan. Who's going to be in charge for the next six months? I think that that is an imperative thing. And like you said, you can't strong ar them arm them. I can't do it. But I don't know if

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anybody anybody here can. Right. But yeah, I I thought it was important to note that nothing else moves without those pieces in place. >> Right. But appendix K goes through every little detail of what needs to be done and it says who's going to do it. And if

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if they're not willing to do it, you know, and the city adopts this and yet the person or the department's not willing to do it or they don't have the time left, then what happens? I don't I just don't I'm at a quandry. I have had jobs where somebody quit and they dumped

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all their work on me and I was already doing 40 hours, you know, and how can you do more than >> where does the other 20 come from, right? Yeah. So, when you can laugh at this, when I left my last job, it took them over a year to replace me. They replace me with one and a half people. >> Yeah. Often.

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>> And it's still probably not enough. It feels like you're already running on fume. So, >> yeah. And if you divvy it out to 20 different people and there's nobody at the head of those 20 different people, it's not going to be very efficient. Anyway, that was my concern. But you're you're absolutely right. And for a city

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the size of Titusville, they need somebody. It can be a part-time consulting arborist. It can be an existing city staff. Um we've worked with cities where they promoted from within essentially somebody was doing gardening type stuff and they said,

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"Well, you know what? this person has the capacity. We're willing to train them and, you know, have them be a part-time arborist, part-time landscaper. Um, that's how my last job started. I was part-time city arborist and part-time parks and wreck. So,

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sometimes those are the compromises and that have to be made. >> Let's hope human resources can think outside the bubble. >> I have lots more, but I'm, you know, Is it okay if I keep going? I make a motion that we give you five more minutes, but

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you're gonna have to go through your questions faster. >> Okay, >> I'll be faster, too. I'm sorry. >> Second. >> Okay. I >> All in favor say I. >> I. Any opposed? All right. Thank you. >> Okay. The ordinance I mean the plan says um that even without a completed

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inventory, early tree planting events and implementation of the adopted tree program can still move forward. So, the tree team could still be planting trees and we can do some other programs that are listed in here. >> Yep. Don't want to stop you. >> Please don't stop us. >> No.

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>> Trees, >> but you could use a little assistance. >> Plants trees. Okay. Another big concern of mine is on goal five objective 52 on page 68 of 125 which seeks to increase species diversity in public tree plantings where no single species

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exceeds 10% genus 20% of family 30% of the total city managed public tree inventory. Mary touched on this but I want to reinforce it. In my opinion, the species diversity requirement needs to be adjusted to accommodate the role of live oak trees in providing tree canopy

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and supporting wildlife in Tisville. We don't want to limit live oaks to 10% >> of the city's uh public tree. >> Do we know how many live oaks we have? >> No. And I tried to look it up online. We do not know. But we don't want to work towards that as a goal. No, that is not

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our goal. Our city managed public tree inventory should reflect the species diversification of the remnant natural forest within our community. While species diversification is important in tree plantings, >> we do not agree with limiting the total

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city managed public tree inventory so that no single species especially southern live oaks exceeds 10% genus 20% family to 30%. So, I would love to talk to you about it, but uh I am not supportive of that and I don't know very

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many people who are supportive. >> I mean, it's an urban forestry standard. If all the city staff and everybody in Titusville doesn't want to encourage diverse tree plantings, that's >> we want diverse tree planting, but we don't want the goal of diverse tree planting to have southern live oak trees

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be 10%. >> Well, and if it's just a couple of trees, that's okay. like we'll do things for cities and say these are just general benchmarks. Um if there are three tree species that we would just love to see everywhere. >> Yes, >> then that's absolutely fine, right? But we don't want to end up with say 30%

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live oaks, 30% something else and 30% another species and then >> just a tiny little remnant of everything else, right? So, but if it's just live oaks, then these are baselines. You can make exceptions to them. They're not they're rules of thumb, so to speak, these industry standards.

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>> Yeah. I don't like the rule of thumb. It It does not apply to Titus though. Okay, moving on. Number three. Also under goal 5 page 68 to 125, objective 5.3 specifies planting at least 50% native and all new public tree plantings with

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25% minimum wildlife value species. I like the value wildlife value species, but the Tyville tree team has long followed a policy of planting only native trees. >> That's all we plant. And so if we're

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part of the um public tree planting, we will only plant. >> I say you guys keep doing what you're doing and planting your native >> as native trees support native insects that sustain native wildlife. The team recommends that the city adopt this same standard and plant only native trees.

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This approach aligns with the natural resources plan guidance for all native landscaping and new development and the tech manual which now recommends to landscapers uh a list of trees and plants which 73%

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is native or Bvard County. So we've been working towards that all along and here you're saying only 50% and it just rubs us raw. I'm raw. >> Well, I don't mean to rub you all of it but you did. And the point is to set a threshold that is the bottom not the

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ceiling. So if the city wants to adopt 100% they certainly can but we also want to set them up for success. So that if they're only able to get say 75% we can still look at that as a victory because 100% is difficult. If our overarching

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goal is right tree, right place, that needs to to come first. And for as a nonprofit partner or group to plant 100% natives is amazing. And so we don't want to discourage that. And if the city wants to plant 100, they certainly can. >> I would like to see ramp it up over

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time. >> That it's our goal to plant 100% native. The city plant 100 is a goal. I would like to see that and I'll I'll sit down and talk with you about it if you'd like. >> Indeed. So moving on. Um page 70 of 125 under objective 62

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includes the launching of a pilot residential tree assistance program distributing a minimum of 50 trees and include guidance on planting species selection and follow-up care. My question is would you please provide additional detail on the residential tree assistant program and the role of

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volunteers in this program because it says that the tree team will help but I don't really know what we're agreeing to help on. >> Well, you don't have to help at all if you don't want. Oh, I do want to help. >> Um, every city structures those a little differently. So, >> you guys have a source of native trees.

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So, maybe you contribute 10 or 20 of those 50. Perhaps you're on hand just helping to distribute trees with the city if they're going to do like a bulk pickup. Um, perhaps you're on call if somebody needs advice. If their tree is not doing well, somebody from the tree

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team can come out and provide some advice. So, there's tons of ways you can assist with that depending on what you're willing and able to do. >> And there was a you said that people will be able to call in for an issue about trees and I wondered if that was

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on their own property or on a city owned property. Every city's rules are a little different with that one. Um, in general, most cities provide overall education of, hey, what could be wrong? But most city arborists do not go and inspect private property. Right. Yeah.

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That's that's not >> the question they're posing should be in regard to cityowned. >> I would take questions. If somebody called and said, "My crate myrtle looks really bad." I'd be like, "Okay, well, it probably has aphids or bark scale. You should call an arborist." But that's my guess, right? So, I would try to help

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them without setting foot on the property. >> Ah, give it some fertilizer. Crepe my love fertilizer. um by the year three 3 to five that's when the city will actually beun conducting annual tree plantings along

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streets and in parks a priority strongly supported by the community this while I may sound critical or even argumentative you don't know me that's came for me >> but we are in support of this I as a

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tree team member uh founder I've asked my group. We're in support. We're just worried about the devil in the details. We've had a little been burned a little bit and now we're concerned. But by year three, three, the year three to five, the city should be conducting annual

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tree plantings along streets and in parks. Efforts will focus on shading low canopy neighborhoods bill. They have specific areas that they plan on planting low canopy areas. uh low equity and setting annual targets to increase

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overall canomic coverage from 44% to 50% in 10 years. So that's a good goal. Um challenging while making progress toward the 33300 benchmark. I think you guys know what

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that is, but it's you can see a tree from your three trees from your house. you can walk to a park in short order and um 30% canopy at in your neighborhood. The tree team remains committed and eager to work with the city to expand the urban tree canopy

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through ongoing planting events. We have proposed to the mayor and the manager and urban forest opening ceremony at S Point Park sometime in the rainy season with a tree planting event along Neptune's trail. I have dubbed that trail Neptune's trail. leads to Neptune

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and he uh I I think that's what we should call that trail and throughout the park. Additionally, the city may wish to have a tree giveaway to attendees and the mayor, the manager, Lily and and Jolyn have all said, "Yeah, that sounds great." So hopefully they'll allow us to do that and have a great big

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event u maybe the last Saturday of June if this all goes through. So, I want to say thank you and thank you for putting up with my argumentative, bold um type of a personality. >> No, this is why we're here. >> This urban forest plan is far better

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than we could have hoped for. We all feel that. Like I said, we're just worried about the devil in the details. So, let's get busy and plant trees. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Yeah. Anybody else like to uh stand up

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and speak on the urban forest management plan? >> Don, please. >> You know, it occurred to me um Tom Perez, Titus. So, uh recently I was speaking uh with someone, a friend of

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mine, and they mentioned that their insurance company required them to cut down some trees. >> What did she do? The unexpected. She dropped her insurance. And it occurred to me just to expand on a program such

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as this to include a private side to it so that when people are in a situation that you know they need to cut down a tree if the city were to promote a program that replaced that tree.

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Okay. I think that would go a long way for several reasons. It might give us an a sort of the input side of what's happening to our trees on the private side. You know, how many are getting cut down? I see things getting cut down all the

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time and I say why, you know, and this might give us sort of a a little reaching in to try to find out, you know, some of the mechanics of that if we're offering something, you know, and we might be able to partner with, you know, insurance

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companies and whatnot >> to be able to fund some of that. >> Thank you. >> Let me ask you a question, Tom. Um, years ago when I was still active with the the tree farm, we used to order trees, uh, little saplings and whatnot,

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and then raise them, grow them, and and then sell them. Um, do you think the folks in the tree farm would be interested in working with with the city to say, for example, like Indie Atlantic did with their swailes, they came up with several different designs with

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different plants, um, deeprooted plants to draw water. >> Uh, and they would provide different design options to the people when they were going to put in the soil. >> We could do something similar. >> Absolutely. the trees and we could we

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could figure out which trees are hearty, >> right? >> Will handle hurricane, will handle frost, >> native to Bvard and that we want as shade trees in our canopy and then we can come up with a short list for the city of how we recommend these trees and

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then work with the tree farm in a >> in a in a relationship. Well, I think the tree farm has been open to having a relationship, you know, and understanding with the city of how we could help, you know,

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>> providing trees, you know, I'm sorry, >> I was just Brad, what's the city side of this? Would we be able to do something like this to implement this urban forest management plan? work with our local nonprofits to help provide us with the plants and the native plants that we

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would need to build this forest. >> Do you make are you referring to the landscape trust fund? >> No. >> Oh, just in general? >> No, I'm talking about you utilizing our the the Titusville Garden Club tree

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farm. They they grow and raise plants usually just as hobbyists for themselves and to keep the farm going, but they can also work with the city through an MOA orou. Um, they can order the seedlings

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from the tree farm where they're sprouted and we can raise them for the city and then the city can buy them at a reduced fee or some predetermined fee. um so that we have a stock of of trees to be able to provide the city with to

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make to implement this this this urban forest plan. Is that something that staff would be willing to to work with so that we could put the two of you guys together? And >> I mean, it's possible. Yeah. I mean, I don't I don't see anything that would prevent that other than just the specifics about it and what our

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council's direction is. Ultimately, this has to go before city council. >> Sure. Well, and cities do that all the that is not a like off-the-wall wild idea. It does it does happen partnerships with local grower growers and nurseries where you get reduced in

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this case working with nonprofits even better. Um where you get good locally grown trees at a really reduced rate um is would be an amazing thing. >> And just start small. It doesn't have to be 100 trees. Right. >> Exactly. Well, gee, I was hoping for

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100. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> That's great. All right. Anybody else? Earl, anyone? No. >> Can I just interject one idea? >> One, one more idea. Sure. >> One idea. Okay. I have worked with the

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tree garden farm um to and brought seedlings that I got from the Ottabon society that I plant at the parks and brought them to the garden club and asked them to grow them for me for a few months you know um and then I planted

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them but they were bigger than when I bought got them originally you know because they've been growing you know now I I just keep them at home and grow them you know but I do think that's a marvelous idea there is so much space and and the garden club is leasing that space from the city is how I understand

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it and they have the volunteers to do it and I'm more than willing to help with that. So that's a great plan but we got to figure out how to get it in this urban forest plan not just talk about it. So I want I would like the consultant to try to make a note about that and see if she cannot put that into

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the urban forest plan and because it talks over and over again with the city partnering with the nonprofits. We don't just want to be helping a teeny bit. We want to have our feet on the ground and digging holes. Uh that's what we've been doing now for years. And we want to

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pursue it more thoroughly while partnering with the city. Thank you very much. >> And with that, I'll close the public hearing, bring it back to the board. Who'd like to start this off? >> Would you care to start us off?

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Okay, let's see. I see this UFMP as a comprehensive framework with sections to be fleshed out and implemented as allowed and items to be tailored to Titusville's needs and

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conditions. >> Succinct. >> Ma'am, I'm thrilled with the plan. Thank you so much. We we like Mary said 2019 we've been waiting since 2019 to have an urban

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forestry plan. So thank you so much Liz. My um this the thing that jumped out at me and caused me the the greatest heartburn as I was going through the um the plan was the 10% species thing. Our we have a

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very unique topography here in Titusville. So un unlike like the flat lands of Kansas where it's all flat and you you'd be able to have a the you know a different kind we have we have sand

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hills ancient beach dunes that sand pines and slash pines and and you know different um let's see myrtle trees will grow on and then we have wetlands that other kinds of trees grow on. So what I

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what I think we should do is look at the we do have a lot of remnant intact forest areas that are left in the town and we need to be mimicking um what's what's been here and we know it grows

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and we know it will survive and we have tons of wildlife in the city and so we know it supports wildlife and that's what I I would like to see. I mean, if you can take out this whole 10% um recommendation that's causing so much

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heartburn and replace it with some verbiage about mimicking the existing um remnant forest sections that are still left in town and expanding on them. That would be one of the things that would make me very happy. Um

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um the it the it's a like Bill said, it's a big plan. It's it's got a lot to digest and it's kind of overwhelming when you look at it. And um Kay didn't have time to talk about it, but I've seen a um re

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some recommendations on some things that could maybe eliminate about 20 pages out out of the plan without doing anything to reduce the plan. So if you can make that happen, that would be really good. At least consider um the suggestions

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that Kay has made. And like Kay said, we worked really really hard for a long time. Th this this this committee to um get the 72% native um species into the city's the

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landscape technical manual. So I see no reason to drop that to 50%. So, if you can change that, you know, and match what's in our landscape manual, which >> would we do we think we could do a compromise and say, I know we love our native species, but 75% where both sides

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aren't happy. >> Yeah. >> Would that would that cause less heartburn, do we think, doing the 75? >> Absolutely. >> I know we want a 100, but >> I know. Yeah. >> Incre And the point is to be incremental about these things, right? >> Right. Well, if we wanted to plant some fruit trees, you know, because a lot of

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citizens have asked if we could plant some fruit trees in in our in our plantings. >> Well, those fruit fruit trees are not native. And so, Right. >> Um, but I think yeah, I'd be thrilled with 75%. >> Okay. >> Um, anything above 50% I'd be happy

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with. >> Um, and um, I'm going to stop for now and see what the rest of the committee says. >> Okay. Anybody else? >> Jason? >> Yeah. Um, so one my first question I

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think is is kind of procedural. Um, so we're seeing the draft tonight. Is there any opportunity outside of tonight for more in the public to comment on the draft either in person or electronically or

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anything else? >> I believe it's going to be on the website where Go ahead, Lily. I think Yeah, I can put it on the website. I think the intent was also to capture that in this um display. I wonder maybe we can do like what uh the CRA is doing

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downstairs. Um but yeah, I can put it on the website. It's just in its draft form now, so it's not >> like a done. I I just feel like even Yeah. I just feel like even with with Kay specifically, you know, limiting her to to five minutes instead of having

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that open conversation, I >> I feel like there's I mean, obviously there's more to say. So, I was just curious if there's going to be that opportunity for others to to give their opinions. >> Are you asking a different format from what we have tonight? >> Uh kind of. Yeah. Like more more of like

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a >> There'll be another presentation before you at your regular meeting on May 13th. That's what we're shooting for. final presentation to council. >> So we do not have in the scope of work an additional meeting that's a public form in the sense that you're thinking of. So if you do want to have provide

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the public more time to speak, you can certainly do that. You don't have to limit them to certain number of minutes. >> Sure. Okay. Thank you. Um, Laura Le, I hit some of this, but the the 50% native, I agree with that. Like 100% like we should be we should be

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aiming as high as we can on that. Um, and the same with the 10, 20, 30. Um, I guess my other big question is, does this plan eliminate and replace the existing tree ordinance?

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>> No. Well, well, that well, that's I I guess where I'm going with that is Mary tal talked a lot about the the conflicts with the the tree ordinance and that. So, I guess where where is that line? Because we talk about revisiting the $75

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and $100 uh fee and L amounts like h how how does this interact I guess with the the tree ordinance? So there and the city staff may know this even better than I do, but so generally we put a piece of like policy type

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recommendations that theoretically aren't code updates and shouldn't require as lengthy and technical of an approval process. Um code updates are just that. So I myself have been through the process as a city arborist

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um before. So, I can understand and what I'm getting from what Mary had said is we have this ordinance. It's fragile. We don't want to mess it up. And um to an extent that is something that you should be aware of.

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Um when I first started as a city arborist um there was a definition in our code that was wrong. It had DBH. It had DBH as caliper. Like they were reversed. Um and it affected everything I did every day. very simple technical fix. Um so I was able to get the change

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on the docket and I went to our uh commissioners and I'm like just need to make this simple swap in the code shouldn't be a problem. Um this is my first year as city arborist keep in mind. So it was very uh hopeful and it turned into like a multimonth thing

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because we had people getting up and commenting about other parts of the code they didn't like and this shouldn't be in there and I'm like we've had this code since 2004. We're not debating this. I'm trying to make it just a teeny bit more technically correct. So, that is something to think about when you

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bring these code amendment packages. Um, and working with a city solicitor and the timing of which they go before council to change 75 to 300 or 500. Um, that is something you have to be aware

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of for sure. And I always learn when I was see arberist is that certain councils and certain time frames are maybe better than others. And maybe if this is called for in year two, perhaps year two is not the right time. Perhaps

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you need more time. Perhaps it's year three and we have to amend that time frame. Um so these would be amendments, updates, extras rather than throwing out what is there. And ultimately, if the city decides none of them make sense for

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them at all, that's okay. These are based on a review of your code versus hundreds of other codes that we've read, what is really good about it, what is missing, what could be improved. And right now, those fees, and I dealt with the same thing when I took over as CE

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arburist, our fees were exactly the same in my hometown where the cost to plant a tree is $600 and our fees were, I think, 150. And the fee was so low, it was creating an incentive to pay the fee instead of planting the trees. And the

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whole reason we had this, I don't want the money. I wanted you to plant your trees. I wanted you to preserve trees. Like I I'd rather have nothing in the mitigation fund. I'd rather you put the tree back on your property. Um, and so yeah, those things have to be balanced. Acknowledging you have gaps. You have

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city staff that says these fees are too low. This is what's happening. but that perhaps the existing ordinance is tenuous and upsetting that balance could be a problem. >> Okay. Thank you. Um,

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another one just I I guess this doesn't necessarily go to you is just a a thought that I had talking about the the employee or whoever that's going to be the initial coordinator for this. And this just kind of comes from my my own time looking at conservation jobs, especially part-time stuff. I see a lot

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of job advertisements for part-time and temporary. So, I just wonder if that might be a way to get it started, a part-time temporary position >> just to meet that that first criteria just >> Yep. And it's temporary and sometimes it

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>> rolls on in the budget and sometimes it doesn't, right? >> Yeah. >> Yep. >> Cool. >> It's a very valid way. >> All right. I I think that's all I got. Thank you. Okay. Hector. time. >> Um, yeah, we're not Minnesota, so there is a difference.

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>> A little bit of a temperature difference, maybe. >> So, so let me start where where you left off with the ordinance and Mary's comments. >> Uh, we always talk about a permanent

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person or a person. >> Perhaps we should work on not a non-permanent person. It could be a volunteer that works with the city at the beginning of this

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endeavor that we're trying to get on and performs the duty that the whole thing is about the duty of what the person is doing. The knowledge may be in the community and it may be available for from people that may help the community

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and it doesn't it's not a lifelong achievement award. Okay. Uh but for the beginning of the project so we can so we can get this off without fighting the FTE issue. Uh I think that we we might be in a

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position where we can make that if the FTE cannot come to be perhaps ask the community if they would volunteer if they have a volunteer that can raise their hand and said you know what I'll do this for six months I'll do this for

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a year okay that the knowledge is there uh and and and I think that may be an appropriate way of getting this off. So we can get this off otherwise we're going to fight about an FTE. >> Okay. And and what we don't want to lose

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this because of an FTE. >> And I'm looking and I'm looking at Tom. I'm looking at K. I'm looking at others that do have the knowledge. I don't I'm an engineer. >> Okay. I will I will plant the tree. I'll measure and you know and do that and I have no idea. But these folks do have

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the knowledge and they they are among their their peers that do have the knowledge and one of them may raise their hand and say yes I'll work with the city as give me a title. >> Yeah. We um >> and go do it and and have you know legal and staff and everybody involved so that

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this person is covered for all the things that needs to be covered and >> and uh but we can get this off with a volunteer. we we don't need a a person from the beginning that it's going to cause a lot

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of friction and not get this off. So to me, getting this going is is my number one priority and I will propose that we look into a volunteer that perhaps can help us get this off >> well. And that would be if when the city

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staff does the staffing plan and maybe that is a huge component of it. Um, my first year city arborist, I had a full-time volunteer who helped me every day in the field doing work, printing trees, all that. I mean, he was invaluable. I wouldn't have made it without him. So, yes, I can certainly

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see the value in that. I think it's important that you still have an employee as a touch point, though, somebody that's truly in charge on the day-to-day basis. Um, because that is a ton to ask of a volunteer. >> So, >> their responsibilities, I think, can be

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worked out. Okay. But that may be a way. And then my second point is uh what Jason was talking about uh if we have any conflict with what we have on the books versus what we

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have on this plan. I think that we should take a little time to see how we can fix that so that we don't Okay. because that ordinance has been around since uh 2021

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and so this this book was just born and came about. So we should not have a conflict. We should try to work with the ordinance and and make sure with staff. >> Okay. Yeah. >> That we don't that we don't cause a

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problem because staff's going to have the knowledge. Mhm. >> Mary's going to have the knowledge and others that go, "Wait a minute, guys. You know, if we all we need to do is amend this or that." >> And keep in mind, these are recommend, like I said, recommendations based off

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of strengths, weaknesses, and gaps. I agree. >> So, yeah, you don't have to do any of them, all of them. Um, it's certainly not a one-sizefits-all. >> I understand. But coming coming from a world of exact everything

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>> and very little room for guessing. >> Okay. Uh >> that's the engineer, right? >> Spock here. >> I I I tend to try to bring the groups together at the beginning so we together >> can go to council and said, "Oh, by the

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way, that ordinance and this book are not fighting and it's not going it's not going to cause problems." and and and that we can do that on the side. I think >> while while everything else marches on, I'm not stopping anything. >> Y >> So those those are my two points that

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that I would like to and of course and and like when when we had the meeting, uh we need to be bold and yes, we need to ask for for the sky. Absolutely. >> But we don't want you set you up to fail either. So, we want to make sure things

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in here, not this that we agree with them, but they are like I think K said like that's a great goal. It's ambitious, but it's still possible, right? We don't want you to fail at every single thing. So, it's just like, you know, >> and we we we should identify obstacles

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>> in the beginning, not during or after. >> Yep. >> And and try to fix those when we go together to council and say, "Listen, we had this, but we're going to fix it. We had the ordinance, we going to fix it. We we had the FTE. This is an a possible

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solution. Okay. And in in that way we integrate. >> Absolutely. >> And I think there's a little bit of time to do that. Brett, you were going to say acknowled. >> Okay. All right. Well, thank you.

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>> Please. Oh, member Thompson, you >> John hadn't spoken yet, so right. Go for it, John. >> Thank you. Um well, I first want to say thank you for the um the the plan. I think it's excellent and there's a lot of information in there and and there's

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a lot to absorb. Um but uh I also it brought was brought to my attention that there are a lot of in incredible resources that the city already has um to use and especially with this fund and the mitigation um mitigation fees and uh

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and and it's my understanding that we the city already has two arborists uh and staff and uh and I'm sure they're dedicated to a lot of work but I'm surprised that we don't have the arborists or um other city staff having this conversation. with us because this

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is an urban forest uh management plan and um so the onus and I agree with you Hector I believe you know we have uh the support from the community uh everybody has spent a lot of time and effort so far to to get to this point many years

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uh but the onus is on the city and I think to get a coordinator is a small ask considering the amount of money that we've invested so far into this project so um however way we do it it's a small ask we already have two arborists and um you know maybe we can look at some

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different ideas the city can you know look at but then internally at their staff and see who's willing to step up and say hey maybe I can you know take on this responsibility or this section of the city or you know residential versus commercial or whatever the whatever that is but um it's a small ask we worked way

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too hard to get to this point to to um be slowed down just by a coordinator position that's my that's my opinion >> Jonathan >> I would probably just echo echo that

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more or less u I think it is important that we have someone who can really uh bring everything together such as a coordinator um and especially with having different private and public

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partnerships I I really love that I I think uh having as much participation from the community is important. Uh I believe they also value all that a lot as well and um a lot of times they have

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the expertise in those specific areas that that helps out a whole lot and um we definitely need that. >> Go ahead. So, as a survivor of the tree wars that went on for years to get the

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tree canopy protection ordinance, actually, we got a unanimous vote out of the city council, even though there were a lot of differences at the time. We cannot we cannot touch that. and and you

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know, we might be able to maybe start looking at I I agree we we're not charging enough money um in the mitigation fund, but right now we need to leave the the original um tree canopy protection ordinance in place. We worked

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really really hard um to devise a new ordinance um to try to get some canopy protection for multifamily. that that's on hold because of Senate Bill 10 >> 180 >> 10 180 and and also um the critical root

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zone we spent a lot of time talking about because just like you had that glitch when you stepped in as um as as a arborist our critical root zone language is wrong and so we're trying to correct that but again Senate Bill 180 put the

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brakes on it but now now I'm going to touch the third rail Um, we have $800,000 in a landscape trust fund and almost none money out of that landscape trust fund has been used

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to actually plant trees in town. Even though the the reason that the the money is there is because developers have killed trees. And I think that it's time that we put our foot down and say we've funded enough failed

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flower projects out by I95 and in the medians in US1 and all the other places. We can't name one single landscape project that we spent money out of the landscape trust fund on that is still

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alive right now. So, I think that even if we can't get, you know, the the the council to turn all of the landscape trust fund over to planting trees, we are entitled to half of it, you know,

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because and we have never gotten our half of the trust fund. We were told that let's finish these landscape I'm sorry uh um gateway projects first and we'll pay for the gateway projects first and

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and then then you guys can start planting trees. Well, that's done. It's over with. It's done >> and I think they frozen and they've done Yeah, they're gone. We might We have a couple of palm trees >> that Yeah, that that got planted that were included in those projects. the

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palm trees are still there. >> Um, but I think >> I don't think it's unreasonable to ask for money from the landscape trust fund to pay for the full-time equivalent employee to um to to be the arborists.

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We we can't depend on volunteers to take the leadership role that needs to happen to make this project a reality. And we need somebody to lead the parade. We have a lot of parade. We have the drum

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majorettes and the the floats and everything and the volunteers, but we need a leader for the parade and that has to be an employee of the city. It can't be a volunteer and I don't think it's unreasonable. I know that the

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landscape trust fund is not going to be there forever because eventually we're going to, you know, have developed everything we can develop in the city. there's not a whole lot left that can be developed and and and that that fund will dry up eventually, but I don't

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think it's unreasonable to ask to use some of the money from the landscape trust fund to pay for the um arborist, hire somebody that can work um with with the volunteers and work with the um the

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um the work with Sandra and her department and and let's get this thing rolling. But that's my recommendation is that this committee, we need to put our foot down and say this is what we want. This is what we need. This plan is never

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going to get off the ground if we're trying to do it with all volunteers. And and you can't legally, it has to be a paid city person that is the that is going to be the leader and try to get this plan off the ground.

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Thank you. Thank you, Lori Lee. I have a couple of notes that I I jotted down. I first of all, I think Mary's right off the bat was that we need we're going to need our own urban forest

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ordinance. Um the the tree preservation ordinance is really designed for uh native natural lands that are being usurped, not brown fields or redevelopment or anything like that.

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This plan covers everything else. It covers the city. It covers the public areas. It covers, in my opinion, should cover rightways. I mean, where we develop a cooperative relationship with the citizens, it'll expand even more.

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So, I think this is going to need to become its own ordinance. That way, we don't touch the third rail. Just leave that as it is. >> No, the third rail is a landscape trust fund. >> That Well, yeah, we got too many third rails.

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Um, I also agree with Mary about not using the canopy area credit and the fee and lure rate. Um, I think we can find better ways to to meter that. Um, I also agreed with the, you know, the 50% um,

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wildlife and native species that that certainly needs to go higher. Uh, we've we've been higher, we we are higher and we want to maintain that. Um, I agree with the, you know, the 10, 20, 30, uh, percentage of what we talked about. I I agree with what you said,

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Lori Lee. I think we should match what's in our current native habitat areas. Um, we are diverse. I think if I remember right, we've got something like 16 different soil types and 27 different habitat types in our city. And the

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combination of those things are what make us so unique. So we might have pine flatwoods next to pond pines, you know, on the other side of the ridge and and it's just so they're all over the place and we need to be cognizant of that as

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we as we build. Um I was going to suggest you had here for goal one establish the program objective 1.2b develop a role description for the urban forestry coordinator. Uh if you look at the Tree City uh urban forestry job

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description which is offered to us by Tree City USA, you've got a very very good place to start. Um I wanted to bring that point out. I say I think that was all I had there. Um I I agree u Bethanne the it's a

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comprehensive framework. Um what what I think I told Lily was that it was as comprehensive as the the systems engineering plan I wrote for uh when I designed the emergency operations centers for the country. It's it's thorough. You've got you've got your goals, you've got your tasks, you've got

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metrics on how you're going to meter those tasks, which is exactly what you want to have every step of the way because if you can't measure it, you can't understand it. And if you don't understand it, you can't control it. So, this plan may look like it's in-depth and it it it is and it's got breath as

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well. It's I mean, you don't get away with 125 pages of nothing, right? There's a lot here. It's ambitious. It's a 20-year shot into the future. And I think every vision that we shoot for should be so ambitious. How we get

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there, that's the challenge. But I don't think we should be cutting ourselves off at the knees and saying we have to go to volunteers to start with. I think we need to step up and and stand up. We had um what was it 92% of the people that were certified uh said they were

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interested in in more trees in our city and I think we need to give them to them. >> People wanted more trees. That was >> they want more trees. >> That was a universal thing. Yes. >> Exactly. So um so we need to find a way to make that happen. And I, you know,

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5.25 FTE, that's five and a quarter people, not just one. That's a lot of people. That's a lot of work. Well, maintaining a forest is a lot of work. I mean, it's it takes people and it takes time and it takes money and it takes commitment.

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I hope our city manager has that and I hope our city council has that because I think this is a good plan to start with. Few little tweaks here and there as we go, but I think I think it's something to get going with and the sooner we get going, the sooner we get done. >> Well, and let's make it clear about the

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5.25. That may not be right for Titusville. Three may be correct for you guys. One would be a victory, right? >> Absolutely. >> So, working and I believe I actually put the ter terminology as working towards that benchmark. Um, I have clients that have below the standards that get more

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done than the benchmark because they just have great staff, >> right? >> So, very possible. You don't want to be on the other side of that where you have seven FTEES and have a below average >> 19 supervisors. Yes, I I get that.

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>> All right. So, that's that was all the comments that I had. Um anybody anything else? >> I I I wanted um to talk about the public engagement. I think if we just if we put the draft on our website and just invite

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people to comment on it, that be it won't cost anything and we'll get we'll get we get the public engaged and get their opinions and their ideas on the on the on the on the draft plan because they haven't seen it yet. >> We're the only ones that have seen it, us and the city staff, right?

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>> And so, um, yes, absolutely. I think that um we can send an email out to the 245 people that participated in the first survey and say, "Hey, the draft plan is here. It's on the website. Take a look at it and >> you know, send your comments in."

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>> That's a great idea. >> I will say if you guys really want this plan to succeed, it can't just be the like dozen people we have in this room, >> right? >> So, you can initially fund a part-time urban forester through the landscape trust fund. That's a wonderful idea. I started kind of in a similar capacity

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for my city because I had a very brilliant city manager who knew how to deal with that type of stuff. Um, ultimately if you want to fund positions, fund a program, you have to have public support and it can't just be us sitting in here talking about how important trees are. Everybody else has to understand it and the city kind of

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has to essentially put their money where their mouth is. Like you have to be the leader. You have this really in-depth ordinance related to trees and development and then nothing about your own trees. Right. >> Right. So, it just doesn't to me if I was that just wouldn't sit right, you

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know. So, yeah, you're on on target with that. We need to reach out. >> I just want to make a comment uh as far as the the proposal and the messaging to the community. Um, I didn't see much in

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there as to your point to get more input and feedback from the community. uh with the volunteers that we've already or the um the the survey that you already took. take that same information and work through the utilities department and and

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get that kind of uh messaging through the utilities where there's more participants from the community and the residents who could understand more about what energy uh efficiency as a result of more trees in the community would be and try and get that kind of education and outreach through utilities

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is one example. >> Good idea. Yeah, we have sometimes they'll in a newsletter you just put a plug for trees um putting inserting flyers with bills. People love reading their bills. They they open them though at least. Um so yeah, there's all kinds of tricks. I'm sure the city staff

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already knows. Um I will say you guys probably have more robust public engagement than is typical in a process. So you should feel pretty proud about that that you really did go the extra length in my opinion. And that all started with the proposal put together for the grant and the city staff that

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developed that. So um there's definitely a lot of effort that went into that I can tell you. >> Do we need to uh make a motion or a vote or anything at this point or we just just the comments were all we needed? >> Just your comments how however you want to handle those comments collectively as

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a resolution or as a motion or just individually. Well, you satisfied with what you've learned so far from us? >> Yeah, I think we have some great feedback to take back and already made a couple of upping the 50 to 75 and, you know, some other notes that we can

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address uh more in depth. So, yeah, I think it's been very helpful. Do you guys think it's been helpful that we feel like we kind of touched on everything? >> Yeah. >> No. Uh, one last heartburn item or anything from anybody? Uh, >> oh, >> all right. K, come on up.

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Let's get it all out there. >> It's what we're here for. >> Okay. This and uh Jason Miller asked some questions about um the changes in the policies and the land development regulations and there's a whole section

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in this I think it's chapter seven where it goes through that. I think it would be huge of all of you to really study that before the next meeting because I think some or maybe uh Liz could have a meeting with Mary and I or something

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because um unless you've already agreed um the concerns about the tree ordinance are are are important and um the tree ordinance is already adopted but it could definitely go ary if we

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tried to mess with it too much. Um, there are some things that we have already, the TEC has already tried to address. We, the TEC actually made a recommendation to council that the landscape trust fund be utilized solely for the urban forest management plan in

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a forester, but I don't even know if that was presented to council or if they if they just ignored it. But I remember Michael Browning sitting right where Jason Miller was there and they made a motion about it and and approved it. So, um I don't know how more we can get

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council to consider using the landscape trust fund for the urban forest management plan, but um they do have a page all about that on page 116. Um, and it goes through uh she she thinks it'd be a good idea if you codify

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the eligible expenditure categories and she has a list of what you could say that the trust fund could be utilized for specifically and one is urban forest program staffing equipment administration. The TEC could say we want this resolution. We could

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recommend that to council next week um following this. So, um I don't know how you're going to deal with all the different parts that count that TEC has already addressed. We've already addressed the multif family. We've addressed the several things um that you

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went through in the policy and ordinance chapter in chapter 7. Um and council just really wasn't willing to do that. And so I'm I'm a little concerned about that. I can tell you what's interesting is when I was a city arborist, I felt like I was saying the same thing over

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and over to my council like year after year. And then we have a consultant come in and it like kind of got on my nerves a little cuz they said kind of the same things I already knew. We're we're on the same page on 95% of the stuff, right? >> And I remember my counselor being like,

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"Oh my gosh, that's a great idea. Why haven't we thought of that?" I'm like, "I've been saying it for three years." >> Right? So sometimes having another professional person saying, "Hey, this isn't >> just what this group thinks. This >> is an effort like other cities across

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the United States. This is what they're this is what they're doing. It's a professional recommendation. It's not just us saying this." >> Well, very good. Um, there is a few mention every once in a while in here about a street tree planting program, but I don't see enough emphasis on that.

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I think that that is a really important factor of this urban forest master plan that could be highlighted. We've been planting trees in parks. Volunteers can do that, but it's really hard for volunteers to initiate a street tree

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planting program and be digging holes where there's all these cables and stuff. And you have to have to be a little bigger too because you have more ch >> street trees are the number one desired place for trees but also the hardest place to plant keep trees alive and the

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most expensive place >> right and so it takes investigation whether you can plant a tree there or not or how many cables are there they keep putting more and more cables underground and I know there's ways to determine that but it's not something volunteers could do so I do ask that

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you've acknowledged that street trees provide the most benefits. I totally agree. They shade the sidewalk. They shade the the street, reducing the heat index. Um, and they shade that person's n yard as well. Get them out of the house because the yard is shaded now.

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And the resident, it's against the law for the resident to cut that tree down if it's part of the city's beautifification project. And we can get code enforcement to enforce that. But, um, that's why street trees are very important. And so I just wish you would kind of emphasize that a little

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>> can look to see if there's any way we can give me that extra time. >> You're welcome. Okay. All right. Lori, >> so um there there is a section and and K just mentioned it and it it is on page 99 in

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the plan or 116 if you're looking at the black numbers in the TEC packet. And I don't see why we couldn't, you know, right now make a motion and recommend to

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the city council that the this page right here be implemented or substituted for our existing language, you know, ordinance. That's I think we should work on the the landscape trust fund

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ordinance again. Take another crack at it. >> All right. and and and do exactly what's on this page right here. Rename the fund, >> the updates, all of the updates. >> Yeah. Rename the fund suggest she um Liz

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suggested the urban forest trust fund or the urban canopy trust fund instead of the public landscape trust fund. And well the the the landscape got added when the city basically hijacked it and right

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>> took stole the money to >> mitigation fund what it was originally >> right so that's when the landscape >> come on up >> got added >> come on up Bill understands the history of this because I know he's he's looked at this for many years

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>> when I was in city council >> and I was asking why is the city taking the money out of the trust fund to do a canopy pro I mean a gateway project I was told that it's

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for landscaping I said is not a landscaping fund it was originally written but Tony Cromales gave me the details I had the paperwork that said tree mitigation fund at that time you only need three city

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council members to vote to change the fund to put it wherever you want and the citizens have no say in what they do. That's why I'm mad because I was here and the lawyer stood up and told me that that is the legality that you only need

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three city council members to say this is a trust fund and no longer a tree mitigation. That's why we've got to work on that. The other thing that I dislike is the Tree City USA that we claim we're a tree city. We do not use that money

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for planting trees. I've been told by the city that it is being used for road work. That's a $100,000 a year that's not being planted in order to be a true Tree City USA. Another thing that's bad

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is in 2013. There was a really great urban tree uh program set up. I don't know how many pages there were. There was a computer program. There was real details in it. and only 17 pages can be found because nobody keeps records.

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Nobody keeps documents. We need to make sure that this document that this lady's written is kept and not thrown out like the last one. And we also need to have documentation as to how much money is collected, how much money is spent, and

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how much is in the budget year after year. because since it was around 2013, I started asking those questions and I've got a document I can send to you that I got a few answers and it's miserable. We need recordkeeping.

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>> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Well, and I will say if you guys towards the end of the plan, we see the appendix we have anam in one of the appendix is an example report. I can't remember if exactly what he was mentioning is in there, but that report's made to be

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tailored. So, if it's imperative to you guys that you put the trust fund, revenues collected, revenues spent, and total, that could easily be added or taken away from that. Um, and also I did want to mention one other thing, using these

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the trust fund to fund a position, you have to make sure you have a really good plan in place on how that's going to transfer. Um, listen, 700,000 buys you a lot of time for somebody, but I would not want to be hired. I've been in this

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position when I worked for the city of New York. I was paid for by grants. All of us were honestly, which is crazy if you think about it. Um, and we'd have people go off for a month and for a month no work would be happening. And so I don't want you guys to run into that. So making sure if that's part of that

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staffing and budgeting portion that there's a transition plan there. Maybe 50% is paid out of that in year 1, 25, year two so that it is it needs to be funded. The city needs to commit to that position and it can't rely on grants or developer contributions at the end of

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the day. In the beginning, I think that's okay. You got to do what you got to do, but having that transition plan, I think, is important. >> Yeah. You got to bootstrap yourself up to start. You can't go from zero to nothing instantaneously. >> Yeah. So don't let >> perfect get in the way of good, but have

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that knowledge. >> That's right. >> So the city's budget process is going to start here real soon, right? >> Yes. >> So So >> do I hear a motion? >> If you really want trees, they should be coming to the city council meeting and getting in up in petitions and requests

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and requesting that the city put a line item in the budget for the urban tree forest. Is that a motion or something similar to >> Well, our we're an advisory body. We could advise the city council that we

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would like to see >> absolutely >> some money be put into the city's budget. Um and and and and it needs to be a regular line item added to the city's budget to support the urban tree

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forest. I thought you were going to propose we send them appendix J to start with. >> We don't have to hit them that hard, but you know, I I think it's reasonable for the TEC to And maybe we maybe we need to

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suggest suggest a number, you know, 100,000 or something like that. Just enough to we need enough money to pay >> the urban tree forester position. So maybe you know >> at least one FTE.

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>> I can give you guys a little logic with that. So how I budgeted my mitigation fund was um whatever we collected the previous I think it actually had to go back two years. But I just took what we had brought in and that's what went into that tree planting fund. So if we had a

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year where we had a lot of fines and fees, it was higher, some years were lower. Um you just can't rely on that wholeheartedly. It has to be a supplemental thing. Um >> but that's the way I did it. So, if you've been in existence for seven years and you have 700,000,

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budgeting a 100,000 would seem reasonable and logical. >> But would that be a 100,000 that would come out of the tree mitigation fund or would that be out of the general fund? I think it needs to come from the general fund.

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>> I think you to really get dedication and commitment from your council, you'll need a line item in the general fund. Um, but I think for the tree mitigation, if you want to start putting that in your budget as a line item, like if it was tree planting, pruning, etc., um,

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just dividing it by how many years and how much money you have in there is a good starting place and pretty defensible if I were on a council. >> Hey, Mike, I had a question. Um, Jason, >> Bill mentioned something a second ago about the Tree City USA that we get like $100,000 a year. Is that

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>> No. The Tree City USA requires that their members spend $2 per capita. >> So per So we have 50,000 people. So that's $100,000. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Which we're not spending as a line item. >> That is not hard for municipalities. The

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one that trips most people up is actually the annual celebration. So the $2 is almost always met. >> They're spending the $2. They're they're um justifying it by saying that they t trimmed x amount of trees and that they

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>> right >> cut down five trees that were diseased. They they they justify it, but part of it is supposed to be spent planting trees. And that's Bill's point is that >> none of that none we're not we're not spending the city is not spending money

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planting trees. and the metrics aren't there either for what they're actually doing >> and and how that's being applied to to tree services in in our city. So, we really do need the plan and I hope this goes forward. Um,

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>> can I something on what you just said in regards to the uh Tree City USA funds $2 per capita uh and that they don't use it to plant very many trees. So, I brought that to the attention of Peggy Basaka immediately after the tree

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ordinance was passed in 2021. I said, "They're not using that $2 per capita to plant trees. Here's the list." And it shows this year, this year, this year they planted none or eight or whatever. And she says, "Go to TEC and tell them to tell public works to use more that $2

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per capita to plant trees." And I did come to you and I said that. >> And we did that, but they didn't do it, >> right? So, you know, like you said to begin with, you we can't force them to do, >> but also one of the worst things as a city I always thought was to put a tree

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in the ground before you had a plan. Um, with no one to take care of it, no one to prune it, no money to fund any of that. It's like throwing those tax dollars away. Tree planting is absolutely crucial, but tree planting with no followup or plan is

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>> okay, but we've been at Tree City USA for 25 years. for 25 years they've been >> Anyways, you got my >> Oh, no. I'm not disagreeing. You need to plant trees. Trust me. >> I literally worked in the city of New York and on the million trees campaign. So, that was how I got my start was

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literally digging holes. So, >> well, I I would propose to make a motion to add a line item in the annual budget coming out of the general fund uh so that we can ensure the longevity of this project um and so that we're not >> um

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>> encountering, you know, past failures with the different projects that we've done and uh so I make a motion to to add a line item in the annual budget coming out of the general fund. >> I'll second that straight out. Any other discussions on this, please?

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>> I don't know that I have a a good suggestion, but I'm just kind of asking out loud. Do we leave it vague like that or should we try to give a target? So, in my mind, if we're talking about, and I I'm not a great money guy, so this

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might be unreasonable, but um you know, we're talking about collecting $2 per person, it's roughly $100,000 per year through the Tree City thing. On top of that, we have the mitigation funds. Would $100,000 a year be a reasonable

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suggestion? >> I I I don't know. >> I think it's a start. >> Sneaker. >> No, I I think 100,000 is a good start. Um and uh that would ensure the salary for the uh coordinator whether it turns it starts out part-time to full-time and

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then overtime that that fund if it's allocated then we could um I would start with 100,000. So, I can tell you the average um urban forester for a city your size full-time would be paid around

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90,000. Now, that would have to be adjusted. That's just a benchmark um adjusted to Titusville's salaries, cost of living, etc. But that would be in a realm for a full-time. >> So, it's not a $40,000 a year. It's not 140,000. So,

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>> sure. But then we also have other funds coming from the mitigation fund, the Tree USA fund, and um the $2 per capita. So, we could we could uh add more money into that once once we get started, but that would be the a good start. I think

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um when we Lily when you go to present this to council um the was it um page 27 of the report 44 of our um where we have the tree urban uh urban forest details. We

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start out with how it relates to the sustainability action plan, our comprehensive plan and the community development plan. These are all supporting documents that support the requests that we're making. So I think that that may be beneficial to provide. >> No other comment. I'll call a vote.

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>> Can I have a few questions about the motion? >> Yeah. >> So this eventually will go before city council. So I'm assuming your motion is going to go with this plan as presented to city council and not separate. That's what we would do. Okay. Then the motion

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also asks for um general funds to be set aside to for new personnel, a new full full-time employee. Right? That's my understand. Okay. We do not I do want to clarify we do not have receive us you know city USA funds.

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>> What that is talking about is using existing funds general funds for maintenance to pay for our current staff to do out in maintenance. That's all it is. And so it's accounting for that. So the only revenue that we currently receive right now that's tree related is the impact fee or the the tree

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mitigation fee rather that goes into that trust fund. >> Thank you for that clarify. >> Uh and I just had one clarifying question on the motion. The motion and second were pending when the 100,000 figure was thrown out as as a suggestion. Is that been amended into the motion?

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>> The the a I'm the second holds. I the first is that acceptable? >> Yes. I I would say to uh include the $100,000 as the line item into the general fund. >> Okay. The second holds, too. >> All right.

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>> Is there a chance that adding the 100,000 is going to be a deal breaker for the council and then it'll kill the plan moving forward? Should we keep them separate? I I don't I don't want to add anything

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to the urban forest management plan that's going to sink the ship. And that could do it. That could be the torpedo. I think that I think that the the motion to add the $100,000 to the to the um the

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city's budget should be separate from a recommendation that we approve this plan. Although we're not we're not approving the plan tonight anyway, but I don't want to tie I don't want to >> I don't want to tie anything extra to the plan that's going to

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>> it's going to be the you know the thing that sinks it. >> That was my thinking was that this would be a separate recommendation not necessarily tied to the plan was my thought. I was >> so we can we can make that recommendation right now and and I think we should we need to start getting we

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need to start lining up you know our arguments for why we need to have the 100,000 come out of the city budget. We should start on that right away. I'm happy to resend that motion and then and reiterate that we just make a line

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item in the general general budget and ask for another motion uh later on for the 100,000. >> So you're withdrawing your motion and then I guess the second needs to do the same about that. I can do that, but I'm not sure why we're withdrawing the money. >> Well, I I do agree that the dollar

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amount can be um a little daunting at first if we're discussing this at the in the >> Can I make a recommendation? >> Yeah, >> this is going to come back to you potentially or help bring it back to you with some revisions at your next meeting. >> That be another opportunity for you to discuss that. So once I guess when

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everyone is brought up to speed and look at this more thoroughly, especially after tonight's meeting, then you may have uh a better suggestion as what that recommendation might be. and we'll certainly meet with you between now and then as well. Um, >> well, as long as we have another opportunity to present this, then then I

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think maybe we we can sit on it now and and uh so I do resend the motion for now. >> Brad, when do the budget hearings start? When are they going to get started talking about this? >> So, I could they have already the budget season has already started for fiscal

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year 27. the city manager is supposed to present a budget to the uh city council I believe late July. I'll have to look at the calendar. So this and this report probably will not get to city council until June 9th. So it's a month time and

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I don't know the city manager he may be able to squeeze in a line item based on your recommendation. If council directs him to do that, that's what he'll do. He'll find a way to do it. Otherwise, council may decide to defer this until next year and just ask us to find someone on current staff to help

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coordinate on a part-time basis possibly. >> Again, this is a plan when it goes before city council, if they accept it, it's a long-term strategy. Before you even start it, you have to get the prerequisites. So we then we have to think about the next year's budget, the following year's budget to find out what

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kind of resources we can collect for the coordinator, the inventory, which um I believe we do have a grant that was awarded to us. We just need to go through that to see what we can actually accomplish with that. And then um even looking at the

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landscape trust fund to see what we can revise on that. That's a process that's that's going to be changes. It's going to take several months council as well, >> of course. So, in all reality, I it's possible you could probably get something a line item into the fiscal 27

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budget, but in reality, I think it might not really start until the fiscal 28, mainly because of the timelines. But you are going to make your recommending body. So, make your recommendation to city council either tonight or wait till your next meeting. It won't I anticipate it won't go to them until June 9th

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anyway because that's when we'll present this uh report to them. The urban forest management plan will go to city council on the 9th. >> That's what we plan to do. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Because we have a deadline to report talking about now is outside of that.

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>> It's in support of it. >> Yeah. >> But it's it's not this. >> Yeah. I'm not telling you not to do it. I'm just my suggestion. All right. >> So I I appreciate you explaining that. The reason I made the motion is to ensure that this project is long lasting. And so my concern is that there

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is not a person in place or the funding or later down the road that there's going to they're going to say that the funding is no longer there. That's why I want the line item for long longevity. Are there going to be conversations between now and let's say June uh internally about staff and how that

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might be reshaped for different responsibilities? For example, maybe you're you're two arborist or the sustainability program or um the community development or excuse me the public works. >> Sure. our I mean our staff internally have been looking at contingencies uh depending on what city council's

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direction may potentially be on June 9th or thereafter with the budget. >> Would you be able to give us some options or what those alternatives might look like? >> Uh we're looking we it's very preliminary. So we just been looking at staff uh roles responsibilities uh the amount of work they have. Right now the

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city manager policy in order to bring because revenues are not coming in as with the you know we don't anticipate the revenue levels to be the same as the previous years. So the city manager's policy right now is to uh go through attrition. He's not limiting positions. He's just those positions that are not

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that are being not filled right now. Uh only in order to bring the budget to balance. So that's his policy right now. So requests for new personnel um to him, you'll have to consider those and if this is a priority of city council, he'll he'll take that he'll take that

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direction. >> Okay. Lauren. So, there's always the landscape trust fund and like if we were going to make a motion, we could maybe include that, you know, at least to get it started the first year, we could use the 100,000 out of the landscape trust

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fund so that it's not dinging anything else. Um, >> that makes sense. >> Still need a motion. >> Well, I think I think we can talk about this on on our in the next meeting. We can think about it and talk about it at the next meeting.

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>> But that would be my suggestion is that we we it's only going to take three votes, guys. Doesn't have to be unanimous. >> We just have to convince three council members that we deserve. >> We've been slided for so many years out

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of the landscape trust fund. Our community deserves the opportunity to take $100,000 out of the landscape trust fund so that we can hire a person to get this plan rolling. >> Y it's ridiculous.

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>> Anybody else? >> I just have a a quick timeline. >> Sure. >> A reminder about um the public feedback addin because this has to come back an edited version by your 15th meeting. So that will be a very short window of only

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a couple days and not enough probably to put in the utility bill by that suggestion. So the thought is we could do a a little mini sprint but it might not get the amount of turnout that it had before because we had months to get the response we had in the initial ask.

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So I just wanted to >> do we have the the email contacts of all the people that responded >> so we could do a quick survey back to those people. I don't have the flash vote ones though, which is where the 300 came from. >> I see. I see. Okay. Well,

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>> so I can I can still put it out there. I'm just letting you know like >> levy the expectations. >> Give them a week to respond and make it very very clear. Guys, you you have a week to respond. >> Suspense date and time. >> That's it. Well, and hopefully this will be one of those times when the other the

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people that are in this room can really help out and share it on the socials and talk to their friends about it and make sure that as many of us as possible put it out there as much as possible um the various service clubs and everything like that, like make announcements and

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and hopefully give people the opportunity to to respond. Okay, seeing no other motions or hearing no other comments, I guess we'll move on to old business and wetlands. >> Chairman, >> no. No.

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>> Chairman, I do have one recommendation because the list has these displays up here. We want to suggest to you to maybe take a recess to allow the members and members of the public to participate in the engagement that she's displayed here and then reconvene for the next agenda item.

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>> Okay, we can do just that. We'll take a short recess. Thank you very much. Okay, we'll give it a minute. Then I guess we'll uh bring the meeting back to order. Um

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since old business was wetlands and we're pretty burned out on wetlands and it's already too late tonight. So, I think we're going to just I'd like to have a motion to to punt the wetland uh to the next meeting. >> I would move >> the table just that table wetlands to

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the next meeting. >> Second. >> Got a motion and a second. All in favor say I. >> I. >> I. >> Any opposed? >> Hearing none passes unanimously. >> All right. Petitions and requests from the public present.

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Anybody? Everybody's jumping up for the podium. Okay. So, we'll pass on petitions and requests. We move into reports from staff and peoples. >> Yeah, I can I can go ahead and start. And as Brad um did allude to, we were awarded a grant to conduct a tree

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inventory. So, that is currently in uh process. So, that's step one of three of those prerequisites, which is started. >> Yeah. And it's funded, so that's good. >> Um yeah, I think that was the major highlight. And you all received the 2026 annual report that is a reflection of

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all the activities working it towards the sustainability action plan from April of last year to April of this year. >> Wow. >> It's thicker than the previous one. Been some work done there. >> Bethanne, you have anything to report?

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>> I do not. >> Anybody down on this end? >> Oh, yeah. Just a real brief one. Um, just wanted to say that attended the uh, planning officials training conference today. I'm not sure the exact title, but Laura Lee was there as well. Super super

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informative. And I'm going to steal Laura Lee's suggestion. I think that's something that every I mean, every city council member would benefit from that. Every boards and commission member I mean obviously not something you would ever enforce, but like I would really really push that as a as a great thing

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for anybody that's dealing with planning. It really opened my eyes to a lot. >> Thank you. >> Anybody else? >> I agree that it was really, really excellent. Um, so I just wanted to make sure that you guys have all ridden across the bridge and see all the new

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sand that's going in on the north side of the causeway. And when you go over our bridge now and you're heading east and you look and you see all that beach and all that sand on both sides of our causeway and there's no other causeway

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in the county that has any kind of beach. They're all lined with rocks. So, um we are and the horseshoe crabs loved it. So, um, we didn't have a lot of crabs on the southeast on the south side this year

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because we didn't have the right kind of winds, but we certainly had a lot of northeast winds this winter. And we have more crabs on our surveys on the north side of the causeway than we've had in the six years that I've been doing the survey. So, it was a banner year on the

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north side. And the reason is because we we put their habitat back for them. >> Yes. you know, so I'm I'm so happy with what's going on on the causeway. >> Thank you. >> I um I got a chance to watch Vinnie

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Toronto's um presentation from India Atlantic to the uh Sorrel COC, Citizens Oversight Committee. Um I was just absolutely floored with what they've did. Um India Atlantic is is a one square mile

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city. It's flat as a pancake and they don't really have any place for compensatory storage for storm water. And they were looking at different ways of trying to deal with it. And the way Vinnie put it, he said, "Which would you rather have, soup out of a plate or soup

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out of a bowl?" And the reason you want it out of a bowl is because there's something to hold it there. And they got to looking at putting in swailes in all of their rightways throughout the whole city, private land. and public land. Anywhere where there weren't utilities,

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they went in and designed a set of swailes that would would go in. And they have several different designs with several different plantings because they figured not only can it capture water, but it can also help water infiltration. And when you get plants that have long

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deep tap roots, that's what happens. So smart people found out that it their costs for swailes were something. God, it seemed I think it was like 13 cents a foot was what they came up with with a one with a six foot wide, one foot deep,

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one foot wide at the base swale, just a very shallow, but enough to capture some storm water. They calculated that if they did half of their roadways, what are available, just half, they would store over a million gallons of storm water just in these little systems. And

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so I was thinking that maybe it would be really good to have Vinnie come and give that presentation to us because I think that's something that we need to be thinking about in in light of the the storm water to trees that I I got you guys copies of from the EPA. Look at

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that. And then when we see what Vinnie's doing and what they've done in Satellite Beach, that'll give us a way to help move water through our city in a very convenient way in a in a way that we haven't tried. and it will help recharge our surficial aquifer way more than what

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we're doing now. So, I'd like to suggest that as a future agenda topic um if that's okay with you guys and then I'll work with Lily and and Vinnie to get that done. So, >> any other future agenda topics since

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we're in the future agenda topic area? No. Okay. Well, that only leaves one thing, adjournment. Thank you everybody for for coming today. >> We're journed.