Good evening. I'd like to call to order the November 5th, 2025 meeting of the Titusville Planning and Zoning Commission. If everyone would please stand for the pledge of allegiance. I allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic
for it stands one nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all. >> All right. Roll call vote. >> Chairman Eton >> here. >> Vice Chairman Childs >> here. >> Secretary Grant
>> here. Member FA >> here. >> Member Grod, member Scully, member Gellen here, alternate member Sidler >> here. Alternate member Troutman >> here. >> We have a quorum. Um, next we've got on
the agenda approval of the minutes of October 22nd. Anyone have any comments or changes to the minutes? If not, anyone care to make a motion? >> I member Seedler. Thank you.
>> Okay. Thank you. I have a comment um on the minutes. I did not see or if it is where it is indicated that um a question was asked by and I think Anna Long the attorney answered it and um it was regarding the wetlands and once the
uh association was turned over who was responsible for the wetlands and she or somebody said that the association was and that's not in the minutes. So, >> okay,
Lori, can we make that amendment? >> Will um anyone care to make a motion including that um change? >> I make a motion that we accept the minutes with that amendment. >> I second.
>> Second by member FA. All in favor? >> I. >> Any opposed? Minutes are approved. Um, do we have anyone to read the quasi judicial? Any volunteers?
>> Just in time. >> Uh, no, no pressure, but you got here in time to read the quasi judicial >> procedures. Proceedings. >> Okay. Good evening everyone. During the public hearing portion of the
meeting, anyone wishing to speak on a quasi judicial item must first sign a public hearing agenda card and sign the oath contained thereon. These cards are located on the table in the back of the council chamber. Those speaking in favor
of a request will be heard first. Those opposed will be heard second, and those who wish to make a public comment on the item will speak third. The applicant may make a brief rebuttal if necessary. Witnesses may be
cross-examined by the applicant, council, staff, representatives, and such other representatives as authorized by the council. Excuse me. If you have photographs, sketches, or documents that you desire for the city council to consider, they
must be submitted into evidence and will be retained by the city. Please submit such exhibits to the city clerk. City clerk uh or representative. Have all persons wishing to speak before the uh planning and zoning board signed an
oath card? >> Yes. >> Is there anyone else present who has not signed an oath card that wishes to speak on a quasi judicial item? If so, please submit the card at this time. Have all agendas items been properly advertised?
>> Yes. Have uh the members visited any sites or spoken to any members of the public regarding an item to be reviewed? >> No. >> Okay, that's it. Thank you.
>> Thank you. All right. Next item on the agenda is our petitions and requests from the public present. Uh you do not have to fill out a card for this and there will be another opportunity later in the meeting to also speak and that's if you want to speak on something that's
not on the agenda. Um >> you >> there this is an opportunity to speak um without filling out a card on any agenda item that's not on the agenda.
Mr. Johnson. >> I don't have to announce myself. You already gave my name, Stan Johnson. Here, I Let me see if I'm going to First of all, if I'm going to be removed from this podium, I have this uh poster. I'm I'm trying to make a presentation. And
here's the law that uh Mrs. Treasure sent to me. She says, "Plackards or science are only permitted in the back of the room." See, I got one back there. Back of the room. uh unless utilized as a part of the speaker's presentation, pluggers and signs will be displayed uh
in a manner so as to disrupt or or to disturb the meeting. And so as a part of the speaker's presentation, I call this a presentation and I have this. So if I can't use this up front, I'm going to claim uh violation of freedom of speech
because I'm making a presentation. Okay, good. All right. So here I'm wearing this shirt. So it says it says FEMAGET and this FEMAGET means is this is this is uh corruption and dishonesty by our our our
city government regarding drainage. Nobody's interested in that right here. So maybe I should just sit down. But anyhow, so what I' I've uh I've got here is there's a law. It's out of this book right here. This is the storm water
management plan of city title. Page 7-2 reads as follows. Please listen. Maintenance of the system will be required and provisions shall be made to keep all elements in top operating condition at all times. I don't think anybody heard it. I'm going to read this again. It says maintenance
of this drain system drain system will be required and provision shall be made to keep all balments in top operating condition at all times. I think you all understand is that it was illegal. I found it to be illegal when I went to a dairy road and uh they were pumping
water over the road, but it was clogged under the drainage pipe underneath was completely clogged or something. So that was ne negligence by the city of Titusville contributing to your drainage problem and flooding of homes and so forth. So
uh that's an example I wanted to share with you. And also uh on this poster back here, the big one, it says uh it shows that uh there's there's blockage of drainage west of I95 that's supposed
to be cleaned out according to this city's violating the law there, too. So, somebody might want to come and see me after uh after this and say, "Hey, you know, what can you do to help me?" I'm hoping for a little bit more time because I wanted to read some more laws
that you're violating. One of the laws you're violating is section 12-11. Let me read it to you. It shall be unlawful. This is city Tyville. It should be unlawful for any person to dam, construct, or in any way place anything in any natural dam, waterway or ditch running through and
within the corporate limits of the city which will in any way obstruct the water from flowing from flowing freely. City has has at least six dams. I'm asking for another minute. Does anyone care to make a motion for more time? >> Yeah, you do. >> No motions. Okay. >> No, thank you.
>> You guys want need to uh help this help help these people out that were flooded. Thank you. >> Does anyone else care to speak? >> Uh seeing none, uh we don't have any old business on the agenda. Our first order
of business under new business is item 9A. Eddie, >> thank you, chairman. Item 9A is small scale amendment SSA number five 2025 Sunset Development 125 Precision Way with annexation.
I'm going to hand out a revised staff report. There are a couple minor changes and I'll explain those. And the annexation ordinance that had a change in the legal description Thank you. I know I'm not a we changes >> they're available. I'm going to make I'm going to explain they're very minor
changes. The annexation orders. >> Okay, we'll start with the staff report. >> The staff report changes are as follows. On page two of 15, line 42, the existing language in the the agenda
that was published says 250 million gallons of water use per day. That was a typo and it should read 250,000 gallons of water used per day. So that's been corrected and when this item goes before city council, that's what the staff report will say. 250,000 gallons of water.
The next change is on page 13 of 15 lines 34 through 37. And this was to correct a a confusion between the uses in that are
described in the code between heavy manufacturing and heavy industrial. The definition of heavy manufacturing says uh the use of processing raw materials and that's been removed and instead the definition of indust heavy industrial has been included. And so now the
language reads some industrial uses in the M2s on the district including heavy industrial uses which use unique materials processes or equipment for specialized materials or are otherwise newly created processes that have not been incorporated into the land development regulations. That language has been added which is consistent with
the definition of heavy industrial use. the use that's been uh proposed in the stuff in the uh with the application versus the language that was previously included which said such as the processing of raw materials which was the definition of heavy manufacturing which is not uh was not ever a proposed
use in this application. So we're just removing language that was not related to this application. I see you're confused. Look. So let me let me explain one more time. So on line um lines 34 through 37, the language that's in the staff report that
was published says that some industrial uses in the M2 zoning district, including heavy uses such as the processing of raw materials. The definition of heavy manufacturing says that that that there will be
processing of raw materials. Heavy manufacturing was never part of this application or proposed as a use. And so that was irrelevant to this application and instead the definition of heavy industrial use which was proposed has
been included has been swapped out. Is that a little more clear? Sorry about that. And then the uh the last change is on page 14 is the exact same language. Um it's on line 14 through 18.
So, if there are no questions about that, I'll move on to the ordinance. >> And again, the staff report. >> I have a question. >> What's up? >> I have a question. >> Sure. >> Uh, where did the change come from to change out these definitions? >> Uh, the applicant notified us that this language was included in the staff
report and that it was irrelevant and so we replaced it with the relevant language for the definition. So, does it if if the zoning was approved, does it stay with the zoning or does it stay with the application? Did does the M2 zoning from an ordinance
standpoint have it? If if that someone wants to use that zoning for a different purpose, it's it's irrelevant as far as it being in the staff report. the zoning still if that use is not permitted in the zoning
district, it's not permitted just because that language would have been drafted in the staff report. We're just clarifying that that definition was never meant to be introduced in this use. >> Okay. >> And real quick, um, sure, >> under this here, it does also say that the may only be approved with a
conditional use permit. Is that something that this definition under the the cup is that is those two linked together? like it you need the COP for it to be a heavy >> I'm not sure question. Sorry.
>> So you're saying that the definition changed as far as the heavy industrial use, but then it also says that uh this may only be approved with a conditional use permit. >> Are you asking if a heavy industrial use
is only permitted in the M2 with a conditional use permit? >> Correct. >> I believe so, but let me double check. Because yeah, I would say is is heavy chemical processing a conditional use and M2 requiring a CUP before any site work.
Yes, sir. Heavy industrial uses require a conditional use permit in the M2 zoning district. Thank you. >> So, just just for clarity sake, since there is no CUP as part of this evening's proceedings, this would have to come back for a cup
for this particular use. >> Yes, sir. So, I wanted to clarify that as part of the background when we get the application. There is no CUP tonight. That this use uh the bleach processing that that uh several people have used. That use is not being approved tonight. What's being
considered tonight is the heavy uh excuse me is the industrial future land use designation and the M2 industrial zoning on the property. And so if there's any requests for uses that uh require conditional use permit, that will be the next step is to go through the public hearing process for that
conditional use permit. And the other change is the ordinance, the annexation ordinance. In that, we had to make a change to add the legal description for the additional ride ofway that's being added, which is along Sunset and Coina. Um the reason that's not being added to the other ordinances,
the future land use and the um zoning ordinances, is because we don't apply future land use designations and zoning to rightways. those are u uh uh areas that don't don't apply we don't apply the those designations to those
and so um only the annexation ordinance needed to be updated at this point. >> And so Eddie, real quick before you go. >> Sure. >> Um in this change that we're that we're making, >> what is the difference between raw materials and unique materials?
>> Uh I'd have to look in the code to see if there's a definition of that. Um, I don't want to speculate what the definitions are, but I don't have that for you right now. >> Okay. >> So, I'll read the introduction to the item. It's on page nine
of 128. The applicant is requesting a voluntary annexation and small-scale comprehensive plan amendment with resoning on 24.83 acres of land. The subject property is made up of 23.93 acre parcel with an unincorporated Bard County, which is the
site of a vacant building previously utilized as an appliance store and 0.9 acres of unimproved rideway. The applicant is requesting the county vacate the rideway. The property is situated south of Golden Heights Boulevard and west of US Highway 1. The property has a future land use
designation of industrial in Bvoulevard County and is zoned planned industrial park PIP light industrial IU general retail commercial BU1 all in Bard County. The intent of the request is to change the entire 24.83 acres to the
industrial future land use category and industrial M2 zoning districts in the city. A concept plan was not provided as part of the request and I want to reiterate that again no concept plan was provided with the request and so there is no binding concept planned with this.
Now, there was a concept plan that was uh provided as part of the community engagement meeting, but there were some uh footnotes as far as this being illustrative only for talking for discussion. And uh the applicant purposely did not include it as binding. And so while there is discussion about a
bleach processing facility, if approved, if if PNZ recommends approval tonight and council decides to approve uh the land use and zoning, then uh any use in the M2 zoning district would be allowed to um to operate at at that site. It's
not just the bleach processing facility. There's no guarantee that that's what would go there. So I just want to make that very clear that there was no binding concept plan. Um, next I wanted to give a little background on how the request came to be and some of that's in the staff report
on page 24 under number seven. Substantial reasons why the property cannot be used in the existing zoning district. It says the property is currently located in unincorporated Bvoulevard County and the applicant is requesting connections to the city's utility services. The city's
land development regulations require property owners to apply for annexation when requesting city services if the property is eligible for annexation per Florida statutes. So we the property owner is requesting the city's utilities because it's in the
city's utility service area and in order to do that the city requires applicants to go ahead and apply for annexation to bring the property into the city limits. There's no obligation for the city to annex the property but the requirement is that they at least apply. Just wanted to make that clear as well of where this application came from. They b purchased
the property to do an an industrial use needed city utilities and so they are therefore applying per our code. Next, um I just wanted to describe the land use process in general because I know we have um several people here who are not familiar with the process in general, the steps, and it's just nice
to have a refresher every once in a while. Um the applicant submitted an application with with all of their exhibits and had a community engagement meeting with the neighbors. Um got some feedback and provided that report back to staff and we provided that to you
all. Uh the next report is staff right to staff report and that's in your agenda packet tonight. Then tonight is the planning and zoning commission meeting which this is not a final decision. Um this is a recommendation to city council whether to approve or not to approve the item. Three items. There's the annexation, the
future land use change, and the reasonzoning. Next, it'll go to city council for our first reading where typically the ordinances are read out loud and there's not a whole lot of discussion, but it can happen. And then finally, the uh item will have its public hearing, its
final action uh before city council, and that's currently scheduled for November 25th. So, just wanted to make it clear that tonight is a recommendation to city council and not a final decision. Um, with that I'll take any questions or if not I'll hand it off to the applicant because I know they have a presentation
for you all as well. Thank you. >> Let's see. Member Chapman. Uh, what is the Titusville's current potable water production capacity in MGDs and how much uncommitted surplus remains today? >> Uh, I'm not in the utilities department.
uh just knowing generally from our concurrency applications it's around four uh million gallons a day and there's I want to say about three uh million gallons in reservations.
Um, but again how many >> about 3 million in reservations, but I'm not I'm not 100% on the numbers. >> Child's, >> you know, I was researching that too. It's actually because I was the one who brought up the 250 million gallons a
day, which was absurd, but um whereas the city of Tyville uses about four million gallons a day. Um, and then the the capacity I think what we got from our earlier meeting this year from Kevin Cook was it's like 6 and a half million
capacity is what we have for capacity per day. So 250,000 of like the four 4 million is like 12% or something. But so it's it's a lot. But yeah, um my question was um
uh when we're reszoning something like this and it's going to be and it could some of the uses include some hazardous stuff or whatever um do do we do an evaluation for um you know emergency
response? So if anything happened at that at that plant that we have the coverage because I remember not so long ago that we were considering as a city of doing a a fire station on the you know a newer fire station on the southern part of the city but we
abandoned that because there was a need. Now this is on the southern part of the city. So what would do we evaluate that as far as um what our response would be? Do we have coverage for that use already or what's what's our process for that?
>> Sure. So, a couple things. The fire department is on the the site review team for the site plan when this would come in for a development permit. Um the development itself is not scheduled to uh be fully operational for several years. That would give the city some time to be better prepared. But yeah,
there is a a routine schedule where fire is re re-evaluating the uh services and needs throughout the city. But that's just so for that specific evaluation, it's just when they're applying for a building permit or or a site >> the site permit which is the first step
in the in the development process. This is the the first step in the entitlements process. >> So we don't take that in consideration when we're reszoning though is what you're saying that we don't really >> uh fire is a reviewer on on at this stage. Uh but typically the comments are not because this is so early in the
process it could uh the site may not get get developed. the building may not get de get developed any at that point the use may not begin in operation and so there's so many steps that may happen that um you don't want to be making changes to the city's operations before something comes online.
>> Okay, thank you. >> Member Seedler. >> Thank you. I don't know if this is the time to ask, but there's a reference to a um Florida Power and Light substation being put on this property. What does it look like? Because when I
looked at the community thing, it was a significant size on their thing. And will this substation just supply this parcel or this project? And >> good questions. I'll leave that to the
applicant to to explain. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Member Traman. >> Yes. Uh, has the city issued a utility will serve letter for this amount of gallons that they're asking for? I'm not I'm not familiar with a utility will serve letter. Um we have a couple
processes. We have a preliminary concurrency assessment which is what we do at this stage when it's a request for a an entitlement on the property and then there's a letter later stage when it's a commitment letter when when it's a dedication we will reserve this capacity for your development and that
comes later during the site plan stage. So, I guess uh where I'm getting this information from would be under the annex ordinance uh 4 packet uh page 27 in that annex. Uh no building permit shall be issued unless public facilities are available concurrent with impacts of
development. So, is that part of the from my understanding that's part of the reasonzoning because no matter what goes there, they need to have a letter saying we're good to give you this much water, >> right? And so that's that's what happens with the concurrency assessment. we don't have a concept plan that shows us
how much water use this development is is intending to use. We have to evaluate it at the most impactful based on the zoning. And so that's why uh we'll do a concurrency assessment based on the square footage allowable under the zoning versus what the proposed uh what a concept plan might show. Unless they
are submitting a binding concept plan, then we will base it on their binding concept plan. >> And then under my understanding, no concurrency means no anization or reszoning at this point in time. >> I'm sorry, I couldn't hear you. at this point in time from my understanding and then please you know educate me uh if we have no concurrency at this point in
time then no annexation or resoning would be legal at this moment in time then >> correct if we did a preliminary concurrency assessment that showed that there was not enough capacity for the development then we would not be able to approve the request >> but I'm under the understanding that that needs to happen first prior to anything the concurrency
>> the concurrency assessment was done and was shown that there is enough there's adequate capacity for this development. Oh, okay. That's I guess that's what I'm getting at is so that where there is a concurrency provided. Thank you. >> Member Seedler. >> Is there reclaimed water available at
this site as well? >> That's a good question. Um I don't know if we touched on in the staff report. I can look at the utility map on our website if you give me just a second. There is not >> member Grant.
>> Um, Superendo, howdy. It says that uh the M2 zoning district is compatible with existing land uses to the north, west, and south. I only see one, and that's uh the west, which is Tao. Um,
could you elaborate on those other M2 zoning district that's near this property? >> So, the the staff report says that the M2 zoning that's requested is consistent with the surrounding zoning. >> Yeah. >> Okay. That doesn't necessarily mean that
there's M2 zoning surrounding the property. Uh, that means that it's consist generally consistent with the other zoning districts surrounding it. Um, the zoning map is available on page page 39 it looks like.
>> I'm just looking at page 14. >> I'm sorry. That's the future land use. Page 14. You said >> I'm looking at page 14 and we're talking about uh what's >> Oh, that's the the table. >> Yeah, because I'm led to believe that um this property is surrounded by heavy
industry, which I don't see. So if you turn to page 40 of 128, uh the property west of the FC Railroad rightway. This is the existing on the left and proposed on the right zoning maps. Page 40.
>> I'm sorry, say again. >> So on page 40 of 128 is the zoning map. On the left hand side is the existing and on the right hand side is the proposed. >> Let's take a look at that. a lot to see. Okay.
I I still only see M2 on the west side. >> Correct. And then the remaining properties to the south um are in IU industrial light. That's Bard County's designation. And so again, that's not saying that it is M2. It's generally
consistent with the other zoning districts. >> Okay. Well, like I said, it kind of feels it makes you think that it's surrounded by heavy industry, which I don't see that. >> That's fair. >> I understand the Tao, but not to the north or to the south. >> Sure. I will also say that the triangle
wedge to the south that is in the city, >> um, that property is also zoned M2 and has an industrial future land use in the city limits. And that's the, uh, Titusville logistics center. Oh yeah. Okay. All right. Even I don't understand that one either, but Okay. Thank you.
>> Sure. >> Member Seedler. >> Thank you. On this map where the M2 is the airport considered M2, >> is it the airport in the M2 zone? What is the airport? I don't It's a little bit further up.
>> I believe the airport is zoned P for public. Um which actually we have on the as an ordinance as a second item for tonight. But um the properties the public property surrounding the airport are mostly zoned M1 or M2. >> Okay. And I'm as I'm understanding it if
tonight the it gets passed that the uh bleach facility is just a concept. We're talking it could be changed to anything because there is no plan. We don't have anything locked down to approve.
>> That's correct. There's there's the bleach processing is just word of mouth at this point. It's not binding to this ordinance tonight. And again, there's no approval tonight. This is just a recommendation to city council and the final approval will occur at city council's second meeting. >> Okay. And we can Okay. Thank you.
>> Member Grant. >> So, you're saying that we can ignore all the talk we've been hearing about a bleach manufacturing facility? Well, I mean, the applicant may decide to present that as something they're willing to bind tonight. you that'll be something you'll have to discuss with the applicant. But as of what we've
received, we have not received anything any binding concept plan that >> been hearing about this for at least a few weeks now through you know through the grapevine about a bleach facility >> and >> the application that was submitted to us
does not indicate with any certainty that it will be that. So, what I can tell you is that if approved, that zoning district will apply to the property and so any of the uses that are allowable under that zoning district can be permitted at the site. >> I understand what you're saying. I'm >> It's crazy, man.
>> So, a couple questions, Eddie. Um so bordering this property uh the way I see it only one border actually borders this Titus city property right >> that's correct
>> so this will continue to be three-sided um we'll still be counting on three sides and then just to reiterate we could reszone annex and reszone the property to get it on the city's tax
rules, but a bleach can't plant can't be built here until it goes through the CUP process since that's one of the under this zoning that we would reszone it to. It would have to be go through the cup
process, come back before us before a bleach plant could be approved on that property. If it's determined that that a the the use that's proposed falls under this use, then yes, a CUP would be required and they would have to come back for a public hearing process for approval.
>> And who determines whether the bleach a bleach plant, which I know is a little bit maybe too nebulous to um to go, but whether that falls under the uses described in the zoning. So,
typically what happens is staff writes a zoning verification letter and that can be challenged and the community development department director, the administrator makes a determination and that can be appealed to uh I'm not sure if it's PNZ or BAA. I'd have to uh check what the code says, but it can be
appealed. Um, but at the end of of the day, it's either the administrator or if it's appealed to one of the boards. That's who makes the determination. Okay, that that spurred a couple more lights here. Member Faith. >> All right, just Hello, Eddie. Uh, again,
just so that I'm extremely clear that tonight's request is to annex and approve M2 and at this time not consider the proposed use since it wasn't given to the city.
So, we're only asked to annex and reszone to M2. >> That's correct. >> And the only other thing that we can consider is possibly using water, but again, that water would go with the use. And we don't really have a use per se to
vote on. So, we're only voting on annexation and um resoning. >> That is correct. And in our staff report, we've identified that a preliminary concurrency assessment was done based on the application and there's adequate services to serve the
development. >> Okay. And the only then the only thing that's really another sticky point or point of contention would be that of the four sides only one of the four sides touch the city of Titusville. According to state law, it just says it
needs to be well, I don't want to say exactly what it says because I I don't have it in front of me, but it needs to be adjacent to the city limits. >> Okay. >> It doesn't say how many sides. It just says it can't create a new um >> a new enclave. >> Uh enclave. Exactly. >> Okay. So, the only reason I ask that question is just because I want to make
sure that the three things that we're to consider are are those three things. Correct. Um annexation, >> resoning, and then >> the future land use. >> The future land use. Okay. Thank you, sir. >> Member Gallen.
>> Hi, Eddie. So, this goes back to the the CU portion of it, right? If it's approved, it comes within the city, right? We kind of have some some hand in it. Is it guaranteed to come back under CUP
for a CUP with planning and zoning or could it go administratively? >> There is no guarantee. So, like I said before, if this is determined to be a different use that does not require a cup, then it may be administratively permitted. Um, if the administrator
finds that it is a use that requires a cup and that decision is challenged and whichever board hears it appeals that decision and finds that it is a different use that does not require CUP, then it'll be approved administratively. So one one more question slashclarification
is if this isn't annexed it continues to stay in the county and whatever goes on that property and whatever happens on that property is left up to the county not and the city has no say in it at all. >> That's correct. And the city has the
ability to sign utility agreements and so what would happen is the development would still be able to use the city's utilities. It would not be in the city limits obviously um but the utility agreement would be would condition that the city could annex the property at its behest. So whenever the city wanted to
annex the property it could because it is not using its utilities. Thank you for the clarification. All right. Anyone else on the deis have any other questions before I open the public hearing? >> Member Seedler.
>> Thank you. Just to clarify that they did when they put in they went to the community meeting and the report there that the applicant proposed for the new plant uh to be annexed into the city for a new bleach production plant. So,
and they didn't give a concept plan and then you gave us worst case like 900,000 square feet and 250 meant to be thousand gallons of water and we have an Florida Power and Light. So, I'm just trying to get all of the
little ducks in a row what we're being asked to do. They did present it as for a new bleach production and it's my understanding if we do pass it and they choose not to do the bleach production and they do something else they can do
whatever and conditions may require a conditional use permit or they may not. So at this point in time we still have a say as to whether I'm guessing that's how this is going. we still kind of have
a a say as because we're we're not being tied down and told anything. We're told, well, it may be a bleach production plant or it may not be well, it it may be something
different that has a lot more uh chemicals or something other. And so if if we change it, then that could be put in, could it not? Well, would also require a conditional use permit probably if depending on the use, but
anything that's doesn't fall within the zoning is going to require a conditional use permit. >> In the M2 zoning, it will require a conditional use permit. Is that correct? We change to M2 >> depending on what the use is. But you're
saying that we don't in some of the M2 zonings that they might not have to have conditional use permits, but we're going based on >> it. It could be a machine shop. It could be an appliance store. Again, it that doesn't require conditional use permit. >> Yeah. So, so there are several
properties throughout the city that are zoned M2 and it allows a variety of uses. There are some uses that are not very intense that might not require a conditional use permit. They might be permitted either with limitations, meaning if they can prove that they meet certain limitations, they can be approved or they might be permitted by
right. Um, but there are definitely some uses that are heavier industrial that do require a conditional use permit. So, there's a mix mixed bag depending on the the intensity of the use. The code has a variety of uh requirements, variety of approvals. >> Any other questions?
All right. With that, I'll open the public hearing. And um I >> think the the applicant wanted to uh give you a presentation. >> Yes. >> Good evening, board. My name is Jim Palmer. I'm the president and CEO of Allied Universal Corporation. Um, and
I'm here tonight to give you a little uh u briefing on our company as well as what our intention is uh with this site. Our intention certainly is to build a bleach plant. Uh we have no other intention other than that. So let me
start with that. Um our company is 70 plus years old. We're a Florida based company. Uh we have two of these type of plants already in Florida. one in Manatee, Florida. The other one in Fort Pierce. The one in Fort Pierce has been running for over 14 years, and the one
in Manatee has been running for over uh five years with no incidents of um loss of any kind of product offsite or anything like that. This these type of plants by Homeland Security and by uh
EPA are what they call inherent safer technologies. And I'm going to make it very simple. And please ask any questions you have. When we did the public meeting, I made it very simple. And a young lady told me it can't be that simple. It's got to be more complicated. But as simple as I can make
it to uh on layman's terms is we take salt, water, and electricity, and we make chlorine and costic soda. It instantly recombines to make sodium hyperchloride or bleach. The bleach, for
a lack of a better way, is like twice the strength of Clorox. Uh your own utility uses this product. We supply that already. Um the benefit that you would have is you'd have it right here uh as well. Um the other use that we use
it for is for swimming pools. So basically you're drinking it and swimming in it. Um, and it's a it's a corrosive material, but it's not an extremely hazardous material uh by DOT regulations and EPA regulations. The
difference is, as I said, our company's 70 years old. We made bleach from way back when, 70 years ago. And what we used to do is bring in 90 ton rail cars of chlorine gas and 50tonon rail cars of
sodium hydroxide and recombined them. There was no protection of the chlorine rail cars. They were sitting outside etc. This process has less than 70 pounds of chlorine. It's inside a building and the whole building is its
own containment. The beauty of of of this is that the extremely hazardous materials are there there isn't enough to do anything. A rail car of chlorine that's lost, you're talking about 14 miles of affected area.
This you'd be talking about less than a quarter of a mile even if it got out of the building. We've never had that happen. Never had anything get off site. Um, we have changed our conventional plants in Miami and in Tampa and in Fort
Pierce itself to these newer, safer technologies. Um, and we supply approximately 75 to 80% of the bleach that goes into drinking water and sewage treatment. Another big customer of ours
is FPNL. And after a hurricane or anything like that, uh we're the most essential service that um anybody can ask for because without drinking water and power and sewage treatment, this
state stops. And our reason for building a third plant is we're overcapacitated because basically the people that still make the product the un what we call the unsafe way. um we're basically taking their business away because we end up
having enough um product to be able to do that. Plus, on top of that, it's a much safer technology. And um so we need to build a a larger plant as Florida continues to grow. And uh you know, we're that we're here tonight basically
to answer any questions. Um we have an open book policy uh and we had the public meeting. Um there you had a lot of people come to the public meeting. We were actually surprised how many people came but uh we had a lot of good
questions and um my associate in our engineering firm is going to talk about some of those issues that they brought up because we want to be part of the community. Everywhere we've been and everywhere we are now, we're part of the community and we're an essential part of
the community and we have no intention of being any different in Titusville than we are here. Your water plant and your surplus plants are tickled pink that we're coming to town. So, at the end of the day, yes, we use 250 uh,000
gallons of water. Uh the other thing is that that is at full capacity and it'll take three to four years to build this plant and then on top of that we would end up uh before we had the plant get to full capacity probably another three or
four years. So to answer the question about the fire department and things like that we train hazmat responders. We're very responsible that way. We're a leading member of the chlorine institute uh which is the governing body of uh
sodium hyperchloride and chlorine gas. Uh we're very active in that. We're very active in all our associations like um the um ACD affiliate chemical distributors. We adhere to responsible distribution and
we have a very good safety record. And as I say, we've been here, we're working on the third generation of uh family members, you know, within our company and uh we are very interested in being part of the Titusville family. I'll
pause now. Any questions that I could answer? >> Member FA. >> Well, thank you for showing up today. Uh, so my first question is is if you knew that you want to apply as a uh bleach facility, why does your
application not state that? >> I I don't know. I'll let our local attorney answer that when she >> Okay. >> And the next question I'm going to ask is how many people will this facility employ? >> This facility will employ between 70 and
90 people depending when when it's built. We're talking about having a 100red to 200 in in u construction workers and things like that. Um being very active in the community using a lot of local services and things like that.
Uh but that would include three shifts of people um and truck drivers. Uh they're all highpaying jobs. Um you know, we pay very very well. We've got excellent benefits. And the beauty of our business is as the economy gets
worse, our business gets better. And I always joke because people get frustrated and they spent more time in the shower and so they use more water and we get it when we supply the bleach to the drinking water and we get it when we supply it for the sewage. So our jobs
are very steady and and constant. Um I've been with the company 31 years. Uh and we've never had a layoff. >> Okay. And last question. Um, since you're going to be building here locally, do you at least gentleman's agree to use as many local contractors
as possible? >> I can I can tell you if you check with the people in Fort Pierce or in Manity, uh, we use the port in Manatee to bring in salt um because that's the main ingredient that goes into this. It's much more pure than the table salt you
use. So, we'll be using the port here. We also will use trucking to move product to there. Um, and we will have uh, you know, outsource our trucking services as far as mechanics and things like that. And we're looking to hire
people. We have a very good training program. What having two other plants like this, what we do is feed the plant with a couple of seasoned personnel and then we bring in the rest of them and we train them as we go. We like to bring them in about six or seven months before
the construction is over so they know where every pipe and valve and everything else is. Uh so yes, we'll use them. We'll use them in the construction phase and afterwards. Um we were joking this evening. We had a quick dinner at one of your local restaurants and we
said, "Hey, we're already supplying some money to the neighborhood." So >> thank you. >> Member Grant. It says that um your waste water would be trucked off site. How is that disposed of?
>> Okay. What what happens is in when you produce the sodium hyperchloride, you take the >> ultra pure brine, the very very good salt water and you electrolyze it. Well, you have to you have to take a little bit of that away and it's too salic.
It's about the same strength as the ocean water as far as salt uh levels. So what we do is we typically deep well that because at the end of the day that gives you the ability to put something back into the environments that's
exactly what's down there now. And it's ultra pure. >> Deep well injection has caused a lot of uh head scratching for a lot of people. They're they're not comfortable with that. whether or not because typically deep wells are used for leech aid out of
out of um um out of landfills and things like this. This is better than what's down there. Now, if you look at the the structure of uh of Florida, we're basically floating along on top of that
that area and it's down 300 or 3,00 to 3,500 ft. The other beauty of this is there's some new technology that we have come up with that will be able to greatly reduce the amount of effluent that we'll have for
this. Um so we're being able to reduce it by about 80% from where the other two plants are now. >> You can't contain nature. M you can't contain nature. Nature will find a way. >> Well the salt that this is is you know
it's it's salt. It's salt water. It's not doesn't have any chemicals or anything like that in it. So, >> okay. All right. >> Member Childs, >> um during your process of manufacturing bleach, whi when is there is there a
part of the process where chlorine gas is is potential? Is it just fire or anything else would that would would make chlorine gas or >> Well, yes. The the system itself makes chlorine gas. It makes between 70 and 80
pounds of chlorine gas. That's all contained in piping and inside a building. So, at the end of the day, uh, all the tanks are scrubbed and things like that. So, uh, if there was anything that would get out, we would be able to
scrub it inside the building as well. >> You can scrub. Okay. So, you have scrubbers in there. So, >> and we have we have alarms that are set up to half a part per million, which give you an idea, it's like it's like a
gallon of water in Lake Okachchobee. So, >> right. All right. And so, if that happens, if that alarm goes off, then you stop the processing and run the >> process automatically shuts off and re is brought down. It uh it the control room operator doesn't have any control
that comes down automatically. What about if a fire happens? What happens then? >> A fire, if there was a fire, the chlorine gas actually would burn and and and wouldn't burn in the sense of burning. It would put the fire out. It's uh it's an oxygen steel or it's much
stronger, larger molecule than oxygen is. So, it would u you know, just like nitrogen would, it would eliminate the fire. >> Okay. Thank you, >> member Seedler. Thank you. Um, can you talk a little bit
about the substation, what it looks like? Um, a little bit about that and then >> I'd rather let I'd rather let Chris, our engineer, um, answer that. Um, you know, I have a basic understanding, but he he's much more involved in that and and
he'll give you a lot better information than I could on. >> Okay, then I'll ask you a different one then. Okay. Um, you um mentioned that you have a very good safety record and that you have two other plants. Where can I find um the toxic release inventory program data? I went looking
for it and it I didn't find it. So, if you could point me in that direction. >> Yeah, you need to you need to check the EPA and the R form and I'll tell you what you'll find. you'll find that we show zero to 10 pounds per year of
chlorine and that's per year. Uh and that's basically um you know parts per parts per billion uh that are floating around. You you you can't say it's zero because you can't prove zero. So the
lowest level that you can legitimately say is zero to to 10. Then the next level would be 10 to 100. The next level's 100 to 500, 500 to a,000 and it keeps going up. And so we we don't want
to be um a try to say that we don't have anything not not a a whiff or anything that but again that's in the building. That doesn't necessarily mean anything outside the building because if you look if you read the R
form requirements by EPA, you'll see that it says what is discharged whether it's inside a building or whatever. The scrubbers are set to about a half a part per million. So you can't scrub anything less than that. So you have to have something. And are the two
other facilities comparable in size? And what your >> The one in Fort Pierce is going to be exactly the same size as this one. The one in Manatees a little bit smaller. >> Okay. >> But they're they're in the same ballpark. >> In the same ballpark. And then you also
mentioned that the new plant, and I'm getting this off the community meeting report, it will produce 100 to 200,000 gallons per day. and that you'll transport them out by rail and by 15 to 25 trucks per day is >> and the reason that we're talking about
100 to 200,000 is because when the plant first starts up it's not going to be sold out. So at the end of the day in the beginning it'll be 200 100 and eventually we'll build up over a few years um to 200,000.
>> And how do you get the product to the rail? Okay, there's a we'll have a rail we'll have a rail sighting that comes off the FEC line that goes right by the property and basically it's got be piped in a
double wall pipe and then put into the rail cars in the truck area. The trucks will be filled in a contained area. So if there's any drips or spills or anything, it's contained. And bottom line is this is money for us. So we recycle everything. Um, and you asked
about before about the uh using recycled water. Uh, when we when we make our brine, we have to clean up the city water. So, it's it's uh it's a real process in that sense. It's a little more complicated, but >> thank you.
>> Member Chapman. >> Uh, yes. I have a question regarding the um entry to this facility. Uh, the safety of that area. It's a very, you know, US1's a very high um traffic area
for Florida or for our area. Um are you are y'all going to proportionate share payment for the US one for a left turn lane deposit before the CO? >> I I know that we're looking at improvements for that, but I'd rather have Chris uh because he's already done
the traffic study. He's already had some preliminary discussions with FDOT and things. So, I think he'd be better to answer your question. um than than I would I I know what he's told me, but better to hear it from the from him. >> Yeah, I would I mean just for my side of
it is that you know I I see him trying to put a a light there would be I don't know how that would work uh too much. I know that there are lights on US1 but something that's going to provide say because I you know there's there's a establishment across the street that a
lot of people go to you know so I used to be a truck driver. I used to own a trucking company and I've I drove trucks so I know how hard it is to stop these things, how hard it is to get them across intersections and then we throw liquid in it. You don't have the same stopping compatibility as a drive van.
You know, you got that slush. I know that most of those type of tanks normally have baffles. >> Yeah. >> Um food grade is the one that doesn't normally have baffles, but still even with baffles, it give you a good slush and will push you through an intersection if you're not. >> And so those are concerns in that area.
It does, but you know, these are $150, $200,000 pieces of equipment, plus our drivers are very specialized drivers. They're the PhD of truck drivers because they have to have their CDL adset endorsement and tanker endorsement. Uh,
so we don't want to lose those drivers. We don't lose We don't want anybody getting hurt, whether it's the the public or our people. Um, I will tell you in u in the Fort Pierce facility, we did put turn lanes in. Um, you know, uh,
we we will do whatever we need to do to make it safe for not only the public, but for our people as well. Uh, at the end of the day, these are highly qualified people and they if you've been a truck driver, you know what the trucking shortage is like. >> Yeah. Yeah. And then I I would just say
that you know I know a lot of times uh I would say a lot of times probably that you know it's it's you know public that has interaction with the truck not per se the trucking >> driver or whatever. Um but that's where
I'm at with the safety on that. That's >> we've looked at several things but Chris will be much better to answer that on some of the ideas that we already have. Thank you. >> Um there seems I've got a couple things. Um
the there seems to be some confusion discrepancies about um the process and tonight and the cup and and all that. So assuming that a cup is required, which is our understanding
that the proceedings tonight do not approve the bleach plant. Are is that your understanding as well that that's the process and that we're not approved this evening? >> I I'm not sure. I I'll
>> let Kim out that. And then uh number two, have you done any kind of projection as to the facility you're building with the equipment and the property taxes and things that would come back to um the county and the city
based on the improvements that you're you're going to put in place here? I I don't have the exact number uh but I understand it's well over a million dollars a year >> and economic impact on >> for the city
>> from the city >> and on top of that we'll be a decent size water user and and we do have sanitary sewer we'll be using as well. So I'm not counting those and I'm not counting the benefit that the you
know the community would get from the employment and things like that. So >> okay. So you want to bring up your engineer to continue the presentation. >> Thank you. Appreciate >> Hello. Good evening. I'm Chris Vigil, senior vice president of BRPH Companies.
I'm a industrial engineer and an electrical engineer. I'm licensed in the state of Florida. I have uh been a project manager and program manager of two of these chemical u these these salt plants before and uh so this would be my third u run through the same uh type of
program. Um I represent our company which we're responsible for supporting allied on um architecture, engineering and construction. We would uh be managing all of those aspects of the project if
the project went forward. Um my company is headquartered right here in Bvoulevard County. We have about 120 employees here in Bvoulevard County. Uh we started here in 1964. So we're very much vested in Bard County and we have about a dozen employees that are
citizens here in the city of Titusville. What you see here in the plan that's uh presented and that was shared with you uh in your packet. Um uh we are prepared to consider this the concept plan. There are some refinements in the plan still that we're going to clean up and certainly during the site development uh
planning process there will be things that'll come out of the city. The city will tell us about things we have to incorporate and modify. So of course there'll be slight adjustments but the plan you're looking at today is the plan we intend to utilize uh for the site development process.
So, this plan, uh, I'll just quickly orient you. Um, if you know where US one is, uh, from that plan, yeah, we have two entrances on the north and on the south side. They exist today. So, we're not asking for FDOT to permit any additional new entrances. The north
entrance is identified to be the trucking entrance. The south entrance is identified as the car traffic. The south entrance is the one that also is a public way. It's used for access to the USA yachts which is on the south end of that property and a future used for
whatever develops on the property south of the properties in question that we're talking about today. The truckers are planned to come in the north and go out the north. So there'll be entrance and exit from the same position. Uh the current appliance direct building is
actually east of the buildings you see right now. So the intent is to build all the buildings uh required for the process of the plant to the further to the west to the back of the property. Therefore moving it further away from US1 and further away from the residences that exite that reside on the east side
of US1. There is a plan to provide a Florida paranite substation here and that substation is intentionally meant to be dedicated to service only uh this facility. Um I'll talk about that a little bit further in a little bit more
detail. We are planning a lot of uh vegetation on the property. Uh currently today uh there's plenty of vegetation on the property as it's mostly undeveloped aside from the appliance direction building. The uh the tree preservation plan has already been produced. Um and
we've already met with the city and had multiple conversations about how we can preserve the natural event of the property with this natural vegetation on the west side of the property. Somewhere around middle of the property, you can see there's a spur that comes off the FEC railroad. Um, you can also see a big
green dot on that plan. That's a heritage tree that we're planning to keep and preserve that in its existing condition. There are two major structures on this site. Um, there's a image there in your packet that shows you kind of what they look like. One would be the salt storage
building which is stored in its natural condition. That's a concrete structure on the northwest corner. And then the main building, which is the process plant, is a metal building, pre-engineer metal building, which would sit right in that center west of the appliance direct uh facility.
The staff comments identified a few aspects I think we should bring to attention. Um the city utility services are available. Um there's no additional public funds are required. The traffic impact uh is identified as being um less
than required uh for the county and airport impact is uh already been talked we've already talked to the airport and the FAA. The height of the main structure which is the physical uh plant with a where the manufacturing occurs is uh approximately 63 feet hasn't been fully designed yet. So we're still going
to work on that. But the uh airport has already identified that that requires further buffering on on the property which we've identified in that concept plan. We've already accounted for it. Concept plan is in your packet. Um we haven't identified as the concept plan but we're already prepared today to say
that that is the concept plan. Uh will there employment opportunities? Yes, the this the staff has already identified that. Um I will say that um Mr. Palmer has already said about the employment opportunities within the plant. I will say that this is going to generate a significant amount of income for the
city as it's being constructed. Uh we would average somewhere around 200 to 250 workers on the site during the course of the couple years that the project's under under built. Um we are a construction company here in Bvoulevard County. Um, we would be employing in our
in in the discretion of work and pricing of course plays a part of this, but we would like to employ all Bvard County subcontracting trades in the area. And frankly, we are already doing that on many projects we're working on at NASA and other facilities here in Bvoulevard County. So, we would keep that going.
Um, and obviously there's a positive market impact. You'll notice that um, that's also in your board packet. And there's always talk about the visual buffers and screening. We'll talk about that in a little bit more here in a second. So, with the site development process, we know it's in a flood zone X and there are a couple identified
wetlands in the property. Um, five in particular. Uh, there's already been an environmental assessment done by Atlantic Environmental, another firm here in Bvoulevard County. The two wetlands are to the west are basically non-ontiguous and and can be eradicated. The three that are somewhat in the dead
center of the property are very small. Uh, so we're looking at repositioning them with the wet ponds that you see from the original plan. I will say, let me go back and I'll show you that in a little bit more. So, uh, the two large green areas you see to the north and to the south, those are our pre-treatment
pre-treatment for storm water management. The plan is is that, uh, that water that's coming off the asphalt, actually the rain water comes off and goes into those pre-treatment areas for dry retention. We have a lot more vegetation than you see in this image. Um then the secondary goes to those two wet ponds you see on the north
and south just uh west of US1. That's a secondary uh treatment which will then treat that rainwater once more and then it'll fall into the FDOT rightway. There's a canal on the west side of US1 which will pick that up and take that from north and south.
Um I've already talked about I I'll talk for a few more minutes about the US1 improvements. I'll get to that. It was an excellent question asked about trucking and the uh airport. I already mentioned. Um so moving on to the city concerns um in the city uh community uh
discussions. There was a lot of great conversation um brought to heart a lot of important concepts about um whether this is right or not and whether that we can make amendments or changes or work within the site development process to basically make this life make this area
better. So that's the number one function and there is a water demand here of 250,000 gallons. Um, as the city of staff has already reported, uh, there is capacity to be able to handle that. There is some question from the community about whether water pressure could handle that. And again, I'll return that back to the staff here at
the city. They've already acknowledged to us that water pressure wouldn't be a problem. And and gallons per minute or gallons for the day wouldn't be a problem either. As far as power demand goes, I'll go back to the conversation about Florida Power and Light. Um, this is a pretty
sizable energy production uh for a power draw and so we don't want to put it on the Florida Power and Light service lines that feed the community and the other um areas around. We want it really to be a dedicated service. Now Florida Power and Light is presently going
through a study on how to provide that and they have three or four or five different options. It's not conclusive at the moment, but the idea the most the call it the biggest case idea is a new substation. They might actually decide to not even provide a substation and
provide a feeder that's direct for the service. If there is a substation provided, then we've identified in the concept plan that there's available space for it. So, we've accounted for that in the purchase of the property. There is it is a big demand and even at that case Florida Paranite one of their
options they're considering is providing a larger than required substation in order to back feed the Florida Paranite mainline that feeds the other properties so that they can provide duplicate reliability to the area of city of Titusville. So they may be seizing this opportunity and that discussion will go
all the way through the site development process. I'll stop right here. Did I answer your question adequately? Okay. All right. Thank you. Um, we've talked about environmental concerns. I think that one of the subjects we ought to discuss a little bit longer about the
engineering of this is how do you contain whatever you're using. Um, Mr. Palmer explained that the process happens inside the building, but inside the building, there's more that happens for containment. Inside the building, whenever there's a tank or storage, a
facility, there's a containment wall system that's built so that if there ever is a leak, we provide for more than the capacity that's demanded inside that storage in a containment within it. And then it's contained within the building. There is no case that any of that ever
gets to the storm water system. It doesn't go to the water system. It doesn't go to your sewer system. From a civil engineering perspective, we make absolutely sure all of that is contained. For the few areas where there is trucking that pulls up to make dispensary or withdrawal, we have
another containment plan for that that provides within that any spill or dribble or any sort of the thing gets caught within a sump and that sump is pumped right back into the plant. So they don't want to lose it. Uh they want to keep it. Um as Mr. Palmer says, it's
very expensive to make it. So they want don't want to dump it, right? So it gets processed back in, filtered and reused. Um, so I'll stop pause right there. Is any questions? I think you guys had a few questions of that. So, any questions I want to answer there?
No. Okay. There is also very big concern from the community about noise production. They're very concerned about um how much this plant is going to make for some noise. So, what we went ahead and did was we did a um an audible study
at the existing plant in Fort Pierce. Um this plant as we've designed it has the main plant uh which is where the major production of noise occurs is inside a building. So we measured that inside of the building to the footprint of US1.
It's about 500 ft on the north entrance. So we measured that at the existing plant in Fort Pierce and came up with about 45 dB outside the plant at 500 feet. 45 dB is a very small quantity. It's in your packet. what that sounds like.
That's like a quiet night. Currently along US1, you are way higher than that in the decibb. So just general car traffic will be much louder than the noise generated from the plant. There was also some concern about the rail and
that the train makes a pretty sizable noise. Um and with their vegetation that's currently on the site, we would be removing a lot of that vegetation. And uh with part of the tree preservation, we'll be putting back vegetation in all those areas I just showed on that master plan and around
the buffering. So we're going to exceed the buffering so that we can create some more visual and sound breakdown of that noise coming from the train. There was also a question about lighting. We'll plan uh in excess of the
development code that we'll have zero foot candles at the lot line. We'll have all of our lighting on the building pro uh produced to go down directly to where the area is needed. And we'll have the street lighting that's around the part around the lot where the truckers go um at probably something like 25 to 30 foot
at height and they'll be shielded so the light doesn't disperse beyond the property and you won't be able to see it from US1. The other big subject that was brought up and Mr. Pani brought it up too is about the traffic on US1. Um we've done
a study already. Um that study was conducted by uh LTG as a consultant that does a lot of traffic work for FDOT and they've come to the realization that there is no requirements based on the traffic movements demanded of the of the uh of the allied process system for any
improvements at all. However, we know that it we need to be good stewards of safety and as as you said about the truckers, we've got to make sure that the truckers have an easy way to get off of US1, not obstructing traffic. So, we we brought this up this concern from the
community and from Allied. We brought this up to FDOT and FDOT acknowledged that they would encourage uh left turn delanes on both the north and the south entrance. So that would be two places and two medians. They also acknowledged
that they would probably be wise to do a right turn del lane coming southbound on US1 as well. So we agree with all of that. Of course we were promoting it too because it's a good safe access. I will say that FDOT also brought up other
topics in such that um there is an a uh median cut directly north of the north entrance which they recognize causes a concern because of its proximity to this entrance that occurs and that uh that median cut only serves one street as
opposed to a birectional four-way street. They also noticed that the south median cut that's the south entrance is uh the opposite side is a is a business unit where Pinto's lounge is and another
couple commercial offices exist but those that entrance there does not align on on US1 with the entrance uh into the south entrance of this property. So FDOT recognizes there's an issue there. They
also recognize that the cars at that lot are parking inside the FDOT rightway and so they're a bit concerned about how that's not properly managed and they recognize that's on them for the US one. Um they have not recognized that there's
any hazardous conditions but they have recognized that there's a reason why there should be improvements made. So, we are already in conversation with them that making the deceleration lanes and making some median improvements that we'll probably be improving something all the way around US1 from top to
bottom on that east side of that site. I'll pause for a minute. Does that answer your question? >> Uh, yeah, that does answer my question. Um, as far as uh I'm trying to think here, the deceleration lanes and things like that.
Um >> yes I sorry I'm trying to think of something else but I'll come back. I appreciate it. >> No it's okay. >> Okay. >> Um so on on that note uh as while we're talking about transportation um about what are the projected excellent question se
>> on a daily basis. >> Thank you. I I I'll I'll lead with then thank you for your lead in because I want to hit that point too. So currently uh in the resoning um this traffic impact study the property has the ability to um under
its current zoning has the ability to actually have a maximum capacity of 53,000 daily trips. Part of this reszoning request is to get to an M2 which would drop it down to
4,540 daily trips. That's an important subject I think we should discuss here and make sure you understand that is a one 12th of the amount of capacity that's allowable by the zoning change. It's a
significant reduction. The current allied plan on this property would have no more than about 200 daily trips. That's a massive reduction. So yeah, >> the semi- trips or just trips? >> The semi-trips would be about 15 to 25 a
day. >> Yeah. So the rest of the trips would be the the employees coming to work and leaving work. Um the probably it's more I'm probably being very conservative when I say 200. It's it's probably more like 100. But that that assessment study
has um not been finalized. And that assessment study would apply into this conversation about FDOT. The FDUT has asked us to do an assessment study of not just those couple hundred trips, but what does that do for the those medians and those turn lanes and those deceleration lanes. So, that's a big
that's that's part of the site development process. We'd go through that. I think that's very important to recognize. Um, if if you don't approve of the zoning reclassification, you actually have the potential of having a much bigger traffic demand if somebody
else develops the property. the plan to develop this property be significantly less than permitted. >> And so one other quick thing because I'm not that clear on how it works. So if so your north entrance is the one that's
planned for the trucks. Is that correct? >> That's right. And so since currently that basically hits the corner of the property based on the materials that were provided to us, how does uh constructing a del lane for that
entrance work in that that seems like that would be in front of your neighbor's property? >> Are are you referring to the right turn southbound? >> Right turn southbound. >> Yeah, great question. So, um the we've actually had this conversation already
with the city uh staff. Um the city staff um did not recommend a right turn deceleration lane u because it's very close to that property. That property is very much close to that northern entrance. The corner line gets really close. Um but the FDOT actually said the
opposite. Uh so there's still conversation that needs to be had whether that's going to be permittable or not. The FDOT actually promoted it. uh they'd rather see the deceleration lane for trucker movements for for you know for the same reason of safety and they recognize that that deceleration
occurs in the FDOT right away. It doesn't incur into um the property owner's property. I would say um there's more conversation needs to be had with that and that would be flustered out flush excuse me flushed
out in the site development process. So when we do SDP I have a quick question. Um, also as far as the uh trips per day, uh, I see that y'all used an IT code, I believe, of 150 and our staff used an IT code of 140, a
difference of 41 trips a day, um, not accounted for on y'all's part. Is that >> So, the difference between the 150 and the 140, maybe that's something that, um, Eddie can explain a little bit. um that would be for the traffic engineer,
but my understanding is that's because there was no concept plan tied to it. And so that's using a different use warehousing versus what the actual use, the proposed use is, right? So now with the concept plan being somewhat submitted, I guess uh would the 150
apply to that traffic? Would that need to be re just calculated or >> Right. That would have to be re-evaluated. >> Okay. >> Right. Agreed. So, so Eddie, on that on that question, um I' I've been waiting, you know, um
>> this application and their proposal are not aligning. Um I think that's a problem, you know. So they, you know, right now their question was only annexation and resoning and and all that good stuff. But now they're
they're presenting a complete um proposal, if you will, or whatever, but it doesn't align with the application. Uh, and so is that a problem? >> I wouldn't say that it doesn't align with the proposal. It's still requesting the same annexation, future land use, and resoning. The difference is that now
that the concept plan that they had shown but didn't really uh commit themselves to, it sounds like tonight they're willing to uh allow themselves to be bound to it. And PNZ has the right to recommend approval of this these three um requests with the condition
that it be have the binding concept plan. And so if you were interested in that, you could make that recommendation to city council. >> But shouldn't it also accompany the CUP as well at this point since it is M2? So the cup is a different issue altogether. So that's about the use and whether that's permitted under the the zoning
district. So that comes later. >> Comes later. Okay. >> Okay. Um the last two items of our presentation, um I think there was some conversation. It it should be in your packet. If you didn't I didn't follow the page numbering as we were talking through, but this should be the image
that you're looking at. Um the M2 designation that exists today is west of the property as well as south of the property and then a number of properties north of it um northwest. So it is like an L-shape around the
area. And then I'll I'll close with this. Um you know we are um citizens of Titusville. We are citizens of Bvoulevard County. Uh we are looking forward to doing a nice wonderful project that helps provide clean
drinking water to everyone in Bvoulevard County. Um we we're we're more than dedicated to the fact that we don't want anything to go wrong. So we'd like to be completely transparent and honest. We like to have an open conversation. If there's any concern whatsoever, we'd love to hear it. Uh we'd like to try and
find ways to mitigate it and come up with an answer. Um we've done this before. We've dealt this plant already tw a couple times, so we know uh what needs to be done and do it right. Uh but if there's anything that's of a concern, we're willing to hear about about it and
we'll try and find ways to resolve it as well. >> Thank you. >> So, was there anything unique about this site? Why why this site? Because it it does seem that there's >> Great question.
>> Something >> I'm sorry I didn't say that. It may not be. I >> Yeah, I'm sorry you didn't say that. So, several things are unique. First, um the the plant is intending to use rail for the for the transport of much of its
product. Um that's an important subject. Um so, the site needs to abut to a rail system. That's the FC naturally. Secondly, uh it needs to abut to a Florida power and light um area that can be served relatively simply. In other
words, in this general vicinity, it wouldn't be like we're producing a new power plant. It's about tying off of a power system. So, create a new substation or maybe bring a new feeder line in something like that where Florida Paranite can provide service. So, this is unique and that it has FEC
railroad on the west side and a Florida paranalite transmission line on the east side. The other factors are is that um it the the plant would have to be somewhere close to a port. Um this salt is brought in from outside uh the country. It's got to be dropped
somewhere. So um naturally that's why there's one in Palmetto which is the Ant2 plant. It's right next to the Manatee plant. That's why there's one in Fort Pierce. It's right near near that Fort Pierce port. And so this is where it makes sense. the Port Canaveral is uh within a driving distance of being able
to get to the salt delivery. Those are some very important subjects. There's four or five more including in that in you know of things like just having the general vicinity of uh size of space and uh and and and and having the um uh
location be other is somewhere else in the state of Florida other than the two locations which they already exist. So there's a lot of great reasons for all that. Thank you. Um, city attorney is where are we on the I I I'd asked the
applicant earlier whether they the understanding that they had to go back through the CUP process. Um is is that where we are and we need to make that clear to the applicant and hear that the applicant is that is their understanding
as well or >> I would refer to Eddie on that. Uh as far as uh staff's position >> So it sounds like um you'd like the applicant to agree that they are required to get a CUP.
>> I I'd like to. Yeah, I think I'd like to hear that they they understand the process that the approval tonight doesn't necessarily or does not mean that the bleach plant is approved and that that's because that's I think the
understanding we're under based off of what what you've said from a staff perspective. So, um I if that's not where we're at, I think we need to know as a board um whether there's a c
another step in the process before this gets approved or whether it what we're voting on tonight potentially pushes it to that through the approval. >> So, I'll say a couple things. Um one, I'll reiterate that tonight is not a final decision, right? So tonight is a
recommendation to city council and city council gets to make that final decision on the zoning for this property. Um two um the inherent in the process what we're discussing here is zoning which is the land development rights on a
property. Um, with anything that comes through through u the planning and zoning board and city council with changes to zoning, there's always the the next steps in the administrative processes of the city, which is the site plan, the building permit, the next stages of development. So, when we say approved, that can mean different things
to different people. Approved for development, approved as far as the zoning on the property. And so I want to be clear that when we say that the we're reviewing and approving the zoning um that doesn't mean that that this this development can be built, right? Um if the zoning is approved, that means this
use is permitted either by right or with a conditional use permit um to move forward in the in the development process, but that still has to happen. There's a site plan. They have to meet all the code, parking, storm water, all the land development regulations, and then it has to meet the building department regulations, the state of
Florida's building code, um in order to go vertical. So there's site construction that needs to be planned and approved and there's also vertical construction that needs to be planned and approved after our process which is the planning level. Um as far as a conditional use permit, I tried to
explain earlier that that is um when when an applicant provides a request for a specific use, our staff reviews that against the code and we have a matrix that shows which uses are permitted in which zoning districts. And there's several letters. There's P for permitted, which means you're permitted
by right. You can get your your application to uh move forward in the process by right. There's L, limited, which means there's certain limitations. If you can prove that you meet those limitations, you can move forward. And there's C, conditional use permit, which means it has to go through the public hearing process, planning and zoning,
and city council. the heavy industrial use. Um, I can tell you that there's a zoning verification letter that was provided to the applicant that said that heavy industrial uses uh require a conditional use permit in the M2 zoning district.
>> Member Chman. >> Um, so Eddie, with all that being said, per our flu, right, our flu um policy 1.8 8 it says to evaluate the resoning based on proposed use and its impacts.
So yes, we are going off of the zoning and everything, but now we have to base us off of the planned use because that was what was given. Correct. Our staff report is reflective of not having the binding concept plan because it was not provided as part of the application at
that point. Um tonight the applicant has stated that they're willing to in uh to be bound by that and so if you're interested you can include that as part of your recommendation to council to approve it with that concept plan. >> Okay. Thank you. Now, >> um I will add
>> I'm sorry. So, two more things. Uh, one, the applicant has not spoken about the concept plan as far as it being binding. I think they had a few comments they wanted to address with you all on that point, too. So, you may want to invite them back up to speak. And also, um, staff did not and and you all did not
receive the concept plan with a lot of time to review it as well. So just keep that in mind that another option is to request additional time to review it to see if that's something that you're interested even in uh including in this application >> or let me ask it another way and there other circumstances where the concept
plan have been submitted with the application. >> Generally when applicants have a concept plan that they would like to be considered as part of their application is provided at the beginning of the uh during the initial submitt. Correct. Uh, member FA. >> Yeah. So, that's kind of what I was
getting to last time, right? Is that if they wanted to do it this way, then it should have been presented as such. Um, I I don't like having to come here now and saying, "Okay, this is what we're presenting." Um, they've had plenty of
time to get that to you beforehand and get this updated. Um, we've had this happen before where people come before the board and at the last minute want to say, "Well, this is our our concept plan or this is what we want to do." And we've always denied that. Had them go back or resubmit and then and then come
back here. And and and um I don't see why we would do something different this time. And I don't know, I don't know about you guys, but we've seen that before, right? where somebody comes up here and then they submit a their their final proposal or or their concept plan, but yet they didn't do it beforehand and
we've said go back do it the right way. Um, so that's that's that that was my question to you and I think that's kind of where we are now that they've they've come to the board now and they've presented a a great plan. I I like the plan, but it wasn't done properly. And
so, it needs to be vetted the proper way to give you guys the the heads up of what their intentions are and not just drop it in our in our in our laps the day of. So, um I don't I don't know, you know, I don't know, attorney if we can I
you know, first of all, how do you guys feel about that? Um chamber members, >> uh member Troutman, your lights on. you want to go? >> I want to piggy back off of Mr. Face on here is uh with that being said because
we don't have that concept plan technically um minus what they've said to us. I know that, you know, in our LDR, you know, it states that for uh industrial use, you know, but any residential FLU, a 50-
foot type D buffer, there's there's things like that that I don't know is being addressed on this concept plan. So, I know that those are things that uh for this possible type of business, a 50 foot type debuffer would a minimum sixoot high burn shall be provided,
things like that. Um, so yeah, I think without some of that being in there as well to see if they're meeting our codes for that because that's what they said. I feel the same way as well that we need to get all these ducks in a row. And again, I I'll I'll say that that I'm I'm
basing my my stances on page 16, paragraph 3, and to the extent to which adequate infrastructure to accommodate the proposed amendment exist or is programmed and funded through adopted capital improvement. And again, it's to the extent to which the adequate infrastructure to accommodate the
proposed amendment. And what they presented today is not the proposed amendment. They've gave a a completely different presentation to what was proposed. And that's that's that's my that's that's my right for today.
>> Yeah. It's where I was going next. if the applicant wants to speak and then um >> uh good evening um chairman, members of the planning and zoning board. My name is Kim Rosena with the law firm of Lacy Rosena. I'm here on behalf of Allied
Technologies. Allied Technologies is the contract purchaser. Um STG Properties uh Appliance Direct still owns the property. So, our use hasn't changed. Our application says heavy manufacturing plant. Everything in the three
applications says heavy manufacturing. And if you look at your code, heavy manufacturing is using raw products to make something. And that's exactly what this is. I have been trying to get a definite opinion from the city since March as to whether we need a conditional use permit. I don't believe
we need one, but I also believe most of what you're concerned about are site plan issues. And this is not a site plan. This is a zoning annexation and future land use. And so what we've asked for is a heavy manufacturing use. We haven't ever changed our application. We're just now giving you more details.
We've always said to everyone, it's a bleach plant. They know it was a bleach plant at the preapp last year. So this is nothing new to staff. And so what they wanted was a concept plan. I was concerned as an attorney because your code is so vague what that means when we have to come back. If we move the
Florida Power and Light plant 20 feet, my reading is we have to come back to the whole process because we're now making more than a minor change. So, that was my concern. They've now committed to the concept plan. Uh I don't know that you really have it because you weren't given the power P
plan uh PowerPoint, I don't think. Maybe you were, but that's what you've seen. If there was one in the community meeting report, which I know you just got yesterday as well. Uh but there has been a lot of controversy about this. This has been in the news. There's been Facebook pages. There's been talk of the
town. So, people are very concerned about this. We have told you it's a bleach plant. They have committed to a bleach plant. I don't believe we've changed our application one bit. They've just given you more information. Zoning law, you don't have to tell them exactly what you're using. I could come here and
ask for heavy manufacturing and never tell you what it is. You wouldn't be happy with that. And they're very transparent. They want you to know what they're doing. This is a bleach plant. is a heavy industrial manufacturing plant, not a heavy industrial use. So, I'm not willing to commit that we have
to go back to the CUP process. And the things that you're concerned about, the buffering and setbacks, those are site plan issues that your staff will review. If we have to come back for a CUP, they will. But we have been told by staff, we won't know that until we go through the site plan process, which we can't start until we get annexed in, get the future
land use and zoning. So, if we have to come back, we will. Otherwise, we'll meet all your land development codes as required and your staff will ensure that they're working on the landscape plan. They're working on the tree preservation plan. They want to be good neighbors. Um, they don't want anyone to be afraid. They don't want anyone to be scared.
They're willing to make all these improvements that they're going to have to pay for with FDOT to make it safer. So, with that, uh, I I had more to say, but that's basically the only reason we're here is because they want to make Clorox and they want to make water for the water supply.
Um, with that, this is the an industrial use. There's industrial uses all around it. It doesn't have to be exactly M2 to be compatible. That's why your staff report says there's other industrial use. It can be considered compatible. It's up to you all to decide if industrial use next
to industrial use is compatible and whether or not you recommend approval or denial. So, if you want to send us back to the process, which I've never heard of before because your land development code actually anticipates us showing this and committing at a public hearing.
So, we're willing to do that against my recommendation, in fact, but they're willing to do that to move forward. Um, they've been under contract for a long time. This has been a very long process and and they want to move forward. If you're going to make them go back and come back or table it, that's your choice. But they're ready to move
forward. And if we have to come back for conditional use permit, we will. >> Thank you. >> So, if you want to table it for us to come back next month, that's your prerogative and we'll do that and we'll we'll do whatever you ask us to do. >> I I appreciate that. Um, I I'll, you
know, I I just want to make sure that all all the members of the board have an understanding of what's going on and and and what we're voting on tonight and the implications of that. And then, um, either way, these people have shown up
to speak. So, um, I think next order businesses will let him speak under the understanding that this could get tabled tonight. So, keep that in mind. But um our first card lord >> Janine rising. >> Good evening.
My name is Janine Rising. I live in the Bellwood neighborhood uh in Titusville. My house is just a few houses from the US one and just less than a half a mile from this plant. Um, I lived there for over 10 years. The meeting I attended
earlier this month with Allied and its lawyers proposed that there would be semi-truckss coming and going all day and night. There would be trucking salt and trucking out product as well as waste. Of course, now they're saying they were not going to truck the waste out. They're just going to dump it or something. I don't know something about storing water. I'm like, "Oh, that's not
what they told us." I have seen traffic on US1 go from light to maddening frenzy. Uh, it's just busy all day and all night. It's crazy. The accidents on this road have really risen bad. Uh, I was told by FHP that the specific
records of the accidents were always reported to the county commissioners. So, I'm hoping that you guys will have information to that because they they wouldn't give anything to me. Across from the street from this proposed plant is a daycare. I mean, directly across is a daycare. Um, a county campground,
Bvard County Campground. I used to work there and three 55 plus mobile home parks. Uh as well as all the single family homes like mine. Traffic and accidents are my top concern. Uh but I also have concerns about the noise
coming from this facility as well as the FPL substation. They intend to run the plant of course 24 hours a day and they did say that they would be using bulldozers and trucks in their back in the back. I think this heavy manufacturing zone facility should be in a much more industrial rural area. They
did suggest other places like Georgia. I don't know, but this is way too this is just way too uh uh in urban for this. So, thank you. >> Thank you. Next card, >> Stephen Cyper.
Um, >> s i p e r or s u p e r. >> Uh, looks like they may have left. Next card, >> Daniel. C i e s i e l s. >> Thank you.
>> I won't need a microphone. I was in the Navy for 26 years active duty and four years reserved for a total of 30 years. >> The people besides that location, location, location. This ain't the location. I'm I'm Y'all need to really consider this.
This is not the location. Everything east of that plant is residential except for the Pintos Bar, the nursery. There's a bus stop directly across the street from where they want to build
this thing. It's a terrible location. We're a residential neighborhood right across the street. Do you want this in your backyard? I don't think you do. Uh the water, what's it going to do to our
water pressure down there? That is already questionable. Also, city of Titusville water has issues. Now, that might correct some of the issues because they have to go down there and they have to vent the water down at our end of the neighborhood every month to make sure that we pass
the water that there's enough chlorine or whatever in it. I don't know what they're doing, but there are issues. Uh there's a jillion things why this thing shouldn't be there. Yes,
there's M2 there. The power plant, the other little M2 they're talking about is nothing more than a warehouse. >> The the trade free zone warehouse, there's no industrial stuff there. It's a warehouse and almost no trucks come
and go there. It's a business that doesn't really exist. Next to that, you have the uh you got the appliance direct and they still are operating. I was in there a week ago. Maybe they're closed since last week, but they're still operating.
And then you have a little uh a small industrial plant there. Light industrial. There's a difference between a light industrial and heavy industrial. And this is a heavy industrial plant. We don't need heavy industrial right across the street from residential neighborhoods. I mean, it's like a
no-brainer. I don't even know why why it's even be discussed. I mean, this is ridiculous. Uh, I know everybody else has got some stuff to talk about. When they did the uh the first presentation, it's kind of I got
one one final thing here. The meeting that they first had was supposed to take place in Port St. John Library >> Community Center. >> Community center. They changed the time and location to another place we went to
Ramadi and whatever. And then the zoning signs were placed at the property as they should have been. That meeting was cancelled. Those signs were never removed. So those signs stayed in place and they
put the new signs exactly where the old signs were. So nobody had a clue that were that something new was happening. It's like slick sham sham, you know, nobody knew that something new was happening.
>> All right. Do you >> this meeting? Okay. I'm sorry. I'll I'll concede you. >> Next card, Lori, please. >> Gary Hodgej. >> First of all, I'd like to say thank you
for the time. Um, I have a great big old speech I was going to prepare to tell you all, but I guess time. >> One moment. Your name and your address, please. >> Gary Hodge. >> Yes. As >> 20 South US Highway One. >> Thank you. I am 0.0.1
miles from north of the plant on the same side of where this proposed plant is taking place. Um 528 ft from the ent north the north entrance where all the trucks and stuff would be going in. I've this property
has been in my family for over 80 years. I've lived there for 44 years. seen a lot of changes, a lot of growth, good, some bad. I think this is a bad idea. I don't want to stop companies from
growing, but I don't want it in my backyard. It's too much at risk. I live there. I need these other people to live across the street. Like she said, there was a daycare from 6 weeks old to four year olds
and plus businesses coming in and out. Um there's too much at stake here and uh I would none of y'all would want to live there, would want to raise your
family there, be exposed to that. There's been many. In 1978, there was a chlorine leak. There was eight people that died here in
the state of Florida. There's 88 people that were injured and there was only 3,500 people that had to evacuate. That's another thing consideration. We're we're older people. How are we going we going to keep a bag packed and have to evacuate at the sound of a
sirene? where we gonna go, who's gonna pick up expense? None of us all move so fast anymore, you know? I mean, uh they nobody can guarantee 100% that that there's nothing going to happen,
you know? Just it just shows in the state in the United States between 2001 and 2011 there was 14 people died from on the job chlorine exposure. Um
the the quote from the Florida.gov gov says chemical spills canur occur in the blink of a few of an eye transforming an an ordinary day into a potential emergency in Florida. The risk is real
and unpredictable. In 2025 in Hope Sound there was a chemical spill, chlorine chemical spill. 2025 there was one in Port Orange 2025
Boca Raton 2023 Zephr Hills 2014 Cocoa Beach 11,000 gallons of liquor chlorine spilled so I encourage you all to please think about it and
vote no. Thank you. >> Thank you. James Hodgej. >> My name is James Hodgej. I live at 7320 South US1, just north of my parents. Um, I stand before you today as a citizen of Tisville, and as a concerned resident in
close proximity of the alleged building of a bleach manufacturing facility. I'm not sure if what I say today is going to fall on deaf ears, but I've got to try my best to make my voice heard. I could have easily written a several page essay on why we don't need this reszoning and
a bleach manufacturing facility built. I wasn't sure how much time I was going to be allowed, so I'll do my best to discuss my main concerns. Number one, please research the process on how bleach is made and the dangers associated with making it. The industrial process used to make bleach
produce explosive gases and the overall process is very hazardous. Living next to a bleach manufacturing facility can be very dangerous due to the risk of chlorine gas exposure which is a toxic chemical used in bleach production and can cause severe respiratory issues.
Lung damage or even death from accidental release or leaks. Facilities that store bolt chlorine gas pose a significant risk to nearby communities. I mean, they can say everything they want, but not everything that glitters is gold. So, number two, I have lived
next to this proposed site my whole life, 44 years. There are all sorts of wildlife that makes their home on these 25 acres. Animals ranging from deer, hogs, turkeys, bobcats, coyotes, and foxes. Birds of various types from scrub jays, blue jays, mocking birds, doves,
hawks, eagles, and owls. In fact, last night, right before dark, you could hear the owls calling back and forth. It sounded beautiful. There are also a dozen gopher tortoises living there. So, ally they they had their their I have pictures from the turtles. They were
wrong with their survey. Okay. There's over a dozen gopher tortoises living there. The gopher tortoise is a keystone species because it digs burrows that provide shelter for at least 360 other animal species. It is threatened by predation and habitat destruction. That
is the problem we are facing here today. You want to reszone so 25 acres can be cleared to build the new facility. And I'm sure 25 acres is just the start of what will be cleared for future businesses. Where will the animals go? What will happen when you destroy their
homes and they have no place to live? Titus's motto is gateway to nature and space. What are you going to do when all the animals in their habitat is gone due to all the development? Because some only see the money that will be made and not the long-term effects. Once all
Florida and its native is gone, you will never get it back. So, please vote no on resoning. Please save some of the last little bit of natural Florida we still have around here. Something this city and state are losing every day. And please vote no because the thought of making money seems more important than
the environment and the human lives of the community you're going to put at risk. Thank you. >> Next card, >> Frank Rob. Macy Mullen. >> Good evening and thank you for your time. My Mullen. Uh, you need our
address? >> Yes, please. >> All right. 125 Bonita Street, Titusville. Sorry, nervous. Okay, so they mentioned about Oh, it's going to start out. So, I'm going to be living across the street from this and
um I am currently a chemist at NASA and so I had a lot of technical questions during the first meeting, one of which was about the EPA reports. So, you asked about the TRI report, the toxic release inventory and Firefax report from EPA
for release of chemicals to the environment. So, they're um it's question nine. It's kind of um they don't answer it very well. They actually didn't answer my question at all. They asked if like they I guess they thought I was asking if there was a potential and that's not what I was asking. There
isn't a potential because they already have released chlorine gas at all three of the plants now that I've learned. Um four happened at the Manatee plant the past four years through a stack and fugitive fumes. one at Fort Pierce and I
had the report for the one down in Miami, but I um threw it away because I didn't think they were manufacturing the bleach by the electrolysis um method, but today he just said they were. So, I wish I have kept that. I have um the
link to the TI report, TRI reports here. I'll um submit that so you can find them. They're kind of hard to find. I also have the Fort Pierce one here. The manatee um for the past four years they've been um releasing between um 5 4
9 and four pounds of chlorine gas to the atmosphere. They have been very evasive and not straightforward about answering that question, which is disconcerting. Um they in the report in the report that
they sent to us, I'm not even sure if you guys have even seen it, they said that we were concerned about this plant being close to a residential neighborhood, and that's true. We very much are. This is the closest they will have ever built to pre-existing homes, which they would not tell us about in that meeting. Um the closest that they
will be to a home is 625 ft. That's um the closest one. There's even more homes further away, a child care center, a retirement community. their Fort Pierce facility is8 miles away from homes in that vicinity. And um yeah, so 08 miles
is much further away than 625 ft. In the thing I'm submitting, there's a scale here. I did my best to overlay a Google image with their proposed plan. Um they they recorded that we were concerned about our property values and
did not give a very good like rebuttal to it. I guess they intentionally left out um in their report that the homes were built after their facility was there. At least those people have the choice if they live by a bleach plant or not. We will not. Could I have one more
minute? >> Sure. >> I make a motion and Yeah. >> Thank you. >> Go ahead. >> I'm almost done. Yeah. So these people had the choice to live by a bleach plant. We do not. They are 08 miles away. Our closest home will be 0.1 miles away.
Um can skip that. Okay. So to you all, this is just another project you see in the course of a growing city. And to the company, this is an opportunity to make an even bigger profit on what I'm assuming is an already very lucrative company. To us, the people of the area,
this is our life. This is where we come home from work, raise our families, and retire. So, please vote no on this. >> Next card, >> Brian Blackmore. >> Good evening. Uh, I'm Ryan Blackmore. I've been here for about uh six years.
live at 350 Birch Street in Titusville. Um, I really like this little town. It's uh, small. It's got pretty much everything we need. And, um, this bleach plant, they may be a good facil, they may be a good company. I'm not here to dist dispute that, but we don't need a
bleach plant here. We are uh, basing our our uh, existence here on nature, technology, and recreation. We don't need a bleach chemical plant here. Um, if you I was in the Navy and I spent 18 years in quality assurance and safety
devices fail. Safety devices fail. They're not designed that way. They just will. That's why you inspect them. When a bleach safety device fails, you have seconds. Okay? So, if the bleach leaked in this room, we would all die. There
would not be enough chance for you to get out of here. Bleach fumes spread quickly. There also an estimated four mile radius north, south, and west that if a deadly explosion or something like that happened, you got a four mile
radius. And a lot of old people that have breathing problems, they're dead. And you really want to approve something like that knowing that that kind of uh injuries could happen to senior citizens who choose to retire here. We want to retire here. We want to fish. We want to
swim. We want a boat. We want a barbecue. We want to do the little things for our grandkids. I don't want to be scared of a bleach plant potentially exploding. And why can't they expand the plants that they've got?
Okay. And um to force everybody to do to live around there. You're looking at the devaluation of a lot of properties. What is there a couple thousand properties there? Nobody wants to live there. What are those people going to do with those properties? They're not worth anything.
You need to seriously consider I I encourage the like Delta um Northrup Grumman, Loheed Martin. That kind of business is what we need here. We don't really need a chemical company and they may be a very good company. I'm not saying that they're trash. However, they
can be a very good company somewhere else. Georgia, somebody brought up. They can be a good company expanding their businesses where they already exist, but they don't need to be a com a big company here. A lot of people when you go out to restaurants and stuff, a lot
of people like the small atmosphere of Titusville, the restaurants, the places where you can gather and shoot the breeze with people, yard sales, estate sales, and things like that. They like that kind of lifestyle here. But you bring a chemical plant here, believe me, you're going to start evacuating people, and I'm going to be one of them. I'll
move north. >> I'll move north. Seriously, um there's a lot of things we can do here. We can attract technology. We can attract boat building. Um but we don't need this. Thank you for your time.
>> Daniel Ward. >> Hi, good evening. My name is Daniel Ward, 120 Secluded Way in Titusville. I live uh directly across from this proposed plant. Um some very good intelligent questions uh from the council tonight. So I was impressed to
see that. Um I served four years the city of Sanford as a firefighter, so I'm very familiar with dangerous stretches of road and uh that stretch of Route One is very dangerous. It's concerning to me that uh there's going to be up to 25
semis a day filled with liquid and I'm familiar with driving an engine with water in it. I understand the complexities of that. Uh that's one concern. Uh there are no uh this is asking to reszone this property to a
heavier industrial use which it never was originally zoned for. So, I would encourage the city to go back to look at the original decision tree as to why this was not zoned uh in that way. Also, this is going to
consume a very large percentage of Titusville's available water, which may throttle future development for the city. Um, that was one of the concerns that I uh that I think is uh valid. Um,
and there's a lot of opportunities to use this property for things other than a a a bleach production facility. It can be part of a uh a larger community development. It's it was it's also zoned
um uh for general retail and commercial. And this might tie in with the development that's going on by the police hall of fame, uh, which is going to become like the the new and improved Vieiraa. So, I don't think that, uh, shoehorning a bleach manufacturing
facility really fits in with with the current development that's occurring in in the city. Um, so those are basically my concerns. Uh, I I don't think that it's the Well, one other thing, too. They're
going to be moving 200,000 gallons of bleach a day. That's not an insignificant number that's going to be shipped out from that plant day in and day out. So there obviously there is the opportunity for an accident. And I will say as a firefighter that when you have
an accident or an emergency at a chemical processing facility, I think that that was your your point that you made. It usually requires the response of a hazmat team. it has to be a specially trained team. So that may put additional requirements upon the uh the
city of Titusville or the county uh to to ensure that they have the coverage necessary for a hazmat response if it ever became necessary. Thank you. >> Thank you, >> Tony Shifflo. Good evening, Shuffalo. The uh historic
Norwood House, Tropic Street. This isn't in my backyard. It's not even in my neighborhood. However, I found um that I couldn't be here and not speak about how convenient it was that at the very last the language was changed um so that we
didn't have a chance to see it and study it. Um, and it was changed to and to allow heavier heavy materials, raw materials, unique materials, vague language to allow a
chemical plant to be the use of the M2 that they're talking about. I thought it was very deceitful of staff to say, "Oh, we don't have any idea. This is just about changing the zoning. This is just about changing the flu.
We have no idea. It could be a bleach factory. It could be something worse was the implication. Optics. I want to speak about optics and remind you about the concrete crushing plant that was brought before everyone
and staff told us you don't really have any choice to deny the change of the zoning and the flu. You have to let that happen. Even though the community came time after time and sat in this room
saying how detrimental it would be to the health and to the environment and I think it's detrimental to the optics, the entrance to the spaceport where we're going to be launching horizontal um takeoffs and landings into
space. That's what the space ports are for. You know, I think there's several of them around the country and and Tiko is one of them. Um and and you're driving in to go into outer space and you got to mask yourself because of a
concrete crushing factory and and down the road is this noxious chemical plant. I just think that we need to be more careful about what we allow, what businesses, what growth we want. I think
the gentleman that stood up and said technical, aeronautical, spaceoriented, we're going to get the starship and my historic um preservation heart trembles at the destruction that's going to
bring, but it's going to bring us really into the future. And I think we need to think about the optics of the kinds of businesses that we bring into our town. So, thank you very much for your depth and your questions. Thank you,
>> Michael Mek. Good evening, Michael, Alpine Lane. Um there's a couple of points that I wanted to raise. Um having been on the environmental
commission now for over 13 years. Um I tend to look at these things with a little bit of skepticism. Um this is kind of like playing the game of mind sweeper. If you've ever played that on a PC, you've got a blank board and you click a spot and maybe you hit an
empty thing and it all opens up. But then the next time you know, you hit a mine and boom, these folks are asking you to approve something and you don't know what it is. It's just that simple. Is it a mine
or is it an empty spot? We don't know. We won't know until there's a full accounting. That hasn't happened. So that's that's number one. Number two, they're asking you to annex this land.
That makes it like a gold rush. It can be anything. Can be anything they ask for cuz it's not part of our current comp plan. So, you can simply deny the reason the annexation
and then you don't have to worry about the zoning and the land use change because you haven't annexed it. So that's number one. Two, sorry, I forgot number one. Number three, I I just did some back of the envelope
calculations on 250,000 gallons per day. 4 million a day is what the city uses. Do you realize that's 5 a.5%. And that's if we're only using four million a day. If we're using four and a
half, then it's 6 and a4% of our city's daily water supply. Where does our city's daily water supply come from? Do you know?
Wellfield 2, Wellfield 3. Want to try four? 65% of our water comes from Wellfield 4. And last year we paid $1.2 $2 million for that privilege.
Now, my back of the envelope sketch, 5.5%. That comes out to $66,000 a year for their 250,000 gallons a day of water. Now, that's our cost, not theirs. Ours.
That's not factored into this. So, that's a resource, a portable water resource. that we're expuning. And last, and I'm going to need an extra minute, I want to talk about the 20.3 acres
and the lack of their finding of gopher tortoises. May I have one more minute, please? >> Yes. >> Now, 25 years ago, I got to meet the great late Ray Ashton, who started the whole gopher tortoise relocation program.
And Ry told me when he came down here to survey what we now have as Brookshshire, 83 acres, the average was three gopher tortoises per acre. This land is in the same Zurich Atlantic
coastal scrub habitat that Brookshshire was. So three gopher tortoises per acre. There's 20.3 acres. That's 60 gophers. They found none. Something's Something's wrong.
Something's not right. And I think you should deny it. Just simply deny the annexation. We'll deal with the later when they come back. Thank you. That's all I have to say. All right. That was the last card. Um applicant has an opportunity for
rebuttal or >> thank you board for the privilege of rebuting some of the comments that were made. Um first of all the 250,000 gallons of water a day will be at full capacity which we're talking about eight
or nine years from now uh more than likely. Yeah, please. >> Um, so I'm sure that the city will continue to grow and uh continue to uh increase in in the water. Uh, the
product that we're making is 90% water. It's only 10% active material. The other comment that was made about uh the um toxic release information or the R form
in the state, we're talking about four or five pounds per year, which is a very small amount of material if you look on a per day basis. And all that was contained inside the buildings.
It never got out to outside of the buildings and certainly never got off the property site. So, and and I understand anytime there's change, people don't like change and I fully understand that. But there's a lot
of benefits to this plant being here. And there's also comments, why don't we just expand our other plants? They're already expanded as large as we can make them. We need another plan. As far as moving to Georgia or Alabama, there's
not any people there. They don't need our product. Florida needs our product. And if Florida wants to continue to grow, they're going to need even more of our product. Thank you. >> Um,
one one question before before you go, and there may be others, I don't know. Um on the on the comment about the uh closest residential um in your other facilities, um what is the accurate answer on the closest
residential or home site? Uh in your other >> in our Fort Pierce facility, our our facility is right along Rangeline Road. literally across the road. They're building a development now that are 6 to
700,000 homes and they're planning on 1,500 of them. There's also a new road that has been dedicated right across from us as well. So, they're going to continue to grow. There's they're building an elementary
school that's probably less than a mile across from our facility. We have a very good safety record. If we didn't have that, the the city of Port St. Lucy certainly wouldn't let a development be
built that way. >> Thank you. Um, member Seedler. >> Thank you. I just want to get a clarification here. We keep throwing around 250,000 gallons of water and that came from staff. Um, and I'm looking at
your community meeting report. You have in here the plant is expected to use approximately 275,000 gallons of water a day at full production. So that's an additional $25,000 gallons a day. >> It it's $250,000.
>> Okay. This is just in your report though. Okay. Thank you. >> Member FA. >> So when speaking of safety >> and if gases should escape. Okay. So there's a a common phrase of um dilution is the solution. So as as that gas as
those gases dissipate from your facility, >> how far would it have to travel be before it becomes inert? >> Okay, very good question. But first, let's go back a little bit here and talk a little bit about chemistry because I think a lot of people are mixing
chlorine gas. We heard about all the oxidants from 10 years, 20 years last year, etc. and sodium hyperchloride or bleach. They're two different products. The chlorine gas is an extremely hazardous product. And
yes, if I came in here with 150 pound chlorine cylinder and I let it off and lock the doors, we'd all be in big trouble. If I came in here with 150 gallons of bleach and poured it on the on the ground here, we'd have a a little bit of an issue, but we wouldn't die.
>> Okay. >> Okay. So, that's the first thing. The second thing is the plant only has between 70 and 90 pounds of chlorine gas inside a building inside piping. Okay, let's assume that it all got out and it
wouldn't. But let's assume we're talking less than a quarter of a mile and and you wouldn't be able to even smell the chlorine. >> Okay, so because so my my question, right? So let's let's address the worst case scenario hazard that the residents
that are so close that they may experience if the worst thing happens the the worst catastrophe. How would they feel? What what is the the most drastic danger that your plant poses to them? >> They would be told to shelter in place,
which is basically stay in the building that they're in and turn off any air conditioning or anything that would pull any air in. and they might have a smell of chlorine. >> Okay. So, because in addition to that, we have the child care as well as a
place that serves food not too far from you. So, not only is it Pintos, but also the VFW that's right there as well. I'm sorry, the American Legion. >> But at the end of the day, the plant isn't right on US1. It's got a good setback
500 ft. Mhm. >> So you have 500 ft plus US1 plus whatever is on the other side. So let's say 6 or 700 ft. So >> so so my >> please control please. >> So again I ask these questions again
because they're they're here they brought these concerns up right and again I I I get the traveling but unfortunately gases and air travels as the crow flies. All right. And so then that distance becomes a lot shorter. Would you not agree? Excuse me. I don't
>> That distance becomes a lot shorter as the crow flies from your facility, say across the street or in a direct line to these these areas or as the wind blows. So, whichever direction the wind is blowing, it's going to blow in that direction. >> If it if it's blowing in that direction,
yes, I mean, that would be it certainly would be better if it was blowing the other way around. But remember, it has to get out of the pipe. It has to get out of the building. It has to get out of the scrubber system. has to get across all that area and then it has to
affect somebody, >> right? >> And at the end of the day, you may be able to smell it and you can smell chlorine gas at one or two parts per million. >> Okay. >> Okay. But it's not going to hurt you.
>> Okay. All right. Thank you so much. >> I don't see any more lights. I do have a question for staff though, but on the uh comment that this is a more intense zoning, could this project as as the
concept plan was presented be built in with the county's um current zoning. >> We have the list of uses that are permitted in both the county zoning and the city zoning on page 13. Um I I can't
speak for the county as far as what their use interpretations would be and maybe the applicant spoke with the county and may know whether that uh the proposed use would have been permitted there. Um but they do seem similar in in scale. >> I don't know.
>> Um BRPH do you have any comment on that? We we did not carry that conversation with the county um about their interpretation of the zoning because it obviously the conversation with the city jumped to an annexation so that that conversation was not had. >> Okay. Thank you
member Seedler. >> Thank you. This is more for staff. Um the current wastewater infrastructure um do we have the capacity to support this facility without affecting any other projects that we have approved? I know a couple meetings ago there was a
mention brought up that there were 1,800 residences. I think that was it. And I'm wondering we've approved a many projects and this has a huge demand on the portable water of are we we keep
approving saying we have enough we have enough but nobody's built and we're experiencing um pressure issues now and I don't know if that's related but I do know that this is a big um demand on
water and we have approved already a lot of buildings Are we going to be able to sustain at capacity in 2030? Yes. So with our preliminary concurrency assessment, we look at the current
reservations for proposed developments and then um add on top of that the what the proposed development would propose to use or is anticipated to use and the result was that there was still remaining capacity. So yes, there is enough uh sewer capacity for this development and still serve the
remaining the uh existing developments and the developments that have been approved but not constructed yet. >> So that was the sewer but the water we're in well four and we just heard we're paying 1.3 million and then I understand that we do get some water
from Coco. How much do we purchase from Coco? Again, I'm not in the utility department, so I can't answer that, but my understanding is it's very minimal. Just enough to keep the contract open. >> Okay. >> Member Childs. Um, I want to do an
unofficial poll, but if so, if we did reszone it and and it wasn't a bleach plant and it was just heavy industrial and not light industrial, how many people here that live in that neighborhood would still be okay with it if it was just even if it wasn't a
bleach plant? Any >> anyone? So, I think that's that's kind of where we're going too, I think, on this is like what we we want to just keep in mind, is it okay for that area, you know, that it's going to be industrial
even even if you just take out the bleach plant, I guess, is what I was trying to figure out. But I also in in um I live in the south part of Titusville and um we all we have water pressure issues during the day. I mean,
it's not horrible, but it I think it does it I do see a difference during the day. Um, but um and I we're always talking about, you know, water pressure issues here during um whenever we're
talking about reszoning something or having like 60 houses built somewhere. And um uh I'm always concerned with that now. And we always question, you know, public works on do we have the capacity for something, you know, just like
houses being built u much less, you know, a plant that's going to use this much water. But um and we don't always trust the numbers that we get because we're, you know, because we experience it. We live here and we we turn on the faucet and we can see with our own eyes
what's happening. So just because we have a report from somebody that tells us what's happening doesn't mean that that's what we're experiencing. So but um okay >> on on that note just so I'm clear
based on the question I asked earlier if it stays county it's already zoned industrial. So we we there's no change there. Somebody can go in under the current zoning and do something that's
similar, but maybe not necessarily the bleach plant, but an industrial use. It's already zoned for industrial use as as a county property. Is that accurate? >> Correct. Although there are a couple other zoning districts on there. I just want to be clear. Um, it's currently
zoned planned industrial park PIP, light industrial IU, and general retail commercial BU1. So, it's got a mix. >> So, the most intense is seems like it would be the light industrial of those >> or the planned industrial park.
>> Yeah. All right. Thank you. Uh, member Seedler. >> Thank you. Um, my computer went off so I'm going to go by my notes on this. Um, on page 43 there's a map um of our 128 pages and it is the St. John's
waterways, the Florida land use cover classification system, wetlands. If you look, thank you. If you look at that map, guys, on number 43, um, look at the coloring. It is all wet
land, >> right? Um >> Um, it seems like we're getting into the point where we're out of the public hearing, so I'm going to go ahead and close the public hearing and then just go ahead with your your question. I just want to make sure procedurally we're
covered. >> That's the one. Thank you, sir. >> Okay. So, staff, do you on number uh page 43? It's the wetland mixed forest. We've got wetland mixed forests. >> I see it. Yes. >> Pardon? >> I see it. Yes.
>> Yes. But when I look at that and I read their description, it's only one acre of wet land and the rest is buildable. And then I see this. How do I interpret that? >> Yeah. the uh the map that you're referencing is extremely old. It's
probably 40 plus years when that map was developed. >> The uh the environmental assessment that was done by a registered licensed environmentalist was just done in the last 12 months. And that map identified the five wetlands that I just mentioned earlier in the evening. Two are far to
the west and they're very small and non-ontiguous. So they're really identified by St. St. John's River Water Management is uh as removable. The other three are in the middle area of the site. They're also very small. And it comes to that calculation of that 0.9
acres that you're referring to. >> Okay. So, I'm we were given a very old map to go off of. >> Those are those are city generated. So our GIS department uh we use different data sources to provide you as much information as possible. Uh this is a
data set of that's provided by the state the St. John's River Water Management District, but the applicant has provided an environmental assessment of their own. That is uh is it ground truth? >> It's Atlantic. >> Atlantic Environmental provided the the assessment
>> and that was the one that included the the turtle report, >> I believe. So, >> and they didn't find any turtles >> um in the property >> in the property limits. There are no gopher tortoise identified by Atlantic
Environmental or GHB. There was two companies that did that. There are gopher tortoises that >> Can you please hold your comments, please? There are gopher tortoises that I per person personally have seen that are actually off the property. They're just
south of the property line in the adjacent property owner's property, but they're not on this property. >> All right. another >> please. Um I'll bring it back to the members. Um
how do we want to proceed here? It seems like we have option to table it or make recommendation one way or the other this evening. Member child I think um we have a lot of you know
some of the issues too. We're we're we're not just talking about the bleach plant. They're talking about I I heard from people saying that they they worried about the traffic uh there the trucks and stuff and that it's you know so close to a residential area as far as
that much you know happening in that area. Um I know the appliance direct had you know normal cars pulling in. they have a lot more man maneuverability, but like you know I I go on um I I I take my
daughter to school on US1 at New Life and um sometimes coming out of the airport there's these trucks turning out and they're taking up the whole two lanes, you know, to like turn onto onto the road there. And um I I couldn't you
know I mean it doesn't happen every morning but it's enough that it's like sometimes they pull out too too close to you and and then people are like trying to go around him and then they see the truck goes over. All we're trying to say is that um if if that you know the
people who live in that area too or anyone else traveling up and down US1 who are used to the traffic that they're driving every day um start you know start having trucks on that part of the area they're going to have a problem I think um will have a problem with
traffic there um and and possibly accidents and stuff and I um and having you know light industrial is one thing, you know, you're you're doing some things, you're you're building something, you know, whatever sell parts, whatever's near there that
they're doing currently. Um, that's a lot different than, you know, having these big trucks come in more often and leaving. So, um, I think for us, you know, if we're if we're looking at that at the zoning of is that appropriate for
that area with the residential area right across the street. I mean, it was I live in a culde-sac back, you know, by the Enchanted Forest because I like to be away from all of that, you know. I I looked at, you know, houses on Bara and stuff and I I didn't want I didn't want
that kind of traffic near me, but um so maybe this is just me, but I I wouldn't if I lived over there, which I probably wouldn't live right on US1 because I'm, you know, um I like my privacy a little bit more, but um I wouldn't want uh you
know, a heavy industrial area across the street from me. So, I wouldn't think that that would fit in that area for me. That's my opinion. Thank you, >> member F. >> Uh, staff. So, Eddie, um, how many other
areas in the city of Titusville do we have heavy industrial so close to residential? >> I don't have that information for you. >> Okay. So, typically is there some kind of zoning in between the two that we would like would we would the CF will allow heavy industrial to abut
residential? >> Typically, no. >> Typically no. Okay. Um, and so members, we just had a report not too long ago about the future of Titusville and our infrastructure and it said that we our current infrastructure right now
is good for the next 25 years to bring in 6,000 more units. Okay, again I question that, right? I question the validity of such report at the same time now. So, on top of the 6,000 units that our current infrastructure can hold, we're saying we're going to add an additional 250,000 gallons of water per
day on top of that. The infrastructure says it can hold. Yet, we have people saying otherwise. Um, so I have a concern for that. Um, I'm saying that that this is bleach and bleach really is a lot safer than gas because it it is a liquid and so it's word I'm going to use
is passivity, but I don't think that's a real word, right? But, I'm going to use it. passivity going from from its location off of the premise to another another location is probably a lot lower than if it was of a gas and um so but I don't know the hazard that it possesses
as far as explosions as far as fires as far as as being catastrophic. My other concern is how close in proximity to uh a daycare and and a lot of our our uh I think we said it was the American Legion
um a lot of those folks are are up there in age and so their lungs can't even though they smoke cigarettes, right? But we don't want to but you know we just don't want to add additional um hazards if we don't need to. If this location was someplace else that did not have so
close of proximity, we're talking 600 yards, 600 feet to the nearest home. That's a little too close in comfort for me, especially when I think the real gray line here is that that the residents that are there are
county and not city. So, the city doesn't I don't know if they do or don't have to take into account that that that that zoning of residential isn't city zoning. Is that right, Eddie? Am I wrong or right? >> I'm sorry. You said do we have to consider surrounding uses? Yes.
>> So, so I'm asking I'm asking that because they're county and not city. Do you have to take that into consideration as well? >> Yes, we look into compatibility with zoning across other jurisdictions. >> Okay. So I I you know um I'm ready to make my proposal. But um
the the the only other thing though, right, to be considered just so everybody is also aware, Eddie has also given us the the um the warning shot again, okay, is that if this is built and if they um ask for a utility memorandum of agreement, the city can
still annex them later on. So if you do, if you don't, okay, put the words in where where they belong, right? Um, and this is where it becomes contentious and where when you go to make a decision, right? You hear your voices
and and we hear your voices, but if the city grants them a utility right, the city can still annex them. >> You don't you understand, right? Right. I'm out of order, but I'm going to say I would encourage the city not to grant them a utility right. I mean,
ridiculous. >> Okay. So, again, >> I'm out of order. >> Again, again, I just want everybody to be aware of that. Okay. And so, as you come here, we we hear your voices and we we we hear what you're saying, but understand that is the also truth. Okay?
That's just the truth. So, be armed with the truth when you leave here today that we hear you. We understand. We all agree with you. We we also don't think that they're a bad company. Okay? Not not saying that at all. >> Okay? So, just understand that this decision is is not an easy one for us to
make today. >> Member Grant, >> I don't really have a problem with the annexation. I don't have a problem with that. I don't have a problem with the with amending the uh future land use to city
industrial, but I do have a problem with reszoning it to M2. Um it gives me jitters to think about what could happen because you never know what
could happen. And I don't know, it it just seems to me that that area seems to be more compatible. I know you said it's compatible to other areas in there, but it's more to me an M1 type of area.
Okay. And I'll tell you right now, that's the way I'm going. I will approve the annexation. I will approve the um um SSA, but I will not approve of the reszoning to M2. I'm sorry,
>> member child. it. So, is that something that we would do is we would say, you know, if we went if we wanted to approve the annexation and the and the land use, would that even make sense to deny the zoning or should we just deny the annexation?
>> That's up to you. You can do that. Um, the property would become part of the city's limits, within the city limits, and would retain the county's designations, either the future land use or the zoning or both. And so if so if it went all the way to city council and city council
decided to go ahead and annex it but not approve their zoning um that that would happen even if the the um the applicant didn't like didn't want that to happen or what what would happen?
>> They could withdraw their request >> and then it would stop then. >> Okay. >> Yeah. because my understanding is it the applicant doesn't currently hold title to the property. Is that accurate? Yes. So,
>> well, I would make a motion to recommend to >> one more line. >> So, in a way, I I I think that's that's one way of blocking it for sure. If we did that, if we annexed it and then didn't zone it, didn't reszone it, that would
block it for sure. Um, I would probably decline annexation and let them go through the county's process and let the county do what they're going to do. Um, and then they can always come back to the city for utilities if that happens. But I I think that if we annexed it and
then did not reszone it, then it's not going to it for sure won't get done. >> Say again. >> They'll pull it. I mean, >> I'm just saying that that that if we annexed it and then didn't reszone it, that will for sure block the project. And I I'm not I'm not in favor of
blocking anything, right? But I I don't think that the city necessarily needs this annexation right now. The city is in itself. Um I think that they should go through the county. Um it's a county property. I I me personally, I I would
vote to deny annexation. >> Right. >> All right. Member Childs. Um, I make a motion to recommend denial of the annexation um, uh, for SSA 5-2025.
>> I second. >> I have a motion and a second. Roll call. Any discussion before roll call. Uh, seeing none. Lori >> member Sidler, >> this is always so I I'll clarify because
it's always confusing. >> You're voting yes if you want to deny it. >> Yes, I want to deny it. >> It being the annexation ordinance, we're going to have three actions tonight. >> Okay. >> Vice Chairman Childs,
>> yes. >> Member Gellen, >> yes. Secretary Grant, >> no. >> Member Troutman, >> yes. >> Member FA, >> yes. >> Chairman Eton, >> no. >> And would the next was which one should
we do next? >> Before we get to that, would the nose like to state anything as to why they voted no? >> Uh, on for well, >> you go first. Um yeah, on on mine, the same as as um member Grant voiced is is my problem is with the use, not with the
fact that the property be in the city. >> The next would be the future land use ordinance. >> Okay. >> I make a motion that we uh deny the future land use for SSA 5-2025.
>> I second. >> Wait, second. Any discussion before roll call? Seeing none, roll call. Employees. Lori. >> Secretary Grant. >> No. >> Member Troutman? >> Yes.
>> Member FA? >> Yes. >> Vice Chairman Childs? >> Yes. >> Member Sidler? >> Yes. >> Member Gellen? >> Yes. >> Chairman Eton? >> No. Uh, same same reason. And I I don't disagree that the it's the prop or a a
option as a land use for the property uh if it were annexed. Um >> I just think that it would be pointless to do it. >> That may be Yes. Um, I make a motion that we recommend
denial of the resoning for SSA 5-2025. >> Second. >> Seconded by member Grant. Um, any discussion? Member facing your lights on. It's okay. Just checking. Roll call, please. Lori. >> Member FAC. >> Yes.
>> Member Sidler. >> Yes. >> Member Gillan. >> Yes. >> Member Tropman. Yes. >> By Sherman Childs. >> Yes. >> Secretary Grant. >> Yes. >> Chairman Eton. >> Yes. >> Denied. >> Did
the uh report that'll go to the city is that all three were denied uh with um the uh appropriate vote count will be passed and uh this will go to the city. you
said on what they >> Thank you, chairman. Yeah, just a a reminder that this is not a final decision. This is a recommendation to city council and the final decision will be made by city council on November 25th. >> Thank you. >> Uh item 9B.
>> Item 9B. >> Item 9 B. Approve, excuse me, public zoning ordinance. The public P zoning ordinance. Item begins on page 120 of 128 of tonight's agenda packet. Thank you. On January 28th, 2025, the city
council directed the staff to draft an ordinance amending the list of permitted uses in the public pzoning district. And I'll pause for a minute just Byebye. No, we're not. Whenever it is. >> Yeah,
>> Eddie. Whenever you're ready. I know that feeling. Sorry. I'll start again. Um, on Janu, this is page 120 of 128. On January 28th, 2025, the city council directed the staff to draft an ordinance amending the list of uses in the public Pzoning district. The
public Pzoning district prohibits several nonprofit uses. Activities such as vocational schools, community centers, community service, convention centers, and other public uses are not permitted. Public and private schools are permitted in the Pzoning district. The ordinance amends the proposed the
excuse me the purpose statement of the public fees on zoning district by allowing nonprofit or other non-governmental organizations and specifically permits the following uses community centers, community service, convention center and vocational schools. Staff has also identified and corrected existing errors within the
code. Um member Grod who is not here tonight, he did review this this item and emailed me ahead of time and let us let me know to share with you all that he reviewed the item. He he approves of this ordinance. So that's >> uh you know, good to know. Um so just a
little background on this, we we did have an applicant who was interested in starting a um like a cooking class, a cooking school, and I think it was in the Gibson Center, and they weren't able to do that because it was technically uh not a governmental uh instruction. It
was her own nonprofit school. And so we found that the Pzoning district is very limiting. It's only for government. Whereas there are a lot of uh good well-meaning intended uses that would serve the community um with these um uh like community service type uh uses that
just they can't use these facilities based on the zoning district. So we tried to make that a little more flexible by amending the purpose statement for the Pzoning district and that's on page 127. So, it's section 28-323 in our code and we added the language. Uh, let's see. It
now reads, "The public PZ zoning district is established as a special district to protect the substantial public interest of real property owned and used by any governmental entity including local, state, or federal government units. And what we added is or for publicly owned real property
being utilized by nonprofit or other non-governmental organizations for the public welfare." So that way it it makes it a little more um flexible. And then added this district is not intended to be applied to privately owned land that is used by government units. So uh that
way if there's um government entity that's using private land, it doesn't have to be zoned P. Um but just to clarify that that's where the flexibility comes from in in the purpose statement. And then each of the pages in the ordinance there's um each of the uses. Community centers is page 123,
community services page 124, convention center 125 and 126 is vocational school. Each one of them has um certain limitations to them. And so uh we'll go through one of them just for an example. Page 123,
the first one is community centers. real quick, Eddie. Sure. Um, these charts that we have in here, for example, under section five, uh, the R E R R1 A. >> Yes. >> I always had a hard time reading these because there's no title at the top.
There's no anything on the left like how this comes across, right? And can you explain that a little bit to me? >> Absolutely. So, this is actually an improvement from what we had previously. Um, these are kind of they're use tables for each of the uses. We have our our
master use table, which has all of the zoning districts and all of the uses that are permitted by the city. And then these are specific tables that are generated just for the use. And so, you can see we have whenever we change where a use is permitted, we have to edit both the master use table and the specific
use table. Um, so that way it's easier for the applicants when they know what use they want to do, which zoning districts they're permitted in. So they can take it to their realtor, their commercial realtor, and say, "Here's where I'm permitted and here's what limitations might apply to me. Help me find a place." Um, our applicants tend to really like these tables. So the gray
boxes are the zoning districts, and the letters underneath are are what I was explaining earlier today. If you see a P, it means it's permitted by right. So that means a vocational school. In this example, we're looking at section 28-256. uh vocational schools all of them are
are listed as L. Um so L means permitted but with limitations and you'll see underneath in subsection C all the limitations are listed there. So again going back P L and C are the three letters you're going to see there. Permitted means permitted by right. Uh the use is is is green light. Go ahead
and get your BTR. You can start operating today. An L means it's permitted but with limitations. meet all the limitations, then you can get your BTR and start operating. Or C is the conditional use permit. You've got to go through the public hearing process and and see if there's any conditions that council wants to impose or PNZ would
like to impose um to mitigate any nuisances based on that um based on your use. And then once the CUP is approved, then you can get your you got your green light to get your BTR and start operating. So that's how it kind of works is you can see which zoning districts and how uh intense the the
permitted permission is going to be. Um, so again, just those are the four uses. Community uh the four uses, community centers, community service, convention center, and vocational school. And so we're trying to make things a little more flexible for um for use of our governmental facilities in
the Pzoning district. All right. Um, any questions? >> I think so. Member Seer. >> Thank you. Um, does this have any impact? So, are these 501c3s?
How I have a question with that with the using changing any of this? Is it does it matter? Is it impact any any of the properties if they're 501c3s in terms of um use and limitations? Are
we changing anything or are we just So, so 501c3s are are nonprofits, right? So, they would be permitted to use the governmental facilities in this zoning district, whereas previously it's only permitted only governmental operations could operate in those facilities if
they're zoned Public. So if they go in and an entity being a 501c3, they can purchase the property and it's reszoned for being a 501c3 in the community. How many of these parcels
um will change? Um, and does the 501c3 rendering have an impact on what the city gets in terms of revenue by increasing the 501c3 uses in the city.
Does that take revenue from the city? >> Um, no. So, right now we have facilities that are being used by government operations or that are vacant and they would be occupied by nonprofits. So in
if anything they would be generating more uh we would not be losing profits we'd be generating revenue from rents if they're even charged they they the whichever governmental agency whether it's the city or the county may choose to let them operate for free out of that facility if it's a benefit to the
community >> member face I'm ready to vote all right so I I I recommend that we approved. Um >> uh hang on. We have no card. Any cards? >> Oh, any cards? >> No cards. >> All right. No need for a public hearing. Now you can go.
>> All right. I I recommend approval of the um again approve the public pzoning ordinance. Changes as written. >> I second. >> We have a motion second. Any discussion before roll call?
>> I think this is good for the city. >> I believe so as well. I agree. But we're going to solidify that with a vote right now that Loriy's going to call. >> Member Gellen, >> yes. >> Secretary Grant, >> yes.
>> Vice Chairman Childs, >> yes. >> Member FA, >> yes. >> Member Troutman. >> Oh, yeah. >> Member Sidler. >> Yes. Chairman Eton, >> yes. >> All right, that's the uh last item. Uh, we have a second section for petitions
and requests from the public present. And there's still a few of you here. Anyone care to speak on anything that wasn't on the agenda? Don't see anybody jumping up. So, we'll move to reports. City staff, >> no report, sir. Thank you.
>> City attorney, welcome. >> Thank you so much. And I'll meet each one of you individually. Uh, nothing from me at this time. Thanks. >> Thank you. I have no report. Any of the members have any report? Member face.
I saw you. You got to say something now. >> Hey, listen guys, you guys do awesome work. I do appreciate each and every one of you as we head into this holiday season. Keep me and I'll keep you in our prayers. >> Thank All right. Uh seeing no other
reports, we will stand adjourned.