Um, I'm going to call the meeting to order at 7:02 p.m. Um, could I have a roll call, please? Starting with Emily on the >> Emily. Fine.
>> And you are remote? >> Remote. Yes. >> Mike said, >> present. >> Veronica Cal present. Selena Thomas, present. All right. So, thank you everybody.
Um, the the meeting is being recorded by TCAN and it'll be uploaded to YouTube. Is there anybody else who is recording? Okay, seeing none. Um, I have no additions or deletions. Does anybody else?
No. Um, all right. So, the next thing is to review the minutes of page 28, which Emily so kindly wrote. And I don't know if people need a few minutes to take a look or >> I wrote them.
>> Yes, I looked this up. So, did I? All right. >> Very detailed and clear. >> Yes. >> Thanks. >> So, is there a motion to approve the meeting minutes for August 28th? >> So moved.
Second. >> Is there any discussion? Um, all right. So, roll call vote for approving the minutes beginning with Emily and and we will need to do a roll call vote because we have a remote
number. So, >> sorry. >> Um, so yes, approve. >> Emily fine. Approve. >> Emily fine. Yes. Mike P said yes. >> Selena Thomas yes and Veronica Kell yes.
All right. So the minutes are approved and I will um send them to the town clerk to file. All right. Um the sitewalk on October 9th. I I put
discussion of the sitewalk. So, anything that anybody wants to say, add, comment on etc. >> Thought it went well. Very well. And the turtle I planted.
>> Couldn't have been better. >> Yeah. No. And they seem to enjoy the place for So, have we had any feedback from them? >> Just that one. Um, no, not directly,
>> but the letter from Dave Vant where Emily um I mean not Emily, Anna Wilkins uh asked a few questions about the water um the well, >> right? >> Um other than that, no, I haven't gotten
any, but they weren't supposed to meet until next week, the um the land committee. So, we're meeting a week prior, but um anyway, so no, no comment
from them or from anybody really. [Music] Anybody else hear anything? Any other comments on the sitewalk? I thought it went great. >> Yeah, >> I I really did. I mean, it it went as
well as it could have gone. So, we'll have to see including the planted turtle. >> But the other thing was um the um statement from the Nasha River
watershed representative too. Um >> yeah, I I think that was really helpful. So >> all right, >> fingers crossed. Yes, I I will I will
get in contact with Anna um within the next few days and see you know if she has any further you know when we I guess the question is when can we anticipate hearing from them
>> and it was nice that you pointed out that knowledge of the location is now worldwide thanks to Sim Montgomery's books many languages. >> Oh yeah. Except except it's not
>> right. >> You know, it's it's it's uh somewhere in New Hampshire. So in uh a town called Torington. All right. Anything else on 2.1?
Going on to 2.2 review of the funding sources. Um I in the packet was the Massachusetts Land and Water Conservation Fund Grant Program. James Gates sent this to me. Um and I thought,
you know, this might this could work. Um and uh so I was I signed up to go on I think it's November 17th to the in-person um presentation of the grant, what they're looking for, how they want
things answered, all that. And it's at the Fish and Wildlife Office in Westboro. Um anybody can sign up for it. So there's a link in that email that if you're interested, feel free. There's
also a virtual date. Don't quote me. I think it's December 2nd. I think November 17th was the inperson and December 2nd was a virtual if I remember right. Um if someone wants to go to that link in that email.
>> Yeah. Um and all you have to do is send her an email and say you're interested and they'll put you on the list to, you know, for being there in person or for the Zoom link. So, is it December 2nd? Is that the right day?
Not yet. >> There it is. Just >> Okay. Okay. November 17th and December 3rd. >> December 3rd. Okay. on the day off. But
um though you can just um send an email and get signed up if you're interested because that's another possible funding source. So and just looking um in the minutes uh
um there was also the Freedom's Way. I think that was the one in the minutes maybe. >> Yeah, Freedom's Way was in the minutes. I don't think this one was. So, it's environmental protection and animal welfare, the wild and scenic stewardship
council, the Marian Stoddard, which we can apply for at any time. Um, NHSP funding for maintenance. I don't know if that >> I don't know how common that is. And then NRCS, I'm not sure what that is.
Does anybody know? Nshawa River. No. CS I don't know what that is natural resources conservation service. Okay natural resources.
So I think that our next thing once we find out whether that we have a a CR holder is to start working on applications for this in addition to the CR.
Um and I'm going to wait. You guys can weigh in on this. Um well for funding sources I I'll go to the next topic in a minute. For funding sources my two favorites are the Marian starter
for starters and if we qualify the DFW land and water grant which I I I read through what it was for and I think having the soccer fields there is a good thing. >> The one that James sent you.
>> Yes. >> Yeah. So that one um the eligible projects it says acquisition of parkland or conservation land. So that doesn't count right? >> Creation of a new park, >> renovations to existing parks.
>> That's where I was thinking. Yeah, >> that that would be our the the choice. And >> um but Tesa cannot apply. It would have to be applied by the town. Yeah. >> Yeah. So that that would be a question.
for them at at the thing. Yeah. >> You know, so um but it it's it's a possibility. >> Yeah. >> So anyway, >> the Freedom's Way grant that was um mentioned at some point in the past.
>> Mhm. >> The cycle opened for the 2026 funding on October 1st >> and it goes through April 15th on a rolling basis. So that one might be worth
digging into a little bit more. Okay. Um, so as far as amounts, it's 3500 for the legal defense fund and $50 per acre. >> Wait a minute. Can you say that again?
um for if if in fact um North County is our CR holder, it is 3500 for the legal defense fund and $50 per acre >> and there's 40 some odd acres if I recall.
>> Yeah. Yeah. What about um the uh marking out the plot? Um >> the survey. >> Yeah, the survey. >> A survey will probably be around 8,000 is my guess. 8 to 12. >> 8 to 12.
>> That's my guess. um and the BBR um baseline documentation uh report that you have to do for for a CR. My guess is that will be around 5,000. that's usually walking the um
they'll initially walk the entire property and at every corner or significant marker they'll take a picture and you know document what it looks like and what is there. I know. I've only ever done it with New England
Forestry Foundation and they have software. They walk with a um iPad or whatever and they a tablet and they do it on that and then and then it create there's software that creates these and then they give you a report.
So >> So we're looking at we're looking at 18,000 to 22,000 total. Um, yeah, I I was This is an estimate, you know. Um, but yeah, I I would say
30,000 max is what we're looking for. >> Okay. >> I think 18 is low when you have a survey and a BBR. And then for the um stewardship funds
that you know >> did the 3500 plus the 2,000 which is $50 an acre times 40 acres. >> I did times 50 acres and did 2500. >> Oh >> I guess it depends.
>> So we'll call that 2500 >> as far as what goes into the CR. What is outside of the CR if anything? So that'll make a difference. So yeah. So what do you get for Emily?
>> 18,5002. If it's 12,000 for the survey instead of 8,000, it would be 22,500. >> Okay. >> And that's including 5,000 for the B the BDR.
>> Okay. the survey, the acre acreage thing, and the 3500. >> Okay. And and we could always if there, you know, if it's a if that's too high or whatever, we could um
apply to a couple different places for different things. Wait, I my math is wrong. Wait, wait, wait wait. >> I get 23. >> Yes. Yes, it's 19,000 or 23,000. >> Okay.
>> 19,000 to 23,000. >> Okay. >> All right. So I think a after we know if we have a CR holder, we start looking at these and working on applications. >> Yeah. >> So
>> and is that something that um Kieran Kieran would >> I I would that would be really nice. I'll have to talk to him and see. But yeah, it's the town's property, so it would make sense that
>> he would do it. So, I'll I'll talk to him about it and I've been kind of waiting until we were certain. Um, but I'll talk to him. So, um, I I might also make a report at
the um, next select board meeting so that people are aware that we would need the grant funding. I've been waiting though. I don't want to do it until until we're certain. So, I don't know. What do you guys think?
>> Yeah. Because there's no point in going forward with all of these costs if >> we don't have a CR. >> Yeah. >> Okay. All right. The next one is the CR document um for review. And unless
there's anything else to say about grants, I'm sorry. I kind of answered that. All right. Uh, the next is a CR document and it looks to me I put a link in an email. Did you guys get
an email from Sabrina with the the pre um saying, "Hey, here's what's going to be on the agenda." And did you get that email? >> I didn't notice it. >> I did, but I think I deleted it because we agenda
>> that that's all right. I I was just wondering in there I put the link to the it's the same link to the CR program at DOEA or whatever they're called now. Um and the reviewer has changed from the
person that I was trying to contact in September. There's a different name there for the person who's the reviewer. And um they also have a a thing in there saying that um anything that's in now
is is good to go, but they're not going to be reviewing until after January for new ones for new CRS, which is kind of perfect timing for us. So if in fact we get a positive response, it would be
good to have the CR document in their hands early January. So, just think about that for timeline. >> Um, didn't during the sitewalk, didn't they say
that they might want to use their own CR >> document? Yeah. Okay. And Anna said that she had already made some revisions, I think. >> Yes. >> So, yeah, they weren't thrilled with template. the solid light. >> The template that we used was the one from um
>> Misa >> Misa. And um >> but we don't have to use that one. >> No, we don't. No. And so they're probably using the standard document, the one that you get from the mass.gov
website that um and that is good in my opinion. It it's good to have that. We want to have the CR through EOEA. Um, it has more teeth in it than the MISA
one. So, u more backing from the state than the other one in my opinion. They should both be of equal butt. >> Um, so we'll see what they provide if in fact.
So I haven't done any changes to it. Although we did get you the map that you sent and all that. >> Yeah. And I think the only um things I had changed and it wasn't changes. I made some comments that there's some like dates in
here that I we need to double check are accurate kind of thing. Okay, so that's that's for that. And let me see, was there one other thing? Oh, I wanted to talk about um the
since we're on the CR uh Anna's questions um to the water department. So, were there any questions about that? It was what was interesting to me was that they aren't going to use the access road at the far end. They say that
they're going to use the one over the pipeline and horseshoe, that kind of narrow piece, >> but it was on the far end >> on the far end. Not the one that's down here where the soccer fields are, but down at the far end. So, that was that
was news to me. So, did you see that, Emily? >> Yeah. I'm not I'm not sure where that access road is. >> It's in the pictures. You can see it in the pictures. It's the little tiny piece
that comes in like this from the H. There's There's maybe three of them or four. There's more than one. So, it's between lots three and four. Um, let me see if I can pull up the There's the map. All right. Let me see
if I can share it. I'm not able to share it. Um TKM, are you there? Could you give um if you are, could you give Selena sharing ability? >> Is that Hartley?
>> Is it Hartley? >> Yeah, Hartley was in here earlier. Was he Hartley? Are you there? >> Yes. And I just gave her sharing capabilities. >> Excellent. Thank you. Thank you. >> Okay.
[Music] Are these going to have the right numbers? Oh, yeah. So, the 35.1.2.3. So, lot three is 35.3 and lot four is this 35.4 I believe. >> And this is the skinny.
>> So, it's not the one at the very end. >> No, it's not. I I think I wouldn't have expected. What surprised me about that is that they're coming in through the developments as opposed to um where
>> up at the end of the lots, you know, where the long skinny lots are right in there. >> So, did he say the roadway was going there? >> He said um >> or just the pipeline >> um the 8 in water line for the well coming off horseshoe. Yeah. Between so 8
inch water line. >> Yeah. So I And then in number six it says the access road. It says and be extended over the pipeline from horseshoe when installed instead. I thought that was the access road will be
extended over the pipeline from Horseshoe when installed instead of Mason Road to limit disturbance or the pipe located under the access road to Mason Road. doesn't make a the it doesn't make a lot
of sense. But I read that and I thought really >> they would come in through there >> instead of coming off of Mason >> instead of coming off of Mason. >> Um I don't know did you guys read it
differently? When installed instead of to limit disturbance or the pipe located under the access road >> disturbance of the pipe
>> I should maybe ask question. Yeah. What does this mean? Um, to me it it sounded to me, just taking it in context, it sounded to me like there would be a pipe going out to a to
Mason Road in that access road, but they wouldn't use that as the access road to the well. they would use the the little piece there. Um, which does >> but that that sort of contradicts number
two, the 8 in water line between houses 20 and 22. So the water line will be in the narrow one and then the access road to be extended
over the pipeline from installed instead of basing road >> to limit disturbance to the pipeline. >> Yeah, that seems to indicate that the access road is going to go
over the well over that pipe. in the skinny part, not off of me off of Horseshoe Drive rather than off of Mason Road. >> Right. >> Makes me wonder if there's enough space there for >> a road.
>> A road. >> And can you can you um Can we make a Is there 60 ft there? You either need 40 or 60. I can't remember which. Well, if it's just a like a driveway, I you know, it wouldn't be a public
road, would it? >> No. Well, it would be I mean, public wouldn't necessarily be going down it, but it would be the water department trucks, >> right? And they're not tiny.
>> I can't tell how much feet that is. Yeah, it almost looks like it's 25 ft, which would say that's a not probably enough for the trucks, but is it >> enough for an official And maybe it
doesn't count if it's for municipal services. Um anyway, >> yeah, it looks like it's 25.07. Okay. Feet and >> because this one is 20 and this one is
25.02, >> right? >> So, yeah. >> And it just surprised me that that they would be coming off of Horseshoe Drive rather than off of Mason Road. >> That's all. >> That does avoid the uh the vernal pool
though. >> It does. >> It does. Yes, it does. So, that's a good thing. Yeah. And well, either way, it's just going to it's going to be a a disturbance on the
nesting habitat, but um >> and it won't be within the next 5 years. >> Y >> um I I think it's probably closer to 10, but he knows his stuff, not me. Um >> Yeah.
So >> said it'll be on the new master plan. >> So do we know when the new master plan comes out? >> They're working on it in the capital plan for this fiscal year. Okay. There was money to develop a new master plan.
>> So I don't know at what point but um >> but that probably was funded last year. >> Yes. >> Yeah, >> it was funded. So >> um so anyway their their questions were on the um the second page
>> the second page >> and just on um there was one place I when I was reading his responses. Wait, let me see if I can find it now. [Music]
Oh, the 400 ft radius area will have very limited access to human activity unless it is for maintaining the well. I'm assuming that >> well he pointed to this town bylaws for
water. So um those were the things that we looked at to add to the CR when we were doing it. So I think it matched. >> Okay. And
>> and in number seven it says there would be a turtle plan involved. So, I'm assuming that the activity involved in protecting the nests would be allowed within that 400 ft radius.
>> That's a good question, but I would assume the same thing. I think that when he says um you know uh limit limited activity, human activity, I think he's talking about if you're going to hike or >> play ball or
>> go running or whatever, uh you wouldn't be able to do it in that area. >> Okay, >> that's the way I read that. >> Do I remember correctly that some of those little strips between the houses
already have pipes in them? Yes. >> Well, going back to six, if that or becomes an of it, it limits the disturbance of the pipe located under the access roads, Mason Road. So, maybe there is already a
pipe. >> Yeah, I think >> under that wider strip at the far end. >> So, I believe they had said that there was one between three and four and another pipe between 14 and 15 already present.
>> Okay. the last time he was on the phone. >> Do either of those go to Mason? >> They both go to Horseshoe. >> They both go to Horseshoe. >> Yeah. >> Well, still doesn't make any sense then. >> I don't know. And unless they're thinking it'll be a wider pipe in that
bigger access road that goes out to Mason Road and joins some other >> pipeline on the road and that the skinny ones go to provide to Horseshoe Drive. I don't know. I honestly don't know. So
yeah, so um I I just wanted everybody to see this and to see that they they were asking questions. So, yes, >> I I did send email to Beth Baxon, the um
uh planning board admin. Um I had wanted to know, Anna had asked maybe at the sitewalk or maybe it was at our meeting, I'm not sure, if there was article 97
land um if there was ever a vote to make that article 97 land. And so I asked that if for that and um they were busy doing the MBTA bylaw and I think I'm
going to ping her again. I I'm willing to go in and look through minutes and see. I mean back when this was done the minutes were taken in books handwritten in books. >> So was she saying that it is not currently marked as such on this map?
>> Yeah, that's what she was saying. and she wanted to know if a vote had ever been taken for that at the time that this development was um put in place or permitted or
whatever. So it's very touchy. >> Um it looks like it is in article 97. Yeah. >> Yeah. Open space article 97.
>> But maybe Massm Mapper doesn't always have the absolute official >> That's true. >> information, but >> it looks like it. >> All four parcels are article 97. I know that some of it is fishing game.
I think on that the one piece. >> So this is the entryway piece that currently Tesa uses with you can see the driveway underneath. >> Yeah. >> So the Tesa field one is over here. Tasa field two is right here.
>> But I mean these are the four parcels. >> It is. >> And it's all marked article 97. But but that's a light green compared to the darker greens. So are you sure?
>> Yeah, because when I clicked on it, um when you click on it, it tells you article 97. >> Huh. >> But that's true. There should be >> I think >> a key or a legend or something that shows why the different colors. My guess
is the light green is town and the dark green is fish and game. >> I think this is um forest or wetland. If you look underneath, I think the reason it's darker green is because it's got blue under it. It's got this wetland coloring. >> Okay.
>> Underneath it. >> So if you remove the article open space article 97 that your green should disappear. >> Yes. The dots. It's the dots that make it the article. >> Okay. >> Oh, okay.
>> Yeah. The green is just the color of the parcel to say this is like a park. >> Okay. >> And I'm guessing this is the cemetery that Yeah. Dudley Road Cemetery. So, it's >> So, if the light green, you can't see me pointing, but the light green stuff is
townowned on this. Even if you go to where the uh main street well area is across 119 >> over here the pump station. >> Yeah. >> So this parcel it doesn't really say
>> is an unknown or I don't know anywhere. >> Yeah. I don't know. >> I'm not certain. >> It's right along the river. Mhm. Anyway, >> okay. >> But yeah, >> good. So, maybe I don't need on that
mapper. It is. >> So, okay. >> Cool. >> Well, I don't have you could be right that maybe >> to have it caught up with reality. Yeah, >> you can
>> use AI to ask if um it can find minutes for you on Open Space meeting like and then >> and then you'll know exactly what dates it pops up and you can go in and look at
those specifically and you might find it faster that way >> sitting there. So, but these are from like early 2000. >> As long as they're online, >> I don't think it's online.
>> My guess is it's not online. Uh because we didn't have that then. Anything before 2010 is probably not necessarily online. I know I've had to look through in the town clerk's office. I've had to get the books and look
through to get answers to questions. So, Anyway, all right. So, that was everything that I had. Um, >> while we were on the walk, James Gates expressed the desire that somehow built
into the restrictions that there would be he allowed some kind of forest management plan so that he could he was especially interested in cutting down some of those small trees on the
embankment um adjacent to the um to the the the parking area and I don't know all the different forest management plans so I don't know which one would apply to this situation like this. >> Um
>> but that was his desire anyway. >> Yeah. Uh I think that's part of the maybe Emily can talk about this more. The management plan that was in place to for habitat um keeping for habitat management.
>> Right. That sounds Yeah. Well, she can explain, but it doesn't sound like it would come. >> Yeah, it didn't. And it it did not involve using any sorts of power tools. So, it was it was um it was not as
um big a project as as what James is talking about. So all all that we did um with our habitat maintenance was um work on on
removing a lot of the small trees and saplings from the sandy slopes. Um and on the lower flat um cutting down some of those white
pines that have been growing up. Um but we did not in our plan um deal with those huge pine trees that are on the slope um along the access
road. >> I don't think it was the huge trees he was interested in. I think it's all of the saplings that have grown up in the last fiveish years. Yeah. >> Well,
>> yeah, maybe a little more than five, but they weren't full grown trees that he was talking about. Right. >> Right. But those pine trees are growing quickly so they're bigger than we could manage with with just hand tools at this point.
Um, and I know that our RDA said that that we had to use hand tools only. >> Now, do you think though that they would if it was not nesting season if they would if um, NHSP or whomever would
allow uh, you know, equipment on there? I I don't know. I mean, >> oh, I think so. I I think so. But um um
the reason the reason um I'm pretty sure that it said that we couldn't use any power tools was um someone from the water department um was very concerned that there would
be, you know, that we would >> spill gasoline or something. I don't know. he so we just >> we agreed that we would only use hand tools at that time. >> Um >> but the place that James is talking
about is outside of that 400 ft area. >> Right. Well, maybe that's something we need to consider. >> But it would be in the area of the conservation restriction.
Okay. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> So, back before I started working on this project with TEASA, um they were in talks with NHGSP about doing a yearly
habitat management um plan to help maintain optimal vegetation and habitat quality. and expand known nesting habitats.
>> Right. The thing I did, I don't think that was the the big plan. That was to to at least get started on some habitat maintenance. And we were given
permission to I know there was the understanding that we would do this um several times, you know, not just that once. Um but I was just wasn't
under the impression that this was a permanent official, you know, long-term maintenance plan. I didn't I just wasn't under that impression that it was uh I think it's
I I would look at that original thing that I wrote up as um sort of the start of of a um more permanent type of of thing.
It's sort of a work in progress. >> Um because what what James is talking about is um because there hadn't been any habitat maintenance for I'd say 20 years.
Um a lot of what used to be nesting habitat is no longer nesting habitat. like we used to get um snapper nests above the access road
um on the little hill up there and I haven't found any nests there um in several years and and it's because of all the all the trees that have grown up.
Um but I didn't even address that in my plan. So maybe what needs to be done is a new plan that is um all-encompassing needs to be written up.
Would that be outside of the conservation restriction or would that be part of the conservation restriction? >> Um, I don't know. I I suppose we need to
talk with North County Land Trust to figure out what they would want as far as detailed description of the types of habitat maintenance that would be done because
the original stuff that I wrote up was much more it was much smaller in its scope simply because there weren't many of us
available to do the work. You I can't clear a forest. So, um so I I didn't even go there. >> Okay. I I think this is something that we
talked to North County about at this point. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Since it seems they're going to take from our template and translate it into the new template. And they might have to change the wording or something and then they just would have to add something
for this >> if they're amendable to it. And for that um if I remember Emily uh it required an RDA which is conservation commission
>> and um NHSP had to sign off on it um or they well they consulted on it on what was in the plan, >> right? Um so maybe something like that gets
written in you know for a certain period of time or some such thing. And as far as a bigger forestry management plan that might be part of it too I don't know. So
something to talk to them about I think if that's what we want to happen on it. Okay. >> All right. Um, so next meeting I know that the holidays are coming up and it should be
after the um after we hear after their land meeting. >> Yeah. >> So I'll find out when that is from Anna, but I I was wondering when people were available and and this is a then we can talk about agenda. I guess I've jumped to you know
2.5 and we haven't done 2.4 But what looks good for meetings for people? >> What about two weeks from tonight, which would be the 20th? >> I have a meeting from noon to 6 that day
here. Um, so if we started at 7, that should be okay. >> Oh. >> So if does that work for everybody? >> Yep. And that gets us in before Thanksgiving. >> Yes. >> Okay.
So, let's let's set that tentative. And can we pick one more for December because I'm around for part of but not all of >> How about the fourth? So, we go every two weeks for a little bit.
>> Um, okay. Let's do the fourth. Yep. If that works. >> So the November date is the >> 20th. >> 20th. All right. and the agenda for the next meeting.
Hopefully, we have a report on a on the results from the sitewalk and the land committee and all of that. and then we can go from there. Take their CR and talk, you know, sit with
them and talk about that, figure out um what we want to go for for grants. >> Um you could also talk about um you're you're you're going to go to that meeting on the 17th, right?
>> Yes. >> So maybe you could tell us about that one. and then the CR itself. And maybe maybe we'll do things differently if we do have the CR holder. We're going to want to meet with them and talk about things. So,
all right. Anything else? So, so what are the agenda items again? I just want >> um report on whether or not we have a CR holder. Um the CR itself, if we do have a CR
holder, what does what's the template now? What you know, >> review what they have. >> Review what they have um with what we have. Uh and then um grants me reporting on the meeting from the 17th and then
anything else. If in fact we do have a CR holder, I'll talk to Karen or I'll probably bring it up at the next I think we meet on the 19th. The um select board
does. So hope hopefully I know by then and we can um and I can talk about using our grant writer for that. So, >> and underneath for the CR template, we should also talk about that forestry
plan. >> Okay. >> Or even just habitat management plan. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Management plan to include
clearing um more sandy slope >> and I can talk with James and try and get a better idea of exactly what he is thinking >> because I know he's mentioned it in passing.
So I'll actually write some things down. >> All right. Okay, that looks good. All right, last thing. Motion to adjurnn. >> I motion we adjourn. >> Second >> at uh 7:52.
>> All right. Uh roll call vote starting with um remote. >> Emily Fine. Yes. >> Mike Quart. Yes. >> Veronica Keel. Yes. Selena Thomas. Yes.