I'd like to uh call to order the January 28th uh 2026 Towns and Conservation Commission meeting at 7:02 p.m. And I have a roll call vote starting with Sandra. >> Sandra Lord here. [snorts] >> Mike Per here. >> James Doryan present.
>> James Gage present. >> Pat General here. [snorts] Mike, do you mind leading us in the pledge of allegiance, please? >> I pledge algiance to the flag of America >> and to the republic for it stands, one
nation under God, indivisible, liberty, justice for all. My audio is not that great. >> That's fine. uh >> 2C delay. >> You came out wonderful. [clears throat] >> Just beautiful. In fact, thank you.
>> So, as long as there isn't any background disruptions, um we'll we'll pause for you to um talk. Um >> Okay. >> And if Yeah. Um
>> Yeah. and uh I'll prompt [snorts] you uh just so that you get a chance to uh or we get a chance for it to catch up. So, my glasses [clears throat] fell out. I got to go. [laughter]
[clears throat] >> I mean, you got to look. She's extra pens. She's got a notebook. Cookies. >> Pat's going after her glasses. We need >> a couple minutes. [laughter] I would miss out on the cookies. >> Yeah, I was just We didn't want to say
anything, by the way. [laughter] >> It would be upsetting for me. >> We don't need that, >> Kobe. >> No, there's no hearing. >> It's for the hearings. Oh, just [clears throat] >> thank you for being good. [laughter]
[clears throat] [clears throat] That was amazing. [clears throat] [clears throat] >> [clears throat] >> Oh yeah. [clears throat] Okay. >> [laughter] [clears throat] [clears throat]
>> Uh, this meeting is being recorded. Is anyone else recording? >> [clears throat] >> Yes, I am. >> Thank you. Uh chair's additions and or deletions, we're going to move the meeting minute
uh review and approval for 1119 and 1210, 2025 to our next meeting of February 11th. chair report. Um I had a conversation with Kevin Smith um
[clears throat] regarding his um status yet to receive a [cough] [clears throat] resignation letter and he has decided to um take a leave of absence shortterm for
um some medical issues and um we'll return once he is uh better. Um so [clears throat] um >> the other chair report is uh we
next meeting um on [clears throat] February 11th we need to vote for officers cuz we haven't done that in a while. >> So [clears throat] we'll I assume address Kevin vice chair. >> We have to vote all of them >> on all of them.
>> All of them. Good. >> Anyone? >> Yeah. >> So, >> good. >> Did you get that, >> Sandy? >> What's that? [laughter] >> Next meeting. Next meeting. You got to be you've got to be voting in people. >> Uh, yeah. We're going to uh do a
reorganization because we're um obligated to and we're behind on it. >> Okay. >> Just so you're aware. >> Okay. >> Sounds good. [clears throat] So that's what I have in uh six. We move to the next meeting and
we are on to 17 agent report. >> Sorry, I I missed which item was moved to the next meeting. >> The review and approved minutes of 1119 and 1210, >> which we're going to just do those to 11:26,
>> whatever you need. >> Okay. Um, >> and you actually before you start, you got what I also said for the next meeting for voting for officers. >> Yes. >> Okay. Good. Thank you. [clears throat] >> Okay. So, agents report for today,
January 28th. Um, we had as far as ID RFS, independent interdep departmental reference forms, referral forms, excuse me, we had a 224 North End Road. Uh,
they have a building permit for our new barn and there are no wetlands involved. Um, we do [clears throat] we had um mass core responded for our placards. Um they they
gave us a quote on the the uh placards we've requested. They were about $13 a piece and with our grant money that allows us to purchase 30. [clears throat] Um that would requires
uh >> per 15 each. >> $13 each and change. Uh I can show you. Will they allow you to order that small quantity? >> Well, that's what we have this >> Well, I know that's what we have to spend. I was asking if that's the quantity they will
>> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yeah. I don't That does sound high, but I could not find the an old purchase order for it. So, I I don't know how much we have paid for them in the past. I'm sure they've gone up since the last
time we boarded them, but if S owns the account, the ordinary, I can look for more vendors. >> I just recall in one of the last meetings we had ordered, I think it was 200. The town should be able to
>> I say somebody should have a record game. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And that would have been >> I didn't have time to go digging more. So, >> I almost go with Jessica. It would be in it would be in the account hold
that just seems expensive only because we're going to need quite a few of them. >> Yeah, >> I thought that was exorbitant. >> Yeah. >> Do you want me to see about them for you? >> Uh if you if you know where to find the
old purchase order, that would help. That's more likely I can access that. I just have to do more digging which I mean time for >> just in reference just for some reason that starts me as particular >> kind of expensive per
>> so was that a guest to Pat or are you going to search for both >> I was going to search you can search as well if you like >> just trying to help you out >> have another vendor I can provide you with one actually easier if I just
provide you with the image of it so you can email it to people. >> Gladly. Um, as far as invoices go, >> um, we had we did pay for the survey um
on Alyssa Drive. Uh, that was $9,280 which came from the grant money account >> which was awesome. It just means
>> and um I am waiting on them to tell me when they're going to start next. >> And that was $9,000 twice. >> $9,280. >> That takes care of Alyssa.
Did I hear a question? No. Okay. [clears throat] >> Just mumbling. >> It was a mumble, too. Sorry about that. >> Uh, as far as that, everything else will be covered under the agenda items.
Okay. Thank you. 7:15. Oh, do you have to um do you mind update on our logging? >> Oh jeez, that's what I wanted to mention. Thank you. Uh [clears throat] yeah, so uh logging uh the timber
harvest at uh the meeting house park has begun. Uh unfortunately, they promptly got whacked with the big snowstorm, so that slowed things down. But prior to that, they were finding that a lot of the trees
were well stained. um with blue stain than they were expecting. Um >> do you mind explaining blue stain just? >> Sure. So blue stain is um well it it can
be caused uh it's caused by a fungus that um follows the larva or laral tunnels of beetles and the scale underneath the cambium of the trees. It makes what it does is it makes the trees
uh unmarketable. Um structurally it doesn't ruin them, but they can't be sold except for bone. Um and there's only so many tall mills that take um such a large quantity of
pine at one time. So that is the difficulty that our logger is having at this point finding enough mills to accept these trees. Uh as far as yet um as far as right now um it he's still
finding places to take the trees but it may become a problem if the level of stain in the trees persists throughout the timber harvest. We may have to change plans [clears throat] the plan.
>> So in other words, it may end up going to more pulp opposed to what we get for any board foot due to the state. >> Yes. And may not be able to >> find anybody move this because we don't have a place to send them. No place will
accept them >> even as a whole. >> Yes. >> Right. We don't >> Yeah. there only so many mills around that can take them and they only take certain cooperative quantities at a time.
>> So when this seems more like an actionable item or something that we need to follow up on the next meeting um so we can navigate this while the ground is still frozen. Um well
yeah um it you may not um or may be looking at if if you wanted the timber harvest to continue you may be look we may be looking at not receiving it funds may be an expenditure at this point
>> there is an account associated with that property that would allow us to pay so that we can at least get to completion of the harvesting whether it gets yarded and utilized for whatever down the road. But we will get it
harvested and clean to safety thing. >> Correct. >> Or or stop the harvest. But like you said, >> a lot of down stuff in there. >> A lot of >> Widowmakers. Well, in the same token, we
knew that was coming with the stain. We knew it was going to be a problem, you know, from the get- go with us. All right, here we go. >> Would stop the harvest mean stop cutting them or just stop just drop them and leave them there until something could
be done with them or what's stop the harvest? >> Yeah, I don't know if that's allowable. We I can talk to the service forcer if that had to occur to me if we can fell the trees and leave them >> or like I said if there would be a spot where we can >> I have to find out from the service for
>> and if they were stacked and yarded at least when they can be released and utilized go from there >> but it's a documented infestation talk to them >> see what our best >> options are if Craig can't
[clears throat] delete If that makes sense. >> That's too bad. >> And then as an actionable item, we can update it the next meeting. >> Yeah, [laughter] [clears throat] um moving [clears throat] on.
717 um 2.1 certificate of compliance COC for 73 Emory Road DEP file number 308-0579 applicant [clears throat] William Schulz approximately 7:15 p.m.
Um Kobe you had some questions regarding this one and um were you able to get those answers so we can >> Sorry. Is this the railroad trail or 73 emery? >> 73 Emory.
>> Yeah. No, we uh I have the sorry the the proper person is on the form now. So the form is [clears throat] ready to be signed. It's in the folder. Um, Bill Scholes is representing or
assisting in this uh in the processing of the COC, but we have the right person the present owner of the apartment on the form now. >> Okay. So, that was where it was mixed up and >> yes, >> thank you. Last meeting,
>> we didn't have the present owner signature. >> Nope. >> The actual present owner listed on the form, >> right? Schultz couldn't represent as a >> that wasn't appropriate because he he's just a contractor and >> doing the work.
>> No, no, that's not okay. >> And again, this is a uh just for review, this is a fairly old COC from 2009. Um [snorts and clears throat] but now it's being changing hands and they want the um all the no loose ends to to hold
up the sale of the house. >> Okay. >> Containment's [clears throat] been received. >> Yes. >> We drove to a um >> the turnover form is in the folder. >> Okay. So I make a motion to um issue a
certificate of compliance for 73 Emory Road. Second >> file number 308-0579 >> second >> slow down. >> I just wanted to Yeah. >> Vote starting with Sandy. >> Sandra Lord. Yes.
>> Mike P said yes. >> James B. Yes. >> James Gates. Yes. >> Pat Jal. Yes. >> Second. I just want to make sure he got his second in right away. >> If you could pass the signature form
around for the other ones here, that would be great. It's >> I believe form 8B. >> Yeah. >> One on top. >> Yeah. Do you [clears throat] have other copies to sign or just this one?
>> I will make copies of that one. [clears throat] We have three. >> [clears throat] >> Do you have an agenda for tonight? >> I do. There's uh several on the cover. >> Yeah. Thank you, Mark.
There's two pages to it. >> Kobe, is this just a single sign off on Schultz? Wait a minute. There's a second page. >> [cough] [clears throat] [clears throat] >> Thank you. Mhm. Take [laughter]
[clears throat] a main desk. >> [clears throat] >> All right, moving on. 2.2 COC for Squan Rail Trail Pile number 308-0669 Atkins Squan Greenways approximately
720. Jimmy, you're going to run this one. stuff out. [clears throat] [clears throat] >> So, we're just going to do basic opening on open this, Jimmy. >> What? >> We're just going to open it. >> Let's open it. >> All right. So, it's all set.
>> Okay. I'll um finish up on the uh order of conditions for the Squander Cook Trail D file 308-0669 applicants greenway um at 720 I who's going to be
up yours if there's any thing other than >> Did you have any loose ends? >> No. walk through >> real briefly if you don't mind me stepping in. >> I didn't know which of the two. >> So we did discuss this at the last
meeting. Uh this is for the certificate of compliance for the rail trail. Um there were several conditions that they had to meet uh to excuse me. Uh there were uh several
items that the Squan Greenways had to fulfill to um uh be able to satisfy the all the conditions of the certificate of complaints which [clears throat] they have. Uh there was found on appendix,
excuse me, uh um attachment fee. Um but we can I can bring those up. Those were elicit discharge form and um remind me what else was on there. >> Well, there was some other things such as describe the structures and
[clears throat] describe the uh the surface. >> Well, we discussed this last time and the reason we didn't vote, we didn't have a quorum, right? >> So, we've pretty much discussed it, I think. >> Right. I don't think we missed anything.
We were just once again [clears throat] >> short >> sure blaming. [laughter] >> No, no. I was back looking at the owl. Now we have a quorum. She she can vote. So Sandra will be there. So we have four. >> Yeah. >> So we're good to go.
>> All of those documents are available. >> Is there anything you wanted to bring up on the screen? Anything other than that? But >> I can bring up a whole slew of snowy pictures >> if you like. >> We don't need that. It's not going to
help us in the description of it. >> No. Monitoring is um for years now. um in myself throughout this year. Uh especially especially the areas that are most interested behind the old church
where there is a um a storm water system uh which they didn't require a permit. It's a drainage for storm water and that's been being monitored. >> Everything has stabilized well down behind the geese.
>> Yep. I will uh that's under a water another permit for water quality >> which the D is overviewing >> it's not applicable to their COC >> just wanted to double check so >> there were steep slopes which have been
um stabilized um some with trap rock uh others with vegetation I don't see any real areas of concern >> and some of the areas where you put a large concentration of the trap rock was down where they're doing the bridge
rehab. That was a that was one area of concern I recall where there was a lot of erosion control on that >> which bridge >> um >> by the by the coupe bridge >> down from the coupe bridge all the way. >> Oh yeah, down further. Yeah.
>> Where they're doing the new >> past the fisherman's parking lot. Yeah, >> that's what I was trying to the fisherman's parking lot. It was a and I went and looked at it and it it seemed to be holding well. I didn't see any any more disruption from the pictures Jimmy had show me previously. So, I'm okay
with everything. Bill, did you want to add any more to this? >> Let's get this done for you. >> Be very patient for and we thank you. I'll make a motion >> that we um grant a certificate of
compliance to the Swan Cookook Rail Trail VP file number 308-0669. >> Second >> James Doryan second. >> Wait [laughter] a minute. You don't need two seconds. I mean, I'm sorry. I was I
wanted to make sure she wasn't Yeah. >> Yeah. I'm here. I'm here. I'm sorry. I'm >> not going anywhere. >> So, ask for a vote. >> Yeah. What's up? Ready for a uh to vote. Starting with Mike Platet.
>> Mike Petta. Yes. >> James Doryan. Yes. >> Pat Jones. Yes. >> Sandra Lord. Yes. >> Okay. I don't know what that is. [laughter] >> Yeah, that's I was trying to prompt her
to >> Oh, I see. Okay. >> Oh. Oh. Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't take the hand. >> That's okay. All right. So, we're all set. >> I'm just following question. Is there some form that you're going to send us? >> There is. Yeah. And uh can you send the
signature sheet around now? >> It's in there's a 73 emory. >> Yeah. Is it right? Excuse me. Real trail. >> Are you going to need to Are are you going to require my signature on any of this?
>> We have enough signatures here. You can come in tomorrow and sign it if you like. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Actually, I do. I I I should be in tomorrow. I have to u be down there anyways for something else. So, yeah, I can drop there. >> [clears throat]
>> Kobe, does does this have does um Jimmy have to close a hearing or is [clears throat] >> uh No, this is not a hearing. >> This is not hearing. >> That's why I was asking if we needed I wasn't sure if we didn't complete it
from last week. >> So, just while you're doing this, there's a point of information. You probably all know this already, but we won a mass trails grant last year to do um permitting for the section from
street all the way into the border. >> So you heading into Well, >> we are we are going to be hire, you know, we're we haven't finally signed the contract, but we're going to be signing a contract with Roy to lead the
permitting effort. So you guys will hopefully be seeing a lot of them. >> So you ended up I I guess just going into Groten at that point in time. >> That's theirs further. There's [clears throat] really no more of that. >> No, no, we're doing that too, but that
involve towns and conservation commission. >> It affects you guys. So the next phase will be it'll start from >> no the um the state is insisting that we permit the entire trail all at once. We
are certainly not going to build the whole trail all at once all in one generation >> and now all the way right to the N4 >> correct to where it picks up the base rail trail. >> But I mean there's a lot of challenges there. We have two state highway
trussels. Two trestles. >> Two trussles. >> And you know, >> so the center and in behind for the other truss, >> correct? >> Okay. >> But just just a heads up, nothing's filed. We haven't even signed the deal
yet. you guys not to get off track. >> Wonderful news and I'd love to have you come back and be on the agenda and talk about it. >> You want to keep the meeting? >> Right. Right. I just that was
purelyformational and we have something more definitive. >> We'll be back. >> He's so busy talking. I just >> sign a bridge crossing down
your pass or 800 foot bridge [clears throat] over the river and everything. I think I'm appropriate at 29. >> Thank you. >> Bye Joan. >> Bye Joan. Bye Bill.
>> No, I'm saying >> Oh, good. Make sure [clears throat] >> uh 2.3 request for determination of applicability for 10 West Elm Street PWB
uh 2026-00 applicant DASM LLC replacement of septic systems within 100 foot wetland buffer approximately 7:30. It is 7:32. >> Um [clears throat] pursuant to the master WPA and towns and
wetlands bylaws. The towns of Hong Kong will hold a work session [clears throat] on Wednesday, January 28th during their 7:00 meeting. hearing will be held virtually via Zoom. Um [laughter] and in person on a request for determination of applicability filed
with uh the Concom by Basum LLC as TWWB 2026-001. Which one is correct? >> There's a difference. [clears throat] >> Mhm. 01 and 0. Did you forget the one?
>> I forgot the one. It is 001. [clears throat] >> Okay, >> thank you. >> No problem. >> It is 01. >> Yep. >> Okay. >> Uh the property is located at 10 West Elm Street,000 suspect map 48 parcel 20. Proposed project is for the replacement
of a subject system within 100 foot of a bordering vegetative wetland. Parties wishing to speak in support of or in opposition to this application may do so at a meeting uh or in writing prior to meeting. >> [clears throat] >> This just came in before it started
snowing. >> Yep. And I I I was actually able to get out there and get some pictures of it. >> Yes, please. >> Okay, [clears throat] that's Mr. Hartley. Uh, if it's Hartley there, can
I share? Oh, I got to send a request. Are you able to share the plan? This is Mary and Depinto, Three Oaks Environmental. I did the wetland delineation at the site working on it. Okay. Thank you. We're there >> actually. Yeah, that's a good idea. I'll
put that up. That's also [clears throat and cough] excuse me. >> [clears throat and snorts] >> This might look this is the wetlands I've seen before. The plans are a little loud. >> Sorry.
>> No, I don't like the actual digital uh PDF. [laughter] Need to change that. >> That might be back in the office. [clears throat] >> [clears throat]
>> the PDF of it. >> I don't have a PDF of it. >> I got a copy of the plans here, but >> yeah, I just don't >> a digital copy get sent to the E or submitted.
Do you have the applica uh representative right there? >> Chris Stoddard is the engineer and submitted the plan. Um I have an electronic copy on another laptop I'm sitting next to right now um so that I can look at it. But um they went back
picked up my wetland flags uh and added those to the plan and put the erosion control barrier down. There's a it's a failed system. Uh the existing leech field is probably within 20 ft of the wetland at this point. Um it will be
more than 50 ft um from the wetland beyond the 50ft wetland buffer zone. It required a variance from the local uh uh setback which is 100 ft for leechfield from the wetland boundary. Uh however
they did the board of health did approve it Monday night. So the system has been approved. The erosion controls are shown. Um what else can I tell you? The the system that's proposed is a new technology. Um
it involves having a septic tank that uh goes to a pump chamber and the pump chamber actually doses the system slowly. So and the system's designed in such a way it doesn't have to be mounted. So you're not getting a bunch
of fill in the uh in the yard. It's at literally in the top two feet of the uh surface of the ground. Um the water table in that backyard, it's all in the backyard area where there's existing lawn. Um it's the the water table's
between 24 and 28 in uh annual high water. So it it it's tight. And you can see by the contours on the plan that the wetland itself is down around elevation 319 uh 320 in in between the two contours of
322. Um so that pretty much fits the location of the wetland um in terms of water table and the uh the offset from it in order to be able to fit the system. The whole property except for a little corner is within 100 ft of the
wetland. tiny lot. It's a little tiny stream channel that disappears, kind of spreads out, and then there's another channel that appears to be street runoff. I did not investigate it any further. Um, it just pops out of the ground. There's a picture of it in my
report and flows into that wetland area. It has no wetland vegetation around. It's steepsided. Um, I I believe it's run off, but it would be counted as a stream channel under the uh the uh local
bylaw. I believe uh not under state law. [clears throat] >> I don't know if you have any questions at this point. >> Is this system at all like a presby? No, it's >> it's called a geomat. >> Okay. Okay.
And there's some sand involved above and below it in the geomat. Um so it it it percolates slowly through the uh soil. >> So >> and that's what reduces the need to put so much mounding or other materials to the top of it.
>> Exactly. You don't need 4 foot separation. And in order to do that, you would end up having to bring in tremendous amount of fill on a very tiny lot. And and then that would probably bring the fill right to that wetland edge and we start sloping not to avoid
breakouts >> up right to that [snorts] right to that edge. >> Yeah. So >> go ahead. >> Out of customer cost is is this a much more expensive system? >> Jimmy, I gota I gota I got to reel that in.
>> Well, I got to I'm just I don't >> I don't know the answer to that. I'm I'm a wetland scientist. Um, I've, you know, I work with people that are registered sanitarians and so I I've picked up some of the lingo and and understanding of these things, but I'm not qualified to
answer that as far as costs. >> As much as I want to dabble in what you just asked. [clears throat] >> No, I just find out though. It'd be interesting. >> If a customer is going to be looking at a a system much more expensive just to be able to save in material, I'd like to
understand it. Um that's all >> what is the access of the project going to be in stockpiling of the soil? I know there's >> I I asked the engineer um the same question. Any soil that is removed will
be taken off site. The existing beach field is going to be abandoned in place and the existing tank will be pumped and removed and replaced with a 1500 uh gallon tank as as required [clears throat] by title five,
but there'll be no stockpiling of soil on the site. >> So the [clears throat] old tank will be punched. >> The old crushing it in place. They looks like they're removing it according to the description on the plan. >> Okay. [clears throat]
Uh what about access? Are they coming in from the existing driveway? If so, that >> the salt fence should be widened out there. >> Yeah. However, their access point is I think they might be able to get in. Well, it can be adjusted to meet their
needs. Um I think they can get in from that corner, but maybe not. I That's where the engineer put it. >> It's such a flat piece of land, too, that uh uh maybe the straw waddles might
even be sufficient by themselves. But they put down silk fencing and straw waddles. >> I don't very wide separated contour lines. It is It displays as well. >> Yeah. you [clears throat]
want to share? >> I do, but I can't get them on here. I can give you the iPad to look at me >> and I can make these available later, but for whatever reason, can't access them through my computer.
Uh, so I have four or five pictures here. Uh, I don't know if you want to everyone get in on this. >> Well, we can pass, >> right? So you go up to >> here. This is the rail trail. So swipe right.
>> Oh yeah. >> Yeah. >> Here you go. >> Send it to Matt. >> No, Pat wants to look. >> Yeah, you two become. >> Yeah, I'll do the swiping. Okay, here you go. So, this is the backyard. This is at the back of the house looking towards the wetland
>> again. Um, if we were here, we'd be standing at towards the deck and looking out towards this direction towards the left. >> Turn that and face that to the camera for Sandy. >> Yeah, I just saw her. I was like, >> that's okay. >> Oh, Sandy.
>> That would be tougher to make it. >> There you go. [laughter] >> Oh my word. That's >> okay. Thank you. That's [laughter] okay. >> That's what fine.
>> Uh I'll I'll give you one more aspect. This is at the wetland looking back at the house. And you're right, it's very flat. >> That was pretty much off site once I got to the wetland. >> Here you go. >> Was on the next lot.
>> Well, you can >> there's anything more specific around. So this is the um >> the canal street would come across this way. >> So is that a different view? >> Yes. >> Oh well. >> Yeah. >> Kobe gave up. I think he's disappointed
us. [laughter] >> See the locust map shows that it's this long narrow here. And it seems like there should be um these houses are right on Main Street, right? >> Correct. Okay. >> Oh, where' it go? >> We're going to split screen there. I know. I'm trying.
>> I see. Okay. That's a backyard. >> Okay. [clears throat] Thank you. >> Expecting to see the houses there. >> We >> Yeah, >> I see. Now >> I I can speak to the termination that I put on there if you like. >> Uh yeah, now we will. Yeah, [laughter]
>> me as well. Uh so I suggested a negative five um determination which which uh means that the area is subject to uh WPA weapons protection act regulations. Uh
but the the activity is exempt under 10.583A I believe but it's written on the floor if you need the exact um uh location of of the exemption. [clears throat]
>> So negative five years suggestion. >> So what does that all mean? >> What we just said? >> Can you come over and explain it louder? >> Yep. Hold on, Sandy. Uh, he's gonna he explained it, but I don't think you heard him.
>> So, there are several categories for um determinations. They are um some are negative determinations, some are positive determinations. Negative determinations that it means that it can be allowed the project can be allowed
possibly with uh conditions. Uh a positive, it's a little backwards. positive determination means that it is not allowed under the wetlands protection act. Um, now if it were to be a positive determination, there is a
process to to supersede to to supersede that or apply for a a further review. >> Okay. >> That's not the case here. >> With a positive determination, you it says basically file a notice of intent
to do the work. Oh, okay. >> Thank you. >> And a negative means you don't have to go any further. This is the sort of the end of the line for permitting. >> Oh, okay. >> Thank you. Thank you both. >> That [clears throat] was a good help right there.
>> That was >> I'm good with this. You need >> um >> No. I think >> 58 is related to Rivers act. Wouldn't it
be better if it was a a negative -3 for work in the buffer zone that won't alter? It's a suggestion just so just so D doesn't say >> going to go out Jimmy as a negative Col's recommendation was a negative
five. >> Yeah. Yeah. That's um I was considering that. Um >> yeah, either way I I don't know what the what uh that um further benefit that is. I think the result is the same.
>> I think yeah, >> but yeah, if uh you can make a case for that, please. I don't think >> the um conservation I mean D might look at it saying oh septic systems exempt it's not in the riverfront and that
exemption is specifically for septic repairs in the riverfront area which are exempt from the riverfront standards. >> Um so I think a three would be better and would not raise eyebrows at D. um if it's work in the buffer zone that
won't alter the resource area. >> It's a repair it changes there on our own. So >> So in other words, due to it being a repair that >> Maryanne, thank you for that explanation. >> Changes the status. >> Okay. I
I I understand we came from because the words exemption there and then he you know >> um stating the >> 10 CMR. >> No, his suggestion certainly seems appropriate. >> Yeah. Thank you, Mike. >> I used to work for D. I didn't want to
mention that up front or anything, [laughter] but >> we we appreciate any helpers. >> Well, I get the big picture. It's too bad I can't do a site visit, so I get a sense of what it's like, but it turns terms of the map. It it's interesting
that the compass rose is uh perfectly um perpendicular and parallel to the borders, which makes me wonder if this was rotated in order to make that happen or whether the compass rows might be up by a little bit, but I'm not sure. I'd have to check that out, but I don't see
a diagram that shows the erosion control. >> There's a dotted line there on the plan. Is it going to be Um, I'm going to do >> silt fence [clears throat] and and waddles or see this.
>> That's what it says. It says it's going to be silt fencing and straw waddles to be installed prior to construction activities commencing. >> Are you looking for a diagram, Mike, or you looking for a legend? >> Well, well, the what's shown on the legend as a fence?
>> I don't know if that's the silk fence. It's not exactly the same um as [clears throat] what's shown on the map. >> I think that would demonstrate silt fence. >> Yeah. And so, but this is fence, >> right? So, that's the stakes, >> right? >> But we're not but we're not showing
silt. I mean waddles. You're looking for the waddles. >> Well, no, no, no. There's no detail for the the fence and the the silt fence and the waddles. >> That's what Mike's saying. >> There is no there's no diagram for it. >> He was looking for the legend first. Well, this this says fence. I don't see
any fences. And that that is not the same >> as what's shown here. >> Actually, >> it's similar, but not not the same. >> I But that I think they dramatized that as the stakes and the silk fence,
>> but there's no detail for the for those. >> No, >> I I think there is, isn't there? No, >> usually there's a there's a diagram up here, >> right? Yeah, there's a fair amount of information on the plan. Um,
>> right. >> Um, >> what else, Mike? >> Uh, well, there's the reminder that you wanted the u the erosion canurl to extend up to the driveway >> beyond the driveway, >> the other corner. Yeah.
>> Yeah. >> Yeah, that would work. Yeah. Just if include that as a condition, that would be perfect. >> Okay. to extend the waters all the way to the corner to >> erosion >> up to the it's not just
>> up to here. >> Maybe just actually between the end of the existing driveway and the shed just have it go like this so that >> Yep. Y >> whatever comes down the driveway, >> right? It was within the
>> W some room to work >> and it's almost like >> So what they were doing Hey, so what they were doing there is they were trying to keep the soul pens on the edge of the 50ft popper. >> Right. [clears throat] >> So with that said, >> see how it's curving? >> Mhm. being realistic, they're not going
to come down the side this side of the yard with the portion of the ramp are on because it's narrow and because it's um that's requires restoration which is expensive. Uh it'd be better to come in from the existing driveway side.
>> Yeah. And it's lawn and and you know it's already disturbed area >> paved in that doesn't have anything. Not. It's just the way the water's going to flow.
>> Mhm. It's pretty flat back here, though. So, >> very much. >> We didn't call for sight walk on that, did we? It came in. >> We We did. I I gave I said to because it was right before the storm to >> Okay.
>> by the driveway or by the roadside and take a look. But >> Kim and I talked about it. I said, "You better get out there before it snows and take pictures." >> Yeah, that's right. That's what it came down to. >> Yeah, I would have taken a run out to take a peek at it, but I mean it is what it is.
>> Um Pat, >> do you have any feedback or comments or questions, concerns? >> No, just as I said, there was nothing up here. So, I was wondering too if they just omitted
it or figured what they put at the bottom was going to be enough and we would understand that. >> Mike, >> you know, you could have a condition that the uh agent inspects the erosion controls to make sure they're properly installed.
>> I like that idea. >> Yeah, that sounds good. >> Team thoughts. Um, Sandra, this one's hard for you because you're not here, >> right? >> Um, this wasn't in the folder that you sent
out today. >> No, I don't have a digital copy. Um, we need to figure that one out with our regulations. Um, yeah, I could hold it up, but we already pictures. I don't want to get too much
entertainment. Um, >> yeah, >> you have enough. >> So, Sandra, you can [clears throat] do as you please. Um, and if you want to, we could continue this so you can come in and look at it. I I um I think us
here um >> we are ample to be able to vote on it anyway. >> Right. But I want to give our >> No, I'm not trying to not be inclusive to it, but I wouldn't be a fail to hold it up, >> right? >> It the system does need to be repaired.
It is in failure. So, >> well, it sounds like you guys >> um have what's the expression? Uh dotted your eyes and crossed the tees already, you know? >> Right. >> Okay. >> Yeah.
>> I mean, I'm listening to what you guys are saying and everything and you guys have a a lot more experience with this kind of uh setup. So, >> Okay. I just want to make sure that >> unless you thought that I really have a need to come see it to really I mean
make a determination would this affect the deter my vote greatly this piece of it? >> Um no I don't think so. I it's a it's a standard system. Um
so I just want to make sure that Yeah. I don't want you to feel left out. That's why. >> No, I appreciate it. What is What is that last little >> uh image that you guys were looking at? Uh what is the uh like exact
>> the [clears throat] backyard? >> So, it's a different viewpoint. One one last view. >> Yeah, it's it's it's literally just a flat backyard with a bunch of brush and stuff on the back side. The system's outside of the 50 foot buffer. >> Okay. So
>> I I have no objection to if when you're you guys are ready to vote, I'll be fine. >> All right. So um make a motion to uh issue a negative three determination. So it is going >> uh with [clears throat]
>> the following conditions of um agent inspecting sil fence and waddle. I mean when you say agent if Kobe's busy he can send me down agent or commissioner include him
>> the commission can expect inspect prior to [clears throat] >> I have a question. How long does it take to repair a system like this? And I understand there's some new technology going in too. So, but I don't know if it'll be tough to say
>> the uh the applica I've been texting the engineer and he says we want to install it this month. >> Oh, okay. >> Looking at it. Yeah. And it's good. Everything's frozen, which is actually probably helpful. >> Oh, okay.
>> The equipment won't be sinking into the ground and all of that. >> I'm not I'm not done with muffles. Um, so special condition agent. [laughter] >> Don't let him growl at you.
>> No growling at me. Just grow. >> Is it my dyslexia or can I not find where it says silence? >> Oh, down here. Okay. [laughter] >> There you go. >> Mike is our resident plan expert that
>> he enjoys doing it. He usually color >> res picky. didn't say >> um all right commissioner uh agent or commissioner inspect salt fence and waddle um [clears throat]
um soap fence to be extended to uh corner of driveway [clears throat] by shed. 24 acres. [laughter] [clears throat] >> Is there a second? >> I'll second that. >> Second. A roll call vote starting with
Sandra. >> Sandra Lord. Yes. I >> said yes. >> James Dyan. Yes. >> James Gates. Yes. >> Pat Jalo. Yes. Thank you, Maryanne. >> You're welcome. Thank you all. Have a good evening. We appreciate your time.
>> Do you need us to find it? I wrote down >> snuck that in on you Mike at the bottom there. >> Yeah. with that with that arrow pointing to the three on it along like that. I'll take that and I'll take the one
next to you, please. Mean this one. Mhm. Okay. Where's JW? [laughter] >> [laughter] >> I don't know. Can't think of anything. I can give you the entire documents if
[clears throat] you need or I can sign the signature. Um, oh, I like to keep it going if that's okay. But I also know you don't want to have to chase us. >> Keep going. I don't turn on [clears throat]
[clears throat] [clears throat] all the way. >> Feels good. [clears throat] >> Cody just realized it, too. >> I haven't left my house all week. >> It's cold out. >> You don't have to. Don't. Right. That's
right. >> We only have to sign this list one. Two. Pay >> attention. [clears throat] Mhm. Boom. [clears throat] I keep
it double check. Thank you. >> [clears throat] >> Uh 2.4 Four, wetland protection act and town and wetland bylaws. Potential regulation violation approximately 7:45 is 8:00. Uh removal of trees
um or vegetation within 200 ft of riverfront area without a permit at the following property. Z Main Street, 72 Main Street, 80 Main Street, Zero Main Street, Zero Off Main Street, Boston Main Railroad property. [clears throat]
One, two, three, four, five, six. This was [clears throat] for um trees that were dead end vines that um probably strangled them. There was no permit pulled. No notification of to the
conservation commission. [clears throat] Did you get a chance to go down there and look at it? >> I did. Yeah. I didn't see them all, but I saw I saw them >> with the snow or not >> before the snow. >> Okay. >> Yeah, some of them were pretty good size. And
then there was another dead one on neighboring property. It looks like it's probably going to have to come down, too. But so they were all dead beforehand. >> No, >> they weren't all dead. >> Do you mind identifying yourself?
Isabelle not. >> So you here to represent H&V? Okay. [cough] >> Yeah, we didn't know anything about it. We went along with just not only I noticed the trees that got cut down, but there was quite a number of branches
that were trimmed to improve the view. We didn't notice that as well. So it's done professionally. Somebody hired them. It wasn't us. So and there's no digit. There's no downfall. They shipped everything and hauled it away. It's super clean. So, it's like who hired
that action. >> Okay. So, what was Oh, sorry. I I should have read the rest of this. >> Yeah. >> Property owners representatives invited to discuss towns and historic Society Haulings worth realy advisory.
>> Next time, don't put put that in bold because I just stop. [laughter] Got it. kind of trumped it with the figure. So, I know we have uh representatives from historic society. Um
thought I saw someone else. [clears throat] Chris, Bill, thank you for joining us. >> Sure. >> So, this started with a a tree that fell during a snowstorm. Yeah. and was threatening the Reed homestead.
And so we contacted Wall-E's Tree Service to come in and uh Jock Snape was actually the person directly in charge, but you know, we we heard from them, but he contacted them and Jock said there was other trees that looked like they
were questionable and uh and as far as I know, those were the trees that were taken down. >> So, did you flag them? Did you drag marshmallow as you wanted them to? >> I did not. I was not involved. I was just >> So, I'll just plead ignorance here.
Hollingsworth and Bose, >> they own the dam. >> Oh, they own the dam. Okay. >> So, near where that electric box is, the historic district commission. I assume that to be HMBB's property >> due to it being the SLLE way which you
people control the water. >> Yep. >> The two trees were cut down on either side of the power box. >> Mean the ornamental [clears throat] jade trees that were planted in there. >> I don't know what they were before. All it is >> well let's identify what they ornamental jade.
>> Where's the property? >> Where are the property lines? um >> cuz it's [clears throat] six different apostles. >> Mhm. >> Is there someone we can contact to find
out who >> I couldn't hear you? What? >> Well, I just was wondering if there was some way of contacting the person who cut them down. >> I can hover the my cursor over it. you know, we'll cut them down.
>> She she wasn't she >> I can walk you through the entire site. It's going to be a little bit difficult online. And um if you have suggestions on how to make that easier, let me know. Um [clears throat]
>> okay, so this is Harbor uh Route 119 South Street here. Uh we have Reed Homestead here and the old church here with two uh private houses in between.
This is the rail trail coming through. Uh this is the brook that comes across the properties and this zero address here is Hollingsworth and Bose property. 72 and 80 are
historical society uh as well as zero main street. Um obviously this is the railway which is the MBTA represented by Greystone uh trees.
>> The MBTA property is leased for 99 years by Squad Greenways. >> I'm sorry. the the Squad Greenways has a 99-year lease on that property. >> Okay. >> So, I I don't know. >> Yeah. I don't know. Um well, I I go for
permitting and violations. I go off of who the um per uh property owner of record is. Um and it comes out to the MBTA. >> They are the owner. Yes. Um,
>> so you lease it from them for 99 years, correct? >> As far as trees, >> you're representing >> that were removed. There were two uh large pine trees from this zero address. And correct me if I'm wrong, anyone. Uh,
there was a line of trees in this area here, probably Norwood Spruce, I would say, but there was 10 trees there or so. Um there were dotted uh trees along in this zero address. Um and along the
brook here there were uh probably four or five other trees that were removed. Uh as well as one large tree which might have been like a cedar or something right there. I'm not sure. Um
sizes. Do you want sizes? Does it matter? How many of the trees were over 12 in [clears throat] PBH? >> Oh, the two big pine trees near the church were much bigger than 12 in. >> Yeah. One was pine, one was maple.
>> Okay. >> Okay. >> At that point was a big king pine that did not had a was a matter of time for that one. >> And according to Wall-E, the maple also had a lot of rock. Did it? >> Yeah.
There there is a story behind those two trees, but that's different from everything else. But >> so we're gonna look at these >> per well. Oh, per lot. >> Yeah, never mind. I'm all set with this, you know. >> No, I I'm asking a question. I got Are
we going to go through these >> per lot? What trees were removed on what area? We have six different lots and all these trees. How are you going to break it down?
I can I can assist with the pictures. Um, you know, there was the snowstorm that came in >> that throws everybody off >> a little bit, but uh this is uh Hollingsworth and Bose property here.
And there's a there was a stump in here and there was another one. >> This is along the broke for Hollings and Bose. >> I have the same picture. >> I'm sorry. I have the same picture. >> Okay. Um
you can see one, two combined, but that's separate tree technically. One, two, three. I'm not making I don't know what the conditions of the trees were before. I'm just counting stumps here. See another one over here. So on that property alone is
five or six. Um that's the >> 72orth and Lowe's property. That's a zero address. >> So that's the first one on the list. >> Yes. >> Kobe, do you have a picture of the power box where those two ornamental trees
were removed? >> I do. >> That says the historic district. >> Yeah. >> Which is >> so it doesn't get too >> HMVs. Correct. Those Okay. >> This is a large uh that's at least 24. >> Well, I don't have my T with me, but um
that's at least 18 in there. This is on the Reed Homestead property. This is another angle of it. This is on the opposite side of the Reed homestead >> back in between the homestead and
>> between 72 and the abiding house there. I don't remember. >> Was there any cut down on the property house or all on the >> homestead side? >> Correct. Homestead side. Oh, >> this is the back to the homestead. And
>> the squan the haba pond is to the right. >> Oh, straight back. >> Straight back. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> You're looking towards >> straight back. Correct. Yep. You're looking from 119 going through Kobe. >> Yeah. 119 at your back here. Looking
towards the harbor, >> the big lake. Okay. >> Again, another angle of it. a large tree there. Again, same trees. Uh this is deeper in the same area.
And this is the same area as well. Uh I believe the answer is in uh between the Reed Homestead and A Main Street. I'd have to go look at the property. This one would be easy to find
though. You say that there's quite a bit of snow up there. Is that >> this is probably on the private property? I don't know exactly where >> Can you zoom into that stump, please?
>> Pine. >> And are we looking at the center of it rotted out? >> We've got red rot in the middle, right? >> Yeah. >> Okay. So that would be the one Wall-E would have referred to as being in pretty tough shape. >> I don't know. >> Okay.
>> Just to be more specific, that looks like spruce to me. >> Mhm. >> Uh this, you know, this is at the point when I did get there and this one red maple here and this is uh right next to the utility pole uh with the electrical
box on it. This red maple was uh fairly damaged with a slight lean towards the the uh uh power lines. It has been removed since this was the last tree standing when I was there. So >> that was the one you told them to take down, >> correct?
>> So okay, I was going to ask that. You did say his >> at that point. It was one tree left that uh for the plan and it was uh one that was endangering the power lines. >> You you said one [clears throat] tree
left on the plan. >> Um not on a physical plan. I discussed it with Wall-E himself and he said that that was the last remaining tree that they were intending on taking down. plan.
>> Well, uh >> I didn't Who asked the question? >> Could you speak a little? >> Let's keep going. Let's keep going. >> Following a plan. Who provided the plan? >> This is what >> she just asked the same question I
wanted to know. >> I can't speak. >> What did Wall-E get given to him to go off of to cut trees from six different lots? I'll leave my question there. >> Finish this up. This is just a different
angle of >> finish. [clears throat] Well, for this Reed Homestead looking towards his [clears throat] composed property in the old fire station
post removal of the trees. Uh this is one near the uh I believe this was actually on Hollingsworth and property too, but don't quote me on that. You would have to go and look at property lines, but it is right on near
to the river edge. For what it's worth, that one did look like it was dying. >> Yeah, the dying trees provide habitat for 87 different species. dying trees if there is not a reason to remove them. >> If there's a danger of limbs falling, then you trim the limbs and leave the
tree. >> At least it property. That's our policy. >> That's a good point. I shouldn't be commenting on the condition of the trees. >> Again, uh this is this is nothing. I thought these trees were for coming down because the green tape
around them they are still up. >> Yeah. Well, >> the trail just put a picture of the trail here and the area where two large trees were taken down on the MBTA properties
greenways. Would one of those trees been a weeping willow? One of them, or were they all? >> Yeah, one pine and the other was maple. >> Okay, so the two behind the church were pine and maple. I got you. Okay,
>> that's the end of the picture. You could uh go through and get a count of the trees if need be in total there. I'm sure there were uh I think that there were may have been a few more near the river's edge, but I didn't get a
picture of those before. They stole the snow [clears throat] question. >> Yes, sir. So I not knowing much about this, but I would hope that a tree service would
Wall-E would have asked if the owners if permission had been granted to take the trees down. They he knew that they were close to the to to the lake. So maybe that isn't a policy. Next question is I
can see treadmarks there. If this had been done properly, would there have been would we have required some kind of erosion control? >> Yeah, because that's typical of a standard order of conditions,
>> right? >> On the on the one hand, there should have been there should have been some kind of erosion control. On the other hand, um it looked pretty level and for the most part it probably didn't cause any
habitat destruction other than these trees are gone and they I agree that they are valuable parts of the habitat. So I just you know wonder the so who exactly asked Wall-E to do
it? So Jock Snave, as you said, he's a director of the National Historical Society, was the one who took the lead in getting these trees done. Unfortunately, he had a medical appointment tonight, so he couldn't make it. I think he did send an email to you.
>> And so he seems that it didn't occur to him that he should go come to us. I would, you know, I don't want to speak for Jock, but that's quite possibly the case because he's new at this and, you know, I wasn't involved in the situation, but
no experience. >> I don't know what you do about it once the trees are gone. [music] >> I didn't hear >> that's the tragedy. You can't put an old tree back. It's not >> No, >> one of those things.
Well, I have a I have a comment I'd like to add. Now, >> yes. >> Um, now the person who the company that took the trees down, now there must have been working with trees
within the um insensitive areas before. you know, this shouldn't have been something new to them to ask for uh conservation to get conservation involved. You know what I'm saying?
>> Yeah. Um it it shouldn't be new to him because two years ago I asked Jacques to stop cutting down a tree that was right there. So >> ah that's rather disturbing to hear
actually. Well, people forget to um but I'm not making excuses. Pat, what do you think? >> I I think that they should know. I mean, anybody that's running a business with the tree service should know all that
and and go before the board to [clears throat] find out if they can take the trees or not. And like she said, there are a lot of animals. I have some dead trees and between the birds making, you know, getting in there for the winter and, you know, the holes and
everything and the squirrels and all the other animals, you know, that's what they look forward to. I mean, that's how they get away from things. So, you know, I just leave them. I don't cut them down cuz they're dead, you know. I just
It's a shame. >> [clears throat] >> I I would like to see this kind of thing not happen with um and how can we going forward how can we
prevent this from happening? >> I think all the businesses with you know that are tree service that maybe we should >> not just tree service landscaping too. Well, or landscape maybe we there should be a either a notice put up somewhere at
the town hall if they read them or whatever stating you know what they should not be doing you know I mean even though they should know um >> well regardless
>> so other than a slap on the wrist I mean is there is binds usually done in a situation like that what's usually done even though this an unusual situation. >> Not unusual. We dealt with it already. We dealt with it just a couple months ago. >> Mhm. [clears throat]
>> With um Jared Woodcrafted onto a neighboring property that ordered um a wet area, >> right? >> We required a restoration plan as part of his notice of intent. >> Correct.
So, um, Ky, what are your thoughts? And I can say mine. We can go around the table and then talk to the [clears throat] >> Well, I guess I can give you the options. Um, >> can you hold on to to that part? >> Sorry.
>> Can you hold on to that part? >> I think so. What do you want me to speak to while I speak to >> um your observations? I know you you kind of had a guess of five to six trees on the first parcel, but um you know really an inventory of
sizes. >> Yeah. So >> helps determine things too. >> Yep. Um so it's a little bit multifaceted this problem here because [clears throat] you're dealing with property rights
infringement. um don't have a permit uh to work within the to do this activity within the riverfront area and you can there's actually multiple wetland resource areas
here if you looking at the brook that comes off of there. >> So you're in reference of the 100 and the 200 >> but actually there's two 200 foot river areas. >> Y just wanted you to make reference to it. >> Yep. So these the you know it's an area
that has um been subjected to a lot of other clearing um where there's just a ribbon of vegetation along the roof press. This is a little bit above and beyond the
scope of the conversation here, but um the the vegetation that has been removed served the purpose uh of solidifying um the soils uh that were near the riverfront uh and filter filtering of
groundwater which is very much needed there because there's a high a you know trans there's a couple transportation corridors there which are heavily used a lot of >> other words coming off >> interruption of the riparian zone.
>> Yep. Um I don't know what I I don't see a a specific real reason for the removal of trees. Um it's unclear. Uh
that's just for beginners. Since >> has a better view of the river now, >> they trimmed the branches on the trees. >> Please I have you have to >> Oh, excuse me. >> I have to keep order. >> My question did they get paid? Is it
because they got paid or they wouldn't get paid if they didn't take them down? >> What do you What do you mean? >> You know the the gentleman that had the trees cut down. [clears throat] Is it because >> Wallally's tree company would have been paid for the work that they have done
removing these trees if that's what you're asking. >> Well, that gives them more of an incentive to take them down than to leave them up. And that's what I'm asking. >> Well, it's a business, Pat. It's a business where somebody approached this company to remove these.
>> You can't re related to Wallally's Truth Company. I'm sorry. I mean if you wanted to see me correct me on this but it doesn't fall to the responsibility of the tree company. tree company was hired to come and remove trees by order of as
I narrow it down it would be the historical society >> but the historical society can't speak [clears throat] >> but but they were hired to to do so on >> the historic society cannot authorize
trees to be removed on HV's property correct That's a civil matter because we've all we've also dealt Oh, it's a very common sense question, but we've also dealt with this before where people have cleared onto other people's.
So it it's and and the person that [clears throat] the person that hired the company or the in this case entity are the responsible ones for
um enforcement or replication. Are you [clears throat] saying that the tree service, even though they've done lots of that stuff and should know that kind of business? [snorts] >> I think that's a separate conversation,
but I I appreciate what you're saying though, Sandra. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> We'll address it the same way I just did to Pat. While these tree service is not there to do an overview to go to
concert, they were hired to remove trees by the historic society. Okay. So, uh, >> so they don't bear any responsibility? >> No, ma'am. >> Okay. Doesn't seem like I don't know. It
sounds It seems like they should. >> Common sense structure. They were hired to remove the trees. They were not hired to do a survey to find out if the trees can or cannot be removed. >> Yes. But they should have known >> the past experience. >> Exactly. >> It more carefully.
>> But it doesn't come down to Wall-E. It comes down to the historic society. >> Correct. >> We keep circling back to this tree company that removed the trees. >> It could be any tree company though. It could be any tree company. Well, I think what I think what Sy's trying to say is
[clears throat] that it has to be acknowledged that what the tree company did, they should they they are owned and operated in Massachusetts or they operate in Massachusetts. They should be very familiar with the WPA. >> Mhm. >> I understand.
>> Um, >> are we trying to connect wallally? >> No, we're not trying to connect any what we have to connect or not even connect because we're not investigators. We're not the cops. The Historic Society hired them to clear a bunch of trees. They cleared trees that were not on their
property as far as the the scope of work and now we have to back up. We have to do the paperwork and we have to deal with it that way, which is a pain in the butt.
>> Yeah. [clears throat] >> What's the nature of the paperwork? It's a retroactive request for determination or notice of intent. >> We won't go under an RDA or you want to do an NOI.
>> They [clears throat] can figure it out themselves. >> Now, it'll go through cold. >> That's my opinion, but I'm only one vote. >> Well, I don't have any, >> you know, no ground was disturbed. No, no excusations are bill brought in um to
to be [clears throat] more on the grounds of an RDA >> and restoration >> the fact that they asked trees on neighboring property agent B um
cuz that's like trespassing. >> That's that's not But that's trespassing. Yeah, >> that's not our jurisdiction. >> But we'll be comfortable about how you just stated it, Mike. >> Right. >> But we can require restoration plan.
>> Spot on. >> Okay. Well, as I said, I don't have the u the um experience of how these things are mitigated, but by granting them an RDA, >> not granting them anything yet
>> or if we go that route in in a sense, it's probably twisted in my mind. In a sense, it's like, okay, we're backing up and almost pretending that we're do we're we're granting you permission to do this. So, in a way, we're saying it's
it's okay that you did it, >> if you follow what I mean. But it's not okay. >> No, sorry. >> But if that's what's usually done in this situation, I guess we might not have a choice.
>> I don't know. I'm I'm sorry, but I'm still stuck on the fact that I'm not picking on Wallally. It could be any tree cutting service. And and I'm I'm sure this is not going to be the last instance this happens. So how I mean I maybe that's another conversation, but
how can we >> uh prevent something like this from happening again for it to go through the proper channels? >> Um I'm I'm acknowledging that. Um Sandy um
and you're right. Uh again though we're we're focus we got to focus on what we came to discuss and that's the the cutting of trees within >> um and and really the you know it it is not um something we do every day and it
is not something that is encouraged but filing a retroactive um RDA or notice of intent is the way to go on this um so that the state issue their determination if need be. Um, and then
we can also require a restoration plan to replace the trees that were [clears throat] removed. >> So, >> okay. >> That's my take. Again, I'm only going to vote.
>> So, it comes down it was a major screw up and there's not much we can do about it. If it hadn't been done properly, maybe a few of the trees that were diseased, we might have given them permission to cut them down, but clearly
we would have marked or they would have marked the trees that were going to be uh cut down and they wouldn't have been on neighboring property. >> Would have only applied to their property. [clears throat] >> Yeah. What's that?
>> It would have only applied to their property now. >> So, it was a major screw- up. What are you going to do? You can't put the cheese back. >> Nobody can put something back. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> So, and that's not for us to determine how much. Well, you know, the quantity
or the, >> you know, they're going to have to hire someone to figure that out and submit a plan [clears throat] in a filing. >> I like to chime in at this point. I think we've listened to everybody along. Is there anything you wanted to add on to this, Pat? Are you pretty square with
how you feel about this, Jimmy? >> How I feel? >> Yeah. But um when when we have how how quickly when did you get the um the complaint, Kobe? How quickly did you
go out there? You went out pretty quick. >> You were right out there. >> It was the day. >> Okay. >> Yeah, >> I was there. The day also, but that was just the tail end of Kobe him filling in the truck and it was all it was done. >> Okay.
>> So if I could try and refocus with conservation commission to decide on is the regulations that were um >> not followed >> violated and the the permit that they
would have fallen under. Liability [clears throat] for is another question that is not for the commission to speak about. No and is liability issues all over the place here. Um
>> as far as we are cons the commission is concerned. I would say [clears throat] you have to consider that um these permits are by property. So, if you so chose, you could require a
>> individual individual property. >> We're looking at six properties here. I did not realize we were at six properties when I looked at it. I understood we were under historical society. That was the only one we were looking at.
>> Jimmy, um I get what Can I let Colobby finish? You're going the right direction, though. >> Yeah. Um >> I don't want him to lose his And uh if if you're thinking of remediation or uh
from the uh weapons protection act, you can expect the um what the responsible person, I'm going to use that term, whoever is deemed [clears throat] responsible here
to um replace the trees to its to its original condition. These are large trees. Um, >> is that stated in the wetland protection act? >> Yes. >> Um, I I can I don't hold me. I have to
find the specific verbage. >> Well, if there's any positive that comes out of this, I would hardress to call it a positive. If we do [clears throat] do a retroactive RDA
and they would have to hire an engineer and come up with a real plan for us. We can require that an RDA most >> I would say that's the minimum we should require but I don't know what
>> we also we also have the rate to charge twice the um the fee >> for retroactive filings because there's a lot of leg work involved in these >> oh boy if I could suggest um um
being a little bit Um if if you could hear out a representative from one of the properties the property that entry is without their consent. I don't know if you may have a
suggestion or some something that you may have in mind that would uh satisfy. >> So are you offering for >> No, I'm we're offering the historic society. >> Historic Society. Okay. Are you talking to me or I'm talking to Izzy?
>> Well, I would like to see happen. >> I'm sorry. >> I would like a restoration plan put in place and and definitely some for the penalty to slap the hand and say do not do this again given that we have history been mentioned today that it's happened
twice now for the same person. So clearly the message across is not getting coming across that you don't just go. >> Help me with you. You just said that >> you made mention that second [clears throat] >> had not been told not to cut trees. >> Was it a year ago? >> Two
>> two years ago. >> Yeah. When he cut that first tree at the power box. >> So there's there's um the behavior part is the disrespect is really irksome. >> I got to speak now. I'm I'm not happy.
We we've been put in a slippery slope here as the commission. I understand there was mention of permits in if any trees are going to be cut, society needed to come forward with with
the permitting. Was this not known a while back that if any trees were going to be removed, there was necessary permittmenting that needed to be done? I just hear from her
and the chair that Josh did have knowledge that he needed to take and get permitting to get the cut have any trees down. I only need to have verifications or yes or a no on this.
I I know Jock had that incident where he cut down Harbor and he was told for that. [clears throat] >> Did you know that that those arbiters were on
>> establish put a sixoot fence around our property section there? I think the historical society will think that's lovely because of course >> the historic district commission, >> right? point is that that would be an isore to the historic society's idea of what they're trying to create. However,
if they continue to disrespect property boundaries, that would be the behavior and some more. I'm just trying to establish if we have prior knowledge that if any trees needed to be removed with the
historic society or >> no matter who it is, >> they needed permitting. it it I'm getting the impression it was known and that it was disregarded and now it's on our lap and I I just don't
I this is really frustrating now we're in the middle of this and there was a lot of trees that can't be replaced nobody asked [clears throat] for permission to remove when they knew it that's what's f that's where my frustration comes in
>> I don't I don't know what degree I mean Jock knew That tree was on HV and I don't know what tree he needed. >> But I didn't stop him. >> We can't really speak for John. >> But I didn't stop him because the tree was on HV because I had no idea. I stopped him because it was close to the waterway. >> I didn't know. You didn't notice notify
us at all. >> But but I had stopped him because it was close to the waterway. So it was so I I >> So when a major tree company comes in to remove trees, nobody >> in the adult world have the common sense
to say does anybody have the paperwork or did anybody speak to conservation? Did anybody make any inquiries to the permitting we need to remove these
trees? So I think what what we not say jock knows a lot better than I did but there was a tree that fell and was threatening the reed homestead and [clears throat] I I understand that we can sit there and say look for public safety we would have taken these trees
for the sake of that it's creating too much shade and a molding factor is coming onto the building I understand that >> as far a reason I didn't I thought that the only tree been taken threatening treaty. >> It doesn't matter. Even if it's a
threatening treaty, you're supposed to have to get approval. Even if it's administrative on that, >> you've done enough of this. >> I I agree. >> If I just be honest with you, I wasn't involved much with the treat happened.
All I did was get a check bill. >> I don't know. I've been a commissioner long enough. We're on a slippery slope, but there's there's no way anyone can convince me that. Well, I didn't know we needed to get a permit. Well, nobody said anything to me about getting a permit when we're cutting trees two feet
from the the lake. I agree with you. I don't I don't disagree. >> So, it seems to me that your suggested alternative, >> well, your stated possible al
alternative. I can't think of any other way to go. Well, when >> which would require them to come up with a real good plan. >> They're going to have to at this point
when when I guess Hobie didn't move fast enough, a two phone calls were placed the state and I had to have a conversation with them about this. Um, >> which should have never made it to that
desk. I I want to say thank you Kobe for responding [clears throat] as quickly as he did to this. Um well, you talked to Kim, correct? With the EP. >> Yeah. Um I included her right now on an email.
>> Okay. Um I had a conversation with her about it. Kim Ross the EP. Yes. Um and [clears throat] and the fact that it KBY didn't respond as quickly as
um someone thought he should have even though he did and lawfully followed through the way we do things. Um >> things have [clears throat] just exploded now. >> Jimmy did he in your opinion I think KBY
did his job best? Yes, he did >> perfectly. >> He did. And we can't put this on an agenda with less than 24-hour notice. So, I I wanted to make sure that's acknowledged. >> Absolutely. >> Because things have to be dealt with locally
before it gets escalated to a state level. We've had enforcements like that in the past and they're not fun. Um, with that said, should have known better. Now, we have to pick up the pieces. This isn't something that is out
of the norm. This does happen. And I'm not saying in towns, but this does happen. Saw some legal notices in Groten a couple months ago or a month ago for two retroactive filings. Um we've had them even with notice of
intense where it happens. This one we've not had to do, you know, the the double the the fee yet, but I think this is a great opportunity to because people knew better.
Pat, >> I I agree on that. >> Sandy. >> Sandy, are you there? >> Sandra, >> yes, I'm here. I hear you. I'm sorry. I hit the mute button by accident. But I >> checking in.
>> No, no, I hear you. I'm just I I'm just um I don't know. >> Baffled by the tree the tree guys. >> I said you're just baffled by the tree guys. >> Yeah, but the whole situation it's you know I'm with Jimmy here. It's I just
can't believe it all. Mike, >> so you say it's uh a real pain to do this retaining for. It's just an expensive >> painful. >> Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I'm just wondering how
it would be different than someone that filed it. >> It really isn't. >> Yeah. But because this is six parcels, um there has to be signed letters stating that they restoration work can
be done on that property there. There's stuff that has to happen. >> Yep. >> I agree. And then you know we have a in a butter or a parcel owner that is less than fees which is understandable that
they really they they are going to we have to give them the opportunity to speak you know to their thoughts on restoration also but it's also 10 of 9. >> Oh my gosh. >> So I I've had all probably six hours of
sleep in the last four nights. I'd like to table this to the next meeting. >> So, at this point in time, we're going to table this. >> We can't do anything now. [clears throat] There's 2 ft of snow out there. >> I understand. >> Not to be a smart ass, but >> I understand. But
>> if I could buy in, I think that's a wonderful idea. It'll give you time to consider creative options to solving this issue. Um along with trying to is the idea of being neighborly
[clears throat] too and keeping good neighbors here. We can think about what what uh what what the solution is here. And I'd recommend you guys find someone to [clears throat]
to handle this. We're obviously not requiring it, but you're going to need to come up with something. >> I think that's >> which is going to be difficult to do for the next two months or a month and a half because of the right. >> Um, so, >> so we're going to circle around on this
again. >> Yeah. And I don't even know if the next meeting is the appropriate time. It really depends on when the ground, you know, when conditions allow a proper sidewalk for Pat and all of us and Sandra. >> Yeah. Yeah,
>> I I I did the sidewalk. I went down and I looked at it after the fact and it it I understand where this whole thing why it happened. The whole nine yards. Here I am biting my tongue. But the point being, this affected six
pieces of property. We're in the middle of this. These people are going to try to have to figure out how to put the toothpaste all back in the tube and this isn't going to be pretty. I don't like having to be stuck in the middle of this and go through this
exercise as a commissioner. >> I don't like to have to go through this even it is a commissioner either because this shouldn't happen, >> right? We had everything implemented so it didn't and it shouldn't happened and I know where it happened and it
shouldn't have and here we are again. This isn't the [clears throat] first time. This isn't the first time I've said too much. >> So I think if [clears throat] we do table it for now gives Colby a chance to think about investigate alternatives.
Well, as commissioners, I strongly suggest looking up past um incidents within the state of Massachusetts where restoration plants were required because of butters or poor butters um
affect the properties. I would have liked to have gotten it done, but >> I said I would have liked to have gotten it done just because >> I hate to see things dragged out and if he's done this already, who knows if he's going to be taking down more.
>> Who were not? Yeah, >> the tree company is is moot in this subject. But >> it's it's a it's a couple layers up above which >> enacted this and put us in this spot.
>> And I'm biting my tongue. >> You said that. >> Yeah. >> So would you make a motion and I can second it or? >> You make a motion. >> But again, >> did you was this >> tabled us [clears throat] to uh
>> table the discussion or this wasn't a hearing? You didn't open a hearing, did you? >> No, there's no hearing. So we just tabled the discussion regarding the wetlands >> um uh protection act. Uh Tom wetland.
>> Okay. If you want me to do mic I can. >> Yeah. Yeah you do. >> But the big question is until when? Because if we can't get out there and look at it and >> um >> until we've seen pictures. Why do we
have to go out and look to see the trees gone? >> Is it Is it better in person than to see the impact? Is that maybe what it is? >> Yeah. Well, the
it's encouraged that we see it in person. We can't just go by pictures. >> It's it good etic for all of us to get on the same page. Let's look at the stunt sizes. Let's discuss what we're looking at, etc., etc.
>> And then we're not going to be able to do it this next time because >> the weather it's gonna it's we're getting another snowstorm. There's, you know, it's going to be freezing for the next nothing's going to melt. >> So, it's not going to be able to make it through for the next one. So, so it'll
be a couple months or April even time, but it also give the historical >> a society time to think about how they want to approach it. >> I think it's going to be a good thing that this gets tabled. I mean, everybody's got to think about what >> and I'd recommend that you're going to
have to do some homework on what you're looking at. I'd recommend everyone talk [laughter] to HMBB and >> yeah, >> the Historic Society. >> Yeah. >> I'm not going to mediate this crap. >> Really not.
>> It's actually not part of your [laughter] >> It's not part of the wetland per That's private [clears throat] property >> table. >> Okay. I think it's frustrating for you to have to come here. >> No, you started too. And >> I can't apologize.
>> Okay. Can I do this? >> Um, >> what you can do, Brad? >> No, no, I don't want to. [laughter] >> Um, I don't want to do >> Oh, the second. >> Oh, >> yeah. Go ahead. >> Going to make a motion. >> Yep.
>> I make a motion then. um [clears throat] the potential regulation violation for the lots discussed um or [clears throat] the properties discussed in 2.4 for be tabled to the first meeting of March
due to weather conditions. >> Second. Um, >> now do we have to put that to a vote? >> Yeah. Hold on. Um, okay. I'm going to add one stipulation that [laughter] you contact with someone to um,
uh, come up with a restoration plan. Correct. You don't obviously you can't start it but we want to know that that ball's moving. >> Um so roll call vote starting with Sandra >> Sandra Lord. Yes. >> Mike Fox said yes.
>> James Dyan yes. >> James Gates. Yes. >> Jim. Yes. >> So we haven't put a date on it. It's not like >> the first week the first meeting in March. >> Okay. I'll just put March. date [clears throat] doesn't matter in March,
>> which is the 14th. >> H >> the 14th. >> 14th, Kobe. >> Yep. >> Thank you for your patience. >> I don't think we say >> Okay, we're going to move on. Um >> I'll be back in March.
>> Thank you. Um 2.5 uh three wheels. I'm stepping up and abstaining from this one as well on Wheeler Road. >> Okay. [snorts] All right.
I'll um open this up. Three-wheeler road parcel 49 4 dash 9-0. We're looking at a potential wetland protection act. >> Sure.
>> Thanks, Chris. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> See you soon. Yep. >> Who you work? >> Well, I apologize for a minute late. Um, I'm Greg Upold and Kobe had mentioned to me that um, you're going to be
discussing a small project that I wanted to do on 11 squad terrace. >> All right. [clears throat] Why don't you go get Jimmy? Go get Jimmy. >> Do we have anyone representing Wheel Road? >> Is there anyone online representing Wheel Road? >> No, it doesn't matter. I'm just been
journeying myself. >> Yeah. [clears throat] >> Can you again? Is anyone there representing three-wheeler road procedurally flip the agenda the schedule of the
agenda around so that we do you open first? Is that what they're thinking? Yeah. Okay. I think so. >> If tonight's not a good night, I'm pretty easy to go. Yours is quick. >> Yeah. So, James can come back to this.
>> Is that the idea? I think so. Can we have a discussion out there? >> Okay. Is the meeting still in session? >> Uh, yeah, it is. Um, we just had to take a a five minute break here. [snorts] >> Okay, I'll pause the tape.
>> Okay, the next >> Okay, I just uh started rolling the uh the tape again, so go ahead. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. just accused of what happened with free willer at the end there. We just had a commissioner just walk out.
Um you were had recused yourself. You're still >> I just said we're talking 3.1. >> Exactly. Continue to the next. >> He restarted. He's going to >> No, >> he's asking what happened with 2.5. Is it
>> never really opened a hearing? >> No, we didn't do anything. No, >> I think maybe you should excuse yourself for another half a minute and then continue it last meeting because there's only going to be two of you to [clears throat] talk
about. Does that make sense? If I could >> Well, there's three of them. >> Three. >> Oh, sorry. Sorry, Sandra. I forgot about you. >> That's okay. >> Six of us. >> I plan on coming in person from now on. This is like a oneoff thing. >> Easier. >> Yeah. Yeah.
>> What's the solution here? Because you do have a quorum still even though someone walked out. >> So, so we need to make a a motion to continue the discussion of three-wheeler road.
>> You don't have to if you have the garment, which you do have. You can make a motion though because there's no one here representing the or three-wheeler or to talk about it. >> Oh, I see. to continue it to the next meeting or you can talk about it now or
you can talk about it after this gentleman's. Um >> I think we'll continue to the next meeting. >> Okay. Got the three options though. Continue to the next meeting because no one's here to talk about it, >> right? discuss it now because you have a quorum
or you can change the agenda around to talk about it after you talk about um 11 squanica terrace with this gentleman. >> Well, what's your council telling me to do? Uh it seems to me we don't
>> honestly I think you should at least it's on the agenda at least read the letter of notification so that the >> it's um been discussed um as far as the agenda and and you could give the
consideration to that person to come in. >> Okay. Okay. Or not. Got it. [laughter] >> That's your So we need do we need to vote to change the agenda order? Yes. Uh, you're filling in as chairperson now. I'm making the call.
Person who was supposed to be chairperson worked out on you. You're the chairperson right now. >> Okay. So, I'll make a motion that we um change the order of the agenda and go to 3.1
and um after that go back to 2.5. >> No, I'll second that. >> Okay, don't worry. I got it. Uh roll call vote on that. Sandra >> Sandra Lord yes. >> Pot said yes. >> Patent. Yes.
>> But that's only we don't have a corner. >> Yeah, we do. >> One, two, three. >> Yeah, that's a even though two people call it accusing themselves. >> Okay. [laughter] >> Whatever that was.
Because Kevin because Kevin has taken a leave of absence. [laughter] That makes five members five voting members right now. >> Oh, okay. Right. Right. >> Okay. >> We've [clears throat] changed the order. So now we're down to 3.1.
>> Okay. >> I don't know why [clears throat] we're changing the or it's just table. >> This person is here to discuss. Yeah, I know. I understand that. >> Um 3.1 living squan terrace property owner uh wants to discuss adding field grading
backyard. Um if you don't mind introducing yourself [clears throat] these pictures. [clears throat] My name is Greg Apple. I'm the owner of Lequeris from Hamilton and I was [clears throat] my parents used to own the house a long
time ago and we uh live there now, you know, they passed away. Um [clears throat] so they had the septic done. Um I think it was some sort of like um they didn't really they didn't pay for the septic but somebody they had come in and done the septic. I think it was like
help the town or maybe whoever. So when they they just did the brand minic in and the backyard is kind of like [clears throat] [laughter] you know lumpy let's say. So, I just wanted to bring in some film [clears throat]
and use, you know, the material that was there also just to try to not level it, but just plain it out. So, like when you mow the kids are playing soccer or whatever it may be, that's not just, you know, lumpy. That was it. And I had Chris had Chris Overton come and take a look at it and he had mentioned, you
know, same thing. He's like, you know, make sure you go down and get permits if we need them or I don't want to do anything beforehand. So, [clears throat] I'm trying to take some pictures and do I can show you. Oh, yes. Okay. >> It's only on mag table. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. I know.
>> So, it's I I gave them the other ones. >> Okay. So, >> it's here. >> Yeah. So, it's actually it's we have a like a you know, the sixoot cattle fence that you, you know, put into the ground here because we have two dogs that we just
recently got. But it's just this side of the yard right here. This side I wouldn't be touching even though in the pictures it was showing over here. So, it's actually just going to be this side right here because the dogs like play over here and there's dog poop everywhere. But it was just this area,
but we are right on the river. So, I just wanted to like we're not bringing in like dump trucks or dump trucks or backho. >> You talked to the our old agent about this, didn't you? >> Yeah, I did. >> And that was their concern. >> But yeah, it's not much. It's it's just
flattening out >> Yeah. >> the lawn. >> Yeah. And then you know this question like where was all the material going and but there's really not that much material. I said I'm hoping that they can use like it actually like so here's the septic right right here >> and it there's like a gully right here
but it comes up here too. So I'm just hoping we just kind of smooth some of it out and bring some fill in just to clean it up. That's it. >> How much fill were you thinking about bringing in? Like I mentioned to Colobby, I'm not sure how much. Maybe
probably like I'm hoping maybe like four pickup trucks worth like the like a pickup truck bed like a F-150 or 250. Um and then with what's there, they can just kind of blend it in. >> Um what side the river is back here? >> Yeah, the river is right back here.
>> Yeah, you can see the river here. >> Yeah, >> that's a lot of weight for a pickup. That's like four yards. Like it's about a yard for a pickup. That's what they can handle. Unless you just I mean I would go for it. I would [laughter] [clears throat]
um so the right way to approach this would I would just file an RDA. You can fill it out yourself, you know. >> Um and then that will allow us to issue the you know the order of conditions [clears throat] to say you know you need
a soul fence and >> yeah Chris mentioned the same thing too. I don't >> I don't think it's Yeah, it's not much more than that, but I don't know what everyone else >> sounds that sounds right. So, it seems like [clears throat] there's a house that goes down a little bit and then it goes up.
>> I only see a little bit of it, >> right? >> So, you're just >> a little not even that high. Just so it's like >> No. Yeah. Wait a minute. I can't see it all now. I'm sorry. I'm trying to see what James is holding up and I
>> Yeah. No, it's the owl. It's an area in a backyard, but we'll have the pictures. >> But I had some stumps grinded down, too. I came in and got the, you know, for that, too. The just we had a fence, a chain link fence that was there.
>> Yeah. Um, I'd like to see this this kind of um thing promoted uh for people to come in and discuss their little >> Yeah. No, that's what we we've tried to do that for the >> I think but uh
>> obviously just got blown out of proportion by a handful of people though. >> Can I suggest doing administrative approval from us? Save the homeowner some money. That's my suggestion. Kobe, can you repeat what you said? I heard you saying the homeowners some
money approval. >> Wait a minute. You're both talking. >> I'm sorry. I'm sorry, Colobby. >> Go ahead. >> I was suggesting an administrative approval. And I don't mean to step on the commission's toes, but u it's a lot
it's a there's a a big step up in money from administrative approval to the RDA. Kobe, what's an ad administr administrative approval? What is that? >> So that that is for very small projects.
Um I think this falls in that category, but again I'm the administrative person. >> Okay. >> I don't mean to show you up just a suggestion. Um, so we uh in the past I've done
actually I haven't done them very much but um someone else had a two dying trees in their backyard and that became a administrative approval and they were >> they got out on the edge of a riverfront area
and that the uh again those trees that the previous owner had were endangering some property fence. Um, and you know, I I'd like to see like people come in and just double check and make sure that you know they are aware
of the wetland that they live near and that they are involved in getting the right permits and protecting it. So, >> is that something we'd have to vote on to to for these little projects per se?
>> Like to give admin like do it. So you have given me some leeway. Um you the commission has given me a bit of leeway here to authorize small projects if I think that uh
they should be heard by um the commission. I I certainly um >> [clears throat] >> um air on the side of caution. >> Okay. So, and in this one I I did I wanted you to hear this one because it's right on
in Squanico Terrace there where there have been some issues with the water quality uh tests have been done there and it's right on river. >> Right. Okay. Thank you Colobby for explaining it. I appreciate that. Um
>> would we have to vote for to give him KBY permission to give a administrative approval? >> Yeah. Um >> can you think of a downside to that? To me it's it seems >> so the administrative approval process
that we came up with was for the instances where someone comes in they want one or two trees they've come down um or you know very small projects be um this one is a little it's not much more
different but it's it's almost just enough that we have to make sure we follow the intended use of the WP PA. Um, and it's it's just a fairly fine line and historically small things like this
that required some sort of bill. No, you're not talking you aren't talking a lot. >> Um, but those situations we did require a request for determination determination of applicability. I don't want to waver from [clears throat] what
we've done in the past, but that's my opinion. Mike, uh, please share and Sandy, please share. >> Well, they both make sense to me. Both arguments make sense. I if we want to air on the side of caution, then we should. So, we should probably do the
RDA. If >> I may say something, I appreciate, you know, [clears throat] your your uh suggestion and and you know, in my favor, but at the same time, I wouldn't want any of you to do anything that you don't feel comfortable with either. You know what I mean? So, that's the reason why I came down to try and do anything.
Yeah. No, we appreciate you doing >> Yeah. I grew up in that house. You know, always respected the river. You know, all the canoe races. I don't know why they don't clean the branches. Uh, you know, the logs are down in the river. I guess they can't do that anymore. We did buy a boat so I could take them up and down the river, but the
canoe races we used to always, you know, they would clear it out so we could get all the way to the harbor. They don't do that anymore, you know. So, [clears throat] I'm not one to be like, "Hey, let's don't worry about the the conservation of the waters or anything like that, you know." But again, at the same time, I don't want anybody that
>> You grew up on it. You know what it's >> Oh, yeah. >> And you know what that river can do, too. >> Yeah. If it's something, you know, you're like, "H, you know, I don't want you to do something later on and say, I should have done something differently." You know, >> I I Pat when you're
>> I don't [clears throat] have really anything to add to this. I mean, I just been listening and, you know, I appreciate you coming and coming before the board and, you know, bringing any questions or
at least not starting anything until you got chance to talk to us. So hopefully more people will listen to this >> and do the same. >> I agree with you, Pat. >> Yeah. So, do we just suggest that he
files an RDA or do we vote on it? Just suggest it to him. >> Um, we would require it if he wanted to do that work. Again, it's not a lot. It's not like >> he's leveling off a yard, so it's, you know, a three-ft fill. He's making the grass usable.
>> Yeah. Oh, yeah. Right. at the same time bringing in some material and we want to make sure that um we follow >> Oh, I'm I'm on the RDA side now for sure. But do we vote? Do we just say you need to file an RDA or that's all we do?
We don't have to vote and say you need to file an >> unless if it unless if we are all in a disagreement or >> Yeah. Okay. >> In my opinion. Um but and I also appreciate K's input on it. >> Yeah. I'm sorry. I I probably stepped
over the line as far as >> No, I don't think so. >> No. >> Well, as James said, it's a fine line. >> I'm just thinking of what we've done in the past and I don't want it to waver. I I try to just keep a um you know,
>> it's good to hear all all angles, I think. [clears throat] >> Yeah. Yeah. I want to make sure that we you know the the um administrative approval you use exactly how was intended for the those [clears throat] >> um so
we yeah we're >> okay >> we're not going to we can't say yes or no right this second but >> okay >> filing and a request for determination of applicability is the right avenue >> okay so I can get that form from here >> I'll send it to you tomorrow >> okay
>> y it's pretty simple form form. >> Okay. >> And if you have any questions on what to fill out on it, just call me or email me. >> Okay. I will. All right. Great. All right. Thank you for your time. >> Thank you. Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you all. [clears throat] >> Thank you. >> Yeah. >> Thank you. Have a good night. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> [laughter] >> I did want to clarify something with a six member board four would be four
because half is three one more just >> yeah options >> does that remove them from the voting sheet >> that doesn't change the form >> [clears throat] >> Thank you.
>> But but in regards >> just that's just an FYI >> in in regards to 2.5. I I'm not >> Oh, I know. I was just informing Kobe for how to um >> that's that's all I wanted to just just so you know for >> Okay, >> that's all. >> Well, I didn't really think it was an
issue. >> No, no, no. I just wanted to make sure you guys were >> Thank you. I appreciate it. >> It's always a question. What is bar? >> All right. I thought I had considered this and I asked for a legal risk.
>> What what are we talking where are we going right now? >> Don't worry about I'll follow up tomorrow. I'll follow up tomorrow with the core numbers and issue >> what >> it's okay you can continue. 3.2 Mass
trails grant uh potential grants available for trail projects and collaboration with Massachusetts regional planning commission for inventory and trail planning project discussion to use money from conservation commission account for matching fund requirements
there's a deadline on this [clears throat] Oh boy. [cough and snorts] [clears throat] And again, my time has been taken away. to really give you a great presentation on this, but the Montreus Regional
Planning Commission asked uh us. >> Can I interrupt? You can ask them to come and present. >> Yeah. And I should have >> doesn't You don't need Let them come to us. >> Yeah.
>> But you can give us the elevator pitch. Well, um the MRPC has um they're submitting a grant application for um excuse me, Mass Trails. and their objective is to create a an
overall plan for a regional plan for uh trails within our area. It includes the surrounding towns including Pittsburgh, Ashb. Um you can look it up. Uh but the
the the requirement of us to join in this uh vision plan as they call it and I put this up online for you to look at. Um uh the requirement of the towns is that
a matching fund of $1,000. And the outcome of that is is just like this. This is an example here, the V Pittsburgh Visions Trail Plan. And what it does is it inventories all
the pl all the trails in town as well as uh come uh it creates a plan and an objective for those um properties. And then it goes into interconnectivity of all of the
[clears throat] trails not only on conservation commission land but to include state properties. um land trusts and other u open space.
Now I want to there was I'm going to cruise through this a little bit because it's it's lengthy. I want to come up with one document. Now what the reason why [clears throat]
I have the reason why I have this one in particular on the agenda the is because the deadline is February 1st. We're not going to meet before then and it would be up to you to um
vote on whether or not we can we could use our our money for it. Now, we do have accounts with money in it. I'm sorry. There's one thing I'm looking for. I don't know. It's like a hundred pages of stuff here.
>> It's trail inventory with descriptions. Yes. Exactly. >> I mean, this would be very useful in planning of our town. >> So, I'm not trying to cut you short. I'm not trying to be rude. Um, I really not
I'm sorry if it comes off as so you you need the approval to spend $1,000 of some account that of our out of one of our accounts that we don't really know much about. >> Yes. >> Okay. I make a motion to approve that. Uh,
>> second. >> Yeah. To provide matching uh funds for the grant potential for Mass Trails and Massachusetts Regional Planning Commission. Got second mic discussion. >> Was that cumbersome? I'm sorry.
>> Just just fine. >> Okay. So, I'm gonna roll call vote starting with Sandra. Unless if Sandra has something to say. I'm sorry. I didn't mean to. >> Oh. >> Oh, no. No. That's okay. I I just wish we had more time to discuss. I just feel this is kind of rushed, but we're going to miss the deadline. I mean, I I I
don't know what to say. I just feel kind of conflicted here. I would have loved to see another, like you said, have them come in and do an additional presentation too, but we don't have that luxury, right? >> No. And that that is almost typical
>> really of all of these. Yep. >> Oh, >> plenty of times I see stuff come through emails and it's like, apply now for this grant and it's a week away. >> And you know that that's largely on me. No, [laughter]
that was not the plan to have such a use that word. >> But with everything else that's gone on over the last couple weeks, I've just been over the limit with work hours and no time to apply to this. And
after this, I'm going to come bring another one up. So >> tonight, >> yeah, >> it wasn't. >> Okay, let's vote on this one. [laughter] >> A lot to unpack tonight. Anyway, >> roll call vote starting with Sandra. [snorts]
>> Can you start with somebody else? >> No, because you're on >> Oh, I'm sorry. Um Oh, boy. [sighs] Sandra Lord, I know there's no right or wrong answer.
I just I I just conflicted and I don't want to abstain, you know, and I don't want to miss out on the grant. I hate to be rushed though. Um, can I ask Kobe a quick question? >> Please,
>> Kobe. Now, now the trails, um, talking about the trails, are you talking about all all the conservation areas that we have? Are there is it one particular area? Like what are we talking about? >> The entire town, right? >> Yeah. No, it's talking about a
comprehensive uh inventory of the entire town. >> Okay. >> And it's really geared towards looking at like voids between uh connecting the those properties and those trails. >> Okay.
>> All right. Well, I guess Sandra Lord, yes. >> Mike Pot said, yes. James Gates, yes. >> Pat Jim, yes. >> Okay. So, we're adding a 3.2. What is that one? >> Oh, yeah. Treating it like another one.
Sure. >> What you [clears throat] mean? >> Oh, what was 3.10? >> I don't know. You said you had another >> 3.2 m. So, we we have the >> I'm sorry. 3.3. >> Should I go right in? >> Yeah, go right for it.
>> So, we have uh the opportunity to apply for this grant more than once. Now, this is for uh the one I just spoke of is for a regional plan. we have we can have specific uh projects that we can do and
there's several in town that we can apply uh the mass trail grant too and the first one that I comes to my mind um would be to apply for the either
the old meeting house road connection uh which is still town property that runs up through um it um >> new rail drill from the old bridge. >> Well, that's going to be that's going to
be more difficult. Uh that's going to be how sever other >> I wasn't listening enough to really >> but that's a much more complex one [laughter] across on north side of 119 where the old camps road goes between two big
fields there up towards the p way up to the hill to the paved portion on the other side on Highland Dav that can be reconnected and that goes right to the rail trail. It connects the neighborhoods up on
Highland Avenue. Um >> Oh, so right through where we're doing our cutting >> forestry. >> Yes. The alternative is to have a nature trail that basically starts at the same point of making house road at 119 and
goes through where our cut area is and up to uh the end of the meeting house road where the parking area is at the top of the hill. Those are the two projects I can take out of my mind. I know we haven't had
any time to think about this or >> is there come up with other alternative ideas? >> Same deadline. >> Same deadline. >> Same match >> that one. Yeah. Bring it up. >> And that one's because it's through Old
Meeting House Park. We could I'm just guessing, but I think the answer is going to be. So, we use Old Meeting House Park funds. >> Correct. And I can bring those funds up um to show you where we can pull the money from. >> How much is it?
>> I believe it's 20% uh match up to $2,000. >> So, who actually does the work? >> What else did or you could just let Ronnie do it? [clears throat] Ronnie. >> Yeah. The guy we gave the permit to
build a mountain bike track and meeting up. >> Okay. >> You know about that, right? >> Mountain bike track up there that we gave permit to do. Was he okay to do it? >> Well, I know that Veronica Kell sometimes is referred to as Ronnie and I
didn't see her. No, Ronnie Ste. [laughter] Why isn't that up there? >> It's Kobe. Honestly, it's fine. I know there's what, 20 grand in it or something. Um, thoughts.
I know kind of pressure on, but it's 9:30. >> Yeah. >> The record keeper, the record books [clears throat] for us. >> Well, what's your thoughts on it? Does it seem like a good idea to create these? >> I think it would be great to have a connection from the rail trail off the
old bean house road or in Highland. They all connect. >> Yeah. And I do as well. >> Sandy. Sandra, >> you still awake? Still with us? [snorts] >> Sorry. When you're home. >> Oh, I'm here. I'm here. Sorry. It's
>> okay. So, do I have any other thoughts? Uh, >> yeah. I'm just >> not for this other matching grant. Um, >> yeah. To put a trail through Old Meeting House Park to connect the rail trail to Highland and Old Meeting House Road.
>> Uh, I really don't have any opinion on that. I I I mean, I guess it would be good I don't have anything against it. I mean >> make a motion to apply for the grant providing action funds. How much are we applying for
>> I'm have to discuss that with Kieran to be honest. give you the >> unless you have an idea of >> I don't know >> they are I can say the award maximum is generally 100,000 for recreational trail projects up to 500,000 for shared use
path projects demonstrating critical >> we don't have that [laughter and clears throat] >> we can't make I I can't at least say that we can't match any of those >> um and this is just the application it doesn't mean that we are beholden to it.
Um, >> how much is the application? >> We need to I need authorization to submit an application. >> Does that make sense? [clears throat] >> Yeah. You have a motion to you need a
value. You need a number to put to it. >> Correct. in I mean not knowing anything about the project or having any collected any estimates that's why I would have to
speak well it'd be a guess >> what's the threshold to bid a project >> what recreational trail project threshold to to do the formal bid process and then go through all 50
>> I believe 50. Don't might call me out on it if I'm wrong, but I >> So >> that depends on the type of project, >> right? I would say
I think if you apply for 20 grand, you can get even if you get, you know, Yeah. 20 grand will get you something, you can always get volunteers. So yeah, volunteers I mean mountain bike guy.
>> So So we're 20 grand. We applying for a grant of 20 grand. >> Yeah. Then we have to meet match 20%. >> This is >> I'm sorry. >> I'm just throwing numbers out there. I just trying to get this moving because >> Yeah. So 4,000. So >> yeah. Are you talking about for for
extending the um from meeting house to um the rail trail the rail trail? >> Yeah. It's just a It's just a walking path really cuz at 3 ft wide it we're exempt from having to permit ourselves. >> Yeah.
>> I just worry about I do worry about the cost. I mean I I'm thinking about it now. I just I don't know. >> I can show you where it would come from. money or maybe high likelihood of their work.
>> It come from that it's the work's being done on that property. That was the intent of that. >> Yeah. >> Meeting house park fund. >> So with a potential investment of 4,000 we
could get 20,000. So be good investment. [laughter] >> What happens if it goes over though? >> You just don't build as much. [laughter] >> But you can also do it in stages. You
could do say you need to do some a couple crossings and whatever. I don't know. I I not like I've walked that land in a couple years. Last time I went on those trails, I got lost. And
>> it's nothing to say that we can't apply for more grants in following years >> to contract to complete it. And you also have the CPA that >> could be utilized in another year or so. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, it's something that could be
slowgoing as we get the funds, so to speak. So, I make a motion that we allocate $4,000. >> We have to motion to apply for a >> motion to apply >> for the grant up to $20,000
>> with the matching. >> Okay. If you say the words, I'll mouth it. So, make it seem like I'm actually saying it. >> All you have [laughter] to say is so be it. >> So, be. >> No. So be it. >> What? [laughter] I make a motion that we allow Kobe to
apply for 20 up to a $20,000 mass trails grant for a walking path or trail from 119 through Meeting House Park to the other side of um Old Meeting House Road.
>> I'll second that. [clears throat] >> Roll call vote starting with Sandra. Uh [sighs] so a vote of yes will be four to apply for the funds and a vote of no would be >> now you need a you need like all three
of us to agree on that right? No. >> But you don't. >> No. >> If one if one votes no, does that prevent Kobe from applying or? >> Well, depends on how everyone else votes.
>> Wow. It's been quite the evening of >> We're all one vote. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh shoot. Uh, Sandra Lord, wish I had more time to think this
through. >> All right, I'll say yes. Um, said yes. Mike P said yes. >> James Gates, yes. >> Pat Jamal, yes. Anything else?
>> Okay, next meeting we're voting for officers. >> Oh, nice. >> Okay. >> Anything else? [clears throat] >> Um, close. What are you doing with 2.5?
>> Thank you. >> I think you guys have questions. >> Okay. You guys make you one of you two have to make the motion. >> Very good. [snorts] >> Uh that we continue the Okay. I make a motion that we continue the
discussion of the three-wheeler road potential WPA in towns and wetlands bylaws violations. >> Yep. >> I second the motion. >> Did I do that right? >> Yep. It was perfect. Can you uh start
voting? Roll call vote starting with Sandra. >> Sandra Lord. Yes. >> Mike Fer. Yes. James Gates abstain. >> Agent. Yes. >> Next meeting is February 11th, 2026.
I make a motion to adjourn at um 9:39 p.m. >> I'll second that. >> Roll call vote starting with Sandra. >> Sandra Lord. Yes, definitely. >> Yes. >> James Gates. Yes. [clears throat] >> Yes.
more.