Good afternoon. Um, this is the Towns and Finance Committee. Um, following the January 27th meeting to order at 6:10 p.m. I have roll call. Attendance, please. >> Carol, present. Gel present. Mary Jane Churchill present.
>> Kathleen Profit present. >> Taylor Walker present. Fan Graham present. Don Hayes present. That's the entire committee. We have um the quorum. We are good to continue. Um
the meeting is being recorded. Um it is available for playback on the on on demand on the YouTube channel and and will be available on local cable channels. Um at this point is anyone else recording the meeting?
None being heard. No one is no one else is recording this meeting for any other playground. Thank you. Um now, um sorry, it's kind of like um additions or deletions at this point before we get
started. Um what I'd like to do, we did have um Vicky Tidman and uh Jody from the assessor's office join us. Um the assessor's budget was on the agenda to be reviewed. So I'd like to move that to the top if there's no objections.
Appreciate it. Okay. And what I did hand out was the BBA for FY26 through the end of December. So these these um items are are in the FY26 budget to
date. I know we're we're going over the FY27 budget, but I always like to um look at the current year, see if there's anything else that pops up. Does everybody have a copy of the assessor?
>> No. No. >> It's a really big budget. >> Yeah. >> Is it? How about the revenue? Is the revenue >> last week? No, it would be somewhere around the >> Okay. What does it say?
So, let me see if I can share. We have the on the budget that >> Carol, do you have it? >> Yes. >> Okay, I'll go copy real quick. >> Some of it's doublesided, I think. >> It is.
>> Was it just the one the one page or >> what? Two pages. pages kind of the expenses salaries and then the summary. >> Okay. See if I can get a bunch of coms.
Okay. So, I have shared up on the screen. Is it big enough for people? Do we want to come Okay. So, we have the FY26
budget. We can confirm that on the BBA. U Karen has indicated that he needs to verify the numbers. So the what's in the BBA does match the
for the assessor salary. The 69,682 is what's in the BBA. Um the 42360 for the support staff um matches the um 1425
for the closing allowance 3,000 for the stipens and then the last item the FSA 250. So they're not quite in the same order, but like and so the total for that is the
118717. Um and then we have the FY27 numbers beside it and that's where the um detail sheets will come in from. >> What is your clothing allowance? The clothing allowance is um
it's line 58 in the budget highlighted there. Um, so the assessor will will get one amount. That's not just for one person. That's for the two that's for the two people. So either the BVA is wrong or the fiscal
year 26 salaries is wrong. >> Yeah, I only got 2%. And I didn't get 4%. >> Well, I think that's so it should be 117 378 instead of the wonderful things something that
>> that vote of that budget what Don is saying, >> right? But that's what's in the BBA. >> And I was assuming that the FY26 column is supposed to match the BBA. >> Well, it's in my budget, but I don't get
the money out. M okay. And >> how does that work? Cuz it was supposed to be a step and a cola and I was at my top step. So >> 2%. >> Yeah. But it got voted in with a 4%
>> right. And good work. So questions that we have on this is the all looks good in BVA. Everything is being spent at a
constant good rate from what I can tell. >> Yeah. Yeah. I mean the FSA has already been >> right. Do is it possible that this includes >> I mean 50 it should be 50% but it's at 55. Is it possible it includes like the first check of January or something in
there? Um probably um it it may have to go back and double check. >> Yeah, it would because it's 1126 >> is when it ran. I had asked for it to stop at 1231, but but even then you might have a little bit higher in
December. Um if there's extra >> if there's an extra paycheck in in the first half of the year versus the second half of the year. So it it doesn't and >> what is the pay cycle? Every two weeks. >> Yes,
>> it's every two weeks. So >> that that'll be the same then through both halves. You're going to have an extra paycheck in one month. >> But the first the first paycheck in FY 26 would be part of the FY25
at the FY25 rate. the new rates happen with with the first work day of July 1st, >> right? >> So, it's kind of like so there's a little bit of money that goes um some people have noticed that on the budget it's a little lower because you
know that first pay was at prior years. Um, okay. So, no questions for the viewers on Sally. Um, >> I think I'm good with everything. >> Hey, Don. >> Yes.
>> Jody can enlighten you about the FSA. Yeah. If you have any questions with the FSA, >> um, I the it's going to be a consistency thing right now. It's kind of like um I expect FSA to be in the wages area. Uh, it's not for everybody. Right. So, it
was a union contract that was negotiated halfway through a budget cycle and nobody had budgeted for it. So, Eric said take it out of an expense line that first year. That's where the expenses came in and then that following year we budgeted for it but not every department
did cuz it's, you know, forgot about it. >> So, that's why there's there's going to be a little bit of a discrepancy because that first year he said take it out of expenses. So, we'll we'll work this year and make sure we get the right make sure it's in everybody's budget and it's in the right
>> and and again the account numbers would be the other piece that I'd be concerned with is you want to report to pay taxes and file right we want to make sure they're in the right the proper locations. Thank you.
I was going to say and I know we asked it before. Um I believe the repair and maintenance is a software contract. >> Yeah, I I changed it this year when I sent out my my budget. Yeah, it's always been carried as equipment and maintenance or whatever, but yeah, it's the assessment software.
>> I'll recategorize that. I think Vicki had told me about it. I just haven't had a chance to get to it yet. So and and again instead of doing anything any work on the linked in the common file, I made a copy of it just before the meeting. So we're working on
it if it's it's not it's not the the file that's been posted >> and and Kieran and I were discussing putting back in the training line. Yeah, that is a goal I think with I think he has shared with us some legacy planning if you will or succession planning which
is important for companies and >> yeah it was um and that's why it was originally put in I'm thinking it was 3 or 4 years ago. >> Yeah. >> Um and having it cut out we it just was um you know not uh so we'll put
Okay. So right right now um the the board recessor training is sitting at at zero. Um so so again it's a work in progress and we'll we'll be looking at to reinstitute the training for the secession planning because 50 is looking
forward to retirement probably soon like the rest of us. I'm looking forward to it more than anybody >> cuz we're all here. >> That's exactly um I'm also looking at this year's BBA
the dues and uh memberships would drop to zero and there's a charge into the dues and membership. So, I'm assuming you're in both in part of an assessor um group that we should have something in the in the dues and membership as well.
Was it in Did you put it into the budget this year? >> I think we have I don't have that. >> I don't have the expense. >> No, it's not in the budget. >> It's not on there. >> No, it's not in there. >> That's a line.
We don't need a lot because it's just the MCAA. Yeah, I think it's under 100 bucks. >> Yeah, I was going to say what's in there is 93 and sometimes they go up on a couple more. >> And I probably don't even need to be a member anymore anyway. >> But in order to classes, you have to be
a member. Yeah. So, Everything else and then of course we have a warn article every too. >> Yeah. >> Right. >> Yeah. Now, did money get transferred into that account last year from >> 26? Yeah.
>> Yeah. Okay. It It's kind of like But it wasn't from the town or anything. That was You did that with the I'm drawing your blank and I talked to Vicki. >> Oh, the overlay. >> Yeah, the overlay account. >> Thank you. It's kind of like so last
year there was there was a transfer of the money but it wasn't on the warrant coming from free cash or available funds. It was it was done out of the overnight place >> which we will not make a >> I I should yeah they personally I I
would say that we we can't make it that you know a habit of doing that. It's kind of like this puts additional burden on the on those monies. The the overlays are are meant for the veterans benefits, the ERO act,
and maintenance, the taxes. So then So that'll be in the is it part of the annual town meeting or the special? >> I think it's in the town just for a year. Yeah. >> Yeah. Okay. Anybody
have any other questions? >> Okay. Um, no more questions for um the assessor's office. Thank you, J and we will if we if we come up with
something. It's kind of like it sometimes as as you're hitting it, it's kind of like and again we still have about 50% of the group is is still new. So questions >> everybody and I appreciate it. This was
now you know where I live. >> Just like a couple that tell me to go back look at them. Okay, back to the agenda, I suppose. Um, so we go back. Oh, now we have um reviewing the minutes. Um, did everybody
receive their copies? >> I did. Yes. >> Yes. Okay. And thank you, Cal, for getting those out. Um, this said reviewing for December 23rd,
January 13th, and I know just recently in the last day or so that January 20th meetings minutes came out. So, we'll just deal with the two that are on the on the agenda. Um, okay. I'll make a
motion to accept the minutes as presented for December 23rd, 2025. I'll second Okay. So, we had a motion and a second. Any further discussion? No changes to the minutes.
Take a vote on the motion to accept the minutes from December 23rd. All in favor? >> I. >> It's unanimous. The minutes for December 23rd have been accepted. >> I move that we accept the minutes for January 13th as is.
We have a motion. Anybody second? >> Sorry. >> Any further discussion or questions? None being heard. Um vote on the vote in favor of accepting
the minutes. In favor, >> I I unanimously accepted January 13th. Okay, next item. Um, I still I'm leaving it because it it's an item we want to keep revisiting. Um, the
email came, but it only had the information for the board of health meeting for Monday, next Monday. So, I figured I would go and see what's presented Monday at the board of health. They should have the numbers that that meeting and they're still preparing
them. So when we get to >> What time is that? >> Usually it's at 6. >> Usually it's at it is at 6 and in this room. >> Is that February 2nd? >> I think so.
>> Um first is Sunday. So that would Monday. >> Okay. >> Yeah, that would be summer. >> I'm sorry. Um I think it said the 9th. me. >> They're meeting they're meeting the ninth. >> The nth. >> Yep. >> 9th. >> Yep. Correct. >> Y >> Well, I hope they have January numbers
then, too. >> It's 29. >> Did we get the warrant article yet? >> Warren hasn't closed yet. >> The warrant. Yeah. >> Well, then we don't have to do that one, right? No, it's kind of like again just you know keeping it there so it's visible to us and when articles come
from and the motions that uh we take it and review it >> and capital planning is the same right? >> Um no capital planning was you wanted on the budget on the I figured we could talk about what the schedule is who the
members are um >> and what the plan is. >> We don't know what the plan is. Okay. >> Are you on the board? Are you on the committee? >> She am too. So, >> is anybody else? >> Yeah. Have is um
>> and select board is represented by Veronica. Veronica. >> Yeah. >> Do you have a meeting scheduled? >> Well, well, no, >> we didn't know about it, but Kathy found the posting, but none of us were notified of the meeting.
>> Why would you be notified? >> Okay. No. So, >> okay. So, you're welcome. I don't know. When is it? >> It's Friday. >> Friday. >> 1:30. >> It's January 30th. >> That's what time.
>> Oh, it's at noon time. >> Yeah, noon time. January 30th. >> Except nobody told us. >> I think that would go to the chair who we don't know. Who's the chair? >> Be the previous person who was gone.
>> Who's gone? Teresa. She was the chair. >> No, I thought it was after. >> So then it would fall to vice chair. >> Oh, no. >> Well, so call the meeting. It's kind of like >> Well, that's what we thought. >> Who called the meeting? >> Well, actually, we went to see Sabrina
and we tried to get some information and she refused to give it to us. >> Oh, surprise. Surprise. >> She said it had to go to all members, not just two members. But Jerry was going to send it out. >> Yeah. Yeah. But anyways, >> okay. >> In a roundabout way, I guess we'll show
up Friday. >> Friday at noon. >> At what time? >> Noon. >> Noon time. >> 12 12:00. >> 12:00 >> in the select men's chambers. >> Okay. Okay. So, she Well, does it fall to the town administrator?
>> Not usually. It falls to the board and the previous members as continuity plans that carry it forward. So, or your moderator. Really, it's your moderator because they're the ones who were members of the board. >> Vice chair. There was no There was no vice chair.
>> Teresa had it. It went to Mark because he was vice chair and then we after Mark there was no vice chair. >> How important is this capital plan? Very important. >> Oh, >> for what it's worth, there's not a lot
of money to capital. How many not to make a joke of it, but that that's the reality here, >> right? >> We still don't know how much >> uh free cash was about 500k. We're waiting for the specific number later on this week. That will have been mostly spent by snow and ice because of the
current weather pattern here. >> So, when will we have the number though? Don't we need that number before we can approve anything? No, it it's you can you can meet with the my >> I was going to say you can you can meet with the department heads and see what
the requests are and prioritize the requests and then >> and then whatever money falls out. I mean we can prioritize what we think. I I'm ultimately if if it's a safety issue and it has to be addressed and
it's a capital project um it's it needs to be identified by the capital plan >> but it it can be a loan right >> it can be a loan >> you know it's kind of like an other piece we need to make sure we work with um the treasurer to get the loan and the
balances of where we where we are and when things may be coming off >> to see if there's um the ability ability to um to do it. The the funding is either usually through capital stabilization, free cash. Um sometimes
it will be funded by like ambulance receipts for some of the some of the higher EMS >> um and actually the >> water enterprise >> water enterprise will do yeah water enterprise will do their own they we
should have a list from water department and um the cruisers even though it's in the budget as a line item is it's it's capital and funded by the operating budget. So it's a so the funding sources
can can be multiple places and we've always run cruise leases right in this budget. Um so it's funded by operating budget. >> Okay. And again, there's been
changes to how >> do you need to names the names of your fellow members for that group >> or do you know Um, we we think we we we had a list. It was Natalie. >> It was Natalie. Uh, myself, Carol,
Kathy, and >> Veronica. Veronica. So, that's >> Robert. Robert who? >> Jula. He's on conservation. >> He's a jula. J U S.
>> And he Yeah. Okay. Yeah. >> So, is somebody >> So, we have one opening, right? Four. >> One opening >> from Yeah. >> at large >> to be appointed by the moderator. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Okay. >> Don't know the answer. So, and I So, that was the reason why
you wanted to get on the get it on the agenda is so that we could see what the schedule is cuz I was looking at it and it does say that 60 days before meeting the capital planning will submit there. >> So, so that's like March 5th or
something. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> But you don't have 60 days. No, 60 days before the town meeting is the dead drop dead, >> right? Yeah. So, it's sooner sooner is better. But, you know,
>> I just think we're starting so late. >> Starting everything late. >> Yeah. Okay. Okay. Ba. >> Do we have it? Oh, >> we have Yep, we do. We do have the BVA. Yeah. Um,
and mainly what I wanted to do with with the DBA, I mean, if we have questions, we can we can bring bring them forward, but use it. Also, as I said, when we look at the FY27, see where we are with FY26.
>> So, everybody does does have this Are you working after the 113? >> Um 112. >> 112 is the is the date on this. >> Is there another one? I don't know. I was just making sure I had the same thing.
I was looking at when the email came in from Elizabeth um because it was right around I requested it um the report through the end of December so that we had the six month
six month. >> So it looks like the town >> Yeah. like 80 86%. >> Yeah, that's >> is that going to be an issue? >> Um well, we the the question is actually should that be an expense line or should
it be a salary line because the accountant position is is >> contractor is a contractor. >> The the salary for the accountant appears to be paid from a salary line, not a not an expense line right now.
>> Right. Yeah. Uh, that's likely to change. I don't foresee us having the bandwidth to hire an accountant and add health insurance costs. >> My recommendation would be to add more to professional services, decrease the town accountant salary line
>> and work with CBiz another year to sort of that's >> then that should be professional services rather than the salary line. So for FY27, we're going to call professional services >> waiting for their numbers based to see
what the number is. So >> So is it going to be any cheaper than hiring an accountant? >> It should be because it won't be health insurance. >> Okay. >> Right. So it the we we go back to where we were a year ago. We were transitioning from um somebody that
wasn't a certified accountant. And so we were raising that salary for the accountant hoping we were going to get somebody trained to stay with the town and then we were cutting down the C biz. So when when you take the accountant salary plus
um plus the the health insurance um and the training those items um >> okay well I know as when I was when I was a contractor I got paid more money because the
company didn't have to pay my um health benefits cuz I had cup cuz I was retired had health benefits as a retiree. and therefore I got paid a lot more money. >> Yeah. >> Without >> Yeah. >> claiming health benefits. So you might not save that much.
>> Um >> yeah, I mean CBZ is a pretty >> CBS is pretty big. >> They're pretty resourceful and Elizabeth um >> is a very strong ally for the town. Um and I think we're getting a pretty fair
shake from her unless the number goes up to 85k like you said. Well, I mean, I'm just I'm just saying from my own experience. Once I retired from federal service and then came back as a contractor, I could ask for a
significant amount more money because they didn't have to pay my health benefits. >> Yeah, for sure. >> Right. So, but the CBiz is going to go for Elizabeth cover her health. >> Okay. But we're going to put in a professional services line. >> It's a professional services. We do have
a professional services money for her account, >> right? Right now it's set at 30,000, >> right? >> And it hasn't been spent at all. >> Right. >> Okay. So, is that also her salary? >> Yeah. >> See this too? So, it's actually 93,000. >> The the two of them combined is what we
were planning to pay. So if you take what what we have for um the professional um for the 30,000 >> plus the accountant salary plus the health that's what we were planning to pay for a salary a an accounting
position for the year. So we there were three parts of it. Um we had CBiz as sort of the backup and the signature for a certified town accountant. >> Second question are we still looking for an accountant? It's last I looked it was posted but we
>> it is still posted >> actively. >> Résumés are in a file but um just with what's going on in the town I don't think the bandwidth for reviewing resumes and I wouldn't know what to ask them and I would say the town's going to go out and get their own town
administrator along the way. You'd want that person to sort of pick the person in their dugout. Maybe someone they know someone within the field training. My question on it, >> we did interview and we did put an offer out that was not accepted in the fall. >> So, we were kind of asking question if
we get somebody who's qualified by the state because I understand that our past person was trying but it >> right. So, if we get do we need CBIS the CBS is is CBS part of the deal no matter what >> in the short term. Yes,
>> that's my question in the short term. what what's the short term if we have a certified experienced applicant who accepts >> so when we had put the offer out to the person that was qualified for the job I believe we had said that we were probably going to have a month or two
overlap for this and we had had to that that number for accountant was not not easy to find any the number we had budgeted for >> the 95,000 the Senates about 69 and change. The
level of candidate we were getting were very unqualified like folks that were not accountants were maybe payroll folks or were something of that little bit lesser caliber. They weren't actual accountants. >> Were they from town?
>> They were not. >> But we did the office. We had we had actually said we were going to ask to have money transferred from the C design to the accountant in order to get it to even close to a place >> and then decrease the amount of the C bits line to 2 months overlap. So we had
tried to figure out how to make it work but she didn't she might have not like I can get you the information. >> No, that's good. Okay. >> If you know anybody looking that is a fully, you know, >> certified. >> Yeah.
>> With the certification for >> Well, I mean, does it just get posted outside the town hall or is it posted >> outside town hall MMA for a while? Um, you know, indeed.com will pick up some of those ads, too. Um, you know, it's
it's one of those ones from other towns I've been a part of. it's word of mouth and sometimes it's someone who's you know we think that like Katie who left you know I I don't know all the details for why she left I think she felt that she was a little plateaued growth wise so um or she hadn't gotten I I don't
know all the inner workings of why she departed but just a better opportunity also >> more money probably >> money talks unfortunately these days so >> well I think there were a lot of factors wasn't just about All right. So that's that. So that's
also so far the office supplies for this money. >> Now what would they be? What would they be? She's got a long thing going. She's a contractor. Why are we paying for office supplies? Well, we still have the daily >> things to do. The checks. The checks have to come down here.
>> Oh, the checks still, >> right? We we have Lee O'Brien in the in the office. Yum. >> So, there there is somebody in the office doing the work, I guess. >> So, checks.
>> Um checks, printer, um printer supplies, paper. for the door. >> Yeah. >> No, >> no, I just wanted $250 for >> I heard 250.
>> Oh, because Lee writes the checks here. >> No, they're not the CBS person, right? >> Ah, okay. Right. >> Which with Lee? Is she an accountant? >> No, she's the assistant. Yeah. support staff.
So um and then the treasurer collector um I think the treasurer collector um if we look in expenses the FSA reimbursement is is under expenses and we think it
needs to be under wages. So we need to get consistency of >> the FSA should be under wages. >> I it is FSA standal up to 250. So this probably should be in
everybody's >> Didn't we counter that? Did we do we talk to her about that? Um, we were talking to the assessor. The assessor is under wages. This is this is the treasur. >> Okay. So, you think this should be under
wages rather than expenses? >> Yeah. >> But consistency reportable. It's a reportable amount of money. When you when you run payroll, you want to be working in in expenses to run that.
So, getting further consistency and so that should move to wages. >> Yeah. As they get where this where is it in the um >> in the treasuries? >> Yeah. >> Or is it just included
>> bottom line of the expenses? >> The bottom line on the expenses >> Oh, on that I was looking I was looking at her budget. >> Oh, her budget. >> Did she move it up? Let's see.
>> So that would be under Anthony, correct? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> I don't see it there. Let's see. >> Uh he is operating administrative assistant. Correct. Yeah, I don't see it under that
listing. >> YSA for >> Melissa >> treasur treasure. >> Okay. So, and it's going to make it into omnibus any place
on her request, >> right? Yep. So, this that's right. And then, like I say, other other department. >> Maybe maybe she decided not to do it. >> I don't think she can decide. >> No, she we have to budget for it because it's in the contract.
>> Mhm. >> Yeah. That's kind of like and so if you have somebody in the position that is depositing into their FSA, we reimburse up to the 250, >> right? >> But what if they don't? >> But if it's not in their budget,
>> what if they don't if it's not in the budget, they have to >> they have to find >> they have to find a place to do it. So, it's better to sort of make it visible simil similar to um the uniform allowances.
>> They're they're in there. >> Uniform allowances. >> No, remember? >> Yeah. Not at treasurer. >> The the uniform allowances are for the departments that are going out visiting sites and the need the equip that needs
it. So I'm not seeing on her worksheets where she's with the FSA. >> Okay, that's so that's an item to to go back. >> Special closings is an assessor need. >> No, she goes in the field. We had that conversation last year, remember?
>> No, >> you don't remember it. >> I don't remember it. >> Oh, it was a big deal. We were a gasast, but we got it square. Okay. So, this these guys, >> we had the same question. >> When they showed up at my house 20 years ago or whatever, 15 years ago,
>> um, they were wearing regular clothes. They don't have off the street clothing >> and then they still are. >> So, >> Oh, yeah. >> That's part of the It's part of the
negotiation for contract. That's fine. >> Who reads the contracts before they sign? >> I do. >> Right now. >> Yeah. >> It's going to change, right?
>> The negotiations are going to change. They're going to get stricter, right? >> Yeah. I just keep pointing at the word two and a half. >> Yeah. >> Two and a half. >> Two and a half. >> Everybody. Two and a half. She's heard it. It's over and over again. Two and a half. >> Yeah. Two and a half or nothing is is
>> anything beyond that is unreasonable. >> Can't afford it. >> I agree. Thousand two and a half close to two. >> No. >> No. >> Two. >> Period. >> Well, that's what the limit is growth. >> The living limit is 2 and 1/2, but
they're they're on a step two plus 2%. >> Two and a half. >> See, that's good. I like >> I like that. >> Yeah, we're going with >> that's it. >> Is that cola or is that step? >> Yeah, >> both.
>> Both combined. >> He's saying everything combined should be two and a half >> except what the contract says, >> right? >> And the contracts. >> What you're saying is when he negotiates the new contract, >> those new contracts are up, >> right? They're all
>> and the budget will only be built based on 2 and 12% growth >> for everybody. >> I like >> for something that I sign >> but that's me. >> Where did you come from? >> The tax levy limit is 2 and a half%.
>> Oh, I'm aware of that. You're a town administrator. So therefore, you wouldn't know any idea about that. >> Good for you. >> What I did in my other town. >> Good. Yeah. >> Why you said where did you come from? >> How's there's no other there's no
negotiation. It's two and a half. >> No, >> there's no there's no wiggle room. I'll give I'll offer two and a half. >> You decide if you're going to vote with your feet or not. >> That's fair. >> That's very fair.
>> Look at those clothinges on the next go around too. >> Town seal >> on all clothing. I can't remember how many of these agree 100% Carol I don't know why through your office since I got
this job from a common site >> what sounds like a few >> a whole lot >> okay >> I had to find other ways so we can start peppered throughout.
>> So, what did you do next? >> Well, it was it was listed as >> Excuse me, please. >> Select court. So, they there's a few. >> Oh, so we're done with the treasur. >> So,
the question for her where CFSA capture >> there is no page. So, how do you find it? >> What's the code? Okay. First page. >> First page. 122. >> 122. >> Oh, there we go.
>> Oh, that's where we're starting, right? >> Okay. So, we're starting with the town administrative fee, correct? >> Yeah. So, >> so the support staff is 52,000 and Oh, yeah. This is where I took July, August, until October 27th.
>> So, we're like halfway through. >> Yeah. >> Now, is she working full-time or part-time? >> She's working about 40 hours a week, I think, is what her contract is. And she works probably beyond that, to be honest. Like, >> here in the office,
>> some of it's here in the office. Some is remote work based on the contract. And how's the remote work um monitored or is it is just your truster? >> Yeah, we don't really have the technology capabilities afforded to this town to track how people are clocking in
and out at home. But as someone who's gotten to know her, as a person who's gotten to know her work ethic over the last month or so, it's thorough and it's a lot of work she's doing more than we compensate her for. I'll I'll second
that as a >> So, as a town resident, can we have some kind of notification when she's not going to be there on the door, you know, like I'm not in will be back Tuesday or whatever you because I've
come to that office probably 20 times, okay? >> And no one is there. Neither of them. And there's no notifications, you know, of when they're going to be back. So, you're just like, "Oh go, okay." And you keep coming back and there's nobody there.
>> Well, come see me first and foremost to see if I can help. >> Well, shouldn't she be responsible to put something on the door for the town residents? So, I mean, she works for the select the town administrator. >> Yeah. >> And the select work. So, her interactions with the public as necessary.
>> Yeah. It's, you know, she does let myself and her, you know, cube mate there, Cali, let know like where she'll be, you given a week in advance, you know, based on, you know, school closing delays, whatever it might be. Um, but I can certainly share with you, you know,
if you know you're going to need assistance from her um office, you know, Wednesday at 2, you forward that to me and I'll, you know, coordinate with her to help you. So, >> okay. Thank you. or I'll I'll one or the other. We'll
I'll help you get an answer. So, okay. So, that's that one. What's next? >> So, professional services is way up. >> I will say just on the town administrator, the line before supports that. >> The town as a whole, as someone who just
went through the MMA 351 connect, >> you know, the the the joy of that conference was great. It was a wonderful experience. They were, you know, there were enough small town administrators there to to know sort of where we should be at wage-wise
and a less than $135,000 wage scale for that role. >> For what role? >> So, we as as I see what you're saying. >> Okay. Sorry. >> Yeah. you will the town will forever
struggle to find continuity in that seat up there in that role without paying more money for it. Right? So when we look at the FY27 which is up on the screen, >> you can see the jump between the FY26
and the FY27. >> Um the salary of the town ministry. I thought we >> Well, you we are there. We're looking at the BBA, but the ultimate goal is to look at the FY27. So that's >> that's what you're you're finally
looking at the future budget, right? Like can you just share with me why you're looking at the BBA? Is it for like spending the spending pattern? Are we are we budgeting the right number? >> Okay. >> It's kind of like and >> but that's why your department has give
you requested a budget, right? It it is, but um we you know they again it's kind of like we we wonder >> um did we get it?
>> Did we get that question? >> Did you do you have select budget? >> Cuz I don't see it in the only person we have will be Carol's. She's >> No, I don't have then we didn't get it.
it. But it's in the in the omnibus. Um it would be looking for >> Yeah, but that's not the That's what this is, but it's >> Well, that's that's FY26. The FY27. >> Oh, I see what you're saying. Okay. Sorry. >> I guess.
>> So, we're trying to look at Yeah. Yeah. >> So, yeah. So, yeah. Why are we looking at this? Why again >> spending pattern? Did do we >> I think we don't you have to put put up against what the budget's going to be for this year. >> Well, you should be comparing to last
year's requests and what was approved to this year's growth and what a department was really hoping to expand and opine on. >> Yeah. But we don't >> for example like highway you know they're trying to add two positions to their department. Mhm. >> So, as a as a fincom, you would be
debating the numbers and the impact and the long-term projecting forecast for what that means to the town, the department, and the stability of the growth for coverage for snow. Does it reduce overtime for snow and ice, things like that, >> but we only have the 26, correct?
>> We have the 26 and >> we have the 27 budget, >> the budget, the files and and the omnibus that that item that He sent that out. Um,
that was sent out of it >> on my phone. >> Oh, >> 120. >> Don says it forwarded the link and it's kind of like a new, >> right? You click on the link and then and then it
>> I know. I looked at it on my computer. Are we going to be able to get like the hard copy of 27 or any of >> I thought we talked about that. >> Yeah, we we did. I I haven't had the opportunity to print them out. Some some things are are preliminary, but I want
to get them easy. >> No, it's hard to look on the phone. >> Yeah, there's a lot of columns and things that just >> like here. >> So, yeah. So >> um col call col call col call col call col call col call col call col call col call col call column K the the peak is
um should should be matching what's in the within the BBA and >> so going from 126 if I'm reading >> 170 >> and and what you're saying is that if you go to 170 it'll be easier to find
somebody and have them stay for a while. >> That's the low end. >> That's the low end. >> Yeah. A town a third of your size is paying about 168 with a $10,000 auto allowance, full cell phone coverage, and deferred compensation.
>> What town is that? >> And what are the duties? >> Yeah. >> Everything the same exact that I have. >> But what town is that? Is it a wealthy town? >> It's not wealthy. >> Oh, that's not wealthy. >> Groten's almost 200.
Brian's a lot wealthier than >> Pilro is about 185 187 with other and they're only 4 days a week. >> Okay, then why is our so much lower? >> I don't know. >> We've just never budgeted for it. >> I mean, but our taxes are not that much
lower than say Demable, >> right? >> So there's the question. >> Well, part of that assess house values, right? So we don't have the same house value as our >> the average house industry. >> You want to get someone to stay commit
years reality. It's got a maybe a higher >> and that person should come with training like human resources, maybe a little legal background, some other tools that can help offset some of the other expenditures that the town puts
money into to move it forward and not always be so dependent on town council and other contract services that you leverage. Oh, so somebody with legal background I >> not like just
>> No, I'm not saying a law degree, but I'm saying legal background experience. >> Someone who's been a TA before like I mean I thankfully you guys think I, you know, called in from the dugout, but there's people that there are qualified
candidates that I met at MA Connect that said I'm like, "Hey, would you ever do towns?" And they're like, "Well, not at 130." M >> I mean like there's no >> like that's about enough money. You're closer to a two in front of that number to be honest. Anything
>> based on 10,000 multi-layered complex >> we don't have >> but if that's the case and then they have to have HR. So could can we roll the HR salary into the town administrative salary? >> Salary for HR.
>> Remember Kathy that was head removed. >> Sorry. >> What do we pay Ericel? He's a lawyer 135 or something. >> Yeah, he was in the 13. It's kind of like and that's why >> here for even two years. >> Yeah.
town council wish we can't turn over every year to two years in >> it's too much >> what it's not very very productive I say that part out loud >> that's silly >> that's like >> so and you could
>> why would he >> at that wage scale you could also help you get a greater pool >> to look through and be like what best fits the town and the interview committee >> and the selection committee is than someone with some HR or, you know, with some affordable housing backup,
whatever. It at that threshold, you start to get a greater applicant pool, >> right? >> And it gives you a lot more opportunity to pick someone that's going to lead the town for the next 3 years, maybe six if you get them to sign a second contract. >> After that, you're probably going back to the back to the fishing pool to look
for someone different after 6 years. Not guaranteed, but if you pay someone, you'll get a you could get a great candidate that could stay for some while >> maybe read contracts. >> Yeah, they could make contract. I mean,
who knows, right? >> Maybe they read a contract contract. >> Yeah. >> Experience. Yeah. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Have that experienced DA. >> Yeah. Yeah. We did.
Okay. So, okay. Next. >> Yeah. Exactly. Okay. So, >> Oh, okay. >> I can't see the whole thing. I can only see two >> only two It's only two columns, right? >> There's only two columns really. We're
looking at the the FY26 which still identifies as needs to verify. >> So we so we did increase the TA $50,000. >> Yep. >> You zoom that in. >> But now did you hide that assistant?
What's the promotion? >> Huh? What? >> And then pull that >> No, no, no, no, no. And the assistant goes up to 65,000 from 52. So the the promotion of the assistant would be that they are going to take on the HR
consulting role because we this budget was without an HR consultant or any HR expenses. >> So if you have a contractor, you've got to oversee him. Just like Lee O'Brien and myself are working with CBiz, we are technically overseeing CBiz and ensuring
the jobs being done correctly. So you're saying part of the opera funds are going to the TA and the promotion to the >> No ARPA funds. >> There's no ARA funds. No, I know there's no more ARPA funds, but the ARA funds were being paid to the HR person. So >> they were previously, correct?
>> Yeah. >> So now there's no more ARPA funds. >> Correct. >> So we're taking those same funds though. Well, the same number. >> Well, the the previous HR line item was about 70,000ish, >> right? >> All right. 50 60.
>> Yeah. Okay. So, I get it. I get it. I get it. Sorry. >> What's the fractional >> consulting for HR? >> Yeah. So, you would still need someone to help you process like FMLA paperwork, um, union grievances, things of that
nature to better understand the impact. And again, this is a, as I framed it last time, the dreamer budget. I full well know that a lot of these numbers that I put in I I think I put that there like KM note >> are what if we had unlimited money to do
>> and sort of like add in a couple guys to every department or having 17 police officers. >> So 25,000 plus 50 plus where's the 50? >> Well just total at the bottom right take the totals at the bottom 272 from 180.
>> Yeah. So around $90,000. Yeah. >> 72 and a half%. >> That's budget. That's wage correction. >> Okay. >> Look at the TA. The $50,000 is correction. The 65 is for added responsibilities and based on some AI lookups for
fractional consulting HR help. That number might be low at 25. So maybe you offset that with a TA that has some HR background and you zero that out. So just out of curiosity, what happens if you regionalize and you go some that
kind of a thing? How does that impact >> regionalize the TA? >> Uh so if it were if it were my idea to regionalize it, I would regionalize it with a town that only has a TA that's there 3 to 4 days a week. And then you
offer them $60,000 60 to 65 and then you have an assistant TA here for around 80ish 85ish and they do everything and they report up any large issues. Both would attend select board meetings. One would present at a
annual town meeting and the full TA would be your collective bargaining agreement person for all responsibilities. Your assistant TA would do day-to-day HR operations. So, it wouldn't be that much cheaper. >> Not really. It would be a It would be a wise idea because you'd have someone,
you know, trained up >> and ready to take on both at the end. You would maybe, you know, move on from having a full-time executive assistant, something of that nature. So, you can, you know, HR would be gone at that
point. So, you do some headcount moving at that point. Maybe they do your grants too. You could really leverage any >> an administrator at large type of role. >> Okay. So that's the wish list from >> that's the wish list.
>> Yep. So yeah, >> okay. And I guess the question would be the new line for um the web services for 750
for the web stipend versus the web um the web master. This was one that was discussed across a couple different um departments. I chatted with the town clerk and you know we've got assistant town clerk Jack
doing a lot of the up you know website up updating. >> Yeah. And I almost, you know, having chatted with our town clerk Harrison, it almost felt like could we split that charge up so that each department head could work with their person of choice, whether it be like someone like Jack,
I'll use an example, to be the website updator and put the information up there. Um, full well knowing you probably have to do some website enhancements down the road. So they have each each of those appointed folks can also be part of a little group, an ad
hoc committee to sort of get some feedback on the website and goals to work with a consultant down the down the line to build out another plan. and and that would just be the town website, the other websites that the town
is is there any consideration to consolidating all the individual websites that are out and about for the town and make it under it. So both like water, >> water, fire, police, um library, I mean
library is CW Mars like they're not they're not coming that we don't have but um there's there's a lot of departments that are paying paying for things and websites. >> Yeah, there there probably is some great buying power. You know, that could be a good recommendation to sort of have some
>> So why is that not part of the MIS department? Uh because that's Guardian providing just dayto-day operations and security for our all our stuff and our all our tickets. I mean they get
tickets from you know records requests. They get tickets from someone locked out of the computer like I was one day. Um you know those are all the things that they assist us with to keep the firewall safe. I mean it just see the website typically
is part of an MIS function. >> It is it's sort of it's it's been outsourced and and done at a stipen level and recently we changed over to just contracting out the
support um and making it an expense. Um that's why and it had been as a wage in in the wages prior because it was it was paid as a salary. >> Mhm. >> Uh versus a contract.
>> Is there any chance that we'll bring MIS back into town to hire somebody? >> I don't think so. I think the previous TA had signed a three-year agreement with Guardian if I remember correctly. So I don't think I'm I'm working that
can of worms anytime soon. Again the whole employee insurance cost etc etc question probably >> they figure an IT person's figures is where they start and I think we take our
15 >> 160 plus >> other things and and again some of that 150 um maybe it's worth taking a look and and seeing is it better to not pay them to do Microsoft licenses versus us.
We don't we don't have it listed separately and I think that's all we've been I think we need to really separate into how much we're paying for software licenses for the how much we're paying for the real service. >> Well, is that Anthony too? Doesn't Anthony >> Anthony has he's an MIS. So, if I if I
jump down to the MIS um that is in the wages area >> 3,400 bucks I think. >> Yeah, about 35. Is he the MIS technician? >> He's the MIS technician. 3266. >> Yeah. So the notes say Anthony from I
help. So rather than go directly to Guardian because it will bump into your hours of coverage that they give you, we we have a triage through Anthony. This is something that can be fixed easily, something he's got experience with. And again, when he works a problem and he
does escalate the ticket to guardian, he's got that knowledge and when they close it out, it adds to his knowledge of the IT part. >> So, does anybody ever look at their bill to see um if we go over their monthly
amount to see how much we're going over or are we not ever going over >> with Guardian? >> Yeah. Uh it depends on the questions and >> well in terms of their 40 hours a month or whatever it is. >> Yeah, >> we exceed that.
>> I'm a month in so I don't know quite yet but um based on you know some some things do rise to the threshold and >> based on what Nelson had told me you know it es and flows it averages out to about that 40 hours or so. >> If you look at the expense report at
least it's only around 50% for MIS at this point. So right on schedule, it's on Yeah, it's kind of on but that's that's required us to raise over the last few years. >> But then what's the MIS communications
that's at 120%. >> Yeah, it's kind of offset by that other purchase services. >> Yeah. So what is that the MSI communications? that might be the questions and stuff that he's that you're referencing. Possibly
>> um at um at one time um I've seen it jump back up to 15,000 at one time. It was explained to us that um because of all the firewalls and things that we collapsed when we redid the wiring, they needed to take it from
15,000 to 5,000. They thought they'd save they'd have that savings. Um >> Okay. So they not having the savings. >> They're not having quite having the savings that they got. >> They are a pretty good group for what it's worth. Um they've been very
diligent with our fiber optic expansion. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. And part of the um offer funds also. >> My experience is that they don't always respond right away. I I
>> Yeah. I'm not a fan. Just think that way. >> Yeah, >> I can tell you that that would be true of any MIS department in any company. >> So, if they're responding to you within two weeks, you're doing pretty good. >> Well, I had a laptop that worked when I
went to conferences so that I could post meetings and do all that stuff. They came along and all of a sudden I couldn't do anything >> and they came in a couple of times and I I couldn't get on anything >> to be able to do that. And
>> welcome to corporate America. >> It used to be >> I'm I'm not arguing that. But I'm just saying you go to any company in this country and their MIS department is pretty much about the same. SNL until you find >> what's that >> SNL Nick the computer guy
>> I was going to say until >> and I work with computers so believe me I know >> I get it right >> that is the argument right there >> exactly >> okay what's next >> okay let's go >> I've looked through a lot of the the DVA
here Most of the departments seem to be running pretty close to 50%. >> And some above, some above, some below. And I was going to say the piece on the on the I it just to get back to they
have the we don't use all 40 hours. They bank them and allow you to do projects using them. So you can you don't use all 40 amount support. They do pay those hours. >> They Yeah, it it's like unused minutes
on the phone. So, you want them carry forward. >> Mhm. >> Back in the day. >> Back in the day, I'm always getting systems notices over over whatever gigabytes whatever they whatever they
over. Um, so I'm I'm going to ask the question just because it's here and it's not consistent. Um, it well it we haven't had continuity between >> administrators and things on the
IT replacement equipment. Is there a plan and are we executing to the plan? >> I do not know your question. I don't know the answer to your question. >> Okay. No, no, no. But that's that's the kind of thing. I mean, we we have it in the budget and we need to get on that
schedule because we know every 5 years a laptop is going to die. >> It's kind of like and we need to whether it's a laptop, desktops are usually more reliable. So maybe have a different plan. But if we don't have that kind of plan, if we've got the money, if we're
not spending it, it really needs to start because it's all going to come at once if we don't if we don't Last I knew, they finished updating land use computers this past fall. >> Yeah. >> Um so I think it was going department to
department, but I don't know enough about it yet. >> Um if if it's with Guardian, and I suspect it is, then they're likely on a schedule. That's probably how the contract was written. Okay. >> So, what other budgets are >> highway? Oh, we're going to look at
highway. Why would we look at highway? >> Well, we >> No, we we may put those off. I wanted to >> put highway off. We can't talk about snow anymore. >> Well, >> we we need to talk about the >> Oh my god. I can't even get out of my
driveway. I can't see. >> It's hard to see. >> Oh, I know. >> Oh, yeah. So, >> Oh, yeah. Coming out of a side street trying to >> see oncoming traffic is a challenge. >> James, I would be
for the um conservation commission and land use and things. Put that in that. What about it? >> Okay. I think land use was at I think six is land use cuz they were at
>> the land use administrator is at 121%. >> Do we have one? I thought who was that contractor? >> That was me. They the funds were incorrectly labeled on that line item. Um okay. >> I worked with Beth and Colby. Um, I
didn't get a full thumbs up from them, but I did input the numbers there on that spreadsheet. >> News administrator. >> Um, you know, they would really like to see a land use coordinator at least part-time back into that role there. Having sat down with them earlier today, I think that's probably, you know, 15K
was the dream. I think it's probably closer to 5 to 7500 and have someone just be a gut check on some of the oil and tanner things, the tie and bond reviews, stuff of real technical detail related to storm water management,
housing ideas, grant stuff, you know, they could really use a second set of eyes at a higher level to review some of those things. We care, you know, how complex some of the planning board stuff is. Mhm. >> Really? >> Yeah. That's why we have the lawyer on speed dial, >> right? So, in lie of a lawyer, I think
it's it's find someone who could be a a peer type review. >> Do we have a a job out for that? I mean, are we >> part of the bargaining? >> Part of the bargaining was to not fill that role. >> Yeah. Last year, >> because it's a supervisor's position. Um
so having done a lot of budget work so far I don't suspect that role will be filled in this goround >> but I think it is worthy of some funding to help that group you know particularly Beth she works really hard for you guys
>> she does think she deserves I think the role deserves to have some someone assist with some of the highle highly technical I agree with you. So, oh, they don't want to hire because they got to hire a supervisor position
because of this union business. >> Mhm. >> So, like my role for the town as the housing grant person was not a union position, >> but the grants were so I wasn't a part of any CBA whatsoever. >> It's not that we didn't want to fill it. It was part of the union negotiations
that that position would not be filled. So it was a mutual issue. So >> the union told us not to fill it. >> It was part of the back and forth negotiations. >> It was part of the negotiations. That was it. >> I don't know what that means. Part of negotiations. I mean >> so in lie of someone else did not want
to. >> Yeah. So in so in place of Kieran a union person losing his job hypothetically and he said we won't fill the vacant role right now. So we don't reduce the headcount. We just don't add
to it. That is your union style negotiation there. I think that also that also happened with a highway position if I remember correctly. They didn't fill it and you'll see on highways budget. I know it's covered in
snow right now. Um there's two open positions they're looking to fill. >> Well, now they can fill >> if they if they get the budgets approved. >> Well, there's money. Well, I mean, well, I Okay, but how does that how does the union negotiate if the union said no,
you can't fill it? >> That was last year. >> The position still exists when instead of the salary cuts, the union negotiated to not fill. We didn't fill the highway department role and we didn't fill the Atlanta use, which were currently
vacant. >> That doesn't mean that they're not those positions are gone. The select board hasn't eliminated those positions. It was just for this year's and part of the union negotiation. >> They couldn't be filled. So who represents towns and in these union? Who
who who is the union negotiators for the town of Towns for our benefit? Let's put it this way. >> For the >> not for the people. >> What's what's the definition of benefit? Like is it who who defends the taxpayers's dollars? >> Yes, that's exactly what I'm asking. So,
in that sense, it's likely your town administrator and a liaison from the select board and your town labor council to say, "We don't we can't, you know, we can't agree to 100% wage increases to everybody. That's not affordable." And, you know, and if they say that's a
non-negotiable, then they'd say, "All right, well, that means you're going to lose, you know, Frosty the Snowman and The Polar Bear King, and you're going to be stuck with Oscar the Grouch." >> So, in other words, it's >> Oh, good. the town administrator, a someone from the board of select one
>> typically. Yeah. >> And the the lawyer a lawyer from >> labor laborally it's different than town council cuz labor laws >> I understand >> but it's from the same law >> correct usually. Yeah. >> Was labor council always part of the
negotiations? Cuz I don't remember that >> until last year. >> Yeah. I can't tell you how it went in the past. So you guys may know better than I think >> you don't really know the email. >> I I can find that out. I'm I'm pretty sure they were I mean they have to review labor contracts.
>> They may have reviewed it negotiating. >> I can get you an answer for that. >> Yeah. The more knowledge you have, the better. >> Okay. >> So, what are the budgets?
>> Well, where are we on the agenda? >> We're at 118 recreation and no conservation. Are they still doing their select boards? >> They have a lot of budgets. >> Yeah, but on here we only have select board recreation highway. But select
board has a lot of >> water. Oh, >> that's why. So, >> oh, so where are we at now? Conservation. >> Oh, we just did land use. >> I was just going to say I I was just going $5,000. >> How about building is building
>> building should >> this is last year. We have >> on the safety when we get to safety. But >> okay. I was just wondering because he's appointed. That's why there's facilities right here. >> No, I'm not. Yeah. No, I'm talking about building. I was asking.
>> No, that's that's Rob. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, where are we going to next? >> Um I I was going to say a little maybe up there. Are you Do you have conservation also? >> The conservation commission. >> Yeah, correct. that's in there. I think
I added 4% to the conservation agent's wages based on I was just guessing what their goal was. I did that for he from the planning board admin and zoning board 48. >> Yep. And then I think I added some training. Um >> go back to that screen again. What did
that say? Partly ARPA funded. I thought there were no more ARPA funds. In the past, that role was ARPA funded >> in the full note says that oper >> no longer funded by Arper in FY26. >> It wasn't before. >> Apparently was
>> it was in fiscal year 24. >> Wow. >> Jeez. >> Because we couldn't >> Don't ask. Just don't even ask. >> Clothing allowance 600. >> Yep.
So conservation agent will often do site visits, put on their muck boots and really get into it. >> One of our agents used to come back with ticks all the time. >> Awful. Awful. >> Yeah. >> I will say one thing though, having called the conservation people out
several times this year. I really really believe that they should be wearing a jacket, a sweatshirt, some things that says towns. Give it a lanyard with IDs. >> Or a lanyard with a what? Something. They don't have anything.
>> Mhm. >> They got clothing allowed. I don't have a jacket with you. >> That's right. Does she have Yeah. sweater or the same police? >> Yeah. Anyway, >> if you want, Don can put that note in
there and give words to Don and he can email it to me and I can put that in the back of my head for negotiations. >> Don put that in negotiation head. >> Okay. I don't like another place they always wanted to
go out on it. >> Boots and shoes too. I mean, >> I don't think they should go to TJ Maxx. >> No. No, I mean you got to give them a clothing allow
some sort of coat whether it's a winter coat or a summer coat with some sort of coat. >> This is a town work for the town. >> Um probably not. >> Oh, >> I would say that there's fees on that, right? >> There's there's
>> always >> very few training opportunities nowadays are free. There are some online courses but in this case you know agent streeter might be going to like a dam discussion where they talk about you know viability of dam and sediment controls and they're
doing >> doing that I know just talking usually they charge >> I see right similar to >> I'm just I've thought some things before
but I guess not stable but I don't I think that's a lot of money cuz I think those guys should be trained. >> Oh yeah, definitely. Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah, that would be fine. I don't have any questions. >> I'm sure he spent some money around
going places already. This year it's only January. He'll he'll load back up on outdoor gear early spring. I guess some of the stuff he was wearing back into the office in the fall when I was still land use was covered in ticks or it was,
>> you know, beat up pretty good from the water and, you know, some real kind of dicey places. So, it's also tons of time 32 hours a week >> plus or minus depending on that week. So, benefited as well. What?
>> Benefited position. >> A benefited position. >> Yep. >> I bet you he wouldn't agree with that if you talked to him >> for >> um MRPCs that come from or is that I know that's just our
general MRPC >> and that that's under conservation. >> Well, after conservation is the MR. >> Oh, it's so it's in that area. So, we have to pay $3,000 to belong to that. Is that the MBTA? Is that the train then?
>> No, no, no. This this MRPC is the more regional planning commission. >> Yeah. >> Um, it's kind of they they do grants and stuff and they do training and mappings. Is this the thing that we work on?
>> Yeah. They suck. >> Oh my god. What a waste. What a waste. >> I mean my you know how I feel about them in my in the open space at recreation. I do.
>> So I won't go there but I keep them. >> I was going to say no,000. >> No increase for them this year. >> Uh undocumented >> because usually they go up a little minute. They haven't yet. >> Okay. >> Oh okay. So it again it's a place
>> away it's not a huge number on the grand scheme. So to see a 10% increase is not out of the question in most of these unknown lines. >> Yeah. >> Planning board is that Beth? >> It is. That's your board assistant.
>> Yeah. >> Y and this is the only place that longevity exists for her. >> Well, she earns her money. That's for sure. I know. She's doing the phone. >> Just Yeah.
>> Yeah. She works hard. >> She You know what? Well, we have to be careful. It's not the person in the position. It's the position we have to look at. >> Mhm. >> I don't know. I like all the facts to be considered. I don't like >> I know. I know. I know. But I
understand. It's where we are with >> the TA position. >> It's the role. If you look at me when I talk about these things, often people get mad at me, but I'll say the board of health administrator, the library director. >> Yeah. You have to be very >> You really have to depersonalize >> as much as you can when you're talking
about >> Well, because I guess the person left. >> Yeah. >> So then you buy somebody that you don't like. >> Well, then you do like >> and so you want to pay that person a whole lot more because you like >> So that's against the law
>> and so that's not the way to look at it. So, it's a position. >> Well, I I understand that it's a position, but tell me that this Okay, never mind. I don't want to go there, but but but I just want to say this. It's so much nicer to deal with people that are
friendly and nice. >> Oh, yeah. >> At the this kind of thing, city hall, >> right? >> Yeah. Courthouse, court, the courts, and all that. >> Then some old grump. >> Yeah. Register. >> Yeah. the way they the the country is
full of grumps at the court levels. >> It's easy to be grumpy. >> I know. >> Grumpy's a grumpy. It's easy to be grumpy. It's hard. It's just like that's a requirement to work in a courthouse and miserable. >> All right.
I mean, I don't have any questions. >> It's pretty upfront. >> Yeah. I will say that when I decided to go back through these numbers today, I I shrunk down some of the, you know, office supplies, you know, things of that nature. And I did look at the DVA to sort of benchmark it. And I chatted
with that, uh, chat with the planning board, um, assistant, and they thought that, yeah, some of those could come down a little bit and be a little bit more frugal. Um so >> well is it what are the chances and is
there any kind of benefit >> to cooling the money the candy >> so that >> instead of my office buying pens, pencils, staples like that. Granted, I
know like the accountant has the checks that they have to buy. town clerk has the security paper and the bonding paper that they have to use. So that could be their office supplies. But for the overall
>> Yeah, it's something that I when I quickly chatted with the Ashby TA and TA town manager. >> Um I think there there may be an opportunity in there. >> We may not save a ton of pennies. We may save a few. So we're going to check in.
>> Anything is better than enough by We could maybe combine it with the school system and that could be the loading dock. Maybe that becomes the real swing there. So each town >> I think that would be huge. I mean just the paper and toner alone, >> right? The toner expense is wild. Like you're almost better off buying a new
printer every time. And then office space in one year it doubled >> and it was like what the heck is this? >> So okay handcuffs. >> That's what that is. >> Okay. P was selling printers many years ago
which probably still exist. >> They weren't selling printers. They were waiting for you to buy their toner. >> Free printer. Just buy your toner. >> All right. Um because our office supply money is
not really um what's the word I want? >> Huh? >> Not enough or >> Oh, it's not enough. >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah, it's it's not enough. It's it's nearly been >> No.
>> cut back and we've we've level funded for so many years and stuff that it's just >> Yeah. >> and cut >> Yeah. and paper. The cost of paper and toner is just >> All right. So, what else do we have?
>> Toning board. >> I imagine that would be pretty easy, too. >> Yep. Okay. >> That's what I was saying. So like in zoning code you'll see that there's operating sound but there there's no
32 and six 38 small I don't know maybe I don't know he was returning to part time that's a person we don't have correct Yeah.
>> For $15,000, right? >> No. And I'll, like I said earlier, I'll probably say that's $7,500. In fact, it's really just it' be a contract with a oil and tanner who's a pretty strong firm in the area for peer review, really complex storm water
management, subdivision plans, etc. So it's properly you know compensating consultant type to look at those high highly detailed projects and we have a few going on um you know for planning it's there's a couple our mergers going
on so but it's also something that could be pardon the phrase a low hanging fruit that if the budget just couldn't sink out then you zeroed out. Oh, you can take them to the curve. >> Placeholders. Where are the placeholders
start? >> Placeholder was my inputting it. I may not have had a number yet, but be part of your practice here. So, >> right. Yeah, because those numbers we get from Patriot. >> Correct. But, um I was going down to the school
because we >> Oh, yeah. Patriot. That's the um the class, right? The Well, I made it last two. >> Are there any other budgets from I'm not thinking
>> I was um probably to be discussed at another time. All the insuranceances and all that. Oh yeah, I think it's way >> and who takes care of that? >> I'm working on that now. >> Yeah. >> Uh the insurance we had a positive um
report from Maya just >> Saturday morning >> Saturday morning as a uh they're not going to exceed the highest one would be 14.4%. >> The lowest was like 2.9. >> I counting all my chickens to hope that
we're somewhere in the middle. We had budgeted 15%. Currently, so >> it was better than what they had originally worked as. >> Yeah. So, I may take that 15% number that I think has the math on there and drop it down to 14.4. I can send an
updated copy out to Don so he can share with you guys. Um, just cuz it that that is a chunk of change that will save us some dollars. >> Yeah. >> Right. Cuz that's a big number to start with. So, if you save a save a percent off, that's what counts.
That might get you that land use coordinator position, right? >> Well, yeah. You figure 1% is almost 15k. >> Oh, there you go. Land. Great. Yeah. Does the school have a um numbers yet for that? Because the last meeting Jerry and I went to, they had I think
>> they just gave us our total number so far and they hadn't voted the budget yet. >> Okay. I think overall they're at 4.65%. >> Okay. I think that's about what it was when we went to that meeting. I don't know kind of after December. I
don't know what happened. Yeah, >> I think I think they were meeting tonight on the budget short. >> Well, this was like a finance committee. >> Yep. Y >> very interesting. Really? >> Yeah.
>> And well, so are we done with the select board accounts and general government part? I I believe so. But other than that, it's just all the expenses after that. So, we'll see again with the health insurancees and >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. That's Yeah. >> Yeah. That's it's too early, >> right? Question, but I think that's that's it. >> So, do we want to move to recreation? We can see if there's any questions. >> Recreation should be in there. Um
recreation is 16. The primary cost there is your director. Okay. >> You have supervisor um salary uh with >> temporary help and some supplies. And then there was one
>> $2,500 line. >> Yeah. I I think I have I have I don't know if I can speak to this or not. Can I not? >> I'm on the committee. I'm telling you right now that you should watch this budget like a
hawk and we should have as much information as we can possibly get from the income and outgoing before make a decision. Um, so it's the account number is 655. I'm sorry. >> Mary Jane, can I just get clarification?
Are you talking about their fund? Because this is just their budget. >> So their fund. >> I understand that. But I think that we have to look at the entire picture in order to be able to make a good decision
on what we should do. I don't think we should separate that because that that has been the thing. We're self-funded except for we're this except for we're that except for No, we want to look I think we should be looking at the big picture and I think
that's going to tell us a very different story. >> So if I can add more complexity to that thought. Okay. >> That would be true of many departments within town >> where indirect costs become a burden of
the treasure collector, payroll, HR, etc. So, it's a really good question to understand all the unexpected costs that I'll use like um
port of health uses, you know, there they have their own enterprise account. Mhm. >> But then they also, you know, will consume some payroll costs because of payroll questions and things of that nature. So, it's a really good question to totally understand the entire makeup
of what the role, you know, um does for the the town. You can say the same thing for water. though they they their budget, you know, their revenue and expenses even out, there are still indirect costs,
you know, asking the treasury collector to process bond paperwork, etc., etc. That perhaps as a con, you ought to consider putting almost like a percentage amplifier on the amount that they return to the town to recover
additional indirect expenses as it relates to that department. >> Okay. could happen for water and go to health. But I don't think recreation does that. >> They do if they call HR and they ask them a question. >> Oh, really?
>> Right. >> None of this very content for right now. Really? >> Well, she's she runs off an enterprise fund saying she doesn't >> revolving fun. >> I mean revolving. >> Okay. So, it's not the Yeah, I was
thinking water. Okay. Yeah. Revolving. >> Yeah. >> Which is why she's the only one listed in here. Correct. Because >> she's she's employed by the town. That position is a town position. I finally got it. >> Yeah. That is that's a town position.
Everything that's hired for the programs is hired. >> I understand that completely. Trust me. I get it. I get it. >> Shouldn't that still be Shouldn't we still know what the pay is for that? >> Yeah. We um that's something we haven't looked at but we should be looking at
the revolving funds on an annual basis to uh determine because at town meeting we vote on what the val what the what the value is to >> that's exactly right and and last year we never even looked at anything for recreation just okay
>> it got hectic last year so I really think that this is one place that we should be really scrutinizing because >> all of them it's >> well I understand that but I have intimate knowledge of this and I really >> I know I can't speak to it but I can't
>> you I would yeah >> I don't know I don't know what the >> we should know what we should know what she's spending the money on >> right >> absolutely and we how many kids involved >> how many kids
>> how many kids are actually in that >> how many kids are actually in that program um morning program, >> the morning program in the afternoon. How many are actually in that program? We have no idea. >> We don't know if this is something that
>> is a benefit to the town. >> Well, that's my exact point. That that is my I absolute exact point. I understand and and the philosophy is, "Oh my god, these kids really need help because they don't have a Okay, trust me, I get it." >> Mhm. >> But there's other ways to take care of
those kind of kids. you know, there's other situations >> and there have been several um suggestions made and just like I don't
>> Yeah. So, in in the um email that was sent, they asked, "We'd like our $2,500 budget." Now, what is what was that? No, not at all. We didn't have a meeting. They did. She didn't talk about it.
>> I have no idea what it is. >> 2500 operation budget back. And additionally, a capital planning form will be sent by Monday. So, we should see that on our meeting, which she's asking for a capital.
>> Not this meeting is not on the agenda. >> No. Okay. I hold >> Yeah. So she's asking for some she'll be asking for something permit to put to install that equipment.
>> Clearly 2500. >> No. >> I don't know what the 2500 is. >> No, the 2500 doesn't qualify for capital. >> No, but she's asking for whatever but I don't know what it is. If you look back to FY25,
it was in the FY25 purpose budget. I don't know what it was, but I'm just looking at approved FY25. >> How much was that? Is there any line item, you know, line next to it saying what it is? >> Just says miscellaneous supplies and services. >> Oh, okay. So, that was approved and it was taken out last year. >> Okay.
>> How much of she's just saying she wants she would like it back. >> But wasn't that originally a a self-funded program. Yes. >> No, but this is what they tell you. It is self-funded except for her salary right >> now. I'm not understanding that because
you're either self-funded or you're not selfunded, >> right? >> Period. And a statement. If you're self-funded, you bring in the money to pay for everything, right? >> Cuz if there was no recreation department
>> or let's say there were no kids, >> would she just get paid to be there? That mean would have to be the determination whether if without the kids is it is it a place you want to a
position you want to fund but if we if we look at and see what the re what the results are is >> yeah we don't know what the results are and I think it's critical because >> right >> tax paid a dollar it was supposed to to watch it out for. >> Mhm. Yep.
>> And the library, it seems that the library >> has stronger resources and can accommodate the things that recreation used to accommodate.
>> Well, recreation has to charge more money because library has grants. I get it. >> Yeah. Look, just because the library can do things because they're brilliant does not mean the recreation doesn't do
anything. Figure it out. >> Well, years ago, recreation had the summer recreation program and program >> and and they had a couple of outings uh maybe three outings during the year. I know monster trucks was a big one.
Didn't they have too for >> Library does Library does monster truck I think. >> No truck. >> This is going to the monster truck show in >> No, but I think we have to get a handle on this
>> recreation. Yeah, they did because they had them upstairs, >> right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. If if you have specific questions you want me to ask the recreation director, maybe not. I can get you some answers via Don and share them back with you.
>> Okay. >> Whether it be participation or you know what what are what are the top right >> four most well attended events you had last year, >> you know, like how many young people are you or how many people are >> I think that the summer program is excellent and good and every town
deserves a summer program. I believe that. But I think we should be looking into that. >> Right. It's a full-time position or is it something that is a seasonal? >> Is it Is it a seasonal? Is is it a part time that reports to somebody that's
putting on more programs all the time? >> This the price of >> kind of but I I think it's the price of that person. >> What the recreation department had 62,000 and change.
>> Yes. That's that's this year's next year. >> Yeah. I'm notically the number one. >> But for a seasonal person and then Yeah, that's >> paid time. The position is full time. >> Yeah.
>> That should be worked in there. >> I I Yeah, I think so. >> Okay. So, we'll get a list of notes and questions um and including getting the breakdown. pay for daycare, right?
>> Mhm. >> Yeah, that's part of the summer program goes into the account, >> right? Okay. >> But here's my question and I asked this question like day one. How come Spalding has its own what do you call it?
>> Before and after and after school. >> Before and after, but it's not a town thing that is outsourced to another >> organization. They charge an arm and a leg. They're getting it. So, and they got over 40 kids in it.
Why doesn't our recreation department have that contract with the school? >> Good question. >> Why is it outsourced? I thought it was Townson first. What happened to that? >> But that's North Middle Sex. >> North Middle Sex versus >> versus town.
>> And it's Spalding. >> But it's just a Spalding kids. It's not pepper. It's not actually. >> Do you guys have a liaison to like the recreation department? Is it a committee or a commission? We have a recreation. >> It's a commission. >> Commission. Okay.
>> I'm actually on the commission. >> That's why I feel the directive that you guys offer that group. >> Well, I asked her to go touch. >> They must have to go out to bid for that. >> I don't know. >> I don't know. Oh, Rachel. Rachel. Um,
which um Rachel, she is the chair. That's not Rachel. >> Oh, Rachel P. >> Rachel. She's the voice of reason. And she said they were going to revisit it when I brought it up because I thought they should be revisiting it and I it never
came back. So, I don't know how they revisited or what they're revisiting. The other issue on it is I know I'm going to get in trouble for this, but the town fields were renting for a dollar
because they take care of them. Of course they take care of them. They have they have to have have the sports on them. >> Who negotiates that? That should be recreation. >> Who rents them for a dollar? The town of Town rents the town softball soccer blah
blah blah to the baseball fields owned by the baseball association by the town of Town and they're rented for >> but they can't work because they need to or they wouldn't be able to use them. >> Right. >> It's not like they're doing it for the
town. But if if they if they were paying more for the lease, they would be expecting Township to >> We know that that would be a negotiable item. >> I mean, haven't you ever heard of a lease and you got to also shovel? >> No. If you're rent,
>> if you're renting an apartment, the landlord's supposed to shovel, >> right? >> It is the um >> I think the landlord's responsible for clearance. >> It is the moth middle. No. Well, it's New York. >> What's this? North Middle Sex.
>> The extended day program for North Middle. >> Oh, okay. So, she would be So, our recreation, our daycare center would not be eligible for that. >> I don't know. Um, well, I mean, anybody.
>> Like Kathy said, it has to go out to bed. >> I would think it would have to go off to bed. >> Well, she never been one. >> I don't know. She claimed that she did once and she talked to the superintendent and he assured her that it was going to happen and then it never did. So I don't know cuz I wasn't there
at that time so I don't know what happened. >> Well, we don't even know which superintendent it was. I mean >> no we do. >> We do apparently. >> Are you sure? >> Yeah 100%. >> Well she said >> but it is part of the middle sex
extended day program. Well, yeah, it is. But it's >> But it's contracted out. >> It's contracted. That's my point. >> Yeah. >> So, everybody gets to bed, right? >> Yeah. >> Oh, this is an old one. So, it must have
This is 24 25. So, there must be a new one. >> I don't know how how long the contract is or anything because I expected them to get information and come back and they never did. Let me see how it feels too. That was another issue.
I think there was another one, but Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There is the um installation of the gym equipment. >> That's probably the capital >> for the NFC fitness courts. So that um
I wrote a grant for that a few weeks ago and we're waiting to hear back from the show valley in terms of their funding level. They were awarded a grant. Um we were asking for I think $25,000 from the concrete slab. >> Correct. And the rest I believe there
have been some private fundraising for to like I guess you have to seal the concrete in a certain either cure it and seal it a certain way with an adhesive and then put the equipment that we are storing I think in one of the garages here >> out there. Um and then it was going to
be you know some parking lot maintenance and such make sure it's ADA accessible >> to get there. So I think we're about 50k short. Um, I don't remember if the recreation director had put that on a capital plan or not. Um, I know at one
point we did have some funds from uh, Miss Margaret Scarsdale's office, but I just don't know if that ever came to fruition because >> No, I don't know. And that's another kind of a sticky wicket with Representative Scarsdale to have her put
funds aside believing that, you know, the project would be completed with her funds and then not have it. That's not a really good look. Yeah, I think you know and that was amidst the governor sort of peeling back little chunks of change along the way too because based on the
financial presentation we as a state are probably in a financial pickle. >> Well well I mean as a taxpayer I'd rather those funds go to the schools right >> than to install some fitness equipment.
So I mean from a taxpayers's point of view >> to representative. >> Oh I absolutely don't worry. >> Yeah. No I think there's some I think that there's some financial questions that we need to answer.
>> Yep. >> And I really do and this is the second year it's been going on since I've been involved. M and I think that uh you know hesitation and changing the story and I and we got to know the facts.
>> If you're on the recreation commission or >> I am >> just this is just be mindful of >> your angling just cuz if you're on a committee and then you're on another committee I just want to make sure I'm saying out loud of my own due diligence like >> No, I get it. I get it. But I think I should be able to tell the finance
committee what is going on. >> Yeah. with concern. I mean, to hide it. I don't care if I'm breaking the open meeting law. Well, there's nobody here. I'm not. >> You You do care. You know, we >> No, I don't care. I mean, what I'm saying is I don't I don't think it
should be secret what's going on over there. >> I think should know. I don't it's kind of like I think we all have insights into different organizations that we're associated with >> in in different parts of volunteering and
working within the town, you know, so you're bringing experience from the recreation. >> Correct. And this is like the second year. This is not the first time and we didn't get any answers last year, you know, straightforward, >> right? Yeah.
and trying to come up with another $50,000 on top of you know I don't know what it is. I mean why >> Right. If it if it's 50 do you do 50,000 for that or 50,000 to >> Well, isn't that what this meeting is for? It's to get the questions to ask
the direct Y that's the reason why person >> we're doing it. Yep. >> Yep. >> So I think those questions have to be asked and answered. forget being asked for the answer truthfully. Truthfully, >> right? >> It's factually concretely, not I am
>> right. Yeah. >> I got a grant out. I don't know what's going to happen. I've got this out. I don't know what's going to happen. >> Those those those are the assumptions. If you if you have dollar numbers, you you put it in. You say this is we're trying to get a grant for this amount and it's going to you know, if it comes
in, it's one number. if it doesn't come in um or if it comes in at half what the grant >> and then there's plan B if the money is not available and we can't get it from any source now what do we do I think that plan B should be in place >> Mhm. Yeah, plan B if the project doesn't
move forward >> and sits in the garage for the rest of eternity. >> Yeah, we may find that that group at some point asks for it back. >> I think they're going to be at the end of their >> group. Well, they've been sending us letters every 6 months.
>> They sure have. >> But there's not enough room in there. No. >> Well, yes, it's paid for, but part of the contract is that you have to have it installed by a certain date, and that's been pushed and pushed and pushed cuz you never had the money. And then, >> oh, I didn't know that either. >> Well, see, you guys don't know because no one told us.
>> No, I I'm sorry I didn't tell you this. >> Okay, >> we didn't have it on the agenda, so I couldn't talk about it, but And we couldn't talk. >> How do we do the This is what bothers me. How do we do these contracts without having the total funds available?
>> I mean, this is other contracts personed by by trade. >> How do you think I feel about this budget in this And this and this drives me crazy cuz we got fire trucks that we can't get delivered because they weren't
fully contracted for for the whatever equipment or whatever they >> it's like >> I'm less concerned about trucks per se. I'm more concerned about bodies and seats and making sure we
answer the taxpayers's call when they call the phones. the equipment's whatever >> whatever but but still it's the contract it we're not doing a very good job with our contracts >> that I would say from my experience what
I've seen you're right you're right I don't know who views them I don't know who says okay I don't know how indepth they get I don't know who negotiates if they're know the right questions to ask I don't know so but the contracts definitely leave a lot to be desired the ones I've seen
>> and the ones I've seen. So, whatever. But >> all right. So, we're going to get these questions answered or >> Yep. We'll we'll put them put them down and get them to Karen. And >> are you taking those? >> Oh, okay.
>> He's going to photographic memory YouTube. >> Okay. So, that I kind of predicted which ones were going to stand out to you guys, too. So, I'm checking the box. I've missed on one so far. Otherwise, I'm pretty much on. >> I was going to say as we were talking
about office supplies and contracts and toner brought back the um details about the new copers in that contract. >> Oh yeah, that's a good one. >> We should count >> because we should pay you to review the contract. Yeah. 15,000.
>> Well, worth it. >> I'll make a deal with you. Oh, were you going to have a new contract with the copers? >> No, no, no. We we signed a contract last year when we got the two new copers and it was a click charge. >> That's when you were new, K before you,
>> right? Yeah. It was a special warrant article. >> Is there like a a page limit and then you pay so much over >> you pay per so every page you print you and colors are 10 times the price of white.
>> Yeah. Always. But do we have like a limit like you know contract says you got I don't know >> 500,000 order. >> Okay. So >> okay >> somebody read the somebody read the
contract so we know who >> so we just need to revisit it and see what it is. >> Carol I think you would be a great person who should be ready to move on the highway. Um, we can look at highway. >> What can we say about highway?
>> Can we push that to the next one? >> Why would we put it in the spring so I don't know the real number? >> Yeah, especially >> and it's where it's under public safety. Let's move it out to get it in the >> Okay. Move it out to what we
>> discuss public safety, right? >> Public safety and put it in there. >> Oh, you mean fire or police? >> Move it to fire police. Public safety. Well, the building commissioner, it's kind of like kind of hard until the winter's over to really high. >> Well, I think snow and ice should be
left aside and let's see what the rest of the thing is doing. >> Snow ice is a different budget. They >> That's a great idea. >> Yeah, I agree. >> Okay. >> But police and white building commissioners and then safety. >> Yeah, he's inspectctor. >> Yep.
>> Safety animal control officer then. >> Okay. So, we're going to move that off. We'll move that >> to the public safety discussion. >> So, is it again, you know, >> is it appropriate to make a motion to adjourn then?
>> Um, we don't have another meeting yet. >> Okay. >> When are we meeting with them? >> Next Tuesday. >> Next Tuesday. 23 and 210 I believe is the goal. >> Is it at 6:00? 23 and 210. Do we know? >> I don't know the exact time off the top
of my head, but I will email Don. I think it's >> five or six and 210. >> Yep. Joint with >> days of those are those Tuesdays. >> Yes, ma'am. Yep. >> Okay. >> So, it's Tuesday and we have set a set
our meeting will go before and after. So, >> correct. >> We're not staying with seven hours. No, I'd love to have you though. A lot of candy. >> Yeah, I think so. I just I I don't know off the top of my head. Got a little sidetracked this afternoon. So,
>> would six be the best five or six? >> Six definitely because we have this working. Fair enough. >> And the rest of us are going to still have to shovel up next. Well, the sun's going down at 5:30 now. It's got to be >> Here's a question about fire and ice. I
mean, not fire department. >> Can we call his residents and ask them to take snow away for us? Do they do that? >> What? >> What do we say that again? >> Can we if the snow banks are too high? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Yeah. No, I don't believe so. Um,
>> like at the end of the street or at the end of the driveway? >> No, not the driveway, but probably the end of the street. It bugs me out here. >> Every year they >> I know. That's why I always go gestured around. >> I don't know what happened in my place,
but right there at the corner of Old City and um Route 13, I left them a space from me to that corner say, "Please pile all your snow here." My trees as I've been planting them over
the last decade and a half have gone, you know, in the roads going like this. My trees have gone like this so they can plant snow on a corner. >> Can I bring my snow here? >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Yeah, we're supposed to put it there.
>> All right. So, I'll make a motion to adjurnn. >> We have a motion. Do we have a second? >> Second it. >> Okay. All in favor? >> I What time? 8:14.