##VIDEO ID:CSYuIhBxMg8## good afternoon everybody thank you for coming I'm going to call the meeting to order at 3:10 on December 12th Thursday um I would like to have a roll call please present GN Bas Laura shiffon Julius darkwell Mary Jane Churchville and we missing Susan but she's on her way correct Saina so what I'm going to do is I am going to announce right now that this meeting is being recorded okay yeah and it's all it's also available on Zoom for anybody who wants to watch it it's great show so we are going to review and accept the minutes of November 14th has everybody had a chance I'll be very worthy jul yeah it is very worthy we had a few minutes to look it over I make a motion to accept the minutes word by word a word by word i' like to take a verbal vote CLE oh I'm sorry any discussion on the meeting just um and I think could just cross it out and put the corre yeah mu namei M AI M AI it's m mui okay so we're gonna so to accept the minutes with the spelling correction yeah any other any any errors questions any other issues that we want to bring up on the meeting I didn't know the spelling of pet Tina the woman you spoke to in the historic dis so I just sort of guessed like an Italian name oh Ellie okay I think you said it was Elizabeth right Elizabeth yeah she called herself Ellie okay okay any other discussion we have a remote yes unanimous accepted I just do Voice vote yeah all right okay now on Al additions and deletions I do have one change I have to make on the agenda I put down mass that we're going to review Mass General law 40 but it's really 40 C it has a c after it so I just want to um bring that up okay now old business I wanted to talk about the applications for the Cooperage because I just want to make the minutes I just want to make it part of the meeting so The Cooperage originally back in 200 I want to say 21 had gone to a store New England and they were approved conditionally for certain work Historical Society has put in another application because a building permit was never given at the time was never issued so we had what 3 years with no building permit issued so with I would like to not force but I would like them to reapply to go back to Historic New England and confirm that what they had originally asked for is still what they're asking for and it's still approved so I can attach it to our minutes excuse me to our application I don't think that's unreasonable because it's been over close to five years is it well passed away I thought you passed around the 2021 and the 2020 uh3 I did but since then I found out that there was no building permit so the building inspector is making a new application requirement so I want that application to require they're going to say the historic district agreed that this is right but I want to make sure it's still an effect with the story going that's my concern claim everything yes so I would like to write a letter to the representative and explain that do we need to take the representative J okay we need to take a vote on that or is that just a clerical Duty that I I think a vote should be taken just to make it very clear that we're all okay so J is yes which we don't have motion yeah make a motion that Mary James send a letter to Jos s clarifying the information that we received several years ago make sure that it still fits into what was it m New England what hisor historic second we have a a Voice vote Yes I'd like to make an amendment to that okay I'd like to see it stated why we have to do this that uh permit was never issued in the letter yeah I will defin you know what I will write the letter and I'll send it for for review how does that sound and then you can just let me know so so you're you're seconding the motion with an amendment that possible I think accept I'm just add yeah right if you could you accept it we don't have to it's on Amendment we can be friendly okay before the vote yeah okay so can I have post discussion anybody else have something to add to that we can vot very good yes yes jul yes Julia so I will write the letter and I will send a copy for review so everyone can take look thank you oh good thank you um we're going to table the postard design and wording until the next meeting how's that you're welcome and new business okay so we have an issue pending in West hen the brick store has opened up again I don't know if everybody knows that and the owner has decided to go sign crazy on his oh God I haven't even seen that I haven't how' you miss it it's on your street I don't I don't go that yeah so taking a look at this I want to preface it that we had issues already with the Brick Store under the same ownership three years ago was it three years ago Claire two years ago yeah same one whoy same on that no I don't think honey owns the brook store I think it's just sunny sunny across the street yeah he owns a liqu store downtown but not I thought he owned no he doesn't own honeyland hey family yeah right so we had issues with honeyland and we had issues with the brick store we count letters to both of them sunny at the time took a lot of his signs down at The Brick Store honey land different ISS now he's back he's got all these signs up here so um I think we have to do an intervention well I'm surprised they're selling liquor oh it's all beer that's all it is beer and wine no beer and what's it Celsius that's a I don't know it's sausage I thought it was aom myself but I don't see any I think it's like a wine in a can I it's alcohol in a can yeah it's all alol I mean we can't do anything about that but the signage is is just so in violation that it's it's painful and he already knows so I don't know if we should just go to a letter or if we should send the building inspector out or how you want to handle it I think we should send the building inspector out that way I do too yeah I think I think that's the most appropriate way to do it yeah so it's a zoning issue Zing issue and enforces Zing yes and he enforces historic district rules too okay the building yeah he's the enforcer okay okay so and I have so what would you do you um contact him by letter or just come see the building inspector I would put it in writing I I'll put it in writing email or whatever should I do an email to him yeah yeah yeah think it should be in writing copy yourself and and I might come down also and speak with him and I'll pull the letter out from the prior the prior letter that was received so he's got some background so there's a little bit of background um you know you could sent the owner a letter stating that he is in violation if you feel comfortable about that but then you mean that is a first step yeah but I would still send out the building what was the letter sent out before was it from the histor commiss and it was under Eric chartran when Eric chartran was the commission the guy and he went up and spoke to Sunny and did he send out the letter or did I know she answered to that I I should look that up I can look under the I mean I could go look right now in Kathy's file but um I don't want to keep this here longer than we have to I can double check with that and find out how that was done and maybe follow that sequence okay because if the previous owner got a letter and sold it and didn't disclose he would have known that he had a violation he should have disclosed it but he didn't sell it he's still the own yeah he's still the own the same person as before yeah they just reopened it again to do the same thing that he was in violation of yeah so find out which Shan's letter was to him okay I'll dig that out and I would like to I'll bring that to the next meeting so that we can vote on consequences but well that's another thing I wanted to talk about segue to consequences um but let me finish this one up I'll will get sh trans order hi s how are you oh trying to be in two places at once it's not good idea oh we need a clone yeah we're talking about the signage at the yeah sunny sunny you remember a couple years ago we had s so um yeah um we had sent notice to him and then Eric Shan at least followed up I don't know if you followed up with the letter because I don't know if we wrote the letter or if Eric did I can't remember but I'm checking the file and we have to deal with sunny again yeah because L had pointed out if it was a sale that'd be a different story because then you have to look into disclosure and you have to find but the newon it's the same person same person so I'm going to look that up Susan what we did two or 3 years ago and follow that same yeah procedure now we're talking about um signs the sign yeah honeyland also has issue I'm kind of watching them because they're putting that new business on the right hand side that X right so I'm going to watch it because they really refuse to take their sign down they might have taken one down that was it so we do need a little bit of teeth in order to enforce I mean and I hate to use that word enforce because it sounds so militant but but we are supposed to preserve the historic inte of our town and it looks awful excuse me yeah that's why I'm gonna wait until I see what fex does you can't have a the fex or UPS yes oh well it's one of them yeah so I want to watch them to see what they're going to do and and kind of like collect the whole thing at one time rather than send them something now and then have to send something later I think it's better to see what they're up to and then give them a notice which brings me back to our cards see if we had our postcards going out every year every other year as a reminder that we would have more of a presence which would give us more of I believe that they would pay attention to okay so question sure um does the historic commission have um at let's say at the state okay do they have a guidance yes of enforcement oh enforcement in other words if this happens this is what you can do this is what's in within your powers to do should a violation occurred yes take them to court we can take them to court yeah I was going to say the anyway our to bring them to the court okay so I I I guess I before I voted on something I would want to know what our power was and what I'll do is I'll bring that to the next meeting with the and new for our lawyer no we can do it ourselves we can go pro okay we can go proos because we go right to theer um to the um it's not a criminal thing it's no you just file yes you just file something and they put you on the roster you show up but I you know you don't want to get to that point with commercial C you but you also don't want your town looking like that that's he could do so much better well I don't know how I feel about being a neighbor if his the next house the house well it's being sold by the way I think it's on the market house next next book on the market one of them is right in that area yeah either the next or one after you know I I don't wouldn't mind it open or you know a smaller sign but there's rules about the sign there rules about that yeah and Claire and Susan you will know it it has to be wooden a it can only be a certain Dimension B you can only have one one or two signs per building it's just one one sign per building yeah and no matter how you cut it this is M well my concern is is he going to come back say to us it's inside my building it didn't what it doesn't matter it doesn't matter what about the sign that we used to see that going by the upper level yeah did that matter they didn't have no one ever said anything about that oh yeah they did that was a free you're talking about the three family that had sign that was free speech where was that why is that three family in historic yeah and we nevered which are the three the one with the big pillars across the street from the Brick Store on the other side of the corner no no we should have I mean new new everything's still right there right so it's SM so I I think that um the inside doesn't cut it when it's advertising because I don't think advertising is Free Speech okay I think it it it change marketing right it's a marketing yeah it's not free speech right which just anyway even if it were free speech well they could use something that would be much nicer well he can bring signs out and bring them in at night can he not do that yeah yeah he he can't have it attached I mean that one supposed to be just beer and wine because junior is right about the thing that's that's Selter black yeah maybe that looks like it's just so awful have you been in it Susan no I have not it's awful no it's I heard it's oh horrible can't find anything no it's said they couldn't find anything yeah so um I don't know I don't go there yeah so I haven't been in either and it's a shame West Town so everybody else is pretty much well we have that blue house which is not good but you know the blue that's Liv in blue one there's a number of places around town that are eyes swords right so and certain they certainly don't reflect the flavor of what people want to maintain absolutely true it's it's real sad and and to that note I would like to give a shout out to three different properties I think the wood Farm Have You Been by the wood Farm it got sold this summer they have done a great job and that place was a mess and sheltz is building next to Forest appliances the Victorian that guy did a great job on beautiful just gorgeous and a little gem that probably I know about none of the rest of you do but on that road that comes up from Evans I don't know what you call it now is it Brooklyn Street is that street okay if you could go down Highland Street for Main Street which you can't do so we're coming up Evans the last house on the right the last one that's right on the river the Old Town by the way it's one of the oldest town old houses and it's been a mess for decades and some young couple bought it and just transformed it it's still cubes 13 no it's it's a little it's a little passed from Evans to School Street no Street I can't remember the name of it cross street is it cross street no the um Bridge yeah the bridge it's a shortcut you can bypass the lights you just go from you know what I'm talking and they've done such a great job and I would really like oh right behind the Methodist Church yes on yeah and I understand they're not part of the historic district other than the Victorian on Main Street but I just think as preservationists of historical buildings I think it would be nice if we just made the gesture of you've done a great job yeah oh yeah send them a letter a letter or a card or something back right up to the river yes I mean J used to live yeah yeah good J yeah a long time I don't know who's lived there for the last 20 years I don't either I don't either but I remember when Joon AL C bought and painted a oh oh that's right I remember that too everyone was like whoa but it just looks great and I think we should keep our eye on this properties that and plus it puts us out there again now we have no newspaper I'd love to put it in the newspaper but and I don't use Facebook so I don't either I couldn't do that but and we can't rely on Facebook either yeah and I don't want anyone to say anything all right to was the first one you mentioned um the wood Farm on road which has been in disrepair for probably eight years bar see it you just can barely see it the wood right across Church yeah directly you take that to go to Road Debbie Jones lived there years ago yeah Debbie used to have oh you have to go buyfast how much I want this St excited by that God I love that place it was in such disrepair it's one of the oldest houses Town yeah the farm and a a couple bought it with their father and they're slowly fixing up and they start on the outside first which I thought was a great idea because the curb sides just changed the road and the Victorian speaks for itself on Main Street Victorian across from store no no Victorian next to John oh John all right Appliance that's 258 Main Street he's done a great job on that so the hard part is that no one knows they're in the historic district and they've never know that's find out sh to them La is taking the job lach going on vacation to vegas. the bullet postcard the bullet postard going to send to us to us fell to sleep and she's wi away the post that new know that it was historic which yes yes he came and he went through all the gestures he came we went down to see you yeah he was very good and he asked us everything we wanted to know and he did everything outside in kind and he did stick to his kinds seems great we have some good people like think some people really say do I he saw that as as a building that should should shine and be be and it does I and you just want to thank people who do that just almost like the ones who did es sh crossing the post office he did a great job in a little um Barber Shop yeah that's great too did the Keith house he did it was somebody else who did the one next to it must been Gary yeah I think did one but um I think the guy is from chsf or teams for to somewhere but he did the keep house on the hill and the little barber shop and that tast looks great oh one and the same person did both of them really it's adorable and and it's and guess what it's not in historic district I don't think what's it used for now is it a barber shop a young man purchased it wow and got a bar but the town hall is story town hall and the little Bank on the side not the heart liary no does that make sense I thought the heart library was included but not your house doesn't either well I think Trump to bad that it wasn't there is Municipal money grant money available for historic buildings see that's the thing and that's right now um for the town right yeah now that we have to really talk about that the sh War because I think the town hall needs no we have to talk about it sooner than that okay I mentioned it to Aaron because there's a deadline for the grant oh so uh talk to Aaron before you leave today and see what's being done because we we want to get the Grant in and then you can decide what needs to be done because I think the renovation here is more than 20 years ago of this building absolutely so there's got to be stuff here that needs attention and why not try to get some of that gr money 100% it renovated because the last I knew it was like the 1990s that it got renovated [Music] Oho yeah while I was here so well you were here then yeah I was 48 years I've been here so so that was 30 years but I agree with war that time f time and the historic building should I think the bank looks awful yeah even though it has a that's the way it looks though that's the way it worked when it was a bank I think the heart Library oh the hot Library I really would like to see in there too I the musical that that Grant was for private property no this is a municipal Grant okay for municipal historic buildings excellent so Aaron but you talk to Aaron about that she's in land use long dark hair glasses oh okay I I not Jessica she's not here oh that's right she's not here Jess so she's up there and Landing okay yeah I will talk to her about that I think that deadline's coming soon so I'll find out what the deadline is now is she the grant writer or do we have to write she's the gr writer oh okay so just ask her about it it may not be that olved but I I mentioned it to Nelson as well okay fine oh I'm so glad you brought that it's either I want to say February or a March date it's coming up quick it is okay so should we have her down at a meeting in January or January I would do that I think she's inundated right now we don't have a l use coordinator and Beth is out with a broken wrist so oh yeah so that department is a little short-handed right now okay all right then I'll go up and talk to I'll report and I'll report back to the uh I thought you sent us was it you that sent us or somebody sent me a list of was it you maybe Claire that sent me a list of um grants that were coming up from preservation no that's that's very good information all right so we're talking about um the grants I also want to talk about one other thing and I want more information on this which I will get to us okay so governor of Massachusetts creates this auxiliary dwelling units which I think are going to be pretty big I mean you would know because you have you real estate I think they're going to be big everywhere and I'm hoping that Townson does it too yeah I want to know how it's going to affect historic properties I don't oh you I don't know from a historic yeah so it what was the title what it the ACT is by right of the owner okay so um and most of it like there's no uh site review of it unless it's added on yeah that's okay but it could be interior oh okay and then right and we don't care about that fine but so the it's called auxilary auxiliary dwelling unit and and and the governor put it into place because the housing shortage and she wanted to make sure particularly that people could age in place instead of being displaced selling their homes so how it affects the historic district commission I haven't received anything and I haven't heard of anything going out but I really think they have they're working on it by February 1st it's supposed to go into a so if we have a house in the district and they want to put an addition on that's going to be an issue for us come before us because application right so I want oh I'm planning to planning so we want to know what our responsibilities are now that it's been so I I missed the one on the 9th but on January 16th I believe is when you can watch another webinar of the draft I saw the first one I I saw the first one oh you got to see it on I did I did see it yeah well that's basically what the law is so if you didn't get what you needed out of that cuz I haven't seen it if you didn't get what you needed out of that you need to call your state historic whoever you right okay and find out from her how historic districts have to adapt to what this new okay all right great so by law is law legislation well I be honest with you I didn't watch the whole thing it's called Adu it's the auxiliary dwelling units that the governor just allowed to be put on property either as an addition to your house or a separate dwelling on your property without going through all the machinations of particularly zoning I guess wouldn't it be of getting variant or yeah that kind of thing so I mean it's easy for the towns of sewer and everything else right we're we're in a if you get over 10,000 have to put in yeah that's the problem you get over 10,000 even have to put system in well I don't I think it's more about like Aging in place or you know what did you say about the 10,000 I said if you go over a population of 10,000 you have to put in a sewage system you have to treat that's never going to happen here I remember us being threatened at a annual meeting in 1990 yeah about how we better be careful because we're going to be over 10,000 within 10 years and instead we're a thousand less this year than what we were in in 90 90 yeah thousand less we'll get ready for this we have no maternity award for young families and um schools might be closing that's probably not gonna be 10,000's not going to be the I wouldn't spread the rumor it's already out there well people like spreading room but we know we don't have a hospital yeah but maternity WS in either Direction I mean wer or the other thing is too there's also this law that came in that where we have these properties in town that they can have a um what do you call it a more a dense population on it for the NBTA right right okay so basically what's being looked at through the mrpc mrpc mrpc massachus regional Planning Commission did a plan for the town we went over the districts of what might be the likable likely places where something like this could happen and we're looking at Route 13 towards lunenberg right okay just to it has to be within just to comp just to comply with this for us it's not going to be feasible until we run Town water there cuz the properties have to be on town water oh I right I didn't know that I didn't say that in the information that's good okay so um and that is probably the most likely place if anything is going to ever be in any way we can comply it's going to be in that area yeah and it only has to be you only have to start with eight units at a time like give you this vast amount that they want you to do but you can begin your compliance with just eight units oh you have to be in compliance at a certain deadline for this you have to have it available to be available by within the next 12 months with a bylaw or they're just going to give you any old bylaw they want and then you won't have your own because you have to comply with the state so that's been worked on for the last I don't know two years we're working on it oh 18 months anyway that's kind of scary since the last guy was here in so it's almost two years wow you know since he left so um that's a anything else I no I don't have anything else does anyone else have anything else oh I do have something else I'm sorry I do the violations and recommendations as Lord brought up earlier in the meeting what's the what's the consequence if people don't do we have the right to impose a bee or yes but I think you have to talk I I think we did discuss this that you should talk to the state and see what powers we have within oh you think that that okay under 40c what are the powers okay and if there's a fee schedule for violation Powers then we should make one that's yes the building inspector has any clue about historic district and finds possibly does I mean does yeah yeah he works in a to them yeah he so I don't have any other issues um this is more like a work session other than but I think it's good to get these things out so we know what we're gonna address anything else speak up now I just want to make sure we're clear you're still going to work with uh jock on on those applications okay yes and I'm going to work with Karen on the grant okay I'm G to call Jen gy on the adus and the fees I'm GNA ask her about that yeah toj at 3:45 34 345 I thought you just I did a second I did say okay I know okay I a motion Jerry seconded okay I I I unanimous thank you very much everybody happy holiday everyone