--------- City of that damn thing. Anyway, welcome to the city of Treasure Island local planning agency meeting for March 12th, 2026. If you wish to uh speak on a topic which
is on today's agenda, a speaker card is available on the table over by the entrance and must be completed and given to the chairperson. Please do not address the board from your seat, but rather from the podium where your comments can be heard by all and recorded as required by Florida statute.
Unscheduled topics may be presented under the public comments section of the agenda. If we could all stand for the pledge of allegiance. I >> aliance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which
it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Okay, if everybody would please uh silence their cell phones. Uh Tia, could we have a roll call? Valerie Aree
>> here. >> Mark Sheski >> here. >> Ross Sanchez >> here. >> Daniel Billingsley >> here. >> Chris Downing >> here. >> Grant Smith >> here. >> Marvin Shavelin here. >> Richard Harris >> here. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Tonight we are going to talk about
the LPA resolution questions, comments, changes about the benefits of plan development. Uh item 6A. You know, we have all talked about planned developments for a long time, but what it boils down
to real easily is the framework does not exist. City of Treasure Island has no plan development zoning category. Um, a lot of the counties, a lot of the m municipalities
actually have something called planned development and it's a planned development district. We don't have any and you know whether it is used or not in the future. What we need to start is the actual framework. We've talked to
the city attorneys in the past and they said that many of the municipalities that they work with have a plan development and quite frankly Treasure Island needs one.
It doesn't matter if it's ever used or not. I know we're in the process of preparing a master plan at this moment and every planner that presented Tuesday night said plan developments are a great tool in the toolbox and Treasure Island needs to
have one and that we can do the preparation of the framework simultaneously to the master plan. You know, one thing that uh we've all agreed on, this master plan is going to be what
it is, but there's not going to be major changes. I mean, we're not going to have, and Ross, I enjoyed your comment. We're not going to be putting single family homes on the Thunderbird site. Um, you know, my idea of a master plan is basically height, density, and where
things go. Well, we already know where things go. some changes to uh height and density may occur, may not occur. We're going to uh see what the market bears. But I was meeting with
several people today and talking about the pieces of property that would be ripe for a planned development zoning category. It hasn't changed for 10 years. I mean, back in 2017, we were talking about planned developments. The
areas we talked about was the RFH50 district out on the west side of Gulf Boulevard. Uh we talked about um the area south of John's Pass where the former Gators and former Krabbies on
the Pass is. It's about 8 acres. It's the biggest piece of privately owned land. It's those two pieces of property. And of course, it was not considered back in 2017, but it was considered now the two parcels in in our central
business district, the north side of the 107th and the south side. There's the potential for other pieces of property, but uh Marvin put together a nice little summary y'all all have copies of. And what we're
talking about is just starting the process of preparing that framework so when the the master plan is in place and we're ready for it, the framework is there and and
the landowners can actually make application to plan development. What a plan development does, it puts the ball in the land owner's court. He has to present to the city commission
what he wants to build. The site plan actually becomes the zoning. I did several of them down in Lee County and you just prepare a site plan and say, "This is what I want to build." If the landowner comes up with something outlandish and just totally offthe-wall, he's going to get denied. There's no
doubt about that. If he comes up with something reasonable, it's going to get approved. Usually, there's some negotiation going back and forth between the city commission and the private
land owner. You know, it's a situation where we would like to see something happen in this town, at least some of us. I mean, our central business district is an embarrassment and we'd like to see some other things.
>> Richard, just as a point of order on all of this. Um, I know that the letter that was came from the city manager at the behest of the city commission regarding whether this board should do anything further as far as developing anything on
PDS or changes to the comp plan while this master plan process is going on. Um, I'm I'm trying to understand just a point of order for us and what we can or cannot do within that framework. >> And that's what I've been discussing with the city manager and
>> I don't see that's is that letter part of the documents tonight? >> It was sent out to every one of us, but it's not in there. And the reason is is we are not approving you know and ultimately the city commissioner will not be approving
anything that will create a building permit or further development. What we are creating tonight is a recommendation to the city commission that you go ahead and you start the framework so it's in
place when the master plan is ready. So, >> so maybe I misunderstood the letter to because I >> actually the letter was somewhat superseded by further instructions. I mean, basically it the idea was don't do anything that would >> I'm sorry. F further instructions from
whom? >> Want to have the city manager come up? He's here and he's prepared to address the letter and you want to call him up. Well, what I was trying to say and Charles, you want to be up here? >> Sure. Sure. Please do.
Go ahead and tell us what you meant. That'll be the easiest way. Well, being a a a college graduate and a public school graduate, writing in English to my very best ability, I've approached the city council in two
meetings in the last 90 days regarding LPA requests to do what I basically understand what you just said, Mr. Harris height increases, density increases, comp plan amendments, and each time
they've said, "Let's get a master planner, let's get um some outside expertise to review all those things." And if you look at the scope of work in the master plan, our land development regulations,
our height, density, all those things are in there. the fiscal feasibility return on investment for developers. So as of when was our last meeting? Uh the not the the the first Tuesday in
March when we met I ver I had the letter written or drafted and I and I sat right where Ralph's sitting and looked at the commissioners and that was the go-ahad. So, yeah, go ahead and send that letter.
And I talked to two of them the next morning. Um, and they're like, "Yep, go ahead and send that letter." That Anyway, bottom line is if you guys request to do something in any of those categories
out of your meeting tonight, if it comes out, hey, we want to do X, Y, and Z, I will again go approach the commission. I've read your um rules and our codes and you're an advisory board to the commission. I think you're well within
your rights to discuss all these things and I'm well within mine to get their direction. And um so no matter where y'all end up tonight, I'll be given a report and to the city commission next
Monday on the outcome of this meeting tonight. So, thank you for the opportunity to speak >> and my comment and as a followup to that, it's my understanding that, you know, once again, we're not approving anything that would affect height,
nothing that would affect density, nothing would affect anything other than let's go ahead and just prepare the framework. Let's get the tool in the toolbox. People have talked about, oh, plan development zoning category is a great tool in your toolbox. Well,
Treasure Island doesn't have one. And all we're trying to do tonight is get that ball rolling. That's it. That's all. So, >> you know, I think the whole point of what I wrote here was to start the conversation. I mean, this is a rough
draft of maybe nothing, but I think we need to talk about it. And we never get to we can't talk amongst ourselves outside of this room. So, you know, I think we should do be doing this more often, but um this plan development thing is a big thing right now. So, um,
I'd kind of like to start out if that's I don't know if you have a how you want to proceed or >> Well, I have had several conversations with >> Thanks for clarifying, >> Ralph the city attorney, and Nancy, the city attorney, and they said plan development ordinances is something that
they write on a regular basis, >> right? >> And they got a lot of practice at it. You know, you uh took took a good swing at Well, I know there's a lot of things that need to be changed in there. Like I said, it's a conversation starter. >> Exactly.
>> And so that's where we're at. >> I could explain a little bit uh some of the technical legal issues. So uh in order to have a plan development zoning category, first you need what I would call a plan development enabling section
that says if you're going to u propose a plan development for any particular development proposal or planning then you would reszone to a plan development. But first you need the ability to have a plan development. So it would just be an enabling ordinance. It says you um in
order to promote innovative planning um plan development is hereby created as a zoning category and you must submit the following things along with it. Um and that just sets sets it up. So you have in your code in this zoning category is a plan development zoning district
that's application process but then you would actually come forward in the future for each individual development proposal and you would seek a plan development for that development proposal and usually they call those by the name of u the development project.
So you have planned development is available if you have it can meet these criteria then you can apply then you apply for planned development um for parcel parcel X plan development and then it'll be specific for that development proposal but first you need
the the plan development enabling section in your code. The land development enabling section doesn't establish the parameters, the constraints. It just says it's available in the city and that's relatively easy to to draft and adopt. But again, it doesn't give you the the the vision.
That would all come later from >> right >> from de individual development proposals about what what each parcel would look like. >> So, and that's in the LDRs. >> They're both in the LDRs >> and there's nothing in the comprehensive plan. Um, you don't have to call out PD
as a category in the comprehensive plan, >> but isn't it >> all development, all zoning has to be consistent with the comprehensive plan. So, if you have a a parcel with a future land use designation of XYZ and you can have a plan development as long as you're within the parameters of XYZ for
your future land use designation. But what I my research and I want you to tell me whether it's true or not is that if we don't have an at least an enabling thing in the comprehensive plan, it's a lot easier to challenge and we will definitely have challenges on whatever
because there's going to be there's going to be increases in height and density. >> So what what you say in your in your in your plan development enabling ordinances is that all all plan development development proposals must be consistent with the duly adopted comprehensive plan. And then if you have
an individual one that's coming forward and it it exceeds the comprehensive plan, then it applies for a land use designation change at that time. But you don't have to put the enabling part into >> right. I'm just concerned that it could be easier to attack
because I know we're going to have challenges and and that slows everything down which is part of the game. So I just think whatever we do, I mean maybe in the beginning we just have it in the LDRs, but if it if it helps us to put part of it in the comprehensive plan,
then we ought to consider that. But >> well, let me th >> maybe it's not necessary. >> Let me almost like you have a constitution and then you have statutes or you have statutes and then you have regulations. So you're just creating the enabling portion of it. Now you still have to send that to Penllis County and
they review it. Is this consistent with our citywide plan? Um in in the PD enabling um section you will write all development for plan development must be consistent with the dilate document >> city plan and city countywide plan. Yeah, I understand the concept. Just
>> let me throw something out here. >> Be more I guess what you would call like generic. It wouldn't have specific, right? >> Well, I'm going to pick on let's say the Gator's property, right? Right. Now, you know, we do this enabling portion of the plan development and what everybody needs to understand
is when we have this enabling portion in effect, the owner say of the Gator's property has to make application. he has to apply to reszone the property. And if he comes in with something that doesn't currently meet our comprehensive plan,
he's going to either have to live with it or modify the comprehensive plan. And you know, any changes in height and density, they're going to have to modify the comprehensive plan. The beauty of the plan development, that puts that expense and that responsibility on the
developer. City's not going to pay for it. the owner. I'm just picking on these guys because they're the biggest privately owned piece of property in the city. The Gator's property, whatever they want to do, they have to make application to reszone the property. They have to make application to modify
the comprehensive plan if necessary. We just need as of today to come up with, and I like the word enabling portion, to give them the device to do it. And uh because right now the city has never had it. We just have standard zoning
categories. >> We don't have any any specifications on density or height, right? Nothing. >> No, >> it's basically >> No, just enabling. >> Okay. Then the owner would come to us and then we'd say, "Okay, then you have to they have to amend the comp plan, which okay, that's so every time every
time an individual property wants to do this, they're going to have to amend the comp." Well, I guess once they amend it, are they just amending it? Would they just be amending it for that property or >> it depends on how they want to do? >> Depends on what they want to do. Um, so I guess you all know every development
order has to be consistent with the comprehensive plan. All the land development regulations have to be consistent with the comprehensive plan. Um, so the PD creates the enabling then you would reszone to a PD gator club or
whatever it's called. Um, and then that would have all the specifics in it. If they were to go over what their current future land use designation allows, they would have to apply for a comprehensive plan amendment either to the text or to the map or both. And then you can
process since uh 2011, you can process a plan amendment and the reasoning application concurrently. So those two can happen in a parallel track later on. But right now you can't apply for PD resoning because we don't have PD zoning as a category because we don't have an
enabling PD category in the in the zoning. >> And how quickly can we get this in place the the initial phase that you're talking about? So, um, if you were to recommend it to city commission and then they would make a decision whether to direct myself as staff to write it and
it would come back to you for one hearing and it would go back to them uh for uh two readings of the ordinance and in between the LDR would go to um forward panelis for review to make sure that it's consistent with the city or
countywide complaint. >> I have to get closer to the mic. Sorry. And how long does the this does the county work pretty quickly or? >> Let's see. Mary Allen and I were looking at this and um
let me see. So tonight is March 12th. If you were to make a recommendation to the council, uh we could take it up at council. March 16th would be the earliest. Um then we would draft the ordinances.
Um we would submit by March 30th to forward Penllis for their consistency review. It come back to you in April for your LPA meeting. It looks like it's April 9th. Then it could go to city commission April 21st
and then it could go um for first reading and then it would go perhaps the first meeting in May or second meeting in May May 19th um have to advertise and meet the notice requirements for the first and second
reading because it is creating a new zoning category. So it would be publicly noticed in the newspaper. Um, so looking at maybe by the end of May, >> so 120 days, 90 to 120 days probably, which would be great. >> March, April, May. Yeah. 90 to 120.
>> And again, it would just be an enabling, >> right? And then then the developer has to come to the city and then he has to go through his process. Yeah. But at least he can start doing something now versus waiting till the when the plan is done, which they say nine months, but
it's more like 12 or a year and a half. >> When the plan is done, then this will >> then they got Right. So, right. >> So, well, so you're do they have to wait but do they have to wait until the plan >> is done to start to apply? >> No. Any property owner can apply at any
time right now, but you know, they wouldn't have the benefit of the plan, >> right? Right. But they would have the benefit of a PD. So they'd have to apply under their existing zoning. And >> No, no, no. I'm saying if we went through the pro went through the process 120 days, we get the enabler. Can they
then come to us before the the master plan is done? >> They could. >> Okay. >> So So master plan typically would have your your vision, your design, right? all those planning parameters, the the massing of the building, how big they're going to be, you know, what's going to
be where. >> But I I guess if the the developer applies, they're going to have to provide a lot of analysis, >> right? >> Yes. When they do the applications, this would just get the the the vehicle the enabling uh section ready to go so that
when uh when private property owners are ready, um they could apply before the master plan, but they might want to wait till after the master plan is done. and but it's ready to go at that point. They can they can apply quicker. >> So, I think it's it's important to for everyone to understand if you implement
a PD designation in the zoning, you're effectively giving the city commission the ability to create a zoning district in any particular area that is allowed within that facility. So that's
some people might call that spot zoning or they would call it, you know, that you're giving you're giving a lot of power to the city commission to do something very specific in an area that wasn't necessarily part of the overall zoning of the city. So it's just, you know, there's there's positives and
negatives to PDs. I I see some of the certainly the positives in terms of having flexibility on setbacks and doing compromise between different things, but we should all realize that having that facility as well gives the city commission a lot of latitude in what
they would be allowed to do within the comprehensive plan. However, they would choose to ch to change it that particular designation. >> You could have your own schedule of uses and your own schedule of planning parameters and constraints. Um, but they still would have to be consistent with
the comp plan unless they applied for a comp plan amendment. >> So your comp plan would then kind of be the what controls the PD zoning. You're limited by the comp plan, >> right? The comp plan would is setting obviously, you know, the the LDRs are set, you know, set for any district are
setting the the density and the the maximum so you can live within that. But this is also giving having that facility gives the city commission to go beyond that by having that facility. I just want everybody on this board to realize that that's what's at stake. You
>> go beyond your regular zoning category, but you stay within the future land use designation criteria. >> If I can tag on to that question, my understanding too is that the plan development process is quite a bit more complex than the current process seeking
approval and is there a standardized approach to evaluating plan developments? And are there criteria that are developed by which these developments are evaluated? >> The enabling uh district would have the criteria. Um there's no standard.
>> Can I stop you for there for a minute? >> Are you sure? Go ahead. >> So it seems to me it would be imperative that we develop the criteria prior to developing the the tool that allows for plan developments. When I say criteria, I don't mean
height, density, things like that. I mean um >> considerations that must be evaluated when somebody submits a plan is what I'm referring to. >> Yeah. Let me some place that you could look um is to the uh
citywide plan. Um, but you would ask for um other design considerations, building scale, building design, site improvements, schedule of uses. Um, you would probably want uh what they call a
chapter 163 development agreement to be part of a planned development. Sometimes they're phased, sometimes they involve public benefits um in exchange. And so you want a vehicle to be able to address those. There's a development chapter 163
development agreement would typically be required and that has a whole list of criteria. Some 20ome criteria including for example annual reports on the progress of the development how many how much they built how much is still to be built. You can phase things as well. So
it seems to me that the rational approach to this if we're developing this enabling process would be to develop the criteria by which these are going to be evaluated at least simultaneously. >> The the criteria by which an individual PD application would be evaluated are
going to be in the PD enabling section. Yes, you have that in there. And just to add on to that, some of the things that is included, I mean, every plan development that I ever worked on, you had to evaluate the surrounding sanitary
sewer system to make sure it was adequate. You had to evaluate the existing water system to make sure it was adequate. Uh, you had to do a traffic study to make sure the roadways could handle the additional traffic flow. um storm water, you had to uh make
sure that you would meet the various requirements of several governmental agencies. SwiftMUD, the local city, the local county, um >> surrounding uses, what what are when you apply, you need to show what all the
surrounding uses are, have all their maps existing, potential future. Um, so you would kind of think in your head if you if you got a PD application, what would you want to see being addressed in it? And then that's in your PD enabling
ordinance. And so when we come to you for the if the commission says go ahead and draft it and comes to you for a recommendation, we want to look at those criteria and see if there's things that are missing that we want to add. Things that we say we don't need that we want to take out. probably not too many of
those, but things you want to add in would probably show up. >> And Mr. Brooks, is there a formal process in your experience by which the public participates in this or it's simply the attendance of these meetings when the presentation is made? Is it is the onus upon the developer to solicit
public input prior to submitting a request or is that purely optional? So for the zoning enabling the PD enabling one, it'll be like the hearings we're having and taking public comment, the um the draft ordinance would be distributed ahead of time. Um so they public would
see it, they would come up and comment on it here and both at the two readings of the commission. Um, and then in in a PD ordinance, what's frequently required because you're allowing someone to go above and beyond what their regular
zoning category is is having them go above and beyond for community meetings, neighborhood meeting, workshops, you know, planning cherettes earlier on in the process. I've even seen some cities and counties that say instead of getting
a notice that there's going to be the final hearing in seven days, they say you have to put a notice out that an application has been received, then the public knows, oh, something's been received and they get earlier input um into staff and everybody else. So, it
does a plan development is supposed to promote exceptional developments and that part of that's community engagement. So you can add in some additional criteria as part of a PD individual PD application to hold a community workshop. You know, you put
some criteria about that in there, you know. >> Thank you. >> If Good questions, Grant for the um criteria that's in this going to be potentially in this enabler that you all are going to create, can we have that specifically called out like to Grant's questions in regards to the process of
community involvement? >> Yes. If again if we do go through it, you're going to write it when we review it in the next meeting. Can we have the comments called out just so because I think that that process is part of important. It sounds like >> Yeah, >> it sounds like it's more of a hassle for developers to go through this process.
Um but again it's if they want something then they have to go through the test of right >> they have to go through the process reszoning and a resoning has that test uh under Snider versus Breard that says first uh a reasonzoning has to show it's consistent with the comp plan
>> it meets the zoning enabling criteria and then the burden shifts back to the city and the city commission could still say no to a resoning request as long as it it's a legitimate planning reason >> and you see the the PDS I mean because I know that I think your colleague, I can't recall her name, but it was like
down in Fort Myers, they have PDs and it was a tool that helped them kind of rebuild post hurricane type situations. I mean, but you see the the PDS in municipalities frequently, I I assume, correct? >> Yes. Especially for larger projects, you
know, may the advantage of going with your existing zoning and is sometimes you get as of right approvals. you know this I'm allowed under the existing zoning to have this as a right and I don't have to go to any public meetings. So to go to PD you've got to go through
a lot of public meetings. Um you're promoting ex exceptional planning. Um but in exchange you're also getting to um build something that maybe fits in with the community better and it's not so rigid in terms of setbacks. Um it
allows you to cluster things um on portions of the property, move things around that normally you couldn't. So gives you flexibility in exchange for flexibility. There's there's more procedural hoops and to uh safeguard, you know, the compatibility and the
other community issues that are there too. >> Okay. I know Richard, I mentioned like the Gators property. I mean, they I think they asked us to call it the Green Leaf property or whatever. But I mean, if they hadn't built or developed that property for the amount of years that they've had it, which I think is like 17
or 18 years, I mean, this would be it could be because of the the the parameters that are in place where a PD does kind of open up that flexibility for the conversation. and and um what a PD does too is to take into allows them to take into account the unique site
circumstances and characteristics like I think Gators is on the water on uh John's >> path. >> So yeah, that's unique. So what does that mean? So you could wrap that into your PD, you know, preservation of waterfront views, opening the water to
public access or keeping keeping the waterfront activated. river walks, uh, canal walk, whatever it would be there, something like that. Those could be kind of incorporated in rather than just a strict um cookie cut or more traditional
zoning district parameters. So like I'll just stay on the green leaf property for a second. So the negotiation part between like the city and the the developer that is kind of called out in the criteria. So like I take example like for the green leaf property, we
have a park that's over there. It's at the end of a road. Um it requires a very hefty bill to fix the seaw wall when it comes to the city saying okay well we'll give you some parcel of land um that's over I'm sorry if the city were to
negotiate land trades within a PD from Green Leaf and but say make the developer like yeah you can have this park with a busted seaw wall um but in return you guys the developer is going to have to build us another park with a pier and park park benches like that
type negotiation. Is that included in the criteria that we're going to review or is that just kind of like a standard PD? You know, >> well, let me address it without the land swap issue that complicates it. >> Okay. Sorry, I was just trying to save the city money. >> So, um because PDS, you know, the
statutory purpose and intent would be to promote exceptional design. Um it's in the public interest. you can have a criteria in there that's that ask the developer to um provide public benefits. So, what what what uh public benefits
are resulting from this PD individual PD application that the public wouldn't get from a normal traditional zoning category and those could could run the gamut, you know, like >> uh improvements to to a park that, you know, we're going to give you
landscaping, we're going to give you pathways, we're going to give you courts or, you know, recreational facilities. Uh we're going to rebuild the seaw wall at the city park at the expense of $300,000, you know, in exchange, you know, to to
have an integrated system. >> In all of my research, I I found that the PD's plan development was a massive benefit for residents when it came to landscaping getting upgraded or whatever it may be because the city is holding
the cards in the negotiation. If you see really cool places when you travel around like when you go to different cities. I was up in Virginia the other day. I saw a really cool thing a river walks like oh this is cool. Oh well this is part of the PD that was done for that. So you can get a lot more
innovative exceptional plans and really um sense of place you can develop more than just trying to build within the traditional zoning categories which tend to give you you know squares and blocks where you get you know more innovative design out of the PD. Like I've heard I
was talking with like somebody that's kind of in the development business and they were I was just asking this is out of out of the state but from a perspective of plan development it was like oh yeah we were doing one project and the city wanted a whole runway of
landscape redone for this project because it was kind of like the entrance and in my head I'm thinking like oh the entrance into Treasure Island our landscaping all the way into the the heartbeat of the city downtown and our beach zoning district. I was like, "Oh, I wonder if that would apply." And it's like when you had made the comment about landscaping, like, "Yeah, that'd be a
great savings for for the city as well as a nice feature for the residents." >> Yep. And then the future residents of that development, you know, they're offering you things because they want to make it nice for their own future residents and sales and marketing. Sometimes it's donations, sometimes it's
the actual improvements, times it's, you know, a bit of both. >> Maybe we get someone to fix the fence at the yach club. One of the one of the things that uh I always encouraged people when they were doing a plan development is to be as detailed as possible. A lot of planners,
especially when they don't know what they're going to build, just put in a bubble plan and say, "I'm going to build 100,000 square feet of retail here and 200 hotel rooms here." >> Well, we kind of want to discourage the bubble plan. And >> the more detail, the more architectural
renderings, the more um >> that was the point I was going to make >> scheduled uses. The other thing that you can do is you can vary the the uses that are there. It promotes mixed use projects very well, more so than some of the traditional zoning categories that tend to separate commercial and
residential and it allows mixing of things even better than some of the traditional zoning categories that allow mixed uses. Sometimes they say you have to have uh the apartments on top of the stores where in a PD no you can have
them over to the side or you can have a mix mixture of things. So it gives you the all those planning constraints that are in the traditional zoning category that everybody says I I read this but I wish it was this. you, you know, that you can write in what you wish it was in
here. And if you have renderings and you show it and you convince the city that this is something good for the city, then, you know, hopefully you get an approval rather than a denial. >> Okay? >> But the city's still free to deny uh individual plan development application for any legitimate public purpose.
You're not forced to approve it. And that's one thing I think we should encourage as these applications start to come in is try to be as detailed as possible because people like to know what's going on and you know if you have already designed a
building for instance show the actual building per uh footprint and your landscaping and everything you know the more detail the better and uh so that works out as a benefit and the citizenry can see what's going to happen. So, I
think it's a win-win. >> Wouldn't we require that? I mean, >> I think it's something you want to put in your criteria. Architectural ren renderings and elevations and landscaping. >> Well, that's that's the thing, Marvin. I mean, I'm just saying from experience. A lot of people did very vague plans and
that's not what we want to encourage in a >> that'sing section did not require the specificity. So, you want to make sure you require specificity in there. >> Yep. >> Just a point of clarification, Mr. Brooks, you mentioned that if a project
comes forward um assuming this enablers in place that's been adopted by the commission and we have these zones plan development an individual is seeking an exception to the height current height and density and this is their proposal
then we would have to change the comprehensive plan permanently or for that particular development. So once we increase heightened density for one proposal, does that open the door to every other proposal? And can you deny
someone the opportunity to build something on subjective criteria? >> So there's a couple questions there. Um plan developments uh have to stay within the bounds of the comprehensive plan.
So if uh you can't build within the comprehensive plan, you will need a comprehensive plan amendment and that's something different. But a plan development uh all development zoning all zoning has to be consistent with the comp plan. So, if someone's proposing something in a
reszoning to PD that's inconsistent with the comp plan, you would have to either get a change in future land use designation to a different category or you a map amendment or a text amendment or now they allow uh smallcale map
amendments to have notations as long as it only affects that particular property, not everyone, but that only for that one particular one. And you can actually, you know, when you're doing comp plan amendments, you can also do, there's no minimum size on a comp plan amendment, you can do a comp plan
amendment to a category um for that particular project or parcel. Then you still want to worry about the spot zoning or spot comp planning. So you want to make sure you're not incompatible with your surrounding uses. Spot zoning would be where you're you're
creating a new zone or a new land use designation that's incompatible with the surrounding uses. And incompatibility is defined as where two um uses cannot coexist in perpetuity without having
negative impacts on each other. So you want to make sure you're not negatively impacting the surrounding uses. That might be one of the criteria that you put in your zoning enabling. Prove to us you're not be not incompatible with the surrounding uses. It will not negatively impact the
surrounding uses. And how can you design it so that you won't? >> So just to be clear, it doesn't create um as a right >> if we grant one, the next one would have to come through >> each on their own. >> He's talking about comp plan amendment,
right? >> The comp the heightened density. If we change the comp plan, if we change the comp plan, >> comp plan stuff is different. That's different than what we're talking about right now. >> Okay. So if an individual comes forward with a plan development proposal and it requires height and density that are beyond our current levels, then we have
to change the comp plan. Is that correct? >> If it exceeds your existing comp plan, you can't approve the plan development unless you change your comp plan and you go through the whole comp plan amendment process. >> And once we change the comp plan, that's the new comp plan. >> That would be dually adopted and then a
PD could come forward. You can run these two things concurrently at the same time, >> but you may want to do the comp plan legislatively and then do the PD after the comp. >> If you create, >> so the next individual that comes forward now, it's uh developer B or project B,
>> a different parcel, you know, maybe different future land use category. There would be a different set of circumstances. So they don't set. >> So they can't go to the comp plan and say that by right we can go up this high. depends how you amended your comp plan
before, right? So that's the comp plan amendment. >> He wants to amend it in a way that it only that in other words, he doesn't want it to apply to everybody once that amendment >> and you do smallcale p comp plan amendments. >> Let me be clear
the comp plan at all until I see more information. So go ahead. I'm sorry, Mr. Brook. >> So um you might be familiar there's comp plan amendments um and there's a couple different kinds. There's text amendment that's taking your future land use designation and adjusting
some of the criteria might be height, might be density, might be something else in there. That's a text amendment to an entire category. Then there's something called a smallcale plan amendment and they used to be limited to 10 acres, then 20 acres, and now it's
all the way up to 50 acres. And that's a comp plan amendment just for that 50 acres or less. It doesn't affect anybody else. It's just for that one particular uh project or parcel or group of parcels. It's a smallcale plan
amendment. Smallcale plan amendments um have an expedited process. Um you still have to go through the countywide plan amendment process to make sure what you're amending here doesn't need an amendment at the county and it might
need an amendment at the county and you apply for it there. But smallcale is limited to that parcel and that parcel alone and you can make text amendments just for that parcel as part of a smallcale plan amendment. >> So could like for in a hotel be considered a small could it just be one
one property in >> there's no minimum size for a small scale plan amendment >> if we did that and it wouldn't apply to anybody else >> depending how you wrote it. You could make it >> make it that way if you wanted to. >> Yes. That really all goes back to the point I
was making earlier in terms of it's complicated. You're putting a facility in place that allows something a lot of flexibility within the current height and density, but it also gives the right for changes to be made to the
plan in whichever way you want to do them and >> particularly setbacks for example. Yeah, you can do some of those within >> right that and and that doesn't require any change to the comp plan if you're just doing a a PD within the restriction of the height and density. But when you
start making a change to that where it does impact the comp plan, there's still the the methodology to do it. But you're now giving the city commission the ability essentially to designate a particular property within
this city to have a different criteria for building on that whe in in the case of for instance height and density than you are other properties. And I just want everybody to be be transparent that that's what this does. >> I get it. But the pro here's the
problem. We're going to do this master plan and I think it's a great thing. The only thing I don't like about it, it's going to take a year and a half. So all these developers are going to be sitting around for a year and a half or two years before they do anything. And if we
put something like this in place for the people that are ready to do something, you know, let's get something started here. This is an opportunity so they don't have to wait a year and a half. I mean, you know, and then once you get
the plan in, then we'll go from there. But we can't just sit around for two years with no development. >> You know, what's unique about this city, Marvin, is the size of the parcels. Thunderbird parcel, 1.84 acres. Gator's
property, about nine acres, and that's the biggest one. uh the other hotels that are ripe for changes because they're sitting abandoned. The Tahesian, I don't know how many acres it is, but it's like an acre. The Sands, it's
vacant lot now. It's about an acre. So, everything that we're involved in is going to be very small. I mean, these individual minor land use plan amendments can come in and and get done, but like Grant was saying, you know, at
every P&Z uh hearing we have for variance, each case stands on its own, >> right? >> There's no precedent setting. So, >> but look, here's the thing. Let's be honest. Let's talk about the elephant in the room. It's all about height and
density, >> right? I mean, let's look at what we're what's going on around us right now. St. Pete Beach, Tradewinds, 12 stories. JW Marriott, 10 stories, 290 rooms. 154 rooms at the Tradewinds. Hampton Inn,
130 rooms, nine stories. Miramar, eight stories, 50 rooms. Cory Landing, eight stories, 133 condo condominium, mixed use. And they got a four a fourstory one. Then MadiRaa Beach, MadiRaa Beach, Beach Comr, eight stories, 171 hotel
rooms. Skooner Resort, eight stories, 56 rooms. Tri Tribute Portfolio Hotel at John's Pass, six stories, 87 rooms. I know Grant will want to talk to me about that. Um, >> I just want to know, is this a good thing you're saying? >> What's the relevancy of that?
>> The relevant relevancy is in St. In Treasure Island, we've got two hotels. They're each six stories. One's 14 rooms, one's 17 rooms. So, basically, what we've got going on is two small hotels, two parking lots,
and a gas station. That's what's going on in Treasure Island. So, we need to increase heighten density. Nobody wants to talk about it. So, you know, we it needs to be done. I mean, this plan, when they do this plan, they're not going to come back and say, "Oh, yeah,
just leave everything the same. We're going to move things around, redo your landscaping." That's not that's not going to >> create any enthusiasm with developers. They want to be able to make money. >> I think that's an opinion. >> No, I don't. It is opinion, but
>> Well, here here's a fact, Chris. I was doing some research on the property appraisers website, and I'll pick on the Thunderbird people. Their property taxes in 2024 was $262,000. This year in 20 or 2025, it's 101. I
looked at the Tahesian, it was like $88,000. It's gone down $20,000. Unless we somehow encourage something to happen and not wait around. Our tax revenues,
everybody involved, school board, the city, the county, everybody, it's falling and the general trend was 10 to 20%. The uh Thunderbird was extreme because it fell 60%. But how many cities can survive something like that? I mean,
we got kicked in the teeth last uh September 2024. And I drive around the city, Palms, Capri, Paradise, and to a lesser degree, Sunset Beach. A lot of things are happening. New houses, new uh raised
houses, a lot of houses coming down. But our our commercial areas, our resort areas, they're destitute. I mean, we're going to have an economic uh >> I recognize the challenge for Oh yeah. So >> I I think I think this is all about
approach >> and I don't see a problem whatsoever about putting a plan development enabler in place cuz that way at least we're taking steps forward instead of waiting and you know delaying things because I've heard from several people I am not
going to wait for two years until this master plan is done. >> No. So, Richard, just to put the tax uh position in context, too, I think it's important that we keep it contextually, and that is that property tax makes up a
portion of Treasure Island's revenue. Um, and it's a relatively small portion, according to what I pulled off of of the budget. What we're looking at is property taxes contribute about 11.5 million to a $43 million total revenue.
Of that 11.5 million dollars, two and a half million or 2.7 comes from commercial, hotel, and business tax, which is approximately 24 point 24% of our overall property tax or 6.3% of our total budget tax, total revenue tax.
>> Yeah, it's about 23%. >> 23% of the the property tax. So the residential tax base to me is is important and I do see an awful lot of residential construction going on as we talked about last time. So I'm I'm all
for building nice things by all means, but I do think we have to be transparent and be very clear with the public on the implications of this building. What are we going to what are the benefits and what are the costs? And the the tax the tax I know is important, but it's it's
not the elephant in the room from a revenue perspective. It's the residential taxes that we have to get back. >> And you just made my point. That's why the PD is such a a benefit the plan development. And once again, the the more detail you
give, the better it is. I mean, I loved it when I was sitting on other boards and people come in and say, "This is exactly what I'm going to build. This is the elevations. I have spent the money. I'm This is what I'm going to build. And you held it to them. You held them to
it. I mean, the site plan was the uh zoning. And if they deviated from that zoning, they didn't get their CEO. And uh it got ugly once in a while. But um you know, with that, any other comments
or I have about a half a dozen cards here. Anybody else have any other comment? If not, we will start on the cards. Mark Ho, he got here first. Uh Mark Hoey, 225 104th Avenue. Uh just a couple of nuggets. This has
been great conversation and education, especially for a uh you know, non educated non-engineer person. Marvin, I fully agree with you that the sunshine law provision prevents this group from
talking together enough. I think that's a good use of the time. I mean, reasonable use of time, especially if there can be some uh practical and non-emotional discussion about what needs to be done, when, where, how. uh I
don't think there's uh the situation where there's this huge faction that's so far apart but I think by getting a chance to discuss it openly where the public can listen in where we can we get weigh in from a subject matter expert
goes a long way to uh clearing that air and I appreciate that couple of nuggets I guess first off um and it's happened at the commission meeting and we heard it time and again but I just wanted to clear the air on the the comment that's been made that Treasure Island is the
only community that doesn't have PDs. Only one up. It's we're we're outliers. >> Well, that's incorrect. >> What? >> That is incorrect. >> That is incorrect. I mean, right near us, Readington, North Readington, Bair
Beach, and Indian Shores. Now admittedly small communities don't have PDs but you know again this is where the hyperbole comes in and and you know we get exaggerate one way or the other. Um the other part
and from uh I appreciate uh city manager Vanzant being here to kind of reiterate and clarify what the intent was from the commission to this body in the form of that letter and from uh one
Florida boy to another Florida boy's English. Um, I will tell you I I thought it was pretty good, but there's one one line here I want to read that that sticks out and it said after a master plan team has given their
input and recommendations on height and density requirements and the commission accepts those changes. I I think that was the point that was trying to be made is let's get going on on the structure.
didn't say at the end of the process two years from now whatever it is says once the commission has started to get recommendations which I think will come quicker than the endgame it's not the endgame it's got to be midcycle if not
earlier then then the piece of putting in the PD or the enabling factors whatever it deem this discussion can absolutely be folded in as necessary I don't think It was a a total
put out into the unknown future. A couple of other things. I'm as concerned as some of you are that about the PD's shift of authority to the commission. you play a big role in filtering on
behalf of the city and obviously you've got to look at the developers or the property owners, but who is going to negotiate on behalf of the citizens for the public benefits that should come from these
developments? Uh certainly this group, but in the end it's going to five individuals that are going to rotate through, right? They they're never all going to be consistent for any extended period of time. So each time we're going to be dependent on them to do the right thing
on behalf of the overall scope of the project, but also the whatever benefits to the community. I'm not comfortable with that. Uh community notification, that was a nugget there. And how PDS You checking
my time? Go ahead. Um, the great example of how that didn't work is the club. Think about that. That didn't come out until it was called out. And yet 6 months worth of work back behind the scenes were done before it
was oops, we got caught wanting to put a marina high and dry on a piece of property. So that does need to go to go forward. So with that, I appreciate your work. Appreciate the commentary. Thank you. Thank you for your comments. Okay,
next card. Eric Nory. >> I'm not sure I completely understand the PD, but for me personally, anything that makes things more efficient and easier is better, and better is always better. So, if we can make something more efficient or easier for developers, I
think it's a good thing. If there's no harm otherwise, it seems like it has to fall in line with with the current rules for the master plan. And it seems like a tool to allow. I mean, for example, I've got some very strange pieces of property. They're strange shapes.
They're strange to try to get parking in them. It's a weird I mean, it's a big it's a big half circle. So, you kind of That seems like it would work good for me in that situation because maybe you could just move a parking space over here. Or maybe there could be three
parking spaces angled somehow to make it easier for traffic to get around. Or maybe there's some creativity that we can use to allow some strange odd pieces of property to be used in a creative good way that is better for the community with, you know, from me, for
example, putting walkways through with beautiful plants and things like that on my property. That's what I'm looking for. So, anything that makes things more efficient and easier is is better, and I'm in favor of that. This is my first round at at at doing this, and it's it's
very difficult, more difficult than I ever knew or dreamed, but of course, I'm new at this, too. But efficiencies are good, and we certainly could use efficiencies in the city all the way around. I mean, however we can get things done better and faster is a good
thing. Thank you. Anyway, before you leave, I just want to address one thing. You know, this won't necessarily make things easier. I mean, this requires a lot of work. I mean, you got to do a lot of studies to get it done, but it does
give you the flexibility. There will not be a whole lot of plan development zoning going on on very small parcels. I mean, the parcel that you came in last month with for your coffee shop, you will never be reszoning that to a plan development unless things are crazy. You
got your approvals last month, so you're good. But, uh, I just want to point out it's not like streamlining the situation. It does put a lot of requirements on the developer and and the landowner. So, just wanted to point that out to you.
>> Yeah. Well, I've got other pieces of property there on that corner that I'm thinking of doing something with, and I would love to sit down with a city planner and have them say, "We'd love to see you build this. It would be great. We've done the studies." I would be open to to that. Um, so I'm open to those
types of things. >> Thank you, Eric. >> Thank you. >> Okay, next card. Sean Burn. >> I'll keep it simple. Um you made a point Grant about the 80% essentially rounding numbers on residential. Um you have many
cities that kind of fight that division and it's either and if that's the decision that the community wants to take, you can go all residential. That is an option, right? The problem is is then it's all residential like you have no commercial, you have no nightife, you have no restaurants and there is areas
like that. I don't know if that's the whole community's thought process, but that is absolutely plausible. I think also the reason that you're 20% of commercials, we haven't had any commercial redevelopment. We've had very little. And so skewing the numbers to
20% well because we don't have any. We haven't had any development. So, um, you know, I I think one of the things when we first acquired some of the property downtown is people said, "Oh, just more condos. We don't need any more condos.
I don't disagree, but then if you say, "Oh, you want to go more residential?" Well, then, okay, we'll put up more condos. Like, you got you kind of you got to be fair in in the discussion. That's all I'm saying. >> Thank you, Sean. Okay, next card. Diana Crayville. >> Welcome back.
>> Yeah, you I don't think you guys want me back up or on that board. Mr. Brooks, thank you for your expertise in giving the option for enabling a PD into our um regulations and stuff. With
that being said, I don't think that's necessarily a bad idea. Matter of fact, it's probably a good one and moving forward. However, I think we need to take very hard consideration exactly what Chris said about do you want the
commission that rotates every two year? He didn't say that. Say rotating every two years. Mark did, but we want LPA to be able to make that decision as far as what goes forward. If we get into a
point where you do have a PD, we need to have certain cr have real specific criteria down through there, which would be getting into a lot of them that you you had said, Grant. So, I want to make sure that if you guys go forward with
something like this that you have a lot of safety nets in there that that will definitely take in consideration what the residents want and need in this community. Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> Thank you, >> Barb Adams. I think I'm really here just to try and understand all this and I'll probably just go ahead and give up my time. >> Okay. Thank you, Robert Boso. >> Evening. Robert Bazo, District 1. Um I,
you know, to get me off the pickle court, pickle ball court and come here tonight was a hard thing to do. been watching this board the last couple of months and uh a little bit concerned kind of a cross between Dr. Strange Love and the Kane mutiny. Um but after u watching this tonight I'm actually I'm
actually feel good about it. I think this is a good meeting. Um I think it's uh it's nice to have this kind of discussion and these kind of people here. It's it's very good. I think it's important to note a couple of things. Um one the Thunderbird would have been approved a few uh a month ago if two
commissioners didn't switch their vote. So Thunderbird would have gotten off. It would have gotten 184 rooms. I do believe that heightened density is the elephant in the room for sure. Um we have rules and regulations for a reason.
And one of my concerns about uh PDS and by the way I like I like PDs. Um I was a president of a large association much bigger than Treasure Island. We had a master plan and uh the developer agreements could be part was part of that master plan. And so the plan had a
gas station going in on its corner and I was able then to negotiate that particular gas station to look more colonial with colonial lighting and things like that. Um but again we were following a master plan a vision a a
recipe a book and as we learned the other night and and all the people here agreed that the PDS could be the chapters of a book and the book would be the master plan. I think the commission has been very clear about uh providing direction to this board. Uh this board is an advisory board and uh I think
sometimes you've been beyond the scope although this particular meeting I think is beneficial. uh as a resident my concerns about PDS are that um it's applicant driven and it does give a lot of power to the commission and I think
as we've seen the last few months there is a question of trust between residents and the commission and the LPA board unfortunately which is why some of us are here tonight it gives a lot of power to them um one of the things I heard
tonight especially from the city attorney was that the PDS And uh if he highen desi was to go above a certain level, it has to be consistent with with the the comprehensive plan uh unless then mod modification is needed. My understanding though is that they can request something up to the county plan
which if I if I'm not if I'm not mistaken I think that's correct and that's really a bridge too far and so I think uh PDS are good but I think we have need to have a master plan to provide the umbrella and and and and then to uh to be part and then come
under that. I I do believe it gives the applicant a lot of power. I do believe that we do need to develop quickly. Uh again, this meeting is a good one, very positive uh meeting and uh better than the other ones. Uh but again, let's
follow the direction of the commission and I think Mr. Smith's uh point was correct that the the stick and weather direction was let's get the master plan rolling around and the PDS will certainly be part of that. Another thing is uh is my concern is speed. Um we're
going to have a change in the commission I think in a month or so. Um I think there'll be more confidence in the commission. uh right now there's there is none. So uh giving power to the applicant and to the present commission I think is a little bit dangerous. So uh
I like speed. I want I want development. I want smart development. Um but again u the top of the pyramid is the resident. Okay. It's not the LPA board and it's not the commission. It's the residents. I think we're spoken pretty loudly. But my compliments to the chairman today for
this meeting is an excellent one and it's good to have developers and residents and a good discussion about about PDS. But I still think it's the master plan that will guide us and there will be there will be increased height and density for sure. Um I order for
Mayor Tyler um because he he he ran on a platform for developing particularly u the green leaf properties. I could I could see very tall buildings there. I mean, extreme heightened density there. That's fine. That's great. But let the
master plan tell that tell us that. Um, a few parcels along the beach I suspect will be six, seven, eight floors. I'm fine with that. Let the master plan tell us that. Not not the applicant, not the
LPA, and not the commission. Okay? Let them let the unbiased, professional, non-aggenda-driven um master planner tell us that and I hope that we will follow that direction. If
it's calls for eight floors um and some parcels on uh on the Gulf side, I hope that we we accept that. Thank you. >> Thank you, Sarah Pennington. Good evening, Sarah Pennington, Isisle
of Palms. I appreciate your time tonight and thank you for this discussion. It has been great. It does just I'm being honest from the resident perspective, it does appear that there is an agenda at play here. I noticed on the um agenda
even the pro the title of the presentation is just benefits of plan development not pros and cons of plan development purely just the benefits. Um so I do thank Mr. Downing for calling out a few of the potential downsides. It
feels like we're almost kind of just rebranding it is now oh we're just doing the framework we're just doing enabling. It's like this constant um changing everything around to try to push this through. And I think that's what has residents so concerned. Uh the majority
of the commission and the mayor have listened to the residents on this topic, but for some reason this board just seems to want to continue exerting pressure on the commission and the mayor regarding PDs. I I even recall at a
lease a recent LPA meeting, one of you said the commission was just confused and that's why they voted these ordinances down and uh the words were that you guys plan to keep knocking at their door with these ordinance. Basically saying we're just going to wear them down, keep bringing it back
even though they told us no. And um I I just find it to be a little disrespectful to the commission, the mayor, and the residents. um they've made it clear multiple times that they're not just waiting to start a master plan. They're also not waiting until a master plan is done, but we need
to have these at the very least the economic feasibility studies to be completed. Um that unbiased data will inform us if heightened density needs to be increased, where that would need to be increased and by how much. So this is vital information that will help us make
good decisions. So, I'm just not understanding why you would want to jump ahead of getting that data that we need to make proper decisions. Why is there this extreme? It feels almost desperate looking from the outside, this extreme
urgency to force this through it. It comes across as very emotional, very personal. We got to cram this through. And um before you guys completely tune me out, uh I do want to say I'm not against PDs. I could see some potential benefits. Um, for example, Mr. Nori was
saying you can use some creativity to develop uh different properties and that can be useful, but again, the timing and the urgency to force this through before the economic feasibility studies are done is very concerning. And I also do share our concerns I've heard tonight
about who would be negotiating these PDs on the city's behalf. Do we have an unbiased commission to do that? And will we have that forever? I I have my concerns about that. So, I'll say it again. The majority of the commission and the mayor have listened to the
constituents and I really wish you guys would just do the same. Please don't forget you're supposed to be working for the residents and it's not just what you want to see personally. Thank you. >> Well, one question on that. You do realize that plan development does not
exist in Treasure Island. None whatsoever. All we're doing is just the framework, the enabler and uh I think it's a great first step and uh but it doesn't approve anything. I mean the Thunderbird's not going to go get started. They have to they have a lot of
work to do and I just want everybody to know this is not the end all beall. There's a lot of work to be done and like I told Eric Nory, this is actually more work for a developer than just standard zoning. when uh you have a
piece of commercially zoned property, you can come in with a grocery store and build it with a PD. There's a lot of work to do. So, just take that into account, too. Thanks. >> Yeah, that's been made very clear. But, um but I also wanted to point out the main purpose of what I was saying is
that I think we should wait, as the mayor and commission have suggested, for us to get those economic feasibility studies done before making these decisions. Thanks. >> Okay, Gilly. Sir, >> can you pronounce your last name? I always Margaret
>> Ovaknin. >> Okay, thank you. >> Vakn with the Thunderbird. Um, so I want to say first of all, thank you all for the commissioning for considering the PD. I do think it's a very good and important tool to have in place for
development to get things around. As you may know, the Thunderbird has already been down for a year and a half. And just in terms of time wise, we heard I've been here at the city commission, the last city commission that we're talking about the city plan, all the planners that were presenting said nine
months is going to be very ambitious to meet that. It's probably closer to a year and a half or two years. But just in terms of everybody thinking that you guys are rushing on that beside the fact that we're down and the pirate square is
down for also a couple of years and the marina is down and very beautiful assets of the city are down and I think that's a responsible action to get moving. uh from the time that you guys if it's going to take 2 months or 3 months for you guys to in put the instrument in
place after that we need to go to a reasonzoning process that's going to take a couple of months and after that we need to go to a negotiation with the city that's going to be a give and take that we're going to show what we are asking and the city's going to ask what there there's going to be a negotiation and we need to put all the planning
inside there's going to be few months is only for that and after that we need to go to production and after production we need to go to construction So the best case scenario, it's going to be if you guys put it and everything goes really well, it's going to be 3 years until something can be really built. So that's
that's kind of like the minimum rather than waiting another two years to put a a a a new master plan in place. Uh I think we're talking about five years or more which is not feasible. I don't think it's responsible not for the city,
not for the developers. It would definitely from our perspective it's going to we're going to rethink what to do with the property, how to how to approach it and how to maybe redevelop something of it that is going to be maybe for the next 10 years but it's going to be something that's going to
generate a return on our investment and at much smaller scale. That's not what we want to do. We want to do the highest and best use and I think the city want to do the same and I think that's the right thing to do. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. Uh, one comment I'd like to
make on that. The Thunderbird, >> you know, you've done a lot of work already. I mean, you were about at the 90 yard line and things went arry and otherwise, like a lot of people said, you'd be under construction right now. You know, the one thing that I would
encourage you is to stick to it and be as detailed as you can. That's one thing that uh I learned that if you can explain to the citizenry about your view corridor that you want to have as you come down 107th, the
elevation of your building, people really like pretty pictures. Uh show what your building is going to look like and uh community involvement and I think it'll go very smoothly for you, but I encourage you to hang in there. >> Thank you.
>> Thank you. All right, that's my last card. I do have a letter from Allan Builds. I'm sorry I am unable to attend this meeting tonight, but would like this short and concise letter read out loud. 24 years ago, the citizens voted against these
increases in height and density. It was a very contentious issue for Treasure Allen. It played a major role in electing a new commission, including myself. I had the honor to serve as commissioner and heard from the residents of all of Treasure Island. It
was decided by a majority of the constituents that we did not want to be another Clearwater catering mostly to tourism and discounting the many residents who voiced legitimate concerns about the quality of life and city
services. 24 years ago isn't traffic 24 years ago is isn't what it is today. The cry of small town ambiance was voted on and won. Tourism is tourism still went on stronger than
ever. I can only assume that the state legislature overrode our vote. Home rule is in the Florida state constitution just for that reason. Just because you think you have the authority to do this doesn't make it right. The voters voted
for it and the voters should have to vote against it. I implore you to ask the city commission for an advisory question that the voters can vote on. Let the chips fall where they may. I stand in opposition to the
proposed change to the comprehensive plan amendment. Although I might not be in the majority. Let's call for a vote. What are we afraid of? Allen builds 131 94th Avenue, Treasure Island, Florida 33706. I'll make a comment in regard to that. That's not what we're doing at all. We're trying to to just enable a
PD. We're not talking about height and density at all tonight. So, that is what it is. And um I'm just going to call a general comment. Anybody else in the audience who would like to speak? I'm
getting everybody an opportunity. Seeing none, we'll close the public hearing. Um, any comments from the board? Obviously, we're not we're just taking a small baby step tonight. You know, the the biggest
problem is let's just say that the city commission said, "Yes, we want plan development. Let's have a plan development zoning category." Well, we don't have anything. We just want to get the city attorneys started preparing
some uh verbiage. And Grant is right. If for instance any parcel out there, all seven of the easily identifiable parcels that would uh be redeveloped if they want a little bit higher or a little bit
higher density, they get to go through the pain of a comprehensive land use plan. I've done them. They're not easy. I mean, it's a lot of expense. It's a lot of uh it's a lot of work. So like I told Eric Nory, this is not making it easier, it's making it harder. But
anyway, >> any further comments from the board? >> Yeah, I have a go ahead. >> So with Mr. Brooks because I think that there were a couple questions from um fellow residents when it comes to the negotiation part. I know that part of the criteria and it's like, okay,
well the commission's going to talk to the developers. I mean it still comes through an LPA board PNZ board. I want to make that clear. So >> there's no really backroom negotiation. What happens is they prepare >> correctation for an individual.
>> I'm sorry. Yeah. So there's no real backroom negotiations. These all occur at the LPA and at the city commission. The applicant prepares their proposed public benefits and describes their project and why it's in the best interest of the city. Then you guys review it. And typically what happens is
there'll be questions from LPA, questions from commissioners. We like this, but what about that? Have you ever thought about this? You're on the water. Um, how can we activate public kayak launches and something like that would happen? >> I know that the board I know the LPA board obviously and the PNZ board are
are the same. Sometimes the meeting and times are different. But is is that function of an LPA or is that a function of P&Z when it comes to a PD application? >> Okay. Yeah, I think this is the only city that I know of that has LPA that's
a different uh body than a planning and zoning. Usually they're together or what the city will say is we'll name our planning and zoning board to be our local planning agency. Um the local planning agency under chapter 163 Florida statutes makes your consistency
with comp plan determinations. So you that's the function of the LPA is to go comp plan amendment review consistency with the comp plan amendment and then planning and zoning board are all those things that are assigned by your city code to this advisory board to make recommendations.
>> Okay. Yeah. The reason why I asked the question is because >> similar functions one's kind of a state statute driven and the other one is a city code driven. The reason why I was asking is because from an LPA functioning perspective, from a PD review, sometimes those meetings can
piggyback in on a Thursday in the middle of the day. And if we're wanting public input, it would probably have to be an LPA meeting in the evening time where the public can make comments on that PD application again. If then if that gets approved, I guess it goes for the commission. And then I mean technically
it could come back and forth a couple of times, right? >> I think is this is going to depend on how it's written up whether it will come before the I just >> It's interesting. You made a lot of comments about >> um there's it seems like there's a lot of um
>> questions about uh the the commission. You know, it's just like, oh, we don't know if we trust the commission, but at the same time, you hear the commission's made the decision to go forward with the master plan. So, it's kind of interesting to hear those types of comments. Um so, I just wanted to make sure from a because I res uh input is
extremely important. So, I wanted to make sure that was clear. And I just try to address a couple of questions. Um, for Miss Pennington, I know you made a comment about the benefits of the plan development. It's not that it's in the agenda. It's just the saved PDF that's in the packet. So, when you look at the
agenda, it it shows that, but it's actually a PDF attachment that's part of the agenda. So, I just want to make sure that that that was clear because that was that was called >> prepared by the prior city attorney, too, I believe. >> Okay. Yeah. So, it's not like that the agenda item is saying the benefits of
plan development. It's solely based of a PDF attachment that's included in the agenda because if you look at the saved document, >> probably shouldn't say proposed comprehensive plan amendment resolution. It should say >> like page seven of our >> recommendation regarding PD enabling
>> page seven of our packet. It says the benefits of plan development right at the top. So, it's how it's how it's probably saved. Yeah. >> So, I just wanted to clarify that >> and misspelled to boot. The other the other point on that is there are there are cons. There's pros and cons, but if
a plan development comes before you, you can say no for any legitimate reason. You don't have to approve them. So if a particular one comes without enough benefits or is is contrary or is incompatible, certainly can say no. >> Okay. Um and then just for Mr. Hoey, I
know Indian Shores, Bair, Readington, I don't think they have their own fire department or or I don't think that they're building police departments. I I think that when it comes to from PD's perspective, like I look around and I see Madera Beach, yeah, they have PDs, but they also have a fire department. They're also buying millions of dollars
of land and this that's city owned. So, I do see the benefits and going back to my statement when it comes to this is an extreme benefit for the residents. Um, again, we're just looking at the tool to kind of get it in process. I know that there's no formal type of um action but
other than getting that mechanism in place. >> Imagine this talking about other cities if you were going to go across the pass to Madira Beach and you have that John's pass big commercial area that was done a long time ago. But say you were going to do something like that today. a PD would
be a natural thing to do to do that type of project because it'd be difficult to create that project with traditional zoning and you'd want to have the innovation and the exceptional planning and the the routing of pedestrians, the river walks, the all the different things that go along with it. I also
think it's that it's important because a lot of the residents are saying architectural design, you know, we want to make sure and I think when you start adding the bells and whistles or like the candy when it comes to building something, it costs extra money and then obviously it kind of squeezes from a margins perspective. So I look at the
the opportunity for folks to and residents to say, well, we want this beautiful this type of architecture, we want that. Okay, well that that that that costs additional money. And again, if it comes down to what's going to be successful, then that you have to apply
that type of flexibility that we're looking for the mechanism today. >> Yeah, I agree 100%. I mean, the prime example is the fact that the last several buildings built in Treasure Island uh are not stellar examples of
architecture in my opinion. It's hard to do. It's hard to build something like the Donsesar, but wouldn't it be nice to have something that uh would really look good in this town? I would think so. >> I even think about the canyon effect going down the clock tower. I mean, a lot of people don't know if they were to
build today, it's got to go on go got to go on the road. >> And that's one of the benefits of planned development. >> So, the current owner of that piece of property can show us what he would like to do. And uh you know, nothing's cut and dried. There's no precedents. I think the master plan shows the
developers what the city wants to do and then the PEDs come in and say well this is the private owner saying well this is what I can do. So they do go kind of hand in hand. I think you can have a parallel process or you could wait or you could do it now either way but the two things have separate functions but
they work together. >> Tuesday night they when they all said I mean they said they all go parallel with each other. I think even the mayor had said that as well. >> Yes they did. Go ahead Chris. So, I heard a number of comments this evening
from both folks on the board and from the audience and from the developers of the positive aspects of having a PD facility. And I'm actually positive towards having Treasure Island have a PD facility in some way that has
some guard rails on it. I think what I also heard that there's a lot of concern about the timing of this in terms of how we push the not push this through but make recommendations to the commission to have a facility like this included.
What I heard was in various ways is that, you know, the the city commission has asked us to not ask for any more than what we've already done, that they're going to wait for the master plan to get started, not to be finished, but for it to get started. And as a part
of that, if that planner would be incorporating PDs as a part of that process, that that would be the time for the commission to actually review that. The document that's before us today um you know is a draft. There's a lot of
very specifics in it in terms of density and height. I I don't think there's anything for us to >> but that's not the enabling that would not be the enabling >> right we wouldn't be enabling. So I think the at the most um you know this board would be just forming an opinion
about moving forward to have a facility for PDS but not um and to probably wait for this to be part and parcel of the planning process that we're all going to go through in the next in the coming months and to do it quickly. Um there's
nothing else really for us to do at this point as a board. It's not for us to force force the issue. I think the the draft asking Mr. Brooks to draft something for us to review. I mean, all of that is going to take time.
>> That's right. I guess I I think all that we can do that this point is just say that we're positive about having the facility. I'm not sure there's any point in drafting anything until such time that we actually have >> the planner on on board to make it part and parcel of that. But I I can, you
know, I can see an opinion both ways on that. Well, one of the things, Chris, is the plan development verbiage is pretty boilerplate and generic, but we don't have any of it. I mean, we just got nothing. And all this is is this first
baby step to get that stuff going. That's all it is. I mean, I certainly don't have any problem with, you know, a a draft, if you will, of a paragraph of how it would be included in the comp plan be presented to the to the board as a part as to to the commission as a part
of the master planning process. But I, you know, I think we've heard from the commission they're not going to vote on any of this until that master planner is on board. But there's nothing wrong with us stating that as a as a board. We there's certainly the opinion that the
facility itself makes sense to provide the flexibility that's needed and to have proper you know I think very important to have proper guard rails on it with respect to density and height uh that would have to go through many more processes to change >> we're not talking about density
>> right just putting the facility in place so we can make it happen >> but if you put the facility in place without the criteria associated with the evaluation of these proposals that come forward. I'm I'm not really sure what we're doing. Um and part of the
evaluation of these proposals is going to be the feasibility work that is done by the master planners. Uh the developers have told us that they need to increase height and density. You're of the position that that's what the planners are going to come back with. I want to see the independent financial
analysis that says that we have to increase height and density. And if that's part of the criteria, that needs to be baked into whatever we're putting forward. I just want to see this checklist or the criteria or whatever is involved in this before we put anything
forward. >> But he's got he said he would have a lot of criteria what you're putting together. Correct. >> Exactly. That's part of the PD enabler. you can um I'm just thinking in my head out loud here but in terms of the timing maybe you can make a recommendation
maybe uh once a master planner is selected or >> um within a few months I mean this is going to take 120 days say to do uh the 90 days to 120 days to get the enabling thing and then at least the master
planner knows well a PD is available you know so that they can wrap that into their analysis. Or you could wait until they're all done and they'll say, "Well, here's what what's permitted under existing zoning categories. We recommend that you do a plan development enabling that." So timing timing is a little bit
separate from the concept of having it. >> I think what was proposed before was specific density, some specific heights, and that's what the mission said, "No, we're not going there yet." when there was a motion from uh the I believe it was the vice mayor said well let's go
forward with the financial analysis and a PD and then so while the PD is not really before you right now so maybe the opportunity it sounds like you live at least one maybe two people that are interested in in doing it on a parallel track >> you had the mayor asking every single
person can we do it in parallel >> you had the mayor asking every single person can we do it in parallel Well, then you had Arthur wanting to do something about it and I guess the vice mayor said something about it also. I
mean, I think if you put if you if you put this in front of him, I think they approve it. No, >> I think I'm in favor of doing it in parallel, you know, as a part of I just don't want it to be excluded from the master and a half or two years. >> Well, that that's what parallel means. You don't have to wait.
>> He says it only takes >> the master plan is going to be started very soon. They're talking about nine months. >> Uh, >> no, that's what they they all said we can't do it in nine months. >> Well, you know, that's I don't know. >> And you know, Madira Beach just did one recently and it took them 16 months. So,
>> well, I think we're we've we've the the commission has already ranked a >> um and they're negotiating right now with that particular company and um I would hope that they would be on board within 30 days. >> Well, you still don't even know the cost of it though either. >> No, I mean that's but which is not for
us to decide. I know it's not for us to decide, but like what again? >> So I'm again I'm in favor of a parallel process and have no problem with a motion in that regard. >> Correct. Okay. Sound it sounds like a motion to if the board is if board I
don't want to cut off anyone from the board. >> Okay. Anybody else have any other comments? >> We can make a motion to have >> last shot. >> Brooks, Mr. Brooks put a PD facilities. >> Would you like to Marvin? Would you like to >> make a motion to have the city attorney
put together a PD facility, >> draft a P PD facility and or ask the U commission if we could go ahead and I guess we have to ask their permission. Correct. >> Basically that there isn't an item on
the agenda for >> March 16th, >> the next meeting for PD discussion at the city commission. >> Oh, there is. >> Yeah. So maybe this will be some kind of input to them whatever you come up with. >> Okay. We basically make your motion to say we recommend to the city commission
that they do. >> We recommend to to the city commission that they put a PD facility in place. >> No, no. I think I think what we're looking is PD a PD enabling >> Okay. >> enabling ordinance. Not a particular facility. Just a PD enabling ordinance.
We recommend a parallel city commission. Put it in something with master plan >> enabling ordinance >> in in parallel with the recommendations of the master planner, >> but that is hired. You know, it's going
to be done way before. I mean, >> for I I don't see the purpose because they're not going to >> just We're back in order a second. You made a motion. >> Okay. >> Do we have a second? >> Can he repeat?
>> Second. >> What? >> Can you repeat the motion? >> Repeat the motion. >> Go ahead. Repeat your motion, please. We recommend that the city commission instruct the city attorney to draft a PD enabler.
>> Call it plan development. >> Plan development enabler. >> Yes. >> Ordinance. >> Ordinance. >> Can I get a second? >> Can I have a second? >> Second. >> Okay. Could we have a roll call vote, please? >> Valerie, >> yes.
>> Mark Jodeski, >> yes. >> Ross Sanchez, >> yes. >> Daniel Billingsley, >> yes. Chris Downing, >> no. >> Grant Smith, >> no. >> Marvin Shavelin, >> yes. >> Richard Harris, >> yes. >> Thank you. >> Thank you very much. We will uh >> Six to two. >> Yes.
>> Six to two. >> Well, actually, it would be five to two cuz Valerie is a alternate. >> Oh, >> sorry. Sorry, Valerie. Your vote doesn't count tonight. >> Can she second? >> No problem. >> Can she second it? >> Um, I thought she was a member of the
planning and zoning board. I hate to make you do this over again, but >> can I get a second with a second from a member of the actual planning zone? >> I'll second. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. Starting over Marvin and um motion by Marvin Shavelin, second by Ross Sanchez. Could we have a roll call vote, please?
>> I'm going to skip you this time, Valerie. Mark Zeski, >> yes. >> Ross Sanchez, >> yes. >> Daniel Billingsley, >> yes. >> Chris Downing, >> no. >> Grant Smith, >> no. >> Marvin Shavelin, >> yes. >> Richard Harris, >> yes. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. 51. >> We're going to take about a 10-minute
break. It is currently uh 7:35. We will reconvene at >> 7:45 is that it needs to go in conjunction with the master planning process. >> If you had >> you guys, we can't talk about it during the break, but when we get back, we can
talk about it more if you want. >> Mr. Brooks, it's so nice to have you here. I appreciate it. Yeah, I enjoy actually working on your stuff. Tremendous. >> Thank you. I enjoy working on I've been doing it 35 years. >> I can tell >> the most I learned was in the Florida Keys. That's the hardest. >> Every little island is different.
>> I said we have 70 different tribes out tonight. >> I didn't get a chance. >> No, not tomorrow. It's nice to meet you. Part: 2
of the community. John Goodrich from your office of economic development. Thank you for the invitation to come in and give you a quick um and brief um update on commercial activity, much of what um you've already u know about or
have enabled. Um, but I did want to um just give you a snapshot. We continue to see a moderate reinvestment in our island. Um, much of it is the our um small-cale property improvements and
tenant upgrades um continue. Um, and most of what we're seeing in the office as far as new leads, new businesses coming into the island fall into the areas of um, food, hotels, and retail.
the commercial pipeline. Again, something that you're u most familiar with since most of this comes um through you when you sit as the planning and zoning board. Um right now we've got um five commercial projects um that are
notable um equating to more than 7.4 um million dollars in permit value for the island impacting more um than 3.8 acres here. Um again, the Sunshine Club, which recently did the ribbon cutting,
that is our new um condo hotel off of Golf Boulevard. Um Caddies, um which again is um finishing up their rebuilding and I saw online um just today they've announced their ribbon cutting for April 9th. The Nordin
continues to make great project um progress on the north end of the island. Treasure Island Plaza on 107 continues to go through um the repairing and and um repairing process um for that um
commercial plaza. So those are some of the things that we'll see coming soon. >> Joe, can you just go back to the slide prior to the pictures? I just wanted to see that. >> Okay. So, the Sunshine Club, Caddies, Treasure Island Plaza, Seaside um resort
on the Bayside for our uh Tahesian, formerly the Tah Tahesian Beach Resort, and then the Nordin. >> What's the What is the Tahesian permit for? >> So, they're repairing the Tahesian um on
the Bayside are repairing those two um buildings that they have on Gulf. Okay. Okay. >> And it's now um branded Seaside Resort. >> And then are there any tenants in the Treasure Island Plaza? Like I know that that's getting redone, but I saw like on Loop Net as of like last week there's
there all of those Treasure Island Plaza uh are you talking with the owner of that plaza? Do they have any signed tenants coming in >> right now? U Mr. Malaw, he's had some interest. He just made a change to his real estate brokers on um the plaza. So,
he's actually looking for new um tenant representation at this point. He's awaiting his electric permit and he expects all of his um spaces basically to go um be ready for tenant new tenants
coming in in the next two quarters. So, he still has some time to go and and that's basically why there's nothing signed at this point because people looking at the island right now want to go in a lot sooner. Most of folks that
I've talked to with Mr. Malow were looking to try and make like this spring break. So now we're going to kind of see a delay in some of the tenant interest until he gets completed so then they can get in in time um probably by fourth quarter in order to make the next cycle
for our tourism season. >> Does that make sense? >> Yeah, it does. I mean first I needed to start off and just say thanks for coming. Um I really appreciate the intro. I hope we can do this more frequently whether it's LPA or P&Z meetings where we can get updates and the community can also get updates when
it comes to like if there are tenants signed that are coming in and what the business owners that you're talking to um are saying to you. So, thank you. >> Yes. So, in in preparation of um this evening's brief um presentation, I
worked with um Mary Allen Edwards and the community development team. So once I finish the presentation, if there's anything that I might not have hit um because this will be basically the framework that I can use for um you know
the next quarterly briefing per se, you can um provide me then that feedback. So again, the office does continue to track all of our commercial real estate opportunities. We do that in a couple of ways. Um, for for purposes of tonight, I
just pulled off what was currently on LoopNet. At this point, we also have our partnership with Penllis County Economic Development. So, I've got access to Co-Star to go a little deeper. Um, but on the for sale side of things, what's
changed since the last time that I came to brief you, we've seen um some multif family um commercial properties um hit the for sale um for the island. We've got a 10-unit property, two 8-unit properties, and one four-unit property
from a uh multif family. I also noticed that we do have some vacant land, um off of 121st Avenue that kind of hit loop net that I hadn't noticed before. Um otherwise, um on the four lease side, that's basically stayed, um the same.
some of the um uh for the office at that um 3,700 um that first line for lease is down in um off of Blinds Pass, so the southern end of the island. Um so that remains um an
opportunity for us to fill most of that retail there. You do see from the um Treasure Island Plaza. Again, I once again mentioned we do have a 5,000 square foot restaurant opportunity in Mr. Melau's um plaza. So, would love um
to receive any leads on that. And the specialty is um the Treasure Island Yacht Club that's still um being um promoted on LoopNet for lease. And that would basically be the building. from a key indicator point of view.
There's just a couple of things that I want to um uh note here from an active business point of view. Um so there's two sources that I have for data. Um one with the property appraiser for tangible personal property and those will be more of our traditional businesses that have
storefronts or property that register with the property appraiser. So we've got 235 tangible personal property accounts right now showing for Treasure Island. Um again um categories accommodations and food is our biggest um industry
sector followed by real estate, property management and then retail. Um we also am tracking business um tax receipts um our licenses associated with that um process here at city hall. So that will
also include um our brick and mortar but also layers in contractors who we require to have BTRs as they do um business on the island and other um our short-term rentals also um will go
there. So from a BTR point of view, business tax receipts, we've got 512 accounts at this at this time. Um commercial occupancy >> I was going to ask about commercial. >> Yes. So from a commercial occupancy point of view, I did add my first ever
um economic snapshot in the meeting agenda. So from um a retail point of view, we're running occupancy at 88%. Um interestingly, you know, office is at 100%. Um why we look at um occupancy
because a lot of times we can use that data as we go out and look at um new developers or investors um try to lead um with where we've got opportunities to to build new spaces. So when you have
high occupancy in this regard, it shows that there could be opportunity for more of those types of spaces to come onto the island. From a hotel occupancy point of view, this number of 58% is our January numbers. Um March is actually
our best season um that we'll have on the island when it comes to hotel occupancy. So we'll see that go up um for for March and April. Our next best month is actually um July.
From a downtown activity point of view, we also continue to monitor these numbers. Our foot traffic is up by um the 27 um.9% that you can see right now. Um but this is still down from two or
three years ago. So we continue to kind of um not only rebuild after the storm, but also rebuild um for our best year um that we've seen in the data is actually goes back to 2021. >> How do you measure how do you measure
measure foot traffic? So, we have a new um data source. Um it's called Placer AI. It's a locationational um analytic tool. So, we can monitor foot traffic um by cell phones. So, as they come into um
from a geotagging point of view, as they come into a particular zone, as they go into a particular property, we can now manage um that activity. And um uh this particular tool actually gives us data for the past seven years. So this is how
I know that our best year in downtown on the island um goes back to 2021. Um our best days in downtown are Saturday first, then Sunday, then Friday. Our best times are 5 to 8. And
generally our average time of those um coming into the downtown area will stay for um 193 minutes. Um I know the table to the right isn't, you know, very readable, but it it basically also gives
us information as to when people come to the island or when um our residents come into the downtown area, we can kind of see who they're patronizing. So that's another thing that we'll continue to monitor as we um move forward.
So our playbook in process um continues. This is something that I had um provided you in in a briefing a couple of months ago. But from a um office of economic development point of view, we continue to um support the readiness of
commercial spaces that we currently have here on the island. There's been a lot of discussion around district parking um parking. Um I'm currently trying to um solve for some of the needs of our local businesses with their employees with with the team in the city commission. Um
again continue to give some insight um to our team on commercial rules. So what are some of those um such as um uh as an example uh with some of the food and retail leads that are coming in a lot of um interest in outdoor dining. So making
sure that our commercial rules can you know that um can unleash um the interest in that downtown activation is another thing that I continue to work with the team um of course we're so fortunate to have um our parks and recreation team
led by Kathy Hduk on what they do with signature events and other um events here in the downtown um core um our Penllis County um beaches um chamber of commerce with their first Fridays is bringing a lot of value into our
downtown core. Business navigator is our new level of service. So, as I get um connected with leads, prospects or local businesses um if they're um looking for um service with city hall, we try to be
efficient, more quick on some of these activities um because I know that was mentioned tonight. So, we've we've got um that in place, working on our um messaging and continue to build our partnerships. Um the city just recently joined the Urban Land Institute in order
to build our relationships with investors and developers and the real estate community um in getting the word out on Treasure Island that we are ripe um for um investment that we would love um you know innovative businesses and
those that can feed us and um help us exercise and take care of our personal needs. Um, so we continue to um build those partnerships that will bring more um lead flow um prospect interest um into our island.
>> What was the name of that organization that you were shooting a flare out to? >> The Urban Land Institute. >> Yeah. Have they given us any feedback in regards to like what who's coming? Anyone? What I
can tell you is um St. Pete is around the urban land institute table. Um the city of Clearwater is and that's about it. So I think there's an opportunity for Treasure Island to certainly fit into
two other markets um here in Penllis County. So I look forward to nurturing those relationships and turning people on to um Treasure Island as paradise. And that concludes my report. >> Could you expand on the unified
messaging comment that you made? I'm not sure you you brushed by that a little bit. I'm not sure what that meant or is there something that you're doing with the public to or some effort around messaging in terms of what what is Treasure Island? Is that >> Well, yes. So, I am just beginning to
put my arms around a potential business development campaign. So generally I do try to ask everybody that I meet you know what's your one word that you use to describe Treasure Island. Um but that is something that I would love to bring um forward before anything is formalized
um to get your um input on before any um campaigns you know go out to the market. So that's in development the messaging. >> Okay. All right. >> Is messaging like branding? >> Yes. Um definitely branding for sure.
You know, right now I'm working on a market opportunity report for our prospect. And so um the these are just some of the things that again, what is your foundational messaging that um we want to put out for Treasure Island to
stand out? >> Any recent convers I'm not trying to like pepper just like a lot of questions because it's been a while since we've connected. So any conversations with like the Green Leaf property, what they're I mean because we're talking about Urban Land Institute and you made
the comment that we're ripe for investment. So the the folks like the Green Leaf like what are they saying? What's their status? I mean that's kind of like on a monthly or every other month. I would like some kind of update whether it's the um uh downtown properties, whether it's the Green Leaf
properties, whether it's you know anything that's on the on the beach because like the sands of Tahesian like are you meeting with those owners and what are they saying about what's the pause or >> Yeah, I don't think there's anything new from the last time that we had spoken
and certainly um as evidenced by the the conversation that you had this evening um you know what I know, >> okay? >> You know, as to um you know, where current state is. >> So, like one of my >> I don't have anything new this evening
to um bring forward. >> Okay. And then like for the properties like just take it for the TI club for example. I I'm getting and I agree with a lot of my fellow residents when it comes to just the eyesore it is becoming. Are we are you talking to them
being like can you guys clean that up? is are you working with code to say can you guys get I mean this is the entrance to our city I mean we're trying to develop economic growth and that's our front door so are you working with code to be like can you go knock on the TI
club's door and say clean this up this is embarrassing for us >> so specifically to the TI um yach club no I have not spoken to them but I do know again our community development department and our code team is having
conversations with all property owners that they want to see do better. >> And is that just like where just so the so the public can know like do they just send an email to codes at Treasure Island that says can we clean up the debris that's laying in our grass that
our public works has to drive their lawn mower around to to mow the grass? I mean, how does that go about us voicing the the club situation on cleaning their act up? >> Well, I'm going to turn to my colleague. Okay. if if if Mary Ellen is still
>> since um with the with the >> Yeah. >> And I'm not trying to like I'm just I mean part of economic development to me is getting our front door our front porch cleaned up and I think it's been a long and I know I've made comments up here and I'm not trying to you know be difficult but I'm just trying to help
the city get going in the right path like I've always said. >> Yeah. Well, I mean typically thanks for the intro music. It is it goes to the codes at mytasreasure island.org as a complaint. Okay. >> Um, you've you've referenced it tonight, so clearly I know and can can bring it to the codes tomorrow. So, >> okay.
>> But that's the typical process as it goes to that email. >> Okay. >> But >> it on my radar. >> Thank you, Joan. From like the master plan perspective, um, I'm trying to So, I think that the city has a huge opportunity with the
properties amongst 108. The city itself is investing millions of dollars into the public um police and fire building on that side. There's going to be leftover land um that's over there. There could be an opportunity for a
marina or fuel distribution for the city to have again additional revenue. Are you in talks with the city to kind of say like can I get a part of that master plan? Can we put 108 in there? cuz I don't I don't think I'm pretty confident it's not in there today, but wouldn't
that be for future economics a smart thing to do is to have that there at your disposal to where you can attract maybe the private uh public partnership type thing? I would think. I I'm just asking. >> Well, again, I think the city commission
in some of their meetings in the past have talked about the opportunities that we have from public private partnerships moving forward. Um again, whether that's through developer agreements or whether that's the use of um city lands moving
forward um and especially you know or or not especially but with some of the lands that we have in the downtown core. So um when the time is right absolutely and and how we again get ready for public private partnerships I think is
definitely on the list. I just I've had a lot of residents talk about what I mean everyone's excit I mean if had a lot of residents ask about what the future is after we move the trailers and we move the car whatever you want to call the tents that are covering the
fire trucks and stuff today. So I mean that's >> but I think there was consensus >> waterfront property >> at the last at the last city commission meeting there was consensus >> among them that as we start this master planning process that there's flexibility with even though it wasn't
included in the initial RFQ >> correct >> that we're going to add the cityowned property at least some of it like 108 plan because I I'm in complete agreement with you that that >> is definitely should be a part of the mix for economic development here.
>> Yeah, that's why I was asking the question to Jono. Again, I'm not trying to like pepper you with questions. I just I'm glad you kind of are with me, Chris, so then they don't attack me tomorrow on social media. >> Any opportunity to make the um island um better for our residents, more
vibrant for our visitors, and um a stronger customer base for our local businesses, I think, is a win overall. and certainly the foundation to our game plan for economic development. >> Well, thanks again for giving us the
briefing. I think it helps everybody in the public. >> Is there anything missing that would be helpful or please let me know oneonone following the meeting? If there's any other things that you think would be helpful in these quarterly updates and
certainly for the printed um piece that I had issued, um the next one will come out in April because we'll do that quarterly. If there's anything that you'd like to see from a data point point of view as we um continue to march forward together on trends, um let me
know. I' I'd love to hear your feedback. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Yeah, I do have a quick question. You know, the I'm just looking at some of the um percentages on here. For instance, office uh 100%. There's not really much office left in this town, is
there? I mean, where is it? >> It's above. >> I know we got some above the VIP. Yeah, above Chase Bank. >> Yeah, that >> it's it it's a there's a little bits and pieces all around town. >> A small amount. >> The bank maybe the bank maybe fifths considered an office.
>> But if there really is demand for it and we're at 100% right now, then maybe some of the empty space in this building could be rented out to the >> Joan. What is considered the office in the 100% stat? Well, again, so that means that all of our traditional office
space on the island is occupied or has a lease tied to it. That's why that's 100%. Um, if you're asking me, can um more office be valuable to come to the island, that's a whole another answer I can give you. >> I think we're just looking for a
specific parcel that's considered office. >> Yeah, there's a list again. The dentist office would be office. >> Okay. Yeah. Um the office above the hardware store would be five. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Yeah. You forget about that up there. >> No, it's interesting cuz like for
instance retail, our biggest retail is Publix. >> Our second biggest is Walgreens, you know. Our third uh biggest is probably Surf Style and that makes up the majority of the retail, which is fine. Uh I mean I sympathize with Slommo. He
got kicked in the teeth and the front his buildings right now really do not look good. But at least he's swinging at it. I will say that. But >> we'll have the economic dashboard delivered to us quarterly. >> Yes, sir. >> And then is that something that the
residents will also be able to see because it'll be in like our packet quarterly? >> Yes. Also, I plan on um I haven't yet added an economic development page to the city's website. So, some of these um documents I plan on adding on to the new
page for the Office of Economic Development. >> And then when it comes I get that this is quarterly. Um will we be able to connect with you at least at like every other month to get some of the So we if we did have questions is that something that you're open to joining these
meetings LPA or P&Z? >> Absolutely. >> Okay. >> I I I I don't think >> What does the board think? I I I don't think monthly is >> No, quarterly is fine. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Going to be part of the master plan staff team.
>> Okay. >> Yeah. >> That would make sense. >> Very important financial feasibility. forgot to turn my microphone on, but Joan's going to be part of the master plan staff team and in leading uh
project managing the uh financial feasibility analysis to take this component in with that, >> the economic development redevelopment component. >> I think the properties along 108 have a pure opportunity for the city to make an investment to springboard everything
else. >> Yeah, they'll be about 2 acres out of the 3.2 2 acres that we own there. Um, that would be an opportunity. >> Awesome. Well, thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I appreciate it.
>> Okay, moving on. Local planning agencies issues, comments, or discussion. We've had two hour and 10 minute meetings so far. Anybody got any other further comments? >> I just want to make sure we're all on the same page that we're going to have always have an LPA after the PNZ, even
if there's nothing on the agenda. Well, it's always nice to like you initiated this one, Marvin, and I appreciate that. And I think we accomplished a few things tonight, >> but I think we should just put it like I mentioned before, just say general discussion. Then if we don't have a
discussion, then >> I agree. There should we should always have one. If it's not special because something might come up last minute and you know, >> we can put it in front of the PNZ meeting um at 2 o'clock as a normal thing if we want to. audience comment.
You forgot to ask >> one second. Usually we have it afterwards >> or afterwards. Yeah. >> Our next uh PNZ meeting is of course one week from today at 2:00, >> right? Which obviously we don't need it for that. >> And but the thing is we have a lot of
cases. So be here if you can. Um >> I will >> more more of the more of the usual, you know, variances for people that are raising houses. >> Anyway, you had a comment Sean comment on the last item. Oh,
>> I guess I always forget to. So, go ahead. Sorry. >> Last agenda item. Um, just having a lot of experience. I think 46,000 square feet of retail we managed for 20 years. Um, you know, a lot of things. It sounds
good 100% occupied, but like what price per square foot? Like you guys are really talking about feasibility. Like you got to like all these numbers are cute, but like what does it cost to build it and what are we actually getting? And I think one of the big things is what are we actually getting? I mean, if they're getting $10 a square
foot, I can tell you you're not getting any buildings that are going to be built at $10 a square foot. >> Yeah. That's only going to work with the existing one that's there, obviously. >> Well, that's desperate, right? They call that you're you're trying to get cash flow, so you're going to take whatever you can get.
Well, I I you know, I think the existing facility that's there, I'm not sure how the economics of that works, but it must be working at least enough to make that person repair that and get it back online. >> Well, to give you some numbers, the True Value guy paid 2.8 million and he's got
on the market at 2.2 and there's no interest. >> Yeah, >> I was in the building a week ago. >> I mean, >> I missed that hardware store. >> That's the hardware store. Yeah. Well, unfortunately, I think we all understand that's a huge challenge right now. For sure. >> Yeah. I mean, retail is
>> I mean, Schlommo, I know him. The guy on the north side, everybody asks, "Are we working together?" I mean, I know the guy very well. I talked to him. I try to help him with contacts and people to help fix it. Uh, he did have it on the market for multiple months. Obviously, doesn't look good. So, he pulled it off
the market, try and finish it to he was willing to build the suit. He's trying to get $30 a square foot and there's no interest. And people say, "Oh, it's too expensive." But the reality is is that's what it cost, right? I mean, you want nice stuff, that's what it costs. And then the other question I had is, I
mean, I know a lot of those numbers I kind of have to challenge. I mean, I didn't see anything about the 36,000 foot club in there that's vacant. >> That's good points. >> You get some of this to She'll >> Yeah, some of that is uh inside
baseball. You know, it's hard to find those numbers. you know where to find them. So that'd be great. >> That's a good good suggestion. Go ahead, Donna. >> Uh committee members, uh just real quick, I mean I think it's wonderful that the Treasure Islands striving for economic growth and outside development,
but we have development right here and nothing's happening. So I'm you know, it would be nice if we can get our own projects underway with the current developers as we're trying to get outside businesses and outside people here. Um, one of the things that's going to sell people to get here, other
developers and econ economic growth is if they see us underway, they're going to want to come too. If they see everything as is, they're not going to come. I mean, what are we promising these people? We might have a master plan. We might not have a master plan. It might take two years.
Might have a PD, might not. I mean, sorry. Well, at least I think uh Donna, we did take a step in the right direction today. >> And uh at least it'll get the boilerplate, the outline in place. So if
and when we get there, they got something to work with because right now they do not have anything to work with. Okay. Based on that, we mentioned the uh meeting next um Thursday. Hope we can all be there for that. Uh, April 9th is the
>> just to note as I did in the last PNZ meeting, I will be missing the March PNZ meeting. >> Uh, next Thursday I will not be here. >> I understand that. >> It's like my only month that I miss other than I have perfect attendance. >> Anyway, we will check and see how the um
LPA for April goes. The PNZ will be the 16th. Um, we usually like to have the LPA afterwards. We'll do that if uh things work out. Okay. Public comment. Anybody in the audience want to make a comment?
Go ahead. >> I was going to raise a contentious issue like residency to be a board member, but I'm feeling really good about tonight. I think it was a great a great uh meeting, maybe because of the oversight, but this meeting was about as smooth and as as
helpful as I've seen in my in two years looking at these boards. Well done to the chair. Uh very informative as a as a as a resident. Um city attorney, I think it was excellent, very informed. Um you really know your business. And he actually buried the lead. Um what he
said what I took away was the city vision of redevelopment here is expressed through the master plan. The developer vision of redevelopment is expressed how how how PDS. >> So uh again bury the lead. Uh well well
done to you. Well done everybody. Um I think the uh the challenging Joan I think uh Commissioner Sanchez did a great job. It's great to see Joan up here. Extremely informative. I I 100% agree with what Sean just said. I mean, >> did you just call me Commissioner Sanchez?
>> Well done. >> That was That was good. >> I like that. >> Keep going, Mr. B. >> I like that. Mayor, Mayor Sanchez, um uh again, having Jonah up here was was brilliant. I've been trying really to to have her get up and speak for for for a
while. Very informative. The numbers that Shawn challenged uh Mr. Burns um spot on. I mean, fantastic. his knowledge, skills and ability that he brings here is is wonderful. Uh I think daughter too are very impressive. But I think it's important to say on a final
note that uh we ready to go with 106 rooms was good to go fine didn't happen. 184 rooms good to go didn't happen. So I'm looking forward to seeing what heighten density they are
coming up with on the on the next round. But again kudos to Chairman Harris. Great meeting and perhaps I don't need you to come anymore because it's so well done. Thank you so much. >> Thank you. All right, motion to adjourn. >> Thank you. See you next week.
>> My god, that's easy. >> Don't worry, the wind's blowing this direction this time. middle blow the other direction next time. Take it easy.