WEBVTT

METADATA
Video-Count: 1
Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=YxqfPkSYdg0

NOTE
MEETING SECTIONS:

Part 1 (Video ID: YxqfPkSYdg0):
- 00:00:22: Opening Statements: Mine Safety, Palmer's Nomination and Priorities
- 00:12:54: Ranking Member's Opening: Black Lung, Silica Rule Concerns
- 00:19:08: Witness Introduction and Ground Rules for Testimony
- 00:20:29: Assistant Secretary Palmer's Testimony: Vision for MSHA
- 00:25:19: Questioning Begins: Compliance Assistance and Stakeholder Outreach
- 00:30:36: Recess for House Voting
- 01:24:22: Questioning Resumes: Palmer's Stance on Silica Rule
- 01:29:46: Incentivizing Job Growth and Expansion of Critical Minerals
- 01:35:17: Clarifying Silica Rules: OSHA Collaboration and Administration Impediments
- 01:39:21: Impact Inspections: Black Lung Prevention and Staffing Levels
- 01:45:23: Domestic Coal Mining: Support, Safety and Compliance
- 01:49:59: Coal's Role in Energy Policy: EPA and MSHA Modernization
- 01:56:07: Pacific Territories Inspections: Sector-Specific Strategies
- 02:01:13: Closing Remarks: Silica Dust, Black Lung and Mine Safety


Part: 1

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Testing. Testing. One, two, three. Testing. Line level. All right. testing one, two, one, two. >> That's great. >> Thank you. Okay. Morning. This subcommittee on workforce protections will come to order. I note

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that a quarm is present. Without objection, the chair is authorized to call a recess at any time and for note we will be doing so uh for house voting in just a few minutes here. We all share the goal of keeping hardworking

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Americans safe. Today's hearing examines the federal agency responsible for ensuring the safety of our men and women who help power our nation. The Mine Safety and Health Administration, also known as EMA, establishes and enforces

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safety and health standards governing all mines both above and underground. We're joined today by the Honorable Wayne Palmer, the assistant secretary of labor for mine safety and health at the US Department of Labor. who will share with us the Trump administration's

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vision for EMH. Assistant Secretary Palmer was confirmed by the Senate on October 7th of 2025. Prior to his appointment, he served as the executive vice president of the Essentials Essential Minerals Association. He also served in the first

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Trump administration at EMSA, including as principal deputy assistant secretary and for a time acting assistant secretary. He also served as chief of staff to a senator from my home state, Senator Rick Santorum. This marks the first time in six and a half years that

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the assistant secretary of labor for testified before this committee, and I commend the committee for holding this important hearing and welcoming Assistant Secretary Palmer today. Mining plays a critical role in supporting our economy and America's energy

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independence. As a representative of the great Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, which has more than 700 active mines, I've seen firsthand how this industry supports jobs, families, and local economies. Under the Trump administration, there is an opportunity for mining to grow and continue

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delivering for communities across the country. Last year, President Trump issued several executive orders aimed at increasing domestic mineral and coal production. And as we seek to expand production, our responsibility is clear. We must ensure workers protections keep

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pace. This is where EMA comes in. EMS has must promote and implement strong and effective policies so that every time and every mine worker can finish his or her shift at and return home safely to their loved ones. While EMS

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oversees the health and well-being of workers in this unique industry, it also faces the challenge of protecting workers from hazards common in other industries such as respiratory uh related silica issues and hazards that are unique to mining such as black lung

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disease. Given his leadership experience at EMA and his background in the mining industry, Assistant Secretary Palmer is well equipped to confront these issues and we thank you for joining us here today. Going forward, EMHA must uphold strong safety standards while also

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supporting innovation as technologies and operational demands evolve. This can be achieved by pairing focused, effective enforcement with a strong compliance assistance program that promotes collaboration among employers,

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workers, and EMA. By working together, we can develop practical common sense policies that prioritize safety and worker well-being. Again, Assistant Secretary Palmer, thank you for being here today and we look forward to your testimony. With that, I yield to the

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ranking member for her opening statement. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Good morning, everyone. Uh, thank you so much, uh, Assistant Secretary Palmer for being here today. Since its inception in 1977,

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the mine safety and health administration, IMSA has strived to protect Americans Americans miners from occupational hazard and negative health impacts, prevent disease through inspection and

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oversight. IMSET's vital health and safety standards such as rules on dust levels posting warning signs and controls for explos explosive hazards. To set those standards, IMSA heavily

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relies on the research capacity of other agents s such as the National Institute of Occupation and Safety and Health, which identifies hazards and conducts health research. IMS's work is critical

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in keeping minors healthy and alive. Unfortunately, after declining for decades, pla black lung disease is now on the rise. X-ray surveillance data indicates that the prevalence of black

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lung disease has doubled from 2007 to 2017. Nearly one in five lung tenored miners in Appalachia have been diagnosed with black black lung disease. The most severe form called progressive massive

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fibrosis is now at epidemic level. M PMF or complicated black lung is caused by the inhalation of coal and silica dust. In fact, silica dust is 20 times more

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toxic than cold dust alone and has been identified as one of the main causes of the spike in black lung. Black lung can be devastating disease. Miners gradually lose the ability to breathe causing them

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to wheeze and gasp for air. For some with PMF, survival requires lung transplant. But even then, life expectancy does not usually exceed five years. Even more troubling, PMF is now

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implicating minors at far earlier ages with cases being documented in minors in their 20s, in their 30s and 40s. And sadly, there is still no cure for black lung disease.

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The relationship between silica and blood lung disease among coal miners is particularly well well known. But silica dust is a significant threat to workers in metal and non-metal mines which makes

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up more than 90% of active miners in the country. These miners also face the risk of chronic lung disease and cancer. Recognizing this longstanding danger, the Biden administration made one of the most significant updates to

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mine safety standards in decades to protect miners from exposure to silic dust. In 2024, the Biden era Department of Labor issued a rule to protect workers from serious health threats by lowering the allowance the allowable

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levels of silica exposure in minors and extending operationf funded respiratory screening to minors. But now the Trump administration is reversing course on this progress by refusing to defend this new rule in court. We often hear our

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colleagues on the other side of the aisle accuse regulatory agencies in a democratic administration of what they call sue and settle. But right now, this administration appears to be working hand in hand with the mining companies to weaken this important silica rule.

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Also of critical concern is IMA's ability to hold bad operators accountable for injuring or killing minors. IMSA now has only 654

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inspectors. I look forward to hearing more from the assistant secretary about this about his plans to restore the agency to full capacity. Staffing ultimately is the agent's capacity to get the job done to protect minors. I

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worry that the current status is not serving minors well. In 2025 alone, there was 21% increase in minors fatality driven by a 40% increase in debts in metal and non-metal mines. Ranking members Scott

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and I sent two letters earlier last year inquiring about the extent and impact of firing DO and IMHA. The administration has so far failed to provide a substantive response to these letters, leaving Congress and the miners who rely

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on the services from IMSA in the dark. By firing staff at IMSA and Naosha, refusing to enforce safety regulations and closing dozens of IMHA offices, the Trump administration is failing to protect the health and safety of hardworking minors and sabotaging

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decades of efforts to prevent black lung. As health care costs skyrocket, miners should not have to worry about work workplace exposures forcing them into hospitals. Assistant Secretary Palmer, I look forward to our

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conversation today and I hope that we can figure out a way to keep minors safe and prevent future tragedies. Thank you, Chairman, and I yield back. Pursuant to committee rule 8C, all members who wish to insert written

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statements into the record may do so by submitting them to the committee clerk electronically in Microsoft Worm format by 5:00 p.m. 14 days after this hearing. And without objection, the hearing record will remain open for 14 days to allow such statements and other

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extraneous materials noted during the hearing to be submitted for the official hearing record. I note that some of my colleagues who are not permanent members of this subcommittee may be waving on for the purpose of today's hearing. Now to our witness introductions. Uh obviously joined by one individual today

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uh who has already been introduced. Uh Mr. Wayne Palmer, the assistant secretary of MIA. We want to thank you for being here today and we look forward to hearing your testimony. Pursuant to committee rules, I would ask that you limit your oral testimony to three minute summary of your written statement

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uh which you have provided to all of the committee members. As committee members may have many questions for you, the clock will count down from three minutes and pursuant to committee rule 8D and committee practice. However, we will not cut you off uh until you reach the 5m minute mark. I would also like to remind

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you uh to be aware of your responsibility to provide accurate information to the subcommittee. And with that, Assistant Secretary Palmer, you are recognized for your testimony. Right. >> Thank you. And good morning, Chairman McKenzie, Ranking Member Omar, and members of the subcommittee. Thank you

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for inviting me to testify here today. And I also want to thank Chairman Wahlberg, and Ranking Member Scott for joining this hearing. It is an honor to appear before this subcommittee and to represent President Trump, Secretary Chavez Dreamer, and the Mine Safety and Health Administration.

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As a descendant of both coal and metal non-metal miners, it is a privilege to serve as the 12th Assistant Secretary for EMA. And I can think of no mission more vital than ensuring the day-to-day safety and long-term health of our nation's 325,000 miners.

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Being called to appear this early in my tenure as assistant secretary, I thought it would be helpful to share with you my initial vision for how I believe EMS should fulfill its mission of promoting safe and healthful workplaces for the nation's minors. In accordance with

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Executive Order 14219, which directs agencies to focus limited enforcement resources on regulations squarely authorized by statute, EMA will first prioritize statutoily mandated mine inspections along with accident

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investigations and mine rescue operations. In enforcing EMH statutes and regulations, we will call balls and strikes. And when mine operators commit errors, we will site and penalize according to the Minax strict liability standard, even-handedly without fear or

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favor. I also will seek to modernize the agency in two ways. The first is through technological advancements. As deputy assistant secretary in the first Trump administration, we launched an aerial drone program for inspecting high hazard

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impoundments using 3D imaging, enabling our inspectors to identify structural deficiencies in tailings dams from a safer distance. We pioneered an artificial intelligence platform capable of predicting realworld mine safety

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risks based on decades of data. As I sit here today, we are further refining this AI platform and will integrate its predictive data into smart helmets that we soon will be field testing in minds. Second, wherever possible, we will

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modernize agency regulations. During the first Trump administration, for example, we updated existing rules to accommodate advancements in electronic detonators, which minimize accidental misuse during blasting in a mine.

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I take the helm at an especially important dynamic moment for America's mining industry as this administration implements policies to improve American competitiveness and address downstream affordability for consumers of finished goods and energy.

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As you know, we have grown dependent on non-domemestic mineral supply chains, including from countries hostile to our economic and security interests. This administration is vigorously pursuing policies aimed at reshoring those supply chains. Where the previous

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administration granted fast 41 permitting status to only a single new mine project, already during its first year in office, the Trump administration has granted such status to 14 additional projects focused all on critical minerals. Where the outgoing

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administration imposed a moratorum on coal lease sales in service of energy security and affordability, the Trump administration is moving to increase sales. These are just two examples of actions that will lead to new mines and increase production at existing mines with the

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International Energy Agency reporting that strong policy support already boosted domestic demand for coal in 2025. So what does this mean for EMS as an agency? Well, from a safety perspective, when new mines enter their development

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phase, EMA will provide compliance assistance to startups. So far, EMA has assisted 93 new or reopening mines with regulatory compliance, helping them to avoid thousands in fines and more swiftly commence their operations.

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How better to ensure safety than to help a new mine prepare for regulatory compliance before EMA shows up unannounced for that mine's first statutoily mandated inspection. From an organizational efficiency perspective, it means situating our resources strategically to accommodate

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future growth. The majority of critical mineral mines in development fall west of the Mississippi and EMA needs to be resourced accordingly into the future. Again, I appreciate the opportunity to discuss mine safety and health with you. I look forward to answering any questions that members of this

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subcommittee may have. Thank you, Mr. Palmer. Under committee rule 9, we will now ask questions of the witnesses under the five-minute rule. We will recognize the chairman of the full committee, Mr. Wahberg, and then we will move to recess and reconvene after house voting. With

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that, I turn to Mr. Wahlberg. >> Well, thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Mr. Palmer, for being here. I remember when I chaired this subcommittee a number of years ago and the the opportunities to go down into underground mines in West Virginia,

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Pennsylvania, open pit surface mining out in North Dakota, salt mine and under Detroit um and then up in the upper peninsula of Michigan to see some of the hard rock mines that that went on. Uh what a valuable resource and endeavor we

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have and the miners incredible people willing to do things that most don't think about and as well as the mine operators um providing the resources that we need. So thank you for your attention to all of this. Um, EMS's uh

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mission to promote is is to pro promote safe and healthful workplaces for America's miners and that demands that robust uh compliance assistant efforts accompany the agency's enforcement status. Can you discuss the AY's

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compliance assistance and uh safety and health or the cash program with us? >> Thank you, Mr. Chair, for that question. Uh so the CASH program was established last year. Uh it stands for compliance assistance in safety and health and it's

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one of a handful of different uh abilities that that capabilities that EMS has to provide compliance assistance. The cash program itself is focused mostly on uh the startups that I was referring to in my testimony. Um, so again, most of those uh tend to be west

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of the Mississippi, but when a mine is in development, um, the our compliance assistance specialist under this cash program will establish contact with them. Now, if the mine is still in early development, and they haven't begun to construct the mine, build roads, build

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uh, uh, buildings, begin to move earth, um, they may not be ready for a compliance assistance visit. But we are establishing those relationships. And when they are ready, we will send a specialist out to walk them through what's referred to as an EO1 inspection, the statutoily mandated twos and fours

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as we call them. Um and and without issuing citations and violations, uh then at some point uh unexpectedly unannounced because under the mine act it would constitute advanced notice which is prohibited. At some point, an MSHA inspector subsequently will show up

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unannounced and do the full EO1 inspection, including violations and citations. But again, as I said in my testimony, it's all in service of preparing them to comply uh and and educating them on how this works, especially if the mine operator, the

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company is uh headquartered based in a different country where they have a different system for mine safety and they're not familiar with the mine act, the minor act and 30 CFR. Well, that that that side of the ledger is so important to have clear um understanding

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the enforcement aspect always has to be there, right? >> But it has to be done in such a way that it's a partnership in the process. So, I appreciate that. Um we can all agree that vast majority of mine operators want to do the right thing. It costs them significantly if they don't. They want to take care of their workers and

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they want to provide them with a safe and healthful workplace. In addition to the cash program, what are you planning to do at EMA to promote more outreach to all stakeholders and ensure their views are considered? >> Yes, thank you for that question, Mr.

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Chairman. Uh, so I intend as assistant secretary to be as visible, engaged, and responsive as possible with the industry, the stakeholders. um serving as deputy assistant secretary during the first Trump administration. I spent a great deal of time attending safety

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conferences and speaking uh and just getting to know the operators. Uh I believe that having those relationships goes a long way toward helping them to comply and keep their minds safe. Um, I'm also looking to renew uh these formal alliance agreements that EMA has

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had in place since the year 2000 with numerous trade associations in the mining industry. Um, and they are non-binding. They're more aspirational, but they do um commit softly commit again non-binding uh the two parties AMA

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and the trade association that is party to to the agreement um to convening at least twice a year uh to in service of safety to cover really important safety topics and trends in mine safety. So I I intend to be fully engaged with the

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industry uh along the way. Well, I I applaud you um for your more than 20,000 inspections of 12,000 mines during the course of 2025 and uh don't have time to ask you about the plans for 2026, but I assume it'll be aggressive as well and

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help us in the whole mining situation. I see my time is expired. Uh I yield back. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. A vote has been called in the House and pursuant to the previous order, the chair declares the committee in recess subject to the call of the chair. We'll plan to reconvene

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promptly 10 minutes after the last votes in this series have been called. And with that, the committee now stands in recess. appreciate everybody's patience as the house was conducting voting. We will now reconvene our hearing today and we are

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going to go back to member questioning uh for the witness and with that I will recognize our ranking member for five minutes of questioning. >> Thank you chairman. Um assistant secretary Palmer I want a clear record

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on your past history with respect to the silica rule. Uh you were previously the executive vice president of Essential Minerals Association, a trade association of mining companies. Is that correct? >> That's correct.

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>> Did EMA comment on the proposed rule? >> Yes, EMA did. >> Uh please detail your participation in those comments. As as executive vice president, I oversaw the uh safety and health committee which is composed of the

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industrial hygienists and safety managers from uh all the member companies. >> Did you personally review, edit, approve or direct any part of those comments? >> Those comments were the product of a consensus from that flowed from all of

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those member companies. >> But did you have a direct contact with those comments before they were submitted? I participated in that process. Our president uh >> and so what was the core objection uh to the rule by the essential mineral association?

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>> Well, Congresswoman, um because the silica rule is currently subject to ongoing litigation and rulemaking, I cannot comment in in any detail at this time. Mhm. Um that is true because your previous employer essential minerals is

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also party to the litigation on the eighth circuit seeking to fate the seeker rule. Is that correct? >> That's not correct, Congresswoman. They are not party to that coalition challenge to the rule. >> They are not. >> They are not. >> Okay. Um exactly what role did you play

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in developing the EMA's uh position and regulatory agenda in this case? >> I've already described the role that I performed. Um but again because that rule is subject to ongoing litigation and rulemaking I cannot comment in detail. >> Okay. Well given your past activities

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related to the citical rule have you recused yourself from matters related to this rule? Yes or no? >> I follow all recusal uh directions from the designated agency ethics officer at the department of labor. >> Is that a yes or a no? I follow all

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recusals that the designated agency >> It's not that hard, sir, for you to say you have recused yourself or you haven't. >> I do not recuse myself. It's that the designated agency ethics officer directs me to recuse myself from certain matters and I I adhere to that strictly.

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>> Okay. Um, I I appreciate you finally responding to Committee Democrats uh oversight letter from last year on the agencies concerning uh decisions to proceed with multiple office closures. I want to focus on one decision in

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particular, which is your plan to close the district uh 12 office in Pineville, West Virginia. Are you aware of the history behind the creation of that office? >> Thank you for that question. Um, I was not sworn in until October 23rd of last year, so I did not participate in that

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process. Um, but I appreciate the opportunity to clarify. Um, in your opening statement, you suggested that dozens of offices closed when in fact it was only six, one of which was already >> I'm asking about a particular one. So, let me remind you, uh, District 12 was

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created after the Uber big branch mine disaster in 2010. an explosion that killed 29 minors. After this entirely preventable tragedy, IMSA recognized it

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needed to do more to protect minors. It created District 12 to split and overwhelmed district's workload and strengthen oversight capacity in southern West Virginia. Mr. Palmer, tell us plainly what you're going to do with

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District 12. Congresswoman, the there were no terminations of inspectors in that process as I understand it. That occurred last year with the closure of those all six of those offices and the inspectors who inspected mines uh are

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inspecting the same mines going forward. So uh so there's there's we have the same number of inspectors in that region. >> It seems from your response that you are relocating the offices or reassigning folks. What steps have you taken to

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ensure the same problems uncovered in the afteraction review of Uber big branch will not happen again after the offices have been closed. >> So the labor department made exceptions last year uh due to safety and health

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enforcement mission. Um no inspectors were terminated including those who were in their probationary period. Uh, the department also did not allow inspectors to opt into the second round of the designated, I'm sorry, deferred resignation program. Um, and we will be

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able to complete all of our statutoily required inspections this fiscal year just as we did last year, including in the region you're you're referring to. >> Thank you. Uh, next I will yield to myself for five minutes of questioning

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and want to discuss Mr. Palmer. Uh, the Trump administration's policies have gone a long way to encourage job growth, particularly in the mining industry, an area of focus of theirs, and the president has issued an executive order focusing on growing our domestic

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critical mineral and coal production. Can you please explain how EMHA fits in with that agenda? >> Yes, thank you for that question, Mr. Chairman, and I'd be happy to. Uh so the administration is has several different tracks where they are looking to

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incentivize more domestic mining. The reshoring of critical minerals as I referred to earlier. Um one is fast 41 status uh where there are now 15 projects that are have been assigned that status which makes more efficient

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the permitting process for new mines. Um but there are other efforts. Um I can't speak to the detail of EPA. it's it's uh not part of the Department of Labor, but I know that EPA uh in terms of the coal sector has taken some actions as well. Um the uh granting or uh um reviving the

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um um right of way to the Amler metals mine in Alaska is another example. So there are all these different uh policies and actions that are leading to the opening of new mines um reopening of old mines and additional mining at at

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current uh uh operations. And so EMS's role in that is wherever mining occurs, whether it's new or or pre-existing, um we are bound by the mine act to perform our EO1 inspections, uh at least two times a year at surface mines and at

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least four times a year at underground mines. Uh and we will continue to do that. Um as I alluded to in my opening testimony, um we do we do want to track where those new mines are reopening. And as I said, so many of those new critical minerals mines are are opening out west.

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And so I want to be sure as a assistant secretary that we are resourcing the agency so that we have the capabilities, the resources in those places as these new mines come online. >> Well, thank you for that answer. Uh as you are well aware, the expansion of

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critical minerals is an imperative for our country's national security. uh we have seen our adversaries try to use them as leverage against us and so making sure that EMA is keeping pace with that expansion uh is important in your role and I look forward to uh

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hearing from the administration about that expansion but also how AMA can continue to maintain worker safety uh as that expansion occurs. My next question uh relates to something you touched on already. So I don't know if there is any more to expand on, but uh there have

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been leaps in technology over the past decade that have been pretty astounding. Obviously the introduction of more AI capable technology. You mentioned drones. Uh can you just discuss how advancements are changing the mining industry and then also uh what that

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means for enforcement of laws under your jurisdiction? >> Right. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, for that question. So to me the most exciting um opportunity is through artificial intelligence right mine operators themselves are looking to adopt it but at I said in my opening

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testimony um we are working on uh predictive analytics. So taking decades and decades of very granular data that our inspectors have collected uh and deposited into our database uh using

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predictive analytics. Um we are developing dashboards. Some of those dashboards are intended for internal use and some are for external use. for internal use. When an inspector goes to to a mine in the future, um they will not just simply

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have a checklist of things that they need to to look at as an inspector as an inspector. Um but the predictive analytics will suggest to them that there are certain aspects of that mine um that they need to pay particular attention to. Um, in terms of external

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uses of these dashboards, um, ideally at some point we anticipate that a mine operator will be able to go on our website, log in with their their credentials, and look at a dashboard that predicts for their specific mine

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based on their inspection history, violation, citations, but broader uh metrics as well like the type of material mind, the region, the climate, the size of the mine. Um, and they will be able to look at predictive analytics

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pointing them to the most likely hazards that would occur in their mine. So, if you're a mine operator, this is will be extremely valuable in terms of focusing their internal safety uh protocols on the the places where an accident, an

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injury uh is most likely to occur. So, I'm I'm especially excited about the artificial intelligence capabilities we're developing. Great. Well, thank you for your response there. I do uh have some other questions about silica, which I think members on both sides are going to be asking about,

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which is a good topic that we consider moving forward. And uh also about training of our miners and what we can do to encourage training in that space. Uh with that, I will turn now next to Mr. Fine from Florida for his questions. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you

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for being here today, Mr. Palmer. Obviously, making sure that we can extract fossil fuels from our mines and other rare earth minerals safely is is incredibly important for the national security of this country. We can live in a fictional world where we assume windmills and solar panels can make everything work, but those of us who

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live in the real world understand that that's not a sustainable strategy for the United States. I have a few questions. Um, certain parts of the Biden administration's first rule on resperable silica aligned with the silica requirements of OSHA, but others do not. uh this can lead to confusion

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over what rules need to be followed if for example a construction company is performing work at a mining facility. Under your leadership, how do you envision EMS working with OSHA to create more clarity and consistency between rules that may deal with similar hazards?

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>> I appreciate that question, Congressman Fine. So, as I said earlier, I cannot comment at this time on the silica rule um in as much as it's pending in litigation and rulemaking, but I can say this. Um so the assistant secretary for OSHA Dave Keeling and I were nominated

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on the same day, confirmed on the same day, sworn in at the same time. Um and we have a great now pre-existing relationship. Um and we do consider OSHA and AMA to be sister agencies. Uh and so on any number of rules or specific risks

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or hazards, uh Dave and I talk all the time and I look forward to collaborating with him routinely throughout our tenurs. So, I appreciate that question. >> Well, thank you. Um, I want to ask you since you are new, I I'd like to ask you about any challenges you've encountered as you begin your tenure at at MEN set

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priorities. Were there any impediments from the Biden administration that hindered the agency? And if so, what were those impediments? >> Well, I appreciate that question, Congressman. There is one thing that I will highlight. Um, back in 2021, the Biden administration uh promulgated an

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executive order uh requiring all agencies to to further diversify their workforce. Um, and at EMA, what that meant was something called the bridge program that the Biden administration at EMS created. Um, they dispensed with the

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requirements that were that are in five uh pre-existing laws going back to the Coal Mine Safety Act of 1941. and including the n the mine act of 1977 uh requiring EMA to hire as new inspectors

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those with five years or more of mining experience and they dispensed with that and created what they called this bridge program. Well, they hired 54 such uh uh individuals and I'm pleased to say that 21 of them graduated so to speak to

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become full-blown inspectors performing the EO EO1 inspections I've been referring to. Unfortunately though, 33 of them did not. And so, uh, that's a what, a 61%, uh, dropout or attrition rate. And were

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it not for that, that illconceived program where they, uh, hired in individuals with no mining experience, um, we would have, uh, potentially 33 more inspectors to perform our inspections, which would relieve some of the pressure on the the rest of the inspector. So, so you're saying, so I

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understand that the Biden administration put hiring unqualified DEI hires ahead of making sure minors were safe. >> You could view it that way, Congressman. >> Okay. So, minors being killed is less important than having unqualified DEI hires. >> Well, as I say, they dispensed with that

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requirement that is in five separate laws going dating back to 1941. And uh uh I will say that during the first Trump term when we hired, we did require uh the the pre-existing experience, the prerequisite. >> So So other than sacrificing minors

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lives on the altar of DEI, are there any other internal policies still lingering from the Biden administration that you intend to address? >> Congressman, no. Nothing comes to mind apart from that. >> Well, I certainly appreciate you getting rid of that stupid policy and so I I yield back, Mr. Chairman.

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>> Thank you. And next we will go to ranking member of the full committee, Mr. Scott. >> Thank you. Thank you. Um, thank you, Mr. Chairman. Um, Mr. Secretary, there thing called impact inspections

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are important because they complement the mandatory twice a year and fouryear inspections. They're important because they target mines with s with with significant compliance issues for additional inspections. CNN has reported

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a 75% decrease in impact inspections for the first half of 2025 compared to the same period in 2024. Uh how many impact inspections did IMA complete in total for 2025? >> Congressman, I appreciate the question.

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I do not have that number close at hand. I will say that um we have continued what we call targeted inspections. I think it's really a question of nomenclature um that are akin to the impact inspections. I don't have that number off hand, but I could get that for you as a follow-up if you if you'd

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like. >> Has the number of these why did the number of impact inspections fall so precipitously? >> Again, Congressman, I I don't have that number close at hand. Um, we continue to do what we call targeted inspections,

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which are are akin to the the uh what used to be called impact inspections. >> And could you get the number of those that you have performed? >> Yep, sure. I can follow up with that. >> And your testimony doesn't mention impact inspection. So, if you could kind of talk about that and what you intend

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to do going forward. Uh since 2010, MIMA publicly posted notices and results of these kinds of inspections, but the agency appears to have stopped sharing that information publicly. Is that true? >> Uh to the best of my knowledge, we do not publish those under the current

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administration. >> Why is that? >> Uh Congressman, I will be happy to look into that. Um that I believe that that predates my uh confirmation and swearing in last year. I believe they were terminated last year. I I'll I'll check into that for you.

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>> Okay. Silica enforcement initiative that was launched in 2022 to target mines with dangerous levels of silica dust. Is IMA continuing to implement that initiative? >> Congressman, as I said earlier, uh because the silica rule is subject to

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ongoing litigation and rulemaking, I cannot comment further at this time. >> That's an initiative. That's not a rule. We continue to inspect mines as we have uh previously, including uh sampling for dust, including silica, if that's what

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you're asking. Yes, we haven't suspended our our normal uh inspection protocols. >> Well, do you know how many mines were inspected under the silica enforcement initiative in 2025? >> I do not have the number close at hand, but I can get that for you as well.

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>> Okay. Um um the incidence of progressive massive fibrosis um PMF is apparently increasing and is a higher proportion of black lung benefit claims.

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Why is that? >> Congressman, uh black lung benefits act falls under the jurisdiction of the office of worker compensation policy within the department of labor. EMS has no role in in black lung benefits and implementing that that law.

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>> Right. But you have a a role in preventing black lung disease. >> Oh, sure. So, if that's your question, Congressman, um the coal dust rule is still fully in effect. Uh we continue to sample for for that type of dust. Um,

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and if there's any concern there on my part, it's that uh I want to make sure that mine operators have continue to have access to the CPDMs, the continuous personal dust monitors. Um, the there's only one manufacturer as you may know.

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Uh, they submitted a new model for testing and certification to EMS. Our role in that process is to test for permissibility in underground coal mines. Um, now NYOSH has the responsibility for testing for performance to ensure that the device

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performs as designed and as it it's claimed. Um, and so I am in routine contact with NAOSH's senior leadership as you may have seen. I believe it was last week. They got the go-ahad to rehire uh staff for the division that

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performs that testing. And so I I Dr. John Howard who heads Nish as you know he and I together want to make sure that uh assuming this new device does you know get tested and certified and passes the the tests uh that that it is

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available to the mine operators. Can you comment on whether or not the staffing levels of sufficient to fulfill your responsibilities and whether or not the closures of field offices has had an adverse effect on your ability to get your job done?

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>> Congressman, uh we completed, as uh Chairman Wahberg said earlier, all of our statutoily mandated inspections in fiscal year 25. Uh we have the ability to to do likewise in fiscal year 2026. Um it every year, and this dates back at

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least to the the first Trump term, um every year we do some overtime. We have inspectors travel from different locations to help out other districts to make sure that those districts can can fulfill their their inspections. Um it does require overtime, which is cost. It

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it requires travel, which is cost, and it does put uh more of a burden on some of our inspectors to to do that that those additional inspections. But we we have the ability to fulfill that obligation this this fiscal year. >> Thank you, M. Mr. Chairman.

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>> Next, we will turn to Mr. Mesmer from Indiana. >> Uh thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Mr. Palmer, for being here today. Coal mining is an important part of my home district where we account for all active coal mines in the state of Indiana. My con constituents feel it deeply when ownerous federal federal

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restrictions shut our coal mines across the state, raising our energy bills and taking away critical jobs from Hoosiers. In December, the Trump administration ordered a temporary halt to the plant shutdowns of two coal b two coal burning power plants in Indiana. This announcement and President Trump's

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executive order to reinvigorate America's clean coal industry are examples of his administration commitment to lowering Americ's cost of living and restoring US global energy dominance. Mr. Palmer, can you tell us just how important domestic coal mining is to the United States?

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>> Thank you for that question, Congressman. Uh it's extremely important which is why the administration um promulgated executive orders last year um and has taken other actions uh to help reinvigorate the American coal industry. I mean it's when when the

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average American thinks about coal they think of I think one thing which is power generation but there are different types of coal used for different purposes. Um the two main ones of course are thermal coal for power generation but then there's also metallurgical coal which is used in in steel making. Um but

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there's also anththerite coal which my ancestors uh mined in northeast Pennsylvania in in prior generations. Um that's used in the electric arc furnace uh steel making green steel making as it's called. Um and that too is a potential source for critical minerals

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and rare earth elements. Um, between the first Trump term and my current tenure, I participated in something called core CM, which was a department is still a department of energy uh program for researching ways to extract critical minerals and rare earth elements from

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from coal and anthraite uh and uh some coal out in the Powder River basin uh contain a lot of such such uh minerals and elements um from coal, from mine tailings, from slag uh from the metal smelting process.

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uh fly ash, all sorts of waste materials, acid mine drainage. Uh and so coal is not just, you know, one monolithic uh uh commodity that is used for electricity generation. It's important to us for a lot of different reasons and a potential source for some

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of the critical minerals that we're the president is trying to reshore in back into the United States. So I appreciate that question. >> Thank you. Uh, in order to keep up with the demands of the coal industry, we we must ensure that the health and safety of miners is a top priority. However, the Biden era one-sizefits-all rule

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rules like the silica rule currently being litigated are not a solution. I appreciate your response to my letter and other members of of this committee asking for to consider amending the silica rule and confirming your administration's goal of working with mining operators. Um, I has a history of

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providing compliance guidance on final rules. So employers know how regulations know the regulations and how to protect their employees. Do you expect to issue a compliance guidance document along with any final rules? >> Absolutely, Congressman. Um so with any

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final rule um we depending on the magnitude of the rule um we will at least issue guidance documents but in many cases we'll hold public meetings uh across the country where operators can come and in person hear from EMS's enforcement our technical support group

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uh all the subject matter experts on how to comply with that uh given rule. So yes, absolutely. We we want to be as forthcoming as possible in helping operators comply with any rule that we might we might promulgate. >> Thank you. Will MHA also ensure that inspectors are fully briefed on these

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guidance documents so they are well equipped to help employers protect their employees? >> Absolutely, Congressman. U so as you probably know, we have the Mine Health and Safety Academy in Beckley, West Virginia. Um and that's where we do our training. It's not just for entry level

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inspectors and and such. We have all sorts of training down there and that's where we would typically educate our uh and a lot of it is virtual as well. Uh educate our inspectorate um in terms of any given new rule on how it works and how to uh help the operators to comply

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with that rule. >> Well, thank you. I appreciate your responses and I yield back the remainder of my time. >> Thank you. Next, we'll go to Mr. Rothman from Wisconsin. >> Thank you. I think a lot of people when you first bring up mining in this uh

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coal mining are immediately reminded of a comment of a uh a person uh running for presidency in this country. We're going to put a lot of coal miners and coal companies out of business. Do you remember that quote? It's kind of well publicized at the time.

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>> I do, Congressman. >> Yeah. The thing that scares me about it is she represented a lot of people who apparently are just instinctively anti-coal. Uh do you feel with your within your agency that mindset exists

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among any of the regulators or anybody put together regulations? Do you see that of some of the u people you work with? >> No, Congressman, I don't. Um I during the first term serving as deputy assistant secretary developed great

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relationships with our career staff. Uh those carry over into this administration. Um they're they're extremely professional. Um we have some of the best subject matter experts on all sorts of aspects of mining. Um roof control, ventilation control, mine

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rescue, uh the construction of impoundments, dams and things. So no, I I enjoy working with them. I have great relationships with them. And so I actually do not see that as a as an impediment. >> I'm glad to hear it. Uh could you comment a little bit about

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what you think the role of coal is in future American energy policy? Do we have the ability to expand the use of coal over say what it's been the last 10 years? Well, Congressman,

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the potential for future additional coal mining depends on policies across a lot of different agencies. Um, from EMH's perspective, it really is a matter of responding where through whatever policies and actions the administration

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takes to the degree that there is additional coal mining, then we must respond and make sure we're inspect. >> I guess I'll put it this way. Uh, do you feel we're in a position that if on a national level or a state level they're going to build more coal fired plants

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that we have the ability to extract more coal out of out of the coal mines and do it safely? >> Oh, we we do have the ability to extract more coal. The deposits exist, the technology exists, the operators are there. As long as it's profitable, we they will. Um, and yes, I'm confident

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that EMS has the staffing, the expertise, and the will to every fiscal year fulfill our statutory obligations under the mine act. So, yes, absolutely. I'm confident of that. >> Okay. I want to flag for you an issue related to EPA's integrated risk

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information system assess assessments. Okay. I know Iris falls squarely under the EPA's guidance, but I'm concerned about its impact on the mining operations in Wisconsin. And you're familiar, we have some minds in Wisconsin. Uh the Iris assessment failed

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to address unresolved concerns before uh final version was released. And as the result, it raises questions about its scientific uh credibility. The contents of this assessment and the resulting actions from it uh could have an an impact on Wisconsin miners. Can you

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commit to working with my staff and our local state stakeholders to understand how this issue could impact continuing investment or job retention in Wisconsin? >> I I do, Congressman. If I'm I'm not intimately familiar with uh the Iris study, but I understand it pertains to

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arsenic and in in terms of mine safety and health. Um, if at a mine, a given mine, there is possibly the possibility of an overexposure to arsenic, we would send our specialists, our industrial hygienists out to collect a sample, put

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it through the lab, and if they identify an overexposure, they would go out and assist the mine with remediation. Um, I will say that, uh, there hasn't been an overexposure of arsenic in uh, EMS's records for at least the last 35 years. So, at this point, it it doesn't appear

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to be a hazard in the minds, but I do commit to working with your staff on this issue. >> Thanks. Your written testimony illustrates ways you seek to modernize uh MSHA, including modernizing agency regulations. Could you share with us policies that

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you're considering for potential regulatory or deregulatory action? >> Oh, yes, Congressman. So it predates my tenure, but um last year, early last year, the president um signed issued three executive orders that collectively

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uh required certain agencies to a lot of agencies to um promulgate deregulatory uh uh initiatives. Um again, that predates me, but uh between June and July of last year, AMA did publish 19 uh

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different regulatory items that all of which are classified as deregulatory. those are still in the pipeline. Um, we will continue on those 19 initiatives. Um, and in doing so, I pledge to fully adhere to the Administrative Procedure Act of 1946, which lays out that

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process. And that process includes a period of certain duration, 30, 60, 90 days, whatever, where uh there's a public comment period uh and any stakeholder can submit a comment to the the record. Um

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and then once that comment period ends, it's uh the agency is obligated to analyze all of those comments and reflect those comments in the final rule. So those 19 deregulatory uh items are still in the pipeline. I can't

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comment on details because they are ongoing rulemaking, but I can tell you that they are continuing forward. >> Well, thank you, Mr. Mr. Assistant Secretary. I'm glad you came over here today and you're exactly the type of person uh we need uh over there to be a

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fair broker when it comes to mining. >> Well, thank you, sir. >> Thank you. And our final set of questions come from Mr. Molen of Guam. >> Mr. Chairman and ranking member, thank you for allowing me to wave on to the subcommittee today. And it's good to be

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back. Mr. Palmer, uh thanks for coming today. and I want to say congratulations on your confirmation and thank you again for the work you did with me and my team while you were senior adviser for congressional affairs. Thank you so much and I'm looking forward to working with

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you in in your new position as well. So Mr. Palmer. In 2024, a report from the Department of Labor Office of the Inspector General found that uh EMA failed to sufficiently identify its own jurisdictions and had

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never conducted ma mandatory mine inspections in three US Pacific territories. So, how are you making sure completes these inspections and fulfills its mandates? Thank you, Congressman, for that

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question. Um, I'm I'm familiar with that November 2024 uh memo uh to the Biden administration. And I can tell you this that um so last year uh EMA sent an inspector to all three of the territories in the Pacific to inventory

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the mines that are there. uh they inventoried 17 mines and subsequently senior officials I know met with your office and offices for the other two uh territories. As I sit here today, our head of enforcement and our assistant district

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manager from our Birmingham, Alabama office are in the territories. They are meeting with government officials and mine operators to talk about the process going forward. Next week, we're sending inspectors over and they're going to perform compliance assistance visits

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because these are these are first inspections for your mines. They're going to go out and walk each mine through an EO1 full uh statutory inspection, but without issuing any citations or violations. um at some

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point in the future they will return and perform uh the one of the actual EO1 inspections and it'll be the real inspection with actual violations and citations. But the whole idea again is to orient your your mine operators and make sure they understand how the

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process works uh so that when EMS shows up unannounced uh they'll be prepared to to get through an inspection um hopefully with very few citations and violations. That that's very helpful taking that approach. I'd like to work with you on

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this so we can help the island better understand what we need for the safeguard and the protection of the community and what we need for our nation as well. >> Absolutely, Congressman. And if you have any feedback that you get back home, uh please do share that with us uh for better or for worse because we want to

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make sure this this uh occurs as efficiently and effectively as possible. So thank you for that. >> You're welcome. Just one other question. Now when many people think about the mining industry and miners they think about coal mining but coal mining is just the tip of the iceberg compared to

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metal nonmetal mines and a variety of above ground mining operations. How are you taking a different approach to strategies for protecting miners in different sectors of the industry and what factors are you taking into

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account as you develop these strategies? Yes, thank you for that follow-up question. So uh back during the first Trump administration, the assistant secretary Dave Zatzeslo I I I think you could call it his signal achievement was creating something called one where

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previously uh within the enforcement division there were two separate verticals. One was for coal safety and health. The other was for metal non-metal. And you're right for every coal mine there are uh a dozen metal non-metal mines. And to your your your

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point on on surface versus underground, for every underground mine, there are two dozen 24 surface mines. Um, and so I'll give you a good example pertaining to your territory. As I mentioned that the assistant district manager from the Birmingham, Alabama office is with our

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head of enforcement uh in the territories right now. Well, the reason he's there is because the inspectors we're going to send to do those compliance assistance visits and the subsequent full inspections are from our Puerto Rico office. Um, they are most

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familiar with, most expert in the types of mines, all surface mines in the territories, right? Um, that that you have in your territories. And so we're sending the ones who are most expert. So, so it's it's a situational thing. it's tailoring our inspections or

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compliance assistance visits to the type of mine. Um, and yes, surface mines are are quite different than underground mines and we want to acknowledge that even though now the enforcement division is one, you know, unified uh unit. >> Thank you for the explanation. Welcome

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aboard. Looking forward to working with you. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. >> Thank you. That concludes questioning and we will now move to closing remarks. I would like to recognize the ranking member for her closing statement. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Uh once again,

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thank you, Assistant Secretary Palmer, for joining us today. The important of the mine safety and health administration's role is protecting the lives of miners cannot be overstated. Black lung disease caused by inhalation

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of coal and silica dust is increasingly affecting younger and younger miners. The Biden administration saw this as an imminent danger and took steps to protect miners from silica exposure through common sense safety standards.

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Unfortunately, instead of enforcing the Biden era rule, the Trump administration has given mining executives a pass to put miners in harm's way without proper protection against silica exposure and

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the administration's chaotic firing of staff at EMA and NHA is efforts to close dozens of regional EMA offices have undermined decades

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of work, preventing plague lung, avoiding workplace disasters, and saving workers lives. IMSA's work quite literally can mean life or death for tens of thousands of minors. That is why Congress must take action to hold IMSA

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accountable and ensure its enforcedment well researched safety regulations and conducts regulatory inspections because miners deserve to come home at the end of the day safe, healthy, and well- paid.

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Thank you once again for joining us today, Assistant Secretary Palmer. I look forward to continuing our conversation and discussing more ways that we can keep minors safe on the job. I would like uh to request unanimous

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consent to enter into the record a regulatory timeline of um IMSA's silica standards. A timeline outlining decades of expert recommendations on this

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challenil. Uh a letter from the National Coalition of Black Lung and Respiratory Disease Clinics. um and a letter from Appalisian Citizens Law Center and Applesian Voices. >> Without objection.

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>> Thank you and I yield back. >> Thank you, Mr. Assistant Secretary for joining us today. Uh your testimony has been very helpful for those of us members of the committee and we appreciate you sharing your vision for how EMHA can achieve its goal of keeping

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America's miners safe and healthy. With advancements in technology and this administration's emphasis on domestic resource production and energy security, we're very likely at a hinge moment in this industry. And we look forward to seeing mining thrive once again all across our country uh to help not only

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uh our economy but also national security. By promoting a strong safety culture, EMA helps mines operate more reliably, protects workers rights, and reinforces public trust in the mining industry. So we support your efforts as

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you achieve strive to keep miners safe and productive. Again, I'd like to thank you for joining us here today. It's been over six years since an assistant secretary of MIA has come before the committee and it's an important part of our work on the workforce protection subcommittee. I'd like to thank you

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again and without objection, there uh being no further business before the committee, this subcommittee stands adjourned. >> Thank you, Mr. Chairman.