I was out three times. Call the meeting to order. May we have a re meeting statement, please? Notice the regular meeting was provided to the public in the press on January 19th. Adequate notice of this regulation was
provided to the public and the press on January 1982 and was posted at the municipal code in accordance with the open public meetings act NJS104-7. Thank you. All the audience please rise and
join me in the pledge to the flag. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands one nation with liberty and justice for all.
Roll call here. Council member Dadetto. Council member Higgins here. Council member Sparta President. Council President Rudo here. Good evening. We are going to have a presentation
by the members of the uh the MUA director and the uh uh I'm pleased to ask them to give us their their uh comments as to the past year's
activity. ities. This is required by by uh the resolution that started the MUA uh that it be provide the council with a written report and also an oral report.
Thank you. Now I can't hear you. adjusted those on. Um, so like you mentioned, we come here once a year just to give you a rundown of the things that have gone over in the
past year. Uh, last year we came and presented to the council um, you know, mini funding project. That was really what we focused on last year when we answered a bunch of questions about EU calculations etc. Uh this year we are going to touch base again on that federal funding um for the community
project funding. We are further along now. So just keeping up on that and a couple of other things. I'm just going to jump right in. Um so in 2024 uh that was when the large part of the construction for pump station 2 um was done at the end of 2024. We had just about completed it. We just had one
small checklist item that had to do with our senses um which monitors our uh everything, our pumps, our levels, etc. So, that was just the one checklist item that hadn't gotten done by the end of 2024. It is complete now. So, uh pump station 2 will be closed out with the
New Jersey Infrastructure Bank. That's my bank. Anyone know that is um and we'll be permanently financing that when they go out to bonds hopefully this fall. It's usually they do it twice a year. uh once it is permanently financed, we'll get a debt service schedule uh from I bank and then that
will be part of Mountain Creek's um obligation to the township in the anyway on an annual basis. Um just an update on Mountain Creek, they have been paying again on time in January every single year. So um that's good. Uh the financials for 2024,
so the budget last year was 3.625 million. Uh the MUA ended out um with additional $250,000 added to their net position. Uh they used an additional amount because of that in to anticipate in this year's budget um as a revenue item. So the budget was up slightly, but
we still kept rates at a 0% increase. 2024 there was a 1% increase, but for 2025 there's a 0% increase. Um the MUA is anticipating in 2025 the 55 um building unit and Omega to be completed. So for the 2026 budget, we're looking
forward to add that additional 30 EDUs, about 33 EDUs um to the budget to help with those numbers um and hopefully maybe avoid another rate increase as well. Updates on the sewer service area mapping. Uh so the engineer who's handling the sewer service area
expansion for the township. Um and if anyone has questions, there's maps on the township website that has what the expanded area is, but I did provide them to council tonight, so it'll probably be in the minutes. um that has been submitted to the county. Um we've submitted we've answered all their comments so far. So we'll be touching
base actually next week or later this week um with the county to do a weekly update with them to find out where we are. The next steps with the sewer service area expansion approval would be a county meeting approval for their um small advisory committee. And then that advisory committee advises the county
commissioners to approve um the updated sewer service area map and then that would be sent to the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection who then give us the final approval process or final approval for um the expanded sewer service area. When is
the small meeting? The advisory committee meeting. It's the first uh week in June. So that's why we want to follow up with them. They've had our, as you know, they've had our application for a very long time. Yeah. Um unfortunately, the county had some staffing issues when we submitted our
application. So it went probably about five or six months without really being in depthly looked at. But we have been in contact with them. We did get back to their comments finally. We did um update, you know, update and address their comments. um in the past few weeks. So, we're hoping that this can move along and beyond the gym meeting.
That would be the goal. Thank you. Um so, the big one that I wanted to address tonight is again what we discussed uh last last year was the updates on the community funding project. That's at 3 almost 5 million that we received from Congress. Uh so,
it's a long process because we're dealing with the feds. Um we're dealing with the EPA. So we did submit a categor categorical exclusion document to the um EPA that's just to ensure that we don't um there where the areas for new piper
going in um are not going to have environmental um detrimental environmental tax. So we had to do this document. We had our engineers um prepare that and send that to them. We're also working I'm working with the engineers um on the work plan and budget narrative um to send over to the EPA as
well. BA is actually very very responsive um in comparison to others that I've dealt with. So, um that has been positive. So, we're just working through that. There's just a lot of red tape because it's federal money. Um but once that goes through, we're looking forward
to hopefully doing um expanded bid specs, etc. This fall, hopefully going out to bid, if not in the fall, in the winter. Um we did provide in this document uh the four areas that we had had um agreement on. We had some
occultations between uh the MUA and the township. The mayor um council president was in that meeting that we had with our engineers to go over um believe there were seven or eight locations that we were thinking of putting pipe in the ground. Uh the idea here was really to connect properties obviously that are
already in the sewer service area. That was what the project money was for. It's not for expanded areas. um but to meet areas where if it wasn't for federal funding, we would not be able to afford it. Right? So, the idea is to use the federal funding for connections that are needed in order to expand. Um but it
wouldn't really be feasible to do that if we didn't have those federal funds. So, the four locations we chose, um I'm just going to say what they are, but then I can give a kind of general idea of where they are to the public since I don't have to run them. Um the first one was A2. So, it is a location down Route
94 going north. um past Vernon Crossing Road up the hill towards um Malibu Drive. Uh Malibu Drive is part of the expanded um sewer service area which would be by the D. Uh that is the largest um cost portion of this
community funding project. It's $1.5 million. The reason for that is because it's going uphill. Um it's gravity fed coming down, but obviously it's going uphill. It's going over um a stream. So, it's going to need a pump station and we're going to have to connect it to the existing force main that's already in on
um so it would only provide seven lateral connections actual connections. Sorry, seven seven lateral connections in town center. Um again, it's more you know that would not be feasible for one individual developer to do. That's a large amount of money. Um so the idea
would be to use the federal funding for that. Um but it would uh again bring in those additional connections on Malibu Drive. I believe it's around between I want to say 50 and 70 additional connections going up that road into that
area. Um the second area is B which is um the area across so on the opposite side of Route 94. So when the sewers were put in only um the one side of Route 94 was done like by Dunkin Donuts um H&H Plaza Wings, right? Um so this
would be to connect the opposite side of Route 92. So that estimate is $650,000. It would include 14 lateral connections on Route 94. Um, and again, those are all in town center properties and it would be necessary to do that expansion if the um township decided to expand
into the uh Gibians and Odell neighborhood behind there. The next area estimated construction cost is 900,000. That's E. Again, that's in your packet. Um, so that would be on Route 94 right adjacent to Mountain Creek. So, if you're going
uh southbound on 94, it's right about um where Cumulus Nimbus Drive, that development is um up towards Mal Creek. Um so, that would be $900,000. So, that connection is needed for any redevelopment that's done at Northwoods. Um as well as the residential area of uh
Cumulus and Nimbus. Um those are also in the expanded uh sewer service areas with the D. And then the final area, the estimated construction cost is 1.4 million. That's area G and that's located along the section of Route 94 um
in town center. So it runs basically from M Baldwin Drive just down the road a little bit. It doesn't fully connect to Nimbus that is needed in order to do any um connections in the Malta area. Um and
that would allow for 36 lateral connections in that area. But along 94, it would include 12 lateral connections and a pump station to pump back to pump station one. There's any questions? Members of the council have any
questions? No. Are we in a position to state? Are you in a position to state that all of the uh money that has been received uh from grants with uh time-sensitive
placements has been uh met in terms of assigning assigning uh areas that are going to be developed or you know included in the uh construction area. Yep. Okay. So, we're
on schedules. No problem. And I know another issue that I frequently your comments about. We are I say we as part of the township that the
MUA stands on its own two feet. It operates with no assists from the council or I'm sorry, the township. and um andor uh any outside funding. You mean financial aid? Yep. Financial aid.
It's correct. Okay. So, you're financially independent. Great. Sounds good. What do we look like in terms of total number of hookups? Are you talking about currently or through? So, um currently we have about
1700 um connections. Um future D expanded area. It's about another 800 plus. Those are just connections. So that includes properties um that would be residential or um developed town
center, whatever that could be. Various uses. How many employees are in the MUA? Five. Five full-time? No. How many full-time? How many part-time? There is one full-time employee. One full-time. Okay.
And just a quick description. What's an average day like? What goes on? What uh what duties for the one full-time employee? The one full time. So, he's a he's a sewer repairer. So, um that would be the title. Um and the job duties include
visiting all the pump stations, all the lift stations. Um what a sec. Um not sifting. What am I trying to say? Um there's some sludge scooping that goes on. Skimming skimming. Thank you. the pre- removal.
Yes. A lot of that, you know, checking the pumps, making sure the pumps are functioning, um checking numbers on the system. They also, um, you know, they also address um any issues if there's any uh alarms that go off on the senses. They're going to address those things
first. Good. Thank you. The Northwoods property, is that part of the expansion or is that automatically because of redevelopment? That's um in I believe that's in Mountain Creek's area. It's in Mountain Creek's area already.
I'm not sure though. I I would have to check to see because I think it's in a red development zone. I think they would do a redevelopment agreement, but I'm not sure if that would be the direction the Mountain Creek would go or not. Miss Ber, you good? Okay. Thank you very
much. Pleasure to hear from you. And uh good news is always appreciated. It'll be great news when the county says go ahead. I'm with you on that. Y even better when the
state says go ahead. See you next year. Next item on the agenda is a discussion item. Um, this was the main discussion.
This is uh this was brought about by an issue that um failed on a council vote the last meeting regarding a position. Um that position was
designated was going to be an addition to a a union uh recognition. The individual which norm who normally would have been uh discussed under a rice
notice has requested that this particular uh issue be discussed in public and actually we're willing to accommodate that request. I think the mayor has some
comments on that. You'd like to proceed. Thank you, Council President. Um, yeah, I was a little kind of shocked about the vote uh that happened last week. Um, and
when, like I said, when you see everything that goes on downstairs, uh, and you see how successful our senior center is, it's it's it's not because of uh, money or anything. It's it's really is it's it's
about the leadership. Uh Jane is is somebody who really brings it to the table and as you can see from this audience here um they're they're all here in support for her. Um this is not
just um to give out food. She the things that she does daytoday uh just some of her responsibilities. She oversees daily functions of the Vernon uh senior center county nutrition site ensuring all rules, regulations,
guidelines and best practices are adhered to for Vernon Township, Sussex County Department of Health, Sussex County Division of Senior Services and the state of New Jersey. Superfly senior uh center staff and kitchen staff maintain weekly schedule of staff to
ensure proper this is also part of what Michelle does as well with that with some of the managing part of it. Uh but but it includes the nutrition site lunch program donations balance and and submit monthly finance reports. Um it maintains
a list of insurance certificates for the organizations using any township facilities. uh assists recreation department as needed. Oversees community garden members and leison on to uh to the garden committee. Leon for the
senior advisory board receipt and and recordable monies for recreation senior sorry just some of the other just to add on some of the other things that she does dayto day. Um if you have ever come down the senior center you'll see she's
non-stop. She runs she runs circles. She's a little older than me, but she'll run circles around me as well. Um she's highly respected in in uh in Vernon Township. She's highly respected and seniors. Um Michelle came
to me publicly, I think it was several months ago, um raised a concern about Jane's salary, which was grossly underpaid. Um, like I said, everything is always by a case-byase situation. Not
every employee, and there's been employees that been turned out, uh, but not every employee, uh, gets that increase above what, well, some of them are obviously it's contractual, but but certain other ones, um, you can make adjustments based
on what they what they bring to the table, um, and what they do dayto day. And Jane was one. Jane, let me explain about some of our and I have her review here. It was done in uh January 8th,
2025. Jane is not a marginal performance. She's not effective. She she's rated as outstanding, which is the top. Now, this is actually this was this didn't happen last week. This is actually on January 8th. Her performance it shows. It shows
in the senior center. It shows with the people that show up. I just need the seniors to step it up a little bit with the Olympics this year. What do you say, guys? I'll be there watching and moving these guys on. So, they took second last year. But anyway, uh it just it it
really shows in in her work. Um I don't know what happened back in 2017 uh why she wasn't put into the union. Guys, I'm not big on unions, but this is something
that we're not going to have no choice. It's going to happen whether we like it or not. Like I said, I'm not we're not sitting here saying I'm pro union and I'm not. But let's let me make that clear. But she should have the right. I
don't see how she's not a department head. I don't see how she could be denied being in that union. Uh, it is my highly recommendation that you pass this through. I don't ask I've always been honest, always been straight with you
guys. Um, I I go I see Howie back there, he'll tell you. I come over there and I kick the tires. You know, I I look to save a dollar everywhere possible. And And this is some place this is something that we we do not want to
uh to skimp on. And I think she's she's worth every every dollar. It's um truly is. So I don't know if you have anything you want to add, if the council has anything they want to discuss. Like I said, this is something
that definitely um at least said I don't know why she wasn't put union. Um I can throw the show administration on the bus if I want, but it doesn't solve anything. Um here we are now, right? this is this something that was uh it
raised the flag. It's something that I have to I have to deal with like other issues as well. So I always say it's the problems of the past that affect us today and apparently it must it's causing a a slight bit of an issue
and I fear that the morale is lowered if it I think this affected the morale a little bit and I'm hoping that the that that we can change that and continue on being a successful
senior center and we that we have it and we are the largest municipality in Sussex County and we lead by we we lead in that in that responsibility and and we are uh we are known for having one of
the the greatest senior centers um and we definitely I want to say it's number one right has one we number one but we are um we do and um that's that's all I have if anyone has anything else they
want to you make a comment from here? Not yet. Not yet. Not yet. No. This is a hearing that normally would have been handled in private at the request of the employee. It's being
done in public, but we it's basically there's no public comment on it. Um Tina, do you want to answer? Does the council have anything? Do you have anything to say? Questions? Yeah, I'll make a comment. I'm the one who voted against it and I and the whole
point of voting against it has been missed. You're wrong, Mr. Mayor. I didn't vote no because of the lady that has this job. I think we met probably one time 20 years ago when my wife was on the ambulance squad somehow. That was
it. And it was a great impression then. I see a lot of people who are here. I see I'm a senior myself. I'm 77 years old. And I I get it. This has nothing to do with the performance with the needs with the camaraderie. It has to do with
the process and the procedure of a union and a non-union person becoming a union uh employee at the will of a whim. That's what it's about. And when I asked the question, why was this on the agenda? Because the
union wants it on the agenda. Well, good for the union. it I it doesn't make sense to me as a is a person a supervisor if they're a supervisor then they're not eligible to be in the union if they're eligible to be union at a whim and somebody says I want to join
the union and I get a nice raise then that's due to the fact that a uh a contract was agreed to last year between the municipality and the union that eliminated various steps that when a person joins a union they started step one two three four and go to wherever
ever the maximum is like on the school board there's 15ear steps it used to be 20 it's now 15 I believe in our police department you hit the top at five so in the UAW it's now five so it's a transfer from a current non-UN position to a
union position is going to eliminate three steps because the people who negotiated the contract in the town said that we can't retain people and we can't hire new people that was the rationale of eliminating these various steps and
and so that that move created a position where you can jump right in to step four, I believe it is. So that's why I voted no. Not because the person I understand, I've heard all good things and it has nothing to do with the person
or the services that you're getting. It has to do with principle and procedure. And I like to stand on that. And even even on the normal events that take place here, I'm the guys asking a lot of questions because this is my second year
on the board now and I really don't understand a lot of the way things get done. They're outside of a common sense normally accepted method and that's why I ask a lot of questions. So I'm standing on principle on on what I just explained as opposed to the person. I
love the program. I I I hear all good things. it. The program is not going to change, but something has to change between, you know, the the mentality of people that run the town and a union. And if I lose, I lose. That's okay. And
I've heard people state here on the council and our attorney that uh various decisions might be made beyond my uh vote, but I'd let them I'll let them go and we'll we'll go forward and we'll
we'll get that ruling. If the ruling is against by no vote, so be it. And the promotion or the change to the union will take place. That that could happen. But uh there's a right and wrong way in my mind. That's why I was elected. Not
up here to rubber stamp anything. And I know you're disappointed you all came out tonight, but uh you know, government is government and I do have the right. And there was another person who voted no. They're just not here tonight. That was my rationale. And by the mayor asking me,
"Come on down and see what this person does every day." It has nothing to do with anything. This is not about the person or their procedure. It's about what I just explained to you. That that issue can be addressed with the union and we can we can have that. But what let's not penalize the employee because
nobody's penalizing that. There's nobody penalizing. If you thought that this employee was the best employee in the entire town, you would have taken all the money and said, "Here's your raise." you would have given a maximum plus more and and you probably did the right thing by hopefully gave her a raise whenever
when she was up for review. But that that has totally nothing to do with the union non-union contract and uh the principle I'm standing on said Bill we are a civil service municipality.
Um, she's, like I said, whether we we could sit here and debate about the process and the union and the problem. We can debate that all day. In the end, she's a civil service employee. She's she's has that right to be in the
union. Um, and without it going into that's where it will end up, it's going to cost the township a lot more money. Like I said, it'll bring the morale down
and uh I think it's something to to avoid and it's my recommendation that she enters into the union as discussed and you mentioned that you are
the voice of the people. There's your voice. Please act accordingly. Thank you. Anyone else wishing to on it? I I do have a quick comment.
Um I um I did vote to support the resolution. However, I did make some comments um about the the union expanding and I I think as admin as part of the governing body um the relationship between administration and
the governing body and the union should always be respectful but slightly adversarial because we both are coming from um different points of view when issues like this come up and that's what we're supposed to do where we both are
tasked with different responsib responsibilities. The union is tasked with um ensuring that their members get um the best pay possible, work conditions, benefits, time off, things like that. The administration, the
council tasked with managing a budget, representing the taxpayer. So, um I would never consider being an enemy of the union, but definitely respectfully adversarial, and that's how they would probably view us, too. And I think that's fair. Um, and we respect our
employees always. This particular position, um, for whatever reason, was not in there. We did make some comments about, um, adding it, like it or not, as a steward of the township's
budget and not considering the path and the legal costs that voting this down would represent to our taxpayers, I think is shortsighted. Um, again, no one is is discounting this
employees hard work and dedication. I've witnessed it myself many times. Um, or the value of her work. Um, you're probably very accurate that she was underpaid. I don't know exactly the salary. I, you know, I tried not to
focus on that. But as stewards of our budget and looking at potential litigation and the costs there, I think that's important to consider because if you're representing the taxpayer, that's also representing the taxpayer. And I understand not liking that bill, but
that's how it is. So by not supporting this resolution and not supporting this change and this position being added to the union, we will be costing our taxpayers more because the change will occur. It will
happen to some retroactive date. I don't know what. Um that will be decided by the courts and then we will also have legal fees. So we're really not being the best steward of the finances if we don't approve that. And those are my comments.
It was a statement made previously by the mayor that uh I think it was by the mayor but uh managers are excluded from the union contract. Managers are under the opices of the mayor's office and uh the title of this position is site
manager. So that would be a question to ask is uh this a management position. Apparently it is. If you would look in the um civil service description, um I wouldn't necessarily consider it a management position. Um there's also
very clear as far as going into union and not going into union. The way it's I've always had it explained is that um a manager has the ability to have input in the hiring and firing of an employee. Um they also have like confident
confidential information which would usually relate to that sort of job. um performance and appraisals of other employees and this employee does not have that. She's management managing the facility, not the Yes, correct. And um this the shared service agreement that
the township counts with the county to provide services to the seniors as a nutrition site um requires that position to be held. She is not a noted department head. Correct. Correct. and we received $27,000 uh a year for from the county
for the program. She started this position um almost 13 years ago as a part-time person and that's why she wasn't in the union back then. So when she was rolled over to a full-time position in that, it should
have been included all those years back in the actual contract and it never was. So last year um when they were going through the new contract, her position wasn't brought up
at that point until actually unfortunately after the contract was signed and agreed upon and that's when it was brought that she should have been put in there. Now if
when we were going through that contract and the union realized that that position should have been in there all those time it would have been placed into the contract when we were negotiating for it. Obviously it didn't happen and then
it was brought to the attention with her salary actually being less than new people coming in and being hired at a lower you know at a lower step than she actually is. So adding her into the
contract was part of, you know, getting her to where she should be and being a part of the union, which she should have been several years ago when she went from part-time to full-time. Can I also I don't want to correct you, but I I just want to um
clarify something because it was mentioned earlier by um Councilman Higgins. So she it's not a step that she's going to, right? It's a level. So I think there's a lot of misunderstanding and a lot of miscommunication about um the union contract and how it works as far as levels and steps. So in this uh
resolution it says level four that is not a step four that is a level four. So the levels each level has specific job titles that are um civil service titles and those were established obviously a very long time ago before any of us here um when the union was brought here. uh
in comparison what what administration did was they looked at the job duties of this nutrition site manager and sat down with the union and negotiated on what that level what that level would be in comparison to what the other job titles are in the other levels are. So you had mentioned earlier about a step a level
one um and removing steps from level one that that has absolutely no effect on this job title because this is a level four. So there's still eight there's still eight steps in a level four. I just want to be clear. It's not a step, it's a level. What's the difference before? If this
position, if this discussion took place before the new contract was agreed upon, what would the difference be? We answered this at the last meeting and there is no difference. It would still be a level four at the same amount of money. The levels changed when the
contract was approved. That's what That's right. No, no, you're talking about steps. You're talking about steps. I'm asking and you're misunderstanding and misrepresenting answer the whole contract new contract. What would the difference be if it was under the old
versus the new? I'm trying to remember what the actual percentage was between I would have to look at the actual um salary guide, but it's just the difference between a level four salary guide and a level four salary guide between 2024 and 2025. Is it just a
percentage of the increase that's Yeah. So let's say it was a 3%. I I don't know what that I don't remember what that was, but that would be what the increase was between a level four and a level and a level four. So it's coincidence that person was in this job for all these years and was
just it it was a revelation that the union is there should have always been in the union and it just happened that it was now at this time. That's that's your explanation. Yes. Okay. Is that your explanation? Yes. Is the letter from the No, I've asked other question because there's more to this than that.
Going back two months ago, I asked a question about people because Tanda just said civil service. I asked question about three people, one part-time transfer, other people were hired. Were they posted at civil service? The answer was, and you all looked at each other
and the answer was yes. A a resident opered that answer and the answer came from Marcy and that person who in the public said could I want you to be aware that I asked this question were they ever posted and the answer
came back over the last year the only civil service postings that were done by this municipality was the police department there were no other civil service. So what am I getting when I ask an answer or a question? Um, so like we explained before the last time you asked
this about it being posted or not. Uh, we follow civil service guidelines and we comply with what civil service requires us to comply with. So what happens is for example, I'm just going to use the zoning officer as an example because we did a temporary or an appointment for that, right? Um, so the
way it works is we would do a provisional appointment for that position or a provisional promotion. However civil service sees that, there's different things that they different um levels. I don't really know. I always plan um in civil service. So when you do
that, it triggers civil service to send us a posting to post. Now that posting could be open to everybody in the state of New Jersey. Um it could be who could qualify for that. It could be open to just people that are that are in this building. Um it depends on what type of
position it is, what what class code it is, um the job duties of that position, but that's all in line with civil service. So everything has been sent to civil service. We can't control that. It might take civil service six months to send us a
posting, but when we get that posting, it is posted in compliance with civil service guidelines. We can't post something without them sending us a posting to be posted. So, it's possible. So, basically, hire someone because, you know, it's going to take five or six months without going
through the civil service. That's that's basically we still have to follow civil civil service guidelines. So it would be an appointment in civil service provisional and then they would contact administration with a posting to be posted and that individual has to apply for that job. Even if they're sitting in
a proision provisional position, they still have to apply for that job during that posted period. They might have to have a test for it. They might have to show all their qualifications and standard that they can meet all the educational requirements or whatever that is for that posting. And then they
would be whatever whatever that goes. I don't know if it's like an award or if it's like a hiring and then it's and then they move from provisional to permanent position. So why would the answer to the Oprah request be there were no postings? Because you didn't get it from civil service yet. We're waiting
on civil service. We can't force civil service to give us a posting as soon as we request it. We request it, then they agree to it, and then they send it to us whenever they want to.
We're we've been waiting since the middle of March for this other posting and we can't post it because we have not received it from civil service yet. The open request is there were none for a year. Not for two months, for a year.
For a year. Those positions were just they were just they're not open positions. I don't think that Oprah request was for a year. There were 12 postings that I answered that Oprah request. So, so during the
year there were 12 postings. The dates of the Oprah request, whatever the dates were from here to here, it was answered. 12 postings. I gave what I could give. Yeah. So, it wasn't just one posting. There were 12 postings. There were there were about 12 of them. Yeah. So, the resident told me that the answer they
got from Marcy was that there were no civil service postings for the prior year except for the police department. That was not the answer to that over request and I can send it to you. So, whoever told you that is not telling you correctly. Okay. Yeah. Like, okay, we'll
research that out. No, there was no answer. No opra at all. I gave the documents that were requested that I could give. So, uh, are you done, Bill? I'm done. Um
what was her what was her salary before all this came up? It was somewhere around 40,000. Um very low very low. It was 40,000. And what would it be under the new contract or under under the uni?
A level four starts at around 50. A level four starts at around 50. So 8 to $10,000 difference. It's about it's about 10. Yeah. So this is some of this is being brought about with the contract with the county
correct because the of the the titles required for the yeah the shared service. Right. So we have a project sealing cost of 277 for with the county on it. That that's what they reimburse us for.
And on page nine, item three, we cannot uh hereby establish a shall only increase through mutual agreement of the governing bodies with 30-day written notice provided by uh Sussex to Vernon from the time period within which 75% of the project sealing cost is reached.
Otherwise, Sussex has the option to terminate upon 30-day notice written. So, we can't reach that 75% until September. Correct. because it's $2,300 a month times 75% is end of September. Is there
any way that Sussex can pick up that difference between her old salary and under the contract? There's nothing that prevents the township from asking for that, but I mean that that would be up to the county and what they've budgeted for because I
think for me that's that's some of this, right? It's it this is driven by an agreement that we have with the county. The county is reimbursing us for you know probably threearters of her salary basically I would think right
because that 277 is excluding a food cost and and everything right it's basically a reimbursement of her her time for that. So if we use that, can't we go to the to back to the county and say, "Hey, have you know a situation
that popped up here that's now, you know, the the burden of the more of the burden of this program is being put on our taxpayers in the town. Can we ask you to pick up 75% of the increase of first salary?" Yeah. Isn't that a conversation worth having? I think I
think that's a really good point. I think that's something that we could definitely do. Obviously, it depends on the county agreeing, but yeah, I think that that's a really good I mean, is there any way that we can, you know, get a feel from him if that's something they're willing to do before we go ahead and move forward with with
any other discussions or any other lawsuits or whatever it may be. You can reach out to them and say, I you know, where's Allen? What? Oh, yeah. All where's Allen? He must have gotten notice of this. Wait, is he walking in
Dorito? not Allan. Um I I I would at least appreciate a little bit of that angle first before we you know um have any other type of solution to this. So how many other how many other
municipalities have this program in their town? I only I know of two others in Sussex County. What's the other one? Um Apachon and Franklin. Franklin. Right. Okay. Vernon's the largest. The nutrition site though isn't just her
only job. No, but they're not also picking up 100% of her salary. That's why I asked the question, how much does she make? We're getting reimbursed. This we have a percentage that we are being reimbured of her salary. Now, we're having an increase in her salary. It
only seems right that the county should pick up a portion of that since it's reasonable, too. I mean, it's been the same amount for I don't even know how long. At least four years now. Longer than that. It's been the same amount since I've been here. So, do we
know the agreements that they have with Franklin andor Pacon as to how much they get reimbursed to for what they're doing? I mean, I would I would get that agreement as well and see if they're on par with what we're getting reimbursed
as well. It's a negotiation at this point in my book on well for moneywise, right? But it still leaves us with her going in the union or not, right? Um
Okay. But that's an unforeseen circumstance, Anthony, right? You know, no when when this when this agreement was reached in uh January 1st of 2025, right? This wasn't an issue, right? And I think you know the town
um all along has been accepting this money uh based on I would I would hope when this was talked about. It was also talked about how much of an expense it is to for the overall program. Right.
And I know Miss Down just said that this has been about the same amount for the last three or four years. Um, you know, if we talk about every every budget season how much all our inflation's going up, I would tend to think that this should go up as well.
Granted, it it's still our taxpayer money that's going through the county and coming back to here. I get that. But when we're, you know, have to pay somebody additional monies for an unforeseen circumstance that would wouldn't exist on January 1st, that's
falling then on the taxpayers of just Vernon. And um it's it's obviously a program that's subsidized by the county and those subsidies should be should fluctuate when unforeseen circumstances
pop up also. So that's all I'm asking. Okay. Any other comments? I think Brett has a good point. So, I think us to vote on another resolution tonight, Pat. No, I would. The only way we could do this is if we if there was a motion to
reconsider the matter and that would have to be made by one of the somebody who t who voted no. So, doesn't doesn't a motion reconsider have to be done in the same meeting that it was turned down? No, you can do it later.
Could always you could you could always bring another resolution or bring it up in a slightly different way. Yeah, it has to be brought up in a different way because otherwise you just keep revoting on the same. Well, you can wait for the numbers that are in your favor reconsider. And that's
why I think I could be mistaken, but I I think motion reconsiders have to be done in the same meeting. I I I believe you're right. I I read about that. Um uh so the only way to bring this resolution back again is to have some change or
have have a material change. Yep. Could we Brad's point about um trying to get an increase from the county? Could that be part of a new resolution? But you you can always you can always bring it the a resolution up again based upon the new information. I
think you have more information tonight than you had before and that would be that would suffice. Yes. Okay. Thank you. Good good discussion. I think that I think if we go ahead and do something like that I think it's going to there'll be another year I think right before they
renegotiate another shared service agreement with us. Right. I bar agreement with our shared service agreement. So So they they they've budgeted as as your CFO mentioned for 2025. So maybe you could get the increase in 2026.
It would cover the difference future budget. I think it's good for the council to know either way. What was that? I think it's good for the council to know either way. Yeah. You know, county would consider that. I mean, it has been the same for a long time. So
Thank you. Mayor's comments. Thank you, Council President. Let me begin by saying happy Mother's Day to to all the moms. This Mother's Day was a was a little different for me. It was a little weird. I had to wish my daughter a happy
Mother's Day. It still felt weird, but um but uh last week we we baptized our uh my grandson Holy Council Lutheran Church in
Vernon. And since we're on the religious topic, I just want to say to my Catholic friends and family, congratulations on your new American pope. Huh? Um and as a litigant we don't I I don't we don't follow the pope. However, I always
admire the pope and the role that that he has in this world. Um I also would like to call uh into the I would put into the record three new applicants for the beautifification committee and their
names are Kim uh Kimberly Uso, Nicole Albert and Claudine Gillian. this week May uh May 14th beautifification will be we'll be swearing in all eight members. So uh I
think we still have I think we can have nine members. So if anybody joined please application in um if you have noticed on 515 we started planting
trees. Um and hopefully another week or two we start getting all the flowers that we've um part on trying to get all those donations for the planners. So hopefully we'll get all those build within the next uh within the next two weeks. And also the hometown heroes
banners. I if anyone took notice, if you drive down Church Street, you'll see hometown heroes. Um, and so that was been a long time that's been long overdue. Uh, so and I got I do want to thank I want to thank Tina and thank Michelle for driving that
forward. And I know you guys guys put the leg work in. Literally, you guys actually did the walk and and counted polls and took information down and worked with JCPNL and Warwick Valley Telephone and and just to try to get the
approvals. Um, so I know that was it was a lot and thank you guys for really for getting that done. And we received uh 1,200 a $1,200 donation. So that helped reduce the price down. Um that was 12250
from Sussex Cultivation. So that helped reduce uh the cost of the poles. The poles were $30 a piece. So um so then we were able to get the banners down to about $125 a banner. So, um also I happy to report that we
just want a um a case um with the affordable housing. Um, originally the state I think wanted us to have over 304,000 units
and Jessica Bwell who was our planner um took a look at a hard look at the properties the the the numbers and uh we came out with 194 with 33 I guess due today like they want
those 33 soon as possible whatever that could the state took about I think it's about 100 municipalities uh to court and I have to say we won and the number still
remains at 194. I know last week though last council meeting we talked about um going out for RFPs for our for our professionals and you know one of the things that when the reason why we use a lot of
these professionals because they're very they know the town, they know the land, they know the area. Um so it's very hard. I mean could you go out and maybe save a buck or two? Sure, probably. But I think ultimately you'll end up spending more money. Um
this comes with experience. I mean just just with this uh with Jessica Caldwell, our planner, I mean again she she got those numbers reduced and and those numbers were accurate. That's very difficult task to do. Uh she was able to
get that done. So again, like I said, it's it's it's these professionals that really uh you get what you pay for. You really do. And you know, we we've we've found like service like services like for an example, the
um the phone and the internet, right? We we looked at that. We found we found a much much better deal and we did it. We make changes where we can uh without without affecting uh the services or or potential
future costs, right? So, so that's that's some of the things that we uh that we did. But other than that, that is all I have to report. Thank you, Mayor. Y public comments. May I have a motion
to open the floor for public comments? Moved by Mard, seconded by Mrs. Bucheri. Floor is open uh for comment from the public on any item on the agenda. wish to address the council, please step
forward. Give us your name. Go to the second one. Thanks. How are you? John Kosh, fire commissioner for the town of Vernon. Um there's a whole bunch of stuff on the
two ordinance tonight for the fire service. I just want to take a minute to explain some of the needs. Um so starting in 256 um under number A or letter A turnout gear self-contained breathing apparatus those are things that are
required to have a lifespan not set by the town of Vernon set by the OSHA um have 15 years on bottles 10 years on turnout gear uh we've worked with administration on giving down a number that we can put in each year so that we
don't come a time when there's 200 air bottles needed or said the turnout year needed. We're staggering it and putting it through um so it doesn't affect the budget as much. So those are pretty standard even in the last
under letter C the vehicles would be four new chief's vehicles for the fire chiefs. Our current ones are leased. Their lease term is ending. Part of the agreement when we got them was the least new vehicles. The old ones
would go back to the assistant chiefs. Part of the deputy chiefs, two of them, the current vehicles that we have are 2011 Ford Escapes. Two of them have been redlined and are out of service. And there's only like two still going
barely. The deputies, they respond to 300 plus calls a year. in those vehicles. And I think I saw in here Denell had down the buyout for those the current Chief vehicles off of the lease was 42,000. So you're getting a vehicle the current chief's ones for like
$10,500 fully equipped with probably 30 I think most of them have 30 to 40,000 miles. is all on itself, but that worked out well on the lease where the main one here is under um E, the acquisition of a new engine to
be used by High Links Fire Department. Um that's been put in replace a 2002 engine that the manufacturer went out of business. The parts are hard to come by and they
really gouge you on the prices for the parts if you can even find them. And the main thing on that is the four-year build time. So we ordered that truck today, the new engine, it wouldn't be here for four years. So that'd be putting fire department operating a 27y
old first new engine which went over when I gave her the price. She thought I was joking with her. And we reached out to the manufacturer, multiple manufacturers, and they roughly figure a 3% per quarter
increase is what the industry is going at. So on a million dollars, it's 30 grand a quarter. Wow. So it adds up if we don't fast. Then you take the risk of how long any breakdowns we're going to have on
the old one waiting four years. And we got fortunate to find a loner one from Ma Mawa on the tanker. And we got really fortunate to buy a used one used mini pumper which allowed us to staff high on Lakes Fire Department with the the loner
and the last engine from Pocha is in Mac while the tankers are out of service. I don't know if we can get lucky again on that. And I'm not sure if you're aware of the new building as the building that's growing in town.
This 55 and over uh community right next door when you have to charge the stand pipes. You're going to need two trucks for search and uh rescue on that. Then you need suppression. You have to charge the building. So that building there would
use every piece of equipment the town of Vernon has plus some if there's god forbid a fire in there and they're looking to make more of those buildings. So the need is going to come along. I think that's pretty much all the items here, but I heard you say
before they called victim of previous councils and it just happened from a study in 98. A lot of our equipment is from 98 to 2008, one year after another and typically it's a 20-year replacement
that's been pushed out the window at lead times and the fire service prioritize what's needed and what's not. So, some of the older pieces that we don't use as much on first do are still in service and we're prioritizing what
we need to uh keep the budget down. And I think that's pretty much it. Um, if anyone has any questions or anyone can always call me anytime. Yeah. Just when it comes time to uh request equipment, is it done as a
township? Is it done by individual uh fire departments? How how do you go? is um fire chiefs present the u budget at a meeting the needs and then we prioritize it then myself as the fire commissioner meets with administration to go over
that includes all the departments correct when I talk about the fire department I talk about all four as one okay service is there is there a master list of uh so you guys maintain of all and like I said we some
pieces are till 1998 1999 still in service that got skipped over. You said the tankers are on order, right? Service. Then the other thing I just didn't quite understand when you were talking about the lease, you said
you have a vehicle the lease is up. You got to turn it in. Correct. The lease the current chief's vehicles are under the the enterprise lease program. Uhhuh. And um I think part of this money you can buy that car out at the end of the lease. Oh, so it's purchasing the
current vehicle, correct? Oh, okay. Cuz I I know on the police department you we put in the uh budget leasing, right? Replace them. Yeah. So, and you're rotating them. Yeah. with these. Um the plan was plan originally um was once these chief vehicles were done, they would just be sent down to the
assistant, the deputy chiefs. Um and then we would just reop for a new um so this is getting four vehicles that are worth far more than the 10,000 each. Um but they're buyout is 10,0005 each basically. Um so it's getting four of those to move down. So you get estimates
currently by calling your sources who make fire equipment. Yeah, they're all on they're all on a co-op. They pretty much Yeah, you can we reached out to another manufacturer and they all say that a engine is a million dollars plus.
Yeah. So, that's the budget number. If it comes in under, we save a few bucks. If it goes over and then it cost us a little bit more. I'm pretty sure Dell's not going to let it go over. You have to budget for this 3%. You get the million if you order it,
right? There's no increases going forward. Correct. Correct. The manufacturer that lock it in. We've been buying through locks it in. They did this. The engine last engine we got, they held their price. I know some other brands. I've heard other fire companies say that they get a bill for 70,000
more. Take it or leave it increases. And knock on wood. The manufacturers we've picked holding their price. And we're trying to get it a standardized so that parts and labor and then mechanics know about the engines as well as if I come
to a call and there's a high links engine there, I'll know it's almost the same as our post engine. Everyone will know where to look for stuff and how to operate it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thanks for
proactive service. Thank you. Hi, Jane Damstro, Pleasant Valley Lake section of Vernon. I have a question for the council. I would like to preface the question though by stating that 95% of
Vernon municipal employees are also union members. Why is it that I am being singled out and denied my right to join the union when 95% of my colleagues have been able
to exercise that right? No answer. That's really an issue with the administration. we re, you know, the council responded to when it was brought before them and
that's essentially what happened. Hopefully, we'll be able to get some extra money if we can get some county participation, but isn't everyone able to join a
union or municipal employees? Has it come down to the for the other 95% to an issue of money or is that a right that a civil service worker for Varnon
has? Anybody advise me on that? That'll be one of the topics that's discussed if it goes to litigation. Okay. Thank you for your time. We'll let this go to litigation. Come on, guys. I had a list. My name is Christa Gary. I
live in Bern, New Jersey. I actually have a list of things that I wanted to talk about that Jane does at the senior center. But I'll just make this short that uh every senior who has ever attended the senior center would attest to the fact that Jane Dstra goes far
beyond what the duties of her position call for. More than anything, Jane is a trusted confidant to all the seniors. She is loved by everyone. Without her, there would be no Vernon Senior Center. She
has excellent leadership and communication skills, which are also very important as a nutrition site manager. I believe that since Jane has been a full-time employee for at least five
years and her has proven herself with excellent work ethics that she should be authorized to join the union. This would improve her employment position which in the long run would benefit her which I think she deserves.
I really do and I hope you agree with that and try to give her what she wants and what she really needs and she's underpaid. I think that's terrible. $40,000 a year is nothing. Thank you very much. Thank you.
I'm not gonna stand here. Excuse me for your name. Give me your name. Say your name, please. My name is Frank Masher. I'm not going to stand here and tell you about how great Jane is because as the councilman has said, which he knows already that she is more than
wellqualified for the job. my question is or not a question but a comment and it doesn't require an answer it doesn't mean anything just a an old man who lived 94 years and I respect the fact
that you are a man who stands by principle and rules I assume but in 94 years I found that principles change they change constantly
rules are broken, everything happens. And this is now a position where you state that because of your principles, it's not a good thing. But it is a good thing because every rule and every
principle has something that is missing and other things take their place. I'm not a speaker. I I don't know. I get a little nervous and I'm a little upset. But here's a person that is the
the epitome of the wrong thing happening to the right person. And only you, from what I understand, can correct that. Well, thank you. Thank you, Mr. M. He's our attorney. They don't vote. He doesn't vote. This is our attorney.
the rest of us. Hi, I'm blessing to use you and I've only lived here two years. I've known Jane that whole two years. My question is the very first thing you brought up was the union. So why is there not a union rep here?
I've never met a union rep that didn't break their legs to try to sign somebody up, somebody newer into the union. So, I'm thinking with all this conversation, there should have been somebody from the union here. I'm going to address that real quick. I did ask
for the union um and I asked to to stand out that we can have hopefully resolve this issue without going into litigation. I did and I've worked what I'm saying. Absolutely. I guess. Thank you. Good.
Good evening everyone. My name is Jim Damstra. I'm Jane's husband. I don't know if any of you are free during the week. Anyone in the daytime? So you could mirror Jane and just see what she does at senior center
Saturday and you're more than welcome to come to my house and see what happens after the fact when she gets home and still doing her job or a Sunday. You have a problem at the the garden plots. Oh, late we got to go figure it out, hun. Let's go. So that's a Sunday, a
Saturday, Monday night. Value is what you have. value costs money. We're talking a raise that is less than my taxes on my house per year
in this town which are going up up up. We all understand that. Everything else in life is too. Everybody deserves credit. Mayor said it best. You get what you pay for. Thank you. Thank
you. Anyone else wishing to adjust the council? Not I'll ask for a motion to close the report to the public. Moved by Mr. Higgins. Is there a second? Second. Seconded by Mrs. Chair. All in favor signify by saying I. I.
Opposed. Motion carries. members of the council have received a copy of the bills list. Do you have any comments or questions on that? That'll be a record. See no questions.
All members of the council, I've received a copy of the minutes of our regular meeting of April 28th, 2025 for approval. I have a motion to place them on the floor for
consideration or I'll make that motion. Motion made by Mrs. Beri. Is there a second? Second. Seconded by Mr. Higgins. Any changes in the minutes or requests for changes, corrections? Not vote.
Council member, yes. Yes. Yes. Motion carries. May I have a motion to We have a minutes of February 10, 2025, our regular meeting minutes. May I have a motion to place those on the floor? We
did the minutes. We did that, sir. Already did them. An agenda. Now, I know what happened there. I used to use the same paper. Oh, okay.
No, it's okay. Don't worry about it. Um consent agenda. If any member of the council has any requests to have any of these resolutions separated, please let me know at the end. I will do so. Resolution
25-136, approving a solicitor's permit. Direct sales marketing LLC. Resolution 25-137, approving a solicitor's permit. Direct sales marketing LLC.
Resolution 25-138 approving solicitors permit direct sales com direct sales marketing LLC resolution 25-139 approving a charitable
solicitor's permit valley fire department incorporated resolution 25-140 authorizing approval of Sussex County District contrib contribution to Vernon Emergency Medical Services,
VMS. Resolution 25-141, a resolution of the Township of Vernon, County of Sussex, State of New Jersey, authorizing the execution of a fire mutual aid agreement between
uh the township of Vernon and the Mcabe and the Mackie Fire Department and the Township of Hardest and Hardest Fire Department. Resolution 25-142, a resolution of the Township of
Vernon adopting 20 25 county hazard mitigation plan. Resolution 25-143, New Jersey Department of Community Affairs Leap Challenge Grant
Resolution FY25. Can I have these voted on as is or would somebody like to separate any? If not, um, may I have a question to place these on the floor? Moved by Mr. Sparta. Is there a
second? Second. Seconded by Mr. P. I do have a a question. Certainly. Um, the LEAP grant, what is that for? Uh, that's for shared services for animal control. So the league grant is um there's two different types of league grants, but
this would be for uh our shared service. So we'll get some type of grant towards our animal control um and the application would be for an expansion animal control. Okay, which we've talked about. So this is for construction. So uh and just to let you know, uh there
are similar resolutions that were sent down to the other six municipalities. Okay. So we're going to share because we have shared services with them. This is technically for that. Gotcha. And um the solicitors permits. Did you talk about
maybe um adjusting that our ordinance for solicitation? Remember the last time we had this come up? Um we were trying to actually eliminate eliminate it. Do it because it would be eliminating a source of potential employment. And why
didn't we do it? It's a uh I can't do It would have been an issue. It would have been an issue. Okay. All right. Yeah. I mean, nobody likes to get in their Okay. All righty. I just I saw that and I was like, okay. Isn't there a list that people can put their names on where they
can't come and knock? We have a list. Um it's mostly the um private communities. Yeah. So, if there's a violation then they can call. Yeah. which and well and what happens I don't know what's happened with this particular company but we've I have personally heard on
more than one occasion they start soliciting before we even approve these permits that would be a violation and that's a violation but people have to call it in and it's it's troublesome I actually did um remove permits from one company that
one because of that right yeah okay that was like a few months yeah last summer last fall okay and then I mean do we track those companies and then say, "Hey, we're not going to give you a permit again because you violated our word." Uh, I mean, they didn't apply, they didn't apply again. But if they do, would that happen? Okay. All right. Because Yeah. If they're not going to
follow the the law. Okay. I mean, the only way I would know that is if somebody if someone calls in called it in. Yep. So, and they don't even know though. A lot of people don't know that the the permit wasn't approved because believe it or not, everyone in town is not watching these meetings.
True. So, they don't know. It's true. Okay. All right. That was um all my comment. Thank you. Thank you. Did we not have a res a mutual aid agreement with Hardison? We do. No, for the fire before. Oh, for the fire. Did we not have one before?
Was the mayor the mayor? No. You stepped down. Did we have one previous to this? Uh, no. It just seems odd that we wouldn't. Maybe maybe it just left out McAfee fire department. I think maybe makes most sense. We have one countywide
the town of partisan requesting any updated one on their end. Miss fire is going to be responding. Okay basis. Oh okay. They just wanted to clarify more on their end. It's good for
Okay. Thank you. All right. Thank you. Roll call, please. Council member Bushieri, yes. Council member Higgins, yes. Council member Sparta, yes. Council President Rudo, carries. Moving to our ordinances.
Ordinance 25-06. It's a motion to introduce bond ordinance appropriating $3,492,500 and authorizing the issuance of 2,550,000 bonds or notes of the township for various improvements or purposes
authorized to be undertaken by the township of Vernon in the county of Sussex, New Jersey. May I have a motion to place this on the floor for for an introduction? I'll make that motion. Motion made by Mrs. Bucheri. Is there a second? Second. Seconded by Mr. Higgins.
Um, roll call, please. Member Busher. Yes. Council member Higgins. Yes. Member Sparta. Yes. President Rudo. Yes. Motion carries. A motion to introduce ordinance 25-07, capital ordinance providing for
various improvements by the township of Vernon and the county of Sussex, New Jersey, appropriating therefore the sum of $265,000 and providing that such sum so appropriated shall be raised from the capital improvement fund. May I have a
motion to uh introduce this? Moved moved by Mr. Spart. Is there a second? Second. Uh, roll call, please. Sherry, yes. Council member Hig, yes. Members, yes. Zudo, yes. Thank
you. Public comment. We have a motion to open the floor for public comment on any item for for a time limit of five minutes. Moved by Mr. Sparta. Is there seconded by Miss
Mrs. Bucheri? Um Buller is open to comment on any item whether it's on the end or not. Motion to come forward and address the council. Seeing no one come forward, may I have a motion to close the floor to
the public? Moved by Mr. Sparta. Is there a second? Second. Seconded by Mr. Higgins. Uh all in favor signify by saying I. I. I. Motion. A motion carries. Thank you. Uh, council comments. Anyone
wishing to make any comments? Done. You're done. I'm good. You're good. I I do have a quick comment um to make regarding our discussion earlier. Um, I think our senior program is very valuable. We have a lot of opportunities
for different demographics in our town. We have um fields, playgrounds for our our children and young families. We have pre-lighting ceremony, a manora lighting ceremony. We have a parade. Um
uh most of these things focus on a younger demographic. Our senior center and the programs offered there focus on a really important demographic in our community. And um I hope that program I hope we can
consider that resolution in perhaps a slightly adjusted form soon rather than later and um move forward with uh adjusting Miss Damstra's salary. Thank
you. Uh I echo the feelings of council vice president. uh we can find a way to come to an accommodation on this I'm sure would be
appreciated by all of our seniors. Um, being a guy who's approaching the ripe age of 82, uh, I'm happy that I have a daughter at home who's a great cook and I have three boys, three grandsons, so I I don't need to
go, excuse me, looking for things to do. I've got plenty on my plate right there. And, uh, I I wish I could get back to building some of my airplanes. Uh but in fact many of these people who attend the functions of the township and
the daily activities in the council I'm sorry in the uh senior citizen center. It's their way of meeting and seeing people and seeing old friends
and making new friends. uh their efforts uh should be encouraged and I I would hope that we can do it in a way that not create any uh ill will.
Uh they're a group of people who tend to vote in a block and uh because they have issues that seem to affect them more readily than others. And yet uh they've been very very
accommodative. I remember being on the board of education when we used to have to uh sell the budget. I don't know. Did you have to sell the budget? First few years I was on the board I had to. Yeah.
And uh you'd go out there and they were there and they were sticking up for the budget. They said, "Yeah, we need that school." and only the occasional individual would come in there and say no, do we really need it and how much is
costing me and so forth. Uh I know there are actions being contemplated in threaten to freeze uh taxes of senior citizens. Uh
I I I I'm very very happy about that. But we can't lose we can't lose the uh the the faith of these uh individuals that they have given us. Uh you know in
terms of trying to coax a budget that is difficult at best at all. uh trying to find ways to save money there uh when they continue to bear a significant part
of uh of the expenditure uh for that budget. Um so I'm hopeful we can do this. I look forward to the ability of trying to meet these accommodations and and hopefully uh resolve this without any further
issue. Um May, the end of May is coming up and I see the members of our uh BFW on the road collecting for the poppies and for contributions as well as the members for
our EM. And uh hope to see you there uh at the at the the festivities for um for the uh Memorial Day
celebration. Other than that, I do have one more certain I did go to the um the dedication up in Highland Lakes for the EMS center. Um Almanza for Almanza. Yeah. So, and uh the the group
there just did an excellent job. Missed you. Oh, did you just miss me? Yeah, they did an excellent job. So, I just wanted to commend them on that. It was a a real honor. Um, you know, his his boys were there and uh I know his his one son and um his wife and all the uh EMS
volunteers. It looks the facility looks great and it, you know, it's really um state-of-the-art equipment and training for those volunteers that um serve our community. So, I just wanted to give them a kudos to uh working on that. It
it looks fantastic. And I I just wanted to um comment, Brad, you know, I I like your idea. Thank you for that um suggestion. Um going back to the county, I think it that's really a good idea and I appreciate you bringing that to the table. Um even if we don't get that in
2025, I still hope we can, you know, move forward with that resolution. I do I have a comment also. Um based on all the comments, my comment with all due respect, you missed the whole point. has nothing to do with the seniors. We love them. I'm one of them. They deserve
whatever they get. She does a great job. For anybody to concentrate on that, you miss the point that that's not what this is all about. I explained what it was all about. It's about a union. It's about a person wanting to join. It's about we we have the demands that that person join. All of the above is what it
was about. Not about they're good people. We know that. We we it's it's a given. You got to love them. And they and they enjoy each other and and they're very important people. And we got a great percentage of seniors in this town. I think it was 18 19%. It's it's an older town. I get it. That's not
what it's all about. So for anybody to from the mayor to Natalie to to you, Pat, you guys were talking about something that we all agree on. It's has nothing to do with that. So that's my point. That's that's the point of this whole thing. I understand your point. I think it's all of it. I think it
encompasses all of it, though. I think it encompasses your point and our points. I think you have to look at it as a whole, not just one piece. Thank you. What's the uh since it's Memorial Day, what what's the date of our next meeting? It's um Thursday the 29th. Yes.
Okay. Thank you. I just wanted to put it in my calendar. Oh, I think I have plans for today. Darn it. Thank you. Um may I have a motion to the meeting? Moved. Moved by Mr. Higgins. Is there a second? Second. Second by Mr. Sparta. All in favor signify by saying
I. I oppos. Motion carries. Yeah. Memorial day. I have fun. Have dinner with my girlfriend. My daughter's going to the pro.