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It's good to see a full house here. Um, always makes uh the meeting better since this is your meeting. Um, we will call the, if I can find my first page, the uh May 20th, 2025 Valuchia County
Council meeting to order at 401. And let me just give you an idea of how we start in just a minute. Um I will ask you to stand if if you care to for um the
invocation. And so we'll do that and then we'll go right into the pledge of allegiance. Um I bet there's a lot of people today that will stand for the pledge of allegiance as I look around the room. Um, if you are a member of a faith group who would like to
participate in the invocations at our meetings, um, you're welcome to do that. Just send an email to, uh, K, the letter K green.org. Um, Chris somewhere over there and u, she will get you all set up
to, uh, to do that. Uh this morning uh we are privileged to have pastor Mo Hawkins from No Limit Praise Tabernacle right here in Dand to uh open our meeting. Pastor, let's prepare our hearts and
minds for prayer. Father, in the name of Jesus, as we start this proceeding, we started with you, Lord Jesus, with you in mind. Now, Father, we pray God that you would give the wisdom, the knowledge, the understanding, God, to God, proceed, God, with your will and
for the betterment of this county. Father, we ask you, Lord God, to give wisdom, God, to our leaders, Lord God, as they make decisions, some favorable, some unfavorable. But Lord God, let it be guided by you. Now, God, let your peace, God, fill this room, God. Let
your understanding fill this room, God. And let your glory be in this room. And Father, we thank you, Lord God, for these who God has given their lives, God, to service unto you and to this county and to this nation, God. Those veterans, God, that have laid their
lives and given themselves over to you, Father, uh for this nation, God. And we thank you right now in Jesus name. Amen. Amen. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the
republic for it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Nice to meet you. Would you call the role, please? Mr. Reinhardt, here. Mr. Robbins, here. Mr.
Santiago, here. Mr. Dempsey, here. Mr. Johansson, here. Mr. Kent, here. Mr. Brower here. So, we have a uh full board here and we're ready to go. We will start as always with uh public
participation. Uh when I call your name, just come up to the microphone here. Make sure that there's a microphone uh near your mouth. The podium actually there's a button on the uh left that will make it go up and down. um and
staff can help you if you need help, but it's important that we're able to hear you and and it will be um recorded. You have three minutes to talk about anything that applies to Valuchia County, anything that this council could uh possibly act on in the future. Um
this is a public meeting and it's publicly aired. So we ask that you would speak with respect for your uh fellow neighbors, citizens, uh children, uh women, and um uh we would just
appreciate it if if you would if you would do that. First, we have um um Josh Rivera and then David Hill and then Robert Flerty. Hello. Thank you for allowing me to
speak. Joshua Vera Miller Road. Uh the first thing I wanted to say is to please request the 2017 permit be revoked from St. John's Water Management District. I don't understand why we ever accepted or
allowed it to happen where you folks have said before where it's not even our water. Why are we accepting it on especially on people's private property? You guys have the the duty to act, duty to protect us, by not taking any action
by not requesting it and helping us out is failing us terribly. Roughly 90 million gallons was pumped out after the storm, six vertical feet, more than the 10% that was estimated in the 2017 permit
stated 2017 permit has violated basically everything it wasn't supposed to violate. removing the wear, being modified, not being inspected, all these things. So, it's clearly in violation and it says that it can be revoked. So,
that's what we're asking you to please do to request it from St. John's Water Management District. The drainage, there was drainage leakage on 1792 that the massive sinkhole had in this last hurricane that that was being patched
for years. Every time in the morning we drive at nighttime or they're repairing it at night time, there was a leak in that covert pipe underneath 1792 and there's millions of gallons being funneled through that pipe to Miller Lake and they constantly were just
patching it for years and years and years. That's what caused a sinkhole because all that water was being pushed through there. It's not It wasn't being cut. The road was not cut through as some folks have said. That was the reason
why. There's acres of private property that are still flooded currently right now. That hurricane was in October. There's still tons of old oak trees that are still flooded. My neighbors properties are still flooded. There's there's tons of acres. There's a ton of
water still there. We've been getting flooded out for about eight years now. So, this is accumulation of water over time. Hurricane season starts in 12 days. So, it's about to be game time and we're still sitting on our
hands. Please start pumping the water out now. It hasn't rained much in 6 months. The bar borrow pit can't be that high. If we could arrange something. I know that was a special order that we did, emergency order. And what if this happens again and we're
sitting here in the same exact scenario and we have done nothing to be proactive, not reactive. Thank you for your time. Dave David Hill. Uh Dave Hill. I live on Miller Road. I'm here about Miller Lake. The
water has never been this high at this time of year. For every inch of water that falls on the Royal Oaks Professional Center Plaza, Miller Lake rises by 2 in. The three Jane the three drains installed on Tmont Drive in 2017,
which are part of the Royal Oaks Professional Center St. John's Water Management Permit, are very effective at moving acres of water fast. These drains put so much water into the system so fast it makes the weir ineffective. Within minutes of a typical rainstorm,
the water is flowing over and and on top of the weir. The flooding of Miller Lake and my property started in 2018. My property, which used to be 300 ft away from Miller Lake, is now a swamp. My trees in my front yard that are 50 to 80
years old are dead. My neighbors homes near or on the water built in the 70s and 80s are close to being flooded. If we have a major rain event this year, we could lose homes. Shady Lane could flood and access to 1792 for most residents
would be cut off. This flooding will bring more people to these meetings asking for help. As long as St. John's Water Management, Valuchia County, City of Orange City allow Royal Oaks to flood us, we will be here asking for help. Why
is the county allowing this to happen? The 2017 Royal Oaks Professional Center, St. John's Water Management District permit states the system, it can't be modified. It was for seven years. It can't be added on to. It was for seven
years. It can't cause deforestation. It has for seven years. It can't cause loss of wildlife habitat. It has for seven years. It can't cause water related damage. It has for seven years. The uncontrolled water from this system for
seven years took away Miller Lakes's capacity for a major storm. Why doesn't the county protect itself and the residents of Miller Lake community? You gave a letter of no objection to the 2017 St. John's water management permit. The permit states that any of the items
happen that I just listed, the permit can be revoked. The people of Miller Lake do not agree to this water. Please call for a reagation to this permit and protect yourself and Miller Lake community residents. Doing nothing is
not accept acceptable to myself and the people of Miller Lake community. Thank you for the opportunity to speak. Robert Flerty. Thank you. Robert Flerty, Deltona. Uh, on April 2nd, 2023, my sister and I were walking
her dog along the sidewalk when a driver lost control of their vehicle, and struck us from behind. The car crossed the center line into oncoming lane, veered past the sidewalk buffer, knocked down a road sign, and continued onto the sidewalk. The car hit my sister,
throwing her 59 feet 5 in, killing her instantly. The dog sustained pancreatic damage, which led to her passing 18 months later. I was hospitalized. Seeking a victim's advocate consultation, I emailed the
sheriff's office and received a dismissive and uninformed response. Quote, "I hope you and your sister are recovering. The state attorney's office will determine what charges they will pursue. I suggest you stay in contact with their victim's advocate. Under
Florida statute 782.071, a vehicular death must be sent to the district attorney's office. Yet, Haley Harrison from the state attorney's office stated, "We did not receive anything. Currently, per the sheriff's
office, I am not a witness. Per the DA's office, I am not a victim. I am both. My rights are violated. I need your assistance to formally request the sheriff's office to comply with Florida statute by sending proper notice to the
state attorney's office so that I can pursue my benefits and rights as a victim. Thank you. Um I yield my remaining time. Thank you. Thank you, sir. John
Nicholson John Nicholson Beachside couple of things. One, you all have control of Main Street. Um, and I've asked for the last 10 years that you all look at the intersections of Peninsula and Halifax. Uh, the streets in Daytona
Beach are 9 ft wide. uh not the normal 12 feet. You have 20 foot wide uh roads or uh lanes at peninsula. We don't need 20 foot wide lanes. Would you
please condense that so that we have turn lanes because would you have something at the ocean center literally all of the main area of beachside stops dead because you can't go anywhere because the cars are jammed and once
they get jammed the other cars can't pass and then the other nobody can go anywhere. So please at this point would you look at Main Street? All you need to do is paint some uh lines. Secondly, I was at CVB meeting about an hour or so
ago and uh Scott Edwards who used to do the spring break got up and he was making comments. Spring break will never ever come back to Daytona Beach. We will never get the crowds that we had. So when you talk
about taking uh putting the cars back on the beach, please realize that what once was there is no longer there. 10 of those buildings that brought them to that location are no longer there. The tourism that we had is no longer there.
The hotels that used to be in the area are no longer there. So, please look at it carefully before you destroy what we've been working on for the last 30 years. And lastly, something I'm I'm sorry to bring up, but you know how much I respect you guys. You know how much I
feel that you are qualified. You are diverse. You have somebody who's worked in city, county, state. You have a county employee. You've got a farmer. You've got a business person. And you got a lawyer. We've never had such a qualified county council in 40 years
I've been here. Last time I was here, some people got up and this is the third time that they've come up about the nword. Well, when I was a kid, there were all kinds of
words. Um, I am Polish, so Pock was there. I'm German. Kraut was there. I'm Irish. Mick was there. My relatives were deos. It was common. They were fighting words, but they really weren't. All right. But they've died out. I've not
heard those words in 40 years. I have a I already came talked to him. There's an S-word that I was called when I was a kid. I was a do lover. I was a lover. Uh, sorry, an S- lover. I was an N- lover because I had friends all over. It was
common. But in most white people, the N-word is not common anymore. The other words are not common anymore because nobody uses them. Thank you. Okay. You allowed the use of the word nword for blacks. I ask you, do not allow the
n-word for anybody. Thank you, Katherine Levenson. Good afternoon, Katherine Levenson, Miller Pond, which is now Miller Lake. Um, so I brought some pictures for you guys today. Here is Miller Pond, which is now Miller Lake.
Uh, you can see the tree that's been cut down right there. And you can see all the vegetation. That's what I want you to notice. All that vegetation that was not there before because that was open land. There was no water there before. So that's new. Uh, next
one. Okay. Because of that vegetation, we now have alligators everywhere. Everywhere. Now, I know it's breeding season and I know alligators are Florida. I'm a Florida resident forever. I was born and raised here along with my parents. But the alligators are just all over
this lake now. And I think it's because of the rotting vegetation that's there because of all the excessive water. So it's dangerous for dogs, for kids, for everything else. And they were not there before. Yeah, we had them here and there, but not like now.
Next, we also have all this trash that has gotten flown, you know, flowed up with the water and it's everywhere. And I don't know where where it came from except for maybe other neighbors. Maybe the farm that's across the street across
the lake from me that is completely flooded. All their stuff is coming. The next one, um, this is Finn. Finn is my eight-month-old poodle. He's awesome. He's a great little poodle. He is one
thing though. He's lake curious. So what he does as a poodle is he fetches everything. He gets in the water and then for 24 hours I'm fighting diarrhea and vomiting all throughout my house. So Finn is affected. Even our pets are affected is my point. So it's not just
all the cost of all the trees that are dying all over the place. The loss of the land that we still pay taxes on. Now our animals are getting sick and we also have an invasion of other animals that we should not have to deal with because we never did
before. So that's good by the way because I have taught him to stay away from the water. I'm afraid alligators are going to get them. Okay, next one. More trash that I wanted to show you that came up from somewhere. I have no idea from where but from the lake being
flooded. Go ahead. Next one. And that's it. Thank you. That's what I want to tell you today is please, please find a way to pump out the water. The water is still very high and I'm afraid with hurricane season coming in just a few days, we get one hurricane just brushing by us, you know, we're going to flood
again and we want to prevent that. We don't want more damage. We don't want that. And getting all the water from Orange City, from the north of Orange City, from the west of Orange City, all of it coming in, not fair that they're able to dump on us like that. It is just not fair. and that it wasn't ever pumped
fully out means that we're at an all-time high and we're going to flood. No doubt about it. And now we're going to flood with what? More alligators. Just saying. Thank you. Thank you for your comments. Before I call the next name um and before anybody else moves,
I'd like to ask you to check uh your seat the seats around you um and your pockets. One of the sheriff's deputies laid his phone down. You found it. Okay. See how well that worked. Thank you.
Thank you very much. Well, that worked well. Thank you. Um, uh, Danette, is it Muser is next? You must have pictures. I do. I do. Danette Muser, Miller
Lake. Good afternoon. These pictures, this is a picture of my driveway and Miller Road when we moved in 13 years ago. And you can see it was a dirt road at that time. But take note that the driveway is level with Miller Road. And
if you look beyond that, you can see across from Miller Road, it is completely dry. You can't even see any water from Miller Pond. Next picture. This is my driveway today. It's kind of hard to tell, but when it was
paved and raised, it is now 4 feet higher than my driveway. And creating that swell in my driveway has made it difficult for vehicles to go in and out without being damaged. We actually had to raise the driveway a foot so vehicles
could get in and out safely. Next picture. This is my driveway right after the hurricane. You can see about a foot of my gate is exposed. Next picture. This is my driveway. You can
see two posts and that is the gate. Again, that was about two weeks after the hurricane. You can see that the water just kept rising and rising. And the neighbors were actually gauging the height of the water based on my gate. My gate is completely submerged. My fence
is submerged. Next picture. This is my husband standing on my driveway and behind him is the temporary road that was put in thankful to get our neighbors access in and out of Miller
Road and that truck is on top of the temporary road. But being that that's my driveway, no vehicles could go in or out of my driveway, leaving us completely stranded on our property. Next picture. And then this is my front lawn.
You can see below that red orange line is beautiful St. Augustine grass. That line depicts where the water came up into my yard. And beyond that, you can see how the grass has completely been killed and all that's left is barren
dirt and weeds. So, as you can see, today is day 221 since the hurricane. Miller Lake remains beyond capacity. The rainy season, according to the news, is going to start next week. The stress, anxiety,
and fear to the state is immeasurable. So now we have 12 days until the start of hurricane season. And it doesn't have to be a hurricane. It could be a tropical storm. The lake is starting out at its highest level. No
communication and no action to prevent this from happening. With each day that passes, the stress, anxiety, and fear grows. Revoke the permit. Stop the flow and save our community. Thank you. Thank
you, Dave Kmer. Dave Kramer, 180 Shady Lane, Miller Lake. I just have one picture. This is the FEMA flood map for Miller Lake and it was updated in 2017. It was actually expanded uh from
before se 2017 to what it is today. Uh now this coincidentally that was done a couple months after the permit was completed for uh Royal Oaks to send that water to Miller Lake. You'll see on here Miller Road above the lake, Shady Lane
below, and that arrow, 180 Shady Lane. That little white square is my house. Now, that's never been surrounded by water. It was not uh it's never been surrounded by water ever. Not during Hurricane Andrew, not during Irma, not
during Ian, and not during Milton. The morning after Milton, that house was not flooded. It was not surrounded by water. It was the days and weeks after that the millions and millions of gallons from the Royal Oaks permit that flowed in to
Miller Lake rose it several feet and flooded the home. Now the lake today is beyond this FEMA flood map zone. So it's it's already uh over the FEMA flood line and as was mentioned the rainy se season
starting next week. And if nothing's done, there's I'd say there's a 100% chance of it flooding again and and flooding over Miller Road again. That's uh that's all. And so again, asking to pump the water out,
work with St. John's and any other entities to resend the permit and manage the water flow. Now, I'm not sure I know every city and county has a master plan, like a 25, 30-year master plan. So whether Miller Lakes's part of that and and it's
just not shared, I I don't know. There's a lot that's gone on in the last uh 14 years, which would be halfway through the 30-year mark, for the county to purchase properties on Miller Lake, tear down a house, dig it out to allow more
water to flow in, then support the permit uh at Royal Oaks, and then just earlier this year, you bought the I believe you bought the uh the farm property. So, what what's going to happen next? You know, we we'd like to
know. And I'd like to note a few things on the Valuchia County Council mission statement. A few of the sentences that are in there. Earn public trust. Respond
to citizens needs, safety, and general welfare. Consistently communicate with citizens on needs and aspirations. Thank you. Thank you, Gary Singleton. My name is Gary Singleton. I'm a
resident of Valuchia County. Uh my issue is with the uh with late additions to the agenda. Uh there's a specific one I will mention later. Uh Valuchia County citizens have a right to be heard and those those in elected
positions exist to serve the will of the people. creating rules that allow politicians to do as they please to uh put in uh without in public input is just wrong. It is contrary to the principles of constitutional republic.
Placing items on the agenda last minute or or uh late in the uh process but in accordance with the rules is a way of avoiding public input. rules created by politicians possibly to circumvent
citizen involvement with government. Rules that allow politicians to complete their plans before citizens have a chance to voice any objections. The willingness to honor the will of the people and subverting their ability to be heard are mutually
exclusive. I'm going to mention item eight just as an example. uh you had no problem postponing discussions on much more urgent issues such as flooding and these people will agree with that. Uh you should have no problem postponing this item to give
citizens a chance to provide informed input. Thank Fred Coulter. I think I'm the last you I'm sure you all are happy. Um, Rod Coulter, I'm from Dand, which is probably obvious from the subject. I want to talk to you about the
roundabout on the corner of Amelia and Ohio, which I've been told was made by the county. There are three problems with that roundabout that while I'd like it if you fixed it there, I really think you should take into account the future. First of all, aesthetically, it's ugly. It's a flat slab of concrete. Aesthetics
affect communities. It affects property values. They affect the morale of the community. If you treat a community badly, you'll end up with a bad community. A flat slab of concrete is ugly, pure and simple. Second, it's impervious. I listened I didn't know they were coming to all these people
talking about flooding issues. Pouring a flat slab of imperous concrete means you've got storm water that you have to ship somewhere else. You should set it up so that you don't need the flat slab of concrete in the middle. Dirt. Then the rain would go into the groundwater. who don't need to
ship it off somewhere else eventually ending up in their lake or wherever it is that ends up. You need to consider when you construct things not to let things flow down where you can. And that would be a perfect example. And the third is sightelines coming from the
south. It's great. You can see it. I have a sewer outback that's not a short little car. It's not a Yugo. When I come in from the north, you can't see that roundabout until you're on top of it. Recently, you've painted it yellow right around the edge. But I've seen many of your roads that have paintings and
pavements and stuff like that. The nice paintings, they fade. Unless you're going to be actively maintaining the paint there, which you don't do to any place else. It's rapidly going to disappear. And the people who go above the speed limit, unlike me, I drive the speed limit because I like annoying my
neighbors. They will go up there and at the last minute be surprised by this roundabout right in front of them that they didn't see. If you had gotten rid of the concrete, put in ground, and had some plant, preferably something low maintenance in Florida that grew 6 in, even a 6-in rise be more than adequate
so that people could see it when coming from the north, and they'd see it's there. I'm not asking for a big live oak or anything beautiful like that, but something that raised it up, something that's a little prettier. I even if you can't do it to that roundabout, at least in the future, since roundabouts are the way of the
future, and I don't mind roundabouts. I do mind the fact that Florida drivers can't drive and don't know what to do at a roundabout, but that's not your purview. But if you did that in the future, at least the roundabouts would be more decorative and more useful for the community and you wouldn't lose the sidelines. So, please at least do that
in the future even if you can't go back and fix that one. Thank you. Thank you, Fred. Okay, that uh we will close public comment for uh this part of the meeting um and move to item one uh which is the
uh approval of the agenda. Can I get a motion to approve? Motion to approve. Second. I think the motion came from uh Councilman Robbins. Is that correct? Is that what I heard? And second was by Matt
Reinhardt. All in favor, uh Danny Robbins. Oh, that was prior. Okay. Sorry, I missed it. All in favor of approving the agenda as written, please say I. I. Any opposed?
The agenda is appro approved seven to zero. Um, now on the consent agenda, I'm going to ask if anyone has an item that they would like to pull for a vote first. Um, I would like to pull
item A not for a vote. we can vote on it and then I would like to have it be uh presented um by Cyrus Callum from the airport. Um because it's it's good information for the public to know. But is anyone have
an item they'd like to pull for a vote? Not pull, just for comment. No vote. Chairman, at this time I make a motion to approve the consent agenda as presented by St. And which item did you want to pull for? For discussion. Second
on uh you Mr. Kent. Yes sir. Okay. Yes. He said me and chairman. Thank you for pulling a I I agree with you. That's good information to share. Good.
Uh okay. Um Councilman Kent made the motion. Second was by Matt Reinhardt. All in favor of the consent agenda as written, say I. I. I. Before I count that vote, Jake Johansson, I did not see
your name. I'm I'm going to comment now that the votes over Oscar and Papa. Okay, then the vote was unanimous, I believe. Okay. So we'll start with item A. Good afternoon, Mr. Chair, gentlemen of
the council, Cyrus Callum, Aviation and Economic Resources. So on Friday, we had our first quarter quarterly meeting where we focused on aviation activity in the
county in particular. uh the new aviation opportunities that we have of course with Boeing being in our market and Aura Arrow being in our market. So uh Lou Paris the economic development division director gave a a a a really
thorough economic overview for the first quarter of the county and went over some information on unemployment. But I was joined by Mike Pharaoh from Boeing and Drew Mcuan from Ora to give an update on where they are with the status. So I'm
going to briefly go over the presentation here with respect to the time that we all have for the rest of the meeting and then also give a brief overview of where we are at Daytona Beach International Airport as well because we've had a lot of occurrences
going on and I wanted to make you aware of all of those. So, um, looking at where we are, uh, Valuchia County Aviation and Aerospace, our gross, uh, domestic product and where we are compared to the rest of the universe.
The total GDP tenure in the country is growing at 61%. We're outpacing that at 69% over the past 10 years, 2015 to 2024, at an amount of $187 million. And you can attribute that
to, you know, the ongoing activity and growth in aerospace and aviation, especially with our vicinity to the space coast, but also Embry Riddle and the product that they're putting out into the industry as well. So, this is all good news of what's to come. Now
that we have Boeing and Aura Arrow in the market, if we go back and we look at this in another 10 years, um that that number is going to be astronomical. Looking at unemployment right now for the county, the fourth quarter in 2025
is at 4.2%. It has risen um a bit uh from this time last year, but the good news about that is with the unemployment rate being at 4.2%. Employers can actually fill vacant
positions with more qualified per personnel for vacancies that they have. and keeping in mind the immigration of people that are still moving into the county, jobs are still being added uh to our marketplace. So,
uh this is a a relatively healthy number um and it's in line with what's happening across the country. And just looking where we are at uh 257,000 uh people in the workplace right now. Uh
still a very relatively healthy job market and employment trend. Um coming all the way back from 2024, of course, the dip due the to the pandemic and our recovery which was strong but still very healthy. So, as I get into what's happening in
the aviation industry, there's a lot of economic uncertainty. Um, we've all heard about the pilot shortage as a result of the pandemic, aircraft delivery delays from, you know, the commercial side of Boeing. uh public confidence and safety in the
industry. And of course, we've all been watching the news in regards to what's going on with communications and the air traffic control system. Increasing airline operating costs. Of course, fuel costs are are one of the largest costs for airlines, but
also um the employment costs. Paying their payroll is is a challenge for airlines. And so with that they make decisions on being in markets where they can maintain some profitability. Their profit margins are extremely thin. So
they make choices based on a lot of these factors that are listed here. So looking at DAB at a glance, I'll skip uh to the bottom two uh bullet points here. We range between the third and fifth busiest airport in Florida in
terms of operations. operations are takeoffs and landings. And I'm excited to present to you that our passenger traffic for the first quarter in January up 4% from last year, February up 7% and March up 7 and
12%. I'd be remiss if I didn't talk about the day after the Daytona 500 was probably our busiest day in the past 10 years. We had 3,200 passengers that came through the terminal with less than 10-minute waits at our TSA checkpoint.
And so I would contribute that to stakeholder involvement and us working together to make sure that we are upholding our customer service commitment at the airport. with those numbers as well. Um, and just looking at our lowcost carriers
of Ella and Breeze, 47,000 passengers have come through the terminal. And each passenger is adding $25 revenue per passenger that comes through the terminal. So that's $25 per passenger that comes back to the
airport. So passenger traffic is closely tied to the economy. And if we look at this chart, you can see the passenger numbers peaked at about a million passengers in 1990. And that's when GE was in the
market. And of course, GE being a large employer, large number of employee employees actually bring in um opportunities for businesses and it attracts airlines and those businesses are buying plane tickets. It helps
supplement the leisure market, but large businesses actually attract um airline traffic. And so that was the catalyst that actually drove the need to build the terminal that the airport is operating out of today. And then we start to see a
downturn in the economy towards 911. It starts to inch back up and then drops again towards the recession in 2008. And then um as we attracted JetBlue to the market um shortly
thereafter was CO. So where we are today um we are forecasting about 750,000 passengers for 2025 and that's attributed to our growth in ultra- lowcost carriers to make our market a lot more diverse taking advantage of our
leisure traffic while respecting the relationships that we have with Delta and American that we've had for the past 50 plus some odd years. So as we get into our existing air service, note the highlighted um
cities uh adjacent to AL. So yes, Hartford, Connecticut and Concord, North Carolina um pulled out of the market. When I came before this council in 2023, um we engaged in a minimum
revenue guarantee program and those were for the New Haven market and the Wilmington, Delaware market. Those markets were not affected by AL's reduction in service. ALA made some business decisions to contract with the
federal government and so with that they needed aircraft for those purposes. The Harford, Connecticut and Concord, North Carolina operations were due to a surplus in aircraft and because our service has been such a positive in
their network, they wanted to add for increasing revenue possibilities for them. So naturally with the addition of the government contract opportunity, they devoted their resources that way. So in no way in effect does that have an
effect on us because we already have Hartford, Connecticut that is served by Breeze and Concord, North Carolina is adjacent to Charlotte which is effectively serviced by American Airlines. And with that um you may have heard that we have an additional
location that Breeze will operate going to Akran Canton. This will be our first opportunity to the Midwest in quite some time. This service will be operated both on Wednesdays and Saturdays beginning September 3rd. So, our commitment to
bring opportunity and and and revenue opportunities for one, but to bring other markets into our community as well is a testament to the hard work that the airport staff is putting in to maintain some diversity in our air service
offerings. So with Concord and that Hartford flight pulling out, um we had nine markets. We still have nine markets now um because of the Akran Catton and because of Breeze taking over that Harford,
Connecticut. And with those nine markets, two of those markets of course go to Atlanta and Charlotte, which give us another opportunity towards 200 more destinations worldwide. For those of you willing to make that connection, uh those of you that like the point-to-point service, I think we
have the northeast effectively covered and we are working very hard to open up routes and opportunities non-stop to the west. Whether it be continuing conversations that I have with airlines about going into Chicago and also Dallas Fort Worth. New York is still our top market
as well as Washington DC. Um, we do have seasonal traffic to Washington DC via American to Washington Reagan, but as you see, Chicago's on number four market as well. We have enough traffic and enough demand to fill three 737s a day
to go to New York. So, we use that information when we meet with the airlines on a regular basis. And we make sure that that's a top priority to get filled. I want to go into detail here. And if you can see this chart, this kind
of goes back to our minimum revenue guarantee uh proposition that uh this council approved back in 2023. So, in June of 2023 when Aello came into the market
uh through April of 2025, uh the million-doll MRG um which expires in June of 2025, um there's a good chance we're going to get back $200,000 of that $1 million.
But what I really want to highlight is the total taxes that the county has received during that time period is $1.9 million. So we had almost 100% ROI from
executing that MRG with AL. And then looking at the total spending, almost $24 million lodging, food and beverage, recreation, retail, and transportation. That economic impact of
$24 million was a a result of our $1 million investment into bringing an ultra- lowcost carrier into our market. Um, also for direction from this council, we've engaged in partnerships with our convention and visitors bureau
and they have been putting this material in all of those previously mentioned markets. Also have a video if it shows up uh something that we've collectively worked on that are going in markets like Akran Canton today. Fly non-stop to
Daytona Beach, your gateway to the ultimate Florida vacation. Relax on sun-kissed beaches, experience vibrant nightlight, or feel the adrenaline at Daytona International Speedway. From family fun on the boardwalk to savory seafood, there's something for everyone.
Explore nearby New Summer Beach with its epic waves, or recharge in West Valuchia with its charming downtown vibes. Your non-stop flight to Daytona Beach International Airport awaits. Plan your getaway at fly to daytononaba beach.com. So, we made sure we've covered all
corners of the the county. And I'd be remiss if I didn't talk about some of the awards that staff has earned um over the my course my tenure uh being here uh in my role in uh 2021 commercial service airport of the
year 2024 commercial service airport of the year and just recently the airport safety award awarded in 20 for 2023 but just recently awarded in 2025. I mean that's the FAA. They're a little bit
behind the curve here. But um also we had a project the runway 7 left 25 right LED runway light upgrade which will save over the term of having you know the obligation to
keep runway lights on for for safety purposes. We switched from incandescent lights to LED uh which is ultimately going to save us um tens of thousands of dollars over the lifetime of having that facility in place. So, um, with that,
uh, that completes my report. And you do have some questions. Uh, uh, Jake, were you was your question for somebody else? No. Councilman Santiago. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you for the presentation. Cyrus, always do a good
job. My question is regarding the marketing efforts uh that you highlighted a minute ago in working with tourism boards. Um, uh, how is that going? Fantastic. Uh we couldn't have better partnerships with Lori Georgia and and and
and company. Um they they've done a phenomenal job. We just actually Joan Maggley went up to Connecticut and and um and Debbie as well. I'd be remissed if I didn't mention Debbie. Um went up to Connecticut and did a television show
just highlighting all of the different portions of Valuchia County that we want to showcase. and and all of those amenities to keep the interest in that community engaging with our community here. So, um I I I think that's been a
very effective program that we put in place and looking forward to building upon that coming up here in the future. Yeah. And as a follow-up to that, we made some budget enhancements to that as you remember when we approved that. Um are we on target for those budget
expenditures? You're seeing it. Can you report back that we are on target on this? I can report back. Yeah, we're going to spend every penny of that money that's been allocated for that purpose. And so, um, part of that advertising campaign and and you know that video for
instance that's going to be showcased in all of those markets that I previously mentioned, you know, all of that is from that money that we were able to have approved with that marketing budget. That's awesome. And the last thing I'll ask you is um I know you said I know it's coming up soon. I was thinking
about it about a month ago before they come back. I I hope we can get them here as soon as possible in case there's any changes or discussions we need to have, but I think they got the memo, but I don't want to get in the position of being at a budget crunch time. So, absolutely forward to seeing their
proposals. We'll we'll be proactive in working with them and you know, they've been moved up in the schedule. So, we uh you'll see them a lot earlier. Awesome. Awesome. and and I hope they've gotten the message and Mr. Chairman I apologize it's more of a comment that we want to be partners. It's not a adversarial
thing that may have been portrayed that way but we're going to invest and we certainly expect them to invest for the greater good. Well, that's how it's been. So, great to know that. Thank you, Vice Chair Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair Cyrus. Excellent job as always. Um I'm
sorry I missed the queue. it conflicted with another event, but I would like to get one of the booklets that you provide that gives the details that you just showed plus a little bit more. My question is the current project that you have underway, um it's a storm water issue underneath one of the runways,
right? Is that on target? I mean, are we and the only reason I'm asking uh where I reside, I'm right there at the airport. I actually enjoy it because when I'm out walking the dogs, I'm like, that's cool. I mean, that sucker's flying right over the house. It doesn't bother me, but I can't speak for my neighbors. Uh, and some of the residents
over in Daytona Beach have noticed a change. We put that memo out. Thank you to Joanne uh by by sending that information out. We shared it with the city of Daytona Beach as well, so they could put the information out. So, I appreciate that. But there was no time frame as to when that project would be completed, and I'm being asked that
question. Absolutely. So, um, I actually have good news actually. Um, that project is actually going to wrap up a lot earlier. It's supposed to be a runway closure. So, our seven left, 25 right is our 10,500 runway. Um, that we
prefer the commercial service airliners to use. Um, had to take that down for that storm water issue in our runway safety area. It's going to be moving ahead of schedule. We anticipate it was supposed to be down through June 3rd. Um, we anticipate it's going to be back
open a week ahead of time. So, fortunately, we've had the good luck even though it's been 90° every day. we have not had a lot of rain, so we've been able to uh get ahead of schedule with that project. So hopefully we'll have that runway turned back around so
it's not flying over your community. Well, like I said, I'm the weird one that I think it's cool, but I can relate to you. I can relate to their their feelings on that as well. Thank you. Thanks. Just a a quick question. You had a slide showing the uh economic value of the flights into Daytona. Now, the the
new flights, um tax money, and then you showed one that had uh lodging, uh transportation, restaurant. They were pretty precise, right down to the penny. Are they precise or was that a is is
that a uh how do you derive the It's a formula. I actually have a consultant that that specializes in economic development reports for airports. And so we take this information of course and share it with the airlines because it's
it's used as a tool to help convince them to come into a particular market. So they take the number of passengers, the average days that they stay at a community and they take some assumptions. So you can say not everyone
that's flying in is going to be a tourist and is going to be using those facilities. Of course, there's a good portion of people that actually live here or a good portion of people that are actually coming here and potentially going up to Flaggler County or going to Bvard County or maybe they're going to
Orange County as well. But um with data that they've used over the years um those percentages we plug in and and that's the output model. So the um tax information that's that's definitely something that we work with uh a lot of
the the tax collector's office and so forth and a lot of the other CVBs to get that data. So um economic development a lot of people say that's fuzzy math but um with that you know we use that information to make educated decisions
on how certain industries are doing in a particular community. So okay thank you. It's as accurate as it can get. Okay. Uh Councilman Dempsey. Yeah. I think we might have touched on this just in passing uh a few months ago, but any chance of getting back the
wings and waves hair show or something equivalent because I remember that was a very impressive event and that really seemed to highlight our airport. Um any chance of that coming? So, we we've had discussions um and in partnership with
the um the the Daytona CVB um Daytona area CBB. Um it it it takes a significant investment up front. Embry Riddle used to sponsor that event um back when we had it years ago. Um not sure about the appetite for them to
sponsor it at this point. Uh for us, the county to sponsor it. uh last estimates were somewhere in the neighborhood of $250,000 to have that event. And then plus you have inind service costs and um VSO and and and supporting community law
enforcement cost. So if that's something that this council would like to um look into, then definitely we have the information where we can engage that conversation. Was there any uh type of economic data from those events? Um, I would have to go back and do some
research and get you that, but that Yeah, that could be achieved. Yeah, if you could get that and kind of forward it to us because that was a really impressive event. I'd like to see it come back. Actually, I work very closely with Lori because um um Lori with the Daytona CBB has a a business
relationship with a a an entity that was looking at bringing that on board here. So, um, we were kind of questioning the, uh, amount of dollars it would take in order for something like that to happen, but if we can, um, have some other
supporting interests that want to come in and sponsor this, something we can look into. Councilman Kent. Thank you, Chairman. Uh, just just briefly, Council uh, Cyrus, just a a couple of of brief things that I would add. Um, and I love
to see the partnership with the advertising and I thought the, you know, there's a limited amount of time they have and I love that they showcased the beach and they showcased the Daytona 500. It was wholesome and I would just say we're also more than that, you know.
Um, I would love to, you know, see see something in there about sport fishing. It's a huge thing off our coast and it would draw people in to to want to participate in that. We have a minor league baseball team here. You know, a quick clip of of something like that and
possibly even a session of the dog friendly session of the beach would make me smile also. But the other thing I wanted to share with you was um something I'd love for you to start implementing when you get in front of any crowd, like we have a decent crowd here today, is to always remind people that Daytona Beach International Airport
is the best boutique airport in the nation. And people don't realize what a true gem it is. I always choose to fly in and out of Daytona because of its efficiency, its effectiveness of getting
the job done close to home. People don't even know that if they had a small I heard this from from you all. If you had a small pocketk knife your grandfather gave you and they stopped you in TSA, Daytona Beach International Airport, the county will pay to have it mailed back to your house or if you brought too much
cologne or perfume, they will they will package it and then send it back to you. So when you get home from your trip, they have small gifts for kids when they get off airlines. They have small gifts for adults during special holidays. They have postcards that they will mail for
you with postage included. It's a wonderful, wonderful airport and it needs to be showcased every chance you're in front of a microphone. Thank you, Cyrus. Thank you for that. Thank you, Councilman Santiago. Troy forgot one thing. The TSA agents are very friendly
there, too. Big deal. Less than 10 minute waits with Yeah. Less than 10-minute waits. All right. Thank you very much, gentlemen. Now, go get all those people that are going to Sanford for cheap flights, bring them here. Absolutely.
Thank you. Thank you. And item U. Thank you, chair. Um, this item I'm very very happy about and I know uh our residents in Daytona Beach Shores are elated at the fact that
uh we're making progress with respect to that park. I know it took a while but I'm glad you're here that you can explain why and where we're at in the progress of of rebuilding that park. Jessica Fentress, Felicia County Coastal Director. Uh we're really excited about Frank Rendon Park coming out for
construction from hurricane repairs in 2022. It was a significant endeavor. This um we had similar failures to Edwin Peek Park, but as you may remember, Edwin Peek, I believe, was only open for 4 months before the seaw wall fell in
the ocean. Um Frank Rendan is an older park. It did not meet a lot of the current building codes. So, we kind of had to redesign this one from ground up where Pec Park, we could just take the construction plans and put them back out to bid and just build the same thing we just built. Um, we will we've got a lot
of work to do before we can start driving the sheet piles. We're anticipating um we're going to get through July 4th with Frank Rendan Park open, but we're probably looking at post July 4th a closure to the park so that we try to get as many seaw wall panels in as
possible before we really hit that September, October, November time. Uh so thank you for that and the big emphasis on the fact that it had to be rebuilt. uh it is an older park and that was some area that uh of
concern some of the residents they didn't quite understand. They saw other parks being rebuilt or I lack of a better word being fixed to where they can visit those parks but they couldn't understand why Frank Random wouldn't uh because it is an older park and because sheep pilings have to be driven in
because but I'm also glad to hear that we're going to wait a little bit so we can keep that that park relatively open until after the holiday and then we can really get to it. So, thank you very much for the explanation of that. Thank you, chair. Thank
you. All right. Uh, Councilman Johansson. Yes. Items O and P, please, for comment. Okay. So, I think I only need Donna, but Ben, thanks for coming. Um I I just want
to highlight uh for comment and Donna you can steer me in a different direction but this is uh um not the kickoff but this is the first of a a bunch of contracts that we're about to do task orders on for the transform 386
for the the program and these are both storm water uh studies. Is that correct? Yes sir. Actually, there's five items. L, which is actually design for the first um infrastructure project that um we're moving forward for design. Um
that's Lantern Park in South Daytona. And then we have four storm water studies. And all all of those are in the land. We've had others that have come before you, too. So, we're moving as quickly as we can to get the scopes through, get task assignments done, and get your approval. And
and this is for Ian, but now that we've cracked the code on how to do this, the the Milton money will be executed much quicker than than before. Correct. Well, the time frame for their approval is much shorter. They have 45 days from when we submitted our action plan and
then we'll have an environmental review and then we'll be able to start spending the money. But we will spend in terms of infrastructure funds, we will spend the EN dollars first and Milton subsequently. they'll kind of be put into a similar pot, but we will try and expend the Eian dollars first because
there is a time frame associated with ex the expenditure of those dollars. And we have six years from the time that the contract with HUD is signed. So, is it safe to assume that if we have a hurricane and get money, you extend your job here for six years beyond that
hurricane? Uh, I'm a drop, sir. Okay. I tried. All right. Thanks a lot, Donna. You're doing great work. That's all. Thank you sir. Drop is voluntary, right? I don't think she answered your question. That takes us to item three.
Um, thank you all for your followup. Um, the Valuchia values veterans program and Dr. Brad Burbal will present that it looks like. Yes, sir. Members of council, um thank you for the
opportunity to talk about our Valuchia values veterans program. This is um something that council directed uh staff to come back with. Um and really what you have before you is a comprehensive program to make Valuchia County Florida's
premier veteran community. Um we're the first in the county or first in the state for a county to lead such a coordinated effort, a public private partnership. um that basically is supporting our veterans. Um we support them and they support us. So I do want to recognize the individuals in the
audience, the veterans that came out when Scott asked them to. So thank you ladies and gentlemen for being here today. Appreciate you. Appreciate your [Applause] support. So I'm going to quickly go through the PowerPoint presentation. One
of the things that we're doing as part of this comprehensive approach is really modernizing our veteran services program. We'll see in early 2026 really making our services more accessible. Our team has seized about 16,000 vets at our four offices last year and so we're
going to make our our services more accessible. We have some people that may want to meet online with us. Um they'll be able to register and do appointments online. We'll have wait list times uh for each of our lobbies. There'll be a kiosk check-in system, but really a unified case management system that our
our vet services officers will use to as the people as our veterans work through their cases with our individual vet service officers. If they show up at a vet office today, we don't know what they're there for until they come in the office and talk to us. Um, now with the
case management system, we'll have notes about their previous visit. Um, we will know why they are there. So we've can we've can do some um background research before they're there. Really the focus of the the initiative is four u strategic pillars
public initiatives and I'm going to go through each of these rather than just read the slide. So what are we looking at in terms of public initiatives? Um some countywide discounts. So, if you're a veteran, um 10% discount on some of our pavilions. Um free the month of
November for Veterans Veterans Day will be free camping at our 11 preserves. Um the campsites at our 11 preserves. Designated parking. I'm sure you've all seen that this is reserved for military or veterans at many of the places. Bass
Pro Shop is the one that I can think of I've seen of last. We're going to do that at 14 public facilities that are owned by the county. Um, Operation Outdoor Freedom. This is uh basically for disabled veterans a hunting opportunity that's coordinated by the Department of A. Right now, we have a
strong program with two hunts annually. We're going to um make four. And this coincides with if you if the council remembers, you agreed to us applying for a grant for the tracked chair um that will allow veterans now to um take part
in in these hunts out on our preserves. U veteran support endowment. Uh would be remiss if not recognizing the United Way of Valuchia and Flaggler County and their community foundation. Um, we're working to establish an endowment, an endowment that will
continually fund the veteran standown. So, rather than using county resources, our goal is to uh fund raise uh $50,000 to establish that endowment. And we'll get 4% spendable each year as that continues to grow in principle, but we'll have some operational dollars to
support. It's a big thing I did at UF while I was there and established multiple to support programs. It's a a unique initiative for us, but uh also the Patriot Pass is a library card we've made specifically for veterans so they can um you know go to the libraries,
libraries, veterans recognized by county council at least twice a year. We'd like to bring um individuals before you who have continued to serve after their service. Um, Vet Tix is an organization who provides discounted tickets to uh veteran families who may not have the
means to attend events otherwise. And then lastly, um, support veteran entrepreneurship. We have a lot of, uh, veterans who have the entrepreneurial spirit. And so we've had our team trained by Lou and his team over at economic development. So they
know the resources they have and can essentially um provide those to the individuals or refer them directly and have a a warm handoff rather than a cold handoff. The next pillar is recognizing our veteran employees. We have over 100
veteran employees. So having a recognition event with council each year on in November um to just say thank you and give them a service pin, let them know that we appreciate their service um both in the military and to our community. Now spotlighting our veterans
and and county media, um the newsletter that we do, uh a county email chain. This is something that Scott's already started with our vets that they're very appreciative of um to let them know about things that are going on in the veteran services world, but also offering our services to our employees
in terms of getting them the benefits that they've so rightly deserved. Uh addressing critical issues. So when we talk about vet population, there are some, you know, really um intrigent issues that are affecting this community over and over and that is suicide, um
homelessness and mental health issues. And so we have partnered with organizations to help us address these issues as we move forward. The West Falucia Habitat for Humanity uh would like to form a partnership with us and it's aou where basically we're helping find and we're working with Halifax
Urban Ministries. So, as people come out of barracks of hope, we will hopefully be able to identify families um who will be built for veterans homes on on Walts Avenue here in Dand over the next couple of years. Next is many standowns. Uh food
insecurity is a big issue for some of our veterans. So, having these food giveaways um working with Farm Share um to provide for our vets is another avenue we like to explore. Veterans Safe Place Program. This is a a nonprofit
organization. We don't have anou with them, but the resources are all free. Our team's been trained um on basically identifying, you know, how to react in a in a situation where someone may be um you know, want to take their life. Part of this is we're asking
council to approve twous with those organizations. So, the community foundation to establish the endowment, which I will say, um, we've got $10,000 from sponsorships we've done this year at the veteran standown. So, our communities who have supported, um, our
events are really what's driving the the fundraising for that endowment. Uh, and then United or sorry, West Valuchia Habitat I mentioned. So, what we want to do is position Valuchia County as the employer of choice for veterans. We want them to choose Valuchia County. And how do we do
that? Um, there's an employee Florida veterans website that we're going to start posting jobs on. There's also a Florida statute we're asking council if you so choose to approve today which says essentially in Lake County, you know, Lake County has done it. So, um,
it essentially says that, um, if you have a service connected disability, if you were in combat, if you were a combat veteran and you were injured and you work for the county and you're going to a medical appointment for that combat related uh, disability or issue, um, you
will provide admin leave up to 48 hours for the year. Um, there is a whole documentation process that's outlined. We, it's a state statute. uh there's only a handful of counties that that have implemented it. Um but we believe that it's one of the things that will attract people to our county. We're also
going to get certified by the uh a national organization who basically um says yes, this organization, this employer is committed to hiring veterans. It's the gold platinum and medallion program. There's only one other organization in the county. Two two organizations in the county that
have this certification will be the third. And then militarybased recruitment. So what we're looking at the ask today is to approve the program proposal authorize the execution of theus and direct implementation of the admin leave statute and I'm here to
answer any questions that you may have. Okay. Thank you very much uh Councilman Santiago. Mr. Chairman, I see my colleague Jake had chimed in. I I will yield to you. This is your baby and I will uh yield to you, my friend, if you want to go first. I don't have any
questions. I have comments. Oh, great. Great. Well, I'll recognize you, my friend. Thank you for bringing this initiative forward. I know this was something important to you, and I'm glad we're here at this day. Um, Brad, I think you I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I think you'd said about the goal here also is to make Valuchia
the most veteran friendly county in the 67. Yes. In your opinion, based on what you've seen out there, does that get us there? Yes, sir. We're the only one who has a coordinated effort that's focused on veterans. So, this is a whole of community approach. We've established
partnerships. I would say you you asked us to do this in January and I feel like we've coming back a bit late, but it was important for us to get community buyin and and having partners that say we're not going to use all government resources to do this. We're going to use public private resources to say you're
important to us, you know, and that endowment. I I love that idea, the 50,000. I think that's a low bar. I think if we put our collective bodies together, not only what we know up here and and and major philanthropists that we have in our community, we should be able to blow that number out the door
and uh I'll certainly do my part. We'll welcome that. Thank you again, Jake. So, I should say that the 50,000 is the minimum to establish the endowment. So, once we got to 50, we can get going. Thank you, Brad. Uh there when you read through the entire program, it's um it's
pretty impressive. you've you this is why I think it came up in January. This is why it it took to now. There's a lot packed in here and a lot of it deals with homelessness for vets. Um and I know vets get some currently they get
some discount on property taxes, but I don't see anything about that in here. Is that something we need to do with the state? Um, so it is a state benefit and we have a actually a resource guide embedded in in the the document that
outlines the state benefits. So not only do you get a property tax exemption, but if you are a trades person, so an electrical, you know, if you're getting an electrical contractor's license, you are exempt from that licensing fee as well. So there are state benefits um
that we plan to highlight as part of our program, but really they're administered by the legislature and state and know Are they uh triggered by uh strictly by disability or does any vet get a some
kind of a discount? I'll turn to Scott, but I think if you are honorably discharged, you you would have you have to be service connected and that it increases by a percentage of disability. Yes, sir. So, in order for a veteran to get a property tax exemption, they have
to be service connected. Um so once they're service connected um at anywhere above 10% then they do get a discount. There's also another property tax exemption for combat veterans over the age of 65. So if a veteran let's say is
80% service connected um and there those wounds are deemed combat related and they're over the age of 65 then they roughly get an 80% you know discount on those property taxes the same as their disability. And then if they are 100% permanent in total uh then they get
total tax exemption. So those are the current um exemptions that are you know honored here in the county and across the state. Explain what service connected. So service connected is Thank you. Service connected is for any injury, illness or disease that a
service member uh develops or get because of active duty service. So, um, classic example, if you are, you know, a veteran, if you're a service member and you hurt your knee while conducting some type of physical training and you get out of service and that knee still
bothers you, then you could file a disability claim and then the VA will compensate you monetarily and they'll also assume all um health care responsibilities for that injury. Uh, another example is all of our Vietnam veterans who served over, you know, in
Vietnam or off the coast of Vietnam. If they were exposed to certain herbicides and developed certain diseases because of that exposure, you know, any of those disabilities will be deemed service related. So based on the, you know, that that is what a service connected disability is. Okay. Thank you,
Mr. Chairman. That it Okay. Uh, yes. Councilman Santiago, I'll see if my friend wants to make a motion. Uh, Councilman Johansson. Move to approve item three, Valia Values Veterans Program. Thank you. Second,
David. Okay. Um, we'll approve the program and then I believe Brad would like us to come back and approve these three uh your three recommended actions. Or can we do that? Can you make the motion to do all of that at once? You
mean theus all at once? There's three Jake wants to amend. Oh, it's We can do it all at once and I'd like to. Yes, I'll second that. Okay. Uh, any questions? Comments? Comments?
Yes. Go ahead, Councilman Johansson. So, I asked for this in in January. Um, something I had been thinking about for a long time. And uh uh fortunately or unfortunately, it was right when Scott
was taking over from Bob and learning the ropes and whatnot and and we had a uh we had a standown that that was breathing new life. So, uh I asked them to get through that before we briefed this. They probably could have been done
a few months earlier, but uh uh but I appreciate waiting because I did want the uh I didn't want the the the standout to go down without a hedge first. This program is is a a phenomenal
program, more robust than I ever thought it could be to get here this quick. So, Scott and and the BSOS and Brad and the team, um, thank you so much. Uh, there are other
things that that were already happening, right? We we have more veteran veteran service officers. We have more people getting support and and I just came back from a a Korean War veterans uh uh
speaking engagement today where where they they're still not being seen quick enough as well as they could be. Community care, which is when the VA um uh contracts you out to local local
vendors. Um it's it's hard to find a doctor who takes community care that you trust. So um that's stuff that I will continue to work on. Uh David, you you made a good point. Um uh and there's some things that Chairman Brower asked
that's a state statute. Um, I've recently met some new friends in Tallahassee and and I am looking forward to le leveraging those relationships to uh get the state
to work hard to give even more benefits at the state level in the in the following couple months. So, next year we can maybe see some of those uh uh occur from from the state legislature. Let let's let them get their budget
approved first, though. Um but but Brad, Scott, team, thank you for everything you do. And for all you veterans out there, please spread the word there. What Brad briefed and what's in this little folder is is he just touched the
the the tip of it. So, uh, take a look, know what you can do, and if there's something, by the way, that you think the county is not doing that we can do, uh, short of building you homes, well, we're already doing that. Um, that then please let one of them, one of our VSOs
or or or one of us know and and we'll do everything we can to make that happen. I appreciate it. Thank you, chairman. Thank you for your comments. We do have one member of the uh public, probably the service public, uh that would like to speak before I
call for a vote. Uh Ray Combmes, how you doing, council? Uh Ray Coons, Veteran Enforcers Motorcycle Association. Uh we're a group of uh veterans, first responders, firefighters, and uh select uh civilians. I can tell you right now
that uh this program that you have in front of you has already affected my group. Uh we have a Memorial Day ride coming up on this Saturday. Uh it's going to be for three disabled veterans. The proceeds are going to them. And uh Scott approached me not too long ago and
he said he partner partner with us on this event. And actually he's doing a mini standown within city hall. That's where the event is taking place. City Hall Saturday the 24th. So Scott, thank you for partnering
with me and uh like I said, this is already affecting us. Thank you. Thank you very much. The service continues. Uh no other comments, no other questions. I'll uh we have a
motion by Jake Johansson, second by David Santiago. All in favor of approving the program and theou and the direct imple implementation of Florida statute
110.119. Please say I. I. Any opposed? And programs approved unanimously 7 to zero. [Applause] Mr. Chairman, can I take a quick moment
of personal privilege before she leaves because we have one one of my colleagues, well, former colleagues in the Deltona city commissioner, Marissa, Vila Vasquez. I want to recognize her. Thank you for coming. And Mayor Miller, I know you're here, too. So, Marissa does a lot of veterans work, so I appreciate you being here. Thank you,
Mr. Chair. Does she have a firefighter shirt on? [Music] Okay, that brings us to item four, approval of award to Banan Development Group for affordable housing development funding. And you're
back. I saw my slide back here. There we are. Thank you. No, it's it's my fault. Um, so, uh, so this is a this was tabled in March. This is a development that is our first development that's going to take advantage of provisions of the live
local act and it is, uh, a minimum of 45 units uh, directly less than half a mile from Sunreil Station. So, one of the things that given that we went through a competitive process and and are providing some funding to support uh
this development, um we were able to negotiate some provisions uh as part of the deal. Otherwise, we would not they would uh they would be able to develop this um without any input from council. And so, we've worked with the developer since the last time he was here. He's a
good partner with us. And so what we've done is um what the negotiated provisions of our funding so it's part of the finance agreement um would be the construction of a of a sidewalk from the complex to sun rail within the county um right ofway. Uh the bring the access
roads to county standards using existing county rightway if that's necessary. Um provide workforce housing. They were focused on veteran I believe veterans disabled and seniors. We really like to see a mix in these complexes. Um so they're going to focus on workforce
housing with um a public service emphasis. Again, they cannot mandate this. We cannot mandate it, but it's simply a preference. If their applications coming in at the same time, and one is a public service official, works in public service and is income qualified, um they would be selected if
they meet all of the other um qualifications. Lastly, and I think most importantly to this council, there are some provisions um of the lowincome housing tax credits that allow these developers to
um exercise a property tax exemption after year 15 of the agreement. Uh what we've done is we've negotiated a payment in lie of taxes with the developer to ensure that they're paying um their their county portion of the tax bill
from year 16 to 50 which is the affordability period. Um so those are the changes before you um based on the feedback from council here to answer any questions that you may have. Thank you. Let's start with questions. Uh, Council, Vice Chair Reinhardt, I didn't have a
question. It was more of a a comment. If I could chair, do we have any questions first? Yes. Councilman Dempsey. Um, just to uh remind everybody, uh, when we talked about this last time, I think we had talked about the high end
of affordable housing being for a two-bedroom, two bath of being about $1,800 a month. Is that right? Go ahead. All right. So, yes, there is an affordability structure. So, it can be as high. It depends on your income level and every household is a little
bit different. So, some of the units would only be between $420 and $590 a month for your very lowincome household, whereas some could go up to that $1,500 $1,600 for your higher income households. It it varies depend all
within the same complex. Correct. Yes. Okay, that's all. Thanks. Thank you. Any other questions? Okay. Uh, Vice Chair Matt Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair. Um, thank you for addressing the issues that we had. Thank you for
the negotiations that you went through um, in order to accommodate what we got on this and understanding live local and how it plays. We we get the first understanding of it right now. So, that being said and seeing this and reviewing this, I'll make the motion to approve.
And we have a motion to approve by Vice Chair Reinhardt. Second. Second. second by uh Councilman Johansson who also has
um a comment. So this is very interesting and it did come back with some with some changes. So thank you very much. Um, one of the things I want to make sure the public is aware of, if if you
hearken back to, not that it was that long ago, but but the fuel farm conversation where there's a subdivision that's built and kind of encroached a
long time ago in a zoning change into industrial area. And those people are not too happy that they live next to an industrial area that could possibly have a fuel farm on it. So here we are living under the Live
Local Act where we're about to build property in an area that's zoned industrial and it's surrounded by industrial. I think there's a a pre-cast yard, a pipe yard, the
circus, right? The circus is over there. The remains of the circus remains and and other industrial nearby. Um, so, so I understand it's affordable, but we have to come to grips
that residential is going to be next to industrial for the foreseeable future and everything that comes with that. Noise, smells, trucks, and overall industrial activity.
We just got to be aware of what this Live Local Act is serving up for us. And we got to realize that when those people come here, you remember this day because probably given our brothers,
this council wouldn't have approved this live or this uh residence being or this residential being that close to industrial. So, um, we are where we are, but I'm I'm a little concerned. This is the start
of some pain in the neck for some future, uh, elected officials in 10 to 15 years. So, thanks, Councilman Dempsey. Um, yeah, Jake, I really appreciate that because you're spot on in your analysis. Um, and that's
why I'm against this for the reasons I've said before, which I guess I can briefly rehash now. I mean, there's no guarantee that Sunreil is even going to be there come 2036. I think that's our opt- out date. Am I
correct? Yes. And there's a large portion of the community and I think a large portion of the council back in the days historically that would like to get out of Sun Rail if at all possible. It is definitely a losing venture. If I was king for a day, it'd be gone. But
unfortunately, I can't make that call myself. We are just now going to find out exactly how much Sunreil is going to cost us because DOT's pulled out. So, we have no idea how bad this is going to be for the county until we have our first
opt out, realistic opt out. And if we allow this to happen and let these apartments or these residences be built, imagine you're one of the tenants or one of the people who've bought into it and now come 2036, we opt out of Sun Rail. I would
think it's got more of a chance of being even heavier industry out there than currently. I mean, right now it kind of sounds good because Sunrail people can go down and work in Orlando. It's workforce housing. I get that. But that's one of the main reasons
why I don't think it's fair for us to use taxpayer money to invest into an area that may that may very well be desolate um come 2036 if Sunrail is pulled from this area. And uh so I don't
think we should be um putting taxpayer money into this. If the investor wants to do it himself, then so be it. Um secondly, uh I think we're at a well we are at a historic point in our economy because basically we are at the highest
level of housing inventory in history in Florida. Um back during the boom we had I talked about this before in 2022 we had uh 300,000 added residents to Florida with only 40,000 houses in
inventory. That's now flipped in the last two years. As of the end of December of 24, we've gone from a net gain of 300,000 people into Florida down to 40,000 people. But yet, our housing inventory has gone from 40,000 to
180,000. So, there is a glut of inventory. There's a glut of apartments. Last time we were here, I went all through Zillow in Dand and found uh multiple apartments, two-bedroom, two baths that were available for 1,200 bucks. And this is proposing upwards of
1,600,700 I think last time they said $1,800 a month rent. So it's not necessarily affordable. So I I just don't think that the county should be in the business of competing with the private industry. Again, I've always touted lazair
economics um a free economy. I think anytime the government thinks we know more than we do, we mess things up. And so I don't think we should be adding 84 more dwellings into our local economy when we've already got a glut. I mean, we've got houses that are sitting on the
market for longer periods than ever. And we've got more inventory than ever. Those unsold houses are going to become apartment units. And the lack of tenants because more people are not staying, they're moving out of the area. It's just going to drive down the prices. We
just need to be patient and let the free market do its thing. Housing prices are already coming down. Apartments are already coming down and we just need to stay out of it. And um I just I don't think if you pulled the people of the community, I think most would say they don't want they're all complaining about
too much development. So I really think they wouldn't like their tax dollar being used to incentivize more development. So that's why I'm a no. Thanks, guys. Councilman Santiago. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um, can can Brad, can you uh remind us again the source of the
funding? Yes, sir. So, it's a grant funding. So, it's a small portion of home, which is the federal ship program, and a larger portion of SHIP. Believe 200,000 in home and uh 1.5 million in ship. So, it's earmarked for um this purpose. It can't
be used for anything else. Earmked for affordable housing, but not for this particular correct affordable housing. It could be other affordable housing type rental development or home ownership activities. So if we if we didn't approve this, it would just go back into the ship funds, the million or
whatever, and then it be used in other ship uh related activities. So we do have a time frame on on being able to spend the money. I'd have to come back to you to say if you know we felt we could find projects here. Here's the issue is that we are as the interest
rate rose um our most popular program used to be first-time home buyer. Um as the interest rate rose more more and more people were priced out of a mortgage and so that's why we have moved to repairs um as this council has well knows um and emermergency repairs and
rehab um and reconstruction. Those those take time and a lot of staff to get money out the door. And so, uh, I would feel more comfortable if I could do an analysis to share with you whether we felt like we could get the money out the door or move, you know, we would do our
best to keep it. Understand? Can I pull up the map real quick? I just want to get, you know, my colleagues bring up some good points regarding the industrial side. I just had to pull up this area. Can you tell us where this is in relative to that? I see Old New York there, 44. Where would it be? I think this So, um, do you have the print out?
We can give them Actually, Chris, it's the last slide on the PowerPoint. Okay. My apologies. Right there. Yep. All right. So, you see that the outline in red there kind of to the middle of the the
the paper there, that that's the Sunrail station. And then to the um where the yellow is is the where the proposed complex will be. And so to the left and if you want to go a little bit I guess north say northwest those are industrial
facilities there. It's completely surrounded by industrial facilities. Yes. Okay. You know my colleagues make some good points regarding this industrial u placement. Um, well, I know they're
using the Live Local Act. Um, do we need to subsidize it? I I'm turning into a nonfan of its location. Um, though I realize and respect the work that staff has done and your guys always do a great job,
but you know, I I kind of use a I guess an old analogy, you know, it's affordable housing is on the other side of the tracks. You know, that saying that's always happened, right? Um, and I don't want to create that kind of environment. Um, and I don't think we
should subsidize it. So that commentary, even though I think last meeting I was a advocate of it, um, I still think we have a place to play because these funds are available in certain ways to help with affordable housing. and I kind of leverage a little bit of what you said,
Don, to the free market, but I don't go 100% towards you, but I I kind of I get you. Um, and uh, you know, that that that moves me quite a bit. So, unless someone changes me back over, um, I'm going to be down on this with a lot of
respect for the work you all did. I don't take that lightly. um that today's commentary kind of moved me quite a bit and I'd rather find a way to spend that ship money elsewhere creatively within the the premise of the grant. Thank you,
Mr. Chair. Thank you. Would you keep that slide up and unless Mr. Robbins wants to see a different one, but um Councilman Robbins. Thanks, Chair. Uh Brad. Brad, you're always smiling. I noticed that, man. You're always happy for you.
It's hard to yell at people that are smiling. I think I learned that in the restaurant business. Hey, so um last discussion I know it was tabled I brought up um some concerns too, a lot of which I share with my my colleagues. I know. Can you explain to
us again just refresh my memory um 0 to 15 they get benefits. They're getting some benefits here. But my strategy uh to to make up for this thing because you know the cards aren't in our our favor. or if they want to do it, they they can do it several different ways here.
What I was trying to do was maximize or minimize uh the um funding handout but recuperate it on the back end through tax savings that we could uh you know generate some so can you explain to us
uh the findings where we're at on the 0 to 15 and then the 15 to year 50 was uh this group uh I know I'd offered uh my support if they can come back and say hey we're going to relinquish our uh
statutory rights to to get X benefit within year 15 to 50. Were we able to capture that? Yes. So, that was the pilot program that we discussed. I think you were out of the room. So, I'll reiterate that first 15 years um they don't get property tax exemptions as
part of the low-income housing tax credit. U but year 16 they are eligible for a property tax exemption. So what we've done with the developer is uh is we've negotiated a pilot a payment in lie of taxes. According to our attorney we can't say you can't take the
exemption uh which they could take but then you could ask for repayment of the county funds. So echo forever you know all of our taxing districts that are county taxing districts. the developer has agreed to years 16 through 50 um pay
the tax property taxes on on how much on the county funds. How much would that yield? So Corey did the analysis for us today because we knew this would be a question. Um so it's looking like if if we took today there this developer we have a relationship with and we've
worked with in the past past. Um so we took a the current um property that they have. So, it looks like the total county millage on that property, if it was returned to us, um,
is 11.128, it would be about $43,000 this year. And compound that from from and and it's probably going to go up. So, between 15 and 50. Yes. So, so it would be essentially from 25 to 40. 2040
would be the end of the, you know, the that low-inccome housing tax where they're they're required to pay. So 2040 basically to um how much we we get what's the big number? It'd be over 1.5 million. Okay.
So, and then I would just be remissed if I didn't share. So if they, you know, if this gets built anyways with low-income housing tax credits, they will they will be able to realize that exemption year 15 through 50 without our because this is our funding agreement. We're we
negotiated that as part of our funding. So So council, you know, my kind of theory behind this trying to take a soup sandwich that we're we're uh and make something out of it, which is hard to do. And
um I I think we can possibly look at this and make this into a model because there's certain things that we have to do or they're going to do it anyway. So why not negotiate it, minimalize it uh to our benefit or to the taxpayer benefit. So that was kind of my strategy behind it. I'm interested in what my
colleagues have to to see if it's worth our while, maybe an option. If not, u we'll just kind of go from there. So, thank you. Uh Brad, the on that slide
the well this current property what is it zoned now? Industrial which is a benefit of the live local act. So there live local they could build lowincome housing on it as much as they wanted. They yes and we don't we
don't receive any tax revenue under live local. So, it it depends on the other in their capital stack, there's different funding um there's different funding areas. And so, if if you get a low-income housing tax credit, which um they're very
competitive for because it will be in the, you know, a transit oriented development, um if they get that, um they will they will have to pay taxes the first 15 years, but then at year 16, they become eligible for an exemption. Okay. the the property just to
the That's all right. I didn't know if you somebody had something to add in the property. There's a big square just to the uh I think that's south of it. Is that also zoned industrial? It's it's all zoned industrial I believe, sir. And
Suzanne did want to you want to help me? Brad, I I just think for the council's benefit, if this uh item is not approved, but the project is developed under live local, the opt out tax exemption uh is presumably going to go away. So, the property would not owe any
local taxes. That's that's my understanding. Thank you. Yeah, it's a dilemma. Um, when the fuel farm situation came up, what it I kept in my mind trying to figure out, well, who who was here
first, industrial or all these neighborhoods? Mr. Kent is next. He might be able to touch on this a little bit as since he was a Orman commissioner. I think that Bayer Creek had been there a long time. Orman Lakes
was a more recent one. Uh but probably the industrial preceded either of those neighborhoods. Correct me if I'm wrong. If if you know Mr. Kent, but here's th this is a really good it's something that we have to
consider. Um um however, the the thing that may make a difference for me is that the people this is going to be affordable housing. The people that are moving there will know it's an industrial area. Now, will
that keep him from complaining in the future? Nobody knows. Um, okay. Uh, Councilman Kent, thank you, Chairman. To answer your question, I don't believe that the fuel farm would have been possible without a county council
preceding us changing that land use that they did when I think in 2004, if my memory was right, they made a change that allowed that nonsense to even come forward. Um, so I think that that will
answer that part of the question. And then to um Councilman Johansson and to um Councilman Dempsey, the only problem with both of your comments is that they're riddled with common
sense. It's industrial. If the property owner wants to do it on his own, guess what? Do it on your own. Um you know, I don't I don't like deals where, you know, you're darned if you do and you're darned if you don't. I don't I don't like that when it's put before us. So, Don, you've you've swayed me on this
one. Thank you. Uh, Councilman Santiago. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Just some follow-up questions along where Danny was was going. So, under the proposal in front of us, if we accept it as it is, years
15 through year 50 or 60 50, we start to reap the tax benefits of it. Correct. but not years 1 through 15. Correct. And that's what the developers agreed to, right? Correct. As part of this
funding agreement, if this funding agreement is not there and they take advantage of the low-income housing tax credit, we would not recoup any funding from year 16 to 40 or 50. And you that's what you estimated approximately 1.5 million during that direction using
today's military. So I get I get it's a so wag wild ass guess. Okay. But I get it's the best you could do. Now we call extra, we call that extrapolation in the scientific community. Um so why does he need the money?
So I think that the you know there's a capital stack um that they're um using like many of the other one many of the other uh affordable housing developers. Yes. Okay. Okay. Thank you. And we and I I I would be remiss if I say we put this out as a
solicitation and this this it was a competitive process and this development one it was more prepared than the other two I believe that we saw significantly more prepared. One more question. Who owns the land? The developer. Okay. Thank and he closed on it or it's still
under contract. Mr. Kiss is here. So under contract. Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Councilman Johansson, I just, you know, Danny brings up a good
point. Um, it sounds like if we walk away, it could be developed and they figure out a different way to to solve their their capital problem. Um and and then we sit back here and and don't get any
revenue at the county uh at the county level for quite some years. Um if we give them a hand now with the with the ship and the home money to help them with their
capital stack, we benefit from years 15 to 50 with about a lot of money. Um, I'm still hung up on the fact that we're putting people in industrial, although there's farm homes off to the
it seems like the south and west there. But but I still fear for those people coming up and complaining when somebody builds to the to the north of them in those two plots and it and it's a uh a gravel crusher or or something of that
nature. Um it's just not a it's not a good place to put people. I mean, these are going to be the citizens of of Valuchia County and and and we're we're just
we're I I understand it's affordable and maybe it's affordable cuz it's there. Um but I don't know. It's just it's a it's a tough nut to crack here. I don't want to walk away and then lose lose
that revenue because because the arrangement can't be made and and them uh the developer or somebody else develops that property in the whole stinking square for that reason for that matter. So, um I'm not saying it's a
damned if we do, it's a damned if we don't, but we we know that that we're going to get our shoes muddy either way. Thank you. If I may, because I'm here to get it right, not be right. Is to the answer to your question. Mr. Kiss has informed me
that to the south and west is residential residentially zone. Not completely sounded by industrial like I said. So, okay. Does he own it? I don't believe so. Okay.
Okay. Uh, Councilman Robbins. Thanks, sharers. It's my my last bite. Don, Jake, uh, uh, Troy, I I I agree with everything up here and and I look at this a little bit of a, um, a chess game. And if I was
him, I'd want this council to say no, cuz then I don't have to pay all that money uh that that it ordinarily um would have or uh wouldn't have to pay. Um, but but somehow too, we have to consider, and I don't like this either,
right? Um but somehow we've gotten into the the mindset it's probably just not in Valuchia County but but trying to associate to to create affordable housing uh for instance in like Halifax plantation it's almost like a double negative like saying jumbo shrimp uh it
doesn't exist. If you look at all the affordable housing throughout probably the country, you're going to see it's in less desirable areas, whether they're low uh homes that are maybe enclosed basins or home areas that have issues,
uh inner cities, uh high crime next to certain things. For God's sake, we I think this board, we approved a housing development next to a a landfill uh or a dump. Um, but it's going to be more affordable. There's things you
can't expect um any different for for affordability. You can't put it out in in some of these higherend areas because it's not affordable. Uh so, you know, this expectation that we're going
to get that affordability in in in better areas, it's I think it's a pipe dream with all respect. Um, so you know, um, at the end of the day too, uh, uh, life is about choices.
You know, I I feel for some of the folks that that come in, uh, that complain, uh, about noise or or, uh, living next to the airport. Uh, I don't agree with it, but but often times too, uh, nobody forced people to buy in those areas,
right? So um there's a sense of responsibility I think that we've lost along the way as well where uh government should be here to solve all of our problems and I think the complete opposite. Um we have a lot of selfacountability as well and I think it
needed to be said. Um uh but you know the stuff up by by the fuel farm uh discussion uh been there for a long time. Industrial's been there for a long time. City has done uh some some stuff up there that to change things. the county has uh but um it's not going
away. Same thing with Spruce Creek flying. Same thing around the Orman airport. Same thing around Massie airport down in my district. Uh you can't buy in these areas and ex I just don't understand the the rationale uh for it. And um you know that's part of
why they're priced the way they're the way they're priced. So I'd just ask council can kind of consider this thing. Like I said, the ball's in his court. Uh, if you think about this on a on a business end, if I was him, I' I'd want us to say no and then I' I'd go full
throttle. Um, and then that way I' I wouldn't have to uh be bound to some of this other stuff. But I think also too, we can use this as a model if we do go forward um and have a um a need through SHIP or some of these
programs that were were mandated by statute to do X amount. And I don't like it. I'm just letting you know, but I'm trying to salvage this um soup sandwich. Thanks, Vice Chair Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair.
I have, you know, every once in a while we make decisions, we talk about things, things we have to vote on, and we go back and forth, back and forth. This is one um I came in here with a mindset thing. It's under live local. You hit the shot clock issue. you know, we have a certain time frame that we have to go
on that money. Um, and then I listen to Don, then I listen to to David, I listen to Troy, and I'm like, "Wow, you know what? They got a point." But then I listen to Danny, I listen to everybody, you know, and and I guess the things that stand out, 1.5
million, the business end, the term you used. I'm not, you know, we have affordable housing is before all the flooding happened, affordable housing was was the big ticket item. Everybody was talking about it during our campaigns. They were talking about it. And I know that there
are several communities out there that are facing that issue. Every every one of them is. And uh Daytona hitting it with linkage fees. I am not a fan of linkage fees. I can tell you right now. I I'm not afraid to say that. I'm not. Um I think that's up to the voters. I
really do. I think it's up to them. But that being said, we have an issue with affordable housing and that issue needs to be addressed. Um, and again, that 1.5 million that you talk about, years, you know, 15 through 50, I don't think that's something we can walk away from
and turn our back on. Uh, leaving us with nothing. So, I'm going to be a yes on this. Um, you might change my mind again. No, but but I am going to based on that and based on those decisions, I did go back and forth and I respect everybody's
decision up here. I really do, guys. You gave me a lot to think about, but we have to make a decision. So, thank you, Chair, Councilman Santiago. Oh, man. I I won't even look at Matt anymore because I can't convince him. I think I'm kidding, buddy. I appreciate your comments. Um, you know, I think I'm
going to paint the other side of that coin, right? And I I'm going to start with where I kind of just came up with that that old analogy, right? I don't want to create it on other side of the tracks. I've seen it. I've had relatives that have lived on the other side of the tracks
that people have pointed to and I just don't like the location. Um the program, I love it. Don't like the location. And the other side of that coin, Matt, could be what if the property stays industrial
and what if we we do a a concentrated effort to attract something industrial related to come into the area because um and and not to point fingers, I don't think we've really talked about attracting industrial in this county since I've been here, right? And and
maybe it needs to be an initiative of ours. And we have some very competent people in this county that uh that we can unleash to try to do something like that and think of that tax base. A successful attraction of of of
industrial there uh can initiate the tax base from day one and not year 15 and not only to year 50. Right? So I see the 1.5 and the 1.7 I think we're giving them. I may be off on the numbers.
That's a wash for me, right? So, I don't see a net gain there. I'm also concerned that putting a facility like this so far, I'll say off the grid is a strain on services, right? Police with sheriff,
fire, other ancillary services. Uh we have to now send our garbage services a little bit further to pick up more even though it might be a trash service. So, I won't even go there. But the the strain on services uh are going to be
much more and I I see it as a loss, potential loss. Um on the other side of the tracks, as far as a developer, I don't blame you for going under the program. You're a businessman, go for it. If I was in your role, I'd be doing the same thing. But this program
operates on a very competitive uh uh nature in in um the Florida housing uh program that I forgot where they all compete for this pool of money to get this affordable housing program. Us giving that money makes his application much more
lucrative. So don't automatically assume that if we do not approve this that he's going to build anyway. He might with his own money, but I will tell you it won't make his application as lucrative compared to the others. So, not that I want to harm him, but I don't want to apply the assumption that if we don't
give this money that he's going to go and build this anyway. I I think that's that's that's a that's a stretch. I've seen these programs happen in the past. Um, us giving him money makes it happen almost definitely. Um, and you know, he has the contract,
he has the property under contract basically on terms and conditions on getting the necessary approvals from us to do this project. So, um, he has the potential to just walk away from this project also. It's not he may have hard money on it. I'm not sure. But, you know, investors in this in this area,
they know what they're doing. They they invest a certain amount of dollars to get to the point where they think they may get approvals and and then, you know, the the re rewards in. If they don't, then they walk away sometimes and go to the next project. Um, so I'll summarize and repeat. I don't want the
other side of the tracks. I don't think it's a good image for Valuchia to put poor people over there. And I don't think there's going to be a net gain monetarily for our county. I think it's going to be a loss eventually. And I'd rather if I have a $ 1.7 million dollars
right now, I'd rather unleash staff to take those SHIP dollars and help existing residents in our county with all those programs. Um, if we got to hire another person and use that money to get it out the door, I'd support that. Um, but the program I like, the
location, I don't. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Councilman Dempsey. Yeah, just to uh kind of double down on what you're saying, David. Um, you know, we're talking about this becoming workforce housing. So, that would just presume that we're housing people to go to
Orlando to work down in their industrial areas. I think it'd be a better goal for us to make this an entirely industrial area so we can have people from Orlando coming up to Valuchia County to work. And I think probably the mood of your
average taxpayer right now is no more residential development, more industrial type jobs. And so I know this uh like the sheriff's office, the road course there, that's pretty much abandoned now. Um I know we got the old circus uh the
Clyde Batty old circus uh property there which is pretty much not being used. Um, this is a a huge footprint of industrial property and if we could just recruit more industry there. I'd much
rather see a lot of big industry come out there and when these prospective employers come in. I don't want him to be faced with protesters from the local residential housing development up in arms that there's some big industrial
project coming in that's going to disrupt their peace and quiet quiet that they've enjoyed for the last 5 10 years having lived there that long. And again, you know, with CSX, I would much rather see CSX stay in
existence to transport workers from the south up to the land to go work in the factories, in the industries that we've created by having this wonderful industrial complex than just another housing development. I don't think that's going to be a a win. Like David
was saying, I think it'd be better to uh to let just again the free market. I do think that Florida's the leading state on the most prime to have a collapse in residents. I don't even know if they're going to actually go forward with I know
you're saying, "Well, they'll do one or the other." They may not. I mean, they're smart people. And I remember back in ' 06 and ' 07, a lot of projects were just shut down mid- project. Subdivisions, all the infrastructure was done and not one house was built. And we
could be at that point now. So whether they do it or not, that's, you know, at their own risk. If they want to do it, more power to them. But again, I don't think we should put taxpayer money into this. I think we need to leave this more wide open for u an industrial complex. Thanks,
Councilman Robbins. Chair, may I ask um Brad a question, please? Yes, Brad. Do we have another view? Can we see how close uh maybe uh zoom out if we're able to of all the uh the housing around there?
Where's George? Help me out. How many homes do we have in that um vicinity? I I would not be able to speculate at this point without doing the analysis or
So where's the uh guy higher density homes? So yeah, zoom in right there, Chris. I believe that's where it is. Yeah. Yep. That's where it's at. So, you see here to kind of the the east side, I
believe, where Fair Street is, you can see some residential there. Um, so I think he So, in the woods there, I think what you he's asking for I mean, if you see Fair Street on there, the proposal is right to the right of that.
Correct. Now, zoom out and then zoom down. That's Lake Beersford. That's what I think he's talking about. You have a neighborhood. So, this what what my thing is
here is um and and and guys, I don't want you to take offense to this cuz I agree with what you're saying. Are are we willing to support any other high density housing there, right, in the event that that happens? And are we going to support or
be be um willing to uh say cuz a lot of people are going to complain just like we had up there in in Orand. And look what happened, right? Situations are 100% alike. Industrial,
it's zone forever. We build industrial. People come on arms. It gets politically bastardized. Everybody's the enemy. uh and they want to hang us when in reality this area has all already uh been designed for for industrial. So is
anybody willing to commit to uh shooting that stuff down and sticking with industrial going your route, David, or or if if they want to put housing in here, put housing and then and then we'll get uh blamed for uh flooding and
overdevelopment. Uh, so you know, um, some of this is goofy to me. I I think I just I think I wanted to answer your question, at least from my perspective. For me, Danny, it becomes a I don't want to subsidize it with $1.7 million. Um, if it happens, it happens
under the law that they're currently able to do it in. Um, but I hope that it doesn't and I hope that maybe we can as we talk about our goals, maybe start setting a goal on what we can do to attract I would love industrial to be here to offset the tax. Make it a priority. I would I would love it. You
know, I I I don't know. Unless we make it a priority, it probably won't happen, right? It'll happen organically slowly. So I'd rather spend the money in other projects in existing u residents and come up with a campaign to attract industrial
to just that's the only reason why Danny just you know if and if applications come through we have to take them one by one but I don't want to put $1.7 million toward it. Okay. Interesting debate. You know, I think everybody's gone uh back and
forth. The the location um is problematic. I remember thinking during the whole fuel farm distribution center is um why did this cities allow residential to come up right around
these industrial areas? And um well, now here we are. Um, however, in that area, uh, I'm familiar with it. I have a friend who owns, uh, I think I'm looking at it,
the, uh, the Orange Grove there. And there's, um, there are some nice homes around. And I would prefer to see lowincome housing, affordable housing in an area where there's
um more expensive housing too instead of putting people out um on the creating the other side of the the track. I don't know which we're doing here, you know, which effect it would it would have. Um, the one thing that that does bother me
about not doing this is Danny, you mentioned, you know, they could just go full throttle. I think the the landowner is here and the um the developer is here. It seems to me that the land owner really wants to build
affordable housing. He sees a need. Um he's using the laws that are that allow us to do that. And um my preference would be to see that happen rather than
um um more industrial because of the neighborhoods that are all already around it. Um Don is right when he says the the uh temperature of the public is just stop building. You know, slow down growth. Don't don't build anything.
um if you're going to build responsibly, this is an area that that doesn't flood um at least not yet. Um so, you know, I don't think it's a bad area for for that. Um but again that the thing the
thing that really worries me is if they decide um several of you have said it's there's a strain on services if this is built under live local. It's a strain on services forever
because we're we're still um required to provide all the services there with no tax money ever um with live local. Um it's a horrible bill and it should have been changed and I
hopeful that it still will be changed. Um but we're required to provide you know all of the emergency services um road maintenance everything and with with no tax base to cover it. So it's uh
it's not exactly uh it's not an easy decision. It's not a win-win. I I have seen we have one member of the public that wants to speak, but I've seen the I think the representative from Banyan stand up a couple times. Um, did you did
you want to speak before we vote on this? He did not fill out a card. Okay. You don't need to. You're from Banyan. I thought you were the property owner.
Okay. And you don't you don't want to speak. Okay. Who are you with? Valuchia County. Okay. When when you stood up like you were gonna correct Brad, I thought Okay, then I'll call on the member of
the public, uh, John Nicholson. John Nicholson, Daytona Beachside. Now, if I'm getting this correctly, and I'm not My city doesn't think I'm good at math, but you're going to give away $1.7 million to get back
$1.5 million, and that's a gain. All right? And you'll gain this 50 years from now. Okay? I have a problem with that. Secondly, nobody likes this location for
a number of reasons. Um there's a city in Day County called Hyia that did this. All right. And it it worked for them. Uh their single family homes were torn down and put in six apartment buildings in
each all over the place. So you have gas stations and bodegas and houses all next to each other and it works out. All right. This is a little bit too urban for something of that nature to succeed. Um, I'm glad you finally put up where
the houses were. They are not literally right next door. They are a distance away. So, this is really a commercial area, industrial area. You do know you make more money off industrial areas than you do from
residential. It is to our benefit as a city not to give away valuable land, especially to the fact that this gentleman needs your money to get other money to succeed in his endeavor. So,
you're subsidizing something that you would normally not want to do anyway, to lose money, which for some reason all of this is not working out well for me. Okay. Um, so
ultimately you want to uh lose money to lose money to create something that's going to cause problems like somebody living next to an airport who doesn't like living next to an airport. Um, this is to me the exact
same thing. Um, I'm not really fond of the idea of affordable housing. Um, I don't believe we really need it. Everybody says we do, we do, we do. Um, and I really don't see it. Uh, I do believe in the
marketplace. Uh, I don't see if we built smaller homes in other areas, then the the people that need it will move it. All right? That's what they did after the war. My parents did that. Um, so I'm I'm asking you,
especially you've partnered with the city of Daytona Beach on Clyde Morris and that affordable housing wasn't open a year before the complaints started coming in. So if you do this, make absolutely sure that they build it to code because apparently they did not do
that in Clyde Morris. And I'm asking you to you look at what you uh put money into to make sure it's functioning because you didn't do it on Clyde Morris. Thank you, Joan. Uh Jake Johansson, go ahead. Answer the question. I won't ask it. If I may, um
the is grant money that we're using for the 1.7. Ding ding ding. You would be gaining county money back, not grant money. Ding, ding, ding. Nothing further. You rested with the judge. Okay. I don't see anybody else who uh
who wants to speak. Um Chrissa, would you call the role? Mr. Reinhardt. Yes. Well, before we before we do this, I just want to We'll keep his vote. The motion was to approve. Correct. The second was to
approve. So, if you don't want it, no. We have one. Yes. Mr. Reinhardt? Yes. Mr. Robbins. Yes. Mr. Santiago. No. Mr. Dempsey. No. Mr. Johansson.
Yes. Mr. Kent. No. Mr. Brower. No. So, the uh motion fails. Four to three. Great job, staff. They really do. I hope they understand
that at least from, you know, from me. Item five, it's a contract with Paul Culver Construction for the construction management general contracting services for uh emergency operations center.
Good evening. Uh Tad Case, county engineer. Uh as you said, this is the uh construction contract for the EOC edition. Uh total cost is $4 million a portion of which approximately $2 million is a state grant and uh we
recommend approval. Okay. Uh Vice Chair Matt Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair. One question, Ted. Are we still number two with respect if storm was to hit Tallahassee, we become the backup? I couldn't essentially. Maybe George can
answer that. We're one of two sites. One of two sites. depends on where it hits because of the shape of our state. But uh yes, we are considered one of the places that they would we already needed it. That just kind of reassured it. Um I love the idea. I was happy to see this
come back. Motion to approve. Okay, we have a motion to approve by Vice Chair Reinhardt. Is there a second? Second. Second by uh Councilman Kent. Any other
questions, comments? All in favor say I. I. Any opposed? And apparently you did a better job than [Laughter]
Brad. Is he still here? Item seven, um, discussion request to modify code of ordinance chapter 72. Regarding digital billboards, all billboards. Yes. Motion to approve.
Second. Nice work. We have a we have a motion to approve and we'll start from there. Motion to approve was by Councilman Robbins and the second was by um Vice Chair. Yes, sir. Was it? Okay. Vice
Chair Reinhardt. It's Thank you. Carol McFarland, planning director. Um this is a request for for discussion. Um so we do have a couple of points towards the end of the presentation that that we'll talk about.
Um we received a request. I really hope I pushed the wrong button. I don't think I did. There we go. Someone's better at this than I am. You can do it. All right. beep. All right. So, thank you. Um, this is a
request that we received, planning department received from Cobb Call attorneys. Um, they have a client, Lamar Advertising, Inc., who owns quite a few billboards in Valuchia County. There's two parts to the request. One is to
expand where billboards are allowed, and the other is to um allow digital billboards. So, right now, billboards are very limited where they're supposed to be with the B6, I1, and I2 zoning. They have to be in those zing categories and
along a federal aid primary or interstate highway system. Um, that's not a whole lot of places. Um, we have and we do not allow digital billboards at all. Um, if you go to the cities, there are a few I think there's 17
digital billboards. Um, right now the state, federal and state regulations are really what gives us um our regulations for billboards. Zoning code does not allow off-site billboards. Um, so we do
not have standards as far as height, maximum copy area, etc. because they're just not to be allowed. Um, so these are where all of our billboards are in Valuchia County here. Um, again, you can see most of them are in the cities.
There's over 500 of them in all of Blush County. In the unincorporated area, there's, um, 214. Of those 214, 200 are non-conforming. Um, meaning only 14 are allowed per zoning
code. Um, again, digital billboards are are not allowed. Um, there are some typical regulations that you would see with a digital billboard. One is, you know, not having a moving image and not changing within um 8 seconds or less. Um there's usually some limitations to
brightness. Uh the federal requirements doesn't have any limitations on brightness. So if we decide that we want to go in the direction of digital billboards, we should definitely look at some sort of illumination requirements. Um there is also the probably the biggest uh discussion topic with
allowing these is a swap down ratio. So there's a lot of places that allow digital billboards that have quite a lot of nonconforming billboards will allow some sort of a swap down rate. So um the one that was discussed um with Cobb Cole
was to swap out four existing non-conforming billboards per one digital billboard. Um these are some of the uh statistics we already talked about. 214 in the unincorporated area. The last time Valuchia County issued a billboard
approval um was 2009. So the request, again, this is a two-part request to allow more billboards. Um they are talking about a maximum size limit of 505 square feet. You could ask them why it's so specific.
Um and 50 feet in height for digital billboards. I'm not going to get too much into this because we'll talk about it at the discussion standpoint. Um but again we're looking at you know no flashing um images certain illumination standards um and uh
it's also part of their request that they would talk about uh displaying emergency announcements from Valuchia County um when needed. So this is these are the policy directions. There's a second slide. First um slide is does the county
council wish to expand the areas where the regular billboards are permitted and um you know we'd prefer to to go A through E on these. Um staff would really appreciate getting very specific discussions so that when we're communicating and negotiating with Cobb
Cole that we we really understand exactly where the county wants to go. Um second slide is going to be about the digital billboards. Um, just so you could see that if you could go back. Um, if it's all right with you, we can get into a a question and answer if you
wish. Um, so the first question is, do you want to expand the areas where billboards are permitted? Um, if you do not, then the A through E doesn't apply. So that's their first question for you today. Okay. Yeah, I would we have um we have a number of people that want to speak, but we have a we have a motion
and a second to approve and I was going to ask what because there's nothing to approve yet. There's a lot of questions that we need to deal with. Yeah. Um, so with all everybody's name, it's up right
now. Do you have questions for staff? Okay. Do you mind taking some questions? Please. And do we have nobody? Uh, no yellow cards. Nobody wanted to speak. It is. Can you fill out a card because
it probably would be uh helpful to hear from you. Okay. Uh David Santiago. Thank you, Mr. Chair. What What is a nonconforming billboard? You said there's 214 and 14 of them are conforming. What What is it and what
jurisdictions do we have over non-conforming? Um we we have all kinds of jurisdiction over non-conforming. However, federal requirements have severely limited what local governments can do. Um there's very very specific requirements about,
you know, preventing local governments from telling billboard companies that they need to just flat out take down the billboards. Um there's very a lot of rules if you want to go into some sort of amateurization schedule where you take down a certain number of them per year until you get to a certain time
period. Um does does that help answer the question? Let me just be direct. The 200 non-conforming, do we have any authority to say take them down or take them down over time? Yeah. So, this is this is where the uh federal law comes in. Um depends upon where those
billboards are located. Uh non-conforming billboards located on federal aid uh primary highways, you cannot immortise them unless you pay full value of that billboard. Okay? So, you want to take them down? Sure. You
just have to pay the money to those billboard companies to do it. Which is why uh but if the billboard is located outside of that federal highway system, then you are permitted to do an amortization schedule. How many of those 200 are on federal highways or or fall
in that category? Probably all of them. Um, I think you had a map that showed so most of those large roadways, uh, federal aid primary interstates. So,
you can see the billboards are all across those areas. Okay. And one of the questions is, do we want to expand the zoning uh, permitted areas for billboards? Correct. Um, and can you give us examples of what
swap down um, behaviors have occurred in other counties? Sure. Um, well, it depends. Uh, so Suzanne and I used to work in St. John's County. Do not use that as an example. Their swap down was very complicated. Each billboard you took
down generated a certain number of points depending upon the characteristics of the billboard and you had to accumulate a certain number of points to establish a new billboard. A much simpler swap down mechanism is uh the city of Daytona Beach's swap down
which for digital billboards um and and their their digital billboard is a face. So when you see a structure with a digital billboard on one side and the other, they consider that two digital billboards. So in the city of Daytona, they need four legal non-conforming
billboards to be taken down in order to have one face of a digital billboard and the feds recognize that as acceptable in the voluntary. Yes. Because it's voluntary. Okay. You're not forcing them to take it down, but if they want to have something that they don't have,
i.e. a digital billboard, then yes, you can make that exchange. Gotcha. And I'll just say this, Mr. Chair, I'm not a fan of billboards, but I if I had to pick a billboard, I'd pick a digital one. Um, and I don't want to turn this into Miami Dade County. I want less. Well, that's
why swap down mechanisms are popular. So, it really discussion is what ratio do you want? I have the opinion that they are eye pollution. It really comes down to aesthetics and what the community wants. Okay. Uh, Councilman Kent. Thank you,
Chairman. So, to staff, um, right now, billboards are allowed in B6, I1, and I2. Correct. Yes. So, how does expanding the zoning benefit Valuchia County residents?
So, the non-conforming billboards, if they were to be destroyed um by hurricane, fire, whatever, um they would not be able to be rebuilt. So allowing them in additional areas would allow us to permit them to permit new ones and to allow reconstruction if there were
damage beyond 60% of the the billboard. Yeah. Don't know you very well. Appreciate the textbook answer, but I didn't hear how it benefits Valuchia County residents to allow a company who their billboard got destroyed because of a natural disaster. We allow them to
build it in a zoning area that we don't normally allow. I just I don't understand how it benefits Fel County residents. It's it's very much an aesthetics. Um it's what your personal preferences are when you're driving. Um some people, you know, there's been some
uh correlation between, you know, traffic incidents and looking at billboards, certainly digital billboards if they, you know, Yeah. And that was my that was my my second question was h how how do digital billboards benefit
Valuchia County residents? just some some food for thought and then I have comments later. Chairman, thanks. Okay, thanks. Um, was there any indication of what zones they they would like to be
increased to? I see uh State Road 44, but are there other zones? Um I believe the nature of the request was more about allowing it on certain roadways. So kind of bypassing the whole what zone it is it in and looking more at um State Road
44 or other individual streets. Could would that affect our municipalities? Are we are we making a decision for them? No sir. Um this is are relates to chapter 72 which is only for zoning and permitting within unincorporated
Valuchia County. Most of the billboards are within cities. Um so we're we're talking specifically about unincorporated Valuchia County. Okay. Um the the thing I like Troy about the
uh electronic billboards is the swap out. We can get rid of four old for one new um new one. That's that's I do like the swap out. Chairman, if I may, why stop
at four? Why not make the swap out 20 to one? I'm not joking. I've I didn't Thank you. Yeah. Okay. Food more food for thought. Okay. Councilman Robbins. Thank you. Uh Chairman, you know something I have some
fond memories of and and uh has anyone ever been to the south of the border. Hey, Joe's pit stop. You know, you started seeing signs in like Georgia and they got closer. I I don't think that's what we have here in Felucia County. Even though some of the signs were
really cool as a kid and once you got there it was so just sus suspenseful. Um, but if if you look at this and break this down, I don't like many of my colleagues, I'm sensing, you know, you don't want these in neighborhoods and stuff like that, but major thorough
affairs like US1 in my district, you'll see them south of uh three bridges there, Rose Bay, um, hight traffic count areas, and at the end of the day to where we see the benefit for residents, they do a couple things. You don't see like a um a book club being advertised
on them, right? You see um Davis AC, you'll see Daytona Auto Mall. You'll see the backbone of the community. Our small businesses are blue collar are the ones putting their jobs up there. So,
how does that benefit this community? I'm gonna tell you why. supports our businesses, supports our jobs, supports our tax base. Um, not to mention income too for the land owner in some of those areas, you know, through this company.
So, um, you know, I wouldn't want to see this get out of hand. Uh, I think they should probably be in a little bit more errors on and limited to those major uh, identified major thoroughares.
because there's a couple ways like I said I stated the ways we could uh you know where it benefits us. So get rid of the billboards. Where are they going to put it in? The penny saver 80 page 87 you know. Um
so I'd be interested in opening it up a little bit. For instance, US or uh 92 corridor uh there's a lot of uh FR right up against the roadway there uh that people own. you'll see uh in some of our our uh
rural thoroughairs, you know, on 17 115A uh 44 has some uh 442 has some, US1 has some. So, I'm curious to see what everybody else uh but there is an economic element to this that that shouldn't be overlooked in my opinion.
Councilman Johansson. Yes, sir. Um, as in addition to the things that Danny said, uh, for for everybody, um, I hate seeing billboards after a storm on I95 or or, uh, US1, they're all
ripped to shreds. Takes a month or three or four to to get replaced. Uh, in the meantime, you know, Morgan and Morgan or somebody half half their head's missing or their arms missing or they only got 300 bucks, not three million bucks. So,
um, uh, I like these because they they don't break down as much and they're fixed pretty quickly, from what I can tell from the ones we do have between here and Orlando and whatnot. The other thing I like from a city manager
perspective is based on the ones I see here that are that are uh green, that's a lot of EOC information that you can put up telling people what to do, where to go. Um, not
that we want to change the message every five minutes to tell you how many parking spots are are on the beach. But from a emergency management perspective, we sure can pass a lot of information to people and it can change.
Uh the Dunlton overpass is closed that that can play until it's open and then we can change it. Uh it takes some coordination, but I imagine if if we approve these digital billboards that the EOC will have the Lamar point of
contact, they can change those with a computer pretty quickly. Um so so there is some benefit including the uh the economic uh uh vitality of our our communities. So um I support them. I know they're eyes source. Uh
David, I I concur when they're bright and they're flashing and they're and they're pissing you off at night. Um, but if we put some stipulations on how bright they can be and and like uh uh like they said uh that they don't blink,
that they don't change quickly and and they're they're a decent u a decent LED light. I think this is a great opportunity for us um to swap down at at a at a drastic rate and and still get a
lot of information out that are that our small businesses that our big businesses need and um there there's one I pass by quite often at the new Smarter Speedway and and I'm I'm I'm blind to
the fact that it's digital until it changes. I'm like, "Oh yeah, it's a digital one." So, you get used to them fairly quickly. A lot more used to them than you do with the same stinking picture of the same stinking person on the same stinking
billboard. Um, yeah, I'm going to go to Dixie Crossroads. I'm tired of it. Um, uh, you know, the I'm I'm thinking about the one in Deltona that tells you how long the emergency room is, the way it
is at, uh, at the hospital. If it says 35 minutes, I'm going to keep going. So, something to think about. Yeah. Did you just say the dword? Okay. Let me let me take a a brief pause
here to ask the council because it sounds like we really have slipped into debate instead of questions that you're standing up there wanting to know if there's any any questions. Um I promise you you have two pages uh 13 and 14 of
questions that you want answers to and we we'll do that before we we vote. Does any uh uh Don, Matt, Troy, David have questions for staff? Let's get to the question. I got questions. You still
have questions? Yes. Okay. Don Dempsey. Um I've noticed at least along 95 there's a lot of billboards that are not lit at night. Do we have an idea of the percentage of billboards that are not lit at night? No, we do. We don't have that
information. No, it's not something we track. Okay. Do you have it? Yeah. You guys want Well, and then secondly, I'd like to get to hear you out, but um secondly, do we
know if this is going to lower the cost of advertising by the fact that it's I would imagine the installation of the ad is going to be a fraction of what it is now to hire people to go up and hang the paper to construct or to construct the ad up there on the billboard. Um, do we
have any idea how much cheaper it's going to be for local business owners to be able to advertise on a digital platform than a uh old-fashioned platform? I I do not know the how their their marketing works. Um, but I'm sure that um Lamar would have some of that
information. We we haven't been given any of that information by them. Okay. Rob, are you are you writing down all these? Not not not yet. Are you writing down all these questions? because a lot of them you you will have a response to um who just told
me they had a question. It was actually that was Don asked my question. Uh costs related to what it would be with a traditional billboard as opposed to the uh digital. I think it's going to be cheaper. It was for me.
So that's all I had. Okay. You could post it up there. Don Dempsey got me parole. Okay. Okay, you know, one of those there's there's no other questions. Everything else is comment. Uh then Troy and David, why don't we
hear from the attorneys and then because that might So, uh and then Mr. Chair, I think just for for procedural and timeliness, let's just go right into the questions that she wants and we can just answer them one after because there's a lot of them. Yeah. Because we could stay on this forever. Okay. I'm going to be
brief as as lawyers say, you record with Cobb Cole. Yeah, one Daytona Boulevard and Pete Castanza is with Lamar. Um, so he's not a lawyer, but but he knows the business well and he can answer some of the questions. Let let me start by saying this thing kind of got started
because uh the conversion to digital is is happening in a lot of places. Uh we've got conversation going on with Port Orange. We had an extensive one with Daytona. Uh you can see some of the boards in Daytona and a couple in Port Orange. I mean it's new technology. it
it, you know, to the questions about public benefit. It just it looks better than the the older boards. Um, you know, Troy, I you and I always have fun with these question answers in in the past, and this is a good one. I'll I'll put back to you. What's the public benefit?
Well, it's kind of like I hate watching TV commercials, right? I I I record and fast forward through them. But how would the television companies survive if we didn't have TV commercials? if people weren't hitting the looking at the commercials and and online hitting the
you know the I'll buy this now. It's something that we need for business to survive. Danny, thank you. That's that's what it's about. This guy's a businessman and so when you say take 20 down to put one up, well, you're that's not very businessfriendly and and he needs to survive just like the rest of
the businesses. So So thank you guys. That's exactly what the point is about the business aspect of this. Um is it is it giving something to somebody in the community? No, it's it's providing a service that is bringing business customers, right? It promotes business.
So, that's the public part. And then, you know, Jake, for sure, the way it's worked in other places is public service announcements are a piece of the of the of the the allowance that you get in the time. It's it's a matter of selling time. Now, you put a put the wallpaper
up on the board, that's all you get for a month. You pay for a month of it or year of it or whatever. In this case, it's it's the minutes of of time. So, you guys will in this negotiation that we're having about how to do this, you'll get some of the time. Whether it's welcome to Valuchia County or
whether it's, you know, your emergency service when the hurricane comes, you guys get a big piece of of here's where you need to go, here's the road you need to take. We're already doing that in a lot of places around the state of Florida with digital billboards. So, looks better. um easy to change out,
easy to repair, easy to have public services. There's a lot of benefits to it. But but I think what would what I'm hoping the staff is looking for some input from you guys. And then you send us back to talk to them about other situations where we've done this and we've talked about I mean Daytona we it
it took us a while to come to the terms with all the different things. There's a list of a dozen things about the how you turn the the the volume, how you turn the the lights down when it's dark out, you dim it. um the the size of the little bulbs that are in the TV set. So you got a nice TV set instead of one of
the oldfashioned ones that's looks like you're looking at bulbs. Uh you know, so there's a lot of things about the quality, the size, the proportion of the signs to the polls, and there's a lot of things we can bring back to you guys with an ordinance that I think you can you can chew on and say, "I like that. I
don't like this." But right here, we're spitballing. I mean, so we the the the the two pages of questions, I mean, we can we can walk through those, but there's a few of them that are just like there's not much to to say about, you know, the federal part of this, and we can't really do anything different, but I think if you guys will just give us a
little bit of time to to work something up with these guys um and show you some other situations that we've we've brought forward, we'll bring it back to you and then you see see if you like it. But right now, I think we're just going to spin out, I'm afraid. Okay. Your time is valuable, so I don't
want to do that. Thank you. Peter, did you have something to add? I when it first came up about the billboards, uh, I've been doing this 30 years, and one of the questions I think Troy brought up was Miami date. We don't want this to be Miami Miami date. I worked in New York
City for 10 years, David. It's awful. Uh, it it's impossible to be a Miami date here because all the boards, as they noted, 200 of them are non-conforming. I can't build in this in this county. I can't. We're a dinosaur in in Deluchia County. The city's the
ordinances. I'm restricted. I lose billboards five to six every year. I don't even need to do a replacement program because I'm losing them through hurricanes. Uh just through landowners, through development, I'm losing them. Uh one of the questions kind of Danny uh
stole my thunder. How does this benefit Lucia County? I think Troy mentioned and no one really answered it. 80% this is factual. 80%'s local money. It's it's our local attorneys. It's State Farm,
Davis Brothers. I can go on and on and on. 80% is local money. It's not national. It's not New York City where it's Nabiscoco. So on so forth. Uh how does it benefit Lucia County? Emergency management. I work
with Semino County with with Alen Harris. He loves it. We're the hurricane pelt. Right. During the hurricane, we shut him off 48 hours before. We're running directionals where to go direction where to go, where what stores are open, what routes to take. FBI,
we're we're we're linked in with uh missing child alerts, FBI. I look at the state. The state's running on the interstate. Instead of running 36 feet, we run 300 360 feet of the same message. Obviously, they love
it. They're doing their billboards as state. Uh cost and relative cost. That was a question. It's it's it's relatively equal the relatively cost, but it's cost us a lot more to build it digital. Uh but what people love about
digital when they first came out 20 years ago, everybody advertises. They want nothing to do. I want to be on my billboard myself. Why they like it? Because they can run different messages, not just the same message all the time. It's not blinking. It's not video. It's
it's a message that every eight eight seconds it changes. Uh and the 8 seconds was something that we, you know, we're talking about trying to negotiate these things. That was something that went through a lot of debate how to do that. So, we'll bring that back to you whether it's eight or 10 or whatever it is so you know that it's not distracting. So,
one of the big Sorry, Peter. One of the big uh debates that we get into is is it going to distract drivers? Do you want it to be something that you know is creates a safety concern? We want just the opposite of course. So we'll deal with that when we come back with an ordinance again. So all the counties
that all the districts that you're in, Port Orange, High Hill, uh Daytona Beach. I have I have the most digitals in Valuchia County. I have 15 of them. Uh my competitors have four and two. Uh, I have a obviously the most billboards
in the county. Okay. Rob used his time and yours too. Okay. Uh, but before you go, uh, Councilman Santiago had a question of of the billboards you have that you manage, what percentage of what industry would you say is the majority of it? Uh, it's
combination of I would say tourism, uh, lawyers and hospitals. The hospitals are one of actually our biggest advertising. Hellifax, Health, and Advent are are top guns. So, with the digital ones, you could say, "He got me one million." The next one says, "He got me two million." Actually, he doesn't like he doesn't
That's David. He doesn't like those billboards. Uh most attorneys, they're ego-driven. And they want they want they want they want uh they like the they like the statics. They like the statics. Really? Yeah. Yeah, they like if they
notice you'll see them on there. I'm not against the digital one. They want to pick up 247 is what you're saying. They don't want to be part of the picture. Most important what what is we are reducing? Yes, we have a reduction in in the city of Daytona Beach. The reason we had a deduction
because we had 50 plus billboards. I can't take any more down. I've taken down like 15 of them. But I also put up, you know, four digits in in Daytona Beach. I never have one complaint in the city of Daytona. And so one thing I'll say is um in part of the negotiation
jurisdiction by jurisdiction some of the billboards people hate. And so when we dealt with the city manager in Daytona for instance there were two or three he said I just I can't stand those. They're they're in the tourist area and they're and they shouldn't be there. So we we worked with him on that. So to the
extent you guys come up with particular boards we want to hear about that too. So I'm really only looking for state route 44. I'm only I'm sorry. As the applicant, I think it's important you understand our request. We were not asking for any more roads than the the interstate highways and State Road 44.
That's it. And those are boards we already have. So, that's important to know, too. Okay. Hold up a second. Sure. We have one more member of the public uh wants to speak and then we'll we'll get back to you. It's John Nicholson who's feeling emboldened because he actually won the
last vote. I just stay up here with him. Oh, listen. Well, that's an advantage. You and I negotiated Daytona. Daytona Beach side. Uh, actually, I like this, but I one, don't add anymore,
please. They're an eyesore. Don't do it. Secondly, I like uh Kent's idea, four, but just think if you did five or if you did six, right? Instead of having 50 billboards left, you'd have
40 or 30. I like that to keep it up, Danny. You're too young. But Burmache used to be on every single roadway with Burmache. See, the old man knows. Um, so actually, I would ask you to pass this
and two, I would ask you to ask for maybe five. Thank you. Okay, that takes uh We're done with questions. We're ready for a debate. I got a question. Okay. Can I one of
y'all? Both of y'all, I guess. Sure, why not? And remember, I have to pinch him under the table. I like all this talk about the lawyer stuff. No, never mind. My question um earlier was I don't know if you caught it, but how many of these billboards are unlit? That's good. 7:30.
I meant to tell you. He jumps. It steals my thunder. 70 are lit or unlit. There's actually think about it on the interstate. They're they're uh they're all non-conforming. They're most of them are nonlit and they can never be lit. So they'll never be digital billboards
there. They'll never be even illuminated. When they're not illuminated, they're on telephone poles. Most of the time we can't get power to even the boards. Okay. So these are not like solar powered or anything like that. Correct. No, not solar powered. Correct.
How many of yours are unlit? I have uh on the inter I probably have about 50 of them probably. Or unlit? Unlit. Yes. Okay. Thank you. And next question. How
much cheaper would it be for an attorney or a politician or people advertising? Um, how much cheaper will it be for a billboard old style versus putting up an 8-second digital? It's going to maybe be
a reduction of maybe 15%. Okay. All right. That's all. Thank you guys. Questions? Troy, do you have questions? David? No. Uh Danny.
Okay, hold your statement and uh I think I'm done with uh questions as well. I will have a statement. So, we'll go back to uh Councilman Troy Kent. Thank you, Chairman. And um Councilman Santiago, I appreciate you want to get to the questions staff has and give them
direction, but I feel like if we don't have this discussion, I can't help guide the discussion a little bit. And Don tends to help all of us with our our our thought process up here as do the rest of you. But um poke a little bit at Don here because he's been he's been pretty
convincing. But council, I'll just I'll just tell you this and I of course know Rob Merrill. I've never met this gentleman. Seemed like a very nice man. But uh I've not had one resident ask for this. I've not had anybody call me up or email
me and say, "Yes, please get involved in this. Change the standards at our with our billboards. Expand it to more areas. Bring on digital. Go ahead and do the swap out 4 to one." I've not had any resident ask me for this change. I just
want to put that out there. So, if you have, I' I'd love to hear. Um, you know, uh, Mr. Robbins, I I appreciate your honesty. I was blown away by your fond memories of a child of looking at billboards. Um, mine were different. Mine were family dinners, fishing with my
parents. Um, I'm I don't I don't necessarily want to, you know, drive down and and see how much money um each person that got in a crash received. You know, Jake, I think um um the restaurant you were talking
about down south a little bit, Dixie Crossroads, I think it's is it exit 124? I mean, we have it memorized yet. You know, I hear what you're saying, David. Miami date and the gentleman talked about it was terrible. Terrible. And I
just ask you to now think about um I75 South Georgia. Terrible. Horrific. Probably a lot like maybe worse than Miami Dade. Um, you know, the the attorney said the public benefit is that they they they
look better. Says who? Not me. So, to me, the benefit here is is for Lamar advertising and the other advertisers who put up billboards, it's it's a benefit for them. I go back to I've not had one resident ask me for
this. So, why would we expand to where billboards are not allowed? Because right now it's very limited in our county and I think that's a good thing. It needs to be very limited. And then you mentioned eyesore. It is absolutely
an eyesore. And Mr. Nicholson, I appreciate that you came up with your comments because I I know this group pretty well. You know, we've only been two years and a few months together, but I would have been shocked if any of them would have bit on 20
to1. I would like it if they would, but I'd be shocked if they would. But to get my buying bone biting on this, we got to get a lot closer to like 8 to one. Okay, let's You know, you you're the one that wants something, which is why this is before us. They're
the ones that want something. The county didn't come up with this. This was by, you know, private industry came before us and they want something. So, if they want something, let's go ahead and do some horse trading. 4 to one's not going to do it for me, gentlemen. We uh there's a lot more meat on that bone and
we should negotiate that and give them and staff direction. So, when it comes back to us, we have our county looking better with less eyes and way uh way more um than 4:1. So, that's how I can get on board with
the digital is is if that discussion gets healthier um towards benefiting this county, I am a I tell you all right now, I'm a hard no on expanding this to any other areas that it's not currently allowed. Um you know, I I I see these uh
around and I agree with Mr. Santiago. Um it's an eyesore and we don't want to look like Miami Dade or South Georgia. Thank you, Councilman Santiago. Just a quick question for staff. Um I don't it was Polo or her, but y'all I'm stuck with that 60% number you mentioned
earlier about 60%. Explain that to me. So in the case of natural disaster uh man-made or otherwise if a structure is if the billboard is structured uh damaged more than 60% of its value um
the the tangible value that it has um on the books with the property appraisers's office. How do we deter how do they determine the value? They have a a big questionnaire that they fill out for the property appraiser every single year. It's quite a lot of information on that.
Um it looks like pillows are the telephone poles in the ground. So so billboards and they can correct me on there the the the property appraiser actually taxes them separately. I think they are taxed as personal property on the land itself. So they actually have a
value that is independent of the land um you know by the property appraiser. Um and the damage the assessed damage is done to the structural elements. So you when when Mr. Johansson was talking about all of those billboards with the
the faces torn off. We do not count the face as damage because the faces or the copy is swappable. Um so you're really looking at the structural elements of it. So that's I'm glad you clarified that because I wasn't sure about that. Thank you. That's all I needed to to
know. Good. Uh Councilman Dempsey for comment now. Are we Is that where we at? Okay. Um, Troy, I respect everything you're saying, but I'm kind of on the other side of the I do agree with you that we shouldn't expand the area where we already have billboards, but I'm
actually I think we should do a one for one swap. And the reason being, well, one is safety. I just I just drove 6,000 miles all over the country out to Oklahoma in the last couple of months. And and I don't know how much cross
country driving you guys do, but when I drive at night and it's eight or nine o'clock at night, I'm driving down the road. How do you guys plan where you're going to go eat or where you're going to get diesel fuel? Now, if I'm going to drive, I got two choices as I'm riding down the
interstate. either I'm doing this. If we got rid of all billboards, then I'd be doing this. Looking at my phone, diesel fuel ahead and food ahead. That's dangerous.
Driving up the interstate. Oh, Pedro is only 300 miles away. Or, you know, I got Oh, Bies is coming up, so I know I can get fuel there, but that's in 30 miles. I'm getting a little bit low on fuel. Maybe I go to a pilot. Driving a diesel vehicle, it's hard. You
got to plan ahead. Same thing with food. So, you and the kids and the family are in there. Where do you want to eat? Well, there's a Chick-fil-A up here. Oh, there's a there's a Cracker Barrel coming up in 20 miles. It seems to me that most people when they're traveling cross country plan their fuel stops and
their food stops by billboards. So if we're just going to create a black space between Flaggler County and Semino County, then all this southbound traffic coming through Flaggler into Valuchia,
you're not going to see any signs. Well, Cracker, there's a Cracker Burough in Semino County. So, let's just drive another 20 miles and we'll go into Seminal County and eat or we'll get our fuel at the racetrack in Semino County. So, I I have a feeling that we're we're missing that big part of having these billboards
because I think it's a lot safer to look at the billboards as you're driving than it is on your phone. Also, um the fact that we have so many unlit signs, I think he said he had 50 that were unlit. I don't want to expand. I agree with you guys. We don't want
more billboards that might look polluted, but I don't think there's any harm in actually having lit signs and replacing them one to one. I I just I think there's so much more added benefit to having these because on the
interstates you're having you're trying to direct people from out of area. We're all talking about locals. I mean, we're all locals. We know where the good restaurants are. We know where to get fuel and all that. But if somebody's driving down from Pennsylvania and they're looking to get fuel and they're getting hungry and it's nighttime, you
know, we want to steer them to our businesses locally as opposed to letting them keep going down into Semino County. So that's why I'm really in favor of billboards. Um, you know, also I think it's a benefit. We can advertise more local events coming up at the Ocean Center.
You know, we can advertise, you know, all these different events at the fairgrounds. Um, the political ads I think would be bolstered. I think it's going to be cheaper. I know we don't like political ads. We hate those little yard signs everywhere. We hate when politicians put their big signs up on
easements and stuff like that. At least this way, you're putting them up in a legal place at a cheaper price. Um, I think he said they're good for Amber alerts and silver alerts as well. I mean, that's a huge benefit. Um, and
it's cheaper for the locals to advertise for their businesses. So, I'm I'm really in favor of these things. I know I don't want to put them in unchartered territory. I don't want to put them up on 40. I don't want to put them in places that doesn't currently have it. But, boy, I kind of would see a benefit
in putting them more in the interstates, more lit, so we can really direct nighttime traffic to Valuchia County businesses. That's all. Thank you guys. I'm sorry to interrupt, but I thought he said he couldn't put them on interstates. Yeah. Okay. Sorry. Sorry, Mr.
Councilman Robbins. Uh, thanks, Chairman. Um, may I ask Mr. Merrill, I I just need a refreshment of the uh Rob, you said uh 44 and where else? So, the interstate highways 4 and 95 and 44 are the only places that we care
about, and that's where we have signs already. Thank you. Uh, council, I'll tell you this would be this is for you, David. I love you, buddy. This would be a great way to promote industrial properties as well. Trying to turn the tables. I love
it. Go down that path. I like it. Um, but uh but no um Don, I I agree with you. I'm kind of in the same direction you are. You know, the one for one's uh fine with me. Uh but I'll reiterate. Oh,
actually I want to give an example. Uh I believe this council um we had an interesting proposition a couple years ago and it was actually quite successful and it was something new. It was out of the box and and I was kind of impressed by it was the uh the
billboard on the beach. You guys remember that? We approved that. Jeff and I, me and I think Jeff, chairman and I were on the council um and uh and it and it worked out and we actually increased the distance
closer to the beach as well. Uh so um but I just want to say too being here four or five years now, I haven't had any complaints uh from from residents on billboards uh since day one. Uh so I'm happy with the uh the
current standards or even uh the the one for one and um yeah promotes uh supports businesses, creates jobs, adds to our economic fatality like uh Mr. Dempsey said. And I'm I'm ready to make a motion
um to approve the request or or have staff bring back an ordinance uh for the approval one for one um to include the I4, I95, and 44 uh roadways uh to be lighted.
Second. Okay, we have a motion I'll go over in a minute from uh Councilman Robbins and a second was by Don Dempsey, oddly enough. Yeah, I I'm going
to have a question on the motion, too. Um so, I'll get to you. Um, I I I had a couple things. Um, just listening to the to the debate.
Um, it's just interesting. You know, Troy, I've I've not had anybody ask for this either, but on the other hand, I've not ever I think Danny just said, I've not had any complaints, hey, can you get rid of billboards in Valuchia County? I I used to hear people say that before I
ever ran for office. I don't anymore. Maybe maybe they've gotten used to it or maybe we've gotten better at it. I think the uh the digital are much more attractive. I think I think it it draws more
attention. Um, and so that's why I like to swap out G, give him for if we get a digital, take away a um a non-conforming or four of them. I'm not going to go for for 20. Um, but I'm also I think part of
this we're giving you information to staff and you're going to go back and negotiate with this team, right? So, right, this is about direction only, right? like we still come back with an ordinance and and as I've told you guys in some of the other ordinances we've
worked on, changing numbers is the really easy part of an ordinance. Thank you. But the the big thing that gets me is that we we have said all along since this council has been together. We want to get rid of regulations where we can and we want to be business business
friendly. This is an opportunity to do both things. I think I do see a a public service to the residents of Valuchia County for all the reasons that you already stated, Don, and and not just on 95 and I4, but but locally um I see I
see local business advertised on digital billboards that um that I didn't know was going on, deals that were were made or deals that are being offered. So, I I do see a a benefit. I my biggest concern with this
um um Rob is is expanding it to 44. Now that's part of the motion. So I'm I'm not a no on it, but I'm worried about it because Highway 44 is already such a congested
nightmare. There's problems there. Now we're talking about 44 outside of the city limits of New Simra. That's kind of a question. So what I say is the we don't we do not want to expand anywhere. The word expand is out of our vocabulary. He's got three signs on 44.
He just wants the opportunity to convert those additional. That's it. Does not want to have any new signs. Okay. Yeah. Okay. Thank you. So, um, yeah, I think I think this meets our goals of le
less regulation and being, uh, businessfriendly and then Santiago can help them make it um, advertise for more industrial businesses. I think we're in a position, let's make a deal. I'm going to propose something in a minute, but I'm let Okay. Uh, Vice Chair Reinhardt,
thank you, Chair Rob. Thank you for clarifying that with uh with respect to one for one. That's what you're talking about and I'm good with that. Um I was on it from the from the get-go with respect to the economic impact that it
has with businesses. Small businesses are able to afford these probably more um because you just clarified the fact that it were probably a little bit cheaper for the for the digital part. That's your that's your business. But it it could be it could mean um a way for
them to advertise. They can't get on television to do it or they're going to be on page 90 of a of a brochure somewhere. Um as far as uh chair, what you brought up about No, I haven't had any constituents come up to me and ask
for removal either um or brought it to us. We approve things all the time that are not brought to us from citizens all the time. We did it today. There were several items on the on the consent agenda that we all approved. So, uh, we do it all the time.
Um, the Amber Alerts, the silver alerts, that's a win-win. I mean, that that's for protection of our citizens. And and Don, great point on on with respect to the uh um Yeah, that's going to get bigger. Uh, trying to plan your stops
when you're when you're traveling. Um, I do it all the time. I'd much rather see a sign than I would try to, you know, I don't look at a phone, but I'm saying if I if I had to make a choice or pass by a gas station, dad gam it, I wish I'd have known, you know, unless
it's Bies with a real big sign. So, um I'm I'm for that and I like the fact that you clarified that. So, I'm I'm good with the uh the motion as directed and and again, this is about um Carol, thank you for pointing out. You know, numbers are easy to change.
So, we can come back with a different couple different scenarios that we can have numbers involved in that. So, I'm good. Hold off. Unless the chair wants to direct you to speak. No, I I'll I'll You're You're
next on the board. I thought you might want to hear what he said. I do have a a question for you, though. Have Were you disappointed when you finally got to south of the border? Um, never mind. That was years ago. Oh god. What I wanted to say, you see the signs for 500 miles and then you get
there and think there's nothing here. I'm going to make a motion tonight though at the end to get the it to help my colleagues how to use voice uh instructions in their phone to find where they got to go. So, um, but I do have a question, Mr. Chair, if I can. um
staff, is this I I understand that Lamar's here and I think there's a competitor which is Clear Channel, right? This would benefit them also, right? Um is this something that allows us to enter into an
agreement? Yes. Yes. Yes. And it's one two-party agreement to agree to any terms, right? Yes. We're not restricted in anything that you're aware of. Um, I would not recommend going too far into first amendment type territory. I wouldn't go there. Never would. But
essentially the agreement is is boils down to that whole like public PSA type things, you know, time sharing. Um, sometimes those appears in the actual ordinances, but it all works out into, you know, an entity that wants to do the digital billboard swap. you know,
there's there's kind of an agreement that what's has and this may be a question for the for the people that do the business. Um, what's a billboard worth? I don't want your trade secrets, right? But give me an industry standard, what is a what is an electronic
billboard if if you had an electronic billboard 75% uh of occupancy, I'll just use that term. What could it generate? Again, don't give away secrets. Give me my sales or what would it cost for the corporation? Uh it's like, you know,
$2,000, $1,500 per spot. We sell them at and we could put like six spots probably, right? Maybe five. We run eight, we run eight spots now. The cost to build it is about a million dollars probably, right? It's a half a million dollar. Half million dollar. Okay. You know, reason I asked that money and then I asked you a question as a preface to
it guys and if we could do this legally, I don't know the answer and I hope we can go down this path. Um, we have an industry that is the norm is a do a what's the term? A swap down, right? And if they do a swap down, it's because they know they're going to make more
revenue on the one that they replaced, right? So, why not see if we can pursue the opp if you guys want to give them one to one, they're going to make a heck of a lot more money. Why can't we enter a look into an agreement where I'll just use lack of a
better term profit sharing or revenue or something that comes back that goes into our road programs. I don't know if it's illegal, permissible, but normally that's when the county has an asset, you know, and then there's profit sharing involved. Um
I'm not sure that type of arrangement. Um I haven't seen that on like I just want to know if it's illegal or not. if it's legal and I'm going to give them one to one. I just quadrupled their revenue, guys. That's basically
what we did. Um, and that has value. What we'll do is we could follow if you do direct us to proceed, we'll return with more information. I want to be like Jerry McGuire. Show me the concerns about that. But yeah, so let us uh look into it and get back and I want to put it into our roads program and I'll be
open to that idea. I'm going to get quadruple your revenue. Let's let's talk. Let's negotiate. I love it. And talk to your colleagues over there at Clear Channel. Have you been listening to Mr. Wonderful on Shark Tank? Shark Tank. I do. I do. I
do. Uh, thank you. That's all I got. Councilman Kent. Thank you, Chairman. Um, I I heard it earlier, I think, but if not, I'll just say it. I I believe that this cheapens the look of of your community. Don, I can tell you I've driven my family pulling a travel
trailer to Yellowstone National Park and back. It was a wonderful 29-day trip and I don't know what I would have done in Arizona without the picture that my wife took while I was driving of the billboard that said free ice water ahead. Um David, I think you bring a a
great point where you talk about, you know, talking into your phone and allowing it hands-free to find out where where to go. Uh, I'm going to quote Matu from the movie Zoolander, listening to three of
my colleagues who I don't ever want them to negotiate on my behalf ever, George. They do not have that permission if I'm ever incapacitated. They are never allowed to negotiate on my behalf. Goodness gracious. A onetoone. But let me get to the quote of Mugatu
from Zoolander, which is, "I feel like I'm taking crazy pills." What? They've got to step down four to one and you're going to give away at the negotiating table. Let's just go one to one. Let's just go ahead and do that right
now. Personally, I want fewer billboards. You can say, "Well, I've never had anybody call me and say they want to get rid of them." All right. You you you live that, and I'll live mine where um I've not had anybody call me and say, "I want more.
Give me more, Councilman. Bring more on. add more areas or change them to electronic. I could do the electronic, but it's got to it's got to be more than 4:1. We've got a great negotiating tool here. David, the only way you could get me on that is if there is some serious
uh profit sharing with the county. It's not a bad idea, but at least I can answer my constituents that this gives you something. There's the, you know, this is this is why the juice was worth the squeeze is because this is what you get from it. And as far as the
electronic safety PSAs, I don't know if you guys have been on 95 or I4 ever, but they have them right now. Right now, they're there. On I4, crash ahead, exit, whatever. 95, same thing. I mean,
they're they're already there. So, you know, I'm you you know, you know where I am uh with this right now. Thanks, Councilman Johansson. I'm I'm done. Thanks. They wore you down.
Councilman Dempsey. Yeah. The only thing I'd like I thought I'd heard the gentleman from Lamar say that we have lesser billboards in this county than other counties. Correct. I mean, so I I don't know if you can quantify how many billboards we
have on I4 versus um Seminal County or 95. because one to one may be too much if we have the same amount of billboards as seminal county but I I have uh Valuchia
County, Bvard County and Putinham County and uh and part of Deval County. Uh I have more in Bvard than I do Valuchia. Uh any can you ballpark the percentage more? 5%. It's now it's practically
about the same. But the most important part I know everybody this this how many a the reduction program every hurricane that comes through we lose about three billboards every hurricane. Uh so the the reduction's happening. We're not
expanding. Like I said where that the billboards are elephant in the room as people said in the in the account when we before when this first started they're litter on a stick. They are litters on the stick. Over the years, we've been changing them to monopoles where they're not wooden poles anymore,
but that's years in the making. Uh where we're trying not to become billboards used to be paper. Now they're vinyls. They're recyclable echoflex vinyls where when a hurricane comes, usually you see them all ripped for like a month. Lamar, they're not ripped. We roll them up
depending a week before. We have crews coming in from Georgia, from from Arkansas, from everywhere of all of them, our plants, and we roll these vinyls up so they look like they're ripped, but we actually roll them up and tighten them to the board because they're called hurricane frame so air can go through them. So, we save our
billboards. We're we're local. Lamar is the only office that has a local office here in uh the county of Valuchia. Uh so, there's a lot of things we've done in the in the over the years since I've been here going on 11 just in Valuchia
County. Okay. And thank you helping out, Vice Chair Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair. Um, Mr. Ken, thank you. I didn't know how I sounded. So, now now I have a with with your comment about not having constituents come up to me. So, now I don't have to play it back. I know exactly how I sound. I didn't realize I
sounded like that. Um, but nonetheless, um, I won't do that. But, um, no, no, no, no, no. I I I'll show you more respect than that. So, with respect to what I'll go back to what you said, Gol. You said these are
just numbers are easy to change. We're not voting on it tonight. We're voting on the idea of bringing back something. So, we're not saying we're voting for one for one. We're not saying we're voting for one for four. We're not saying we're we want it brought back. Clarified, done, ready to vote. And I want to clarify one thing based on what
Mr. Merrill said. You know, we looked at it as as an expansion, but what I'm hearing is the request is not an expansion. And it's it's if you're doing a swap, allow a digital billboard to be replaced with a non-conforming billboard
on 44. So you're not expanding the area, but you are allowing that conversion and upgrade in that kind of corridor, which is something we can accommodate without expanding, you know, to future areas. Essentially, you just take an existing
billboard and you just swap it or convert it to digital and you know it's your choice for uh swap down which is I I think that you you agree with that because what the question put before us is did we want to expand into sections of state
road 44? Okay, good. So, um, then I don't Can you step just aside a second? I want to look at Carol. Um, do you need us to go through all these? I think we've we've kind of come to an agreement that we're going to send it to you to
negotiate with. We don't want expansion. Um, there they don't want expansion. I think all the standards you have for setbacks, height, and all that everybody's good with. Um, what was the other request? The uh
if we're not talking about expanding, then these questions don't matter, right? So, we're on to negotiate a mechanism for revenue sharing or or permitting or something. Um, if we do the one to one, the motion on the floor is one for one in the existing
locations. That's it. Does that mean you won't accept my proposal? Do we got to start all over if he does? If they want to negotiate that in, they can. They're going to come back with several proposals here. Let's We got to get her get off the pot. We'll take a
look at that aspect of it. I mean, what's that's I'm hearing a lot of discussion. So, there's a there's a lot of options that we're going to need to research, discuss with them, and bring back to see what's viable. Gotcha. Well, I'll make I'll make it clear my position. If it's a one one and we don't
have anything that's revenue for the county, I'm an absolute no. Make it clear for everybody. Okay. All right, then. Uh, no more questions. We do have one
more comment from, uh, Deputy County Manager Suzanne Conchin, and it's actually a question to council. So just in um our procedures for creating an ordinance, we take it to our PLDRC, planning and land development review committee and then back to council for
final action because of the negotiations and some of the issues. Do you want us to take it in some draft form to PLDRC and then bring it back here or come back to you with the terms before we do that process? Bring it here. Here. Yeah. Thank you. I think it needs to come
here. Thank you. Okay. All in favor say I. I. I. Any opposed? I. And the request passes 6 to one. We're passing along to staff. Thank you. Thank you for coming in. Bring that
calculator to the negotiating table. Okay, that brings us to the last item of the night, which is item eight. And before we get too far down, I'll I'll make a request on this from uh this comes from some of the public, David,
that lives along this road. You heard one of them tonight, but getting phone calls. Uh the public um has asked me if I would um um table this at least until
the next meeting. And um but I need to I can't just say yes. I needed to bring that here and allow this council. And the reason was they are not against the sheriff. They don't know the sheriff, but reading the history, it sounds wonderful. They feel like it's it's
their road and they had no say in it. And this was a a late edition. I would argue with that that it was prop properly noticed, but didn't give them enough time. And um so uh anyway, they
the request is that it would be uh tabled until the next meeting. I got a question, but I can't I can't make a motion. I got a question. Okay. Uh Councilman Robbins. Thank you, chairman. Mr. Bullet, can you clarify?
Mr. who? Bartlet. I had Twizzler in my mouth. What did you call him? Barl. Bartlin. Okay. Can um can you clarify for me? Is it still going to be Tamoka Farms Road
or is there going to be a sign just like every other road uh that says um so and so highway? Uh can you can you clarify this? Correct. It'll still be called Tamoka Farm. It'll still be called Tamoka Farms Road. There will be a sign at each end. Dedication. It's similar to
what the state does. We've done it before on on Maytown Road as well. So I I I've council, we all pretty much receive the same emails. I live in this area. Uh two of which uh one person uh was here who spoke. Uh the other email
was uh from another um young lady and and uh from what I've gathered out of those two people out of about 3,000 um if not more in that area um you just answered some of the
questions. It's not changing the road and and if it was uh um and and one of the the the people that had uh inquiry obviously uh made time for it uh here. How much public notice did we have on this? I believe they went out in the agenda
update on Friday. Okay. So, uh at the end of the day and it was it was discussed at the previous meeting. Yeah. Two meetings. Yeah. So, um I don't have a problem with this. Uh motion for approval. Second. Joe Hansen. Reinhardt.
Okay, we have a motion for approval of the me memorial sign by uh Andy Robbins and the second was by Jake Johansson. Comment and yes, thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Um and and thanks for
for the motion. As you remember this, I've I've spoken about this topic twice, I think at least twice before, and I appreciate my colleagues. Uh, you know, John Tucker was a former sheriff and I want to recognize his son who works for the city of Daytona who's sitting here in the corner. Um, this was presented to
me, folks. Just so you know, I felt that um, he was somebody worthy to be honored because he had the courage at a at a at a time in the history of Valuchia. He was the first what I've been shared, the first deputy uh, elected deputy to hire the first black deputy to work in
Valuchia County. So, that's an honorable moment. Um, and I understand his father also died. John Tucker died uh drowning saving a kid that was uh drowning in one of our ponds. So, or or waterways. So, uh those two felt uh to me it was worthy
enough. We're not changing the name of the road. We're dedicating a segment of the road to memorize his service to our county. Uh and I appreciate your support. Uh and just to note, he was also the first sheriff to hire a female deputy. Oh, didn't know that. Look at that. First female deputy. There you go.
The Susan loves that. Thank you to Mr. Chucker for coming here today and uh hopefully we get a unanimous vote to honor your father's service to our county. So, thank you. Okay, we do have some members of the
public that would like to speak. Uh three of them. Uh start with Gary Singleton. My name is Gary Singleton. I'm resident of Lucia County. I don't have any problem or issue whatsoever with honoring uh
Sheriff Tucker with the memorial road. Uh my issue is that I live in Tamoka Farms area. I've never heard of him. Uh I did some research. It seemed like the bulk of his contributions were in Flaggler and Banell. Could be wrong.
Correct me if I am. What I'm interested is hearing, okay, you started with why him, but why now and why in district three and why Tamoka Farms Road? Uh the name Tamoka it goes back my
belie my understanding to the a Native American tribe that was here 12,000 years ago. Our founding families in the area named a river roads and a neighborhood Tamoka. Realators refer to homes in the
Tamoka Farms neighborhood. Our comprehensive plan includes a local plan protecting the Tamoka Tamoka Farms Road Village. The name Tamoka has significant historical significance. I see diluting this
historical significance in any way demonstrates a lack of respect for the residents that actually live in the area. Again, I want to emphasize I don't mean any disrespect for Sheriff Tucker, but we need to show respect for
the residents that live in this area that will be affected by this. I'm urging you to pull this item from the agenda because of the limited notice. Please place it on a future evening agenda so residents who actually
live in the area can be heard. find a more appropriate location, maybe one that would better honor this man and his family in an area where they had the greatest
impact. You've not you've never had a problem postponing discussions even on more urgent issues such as flooding or rural boundaries. Now, it was mentioned there are only two people
or three or whatever. Maybe that's because they don't even know that this is going on. They have not they don't know that they can come here and have a say. It'll be done by the time they hear about it. So, that's all I'm asking is
that it be delayed so that we can have public input from the people that live in the area. Stacy can too. Good evening. Um Stacy Cantu, Daytona Beach Commissioner for Zone 4. Thank you
um David for bringing this forward. I know we've been working on it since last year. This is his son. Um he works for the city of Daytona Beach for 18 years now. 18 years in public's works department and he his father died when
he was young. Same here. Um and we do he did hire the first um three black deputies and back in 1953 you know that was a no no. Um he was the youngest sheriff in Valuchia County as well. He also was given the sheriff Tucker
complies outstanding record. I've done tons of research when he gave it to me before I even got behind this because it's my name as well and he does have family um that lives on
Tamoka Farms Road um that grew up and a lot of his friends actually I know some of his friends as well and this is the road that we chose and we came to you and I it's a memorial we're not changing
the road, the name of the road. I don't get that. There's memorials all over. I live off Beville Road 400. You guys have the Delta Kai takes care of that road. There's a big sign right there when you go into Publix on 400. So, there's
memorials everywhere. City of Daytona Beach, the first deputy was Brinkley, and we do have a road named after him. But we only thought it was right since he was a Valuchia County Sheriff if it was a county road. And would you like to say anything?
I know he doesn't like to talk, but I can talk. My dad fished a lot. He fish on the Tmoka River a lot. Um, he would have never wanted to take anything away from the name. Like I know Indians, the Tamoki Indians been here thousands of years. Um, but we're not taking away from to
the road. Like she said, we're just two signs on either end. That's all it is. Pretty simple. And he did grow up in Valuchia County. He went to Stson University as well. Um when he passed away, he was running for um judge, a judge. Um and he did pass away like you
said. Um he was in a boating accident trying to save a little girl. So I hope you all consider putting this memorial up. Um we would really appreciate it. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Uh
Terry Tucker. Well, I wasn't planning on speaking today, but I I want to honor my father-in-law that I never got to meet. And I learned about him because he has stacks and stacks of newspapers. And
although I'm a big researcher, you can't find it on the internet. We have stacks and all the ones that you got, I copied them. And there's more where that came from. There's so much. I couldn't even believe all that he has done for this county. And yes, Daytona
Beach was his area. Banell was later in his life, but he was a sheriff at 28 and he dedicated to do the right things by the people. And I'm going to fast forward because we've only been married 15 years. But in the year
2013, I got to meet Henry Duffett and he was down the hallway where I don't know if you know who Henry Duffet is, but he was an attorney and a real estate attorney. And I was telling him about his dad. And when his dad was the city
manager, the last job he ever did when before he died was with Henry Duffett. Henry Duffett went on to um live to be in his 90s. And then we got to meet I got to meet Carl Brinkley and we were honored to attend his 90th birthday. And
at the table was uh Mike Chitwood and Ben Johnson were the was the um sheriff at the time. And at that party, I got to hear from the very first black deputy speak
praise and honor and love and devotion and how that changed the trajectory of his life. And so many in the community in such a way that I am the pain in the butt who kept saying, "Why are we not honoring your dad? He's so amazing. We
need to do something. We need to do something." And so I am the little thorn in the side because this man was so amazing and so humble and died at 48 because he went into the water to rescue a little girl and had a heart attack and
died. And so he didn't get a chance to do all the extra things in his life and make all those extra wonderful contributions. But what he did from 28 to 48, it's it's unbelievable. And if you
need more, I can copy more for you. Thank you for your time. Thank you. Thank you. Uh John, as you go back to your seat, I'll just tell you you you have a thousand reasons to be really proud of your dad. And um there's
literally probably 50 stuff that he started. Yeah. The marine patrol, all kinds of stuff. And I I'll also the pamphlet. I can give you more of the pamphlet pass out. I'll also say just to the council, most mostly to David, it's
a question for him. I think you know the the people that uh contacted me and said they weren't for this made it really clear that it had nothing to do with the sheriff's sounds awesome. I think the biggest question, although it didn't
come up tonight, was Yeah, it did. Mr. Singleton. Why? You're from Deltona. Why did you not pick a road in Deltona? Why this one? And then Stacy just said that we picked the road. Did she pick it or you? No, they did. And then that's why
um that's exactly why. So it it it reflects where the family used to spend time um on Tamoka Road. You just heard it. They said have relatives on the road. So thank you. It could have been another road and I would have said sounds good. So it's not about that particular piece of it. Okay. You know, and I I did see a little bit of the
turmoil in social media and it started with fake news, part of it, Mr. Chairman, because they were saying, "We're changing the name of the road. They got it all wrong and it flustered what social media often does. Stirs the pot." But I'm glad people came here to speak, but I think there's no cause that
anybody can give us to not designate this route. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Right. And I also uh before I call for the vote, um I also asked staff, does this by putting up this memorial sign, even if we put one in either end, does it any
way jeopardize the overlay for Tamoka? And the answer was was no. Has no effect at all on that. So, um did you have something you wanted to say still? Okay, then I will uh call for the vote. All in
favor of uh approving and you saw the picture of it, approving the memorial sign for Tamoka Farms Road, County Road 415. Uh please say I. I. I. Any opposed? And the motion
carries seven to zero. Good job, Ben. All right. And uh okay, we have one person uh for public comment. John Nicholson, John Nicholson, uh the town
of Beachside. Uh first I'd like to apologize to David. It slipped out. Um, but I still would like you to to formally say that the n-word can't be used here by anybody. You don't make exceptions based on race or whatever. I
know Marjorie said it's okay for blacks to use it because it it's theirs, but if it's offensive, it's offensive and we really shouldn't use words debating on what skin you are. Uh, secondly, uh, again, I got stuck uh because of the
ocean center. I couldn't get to my house. All right. for we have to do a traffic study for that area. We really do. And the Ocean Center needs a parking garage because there's not enough parking. Uh when you come from the south and you have to
cross Main Street, you can get one car between Main Street before it stops on Halifax or Peninsula. And then you sit and you wait because everybody is in a traffic jam and nobody can move because they can't get into another road. The
roads don't move anywhere. So we really have to look at that and it happens every Memorial Day, every graduation day, every major event at the ocean center. Um I was at CBB gentleman there was just absolutely livid uh about uh
the condition of Daytona Beach and we were talking you know CBB you got to do something because you're advertising to bring these people here and there's nothing for them to do and it's ugly and you guys got to get involved. You really do because you have the ocean center
there and it is a major investment for you guys. it is your bread basket. So, he was saying that you need to get involved. I'm saying you need to get involved. And lastly, uh when you had the meeting on the reefs, there was no meeting on the
reefs. I had hoped that they would say something other than the fact that there's a bunch of rocks out there and that's a reef, but they didn't tell you that 20 or 30 ways that you can put a reef, the height of a reef, the shape of a reef, all
uh affects the land. All right. So, would you please look at it again? Because it's such a simple thing to do and if it does what the people from Koka said it would do, it's a gamecher and we have to look at our beach as an
investment because without it, trust me, they will not come. Thank you. Thank you. And that takes us to uh closing comments uh from the county manager.
Yes, Mr. Chair, honorable council. I just have uh one thing uh to talk about. Uh you know, when we have disasters, uh we really do depend in a lot of cases on uh volunteers uh volunteer
organizations. uh there's a lot of limitations on what we can do in private property and and for vulnerable residents. So uh in years past we've uh depended uh heavily on Valuchia community organizations active in
disasters co-ad. It's an actual part of our team out there. Uh we've also in the past uh depended on uh things like the United Way. Uh but in order to improve really uh uh the coordination and
efforts uh for our volunteers out there um our community services director uh Brad Burbal and Clip Mechum our emergency management director have come together and they really are trying to
uh form uh the Valuchia Ready response core. It'll be a new volunteer program for residents to help their community prepare and recover from emergencies like hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, etc. So, the focus will be on helping
vulnerable residents. Residents interested in volunteering can attend an open house Thursday, July 5th from 4:00 to 5:00 p.m. with an orientation from 5 to 6:00 pm at the emergency operations center out on Indian Lake Road.
residents can meet the team and ask questions. Of course, we're going to have more information and uh start promoting the program. We'll start with valucia.org/vrc and we'll put out more media, but I wanted uh council to be
aware. Yeah. Oh, sorry. June 5th. Sorry. Okay. And that's all I had, Mr. County Attorney. Yes, sir. Um, I will not be at the next council meeting. Um, yeah, I thought that'd make
some of you happy. My oldest son's going off to college and it's his orientation and it's parent orientation, too. So, I can't find an excuse not to go. So, Russ will be here and uh I'm sure nothing exciting will happen.
So, we should hold off on the attorney appreciation. Yeah, if you could award. Yeah. Yeah, cancel it. Cancel it. Only date we had. Uh, it's our first to go to school, so it's exciting time. Thank you.
Have a good trip. I think that's a wise choice. Okay. Uh, council members and vice chair Reinhardt, you're up first today. Thank you, Chair. Um, only two things. Um Thursday, this coming Thursday, um the Law Enforcement
Officers Memorial Day will be at the Daytona Memorial Park over off of Beville Avenue. It starts at uh 8:00 or 8 or 8:30. So, I encourage that's we've done it for the last several years. Um awesome
event, tribute to uh to our law enforcement community, those that uh made the ultimate sacrifice. Um, after that, uh, the following week on a Tuesday the 27th at 11:00, the Hispanic Chamber, David, do I have permission to go into Deltona? Yes, sure. I'll stamp
the visa. All right. Thank you. Um, the West Valuchia or Hispanic Chamber is doing the regional valor awards. Um, they normally do that at nighttime, but they're doing a daytime lunchon. So, um, and they're honoring the they are honoring corrections. Yes. This will be
the first year. So, I'm very very happy about that. Um, so I encourage uh those of you that can attend to please register. Other than that, thank you very much. I have nothing else. I'm Robbins. Thank you, Chair. Uh, Brad, may I uh ask you a few questions.
Jeez, I put on my seat. Keep smiling, Brad. The smiler. Sir, and I'm only calling you because you're probably going to have the most historical uh knowledge u on this. Um, Gemini Springs. So, my my family and I, we go on uh
these little day trips, spring tours, and all this stuff. Uh I want to talk about Gemini Springs a little bit and see uh kind of where we're at with it. I can you talk to us a little bit about um why it closed down maybe years ago and what we're possibly doing? Um
so, I don't have a lot of context I can provide you with what I've been told by Tim Bailey. Well, what I know of it is is that the uh swimming area was closed because of u high levels of fecal
chloroform and uh there's several reasons for that. Uh of course the place originally was a uh working dairy farm. So, uh there was some discussion about that, but also
uh you know there's a large uh housing area just uh to the north of it uh that are full of uh septic tanks and of course they're all up on a hill running down towards that area. So, I will say the city of Deerry
uh has worked with us and worked with our utility and I believe we have uh a septic to sewer project uh on the books uh eventually to try and uh put people on sewer in that area and help to clean
up the spring. uh a goal for us all would be to be able to go back and and uh swim in that spring and and part of the issue though uh also got into a time when a lot of our spring flows were down. This is not as it does not have
the flow at Gemini that you have at Blue Springs, right? So that's the other part of it. So it doesn't flush out uh like uh other springs have. So there'll be that challenge as well. But the good news uh I know we've had a lot of negative about the rain and the water
and water in places it hasn't been. But also uh in that cycle of life, well that means our springs do have flow now. And uh so there's that side of the coin. No, that that that's that's great. And and what I'm getting at is to to possibly uh
get staff to come back with additional information. We haven't looked at it in in several years. Um, I know we have some restoration product, but I have a target, and I'm about to show you that target. Uh, Chris, I sent you some pictures. They're they're labeled Buccaneer Bay. So, we're getting ready
to go on this uh uh day trip out to uh T um Wikiwatchi. In Buccaneer Bay, they they took a spring and and it it's not bland. Uh next picture, it has
activities. There you go. There's a there's an aerial and stuff for kids of all ages and they're doing some of this stuff in other communities and I look at some of we have a great springs program but I couldn't think of a better environmental green project than to
restore have an end goal but restore um that area. Uh, and and I hope uh David I don't want to step on your toes. Um, but we're always traveling with the kids and I'm going to we're going to check this out, but it really caught my eye because we don't have a lot of place
for for younger kids and and younger families. It's wholesome stuff like this and whatnot. And if it's something the the council may have an appetite um to, you know, I'd be interested in looking at to see what the flows of that are. let's maybe look at restoring it or
giving direction to to restore it if it's something that we can talk about, you know, um get get some more information. Um see if we can partner with the Barry and plus two, I mean it would create uh it's something different. We don't have anything like
this. Um other than uh Matt, what's the the water park but up there in A1A Lagoon? Yeah. Daytona lagoon, you know. But um you know, um council, I mean, should I make a motion or is this
something that that y'all would be interested in looking at and talking about for for the future? If I may, sure. I guess he was looking at me because I think it's my district or me me and Don shared that border there. I think close by. There's a couple uh Chris, is there any other pictures?
They have a little beach area for the kids and there's, you know, they're able to to protect certain areas. Danny, I love the idea of trying to re revitalize Gemini Springs. When it first opened, I used to swim there all the time. Um so, um I if you're asking for support to
look at options to revi revitalize that, I'm on board and make it a look at a good, you know, good project, one of a kind. I like And I just wanted to know did in order for you to get there, did you read a billboard? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. I think so. I love the idea. Right by your house.
All right. Just to let me uh quick question for staff on that. I'm for the idea. I think uh it's it's already a really beautiful park. Um nice facilities, but it doesn't have anything like this. And it's it's uh been a
question I get for 5 years now. Why is why is it never reopened? My question is are we is anybody testing it periodically for bacteria? Yes. And the reports are still horrible. Not horrible. Um but they're above the
threshold that you would want swimming at. Okay. Brad, the interesting outlier that I will throw into this that Tim Bailey has conveyed to me, we actually had some thinking it may have been an old dairy farm and that maybe or the septic tanks.
We had the fecal cola form tested, the DNA tested and the vast majority of what it was was bird from birds. So, just throw an outlier in there to make it more complicated. How did they keep birds away from an airport?
How to do that? There you go. Uh, I'm good with that. Uh, I think that could have been a chicken farm as well. Yeah. Does that mean we can't we have no options to pursue anything? Like Danny was saying, there's ways to clean it up. I think No, I I wouldn't say that. I I
think we are, like I say, heading in that direction, but I think it uh we'll continue to study. Uh um I do think the septic to sewer will will in fact help even though I know he what he said but that's just again part of what's in
there. You can clean up all that and then it's birds. We'll we'll figure out uh about the birds as well. So it was very popular when it opened. Oh yeah. Uh it was uh very popular and my kids grew
to all be 7 foot tall because they you know were in that good clean water with the fecal George what what do you need from us? I had hair before when I was jumping in there. George, what do you need from us to uh it seems like we're going to study it to study. We we we
know that there's some issues there, right? We got the septic disorder. I was wondering how can we start the restoration portion of this if we got to remove all that old that soil that could be leeching in there all around there and then put up some somehow some barriers from let me get the team together do a little brainstorming and
and maybe we can come up with a report without spending a lot of money to uh just give us a general idea of what things would have to be attacked uh and come back I can come back with you uh let's say in uh July or August That's
fine. Okay, good. Thank you, Brad. Also too, I I I had in my notes uh me and Mr. Kent uh or Mr. Kent and I uh had um supported the idea to explore a set millage rate and I think uh Troy, do you remember that you said my memories
did you did you guys do that in Orand a set millillage for road that went towards roadways? Can we um I know that we uh staff had helped us out getting us by this year, but I'd like to make it a priority, you know, for future years. Let's try to
carve out a set millillage, help us improve roads district. I mean, all of our districts, we have we have issues. Um and uh we have priorities uh too. So, uh I'd like to um what do you guys think about uh having that discussion at the
end of budget, but making it a a priority to set this uh for the for the next year? uh because we obviously can't do it this year. So, Councilman Robbins, it's a it's a really smart thing to do, especially whenever um most municipalities and or county
governments don't don't do that. Orman was always in a position where our roads were in much better shape than our surrounding friends because we did something like that. Um after a couple of years, you forget, you know, I say you forget like staff sort of forgets that they did it and that dedicated
millage is there. So, you're guaranteed to have that money, right, to specifically attack that? It's It's something that I would certainly be behind. Jerry, you want it in a motion or or uh we got a general consensus? Uh
it's not not going to raise taxes. It's all within general fund, but but carving out a section of the general fund every year set on a price or it's 5 million, 10 million, whatever the mill would be uh out of the general fund go towards roads, road improvement. Yeah, you can
uh you can make a motion to send that back to staff and then they can bring it to us and and vote on it. We I think what would be prudent uh you're two meetings away from on the second meeting in June is the uh
five-year forecast. And that would be a great time when after you take a look at that forecast to decide if you want to entertain uh something like that. So, we'll show you what it can look like with x amount of dollars uh in there. So, we'll I
think that would be a great meeting to at least discuss it and then we can go from there. Okay. Will you add it to that meeting? Absolutely. Okay. And is that good enough? Yeah. Perfect. And uh and also do something I do want to bring back and then I'll make a motion on I
think all of us have been big on customer service. you know, um something I keep track of whether it's phone calls, emails, uh within our our departments, I I want to strengthen um our quality control and customer
service, uh especially in the um the growth management area, you know, um this is how we eat. Uh this is how a lot of our community eats and we have to, in my uh
opinion, get these uh permits, answer the phones, respond to phone calls in a in a more timely fashion. And I'm looking at options to give some more of that people that that power back to the people, which I'll bring back. Um some are not
going to like it, but um I think we all know that there's some issues there. I can't be the only one that sees it. Um, but also too, it holds it makes us better as policy makers. I think it makes us better um employees, you know,
uh, workforce and, um, gets a lot of ships moving and lights light some fires. But just to let you guys know, um, I I get I get calls all the time. Where's my permit? Where's this? Why I
got to go here? Why do I got to shuffle around here? How come I can't get a call back? I can't get an email back. So and so says this, I go there to pay for it. So and so says this. So how can we make this this better? Um and one of it is holding ourselves accountable and and
looking at a mechanism possibly where if we don't do stuff in a timely fashion, if the permit was $500, now it's $400. If we're outside of a time frame, now it's $300. But the only way for
people to learn, it's no different than than putting your putting your hand uh on a stove, right, is accountability. We're asking uh a permit submitter uh or a resident to be accountable, but it never seems like government's accountable. And I' I've heard the same
thing. I'm 40 years old. I've been down here most of my life. It's been this way in Valuchia County forever. and and I see it discouraging businesses, discouraging uh residents, and it it it and and at
one point in time, it left a bad taste in my mouth as a as a citizen, and I still am. Uh and and and but I think we can do better uh in this and and and whatnot. So, um I'm going to be looking at
ways to for better quality control and and possibly uh discounts when government is at fault. And I'll just uh I'll just leave it at that for now. Are you done? Oh, okay. Uh Don had a
question on that. Well, just to supplement what Danny was saying, I mean, an onbudsman's office, like I brought up a couple years ago, would be, I think, a huge help to help guiding people um through the system. I don't know if we could ever get serious on
that and really put one into effect. Excuse me. We have one and we're from that discussion and I think they had over 330 uh uh cases that they worked on in this last year. We have an official on Buzzman's office. Yeah, it's through our
economic development and uh and uh we have a guy trained and that's what he does. And it's not just for business, it's for everybody. And it's not just for permits. It's he's uh also worked on other issues, but uh we have a I can
give you a report. He's had over 300 cases. Oh, there he is. So, um he's done a great job. Mccardi is a great personality, a great person who has uh worked with po folks and um so like I
say it's as of May 15th 334 residents and businesses have been helped navigating that process. Of course our goal would be to have our processes and we are looking at streamlining them so that we have less
need for that kind of help. That's true. And and and and George, I I appreciate that. And I, you know, I hate um I hate bringing some of this stuff up and and I know you we're all into we're all into improvement and I think you'll
see some uh improvement and changes uh here shortly, you know, and and as a business owner, uh no matter the day or how bad the day that that you're having and even like a cop, uh when I was a a police officer,
um you don't let that carry on over. uh in into the customer service area and and I remember sometimes, you know, I I'll go in county office just like a a ordinary guy, you know, just to sit back and listen and and I listen, I do it periodically here. I've done it in Lake
County because I've got get permits in Lake County, but um it's always interesting to see it and and I just want to um remember who we work for and um customer service, everything. Smile. I mean, we get Brad's face uh, you know,
up on a poster in every department. Brad's always smiling. Um, and, uh, also to, uh, George, do we have an idea of when we're bringing back the executive summary um, for the uh, growth management department to uh, review that collectively or is that
something you guys were going to what were we going to do with that summary? Oh, do you mean the report where that where that's an in-house document that we worked on for us to make changes? I mean, I'll share it with any of you that
Okay. want want to talk to about it, but that's a tool that we are using to do the streamlining and stuff that you're talking about. Now, since I was sitting here, the HR director did text me and say I could not put their hand on a stove anymore. Those days are we got
past that. I don't want to be burning them. I'm with you. Uh no, but no, seriously, we are working on that and uh you'll see things and I'll come forth uh with where we're at. We we understand and things and you already have started helping us with a process just recently
by passing some of the things like the sheds and fence stuff to to shift the workload to where it needs to be to put their efforts and resources so that we are making those shock locks. Uh also, you know, there's some philosophical changes that we we're having to make and
and and again, I need uh and you guys are providing good direction so that we can u uh do what the policy of the council is and and some of it uh it's going to take a little bit more time, but uh and some of it you uh of course,
you know, we get into certain things we're trying to do and then the state comes in and says, "Oh, well, by the way, uh uh don't make anything tougher and don't make anything or you know where we might want to prevent flooding or do something like that. So, right, you know, but again, uh I assure you it
um we're working at uh you know, after budget, I would say it's probably the other thing we're working on the most and and and I'm just looking at the some of the cultural changes and we all know what we're we've all been here long enough. Um, I'm going to try to leave it at
that, but um, you just let me know or let us know to, you know, if there's anything else, uh, that that that we can do to to help further this. Um, still interested in looking back. I I know we had the couple ordinances out out in the wind, if we can bring back
the the farm products uh, or egg products not produced on the property. I think there was an appetite for that. and also to the uh to support our businesses and and uh blue collar folks the uh the ordinance with the trailers as well or the business vehicles. It's
been so long I forget the details but um talk about the the the trucks over the road trucks. Well, the the trucks and the um I talked about, you know, there's an ordinance out there where you can't park the trailer in the front yard. It's
in in our rural and transitional areas. I mean, it's it's kind of goofy, but you can do the same thing if you have a farm, but if you're an average working man, you can. Um, if you can bring back those two um ordinances here uh within the next few meetings, appreciate it. That's all I got. Thanks,
Councilman Santiago. Thank you, Chairman. Um I was just going to add add a little thing to that. You know, Danny, I think government in general and maybe not all, but um needs to get into a uh in a more customer centric uh
mentality, right? So, I support that that concept. I'll give you an example. I was um in uh Orlando today and um talking with some electeds over there and very similar stuff. You know, it's a it's that constant bite at the apple type of
stuff, right? where you submit something and then oh wait something that we should have looked at you know six months ago is now coming up on a new list and all these things cost time and money. So we just got to get better at whether it's checklists or things like that to make sure we we're really doing
our job more efficiently to for for better service delivery. So um we we have that issue and it's a big government problem throughout and and I said I was talking to one these people came in thinking they were going to get a permit in six months. It took him a
year and a half because it was a constant bite in the apple. And I'll just give one I think is a foolish example. At the end when they thought they were there, the city of Orlando, I'll say it, came back and told the applicant, "Wait, you need a indoor bicycle storage place for the public at
the at the final hour and now they had to redraw plans and make a indoor bicycle storage." Well, if that was the case, why didn't you tell them, you know, 10 months ago? But anyway, that's just that example. Hey, uh, good news. Hey, I had a great time. I went to the Tortugas on Friday. They lost, but it
was still a good game. So, my first time to a Tortugas, uh, game. I went out there with my grandson, and uh, we had a good time. So, Tortugas fans, uh, good job over there. I I didn't get my visa stamp. Sorry. Yeah. Um, on the roundabout thing, I I
did have a curious question on the roundabouts. the gentleman that talked about the roundabouts. Um, do they have to be concrete? Can they be landscaped? I I I don't know. Is it a is it a visibility thing from Well, I can have him talk to it, but uh there is some history here and we worked with Stson
University because it really is kind of the entrance to the center of their of their campus and uh they're supposed to come back with uh you know, they have the ability to put within limit and by approval of the
county uh things that would be related to Stson University like an like a big S or some other things that they could decorate it uh with. So it does not have to be and as you know there are uh roundabouts that are full of landscaping
and uh and other areas. Um, but I will say we've kind of had a a policy in a lot of these cases uh where uh we provide the infrastructure and then uh either like a city or in this case maybe
Stson uh would provide the decoration or the maintenance to try just to try and keep our cost down from specialized uh maintenance requirements. And the same thing with medians. uh you know when you see like medians very well
decorated on uh places like Orund and uh uh Port Orange and all that of course those are special assessment districts that uh are run by the cities to um to maintain those. Gotcha. And I get it the low maintenance thing and and maybe just
food for thought maybe we use uh native plants or something in the middle would require low maintenance or something. I don't know. I'd rather have them some nature than just concrete if that's the case. In this case, uh this traffic circle or roundabout is actually of a size such
that it's designed for vehicles to go over the top of it. So, it's a it's a smaller area. It's a two neighborhood style streets as opposed to like Orange Camp and Martin Luther King or 44 and Kepler. Uh so, you don't use as much space. You don't have that green space
in the middle like we have in those other areas. And uh it's concrete on purpose. So buses and trucks because we do know that they utilize that corridor, they actually will go over it's designed for them to drive over the top of it. I didn't know that. We did look at trying to isolate a small section in the middle, but when you take a look at the
way the vehicles move through there of that size, fire trucks as well, uh it doesn't fit. Okay. So, okay. I didn't I I wasn't aware of that. I like round the balance, by the way. Um, the other thing was, uh, um, you know, as we get into this budget season, Danny was talking
about, I want to see, I brought up that idea to maybe make a serious effort to promoting industrial uh, recruiting industrial corporations to Valuchia. Um, I just want to see if there's consensus to give direction to staff to, you know,
turn our economic development engine team to, uh, find ways to recruit there if there's any. And of course we are you know your recruitment your actual recruitment arm is team Valuchia and that is what their charge is is to recruit industry
here. Uh you couldn't see it in that picture but just to the north just north of our facility there was an empty uh building there for a long time. Uh that's an example of that's now a uh a trailer manufacturer and very
successful. I think there's over 200 uh employees in there that are welding and turning out trailers uh at a at a big clip that was just to the north of the picture just north of our our facility. So yeah, I mean uh and we can certainly
look at uh the target businesses that they're going after and uh and make sure that they're in in the inventory. Um but yes, I I agree we should be going after any kind of manufacturing job. uh
industry we can get. They're coming back from China. I don't know if you heard that. So, we got to get David. May I ask you something? Yeah. You have two questions. Danny and then Matt. David, can we also incorporate in there, too? I mean, we can recruit all we want. We don't have a lot of industrial
properties. What's raises red flags to me? They're in they're in demand, right? They're they're they're diamonds. Okay. Why aren't people and businesses coming to Valuchia County?
That's what I want to know. And I would like to have a a a a talk and I know some of the answers already cuz our permitting and regulations just like everywhere else across the world are ridiculous. And that's why we lose so much business to China, India, and all
over the world in in in this country. But that's going to play a large portion of it. And if we want to get down and get people here, we're going to have to make some bold regulation moves to free this economy. Well, in addition to being bold there, uh I can tell you just in
today, I met with team Deluchia today and there are several projects that uh they want a readymade building. You know that that uh we don't have the product that some other areas have. So you have some areas of the country that saw a lot of manufacturing loss and I came and a
lot of us maybe have been in areas the rust belt. You have factories that are sitting there empty and so a company can go and get a a factory already built in some of these other places. So we have we have the advantage of weather. We have a lot of great advantages here, but
one we don't have is uh is a lot of inventory of of industrial land and industrial uh buildings already built, which of course that also talks to what Danny's saying. Well, if the building's built, you've already got through a lot of the hurdles that that he he means
because that's it's time is money and uh in order to put together something some of these projects, it's they're years in the making. Years in the making. So uh but yeah I I think you know we have um on our schedule I think in August team
Valuchia to come through might be a good uh part to add to the presentation and you can help you know again setting direction uh that would go in with the money that we uh that we send. Uh there are like I say we contract with them to be our recruiter and then our own team
recruits for the airport and also for business expansion which is also a very big part of that and there are businesses that are not happy maybe in neighboring counties uh maybe because of population growth and other issues that are are looking at us now. So, um, so
there is good news. Uh, I think it's a great topic and, uh, we can set that up to make sure that's a a priority. And David, I just I just feel like we're so anemic in that area. It's so just almost non-existent. I mean, uh,
chairman, how how many industrial projects have we had in the last four years? We had a couple, uh, do we have a food, uh, god, the food depot? And I can't I think we can count them on three fingers. Um and we have the inventory
here, but you know I'd like to be Yeah, we just need to put some f more focus on it. I think and then change policy. Do we have Yeah, we have to. Do we have it in unincorporated Valuchia? Yeah. For the cities, probably both. Either or. We
need it. Yeah. So, I just wanted to emphasize it because now that that property will probably become available very soon. So, let's get it back on the market. try to get what's going to So that leads me to my next point. The ship funds just I know Brad um you said you're under a clock and I know you do your job very very well. So let's get
them $1.7 million. Uh unless there's a council feels differently. Let's get it to our existing residents. Is that going to be a problem? I don't want to lose money. That's why my team and I were strategizing when we left after. Um, so I guess a question to
council is, would you like us to put that 1.5 million out again for rental development or focus more on homeowner repair and rehab? If you're asking me, I'd rather put it in homeowner repair and rehab. Okay. I
want to help our existing residents if we could that qualify for the program. Could we fund Can I speak? Okay. Can we fund um another shelter with that money? No, sir. No homeless shelters on that. No, sir. Okay.
So, we'll move down that road. Otherwise, we have other rehab for me. I'm sorry, Jake. Did you have something on that subject? Yeah, I was I was looking over to Don. He's he's not for affordable housing. He's not for spending money for fixing homes. So we I
if if I'm not saying you're you're swaying us to to make that decision, but you make a good argument. Is there something else we can use the money for? No. No. And the answer is no. So we either build the affordable housing. I don't want affordable housing. We fix at
an exorbitant rate existing housing. We don't want to do that. Or we give the money back. Yes, sir. Those are our three options. So I'd rather rehab, help people that live here. Okay. And that's part of our strategy. We produce and preserve are the two
strategies that we have for affordable housing. And preserving is certainly one. Um it's a a resourceheavy endeavor, but we will make it work. Before you go, it was maybe two years ago I sat in a
meeting here uh with the former director of um Daytona. It doesn't matter. Um he had plans and pretty good backing to build a
little village for homeless vets. Um and he just needed land. We didn't have any land available at the time that wasn't already spoken for. What about would Don vote for something like that? This is like tiny homes. I'm You
know, I think this is going to come up in a later discussion, but you know, we are ranked ninth in the state of transient sex offenders. I just found out we went from 61 to 72 now transient sex offenders living on the streets that these shelters won't house. They can't
find any place to rent. So, I'm trying to find a fix. Jake, I understand you may think I'm being hypocritical, but I'm trying to find a solution to getting these homeless sex offenders off of the streets and into a place where we can account for them. So, if we can take
this money somehow and put it into a another shelter that will house sex offenders, I'm all for it because I want to get them off the streets. Okay. Well, I think you know where you can spend the money and I think you know where this council is. I hear the
direction. If there's alternatives, we'll come back. We'll come back if there's anything. But right, it basically has two choices. We hear you loud and clear. Uh you want it right now on rehabs. So that's the direction we're going to go and then he'll look at other options. And if we can work I don't know
on some cities if we can work with some of the cities and see if they have uh I don't know if we can divvy it up. We can actually we have been partnering with the city of Daytona on a project. So we are pooling our resources. Okay. Good. That way if it can help us get the funds where they need to be. My my my Thank
you, Brett. My last item, Mr. Chair. I don't want to This is like a third rail. It's like a New York saying, right? You touched that third rail. That's the electric one. Um but I I want to put something and I apologize to to George because I don't try to throw surprises
out. Um, but I wanted to see if in the future we could have a um a look at our evac system, our transportation system to really look have a holistic look as
to how uh emergency transportation, non-emergency transportation is dealt with in the county. Um, and uh I I I don't know if it needs to be fixed. I don't know it needs to be tweaked or I don't know if it needs to be left alone
or completely blown up and start all over again. Um I hear my for my well 20 years I guess of service service to the community. Um you hear about it all the time. It flares up here and there and and normally what I come to the
conclusion is is we're dealing with turf wars and turf wars usually the people that are around you don't benefit from them. It's usually the the different parties that are being protectionists for their own corners. And I'm not looking to pick a winner or loser other
than the the the taxpayers and the service that they get from this. So I don't have a accusation or a thought or anything but maybe if we can in the future not too distant find a way that we can have a um
holistic look at it and look at best practices throughout the country and see if that's an opportunity uh here for Valuchia. I don't know if there's any support to look at it. Just because it's been a certain way for a long time doesn't mean it's the right one. That's
what I believe. So I it's a great uh great idea. Maybe a third rail, but you're not asking for us to make the decision tonight. But I by way of encouragement, I would just say I think Bobby King is doing that right now with
with public transportation, not EMS, but she's looking all over the country, bringing back ideas, changing. We've we've actually incorporated some of Don requests that made it sense in in bringing in uh Uber and Lyft. Um not
trying to compete with them. Uh so um I I've I since I've been here, I've I've seen tremendous progress just in that segment in in public transportation. Now, I you know, the EMS um we need to hear from them, see what
they need. We're building a big station. Yeah, I want to look at it. I just don't I don't want to just ignore it. Okay. Danny had something, Mr. Chair. Yes. Um staff, uh I know this was a a big topic for several years. We have a lot of information on it. We did two
presentations, one in 2021, and it was like the gift that kept on giving for two or three years. We have a lot of good information. I we uh made uh some more outposts, you know, we've uh hiring and retention bonuses. Uh there's been
several contracts in between there. Um can we get him the the is it BLS? Basic life service. Yeah, support those uh presentations. I forget who was it Joe at the time. Well, we can Yes, we
can pull back the history and and distribute it to all of you and then you can just look it over before we vote on anything. I I I'm okay with that. We could start there. Um again, I'm I'm not by far suggesting that we have a problem. I want to make that clear. I
just don't know. I just hear stories and and when you hear stories, you got to look into it, you know, and see if there's anything there there. That's all I got, Mr. Chair. Thank you. Okay. Hey, Don Dempsey. Okay. Um, yeah, if I could just clarify
because I I know George, you told me previously that we have a concier service, but I maybe there was a miscommunication on what my hopes were back a couple years ago when we talked about it. The concier from what I'm reading and what I understand is just somebody to help guide people through the permitting process just to make
these owner builders maybe uh less frustrated as they're trying to navigate through you know, our building codes, but an onbudsman, and boy, this would this would be great if this is what it is. My definition of an onbudsman and how it's
defined um in the d, you know, when you look it up on the internet, it's an it's an official who investigates complaints um often related to government or large organizations and seeks to resolve them through various means, including mediation recommendations and sometimes
legal action. They act as an impartial and independent advocate for individuals and aim to identify systemic issues that lead to poor service or rights violations. And so I've heard from uh developers who have told me that they're
sometimes afraid to step forward and complain about their dealings with the county because of the fear of blowback. And one of the things I understand that an onbudsman does is they take this um in confidence. So when they receive a complaint about a department that
they'll actually investigate it independently. They're not a employee of the county, although they may get paid by the county, but they are an independent agent and their job is just to try and identify these complaints. And you know, I I just think the concier
is awesome. I think you guys did a great job by implementing it, but I'd like to see something with more teeth. I think what Danny's looking for is something with a little bit more teeth, a little bit more independence. And I think the developers and the people who I hear complaints from, um, they want confidentiality. They don't want to be
outed for being the squeaky wheel, um, for fear of blowback. So, I didn't know if we've gotten that far down the road towards an onbudsman, but if not, I'd like to see us get there. and and Don, we we
have an area um that that we do uh and that like the independent auditor for instance, right? He's fair and impartial and and all that stuff. And I see what you're saying because there there has to be some conflict re resolution, right? And and it would I agree with you
and however you want to package that in a motion, you'll have my support. Well, I I mean I don't know if this is the time to make a motion. I mean, I would move that we actually just have staff report back to us about the feasibility of an onbudsman's office and
what that would take. Yeah, I think that's this a safe motion you can make. Motion that we that we've agreed that we would avoid is making a motion to do something and voting on it without it going to the public without public input. But to request staff to bring
back information is is perfectly acceptable, I think. And chairman, I'll just also add if you don't mind, and and I think it's a fine idea, but this is going to cost money. Yeah. Like this is going to be a full-time position. So, there's that piece to it as well. So, with our budget season coming up, I
think it's an appropriate time to have that discussion then and to see if we want to add someone to our budget. Unless it's something our internal investigator could do. We have one. He's pretty busy. But who's that? Our
internal investigator. Yeah, I think bringing back information is appropriate, but I think we also need to have some discussions about what exactly are we talking about because uh we do have an internal auditor who does review issues.
Um we're in a public records environment. So, I'm hesitant to say that we could establish a process where people could say that they're never going to have I mean, our code enforcement complaints are public record. So, I I I
don't know how to avoid that, but lot to unpackage here. I think that you can talk about what council's discussing. You're talking about a com a complaint to be confidential would be a public records. Yeah. I mean, generally, yeah. I mean, our public our code
enforcement complaints are public record. And Don, I I think a lot of what you're hitting on and and Mr. Kent brought it up too about adding money, but I also want to see the money and revenue that we are losing by not processing these
things by going having government go back five 10 shots at the apple, not being held accountable for maybe missing something or uh not not uh um issuing bonds back or whatever the case may be. But I see what you're saying. I don't
know how we can we can package this. It's like um another check and balance. I think it would it would pay for itself a million times over to to have some somebody that that you're kind of describing to
help get some of identify some of the issues where we're going wrong where we can make policy changes uh to improve our overall system. Um, and like I said, we just have to figure out how to package that.
Hold on before you uh continue. Vice Chair Reinhardt. Thank you, Chair. Um, and I was going to say that, Dom, with respect to what it takes with our internal auditor. His schedule is packed and he doesn't hit every agency in a one-year period. Now, if you have to
stop him to address a complaint and then stop what his process is, his office is of what three if that. So, I I don't necessarily think that that his particular office would work. Um, so therefore, that being said, yeah,
it's, you know, if we we have a separate office, I'd be interested in the cost and whatnot it would take as well. I think the idea is great, but you know, we all look at the cost. Um, and as far as public record, you're right. I was going to mention that. So, thank you.
Uh, code enforcement does just that. So, um, all that's public record. So, well, I mean, if it's that route, I'm just saying if it's that route. I don't disagree with anything you're saying. I, you know, we operate in an
environment, you know, local government. It's going to be about the most transparent environment that you're going to work in, right? Think about all the appeals. People are unhappy with a decision your chief building official, they go to
you. People are unhappy with a zoning decision you make. They go to circuit court. Uh they think that you're not applying the law correctly, they sue you. You meet every two weeks in a
public session and have discussions. So at the end of the day, some of it is going to be, you know, that's why you have management, right? That's why you have a process where people complain and say, "Hey, I'm not being treated correctly on this." Well, many times
they may be wrong. Other times they could be right. But you got to have the right people in place to review those concerns and make sure things are being done correctly. At the end of the day, that's what you're talking about.
So, you know, I think yes, you do have this concier service to help move people along. You also undergo audits routinely. You've taken an extra step to bring on an internal auditor, which you
did not have to do. So, you know, if somebody is unhappy uh with and they feel like their rights are being violated, there is more due process here than anywhere else on earth, you know. But it does take
somebody to complain. And if that person's not willing to complain, I don't I don't know how the issues not is resolved because it takes somebody willing to complain. And there are avenues for people to complain. Now,
I've taken complaints uh Saturday and Sunday in the evening from probably the person who is last complained uh about this very subject. So, and who's also made the statement about
retaliation. He's a gigantic builder. Uh I don't think there's been any retaliation. And in fact, when you when you peel the onion back on a lot of these things, you find out maybe there's some blame on both sides. But at the end of the day, a lot of times it is uh engineers that haven't completed reports
to us. It's inspections that haven't gotten done on time. Uh there, you know, believe me, the team wants to get they want to clear their docket. They want to move stuff through. I I I've never found one yet that wants to, oh, I want to hold back and I'm going to punish this
person. That that is myth. And if I find it, they're eliminated. And that's my job. And that is what uh occurs. So I to that degree, then I guess I'm the omnibutsman because uh I do the investigations with Suzanne, other
folks. We look into all these complaints and they also know that if I get too many of them, then that's a big that's a big problem as well. But I will tell you when we look in there, it's not always, you know, what people say. They love to play us against each other. They love to
do things like that. I mean, if I had a dollar for every time they've complained about the speed of something only for us to go back and we had keep those records and and so yeah. Yeah. It took a while, but you didn't turn in the thing to I've had them actually scream and holler to me about it and I find out they turned
it in the Friday before and it's Monday or Tuesday. We don't work on Saturday or Sunday. We can do that if that's what uh we'd like to do, but people will do that to us all the time. So, uh I will definitely look into it. We will
definitely uh uh pull the records. We are making changes, but some of it has to do with again changing ordinances, changing laws. We're in the middle of doing that. Uh but and I'll do uh obviously whatever you'd like us to do, but I just don't want you to think
nothing's being done in the meantime because it's being done on a regular basis. Uh and people I'm a pretty accessible guy uh especially in that community. So um so I and I I think I'll
be meeting with one or two of them here in the next coming days. So, uh, so again, I'm out there. We're making those changes and we'll look at whatever kind of system you want. And you do have an internal auditor. He is he is very, uh,
busy, but we can always redirect. If that's the priority, then that's the way we'll go. Jake Johansson. Yes, sir. I was about probably to say exactly what George just said. Having
having worn a city manager app for a little while, I found that a lot of times and and government's good at this. If they get a piece of paper, they stamp the damn thing. If an email comes in, it's got a time or a date on it. Um and and
so nine times out of 10 when you start doing the chronological order of things, they're not in the order that either one party or another says they happen in and in development especially. You have what
do you have George? You got the land owner, you got the developer, you got the engineer, and then you got all the contractors. and between them, they sure as heck can make you think that everything's eight weeks behind. Um uh I also think that that George mentioned
something during uh Danny's time that uh um that we're looking at the customer service piece. Um and and lastly, I think that the um uh that the that the
way to do it without without getting retaliated and the way to keep your your your name out of it is by coming to us. And and that's what a couple of these developers doing. They're coming to us and we're bringing it to George or to
each other. Uh and it's getting done. And you know, I it's it's it seems to be working. Um and and by the way, I as a as a person who spent his whole stinking life
pretty much in government, I've had ombbudsman's in almost everywhere I was. And and none of them had all the abilities of a of a private sector unbudsman. They were a little bit different because of of the laws we have
here in government. Uh so the ability to um to take legal action against one or another um is uh is a little bit robust if if we're not getting permits out in time. Um our our concier guy, our
onbudsman is is quick to bring it to staff's attention. I know that because I' I've met him a few times. Um, and and I've also heard that he's the best thing that's happened to that place. So, I know he's doing a good job for the
average person that comes in. He goes, "I just want a fence." Um, and and he also helps the big developers with the big uh with the big issues, too. So, um I think we're making progress there. And I'm not a big
fan of hiring another person to that ends up being constrained by government regulations that are beyond our control from from doing probably Don what you'd like him to do in this to in its totality as the dictionary states. Thank
you. Okay, Don, I'm going to throw it back to you. Okay. Well, I don't think it's out of line to ask for an on budsman. I mean, we have one at the state level for the DP. Um, we have an onbudsman, John Calhoun, who
uh serves in the same capacity, I believe I was just speaking of. And then Flaggler County has one for their elder care and um it's designed to help uh families with long-term elder care residents to uh investigate complaints on the way they're treated. So, I don't
think it's out of line. I'm just kind of following with what Danny kind of brought up is just I've hear these complaints. I've heard complaints before I was elected. You know, I've done it. I I had 20 years ago I did a a subdivision. I tried to do it took me
two years. The the frustration of trying to just do a simple three-piece subdivision out of five acres was un it was mind-blowing the bureaucracy I had to go through. So I share I I've experienced the frustration that a lot of these developers have done or what
they're complaining about. So I'm just saying if if we're not doing anything wrong, which I don't think we are. I'm not sitting here drinking the Kool-Aid. I'm not sitting here trying to point fingers at any department and say shame on us. But I don't I don't think the county is above reproach. I mean, we
can't just sit here and just say, "Oh yeah, we we do everything great." I mean, I don't think there's anything wrong with somebody overseeing the complaints that we get. Um, I'm not saying there's any blowback, George. I don't think anybody said that you've ever treated them differently after they've complained. But there's I have
heard from some developer. They're just afraid to ever speak. They they just like Jake said, they come to me and they say, "Man, I can't get a permit. I can't get this." I'm like, "Why don't you I'm afraid know." There's this underlying fear of blow. Not that we're giving any blowback, but there's this fear of of
complaining. So I just, you know, I'm not like I've just said this from day one and I still kind of maintain it. I think an onbudsman office with those types of capacities. I mean, if Jake, if you're saying that they can't have that kind of teeth, then so be it. That's why I was just suggesting that maybe staff
give us a report. And if if they're not allowed to have that kind of teeth in this setting, then so be it. And if you guys don't want it, so be it. I just I think it would be a good idea. Don Chair, may I wait? Let let me toss it to Michael Dyer. I just want to say
question, you know, Don, you and I, unfortunately, I get frustrated by it sometimes. We work in a profession where uh we get caught up in words. Um if you look at the D on budsmen, I think that's your concier service.
Yes, if you look at their powers and duties, they facilitate communication between D, businesses, government entities, and advocacy groups. They also assist with questions and concerns, provide references for
agency services, help point them in the right way, uh resolving agency issues and advocating solutions. They also p uh public records process for the agency and agency records retention compliance.
So you know that to me that's that sounds like what we're doing with the concierge and help pointing people in the right direction and navigating. I I don't see in here that you know more than that. However, I
I still go back to uh I I just think you got when you have this discussion, you have to take into account what are you expecting from your management because you have and I and I
wasn't kidding when I said it. They have more due process here than anywhere else where people can appeal decisions and seek review or then they have you ultimately they can go to if they're unhappy uh with what management can say.
So I I only say that respectfully. Um I I just don't see a difference between the budsman for D and and at least the mission of our concier service. Councilman Robbins. Chairman.
Um, Don, it it'd be only right of me to say that uh we do share some of the blame uh if there's any blame for the the bureaucracy, not just us, but 40 years plus of different administrations
and laws and all this stuff. And I know I was critical and and and and hard on it, but uh on you guys earlier, but uh growth management has always had a uh a spot with me since the beginning. So it's we all know it's
nothing new, so don't take it personal. But going back to what you were saying to make your jobs or less complaints equals less laws. If we really wanted to have some uh policy reform in that
department, what we can do is say anything above state or federal law, get rid of it. It would rock the access of this county. You better be prepared for it. Um but you know, a lot of what they go
through is this 40 plus years of different administrations enacting this, enacting that. It's got to be six inches from here. You can't have a shed over here. It's Some people think it's temporary. You can't have a fence this high. Some of this stuff, 90% of it so
trivial and a money grab and a waste of time. I'm I'm with you. But that's us. We're responsible for that and we contribute to to some of their problems. So, you know, uh, if we want to do this, I think there's a way to do it through policy, but we have to be willing to
grab that that bull by that horns, uh, and say, "Hey, um, anything in our chapter 50 or chapter 72 or chapter whatever or countywide in our in our charter, anything above state or federal
law, nix it. That's how we're going to change the the culture and everything in this county cuz it's like Valuchia County is one big HOA in my opinion. What are you done? Let me just add this because I'm not complaining of I personally every time I
call Clay or anybody else about a complaint, they're always quick to respond and they always have a good answer for me. So, I'm not saying that they're deficient as far as I'm concerned. I've always had wonderful experiences talking to staff about any issue I've had on any subject. I mean,
I'm not I'm not complaining, but when I hear it from constituents, I mean, I do hear it, not all the time, not nearly as much as I used to, to be quite honest with you. Um, two or three years ago, I heard it more, but now it seems to calm down. But I just, you know, and I'll always be a
proponent for an onbudsman's office, an official onbudsman, just because I think it's good for a community, but I'm not saying that we're so far below the threshold that we have to have it, but I think it's it's a nice service to offer the community. That's
kind of where I'm at. Does that wrap it up for you? Okay. Uh Oh, no. I was Okay. No, I didn't know if we were the other thing I was gonna Did we have a vote coming up on that or not? Or I don't even know a vote on um on budsman. I'm coming back. If not,
I'll withdraw it. We didn't vote on it. Danny, I we just discussed it for half an hour. Um I'll withdraw the motion. What was your motion? to have staff come back on a
report on the feasibility of on Buzzman's office, but I'll withdraw it. I don't care. I didn't think anybody seconded motion. I didn't hear a motion or a second. I'll just leave it at that then. Okay. Um, and
just I would like to talk about the issue. I understand I know I've talked before about it. I mentioned it today with Jake, but um, you know, our I don't know where we rank as of today on the homeless sex offender population, but my understanding is that it's gone from 61
to 72 now. And we were ranked ninth at 61. And so I really want to see what we can do about getting some sort of shelter put into place. Since none of these shelters will take transient sex offender or homeless sex offenders, I
really would like to see us look into finding options on where to house them. Again, it's because I want them to be accountable for the reasons I said earlier today. So, I don't know what money we would have available out
of any of these funds that we've received that might be allocated towards that type of housing. Suzanne, I mean, may I, Mr. Chair? You may. We can look at our homeless funding, but I don't think we have any ready funds for that.
And I'll work with Brad on it. I know that Brad uh Burba and I have been working on a statistical analysis for council on the question of what our rate of transient sex offenders have done before and after the ordinance
changes here. Uh we promised to get that memo out before the end of this week. Uh so you can look at the statistics and and I'll just simply say upfront I it is hard with the few months that we've had
pre and post to make a statistically significant determination on what the regulations have done. But I want to let those facts speak for themselves and of course we're keeping a close eye and monitor with the sheriff's office on this issue. But we'll work to see what
funding sources are out there at this point. uh much of your homeless funding is coming out of your general fund. Okay. Thank you. And then last, I just want to thank Ben Bartlett. Um we had our Taylor Road meeting. We had the uh Bartlett, right?
Or Burkup, what was it? Whatever it is, something. I'd like to thank Ben because um after the uh the Jones Edmonds study came back, he had a uh basically a town hall meeting to tell all the Taylor Road um
residents of the uh the results of it and it was kind of a heated debate and that went on for quite some time. And then he offered again to have a one-on-one with uh JC and Miss Anderson and the Jones Edund uh engineers and himself and it was scheduled for an hour
and I think he went two and a half probably close to three hours. Was that No, no, you're right. But, um, I just want to thank you and and give all the accolades to Ben for taking the time to,
uh, to try to do a one-on-one to try and explain, uh, and differentiate their opinions versus Jones Edmonds results. And it was very informative to me, and I really appreciate you taking the time to
do that. I think we mended a lot of uh gaps there as far as the results of the study versus maybe opinions or whatever, but I I came out feeling better about it. So, I just wanted to thank you publicly. Thanks, Ben. That's it. Okay,
Jake Johansson. Real quick, I a couple things. Uh first off, the uh the county is um hosting the East Central Florida Regional Planning Com
Council tomorrow at the uh the beach headquarters. Uh so thank you. Thank you, Miss Melford, for taking care of us. Well, you know, you're taking care of us tomorrow, right? What What kind of sandwiches are we having? No, I'm just kidding. Um, so we have a couple
meetings there tomorrow starting at 9:00 till probably about I guess 1 seem they seem to go forever but uh we'll be there tomorrow. Um also uh this month
is is speech, language and hearing month where we discuss um uh the importance of things that are near and dear to me. Uh as most of you know or or do you guys want to run the video first?
Run the video first. Teresa, I have a quick one minute video that they're going to shoot and whatever they don't say I [Music] will. No crying. [Music]
[Applause] [Music] [Music] If you go up this stair Come on. [Music]
So, most of you know or or some of you know here that uh well, you know, I wear hearing aids probably because you can see them, but what you don't know is in 2012, I uh was diagnosed with throat cancer. Um, and
and the the outcome of that is is a bunch of chemo and a bunch of radiations to your radiation to your head and neck. Well, some of the side effects of that as you go down the road and get above 60 is the the radiation that's that's
pretty much killed your ears, your throat, and uh everything they tried to kill with the cancer. um also ruins your hearing, ruins your vocal cords as you can tell and and pretty much fries your
throat. So, it's very important to me that that we bring to the forefront the importance of of hearing and the ability to listen. And if there's one takeaway
from that, there's a couple of them. Uh, I always ask for a long amount of time to eat lunch and dinner because I I can't chew and swallow quick. Um, the the second is I'll always have a bottle of water or a cup of coffee with me because I don't have any saliva anymore.
But the third is how many times have you been to um an event and the microphone has a problem or or the lady or gentleman doesn't like it and they say, "I'm going to talk without the microphone. Is everybody fine with that?
Well, folks, the the people that can't hear couldn't hear that. So, they're not going to raise their hand. Uh the people that are kind of ashamed because they can't hear. And you know those people, they probably need hearing aids, but don't go to get them. They don't say
anything and try to read your lips. And the end result is whatever great message you're trying to get out to people, they don't understand it. And they're usually standing in the back because they're ashamed, too. So, if you
ever have the opportunity to use a microphone, take the opportunity to use a microphone. And if you don't have a microphone, ask the audience to gather as close as they can and walk around as you're able. It
really helps people like us. In my case, sometimes I forget my hearing aids or they don't have them yet to really do a great job at at getting your message across and not making them feel bad. And the same thing about
speech. If somebody struggles with their speech, just let them figure it out on their own instead of uh trying to replace their sentence with what you think they're going to say. And that's all I have for tonight. Thank you. As you can tell, I'm running out
here. Thank you, Councilman Kent. Thank you, Chairman. Just a few items tonight. First, I want to uh let the the public and the council know I had my district dialogue for res four for residents at the Orman Beach Library yesterday. And typically, I mean, I've had on the low
end between 25 and 30 people attend and yesterday's was the highest I've I've had. I had uh over 60 people attended yesterday's dialogue. It was very well attended. Um and uh some some good discussion back and forth with uh with the residents of Valuchia County. So, I
just want to give you an update on that. During that discussion, Mr. Rectenwald, there was a topic about the unpaved road up in Norman by the sea. The gentleman gave me some pictures, so I'll give these to you. You can put in the public record um before I leave tonight. I'll hand I'll hand those to you so we can
talk about a a solution to that problem. Uh Michael Dyer, I wanted to just tell you, um I would have been disappointed in you if you didn't miss the next meeting to go be with your son. Uh, I've said it here before, but uh, any any man
that I'm going to spend time with and hang out with outside of work has to be an incredible father and and an equally good husband. And, uh, I I admire that about you, and you won't regret uh, missing that meeting and, uh, spending that time with your family. So, I'm pleased. I'm pleased you're you're doing
that. Um, council, this this next one, when we set our meeting calendar, and I was absolutely for it, and I will live with it if we don't change it. But we only have one meeting in July, and that second meeting, we uh decided we were going to supposed to be an afternoon meeting, but we change it to a daytime
meeting. Looking at my work schedule, it would be better if it was an afternoon meeting. Is there anybody willing to support me that we change that back to an afternoon meeting, our second meeting in July? It's fine with me. Thank you, Jake. I'm worried about you because
you're the one that brought that up. I want to make sure you're good with it because we don't have one earlier and I think the thought was if we have it earlier, but now we have a six-hour time limit anyway that we're pretty good about. So, what's the date again? It was
the second meeting in in July. So, we don't have one the 1st of July because the 4th of July we canled that meeting. I'm going to be in Alaska. So, you you knock yourself out. Thank you very much, council. I make a motion that we change
that meeting back to an afternoon meeting starting at 4 p.m. Second. All in favor? I. Thank you. Thank you, council. Um, the next thing that I I wanted to talk about and council, I may need your
help with this. Um, George and company are are uh responsive to me and and help me. But correct me if I'm wrong, George or Suzanne or Miss Malfur, but from Granada to the Flagler line, is is that roughly 14
miles? Google says it is. Okay, Google says it is. Um, Miss Malf, you may want to come forward because I I have just a couple of questions here. How many lifeguards do we have? Not counting Granada, but going from Granada
north to the Flaggler County line. I I want to say it's one or two. Is that correct? Do you mean like the the lifeguard towers? Yes, that's exactly what I mean. People that will that will save people that are drowning in the water from Granada to let me see here.
Isn't it Aweek's Park and one other spot? Maybe I have I have the list here. I I I'll start off uh Thank you, Chief Malf and then and jump in because uh uh Mr. Ken and I have been exchanging some
information on the lifeguard situation in the North Orman Beach area. So last weekend and uh I think most all of this past week, uh our lifeguard staffing, our red towers have run around 19 to 22
on the weekend countywide, all 37 miles of your county man beach, which actually would not include the state park, which is part of your 15 miles area that you referenced. That's uh actually not in the area that we man. Um, we had uh a
tower at Granada. You're correct. A tower at Tom Renick Park and uh the control tower uh at Al Weeks Park uh which is actually staffed pretty much 365 days a year. I went by it on Christmas Day once. Okay. Um uh we do
have a a tower priority list that's been developed uh over the years based on uh density of uh people and the calls for service. And we try to follow that from a health and safety and a public
response perspective to make sure that we are where those right saves need to be. Thank you. And um and Miss Malfford, I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I believe and I think I may have put words in your mouth in a couple of emails where the comment I think you've said is that people should not swim in
the ocean unless they're in front of a lifeguard. Correct. And and by the way, I I totally agree with you. Thank you for that. Council, here's where I I I'm going to ask for your help tonight is that um it sounds like How many did you say, Suzanne? Countywide? 20 What? How
many lifeguards? 24. Is that what you said? Yeah, that's what we had over the weekend. Over the weekend. Yes. Okay. So, you know, let's let's just roughly take five miles out of what I said, you know. So, we'll say 9 miles or take four miles out for the by for the state park
up there. But for 9 miles and and listen, if you've not been up that way, it's it's uh not as heavily populated. You know, it's it's old Florida Beach, you know. It's it's not like going to the Main Street Pier. It's not like going to New Simr or Pon Inlet. It's not
always like that, but I have to tell you, I have constituents of mine asking very good questions, and I don't blame them. Um, they say, you know, two, sometimes one, but maybe three places north of Orand where you can
swim, where our our chief captain is saying, "Don't go in the water unless you're in front of a lifeguard," which is very good advice. Council, here's my ask. I I want on on weekends starting in the
um busy week I'll say busy weekends in the spring and then for the entire summer season I want lifeguards north of Granada at Neptune Amstonish you already have it at Aweeks you already have it at Tom Renick and I
want one at Bsentennial that's where I want lifeguards on the north on the north peninsula I I don't think it's too much to ask. I think Orman Beach deserves to have that type of protection or in Orman
by the sea. We have a a thousands of people that live up there and we have quite a few people that like like to visit up there. So, what I'm really asking because they already had they said Tom Renick, they said Al Weeks and there was a third one they said help me
staff. Granada was it? I'm not counting Granada. I'm saying north of Granada. So I guess that's two places we have. We have Tom Renick and Out Weeks. We can do better. We we must do better for our uh for our residents. And uh so I'm I'm
proposing that we add Bsentennial, Standish, Neptune, and Amston. I want four more guards up in up in Orman Beach if possible. Mr. Chairman, for a total of six. Yes. For a total of six. Yes. Uh Councilman Santiago. Thank you,
Mr. Chair. Um, Troy, I I uh I respect your request, but I disagree that this body is the one to do that. Um, politicians shouldn't be directing how our
resources, which are limited, and I get it. We're struggling with lifeguards, but politicians shouldn't be dictating how public safety gets disseminated amongst our community. Um I don't deny that there there's a challenge there. Yeah. But it's not our
role. It's her role and who she reports to to use to the best of their ability what we have. I would I thought you were going to go to a different path and say let's find some money to create some uh startup bonuses. And I'm not suggesting
this, right? Some in and startup bonuses to get more lifeguards for the season. Then I'd say, "Okay, where do we find those monies?" But right, I I appreciate your your passion for your community, but I couldn't support that because I I don't think we're best positioned to do that. I I appreciate that, Mr. Santiago.
And actually, what I wrote here was, and I didn't say it, but it's written here. You can see it. I don't want to get stuck in the weeds with making staff's decision, but I've got to tell you, and I I don't think you're wrong with what you said, and council, I publicly say that again. I don't think Councilman
Santiago is wrong. This is our third year working together and unless this council directs staff to do this, it ain't going to happen. I I've been thinking about this. How do I get this across the finish line? I've
been talking to George. I've been talking to Suzanne. I think Miss Malfur has been on the emails. And you know what? Um, it's going to stay the same. So, you know, I'm just saying I don't want to be in that position, David. I don't want to make decisions for staff.
I would have been happier if staff wrote me back and said, "Hey, we're going to compromise and get you two more lifeguard towers up here." But that didn't happen. So, I have I have constituents asking me real questions of, "Hey, if our director of beach safety is saying, don't go swimming unless you're in front of a lifeguard
tower. So, you're telling me there's two spots north of Orman for 10 miles that only two places they can they should go swimming?" And I go, "That's pretty good. That's pretty good response. I don't want to be that guy. I don't I You are 100% right. But I don't know how to fix it
otherwise, you know. I I don't know how to fix it, which is why I'm coming to you for help. I I I get it. I I respect it. But I would be criticizing staff if they had a lifeguard in front of 10 people swimming and two miles down the road there were
500 people swimming and we didn't have a lifeguard there because we have limited resources. Um, and and listen, if I get zero support out of this, that's I I'll leave here and I'm Yeah, I I do and I respect it as well. But you've I know you understand each of us are going to
advocate for our districts and try to get the best possible support we can. And I have people beating their chest on this in Orman Beach who are adamant about it and I always like to have a good response to them and I don't have a good response other than I guess you
should go to those two places and that's where you should swim concentrated there. I would support saying you know staff what else can we give you to recruit some more firefighters and and see firefighters. Yeah, maybe firefighters can become lifeguards. I
don't know. Well, I will say you have done a very good job giving us what we needed to recruit, but recruiting is a major national issue and we're feeling the shortages of that. So, we have the money, we have the bonuses, we are our
recruiting efforts are out of off the charts. We've attended 70 recruiting events. We've attended all the schools, swimming events, surfing events. We're getting people. We have a little more people than we did last year at this time and we still have another recruit class. I will say that our numbers for
coming into Memorial Day weekend are probably almost double what we had last year as far as staffing towers. So, we're looking at um our towers are based on a priority priority list and it's based on uh historical rescue data. Um
it's based on bather count based on time of year and we can change that um with special events and other things. We can change that. But and Miss Malf, I appreciate that, but how can you have historical data if you've not had a lifeguard in a miles of a stretch in
decades, you know, like if you haven't had it? Well, it's well, we respond to calls up there as well. So, um, we I will say going into Memorial Day weekend, we have about seven or eight towers that will be staffed north of Granada, but we're looking at some good
numbers throughout the whole beach. Council, that's that's where I am with it. I um I'm I I don't like coming with problems unless I have a solution, which I think I historically do here. I don't
have a solution, which is why I'm coming to you gentlemen and saying, you know, um Orman needs more support with lifeguards on towers, at least on the weekends, you know, to have to have a 10
mile stretch and have two places. I just that wouldn't fly in New Simra, that wouldn't fly in Daytona Beach Shores, that would not fly in Daytona Beach, but it flies in Orand. And it happens every time. And uh I I'm I'm going to be that
guy that's going to say not okay. We have to do better. and and uh you know if it's at the end of this uh healthy discussion if it's if it's George and company going back and then reaching sending an email to staff and saying hey you know we we gained two more we gained
one more in that location I'll feel a little better about it but you know those locations that I told you these are approaches and places where people do go to the beach and do attend and all of this is out of love to protect people to make sure someone
doesn't have a horrific event um in that area and they can also go to the beach in that area. So I I don't I don't hear anybody piping up about it. You've got several people. Uh I'm sorry. Councilman Robbins. Uh thank you, Chair.
Um David brought up some valid points and Troy, I'm going to I'm going to support you the best I can. I I think delivery uh and how we approach this uh is going to be key. Um what I would my gut's telling me I can't speak
for for everybody but um as presented um I I would need to look at the numbers and then we calls for service cuz I'm going to tell you something about Miss Malfur and and staff if if if it was uh dangerous and I've been on the law
enforcement side of things. Um, you don't go down into certain areas at night uh if you're scared of of of of crime, right? Um, you're not going to be able to put an EMS uh at every street corner. You're not going to be able to put a lifeguard in every area. And what
I've seen over the last four or five years is they do track where it's needed, calls for service, uh, uh, high points of the year, uh, uh, weekends, um, uh, holidays and stuff
like that. We have part- timerrs or stuff. They they shuffle around. I think they do a real good job because I don't want to send the message that we're we're purposely putting uh our constituents in harm's way cuz I I don't believe that's the case at all. And uh
you know, for maximum swimming safety, yeah, you do want to if you can't swim, you should probably have a lifeguard or if you can't get out of a rip, you should probably have a lifeguard in front of you. So I I agree with what Miss Malf is saying. I Troy, I agree with what you're saying. We should maximize this. staff, can we just before
we get ahead of our skis, I don't want to see Mr. Kent's initiative uh lose. We maybe uh approach this from a different angle, bringing back some some numbers. Uh well, I I think Miss Melford's just said one thing is uh Memorial Day, she's
talking about having six to seven, which would be and then what he just talked about and and I'm not sure exactly what approaches, but you know, key too is where's the parking and where's the people. So, uh, we're working at it. Uh,
we definitely know it's a it's a a need. Uh, we have added more people. So, I have a lot of hope that we will and she I think she heard everyone loud and clear that, uh, we we need more up in that area. Uh, we just need that flexibility to be say this happens, you
know, say and this happens to other areas. I mean, they'll get a call that there's a church function or something that's come into a parking area. say Al Weeks or somewhere like that. Uh they'll have to move people up into that area. They try to be dynamic in their
deployment, but they're not consistent enough in that area. And I absolutely understand uh Mr. Kent concern and the concern of his constituents. So, we'll make uh every effort to put people. We also do put people in a mobile situation
which tries to cover more ground because again, we're because we're the world's most accessible beach. uh people are swimming all up and down it. You go to other uh counties or other areas of the state, the only place they swim is in a park, a park where there's actual
lifeguards. So, it's a lot more concentrated. uh we have that concentration and then we have miles in between uh where we're also trying to uh cover people but I believe there's gaps if you were to even go to the south and say
from uh the Sunlow Pier south into an area down by Wil by the Sea and everything which is a very similar area to uh the North Pen. It's the same same idea. There's no lifeguards uh for big stretches in those what we call natural
areas because you don't have the parking and the access on a particular park. Uh but I'm very concerned. We've been and and we'll continue to do and she's done a great job. The team really has really uh recruited like never
before, but it is a nationwide problem. I've been reading stories about uh big beaches in the Northeast that won't even open this year because they can't get kids. Uh and it's really a physical fitness thing. It's a it's getting people to uh uh go out in the heat and
work in an area that just young people uh are not going to like they used to. and and but she I think we went up to what $189 an hour on uh yeah we went up to $1850 and then we are offering the seasonal bonus as well. You have to work
a certain amount of weekends and holidays and another thing that we did do was we train changed our strategy for scheduling. Up until last year we were letting guards sign up because they had to be um they had other things they were doing and you know it was a generational
thing but I we're starting to see a little bit of shift in that generational thing. So this year um we instead of letting them sign up we are um mandating them to work the holiday and we are um making them give us a pattern instead of
just signing up dayto day. So that is uh has worked really well so far and our preliminary numbers for Memorial Day are looking really good. So we'll make sure that there's an effort put up in Orman. I I appreciate that and and thank you and chairman, thank you for the latitude
to to compliment them for that and and thank you, George. And I'll just say publicly that's one weekend. Thank you. Yeah. And we'll start, but we we got to start and we're No, I know. I I I know. But I just I don't I don't That is a big weekend and and it is a weekend that's probably our biggest challenge, right?
And then I'll I'll just say because Troy, I think I still have it. I'm going to help you out, Troy. Um real quick and I'll I'll try to finish up. Uh m Mr. Kent, would you be uh willing let staff get us this this data? Let's look at it.
We have a couple of things here that we can do. Um you know, get us that data to see that what the calls for service are the feasibility uh if we want to take some of the uh or direct staff to um uh
do do whatever in terms of maybe uh making something way more uh permanent. and then how we're going to pay for it. And when you when you have your funding sources may be an option, but you know, we have to we're kind of riding a a fine line of dipping into day-to-day
operations. So, I'm trying to help you out, try to get you some support if if that's the the case where where this is justified or needed, but I'm also trying to respect the charter as well and not um get into that day-to-day operational
uh stuff. So, um, it may behoove us to pump the brakes just a little bit, review the data. If that's something this council wants to entertain, I'll I'll entertain it. Uh, I want to make sure we're the safest. I think we all share that that uh, and staff shares that 110%. Um, and and if there's something
we can do, let's talk about it. But, uh, I without reviewing everything first and kind of seeing where we're at, I think it's um, premature. Yeah. And I'll just tell you ahead of time the data the data is going to look um skewed in my opinion because there's no there's no lifeguards
up there. So they're going to come back and say there's like zero calls in any of these areas because we've not had lifeguards there and I don't know how many long I mean how long. And then you know all the places I mentioned you know Neptune they have a an agreement with
the county the church does there the people that park at Neptune. Amston is a a lot where you can park. Standish al weeks. We know how busy that gets. Bsentennial, you know, we know that. I'll just say this last piece about about that. The growth we've had in
Halifax Plantation, Plantation Bay, Plantation Oaks, all those people, they head over to Hybrbridge and then they move south in Orand, Orman by the Sea. And that's and that's where they're going to that's where they are are going to the beach. And then for staff to get back with us. I mean, Memorial Day is
next weekend. I'm glad they have a plan then. But yeah, thank you, Suzanne. You took your name off. You're good. Okay. Go ahead. Okay. And um is there anybody up here concerned
about Senate Bill 180? I know a couple of our municipalities have written letters asking that the governor not sign that bill. Is there anybody up here that wants to support that thought process? I do. I have Okay. my own letter. I've
answered surveys. Okay. I would like to see anybody else like a collective letter from this uh this elected body. I have no opposition to it. I thought we I mean some of the same language actually we we sent a letter in uh I think this
was a watered down version but I think we already sent the letter in uh for was it 1080 or 11 or 118 I forget the numbers of it 718 that was like the nuclear uh button but it all comes back to local control. So, um, I would just
assume that they would still know that we're obviously against it, but I I'll do whatever the the the board wants to do. Okay. Then then I'll make a motion that the a letter from this body be sent to Governor DeSantis asking him to veto
Senate Bill 180. I'll second it. Good. All in favor of that say I. I. Any opposed? times out. My my last one, uh, gentlemen, and and I'll just I just put
this out there and and and leave it there, but I have had some really great conversations with quite a few people in my district. And unless you start the conversation, it just won't happen. But the idea is for the county to work with
the feds and the state to create a new inlet in Orman by the Sea at the location of Hybridge. Recreationally, it would be incredible, but it would also clean up
the Halifax River, the inter coastal in that area as well. So, I put that out there. If any other council members are in support of at least talking about creating a new inlet in at the Highbridge area, it's music to my ears.
Thank you. And uh with that, have a nice evening. I don't have a problem with uh having that conversation and learning more about it. Great. So, I'll make a motion then to um have staff bring back uh u a discussion item for us to talk about the possibilities of an inlet and
the location of hybrid. Thank you. Questions? Yes, I I'll go ahead Jake. Yeah. Um,
what, George? What What does that entail? That's an Army Corps. It's an Army Corps thing, right? Yeah. We'll have to we'll do some investigation. We can come back with discussion on just those answers like
what would it take, what bodies would be involved and uh, okay, thanks. It would be just a discussion what the facts, what we'd have to do. Yeah, I'm I'm asking it's questions. I'm asking a question. No, no, I get it. I just wanted to make sure I was understanding, too. It's just a
discussion. And Mr. Johansson, in about 18 months, I expect to be twisting your arm to help lead this from the state's point of view. We'll see. I I think it's a little bit bigger than that, but Oh, it is. It's it's feds as well. Absolutely. Thanks. I think would you
open it up from it probably doesn't matter at this point but from Granada to Hybridge because it's there's a lot of debate on where the thing is is that there are all homes right there in Granada so I would not even think about any of that the Hybridge area there are no homes in that
area um that's some state land that we would have to work with so I I would say um give or take u a half a mile north or south of Hybridge All right. The only reason I bring that up is because you're you're right. It would help another
inlet would help flush out the northern end of the Indian River Lagoon, but that location's too close to Matanzis. It It needs to be further south and then it would really help with with Orman. I'm a I'm a no on imminent domain to take people's homes for something like that.
I am I don't want to take anybody's home either, but there probably is some land uh somewhere south of of that. But let's bring that back. Yes. If if this goes if people agree. Call the question.
Uh all in favor of asking staff to bring back uh information on another inlet uh in the vicinity of Hybridge. Say I. I. Any opposed? Thank Thank you, council. Have a good night. And Don, you
missed a vote. I'm a yes. You're a yes. Okay. That's on my next list. You know what? Okay. You know what? Sorry. I I I I yielded, but but I actually had it written down here, but I marked it out because of
time. council. I would like for us um I've seen some pictures and uh I I would like for us to have two locations where where we could open up Valuchia County beaches um one on the south end of
Valuchia County and one on the north end for horseback riding um experiences and uh staff can bring it back to us. But I mean at a minimum they would have to have a bag to catch everything and um you know we could open it up to individuals who could horse trailer
their horse there and then you could go and purchase horseback rides on the beach. I'll second your motion. Go with the pilot project or the study for North Orman first as a test and then we can expand it. You don't want you don't want South. I want but I want your to be a
test first. But we already have we already have horseback riding in in Oak. I'm I'm I'm okay with that. I'm okay with the test area up in uh up in north uh North Felia. That that's fine. Yeah, I did have it on my list. I just scratched it out because of time, but why not? Your motion is to bring back
information on that. Yes. Okay. Second. Thanks, Troy. Any other questions about it? Bringing it back for discussion. All in favor say I. I. Any opposed? next to Okay. Okay. Uh Tamara, can you come back
down, please? I'm sorry. Um I didn't want to prolong the discussion, but I had you at the top of my list. Um um this week is uh beach safety week and I had the the honor of of giving a
um proclamation to the lifeguards at the at our main uh headquarters. Um, Chief Malfus was there with quite a bit of her crew and um, this came up in a discussion with you and I, how are we
doing on on recruiting? And I just wanted to bring you back up to tell you you haven't been in this position very long and um, everything that I saw said you're doing a tremendous job that you had good troops there, men and women,
maybe equal parts. I I don't know. So, it's pretty amazing. Um, which works fine because the water's an equalizer. You don't have to be 6' three and and weigh 200 lb. It's probably better. Well, anyway, good-looking
people, 10 times better equipment than when I worked on the beach. Um, 10 times better communications abilities. Um, now that's not all on you. Part of that's on this council, previous council, what what the staff has has done. Um, but I
was really encouraged as you go into one of the busiest weekends of the year. The the men and women there were just they were respectful, courteous, they were ready, they went out and did a pretty hard drill um that you do on a regular
basis and I just wanted to commend you on that. And then just add a little bit to Troy's conversation with you that what when I when I started on the beach and they everybody hates me. I'll tell another beach story, but started in North County, north of Granada, way north of
Granada. There used to be a pier there, and I sat two towers south of the Happy Whale. I also sat Tower 87, which was as far north as you could go, but there was seven of us way back then, and there
wasn't that many people, but we had 200 lifeguards, you know, we had a a lot, we had a full roster, and it's just different now. I hate that it's different because I know what a great job it is. Um, you have you've unleashed
everything you could think of along with uh with Ryan staff, rest of the staff, uh, Michael Ryan. Um, in public communication, we had a we've had a really good uh, recruiting period. There was one guy there that was his second
day. Yeah. This morning and he looked like he was ready. Uh it's uh so um I agree with Troy and I'm really happy to hear him fight for his district that we meet need more guards there. The
ugly truth is you have to look at the numbers of people. My question to you in the busy beach will they will they be so far apart that they need binoculars to see each other? We're trying to close that up. You have to look at the number
of people on the beach and divide that by the number of lifeguards. It's a hard decision to make. I commend how you how you and your staff are are making that. Um but Troy's right. We need to keep
pushing for uh um uh for more recruits to come. You've I think you told me that you have one more recruit class. Yeah, we have uh one more recruit class and we did have our first ever fall recruit class this year. So,
we did add one more recruit class in the fall which was very successful and we had a lot of good candidates from that class. It used to be that you would open you would get the Daytona the mainland swim team, Seab Swing Team and Father Lopez. Now we have Spruce Creek and and
they would just about fill it but they're they're not coming anymore. No, I mean we we go and recruit at the surfing events. We we attend the swimming events uh swim you know uh you know we do we do all the swim events and
we even recruit um swimming schools in their swimmingies and um it's it's really hard uh the kids and when they're racing and when they're swimming um they this generation that's what they want to do. They don't want to do anything else.
So that's the problem we're having. You don't um what is your age limit? We don't have an age limit. They have to be 16 though. Yeah, we I went to retirement. I'm coming after retirement. No, I watched I watched their drill
today and I thought I could do one fifth of it. They had to go back and forth five times. I need to start swimming more. But no, where I was go going is we my daughter's in a a homeschool co-op and they had a school dance and I met one of your guards there and he was
between 40 and 50. I forget what he told me. He didn't look he didn't look like it. I wouldn't have guessed it, but he had two two uh high school kids there. And um I thought, "Wow, are we tapping in into that age group?" because there's
some Yeah, we have we have at least uh every year we have probably two or three over 35 over 40 that come and try out. Good. And you can't get Driscoll back? Oh, well, we have him. Oh, he comes back and works every now and then. He'll sit
on a tower still. Yeah. Okay. All right. Well, just I I know you're facing a a really your first really busy weekend. Um you have all of our support up here. Please let us know what you need. I know what you need is recruits to solve Troy's problem and the rest of the
beach. I mean, we just need we need more guards, but it's it's interesting how we're filling those gaps with patrols and and um um so um good luck. Thank you for what you're doing. Absolutely. Thank you. I hope our new uh scheduling
strategy really helps out a lot this year. Uh we literally our scheduling staff called uh actually physically called 169 people to basically let them know they're they're working the holiday weekend and that you know if they
couldn't they need we needed a good reason why. Could you certify Ben Bartlett and it seemed we could make a reality show out of this. Cyrus is still here. He could he could probably do it. Cross train. Cross
everyone. Let's go. All right. Well, thank you. Have a good season. We're we're looking forward to it. So, but it's beach safety week. And then, um the only other thing I had was the Senate Bill uh 180. Troy, thank you for
bringing that up. So, that you're going to bring us send us all a letter that we can all sign or agree to sign. Yeah. If it's if it's okay, we'll just treat it as a requesting the governor veto Senate Bill 180, get with job
worker on it tomorrow morning and have it signed. And I got to tell you, I really appreciate what you've done, Mike, to this point. You've kept kept us really well informed and your staff has on what's going on in a one of the most difficult sessions
ever. I'll try and put it that way. Be a little bit more diplomatic. This one is pretty egregious and especially it's in a muchneeded bill for emergencies, but then it's tucked in at the very end. Yeah. So, it's a shame you have to get rid of the whole bill. But if we let him
know now, he could take it to the back to the House and Senate and say, "Redo this possibly." And bring me something back. You're laughing, so you're probably not doing it. Huh. Oh, no. I just know how it works. So, um, but I think you've done a good job in keeping us up to date on bills that are just
hammering us on local control. So, um, thank you for bringing this back. And that's all I have. We'll adjourn if nobody else has anything. They're already in another meeting. At 9:33, we are done. I think yes.