Hey, hey, hey. Hey, hey, hey. The November 20th, 2025 hearing for the Planning and Land Development Regulation Commission is now called to order. And could I have you silence any audible
devices that you may have? And please join me for the pledge of allegiance to the flag of the stands one indivisibley and justice for all. >> Good morning everyone. I would like to
thank you for joining us this morning. And um Miss Grinnon, could I please have a roll call vote? >> Member Erien >> present. >> Member Craig >> here. [snorts] >> Member Shelley >> here. >> Member Costa >> here. >> Member Bush >> here. >> Member Sixa
>> here. >> Chair Mills >> here. Thank you, Miss Grin. We do have minutes from the October 16th, 2025 meeting. Is any discussion on the minutes? >> I'll move to approve. I'll move the second. >> I have a comment. No, it's okay. Um, on
V25-062, I voted against this project. However, the minutes reflect that it was unanimous. And on V25-056, I voted for this project and it shows that I voted against it. So, I think there was just an error on those two items and I wanted to fix that for the
record. Yeah. >> You [laughter] >> Okay. >> If only. Miss Granning, can you see that those corrections are made? >> Yes, sir. >> And do you want to go ahead and approve the minutes with the um corrections that have been mentioned? >> I'll make my motion to approve the
minutes with the corrections as submitted by Miss Bush. >> I second those. >> Okay. Okay. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. >> Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously.
Okay. If anyone would like to speak for against any of the cases being heard today, please fill out a form at the back of the dis here and hand it to Miss Grenon to my immediate left and u we will be limiting you to a threeminut
time limit. After the comments have been heard, I will give the applicant an opportunity to address any concerns the speakers have and answer any questions the commissioners may have. And at this time, I'd like to turn it over to Mr. Sora for legal comments. [snorts] >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. This is for uh applicants and members of the public
that decisions by this body on special exception cases and cases which reszone real property uh actually we'll correct that um decisions on this body by cases which reszone real property from one classification to another person to the zoning ordinance are recommendations only to the county council and do not
constitute a final hearing. New evidence may be introduced at the county council public hearing. Decisions on special exceptions and variances made by this body constitute final action subject to an appeal to the county council. And what this means is that no new evidence may be presented at the time of the county council public hearing on the
appeal. An agrieved party that appeals such a decision is confined to the record made before this body. Hearings by this body on reasonzonings, special exceptions, and variances are quasi judicial in nature, meaning that this body is acting more like a court and must take into account all oral, written
or demonstrative evidence presented. Their decisions on these cases must be based on competent substantial evidence on the record and competent substantial evidence has been defined as that evidence a reasonable bind would accept to support a conclusion. Thank you, Mr. Chair. Thank you, Mr. Sur. And while on legal comments, I'd like to ask the
commission to disclose for the record any exparte communications that have occurred before or during the public hearing at which a vote is be taken on any quasi judicial matter. And I'll start with my immediate right, Mr. >> None. >> I have none. None.
>> None. >> None. >> None. >> And I have none. >> Okay. We do have some items to be. Is it either continued to withdrawn, Miss Tucker? These are yours. B25 060 and B25067.
>> Good morning members. For the record, Kelly Tucker, Planner 1, Planning and Development Services. Um, so for these two cases, the applicants did not meet our due public notice. So we are asking for a continuence to our December 18th PLDRC hearing and I will work diligently with the applicants to make sure that
they do get to you at that meeting. >> Okay. Thank you, Miss Tucker. Any questions for staff? Okay, let's take these one at a time just to keep it clean. U B25060, I'll entertain a motion. >> I'll motion to
>> continue till next month. December 18th. >> That's what you have. >> Y >> second. >> Okay. I've got a motion on the floor for Mr. Ersen to continue V25 060 to
December 18th, 2025. A second from Miss Shel. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. Okay. And our next case, V25067. Do I have a motion on that one?
>> I'll motion that as well >> for the next meeting of December 18th, 2025. >> Second. >> I got a motion on the floor to continue V25067 [clears throat] to December 18th, 2025 for Mr. Ersen and a second for Miss Shel. >> Any discussion on the motion? All those
in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. Thank you, Miss Tucker. >> Thank you so much. Happy Thanksgiving. See you guys next month. >> Thank you. Okay, we do have one uh unfinished old business. It's B25064.
So, Miss Shelley, could I get that case read into the record, please? >> Yes, sir. Case number V-25-064. Variance to the minimum yard requirements on urban single family residential R3 zoned property. >> Thank you, Miss Shel. Mr. This is yours.
>> Thanks. Uh good morning. I would like to state uh start by addressing a discrepancy that does not change the variance request but needs to be stated. The um square footage for the addition is 890 square ft rather than uh 750. It
does not change the variance request. Um the applicants the applicants are requesting a variance to reduce the northern front yard from 30t to 19 ft or a 890 square foot addition to the principal structure. Um
the property is zoned R3 which requires a minimum uh front yard of 30 feet and a minimum sideyard of 8 ft on one side 20 ft combined and a minimum rear yard of 20 ft. The subject property is located southwest at the intersection of
Ottabbon um Avenue and um Cordova a Avenue and Don Springs on a corner lot. The proposed addition will be where the mother of the current um homeowner will reside. They wish to create an addition to make an ADA accessible residence for
their mother. Um the proposed ADA uh ADA accessible design features include but not limited to wider door frames, a roll-in shower, the elimination of tide corners. The proposed structure will provide a bedroom, a bathroom with a
shower, a living room, and a uh wet bar. Um upon the first uh staff review, there were discrepancies on the proposed structure would if it would be an accessory structure, an ADU or home addition, which prompted the
continuence. Um and now the structure is a home addition to the principal structure. Um, furthermore, the applicant explained that the proposed addition will be placed near the drive uh near the driveway and um attached to the garage and the residence for internal
accessible reasons u um and for internal uh access to the home. Um, however, staff recognize that the corner lots are not inherently special or unique uh conditions as it is as standard in
subdivisions with intersecting streets. Advocate has adequate space to the south or can reconfigure the layout of the addition to fit the needs of the residents. Environment environmental permitting reviewed the variance request and stated that they have no objection
uh but must comply with the environmental regulations of the land development code. Staff recommends denial as the variance does not meet criteria one, two, three, and four. Should PLDRC find the applicant has provided comp substantial evidence for approval, the conditions are provided
for your consideration. And in addition to that, we will make an alteration to the first condition to recognize the 890 foot uh uh addition rather than 750. Thanks. >> Thank you, sir. Any Mr. Costa? >> Yes. Good morning. Just want to verify
this is a this property has two front yards. Correct. >> Yes. Correct. >> And looking at the aerial shot. Um the true front yard is the one where the driveway is connected. So the addition is going on what will considerably be a sideyard. >> Yes. >> And if I'm looking at these numbers right, the sideyard setback is 20 ft. So
in essence, if that was a sideyard, it' be a 1 foot variance. Just want to clarify all those points. >> Yes. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Frost. Uh and I also just to clarify, we're increasing the square footage size from 750 to 8.90.
>> Yes. >> Uh according to what this report says. What about lock coverage? Does that have an effect on lock coverage? >> It does not. >> Okay. All right. Any other questions for staff? Okay. Hearing none. Is the applicant present?
I get you to come forward, please. If they want to fill out a public participate, are they the applicant? She would have to fill out a form. If you want to come to the microphone, please >> and state your name and address for the record.
>> Jennifer Rollers, 5251 Ottabon Avenue. >> Okay. To answer your question, if your mom was part of the applicant, she can come up and speak with you and just give me her name and address. As far as the neighbor, they would have to fill out a form and give it to Miss Grenon on my left here. Okay.
>> And she can speak uh after you've made your presentation. >> Thank you. And I'm sorry. So would Miss Katherine want need to go over there now and speak with her? >> Yes, she can do that now. >> Miss Katherine, if you want to give it >> or Yeah. Or she can give it to her after the fact. I will go ahead and recognize
her. But go ahead with your >> I'm sorry. Okay, >> that's fine. >> Um I'm gonna I'm gonna try to keep my emotions out of this. Um I we grew up with generational homes also because once your parents do kind
of reach a certain age um in medical situations. We did grow up to where my grand I'm sorry my grandparents did have actually more like an in-law suite attached to their homes too. So I grew up visiting my grandparents with my with my Grammy and Paul's attached also. And
then I saw it, I'm sorry, saw it growing up, how it all actually did work out and how it also kept them from going to certain facilities and you caring for your for your seniors and your elderly and making these relationships you would never have any other way and you
wouldn't have any other way because you also don't want other folks sometimes taking care of your own family. Is that if that's fair to say? >> Um, so I have had now my children have seen it also. Well, now the situation has came. I am my mother's only child that's
here in the state. My brothers are in the are in the military and other career fields where they're not here. So, not only is she a part of my major support system for our family, um I feel like I I mean we we are for each other. So, there are certain mobility situations to
where last year when we sold our home in the land, we had already been talking about how our next home's going to need need to be all of us together. and she has certain medical situations to where as much as we want to pretend, you know, we always want to say she's still in her 40s, we're not. We're all not, right?
Because I'm 45 and she's in her in her 70s. Um, but more of her mobility issues have now kind of been in light because I think she used to hide some of that from us, but now we're under one roof, so we see more of it. Um, and so I we
understand we're asking some folks will say, "Why don't you put in the back of your property?" Well, because also if you see the elevation of the back of our property and where mom safely can pull into the garage with weather and it's Florida, right? We're going to have weather. I have found out now sometimes
she sits in the garage. She sits in her car and waits for the rain to stop before she can try to come inside. If she can park into that one garage and we can have the have the entryway from right there where we're proposing, that's a shorter distance for her. It's safer. There's the door. There's no
steps than also involved. So, if we go from the back side of the house, we then have steps involved. I also have some photos of the backside of our home. So, you'll see the elevation angles and how it actually could even it would be more of a project even with
the elevation issues in our backyard than just than asking for 11 feet on our side. Um, I'm trying not to because I know she's she's my mother. She has been the local kindergarten to
second grade teacher at our local elementary school my whole life. She's the woman that hides a cane in her car because she doesn't want people to see it. So, that bothers me. Like, she didn't want to bring it today, but she still volunteers every day. I need to take care of my mom and this is the best
way to do that. >> Okay. So, I'm just asking please for the 11 ft so we can get this going. >> Okay. >> But she also we also found out she doesn't we she doesn't the upstairs bedroom all the bedrooms are upstairs. >> So that's an issue. The showers have
steps. All of this we are making sure has the capability to take care of her and moving forward. >> Okay. >> She's talking like I'm dead. >> I'm sorry. [laughter] It's just like >> good days. I really do. >> Okay. >> She does. She has great days and then some days I'm, you know, telling I'm
telling our children to go ask grandma what she wants for dinner and I'm having them bring her her plate. >> Okay. >> So, I'm sorry I got emotional. >> No, you're fine. You're absolutely fine. >> Ma'am, would you like to speak or you got anything you would like to say? >> Correct. Answering question because it's
shorter. [laughter] >> If you want to state your name and address for the record. I'm Vicki Vicky Bowser, 5251 Ottabon Avenue, DeLeon Springs, Florida. >> And I've lived there 37 years. And she was she's right. She was raised there. >> Yeah. >> From time you were in second grade.
First grade, second grade. Yeah. >> And uh the main thing is is is you know, I think I have a lot of time before to this point, right? But yes, I do have health issues, but they're the type that has, you know, I know it's public record, so I don't want to go too
deep, but you [snorts] know, with autoimmune stuff, you have flares and stuff, so sometimes you just have more issues than other times. And um and it affects my mobility. >> So anyway, >> okay. All right. We do have a public
participation for this case, which you obviously know. Uh do we have any more than one? No sir. >> Okay. All right. We're going to hear their comments and then if you need be, if you feel like you need to say something after that, you'll have the opportunity to do so.
>> Thank you. >> Okay. All right. I don't have the form, so I don't know the name. >> Okay, you can have a seat. Yes. Yeah, you can have a seat. >> Miss Dendle, Katherine Dindle, if you'd like to come forward.
Good morning. >> Good morning. >> Could I get your name and address for the record? >> Katherine Dindle, 356 Cordova Avenue, Deon Springs. >> Okay. You had a comment you'd like to make for this case? >> Uh, yeah. In favor of Vicki. I I'm her neighbor directly across Ottaban. I'm on
a corner lot as well and I've known Vicki since >> I moved there in 2019. >> Um, I can see the mobility issues that have developed. I have them too. Um, I have hydrophilis, so I completely
understand why she needs it level and safer for her to be in her own house. Um, I walked the proposed addition with Jen a few days ago. won't infringe on any visibility from the intersection
uh straight in straight out be wonderful for Vicki and I'm just very much in favor of it. >> Okay. All right. Thank you for your comments. >> Okay. We don't have any other public participation forms for this case. Is
there anything else you'd like to say? >> Um we did provide some photos. The aerial does show it's kind of an older aerial. we had all those trees removed. Um, so it is a nice clear like even if you're heading which I'm sorry. So I do
have photos also like like I walked Kdova and I was taking photos. Um, even like midway down Kdova approaching that stop sign of Aottabon and Kdova. It's completely clear. We are not at all asking to go towards the front side of
Audabon. It actually sets back just a little bit. Um, but we've really tried to make I mean all if there would have even been an obstruction. We made sure to already kind of try to handle that. So, >> okay. All right. Any other questions for
the applicant? >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, ma'am. We're going to close the floor for public participation and open up for commission discussion or motion. >> I'll make a motion, Mr. Chair. >> Mr. Costa. >> Uh, case V-25-064. I would make a motion that we approve
variance number one uh with the two recommended conditions and changing the square footage to 890 feet from 750. >> Second. [snorts] >> Okay. I got a motion on the floor to approve variance one with the two staff conditions and change the square footage
from 800 from 750 to 890. So it would reflect that uh from Mr. Const and a second from Miss Shel. Any discussion on the motion? >> Yeah, Mr. Mr. Chair, if I have if I have a moment, um I'd like to take this time to basically say that um
I too am in a multigenerational family situation and I sympathize with your with your needs. Um my question is to staff this is there something for us to consider down the road that potentially when these come before us as a as a true ADU as opposed to a ADU rental unit that
we can kind of streamline this process for them because I know they've been skipped in front of us. It's taken at least three months minimum. for the and I for what for what I'm considering to be a one foot variance because it is a side it's technically a sideyard even though it has a a front yard on there but something for us to talk about
possibly at the end of the meeting that maybe we can kind of streamline this a bit to make it a little bit easier for these folks. >> That's my comment. That's all. >> We can bring it up later >> moving forward. >> Yeah. >> Any other comments on the motion? [clears throat] >> If if I can add um I 100% agree with
Commissioner Aosta. We're now experiencing more seniors that are aging in place and want to stay in their community. Um, I also have a multi-generational home. I am a caregiver for my uh senior grandparents um and my autistic adult brother. So, I
totally understand and I think that we are going to see the increase in the number of people asking for um additions or renovations to their single family homes in order for them to stay in place. Um, and I think that we need to accommodate that as much as we can as
fast as we can because the aging we're going to see this shift happen um much faster than we have in the past five years. So, I will second um uh Commissioner Costa and when we have this discussion later on, I'd be happy to to support that motion moving forward. >> I think most of us agree with the two
commissioners there. So, okay. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. Good luck. Hey, Miss Shelly, that's the end of the uh old fishing old business
>> unfinished business. [laughter] >> I'm getting tongue tied here. Now, we're going to move right into our new business. Miss Shel, if you give our first case, please. >> Yes, sir. Case number V-25-058, variances to the accessory structure requirements on urban single family
residential R4 zoned property. >> Thank you, Miss Shel. This is Miss Rays. Oh, there you are. [laughter] I look back over there. >> Snuck up on you. Um, good morning. Kristen Ray with Planning and Development Services. Um, so the
applicant is requesting two variances for proposed ingrounds swimming pool and screening closure. Variance one is to reduce the north waterfront yard from 25 ft to 15 ft for the pool. And variance two is to reduce the north waterfront yard from 25 ft to 15 feet for the
screen enclosure. The subject property is currently developed with an elevated 2,332 ft two-story single family residence. The residence was constructed on stilts in 2003, making all the livable area on
the second floor. In our code, a swimming pool can be located no closer than 8 ft from any side or rear lot line. However, for waterfront lots, the pool must meet the waterfront lot setback. The property is located within the natural resource management area
which requires a 50- foot upland buffer from any wetlands. Environmental permitting reviewed the request and did not object. However, a wetland alteration permit will be required at the time of building permit for any impact to wetlands or the wetland buffer. The applicant did state
in the written petition that the proposed swimming pool will be used for low impact hydrotherapy. Staff's recommendation for variances one and two is board denial as they did not meet any of the variance criteria. Should the PLDRC find that the applicants have provided competent
substantial evidence for approval, three conditions were provided for consideration. I'm available for questions. >> Thank you, Miss Ray. Any questions for staff? Miss Bush. >> Yes. Um I in the written petition by the applicant it says that they were previously told by the zoning department that the minimum waterfront setback for
a pool was 15 ft and that is why that they designed the current site plan uh to reflect that. So they were under this assumption uh and then they received that information that it was incorrect. So is this true and can you walk me through what happened with the applicant
>> there? We did not find any notes in our system of that conversation. So, I'm not okay. I I can't speak on it. Okay. >> Okay. Any other questions for staff? >> Okay. Thank you, Miss Ray. Is the applicant present?
>> Good morning, sir. Could I get your name and address for the record? >> Yes. I'm Douglas Pat Berdette. Uh, my address, you're in Aster, is 1544 River Edge Court. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report. Anything you'd like to add to that? Um yeah, [clears throat] I understand why
they recommend against it because it the definition of a variance. Um that I don't meet those criteria. Um in the notes that I was sent, I I did notice uh on section 72-227
uh section A subsection 6 that a pool can be no closer than 8 ft measured from the water's edge. So, I'm a little bit confused by that. Uh, we're looking to place it
15 feet. Uh, staff also had mentioned that I could move the pool closer to the residence, which from the residence to the 25 ft setback line is only 5' 8 in. So, I really don't have any room to move
it closer. With this 10 foot uh variance that I'm looking for, I intend to install a container pool. It's eight feet wide and 20 feet long, and it's only 4t deep, so just enough to walk
around. Uh so that'll allow me to move the uh pool one foot away from the residence, so give me good egress there. And then I only have 12 in one foot on the other side. uh which eight inches of that is a concrete wall and that's where
the screen enclosure would mount and go up at an angle to the upper deck because I do have some big oak trees right there on the side. Uh I had added a carport uh to my site plan. Um and that's when I
was notified that the pool set back would be 15 ft. So I had had my sight plan redrawn for that. But I was there to get the carport uh signed off by zoning and I was told then that that was the 15 ft. So I went and had that redrawn and then when I
went back they told me no that was 25 ft and couldn't find out who I talked to and I didn't remember who I'd spoken to two or three weeks earlier about that. So that's where that came from. But again uh we could find no record of of
anybody saying that or any notes. >> Okay. So that's why [clears throat] we're here for the variance. And uh in this little enclave, there's only two streets there. And this house built in 2003 is the newest house in there. Uh a
lot of them were old fishing camps that had been added on to and added on to. So this the proximity to the the W's edge is not out of line at all. Some of these houses even have structures over the water and it's not where it would
inhibit anybody's view. There's only two houses to the end of the canal there. And uh the uh house closest to me is about 100 ft away. So it wouldn't be any uh thing that would block their view.
And across it is the marina. Uh so we have no impact on anybody. for this. >> Okay. Um, you refer, what was that you referenced? That was it code that you referenced? >> Yes, it was the ordinance uh section
72-277 section A subsection 6 of the zoning ordinance and ground pool should be located no closer than 8 ft as measured from the W's edge from any side or rear lot line and the accompanying screen
enclosures to be no closer than five feet. Okay, Mr. Ashley, are you can you I'm sorry, Miss Ray, you he probably knows the ordinance better. That's >> I'm just trying to get her attention to come up, but if I can gladly uh address that. Scott Ashley from the record
zoning manager that 8 foot is from the property line to the water's edge of the pool. So that is our setback requirement. The code section further goes on to say that uh a grin any kind of type of pool or screen enclosure anything similar water feature
associated with it has to comply with the waterfront setbacks. In this case R4 is a 25 foot waterfront setback. >> Okay. >> Okay. So the water's edge means the pool edge >> the pool not necessarily. >> So in a normal situation on a lot where
you're not on a waterfront you would be 8 ft from the rear lot line. >> All right. Thank you for that clarification. Sorry, Miss Ray, but he'd been around a long time. [laughter] Okay. Uh, the other question I had for you was the elevation. Uh, there is some
flooding obviously from the river and that going on in that area at certain times of the year. What's the elevation on this property where you're proposing the uh pool? >> Do you have any flooding issues? >> Uh, no, I haven't had any flooding
issues there. Uh the last year during this uh hurricanes when the river was at record levels uh I had no water on my property say for just right along the property line and of course the street was about 8 10 inches underwater but
I've got no issue like that on my property. >> Okay. Okay. Any other questions for the Miss Bush? >> Thank you. You knew before I even hit my button. Um, [laughter] you had mentioned that this is going to be a container pool. Is this going to be above ground or below ground?
>> No, it is. It is an inground pool, but it will be level with the first floor of the residence. So, that's going to be >> So, you're building like a deck around it or >> but it's going to be about 3 feet above grade, which is where the finished floor has to be.
>> Okay. So what you would see from the water's edge as you go by is about three feet of a split face block wall is my construction design. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Okay.
Do we have any public participation forms for this case? >> No sir. >> Okay. Uh [clears throat] if there's no other questions for the applicant, we're going to close the floor for public participation. Open up for commission discussion. Thank you sir. Thank you.
>> Any discussion on this case? Come on, guys. I wanted to get out of here. >> I'll make a motion for you. [laughter] >> Okay, you got it. >> Case V-25-058. I make a motion to approve variances one and two with the staff recommended conditions, which I believe there are three. >> Second.
>> I second. >> Okay. I got a motion on the floor to approve variances one and two with the three conditions from staff from Mr. Costa and a second for Miss Shelley. Uh any discussion on the motion? All those all those in favor signify by
saying I. I. Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. >> Okay. Miss Shel, can I get the next case, please? >> Yes, sir. Case number V-25-066. >> Variances to the accessory structure and off- streetet parking requirements on
urban single family residential R9 zoned property. Thank you, Miss Shel. Mr. J Schoola, this one's yours also. >> Thanks. I forgot to mention um for the record, Joseph Jet, planner, too. Um the applicants are requesting uh are seeking
var two variances. Variance one, a variance to reduce the eastern side yard from 5T to 3.5 ft for a proposed 420 ft attached carpour. The variance two, a variance to allow the existing driveway to be within 5 ft of the eastern lot. Uh
the current zoning is R4 uh R9 with a minimum set back of 25 ft from the front, 7 feet from the sides uh and 20 ft from the rear. Um the subject uh property fronts uh Broad Avenue and
approximately 280 ft um east of the intersection of South Peninsula Drive and Broad Avenue in Daytona Beach. The property is developed with a roughly uh 1,200 foot single family residence originally constructed in 1954
and an inground uh swimming pool that was constructed in 2015 by the current owners. Uh there was a lot line adjustment in 2019 that removed six uh a six foot by 125 foot or 7 750 square ft
area from the side uh from the eastern side and resulted in the concrete driveway uh being located at the eastern uh lot line with no separation. According to applicant, uh the variance is requested to provide a cover uh covered parking protect the vehicles
from the sun exposure throughout the year. Uh the drive uh driveway currently ceases at the beginning of the uh front facade of the principal structure. Um and a pool pump is already uh installed within the footprint of the proposed
carport and the carport has been designed to accommodate its location while maintaining adequate space for the vehicle parking. uh the car part will be attached to the uh principal structure maintaining architectural consistency with uh the roof line uh and will not
provide any internal access. Uh staff also identified that the other variance to the existing driveway due to the lot line adjustment that ended um with the driveway abuting the property line um that uh when it needs to be more than 5t
away. Um the applicant uh gave a special condition that they are limited to the viable space uh due to an underground propane tank used for their pool heating and a tree butting their drive driveway in the front yard. These limitations uh
these limit the place uh the place um of the carport more in the south and further from the sideyard. Um, originally the variance saw um a zero setback. However, the applicant substantially revised their design and
provided a 3.5 ft uh setback to help mitigate overhang and drainage onto the neighbor's property. Um, however, staff recognized that the propane tank location was due to the applicant's own action and the tree could be removed to accommodate the
proposed car pour to meet setbacks. Staff also recognized that the variance uh variance request 2 is not the fault of the owner or their action as it came before their purchase. Um staff also has recognized that there are two letters of
support for the variance. Um and environmental permitting reviewed the variance request and stated they have no objection as long as they comply with the environmental regulations land development code. Staff um recognize uh staff recommends denial for variance one
as the variance does not meet um criteria one, two, three, and four. And then staff recommends approval for variance 2 as it meets at least three of the five criteria. Should PL DRC find the applicant has provided competent substantial evidence for approval, the
conditions are provided for your consideration. Thank you. >> Thank you, sir. Any questions for staff? Uh this survey that you have here does it
doesn't depict where the proposed carport is going does it? >> Um site plan does >> varian site plan does >> page. Okay. >> It's going to be on the eastern side of the
>> Oh, okay. >> res. >> All right. All right. I was looking at the survey. Okay. Thank you, sir. Any other questions for staff? >> All right. Is the applicant present? Thank you, sir. [clears throat] >> Good morning. Could I get your name and
address for the record? >> My name is Elizabeth Parker and I am the owner of 109 Broad Avenue in Daytona Beach, Florida. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report. Anything you'd like to add to that? I I do have a question and I know I I should
have asked Joseph this question before because uh we did purchase the home from our neighbor and before we purchased the home he took I think six feet which is fine. It's his property. If he wants to pay taxes on it he can do that. But if
he hadn't taken that six feet we would not be here right now. Correct. We would have we would have the room. So, I guess my question is why can't I just I know there's rules and regulations, but why can't I just go further?
>> Isn't I'm here for a variance. So, I appreciate everything Joseph's done and it makes a lot of sense, but my question is um I'd like to be able to to move it over a little further
>> than what you proposed here >> than what I've proposed because he It's it's the rules that's what he's gone by. But if if I guess it's maybe just a question if >> well whenever [snorts] you come forward
variance what we look at too is the least impact and if you can move it away further then that's the obviously that would be in your benefit to request that >> because that would be the fact that being able to do what's the less impact of the [clears throat] of the actual
ordinance. Okay. >> Okay. >> Does that answer your question? >> I think so. I think so. >> Have a question. >> Yeah, Mr. Costa. >> Yeah. Is this this structure is it a a a masonary structure? Is it aluminum structure? Is it >> wooden
>> wooden structure? >> It's basically a roof with just post. We literally just want to be able to cover the car. >> So, it's not a temporary or a quasi temporary structure. That is a permanent structure. >> It's a permanent structure and it will also cover the pool equipment. Mhm.
>> Uh which will be nice the pump that we have there. >> Okay. So, the neighbor that's that you said you bought this property from is I'm looking at this picture your neighbor to the right. >> Yes. >> Um >> the east. >> Are they one of the letters of recommendation? >> Yes. Yeah. He's totally fine with it.
>> He's he's the uh peninsula building guy. Harington. >> Uh nope. Peninsula building guy lives across the street. >> Heather Roberts. >> Nope. She lives across the street. It is uh Shark Bird is his name. >> Do we have that letter? He he sent >> I saw it in our packet. So that's why I'm asking the question.
>> Um Joseph had mentioned to me that and I thought it was in here that my neighbor did send um I'm sure it's in here. I'm sure that I read it. He was the very first person the day that I told him about it. He did send an email.
>> That would be very helpful if we had that. >> Oh, I I'm sure that I read it. I I printed out the first few pages. Um, Joseph, I know we have it here somewhere. Okay. Any other questions for the
applicant? Nope. >> Okay. Do we have any public participation for this case? >> No, sir. >> Okay. Anything else you'd like to add, ma'am? >> No, other than I'm sorry I cannot find that it's in here that my neighbor next
door, Shark Bird, as uh was totally fine with it. He actually sent the email I the day that I mentioned it. >> Okay, >> that's about it. >> All right, we're going to close the floor for public participation, open up
for commission discussion, and see where we go with it. Okay, >> thank you so much. >> All right, thank you. All right, folks. Any discussion or a motion? >> I'll motion it. Well, then we can discuss it. Motion case number V-25-066.
I make a motion to uh approve variances one and two with three staff recommended conditions. >> I believe it's four. >> Is it four? >> I can't even see straight then. Yes, four. Sorry. Four. Four recommended conditions. >> Okay. Okay. I got a motion to approve variances one and two.
I guess that's how many there are. >> Uh with the four staff conditions for V25066 from Mr. Costa and a second for Miss Shelley. Any discussion on the motion? >> Uh yeah, chair. Um and that's actually for staff as well. So I'm looking at
listening to what she's saying that I guess the lot was split at some point. Uh, but if I'm reading this correctly, it meets the criteria of the minimum 7500 square foot and the minimum lot width. Is that right? So, it is conforming property. All right. Thank you.
>> Any more discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. >> Good luck. >> Shelley, could I get the next case, please? >> Yes, sir.
Case number B-25-069 variance to the minimum yard requirements on prime agriculture A1 zoned >> you miss Shel Mr. Harris, this one's yours. >> Good morning. Courtney Harris, plan two, planning and [clears throat] development
services. The applicant is seeking three variances to the minimum yard requirements to establish a 50 foot x 65- ft buildable area for a new single family residence on prime agricultural zone property. Variance one is to reduce the southern
front yard from 100 ft to 40 feet 6 in. Variance two is to reduce the sidey yard from 50 feet to 25 feet. Variance three is to reduce the eastern front yard from 100 feet to 75 ft. The parcel is 1.25
acres and was originally created as part of the how and courier's unrecorded 1909 plaque making it an older historic lot that predates modern zoning standards. The parcel is also a corner lot which requires two 100 front yard setbacks.
A vested rights determination was denied in 2023, but during later review, the parcel was confirmed as a valid non-conforming lot. On August 26 of 2025, the DRC approved the overall development plan to establish the parcel
as a buildable lot of record. As a condition of approval, the applicant was required to dedicate the rideway along the eastern boundary. The site contains wetlands a 50ft upland buffer in areas within flood zone 8. The proposed home
location, wetland buffers, and flood plane. The applicant will avoid those with the request. Environmental permitting reviewed the proposal and had no objection provided all environmental permits are obtained during building permitting review. Staff recommendation is to approve
variance request one through three with the three staff conditions. Uh any questions? >> Thank you, Mr. Harris. Any questions for staff? >> Yes, I do. Um I may have missed it when you said it. How long ago was this? Um 2025 is when
it was basically codified and it approved as a standard lot, but how long ago was it split at 125? Because these are all 10acre lots out there in that section of Samsula. was curious when that happened. >> Do we have a timeline? >> I don't have that. >> Okay. >> All right.
>> Okay. Any other question for staff? Is the applicant present? Thank you, Mr. Harris. >> Good morning, sir. Could I get your name and address for the record? >> Good morning. David Stokes, uh 431 East Ratio, Maitland, Florida. Here with the applicant, uh Mr. Casey Clark.
>> Yep. My name is Casey Clark and I'm at 1945 South Glenco Road in News. >> All right. You've heard the staff report. Anything you'd like to add to that? >> Uh, first just thank staff. It's a pretty good report. This parcel has been existing for a long time. Um, I'm not
sure when it changed from 1909, but prior to 1978, it was in the form it is and now. Um, so we've been going through the steps just to get it to where it's a buildable lot of record where someone could build a home. Um, we did the non-conforming lot letter. um Cobb Cole Law Firm did that. Um you know, this
hasn't been created by the applicant or the prior owners. Uh we went through the overall development plan process to establish it as a buildable lot of record. And then the the final step is coming before you guys to deal with the setbacks because of the size. Obviously,
it's not 10 acres. It's only one and a quarter being on a corner and then also having the u the wetlands and the 50 foot buffer. And then we had to dedicate a varying width, but it's roughly 20-ish feet on the east side for Sam Sula as
well, which further reduced the distance on the parcel. So that's kind of why we're here today, just to get a reasonable size home built, and that's why it's also in that southwest corner is the wetlands are the northeast corner. Samul is obviously on the east and the south side of the parcel as well. Um, so we're just trying to, you
know, we 50 by 60 pad roughly of buildable area. Nothing crazy. um avoiding the wetlands and the buffers and the road of course. >> All right, sir. Anything you would like to add? >> No, no comments, [snorts] but happy to answer any questions you guys have about it.
>> All right. Do we have any Mr. Costa? >> This is in my backyard, guys. Um literally. >> So, my question I have several questions for you. Number one, um I don't see any letters of support from the neighbors and Samuel is a pretty tight-knit community. So, have you talked to any of the neighbors about what's going on
here? >> Yes. They were all notified too through the process of the uh notifying them that I'm I'm asking for the variance. >> Any push back? >> No. None. None. In fact, again, one of them had offered to potentially make an offer on it once this was done because they were looking
to basically move their homestead to give their daughter and they were going to think about building here potentially. So, >> all right. And that that section of Samville Drive is county maintained dirt road. Um, and that intersection right there, that turnaround is now on the weekends, it seems like it's pretty heavy because you got that farmers
market back there. Uh, so my question is how is how is that going to impact um the flow of traffic? I mean, when you start doing construction because it's our tax dollars are fixing that road is my point is you're going to be tearing that road up with, you know, construction equipment back and forth.
And is there any kind of fair share in there or or something to help out the situation? >> No. My question is, are we worried about the the traffic coming from the Saturday farmers market or we worried about what I'm bringing in? >> Well, no. What you're bring what you're bringing in with the heavy equipment when you start building that house.
That's my problem. >> I know what I built my point when I built my house also on a dirt road. >> Mhm. >> Between the concrete trucks, the cranes, you're tearing that road up. And I actually I gave the neighbors that we I would replace everything that was was done after the fact. And I'm just
looking at that between the traffic that you have from already from the farmers market. And you're adding the construction traffic. Yeah. >> On that road, it's going to take its toll for sure. >> Well, and remember too that this is at the very end of that road. It's not, you know, >> again, that farmers market is way up in the front
>> for us. I'd be happy to, you know, do some sort of it bring in additional shell after it was done. Okay. could be a but you know I built on a dirt road as well and the neighbors were pretty accommodating with how to get it done. As long as I was >> grading it out and doing everything else with it being county maintained I know that I can't touch it. So
>> whatever we got to do to to make it happen I'd be open to accommodating that. >> Are we building to keep or building to flip? >> I undecided at this point. We wanted permission to be able to to know whether we could even build out there first. >> Okay. >> And then uh much like the lady who has you know was doing the ADU for her
mother. I'm kind of on the other end of the spectrum where I've got a daughter who's graduating and we all know how expensive prices are around here. I didn't know if if even building a house for them might be, you know, something, but to know whether it's buildable, I guess, is the the first step in, >> right? Okay. All right. Thank you.
>> Any other questions, Miss Bush? >> Yes. Thank you. So, is your building footprint that you're asking, do you have um a rendering of what the how do you know what the outline? You're just asking for this area to be able to build within. We're asking for permission because again with with as expensive as it's been to get to this step with all
the environmentals and surveys and everything else, we wanted to make sure that we could get to this point first before we even brought in renderings and doing all that stuff. So, >> understood. But my question is the house layout could be you could have a smaller footprint, right? Because you don't have the house designed yet.
>> Absolutely. Absolutely. This would be the absolute maximum. We want to build something that's appropriate for that area out there. We're not looking to put some sort of giant mansion or, you know, twotory monstrosity. It would be appropriate for >> there. Yeah. The square was estimated to based on like a 2,000ish square foot
house with porches and a garage. >> Okay. >> So, once we got to that, we kind of got to that 50 by 60 square once you accommodate all that. >> So, even though the square footage is larger, that the livable area is going to be like >> Okay. >> You have porches and garage.
>> Thank you. Any other questions for the applicant? >> Do we have any public participation forms, Mr. Cross? >> Yeah. Uh the site plan that's up there, that's you guys generated that, correct? >> Yes, sir. >> What is the Tell me what the green shaded area means.
>> So the uh there's with the wetlands, there's also flood plane on the property. >> Okay. That's a flood plane. >> That's the green is compensating storage for the red, which is >> compensating storage. All right. Got >> volume. So it's an equal volume. >> All right. Yeah, I didn't see it. I if I
if it's labeled, I didn't see that. That's why I asked the question. >> It's cut off on that page. There's a a legend that didn't get [clears throat] that view. >> And the red is obviously the impact. That's the area you're looking for the variance. Okay. >> Thank you. >> Okay, sir. There we don't have any
public participation forms, so we're going to close the floor for public participation and open up for commission discussion or motion. >> I'll be glad to make a motion. >> Thank go ahead, Miss Shilly. I move that we approve case number V-25-069
subject to the three staff conditions. >> I'll second that. >> Okay. I got a motion on the floor to approve variance V25069 with the three staff conditions for variances one, two, and three from Miss Shel and a second from Mr. Ersen. Uh any
discussion on the motion? I will say one thing and I've always said this again and again and again. We've got an A1 class zoning classification with a 100 foot setback, front yard setback.
It's it's more restrictive than than I I don't know of any other zoning that has that 100 foot other than the egg zonings that we have or forestry probably. >> And then we got a sideyard setback of 50 foot. They're going 25 feet.
A residential setback's only five feet. So, here we go again. And I just want to continue to beat the drum on this because I think the setbacks on these agricultural properties are just too great just because they've got the area to do so. Miss Bush.
>> Yes. Thank you, chairman. Um, comment and a question I guess for staff. Um, so I was curious, one I I agree with the the A1 uh and the fact that those setbacks are excessive. We've had that discussion. Um, but my question is I don't really feel like A1 as a zoning
district fits for this lot. And then so I was curious. I'm like, why is it a substandard lot? Why are why is it um, you know, like 50,000 square feet it seems like? And so then I went and looked at the plat uh for this entire area and none of the lots are 10 acres
or greater. They're all 50,000 square feet. So why I guess for staff, number one, why is this zoned A1? And number two, um, is there a way to administratively reszone these parcels so that as they do come up for development that we're not having to go
through this every single time? >> Uh, administrative resoning requires would be um, uh, an exercise driven by county council. Um I don't know how successful previous administrative zonings are. Um
usually when people come when the government comes in and says I would like to reszone your property even if it's to your benefit they they tell us you know they slam the door in our face. um kind of difficult to do that uh and to do it on a on a on a lot bylot basis
um requires a lot of uh I guess effort and um money that the county doesn't have to do those one onetoone administrative resonings um
rather than just um go through this process. I mean, that's that's an option. And uh Scott, I think A1 changed, right? The standards of A1 was were different um from one year to
another. >> The A1 was changed in 1980 when the uniform zoning ordinance was adopted. A1 was 5 acres and it was increased to 10 acres in 1984. in this area has the A1 zoning because
it has a agricultural resource land use designation which dictates a density of one unit per 10 acres and the A1 meets that and majority this is part of an old plat as you looked at old Howard couriers but most of the properties in
this area are groups of accumulation of lots they're not this is one of the somewhat rare situation where this is a single lot of that plat and that's why you have a non-conforming lot, but a lot of the properties in this area are
either are acreage based on multiple uh lots as part of the tax parcel. >> And I I also want to jump in and this is one of the most rural areas of our county. So to downzone, you'd have to do a full land use change for the whole area. Um and an area that we right now
since it is rural, do not want to be providing any type of utilities out there. So the the more homes we allow, then we're going to get into a safety issue with fire rescue and and all of those things. So caution. >> Yeah. No, I I Well, that's why I'm asking the question, right? Is because
of the the the difference between what you're telling me it's zoned and then what the parcel structure looks like, right? It's two totally different things. >> Yeah. And this is that 1909 multiple square mile plat. We've It's across a large large portion of the county. So we
do see this coming in a lot. >> Understood. Um just from my just quick review of the parcel information, it does seem like there are multiple owners of mar of these smaller parcels. So I understand the um I don't really
understand the financial impact on the county, but I understand the time and effort that it takes on the county to to administratively reszone these parcels. Um, but I if it's just I see this time and time again where our county council says, "Well, it's in the A1 zoning district, so it should be allowed to do
X, Y, and Z." But that's not necessarily what we're seeing when we're getting these variance applications and or when we're seeing the changes happening in our community. So, there's a disconnect. And I'm just bringing that up to say maybe that's something that the county needs to consider is whether or not the the zoning is fitting for the land use
and for the parcel sizes the way that they're chopped up today, right? Um because anybody that owns one of these 50,000 foot lots can come forward and go through the same process these gentlemen did. Build a single family home and flip it and sell it. And now we have a lot of
single family residential in an area that's not meant for that. Okay, I've got a motion on the floor. >> Do I not? [laughter] >> Okay, any other discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by
saying I. >> I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. >> All right, Miss Shelley, could I get the next case, please? >> Yes, sir. Case number V-26-00001, a variance to the accessory structure requirements on Stone Island planned
unit development PUD zoned property. >> Mr. Harris, this one is yours. >> Good morning again. For the record, Courtney Harris, planner two. The applicant is seeking two variances to the minimum yard requirements to construct a 984 square foot boat storage
building on Stone Island Plan unit development zone property within the enterprise community overlay zone. Variance one is to reduce the rear yard from 30 feet to 3 feet. Variance two is to reduce the sideyard from 10 ft to 3 feet. The subject parcel is
approximately 19,815 square ft and is part of the Stone Island Estate Unit One subdivision that was approved in 1975 under the former West West beling regulations as a community development plan. The zoning
was later reclassified to PUD with the adoption of the 1980 uniform zoning ordinance. The PUD established minimum yard requirements of 25 ft for the front, 10 feet for the side, and 30 feet for the rear. Because the PUD did not
include special standards for accessory structures, the accessory structure requirements of section 7277 apply. The property is developed with a single family residence built in 1972 in a 140 ft shed. The proposed building
would be placed in the northeast corner of the property only three feet from both the rear and east property lines. The parcel is located within the natural resource management area and is and in sorry and included in flood zone AE
environmental permitting reviewed this request and had no objection provided all applicable environmental standards are met. Staff recommendation is to deny variance request one and two as they fail to meet criteria one, two, three,
four, and five. Should the PLDRC find that the applicant has provided competent substantial evidence to support approval of the variances, staff has provided three conditions for consideration. Any questions? >> Thank you, Mr. Harris. Any questions for
staff? >> The applicant present. Thank you, Mr. Harris. You have heard the staff report. Anything you'd like to add to that? >> Uh, yes sir. My name is Zachary Huffman. I live at 524 Province Boulevard in Deltona. This is my mom's property which I have will eventually eventually occupy
one day. Um because of what how the prop the home is situated on the property, this is the only area where the building would fit without sticking out past the house to be to make it keep on looking good. Um I'm just trying to we're just trying to build a boat storage facility to to
store two airboats, a offshore boat and a flats boat. And one day I will occupy this probably when eventually my when my mom moves on. >> Okay. Any questions for the applicant? Miss
Bush. >> Um yes. Did the neighbor specifically to I guess the right um support this request or did you ask them how they felt about putting >> I believe my brother talked to him and he's he he he was okay with it. He's here I believe today.
>> Okay. >> Yeah. Easy. I've got anticipation for you. >> Cool. Uh, and then is there a reason why you couldn't move it to comply with the setbacks? >> Um, it would it was it would it would be too far over um to um and we'd have to
remove the shed probably. Um, we could probably work with five foot and five foot on the back and the side or we could go with a smaller building. We're just trying to put a a boat storage facility. Um, we we didn't want to we didn't want it to stick out past the back of the house
because it would it it wouldn't look well. And there's other there's other there's other properties on on Stone Island that have boat storage facilities, but on these other two properties, the house the actual house is located to the left or right of the middle of the property, not sitting right in the middle of the property.
>> Understood. >> Okay. Thank you. and and on the other side. We couldn't do it on the other side because we would have to rip out um sprinklers and and and sprinkler system in order to do it on the other side. And we've already we've already started on the right side. We took down a big oak
tree to make room for it. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Any other questions for the applicant? >> We do have a public participation form. I'll give you a chance for rebuttal after we've heard their discussion. So, if you want to have a seat close by, I'll let you come back up. Mr. Robert
Moran. >> Um, I'm here to oppose that. >> Could I get you your name and address for the record? >> Robert Moran, 1450 Shelmont Road. >> Okay. >> Something you'd like to add to this? >> Yeah. So, when you look at the property, um, or the structure, that area between the the two lots, there's a natural
covert. So, when Stone Island floods, water comes through there. So, the front of the property, there's actually a pipe that goes underneath the road. On the other side of my house, um there's a a dredge culvert that also flows. So everything flows away from the lake to
the back of the property where that structure is that he's proposing. Um that's the first place where water will sit. Um so my concern is that structure is going to drive water into my property. um and a structure of that size. I'm
just kind of concerned about that um infringing on my setback. I don't see why it needs to be 1,000 square feet um when the house is 1900 ft. But um I would like to have also have environmental come out there and look at
it. Even if it was in the proper position, how is that going to affect the water flow when we get flooded again? because both the structures, both houses were flooded during hand and had to be redone. >> So your concern, sir, is the uh side
yard set back. >> Correct. >> And what about the rear yard? >> It's not my yard. >> Pardon me. >> That's not my yard. >> Got it. >> On the side. >> So that's going to be visually I have a pool area back there that's screened in.
So visually that's what I'm going to see is that structure. the way they have it positioned, they won't see it from inside their house. From my house, I will. >> Okay. >> Any questions for this
>> speaker? Mr. Costa. >> Um, so would you you're opposed to the as it as it's shown here, a three-foot, but would you would you support a five foot? >> No, >> you would not support a five foot either. You would support any variance whatsoever. Correct.
>> Okay, that's all I needed. Thank >> All right, sir. Thank you. Do we have any other public participation forms for this case? >> No, sir. >> All right. Um, Mr. Huffman, if you'd like to come back up for rebuttal, make
a comment. >> So, if we go 10 feet, he can't say anything, right? >> Well, no, sir. As long as you get your proper permitting uh from the sideyard >> and the 30 foot on the rear yard. It depends on when you apply for your
permit. You can ask staff about this. It depend on if he's there is if there is an environmental concern and they may require environmental to take a look at it. >> I don't see how there would be an environmental concern. >> Well, that's not for I that's not for me to decide, sir, or this board to decide
if there is. >> Mr. Hold on, Mr. Cost. >> Yeah. So the the the setback your side setback is 10 foot. So if you if this variance were to say that you're only looking at a three-foot variance on the back, you want the variance for the back and leave the sideyard at 10t, then correct that
that's you're just looking for one variance, not two. >> Okay? >> So you could easily slide if you can slide it over 10 feet, keep I mean stay within the the requirement of 10 foot on the sideyard and the variance is only applied for the back entrance, then I think that would be a a motion that we can amend on the floor as we go. That's
something we can make the change we can make as we go. So if you're okay with that, I that's how I would I present the motion in that fashion that we'd strike variance number two and just looking at variance number one. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. That would take you outside of that of his concern of the plane. And yes, you're right. That would put you
inside the standard requirement setback which is 10 ft. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Any other comments from st I mean any other comments to the applicant? All right. All right, we're going to close the four for public participation.
Open up for commission discussion or motion. Mr. Cross. >> And yeah, before I make the motion, a question for uh for legal. So on this particular one, um can we just deny variance 2 and and accept variance one? >> Yes. >> So two separate motions then. >> I would recommend two separate motions.
>> Okay. Perfect. All right. That case, let's start off. I'll make a motion on case V-26-001 on variance one. The motion is to approve. Need a second. >> Okay. And a and a and then a second motion on case V-26-001.
Uh >> take one motion. >> Okay, that's fine. >> Okay, we'll separate the variances. >> Got it. >> Okay. All right. I got a motion on the floor to with the three conditions from staff. The conditions still apply if we >> uh on the variance one.
>> Uh I believe that the >> the conditions would obviously not apply. really >> one of we would need to modify the condition one so that it only references variance one. >> Okay.
>> Yeah. >> Yes, that's it. >> All right. I'll I'll ver I'll amend my motion to basically say uh approve variance one with conditions one, two, and three changing v uh condition number one to only specify variance one.
>> Second. That's that sounded convoluted, but >> you're good. [laughter] >> Okay. I got a motion on the floor for Mr. Costa to approve variance one for V260001
with the three conditions for staff with the uh to reflect on variance I mean on the condition one to apply just to variance one. Make sense? >> Yes. >> Got it. Okay. Uh any discussion on the
motion, Mr. Miss Bush? >> Yes, I'm not opposed to um amending the motion and um doing variance one and not doing variance 2, but I do want to con, you know, put this out there for the consideration of the commission and the
applicant. Um you're going to have to shift this building over now 10 feet. It might come into um conflict with the the storage shed. So, you might have to move that. uh you might even want to back off the the um rear lot line when shifting this building around in order to not
have to apply for the second variant. So, I personally would like to see this maybe tabled andor continued to allow him to shift the building where he needs it. Uh and then come back to us with the exact variance for the rear yard. Uh that would be appropriate. Um I just if
we do this today then you're kind of locked in and if you move the building and need an additional variance say you need two feet or you know one foot um then you're going to have to come back here and see us again. So that's the only reason I bring that up is just to allow him that flexibility to move the
building and maybe ask for a lesser variance than what's presented today. Well, >> that's a that's a question. >> Well, in saying that the proposed structure um Actually, he couldn't. If he moves it
over to the 10 foot, how close it would be to the resident there? Okay. >> And I'm gonna assume you're asking for a continuence. >> Yes. May we have a continuence so we can re relook at this and and see what and
re do some more research and see what type of different building >> 30 days or 60 days? >> Excuse me. >> 30 days or 60 days? >> 30 days would be fine. >> I think that's a great idea because I would be voting no on both of these. >> I support that as well. >> Okay. All right. Then I'll withdraw my motion.
>> Okay. Um, >> a motion to you want it 30? >> Yes, sir. >> Let's do a date certain. When's the next PLLD or 17? >> September 18. >> It's 18. >> Okay. Does that >> You're good with that? >> I'll uh withdraw my original motion and make a second motion, Mr. Chair. >> Go ahead.
>> On case B-26-001 that we continue this case to the December 18th PLDRC meeting. >> A second. >> Okay. I've got a motion on the floor to continue um variance V260001
to our next meeting of December 18th, 2025 and is for Miss a motion from Mr. Cross and a second from Miss Shel. Any discussion on the motion? I will say this, I would like so Mr. Moran doesn't
come back even though um I mean he can if he would like to come back at our next meeting but I would like for it to be put in the record that that we his discussion and that we can go over his discussion so he does not
have to be reappear this >> yes everything is continued from from today it's just a continuence of this discussion >> I would like that it would go into the record that this discussion so we would definitely know what's going on here with him so he does not have to come
back because otherwise a lot can happen in a month's time. You're more than welcome to come back but I'm giving you I'm making it this way so you don't have to. Okay. All right. All those in favor signify by saying I.
I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. We'll see you next month. Miss Shelley, could I get the next case, please? >> Case number 0-26-010. Ordinance number 2025-26, amending chapter 72 of the code of
ordinances regarding certified recovery residences establishing a process for requesting accommodations from land use rules and regulations that prohibit such residences. All right. Thank you, Miss Shel. Mr. Sor, let's hear it. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair.
>> Do we have a choice? Let me ask you. >> No, you do not have a choice. The uh the good people at Tallahassee have uh written a a bill that says that we need to have an ordinance in place prior to January 1st, 2026 that makes a reasonable accommodation for certified
recovery facilities. Um recovery facilities, you may know them as sober houses. We don't have a lot in the unincorporated area of the county. Um, most of them are located in the city. I think the last time we treat them as group homes. I think the last time we approved a group home was something like
10 years ago. Um, so this establishes a process for for certified recovery facilities. The state has a voluntary certification program for um these types of sober houses. And essentially what it's saying is like if they um get that
certification, you need to have a reasonable accommodation standard. So reasonable accommodation is slightly different from the variance process. In variances, you are looking at the property. You're looking at okay, does the property prevent um you know
construction. Here when you do reasonable accommodation, it's usually in connection with some kind of um ADA or disability. You can look at the person, you can look at the activities, you can look at the business model. So it broadens it. Um, so if there is a
best management practices associated with a certified recovery facility and it runs into one of our land development regulations, they can make a reasonable accommodation request. We'll look at it and whether or not the BMPs actually require that and it's driven on the
staff at the staff level um for efficiency purposes. Now, if they're just a standard sober house and they don't have that state recovery, we do not have to make a reasonable accommodation to them. So, you're telling me that if it's certified,
we have to make reasonable accommodations to apply for it or reasonable accommodation to give it to them >> to uh we have to make a reasonable accommodation um when their use of the property or their best management practices of a certified recovery
facility runs into conflict with one of our land development regulations. um access access requirements um you know wetland uh activities or um I think it's a maybe a setback
provision. >> So I think it's 45 ft for group homes. They need to be 45 ft from any of the the um the property lines. Uh so that's kind of specific to the user. So, if
they lose their certification or if um they're no longer a recovery faced recovery facility, then they lose the accommodation. >> Okay. Miss Bush, you had a question. >> Yes, I have a couple actually. Um and this is in the ordinance text
specifically, um on page 8, line 104, it states, and I'm pretty sure I know the answer to this, but I just want it for the record. Uh if a final written determination is not issued within 60 days, it's deemed approved. Is this language required by the state? >> Yes. >> Okay.
>> Um page eight, line 109, it says within 30 days, um that basically you have 30 days to appeal it and contest it. Um but what if the residents don't move in for 30 days into this home? Uh what if there's construction going on, rehab,
etc. Now, residents do not have the ability to appeal this decision because that 30 days is up. I was wondering if we could extend that to 60 or 90 or if that is a state statute requirement as well. >> That may be a state provision. Let me check.
I would also assume that as well considering the language, but if we could extend it and provide the residents around the area that are impacted by this more time to appeal um or maybe change the language to say that when a CO is issued for the building and
when the business is in operation, then it's 30 days. Something that clarifies to to say that it's not just it exists. Now, that is something we can actually increase because it's Yes, we we can increase that.
>> Okay. I if I was to be a resident next to one of these facilities and they were to say not operate in, you know, good faith in the community, I would want the opportunity to have a longer time frame to appeal uh to I'm assuming the city council, right? I think that's what was
in the ordinance. >> Yes. >> Um I would I would want that time So, I'm okay with 60 or 90. Just 30 is just I don't think enough. >> Is it Miss Greg? >> I'm just wondering if the process at
this point wouldn't have been long enough that the neighbors could have had had an opportunity had more than enough opportunity to speak to um to that as an issue. From what I understand of the process, it's all administrative. It's handled by staff. that doesn't go
through any public review. So would the neighbor know until the business is in operation and the residents are there and if they're doing nefarious things then that's where the appeal process would come in. >> Mr. Post. >> Yeah. Just so I can get clarification
here on um Mr. for staff the uh this applies to across all zonings. >> Yes. >> Irres irregardless. >> Yes. So, whatever we have in the in our zoning code, this supersedes it. >> Yes. >> So, you can this could be over here in
Victoria Park. >> Uh, if if it's a group home, yes. Oh, certified group home. So, >> certified group home, right? There's no I I'm not seeing any any dimensions, any minimum square footage or anything like that or how many bedrooms. So, any home could be a quote unquote group home in any subdivision in the county.
>> Yes. >> Yeah. I got a little bit of issue with that personally. And if I'm not mistaken, that was a state statute a few years ago that preempted us. Okay. >> Yes. We we are required to accommodate >> this these types of facilities and not
discriminate against them. >> Um two factors, you know, there's a fair housing act and there's the right of people to group together to live together. That kind of is uh implicated by these types of regulations. Um
it's it's these only apply to the the certified recovery facilities. So that's a higher bar than just um a house that offers itself as a silver house or a recovery house >> and and I and Okay. So this doesn't also
specify whether or not these uh group homes are forprofit or nonprofit. Doesn't specify one way or the other. So, what I'm what I'm saying is te technically if I lived in Victoria Park and I wanted to set up a gunsmithing operation in my home, that would not be
allowed by code. But you're telling me that this if it's a for-profit business group home, that would be allowed and there's nothing we can do about it. >> Yes. Yes. Um, so long as you know the if it's the if it's certified and the best management practices
>> of that certification require come into conflict with our rules and regulations. um we would have to accommodate that. >> So, and with all your legal smarts, there's no way around this where we can basically just designate a particular zoning or two zoning categories that are these are group homes within these two
zonings. You know, >> no, >> you could, but then someone could just say, "Hey, I'm doing a group home and your your zoning prohibits this group home and I'm going to make a reasonable commentation." >> So, we'd be right back to this ordinance. Okay.
I might add too it one of the loopholes that we've run into before would be I mean that we've been able to use would be compatibility. That wouldn't apply here, would it? >> It's uh I think the state actually specifically says you must treat these
in the same way as regular housing. That's why they're called recovery residences and they're not treated under the state as a as a business. Um, and they don't even treat them as multif family. Sometimes they're just treated
as a single family with, you know, um, uh, multiple unrelated people living in the home. >> Okay. I know there's been some push back on SB 180. Is this has there been any push back on this statute?
>> There's been some chatter on how to accommodate these uh these requests. Um, A lot of it is because it's a new requirement. Um is well what does the process look like? Um what
considerations can you make and not fall a foul of either the state or federal fair housing act? >> Okay. as we proceed through this and and run into these issues or well I wouldn't say issues uh these things is there is
there amendment process to this ordinance that we're passing today or moving forward today what's the amendment process if we want if we find that we there's other ways to do it other than what's in our proposed ordinance
can we go back and amend this >> ordinance >> we don't have a time frame or anything of that nature? >> No. Um so long as we're consistent with the statute and we're consistent with the uh state and federal fair um fair housing acts um you know we can refine
the process in the event we actually run into any issues. >> Okay. Because I can see some push back coming from down the road on this >> statute. Not the our ordinance but the statute itself. I mean, we're our hands are pretty much tied. They're shoving it down our throat pretty much.
>> And and I see I think most of the push back are going is going to be in your cities and your in your very urbanized areas. Um because of the way these function, they need a kind of uh urban support system to work. Sometimes you can get them out in the middle of
nowhere, but most of these operate in urban. >> Okay, Mr. Costa. >> Yep. the um this doesn't specify, but as I'm reading these levels, you got one through four here, they're talking about sobriety, sober living. So, we're not
talking about uh pedophiles or anybody. This is strictly drug and alcoholrelated homes, >> I believe. Alcohol, I think it's alcohol. Drug and alcohol. Yes, >> drug and alcohol related homes. All right. All right. So, I I look at level C and D, which is levels three and four
on here, where they're having uh 24 hours 24-hour sta on-site staff. How do how do you how do you work that in a in a neighborhood where you've got now it's a 24-hour operation and so you've got cars coming and going 24 hours a day in a in a
single family residential neighborhood. How do you how do you justify that? That's my question. in it's a business model. So, they would look at, okay, does this make sense if you're level three, that's that's a
pretty intense type of recovery facility. Um, you know, buying a 50 by 120 foot lot in the middle of a neighborhood may not be the best business decision if you have to accommodate and keep your certification
um with on-site staff 24 um for 24 hours. Uh it's expensive real quick and >> um you may run into covenants and restrictions that would prohibit that. >> But that that's a business decision on their end. But uh from out from the county's end though, isn't that
something that you could deny because of that particular case or this basically says you can't deny you got to approve it, push it through. >> If they get the certification, um we'd have to accommodate that particular use to the extent >> and the certifications are sight specific. >> Yes. >> So they would do they would do the state
would do due diligence on the particular site to make sure that it works. >> Yes. >> With the surrounding areas. All right. That makes me feel a little bit better. >> Okay, Miss Bush. >> Uh yes. So couple things. One, just as a reminder for everyone, this original law was what, 2018, I think the statute came
in when we they they preempted us and required community residential homes. They defined how many residents were within them. Um, and basically said, you know, sorry, local planning organizations, you have no, you're preempted. You have to allow these everywhere. You have to define it as
such. This is just an addition to that that um the various uses within the community residential group home. It could be for people with disabilities. It could be for seniors. Like there are varying different uses and ways that a community residential home could be
used. Many of so have uh 24-hour care and staff and are having those challenges with traffic. Anyway, so I just wanted to point that out. I think this is an addition to that original legislation back in 2018. Um the other thing that um I wanted to note here was
um that anywhere that we could have a level of control which is why I think increasing those dates for appeal processes for your administrative processes would be beneficial. Um, so I ask, did you model
this off of an existing ordinance or something that has anybody adopted this administrative policy that you guys are requesting taking it through staff and staff only? Where did you get the ordinance information? >> Um, I think there was uh there was a Scambia County has one. Um, and then we
just we tracked >> the uh complying as minimally as possible with the state statute. Okay. >> It's like, okay, what are you telling us we have to do and we are going to do that and that only. Um,
>> so that's >> I I appreciate that. Um, two more things. I apologize. In the future, um, it would be really nice to provide the state statute in the backup. Um, I had to go look it up and then I had to read it and then I was like, wait a minute, how and I was trying to link all these
things and on four hours of sleep. I don't I don't recommend that. Uh [laughter] um then the second thing the second question that I asked is twofold. One since community residential group homes um were amended and allowed within any
zoning district have you been tracking them first and second are you planning on tracking these as well? If you are not tracking them currently will you be tracking them? >> Yes, we will be tracking them. I think the last time we approved a group home um we track them for various purposes.
some uh community services tracks them when they get uh grants um and then we use we track them um when we used to issue special exception permits prior to 2018. Right. >> Um so we have not seen a group home or a
sober house in unincorporated county for a number of years but if we do get the request um we'll know where they are. Um, obviously they have to come in and make make application, right? So, you know, we'll have a tracking system set up for it. >> Okay.
>> And not every community community residential home has to come in for that. If the home is set up that way and they don't have then it can fly under the radar, right? We had we had that in the city that I worked for it. We didn't know that it was operating. >> And a lot of these they a lot of these
are kind of shady fly by night type, you know, organizations. Um the the certif the the certified ones have a have a you know they have that state control they have that state certification where you need to check in they need to comply with the standards
and if they lose that certification which is appealable you know anyone can actually appeal the certification in addition to the local reasonable accommodation if they lose that they lose the reasonable accommodation. >> Thank you. >> Miss Craig you had a comment.
>> Yes. This goes back to Mr. K's um issue earlier about 24-hour access or staffing. Um in a previous life, I've worked at a residential treatment facility and um basically the
staff that was there at night spends the night there. I mean that as much as possible the house is run like a normal a normal uh home would be and bedtime lights out staff might sit around and smoke cigarettes for a while or whatever
but then they go to bed. So there's not the kind of traffic issues that you might have during the day and so I think that as an issue is really um somewhat minimal. I I can understand there might be times when there might be disruption
that needed to be addressed, but um in theory it shouldn't be much more than in a normal residential setting. >> Is there any discussion on changing the appeal time frame because right now it's 30 days. Doesn't have to be 30 days. >> I'm in support of 90 on line 109 if I
make a motion. >> 90 I'm good with that. to what? >> To 90 days instead of 30 days >> line 109. >> So with that said, I guess I'll go ahead and make the motion to forward ordinance
uh 2025-26 to the county council with recommendation of approval. However, amending line 109 to read 90 days rather than 30. >> I'll second. I got a motion on the floor to forward
ordinance 25 2025-26 to the county council for recommendation of approval with the amendment of line 109 to reflect 90-day appeal process rather than 30. I got that from Mr. Ersen and a second from Miss Bush. Any
discussion on the motion? >> All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. >> Thank you. Okay, guys. Do we That pretty much covers our new business. Do we have any
other public items? >> Anyone want to address that public items? >> N. >> Do we have any other staff items? >> We do have a few staff items. [laughter] Samantha West, planning manager. Nice to finally join you all.
Um, so you all made a motion to bring forward to county council um a request to potentially increase your stipen of the $200 per month um for each member per year. Uh as you discussed before,
that was from that 1987 or so resolution. Um that's for an expense allowance. So we looked into our budget to see if there was any way we could increase it. We have no fat in our budget at all. Um so we would not be able to increase it midblock during the
this fiscal year. It would have to be an actual request to council besides the resolution. It would have to be um an amendment to our budget. Um $600 well say $200 per member per year is $16,800 that we have allocated in our budget. If
we were to increase that to $600 as was brought up at the last meeting, that would be $50,000. $50,400. So, I wanted to bring that to your attention. Um, we also researched to see what other boards were paid. The code enforcement board is the only other
board that is paid. They get $100 per meeting and if they miss a meeting, they do not get paid. So, wanted to bring that to your attention so you were aware. Um, especially in light of the cuts that council has been doing recently for multiple items that were
already budgeted. Um, we would probably on the staff level want some justification um receipts for expenses that you've had that would help and um chair Mills probably in attendance at the council
meeting to answer any questions from the council. So wanted to bring that up if you want to discuss it um and or if you want staff to keep moving forward with it. We're figuring out the best route to to bring that to council if you still want us to.
I will say that our the last council meeting there was some discussion on filling these boards and u that might increase the uh you know the people wanting to be on
these boards you know because when you start paying out of the pocket I mean this is something I would bring towards council uh there would be more participation I would think whether it be for the right reason or not. That's for discussion, you know,
but um the I don't know how well I'll let some of the other members speak first. Mr. Costa. >> Yeah. The the obvious lowhanging fruit here would be these agendas and how much time you guys spent together putting printing them, mailing them. What is
that cost factor? Because you take that out of your budget and put it back into our pockets, if you will, and just basically we go it's fully electronic. We're on our own to either bring our own tablets or print our own paper if that's what we want. Uh but as you know, paper is not cheap. Neither is neither is
toner. So it's and then plus all the drive time that $200 is I mean just probably we're probably putting more out of pocket than that. So I'm done. >> I'd like to make a comment. >> Okay. I got Miss Bush.
>> Um thank you. Thank you, Samantha. Uh just quick question. That code board that you mentioned, that's Valuchia County, correct? >> Correct. >> Did you look outside of any other jurisdictions to see what they pay or what their processes are for planning and zoning? >> But we can definitely have that as a
part of the agenda item. However, it would be presented to council. >> Yeah, I think that that would be pretty important to include like what does Orange County do? What does Flaggler, Bvard? Um >> I believe you asked that last month. >> I think I did. >> You did?
>> Yeah. Okay. I'm I'm not okay. Every once in a while, the lack of sleep, I'm like, didn't I say that? Did I? Um, so I just I think that that would be really critical um especially for a decision-making process for us to say that we want to move that forward in a specific dollar amount, especially considering the big budget uh changes
that would be proposed. Um, you know, I didn't sign up to for this for the money. I didn't even know we got paid because in my experience, these these these positions don't get paid. Um, so I'm I'm just I just want to understand what the landscape is before we move
forward and ask the council to make any any decision that really impacts the budget, especially now. >> Okay. Mr. Ersen, code enforcement provided vehicles. >> No, no, they are not provided vehicles.
>> My concern is fuel. It's very expensive. And >> Shel I I agree with Miss Bush um about checking those things out, but one of the things as well is um I think it does have to do with the fact that we do
travel to these sites. And I think maybe moving forward if this is something then perhaps we need to start keeping track of our mileage and costs if that would help that discussion of driving out and say, you know, mean take a picture of okay here's what my
mileage and when out you know those sort of things if they want to get that picky but it it's really has to do with all all of the driving to me if it was just back and forth to the land it's not necessarily an issue anyway that's my two cents >> Miss Bush
>> um just I'm not sure if the state or if you all um adhere to the state mileage reimbursement or the federal mileage reimbursement there's a 20 cents difference between the two the state is like 0.54 or I know I'm sorry I think it's like 045 where I think is the
federal is is like 6 or 7. Yeah. And that's that's why yeah that's why I bring up the mileage thing because I don't think we want to hang our hat on that because it's so it's so small and and it really does differ between if you're getting um if you're following the state requirement or the feds. So,
and again, I'm not sure if other boards um reimburse for mileage if that's, you know, I I know at my organization we do for our contractors and we do it based on the state rate because we have state contracts. So, we can't go over the state rate for state contracts. Um so,
anyway, I bring that up because I think that if if the county council is like, "Yes, we'll do reimbursement." I think we're going to lose, right, the money. >> I'll withdraw my request. [laughter] >> Okay. Yeah, I might add something else here too, depending upon the council member. This could go in the negative
way also. Um, but I think we have enough, you know, to present them that a rational person would see where the the expenditures are at this day and time are getting quite expensive. Um, but it
I just want to remind this board it could go in the negative way because I know that there's been comments that no other board gets any kind of stepping and so be careful tread on thin ice. [laughter]
>> I I agree with you. But how how many of those other boards are also quasi judicial as opposed to being just a advisory? I think that's quasi like coin enforcement is pure quasi official because they take you know access to their testimonies uh is is under oath
but they meet once a month depending upon you know unresolved code issues. Um yeah. And then and there is Yes. And our contractor licensing board um deals with
contractors gone rogue. Um we have our historic preservation board. They're they are quasi judicial. They make determinations. Um and then think that may be it for our judicial
but their their scope is narrower. You know, they don't have to deal with the entire code and the entire comprehens. >> I will say this from the public standpoint, you know, a lot of times we're looked at as a lot of especially
nowadays with the development and everything that's going on. They look at us and think that we're making a lot of the decisions on the development process because we are the planning and land development regulatory commission. And so, uh, we probably are impacted from
the public more so uh, than a lot of these boards of people reaching out to us wanting answers. you know, we have to let them know that we are more of an advisory board to the council than we are uh making the the indecision other
than the variances and the uh right now the special exceptions. And so, um, looking at it from a board standpoint, I guess every board can say that they're more important than the next, but we do pretty much take a lot of flack, if you
want to call it that, from the general public and and what we have to deal with sitting on this board. And maybe that's why it's so hard to get people to apply for the board. I don't know. But you have to be dedicated to be on here. It is not for the money
>> or the glory. >> Okay. So, I will I have my points for research. I'll come back and bring it to you all next meeting and you can make a decision whether we're going to continue going on county council or not. Um, but you'll have all the information. I'll try to actually get that out to you
ahead of time so you can >> read through it and think about it overnight. And uh >> like I said, we need to >> be careful on how we move forward with this because it could work in the the negative side. Also, >> piggybacking on that, I was planning on
taking the um attendance policy in January, probably second meeting in January to council. Um I don't know if it's wise to coordinate with this request or keep them separate. >> I'd like to keep them separate. [laughter] >> Yeah, separate. Truthfully, I'd rather
see this go before the attendance issue, but uh >> All right. >> You know, >> I want I want to get it done before March or before the March, April appointments because that's because we're we're resetting the um the
12-month term. >> They're resetting the 12-month term and also the just adding a day. That's it >> to to accommodate all the excused and unexcused. Oh, we were just changing it to four, >> right? We were simplifying it. We're just making it.
>> Yeah. If you miss four, >> you out there. >> Okay. In other words, you can miss three. >> Okay. Okay. Any other staff items? >> One more. Okay. So, um I want to make sure that my PLDRC member preference
sheet for how you get your packets is correct. Um, so I want to go through that and then y'all let me know if it is correct or not correct and then I will have a request at the end of that. Um, so Chair Mills, you're picking up your package. >> Correct. >> Right. U Mr. Costa, we're mailing your
package. >> Correct. >> Has it been coming in better? >> Beautiful. Okay. All right. We will continue working with our male corers. Um, Miss Shelley, where you're picking up your package.
Okay, Mr. Sixman, um, we're mailing your package. Miss Bush, we are emailing you the package and link. >> Okay, Miss Craig, we are you are picking up your package. And Mr. Arison, we are emailing your package and link. >> I've now changed that to have it here
for me day of. >> Okay. Day of. All right. being picked up by someone. Yes. So, there is a pickup. Okay, perfect. And so, if you ever want to change what you're doing, let us know ahead of time. Um, preferably if we need to print your
packages or you're thinking you're going to forget it or something happens, um, let us know the Wednesday before. So, that gives staff time to be able to print it because, um, I work them pretty hard, so they have full schedules. All right. And that's the only thing
that I have. >> Anyone else on the staff items? Okay. Staff comments. >> No, sir. >> Commission comments. Miss Craig.
>> Yes. This is addressed to staff. If I could, when there are changes to the agenda items that come in late, the way that we that had with um with one case today, it would be helpful for me anyway if you would um specify where the change
is um either with highlighting or uh with specific line reference would be most appreciative. >> Noted. Thank you. Any other commission comments?
I'd like to say uh I wish everybody a happy Thanksgiving. Don't eat too much. [laughter] And uh hopefully uh hopefully we'll see you back next month. Any present citizen
comments? This meeting is ajourned. slashing the budget. It's pretty much all of them. I think I said it wouldn't surprise me I'm sorry. Oh yeah. You're okay.
>> [laughter] >> I've watched it. I saw [laughter] it. Somebody told me [laughter] >> [laughter] >> Good for you. Got
it. 198 Super. That's where