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Video-1: youtube.com/watch?v=Zc5VL2FGgac

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The July 16, 2026 hearing for the Planning and Land Development Regulation Commission is now called to order. And if I could please have everyone silence any audible devices that you may have. And if you could please join me for the pledge of >> allegiance. I to the flag of the United States of

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America and to the republic for it stands one nation under God indivisibley and justice for all. >> Good morning everyone. And I would like to thank you for joining us this morning. And Miss Tucker, could I please have a roll call?

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>> Good morning, members. Uh, member Sigma >> here, >> member Bush >> here, member Costa >> here, >> member Craig >> here, >> chair Mills >> here, >> and members uh Arison and Shelley are

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absent. >> Okay. Thank you, Miss Tucker. Uh, three. Yeah, we're going to have a quum. Okay, we do not have any minutes for discussion this morning. So, if anyone would like to speak for or against any

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of the cases being heard today, please fill out a form and give it to Miss Tucker right here behind me. And we will be limiting you to a threem minute time limit. Where are the forms, Miss Tucker? >> Uh the forms are located on my left,

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your right side of the room. There's a white binder um and several pens. If you'll please just fill it out and hold up the form, myself or one of the other planners will come and get it from you. >> Okay. Thank you, Miss Tucker. And uh after the uh we will be [clears throat] limiting you to a threeminut time limit.

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After the comments have been heard, I will give the applicant an opportunity to answer any concerns the speakers have and answer any questions the commissioners may have. And at this time, I'd like to turn it over to Mr. Sora for legal comments. >> Thank you, Mr. Chair. So this is for members of the public as well as

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applicants that decisions by this body on cases which reszone real property from one classification to another present to the zoning ordinance are recommendations only to the county council and do not constitute a final hearing. New evidence may be introduced at the county council public hearing.

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Decisions on variances made by this bo and variances and special exceptions made by this body constitute final action subject to an appeal to the county council. And what this means is that no new evidence may be presented at the time of the county council public hearing on the appeal. An agrieved party

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that appeals such a decision is confined to the record made before this body. Hearings by this body on reasonzonings, special exceptions and variances are quasi judicial in nature, meaning that this body is acting more like a court and must take into account all oral, written or demonstrative evidence

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presented. Their decisions on these cases must be based on comp substantial evidence in the record and comp competent substantial evidence has been defined as that evidence a reasonable mind would accept to support a conclusion. Um, also if you are speaking to the podium, you can hear the the the

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acoustics in this room aren't that great. So you'll need to get right up to the mic to so that we can hear everything. Thank you, Mr. Chair. >> Thank you, Mr. Sorium. And while on legal comments, I would like they ask the commission to disclose for the record any exparte communications that

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have occurred before or during the public hearing at which a vote is be taken on any quasa judicial matter. And I'll start with my immediate right with Miss Craig. >> I have none. >> I did I had conversation with applicants on case V26073

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and zebra 26081. Um uh should I should I be um >> No, you can do that at the time of the application. >> Okay, cool. Thank you. I have none. >> I have none. >> And I have none. Okay. We do have a couple items here

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this morning uh to be continued. That's V260 and Z26076. Staff, could I get an explanation on that, please? >> Sure. Good morning. Uh V2660 was continued at the request of the

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applicant to the uh >> August 20th >> August 20th PLDRC. Thank you, Kelly. And uh case Z26076 did not make due public notice. So they are also being continued to August 20th.

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>> August August 20th meeting. >> Yes. >> I'll make a motion to uh continue these cases. V26 060 and Z26076 till the August 20th meeting. Okay, I've got a motion on the floor to

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continue items V2660 and Z and Z26076 to August 20th from Mr. [clears throat] Six minutes. Second from Miss Craig. Any discussion on the motion?

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Okay, we're going to take them one at a time because Mr. Costa can't vote on one of these. Uh, so we'll do the V260. All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. Any opposed. Motion carries unanimously. Our next one would be

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Z26076. >> I >> I >> I. >> Any oppose? Motion carries unanimously. Okay, we do have let me see.

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We have five members here today. It's going to take four members for the variances to be approved. So, if anyone would like to continue, uh, let us know now so we don't you don't have to sit through this. Um, it takes four votes. Mr. Sora, can you explain that on the

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the >> Yes. So for uh variances and special exceptions, you are going to need a minimum of four votes to approve any item. So there are uh five of you. So majority is technically three. So anything that is just a recommendations

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um can you know get approved or denied by majority vote. However, because you are taking final action on variances and special exceptions, we need a minimum four um to vote in the affirmative to approve any variance or any special exception. Okay. So, if you'd like to do so, we'll

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give you this opportunity this time to request a continuance. Otherwise, we're going to move forward right into our uh unfinish old business. And I'll start. Um Mr. Costa, can you m Miss

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>> you speaking to the mic? Can you make sure the green Y >> V26073 would like to continue? >> To when? >> To August. >> To August. >> To the August meeting. All right. I'll make a motion uh case B-26-073

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to continue to the August the 20th, I believe. >> Yeah, 20th. Yeah, I'll second. >> Okay. >> Okay. Okay, I got a motion on the floor with a request to continue V2673 um from Mr. Cen, a second for Mr.

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Sixman. Any discussion on the motion? Okay, all those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. >> Also V26075 would like to continue to August as

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well. >> Which one? >> 75. V6. >> I'll make a motion that V-26-075 be continued to the August 20th meeting as well. >> Yes. >> Okay. I've got another motion on the floor to continue V26075

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to our August 20th meeting uh from Mr. Costa and a second for Mr. Sixma. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. >> Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. Anyone else?

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Okay. All right, then. So, we're now we're going to go into uh the unfinished old business, which would be V26052. Can I get Mr. Kasa, could I get you to read that in the direction? >> Absolutely. Case B-26-052

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application of Philip Waselina owner requesting variances to the minimum yard requirements on urban single family residential R5 zoned property. >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Costa. Miss Costa, no relationship here. This is your case.

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>> We'll just say Uncle Frank, right? >> Can we get the uh staff report on that? >> Good morning. Good morning. >> We we are here. Mr. Waselina was here last month with a resoning for his property and this is the uh

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case for his uh variances to the setbacks of the existing home that was constructed in 1959. Um variance one would reduce the required west front yard from 25 to 14 feet and variance two would reduce the

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south sideyard from 5t to 4 feet. um property was developed is 5,249 square feet and is located in the Highland Park subdivision. The existing resident predates the county's uniform zoning regulations.

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The app uh the variances are necessary to recognize the existing location of the home under the R5 setback requirements. We wrote the report for the proposed new zoning classification. Um staff determined that the applicant

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had did not create the non-conforming conditions as the residence as it has existed since 1959. The requested relief is limited to the residents and there are no proposed additions or modifications to the surrounding area. Uh staff finds that all five variance

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criteria were met. We recommend that variances one and two as requested successfully meet all five criteria. We just ask for um several conditions. Is there any questions? >> Okay. Thank you, Miss Cost. Any

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questions for staff? >> Okay. No, ma'am. >> Okay. >> Is the applicant present? >> Could I get you to come forward, sir? And if I could get you to speak into the mic and give me your name and address for the record, please. Philip Waselina,

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16 Sander Drive, Orman Beach, Florida, 32176. Good morning, Chair Mills, Council members, and staff. I come once before you again, and I'll try to be brief. This appears to be very simple and that's just correcting the record from a

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67y old home moving its boundaries up from its 14 ft zone to a 25- ft zone which meets code and altering by 1 foot from five from from four to five appending your questions sir that's all I have

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>> okay any questions for the applicant okay Miss Tucker do we have any public participation forms for this case >> noir Sir. >> Okay. We're going to close the for public participation and give you an answer. >> Thank you, sir. Request your approval. >> Thank you, >> chairman. I would like to uh uh make a

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motion to approve V6 um V-26-052 um for the uh variance for the R5 yard setback. >> Second. >> Oh, in the two in the two conditions. Thank you. >> Okay. Okay, I got a motion on the floor from Miss Bush to approve variance

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V26052, variances 1 and two with the two staff conditions and a second from Mr. Sixma. All those in any discussion on the motion. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed?

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>> Motion carries unanimously. [clears throat] >> Okay, Mr. Costa, could I get the next case, please? is the uh >> case V-26-069 application of Brent Walters Walters Construction Corporation agent for the owner requesting variances for the

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minimum yard requirements on urban single family residential R9 zone property. >> Okay, Mr. Doula, this is one's yours. >> Yep. Good morning. Uh the applicant is seeking four variances. Variance number one is uh to reduce the western front yard from 25 ft to 17 feet for proposed

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self-supporting entryway. Variance two uh is to reduce the southern front yard along Starfish Avenue from 15 to 8.8 feet for the existing home. Variance three is to reduce the waterfront yard from 25 ft uh to 20.75 ft for the

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existing home. And then variance four is to reduce the waterfront yard from 25 ft to 10.6 ft for the ex existing two decks. The subject property is located on the corner of the South Atlantic Avenue and Starfish Avenue and New Ser.

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Uh the property is owned urban single family residential R9 with a feature land use urban low intensity. Um this is a variance request for a roughly 5,000T parcel with uh with a threetory uh 1,360

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square foot single family residence. um and two decks each approximately 380 square ft. Um the parcel is a lawful non-conforming lot and does not meet the minimum zoning size and width requirements for the R9 zoning classification. Uh the residence was

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built in uh 1993. At the time, PLRC approved a variance to reduce the southern front yard along Starfresh Avenue from 15 to 9 ft and subsequently subsequently the survey shows that the setback is actually 8.8

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ft today which prompted variance number two. Um a waterfront variance was also included within that but was was withdrawn so no relief for the existing for the proposed deck was needed at the time. Um the duck however was repaired

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over the years including in 2004 and again in 2017 and uh also was included with a walk over with the same dimensions as shown on the plan. Um uh and then in 2022 there was a fire

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that sustained that the building sustained damage from and in 2025 the applicant applied for a building permit to repair the home and add the front entry and rebuild two deck uh and to rebuild one deck but they ended up adding an additional deck. Um

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uh the waterfront yard is now measured from the landward edge uh um landward edge of the revetment which places the house within the um the point uh 20.75 ft and the decks um places the home at the end of the decks at 10.6 ft

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prompting the variances regarding variance number four. The initial building permit plans did not include the decks um which was reviewed by zoning and subsequent submitts uh did not route for zoning um updated review. As a result, the decks and additions

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were not reviewed by um zoning staff yet. The permit was issued and the decks were built um uh giving rise to the determination of the variances that I laid out within the report. And then um environmental permitting has reviewed the request and has no objection as long

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as the applicant must uh comply with environmental regulations land development code. And then staff recommends denial for variances one um as it fails to meet criteria 1, two, three, and four. And then staff recommends approval for variances 2,

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three, and four as it meets um all five of the criteria. Should PL DRC find that the applicant has provided competent substantial evidence for the approval of the conditions are provided for your consideration. Thank you. Sorry, long-winded again. >> Thank you. Any questions for staff?

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>> Hearing none. Okay. Is the applicant present? Good morning. If I could get each one of you to state your name and address for the record, please. >> Emanuel Hernandez, 6995. >> You could get closer to the mic. >> Manuel Hernandez, 6995, South Atlantic,

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New Smyrna Beach, 32169. This is a contractor. This is our contractor. >> Okay. He needs to state his name and address for the record if he's going to speak. >> David Hardy. Your address >> is 4615 Shady Shady Oaks Lane, Edgewater, Florida.

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>> Okay. And you, ma'am? >> I'm a representative for Walters Construction at 421 North Causeway, North New Smyrna Beach, Florida 32169. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report. What would you Is there anything you'd like to add to it or make comments on?

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>> Yeah, I I believe the older variances were >> I need to get you to speak a little closer to the mic, sir. >> Thank Unfortunately, >> the older variances are rolling over from the prior, but the new variance or the new extension on the front of the house is really the concern that the

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staff had concerns over. Um the we've received variances on the neighbors that are way out uh from our location, which has changed basically the property value of our home. We would like to extend a little bit forward from our current

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situation. So, we have some coverage on the front. Not the 20 or 30 feet that the neighbors have, but I think we're asking for 14 or 15 feet, just a short amount to match where the property values around us have gone and where the other properties

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around us have gone. And that's all we're looking for is just a short coverage area on the front that would make the property equal to the properties around us. not not so far, but just to have a little bit of of the value that we've lost as the houses have changed around us and received variances

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over the years. >> Okay. Anything else you'd like to add? >> Um, the setback that we're putting on the front of the house is going only going I think it's eight or nine feet. I don't think it's 17 feet. It's 14. It's 14 >> 15 wide or 14 wide and seven or eight

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feet. >> Yeah, it's eight feet into the setback that we're going into. What we have planned now is just a little tiny el cove. So once you open a door, you're back out into the weather. And they have a little eyebrow that they have planned

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over it now that encroaches about the same, but it doesn't go to the ground, which obviously is not as strong as actually fastening something to the ground. You have this high eyebrow up here swinging in the wind and it gives them a little bit of coverage, but this will give them a lot more coverage. And

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the neighbors houses are already much further into the encroachment. We brought some pictures. Not that that's a problem for them and it's not a problem in their driveway, but the point is it won't make a problem for anybody else's driveway or hardship for anybody else in the neighborhood. It won't impede and it'll add a little character like the

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other homes in the neighborhood have little porches and his is just flat with this little tiny area. Once you open that door, you're straight out back into the weather. This will at least give them a little coverage from the weather, be able to unload their car. The garages

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are tight inside, so there's not really they they really need to unload in the driveway. >> All right, sir. Any questions for the applicant? >> Mr. Costa, >> I'm assuming there's no area no pictures or representations of what this is going to look like.

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>> You have pictures? >> Yeah, I do actually. >> That would be helpful so we can see what we're talking about. >> Um, just >> once you submit them, they will be part of the record and we will keep those. You won't be getting them back. >> Okay. Any any >> just one short point though the um the

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overhang the eyebrow the 8 foot overhang is going to be the same profile. We're just trying to put columns to support it. And that's what the variance is for just to support it rather than hanging off the wall. It's going to have the same external profile. It's just going to be supported by columns as opposed to

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just elbow bracketing into the wall just to give it more strength. >> And I have a photo. >> That's not what's presented. >> Like it to look like you're someplace. Yeah, because what it's presented it's projecting out. So,

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>> and for public notation, since we don't have an overhead projector, the attachments will be passed amongst the commission members. And if one of the members can just hold on to them until the end of the meeting, I'll collect them. Thank you. >> Okay. The difference over the proposal versus

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the current plan is that we're going to have two columns supporting the eyebrow as opposed to freehanging. And that that's the representation is you see the column supporting it rather than just freehanging the eyebrow. >> Right. >> Yeah. The current their current plan they got them bolting into the >> right. They got them candle levered out

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now. You just >> And you know >> Yeah. >> That's not nearly as strong as bringing something to the ground. >> Sir, can you please speak into the microphone? Oh, I'm sorry. >> Thank you. >> One of the reasons they uh have you speak because it becomes public record.

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If this were to get appealed or something, this all goes into the record and then if it goes towards county >> totally understand council. >> This is accurate representation. >> Yes, that's the plan.

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It's a metal roof on columns with >> It's just got post over. >> It's a metal roof on column with exposed >> structures uh brackets. Okay. Any other questions for the staff?

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I mean for the applicant. All right. We're Do we have any public participation forms for this case, Miss Tucker? No, sir. >> Okay, we're going to close the four for public participation and open up for commission discussion. Hopefully give

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you an answer soon. Okay. >> Thank you. >> All right, >> chairman. Um, >> go ahead, Miss Turn your mic on >> it. It is. >> Um, I sorry, I need to speak more clearer into it. Uh I would like to

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request that we approve these variances uh individually since there was some questions to I have you know a little bit hesitation to variance request one but I think the rest I'm comfortable with making a vote now. >> We can do that.

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Uh so does anybody else want to combine any of the variances other than the variance one? >> Sure. I'll do >> we can do two, three, and four. >> Yep. All right. >> Okay. Let's take two, three, and four first. All right, I'll I'll make I'll make go ahead and make a motion on case

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B-26069 that we approve variances 2 3 and 4 and a second motion on V26069 to approve variance one. So we'll vote on two individually. >> Okay. And the staff conditions. >> Yeah. Uh with the staff conditions,

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correct? >> We're voting on variances 2, three, and four >> first. Y >> with the two staff conditions. >> Okay. >> Three. >> Three. Three total. Sorry. three staff conditions. Okay, >> I'll second that motion.

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>> Okay, I've got a motion on the floor for Mr. Costa to approve variances two, three, and four with the three con staff conditions and a second for Mr. Sixma. Any discussion on those that motion? >> Hearing none. All those in favor signify

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by saying I. I. >> Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. I have a second motion on the floor to approve variance one with the three conditions from staff from Mr. Costa. Do I have a second on that too, Mr. Sixman? >> Yeah. Yes.

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>> And a second for Mr. Sixman. Any [clears throat] discussion on the motion? >> Go ahead, Miss Bush. >> Thank you. Um, I'm, you know, I did not travel. I did not drive this street or this community, so I cannot I can only speak to what I've been able to see on

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Google Earth. Um, in all honesty, um, I appreciate that the applicants have brought the details to us that I think I was really lacking when when looking at this case originally to make a decision and vote favorably for it. Um, however, I am looking at some of these other houses that have been built and I don't

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not seeing quite the extension into the setback. Uh, I am concerned about site visibility, especially if the property next door were to be developed in the future. So, I'm I still have hesitations over [clears throat] uh that first variance request and we'll likely be voting no for it. Thank you.

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>> Okay. Any other discussion on the motion? >> Okay. All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. Any opposed? >> I. >> Motion carries four to one.

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>> Okay. >> Mr. Mr. Costa, could I get the next case, please? >> Certainly. Uh, we are due. All right. KB-26-078, application of James Price, owner, requesting variances to the accessory structure requirements on prime

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agricultural A1 zone property. >> Thank you, Mr. Cen. Miss Ray, this major. >> Good morning. The applicant is requesting three variances to the minimum yard requirements for a proposed 1500 square f foot metal building. The property is currently developed with a

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single family residence, ingground swimming pool, carport, and brick building. The property fronts three rights ofway, New Jersey Avenue to the west, Cumberland Avenue to the north, and Michelle Drive to the east. This causes the property to have three front yards

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and one sideyard. According to the applicant submitted survey, there are also there is also a 20 foot bridal path easement along the western boundary, 30 foot ingress egress easement along the northern boundary and a 15-ft road easement along the eastern

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boundary. So, I'm going to provide a little history on the parcel. Prior to the adoption of the unified zoning ordinance, the parcel was zoned A1, which required 20,000 square foot in lot area. After the adoption of the unified

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zoning in 1980, it re it was reszoned to A3, which required a minimum law area of 1 acre. The parcel was created in December of 1980 through Michelle Gardens unrecorded subdivision, which created 16 2 and a half acre parcels

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and of course met the zoning at the time of creation. In 1992, after the comprehensive plan was adopted in 1990, the area was administratively re reszoned back to A1, which now requires a minimum lot area of 10 acres.

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The A1 zoning has a minimum front yard requirement of 100 ft and a minimum side of 50 ft. Variance one is to allow the accessory structure to be located within the front yard. Variance two is to reduce the east front yard from 100 ft

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to 40 ft. Variance three is to reduce the southside yard from 50 feet to 25 ft. Staff recommends approval of all three variances as they meet at least three of the five criteria for granting said variances subject to two staff recommended conditions. I'm available for questions.

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>> Thank you, Miss Ray. Any questions for staff? Miss Ray. Oh, good. Go ahead, Miss Bush. >> Thank you. Um, is this another area that you might be looking at administratively resoning in the future? >> It's definitely something we can look into. Absolutely. >> Thank you. >> You're very welcome.

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>> Miss Ray, this uh agriculture zoning of A1, if this was bonafide agriculture, we wouldn't need these variances. Is that correct? >> That's correct. >> Thank you, ma'am. Okay. Any other questions for staff? Is the applicant present?

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>> Could I get you to come forward, sir? Can I get your name and address for the record? >> It's James Price, 5375 New Jersey Avenue, Dillion Springs. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report. Is there anything you'd like to add to that? >> No, sir. >> All right. Do we have any questions for

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the applicant? >> Okay. We do have a public participation form. And what I'll do is after I've heard that, I will give you an opportunity to respond to it. Okay. >> Okay. >> So, if you'd just like to have a seat, could I get

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>> uh Patricia Truskins? >> And if I could get your name and address for the record, ma'am. >> Patricia T. This one or this one? >> Speak to that. Patricia Charlesson, 5251 Michelle Drive, Delon Springs. >> You got a comment you would like to make on this case? >> Um, yes. Um, I'm not concerned about his

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building except for how big it is on a 2 and a half acre piece of property. Um, it's this is the first time we're finding out as neighbors that it's A1 agricultural and A1 is 10 acres minimum. So, I was

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just concerned about what else is he putting on there? What else is he farming? He's on a corner lot. I'm not sure if the other neighbors are concerned about the size of the building and for I'm going to throw you under the bus.

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Sorry. His carport is not a carport. It's a conc. So I would just like to see things fair across the board. When we wanted to remodel, we had to reszone. If we wanted to do the remodel we wanted to do, we would

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have to reszone as multif family. We weren't given A1. And our remodel was part of our house. It was a garage. So, we weren't able to. We didn't do the remodel we wanted to because we didn't want to reszone as multif family >> and he gets A1 on two and a half acres

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>> and I have 11. >> If it helps any, we consider these cases on a case-byase basis. Um, so unfortunately I don't know what your case was or is and so we have to do

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it on the merits of this case alone. >> Okay, I understand. I was just concerned about the acreage and what was allowed and if it was she says 1990 it was A1. I have papers that said A3. So I don't know when it was reszoned or if it had

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to be reszoned and noticed like this variance is noticed. And that was my concern is the size and if he's going to use more than 35% of the land use for his property and then what goes on from there. That's all. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> Well, thank you. Do we have any

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questions for the speaker? >> Okay. Thank you, ma'am. >> Do we have any other pro participation forms for this case, Miss Tucker? >> No, sir. >> Okay. We're going to clo could I get the applicant to come back forward? You've heard the concern from your neighbor. Is

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there anything you'd like to add to that >> or? >> I I don't believe so, sir. I just I mean, it's a 1500 square foot metal building to for my boats, you know, to protect my boats and and I'm asking for this location because I do live underneath a beautiful oak hammock and

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in this area right here, I would not have to clear any beautiful live oak trees. Um, it's already open in that area and uh, that's all I'm asking for is the A, you know, A3 setbacks. >> Got it.

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>> All right, sir. >> All right. Thank you all for your time. >> Thank you. Okay, we're going to close the four for public participation and open up for commission discussion or a motion. >> Chairman, >> go ahead, Miss Bush. I will move that we um I'll make a motion to approve

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V-26-078 um for an accessory structure in the A1 zoning district with I don't have the conditions in front of me. I apologize. >> Do we have any conditions on that? >> Three staff three staff conditions. Two >> two. Thank you.

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>> Two. >> Three. Yes. >> And who second it? >> Yeah. >> Okay. I've got a motion on the floor to approve variance V26078 with the two staff conditions for Miss Bush and a second for Mr. Sixma. Any

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discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. >> I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. Mr. Costa, could I get the next case, please? >> Yes, sir. Case V26-079.

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Application of I'm going to destroy this name. Sorry. Macy Samjek Tri-State Builders and Remodeling LLC owner requesting variances to the minimum wall height requirements on tourist B8 zone property.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Costa. And Miss Tucker, this one's yours. Where you at? >> Good morning, members. For the record, Kelly Tucker, Planner One. Um, I do want to notate that there is going to be a correction on page seven of the staff report in regards to the variance site plan. Um, it incorrectly states that

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variances one and two are for a linear distance of 97 ft. Uh, variance one is to actually be 25 linear feet within the north front yard and variance 2 is for 72 linear feet within the west front yard. So, we'll go ahead and jump in. The

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applicant is requesting three variances to develop a 7-ft wall along the west and southern property lines. The subject property is whole lot 10 of the Orman Beach by the sea number four replant from 1952. The subdivision was deemed vested and eligible for building permits

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in January of 2022. The current property owners purchased the property back in December of 2010, and the subject property is zoned B8, which does allow for single family residences as a permitted use. The applicants are requesting these variances because of a sidewalk

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expansion project from the Florida Department of Transportation. The letter that the applicants received from FDOT notifying them of the project is on page 13 of your staff report. Additionally, vegetation was removed from the southern property line that bordered a pedestrian beach access. Photos of the before and

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after the vegetation removal can be found on pages 16 and 17 of your staff report. The proposed wall will reduce the noise pollution from the increased vehicle and pedestrian traffic as well as create screening from the pedestrian beach access path as stated from the

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applicants in their written petition. Per section 722821A, no fence or wall located within the front yard shall exceed four feet in height and six feet in height in the side or rear yards. The subject property has a front yard along the north and

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west property lines and sideyards along the east and the south. Variance one is to allow the 7-ft wall within the north front yard for a distance of 25 linear feet. Variance two is to allow a 7ft wall within the front west front yard for a distance of 72 linear feet. And

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variance three is to allow a 7 foot wall within the southside yard for a distance of three feet. Staff does recommend that the PLLDRC deny variances one through three as they failed to meet five of the five criteria for granting said variances. However, if the PLLDRC does find that the applicant

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has provided competent substantial evidence to approve said variances, staff has provided two conditions for your consideration. I'm available for any questions. >> Thank you, Miss Tucker. Any questions for staff hearing? None. Is the applicant present?

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>> Could I get you to come forward, please? >> I have it. Yeah, but that's okay. >> Go ahead, Miss Bush. >> Okay. Uh, thank you, chairman. I apologize. I didn't get your attention. Um, if the wall was constructed, would there be um sight line require? I I'm assuming they would have to meet sight distance requirements and sight

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triangle. Has that been uh evaluated yet? >> Not yet. So, with the distance of where because there's currently a 4ft wall. Um, it's about 2 feet of solid concrete and then it has like the polling in between. It's pulled back from that sighteline corner because there's a

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water or a utility box that's in the corner entering way. So, it's not going to go up to the full extent. It's going to be about two or three feet back from that front property line. >> Okay. Thank you for that further explanation. >> Okay. Any other questions for staff?

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All right. Your name and address, sir? Ma'am? >> Good morning. Uh, David Glenny, 1111 Ocean Shore Boulevard, number 10 Orman Beach, 32176. >> Okay. And you, >> this is my wife, >> Elizabeth Glenny, 1111 Oceanore

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Boulevard, number 10. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report and obviously there's you'd like to make a comment on this, >> if I may. Um, well, first, thank you. We appreciate your time and consideration of our request and thank you to the county staff. We've never been through

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this process before and they are extremely professional. I'm sure you know, very courteous and citizenoriented. So, um this process is a little overwhelming if you've never done it before. So, we really appreciate

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that. Um, okay. So, this this property, if you're not familiar with that part of Orman by the Sea, is just north of where they've put the Margaritavville Beach Club, and we are across the street from Hanky Panky's Lounge. When we give

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directions, we say we're across from Hanky Panky's Lounge. Um, it's like a mixed area. We have a I've got here I kind of blew this up just to give you a little different perspective because you do have on page 17 a few photos but you can see this really came about.

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Traffic has increased over the years. Um we had a break at COVID but and before that it was you know event or seasonal oriented. We had bike weeks, Biketoberfest, now we have Jeep week and it just seems to keep coming. Um, and then when the FDOT did this road

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improvement and expansion project, it's actually, you can see where that excavator is, they've pushed that travel lane is actually now right up where the grass is. There's a curb there and it's right at where the grass is. This is the corner of our house. I mean, and in

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addition, they have added this crosswalk light for the Brooks Beach approach. And so all that traffic, which is fine of course, but all that traffic is funneled right to the side of our house. And when traffic backs up to allow the, you know,

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pedestrian access, I literally could have a conversation with people and occupants of the vehicles there. That's how close this is. So it's a sound issue. It's a security issue. We have nine grandchildren 12 and under. And

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when they're in the back, you can see on the photos too on page 17, the county has removed the vegetation which provided some privacy to the south portion along the beach access there. Um that pine tree, I'm not an arborist, but

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it appears to be dead or dying. It's on its way out, I think. So, we're probably going to lose that as well. Um, so you can see we're we're really in a fishbowl and and the sound um, you know, we're we're good neighbors. We try to be good neighbors and Hanky Pankas is a great

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place. Um, but it brings a lot of traffic and across the street also is a shopping center. We've got, you know, hot dog hut, um, a psychic and a barber shop. Um, so all of that adds to, you

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know, vehicle and pedestrian traffic and so it's gotten to the point where we needed to come before you and and make our request. Uh, our builder recommended the 7 foot absolute maximum. The actual wall is uh 6'8. You have the the drawing

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of it. There's a 4 inch decorative cap because we want it to look nice. Um, we have columns in it to make it aesthetically pleasing. We're it's going to be a stucco finish. Um, and you know, we'll do whatever you or the building

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department require. Um, but it's really a a sight, sound, and security issue for us. Um, because right now we're not able to fully enjoy. We appreciate it what we have of course, but we're just not able to fully enjoy it when the traffic is

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just so bad and it's so close to our the actual house and whatever backyard we have there. So, the re that's the reason for the request. I don't know if Kelly mentioned it, but environmental perming has no objection to it. It doesn't have

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any impact on the environment. Um, so I know I think my wife wanted to say a few things, but um, that's that's the gist of it. It's gotten to the point after owning this home and being there for 16 years that it's we felt like we needed

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some relief and and your commission is the place we've come to ask for it. >> Now, the photo will become part of the record and we'll have to keep that. Okay. Yes, sir. >> I just want you to be aware of that. >> Okay. >> Mr. Costa, you had a a comment or a question? >> I do. Is this your primary residence?

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>> It is not, but it's not a rental. We've never We've >> That was my next question. So, you don't It's a family home. It's It's our happy place, and it's used by us and our children. >> Uh and someday hopefully their children, our grandchildren. Yes, sir.

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>> Miss Bush, you had a question or comment? >> Sure. I didn't even ask you yet. That was impressive. Thank you. [laughter] >> I got you figured out. >> Yeah. Um thank you for the pictures. I I appreciate your additional uh explanation of the request, right? I I

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totally understand. Um I'm in transportation planning as a profession. Good. >> Um so I'm I work a lot with DOT. I'm very familiar with this project from a pedestrian and bicycle safety standpoint. Um >> and I just want to note though, they didn't move the curb for this project.

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So this road and its configuration didn't change. So your request should for me the request for a relief shouldn't be based on the fact that this roadway project occurred because they're reducing speed limits on here. So you're not going to have some of the issues

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that I think that you had stated when this project is complete. So I just wanted to make you aware of that that they did not move curb that a lot of the changes they're making are actually to reduce some of the issues that I think that you spoke about. >> Yes. Thank you. Thank you for clarifying. I mean, I am sure the DOT,

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they are the professionals and they know this is going to make things safer and and I think the crosswalk being there because I can't tell you how many accidents have happened right there. We've had, I think, at least one fatality right there. People trying to run across Ocean Shore at the Brooks

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Beach approach. Um, but they've put that crosswalk um marker, that signal right there. So just in the short time that that project and I don't think it's even fully complete yet, but just in the short time that it's been going on, literally a traffic will back up to the beach club.

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And so the volume has increased, the safety's improved, but the volume's increased. And so that's one thing that we've noticed. And the crosswalk has done its job. It's funneled all that pedestrian traffic right there. But as they come across ocean, there's our house. And and it's like almost like

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from me to you. That's how close it is. So okay, >> that crosswalk was still there though prior to the project under Yes, >> but it was but it was not >> it was it was not lit. >> It was not lit. >> It was not lit. It was just a stand. So I understand some of those concerns there. However, it is in the same location before and after the

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>> unfortunately Well, that's why I say this is a good thing because before people just kind of disregarded it. They just thought, well, there's kind of a crosswalk somewhere here, so that's why people were getting hit. Now there's actually it's doing its job. It just has the it's like a funnel. just brings everybody right there to that one point.

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That's the concern. >> And I I won't disagree with you that maybe the location is not the best location to serve pedestrian movement, especially to and from the beach. You know, you've got the jog, so now they come out of the beach. They've got to go north past your property. They're not going to do that. They're just going to continue to go straight. So, those are

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some comments I have for DOT. They are about that. >> I appreciate it. It's good to hear from somebody who's in the business. >> But I'm just saying that the conditions that you presented for the variance hasn't really changed because of this project. And that's a lot of your arguments have been based on the fact that this roadway project has come in

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and these changes are you've articulated are coming in, but I don't necessarily see them being the warrant for the variance request that you are requesting today. Let's just >> Yes, understood. >> Thank you. >> According to your picture, that column is sitting closer to the sidewalk. Can

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you tell me how tall that column is? >> I believe the columns are 4 foot now. Not including >> No, that that one that solid one there. The big one >> by the blue house. No. Up. >> Oh, that is that one. >> That's the That you're talking about this? >> Yes.

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>> Oh, that's the mailbox. That's the That's the community mailbox. >> Got it. Okay. >> Yeah. There actually is a a PVC fence next to the blue house that's six foot, which would be a standard size fence. So, we're only asking for really another eight inches plus four for the

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decorative cap to make it look nice. Um, but yes, sir, that's the that's the mailbox there. >> Okay. >> And you can see too, we seem to be a a receptacle for trash. You know, people walk by and they just Well, that's >> just throw it there or it'll blow in and

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I'm out there picking up garbage. Um, so I mean, not love the air. I mean, it's just that's just the reality. But this is we think and our builder has recommended this is a good solution if it's acceptable to you and we will do whatever you want us to do to help us

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enjoy our property. >> Okay. >> Did you want to say something? >> Yes. >> You said you had a rendition of the the wall itself because it's not in our packet. I didn't see it. >> There is a rendering on page 12.

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>> I'm sorry. What was the question? It's a little hard to hear back here. >> I don't >> Oh, that solid wall. >> It's a solid wall with it'll be a stucco finish and that's really for, you know,

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sound and for storm. I mean, that's, you know, a fence. >> Yeah. >> Got it. >> Yeah. >> I think she May my wife make a comment or two. >> Pardon me. May she make a comment or two? >> Sure. >> Thank you.

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>> As a grandma, I'm talking um mostly security for my part. We have nine grandchildren that come very very frequently. Um, one has a residence in Dayton Chona on Halifax and they on the intra coastal, but they come over to our

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house for beach. And then my um other set of grandchildren live in Gainesville and they come over [clears throat] pretty regularly. Um, and the way this is situated is that they cannot be in our backyard or sideyard because the

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without an adult because the some pedestrians are very nice when they're walking by and they're just being friendly. They're just saying, "Hi, how are you?" others. Hanky Panky opens at 7 for alcohol in the morning and so some by 10 in the

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morning are already happy and they um will chat up the children and so unless the we're out there, it's just not safe for them to be out there alone in our backyard exposed

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where that is. And then our oldest grandchild is 12 and getting ready to be 13 and she was just rinsing off and she's getting cat calls from the people driving by and people just looking over and she's just in her bathing suit whole

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piece just rinsing off and they're she's getting all kinds of not nice comments and she's 12 and so I'm like one of us has to be out there at all times so they're not getting honked. at. Well, they are still being honked at when

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we're out there, but at least for the comments, it kind of keeps them to a dull roar if we're there. Sometimes they still comment when we're there. And I'm just for the protection of my grandchildren. I just would like there to be a barrier

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so they can have some privacy and be because I can't let like the four-year-olds out just to play ball in the back because there's people out there and I just they come over and they can't play outside. So I was minus security reasons.

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>> Okay, go ahead Mr. Cost. >> Actually my question is more directed at staff then back to you. Is is there any historical or precedence of 7 foot walls along A1A or uh >> Okay, that's my question. >> beach area that we we're talking about

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here. Is this this would do would this be the first one? >> So, I did do um a site visit about a week and a half, two weeks ago. I drove the area up and down Ocean Shore. Um there are some condo buildings that have

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large walls. Um, I did not stop and measure them because it was raining that day. Um, but there are other areas that do have seeming to be six foot walls, not up on the street front. They seem to be out of the front yard setback, but it

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is common within that area. >> You said six foot, correct? >> It seemed to be six foot. Yes, sir. >> All right. Thank you. So then back to you guys. is would you consider something shorter and potentially uh using

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landscape to finish off that extra foot or two? >> Landscaping on the top of the wall >> or behind the wall. I mean pa the pod carpuses grow up to 8 foot pretty quickly. So >> commissioner we've thought about that too if yeah I mean we I don't it doesn't give you the sound protection of course

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and then it has to be maintained and if it gets subject to you know what the county had to remove the vegetation from the south side of the beach access. It's just a built-in problem. But yes, we did consider it. >> Um, it certainly doesn't it's not the optimal solution for us, but I

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understand what you're asking. Um, would six foot work? >> I mean, this is going from the builder and >> better than four. >> It's better than four. I That's all I can say is yeah, thank you. I mean, we're we're here asking um so but yeah, we're just going with the recommendation

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of the builder and blockmason as far as the seven foot. Now, four of that again 4 in of that is a decorative cap to make it look nice. There won't be these uh >> what are they? Artichokes or whatever vegetable that upside down pineapples >> that is there apples. Okay. Um so it's

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just going to be a flat masonry cap. >> Okay. All right. >> All right. That's all the questions I had. Thank you. >> Okay. Any other questions for the applicant? Miss Craig? Uh, this is more of a comment than a question, but I think I would be I would be willing to

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go with six foot solid wall with the four 4 inch cap. I I could even go with the pineapples. I think they're great. >> Okay. >> Um, and I'm a neighbor, by the way. I live in Orman by the sea. By the sea, by the beautiful sea. So, I appreciate your

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issues about traffic and foot traffic as well. Um, but some of that is going to go away when that abominable construction is completed on the street. Um, so that's my comment is six foot

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works for me for the solid wall. >> Miss Craig, you said six foot with a 4 inch cap. Is that what you said? >> That's what they're asking for, right? Is a 4 inch cap. >> Six 68 with 4 inch cap. >> So you're looking at a six foot with a 4 inch cap. >> I'm okay with that.

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>> Got it. Chair Mills, if I may just provide maybe a little bit of clarification for the members. Um, with the cap that and the additional eight inches on the wall is what puts us over that threshold. So, we wouldn't be looking at it for a 6' 8 in part. We are

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looking at it from top of cap for the wall, which is why we're here asking for the seven feet today. >> 68 wall. with a 4 inch cap. >> 68 with a 4 inch cap,

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>> but you got to do the variance for the entire amount. So, in other words, if you were agreeing on six foot, you'd make it 6'4 instead of seven foot. Well, you need to discuss that with the U applicant.

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So instead of doing this, anything's better than a 4 foot pretty much. >> Yeah. So that's what they're I'm looking at the leaning here. They're Could you live with a six foot overall height? Six foot total. >> Not six foot with a 4 in. I'd like if I could ask for the 6T with a 4 inch cap. >> So 6'4 in total is what you're looking

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for overall height. Okay. As opposed to the seven that you're requesting. >> Yes, sir. If that's what the commissioner wants, that's what we'll do, of course. >> Okay. Miss Bush, did you have a comment? >> Not for the applicant, but for discussion. >> Okay. Miss Tucker, do we have any uh public participation form for this case?

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>> No, sir. >> Okay. Okay, we're going to close the floor for public participation and give you a decision in a few moments. >> Thank you all very much. >> Thank you. >> I'm good with modifying the variance from 7 foot to 6'4.

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That's where I'm at on it. 6 foot. I don't 7 foot is getting up there. And I miss Bush. Go ahead. >> Thank you, chairman. Um I I still have some reservation over even the 64. I'll be honest. I mean, that's the typical

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average adult height. Um, I'm just thinking of of sight visibility issues. I'm also thinking of the character of the community. You know, I understand the constraints that you've issued. I I or you know, I understand, right? >> I'm sorry, Miss Bush. Do you mind being a little bit more up on the mic? We're just not picking it up. That's okay. Thank you.

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>> I know. Okay. I will hold it so that I don't move away from it. Um, so I understand, right, all your all your issues and your constraints. I just I don't necessarily think a six foot four inch wall is um is keeping with the neighborhood character and community. I realize that some of those condo

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buildings have those walls, but they do seem like they're set back from the uh Google imagery that I've been able to see. Um I did see a house further north about half a mile that seems to have a concrete mason wall with an entry into

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it and it's the back of a twostory home it looks like. Um, I' I'd be curious to know what the height of that wall is. It is pushed back quite a bit off the road. So, it allows for people coming in and out of that that community or wherever that home is to have visibility. Um, I

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just with the pedestrian access there, with that beacon there, with the entrance into your community back and forth, I I just do think the 6'4 in is going to be a sight issue and I do think it's going to do um more harm to those trying to cross the road than good.

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>> Okay. Any other comments? >> Well, when you look at the surrounding community, I don't know with what is actually there and what they have to deal with. I can understand them not wanting a 4ft wall

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uh sound aesthetically and everything else. So, I mean, they made a pretty good case for themselves, I think, and they're willing to modify the variance to a six foot with a 4 inch cap. And um that's where I'm at.

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So, if anyone would like to make a motion, I'll entertain your motion, sir. Uh motion. I'll make a motion on case V-26-079 on all three variances changing the

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height from 7 foot to 6'4 in maximum and with the staff recommended conditions which >> two two conditions >> I'll second that to move it. >> Okay. Okay, I've got a motion on the

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floor to modify variances 1, 2, and three for variance 26079 from 7 foot to 6'4 in consideration with the applicant from Mr. Costa and a second for Mr.

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Sixma with his two staff conditions. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> I. Motion carries four to one. Mr. Sixman, I mean Mr. Costa, can I get

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the next case, please? >> Case V-26-082, application of Barry Nunny, Nukem Enterprises LLC owner requesting variances to the accessory structure requirements on rural residential RR zone property.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Costa and Mr. Z Zakus >> Zuz >> Zuzac >> I get you Mr. Jacus >> Zuzac. >> Sorry about [clears throat] that. >> Good morning. I'm Rob Zuzac. Cliner 2. >> Zuzac. >> Zuzac. Zuzac.

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>> Zuzac. I'll get it. >> Just like it. Just like it's spelled. [snorts] This is for [clears throat] two setback variances for a proposed 1,800 foot accessory storage building on a property located at 1701 Carr Street. The land.

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The first variance is for a westside yard setback. 15 ft's required. 6 foot is proposed rear yard. The second variance is for a rear yard setback which is a requirement of 40 feet and it's 21 ft proposed. The property is

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approximately 3/4 acres. It's zone ruled world residential with a rule of future land use. The parcel is legally develop developable and was um vested for permitting on June 19th 2026. Existing lot coverage is 6.8%. Proposed

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lot coverage is 12.4% 4% and that's well under the maximum permitted coverage of 30%. The parcel is smaller than many nearby rural residential parcels. Uh the owner seeks to preserve the usable rear yard area and cites the location of the well as a

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placement constraint. The use itself for residential accessory storage building is compatible with the surrounding development. The lot size and configuration are not unique with the subdivision pattern. The accessory building can be placed within a required set box. A compliant A compliant zoning

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plan was previously approved. The variance became necessary only after the structure was moved on the revised plan. The request is not the minimum relief necessary because relocation or redesign would reduce or eliminate the encroachments. Staff denial does come

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with a caveat. Uh if you look at exhibit A, uh the DuPont grants were subjected to multiple subdivisions. Uh during the early 80s housing boom, uh those lots were actually zoned R4.

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They became rural residential with the adoption of administrative zoning between 1990 and 1992 when the comprehensive plan was adopted. So denial does come with that caveat. Um

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if approval is granted, there are two there are two recommendations. There's two um the variances are limited to the proposed building and any expansion beyond the depicted structure requires a separate variance.

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>> Thank you, Mr. Zuzac. Any questions for the staff? All right. Thank you, sir. Is the applicant present? >> Good morning, sir. Could I get your name and address for the record, please? >> Good morning. My name is Troy Thurman.

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1701 Carr Street, Dan, Florida. >> Okay. And yours? Good morning. My name is Amanda Nukem. Um owner of Nukem Enterprise, 6749 Lake Winona Road, De Leon Springs. >> Okay. You've heard the staff report. Anything you'd like to add to that?

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>> Uh yes, sir. I got a little uh speech made up. I'm not really good at speaking, so that's I I wrote it out. >> Go right ahead. >> Um good morning. Thank you for your time. My name is Troy Thurman. I am the homeowner today, and we are today asking approval for the setback variance. The building itself has been permitted.

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We're only asking for the variance to be placed in the location that makes more sense or most sense of the property use. Um we have we have to meet the standard setbacks. If we if we had to meet the standard setbacks, we'd have to re not

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relocate but modify our well. Um remove a healthy 10-year-old live oak tree. That [clears throat] is the only shade that we have in our backyard. Um I do have small children. I do have a play set that I built two years ago for my daughter's birthday. Um, so it does mean

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a lot to me. Uh, we do believe locate we do believe the location we're requesting is at least the least disruptive option and allows us to preserve those existing fe uh, features. Right now, the only storage I have is an old makeshift storage room that's made out of wood

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that was already on the property when we bought the home. It's deteriorating due to the storms that we've had. I don't know if you know Glennwood area. We have a lot of trees. Um, one of them did come down last year and it broke three of the beams inside and now is leaking really bad. Um, that is the main reason I am

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trying to build a building. Um, I also have a 22 foot boat that is sitting in the Florida weather. Anybody that lives in Florida knows what the sun does to it. Um, the building is set farther back so I can drive around the existing well and be able to make that turn and back it in. Um, I also have several vehicles

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and equipment such as mowers and um, I work on woodwork, so I have a lot of, uh, you know, just little tools that I would like to keep out of the um, the existing weather. Tarps and covers for the for the boat

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and the lawn mower. They only last so long in Florida weather. I have to constantly keep buying them. Um, it becomes costly. Uh we also took the time to speak with our surrounding neighbors. For the neighbors, property owners have supported our request and provided

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letters which were submitted in our application. We understand those letters should have been included in the material presented to the board and we wanted to make sure that we are aware of that. This variance will not change how the building is used. We do not believe

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it will have any negative effect in our neighborhood or the surrounding areas. We simply are trying to improve our storage situation while doing everything in the right way and following the proper procedures. We accept or we appreciate the board taking the time to consider our request and we respectfully ask for your approval. Thank you. I'd be

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happy to answer any questions. >> Thank you, sir. Any questions for the applicant, Miss Craig? >> I'm curious as to why the building was changed after the permit, the size of the building after the permit.

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>> Uh yes, ma'am. Uh, so whenever it was um built, the the setbacks weren't um I guess looked at. Oh, sorry. Can you hear me, ma'am? Um, my contractor may be able to speak a little bit better about why it was that way. Um, but it was set in an area where they thought the setbacks

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were. Um, after further notice, it never got caught. So, that's why we're here at the variance right now and we're just trying to make sure that um, we're doing the right things. So, the drawings were done and approved, but they didn't meet setback.

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>> Yes, ma'am. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Any other questions for the applicant? >> Okay. Do we have any public participation forms for this case? >> No, sir. >> Okay. We're going to close the floor and

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hopefully give you a decision real soon. >> If if you may. >> Yeah. Go ahead. Um, one thing I wanted to clarify, the side variance is we're requesting 8 foot, not six. And the backyard we were requesting 20 foot, not 10. I seen in the notes that the numbers

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were wrong. >> Okay. >> I didn't receive a form, sir. Who did you hand it to? >> Sideyard from the what? >> Apparently, somebody did fill it. He >> he was the one to speak and he said he

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brought a he filled a form out. Correct. >> Okay. >> I did not receive one or whoever hand took it from him did not hand it to me. >> Okay. I want to get the clarif get that. Can someone get that situated? Get him a

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public participation form. Okay. You're doing variance one from the sideyard. You're doing 8 feet, not six feet. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Is it depicted on the the survey?

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>> It's depicted as 6' one inch. >> Y >> Well, that's the shortest corner, but we we want to try to go 8 foot, which is that top corner. >> You need your request needs to be the minimum. Like, so you really you do need to request the six. >> Okay. >> That's >> Oh, okay. >> Yeah, >> that's okay.

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>> Yeah. >> Okay. So the >> you need what? >> So the 61 is accurate and then the 20 foot 4 inches in the back is also accurate. >> Yes. >> Okay. Okay. >> Got it. So we're good on that. >> Yeah. She was pointing. >> Okay. And we do have obviously a public

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participation form. >> Soon as I get it, we'll let them speak and I'll give you a chance for >> rebuttal. Sit down. >> Yeah, we can sit. >> Where is he at? Sir, you can come forward and then once

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you speak, you can go ahead and fill out finish filling out the form. >> All right, >> that's all right. We need to know. Get state your name and address for the record. >> My name is Glenn Schwanbec, 1730 Lemon Street. I'm to the north of the

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applicant's property. I just have a couple questions. Some of them probably have already been answered. He says it's the building's just going to be for storage. That was going to I was one of my questions was what it was going to be used for. And then I was just wondering is it a

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when I first saw the notice and called the county I believe the building was going to be 1500 square feet and now I think somebody said 18. I just wonder is it common practice to reduce an easement by 75%.

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And my other question is, isn't there a percentage of the total square feet of any property that can be built on and would this be within it? And I think the person that came up before him stated that it was. So, but probably my main

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question is if this variance is granted and then let's say I or another owner of my property wanted to put up a building with the same variance, would it be granted? And if so, can I get that in writing?

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Because I work for Felia County also and I was once told that if it isn't in writing, it never happened. So, I'm just kind of wondering, you know, like you give the variance and then, you know, I originally heard it was going to

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be they were going to go from 40 feet to 10 feet and I think I heard now that they change it to 20. And my concern would be like I don't care what a neighbor does on their property as long as there's no effect or impact on me or

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my property. So, I'm just wondering like if this building's pushed back to 10 or 20 feet from the property line and let's say I wanted to put a building and do the same, would I get that same variance? If not,

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if they moved theirs back and then I wanted to do the same and they said, "No, you can't do it because you'd be too close to the other building, then the variance you're giving him is kind of like taking footage away from me or a family member that owns the property

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when I fall over or something, you know." So, those are my only questions. >> I can tell you each variance is individual cases. We don't we don't look at it as a broad you know we look at it on a case by case basis. >> Yeah.

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>> So to answer your question just because someone else got a variance doesn't necessarily mean that you would get a variance. >> Yeah. >> I'm not saying it would happen and but I'm just letting you know >> that each case is based on and Mr. Sory if you can clarify that if you'd like. >> Yes, that that's correct. So it has to

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be based on the um peculiar circumstance of each Oh, sorry. Okay. So your your variance has to be based on demonstration that there is something uh special or unique about that particular property. Uh demonstration by comp

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substantial evidence. Um you know so you you do look at it on a property bypropy basis. Now, I will say if the if prop producer side by side and they both share the same kind of unique variance and they're are otherwise identical, you

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should grant the other variance. Um, assuming that the special condition you've identified is localized enough and doesn't spread throughout like it doesn't affect the entire neighborhood, but it affects, you know, a couple houses, maybe three houses, maybe three

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lots. um because you never know with what how large the special condition is and how it affects properties and adjacent properties. So >> that golden word of should because this board could change from the time one

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variance is requested to the next. So it's not a guarantee that you would get that variance. Yeah, that's my only concern is, you know, like I said, I wouldn't, let's say, down the road I wanted to sell, you know, the property. You know, obviously there's a house on it, but I wanted to sell it and the

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person sees there's a building back there. I don't care that he's got a building. That's fine. You know, I just wouldn't want, you know, their setback to affect mine, you know. You know, that's all I'm concerned with.

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>> Okay. Other than that, I don't have a problem with him doing it. You know, it's his property, you know, just so it don't affect my property. That's all I'm here about. >> I We understand that. >> Go ahead, Mr. >> So, I just want to clarify. So, you're in support of this variance.

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>> As long as it long as it doesn't have any impact on me, I don't care what he does. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Thanks. >> All right. Do we have any other public participation for this case? I double checked and no sir.

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>> All right. Could I have the applicant come back up? You've heard the questions that he he alluded to. Um obviously the acoustics aren't that great in here. I have I didn't write them each down. So did you

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like to comment on anything that he had to say? >> Uh not technically on what he had to say, but um I do live at 1701 Carr Street. If you ever have any questions on what we're doing with the building, you're more than welcome to stop by. We would answer anything. Um it is just for storage use and to get things out of the

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weather. Um and to clean up the yard so my kids have a safe environment to run around in. Um I know you have y you've seen the overhead view on what that side structure looks like. It's not the greatest and uh it it potentially could be a hazard if the kids get in there.

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And I'm trying to just make a better um I guess site for the property use. Um I'm trying to make it look like the rest of the neighbors, adjacent neighbors, they all have steel buildings and I've talked to all them and they're more than happy to see something better than what I've got.

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>> Okay. All right. Any questions for the applicant? >> All right. We're going to close the floor for public participation once again and hopefully we'll get you an answer. Mr. Costa, >> I just want to know for the record that we've got one, two, we have four written

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letters of support and the one gentleman before it, which would be five. >> Okay. >> Yes, sir. >> You you can have a seat. We'll give you an answer in just a few moments. >> All right. [sighs and gasps] We any discussion on this variance or I will

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entertain a motion >> uh to move it along. I will make a motion um for approval for case V26082. I think we got what? Two staff conditions on that. >> Yes.

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>> Variances one and two. Correct. >> Two variances and two staff conditions. Do I have a second? >> I'll second. >> I got a motion on the floor for Mr. Sixman to approve variance V26082 with the two staff conditions, variances

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one and two and a and a second for Mr. Costa. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? >> Motion carries unanimously. Okay. Zero. All right. All right, next

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case. >> Mr. Costa, can I get the next case, please? >> S-26-068. Application of Mary Solic Xquire and Doy Solic Law Agents for owner Max R. Bates requesting a special exception for the

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communication tower exceeding 70 ft in height on resource quarter RC zone property. >> Miss Ray, this one's yours. >> Good morning again. So, the applicant is requesting a special exception for a 250

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foot self-support communication tower on a 14.9 acre parcel. The property is located within the Jacksonville bombing range complex military zone local plan. The goal of the local plan is to encourage the long-term viability of the military mission at Pine Castle and Lake

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George Ranges for the US Navy. Due to the tower being taller than 200 feet, the Navy representative had an opportunity to comment on the application and after his review, he had no comments or concerns. The applicant did submit environmental impact analysis. It shows that there is a wetland on the northeastern corner of

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the property approximately 119 ft away from the proposed proposed tower location. There are four gopher tortoise burrows found on site, but there were none located within 25 ft of the proposed project footprint. and environmental permitting did review the

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application and does not object. The proposed lease area is 10,000 square feet located on the eastern portion of the property. It's proposed to have up to four carriers. T-Mobile being the initial carrier. Compound is proposed to be surrounded by

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an 8ft tall chain link fence and to have a 15oot landscape buffer on the outside of that fence. A letter from the Federal Aviation Administration was submitted and stated that the proposed tower will not be a hazard to the air navigation and it will need to be marked and lighted in

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accordance to their regulations. Um the tower will close a coverage gap between three different towers. The closest tower is approximately 2.8 miles to the northwest. Um, it is not anticipated to create undue traffic congestion as this site

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will be visited for maintenance only and staff's recommendation is to approve the special exception request subject to two staff recommended conditions. I will also note that we did receive two letters of opposition. I'm available for questions. >> Thank you, Miss Ray. Any questions for

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staff? >> Seeing none, is the applicant present? Good morning. Could I get your name and address for the record? >> Absolutely. Mary Solic, 121 South Orange Avenue, Sweet 1500 Orlando, Florida. I

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am legal counsel for Blue Sky Towers, the applicant or the developer on this particular project. I have with me today um Lisa Ramos who is with Blue Sky and Jason Paulie who is the RF engineer with T-Mobile. Um your staff has done a very thorough review of this application and

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determined that we meet all of the performance criteria in your code for this partic oh for this particular Thank you. for this particular tower. Um I know that you have some citizen written citizen opposition and that there may be members of the public. Maybe the best

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use of our time is for you to hear that and then for me to come back up and address that unless you have questions for me now. Anybody have any questions for me now? >> Any questions for the applicant? >> I do have I do have one question. Thank you, chairman. Um, does the light at the

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top flash or is it solid red? >> It is a It's flashing. >> It is flashing. Okay. >> Anything else at this moment? >> Any other question? >> Okay. I'll sit down and then come back up. >> Okay. We do have some public

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participation forms. So, I'll give you an opportunity for rebuttal. [clears throat] Okay. Justice do Dollar Dolly. D A W L E Y. All right. Good morning, sir. Can I get your name and address for the record?

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Uh, my name is Jesse Dolly and my address is 1490 Black Bear Ranch Trail. And what I understand, they're putting this tower out there and they're wanting to come down Black Bear Ranch Trail.

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when his driveway goes straight ahead, he could put the driveway. In fact, it will be longer for him to come down Blackberry Ranch Trail and go in there. But it's a private road and I'm I'm not agreeing for him. I'm

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not going to sign him permission to put that entryway off of my road. And uh that's all I got to say uh about that. >> Okay. Can you say there's another access to the property other than coming down

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Black Bear Road? >> Sir, Buckles Road, the entryway comes in, his driveway is dead into it. >> Correct. >> And if he goes up his driveway a little ways, it's a lot shorter there than to

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come down here and go out. >> Okay. >> On a road. >> All right, sir. So he can, as far as I'm concerned, he can put it put his road to the tower is what I'm talking about. >> I understand. >> Okay. Thank y'all.

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>> Okay. Thank you, >> Lauren Wford. >> Can I get your name and address for the record, please? Lauren Weisen Ford, 1425 Black Bear Ranch Trail. >> Okay. You had a comment you would like to make? >> Yes, sir. I'm We're opposed to it. Um

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the association is trying to hire an attorney. It was late notice. We just saw the sign that went up. We just saw the sign that went up recently. Um we're definitely opposed to it. We're a private community. That's why we bought into the community. We're out in the

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middle of nowhere. Um, it went from what I'm I was heard was told was a 70 foot to a 250 foot tower, which I don't know if anyone of you has ever seen a 250 foot tower. It's a monstrosity. It's it

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lowers everybody's property values. Not to mention, like Mr. Max said, it's a private road. Um, it it's it's a private community. I don't understand how we've even gotten this far. We pay fees every year to maintain our dirt roads, their

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dirt roads. Um, it just we're very opposed to it. We're we had a meeting on it. Um, like I said, it's very short notice. We would I would like it totally denied. Um, but if not

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denied, definitely not given the 250 foot variance. I think the 70 ft is I mean I don't even want the 70 foot but if it has to be anything at all then definitely the 70 instead of the 250 and

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the fact that we're on a private road that we pay annually to maintain that now you're going to have you know maintenance trucks and building trucks and like I said it's a dirt road it's you know it's not the best dirt road to

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begin with so very opposed >> so You're opposed to the tower and the access. Is that correct? >> Correct. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Uh

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Stanley and Janice Row. Can I get your name and address for the record, please? >> Uh, Janice Row, 861 Buckles Road, Pearson, Florida. >> Okay. >> And Stanley Row, 861 Buckles Road, Pearson, Florida.

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>> All right. You had a comment you would like to make? Uh we are here to represent Black Bear Ranch Property Owners Association. I submitted in writing a packet to you. >> We got it.

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>> Um I'd just like to uh go over some of the points that are in there. First of all, our articles of incorporation state that the association has been created and established for the objects and purposes of and shall have exclusive

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jurisdiction over and the sole responsibility for the ownership, administration, management, operation, regulation, care, maintenance, repair. basically everything that deals with access, easement, and road construction

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on those roads. We were developed in 1998. We're 46 lots, small development. Um, the subject property is to the north of our property. Black Bear Ranch Property

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Owners Association has control of the property to the east, to the south, and to the west of the subject property. The access that the lot owner has for that

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property goes up Buckles Road and Buckles Road only. Also, we have concerns over a memorandum of option and lease agreement attach attachment one to what we submitted earlier.

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It states that um first of all they are granting a they have an agreement that they can assign to anybody else

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for 50 years. That means they would have control over our roads which we question whether they even have an option to use for 50 years. This agreement al also states that it's a summary

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and it's being uh put in here only as a memorandum. We don't know what the final agreement is, how that will affect our properties, how that will affect our roads. I think that we should be able to see what that agreement is so we know how it

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will affect us and the county. If you look at page 16 of the information packet that you sent out to us, the map clearly shows the easement for the proposed cell tower is only on Buckles Road and it is a non-exclusive easement.

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Page 46 of 57, the staff comments begin. Written by development engineering Anthony Taylor, Civil Engineer 2. On the following page, page 47, he states that per LDC section 72612A

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612BG, >> all proposed lots shall front on publicly dedicated street paved to county standards. Miss Row, you've used your three minutes up. >> This is a private road. >> Okay.

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>> We are against it completely unless they can show that they have a right to our roads which is a private subdivision. >> Mr. Costa, you had a question. >> I do. I have several actually. Um, so you say that the the property in question where the cellar is going is

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not a member of your POA. Is that correct? >> They are not a member of the POA. >> Okay. and therefore they're not under the umbrella and requirements of the POA. >> Correct. Okay. >> Ma'am, can you speak into the microphone, please? >> Speak into >> I'm sorry. They have to use the POA

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roads to get to that property. >> So, and I also live on a private road. So, uh the the road here in question is actually uh Black Bear Ranch Road. Is that correct? Is that the one we're talking about? >> Buckles Road is the only easement that they have been given to that property. >> But your opposition is for them coming

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out onto Black Bear Ranch. Is that correct? >> Your opposition is not them exiting on buckles. It's exiting exiting or entering on Black Bear. Is that correct? >> That is part of it, but also the whether or not they have a legal use to lease

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our roads that they don't have a exclusive right over. >> Well, that's that's for the attorneys to work out. So, my other question is, so it's a private road. >> In your opinion, who's allowed to to use that road? Who's allowed to come down that road on that private road?

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>> All members of the POA have access to that >> and anyone that >> their guest that they allow to come into their properties. >> So, is Amazon allow allowed to come down that road? >> Yes, sir. >> UPS? >> Yes, sir.

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>> US mail? Obviously, >> US mail? No. >> No. They stop at the kiosk at at the main road. >> Yes, they will not come on to our properties. >> And what about trash pickup? Is that done at uh buckles or individually? >> That goes throughout uh property owners association roads.

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>> Do you have any objection to the height of the tower? >> Yes. >> You have objection to the height of the tower as well. You have objection in general. >> Okay. All right. Well, let's let's pair this down to what's really >> the property that is going on is a beautiful pasture.

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>> Rolling hills on that property and it's just going to look awful. It's going to be visible from way down Buckles Road before we even get to the property owners. >> I know 250 ft. It's a pretty good distance. >> It's Yeah, it's super high. >> So, but but your main objection though,

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your main if you had to pick one main objection, is it the exit onto Black Bear Road or is it just the entire project completely? So, I'm trying to find a common ground. >> The property owners association >> was made to maintain the roads and take

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care of those roads. So the association itself can only deal with the roads. Personally, I'm against it all. >> All right. So if this property owner where this tower is proposed was to become a member of the POA and pay into that association, would that

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soften the blow at all of them using Black Bear Road? No. Okay. >> All right. >> Here's here's one of the problems. Go ahead. is when you do construction, bringing in dump trucks, >> concrete trucks, cranes,

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depending on the time of the year, if it's wet or if it's real dry. >> Uh the road has like a crust. Once you break through that, you're in the sugar sand. And I don't feel that we should be responsible for a

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commercial company to have to do all those repairs, which would be very costly. Well, that is something that we could actually put into this uh this variance that they are responsible for maintaining the road during the construction process and bringing it back up to current condition at the exit

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of that project. Would that help you? >> If if K did anything else, that would help. >> Okay. All right. Thank you. >> That that would not be ideal and we do have a lawyer that's working on it, but due to short circumstances, nobody had time to get anything done.

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>> All right. Perfect. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Miss Bush, you had a question. >> I have a question for staff if that's okay. You want to >> Yeah, let's >> Are we Do we have any other public participation for this case?

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>> All right, we're going to I'm going to get the applicant back for a rebuttal. But let's ask staff the question so in case the attorney wants to ask. Go ahead, Miss Bush. Ask >> Thank you. Um, I would like to ask, can can the development review committee

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provide a waiver to provide access to a roadway that's not theirs? >> Do you mind restating the question a little closer? >> Absolutely. I'm sorry, I got to hold it. Okay. Uh, like an ice cream cone. Um, so per LDC section 72-612A

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and 72-612 uh G, all proposed lots shall front on a publicly dedicated street paved to county standards. The proposed roadway providing access to the proposed lots is identified as a private street on the

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plan provided. Private access shall require a waiver from the development review committee. If the waiver is approved by the DRC, the applicant shall record a notice to future land owners declaring that the road is not currently countymaintained, has not been accepted by the county, and that the maintenance

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of the road is not the responsibility of the county regardless of use by public service vehicles prior to issuing of the development order. So my question is, can that DRC approve a waiver to a roadway rideofway that is not under

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their purview and is not in their jurisdiction? >> Mr. Sure, I can answer that. The answer is yes because because what they are proving is a construction standard. So the the property owner still has to demonstrate that they have the legal right to use the easement. We determine

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what they have to build that easement to. So if the DRC grants the waiver, which the county is not interested in accepting this as a publicly dedicated road, the discussion becomes what construction standards will the DRC require? Uh usually it's to meet fire

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code standards. So that is you know to um construct whatever access that you legally have the right to uh to withstand an emergency vehicle that's usually 80,000 pounds you know LBRR40 or you know or some kind of compaction such

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that whatever con whatever emergency standard needs to access this unmanned tower it you know emergency of an emergency vehicle can get there. So that's the type of construction standard we're looking at rather than >> would would the applicant though need to

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bring the that they have an agreement with the private property owner of the road prior to the DRC reviewing the waiver request. >> They need to demonstrate that they have legal access to the property. So, I do not know if there is a if how they're

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taking access to the tower, the the private road, which is um Black Bear Ranch, may be on their property, in which case they don't need an easement because it's their property. The easement is on their property, and we are just saying, "Hey, you are going to

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need to construct that access or driveway to the tower to our standards." you know, because the the easement is non-exclusive, they can technically coexist. They just can't interfere with each other. >> Mr. Sora, correct me if I'm wrong, but

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we're not we're not determining whether the what the access is to the tower. Our special exception is to to for the the tower to exceed 70 ft and to for the tower itself. >> Yes. But you're looking at the entire site plan. So, you're looking at it from

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a compatibility standpoint. So, for example, um you know, that's their proposed access area. If they do do not have the right to access the easement of um >> Black Bear Ranch, then they will have to

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demonstrate and show that they are accessing the tower in as close way as possible as presumed to the site plan. Basically, keep it entirely within their property and constructed to our standards. So I mean there is a little bit of how are you accessing the tower

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in your determination of compatibility. >> So the legal the the the applicant has to have uh demonstrate that they have legal access to Black Bear Road and for that type of use on Black Bear Road. Is that correct? >> Uh

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>> that's what they're going to have to do. >> Yes. But we don't have if it's a private agreement that's not something we enforce because that's a private um agreement between two private parties. So what we are looking at is um you know

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do you have access to the to the tower from uh just at least show us primmaascia that you you have access to it and then we're going to determine the construction standards. If there is some kind of restriction the county can't be

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a part of that. So that has to be enforced on a private matter. >> I guess the other question is is Mr. base. Does he have an exclusive or non-exclusive right of that easement that which is the Blackberry Road which >> we don't know we don't haven't seen any

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easement documents for Blackberry. We don't know where the actual easement is, if it's on their property or what the details of that easement are. If it is exclusive, that's something the applicant will have to deal with and shift the access to the tower such that

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it doesn't interfere with um Blackberry Road. Well, from my point of view, if I don't know if they've got legal access to do this or not, how can I determine whether the tower should go there? >> Well, you look at the entire parcel like that the parcel is large, so they can

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shift their access to get access to the tower. Um the question is is um access isn't going to be an issue for the tower. like they can relocate their access to be outside of Blackberry Road

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if they do not have the rights for it. But um the applicants attorneys here, they can probably short circuit a lot of this >> the decision process in order to determine whether it comes in off of Black Bear or it comes in off of buckles

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and or if it even should be there at all. And so I, you know, it's kind of vague to me unless they somebody can clarify it. >> I can absolutely clarify it. >> Go ahead, Mr. Cross. >> Well, before we go to the to the attorney, the question I have is if

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we're just approving the height of the tower, this still has to come in for permit. During permitting is where they're going to determine what road they can or cannot use. Is that correct? >> Absolutely. Yes. >> That's the final say. >> Yes. >> All right. So, we're just approving the tower. The location of where it's coming and going is going to be handled through

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permitting process. There you go. Okay, >> Miss Craig, you had a comment or question. >> I believe his question just sort of made this somewhat moot, but once the construction is completed, how much traffic is involved in getting

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to the tower? >> Great question. Once construction is complete, you can anticipate one visit per carrier per quarter in a light duty vehicle four times a year and you really only

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have three licensed carriers left in your marketplace. That's the traffic it will generate. Um, Miss Ramos can talk to you about the construction schedule, but let me clear up a couple of these other things that have gotten us bogged down. First of all, I've um I've pulled up the code section that was cited by

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your staff in the DRC comments. And in the very first section, first sentence of that section, it exempts out from the paved road requirement, specifically communications towers, utilities such as communication towers. So, that is a that's a moot point. We don't have to

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put it on a paved road. We're exempted under the current language of your code. I have passed out to you. I hope this will help. This is a two-page document. It is just an enlargement of the site plan that we have already submitted. It might be helpful if you rip the staple

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out of there and put them side by side so you can see the access road all the way across the Max Bates property. That's our landlord's property. We are coming in off of Buckles Road and Mr. Bates is giving to Blue Sky a 30-foot

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access and utility easement completely on his property. The access is coming from Buckles on the Bates property. Now, the aerial shows you that Black Bear Ranch Trail, the

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roaded meanders in there. There are portions of it that are on the Bates property. There are portions of it that are on the property owner to the south, but our access is coming only through Max Bates's property. So, that should answer your question. We don't need

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approval from anybody to use Black Bear Ranch Trail. We only need Mr. Bates approval to have a 30-foot access easement that runs right along his south property line. Mr. Costa, you have a question? >> I I do actually. Yeah, but I'm looking at the what's been submitted. It shows access coming from your tower right onto

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Blackberry. You're telling me that's in that's >> No, no, no, it doesn't. No, no, it goes to Buckles. >> What she's saying is Black Bear that portion of Black Bear Ranch Trail is on Max Bates's property. He's given the easement. >> I gotcha. >> It runs that that dark heavy line on

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there is the southern property line of the Bates property. >> All right. So, they're making >> and that's part of the site plan that we have submitted. It's that same page page you're looking at right there, Mr. Costa. I just enlarged it so you could really see the detail. >> Okay. >> I can't help where the road meanders,

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but Mr. Bates can grant a 30-foot easement along his southern property line that's completely within his ownership. Uh, Mr. Bates has deeded access to Buckles Road. He took title to this property in 1997. I've got the agreement

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for deed right here. It is not an exclusive easement. It can be assigned. It can be transferred. It can be uh you can have licenses. It runs with the land. It doesn't specify any limitations on use. It's the same access everybody

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else has to Buckles Road. Anybody else can build a house that has a construction project or a span that lasts a lot longer than this tower would. These are all rights that everybody out there has and Mr. Bates has them, too. Um,

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we I can I can have Miss Ramos tell you about how long the construction process takes if you'd like to hear that. Uh we would also be willing we we we build towers everywhere and we build them in a lot of remote areas and we deal with a lot of private road situations like this

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and what we can offer to do. She would tell you that we have three heavyduty vehicles that come in. A crane comes in once to stack the tower. A flatbed trailer comes in once with the tower segments. And then you'll have concrete

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trucks on one day to pour the limited amount of concrete that a self-support tower requires. A monopole tower requires a lot more concrete because you have to pour the case on. So those are the heavy duty vehicles that will come in for construction. We are more than happy to videotape the road before we

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bring each of those vehicles in and videotape and by road I mean buckles because that's the road we're going to use. We'll videotape buckles before we bring those trucks in. We'll videotape when those trucks leave and we can submit them to the POA to determine whether we have damaged the roads. We're

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happy to do that. We we do that in other situations. >> You said buckles. What about Black Ranch? >> We won't be on Black Bear. >> This is This is depicting that you're on Black Bear. >> Well, in tiny portions of it, but it's it's Mr. Bates's property.

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>> Yeah. The property line goes over into Black Bear is what she's claiming >> in in places. Not all not all of it. >> So they're technically skirting down the edge of his property. >> Yeah. No, I see that. >> See, >> but I don't but I don't see where the access

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>> I'm sorry, Miss Bush. We can't hear you. >> That's what she's pointing out. >> I see it. >> I see what Okay. >> Do you see it now? >> I do. >> I do. >> I do have some other questions. Chairman, >> go ahead. Thank you.

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>> Um, can you tell me about So, you're putting this communication tower in the Florida wildlife corridor, >> correct? >> In a map in the staff report, it indicates that this tower is going in the Florida wildlife corridor. >> Okay. >> Uh, in the wildlife corridor, wildlife

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migrates, right? They move around. Um, can you tell me is this does this tower have guideline wires coming down? >> No guide wires. >> Okay. What are some of the measures that you're taking to reduce maybe impacts to the environment considering that this isn't a very sensitive land?

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>> We we have to do a NEPA report for our FCC >> compliance and we would will do that at the site plan stage and we will have to meet any of the requirements that pop up as part of NEPA. Any environmental any endangered species, any gopher

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tortoises, all of that will pop up when we do the site plan and we have to comply. We you heard that there are we we noted four gopher tortoises on site but none of them are within 25 feet of the tower location between now and when we actually build it. They could move.

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We will have to do that again at site plan. We'll have to go back in and re-evaluate those environmental impacts. Those are all site development issues. Today we're just here on the zoning approval. >> Well, you're here on the use approval and the the communication tower use impacts a lot of those things. So, we

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are talking about a lot of that today, which is why I'm asking the questions that I >> and that's why your staff had had us do an environmental assessment. >> Absolutely. >> For as part of this application, >> you know, I'll I'll be honest with you, a lot of those are just checking the boxes, right? Uh unfortunately, but um I I would like to know more about how you

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are going above and beyond to prevent any migratory bird deaths, which they died by the millions by your commun by these communication towers. But what are you doing to support wildlife movement in the Florida Wildlife Cor? >> Well, in in terms of migrating birds,

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the the US Fish and Wildlife Service uh guidance is directed at towers that are guide towers and over 300 ft. Monoples and self-supports under that are are not deemed to be impacting um migratory birds. And again, that's part of our

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ANIPA that goes up to the FCC. That gets reviewed by Fish and Wildlife, too. So, we'll have to meet all of those standards, but the tower of this height generally does not is not generally deemed to have an impact on migratory birds. Guywires, yes. >> I mean, I'm on their website and I'm

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viewing otherwise, but we'll just rest that case. Those are my main concerns about this. the coverage that you're going to this tower will be providing. Is there any overlapping coverage with the other cell towers in the area?

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>> Um, I'm going to call Mr. Pauly up for that. I can only he can only speak to T-Mobile's coverage. I don't have coverage maps for the other two licensed carriers in your marketplace. Um, T-Mobile is the anchor tower on this particular tenant. Let me pull up his maps. Um

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>> what I'm based on the reason I even asked that question is the benefit outweigh the uh impact and in that area if we have coverage already from other existing towers do we or do we not?

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Jason Paulie, uh 315 Elorn Court, Winter Park, Florida. >> Uh T-Mobile engineer, uh coming up on 32 years of RF experience. Uh there is a lack of coverage in the area currently.

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Um the we have different bands that we use. Low band covers farthest. Uh, and if you'll go up a slide, uh, down a slide, I'm sorry. Um, you can here we're depicting the 1900 megahertz

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5G coverage. Uh, you see the lack around the tower location. Um, if if this was low band depicted, the coverage would be larger because low band covers further. It's

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just the physics of the spectrum. Um so in the exist existing picture here between the sites in the southwest you see that there is only connect connecting in vehicle coverage. If you looked at lowband

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it that invehicle connection would be much smaller and there'd be more in in building residential. Uh so is there coverage from low band to some extent?

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It's getting closer, but you're not going to have the inbuilding and the invehicle will not be fully there either. Uh if you go down another slide, you can see with the 5G1900 with the site expands greatly to the north that the

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existing sites do not give even with low band. >> Did I answer your question? >> You did to some degree. Pretty much what you're saying is the low band, which isn't the 5G, we have coverage. you just don't have the

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coverage on the 5G. >> I'm not saying we have coverage at the tower location with the low band. Uh outdoor coverage probably is there on low band. Uh to the north, we don't have it that this is gaining us and we're improving to the south with multiple

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bands. >> Okay. We I'd have to ask staff, but we just approved one in Seville there off the railroad tracks. Is that depicted on this also? Because I don't I don't think it's constructed yet. Is it staff?

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>> I don't believe it's constructed yet. Um, they do have a tower distance map. So, you can I think it's like the the slide that is directly above this. >> Yeah. But does that include the one we just approved up on in the Seville area? >> I don't believe so because um

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>> because this is pretty close to that. Actually, it may. That may be that one 1027523. That does look pretty close. >> Do you remember how big the other tower was? How tall it was? >> Pardon? >> Do you remember how tall the other tower is not constructed?

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>> I don't remember what I had for lunch yesterday. >> Yeah. All right. I just remember that tower, [laughter] but that that red ring on that map I showed you is a two-mile radius and at the time of our application there weren't any

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other existing structures in that ring. >> What we had approved is a cell tower along the railroad tracks there is closer to Seville which is pretty close to where this location is. And that was the reason I'm even asking the the

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coverage area. And and this lease it's for how how many years? 50 years. 50-year lease. >> It's a 50 50-y year lease. >> 50-year lease. >> That's pretty standard in >> the advent of technology with the Starlink and all that going up. You

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know, I mean, you being an engineer, you probably know better than I do, obviously. What are we looking at? Obviously, in 50 years, you're not going to need this tower. You're probably not going to need it in 20 years, you know? And so that that's my point

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going, you know, >> techn technology is changing and advancing. Uh the satellite communications that you're talking about uh have limited bandwidth and they're not going to they're not going to

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replace terrestrialbased tower systems. >> Not now. >> Not ever. >> Not ever. But the technology of the devices being used will change. >> So yeah, T-Mobile and other carriers can

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use the Starlink in areas where they have zero service for communications. They can text. They're going to introduce calling features in the future, but it's not going to replace towers providing service to two areas

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where you know they're up. >> Okay. >> The lease runs in fiveyear increments. It's renew it gets renewed every five years automatically at the option of blue sky. And if the tower ever becomes obsolete, the lease provides that Blue

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Sky will take it down. I mean, that's a pretty standard provision of all tower um agreements. And you probably have an a provision in your code, I didn't look at that, that requires removal of towers if they are not being used any longer. >> Okay. Do we can can staff answer that

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question on the >> I'm sorry. What's the question? The Seville Tower is that does this depict the coverage from the Seville Tower? >> Oh, it's about the new the one you just approved by the >> one we just approved within the last year >> and I don't think it's in construction

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yet or it may be in construction. I don't know if it's operable yet. >> So, the closest one that we have to this area was approved in 24 and it currently has a final site plan and it's uh very far west of US7. So, it's not on the propagation map.

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The one >> Oh, it's west of 17. >> The one that was in the Seville area there though was right on 17 because it was right on the railroad track. >> Or is that on this map? >> Is that on this map?

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Okay. >> I don't even remember when it was done. I remember doing it. >> Pardon me. >> Yeah. >> I'm not getting a >> I don't mean to, but it's something you

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got [clears throat] to take in consideration. >> A a tower along 17 is not going to replace the need for this location. It's too far away. If you go down to the coverage maps that I've provided,

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um you'll see that we have a site along 17 and it it's not reaching out here. >> How far apart are the two towers? >> Yeah. I'm kind of torn on this. The scale there is two miles.

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>> Yeah, it's over two miles to the existing tower to the west. >> That's that's for the 5G coverage, correct? Yes, >> correct. I'm It was depicting 5G. LTE has a slightly larger footprint at the

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same frequency. Again, I'm bringing you back to this map here that for for a scale, that red ring is a two-mile radius. And you see 17 is all the way over to the west. And the existing towers to the west are then

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probably another mile. They're >> okay. >> 15 15,600 ft. That's almost three miles. The one other one to the southwest is 16,000 ft. That's over three miles. these folks that have the POA on the

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Black Bear Ranch Trail, >> obviously they do the upkeep and stuff on that that trail. Um, during the construction process, I'm not saying for maintenance with that quarterly um visit. What I'm talking

417
01:57:56.239 --> 01:58:11.679
about is during the construction process, if that road's damaged, would you be willing to put in a condition to bring it back to the where it was previously? I'm not saying go in there and pave the road. What I'm saying is to make bring it back to the condition that it

418
01:58:11.679 --> 01:58:28.159
>> the portion of Black Bear Ranch that is on Mr. Bates's property that will >> It doesn't matter. They're taking care of the road, >> right? >> Even though it's on his >> But we won't be using it. We will only be using the portion of it that's on Max Bates's property. >> I understand that. And we're happy to repair that. >> The portion that's on the portion that's

419
01:58:28.159 --> 01:58:44.719
on Max Bates property, they maintain. >> We're happy to repair any damage to the portion of Black Bear Trail that's on the Bates property that we damaged during construction. >> That's that's all I wanted to know. >> Yes, absolutely. I know you said buckles

420
01:58:44.719 --> 01:59:03.280
and I but I need >> technically >> technically they're coming on Buckles but they're actually driving Black Bear even though Black Bear is on his property >> but they're maintaining that property >> and it's being maintained by an association up to this point. Um,

421
01:59:03.280 --> 01:59:19.679
>> I mean, from a neighborly standpoint, again, I also live on a private road, and if this was happening on the corner of my road that I'm helping to maintain, I would definitely fight to, if nothing else, to get that homeowner or that owner or this company to become a member

422
01:59:19.679 --> 01:59:36.480
of the POA and kick into that fund, especially if it's a 15-year lease. We're not talking a five a fiveday temp. It's not a temporary lease. It's a 15 with another renewal. I've seen the I've seen the the cell tower leases before. So I would I would feel comfortable and as a citizen being saying, "Hey, yeah,

423
01:59:36.480 --> 01:59:52.239
listen, we're going to be good citizens. Whatever we tear up, we're going to fix." But at the same time, because that property has such a long stretch of it on Black Bear and actually it's the head to Black Bear Ranch Trail that's being maintained that they would kind of jump into the fold and kick into that fund. I

424
01:59:52.239 --> 02:00:10.400
have no idea what that POA what they collect. I can only uh speculate at this point, but that's just my that's a suggestion. I'm not not making it as a requirement, but it's a very strong suggestion. >> Okay. Well, you've heard the concerns, you've

425
02:00:10.400 --> 02:00:25.520
heard our questioning. Is there anything you'd like to add to that? >> Chairman, >> before we close, >> I do have a clarification for you. Uh the tower that you all are referring to that was approved last year is located on their map. It's the northwest

426
02:00:25.520 --> 02:00:42.760
uh tower number is 1200695. >> Says it's on there. Okay. >> I just wanted to make sure that we included that. >> Yes. >> So we didn't get overlapping coverage. That's all. >> Okay. >> Okay.

427
02:00:43.040 --> 02:00:58.080
other than the >> So, are you I was gonna >> if you wanted us to continue to dig into that tower more, I was going to suggest that, but are you now satisfied that that tower >> is not a replacement for this one or do I need to come back?

428
02:00:58.080 --> 02:01:14.639
>> overlapping coverage and he explained it pretty well. >> Okay. I just want to make sure I want to give you all the information you need to make a >> bandwidth coverage, >> but we don't have the the 5G pretty much. And as far as the I look for these

429
02:01:14.639 --> 02:01:31.440
towers to be obsolete because even though the towers are the bandwidth they're going to come out with devices that can reach these satellites would be more efficient. It's just technology. But you said you review this every five years

430
02:01:31.440 --> 02:01:47.280
and if it's not >> if it's not needed any longer we take it down. >> You take it down. You remove the tower. >> We do. >> Okay. And I should have looked while I was Did you look, Paulo, to see whether we have a tower you have a tower removal provision in your >> I don't believe we do. I know some

431
02:01:47.280 --> 02:02:03.440
jurisdictions have like a make you put up a bond to remove the tower. Um >> I'll have to check. >> Right. I think >> we have a legal obligation under our lease with Mr. Bates to to remove it if it's not used anymore. >> And that's and having

432
02:02:03.440 --> 02:02:19.520
>> and the special exception runs with the use. Once the use is discontinued, then the special exception. >> That is correct. Um if they are no longer using it as a tower, it you know abandons the use and they don't take the tower down, you know, uh we can initiate

433
02:02:19.520 --> 02:02:36.239
proceedings to start uh demolition and removal of the tower and then eventually lean the property. Um so that's 50 years in the future. Uh normally the the lease agreements because we've done lease agreements for our towers as well, you

434
02:02:36.239 --> 02:02:53.239
know, has a provision saying after the lease is terminated, you take down the tower. Um that is common. >> Miss Bush, you had a comment or a question? >> Yeah, a question. Uh just a followup. Um Paulo, how do we know that the tower is not in use?

435
02:02:54.960 --> 02:03:11.119
There's a list of essentially towers um and uh when they colllocate or when the carriers colllocate they have to kind of inform us on what structures are on the tower um obviously it has to be powered.

436
02:03:11.119 --> 02:03:29.040
So once you know things there there's there are going to be signs that this tower is no longer in use. Um, also we've got landscaping plans and landscaping maintenance requirements and um, you know, kind of storm water requirements for the impervious. When we

437
02:03:29.040 --> 02:03:45.440
start seeing some of those things, you know, fall by the wayside, we start asking questions, you know, uh, initiate code enforcement for maintenance. And when no one responds or if there's no electricity coming to it or if there's no license anymore for any one of these

438
02:03:45.440 --> 02:04:01.440
things, those are kind of evidence that hey, this who's on this tower, who's paying for it, is it abandoned? >> We and the carriers take the antenna off. >> Understood. Um I just I've had an experience in the past where that wasn't indicated and the property owner kept

439
02:04:01.440 --> 02:04:17.119
the lights on and kept maintaining it in order to get a carrier on, but the 90 days of their exemption had lapsed. So, it was an issue that I had to deal with on the abatement side. And so, that's why I just want to ask the question and that is really not confident enough for

440
02:04:17.119 --> 02:04:34.000
me to think that I would support this. So, thank you for that. I appreciate it. >> Okay. With that, I I think we've met all of the your code is written kind of differently. They have reasons for denial, not reasons for approval of a special exception. And I don't think you've heard any competent substantial

441
02:04:34.000 --> 02:04:50.000
evidence today that demonstrates that we don't meet the requirements of your code for a tower on this property. We meet all the setbacks. We meet all the separations. Um you have separations from residential structures and from the property lines to address aesthetic impact and to address safety. And we

442
02:04:50.000 --> 02:05:07.360
meet or exceed all of those setbacks. Um and there isn't any you haven't heard anything to demonstrate that we don't meet the requirements of your code for towers. and we would ask for your approval today. >> Well, the only thing that I could add to that would be a condition

443
02:05:07.360 --> 02:05:23.440
and the condition being the right of way that it would be maintained properly during the construction process and and forth going whether you join the POA or not. I'm not telling I wouldn't go that far, but we need something in writing

444
02:05:23.440 --> 02:05:40.960
that you're going to keep that whatever you destroy, you're going to maintain because these folks are putting their money out to keep this road drivable because I live on a private road myself, so I know how it is. And so for them to get that assurance that

445
02:05:40.960 --> 02:05:56.000
we're not going to go in there and tear the road up and just leave it or have undue traffic to the point where they it makes it very burdensome for them to use their road that they've maintained. I understand it's on Mr. Bates's property.

446
02:05:56.000 --> 02:06:11.920
Okay, that clarify that portion of it for me. But what I'm what my concern I would if for me to be okay with this there would be a third condition. >> Absolutely. And can I help to help you craft that? Yeah, you'd be more than happy if you

447
02:06:11.920 --> 02:06:28.480
>> My suggestion is that um Blue Sky Towers will be responsible for any damage to Buckles Road andor Black Bear Ranch caused during the initial construction of the tower and that Blue Sky will document that by videotaping the condition of both of those roads prior

448
02:06:28.480 --> 02:06:45.360
to the entry of any heavy duty vehicles and after the the departure of of heavy duty vehicles during construction >> and during What about during the quarterly visits if any maintenance has to be done. >> We're happy to do it then. I think that risk is very low. It's they're light

449
02:06:45.360 --> 02:07:02.440
duty. >> I just want you to be responsible for anything damage as you do their to their road. >> We're not we're not coming in in anything bigger than an Amazon truck for maintenance. >> Well, if you had to bring another crane in or something, >> we use tower climbers.

450
02:07:02.639 --> 02:07:19.440
>> Okay. Okay. >> Mr. Chairman, >> go ahead. Um, I'm still not comfortable with that. However, I would like a time frame. Like, you can't just say that you're going to maintain it and then not put a time frame to it. So, 60, 90 days when

451
02:07:19.440 --> 02:07:37.760
the time you're going to repair it 90 days after the construction is done. >> Yeah. I I want some kind of asurances on a time frame. >> We can do it within 90 days. >> 90. It's fine. >> 90. That's a good idea. Tie it to the CO. How long is the construction

452
02:07:37.760 --> 02:07:52.800
process? >> Miss Ramos, you need to come up. She's got better information. Can testify to that better. >> They got to keep it maintained during the during the construction. >> It's it's it's much shorter than building a house.

453
02:07:52.800 --> 02:08:09.199
>> Name and address. >> Good afternoon. Lisa Ramos, uh 4614 West 9 Griffin Road, Plant City, Florida 33565. The time schedule for the ETA for the construction of the cell uh telecommunications tower will be about

454
02:08:09.199 --> 02:08:25.119
10 weeks. Um that could be less or a bit more but usually about 10 weeks and that's dependent obviously that weather permitted. Um and we stay on schedule. >> Do you have folks on site every day? We

455
02:08:25.119 --> 02:08:43.199
will have contractors on site uh working but the crane like she mentioned the crane will be once heavy truck loads will be ones um to bring the tower in and then after that it was just limited traffic with contractor coming in staying on site leaving and u completing

456
02:08:43.199 --> 02:08:58.960
the development of the tower. So in this in the condition you you put 90 days but to me I think they need to keep the road maintained through the construction process too. People have

457
02:08:58.960 --> 02:09:13.360
got to travel this road in and out of their residence >> and that's fine >> and you'd have to maintain it through that the whole construction process plus bring it back to its current condition after the construction. >> Yes sir. And we can do that. We can do

458
02:09:13.360 --> 02:09:29.920
that however we drafted. >> Okay. All right. I'm not sure that we're going to get it passed, but that's, you know, that' be one of the stumbling blocks for me. >> Yes, sir. >> Is that these folks pay money to keep

459
02:09:29.920 --> 02:09:46.400
their road maintained. We want to keep it that way. I've not personally been out to Buckles Road, but I've I've had other tower construction situations where the roads were in such bad condition, we couldn't get the crane in to start with,

460
02:09:46.400 --> 02:10:01.440
and we had to come in and do the improvement before we brought the crane in. So, if if it's not if that's the situation, we're going to have to do that, too. We're going to have to make the repair to the road to get the equipment in. Again, I don't know what the condition of Buckles Road is. It

461
02:10:01.440 --> 02:10:20.320
looks pretty passable from the aerial, but I've not been out there. >> Okay. Okay. Any other questions for the applicant? >> Um, yeah. By chance, is is uh the owner

462
02:10:20.320 --> 02:10:42.800
here? Is Bates here? >> No, >> I asked. >> No. All right. Thank you. >> Okay. We're going to close the floor for public participation and have a discussion here and um give you an answer. >> Okay. >> Um well the discussion actually let me

463
02:10:42.800 --> 02:10:58.159
go ahead and make the motion and we can discuss uh case S26-068. Uh I make a motion to approve special exception case uh subject to the staff recommended conditions. Would you want to add a third condition road construction

464
02:10:58.159 --> 02:11:14.400
>> two? Yeah, I'm I want to talk about it before I add conditions to that, but you have two staff recommended conditions on here. I believe they are. >> Mhm. >> Okay. So, >> it pertains to the tower. >> In essence, I I personally don't have a problem at all with the cell tower. I

465
02:11:14.400 --> 02:11:31.280
think that it's it's a it's a fit need situation. The private road part is giving me a little bit of consternation here. Um, and I understand the I understand the attorney speak when it says, "Hey, we're staying on Bates's property." I get that because the

466
02:11:31.280 --> 02:11:48.400
property line runs into to Black Bear Ranch Road. But nonetheless, that is the head of Black Bear Ranch, which is used by everybody downstream and they then the POA has been um has been maintaining it for I don't know how many years. I would like to see a condition where and

467
02:11:48.400 --> 02:12:04.320
I was jotting some notes down and again I'm not an attorney so bear with me here that uh it's a blue sky. Yeah, BST. I'm going to call them BST for now. Is that good? Well, they'll be responsible to maintain

468
02:12:04.320 --> 02:12:20.159
um to maintain the current condition of the road from buckles to Blackbear Road along the entirety of Bates's property during construction and post construction. And within 60 days post

469
02:12:20.159 --> 02:12:37.159
construction CO release, BST will then turn the road back over to the homeowners, if you will, in the same or better condition from the day the permit was issued. Something along those lines.

470
02:12:37.440 --> 02:12:51.840
>> I happen to agree with you because they've met all the >> conditions for the tower itself. Um, >> according to our code, they've met all the conditions. So I don't see any uh anything that would prevent that.

471
02:12:51.840 --> 02:13:09.280
>> So there's no turnover to the PA. It's >> well they're not really taking it from them, but I'm basically releasing their their responsibility as far as maint maintenance at that point within 60 days after the CO >> because they're going to have to come back and do whatever road repairs they need to do.

472
02:13:09.280 --> 02:13:24.000
>> In other words, we're not turning it over to the county because we don't control it. It's a private road. So it's basically back to the homeowners. Well, they can keep it maintained, >> right? It I think we >> I don't think >> I think where you're headed is it needs to be tied to maintenance of the the

473
02:13:24.000 --> 02:13:41.599
road does not the road itself does not belong to the POA. It's an easement on private property, but we're happy to maintain Black Bear Ranch during construction >> and return it to its original condition post construction for the length of Max

474
02:13:41.599 --> 02:13:57.040
Bates's frontage. >> Mhm. >> Of Black Bear Ranch Road. >> Yeah. >> I don't know if I've said that more artfully or less, but I'm >> Well, I just want to be understood that they maintain that road. >> Yeah. And it's and even though it's on max

475
02:13:57.040 --> 02:14:12.159
base property, >> he's given them an easement and part of that easement he's allowed them to maintain a road on that ement, >> right? >> So regardless of who owns it or who doesn't own it, it needs to be maintained. That's that's the bottom line.

476
02:14:12.159 --> 02:14:29.119
>> And and Blue Sky is happy to address any damage that it causes to Black Bear Ranch Trail due to the construction of the tower. We we are I don't know how many times I have to say that. >> Okay. I just don't want him to come back and say, "Well, he owns the property. He doesn't have to do keep this up or that

477
02:14:29.119 --> 02:14:45.119
up." That's part of the condition to approve this special exception. >> Understood. >> Miss Bush, you had you had a comment. >> Well, I Let's maybe complete the motion on the table and then Sorry. Let's complete the

478
02:14:45.119 --> 02:15:00.480
motion on the table so that I can give my my suggestions or my recommend or my responses because I don't agree that they've met the conditions of the special condition criteria and I'd like the opportunity to explain why I feel that way.

479
02:15:00.480 --> 02:15:17.440
>> Okay, go ahead. Most >> that's the motion. So, there's a motion on the floor. >> Well, you need to get the you need Well, are we going to put a third condition in? >> Oh, what's the third condition then? The one I just read. >> The one that >> maintenance >> the maintenance portion of it. Yes. Yes. >> I mean,

480
02:15:17.440 --> 02:15:31.280
>> you might as well make it in the motion because it's not going to pass. >> And correct. >> I'll repeat what what I think I heard what the motion was, which is uh BST, Blue Skies Technologies, will be responsible to um >> speak to the mic.

481
02:15:31.280 --> 02:15:48.639
>> Sorry. Uh so BST will be responsible to um I can't read my own writing. uh to maintain the uh uh um existing conditions of the roadway um along what's the road again? Black

482
02:15:48.639 --> 02:16:02.880
>> Blackberry Ranch. >> Blackberry Road. Um during construction of the tower and after construction of the tower um and will return the uh fix any damage and return any any portions of the road uh within Mr. Bates's

483
02:16:02.880 --> 02:16:18.800
property um within 60 days. >> Same condition it was the day the permit was issued. >> Yes. Yes. >> Okay. >> So, they and I think they've already said they will document and then they'll move forward. >> I I will second what he just said. >> Well, we just make it a condition. Make

484
02:16:18.800 --> 02:16:33.040
that the third condition from staff. >> So, you the three staff recommended conditions. >> Sure. >> You recommended that one. >> So, that's that's the motion. >> This is why it's going to go without it. >> Okay. >> Do we have a second on my motion? >> Not yet. >> Okay.

485
02:16:33.040 --> 02:16:55.519
>> Do I get a second on that motion? that we've >> No, ma'am. No, we're close. >> There is an appeal process and I'll let Mr. Sora go over that uh with you at the end of the conversation here. >> A second.

486
02:16:55.519 --> 02:17:12.880
>> Do I had do I get a second on that? >> You got a second? Okay. All right. I got a motion on the floor to approve special exception case S 26068 with the three staff recommended

487
02:17:12.880 --> 02:17:30.240
conditions. The third being added by a discussion here at this panel and a second from Miss Craig and the motion from Mr. Costa. Any discussion on the motion? Miss Bush.

488
02:17:30.240 --> 02:17:45.280
>> Thank you. Um I do not feel that the um applicant has met the conditions for the special exemption. Um more specifically and I will find this in um the criteria

489
02:17:45.280 --> 02:18:02.399
that is listed on page 8 and nine of the staff report. Um specifically section H and section I. I'll start with section H that it materially alters the character of the surrounding neighborhoods or adversely affects the value of

490
02:18:02.399 --> 02:18:17.760
surrounding land structures and buildings. A communications tower in the Florida wildlife corridor will absolutely materially alter the character of the surrounding neighborhoods and adversely impact the value of the surrounding land structures and buildings. So I do not agree with

491
02:18:17.760 --> 02:18:35.040
staff. I do not find that there's enough evidence to suggest that there is not going to be an alteration to the character of the surrounding community by installing this communications tower. Secondly, I will adversely affect the natural environment, natural resources or scenic beauty uh or cause excessive

492
02:18:35.040 --> 02:18:51.040
pollution, not necessarily on the excessive pollution side, but again a communications tower in the Florida Wildlife Corridor will adversely affect the natural environment. We've already talked about migratory bird patterns and natural resources. In addition, there are some requirements that are

493
02:18:51.040 --> 02:19:05.840
guidelines from the United States Florida Wildlife Services indicating that the placement of new towers should really be away from these environmentally sensitive areas and should maximize the protection of these environmental areas where they best can.

494
02:19:05.840 --> 02:19:23.359
They give examples of how to place towers not near wetlands or in areas that are known to have bird concentration areas either in na uh state or uh national refuges, wildlife areas, staging areas, rrookeries or

495
02:19:23.359 --> 02:19:40.080
other important bird areas. So for these reasons, I do not feel that the uh substantial evidence to support that we should be recommending approval on this is there. Um so therefore I am not in favor of this for those reasons and do

496
02:19:40.080 --> 02:19:55.520
not feel that it meets those requirements because of that what I've outlined. Thank you. >> Thank you Miss Bush. Mr. Sur on the criteria portion of the special exception. I know in variances it only has to meet three special exceptions

497
02:19:55.520 --> 02:20:11.280
what do they have to meet? Um so so these are these are uh reasons for denial right you can so if they meet all the criteria you should approve the special exception and you can only deny the special exception if you find

498
02:20:11.280 --> 02:20:26.080
there's comp substantial evidence that triggers one of these reasons for denial. So it's it's a little bit different from your variance applications where you need to meet three out of five. Here um you know they meet all their criteria for the special

499
02:20:26.080 --> 02:20:43.040
exception. Um and that you have to basically look at okay was there evidence presented that um that indicates that there is substantial evidence that triggers one of these reasons to deny. So that's what you're

500
02:20:43.040 --> 02:20:58.080
looking at in terms of your decisions. So you know, step one is do they meet all the standard criteria for the special exception? I don't think I've heard any evidence that they don't. Step two, if if they meet all those, do they

501
02:20:58.080 --> 02:21:14.800
trigger one of those reasons for denial? >> So they got to meet all the criteria is what you're saying. >> Well, all the all the standard criteria for this specific special exception. And then you have, you know, these um these

502
02:21:14.800 --> 02:21:30.399
factors. And so, >> so if we agreed with what Miss Bush said, >> theoretically, we could deny the special. >> So, here's the provision. Um it's in it's in your report. Uh under the

503
02:21:30.399 --> 02:21:46.319
special exception criteria, you know, uh you can deny the application for one or more of the following reasons. and it goes all the way from A through I. I I will say however that towers are treated

504
02:21:46.319 --> 02:22:03.200
differently in special by both uh the US government and Florida law. So you know regarding property values um you know mere statement about the reduction of property values is not sufficient comp substantial evidence. You need um you know needs to be

505
02:22:03.200 --> 02:22:18.560
provided by property appraiser or real estate agent. Um and the factual basis usually you know the comps or some kind of demonstration of an actual reduction is necessary. Um regarding aesthetics that is actually also a different test.

506
02:22:18.560 --> 02:22:34.319
A mere generalized objection to aesthetics is not sufficient. That usually has to be demonstrated by some kind of um faximile of how the tower interacts with the environment. Um uh balloon test or some kind of like

507
02:22:34.319 --> 02:22:48.960
picture. Um when we go about environmental um impacts, you have to be very careful because you cannot base your decision on the environmental effects of radio frequency. Um so that is that is not

508
02:22:48.960 --> 02:23:07.520
something that the um uh 1996 towers act um allows you to do when you are evaluating these these towers. So you know within that realm that's the comp substantial evidence that you may consider when making your determination. So the environmental impact if I were to

509
02:23:07.520 --> 02:23:22.800
look at it and the the size of the project being the footprint of the tower itself if I me personally sitting on this board if I thought had had an impact on that >> it's usually the the the structural the

510
02:23:22.800 --> 02:23:39.520
impacts of the structure itself on the environment not the radio frequency effect. So, you know, locating a tower in the middle of a wetland, for example, is something you can consider because that's like standard land development practice. But you can't say, oh, 5G is

511
02:23:39.520 --> 02:23:56.080
going to do something like that's not within what you can consider. >> Well, we've been given a big obligation on these special exceptions that it stops here. I just want to make sure we got it right. That's all. Okay.

512
02:23:56.080 --> 02:24:12.240
All right. So, any other comments on the motion? >> Okay. All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any oppose? >> I >> I Okay, we got two denials.

513
02:24:12.240 --> 02:24:27.520
>> Miss Craig, I didn't hear you. I'm sorry. >> I Okay, >> so the uh it takes four, correct? >> Yes. So, here's your here are your options. You can um revote with a different set of conditions. um you can

514
02:24:27.520 --> 02:24:44.640
continue it to another matter or Mr. Chair after you know you've taken uh you continue it to a next meeting or you can uh ask for additional motions and if none appear um it operates as a

515
02:24:44.640 --> 02:25:01.920
technical denial and you can appeal to county council within 10 days of the rendition. >> We'll we'll ask for a continuence when you have a full board. >> Okay. But we got there got to be we have to recommend that at this point. Okay.

516
02:25:01.920 --> 02:25:18.319
Well, we can either recommend a continuation for a full board or we can do a technical denial because it didn't meet the four criteria. It only met three. Or we can or we can or we can redo the

517
02:25:18.319 --> 02:25:34.479
motion >> to satisfy what the problem is on the motion or if it could be satisfied at all. >> If May I >> go ahead. >> Well, I know where Ry stands, >> but I don't know where you stand. Is there anything that we could tweak this to that would change your point of view

518
02:25:34.479 --> 02:25:52.560
on this? >> Sorry. I >> he understood where Miss Bush is at, but he didn't understand where Mr. Sixma was at. That's why he's >> I don't know. I'm just I'm just not feeling good about certain things. Like I said, the road I guess is covered at

519
02:25:52.560 --> 02:26:08.960
this point, but um I mean, even the height of a tower, the 250 ft is really bothering me. But the there's no there were conditions we could put in here that would satisfy you at this point? >> I don't think so.

520
02:26:08.960 --> 02:26:26.720
>> Okay. All right. It's a valid question. This >> um >> Okay. >> The procedurally >> Okay. Do you want to procedurally >> we can uh look at it because it is a

521
02:26:26.720 --> 02:26:42.720
technical denial. >> You could you can ask if the board would consider a continuence. That's all. That's where we're at now. >> All right. Well, as a motion, you mean? >> Yeah. There's a motion. >> I would make a motion that the see if the board will accept a continuence on

522
02:26:42.720 --> 02:27:00.160
case S--26-068 to the August PLDRC meeting. >> I would recommend going one month after that. >> One month after >> Yes. We have a medical condition on one of the >> Make it at September uh >> September 18th. >> September 18 PLDRC meeting.

523
02:27:00.160 --> 02:27:16.080
>> Okay. >> Excuse me. So, the motion is to uh continue case S26-068 to the September 18th PLDRC meeting. >> I'll second that. >> Okay. I got a motion on the floor to continue S26068

524
02:27:16.080 --> 02:27:31.200
to our continue it to our September 18th. >> Chair Mills, I apologize. It's the 17th. >> 17th. >> Got my Thursdays and my Fridays mixed up. >> I can't I can't echo. I can't understand it. >> September 17th. I

525
02:27:31.200 --> 02:27:48.319
>> I'll amend a motion to September 17. >> Second. >> Got a motion on the floor to continue case S26068 to our se September 17th meeting for Mr. Costa and a second for Mr. 6. Any discussion on the motion

526
02:27:48.319 --> 02:28:03.600
>> real quick? Obviously punting this doesn't change any of the conditions any of my reasonings for what I've stated. uh if you are to come back, I would highly suggest maybe trying to address some of these of my questions because I am still going to be a non-serve for

527
02:28:03.600 --> 02:28:19.200
this. I understand. Um but I don't necessarily that feel that that's fair to the residents that are here as well that we're punting this just to see if we can get a couple other people to vote for it. So I'm not going to vote for this. >> Any other discussion on the motion?

528
02:28:19.200 --> 02:28:38.160
>> All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. >> Any opposed? >> I. Motion carries four to one. >> Okay, Mr. Costa, could I get the next one, please? >> Next case, Z-26-081.

529
02:28:38.160 --> 02:28:55.280
Application of Joseph Hopkins, the Performance Group, Inc., Agent for owner Joseé Luis Bruno Ludwig of Bedford Homes LLC requesting a resoning from the traditional transitional agricultural A3 zoning classifications to the transitional agricultural A4 zoning

530
02:28:55.280 --> 02:29:15.359
classification. >> Mr. Suzik, this one is yours. >> Wowects this time, so didn't make me any louder. >> [sighs] >> Good morning once again. My name's Rob

531
02:29:15.359 --> 02:29:30.640
Suzac, planner 2. This case is a request to reszone the subject property from A3 to A4 for the simple reason of being compliant with code section 72-537 subsection 10 subsection B to be

532
02:29:30.640 --> 02:29:50.240
eligible for a exempt five or below lot subdivision. The proposed A4 zoning is compatible with urban light intensity future land use designation. Reduces the potential intensity by increasing the minimum lot size from 1 acre to 2.5 acres is

533
02:29:50.240 --> 02:30:05.760
consistent with the surrounding traditional development pattern. Staff recommends forwarding the application to the county with a re recommendation of approval. On a planning note, this uh piece of property was the remnants of

534
02:30:05.760 --> 02:30:23.840
a slice and dice resubdivision where everybody took their uh where they took their basically piece of Lake Mammy and this is what was left behind because more than half the property is submerged and actually it's

535
02:30:23.840 --> 02:30:40.640
prone to flooding from Lake Mammy. So from a planning perspective, taking marginal land like this and developing it is a good idea. It's very compatible with the current comprehensive plan and it fits into that ULI future designation

536
02:30:40.640 --> 02:30:57.359
because this will ensure some green space even if those lots are subdivided further. That's all I have to say about it. Are any questions? >> Okay. Thank you, Mr. Zeus. That any questions, Miss Bush? >> Yes. I'm not sure you're going to be able to answer this, so this is for

537
02:30:57.359 --> 02:31:13.920
everyone. Maybe um Mr. Ashley, why was A3 omitted from section 72-537 A10B? >> Yeah, I I won't be able to answer that because that's a plan thing. So, it's before my time.

538
02:31:13.920 --> 02:31:30.800
>> Uh because it's one A3 is one acre. So >> yeah, the uh the purpose of that um uh subdivision exemption is to not require people to plat and we want large lots. So 2 and a half acres minimum. A3 is 1

539
02:31:30.800 --> 02:31:46.720
acre. A4 is two and a half. So that's why we intentionally excluded A3. So you can't subdivide it without platting. >> Okay. >> Actually, I did know that. >> I assume that platting. It's a platting thing. Yeah. The two and a half was the previous exemption standard prior to the code

540
02:31:46.720 --> 02:32:03.439
change in 2008. So that's why it's like that too. A4 that's the minimum. A3 is minimum 1acre. You could do two and a half in A3 but that's not the minimum. So it was excluded from that option. >> Okay. Understood. Thank you. >> Anything. >> Any other questions for staff?

541
02:32:03.439 --> 02:32:26.240
Hearing none. Thank you sir. Is the applicant present? Good morning, sir. Could I get your name and address for the record, please? >> Good morning, Mr. Chairman. My name is Joe Hopkins. I'm an engineer with the performance group at 100 Marina Point Drive in Daytona Beach. Um, I I believe

542
02:32:26.240 --> 02:32:41.920
Mr. Suzac's presentation is right on spot. This meets all the matrix for uh evaluation of the zoning crzoning criteria. Um, we've been pretty forward with staff on what our objective is with this is to pursue an exempt subdivision,

543
02:32:41.920 --> 02:32:57.680
four lot subdivision. It's an exhibit in your package on page 11 that depicts what we are uh attempting to pursue. Uh we're not uh it's not a smok and mirror. We're not not a not a shell game of any sorts that we're going to try to subdivide any further. Uh it's our

544
02:32:57.680 --> 02:33:12.800
intent to divide into four lots at the end of the day through the exempt subdivision in U section 72 uh-537. And uh Miss Bush, you were correct in in raising the question about why A3 to A4.

545
02:33:12.800 --> 02:33:29.200
That's the reason. >> I'm here to answer any questions if you have them. >> Okay. Do we have any questions for the >> Okay. We do have a public participation form. I'll give you a chance. >> Oh, go ahead. Um, thank you. Um, so I see that you're just straight

546
02:33:29.200 --> 02:33:46.000
subdividing it down the road, right? Like you're just north south providing that um, delineation, correct? For your proposed Lake Ma mainy estates. >> Correct. >> Okay. Is the access then for these parcels supposed to be on State Road 15A?

547
02:33:46.000 --> 02:34:02.319
>> Correct. Be North Spring Garden. Correct. >> Okay. Um, that is a state road, correct? >> I believe it is. Yes. Okay. It is >> state road 15A. >> It is a state road. >> Okay. Um >> that's mislabel. >> And so the intent for these lots is to

548
02:34:02.319 --> 02:34:18.080
have access to ingress and egress off of the state road. Is that correct? >> That's correct. >> Okay. Is there I see that you've got some lowlying. So it looks like the property kind of drains I guess or you have water I guess coming in from the north side of state road 15A that's kind

549
02:34:18.080 --> 02:34:35.760
of coming into Lake there. So you can highlight here, right, your wetland area that's being delineated. So my my question is, is that wet? That section that runs up on that parcel A to State Road 15A. Is that wet? I >> I believe it is. Uh it was classified uh

550
02:34:35.760 --> 02:34:51.359
previously by an environmental uh evaluation. The site has approximately 7 ft of relief from north to south towards Lake. Um starts off around elevation um I think it was Okay, that's fine. >> Okay. My main my main question my

551
02:34:51.359 --> 02:35:08.000
purpose of my questioning um is because in in my my expertise this is essentially subdividing and creating some sprawl right these are really large lots that you're creating and around here you starting to get some smaller lots kind of building up a little bit

552
02:35:08.000 --> 02:35:24.800
and I just wonder if there's a better so that's number one number two as a transportation planner you never want to have access ingress and egress off of a state road it's really it's not safe um and I would be really concerned about continuing to put individual ingress and egress access on a state road. What I

553
02:35:24.800 --> 02:35:41.120
would like to see, and I know that this is kind of what you're trying to not do, right, is to do a proper subdivision here and really plat this out so that you can utilize the land and maybe make it better suited instead of just cutting it into four pieces and then having everybody access the state road. Um, so

554
02:35:41.120 --> 02:35:57.120
anyway, I'll get into my comments later, but I'm I'm just questioning whether or not the land could support a different subdivision of the land to limit access onto the state road. >> U, Miss Bush, I think what staff had identified is that this this particular

555
02:35:57.120 --> 02:36:12.240
reasonzoning is most appropriate for transition between urban and rural uh to the north. Um, there has been some subdivisions, some more intense subdivisions to the south. Uh there's trailer parks, there's R3 zoning and things of that sort, but once you cross

556
02:36:12.240 --> 02:36:29.040
15A, it gets pretty urban. Um and I mean pretty rural in in terms of large tracks of land and so forth. So I think um I think staff felt that this was appropriate uh not only as A3, but also even more uh more so as A4 zoning

557
02:36:29.040 --> 02:36:45.680
because we increase the lot sizes and offer a better transition between the rural and the urban uh transition. Yeah. Okay. And Miss Bush, if I can clarify, uh, that section of Spring Garden Road is actually county maintained. North of US 17, it becomes

558
02:36:45.680 --> 02:37:02.080
county maintenance. >> It's Yeah. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> I mean, I I my comment is still valid regardless state road or not, right? you want to limit that access onto a facility that could be widened right in

559
02:37:02.080 --> 02:37:17.840
the future or could have um impacts because there is significant density south and also to the east. Well, not significant, but there is more density to the east. So, all right. Thank you.

560
02:37:17.840 --> 02:37:38.560
>> Any other questions for the applicant? >> We do have a public participation. >> I'll give you a chance for a bow. Thank you very much, >> Miss Cindy Jones. >> Okay. All right. Well, then we'll close the floor for public participation, open up for commission discussion or a

561
02:37:38.560 --> 02:37:57.680
motion. I'll make a motion, Mr. Chair uh case Z26-081 that we forward the resoning application to the county council uh for final action with a recommendation of approval. >> Second. I've got a motion on the floor

562
02:37:57.680 --> 02:38:14.240
for Mr. Costa to forward the resoning application case number Z 26081 to the county council for final action with the recommendation of approval and a second from Mr. Sixma. Any discussion on the motion? Miss Bush.

563
02:38:14.240 --> 02:38:31.200
Um, I disagree with staff that I I do feel like there could have been, I think, a better way to slice up this parcel and reszone it in a way that doesn't >> I'm sorry, Miss Bush, you might get a little closer. Thank you. >> I'll start over. Um, I do not agree with the um, uh, evidence presented in the

564
02:38:31.200 --> 02:38:48.560
staff report, more specifically to um, uh, some of the issues and changes in section five and in section 8 um, public health, welfare, and safety. Um I've indicated that um you know having access you know building a subdivision like you

565
02:38:48.560 --> 02:39:04.640
are splitting it up one lot into four and then pushing all of those vehicles onto a county road you know state county road um is just not good planning practice right in order to I'm almost thinking that this could have been uh an opportunity to do a conservation type

566
02:39:04.640 --> 02:39:19.680
subdivision to really kind of maximize the the um density uh and the opportunity that you have for development in an area where it doesn't impact um flood uh considerations on the property and the influx in um water to

567
02:39:19.680 --> 02:39:37.840
Lake. Uh and so for those reasons, I am I am not in favor of this resoning at this time. Thank you. >> Thank you. I on the other hand agree with staff because I believe the transitional zoning is actually uh a good thing in

568
02:39:37.840 --> 02:39:54.720
this in this situation here and especially when the option would be to increase the densities. So uh I'm I'm definitely in favor for this zoning request. Any other comments?

569
02:39:54.720 --> 02:40:16.560
All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. Any oppose? >> I >> motion carries four to one. >> Thank you very much. >> Our next case. Yep. Uh should I read these uh together? The

570
02:40:16.560 --> 02:40:33.359
PUD and the CPA? >> Uh no, >> the last 005 is standalone. >> Okay. All right. uh PUD-24-005 application of Mark Watts uh Cobb Cole attorneys at law uh for Dr. Horton and England Times and Miller in Inc. agents

571
02:40:33.359 --> 02:40:50.479
for the owner KCO Southern LLC requesting a reszoning from transitional agricultural A3 and urban single family R4 zoning classifications to a planned unit development PUD. >> Miss Ray, this one's yours.

572
02:40:50.479 --> 02:41:07.520
>> Hello. So the applicant is proposing a planned unit development resoning for a combined 52.85 acre site in the Dand area for the development of 147 single family residential units and one commercial use. The project consists of

573
02:41:07.520 --> 02:41:23.200
five parcels approximately a quarter mile west of the intersection of State Road 44 and South Kepler Road. The surrounding uses to the north are majority mostly undeveloped with uh general

574
02:41:23.200 --> 02:41:38.640
commercial B4 and PUD zoning classification. Uh the PUD that was previously known as Redstone is now referred to as Eastland Marketplace which was approved in 2024 and is mixeduse development to the souththeast

575
02:41:38.640 --> 02:41:55.200
and west. um mix jurisdiction between unincorporated Valuchia County and the city of Dand and are either undeveloped or developed with single family residences. The city of Dand's planning staff re reviewed the project and stated that the portion of the property that is located

576
02:41:55.200 --> 02:42:12.399
on State Road 44 is within the city's redevelopment gateway corridor that incurs enhanced landscaping and signage requirements. The proposed landscape buffers meet the lands and counties requirements. The property is also located within the transit oriented development and the

577
02:42:12.399 --> 02:42:28.720
urban core areas of the Dan 2050 vision plan where growth is intended to take place and encourage higher density and mixture of uses. The PUD is proposed to be developed in two phases. Phase one includes the 147 detached single family dwelling units

578
02:42:28.720 --> 02:42:44.000
and phase two includes the commercial portion along State Road 44. The commercial use includes 13 possible neighborhood convenience uses that are listed within the development agreement. There is currently no plans for the

579
02:42:44.000 --> 02:42:59.920
commercial portion. However, no single permitted use listed shall exceed 5,000 square ft with no single structure to exceed 8,500 square ft in accordance with the urban low intensity future land use and the neighborhood convenience definition within the comprehensive

580
02:42:59.920 --> 02:43:15.680
plan. The site will be required to provide 7.33 acres of common open space and the applicants have proposed 7.61 acres of common open space. The proposed development could generate approximately

581
02:43:15.680 --> 02:43:34.240
1,82 daily trips and 147 p.m. peak hour trips. Due to the project's trip generation, a traffic impact analysis was required. Countyy's Traffic Engineering reviewed the TIA and was approved on June 1st of 2026. However,

582
02:43:34.240 --> 02:43:49.680
before the commercial portion is developed, the applicant will be required to submit an intersection analysis to traffic engineering for review. Staff's recommendation is to forward the resoning to county council with the re recommendation of approval. I do also want to note that we did

583
02:43:49.680 --> 02:44:04.240
receive five letters of opposition. I'm available for questions. >> Thank you, Miss Ray. Any questions for staff? Mr. Cos, I >> I I can't the the font is too small for me to read. Are these homes or town homes on the site plan?

584
02:44:04.240 --> 02:44:20.880
>> Uh they're homes. They're single family detached. >> Yes, sir. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yeah, they were originally came in as town homes, but it's now just single family detached. >> Single detached. Yes, sir. >> Thanks. >> Any other questions for staff? >> Okay. Could I get the applicant to come

585
02:44:20.880 --> 02:44:43.120
forward, please? I had to zoom in. >> Good morning, Mr. Watts. Name and address for the record. >> Yes, sir. Uh, for the record, Mark Watts with the law firm of Cobb call, 231 North Woodland Boulevard, Dand. And I can can just say good morning still. >> Um, so I've got a a couple slides I want

586
02:44:43.120 --> 02:44:59.040
to walk you through. Um, actually on the >> It was the wrong one, >> the prior one. You got the other one coming up? >> Um, as you can tell from the case number, this one's been around for a little bit. We've been working through a number of different issues um on the technical side with both county city

587
02:44:59.040 --> 02:45:16.399
review going um on with this and also a lot of review and coordination with DOT which I'll get to in a little bit um as we talk through some of the slides that I've got for you. Um so let me walk through this initially and then I'll have a couple comments at the end. Um, we have seen some of the correspondence that came in. Um, and I'll I'll just

588
02:45:16.399 --> 02:45:32.640
note, um, there's a there's a number of things in the correspondence that relate to some of the technical details and design details that ultimately come at the preliminary plat phase for the design of things like storm water systems and everything else. We have some information that we'll show you here. We also have scheduled a meeting with um, some of the neighbors that

589
02:45:32.640 --> 02:45:48.800
reached out. We're meeting with them next Thursday to to kind of sit down and go through some of their questions in more detail as well. So, um, just keep that in in your mind as you're as we're kind of walking through this, um, we do have that that meeting scheduled to to sit down and go through some of the questions in detail. And I know there's a number of them that are here, uh, this

590
02:45:48.800 --> 02:46:06.080
morning as well. So, just to to give you kind of the existing lay of the land, um, you saw these maps from your staff report. Um, the northern portion of the site, you've got R4 zoning. Um, you've got A3 on the southern portion of the site that you see in green. The interesting thing that I always um kind of look at when you're kind of going

591
02:46:06.080 --> 02:46:21.760
back and looking at where the existing zoning and things like that are is how long has it been there. Um in this case, the zoning has really been in place since our original zoning maps were adopted. And so, um let me put that in context for you. In this area, when this

592
02:46:21.760 --> 02:46:37.279
zoning was adopted, the zoning that's in place currently, Kepler Road was dirt south of 44 and stopped at Oaklair. Uh it didn't continue further south. So, the development of Martin Luther King Boulevard all the way down to 472, the

593
02:46:37.279 --> 02:46:52.080
development of Victoria Park, development of all the housing and subdivisions that have proceeded over the the planning that's occurred in the past 35 36 years. Um, this zoning has not been updated to reflect kind of those

594
02:46:52.080 --> 02:47:08.319
changes in circumstances in the area. So, I think that's, you know, obviously a relevant point when when you're looking at some of the, you know, the character of the change that we're asking for here. So what you did have in place going back to the original adoption of the comprehensive plan and the original land

595
02:47:08.319 --> 02:47:23.520
use is the ULI's land use classification. Now, if you look at ULI, um again from the from the from the adoption of the comp plan in the 19 late 1990s, there's uh or the most recent revisions to it, um there's been an intent that this would be an urban uh

596
02:47:23.520 --> 02:47:40.479
area eventually as growth continued to occur in Valuch County and in the areas adjacent to the city of Dand. So, what we're proposing is to reszone. We're the urban land or urban low inensity land use classification. We're not asking to change that. Um we are uh asking to

597
02:47:40.479 --> 02:47:56.800
reszone the property to PUD. Um and at the end of the day um you know the we've got a mix of we've got some commercial in here. I'll talk to you a little bit about the layout and how I think some of this all ties together out there with the other things that have happened over the past number of years. Um but we're

598
02:47:56.800 --> 02:48:12.479
providing something that's a little bit different. We'll talk about that as we get into the the discussion of some of the specific types of units that are being proposed here. So, I always like to kind of look at this because not every community does this. And I will say just for the board's um

599
02:48:12.479 --> 02:48:29.520
edification, one of the reasons you're seeing this uh instead of this property being annexed into the city of Dan for this process is because we have an enclave issue. If we were to annex this property, we would create we would create an enclave which is impermissible. And so, the applications have been submitted to the to the

600
02:48:29.520 --> 02:48:45.760
county, but have also been reviewed by the city of Dand. And you'll hear me talk a lot about the long range planning that Dand has done historically and and that's what this map right here is. So let me let me talk about Dand's planning and how it's kind of evolved over the

601
02:48:45.760 --> 02:49:00.960
years. Um the total area that you see colored within this map is what's known as the greater Dand area. Um, Dand's fairly unique in that in 1973 the state legislature adopted a special act that said this is the area of

602
02:49:00.960 --> 02:49:17.760
influence essentially that the city of Dand ultimately will exercise over the area that surrounds it. In other words, as the city grows and as the utility uh infrastructure grows and things of that nature, this is the area that was identified beginning in 1973

603
02:49:17.760 --> 02:49:34.160
as the growth area um for the city of Dand. Now, Dand doesn't have a desire to grow out to the the full boundaries there. Um, in fact, we've talked to Dand in various at various times about some of those areas that are in the light yellow that you see here, and they say we're perfectly fine with those things

604
02:49:34.160 --> 02:49:50.560
staying exactly as they are right now. In fact, if you look at what this map is, this is the updated map from the Dand 2050 plan. So, Dand has undertaken this effort twice. Um in 2009 the original Dand 2050 plan was uh reviewed and gone it went through a number of

605
02:49:50.560 --> 02:50:06.800
different workshops over a year or so. Um and they identified kind of how we want to continue to grow as a community in the dand the greater Dand area that was also updated in 2024. Um so this is the most recent map from that 2024 update. But the the colors that are here

606
02:50:06.800 --> 02:50:22.560
are the key. So if you look at that orange or or kind of darker um mustard color, let's call it um that's the area that the land has identified as the growth area. That's where increases in densities, diversification of housing,

607
02:50:22.560 --> 02:50:39.359
encouragement of things like transit and things of that nature. That's the area where Dand has focused its in intent and investment in infrastructure um for growth u for the community. And if you'll see the little green star there that's on the kind of right hand side, um that's the location of this property.

608
02:50:39.359 --> 02:50:55.840
Now the staff report also mentioned that Dand indicated this is a TOD uh corridor. Um we don't see a whole lot of buses going back and forth in Dand at this point in time. But what their 2050 plan tries to to look forward to is if we continue to grow according to how

609
02:50:55.840 --> 02:51:11.840
this plan is laid out, where do we need to preserve those corridors for things like transit and everything else to develop? And so if you see how 44 1792 kind of have that peach color or that pink color in this map, those are those corridors that the city has set aside for the development of some of that

610
02:51:11.840 --> 02:51:26.960
transit and it actually goes out and ties into the to the uh uh Sunrail station um out at the on the west side of town as well. Okay. So, just to to kind of talk about how that plan has been implemented over

611
02:51:26.960 --> 02:51:42.880
the n past number of years, this is actually a slide that I put together a couple of years ago when we were working on the Redstone PUB, the commercial PUD on the corner. Um, but this gives you an idea of the things that have occurred um in this section of the community over the past number of years. You have the

612
02:51:42.880 --> 02:51:59.840
Crestin development out closer to the interstate, Summit Place um town homes over by the Daytona State College campus. Um Lakewood Park, Victoria Reserve, Trinity Gardens. Those are all kind of within the um Martin Luther King Boulevard corridor or and I'll talk

613
02:51:59.840 --> 02:52:15.600
about this in a little bit a little bit more in a second, the emerging Beersford extension corridor. Um, Beersford Extension is actually a road that the county and the city have had on the pl on the books as a planned, you know, kind of primary thoroughare connecting road that provides relief to State Road

614
02:52:15.600 --> 02:52:33.439
44. Um, since 1996, um, we actually were able to move forward and finally complete the connection of the corridor in partnership with the county, partnership with the school board and the city. um about five or six years ago. And I'll talk a little bit about where that's currently sits, but you can kind of see the white star in the center

615
02:52:33.439 --> 02:52:48.319
is the project that's in front of you today. Um and it's within that cluster of areas where the city uh is following its 2050 plan and focusing um that future growth. So here is the the the general overall

616
02:52:48.319 --> 02:53:04.319
layout. Um again, we're around 50 I think it was 57 acres total on the on the site. We've got 147 units. So if you look at it from a ULI density perspective, it comes in somewhere around 70% or so of that maximum density. So we're not proposing to come in and maximize it, but there's a couple

617
02:53:04.319 --> 02:53:19.920
of key features that I wanted to point out with regard to how we approached planning for this site. And you'll see it a little bit more as you go through the process and we look at some of the topo maps and things of that nature. But the key thing here, and it's something we did on the on the Redstone PUD to the

618
02:53:19.920 --> 02:53:36.160
north as well. We've talked a lot over the past number of years not only in in Valuchia County generally but in Dand in this particular part of Dand about flooding and how do we plan to make sure that we're not creating additional issues with regard to flooding. One of the most important things that we've

619
02:53:36.160 --> 02:53:51.600
identified is that if you look at if you see this area here we don't have the same uh power line runs along the eastern side of this property. the portion of the property that is east of that power line easement is a really regionally

620
02:53:51.600 --> 02:54:08.960
significant drainage pathway. Um that water that wetland system goes all the way down uh and connects over to where Victoria Reserve is. It connects to Trinity Gardens. And you'll see a little bit more of this in context in a minute, but it continues to go up to the north. It goes under State Road 44. It goes up

621
02:54:08.960 --> 02:54:24.800
through the chain of lakes with Lake Talmage and Blue Lake and everything else. It comes up to Miller Lake next up next to 1792 ISB. Goes under that, goes along the canal that's on the east side of the airport and connects up ultimately into the Hall Creek system that goes up into Flaggler County and

622
02:54:24.800 --> 02:54:40.640
empties out through Pelicar Creek into the inter coastal. So this water actually from here connects to the Atlantic Ocean. And so the first thing we did was okay, we're going to put that in conservation and we're going to dedicate that portion of the property to the county that that is part of this footprint to the county as a conservation easement so that that can

623
02:54:40.640 --> 02:54:57.120
be maintained. Um, and then we focused on kind of designing the storm water system to tie into that and and clustering the the the proposed development footprint kind of away from that and and we'll go into that in a little bit more detail in the next couple slides. Um, this is one of

624
02:54:57.120 --> 02:55:12.080
the things and and Mr. Costa, you asked the question, are these town homes? We did initially come in and ask you and and propose that this would be, you know, kind of more town homes. What we have found from a marketplace standpoint in the past couple years is that this cottage product, we're actually, you

625
02:55:12.080 --> 02:55:28.800
know, I went back just to my 130 meeting today, if we make it, um, is for the Summit Place uh, town home project, we're actually going in that one and it's 300 town homes is what the land originally approved and we're converting 114 of those to 90 cottages instead because there's just a emerging

626
02:55:28.800 --> 02:55:46.319
preference for this kind of small single family um, style um, you know, housing as well. So, and I thought that the numbers on this were were pretty interesting. So, we've got kind of the standard single family 50- foot lots that are proposed um as a portion of the

627
02:55:46.319 --> 02:56:01.680
overall property, but then we've got these 30-foot cottage lots that are um also being proposed. And I thought the number was great. 85% of which, you know, in similar communities are selling to first-time home buyers. Um so you can see the kind of some of the information

628
02:56:01.680 --> 02:56:18.560
that um was provided by the home builder here with regard to these particular types of units. 85% first-time home buyers um you know 40 affordability um with regard to those housing types 41% of those buyers at or around the median income for this uh community for this

629
02:56:18.560 --> 02:56:35.279
area. So, I thought those were some some important um points to raise. And then I wanted to put it a little bit more into context because, you know, I talk about, you know, kind of the stars on the map. Um but this is Trinity Gardens. This is the proposed Everly Park development as

630
02:56:35.279 --> 02:56:51.040
it connects to and is adjacent to um Trinity Gardens, which is an existing project that is under construction currently in the city of Dand. Um you you may if you've heard um kind of some of the prior discussions about this. This was actually Trinity Gardens was

631
02:56:51.040 --> 02:57:06.640
one of the first projects that really implemented a lot of the LI standards before we had technical LI ordinances either into land or in the county. Um but one of the things that you'll note here if you in your staff report you see we have got a road connection to Voris.

632
02:57:06.640 --> 02:57:23.040
Um we've got an emergency access only onto Siesta. But we've also laid this out so that as these roads to the south develop, we can also tie into that road system. Um there's a community development district that's been formed for the Trinity project. Excuse me, I got something in my eye. Um and

633
02:57:23.040 --> 02:57:37.920
particularly down on the south uh east corner here. Um those roads aren't there and dedicated yet. So we we don't have, you know, the ability to say we have road connections to the south. But I think this illustrates that we've tried to lay things out so that you've got the possibility for that connection. We've

634
02:57:37.920 --> 02:57:53.200
got some ability when we're in Platt to adjust that area on the eastern or I'm sorry on the western edge of our property as well on the project to tie into the road network that's over there to the to the west as well. So, we've got a couple of other potential connection points as long as the timing

635
02:57:53.200 --> 02:58:08.640
of those plats corresponds and as and as long as they don't relocate kind of where their roads are as we move forward and we can kind of make the adjustments to continue to tie those things through. And that's your your PUB development agreement language contemplates those types of adjustments and gives us the

636
02:58:08.640 --> 02:58:24.080
flexibility to work through that as we get into the overall plat. Um from a density standpoint, I also just wanted to point out since the 19 I think it's 80s 90s um the Oaks mobile home community is also over adjacent just to the west. And

637
02:58:24.080 --> 02:58:40.720
so, you know, kind of that that cluster of smaller um you know, cottage lots in that area really kind of ties into what you have over there with the Oaks community as well from a density standpoint. This gives you a little bit more of a zoomed out view. You can see some of the other development that's occurred, but

638
02:58:40.720 --> 02:58:56.560
this also gives you a really good um view of the Beersford Avenue extension. So, when Trinity Gardens first started, I just kind of want to want to point this out. Beersford Avenue did not exist when that project was originally approved. That was one of the key things

639
02:58:56.560 --> 02:59:12.319
that we worked with the city and the county on to you know collaboratively build that roadway. There se I think that whole road has been broken into about four sections. Um two have been built by the county, two have been built by um developers or you know as projects

640
02:59:12.319 --> 02:59:28.640
have moved forward. So on the southern end of Trinity Gardens you can see the roundabout. If you can see that kind of on the far left hand side of the picture, that's Blue Lake. Um, that's where Beersford stopped up until about five years ago. Or actually, I'm sorry. I think Beersford's been open for about

641
02:59:28.640 --> 02:59:44.399
a year now. >> Uh, depends on which Beerford you're talking about. >> The one at the roundabout at Blue Lake. >> Um, I don't know. I take it every day. It's fine. >> Yeah. So, so that connection is is kind of relatively recent, but you've got the roundabout there that comes all the way over and connects to Martin to the MLK

642
02:59:44.399 --> 03:00:00.800
MLK beltway. Now, um the extension um east of MLK has been completed uh over to where the Lakewood Park north south connection is and the corridor for the connection over to Summit um has been dedicated by both the Lakewood Park

643
03:00:00.800 --> 03:00:17.359
property owner um and the Valuch County School Board. Um so you've got that full road corridor now that's in place and dedicated um and has been part of the planning that we've we've collaboratively worked with all the agencies and the land owners on for for a number of years now. that will actually tie Beersford directly into the

644
03:00:17.359 --> 03:00:33.600
light at 44 and Summit and Summit will actually pull back and intersect with Beersford in the future. So Beersford will be the main connection to 44 up in that location. But the significant thing is, you know, when you were really planning growth, well, you have the growth follow where the infrastructure

645
03:00:33.600 --> 03:00:49.120
investment is. And if you've been in this area, you know, kind of over the past number of years, 44 has been reconstructed from Hill to I4 um over the past three years. Um we've had uh the Beersford connection uh almost completely done. Uh that's you

646
03:00:49.120 --> 03:01:03.920
know I think the last piece has been fully engineered and designed. Um and I believe they were accepting bids um recently on that and opening that up to start construction. Um the city of Dand is installing utilities along that 44 corridor. Those are going to serve not

647
03:01:03.920 --> 03:01:20.560
only this project but also the um the commercial uh corner that's been approved at 44 and Kepler as well with that Redstone PUD project. So, this is kind of continuing that theme of focusing the building and development within the area we're planning for it, uh, and within the area that we've

648
03:01:20.560 --> 03:01:36.720
invested our infrastructure dollars in. So, I mentioned, you know, kind of early on, um, storm water we know is one of those very important things, but I thought this was a great map in your in your staff report because if you look at our layout with the majority of that development occurring on the southern

649
03:01:36.720 --> 03:01:53.279
portion of the property, it's the high contour portion of the property. So this shows kind of the general LAR um you know elevation lines and you can see that kind of drop off as you get up closer to 44 and that that drop off is more significant over to the eastern side of the property where you've got

650
03:01:53.279 --> 03:02:09.359
the power line easement in the area going into conservation to preserve that regional uh drainage um kind of feature there. But we went a little bit further. Um this we kind of put together just to give you some ideas on that. those big ponds always I think you know since we've had those flooding concerns

651
03:02:09.359 --> 03:02:24.960
have you know tend to give people pause. So one of the things that I think this map is particularly good at showing if you look at where that elevation 70 is um the design and again these are preliminary designs because we're not fully into construction uh designs yet

652
03:02:24.960 --> 03:02:40.880
but that 70 foot contour which is the existing contour line goes all the way up to 44 you all the way up to Voris along where the majority of our neighboring property owners are. Uh and that's the top of bank for the pond design. Um if you look at the the other

653
03:02:40.880 --> 03:02:58.640
notes there, the normal water elevation within the pond would be 66 uh feet, which is below that elevation on the property to our north. And you see that there's a little bit of a fall from 70 to 65 as you move to the to the um east there. The outfall for the pond is

654
03:02:58.640 --> 03:03:15.120
designed to come out off that eastern side, go into an existing wetland system that's being preserved and then flow into that regional, you know, kind of north south um flowway for storm water. So, we tried to look at that from the very beginning to make sure that it was

655
03:03:15.120 --> 03:03:30.880
being designed, you know, appropriately and correctly. Um the other thing I'll just mention, traffic, we always, you know, kind of hear um concerns about in particular because of how our intersections are here. We've got, you know, 44 and Voris come together with a merge lane. Um, that ties into where our

656
03:03:30.880 --> 03:03:46.000
two driveways are. So, there was a lot of discussion between the county and DOT and our and our clients with regard to that overall, you know, how that was going to work. Um, so we went a step beyond what you typically are required to do at this point in time and providing kind of the zoning level of

657
03:03:46.000 --> 03:04:00.800
TIA analysis. We actually have done a full operational analysis that also not not only identifies that we can function within existing parameters and what our prop share liability would would be which if I remember correctly it's somewhere in the $850,000

658
03:04:00.800 --> 03:04:18.479
range once that you know is is finally reviewed and approved and signed by the county but your staff has gone through and reviewed all that data and analysis in in partnership with DOT and has approved that TIA as meeting the the TPO guidelines. So, um, I said a lot. Um,

659
03:04:18.479 --> 03:04:32.800
I'll stop there. I I will say, um, and Miss Bush, this is part, uh, just an opportunity I wanted to point out here because, um, Mike Woods, one of my partners, and I have done a lot of coordinating with some of the projects that have occurred along this corridor.

660
03:04:32.800 --> 03:04:48.960
and Trinity um picked up some of the planning that the city and the county were doing for pedestrian uh networks as well and is bringing the multi-use trail along Beersford out to MLK and then the county and the city have the um

661
03:04:48.960 --> 03:05:04.160
what's the lake what's the uh new preserve property south of Lakewood Park. There's 126 acres that the county and the city have purchased for conservation and we're tying all these trail systems together to get from beer from the downtown park uh Earl Brown

662
03:05:04.160 --> 03:05:22.000
Park all the way out to I want to say it's Miller Lake but it's not right. >> Yeah, I think it's the other Miller Lake uh Lake Moore. So, it ties into the Lake Moore preserve. Um I think there's an opportunity here. Um, and this is something where the county and the city

663
03:05:22.000 --> 03:05:38.560
may be able to work together on this because it's easier a lot of times to work with utilities if you're a government. But if you'll note from that trail system that's in Trinity uh gardens, you've got a utility uh connection, a utility corridor that goes all the way up to 44, which is going to be where the commercial area is under

664
03:05:38.560 --> 03:05:54.720
the Redstone PUB. And so I think there's also an opportunity to kind of tie the pedestrian corridor together throughout this whole area as we're kind of wrapping up the planning. So, um, with that, I'll stop. I know there's some folks that have some questions here as well. Um, and I know you may have some questions. We have our whole engineering

665
03:05:54.720 --> 03:06:16.640
team and our traffic team back here. If you've got any questions that I I can bring them up for. Uh, and again, just just to reiterate, um, we know that there were some specific questions that came up in some of the emails that staff shared with us and have set that follow-up meeting to talk to them about that. >> Does this have a uh reclamation pond on

666
03:06:16.640 --> 03:06:34.640
it? Reclamation pond. I see your storm water. Does it have a reclamation? >> I'm going to bring Chris Warshaw up from ETM. He's our project engineer and is much more qualified to answer that question. >> Name and address.

667
03:06:34.640 --> 03:06:51.520
>> Chris War Chris Warshaw with England Tims of Miller, 1411 Edgewater Drive, Orlando, Florida 32804. Um the pond that we have shown on there, uh could you just Just repeat your question. Make sure I hear it. Correct. >> The reclamation pond for reclaimed

668
03:06:51.520 --> 03:07:07.520
water. >> Um, right now that pond is not designed to accept reclaimed water. Uh, certainly reclaimed water would be used for irrigation purposes, but we would not be dumping reclaimed water into that pond. It is strictly a storm water pond. >> Okay. So, you you don't have a um

669
03:07:07.520 --> 03:07:23.279
consumption permit from the city of the land yet on this. um there would be no need for any sort of consumption use permit because we would not be extracting any water out of the aquifer for our use. So >> you'd be getting it from the city of the land though would you not?

670
03:07:23.279 --> 03:07:38.960
>> We'll be getting utilities from the city demand city. So when you >> and they request if I'm understanding correctly the term consumptive references in normally a consumptive use permit which is extracting water from the aquifer >> consumption permit from the city of the land. We as part of our engineering

671
03:07:38.960 --> 03:07:56.479
permit process, we will be getting our permits and our usage permits from the city of the land for utilities >> because some of the consumption permits as you know Mark require them to take back a certain amount of reclaimed water during high rain events. My question is

672
03:07:56.479 --> 03:08:13.279
where is the reclaimed water going during high rain events if it's not coming back to this site? So, generally, um, when I think there's multiple things here, so I'm going to try and answer it as succinctly as possible. A utility has

673
03:08:13.279 --> 03:08:29.040
to worry about where the reclaim is going when they pull their consumptive use permits as part of their ability to manage and operate a utility. >> Correct. Um, part of that, how do they manage the reclaim is by making sure that new development when it comes

674
03:08:29.040 --> 03:08:46.319
online has a spot to put that reclaim water. So, that'd be the irrigation usage that we would use for >> Exactly. Um there's a it it's very complicated and it's very highly regulated to just take that water that

675
03:08:46.319 --> 03:09:02.080
reclaim water and to dump it into a pond especially as it goes into a storm water pond because it's no longer considered reclaim at that point. It's now considered water and it's considered a discharge. So that's a that's a normal process that a utility would go through when they're managing that system. But

676
03:09:02.080 --> 03:09:18.479
for a residential subdivision such as this, um, we would generate the waste. It gets taken to the wastewater treatment plant. It comes back to us in the form of reclaim water that's put out in the in the land as irrigation. >> If the city has additional storage needs

677
03:09:18.479 --> 03:09:35.120
um, for excess reclaim that they may have, then that would be dealt with something that they would normally deal with from kind of their overall plant setup and and operations. They may reach out to different land owners and say, "Hey, you have a large pond. Can we dump our reclaim in there? That's a completely different permitting process that is outside of what we would

678
03:09:35.120 --> 03:09:50.960
normally do on a residential subdivision. >> Well, and if I can can just add to that, I think part of the difficulty in fully answering that question yet is we haven't designed the full site yet. So, the the the full design of utility connections and how those are going to function.

679
03:09:50.960 --> 03:10:07.200
Everything else would typically be handled through that preliminary plat and construction uh plan process which is the next step after we decide what are we what are we planning for based on the zoning. >> Yeah. I've always said that part of the flooding problems that we've occurred

680
03:10:07.200 --> 03:10:22.399
has been being that the water being brought up from the development has to go back somewhere. >> So they bring it into the area back in some areas more than what they're actually producing. I mean actually taken out from the utility. The utility

681
03:10:22.399 --> 03:10:37.200
is a requirement to take more back, >> right? >> So what we end up having is I've always contend that we'd have a create a false water table. >> Sure. Because you're creating that bubble or that lens because you're recharging. >> So my question is, and I didn't see a

682
03:10:37.200 --> 03:10:53.920
reclaim pond on here. >> Is there going to be one? Number one. And is if not, where is that reclaim going? And I know you can't answer that because that's utility, >> right? >> And so until the utilities get this under control

683
03:10:53.920 --> 03:11:17.520
uh because you can't do any open water distribution anymore. >> You've got to you've got to use it as reclaim. A lot of their develing it. Okay. Right. And um my question to you is if this doesn't have a reclaim or

684
03:11:17.520 --> 03:11:33.279
do do you know if it does, is it going to have one? >> So if reclaimed is in the area, we're required legally to to connect to it. Um so you know both by by Florida law by you know the and by the city's regulations we would be required to extend reclaimed onto the site um just

685
03:11:33.279 --> 03:11:49.359
based on on their existing regulations for irrigation purposes. And I don't know if you've gotten into that level of detail. storage more than bringing it back. >> Storage, we have not had any conversation with the city of Dand about whether there would be storage on site, but you know, I certainly um understand the concern that you're addressing.

686
03:11:49.359 --> 03:12:05.200
>> Well, because to the south of this location here, we've had issues with the flooding and bringing it on. A matter of fact, they've addressed it >> trying to take some out of some a lot of it eventually will go end up in Lake Moore. >> Yeah. And so

687
03:12:05.200 --> 03:12:22.240
my question is I just don't want to add to that problem >> agreed >> that we're trying to resolve. >> And I think what what we're seeing, Mr. Chairman, is that as there's been a development of understanding of what has created some of the problems down to the south that the jurisdictions are working

688
03:12:22.240 --> 03:12:39.600
actively to avoid recreating those same problems. So, for example, where you had a lot of those ponds down in Victoria Park where you had reclaimed that was put back into the storm water ponds that, you know, led to some of the, you know, the complications some some of the reductions in storage volume, some of that artificial water table issue that

689
03:12:39.600 --> 03:12:56.640
has been something that they've been moving away from since that issue has been raised. >> Right. I just don't want to add to the >> but I but I think that is certainly something that we can note moving forward that we need to keep in mind as we're working with the city and the county on the design of the utility systems. Yeah, because this as you said

690
03:12:56.640 --> 03:13:13.439
and previously they were always said that the what and I've always contended this is that right there there's an under drain right there >> on Boris and 44 and it goes through that chain of lakes >> if we disrupt that >> right >> then everything backs up

691
03:13:13.439 --> 03:13:27.920
>> correct >> it's got to get out of here somewhere >> yeah and and that's why I think what you've seen both the county staff request and and us work with them on you know representing private property owners ers is preservation of that corridor. You can trace that that slew

692
03:13:27.920 --> 03:13:44.160
that runs along the east, you know, kind of off the top of the east side of the Dand Ridge down really kind of down the east side of this property because that's where a lot of that contour drops down to 44. >> It is. >> So that's the area of the property that we control that is going into conservation. And if you look at the um

693
03:13:44.160 --> 03:13:58.479
Trinity Gardens plan to the south, >> we also worked with them to take on that same approach with Trinity Gardens. So that instead of having any disruption there, we've tried to focus on maintaining that corridor so all of that water continues to flow north into the chain of lakes.

694
03:13:58.479 --> 03:14:15.760
>> And I will say that this property here is has been a filled area. At one time it was the uplands for that wetlands right there. >> That that that property has been filled in right there where the Vors and 44

695
03:14:15.760 --> 03:14:31.040
connection is made. There's there's a lot of area, you know, that whole 44 corridor coming across that um that marshy area um right there um kind of as you come off the hill from from Kepler from the roundabout. If you're coming down, it goes down. You can see where all that all that that kind of historic

696
03:14:31.040 --> 03:14:46.720
marsh area was >> that was really disrupted when 44 was constructed and kind of created a little bit of a a dam through that area. What you have is most of that's been pushed over to the east and that's the area we're trying to make sure we don't repeat that issue again. We're trying to make sure that area stays in

697
03:14:46.720 --> 03:15:03.359
conservation for the benefit of kind of the whole regional drainage. >> Okay. >> Interest. >> All right. And the other question I had, uh, you said 70% of coverage. Is that what's the actual formula for density on this?

698
03:15:03.359 --> 03:15:19.920
>> So density under ULI, you're a maximum of, um, it's four units an acre is the maximum permitted density. We're just under three units an acre with the density that's been proposed >> with the density. Okay, that's what I wanted to ask. Okay, >> so we're just under three units. I think

699
03:15:19.920 --> 03:15:34.960
it was like 2.86 or 2.89 when I ran the numbers and I think we all agreed in our staff report as well. >> Okay, three units per acre usually can handle the water that would come out of that on

700
03:15:34.960 --> 03:15:51.520
a residential side. I just don't want you to end up having to take more water back than what >> Sure. >> you're producing. >> Yeah. Understood. >> And I also don't want you to put your water somewhere else where it causes a problem. >> Yeah. Understood. >> That's basically where I'm at with this. >> Yeah.

701
03:15:51.520 --> 03:16:06.880
>> And I think once we address those issues, we'll probably resolve a lot of our flooding issues. >> Agree. And you know, I think that's one of the things it's certainly hard to look back at what has occurred and say, you know, >> be confident in how we're fixing it now.

702
03:16:06.880 --> 03:16:23.520
We've learned uh and I think staff has done a good job of quantifying un understanding where the flow is and how to try and work through it. And that's what you see a lot of these projects coming forward now reflect that >> because a lot of the storm you know people they put a big influence on storm

703
03:16:23.520 --> 03:16:39.120
water >> but it's also your reclaim water. Water is water no matter if it comes from the sky or if they're bringing it back on irrigation or whatever. So anyway, I just want to make sure we address those issues. >> Yes, sir. >> So we don't cause more of a problem.

704
03:16:39.120 --> 03:16:53.359
That's all. >> Okay. >> How are you have you decided what you're going to do at that force and 44 intersection there? Because that does during peak periods or before the roundabout went in, you did have a

705
03:16:53.359 --> 03:17:09.120
backup right there all the way to that curve. So with regard to where the connection is to Voris currently, >> yeah, where the connection with Voris and 44 come together. >> So yes, we've we've had that fully reviewed, not only from a zoning standpoint, but again, the operational

706
03:17:09.120 --> 03:17:25.840
review. Um, Charlotte Davidson with TMC is here and she can talk about that in specific detail if you'd like. Um, one of the things I will say we have modeled it based on that being the only connection with the emergency access point, but we've also planned for the connection to those other future roads

707
03:17:25.840 --> 03:17:42.239
that don't currently exist. So the idea here is that while that's the only connection that we can plan for now because those other roads don't exist, the ultimate intent is you really kind of create a little bit more of a grid network where you've got options to go to ultimafares

708
03:17:42.239 --> 03:17:58.479
from within the development. So you can go to the south and get to Beersford. You can go to the north and get on to 44. So and that takes some pressure, >> but you've definitely took in consideration of the >> Yes, sir. >> the proposed developments that haven't been fully developed out yet. >> We're required to to include any

709
03:17:58.479 --> 03:18:14.960
development that's been uh that's been approved is in the vested background uh in our traffic modeling. So we have to include those trips as though they exist now. >> Got it. >> And that that that would include also the commercial development that's that's been approved at the corner. So, we want to start stacking them up and then they all right at the same time,

710
03:18:14.960 --> 03:18:30.720
>> right? No, we have to we have to factor all of that in under the TPO guidelines to the TIA. >> Okay. >> All right. Any other questions for the applicant? Miss Bush. >> Thank you. Thank you, chairman. Good afternoon. I can say that now officially. >> Good afternoon.

711
03:18:30.720 --> 03:18:47.920
>> It's 19 minutes past. Okay. Um, so I'm gonna leave my comments for later. Um my question is the preservation area considered a part of your common open space or is it just the common open space that's considered the common open space? >> We have to have the way that common open

712
03:18:47.920 --> 03:19:03.680
space and I don't think our our planners >> I can help with that. >> I'm going to give it to Chris. >> Uh the short answer to your question is no. It is not included in our common open space. That is preservation. Common open space is within the residential

713
03:19:03.680 --> 03:19:20.399
port within the residential portion of the neighborhood. >> Okay, great. Thank you. >> And under the county's regulations, common open space has to have passive or active recreational facilities as well. So, it can't just be a green space. It has to be accessible, if you will. >> Understood. Y

714
03:19:20.399 --> 03:19:36.720
>> um cool. Uh my next question, and then I'll save some of my comments for later. Um, is does the trail show me show me where the trail goes because I really struggled to figure out where the amenities are of this project. Um, I

715
03:19:36.720 --> 03:19:52.640
really was I was trying really hard to figure out >> where some of those amenities exist and how the access of the different residents and kind of your different sections of your plan. Certainly, how would they access this? >> Um, >> these amenities that you might have.

716
03:19:52.640 --> 03:20:08.000
>> Uh, for right now, the plan is just shows green spaces. we've identified some potential amenities we're going to have. So within the green spaces we're going to have that will be the amenities will be placed in that'll come through as Pet go through the final more detailed final engineering. >> Okay. >> So there's not a lot shown on the plan

717
03:20:08.000 --> 03:20:22.720
now but to your question about the trail um specifically uh >> Stephen I don't know when we made the first application on this but it's been probably a couple years um two years ago. And one of the key things that

718
03:20:22.720 --> 03:20:40.840
staff forced us to do was that we had to get an agreement from the power company to put the trail in there before they would allow this to move forward. So where's our trail? The trail is is is as cleanly as possible. And I'm going to step away from the microphone here. Someone's going to >> point

719
03:21:03.040 --> 03:21:19.680
that green space as we come in with more detailed plans. Okay, thank you. It's all my questions for now. >> And I think that's that's one of the other reasons why I thought there's an opportunity here to kind of maybe complete that and take it down to Beersford through Trinity at some point

720
03:21:19.680 --> 03:21:34.960
in time. Um because I think that's a connection that makes sense. Um and expands that that pedestrian network. >> Um last question real quick. Does that trail system intend to connect to the southern development? And I apologize you named it, but I >> Trinity. They don't have it in theirs

721
03:21:34.960 --> 03:21:50.640
yet, so we haven't planned it to the south yet. >> Okay. Is that something that could be feasible? >> I think as long as we have the appropriate agreements in place with the with the power company, you know, to to cover that extent. >> Understood. And who is the P? Is it FPL? >> Duke here. >> Okay. >> Yeah.

722
03:21:50.640 --> 03:22:09.040
>> Okay. >> Okay. >> Miss Craig. Um I'm I'm a little concerned about intensity um and the impact, but one of the things that jumped out at me along that line

723
03:22:09.040 --> 03:22:25.840
had to do with the school systems. >> Now you you brought up some new information which is very interesting that 85% of the homeowners are expected to be firsttime homeowners. >> Correct. I would assume that to be young families with children.

724
03:22:25.840 --> 03:22:44.080
And yet in here it talks about um page seven uh only 29 additional students. And I'm wondering how you came up with that number in light of 147 single

725
03:22:44.080 --> 03:23:01.040
family units with 85% of them being firsttime home buyers. So, so we don't come up with those numbers. Um, what we're required to do, and we're required to do it two times as we work through the development process. So, this is the first time. Uh, what we're required to

726
03:23:01.040 --> 03:23:18.720
do is tell the school district and apply to the school district um for the letter that you see in in the staff report. um we tell them this is the mix of types of housing that we're proposing and the number and they do the calculation for what they expect the student population

727
03:23:18.720 --> 03:23:35.279
to be based on the the number of housing units that are created. So those are the school districts numbers that are created. Um and then they tell us whether or not they have capacity based on that anticipated number of students. Um so this is the first time we check in

728
03:23:35.279 --> 03:23:52.000
with them. the first time that we we ask that question, we're required to ask that question again before you can actually construct anything. So the the letter that is in the the staff report now is what's required at the zoning stage.

729
03:23:52.000 --> 03:24:07.120
When you get to the preliminary plat stage, we have to go back to the school district and ask them for a a a capacity certificate that actually vests the number of school students, you know, desks that we're we're going to generate

730
03:24:07.120 --> 03:24:22.800
for the project. And if they don't have capacity at that time, then they tell us we don't have capacity. We can't get that certificate. So, we can't get an approved plat to build the project at that point in time until we come up with a mitigation agreement with the school

731
03:24:22.800 --> 03:24:39.520
district for the, you know, for that deficiency. Um, that can be, you know, prepayment of impact fees. It can be a lot of different things. It can be dedication of land, you know, um, things of that nature. So, we don't create those numbers. We don't calculate the numbers that are there. Those are calculated by the school district based

732
03:24:39.520 --> 03:24:56.239
on the number of proposed houses that are in the plan. Um the other thing that I'll note is that Valuchia County Schools has actually been experiencing a decline uh more recently in recent years um in their student population. And so there's been a trend but of some

733
03:24:56.239 --> 03:25:13.520
declining enrollment. So um in general from a capacity standpoint, they're in charge of telling us whether we have capacity to serve this and they've confirmed at this point yes. And then, you know, um, as we continue through the process, we have to keep checking in to make sure that remains true.

734
03:25:13.520 --> 03:25:29.439
>> Has that decline in school, um, the student bodies been consistent on the west side of the county or is that or is it >> I'm sorry, Miss Craig, can you get a little closer to the mic, please? Is the

735
03:25:29.439 --> 03:25:45.439
um the decline in student population lower in the west part of the county as well as the east part or is it primarily the east part that's declining? >> I I don't know. I think there is likely some variability depending on which part of the county that you're in. Um so I

736
03:25:45.439 --> 03:26:01.359
can't answer that directly. Um the school district, you know, would have to answer that question when we go back to them. What the district tells says typically in response to it is if they have capacity they may change boundaries dep you know for attendance and everything else to match up with where

737
03:26:01.359 --> 03:26:18.239
their capacity is. So um you know to account for whether the um the capacity is you know in southwest Valuchia versus central west versus northwest they may shift their attendance boundaries for where the students go to school um based

738
03:26:18.239 --> 03:26:34.720
on on some of those factors. So, um, but I, you know, that that's really information that we have to coordinate with the school district and have them answer when we get to that point. So, yes, ma'am. >> And you guys have touched a little bit on elevation on the east side of this property, but on the west side where the

739
03:26:34.720 --> 03:26:51.359
Siesta Drive is, uh, what are we looking at for elevation comparable to the adjacent property owner? >> Yeah. So, uh, sometimes I create a map and I think it's going to look great and then it shows up on a [clears throat] on a on a screen like this and it's just

740
03:26:51.359 --> 03:27:07.920
not as clear. Um the topography from the the entire kind of middle of the site going north and east kind of generally falls >> from the south and the west to the north and the east. So if you were to say

741
03:27:07.920 --> 03:27:23.680
historically the discussion we had about you know this being more of historical kind of a slew in a wetland system it was all falling >> that way >> towards that that area. the the intent that we've gotten, it's why we've designed kind of larger green spaces behind these lots is such that we can

742
03:27:23.680 --> 03:27:39.760
collect that water behind our lots, behind those other houses and make sure that we can route that around to our pond as needed. Um, as Mark had mentioned earlier, we've got the ability where our pond is is actually the lowest part of our property. Um, and so

743
03:27:39.760 --> 03:27:56.479
therefore, we can hold our pond lower than those houses that are out there. And so as long as we can route that around, we will we will essentially cut that flow from going into the back of those people's houses and route it to our pond, collect, treat, manage it, and then discharge it out.

744
03:27:56.479 --> 03:28:12.479
What I'm looking at more so than that is the fact that you've got an adjacent development with the roof lines of the adjacent property owners at ground level >> and there's been a lot of discussion on

745
03:28:12.479 --> 03:28:28.960
that as far as you know and the flow you're talking about all goes that way. It goes from them too and are we blocking that off with the elevation of your development? That's my question. >> Um, as we move through the preliminary

746
03:28:28.960 --> 03:28:44.239
plat process, we will be working handinhand with the county engineer, with the St. John's River Water Management District, with FEMA, and all three of those regulatory agencies will force us to show that we have compliance, that we are not increasing

747
03:28:44.239 --> 03:29:00.560
any runoff to an adjacent property owner. Um, and so from from that perspective, that's that's our test. That's our that's how we will be graded throughout that engineering process and then also through the construction. The site does have you know our the the west

748
03:29:00.560 --> 03:29:18.319
is higher than the east and so that naturally will continue to fall. Um, as I mentioned, that's why we've actually given ourselves the extra room to know that we will have to work with that. And so, we've got a we've we've we could we've got the ability to collect as all that water coming off of our generated

749
03:29:18.319 --> 03:29:34.560
um, sorry, off our roads, our households, collect it, route it around, take it to our pond, manage it, treat it before it ultimately discharges. as opposed to kind of just letting it just just, you know, we're not going to have in this situation as we're sitting up on a hill and everyone's looking up at the hill and the water's coming down the

750
03:29:34.560 --> 03:29:49.760
hill. We will have the ability to collect it and and um and make sure that it's managed and treated in the proper way. >> I understand that. But what I'm saying is you're to the adjacent property owner to the ones to the west and the ones to the south.

751
03:29:49.760 --> 03:30:07.520
>> The elevation where this project meets their property or roadway. Is it going to be substantially higher? Because we have seen that some that have been 3 to four foot higher in elevation. This adjacent property owner is lower because

752
03:30:07.520 --> 03:30:24.399
it it puts them down here. And the and then the um >> yeah I I understand your question now. The um the adjacent properties are certainly higher than us as they are right now to the west and to the south. >> That was my question. >> And so that we will have to make sure we manage their storm water as it enters

753
03:30:24.399 --> 03:30:39.680
our site so that we don't just cut it off. >> That's um and so that'll be again there's there's got the buffers back there. We'll work through that. We'll have make sure that we've collect manage it as needed so we don't flood out our property um and also block their property from being able to continue

754
03:30:39.680 --> 03:30:56.080
their historical drainage patterns >> because this is some of the concerns of the adjacent property owners. They're going to speak and I'll give you a chance for rebuttal after the fact. But >> certainly appreciate your time. Thank you. >> All right, we do have um some public

755
03:30:56.080 --> 03:31:21.040
participation forms. We'll start out with Alicia Hansen. Good afternoon. I get your name and address for the record, please. >> My name is Alicia Hansen. I live at 102 Siesta Court in Dand,

756
03:31:21.040 --> 03:31:37.920
uh, which is right smack in the middle of the new, uh, proposed development. Um, basically I I did not have a going in front of the Valuchia County uh council

757
03:31:37.920 --> 03:31:55.200
meeting on my 2026 bingo card. So, here I am. Um, I just want to say first that I'm not anti-development. Um, I work in this industry. Usually, I'm um on the other end asking for signage variances and things along that

758
03:31:55.200 --> 03:32:12.160
lines. So, um that's where I play typically. Um my uh concern with this is basically that, um I live at what I would call the low spot that you were just referring to. My

759
03:32:12.160 --> 03:32:30.160
house is at the corner of Siesta and um Valuchia. And so I am that low spot. There is a drain right next to my property during uh storms and heavy rain that has filled and my front yard and

760
03:32:30.160 --> 03:32:46.080
house has uh gotten tons of water. So, um, my concern is that with the new redstone property across the road, um, and this property, um, I know on the the

761
03:32:46.080 --> 03:33:04.880
maps, um, you know, they're saying that when I look up the hill, what I see is a hill with a whole lot of houses coming. Um, and I feel that our house is endangered um, from all the drainage.

762
03:33:04.880 --> 03:33:23.120
Um, and I'm not asking for necessarily uh, the property to not be developed or any of that. Um, I understand those things need to happen. Um, what I'm asking for is that you take into consideration

763
03:33:23.120 --> 03:33:40.319
that we live there already and we are residents and that we do not want to be flooded out. And um I just learned from Emily uh today that uh states routes uh

764
03:33:40.319 --> 03:33:57.520
you know that that would be an entrance that would be created um on a state highway and um there would be all those 147 residences exiting uh and entering right there um onto a really bad

765
03:33:57.520 --> 03:34:13.600
intersection that already exists. Um, I've had uh multiple accidents uh in my front yard and been the 911 call um for those people. And honestly, I'm probably going to be like the other guy asking

766
03:34:13.600 --> 03:34:27.439
for a concrete wall in front of me to slow those cars down because I'm afraid I will get one in my front yard. Um to be honest. Um, so, um, I would just say,

767
03:34:27.439 --> 03:34:45.600
um, I think that if you can consider doing as much as possible to help us save um, our house, I would consider um, you know, I I love the ideas of reclaimed water. I love the ideas of

768
03:34:45.600 --> 03:35:03.560
thinking bigger and really how can we recycle water? How can we keep it? Okay, >> I've am I up? All right, I'll stop. [laughter] >> Okay, >> we try to address those issues if you heard my go. Mr. >> Costa Quest, >> Miss Hansen,

769
03:35:04.160 --> 03:35:20.479
>> you said you live off of Siesta Court, right? >> Correct. >> Which is right in the middle of this subdivision here. Uh, have you pl have you flooded in the past the last two times? >> Not inside my house, but to my door. >> To your door. prior to this development even going in. It was already flooding

770
03:35:20.479 --> 03:35:46.560
on your property. Correct. Okay. >> All right. That was all the questions. Thank you. >> We Chris and Pekquette. >> Could I have your name and address for the record, please? >> Yes. My name is Kristen Pocket and 105 Siesta Court was my childhood home. I'm

771
03:35:46.560 --> 03:36:01.600
here on behalf of my mother as well, but I currently live in Deltona. >> Talking to the mic a little closer. >> Sorry. >> Okay. >> Uh I'm representing from 105 Ciesta Court, Deland, Florida 32724. >> Okay. You had a comment you'd like to make?

772
03:36:01.600 --> 03:36:16.160
>> Um yes, I had something prepared. Go ahead. Um so my name is Kristen. Uh I want to say thank you for allowing us the time to voice our concerns um not only about our community, but also our neighborhood. The land is my home, my community, and my favorite place on this

773
03:36:16.160 --> 03:36:31.760
planet. Where I grew up, I went to school, participated in community events like parades and celebrations all throughout the land of my 25 years of existence so far. I did all of this and more whilst living in my home on Siesta Court. I'm well

774
03:36:31.760 --> 03:36:48.479
aware that things change over time and that changes are inevitable and they're going to happen regardless if we want them to or not. However, when change happens that jeopardizes everything that my community stands for, that's when it becomes an issue for me. I was a firm believer that the land was the best city

775
03:36:48.479 --> 03:37:05.920
in this county, if not this country. But now, as I've grown and witnessed all the changes that have happened within the past six years alone, I worry that we're losing everything that makes the land great. Within the past six years, numerous planned developments have happened in the land and are still currently in development.

776
03:37:05.920 --> 03:37:21.840
This gorgeous small town is being turned into a giant suburb and it has come to the point to where our town's integrity is now in jeopardy. The structural the structural integrity of the land not just around Siesta Court but the town overall. Not only do I worry about the

777
03:37:21.840 --> 03:37:36.239
issues of flooding near my childhood home because of this proposed development but also because of the impact the development will have on the already overflood overflooded schools. I myself am currently a teacher and right now classrooms are reaching over 30

778
03:37:36.239 --> 03:37:52.960
students per classroom per class period. Never been in a classroom before. It's a lot to handle, but teachers are already under pressure as is, and continuing to add to the population is only going to make the current crisis of the lack of teachers in classrooms worse.

779
03:37:52.960 --> 03:38:08.640
Also, the natural flora and fauna in this area are going to be severely impacted. There are deer, turkey, and other varieties of other wildlife in the area where the development is planned for. And I was fortunate enough to grow up around it. And it breaks my heart to see all of that disappear because of an

780
03:38:08.640 --> 03:38:24.080
organization's desire to build more suburbs and plan unit developments that already plague the area. If we are able to provide something beneficial to our town, it's not going to be from yet another suburb. As I have mentioned previously, I'm aware that changes

781
03:38:24.080 --> 03:38:40.160
happen, but why not make something that's different or even beneficial for everybody, not just the humans, but also the natural wildlife. I hope my words haven't fallen on deaf ears because if there's one thing I don't want to change, it's the beauty and integrity of this great town. Thank you.

782
03:38:40.160 --> 03:39:06.399
>> Thank you. We have a Paul Newell Good afternoon, sir. Can I get your name and address for the record? >> Yes. Uh, hello. My name is Paul Newell, 105 Siesta Court, D, the land 32724.

783
03:39:06.399 --> 03:39:24.399
Uh my main concern being on my main concern being on Siesta Court is it backs up right to the new preserved territory that uh Chairman Mills acknowledged was filled in now

784
03:39:24.399 --> 03:39:41.920
because it was raised and I don't know where the water's going to go. My backyard is right there. And now we're not going to have a lot of that land that was already soaking up. Most of the

785
03:39:41.920 --> 03:39:57.279
water and runoff will now be paved over. So, I'm concerned mostly about my backyard being underwater and going

786
03:39:57.279 --> 03:40:24.960
into my house. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. I don't know the first name here. Uh Sterns. Is it Miss Sterns? >> Good morning. Could I get your name? Good afternoon. Could I get for the

787
03:40:24.960 --> 03:40:40.960
record? >> Hi, Lisa Sterns. How are you? I live at a 111 Siesta Court. Moved there in 1972 when that was just three houses down that road. Beautiful Orange Grove. I wish we had a voice in this. Our

788
03:40:40.960 --> 03:40:57.359
neighbors. I know we don't. And we know that the subdivision's coming in. We've known that for a very long time. I live exactly where that storm water pond is coming in. It's taken all of my

789
03:40:57.359 --> 03:41:13.120
property. I look at the pasture. So, that storm water pond is going to go the length of my literally my property and to the east. So, it's going to literally

790
03:41:13.120 --> 03:41:31.200
the south and the east, my whole property. And am I concerned about the flooding? asked because I was at the meetings about melting and so we don't need a pond to have flooding, but yet

791
03:41:31.200 --> 03:41:48.479
what's that pond going to do in front of my house? Although I'd rather look at that than homes. It's still the fact that he's saying that we're higher. Well, yeah, we're high now, but when you build these subdivisions,

792
03:41:48.479 --> 03:42:04.880
Crestwin, Trinity Gardens, you know, I mean, we're being impacted. So, I don't see the deer anymore, and I don't see the bears. I don't even see turkeys anymore. I don't see any wildlife because of how little the land

793
03:42:04.880 --> 03:42:22.080
can't contain. And I don't understand why there isn't one subdivision built at a time to see how it's going to impact the land. We have Trinity Gardens that's not even built fully. And now we're going to

794
03:42:22.080 --> 03:42:39.439
have this. And then I'm thinking, well, is Little Siesta Court going to become public domain? Are they going to say we want to put a park in there? I mean, what's going to happen to our little, you know, my mom's sitting over there? She moved there when she was 26 years

795
03:42:39.439 --> 03:42:57.760
old. 26. And that property is just, it's little. You know, if you go on my property, you'll see it's such a pretty little two acres. But now with the wetlands behind us, uh, north right there, right literally behind me, that's

796
03:42:57.760 --> 03:43:15.279
wetland. Those trees were removed many years ago. Then it was filled in and then it was cows were on it. That's all wetland. And yet there's a proposed commercial one acre commercial. This is just a proposal. We have no idea what

797
03:43:15.279 --> 03:43:38.800
it's really going to look like when it's all done. So I wonder what's going to be behind me being wetland on the side of me. And even if you look at my property, >> ma'am, that's time.

798
03:43:38.800 --> 03:43:54.319
>> All of that is wetland. So with and then my property is told that I'm wetland in some parts of my property. So then we're having across New York probably have a Publix, maybe a car wash, nail salon,

799
03:43:54.319 --> 03:44:09.680
whatever's going on in there and we're going to be impacted. It's happening. So what are you going to do for us? That's >> I get my time's gone, but what are you going to do for us when my house could

800
03:44:09.680 --> 03:44:26.160
be potentially flooded? And flood insurance is not the answer. That's not the answer. We've never flooded. We never flooded with Milton. We've never had to have uh flood insurance. So, what's what are you going to do for the people? >> Okay. >> I mean,

801
03:44:26.160 --> 03:44:40.239
>> thank you for your comments. I understand what you're coming from. >> Yes. >> And that's the safeguards that we're trying to get for you. But I feel this way that I'll be I'll be at a meeting crying like

802
03:44:40.239 --> 03:44:58.479
elderly people because of Milton saying I have to leave my home because I'm not going to be able to resell it because you have to be honest and disclose. I can't sell my property and I'm right here. I'm the one that's going to be very impacted with this six acre pond in

803
03:44:58.479 --> 03:45:14.720
front of me. >> Okay. And you know what? The natural flow is to go to my house. >> I hate to cut you off, but your time is up. >> The natural flow is to go to my house. It's not going to go towards the subdivisions. They're being built up. So, that is going to go towards my house

804
03:45:14.720 --> 03:45:30.399
and all of these people. So, thank you for your time. >> Thank you. Do we have any more public participation forms? >> No, sir. >> Okay. Mr. for Watts. Would you like to have a rebuttal on any of that? And this is

805
03:45:30.399 --> 03:45:46.880
what the >> this your your >> This was some of the concerns I think I brought up and I correct. We hear it every day. >> Yeah. >> And um we just don't want to compound the situation that has occurred in different areas.

806
03:45:46.880 --> 03:46:01.359
>> Right. And and again, I think at the outset, you heard me say that was one of the things that we we started looking at this property based on where the water goes and how to make sure that you're looking at the design of the property to take that into account from the from the

807
03:46:01.359 --> 03:46:17.439
outset. Um the the emails and it was Miss Hansen's email that ended up being forwarded to me that had a number of very specific things that I think were also picked up in a couple of the other emails. Questions about elevation adjacent to the property, questions about some of those. Um and that's when

808
03:46:17.439 --> 03:46:32.880
we reached out to to them to you say let let's get together and meet so we can sit around a conference room table and kind of talk through that. So hopefully it'll be um there'll be a better ability to understand you know kind of the technical aspects of it how we're planning and hear from them what what

809
03:46:32.880 --> 03:46:50.479
issues they've experienced on their individual properties. One of the things and and you know I think um Chris touched on this a few minutes ago with regard to the way that this plan is laid out. you do have, you know, kind of the pond in the location where the water goes today. Um, and with an elevation on

810
03:46:50.479 --> 03:47:07.040
the top of bank that matches the elevation on the properties that are on Siesta to the north and that you've got that fall that goes off to the east which is in the same direction that we're designing the outfall. Again, we're not at the formal construction plan design stage. So, we have to get to

811
03:47:07.040 --> 03:47:22.560
that to be able to kind of finalize that. And one of the things that I think we'd be happy to continue doing is having the residents involved in that process so they can see how that design is moving forward for the property. So they can see how the you know kind the design of the pond will will end up. But

812
03:47:22.560 --> 03:47:39.040
the other thing that I think if you look at the and and Chris touched on this a minute ago, we tried to locate the areas behind, you know, he said we we left some additional green space areas for those catch basins and things of that nature between the homes that are being proposed and the neighboring properties.

813
03:47:39.040 --> 03:47:54.800
So if you look at the concept plan here and look at the area of Siesta Court, that's the white area that's kind of in between there and then look at the amount of the edge of the property that's around it, that is that green space. Um, and if you go back to the other, one of the exhibits that we had

814
03:47:54.800 --> 03:48:10.399
in our presentation actually had some notes on there that identified each of those locations as potential locations for additional exfiltration and additional I'm sorry, infiltration. So, the the general idea there, Can you put that back up for just a second so I can

815
03:48:10.399 --> 03:48:28.000
show that? Yeah. I'm just waiting for the this is the staff presentation here. So, Okay. So, if you look um again down on the very bottom in that large green space, it's in the center of the kind of

816
03:48:28.000 --> 03:48:44.800
top of the property um you know, identifying that as an infiltration basin location. You've got that same thing over here along the back side of the properties on Siesta Court with some of the green space there. And I think we'll have those same opportunities around kind of that commercial piece that's, you know, up to the north along

817
03:48:44.800 --> 03:49:00.720
um 44. And we don't know that anything will ever happen on that commercial piece. It was a requirement to to do an MPU that the commercial be in there. Um 5,000 square feet is what's provided for under the ULI land use classification. So that was included. We felt like it wasn't appropriate to do anything on that property that was additional

818
03:49:00.720 --> 03:49:15.520
residential or to expand the neighborhood up into that area, particularly given, you know, kind of the fall of the land. So, you know, I think there's the way it's laid out um continues to provide a substantial amount of that green space kind of

819
03:49:15.520 --> 03:49:31.279
around the Siesta Court area. And then we looking at those contour lines, we're trying to make sure that we're matching those elevations and that we're keeping the storm water design lower than the elevations of the surrounding area. So, not talking about, you know, where the house is, but I'm talking about where

820
03:49:31.279 --> 03:49:48.880
the actual water design is is based. If you go back here, the outfall elevation, so the point at which it's it's discharging into that that system to the east corresponds with that. If you look

821
03:49:48.880 --> 03:50:15.439
at that 65 ft contour line, >> yeah, that's true. Sorry. And so I think the general idea was to try and make sure that we're designing that system to be at the same elevation as Siesta Court. So that discharge is going where we want it to go off to the east rather than being built up because

822
03:50:15.439 --> 03:50:31.920
I know in some of the other areas where we've had some some issues, you've got storm water ponds that are above the finished floor elevation of the homes. And so my point in kind of pulling this back up was to show we're trying to make sure this system is designed so that that that storm water elevation that

823
03:50:31.920 --> 03:50:49.120
that design elevation for that pond is below that area. Um so that the discharge is occurring kind of at the low point of where Siesta Court's residents are rather than at the high point of where they are that 70 ft. That's why that top of bank's at 70, the design elevation and the flood elevation

824
03:50:49.120 --> 03:51:07.080
are at 65 or 66 with the discharge at 65. So, I hope that all makes sense. Those are some of the details that we thought it would be helpful to sit down and talk with with the residents in the area about specifically. And so, that's what we're hoping to go over in some more detail at that meeting next Thursday.

825
03:51:07.199 --> 03:51:24.720
Okay. Any questions? Any comments? Okay, we're going to close the four for public participation. >> Well, I can wait till after the MO. I've got lots of comments, but I will wait till after motion. >> Okay, close the for public participation

826
03:51:24.720 --> 03:51:40.800
and open up for commission discussion or motion. This is what I've experienced. I'm just going to put it out there. I'm very concerned with the flooding. I'm very concerned with the density

827
03:51:40.800 --> 03:51:57.600
issues. But this is what I also know. I've there's been times that this board has turned down a conceptual plan or a PUD and it ends up going to the cities the

828
03:51:57.600 --> 03:52:13.439
city and then then what happens is because you know people that live in the county really don't have a voting with the city and um so what ends up happening these densities rather increase

829
03:52:13.439 --> 03:52:30.479
and if they're willing having to cooperate with the adjacent property owners so we don't get into the flooding and and obviously it's well documented on the in the past the flooding issues that we've had if they're willing to work with that um

830
03:52:30.479 --> 03:52:46.880
you know as much as I hate to say it the lesser lesser of the impact I believe would be to move forward with um with one that actually comes through the county rather than let it end up in the city's hands because I I can tell you there's some issues with the city plans

831
03:52:46.880 --> 03:53:03.040
and I've seen this time after time that they come in with a low density. This is what three units per acre and I've seen it go as high as six and eight and others. So I'm just forewarning, you

832
03:53:03.040 --> 03:53:20.000
know, we can sit here and say we don't want development. Unfortunately, you know, I've lived here all my life and and I've seen a big change, too. and that not necessarily be better for me, but the but that's progress. That's that's the future. So,

833
03:53:20.000 --> 03:53:36.560
um that's where I'm at. >> Go ahead, Miss Bush. >> Thank you, Chairman. Um I have some concerns over this. I'll I'll be honest. Um, I'll try to do my best to um make sure that I speak into the microphone

834
03:53:36.560 --> 03:53:53.040
and annunciate where I think it fails to meet some of the tests that um we have to review in the site um in the staff report. Um I'll first start and say that um per so I'm looking at the review criteria analysis. I'm trying to stick

835
03:53:53.040 --> 03:54:10.479
very matterof fact there. um its impact. Number two, its impact upon the environment and natural resources. I understand what staff has presented here. However, there is an impact to the environment and natural resources, water flow. Um you know, originally it was not very well explained in the staff report

836
03:54:10.479 --> 03:54:25.760
about the 10acre tree preservation area and I was a little shocked that that was your suggestion for preserving. Just let's throw a 10acre chunk to the side and we won't touch it and that's our conservation. which is why I asked about the open space because that's not an appropriate open space if we want people

837
03:54:25.760 --> 03:54:42.239
to have access to green areas and I think that there's a probably a better way that you can give residents access to that 10 acres instead of just saying we're protecting the trees there they are right we can do a better job of integrating that especially if the residents are complaining that they're losing the natural environment that

838
03:54:42.239 --> 03:54:58.640
surrounds them so I would love to implore that you all and I know ETM can do do this um can look at how to integrate this community better with the existing residents and with the existing con you know um environmental constraints and issues that are out

839
03:54:58.640 --> 03:55:15.840
there. Um number three, the impact upon the economy to the affected area. Um I I probably um am a little so single family homes right generally um are a tax suck on uh your property taxes, your

840
03:55:15.840 --> 03:55:32.319
advalorum, right? You spend more to support your single family homes than you do anything else including commercial brings you more advorum or more taxes into your residence than your single family home base. So just naturally thinking and looking at all the evidence supporting, you know, good

841
03:55:32.319 --> 03:55:49.279
urban design, lack of sprawl, those types of things, I'm really not sure that this piece really is the economic driver, right? Or supporting economic opportunity in this community by just slapping down single family homes, right? And then you have your splash of commercial in the corner to call it

842
03:55:49.279 --> 03:56:04.640
mixed use. Like come, we know that that's not actually mixed use. So I'm a little concerned that that impact on the economy. Yes, we're bringing in all these new people. They've got disposable income. That's great. But what about the services that we're now providing? I mean, these are questions that we're now

843
03:56:04.640 --> 03:56:19.600
being asked more specifically as taxpayers now addressing whether or not we want to reduce our taxes, right, come November. Um, and so here's a huge subdivision that's coming in that's going to be an added tax drain on both the county and the city. And there's not

844
03:56:19.600 --> 03:56:35.279
really enough evidence for me to approve something like this to shows that it is going to offset what it is expected to um use in services. And this is like generic, right? This is very much basic urban planning 101 that you look at how

845
03:56:35.279 --> 03:56:51.199
your infrastructure and those services apply over 20, 30 years. It's not just the snapshot now, but you know, are we going to be asked to be maintaining some of these facilities, the infrastructure like that? and are these homes paying for that maintenance? We know that it

846
03:56:51.199 --> 03:57:06.239
doesn't the property taxes don't cover that, right? Generally, especially on a 30-year outlook. So, for that, I don't necessarily agree with staff. Um, lastly, and this isn't really on staff. However, I feel like there should be a criteria and here, maybe there is, and I'm just not looking at it specifically.

847
03:57:06.239 --> 03:57:21.760
Um, but as a professor that teaches land use planning to the next generation of planners, um, this is what I teach them not to do, right? Um, this is a very sterile type of, you know, your your typical suburban subdivision. You're

848
03:57:21.760 --> 03:57:38.399
trying to smack it in and try to fit it in. And I understand that you've got a lot of constraints here, but I don't think you're really taking in the context of the community into consideration. I know you're looking at what you're allowed to do, but what what should you be doing? Nor, I'm not really

849
03:57:38.399 --> 03:57:53.760
worried about the density at all. I think the three units per acre are fine. I think that it's it's how it's spread out. it should be re-evaluated. And I think that maybe minimizing some of the number of lots would in, you know, decrease the amount of storm capacity

850
03:57:53.760 --> 03:58:09.920
that you have to have and that would decrease the size of the pond. Maybe your open spaces could be a little bit more active instead of passive, which is I assume what some of those buffers behind those residential properties will be. That's at least what we did when we planned a lot of those when I was a a

851
03:58:09.920 --> 03:58:25.600
planner. Um, so I'm just not sure. I Dand as the young woman indicated is a really cool unique place and it really is something that we should cherish. Mark I know you're very familiar with that and fight for that all the time but these types of places are not they're

852
03:58:25.600 --> 03:58:41.520
not this isn't unique. We could put this subdivision down in anywhere in America and it doesn't necessarily call out that this is the land. And I think over and over again we're hearing from residents that they're pointing out the flooding. are pointing out these other issues, but the lack of quality and character of the

853
03:58:41.520 --> 03:58:56.720
places that we're building, specifically the public places that we're building, is atrocious. And we have to do a better job. And I teach this every day. And so I would be remissed if I didn't bring that education that I bring to my students and apply it here today with

854
03:58:56.720 --> 03:59:11.680
this. So I appreciate the young woman's comments about creating a unique place and holding on to that unique identity. And that's something that I said I I try to teach and I try to implement when I am trying to work through some of these con you know conflicts that we're

855
03:59:11.680 --> 03:59:29.359
dealing with. So I would be willing to say maybe table this because I would love for the conversation with the residents to occur and I think I would feel a lot more comfortable then moving forward with this if that was taken care of and maybe some of these other things that I think all of us on the dis have

856
03:59:29.359 --> 03:59:45.120
pointed out. I'm just not sure that I feel comfortable enough to approve it like it's at and I don't necessarily agree that with staff's recommendations that it's at that point that it is not going to have that intent or that that conflict with the community in the existing environment. So those are my

857
03:59:45.120 --> 04:00:00.720
comments. Thank you. >> I guess my question would be have you met with the prop the adjacent property owners >> next week. So we do have that meeting scheduled. I was going to say if that's the way the board wants to go, we don't object to that at all. We do have that

858
04:00:00.720 --> 04:00:16.160
meeting scheduled next week. So, um it is going to be an opportunity for input um and for um make sure that everybody's on the same page with regard to what's happening out there. So, you know, if that's where the the board would like to see us do that and then come back with

859
04:00:16.160 --> 04:00:33.359
any tweaks, you know, based on that, we're happy to do that. Um you know, we we um we started getting kind of the feedback after the public notice stuff went out. Um, I generally like to try and do neighborhood meetings before we get to this point. Uh, this is one that kind of popped up um on on on the

860
04:00:33.359 --> 04:00:50.160
schedule. So, um, you know, we've got that schedule for next week. Um, if if that's what the board would like to see us do on this, I do think in getting to to the specific points that you raised. This is within the good planning context that the Dand area has been working towards in that 2050 plan. I think

861
04:00:50.160 --> 04:01:07.199
anything can always be improved. Um, so, um, but I think from a grander scale, from a communitywide scale, it's within the area where we're targeting for growth. And I think that's some of the stuff that we've focused on with regard to the densities and everything else being appropriate. And you said that as well, that density is appropriate there. So, um, again, if that's if that's what

862
04:01:07.199 --> 04:01:24.560
the board would would prefer to do, then we were certainly not um we're certainly in agreement with that. >> I mean, I would be willing to entertain it. There's still a lot left on the table though that I have significant concerns about, you know, related to the the layout and the site plan and its

863
04:01:24.560 --> 04:01:40.840
context related to u you know, we're here talking about specifically resoning, not the site plan, but there are things related to it that I do think need to meet that criteria that I do not feel meet that criteria right now >> and I I think I got most of your points. >> I can email them and summarize them for you.

864
04:01:41.920 --> 04:01:57.040
>> I'm happy if the board I mean we do have a meeting scheduled with the residents next week. I think it's always helpful if we get, you know, the ability to do anything that's a a tweak based on the input we get in those meetings, we'd be fine with it. So, um, if the board, you know, I'm I'm happy to accept a

865
04:01:57.040 --> 04:02:14.319
continuence, uh, or to request a continuence if that's where the board would like to go with it. >> What do we have to have a motion on that? >> Um, I would recommend September. >> September at the at the earliest.

866
04:02:14.319 --> 04:02:30.160
We closing the floor. >> Yeah, we're going to close the floor. I think I already did. >> Did you? >> And Mark, who who's who specifically is the meeting with >> just the homeowners around there? >> Yeah. So, so far and and if you're I think if you haven't received an email

867
04:02:30.160 --> 04:02:46.000
from my office about a meeting, if I can get with you right after this and make sure you've got my information, we'll make sure that you're invited. >> Yeah. I'd definitely like to hear more of their concerns and not Okay, >> we can set a followup then. >> Okay, we we can set another meeting as

868
04:02:46.000 --> 04:03:01.680
well. >> Okay. >> All right. So, um I'll make a motion on PUD 24005 that we continue this to the um September >> 17th. Yep. >> Y second. >> Okay.

869
04:03:01.680 --> 04:03:18.880
>> I got a motion on the floor for Mr. costed to continue PUB24-00005 to the September 17th meeting >> and a second from Mr. Sixma. Any discussion on the motion? >> Well, just a a comment to the folks in the gallery. This is your opportunity to

870
04:03:18.880 --> 04:03:34.800
sit with the uh the presenters and the developers and voice your concerns and depending on what kind of answers they give you, you come back and before us and kind of give us your point of view as well. So that kind of gives everybody a playing field that you can kind of get back, gather some more information, and

871
04:03:34.800 --> 04:03:50.160
come back. And uh I think like most things, you're you're not going to get 100% approval, but if you can get a consensus, I think that's pretty much what we look for up here. At least my I do anyhow. >> And and the other thing too to keep in mind what I said, you know, I mean, if

872
04:03:50.160 --> 04:04:05.520
this gets annexed into the city, I don't know what you're going to end up with. I've seen it too many times. If you can work with these folks and they're willing to work with you, That's the avenue that I would definitely take. So,

873
04:04:05.520 --> 04:04:23.600
all right. So, we got a motion on the floor and a second. >> All those in favor signify by saying I. >> I. >> Any opposed? >> Motion carries. >> Appreciate it. And thank you for your time and I'll be right back.

874
04:04:23.600 --> 04:04:39.600
>> Uh, chairman. >> Yes. If I may, I'd like to um uh recuse myself from CPA24-006 and PUB-26-067. Uh on both of those items, I worked with the applicant, the developer, and the

875
04:04:39.600 --> 04:04:57.059
homeowner to um update and amend the site plan and the developers agreement, which is what's before you today. So therefore, I wish to abstain from voting to asssure that there is a fair proceeding free from potential bias or prejudice. Thank you. Okay, you may leave.

876
04:04:57.059 --> 04:05:16.880
[laughter] All right. Four. All you have to have is four four. Nobody can get up. Go to use the restroom, though. >> If you do, we got to stop. >> Yeah. Yeah.

877
04:05:16.880 --> 04:05:33.680
>> Okay. Mr. Kusta, can I get the next case, please? >> All right. Let me screen read both of these together. >> Yeah. Well, let's do both of them together. >> All right. So, KC CPA24- Z006. Um, where am I going here? Application by Mark Watts, uh, Cobb

878
04:05:33.680 --> 04:05:53.479
Cole, Attorneys at Law for MJ, MDJJ LLC, requesting a comprehensive plan amendment to the natural resource management area overlay boundary on the Ostein mixeduse village and Ostein transitional residential designated property. Also reading in PUD-26-067

879
04:05:53.680 --> 04:06:10.399
application by Mark Watts uh Cobbell MDJJ LLC requesting a statutory development agreement pursuant to the Florida Local Government Agreement Act on Ostein mixeduse village and Ostein transitional residential zoned property.

880
04:06:10.399 --> 04:06:27.439
>> Thank you Mr. Costa. Mr. Shams, this one's yours. >> Hi, good afternoon. So, uh I'll first go through the CPA. So, the subject site is uh 12.98 acres uh along State Road 415 in the OE local plan area. It currently

881
04:06:27.439 --> 04:06:43.439
has two future lanes designations, Ostein mixeduse village and OE transitional residential. Uh you may remember this case. It was previously heard by the board on January 16, 2025 as a future land use change. However,

882
04:06:43.439 --> 04:06:58.720
the applicant requested an indefinite continuance at the March 4th, 2025 county council hearing to revise the project with feedback from the OEN Planning and Preservation Society or OPs.

883
04:06:58.720 --> 04:07:15.840
Now, the application has been revised to remove the future land use change and will only amend the natural resource management area overlay boundary u or norma. Norma is an overlay from the future land use element and is intended to provide additional protection for

884
04:07:15.840 --> 04:07:31.199
environmentally sensitive areas. It sits on top of normal land use and requires adherence to specific standards. It is not a land use designation and it is not part of the Oian local plan. Currently, the normal boundary on site does not

885
04:07:31.199 --> 04:07:46.800
accurately correspond to areas where it should. As you can see on the diagram, the current normal boundary is outlined in blue. And the proposed boundary is outlined in green. So the applicant has submitted a wetland delineation and is proposing to

886
04:07:46.800 --> 04:08:03.760
revise the normal boundary to account for the wetlands along Lake Ulleia and its 50 foot upland buffer. The total affected area by this change is approximately 2.42 acres. The existing norma area being 1.24 and the proposed

887
04:08:03.760 --> 04:08:21.199
being 1.23. There is a small overlap uh circled in red that is approximately 2400 square feet. Uh our environmental permitting uh team has reviewed this request and does not object to the change and overall staff

888
04:08:21.199 --> 04:08:37.680
recommends forwarding to county council with final action of approval. And now I can go through the PUD. So the applicant is after meeting with uh OPS is proposing uh a statutory

889
04:08:37.680 --> 04:08:53.199
development agreement to develop the site with 76 town homes. This was previously uh an accompanying application with the land use change to reszone the site uh from Ostein mixeduse village and Ostein

890
04:08:53.199 --> 04:09:09.840
transitional residential to a full O mixuse village. Uh their intent was to develop 80 town homes with consistent development standards across the site as town homes are allowed by right in MUV

891
04:09:09.840 --> 04:09:27.199
but not in uh TR. The community had reservations with proposed future land use change and reasonzoning due to encroachment of higher intensity uses away from the intended state road 415 corridor. The applicant has worked with the community to propose a project that will

892
04:09:27.199 --> 04:09:42.000
not amend the land use and zoning map and a proposed an application that is rarely used in Valuchia County which is the statutory development agreement. These agreements are governed by the Florida local government development act development agreement act Florida

893
04:09:42.000 --> 04:09:58.800
statute uh 163220 to 3243. Um, this will memorialize the entitlements for a maximum of 30 years and will not change land use and zoning lines. Though this case has a PUD

894
04:09:58.800 --> 04:10:15.040
number, it is not actually reserving the property. It was just reviewed through the county's PUD process due to similarities in project scope. Statuto development agreements are required to be consistent with state law, such as a minimum of two public hearings. So, this

895
04:10:15.040 --> 04:10:30.399
will also go to county council for final approval. an agreement with uses, density, standards, description of lands, and duration and consistency with the county's comprehensive plan and land development code. As a result, the project is

896
04:10:30.399 --> 04:10:47.199
limited by the maximum density allowed by the current future line use designations MUV and TR which is approximately 56 units in the MUV area and 23 in the TR area for a max total of 79.

897
04:10:47.199 --> 04:11:04.479
Based on the proposed plan, uh they are proposing 53 units in MUV and 23 in TR for a total of 76. So that requirement is met. The site is currently developed with a mobile home that was originally placed in 1973

898
04:11:04.479 --> 04:11:21.920
and from 1987 to 2012. The site operated as the native southeastern tree farm. It was sold to the current owners in November 2021. Uh as I said previously, it is located on the east side of State Road 415 in the Oine local plan area which is south

899
04:11:21.920 --> 04:11:37.520
of the city of Deltona. Um, adj adjacent uses include single family and there is also a nearby commercial intersection with the Walmart Super Center. Uh, the site will be serviced by Deltona Utilities and the applicant will be

900
04:11:37.520 --> 04:11:55.920
responsible for all utility connections. The proposed town home units will be uh on four unit and sixunit structures. Each unit will be on a 2,000 square foot lot and will have dimensional standards relatively consistent with the county's

901
04:11:55.920 --> 04:12:13.760
R seven town home zoning standards. The proposed development will generate 572 daily trips and 44 p.m. peak hour trips. Our the county traffic engineering reviewed the analysis and did not express concern. Overall staff finds the

902
04:12:13.760 --> 04:12:40.000
proposed project consistent with the comprehensive plan and the OC local plan and recommends forwarding to the county council with final action of approval. And I'm available for comment or question. All right. Any questions for staff?

903
04:12:40.000 --> 04:12:56.960
Hearing none. Mr. Mr. Watts, >> I'm back. Um, for the record, Mark Watts with the law firm of Cobb Cole, 231 North Woodland Boulevard, D, the land. Um, and I appreciate the opportunity uh to be here on behalf of the property under MDJJ. Jeremy Griffith, one of the

904
04:12:56.960 --> 04:13:13.359
members of that company, was here earlier. Um, had to leave to get to another appointment. So, um, I want to walk you through a couple things. This is um first of all we sort of had to create a process to bring this before you because that's how infrequently you see a statutory development agreement.

905
04:13:13.359 --> 04:13:29.279
Um everything goes the route of doing PUDS and everything else these days. One of the things that we heard um kind of back in the process last year in April and May um you know with the county council and and you know the Ostein joint planning area and everything else

906
04:13:29.279 --> 04:13:45.120
was we heard please don't change the colors on the map. Um, that was one of the key things because every time we've ever gone to the county or to the city and started talking about changing colors on the map, everybody gets very concerned about what that's going to mean and how that's going to set a precedent and everything else. And so

907
04:13:45.120 --> 04:14:01.040
I'm grateful that we were able to we I'll talk a little bit about some of the meetings that we had, but um we got together with some of the the executive leadership team from the the the ops group, the Ostein preservation planning society group, talked about the standards that you see in this development agreement, and basically

908
04:14:01.040 --> 04:14:17.680
came back and um came up with a way to do this without changing the colors on the map. Um which was kind of one of the one of the key uh requests. So, um, I'm going to go through a lot of this quickly because you've already seen it and it's slate and, um, I don't want to take up too much more of your time. Um, but the general location, if you know

909
04:14:17.680 --> 04:14:33.120
along 472 where the Walmart is, uh, this is just right across the street from Walmart, I'm sorry, on on 415 where Howland comes in. Um, you saw this last year with that res land use and resoning request and approved it. Um, but again, right across from the kind of the storm

910
04:14:33.120 --> 04:14:48.800
water pond that's behind um, the the Super Walmart that's at Howland and 415. Um, and we've got two applications. I'm going to skip through this because you've already heard it. Your NARMA overlay. Um, so the only remaining aspect of the land use

911
04:14:48.800 --> 04:15:05.439
amendment that we're asking you to do is one that we are just really kind of truing up what's on the ground with the maps. Um, so when we when we originally looked at where the Narma overlay was located on this property and we actually

912
04:15:05.439 --> 04:15:20.720
had our environmental folks meet with the county environmental staff out there, everybody agreed this is in the wrong location. And so the key was really making sure it kind of went around and protected Lake Ulia and the wetland systems associated with that. And if you see the kind of that blue

913
04:15:20.720 --> 04:15:36.319
outline, which is what is currently NARMA overlay, it really doesn't even make sense that you've got that much of an angular shape um kind of following those, you know, the NARMA area. So um everybody agreed this was something that we could take care of. Typically, when

914
04:15:36.319 --> 04:15:52.080
we have a situation like this, your comprehensive plan allows us to do an administrative shift of those boundaries by up to 660 ft, but Paulo over here said we can't do that with NARMA. Um so uh because Paulo made that decision, we had to bring this through as a separate part of the application to uh to bring

915
04:15:52.080 --> 04:16:07.279
it through as a specific application to shift that. But I think this is kind of otherwise self-explanatory. We're putting the protection over where the things that we want to protect are uh effectively. So and you've got a recommendation of of approval from staff with regard to that

916
04:16:07.279 --> 04:16:23.520
um that request. So, this is my associate Kelsey did a really good job putting together a presentation that I'm going to skip through a lot because it's late. Um, but but we've been at this for a while. You know, we we uh in January of 2025,

917
04:16:23.520 --> 04:16:39.279
um I think was when we were originally here with the actual application to change the zoning classifications. Um my recollection is we had a recommendation of unanimous approval, if I if I remember correctly, coming out of this this board um for that application at that time. Um, but then we ran into the

918
04:16:39.279 --> 04:16:54.159
concern about changing the colors on the map. So, we came up with the alternate way to approach it. Um, here's a couple of the key things and I'll just make the summary pretty simple. We're not asking to increase any of the density or intensity or anything else relating to the property. We're really just dealing with the fact that there's a line that

919
04:16:54.159 --> 04:17:08.399
goes through the middle of it on both sides of which says you can do town homes, you can do multifamily. Um but because I think that change occurred in May of last year if I remember correctly. The no when was the change to

920
04:17:08.399 --> 04:17:27.760
the um ordinance? I think it was towards the latter half of last year. The county council adopted the ordinance that changed some of the which special exceptions go to the county council which you know that you know that revision that they made to the overall list of uses and and kind of um

921
04:17:27.760 --> 04:17:43.439
land development regulations. They also kind of addressed the issue that we brought up last year when we were here on this property, which was the land use um on this property. All of it permitted that multifamily use, permitted that town home use, but you didn't have that in the zoning on the eastern portion of

922
04:17:43.439 --> 04:18:00.960
it. So, we had to do we had to come up with that reszoning before so that we could have town homes on the eastern portion even though the density would otherwise support it. Lot of lot of kind of complicated and technical issues here. When the county then approved the use on the eastern

923
04:18:00.960 --> 04:18:17.520
portion, they approved it, but they didn't put any development criteria in place for that use in the new zoning regulation. So now we had the ability to do town homes. Um, but we didn't have any zoning any criteria for how big the lots needed to be or any of those things. And so this statutory development agreement fills that gap in.

924
04:18:17.520 --> 04:18:32.399
Um, and it basically says the development criteria that you had on the western side of the property under the existing zoning is now also on the eastern side of the property. and we're just making it as a unified approach to the overall property. Does that make sense? >> Okay. >> Y

925
04:18:32.399 --> 04:18:48.000
>> um so again, originally last year we were coming through it was going to let us go up to 80 units I think was what we were proposing. Um we're actually about 76 um is what's being proposed under the development agreement. Um this is all kind of gone through um you know the

926
04:18:48.000 --> 04:19:02.880
review with staff. And again I want to I want to thank staff because this was one of those where you know we we came up with this approach. Oh forgot to tell you one of the most important parts. So when we met

927
04:19:02.880 --> 04:19:19.159
you know as the result of a series of meetings that we had with that executive leadership group with the um um the ops organization. Um the end result of that was a list. Um

928
04:19:19.520 --> 04:19:35.439
and uh we we sat down kind of at that final meeting and said, "Hey, there's a way to do this without changing the colors on the map. We can do it with a statutory development agreement." And in that statutory development agreement, we can address these things. Um the expansion of the town home uh town home use into the existing TRZ zoned area

929
04:19:35.439 --> 04:19:51.520
would be permitted by this agreement rather than through a resoning, which this is not a resoning. It's just permitting it through that agreement. The maximum lot count would be limited to 80 units. No multi- 80 town home units with no multifamily. You know, apartments are also allowed under the existing zoning. The statutory

930
04:19:51.520 --> 04:20:07.199
development agreement is committing it to town home use instead. So although technically staff looks at that as a multif family use, it's qualified as a res as a single family residential use from an ownership standpoint. um a minimum of a 100 foot building separation uh from Lake Ulleia would be

931
04:20:07.199 --> 04:20:22.479
maintained by the plan and we've done that and that's also a term in the agreement. Um LI principles will be employed as as possible for the design of the storm water system within the development. Again, we've included those same uh terms in the in the statutory development agreement. Florida native

932
04:20:22.479 --> 04:20:37.760
plants and plants that are attractive to pollinators be used for plantings and landscape buffers in areas around the stormwater ponds. We've included that standard in the in the development agreement as well. uh the design of common areas uh and entry feature improvements and architectural details for the proposed town homes will be coordinated with the executive

933
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leadership of the OEM planning and preservation society. That provision is in in the development agreement as well. And then um this was one that we actually were able to do something about kind of late breaking um except as required by the county land development code. Vehicular access to the existing

934
04:20:53.600 --> 04:21:09.439
first street east and second street east rightway would not be permitted. the cross access connection shown on the attached concept plan are I provided as required by code uh to permit future development that cross access was a concern u at the end of the day because of how the density and everything else

935
04:21:09.439 --> 04:21:28.640
falls because we can't kind of increase the density on that eastern portion through this uh application so we had to kind of fit the density into the property as um you know kind of the overall um >> you know >> hold We'll hold it here.

936
04:21:28.640 --> 04:22:24.880
>> Yeah. >> Mr. Shams, you have any jokes? >> He He Yeah. Didn't have a pass. >> [laughter] >> Stony. >> I know, right? It's I sort of The acoustics are horrible in here, but I I kind of love I kind of love being in

937
04:22:24.880 --> 04:22:41.120
this room. >> It's uh It's hot. Wish I had a >> Yeah, we when my when my dad passed away, we did his um his visitation was here in the building and this room was open and everything. And um yeah, it was

938
04:22:41.120 --> 04:23:12.199
kind of a cool a cool setting to be able to do it in. >> [laughter] >> Yeah. Yeah. This was Bunky's courtroom. [laughter] >> Yeah. >> That's okay. Um

939
04:23:12.239 --> 04:23:27.760
>> Yeah. >> Yeah. In any event, um my point in reading you that list was we tried to make sure that every one of the things that we had sat down and gone through that group with, you know, um the ops group with over those course of the meetings is included as a term in the in the statutory

940
04:23:27.760 --> 04:23:44.479
development agreement. So, we've we've provided copies out to everybody. I think um you know um I think they actually have a meeting tomorrow to go through and review any other questions that they've got, but I've been in in communication with their leadership and and they're aware of the meeting here today as well. So, um, this was an

941
04:23:44.479 --> 04:23:59.760
interesting one to come up with a a tool that's a little used to try and sort of get to the same place that the existing zoning gets you there without without, uh, changing the colors changing the colors on the map. So, with that, I'll stop talking. >> Less than two hours,

942
04:23:59.760 --> 04:24:19.040
>> not cumulatively between cases. Okay. Any questions for the applicant? Go ahead. Is there a is there a builder already picked out for this or is this you're just getting it set up to >> They have I think they have a builder that they partner with. You know, our clients also do site development work.

943
04:24:19.040 --> 04:24:36.720
Um so MDJJ um they I think are u not the Brier team. Uh Wallrose um is is their uh site development company. So I think they they have a builder. I'm not exactly sure if that's public. >> Thanks. >> Any other questions for the applicant?

944
04:24:36.720 --> 04:24:56.960
Okay. Hey, do we have any public participation forms for this case? >> Yes, we do. >> Yep. >> Mhm. >> How could I forget? Miss Bush. >> Emily Bush. >> Yeah. Yes. >> Name an address for the record. >> Sure. Uh my name is Emily Bush. I reside

945
04:24:56.960 --> 04:25:14.159
at 2195 Enterprise Ostein Road. That's in Deltona, Florida. 32738. Thank you, commissioners, for allowing me to speak today. Um I uh um not necessarily leadership on ops but helped support the Ostein Preservation and Planning Society when this issue first

946
04:25:14.159 --> 04:25:31.120
came up when the colors on the map were getting changed. Some residents in Ostein reached out to me and I worked with them to understand what was happening before them. Um, I had some questions at the time and reached out to Stephen because at the time the future land use was um, calculated based on

947
04:25:31.120 --> 04:25:46.960
what the use was on the individual parcel and that was something that I was very much unfamiliar with. So, I needed some education on that and this was really my first introduction to uh, Valuchia County Planning. Little did I know that I would be serving on the board a few months later. Um, but I wanted to just mention that we worked

948
04:25:46.960 --> 04:26:03.040
really closely with Mark and the property owner uh and the engineer of record uh and they truly listened to the residents concerns not just in the initial meeting that we had with Mark and the group but as those meetings continued. So um I I have not had a chance we are meeting tomorrow. I have

949
04:26:03.040 --> 04:26:18.479
not had a chance to go through the details other than what was presented in our packet. Um so I'm still kind of jury out whether or not I'm going to be for this project or against it. But I just wanted to say that I appreciate the applicant and um their staff working with the community to address these

950
04:26:18.479 --> 04:26:35.359
concerns and bring it back to you all in a manner that um is the least conflicting of um the Ostein plan. I think what we learned through this exercise is that the Ostein plan doesn't necessarily reflect what the Ostein residents want today. And I think that there are some challenges that we we are

951
04:26:35.359 --> 04:26:52.319
going to need to continue to deal with um hopefully once Senate Bill 180 sunsets. Um, but that's really kind of the the hindrance right now from Ostein, from ops to essentially move forward with some of their visioning that they've done with the community. So anyway, I just wanted to to say that for the record. Um, and that's part of the

952
04:26:52.319 --> 04:27:10.960
reason why I'm abstaining. Thank you. >> Yeah, she did. >> Miss Craig, >> I have a question about the OPS. How how many members are there and what's the um

953
04:27:10.960 --> 04:27:26.159
in in relation to the population of the Ostein area. >> Sure. Um the Ostein Preservation Planning Society is somewhat newer. They've just established their 501c3. So the residents that are serving in that capacity have not been elected per the

954
04:27:26.159 --> 04:27:42.239
501c3. That still has to like the board members on the 501c3. So that they're still establishing, but the people that are commenting and are being involved in this are the established um people that are starting up the 501c3 in the community. So as far as what the

955
04:27:42.239 --> 04:27:59.040
population of Ostein and how they represent, I'm not really sure of those specifics. I'm not an Ostein resident. I was just asked as an subject matter expert to support them in this matter. >> Any other public participation forms for this case?

956
04:27:59.040 --> 04:28:14.159
>> No, sir. Mr. Watts, you said everything you wanted to say. [laughter] Give you >> just here for any other questions. >> Okay. All right. We're going to close the for public participation and open up for commission discussion. We'll take

957
04:28:14.159 --> 04:28:34.560
the uh CPA first and then the PUD. I'm open for a motion. >> I'll make a motion. Go ahead. >> Uh CPA 24006. Uh, make a motion to find the comprehensive plan amendment consistent with the comprehensive plan and forward the application case number

958
04:28:34.560 --> 04:28:53.920
CPA-240-00006 to the county council with a recommendation of approval to transmit to the Florida Department of Commerce for expedited state review and to the Valuchia Growth Management Commission for certification. >> Second. >> Okay. I've got a motion on the floor as stated from Mr. Costa and a second from

959
04:28:53.920 --> 04:29:10.760
Mr. Sixman. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor signify by saying I. I. >> Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. >> All right. On uh I'll make a motion on PUB26-067

960
04:29:12.159 --> 04:29:28.560
that we forward the planning application case number PUD-25-00005 to the county council for a final action with a recommendation of approval. >> It's not 005. PUD 26 067. All right. On the write up they have it mislabeled. So

961
04:29:28.560 --> 04:29:47.120
it is let me correct that to it is PUD 26-067. Gotcha. >> Second. >> Okay. I've got a motion on the floor from Mr. Cost as stated and a second for Mr. Sixman. Any discussion on the motion?

962
04:29:47.120 --> 04:30:04.319
>> All those in favor signify by saying I. I. Any opposed? Motion carries unanimously. >> Thank you all. Appreciate the time. >> Thank you. And uh Mr. Chair, for the record, there's something we have to do because it's a development agreement. The second hearing will be on September 3rd, that's a Thursday, at county

963
04:30:04.319 --> 04:30:26.720
council. >> Okay. >> Okay. I think that takes care of all new business. Uh do we have any other public items? >> Uh no, sir. >> Okay. staff items.

964
04:30:26.720 --> 04:30:51.399
>> Uh yes, we do have one staff item. Um unfortunately, [clears throat] today is uh the last hearing that we'll have Mr. Jascula. He's moving on to Sarasota County and we all wish him well. >> Who is that?

965
04:30:52.000 --> 04:31:07.640
>> Congratulations. >> Yeah. Staff, I thought you staff comments. >> No, sir. >> Commission comments. >> Yes, sir. >> Go ahead. >> Parking.

966
04:31:08.000 --> 04:31:23.600
>> So, so as always, it's always always starts with so. >> We did submit the request to facilities. We have record of that if you'd like it. Uh, but they did not put out the cones. We're very sorry. >> Apparently not. And just for the record

967
04:31:23.600 --> 04:31:39.520
as well, I think I at the email yesterday, so the mailed package as of yesterday's delivery had not arrived. I'll check again today and see when it was actually postmarked, but um that's twice this this cycle. >> Yeah, we did postmark it uh on our

968
04:31:39.520 --> 04:31:56.000
publication day, which was last Wednesday. So again, we're very sorry you didn't get your package. Yeah. I'm just curious to see how where it travel to before it shows up or you know >> it's a pretty thick package so it could be all I'm going to get is an envelope when it actually arrives. >> I had to drive here Tuesday to get mine. It's like showed up. I got to have it

969
04:31:56.000 --> 04:32:10.319
now. >> So >> that's all I got. >> The mail system. >> I'll be glad. Are >> we going to be back street back? >> I mean next week. >> Next month. There we go.

970
04:32:10.319 --> 04:32:26.640
>> I'm listening to him. [laughter] here over there. >> Yeah, >> we should be back in count council chambers. >> Oh, yeah. >> Should be. >> So, we received word that they're opening back on August 15th, which our meeting is August 20th. So, we're just

971
04:32:26.640 --> 04:32:40.960
in time. >> All right. Was it a low bid contract? >> What was that? >> Is it a low bid contract? I mean, no idea. Timeliness timeliness can't be, you know, top of their list, but All right. >> Okay.

972
04:32:40.960 --> 04:32:49.800
Any other commission comments? Preston and citizen comments. This meeting's adjourned.