mic check mic check one two three 4 plrc meeting March 20th 2025 the March 20th 2025 hearing for the Planning and Land Development Regulation Commission is now called to order and if I could please have everyone silence any
audible devices that you may have and if you would please join me for the Pledge of Allegiance i pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands one nation
indivisible liberty and justice for all good morning everyone i would like to thank you for being here this morning and uh Miss Summers could I have the roll call good morning miss Craig here mr sixma here miss
Shelley here mr mr costa here Mr mills here thank you okay thank you Miss Summers we do not have any minutes this morning um so if anyone would like to speak for against any of the cases being heard today there are some forms at the
back of the DAS here that you'd fill out and give to Miss Summers to my immediate left and um we will be limiting you to a threeminut time limit after the comments have been heard I will give the applicant an opportunity to address any concerns the speakers have and answer
any questions the commissioners may have and at this time I'd like to turn it over to Mr sora for legal comments thank you Mr chair this is for the applicants and uh members of the public that decisions by this body on special exception cases and cases which reszone real property from one classification to
another present to the zoning ordinance are recommendations only to the county council and do not constitute a final hearing new evidence may be introduced at the county council public hearing decisions on variances made by this body constitute final action subject to an appeal to the county council and what
this means is that no new evidence may be presented at the time of the county council public hearing on the appeal an agrieved party that appeals such a decision is confined to the record made before this body hearings by this body on reasonzonings special exceptions and variances are quasi judicial in nature
meaning that this body is acting more like a court and must take into account all oral written or demonstrative evidence presented their decisions on these cases much must be based on competent substantial evidence in the record and competent substantial evidence has been defined as that evidence a reasonable mind would accept
to support a conclusion thank you Mr chair thank you Mr sora while on legal comments I would like to ask the commission to disclose for the record any exparte communications that have occurred before during the public hearing at which a vote is to be taken
on any quas judicial matter and I'll start to immediate right with Miss Craig i have none none none none i had one on case number S25001 and V2523 i did have a discussion with Mr
lewis okay we do have an item to be continued or withdrawn we're not sure yet so we're going to make it as a continuence right now and um we just got an email from the applicant um they've asked to withdraw
PUD25002 all right okay we don't need a motion on that they're just withdrawing it correct so if anyone's here for that case today PUB25002 that item has been
withdrawn we do have some old unfinished business so Miss Shelley could I get you to read that into the record please yes sir case number V-25-010 application of Alana Smith Cobbco attorney for Frank and Maria
Okconor owners requesting variances to the accessory dwelling unit ADU regulations on urban single family residential R4 zoned property miss Ray this one's yours good morning the applicant is requesting
two variances for an existing accessory dwelling unit to resolve a code violation variance one is to allow the ADU to be located in the in front of the rearmost point of the detached single family residence variance two is to
allow the ADU to be greater than 50% of the living area of the principal structure the property is a through lot so it is subject to two front yards and two sideyards the property is currently developed with a 960 square f foot single family
residence that was constructed in 1985 and a 590 square ft detached garage that was constructed in 1987 the detached garage was later converted into the accessory dwelling unit um a code complaint was received in
November of 2023 and upon review it was discovered that the ADU does not meet the regulations the single family residence entrance faces the southern boundary line causing the location of the ADU to be parallel to the single family residence instead of behind
it the variance requests are not likely to be injurious to the area because the ADU is located within the structure that has been in place for approximately 38 years staff's recommendation is approval of variances one and two as the requests
have met at least three out of the five criteria i'm available for questions thank you Miss Ray any questions for staff is our request to speak speaker working properly today yes sir it's working got it okay all
right we will be using that queue okay is the applicant present good morning could I get your name and address for the record please alana Smith with Cobb call Law Firm 231 North Woodland and I don't have the remote
okay you'd have comments you'd like to add to this case excuse me do you have comments you'd like to add at this yeah I'm going to do a brief overview of the request okay am I pointing it in the wrong direction or Excuse me
there we go it went a little bit here okay you're pressing right there okay i tried all them but okay thank you okay so the first variance to allow the
ADU to remain in its current location so the code requires ADUs on lots less than 1 acre in size to be located so that its front facade is rearward of the rearmost point of the principal detached single family dwell dwelling unit so what that really means is it has to be the ADU has to be behind the rearmost point of the
principal dwelling and on through lots this means the ADU must be located behind the rearmost point of the principal structure as measured from either right ofway so as measured from Ace Park Drive to the west or Sunset A to the east and then the dual frontage
lot prevents the ADU from being able to be located behind the principal structure because the rearmost point from one right ofway is the front yard from the other rightway and the existing ADU is situated parallel to the principal structure instead of behind it just to match the
orientation so the second variance to allow I don't know why that says proposed ADU sorry that's a typo existing ADU to be greater than 50% of the principal structure so under the code ADUs cannot exceed 50% of the living area of the principal structure but this excludes spaces such as garages
and porches and other spaces from the definition of living area so the existing ADU is 545 square ft living area and that's a total of 590 square ft and then we subtracted the 45 ft of storage space and the principal
structure is 960 ft so the ADU can only be a maximum of 580 or 480 ft sorry and then so it currently exceeds the maximum permitted size by 65 square feet and then here's a footprint so you can
kind of see the orientation how it's laid out and both structures are facing the south boundary line and there's an aerial as well and then just to go back over sort of an overview of the request and the variance criteria the dual frontage
prevents the ADU from being located behind the principal structure oh okay yeah because of both the because of that through lot either way you're in the front yard and it's consistent with the intent of the zoning district as ADUs are
permitted in the R4 zoning district um a literal interpretation of the ordinance would require removal of the ADU which would put an undue hardship on the owner and then the request is the minimum necessary to allow us to resolve the outstanding code violation and again as was previously mentioned it's been on
the property for almost 40 years so it won't we don't believe it will injure the surrounding area and that is everything okay any questions for the applicant Mr costa yeah quick question um this uh was a a garage previously
correct yes built with the house originally yes and converted two years later okay all right that's all I need to know thank you yep okay okay i don't see anyone else on this list so is there do we have any public participation on for this one
miss Summers no sir okay we're going to close the floor for public participation and uh open it up for commission discussion or a motion i'll be glad to make a motion go ahead i move that case number
V2510 variance uh be approved subject to two staff recommendations i've got a motion on the floor from Miss Shel to approve variances one and two for V25010 with the two staff conditions and
a second for Mr sixma any discussion on the motion all those in favor signify by saying I i any opposed motion carries unanimously okay that finishes the old uh business so we're going to move right
into our new business miss Shelley could I get the first case please yes case V-25-015 variances to the minimum yard requirements on urban mobile home MH5 zoned property
thank you Miss Shel miss Ray this one's yours also good morning again so the applicant is requesting three variances to resolve a code violation variance one is to reduce the west side lot line from 15 ft to 0
feet for an existing dock variance two is to reduce the east side lot line from 15 ft to 0 feet for an existing boat house and variance three is to reduce the north waterfront yard from 25 ft to 11 ft for a proposed
deck the property is a canal front property located on the north side of Lewis Street it is developed with a mobile home that was constructed in 1974 and is developed with a boat house and a wood dock that were constructed in 1978 according to historical aerial
aerials the dock received hurricane damage in approximately 2017 in 2019 the applicant began making repairs without a permit but did not become a code violation until 2021 the applicant did apply for an after
the-act building permit in 2022 and that's where it was discovered that the encroachment to the side lot lines for the existing dock and boat house the applicant is also proposing a new deck over the existing boat house that is proposed to extend southward over the land encroaching into the
waterfront yard staff's recommendation for variances one and two is for approval as the variances met at least three of the five criteria and variance three is for denial as it fails to meet three of the five criteria i do also want to note that we received one letter of support from an adjacent
neighbor to the south and I'm available for questions thank you M ray i don't see anybody Oh Mr costa yeah I have a quick question for you um on variance three so there's an existing deck there
now currently no sir there's not there's not an existing deck or dock rather um the boat house is existing um but where they're trying to extend over the land that is not existing they'll call you so the 11
ft that you're showing that they want to go on variance three Mhm there's currently nothing there there's a boat house there correct boat house there yes sir but to be able to extend from the boat house landward they would need that variance uh to the waterfront yard cuz it's not it's going past the boat house
okay I got you i understand it now thank you you're very welcome okay I don't see anyone else so is the applicant here sorry I can barely hear okay part of getting older I guess good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record
william Porter P O R T- er 192 Lewis Street Edgewater Florida okay you've heard the staff report is anything you would like to add to that this morning say that again please said you've heard the staff report anything you'd like to add to it this morning sir
yes sir i I sort of heard it uh but I read it before I came in okay uh what I understood was that u it's it's approved for the setback because it was built in 1978 the docks it actually adjoins the dock next door to me as well that's on
the west end but as far as the boat house goes it had the deck on top of it in 1978 and your records show that it it it it's a deck it was built in 1978 and it
was a 10 by4 then it shows that the boat house is 10 by 20 well at one time the boat house may have been 10 by 20 but it had a wooden ramp that went into the water as
far as the six foot from the seaw wall so you could put your boat on it and pull it right into the boat house mhm that fell apart before I had a chance to fix it so I think that's what they call 20 foot because right now the boat house is 14 by roughly 10 10 x 14 but on the
records it says it's 10 x 20 but it also says in there that the deck is 10 by 14 and that's the deck on top of the boat house and what I had proposed was to extend
the south end of the deck where I could be on top of my first retention wall so that I wouldn't have to step down and then step back up i have a disabled son and I'm getting old so I wanted to be able to just walk right on it uh it had
a ramp but I didn't repair the ramp in time so it fell apart when this other stuff started falling apart so originally all I wanted to do was repair the dock that was in the center of the yard at the seaw wall but somebody
turned me in for putting the boards on it so I guess okay so v these v these three variances going to address your concerns and be able to do what you want to do there is that correct yes sir okay
all right okay mr costa you had a question yeah one quick question for you the um this proposed dock does not go further out into the water it's only going across your property line correct yes sir the same post and everything are there all right thank you yes sir thank
you okay it doesn't look like we have any other Oh wait a minute miss Shelly I forgot um when you came to the podium this is just for clarification in my head you I believe you said your address was 192
Lewis Street that's where I live now i lived at 123 so this is your property and you are the Gotcha okay thank you couldn't live there it wasn't safe to go to the water anymore so thank you okay um Mr porter you have you read the three
conditions that that the staff recommended in the packet here i read for it had been approved for one and two which was the two sides no I'm talking about if in the event this was to go forward and be approved you've got three conditions that you abide by for the
variance in the packet did you read those i I I probably did but I don't know could you refresh my memory on those okay it basically it says variants one through three are limited to the size and location of the
dock boat house and deck as depicted on the variant site plan in other words whatever you put on there you can't make any larger it has to be within that boundaries there absolutely ex and it also says the applicant shall obtain all required after the facts permits within
60 days of variance approval for any unpermitted structures so now you're going to have to get permits for those unpermitted structures that you've done is 60 days going to be time for you to do that it should be but I don't have any unpermitted they were already there
all I'm doing is replacing things that were there it requires a permit though sir but it requires a permit to replace what has fallen down yes sir okay okay so you're going to have to apply for these permits
and you they're giving you 60 days to do that 60 days is that sufficient time for you well with the I have to read some re get an engineer again and and uh change things like that so um for the plans I
already sent in I have the dock but I guess we're not approving my deck extending out yes sir that's all in the same application um on the variant site plan it shows the dock the boat house and that deck so what your engineered
plans that you've already submitted yes that's what we have here for for it to be approved so you can submit that with your permits yes okay you're going to see if we can approve that yes if it gets approved here you will take that yeah you will have to get your permits for that i apologize for my hearing i
just That's fine i just want to be clear what you have to do a after this moves forward and it will also require a wetland alteration permit will be required that impacts any wetland buffers you're aware of that yeah I was uh someone told me that once I got this
approved that we could put them all together okay and get it all done at once well I just don't want you to leave here thinking that it's all said and done there's other things that you need to do to to move this forward okay okay all right miss Shel you had a question uh no i'm fine okay do we have any
public participation forms for this case no sir all right sir we're going to close the four for public participation and we're going to make our decision now okay okay all right thank you okay okay we're closing the floor for public participation and open up for commission discussion or a motion
something I'd like to ask is the can we make I know we got the steep the three staff conditions on here if I do make a motion on this could we change 60 to possibly 90 days we can time if that's what your motion would be yeah because
the way things you know who knows if that'll be enough time okay I will make a motion for approval for case B25015 with the staff three conditions with number two being extended from 60 to 90 days second okay okay i got a
motion on the floor for Mr sixma to approve variances one two and three for V25015 with the three staff recommended conditions with the amendment to make the uh recommendation number two from 60
to 90 days any discussion on the motion miss Shelley are you still want to talk go ahead no no okay why is this on here i'm going to reset it right now there we go okay okay um all those in favor
signify by saying I i any oppose motion carries unanimously sir all right thank you good luck Miss Shel could I get the next case please case number V-25-017 variances to the minimum yard
requirements on urban mobile home MH5 zoned property miss Ray this one's yours also the applicant is seeking two variance two variances to replace um an existing dock variance one is to reduce the west
side lot line from 15 ft to 0 feet variance two is to reduce the east side lot line from 15 ft to 0 feet the owners purchased the property in two uh 2024 the subject
prop the subject property is currently vacant except for the existing dock and boat lift according to historical aerials the dock received hurricane damage in approximately 2016 according to the applicant's written petition the replacement dock is
proposed to be located within the same footprint of the existing dock the existing boat lift is proposed to be demolished and replaced with a boat lift that is smaller in size the variances are unlikely to be injurious to the area as there are adjacent properties that
have docks similar in size and they are replacing the dock that has been in place for about 20 years v staff's recommendation for variances one and two is for approval as the variances meet at least three of the five criteria i'm available for questions
thank you Miss Ray and we don't have anybody want any questions so is the applicant present good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record uh my name is Ken Anderson 817 East 9inth Avenue New Summer Beach Florida 32169 all right sir you've heard the staff
report anything you would like to add to it no sir all right any questions for the applicant we don't see any do we have any public participation forums for this case no sir okay we're going to close the floor for public participation and open up for commission discussion or motion thank
you i'll be glad to make a motion go ahead Miss Shel i move that we approve case number case V-25-017 uh subject to one staff condition second i got a motion on the floor for Miss
Shel to approve variances one and two for V250017 with the one condition from staff and a second for Mr sixma any discussion on the motion all those in favor signify by saying I i any opposed motion carries
unanimously and Shelley could I get the next case please yes case number V-25-018 a variance to the minimum yard requirements on urban single family residential R9 zoned property
thank you Miss Shelley and Miss Mr shams this one's yours hi good morning uh to begin I'd just like to establish the proposed variance is only applicable to the waterfront yard if approved the variance would permit a buildable area and would not supersede any other
requirements so the applicant's home was destroyed during hurricanes Ian and Nicole and is currently being reconstructed um you can see the reconstruction on your screen right now um it is seawward of the coastal construction control line which requires
additional permitting and review by uh Florida Department of Environmental Protection the applicant obtained an an approved permit for the new residence with a 4ft retaining wall and a permit for the concrete seaw wall uh as a condition of the permit a 25 foot wide
area between the home's retaining wall and the concrete seaw wall is a storm water drainage swale per the county code the waterfront yard begins at the concrete seaw wall the applicant is requesting a variance to reduce the waterfront yard from 25 ft to 14 ft for
an 11 by 11 deck extension according to the applicant the deck extension will be attached to the 4ft retaining wall and step down into an enclosed seating area that includes built-in seating and a natural gas line for a fire pit the applicant also intends to place filled
dirt on the landward side of the retaining wall for stability overall staff recommends denial as the variance does not meet any of the five criteria if PLLDRC finds evidence to approve staff recommends two conditions and I'm available for comment or question
thank you Mr shams i don't see any questions oh Mr costa you had quick one here so this variance that they're requesting so the house was destroyed during the hurricanes was this deck existing prior to
um part of the house that got destroyed or is this an addition to what was there previously um so I believe the deck the retaining wall was there which is being re rebuilt um the applicant can provide further
information on that but as far as what he's proposing that's new and can we go back to those construction pictures please all right so that that is the house as it currently sits right now and during construction yes sir and so the and if I'm looking at this picture correctly the back of that seaw wall the
deck that we're talking about extends outward from there no sir it it extends closer to the home so inward of that wall yes okay so if I'm looking at this correctly then that um seaw wall there is actually behind both the properties on the left and the right of the picture
or is that an optical illusion they're behind both those feet wall lines correct on the left and right yes okay that's correct thank you so the the clarification here again is this he's not going exceeding the seaw wall is that correct the seaw wall is a
setback point the seaw wall as you see it right there is where the waterfront yard begins then it moves towards the home so and previously with that new seaw wall being built was it further out i I believe so this is an area that
experienced a lot of erosion um because they they applied for a seaw wall it is the DP that dictates the location of that seaw wall so it's not the county so they they if I recall this property had
more land seawword of the structure um but because they obtained a seaw wall from the DP the seaw wall is now the measurement of the of the waterfront yard okay and this variance Mr sora I'm looking at the staff
conditions it's limited to the size and location of the actual just the deck request that he's planning on building in other words he can't go and put another building or anything in that variance yes yes he can
no he can't this it's it's basically asking just for this just specifically what he's requested okay that was my question okay is the applicant present good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record sure good morning ken Meister at 4227 South
Atlantic Avenue all right sir you've heard the staff report anything that you would like to add to it yeah I just want to clarify one thing that the the requested variance would be off of the retaining wall so it wouldn't it wouldn't come off of the the question you asked was off of the seaw wall
seawward it wouldn't even come off of the seaw wall landward it would start from the new retaining wall that's 25 ft landward of the seaw wall and then extend 11 ft towards the water and so in
essence um as you could tell by the pictures I lost 32 feet of property when the D made me locate the seaw wall 32 feet landward from my neighbor's seaw walls so I've lost not only the 32
feet of property but then with the 25 ft setback I lost a lot of property so I'm just trying to gain a sitting area i could have asked for a larger variance i kept it to 5% of the setback i think it's reasonable um it's all in my property
and and any concrete structure there is going to be even further landward than my neighbors concrete structures so it's just basically an impact of the hurricane i'm just trying to get some backyard back all right sir any questions do we have any
questions for the applicant yeah I'd like to say something so your existing seaw wall was farther out before the hurricane i didn't have a seaw wall i just had dunes okay you went ahead went after hurricane either up but Okay good thanks
all right um do we have any public participation for this i have a question i have a question oh oh we're supposed speak button now there you go i pressed it and left mine on thank you um what is the deck construction
material is it wood it's probably going to be a wood we haven't finalized that yet because we were just waiting to get past this phase but most likely it's going to be a wood material so it would have peers down into this
into the sand yeah there'll be drainage into the sand okay thank you mhm okay we don't have any public participation forms so we're going to close the floor for public participation open up for commission discussion or maybe even a motion at
this time okay all right thank you sir okay we are closing the four for public participation i'm put it up for commission discussion or motion i think I'm ready to make a motion go ahead Mr
i'll make a motion for approval for case 255018 with the staff's two conditions second i got a motion on the floor for Mr sixman to approve variance V25018 with the two conditions from
staff and a second from Mr costa any discussion on the motion all those in favor signify by saying I i any opposed motion um okay okay it's uh four four to one with Miss
Craig in descent okay all right miss Shel could I get the next case yes sir case number V-25-020 variances to the minimum yard
requirements and maximum lot coverage requirements on urban single family residential zoned property thank you Michel and this Mr shams also hi good morning so the applicant is seeking variances to allow reconstruction of outdoor wooden decks
and wooden walkways to allow beach access um this is also a result of hurricane damage uh the site is developed with a 4,000q ft residence originally constructed in 1960 and the current owner purchased the site in August 2023 um the property is supported by a
seaw wall along the entirety of the eastern boundary the eastern most 35 ft on the northern and southern boundaries according to the applicant there was a previous deck area before uh the property is seawward of the coastal
construction control line and requires FD permits as you can see there are four uh distinct structures being proposed uh the applicant received an approved FD permit for the proposed work
um R9 zoning class requires a 7 foot sideyard and a 25 foot waterfront yard and it also has a 35% maximum lot coverage the property currently exceeds uh the lot coverage at 43% and the proposed structures would increase it to
45% so overall they're requesting five variances reduce the north side yard from 7 feet to 0 feet for the wooden walkway and deck reduce the east east waterfront yard from 25 feet to 4 feet 8 inches for a wooden deck uh reduce the
east waterfront yard from 25 feet to zero feet for the wooden walkway uh reduce the southside yard from 7 feet to 2 feet for the walkway and deck and to increase the lot coverage from 35% to 45% overall staff recommends approval as all five
variances meet three of the five criteria and we also recommend two conditions available for comment or question thank you Mr shans mr cross do you had a question i do this um this is just replacing what was lost
during the storm essentially it's the configuration is a little different but it's very similar square footage the layout I mean not the configuration but the square footage is the same pretty similar yes okay all right thank you okay we don't have any other
questions Mr shams if in the event that this were flat work if it wasn't decks that we're talking about it wouldn't require a permit would it could you repeat your question if it was flat work in other words if if this wasn't a wooden deck if it was flat work
concrete sidewalk it wouldn't require these permits correct no sidewalks do not okay that's that's what I wanted to find out and also there again I'll ask the same question I asked previously the condition of the staff recommendations is specific to this
wooden deck correct in other words another structure can't go within this variance that's correct sir okay there we go all right is the applicant present i'm just getting clarification on that you know good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record good
morning yes sir john Sharp 3660 Old Oak Court Orlando Florida 32812 all right you've heard the staff report anything you would like to add to it i'd like to add that I wholeheartedly agree okay it doesn't look like we have
any questions for you so uh do we have any public participation forms for this case no sir okay we're going to close it down we'll see if we can't get you get moving thank you get you a long time moved on all right closing for for public
participation and open up for commission discussion or a motion i'll be glad to make a motion go ahead Miss Shel i move that we approve case number V-25-020 variance to the minimum yard requirements and maximum lot coverage requirements on urban single family
residential or ninezoned property subject to two staff conditions thank you Miss Shel second okay I've got a motion on the floor to approve variances one two and three with the two staff conditions from
Miss Shelley for B25020 and a second from Mr costa any discussion on the motion all those in favor signify by saying I i any opposed we
good motion carries unanimously okay Miss Shelley could I get the next case please case number S-25- Z001 a special exception for a recreational area on prime agriculture A1 and
resource corridor RC zoned property okay this has also got a companion case with it so we might as well hear both of them yes sir i'm going to read that one too please case number V-25-023 variances to the minimum yard
requirements on prime agriculture A1 and resource corridor RC zoned property thank you Miss Shelley and Miss Smith this one is yours thank you this is a special exception for a recreation area on prime
agricultural property that's A1 classification a special exception is a use that would not be appropriate generally or without restriction through a particular zoning classification but that would not adversely affect the public health
safety comfort good order appearance convenience morals or general welfare if controlled in number area location relation to the neighborhood or in other appropriate respects so a recreation area is allowed in the A1 zoning classification with an approved special
exception and a recreation area is defined as a privatelyowned and operated facility providing recreation and sport uses such as golf courses country clubs swim clubs tennis clubs and the like a private recreational facility is generally sustained through the sale of memberships but it may be open to the
public for a fee the property owner has been operating a dog diving dog training facility at her residence it's a 10.56 acre parcel with business activities occurring near the southern boundary and access from Marsh Road code compliance receives some complaints from the
neighbors and the owner was issued a code violation they need to cease operations until that case is resolved the owner can resolve the code violation by getting a special exception for a recreation area and abiding by the conditions outlined in the special exception
the property is splitz zoned A1 and resource corridor but all the activities are limited to the A1 portion of the property activities include individual dog training lessons on a daily basis and dog diving competitions throughout the year the facility is open 7 days a
week from 10:00 a.m to 5:00 p.m weekdays are used for individual dog training appointments competitions are held over a 3-day period Friday through Sunday with an opening of 8 a.m to allow for registration at the diving events no overnight camping is
allowed so for traffic traffic generation for weekend events is approximately 120 trips a day traffic for daily appointments ranges from 6 to 24 trips a day and a typical single family residence generates about 10 trips a day recreational facilities
require all structures to be at least 50 feet from the property line the pool and the shed used for the business are less than 50 feet from the southern property line and the applicant is requesting variances for these structures variance one is for the above ground pool which
is 44.1 ft from the property line and variance two is for the shed which is located 12.3 ft from the property line the pool was permitted as a residential structure which was allowed to be located 8 feet from the property line
the shed could be located 5t from the property line if it was being used for residential purposes as well the building official determined that the pool should be permitted as a commercial structure since people and dogs are coming to the property and the pool is being used for business purposes we do have letters of support
and letters of opposition that have been received for this application and they are in your packet the adjacent neighbors most impacted by the business did submit letters of opposition so in reviewing the variances um staff recommends denial because they
don't meet at least three of the five criteria for granting variances we also do recommend denial of the special exception application because it does not meet all the special exception criteria and based on the letters of opposition it appears to adversely affect the adjacent neighbors
if the PLDRC finds that the application meets the criteria for a special exception we do have 12 conditions that have been provided on page eight of your staff report for your consideration and just a reminder that if the special exception is approved by county council the applicant still needs to go through the final site plan
process to ensure that parking storm water landscape buffers fire and building requirements and other special exception conditions are in place prior to reopening the business i'm here to answer any questions and the applicant also has a presentation thank you Miss
Smith i do have a few questions on near 12 recommendations it's limited to 30 dogs how are they going to h how would code enforcement enforce this how would that be obtained how will we know if they got
30 dogs or 50 dogs there at an event that's done on the weekend it would be through complaints through the code process we did put a limit on dogs because there was a recent case that you all heard for a dog um training facility that you did have a cap of 30 dogs on
that wound up um having a lot of complaints and um ultimately they were shut they were closed down as a special exception because they didn't keep that limit um we were advised to put a limit on here to avoid that problem in the future but you are welcome to change that number to whatever you all think is
appropriate no it's the not the number i'm wondering how it's going to be enforced code enforcement would have to go out there would have to be a complaint and Yes sir and on the weekend and code enforcement usually doesn't work on the weekend correct and neighbors could submit photos and things
okay the other thing is um it says no loudspeakers does that include megap phones and stuff like that any Yes sir that is a special condition um that that is a criteria of the recreation area you're not allowed
to have amplified sound okay i'm curious to see how they're going to communicate without it so okay all right thank you is the uh Mr costa Oh Miss Miss Craig you I had a question go ahead i need to pay attention can you turn
your mic on please sorry um I'm concerned about the traffic problems that could be resulted is there are there any requirements for signage on since this is a curved road we did not include signage requirements but you can certainly add those as
conditions if you so choose thank you Mr costa um yeah that there's on your conditions or recommendations here this is a public and animal event
correct people and animals at the same time correct correct no requirements for facilities bathrooms we can ask the applicant how they've been handling that in the past they have
been in operation mhm um but we can add specific requirements if you would like and I also know that on in cases where we've had um wedding venues for instance and parking you there was always a condition about uh ADA parking i don't
see that on this list of items either that's a requirement for building that all right thank you okay don't have any other questions so is the applicant present good morning sir could I get your name
and address for the record of course uh Joey Posey 420 South Nova attorney for the the owners um and I don't know how to move through this ah thank you oh I don't see the presentation and and I guess while the presentation's coming up I'll just jump into it and uh
you know a lot of these concerns actually are outlined in the concept plan that we submitted it does show ADA parking i just asked to be sure that we have portaotties and we also uh going to ensure that there's an ADA compliant portaotty out there too uh for all the
uh um guests that want to come out there and if they have those needs but um I I do want to maybe highlight some important parts and walk you through how we got here a little bit and uh maybe the nature of what they do cuz I I I feel as if the the nature of their
business is maybe been a little bit misrepresented and uh you know putting it on the record and trying to make sure we have uh you know just open and honest conversation about what these folks are up to I think would be very helpful um so just uh the background as uh I think
Trish indicated it is A1 property and just to be clear uh in the A1 property permitted uses such as outdoor entertainment events are permitted use and if you look at the definition of the code uh any activity designed to attract 500 or more persons per day one or more days for the purpose of listening to
viewing and or participating in outdoor entertainment conducted in open space outside of an enclosed building is is a use by right uh you you have the ability to do it uh just by the nature of being in an A1 zoning uh also there's a zone the zoning category allows the limited
boarding of dogs and uh just as a permitted use you don't have to go through a special exception uh so just to give you a flavor of what's allowed out there because this this is a little bit of a rural area and you know I recognize that some of it is residential but uh there are activities that uh are
just permitted by right that you're allowed to do on your property uh the uh mention of the 30 dogs uh that was something that came out uh when I read the staff report i wasn't aware of that until I read it but which is fine um the uh but uh you know this isn't a kennel
just to be clear you know it's a venue that folks can come and go uh at appointments during the week few appointments a week and they have periodic uh events that they advertise for that they try to encourage participation in and it's not an every
weekend thing uh at most uh it's eight or nine and that's one of the conditions I think that's mentioned in the special exception that uh these are these are very infrequent uh so so to move it's like I don't know if I'm doing this right oh there we go uh
so uh how we got here uh the property owner attempted to get a pool permit uh in 2023 for diving and swimming lessons uh it was conveyed to staff that's always been their that was always their purpose you know they wasn't trying to hide anything uh these folks are just your normal average Joe does that went
down tried to pull a permit and um you know the only clarification and guidance they were given was the lack of guardrails on the pool and just looking at the pool you can kind of you can tell by its nature a little bit that it isn't your normal residential pool uh and even staff was encouraged to attend events talking about what they're up to you
know what they want to do how they you know want to do these events out there uh and just the periodic appointments uh and at no point was the representation changed uh the pool was in the dock we're always going to be there for dog diving and swimming lessons so uh it it there it's permitted it has an actual
permit it just uh uh unfortunately went through a form of permitting that was a miscommunication and a misunderstanding as to what the nature of the the swimming pool was but that doesn't change anything on the applicant's end regarding their intent that they've always wanted to do this they're happy
to if there's additional requirements that come from commercial permitting happy to do it it's it's not a big deal from their end because this is always what they intended to do uh and I think uh if I remember correctly that the neighbors were even aware of this situation and invited onto the property
to see what they're up to so it's you it this just didn't happen and everybody woke up one day and there's a pool there uh looking at the special exception criteria um the separation requirement of 50 ft which is unique to the activity
center special exception uh these would be that would be a permitted structure otherwise so and I do recognize why the 50oot boundary would be important uh unfortunately the you know the pool and the footers went into the ground uh through a permitting process and uh they've been trying to do their best
based on feedback they received to try to be accommodating as possible to minimize impacts um and the presentation is going to get into it a little bit of a lot of those mitigation measures that they've taken um and if you look at the surrounding area also too just uh
highlighting structures around the immediate area it I think most of the properties suffer from the same problem when it comes to sideyard setbacks so um it's just a little bit of the nature of the area um and they were also trying to be conscious of everybody around them by
trying to get into that upland acreage trying to isolate in an area that's accessible uh and just to be respectful and uh in a way that tries to address the concerns that we've been hearing in terms of potentially that there may be noise concerns and that's great we're
happy to take that off the table and you know remove microphones you know loudspeakers and um and it looks like and and it's just as my rough estimate there's a few hundred feet away from the nearest structure but uh I can't tell really from the aerials other than that and uh we have no issues with the staff
recommended conditions so you know even the additions that were added uh you know the whole goal here is to be a periodic appointment only uh dog facility for dog diving you know they're very passionate about it and have the periodic events on the weekends which
are noticed everybody knows they're coming and uh you know just to stay accountable uh uh and the variance by necessity that that's why we're here with the variance too that uh the location of the pool because of the special exception trip
the variance criteria which has required us to get a variance for the pool uh the the shed also too would need a variance which is simply for the storing of uh of their equipment on the weekends it's um it's not a very large structure and to be honest with you if that that is
something that we can do to be accommodating you know we're happy to you know talk through what maybe some options to further limit the impacts uh and like I had mentioned earlier there's no issue with um addressing the safety and structural issues that potent
that have been alleged even though we're fairly confident that this pool has been overdesigned that uh would be through the county permitting process uh to clarify also just how you know maybe some of the what you may hear is
uh you know the first event took in back in July that uh it was they were very excited to do it they had friends out there um there were two RVs that came out that were friends uh of the of the actual family um after it was made clear that they were not allowed to have RVs
there has been no RVs since uh and there that will be the rule moving forward uh the same is true of a food truck that there was somebody that a local person that came out there with a food truck uh at the July event and the July event u
we heard the complaints they responded immediately and there has not been a food truck since and the notice to hearings as you can tell and you can see the timeline and it moved fairly quickly and the problem that they ran into with their oc their August and September events is that uh funny enough the dog
diving uh activity itself is a has a u a competitive permitting process through in North America and um you have to schedule your events a year in advance so there was no opportunity to cancel those events in August or September but as of the October hearing date that we
had for co- compliance there has been no events since so uh you know they're trying to do the right thing and you know this is something that you know they do as really what they they're passionate about that that this is what they want to do and uh you know I do feel for them a little bit that there is a financial hurt when it comes to these
kind of things because it's you know and I can imagine from as you guys see from your perspective it's hard to have those conversations when you rely on this a little bit for your income um but move and then moving forward the uh again the
hearing was in October uh they've addressed even future uh moving forward with future events there was one that I think was alluded to in the staff report in March but that was with the anticipation that we would be done with this process by March so it's not happening um it's again it's dependent
on us moving through this process um there again no food trucks like we said uh the obedience training uh if there is any that requires uh you know a something beyond just the normal things you would do associated with dog diving
then it would be it's it's done offsite there's there's nothing like that happening at the facility uh and just to maybe dispel some rumors that may be floating out there that you know events are every weekend and no it's it's not it's 6 to 8 6 it's 8 n 10 8 to 9 at most
and I think the staff report specified nine if I remember correctly as the cap and they're weather dependent uh there's loud music all the time uh again they were very quick about not doing any audible sound after they heard the first complaint um there will be no food trucks uh this was an RV event there's
no RVs that are allowed uh and here's just an example and uh we even invited county staff if they'd wanted to attend to uh see what one of these looks like and this was in August um 2024 uh really just um you know it's it's a very informal setting and it's dogs diving
into a pool that's really the sum of it uh and and you've been trying to do their part too by reaching out to neighbors um you know they've done a lot of their homework and you know I think that there's nine folks on Marsh Road that they've reached out directly that get
support from and about 15 others in the immediate area uh and these are in addition to your staff report uh letters and also some local businesses and one even on Marsh Road uh that recognizes the benefit of something like this in the community and another letter from a
new Sarna Beach facility that runs a similar operation that um also does the same thing and you know it's it's not a very it's it's not a very large and grand event it's it's dogs diving into a pool and uh periodic lessons that happen during the week for uh you know the
training associated with it so uh I I'm happy to answer any questions um you know we really want to do the right thing and if there's ways to limit this we're happy to do it um you know I just wanted to make sure it was clear that you know these folks are not trying to you know run a big grand um event or facility and that you know some of the
things that may be allowed by right they they're not looking to do that they just want to do something that's limited it has you know very tight uh conditions to it and that if there's anything we can do to help you know that's why I think all these folks are here over here to you know just voice how much they you
know do appreciate and and uh you know what these what they're doing because there's a lot of benefit that you know people can come out and enjoy these type of uh these type of events so uh I'm available for questions or if there's anything I can clarify that wasn't touched on okay Mr costa you had a
question yes good morning good morning can you go to your slide number 10 the beginning of the clarifications and rumors your very first line this is not Nope this is not a dog training facility yes first line on the on the case number
25001 is recreational air to operate a dog diving pool and a training facility so which is it it again I I it's the implications of code compliance or it the code definitions it where all they're doing is dog diving and there's
appointment trainings if you want to call it training associated with the dog diving and they've got a frisbee area and a little I think if you go out there you'll see some little gymnastics area for the dogs but that that's really it so do they train dogs Monday through Friday and then have diving events on
the weekends or no if you're saying training as in I mean they're teaching them how to dive that's correct i I and that's a fair that's a fair that's a fair assessment i just I just want to be careful with saying that it's training as if it's some a it's being associated with for instance the
K9 facility that was alluded to over here yeah correct totally different right honestly when I first read this I thought it was a joke it's like dog diving what the heck i had to look it up and it is it's a thing it really is a it's a big thing actually it's not a
small thing um the other question I have is there is a picture that's been submitted and um actually it may be on the very first page of your layout as well if you can go there over here yeah that one doesn't
really quite show it it showed the property line showed the pool to the relationship to the property line with the adjacent neighbors it looked like uh to the below them i'm going to assume that's to the south this one yeah that one and actually there was a picture that was submitted but regardless the
only thing separating those two properties right there in that picture is a chain link fence is that correct no it's a sixoot fence now there is a six fence there now yes we out of courtesy to the neighbor they've installed a sixoot fence as of a month ago about
three weeks ago three weeks ago three weeks ago yeah final fencing see if this picture has a date on it and it does not okay that's all I had thank you
okay I've got a Miss Craig you had a question yes um when you were reading about the uh the definition of the A1 zoning it mentioned boarding of dogs being allowed is there are there is there any
possibility that this could turn into a No no no no and I and I'm happy to put that in the conditions too if it needs to be explicit but there's there's no intent to board them and there will be none so I I I only I only brought it up just to give a sense of what is possible
and what's allowed by right in the zoning category just because of the uh you know the nature of the use and you know terms of outdoor events in terms of boarding of dogs by right um you know those discussions don't happen here you know this discussion is happening here
because of just the nature of what outdoor wreck and its definitions are and I just wanted to make that clear for the record miss Shel you had a question yes I have a couple of questions um when did the owners purchase this property
96 and how long has it been operating in this capacity uh Well the diving and what you're doing Sir I'm gonna have to get you to come forward and put his name on the record yeah you need to put your name in record
and and uh for your comments july correct july 1 my name is Fred Ford i live at 3098 Marsh Road and as far as this what we're doing
now was July 1st was when that was completed and we opened it up then we had our events we have not been doing the dock diving prior to that no okay um have you been having events on this property prior to that no um interesting
because some of the letters I've been attending these events for years was in one of the letters i was just wondering the Well I think they were talking about in general dock diving events not our Oh not particularly on your property okay thank you for that clarification um so
you purchased the property in 93 93 and you've started doing the pool diving in what year 2024 2024 just careful okay got that on there okay um the other thing I was going to ask I
was trying to write notes along here as we went um okay so no lighting because the activities are all in the day yes okay and then uh I would just say from my perspective in reading through the report
um the all the the letters that were submitted in support uh the majority um did not have uh address they were more like conversations and it would be really good for our point of view to
have the person have their name and address submitted any time they're doing something and there were not a lot of addresses in what I received um regarding this and like on your petition it says cities uh lots of cities and all that
but they're uh addresses and then um you're not going to have any food trucks or outdoor sound i'm sorry there was another question I wrote on here when Joey was talking oh oh the discussion on and and I heard um Mr posey say that there would
uh you know shook his head on or talk mention the canines a little bit because that also was included in here so because uh so you're not planning on doing K9 training on your property meaning police no no law enforcement
animals okay thank you Mr costa yes uh back to the your presentation page one please that one right there so if I'm reading this correctly you're telling me that that the definition says
not more than 500 persons per day correct on a five on a 10acre parcel as as permitted as permitted yes it's a lot of people potentially agreed on the first event that you had roughly how many people attended uh
approximately for the weekend well just in in a a particular day in a 24-h hour period uh we estimated it to be about 40 45 people okay so under that's throughout the day they come in the
morning they some come early some come later at uh the zoning they don't come and stay and do things congregated at one point was less than 50 people yes okay my concern all right that's that's that's reasonable then the other question I have is regarding the swimming pool because we have an u the
companion here is the uh the yard requirement so when the swimming pool was originally put in was the intended purpose for this yes yes it was and we we talked to the permitting office explained what we were trying to do in
hopes that we would get the proper direction there was some miscommunication or something for some reason and they said "Well here's what you need residential pool da da da." So they gave you the residential pool setbacks as opposed to a and residential pool permitting okay that's what I
wanted to find out all right and how long ago was that that was uh October 20 2023 was when we finally got the uh permits approved to go forward and then
the final inspection was uh on all of it i believe it was May could be earlier than that of what year h of what year 2024 of 24 so
okay so and you didn't have your first event until the July July of 24 right all right and then here we are today all right that's it thank you Mr sora yeah um I think this board should and
with Mr proposal should clarify the training aspects because we uh staff took the queue based on you know their their historical use and their advertised use so they are advertising you know training uh basic obedience
service dog skills dog swim lessons dog diving lessons you know occasionally they have competitions that's the event um but they also stayed on their flyer you know they work with local shelters um they're planning or this may not be that may not actually happen to offer
their services to police and fire departments to allow them to train their their canines so there's a kind of training aspect it's just that it it you may want to clarify on what that kind of looks like but that's why the special exception is written as it is to account
for you know I don't know if it's training the dogs to jump into the water is the training position but that's kind of what staff is looking at okay thank you Mr sora and I don't mind clarifying if you'd like go ahead i I I
was just talking this through and and I think it's fair to say that you know there is general obedience in some of the aspects i it's fair to say that you know it's if it's for dog diving or not that you know it's it's there is some obedience and it doesn't have to be dog diving uh but it is for individuals um
you know that's that's all they've really ever had and I think in terms of folks that are booking these appointments so um you know it's you know anybody who wants to come in and train their dog and get the dog diving you know that's really the intent it's you know the partnerships would be great but that's not the nature of the special
exception and you know um nor what isn't the intent of the special exception for this application may I go ahead Mr the So that Let's go back to this training uh the individual one-on-one so you're not boarding any animals overnight to train no they're
being they're brought in it's almost like a daycare you're the the owners are bringing the dogs in you're working with them with the owners and the animal at the same time owners and the animals simultaneously usually would be like an hour hour and a half uh do some work and then they go home and work with what
we've shown them in groups or in individuals individuals individual only yep okay so at maximum we used to have my angel with paws service dogs okay at one point and that's where we got started with the dog training okay but
it's we're just doing it just oneon-one by appointment only right perfect yep okay thank you Miss Craig you had a question um yeah I'm curious about the um national organization does it have
any uh restrictions on the size of of these events or what are what are the normal how how large can these events grow to i mean I understand that this is a new uh enterprise and so you said you had a a peak of 45 people is there you know is there the possibility that it
could fill up well the July event was way beyond what we really expected it was busier than we thought it would be and as far as I know NAD NAD does not
have any restrictions on how many people you can do other than the amount of people you can handle getting done in a day you know they don't want you running into the night they don't really like lit pool because
lighting at night doesn't light down into the pool it's not safe so So Fred is it safe to say that they would take deference to the county requirements absolutely yeah they're they would follow whatever the permitting in the area
requires um Okay i don't know of any that have gone really beyond what we did on Janu on July thank you M mr costa yep um by chance do we have this picture available to put
up just want to get clarification on comment that we made earlier if I could waiting on the picture yep waiting on the picture yeah and and while we're waiting for the picture I did want to point out that in the PowerPoint there are several other
support letters with addresses that didn't otherwise make it so I I just wanted to make sure you guys PowerPoint which we don't have i I do I do have physical because I saw them on on the screen i was like that would have been nice those were in addition these folks have been working
hard not coming up okay that's fine so if you take a look at that picture and it doesn't have a date on it um that chain link fence is the one I was referring to you're saying that's been replaced by a uh Yes sixoot stockade fence of some sort six foot
vinyl vinyl PVC okay so now you have separation between the neighbors it goes along that property line and then along the front towards the road okay so it's blocked from the road as well as the neighbor itself okay that's what I wanted to clarify thank you and a
clarification uh on the I guess NAD does she's our NAD specialist expert does have a limit on number of splashes that you can do each day and splashes is how many times a dog jumps in the water
interesting okay that's per dog 45 45 Okay I've got a few questions here um you had a thing from additional area support correct was any of those
adjoining property owners uh not not immediately adjoining that's incorrect uh the only adjoining owners I think are the two that are jointly owned and one's a rental the gentleman across the street was spoken to uh and I can let Fred
speak to that if you'd like but um I think the only person that wasn't reached was the northerly owner but I think it may be a relative of the other owners i I'm not immediately sure uh but we the attempt was made okay but they because we have letters of opposition
from it look to me like all the adjoining property owners you know I'm just telling you about that and the additional area support that you had none of those majority would you say that the majority of those I would say
90% do not live in the area that area immediate area on several of those are like uh a letter from the person on the other side of the property south of us there's uh letters from people further
up the road by a couple of houses but I'm just what I'm talking about is adjacent properties not adjacent to us no okay okay and in the one of the conditions it said for the loudspeakers okay i don't know
how many decibb that would be or considered but when you have let's say 20 dogs let's don't even go to the maximum 20 dogs there are excited dogs and you got the barking and stuff going on do you would you say that
that because I I know that I can hear a dog bark a long ways a lot further than I can hear a loudspeaker a lot of times and to have those 30 excited dogs there with the barking how are you going to communicate
the event without a loudspeaker or something to overshadow this noise of the dog barking well generally it's the information we post like order
of dogs on a board for everybody to know we don't necessarily have to announce it to anybody that they're it's there and it's a it's a fairly compact area and we can communicate we have not had any problem
since we stopped using the amplified speaker to announce things um as far as I know it's just basically we'll holler out to people and in the statement you
just said you said it was a fairly compact area where the dogs are and where the pool is right and so that compact area is actually on the edge of the actual 10 acres so really it's not it's not like we're looking at this
sitting in the middle of 10 acres correct and when you put up your event I'm looking at a picture here where you had a temporary uh thing closer than what the pool is and in that buffer zone a what
temporary umbrella oh yes so what I'm the point I'm trying to make is you're bringing this event right next to adjacent property owner that have probably been there a lot longer than what this facility has yes and so I agree that you
should have property rights and everything but I believe we all should take in consideration the adjacent property owner that this is going to have to them when maybe not to you or your supporters an adverse effect for the amount of dog barking and stuff that would be going
on and the amount that the commotion and the traffic and that would come into that area i'm very familiar with this area and there was some other special exceptions that actually I was against because of the traffic coming in and out of Marsh Road there because it that
there's been some deaths on Marsh Road there mhm and so there is a traffic that should be well u made aware of that road there well I can't so I just I just and going back to your variance there this is an above
ground pool how difficult would it be able to move it out of that uh in the event that that were to go through how difficult would it be able to to move it into the setback the problem with that is that it is associated to the dock which is in
concrete pillars so it has to be placed in relation to the dock where it is so we would have to move the dock also so we'd have to tear down the dock and pour new footers and everything else
you've got uh 37 parking spaces what would you do if you had an event just like you said and you didn't expect the out you know the return out how you going to how you going to regulate the turnout when you have more
than 37 people show up for an event well well and and I'm trying to figure out a way maybe to manage this and u you know an easy way to do that would probably be to make sure that folks uh RSVP ahead of time and if you're not RSVPd it's one of those things where you
know trying to control the management or even turn them away i I mean if there's no parking there's no parking and you know that's one of those situations and the only time this became an issue was I think the initial July event with the expectations of the other aspects of
what was being advertised and you know these folks understood that you know that that isn't something that we can do moving forward and that we have to control this in a way that manages the size of it that that's that's the idea and that from the August and September events they they were very low-key it
wasn't nearly the the the same impacts that we're talking about from July partly because um you know the way that it was handled from a management perspective understanding the issues from the first event um and trying to be responsive to the neighbors uh just from what they had heard um and I think that
you know even a large number of these folks over here could probably attest to it better than I can because they were there physically but um you know if there's ways to manage it in a way that we're communicating with folks communicating with neighbors we're happy to do it um you know I just you know I I think it's always true that you know any
any event in itself you know it doesn't have parking it doesn't have parking you gota you got to move on and it's if it has a limited number of parking that's the the rules they've got to abide by but if there's a way to keep accountability and communicate we're happy to do it
okay the other the other thing here is you talk about working with local shelters how does this go hand inand the diving that's just something we'd like to do is help them and it would not
necessarily what what was discussed is possibly taking shelter dogs bringing them out see how they do with dock diving what they think of it what the dogs react like and then promote that
dog to dock diving people who might be interested in looking for a new dog okay we wouldn't be housing them we wouldn't be doing any of the actual adoption anything like that it would just
basically be okay we found this adoptable dog that loves dock diving anybody interested okay all right sir that was all my questions miss Shel you had a question can you turn your mic on please
this is a business and all businesses I have a business you want your business to grow and so um and the excitement I mean I've I have actually been not here but I have seen an event and um they are popular they and I I
don't understand how limiting to 35 I I always get very concerned when the the um maintaining or the the egreg it falls on either neighbors to file complaints
it's it's a reactive enforcement or you having someone at the gate that says "Sorry we only have I'm just throwing out a number 35 parking spaces you can't come in." Those things cause tension resentment neighbors having to call in
and it's this self policing that makes something very difficult so that's just a comment out there okay well as we as I mentioned NAD limits the number
of event or dives that the dogs can do during the day and generally the dogs do several each dog will do several during the day three or four they're limited to 45
it's going to be really hard to get more than 30 people in there 30 cars in there if each dog is even doing two jumps i I understand that but so there are no So you won't have people coming in to watch you don't have people watching the
event it's only the dog owner only the dog only it is mostly dog owners there are a few uh spectators but not but again it's self policing so um as far as
growing the business uh the growth of the pool would be that we're kind of limited on that because of the NAD and the area if it ever got to a point where okay we want
to grow that we'd probably move and well and I think more importantly you'd have to come back here and get a special exception approval and just a few points maybe to help ease concerns here that um you know any we're we're happy and I think it may have been a condition that you know if there isn't a complaint and
it's verifiable that you know one of these condition a dozen conditions are violated that you know these folks are happy to be held accountable as to the special exception you know it's it's something that you know gives teeth to what they're trying to do um the other side of this too is um you know it by
right there's you know a businesses are allowed there they're allowed to do outdoor events of 500 people you know there are things you're just allowed to do by right if you choose to um and that doesn't require special permission it just requires come through with a site plan show compliance with the code uh
you know the dogs I understand may be a unique factor here but you know controlling that aspect of it again with the NAD requirement for the splashes the uh ways that we are committing to trying to limit the number um really puts them at risk that if the special exceptions
violated then boom it's gone you don't you don't get to come back and try again um and and you know that's the accountability that we're happy to do and uh you know trying to try to ease concerns with impacts of neighbors um I think that shed is movable Um you know just thinking out loud
trying to work through things you know that's something that would be a consideration because maybe there's a way to re rework that um you know I really hesitate about the pool just because the footers are in the ground and um you know the the permitting process for that was a little bit of a nightmare but you know these folks want
to do the right thing and make it and and make it right um but if there's I I'm just trying to think out loud because it's not unique necessarily to this business that some of the concerns we're talking about but this business would has a lot more accountability aspects to it with this
approval than other businesses would have because they risk losing their special exception the other folks don't so it's um you know just something to keep in mind okay i don't see any other questions for you so we do have some public
participation forms i will allow you to come back can we address this you sure can uh this picture is a little the perspective is a little off that tent is actually right next to the pool not next to the
fence that is our judge's tent that the judge that jud is judging the dogs jumping sits out there and watches the dogs so it's actually a good uh 20 feet from the fence
all right it shows that your pool is 40ome feet away from the fence that's that tent there is a 10 by 10 fence okay is it right up against the pool it doesn't look like it's not it's within 3 ft of the f of the pool
it looks like it's right next to the fence but it really isn't and can I and I think the easy answer to address this is that if it's a you almost like a demarcation zone where we're not talking about structures or any thing in there
it makes it very easy and ver easy to verify that if that's the the way the special exception is conditioned that that judge's tense will have to just be relocated yeah which is something that these folks didn't realize at the get-go that why we're here and why we're working through
this and you know to do the right thing and that it you know an easy easy picture can verify whether that's the case or not well you now that he brings the picture up I wasn't going to mention this but you know you you downplay the size of
these events because of the amount of dives a dog can do but yet looking at this picture it looks like it was set up for a pretty large event or that you were hoping it to be what do you mean well you've got the decorations up there on the top and
everything i mean for just for a few dogs I don't think you would go all out like that in order to have just an event that you would Yeah the sun sails on top we pretty much leave them all the time for any of the use it just keeps the sun off the dock so that it doesn't uh get
so hot you can barely walk on it okay uh that's not really decorations it's not really decorations and some of the things that you're seeing like the banners along are pretty much permanent they're there too all the time okay all
right like I said we do have some public participation forms and I'll give you an opportunity to come back and uh for rebuttal on these and so let's get started with Miss uh with Nathan Battles i have another question
good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record absolutely nathan Andrew Battles um 3725 Marsh Road okay um I do live there as well as own Noah's Arc boarding kettle okay um me and my wife and children go to these types of events all over the country my
wife's the vice president of Gaylake Dalmatians um actually based out of North Carolina there but we actually hel uh hosted the Dalmatian Nationals last year and maybe again this year now it's not here in Marsh Road but it's up in Georgia i'm very familiar these type of events you cannot have more than what
they state i've been at them fast dock diving all these barn barn hunt all these different things for dogs they have a limited amount by the AKC and these other organizations you can't go past that that's it i volunteer my property down the road if they have excess parking they could park there and
we could shuttle them over if that's a big concern i don't have a problem with that the car accidents on Marsh Road let's be face it has to do with speeding and drunk driving it does not have to do with people slowing down to go into Oyard i live there i've lived there for a long time i had a child run over by a car on Carter which is real close to
there so that's a very big thing close to my heart that I don't want to cause car accidents this is a misnomer that that that does people i was there during those events i wasn't at their events but I drove by multiple times yes the first one had a lot of people coming in after that it wasn't it was very
controlled and like I said I very much volunteer my property right down the road people can park there and they can shuttle over if that becomes a concern um having this type of event coming to Dan brings people in for local businesses hotels restaurants going shopping all these different things it
increases the local economy um on top of that it brings people into the land isn't that what we want and we want to have local businesses to shut down a family trying to start continue and operate a local business don't we want to improve our economy not shrink it
there the impact is positive not negative and yes I don't live directly next to them however I think the neighbors being directly next to them have been lied to about the nature of what's going to be happening here i think someone's been telling them one thing and it's not what's actually happening i live right down the road
maybe what a mile i've seen the three events that happened there i saw how they were run as I drove by i participated in these events many times in support of my dear wife because she likes these sets of events i would love for my kids to be able to just basically walk down the road and be able to do
something like this and I do own and operate a dog business real close to here i understand the concerns however and you don't need a loudspeaker they have boards people go up they see their name on a board where it's put where it's posted what time they do their jump and do things like that um you really
don't need a loudspeaker you truly don't i've been to these events many many many times throughout the year um I'm welcome to any kind of questions anybody would have because I've I've witnessed these i've been involved with them many many many times
okay okay thank you sir uh Frederick Ford oh okay did you want to speak again sir yes my name is Frederick Ford i live at 398 Marsh Road and what I mainly want to
talk about is I've talked to the people you asked about the adjacent properties i have talked to at least one neighbor there and found out that there's some rumors and misinformation being spread and I just wanted to straighten some of
that out we have covered part of it is that the we are limited to eight events nine events according to the what the is on the recommendation there um we're not having them every weekend
it's been said that we're having them every weekend we're never were going to have them every weekend we couldn't even handle it every weekend to tell you the truth uh the next thing is the loud music we've covered that that we're stopped that
um multiple food trucks coming in we're not going to be having multiple food trucks we had one now if the county gives us permission to we would like to have one but we're not going to be having multiple ones and it would only be for
events not any other time it's also uh the RV parking we covered that that we're not going to be doing that the last thing is again the traffic been brought up that there's a dangerous curve there and even given
examples of accidents that have taken out my fence and my neighbor's fence those did happen they happened uh between the hours of 2 and 3 in the morning you can probably guess what contributed to the
accidents they happened three of them between the year of 2000 and 2017 there was one other accident and that happened at the beginning of 2024 I believe or the end of
2023 2023 a vehicle ran straight into an oak tree right out in front of the neighbor to the south of us property he didn't slow down didn't swerve didn't break nothing
i was outside when it happened and saw it he went straight into the tree he was obviously distracted by something don't know if it was his phone whatever had nothing to do with other traffic it had to do with him or
her not paying attention those are the only accidents that have happened on that curve since we moved in in 1993 so and we really never wanted to have any issues with the neighbors or
anything we're trying to do things and wish we could have solved this without going through all this would have been better wish I had known about the uh special exemption required at the beginning okay Miss Shel you had a question for the speaker go
ahead for the speaker clarification ma'am you have to turn on your mic sorry yeah we would be having probably eight events throughout the year throughout the year okay so it says it is one go ahead one each month generally through
the spring summer early fall time none during the winter okay but I was just we might have an additional go from 8 to 9 if the weather is really nice a particular year that we can get an early
one in but the water's too cold so we don't do the dogs during when the water's that cold okay all right sir thank you thank you Nathan Battles oh you already spoke you already spoke
you had two sheets here let me make sure I didn't put somebody else in there yeah he had two sheets okay um Dwight
Lewis good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record dwight Lewis 860 Carter Road D the land and I own the property to the south of this property i'm adjacent to the dog park or whatever you want to call it you know
what's interesting to listen about all the corrections that are being made and we're going to do this and we we'll do this and we'll correct this we'll correct that to me that tells you what they were doing that they shouldn't have been doing why would you be correcting something that you weren't doing you
were doing all those things and um I'm contiguous to the applicant's property on the south side and I'm adamantly opposed to this special exception variance to the minimum yard requirements you will find in your
packet letters from every contiguous property owner opposed to this special exception the people that have signed those other letters do not live in close proximity the one man that says he's down at the
other end of uh Marsh Road is a long ways down there he's not affected by it i'm not against the dogs and I'm not against uh they trained service dogs they trained service dogs for years while I was there never a problem the
problem came when they wanted to run a business out there and they had all this people and those kind of things and they're addressing problems that they created themselves this area is residential it's urban in design and development you may have letters of
support but they don't come from pe from uh residents out there their letters come from people that they do business with and again I want you want to tell you that I'm not against the dogs i would go to a dog diving place but I don't want it next to my house you know
if they had I'm not against the speedway i love the speedway but I don't want it next to my house uh the problems come from the way the things that they've done in the past one other thing they they were told to stop until they got a
permit and guess what they didn't stop they ran two more events after they were told you couldn't do them so I'm not too sure that I believe they're going to change the stuff that they tell you they're going to change some of the u requirements
that you guys have put in there I like them they're good and that's the right thing i don't know if I like nine maybe four events a year and then enforce it but I have a tenant that lives in the
house that I rent right next to it my tenant is a Felia County it's funny he's a can-ine deputy and he works at night he comes home 4:00 in the morning and that's on the weekends too and then he can't get his sleep he can't sleep or
anything he's going to speak in a minute you can ask him any questions about that they advertised one time bring generators to stay again we're going back to stuff that they were doing not what they've said they will do uh that's a different story there may not be some of these things in here if they hadn't
already done them they've already done these things and I would ask you would you like this next to your house i doubt it uh I brought you that picture well they were training service dogs we like that
i tried to keep the fence cleaned down in between the two properties keep it mowed so that when they were training and out there that they weren't distracted and they've been pretty good neighbors it's just I don't like what's going on here thank you thank
you Mr brett Witson good morning um my name is Brett Witson and I live at 3030 Marsh Road i live at the property that shares a property line with 3098 Marsh Road which is the property in question here today
um going through I've I've made a couple bullet points I want to to talk about um council said the outdoor event for A1 property is a right um but it also has some stipulations as far as um the noise and the level in which it disrupts
public morals where there's sound and there's uh noise complaints and such that's certainly the case here um the folks there have been instructed to stop holding these events and in fact that they continued and you heard here today that they said that that they
couldn't or they wouldn't they chose not to it's not that they couldn't they chose not to so the enforcement that Mr mills brought up is definitely an issue because here they were told cease and assist and they said no we're going to continue um in the immediate area
um council said there's been letters from folks that live in the immediate area the immediate area is defined as someone that lives directly um surrounding a specific point you won't find that what you'll find with the immediate area is people that are opposed to
this um initially they did invite overnight camping plenty of room for RVs bring your generator i don't think that's happened at the other two events but that was advertised initially that said eight or nine events and then it was brought up how is that going to
be policed these are often on weekends and uh when I've called to make a complaint I'm sorry there wasn't anybody to do that the sheriff's office isn't responsible for code violations so they won't send somebody out for that and they also say eight or nine events but what that is is that's a
weekend but leading up to those eight or nine events they have practice they have training so that place is packed leading up to an event not just on the Friday Saturday Sunday of the event but of the days coming to the event so they're hosting people out there they advertise on a Facebook page pool rentals and it's
hourly however the case may go so yeah they may want to have eight or nine events but how many days leading up to those events are we going to have this uh Mr battles he says that he wasn't there but he spoke on how well it was controlled uh neighbors have been
lied to they've seen it firsthand so the the neighbors see it they weren't lied to this is the neighbors opinions and in those opposition letters that's not something they've been forcefed that's something that they chose to complete and to send in um in accidents Mr ford
mentioned vehicle accidents i don't believe that that any event there contributed to any accident but he mentioned that it was from a distracted driver would these events not certainly bring a distraction to motorists passing by i think it would so u I work at night
and I just ask that although yes I chose to rent that doesn't mean that I'm not entitled to peace and quiet in my home when I get off work my children who are both homeschooled have IEPs they are distracted by this they have to wear headphones during the day i have video
sound bites showing their property from my front porch that I can play and that's from the August event this is for my front porch and I can show each member the video it shows facing directly towards them
all right sir your time's up i'm sorry that but your time's up so we're going to have to move on to the next speaker i understand that and I appreciate that thank you thank you okay Mr christopher Hudgy
apologize for butchering your name but just I'm gonna ask you to say it again now anyway first name is Christopher last name's Hutchko my address is 14841 Northwest 66th Avenue in Chief which is about two and a half hours from here i am the
owner of uh Tracks K9 Club which is a dock diving facility i dive in three different um organizations i'm probably one of the largest dock diving facilities on the east coast um I've been to this facility twice um actually for his video it just it was that was
one dog probably waiting to go up on the dock to jump in a pool of water they get really excited when they jump up um our facility the the amount of dogs that come to our facility is the people in the fac in the area we rarely have people from outside the area come if we
do it's one or two dogs that come from maybe a Georgia dog or someone's traveling through the area um we've been in existence for four years now i'm also part of uh Central Florida Search and Rescue i work with Valuchia County we do uh human remains detection and live
tracking so I'm in this area a lot so I've I've actually known these guys for uh five years since I started dock diving a long time ago with just one dog now I've grown into my own facility i live in almost the same kind of area
they do um I have average of 30 dogs 40 dogs that come to my events and I've been operating for four years now um their facility the twice about times that I've been to it uh there's 15 20 dogs there's because the dogs come they jump in the morning they leave oh I'm
sorry they jump and they leave the same when I was there um their last two events that they said that people were saying that they ran their events i was signed up for them both events have been cancelled and I didn't go so I don't know where that came from they from what I understood they complied with not
having their events there um any questions that you want from me because I own the same exact type of facility um our facilities are almost identical almost identical in the rural area that I live in um so I just I just feel like I had to
come here to just if there was any questions on h you know what goes on at these events and and like uh um the noise or PA systems we don't run PA systems at ours we don't run music at ours there's a huge board where we the people come in they put their names on
they know the order most of the people are are it would be like just in this room right here right they all know each other they all know each other's dogs if I say my dog Mazaken that's my dog if I if she's up next I know on the list I know everybody else's dogs in here and
when they're up so I know to get my dog up and get them ready to go and they're jump literally jumping into water dogs are having fun jumping into a pool of water it's It's not an elaborate thing the ESPN isn't there it's not I mean
it's just dogs having fun i am a trainer uh and when you consider dock diving training it's teaching dogs to swim in a pool it's teaching to jump off a two- foot high dock into a pool so I mean it's not it's not extensive training now
when I train search and rescue I do human remains that's a whole different story it's just But um as far as dock diving it's it's fun for dogs okay well your time's up sir so thanks for your information thank you you're welcome appreciate it
all right Samantha Pasco good morning could I get your name and address for the record samantha Pasco 3311 Kumquad Drive Edgewater Florida um I have known Val and Fred for a very long time back to my college years over 10 years a So first off I want to say I
am one of the owners of Superior K9 Academy one of the only dog training companies that work with some of the most aggressive anxietyridden cases in the general Valuchia County area and this outlet this type of activity is crucial for these types of dogs to build
confidence they um get to bond with their owners on a completely different level than they can at home in a general day-to-day life and I find that dog sports in general being misrepresented a lot of people in the general public do not understand what dog sports do for
dogs it builds an enormous amount of confidence for these types of animals that are struggling at home in their normal day-to-day life so dog diving in general is not just a fun my dog goes and jumps in the pool this is huge for
dog behavioral issues this is huge for clients to be able to learn how to handle their dogs and I find that this is not being represented sorry appropriately it's not a free-for-all dogs are not out there running around
dogs are not loose dogs are not having you know a complete uncontrolled experience dogs are out there learning they're building confidence they're spending time with their owners they're spending time with their friends and this type of facility is very much so needed in this area there's nothing like
this in this area so just wanted to put my opinion out there because I do think it's being misrepresented this is huge thank you thank you okay mr robert Sim Roland Simon how you doing good morning sir could I
get your name and address for the record roland Simon 3200 Marsh Road i'm adjacent north of this property yes sir uh I just I've not a lot of comments here i've never heard anybody say anything about property value is my my my big deal with him was property value
i mean my wife moved here in uh 11 2011 and we love the area we love the neighbors we've really haven't had any issues with the neighbors at all but this particular thing is just brought a lot more traffic my wife says it's it's
just she's scared that it's going to be blow up a little bigger than it's been and we don't mind we love dogs and we love animals but we just don't uh think this is right in this area we think it could be somewhere else where there's a lot more room and not homes next door i
mean I understand the neighbor that he works late and he you know he he should be getting to sleep so uh yeah we're just concerned more about the property value and the the traffic and uh and hope they can you know resolve whatever
they need to get done okay thank you sir all right thank you okay that ends the public participation i'll let Mr um Posie come back and give a rebuttal uh again Joey Posey 420 South Nova uh just
to touch on some of the things I heard um you know in terms of the nature of how we got here I I I we were very transparent about the initial July meeting code enforcement very quickly to cite them and get them on an agenda and
we had a hearing in October and you know by that time the August and September meetings had or events had been committed to and people were were there they were intended to be there but we told staff we told everybody that guys you know as much as we want to unwind it you know there's a lot of commitments to
folks that had to be there that it it would have been very difficult and it would have risked the the certification with the NAD but we made the commitment after that to say nothing and that is what has happened since October that nothing moving forward from then um you
know that's you know we've been very clear about that representation um the other parts to this uh in terms of the property values and you know again it's one of those things where I I really just feel like this is one of those little niche uses that can really
be an asset to folks and um you know it doesn't have to be a very large or very big enterprise and you know that's the whole reason for conditioning the special exception in the way you can condition it and and if in terms of impacts if there's a way to you know manage you even more than is already
being managed um moving forward you know I we've been they've been trying to do it the right way uh from those August to September um events and you know that's the that would be the the norm moving forward and um again just trying to
figure out a path forward for these folks if the buffer is the issue we're happy to do a buffer if it's the shed that you know it is movable and that that'd be easy that'd be an easy relocation and you're really just drilling to feel feel out how to be a good neighbor that's that's the whole goal here because I I don't want the
neighbors fighting either as much as uh you know I can feel the tension that's happening over here so um you know I'm open to suggestions uh I really just feel like you know in terms of what these folks have a right to do on their property this isn't much of a a pivot other than that it just happens to have
you know some of the dogs associated with it um and that's just something that I I hope folks realize when we're talking about how to do this the right way that you know everybody has a right to utilize their property utilize it under their existing zoning and within
that context how do we make this the least impactful that's that's the goal I'm trying to reach so um I'm open to suggestions and questions or anything that we can do maybe to clarify you know this group over here is actually the group in support and I know some of them are shy but um you know we're we're
we're trying to do this the right way for the community hey Mr cost you had a question yeah you actually have uh probably more than one but we'll start with the first one yeah um because I know you I know you read these documents diligently and so on the very
first one the 25001 the special exception itself did you dive into why staff recommended denial if this in fact is you say is a basically a slam dunk well the the staff report from my and I don't want to necessarily speak for staff but the way I interpreted it is
the the nature of the the three adjoining owners in their opposition and the fact it didn't meet the buffers and that was that was essentially the the uh the reason for the denial in terms of meeting the literal code requirements for a special exception this special
exception it meets them other than the buffer absolutely you're you're making that as an absolute statement yes okay and and correct me if I'm wrong is that a fair characterization if you approve the variance they can
meet the setback requirements what they failed to meet is the compatibility with the neighborhood gotcha yeah okay um and then my last one is as you see we are a limited staff up here limited group uh and I know you can read
a room pretty well so just proceed with caution from there is that it Mr c that's it okay all right i did receive another public participation form but we'd already closed the form for that part of the
meeting it's in favor of the request do I need to listen to their I'll ask you i mean I'm not sure who I Does any of the board members want to open it back up i I think if if we have an extra one I think we should go ahead and listen to it this is a pretty
This is um contentious case right here okay everybody agree okay all right mr brian Fiddler hi um good morning my name is Brian Fidler um owner operator of Superior K9
Academy with Samantha Pasco 3311 Kumquad Drive i did just want to clarify some things i'm not up here to give any kind of I think people have done a great job giving their emotional arguments for things and everything i did want to clarify some things with people announcing with barking dogs and
um kind of the idea it's been mentioned that I dog park next to my house um I understand that the typical public understanding of dogs is mostly dog parks boarding facilities uh things like that very uncontrolled
environments with dogs this is not actually what that is um this is not and I will say at the events on that property line I would probably say there's rarely any dogs actually by the property line what you would be looking at is majority of the dogs are kept in kennels inside of the owner's cars on the other side of the dock in the
parking area and they're very controlled most people do not put up with barking behavior from their dogs yes you might have a dog or two that are on the dock that are barking at times and things like that but I could see where you could make stipulations where only you could have you know the dog on the dock
uh a dog in the hole waiting to go on the dock and then all of the dogs also put up to where they are controlled and not out it's not a free-for-all there's not dogs off leash running around playing it is not a dog park these are people that I would say majority of them
agree that actually dog parks and dog boarding facilities are actually detrimental to dogs health and they do not actually do a lot of dog social interaction that you guys would probably recognize from the public view so I do understand that there are some differences here and it is hard for you
guys to picture this but this is not just a wild free-for-all where dogs are out running around causing havoc dogs at large those kinds of things going on and I just feel like that hasn't been described very well to everybody here so I also train dogs i do compete um but I
did want to kind of clarify that for you guys that this is not just probably what you guys typically see and it would be very beneficial if people from this board or anything would come out to actually watch an event to see how controlled the environment actually is there's not 40 dogs along the property
line that are all barking playing with each other running around most people have their tents set up behind their cars they're hanging out these are also events that are very family and social friendly they not usually there's no alcohol at these events this is not an event where people go out and are
partying and there's a lot of loud music and stuff people are literally there to get their dogs some exercise to play with them to get them an outlet and then go home this is not something where it's like a huge social gathering where everybody's hanging out with each other everybody usually has their dogs put up
for the most part unless they're walking to take their dog to the dock or go to the bathroom and things like that so I just wanted to clarify that for you guys for people who probably have not seen these events before and seen these things that are going on okay
all right thank you yep one sec again Joey Posey420 South Nova i was talking with my client and um you know some of the things we heard tonight or today that you know if there's ways to mitigate it if there's ways to handle this you know we'd love to continue that
outreach and honestly meet with the neighbors so my recommendation to them and they would be willing to do this is that if we could have 30 days to have that discussion you know an open invitation to anybody that has concerns um you know sit down and talk about this
and find ways to address concerns that may be perceived and some of them that may be actual i I I recognize that that I would at least ask for 30 days uh to continue it to the next meeting to have those discussions with the folks that I've heard today and you know continue the dialogue and be good neighbors
that's really what the goal is so um if chair if that's something I wanted to ask you I'm glad you came back up is this the cease and assist were there any events after that order was after the initial notice that was that's correct
because what happened after the July event the notice went out for cease and assist towards the middle to end of July i have the dates in the presentation but the August and September events had already been committed to um there was still scheduled events for the rest of the year but the August and September
ones already had commitments to to actually run the run the event uh they couldn't cancel them but we made that very clear right after the notice to staff to code compliance that those are the two that I can't control i can control the rest and I I've probably had
that conversation several dozen times to reiterate it but I'm here again just to say that you we've been transparent with trying to make sure that they understand that I just didn't have control over those two events but every event since October has been cancelled moving forward there's been no activity for the
the dog diving special exception okay all right sir mr costa you had a question or uh Yeah well a couple things um it would be it would it would be nice to as the last speaker said to actually go and witness an event unfortunately
you guys are in a cease and desist mode so we can't do that we offered but nobody took us up i Well it was before it came before us but I I didn't I don't remember getting that offer personally so I because I would have attended something like this to find out what we're dealing with here uh as far as the continuence is concerned um I would say
that uh yeah your best course of action would be able would be to sit down with the neighbors and hopefully come up with a reasonable um compromise if you will uh it this reminds me of the reason that I'm sitting here at this chair was a similar exception and it had to do with the
borrow pit and I got involved with that as a resident at the time and we were able to come to a consensus with again you have property rights and as you stated on your very first slide so I look at that but it's a m it's a matter of harmony in the neighborhood and
hopefully you can come to some kind of an agreement um I personally uh would support a 30-day continuance uh on this one so we'll go from there okay mr sora yes i've spoken with uh Miss Smith uh where we would recommend
due to the nature of this to continue this is the May 15th um that gives them time to schedule a meeting um get input and gives staff time to collect all that information and write the report i'm not sure 30 days is sufficient to cover all
of that considering the the all the issues that need to be discussed in higher doubt i we have no objection on our end okay need a motion on that well um as far as the continuence we are doing a
recommendation it's not a ironclad decision you have a the variance attached to it pardon me variance attached to it that is Yeah I know the variance yeah okay well the variance is looked at as far as the variance i mean
the variance could be I mean it's null and void if this doesn't go through is that correct uh the the special exception is contingent on the variance because they need to meet all the criteria so they're they're kind of um tied together at at uh so if you approve
the special exception hopefully you'll approve the variance uh because otherwise if you deny the variance the special exception kind of fails um so that's and if you approve the variance um it's presumed you're going to approve the special exception so they are
slightly tied together may if I may are we suggesting then that we continue both these cases yes okay that's what I I was hoping that that was the case that not one yeah I would continue both simultaneously um well if you'd like to make a motion I'll go ahead and accept
the motion and then what we'll do is um uh discuss the motion and then we'll move forward in that case I'll make a motion on case S--25- Z001 and case V-25-023 023 that we continue both cases
to the May 15th PLDRC meeting i'll second that one okay I've got a motion on the floor to continue case S250001 and
V25023 to our next uh May 15th uh PLLDRC meeting from Mr costa and a second from Mr sixma any discussion on the motion uh there again I will say that this would be a um as far as forwarding
for the U special exception it's it is a recommendation and council's still going to hear this it's not like it's an end all here we've heard the entire case and I don't know how the people that come in uh would
come back um okay but if it's the commission's desire to continue it then I'll go along with it well m Mr chair my my comment would be that in this it doesn't sound to me like the the applicant and the neighbors have
actually had a sit down conversation as to to try to work iron out some of the kinks uh and opposition of the you know the neighbors have they may not change their mind you're absolutely right but I think the opportunity to give them to sit down with those uh three individuals uh three individual neighbors and see if
if there's a compromise that can be reached that would make everybody at least satisfied with the scenario i think that's worth a continuence all right and saying that that would be the only way I would ever give my approval is if there something could be worked
out with adjacent property owners so Miss Craig um there was some discussion about uh the food trucks being specifically denied and also signage on the road to to try to alleviate traffic issues should those be made part of staff
recommendation miss Smith could the We can add those to the revised staff report so you'll have to address those two Mr posey okay all right i've got a motion on the floor and a second and we've
already discussed it any other discussion on that motion all those in favor say I i any opposed motion carries unanimously so we'll hear this case again in May 15th for those of you that are here today and
uh we'll go from there miss Shelley could I get the next case please yes sir case number case number S25-00006 a special exception for communication tower exceeding 70 ft in
height on prime agriculture A1 zoned property thank you Miss Shel this is uh Miss Rays if I could ask you to take your discussions outside the dis please we'll wait for it to clear out a
little bit okay Miss Ray this one's yours yes so the applicant is requesting a special exception for a 195 ft monopole communication tower on a
4.84 acre parcel the parcel is surrounded by agricultural properties and single family residents to the west and south it is approximately 334 ft west of the Turnbull Hammock Conservation Area the property is
heavily treed and the current use is a dairy and feed lot the proposed lease area is 10,000 square ft located on the eastern portion of the property it is proposed to accommodate up to four tenants with dish wireless being the
initial lee it is proposed to have a galvanized gray color and it will have a 30foot ingress egress and utility easement from Vulco Road the tower will close the coverage gap between three towers with the closest
tower being approximately 2.7 miles to the northeast the project is not uh not likely to create undue traffic congestion as the site will be visited for maintenance only um it is also unlikely to be a
hazard as the fall radius is approximately 95 ft so if the tower were to fall it would remain on the parcel we did receive a letter from the Federal Aviation Administration stating that the proposed tower will not be a hazard to the air navigation staff's
recommendation is to forward to county council for final action with a recommendation of approval subject to five staff conditions i do also want to note that we did get a um letter of opposition from the adjacent property to the north i'm available for questions
thank you Miss Ray uh I do have a question u are there any other towers in the area that we may have overlapping uh coverage yes sir so there are three however they
are quite a distance away the closest is about 2 point 2 2.7 miles um to the northeast and so this proposed tower is um to close the coverage gap between those three towers we do also have the applicant here so that he might be able
to elaborate more on that okay and do we know um the distance the distance of these towers that are even though they're 2.7 miles is there any overlapping coverage so within the packet there are
propagation maps and it does show Yolanda are you able to pull it's on page 42 and 43 so 42 is is uh without and 43 is with for the propagation maps
okay coverage without coverage with Okay that's all the questions I have okay is the applicant present i'm sorry where's the location of the tower on that on these maps maybe we can ask the applicant
i am Mr chairman uh Jonathan Yates 105 Broad Street Charleston South Carolina first and foremost I want to thank Miss Kristen and Miss Yolanda uh during this process I asked 101 stupid questions they never laughed at me their professionalism courtesy is
well respected uh this is a piece of property owned by Miss Kim Payne she unfortunately couldn't be with us here today uh it's about five acres um and she bought it about 20 years ago it used to be used for citrus farming like a lot
of that area and presently uh just a lot of trees on the property uh no structures on the property the purpose of the facility we not only have Dish Wireless also Verizon Wireless they have a they're trying to cover what we call a
donut hole or a deficit area so you have a above us a crown castle tower it's about 2.7 miles away in the north you have an American tower about 3.6 miles to the south we're trying to interrupt you on this map here can you pinpoint
where this is tower will be just so we while you're talking we'll get a general idea of what you're talking here this um where it says so there's kind of a hole the the light light green it should be right right in
the middle where it says 630A that's where the proposed site is right there right there and this is Jessica Ross of Tower my colleague that's the one that's 2.7 miles away that would be the the 2.7 is
to the northeast uh the and then you have about 3.6 to the southeast roughly mr okay in relationship to where this uh what she referenced there the 60 where is the tower that you're proposing
she said that it is where the where the hole is got it okay that is it so this is the before uh um map and law if you can scroll down this is the after map got it okay so you can probably switch
between those two to discuss propagation okay proceed with your presentation i'm I'm sorry to but to follow along with you we uh me personally I needed to see where this tower was going ex Absolutely and um that's that's the true purpose of
the facility we have a deficit there verizon has a deficit um the other carriers have slight deficits there the facility has been designed for Dish Verizon at least two additional broadband carriers about the facility
itself is 195 ft monopole 4 foot lightning rod and that's essential as brought up by staff uh we have been reviewed and approved by the FAA and most importantly they also found uh we're about four and a half miles from
the Massie Ranch air strip to the north so we will not have illumination this tower does not have to have the AirNav lights on it i know we got some folks here that want to talk about it and what we want to stress to the neighbors is this will not have lights if this board
recommends approval to county council if county council is willing to approve it it takes about 30 to 60 days to put it up most of that's in set in the foundation the tower itself is stacked in a day so we'll have a little bit of traffic on Volco Road during that period
after that the carriers only come about 8 to 10 times a year so we're not being creating additional traffic on Volco Road the equipment is monitored and for the most part operated remotely uh the facility does not put out any noise odor
lights vibration fumes or glare what it does it improves wireless voice broadband in the area and most importantly to me access to 911 first responders you have in Valuchia County the alert Valuchia emergency
notification system it works a lot better if you can actually get the notifications out to people we spent a lot of time working on this working with Kim to make sure we had the best location on the property wanted to have adequate setbacks all the way around to
adjoining properties a couple other things uh this has been the the pole has been reviewed and designed by Florida professional engineer Robert Beacum he's designed it to the NCTIA 2228 standard
of 140 mileph winds living on the coast that's important i hope we don't get a blow in the fall i hope we don't get a blow in the fall but we've overd designed it in addition uh Mr beac has designed it with a 95 ft fall zone so
the fall if in a catastrophic event would be all contained within Miss Payne's property so again what we're trying to do today some people call us the fourth utility we call wireless infrastructure
for a lot of folks we're pretty important we wanted their phones to work whatever they're doing on the phones you know whe they're accessing the internet trying to get 911 we want their phones to work and that's what we're trying to do today is cover that hole we have a
little bit of a donut hole you have a little gap between the other towers this is designed to do it again initially Dish Verizon also but we provided space for the other two broadband carriers as well i'm here for any questions okay Mr
costa you had a question yes um how is this being powered uh electricity wise is it yeah we we we have a 30foot access utility coming in from Valco Road we're coming in about
115 ft so you're tapping into FPL to power this uh what about backup generator uh that is up to the carrier verizon typically does Dish with a backup does not Yeah Dish does not have one proposed but Verizon particularly does have a backup generator so there'll
be a backup generator at the site as well yes sir okay obviously that exercises periodically so you will have a noise generator and obviously during any kind of power outage it will also be operating as well to keep the tower running is that correct exactly exactly
and um we would do testing we require attendants to only do testing between 900 and 5 Monday through Friday no testing the generator on the weekend and obviously if that generator is running after a natural event there'll be a lot of other generators in there as well yes
sir okay all right thank you thank you Mr costa okay and also I wanted to address one thing here that we had on a letter of opposition yes sir emf exposure i'm not I don't think any of us are very much Mr chair I'm going to stop
that discussion um you cannot consider that information telecommunications act is very specific that um cannot render us a decision on the basis on the environmental effects of radio frequency transmissions which includes EMF
exposure okay that's the end of that then thank you sir okay all right we do have some uh public participation forms i'll give you a chance for a rebuttal after we've heard their discussion yeah and we're looking forward to hearing their discussion so hopefully we can work with
these folks and answer their questions all right sir thank you sir okay all right we're going to get started with uh Okay matthew Victorelli good morning sir i hope I didn't drop it
up too bad and your name my name is Matt Victorelli and uh I own the property across from them it's uh 89 lot uhhuh and uh it's a vacant piece of property right now but I plan on building a house there someday um and I'm concerned about
the EMIs you know the radiation that comes off of it um uh we've had it for two years now and uh we camp out there and we use it just for a recreational area um I'm concerned
about the generator making the noise um it's nice to camp in quiet and peace um it's an eyesore it's a depreciation of our value of our property um and uh if anything change carriers
you know get T-Mobile ours works fine everybody in the area doesn't have a problem with it and that's all I have to say all right thank you sir thank you Greg uh
Petraac petzac it's pronounced the way it's written i just tried to put a little extra make it fancy good morning sir could I get your name and address for the record sure greg Petsac i live at 4721 Lingo Grove Road
um my property is mostly on Lingo and I joins the Vulco area there um and I'm on T-Mobile okay i got perfect service out there i don't lose signals at all i mean we do at times during a
hurricane you know when the towers go out for a day but our phones automatically go into um satellite mode with the Starlink so what I'm looking at is you know the cell towers are going to be a uh a dinosaur
in the past okay because you look every two days Starlink's going up with satellites right that's what they're going to do it's going to go off satellite phone so when this thing after a few years everything went satellite and we're looking you know with the mo you know the cell towers it going to be
a thing of the past the thing's going to be out there it's going to be an eyes saw you know with you know decreases our property value you know uh 10% and you know a couple of the houses around there plus I'm within the range there and you know I'm worried about
this uh RF factor going on and what it's transmitting plus I'm a pilot and I do fly a helicopter and I do land out back on my property with it so now I have a navigation thing if this thing's not going to have lights on it I'm going to be landing out on my
property you know and I do have a couple other aircraft that come out there every now and then and Vulco Road if you don't know it it's a dirt road and it is very highly uh used during the uh the day so I mean I'm totally against this i
don't want to see in my backyard all right sir all right thank you robert Brown good morning sir name and address for the record robert Brown at 2695 Vulca Road immediately west of this particular property okay and this cell tower is
going to be 400 ft from my house i have horses i got studies from 38 countries we can't discuss that i'm the He just said you can't use that okay it decreases our property value it's an eyesore we live in the country we have
perfect phone service all of us do none of us in that area have any problem with cell service there's a tower he said to the norththeast it's to the northwest there's another one south maybe at like you said a donor hole is about what it equates to if
there's any I can talk on the phone from one end of volco to the other i've been there 10 years my horses don't like any of that type of of frequency and my neighbor who had to leave has 37 acres
directly behind her to the north and he breeds cattle and we just seen this as a poses a threat to our livestock and and property value and our own health so I know you're not allowed to talk about the whole thing which I completely don't
understand that but I have studies from 38 different countries that say different and that's pretty much all I have to say all right thank you sir mike Minute good morning sir could I get your name
and address for the record uh it's Mike Bennett uh 2625 Vco Road and I'm only about at most 300 ft from this thing now I don't have a house there yet
but I bought the property to put a house on it there's no issues with that kind of thing at the present moment so what's that going to do for my property when this thing's sticking up
there and RF waves are a factor i don't care what anybody says about that so I mean it's going to be detrimental i'm going to have to either sell that land or and get whatever you
can out of it it's it's we have good cell service there i don't understand what they're talking about a donnut hole so yeah I just don't I don't see the
need for this thing to be there and there's other places that would have less impact on on people that live in that area because there's plenty of open area around there
i mean that's 300 foot is not that's at the least is 300 feet so I apologize for No you're fine you
did very well it's it's nonsense is what it is okay so because we all have good cell service if you want to come out and check it you can clearly see that we don't have an
issue there so thank you very much thank you sir and that ends our public participation and I get the attorney to come back up for rebuttal or explanation
and we're going to talk to these folks afterwards see if we can address their concerns other than uh discussing the health whenever you do a cell tower you always have neighbors and why is that we have to put them where people are where people live where people
travel it's all part of a network if you drive throughout Valuchia County there's cell towers throughout the county some of them are right next to where people live others in commercial areas but it all works so everyone can use their phone at all times that's the purpose of
network i think if you look at the tower ordinance and the criteria for a special exception my opinion is it'll be your opinion that counts but my opinion is we met the requirements we have a 5 acre
parcel we are doing a 195 foot monopole st tower it has been approved by the FAA two carriers right now say they have a need they and they have a need verizon and
Dish they don't put equipment on a tower unless they need to there's two types of needs there's coverage base coverage and capacity as more people use a tower you have to split the cell and have more cells this is needed this is needed i'm
uh we will work with the folks around see if we can answer their questions but we feel if you look at Kim Payne's property Kim's owned this property for 20 years i feel that Kim deserves this in that I feel we met the requirements we
cannot always make everyone happy we're going to try to we're going to try hard to work with these folks um but just looking at it looking at the staff recommendation did we meet the ordinance i feel we did but that's your decision
thank you sir mr costa you had a question yes I do uh could you put page 11 back up you had it up there briefly i thought you were reading my mind page 11 yes just to clarify a point because we've had two of the public participants that came up both
uh stated numbers feet from the tower and I want to take a look at that page real quick um just confirm with you that what I'm seeing is correct so if I'm looking at this right you've got the the setback to the closest barn is 600 ft yes sir and the setback from
to the closest house is 748 ft yes sir not 300 or 200 foot like I heard before okay there's no because the rest of it's vacant land to the other to the I guess to the south side of that property that's all vacant so the only structure is to the north end yes is that right
and we're going to talk with Mr brown uh he is he is the closest his his residence is 748 y his barn is 600 uh Kim had talked to him a while back but obviously we need to talk again kim wants to be a good neighbor i would
suggest it yes um yeah I think if you take this the proper steps and get with the neighbors uh and put their their uh concerns at ease uh regarding the RF and EMF obviously we can't discuss that at all uh that's that's a that's a different ballgame there i I know that I
do have one within 300 ft of my property and actually I don't even know that it's there most of the time other than the blinking light that this one is lit does have a red beacon on it that uh comes on from time to time but um you know that's we found Mr costa I'm sorry we found Mr
there's a lot of outcry at the start but then some people call and tell us when's that tower going up and we go it was up a year ago it's sort of like when you're driving home there are power poles and telephone poles the whole way you don't see them they're there but you don't see
them and particularly with this without the air nav lights you're not going to see it at night understood thank you thank you Mr costa okay that ends our Do we have any more public participation forums we don't
right no sir okay I'm going to close the for public participation open up for commission discussion or a motion but first of all I'd like to ask um Miss Let me see who's this Miss Ray and I guess I could ask
Miss Smith too this question comment was brought that kind of rang a bell here was brought up about Starlink we know that's part of the future is that ever in consideration with some of these towers as far as approving or
recommendation of approval i can kind of answer that so um a lot of the the hype on what we call small cell towers um kind of overblown they are
prevalent in dense urban areas because of the way the technology works it's very short range it need still needs what these legacy towers to kind of operate um you know Starlink is a is a a
different because it's you know works on a on a different system but um my understanding is kind of the backbone of telecommunications is still based off of these legacy towers um and only when you get to the um to the dense areas are
when you get the kind of the the small cell towers that are basically they look like light poles or they're attached to light poles so in other words you would still have a connection with the Starlink with the larger towers is that what you're
telling me i think Starlink operates independently um you know that's just that's another type of service and another type of process than the uh the uh frequency allocation issued by the
FCC for the traditional communications like your your 4G and your 5G and your 3G technologies um operate off of the FCC's allocated frequencies i don't know that Starlink does i think Starlink just shoots
through satellites okay well the reason I was even brought this up I don't want to approve a steam engine when I got a brand new diesel fix and they come hit the lot you know um I think I mean these are for mobile tech i think I believe Starlink you need you
need a device so that replaces your broadband it replaces your your physical wired connections it does not replace your cellular service okay okay that was my question and
uh I'll entertain a motion miss Shel go ahead yeah I already closed the floor Michelle um yes on the staff recommendations i just have a question about um the requirement it states in
here for the tower to be no less than a thousand feet from residential structures is waved um and in this case it sounds like it's close to residential structures 400 ft 300 ft why why is that
considered that that that's waveable uh 738 the code the code is written in such a way as to uh wave that provision um I believe this goes back but towers used
to not be designed to collapse in on itself so you would have a massive fall zone um as opposed to right so this tower in fact some towers supposedly have a zero foot like they're engineered in such a way is to collapse on itself
um this one I think has a collapse zone of 400 ft 95 ft so that's okay thank you that's that's kind of the reasons why there's a distance but you know norm setbacks is more are one of those like normal land development regulations um
this one has a thousand foot setback but it is explicitly you know wavable usually justified on the collapse zone of the tower thank you i've got one other question also i heard during the comments that this tower does not have a light on the
top okay okay and then some of the concerns about the local air traffic there being that it is helicopter and not fixed fixed wing why is it not being required to have a light that's the FAA um but we can put it under our
conditions is that correct i'm going to say yes but I don't know if that will um if there is a preemption on the FAA on lighting towers that they say don't need to be lit um that may kick in some
other kind of analyses um in terms of who knows we could put it uh we could put the condition in reference if it was if it as long as it didn't interfere with the FAA requirements yes I believe so let me
check to see if we've got that authority mr cross I'll let you go ahead and ask your question while Well he's looking that up my uh my only my only comment on the light would be that um um if I was the N if I was the neighbor I'd prefer not to have a light blinking
in my backyard 24/7 as opposed to that and again that I I have to default back to the FAA on this one um I think it was the distance to the Massie Ranch is the closest and we're under 200 foot in height um if they're landing aircraft in an
uncontrolled field that's a whole different situation so but I again it goes it's a 50/50 you know you put the light and all of a sudden now you got a light that's going on all night so I started to say but you're not flying helicopters around not that we know of
yes sir come on to reiterate what Mr kasa said most people make insist that we don't have a light what if they insisted you did would you put it on there you can voluntarily you can do it uh but we find
you find a lot of ordinances throughout the country they oddly enough have a top height of towers is 199 so they don't have to have the light the usually the biggest outcry comes from the light on the tower and again the FAA they control
this the again the closest is Massie uh Massie Ranch say it's about 4 and a half miles uh north so most folks do not want us to have a light on it well that was one of the concerns about Yes sir one of the adjacent property
owners so I don't know maybe it's a discussion within would you I'm not going to I'm not going to recommend putting that in as a condition but would you be willing to discuss that with the property owners and see if you can come to a
general consensus on that yes because if he is flying helicopters in and other people are flying in too this would be a safety concern i would think you don't want anybody hitting your tower either no no certainly and and and I don't know if that the FAA mostly looks at landing
patterns and that usually fixed wing aircraft not someone that's got a helicopter next door and the last thing we want to do is have a buddy fly his helicopter over not familiar with that tower and taking out your tower
no we we don't want that it's just And so I mean there is a circumstance here obviously if that's a fact of of of him flying helicopters yeah and then the tradeoff is folks who live there don't want to see a light well that's why I
said you know if you can somewhere in the middle yeah somewhere in the middle there if you can talk to the adjacent property owners and be willing to do that if it's if you find it necessary yes sir well I don't care if it's 75 ft you know it's just something that that I
would think that that I don't know why it wouldn't be in there if it if if he is flying helicopters into the adjacent property yes sir okay all right i'll accept the motion wake up guys
okay I'll make the motion i move that case number S-25-06 be approved no for final move forward I'm sorry that move forward for final action with a recommendation of approval to the county
council subject to staff recommended conditions five of them second okay i've got a motion on the floor to forward the special exception case number S25006 to the county council for final
actual recommendation of approval subject to staff recommending conditions from Miss Shelly and a second from Mr costa any discussion on the motion yes i would suggest to the applicant uh strongly that they that he that they sit down with the uh
neighboring uh property owners prior to this going to council final approval and work out those few kinks that are out there and also to council and also to the adjoining property owners u you really
this is we're just we're not making the final decision on this this is a recommendation by by this board um the some of the things that you brought up as a concern obviously there's some that we can talk about and some we can't but those that we can I would hope that you
would try to get with the people that are going to try to put this up and see if there's a general consensus on if you want to light if you don't want a light but u I would have that ready to go at the uh county council meeting because
they could always add that can they add that to it Mr sora yes okay they can add that to it at that time okay okay all in favor signify by saying I i any oppose motion carries
unanimously okay all right that was Miss Shelly can I get the next case please please yes sir oh this one got continued to cancel
okay we're into our ordinance i'm not matching we got Mr ashley up there already he's ready to go number ordinance 25-005 ordinance 202513 amending chapter 72 of the code of ordinances to amend
accessory structure and fence permitting requirement thank you Miss Shelley mr ashley good morning sir good morning i made it um as noted this is a proposed amendment to the zoning ordinance to allow for
modifications to the some standards relating to accessory structures and to fence permitting um just a little background for you the county council directed staff to evaluate ways to reduce time and cost to the public
during permit review process by reducing and eliminating or eliminating various land development regulations at the council workshop on July 23rd 2024 the blue growth management department responded with various suggestions and recommendations for the council to
consider um after much discussion they were forwarded to another meeting which was held on October 1st 2024 where council gave the concession for staff to move forward on uh multiple code amendment proposals two of those items
are the subject of today's ordinance which are to amend section 72277 accessory structures and exception to the minimum dimensional requirements accessory dwelling units and section 72282 fences walls and hedges of the
zoning or ini county the goal is to eliminate the requirement for a building permit for accessory sheds under 400 square feet and eliminate the requirement for a residential fence permit uh except for those function as a pool barricade currently uh all sheds
regardless of their size require a building permit to verify compliance with minimum structure building setbacks maximum building height and maximum lot coverage in addition to the provisions of the Florida building code and in the residential classification a fence permitted is required to verify
compliance with specific height and location requirements uh on the first half of the ordinance uh dealing with accessory structures or sheds uh the ordinance currently allows for a lesser setback for rear and sideyards for sheds that
are up to up to 500 square feet this ordinance is proposed to allow by right sheds 400 square feet in size on single family residential use properties to be built or constructed without need of a building permit however the sheds must
still adhere to applicable county accessory structure requirements that would be the yard requirements uh article 3 division 7 of flood hazard management requirements of the land development code as well as compliance with wetland wetland buffer and gopher tortoise regulations of the land
development code in chapter 50 of the county code of ordinances um and regarding defenses this is the second part of the ordinance uh as I noted the fences are used as a barrier for property uh chapter 72 currently defines does not include
fences as a definition of structure uh and it is not referenced in the Florida building code as a structure as well is only used for barrier for a swimming pool uh we require the permit obviously to make sure there's compliance with the location fences uh have varying height
based on what yard they're located in uh what is being proposed is we're recommending limiting the permit as directed by council uh and that would be for chain length wood or vinyl fences um we would not address the wood concrete
walls or masonary walls that would that's a structural element we're only talking about fences and even though there would be no specific review no permit for the items I have referenced uh the way we've structured in a direction the uh
property owner would still be required to comply with the applicable setback yard requirements for a shed location for a fence and height uh however it would be up to the individual property owner to check with the county on the requirements and if they fail to adhere
to the requirements upon receiving a valid complaint code enforcement would be the initiating initiated to seek compliance and that's what the goal from council no permit but for us to verify it it will take a compliance uh
situation and I would kind of go over quickly uh the ordinance some of the changes um dealing starting with page four just to provide a distinction which we don't already have in the code we are proposing a definition for wall and that
is for the purpose of section 72282 which a masonary fence which is constructed on a footer serving as a means of protection or confinement uh and again just to help distinguish between what a wall and a fence is we do define what a fence is
but not a wall uh the next section uh deals with our accessory structure it starts on page top of page three this is the specific language that we're putting in the ordinance that accessory sheds under 400 square feet in size located on
single family residential use properties are subject to the standards of this section and the article 3 division 7 flood hazard management but may be constructed with a shed building permit such sheds may not be constructed within any wetland or wetland buffer or within
25 ft of gopher tortoise burrows um and because of this new section we had to renumber or reletter accessory dwelling units so there's some formatting changes that are going to be part of this code as well uh next with
the fences um further down on page three of the report we've kind of created a breakdown to make sure we distinguish between residential classifications and non-residential more a little more defined that way um and so what we've
referenced here fences and walls in a residential zoning classification are permitted in any yard provided they comply with the code sections as enumerated previously however we're allowing for chainlength wood or vinyl fences on single family residential use properties are subject to the standards
but may be constructed or without a fence permit and that's a distinction as I mentioned earlier uh fences are not referenced in the Florida building code so there is no building permit there is a county fence permit it's more regulated through the zoning office
um it's only for the individual lots as I noted uh all residential fences and wall would be like on exterior or perimeter of our subdivision per se that would still go through the peritting process uh as noted because of this modification
to the code we've had to do some reing releting for the uh further sections in the code and uh that is essentially uh when the one last change if we go to page nine um we did have to address the
uh permitting requirements under the administration section in 72341 uh for clarification u the language basically said you couldn't who put up a fence without a permit we've um made that more specific to non-residential
classification uses cannot erect a fence in those areas without a permit and that is the uh the ordinance i'd be happy to address any comments and questions you have mr costa yep morning good morning um page three of eight on the ordinance
itself uh first line why 400 ft i as opposed to say 500 feet that's the number that came out of the discussion with county council at their workshops at their workshop yes sir the reason I'm
bringing that up is uh so a standard two-car garage is 480 480 ft and um which would be a pretty good size accessory shed i'm just trying to avoid that extra 80 feet coming in for a variance to go for 80 foot if we could I would my suggestion would be that we
change that to either 500 or make that 480 to accommodate that and then secondly on that same line uh located on single family residential use properties uh as opposed to why the wording using the wording of non-commercial properties as opposed to
using the single family residential to to more encompass the you know I'm I don't just seems a little restrictive there on the single family and then you go back on the other pages and you're talking about non-residential properties is the distinction there i
I'm kind of lost a little bit well the specific for that was that's where the issues came up were brought to council um not a lot of this initiated um issues were about a year ago where we were substantially behind with permitting we had a big impact to the residential
permitting phase uh and we were behind of course now we're and that was part of our what we call a singlephase permitting process it had to get through building zoning environmental uh individually but if somebody was behind it would stack up we do now have a
two-step process which you have a clearance process of basically zoning environmental and any other non-building group that has to pass then it goes to the um the building department and that's also tied in with a permitting time shot clock where you there's a
certain time permits have to be reviewed and get out mhm so in in that spirit the council was looking at what are ways to curb the timeline our our biggest issue is residential permitting what are the issues that are some of the key things
accessory structures and fences are some of the bigger you know other than new homes this is something that existing home sites deal with a lot and how do we get through the process or permitting process faster cheaper and these were some issues we thought well maybe we can
eliminate permitting for those type of issues and where the specific 400 came from I can't tell you um that was the council between staff it was two public hearings well those would be that'd be the I would make that suggestion that on that that line one would read accessory
structured under 480 okay um and um and I'm not sure why but I also like to to I would strike the n single family residential use to uh read non-commercial uh property uses to basically more encompass and
capture everything else um personally I'd like to strike article 3 division 7 flood hazard but I know you're going to tell me that can't be done u that was just a comment okay move on that's it that's it okay oh I I'm sorry i I lied i misled you uh
that same goes for line 15 on that same page is strike single family residential use and change that to non-commercial properties okay uh one of the specific things the distinction there is um and maybe this helps you or doesn't help under section
72277 specific zoning classifications are listed and they are ones that allow for single family residential use multifamily zonings and most of the mobile home uh park type zonings they are not included in the accessory structure standards under the fence
section it's kind of a carp launch you're either residential or you're non-residential so the distinction whereas this is going to be single family residential is these fence standards would be applicable where you get the exemption versus a mobile home park that type of thing or multifamily
which also would fall under the residential category mr ashley I'm going to give you a hypothetical oh Miss Craig you had a question i didn't see it further to Mr c's discussion about the size of it to me an accessory shed is different from a
garage i think of a shed as being a a storage shed that is built and plunked down in the middle of a of a um open area and a garage is something that's sturdier and it's built for a
purpose and I can I can envision a need for um permitting on something of that sort just a comment well the word shed was specific to the council discussion
so Miss Shelly yeah I I have a question um on uh page two at the bottom it says um um reducing cost to citizens and allowing a more affordable housing option yeah that's a mistake i had a
corrected staff report that should have been provided to all y'all already okay maybe okay was like okay looking at that okay um because I was like is that or is that making the 400 square foot the sheds are they ADUs without any guidance
I don't know I apologize for that okay thank you for answering that and then um you know I understand um the request by council but it does seem interesting to me that um you still have to so if they don't
ask or think they need a permit now for a fence or a shed that they certainly aren't going to think they have any it says it's still they still have the same um applicable you know the requirements are still in
effect but they just except for you don't need a permit so again it seems to be that back way somebody will have to complain again before okay i just find that interesting okay okay get back to my original question if
I've got a piece of agricultural property that's not agriculture exempt but yet I don't have a resident on it get back to Mr costa's point of making it commercial rather than residential uh
for for non-commercial use um wouldn't that residential clause in there have an effect on an agricultural piece that I'm allowed to put a building
an accessory structure because it is agriculture would that be covered under this ordinance well it allows for a residential use the agricultural zoning is one of our residential single family use classifications even if I don't have a
resident there I can still put that 400 That's where do you get to the agricultural use aspect is this a non-residential farm building on a farm mr chair I just kind of want to uh I guess if you go to page four of eight um
page six of town yeah so so the fence section already accounts for agricultural use classifications under former section four five not section four scroll down a little bit so four of eight so it says you know this section shall
not be applied to any agricultural conservation or public use classifications doesn't require your bonafide a determination so we we've already accounted for fences to fence off these particular
uses um and I think fences are now one of the accessory uses you can have without a primary structure fences and docks yeah okay what is your view on the non-commercial well instead of resident residential
I I think the concern is what Scott stated is you have you know the the residential versus um the types of residential developments that you would still require a fence permit for for
your your kind of uh multif family type objects um I'm trying to think of a a classification that isn't residential but also not commercial usually you're dealing with your kind of
like when you mention multitational if you had an ADU on the property that's a multif family multiple family No that's that would we don't look at it that way um multif family is going to be a building have multiple units in it or
like a apartments or cond though in the commercial wouldn't that be commercial well I mean in your in your definition of commercial if you had apartments it's a residential use um so certainly
from the building code perspective if you want to talk about commercial they treat it because it is you're dealing with a single entity versus multiple owners trying to build one large structure but from our perspective in the zoning or that is a residential uh classification and use
different from commercial but they would be able to put a fence up without not in multifamily not in a multifamily zoning classification as it's written we're restricting this to single family okay got it okay
and follows point2 section 72 341 which is uh on page eight of the package or excuse me page uh seven it's already in the code there on line uh starts 15 161 17 it's already been the code that
agricultural zonings aren't required to get a fence permit and that's tight that's tied into state law as well right they're exempted i'm talking about the accessory structure though i know he was speaking to the other issue but on the sheds if you have if it agricultural zoning we
still have the provision for allowing more than one principal structure as long as only one of them's a home so certainly if it's a vacant agricultural property you want to put a a storage building of some sort that's agriculturally related then that's part of that exemption pro procedure we can
have on the non-residential farm building on a farm got it okay that's Does that satisfy you Mr costa yes and no i I just keep um and I can't pin pinpoint it but I'm feeling we're leaving somebody's getting left out here
with that wording and and I'm not sure who it is just yet does that make sense i can't quite put my finger on it but some something is being someone is being left out unintentionally obviously and I'm trying to to make sure that that's protected i think I get the rural the
rural part and the agricultural issue uh I understand all that um it's just something about that the wording single family residential use it's it's I don't know it just maybe it's like a it's like a burr in my my shoe maybe duplexes duplexes are kind of this
odd thing where it's it's not technically multif family but it's not also not single family um yep and they they put up fences in the same manner as single
family residential or town home for that matter as well you know you've got attached those are attached town homes but they're individual single family units right um those situations those fences are typically covered un on common
property but yeah it's it's for for those ones it's um I think we treat the town homes in the same manner as multifamily right okay it's just it's the duplex ones that are just kind of odd because you can have duplex
development in the middle of you know a row of single family development and if you want uh you'd like to do that that might be something to add is the duplex uh because we pretty much only allow duplexes in one zoning classification the R six and that R six also permits
single family residential so if that to your suggestion maybe located on single family or and duplex residential use which you said was what zoning r six r six it allows both single family and duplex two family and you're prohibiting
that on the next page though uh R1 through R9 for the fencing on page eight uh line line 18 or line 19 rather on page four of eight I hear you're prohibiting the fences through R1 through R9 so R six is in that grouping
those apply to barbwire and electric barbwire electric only yes okay yeah that's a bit and that's not that's not being changed other than um yeah I like that suggestion Regarding the duplexes
I'd like to get a view on the other members miss Craig's weighed in on the square footage uh I'd like to get some kind of a consensus here i mean me personally I don't have an issue with
the 480 500 well Eric it comes down to it comes down to this um I guess or this is a question so that there is a I'm looking through here and unless I'm missing it do you have a definition for sh for for the word for accessory shed what an accessory shed does it have to have four
wall have to have four walls or can it just be a uh an accessory carport if you will is that considered a shed well we don't have a definition in the ordinance uh we do defer to Mary and Wester's 11th edition if we need one and they have a
definition of shed is a slight structure built for shelter or storage especially a singlestory building with one or more sides enclosed one or more sides enclosed so potentially a a two-car carport with the back wall would be a
shed there in lies my 480 ft yeah which are those are you know those are you know dropand go kind of items that's where I'm at with that i'm with you yeah I'm with you i just didn't know how anyone else felt Mr sixman no I
think 480 i mean it's it's so close because you're right most of them are an average of 480 mhm yeah i I definitely say 480 or 500 but 480 is perfect 400 to 500 miss
Shelly where do you stand i don't I don't want to single out Miss Craig but I do want to I don't want to overlook her concern i mean it it can be concerned okay staff always does
put that brought up regarding concerns well I'd like to send it with a general consensus or just you know just not one member's view okay the other thing too this addresses my chicken coops don't it remember that 10 by10 chicken coupe that
had to have a permit in our our zoning this addresses that don't it i thought that was the most ridiculous thing I ever heard okay well I'm all for this ordinance i'll be honest with you i support it 100%
uh I guess Mr paulo you've already spoken miss Shel spoken okay so I'll entertain a motion oh do we have any public participation for this
no sir i don't see I see the attorney here no so we're going to close the floor for public participation and open up for commission discussion and a motion go ahead can you turn on your mic having trouble with that today the PLDRC
that uh we find the ordinance 202513 consistent with the comp plan and forward it to the county council for final action with a recommendation of approval with with uh member comment subject to comments yes subject to comment all
right second got a motion on the floor from Miss Shelley to uh Well where am I at okay here okay that we find the ordinance
202513 consistent with a comprehensive plan and forward it to the county council for final action with a recommendation of approval subject to the commission comments mhm and a second
from Mr sixma mhm any discussion on the motion all those in favor signify by saying I i i any opposed my mic wasn't on okay motion carries unanimously okay thank you very much thank you thank
you Mr ashley now my friends with chickens don't have to worry about where they're going to put them okay all right that's the end of our business for the day and uh do we Miss Smith do
we have any other public items no sir staff items just very quickly um you all are invited to a public hearing that we'll be holding at the um Ostein Elementary School it's specific to the Ostein local plan um we're going to have
a bunch of fun interactive activities and give you the history on the plan and uh show some case studies and it is April 9th from 5:00 to 7:00 p.m we hope you'll join us fun activities like piñatas and stuff or we're going to let you color draw where's this is going to
be o April 9th 5 to 7 o'clock at the Ostein Elementary okay 500 Doyle Road it was she sent an email out got it and we've already noticed it so all the members can come with no problems okay staff comments yes sir i
have do have one no you're not a staff oh I'm sorry no sir not collecting a check yet yeah you're right okay no more commission comments yes sir i have I have one can we if since we're all here the ones that are here can we
check our request to speak button because I noticed uh Donna's was popping up as somebody else but then it got changed yeah I actually had a different name yeah now you're you're Donna now you were uh uh Summers she she I fixed it as soon as I
do in midstream and so all of a sudden I saw her name pop out go hey it's been corrected selfcorrected she corrected that when she saw it beautiful thank you she that's already been done thank you however if you'd like to move your seats now would be the time to tell me so that I can fix it again okay Miss Shelley yes i just um Mr
source would you just say um you said it so eloquently before but about the EMF you just cite what you said yeah so so uh this has been a thing since the '9s when cell towers started to proliferate
so there's telecommunications act um and the federal government has doubled down more and more on preeemptions on local governments so um it essentially says that you cannot base your land use decisions on the environmental effects
of u of radio frequency um emissions um so that covers things like you know when when 5G was starting to proliferate you had a lot of people start to get concerned um you know alleging all all kind of
sorts of things so but that that kind of prohibition on consideration of environmental effects so environmental effects is is a very broad statement it includes you know allegations that it causes health effects it causes cancer
that it that it interferes with um uh animal sonar or something like that or or you know the the the the way that um things move uh or animals move or you
know so that has been a preeemption since the telecommunications act of 1996 thank you um there are some other state provisions and preeemptions um including you can't you know uh discriminate against a particular service provider
like say for example you have a grudge against AT&T and AT&T wants to put up a cell tower it can't do that um you know and some as the as the case law has evolved the way that towers are looked at is kind of very specific so um you
know uh allegations on on dimunition of property values need to be established by um an appraiser or someone versed in real estate if they are um if they are opposing a tower based on aesthetic grounds you know a plain statement
saying it's ugly it won't suffice um you have to show evidence and that type of evidence is is usually in the form of simulations you know you you kind of mock up what the tower would look like in relationshipship to your house or you can do a balloon test where you you
shoot a balloon to the height of the tower and it's like okay physically everyone can see where that top of that balloon is and um I've seen tower cases where a tower is denied because you know it looks like the tower is growing
straight out of a house um and that that is kind of a good example of you should deny this tower because of one aesthetic reasons and two um someone actually uh provided evidence that it would you know radically uh you know interfere with the
property values of of a particular property so okay I'd like to bring up something is I know we all received our packets this month uh there's been some discussion of our Valuchia County Doge
that do we want to cut costs and so um I've been kicking this around a little bit because there has been some not they may approve it they but may not also of providing laptops instead of print and
mailouts one of the things that I saw when I got my packet was that when I received my packet it cost $10.50 50 cent for them to send it out and if they don't send it out it takes time for staff to deliver it so you usually have a staff member you take it away from the
staff for a day to deliver packets so I don't know how you guys feel but if you want your packets uh to give some kind of kind of compromise because a lot of the cases that we hear are on this side of the county and I know it's tough for the
people on the other side is one of two things you can either look at it on your online and uh and I'm not saying they're going to go for this but it's it's a compromise from us so they may or may not do so would be to either come over
and pick up our packet or look at it online and then if you're in the area pick it up and they would have it available for you when you come in that morning if you didn't want to come over and get it uh or
uh if you'd rather have and I'm not saying we're going to get that either a laptop but we all have our own laptops and I think it was a general consensus we like to have the packets in order to make notes on and visually look at something without having to scroll through it while we're looking at each
individual case because I know we all do it we make notes and talking points we all like it i if at the least I would like to have a packet here on my desk when I come in for a meeting uh what do
you guys think about that can I have you on the mic please i'm sorry if there's a um a shuttle or you know a delivery between this office and the other offices where things could be dropped off and more easily picked up than driving all the way over here that
would certainly help as well do you guys have an office on the other side of the county for planning no we don't i I think our preference would be either your recommendation of we have the packets available here or for those that don't want to come to
this side of town that we go ahead and mail them that would be a little easier on us okay well I don't know if that's going to fly as far as I mean my understanding is we're not going to get them mailed to us they're more or less either we're
getting laptops or no packets at all well it's not laptops uh we are looking at getting iPads ipads um just so you're aware of it though if you do get an iPad and they're still working through that laptop if you do get an iPad they will not have Wi-Fi access so you will still
have to download your information from the website to that iPad before you go out on your site visits i think it won't have cellular access cellular access okay so you do I was going to say you have to have Wi-Fi access you can download it so all right
got it and it's only And that's that would be a county-owned piece of equipment county owned maintained yes if they agree to it they have not agreed to it yet if Okay if and when they agree i I will tell you we did um send the chair's letter on and the response we
got back was no we're going digital um I think they've come off of that a little bit now and are willing to explore iPads that's we're waiting for the response and I'm willing what I'm saying I know how much we like our packets and I was
coming up with a compromise okay we're going to cut your cost we meet us halfway let us have our packets but we'll pick them up either the morning that we come here or we'll make a mo time to come over and pick them up from
uh the office here um like I said we do have cases on this side of the county if you're coming over to look at that case put it on your number one list go ahead and pick up your packet and move on
so I don't have a problem with that but but I think the incentive of the mailing cost and providing this staff member to go out and deliver them uh either or would be
a a logical compromise what do you guys think i mean I'm not gonna I mean I'm willing to come in I'm willing to drive in here and pick mine up because when I go visit sites I like to visually have something I can
sit there write and make notes on so I definitely like the paper so you guys okay with making that recommendation are y'all okay with making that recommendation yeah that give that to me one more time that compromise hear that
compromise once more compromise would be that they we would still get our packets but instead of them mailing it out or sending the staff member to deliver them because that is a cost and that I think from what I'm hearing they're trying to cut cost and everything from paper clips
to to postage stamps right and so my point is if we give them a compromise that we would pick the packets up either the morning that we arrive here or if we're in this area
looking at a site that we pick them up then or whenever they're ready mhm you can pick them up you can pick them up beforehand or or u get them day of or day of yes
we we always email you the Wednesday before the meeting to let you know that it's online and published and that's the same day we would we have been mailing out the packets so in this case you would get an email on Wednesday saying it's available one week and I'm sorry
you do it eight days not the Wednesday before our meeting's on Thursday the week before the Wednesday before we said the Wednesday before the Yeah not the Wednesday before the meeting the week before the Wednesday of the week before the meeting we notify you all that it's
ready so in I think what you're proposing is we'll still print those packages on that Wednesday we'll have them available in our office either for you to pick up throughout the week or we'll have them here available for you at the Thursday meeting
as opposed to mailing them yeah or not getting them at all that's my concern and I'm afraid that it's going to end up there we're not getting him at all but they go tablet because I've even heard Yeah that Yeah but really when you're looking at when
you're looking at a case I mean they put it up on the prompter here unless you got something here that we can go back i I go back all the time same here yeah go back and forth and I make little notes all the time and to sit here to be uh
with a tablet even with a tablet of trying to make the notes and everything I mean I might as well do it on this you know so I just believe it's a it it takes away from the presentation when you have to do that so I'm I'm in agreement with your
compromise okay you're good with that everybody good all right so just for clarification is that in lie of getting a potential iPad you'd rather have the hard copy i'd rather have the hard copy yeah mhm thank you
yep we good with that all right and then any any changes you can send us something by email and I know we get a stipen but I will say this again that does not cover our fuel much less printing cost
okay uh not that much do you realize that stipen hasn't been changed i know in 20 years i know for a fact it hasn't been so cuz I've been here almost that long that's a That's a
1990 something resolution that set the amount that has been changed why don't we get it why don't we get a little bit more do at least do a at least do a uh if you realize what it was worth back
then to what it's worth today aren't we worth that put that in your ear Mr sora you know now we got cost we got to come over and pick up her packet see all right
okay uh any press and citizen comments this meeting's adjourned no