Washington zoning board. Adequate notice of the meeting was given in accordance with the open public meetings act by the board secretary to at least two newspapers on December 27th, 2024. And this meeting has been posted on the Township Boulder Board, electronic
message board, WCTV, and on the township website. Please salute to the flag to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice
for all. Grace, can I have a roll call, please? Mr. Dagustinino is absent. Miss Grimmaldi here. Miss Hannah here. Mr. Lrada here. Jeff Roberto is absent. Mr. Zitka here. Mr. Rivera
here. Mrs. Osmond here. Chairman Gett is absent. Let the record reflect also in attendance are attorney Gary Gantonio, board engineer Johnny Kimick, and board secretary Grace Cage. public portion. To participate in the general public portion of the meeting,
please click the link on the website and listed on the agenda. To join the webinar, you will be asked to state your name for the record, and we ask that only one person speak at a time. This public comment portion is only for non-aggenda items. Time is set aside
later in the meeting to address questions or comments about current agenda items. If you are participating by phone, press star 9 to raise your hand and star six to unmute. At the end of the general public portion, no further general questions or comments
will be accepted. Motion to open public portion. Motion second. All in favor? I. Anybody on Zoom? I'm sorry. I'll take your time.
No one with hands raised. Anybody in the audience? General statement, comments. Motion to close public portion. Motion. Second. All in favor? I. Approval of the minutes. Um those
members with the strike through are not able to vote due to absence or not being a member at the time of the meeting. Uh approval motion to approve the June June 17, 2025. Did anybody have time to read it? Digest it.
We got it. We amend it. Motion to approve. Motion to approve. Second. All in favor? We do a roll call on it. Um, I can if you want do a roll call, please. Mr. Baldi, yes.
Miss Hannah, yes. Mr. Lrada, yes. Mr. Zitko, yes. Mr. Rivera, yes. Mrs. Oz? Yes. New business. Application of Brian Collins for a driveway expansion located
at 891 Manhattan Avenue, block 2404, lot 23. Are the applicants here? Yes. Want to step up to the microphone? I'll swear you. Please raise your right hand. Do you swear that the testimony you're
about to give this board is the truth, whole truth, and nothing but the truth? I'll help you God. Yes. And please state your name for the record. Ron Collins. Thank you. You want to proceed with your case? Yeah. I don't I wasn't really prepared.
I don't know. I mean, my driveway is from one end of the garage to the other end of the garage. So, you're you're the owner of the property or one of the Okay. And what? Yeah. Give us a little history. What happening on this property? Looks like you were doing a project.
We've done Yeah, we've done construction since 2022. So, we did we completely renovated the house, added additions, and then in the backyard, we did a pool, there's a deck, a shed, a top patio, a bottom patio.
Everything is completely to code. The driveway, to be honest, was an afterthought. I It was in the plans, but it was the last thing we did. I think we did it like last August or September. I told the driveway guy, just do it down
the driveway. I didn't I really I wasn't paying attention. every inch of that when we looked at the pool I you know lounge chairs making sure every foot of this and that I never paid attention to the driveway. All the only decision was did I want like the block standing
upright or that I want them on an angle. I was never thinking I never knew that there was a thing that it couldn't be straight down from garage to garage. That's fine. So how did we end up that you're here today? What you preitated?
25 feet instead of 22 feet. What do you Well, who discovered that? It's the engineer I guess. Were you Frank? Were you closing out permits or what was like what was happening? Okay. And they came for that. That was like the final thing and they saw that. Okay.
Yeah. And they saw that. So, and who did all the curb cuts? The contractor. The Yeah, the people who did the driveway. I had a single. Well, I had a double that went to a single. It was I don't know. I don't know what maybe it was 15 feet at the top and then I guess kind of
angled down and then when I did the house renovations now it just went straight. I just went straight down. I saw I passed your house twice. Okay. I had to go look at it twice. Um Yeah, cuz you went from one side to the other straight down from up to the
bottom. I saw that. So the contractor cut all the curbs and he just made form. Yeah. Yeah, he didn't he never asked like they never asked for he never asked for the plans, but he wasn't looking for the contractor. It was like
it was the the driveway be separate from right cuz I did the house first then the pool. This was like a couple months after the pool was done. But see, right? And that's what I'm going to say. The pool plan shows that
the curb cut is 22 ft. No, I know. I'm That's what I'm saying. I'm not saying that it wasn't on the plans. It was just like a I don't know. I just He never asked for the plans. I didn't never looked at the driveway plans to be honest. I didn't really I wasn't even sure if I was going to do
the driveway. It was It was the last thing we added with all the money that I spent on the house. I really didn't know if I was going to do the driveway. And there was an existing driveway that was a lot shorter because I had a I didn't
have a two-ar garage. So, They went like halfway through the second car garage. All beat up. Was there a permit pulled for the driveway? Yeah. I mean, there was permits pulled for everything by the contract.
By the Yeah, driveway. By the pool company. The pool company pulled the driveway. No, it was all one. The drawings. Yeah. I mean, you guys would know better than me. I don't
Well, I think the driveway is complying that they have on the plans. No, that's how I read it. Yes. It shows what was proposed and what ended up being is two different things. Right. That's what I'm saying. So, what exactly what it ended up being was different, but yes, this was all
approved. I never we never changed anything midway through. This was just from the beginning. This was what it was. And the and the reason why it got caught now is because you were closing all the permits and they went out to do a final inspection and they noticed that the driveway is 25 ft versus 22 feet.
Yeah. This has been going on for months. Yeah. The driveways it's been done since last I think September, right? Or August. August or September. I know. It's like the c before the horse cuz it cuz in reality if the board says they don't like it and they turn you
down, you got to put it back to what it was, which is kind of you disturbing what exactly what you tried to accomplish in the first place. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it looks way nicer than it did. I know. But the I I will tell you this, that apron, that white apron needs to be
fixed. It's all broken up and everything where it meets the street. Yeah. I don't know what's causing that problem. I don't know if it's drove over it, but it it Yeah, it cracked. Yeah, I just Yeah, I'm just I already Yeah, I already have my somebody lined up for it with some other things that
have fixed. I have John, help me out a little bit on this because I I read your I read your letter that you sent about updating certain paperwork to make sure that it reflects dates. Well, um, let me
just cut to the chase. The the concern is is that the proposed maximum impervious coverage per the plan that was submitted for the pool is 34.93%. The code only allows 35%. So, I had asked
from my May 15th letter for the applicant to provide what the new imperous coverage for the site would be since we're so close to that 35%. Uh, that's issue number one. Issue number two, response.
I did not get a response. No. Issue number two would be what you pointed out was that the curb is damaged and it needs to be repaired and I copied the township engineer and we heard testimony
that the applicant plans to correct that. So the the impervious um I'm not sure if it's an issue. I didn't do a calculation based on 25 ft.
We always rely upon the applicant to do that calculation and we check it. So, um, if you had to take a wild guess what you think the impervious coverage would be, it's a hu pretty big site. I would think that it's going to be very close like 34.99%.
Okay. So, even if it's at 35102, it's still workable. That's we're in why we're in front of the board. Okay. Do you have anything else to comment? No. Well, I mean, I'm not happy about the bottom of the driveway either. I mean, I got to pay for it to get fixed.
It's not even a year old. I mean, it's September will be a year for all of us. So, now I got to pay somebody to fix it. Can I just ask according to this topographical survey, what is the actual or was was the
original amount of of this area? You know, now we know it's all the way over here. How how wide was it to begin with? Do you does anyone know? Can you see it on the exist? It it looks like it varied anywhere
between roughly um 11 ft to 25 to 26 ft. But the entrance is like 11 ft in the front. Yes. Yes. Is that the Schmidt survey? We're
looking at the topographics. Yeah, the topographic. Well, I'm also looking at the pool plan by Errolo Engineer. So, either one, you can look at the Schmidt survey. I think she was asking what it looked like before. Yeah. What it was, you know, because this is 2020. What's the date of
this? August of 2023. It was still in the prior form, the driveway, right? Yeah. It was like the egg on the top. Yeah. Yeah. The driveway. I don't want to put It's like an odd shape words into Mr. Collins, but the driveway
was done probably very as last because in building the pool, you're doing a lot of disturbance to the rear yard, the front yard, etc. with the construction. So, the the it makes sense that the driveway would be the last thing to be to be done on the site.
Should these reports that we have, should they be updated with current dates or can we still accept these and leave them alone? I I I think it could accept them and then um
you know, if the the board is leaning towards acting favorably on the on the application, make make some conditions. I mean, at this point, it's what's done is done, right? Like he said, you know, you need to get the work. Um, right now,
what I'm hearing most is about the fixing of behavior, which you already addressed as you mentioned. Um and and and then again based on what you said, you know, regarding the uh
coverage, I mean it would be nice to see the plans actually updated to show the population, but it's not 23 years old. It's just like this. This is the
Yeah, this is John. Besides those couple of things, was there anything else that needed to be changed, upgraded? Yeah. No. Okay. Yeah. What is the permissible impervious
coverage? What's our max? 35%. 35. Okay. So they were at according to the submitted plans they were 212%. No, no proposed 34.93. And what's allowed? 35 ft. So they were under submitted but we're not sure
because it's an extra 3 ft. And how long are Looks like almost 50 ft. He can probably a better view, but when I looked at it, it was close to close to 50 ft. So you're looking at at least 150 square feet added.
So it could be close to the next. Will there be an ad as built for this house when it's finally finished? Do we do as builts? This a lot of work was done on this house. It's not as it was just a minor Let's let's ask the question of the applicant. Were you required to provide
an asbuilt for your final Yeah. CO and was that submitted to the board? Yeah, it was. Yep. And the company's actually out of business. Um, Paige Page Consultants.
Yeah. I We did I did not receive an plan. We didn't receive one either. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, at the time you guys require it. I sent out everything that I got. So, it might be in the building department
and I think I got the survey that you submitted when you began your project. Okay. I did not know there was an aspect. Because that would answer some of the questions, wouldn't it? Yes, it would. Okay, that's what I thought.
So, was it maybe submitted as part of the permits to the building department, but not to the zoning? Right. Right. Yeah. Are you feeling out the calculations? I'm trying. Okay. The length of the ground change, right? It's just
No, the length still. It's just that end piece instead of curving all the way in. Yes. You made it straight up and down on both sides with the P. See, it even curves out a little at the edge when they're going into it. You see that once you drive? I couldn't believe that. That's deep
property back there all the way like kind of Yeah. in the back. Yeah. You know, it it's really just a sliver. Um 3 by at the time we were doing the driveway.
Did the the driveway companies in give you any indication that No, he told him to. He said, "No." Yeah. I just told him. He told him to just do the driveway. Basically, nobody looked at the price. He just did it. That's all. That's really what happened.
Yeah. He's an unlike a driveway guy. Okay. I think we got Hold on a second. I mean, yeah, an oversight on my part. And like I don't he never even never really even asked me for the plans if I remember correctly. And this and this gentleman was a driveway guy.
I hope so. I know not to use all his trucks. Put them on the list. Not to go to Yeah. With this, you know, like No, it No, it went it went all to the
right. As you look at the house though, it went to the right cuz the curving is changed on that side, not on the other side cuz that's where I went back there today because I had to see which side and got affected. And which side did you say?
All to the right. Okay. As you're looking at the house. As you're looking at the house. Okay. It's on the side where the h where the house continues. Yes. So based on the geometry of the old driveway which had a curve to it and
what was proposed on the plan we were only looking about an additional 100 square ft because it went from you know that varying width to all 25 and plus we only have to look at what's
on the property. We don't look at what's in the rideway in that in that 10 ft. So you can't include that right at 10 ft. So at 100 square ft of additional imperous area divided by 0454
acres which is 23,000 square ft. You're you're not even moving the needle. So it's only 34.94%. So you'll be under the 35%. So it doesn't trigger any sort of variance with improvement.
But do you still want revised numbers? I I think it would be a good idea. Okay. Um but it might be on the AS bill, but we might not. We don't know because we didn't We should put it in the minutes. We should see the as bills.
Yeah. Somebody should see the as bills. Yeah. But it it doesn't it doesn't move the needle with triggering a variance for impervious area. Still under 35%. Yes. Yes. Probably slim.
take out a few bricks in the back. Yes. I think I think as long as we I'm looking at conditions to update the numbers if there is Well, he's saying there has to he said he has an has built. Anybody else have any questions?
So, we we want to see that an asbuilt. So if you're going to approve it, let's say you want an as the condition, fix the apron, fix the apron, fix as built plan and as built showing the current calculation of impervious coverage
numbers and there has to be one at the building department. Am I correct? That's what the test I could have sworn. I don't I mean listen if I have to pay for another one. Do we do you want to make a condition in the event that the impervious
calculation exceeds the amount that the applicant agrees to make it comply? Like what if it came back at 36%. I don't cover I know but how is he going to how is he going to fix a driveway that's already been done? So the question becomes is I would I would if that's the case he
would have to come back and have him come back have him come back to the board for a variance for that that way it's legitimate. Right. Yeah. He it's built already. So it's not going to delay construction or so bring him back another month with all the correct paperwork and all. It's not
going to hamper anything. And so it's not like we're holding you up from doing any work. It is what it is. But we just want updated paperwork to show that it's not a problem. Do this again or just come back at hand that has built s. No, you got to come back to the
if it exceeds the 35%. If it Right. We're just saying if it does because then you'd need another variance, right? Gotcha. If it doesn't, if it doesn't, you're just handing the paperwork and it depends on what the numbers are at the end of the day. That's usually why
we're saying we're going to if it exceeds the 75% now it it triggers another variance that would have been needed. Gotcha. Okay. I understand. And that's usually why we're making it subject to because if it does, you're going to have to come back and then another variance and so forth and so on.
If it doesn't, we have all the updated information in your folder and then we keep on going. Right. Can I ask has the engineer been the same engineer from this whole job? You're talking about the town engineer? Yes, the town engineer. No, there's been there's been two
different engineers. Okay. So, there are different then calculations from different letters. So the asbuilt would be the last certified piece of paper that says what's right. And yes and and the town engineer
theoretically would check that. Not me. It only it only came Yes. Go ahead. So the town the second town engineer who worked on this only did the pool and I don't think I don't think he would request an asill from the pool. Do you think you would request an as for the
pool? Did you request an asbel for the piece to use it? Did I request an asbel? I can't remember. It was so long ago. Good answer. Because I don't think that I honestly can't. The second piece of it was the pool. I mean, seriously, but once they do the ads build, it'll
show everything on there and the engineer can then calculate from what exists on the property as of now all of the figures that are needed. Yes. Correct. Yeah. And that and they and I agree with you. That's the reason why we need to get that report because that would solve
all the mystery questions. So either the eggs built exists or he has to get one. So right so tomorrow I'll ask the guys at building department to check the file and see if they have an aspect and if they don't you'll notify and I will let them know. That's fine. And maybe you have a copy of your house
or you know Yeah. Because I think you need that. I already It doesn't matter. I'll just pick no one. I already tried page consultants been in business for like 30 40 years. They went out of business. I'm sure some he's probably heard of them. I mean they were around forever. The guy in
Florida now. Yeah. I know Paige. He doesn't I haven't seen anything from them in Yeah, they're done. But whatever. If that's what I have to do, I'll pay for it all. I thought the daughter was going to take them anyway. We'll we'll check with the building
department. No, that he will graceful graceful will check the building and notify Mr. Collins if he needs to do it or good to go. We'll give you instruction. The good thing is we need to make sure your paperwork is correct.
Okay. Anybody else has any questions, comments? Let let me open up to the public. Motion to open to the public comments. Motion second. All in favor? Hi. Anybody on Zoom? No.
Anybody in the public that would like to make any comments pertaining to this application? Motion to close public comments. Motion. Second. All in favor? Hi.
So, I'd like to make a uh a motion to approve this application subject to um a couple of things which is um the asbuilt plan. Um confirming that the impervious coverage
confirming that the impervious coverage is less than 35% based on the new numbers. Uh second is the uh the pool plan and the other plan needs to be updated with current dates.
You okay with that? Current um like revisions to make sure current revisions reflecting the the 25 ft. Anybody else have any other the apron? Oh, in the apron. Sorry. Thank you. And fixing of the apron.
You okay with that? 68 round the plan's updated right to show actual driveway driveway because it says 22 ft and it's really 25 ft and accurate and the asbuilt plan to show the impervious coverage being hopefully less
than 35 right I make that motion second anybody second it roll call grace Mrs. Grimmaldi, yes.
Mrs. Hannah, yes. Mr. Lrada, yes. Mr. Zitko, yes. Mr. Rivero, yes. Mrs. Osman, yes. You're good. All right. Wait for wait for Grace's call and she'll help you out with that. If not,
then you have to follow up on those paperwork. And then hopefully everything is well and good. We have a resolution which will prepare at the next meeting. will be memorialized and you'll get a copy of that and then you can get the variance
department the variance to close up the bid show the building department if there's any issue closing out your got to wait thank you have a good night you don't have to come to the meeting though old business resolution 25-10 to approve
the application oh oh sorry 25-12 to approve the application of Brian Ptori and Kelly Fitzpatrick for the variance related to a proposed detached garage driveway expansion and adjoining
covered patio to be located at 335 Wilson Avenue block 2413 lot 18. Everybody have any comments pertaining? Uh well gentlemen have comments. Um, tell us I think the maximum garage floor
area I had 26% which I got from the minutes like I I don't I mean I just took that from the minutes. I I don't know where I just take it from the tape. So it and and because I called Joe Bruno today to confirm the 246% and he said
no that doesn't ring. You know, it is what it is. whatever the garage area divided by the area of the house is, that's the percentage. And the board didn't have an issue with that. And I said, "You're right." Right.
Because they wanted the the garage because it had no garage. So that number I calculated to be 44%. Okay. Which, you know, it sounds high, but I I think the the board was was fine with
that. But I checked my notes. I didn't see anything. So if you have a veteran your number because sometimes the way the conversation is, it's not always I don't even think it was really mentioned anywhere in his plans or it was brought up only at the meeting. That's why I had it in there,
right? But yeah, 44% it is what it is. It is what it is. This was a property with no garage to begin with. That's right. board was happy that they were put making it comply right subject to some of those conditions right and it was a small house so
right the other I wasn't here was any other you have a bunch of comments well he puts a lot of checks
yeah it was it was just grammatical um was it John was there a question with the your yard setback. I see you have Yeah, you know, um or is it more of a the zoning officer I believe said 20 ft
or the application came in 20 ft. So that's why I I left it. But for the life of me, I can't find it in the code. So, as to what's for either way, we permitted a 10 foot, right, setback because it was seven and we had
to move up the garage, I think. Right. We Right. We moved up the garage 3 ft. Yeah. Right. Uh I would like you to put in reinforced concrete. I remember that. Yep. It has to be reinforced.
And then my notes said that for storm water management it was the runoff from all new roof areas plus the existing gutters at the rear of the house. The east side, right? Not all the roof. Not all the
roof areas. That's what my plus the east side and all new anything new plus the east side of the existing house. Where do we have it in the condition? Okay. the condition. Okay. Yeah. You grace, you saw that. That's ince. So, the applicant will hire a civil engineer to design storm water
management system to retain the runoff from all new roof areas and the existing gutters at the rear of the house. Will be redirected and tied into the seage bin. Yeah, that's what it says. Got it. That's it. I'm good with all that.
Anybody else? Any comments, questions? Motion to roll. Motion to approve it. Motion. I'll make a motion to approve the resolution 25-12.
Motion. One second. Second. Second. Coberg. Mrs. Remaldi. Yes. Miss Hannah. Yes. Mr. Zitka. Yes. Mr. Rivera. Yes. Mrs. Austin. Yes.
Resolution ZB25-1. Is that right? Okay. To approve the application of Kevin and Jennifer Penner for variances related to a proposed detached garage and driveway expansion to be located at 667 Kennedy Drive,
Kennedy Drive, block 1208 lot 10. So this one on the first page, John corrected the maximum driveway width. I had 42.5. It's 45.2. John, that's what you have. Yes.
I'm sorry. This says 45.3. You said impervious. You said no. No. I'm sorry. Oh, 42.5. Is that right? It's 45. 45.2. Oh, it's 45.2. It's a reverse.
So, we're correcting that. What is it? 45.2. 45.2 instead of being 42.5. Yeah. The numbers got transposed. Uh the other question I I really have on the second page, John referencing the
documents. Yeah, I I don't have that. Go ahead. The actual Oh, yeah. I just because I have topographic survey that was by Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I see it now. Um the one I have that stays good. But that boundary
survey I I the boundary survey I have from ample survey from whatever I have here. Okay, that's that's so I have that's fine. I I was confused there. Yeah, Jerry Binowitz from Ampul Survey.
Yeah, disregard disregard my So Grace, we could just leave those. Okay. Um just the date on on A if it's June 3rd or Right. Right. Change the date. E we'll leave D and E the way it is. F
is correct. It was two sheets for the architect plans. I'm sorry. One F is one sheet or two sheets? Two should be two sheets. Should be two sheets. Yeah. Uh let's see. Is anything good on page three?
Page three, paragraph two, John just added rear yard coverage and driveway with at the end, right? Parag at the end of paragraph through two, paragraph two on page three. Got it. Um,
anything on page four at the top? Oh, the end of the first paragraph he added where it says the applicant maintains Garden State Parkway within the ride of way. Right. That's what you Yeah. I said the applicant maintains property within the Garden State
property. Oh, okay. Within the Garden State Parkway rightway. Gotcha. Rather than the applicant maintains Garden State Parkway. It sounds like he maintains the entire Garden State Parkway just within the rightway.
Okay. Anything on page five? Um, good. I think five and six were good. Okay. Seven. We had on 13 in some of the conditions all where it says at the top all fencing
that is encroaching onto neighboring properties would be removed and John had added and reset to within the property. Right. We want that fence to remain but we want it in inside the property. inside his property. So, yeah, it's and we're not going to do anything about
the overbody staying there on Parkway. No, I I didn't hear anything from the board. We We discussed it and we said it doesn't matter if the Parkway wants them to move them. They can tell them to remove them. It's just vegetation. Why rip live trees out? Yeah. Well, my my guess is that they
didn't they wouldn't care. No, they won't. Yeah. I think they just said if the parkway tells them they have to remove it. That's what we had said, right? Basically, was the boards I think that was it. No, it's just that you put a gate at the end of the property and he has extra property. Really?
Yeah. Come on. You play bad mitten. But other than that, that was over bowling. You know what I was problem with it? They can handle it. Everything else is good. Yeah. And nobody can see you. The over bodies are so big. You know, should probably have it thousand
location. So, subject to those corrections that we made, which I'm agreeable to. Okay. Make a motion. Motion to approve resolution ZB25-11. Motion roll. Grace, please.
Second. Okay. Mrs. Grimaldi. Yes. Miss Hannah. Yes. Mr. Zitko. Yes. Mr. Rivera. Mrs. Osman. No. Okay.
You vote no for what? For the resolution. I'm not voting for the application. You're not voting on the application. You're voting on the resolution. I debate that. So do I. I debate that. I'm sorry. If I voted no for this application.
You can vote no. Yeah. But to me that's more of a form like there's something that you Yeah. But I besides what I get you vote no I understand. I I've never in all my years working for Munic.
I would think a no vote is always a no vote. If I abstain it'd be different. But this and Mr. Zit go the same way. If you voted no for the application itself. Yeah. I I think we're just voting that the resolution is correct as passed is how I when you look back and say because I had
this problem four years ago when I was on the board. Um the same thing was brought up and I just I voted no and I'm voting no again. As I was explained in the beginning, the application is different than the resolution because I felt the same way.
I had voted no on both. But I was told that when you vote no or vote yes, it's only for the resolution to make sure that the wording um the the paragraphs are correct, the spelling is correct, and what the board has decided to do is
correct for the resolution. That's all that it's for. The conditions are all the conditions are all there and everything. So when I was told that, I said, "Okay, even though I voted no for the application, I guess based on what you're telling me, then it would be yes for the resolution.
I was told the same thing for we had the uh used car lock. I voted no one that used car. They told me I'm supposed to vote yes when I said no. You don't like my resolutions? I take I've done many resolutions as a no. It's a no.
No. All talk. Any board members have any issues? Yeah. I have a just out of curiosity. What happens in cases where and I know what the resolution could be because it's happened before here in town. People had to take down like they overbuilt the height on a house. There
was a house that had to take down the height. Uh and I know that that can happen. But is there any other recourse? You know, it seems that when people have problems like this, it's done already and you're sitting here.
I don't know. I I Is there anything in the engineer? Do you know of anything? And do other towns do things? Like I always say, the board could do whatever it wants. Yeah. Yeah. But see, that's that's not what according to when you read the rules and regulations in the town. There's nothing
that says anything. So you could have made this gentleman rip out of the truck. What or cut it back? Or cut it back. Make it comply. But I'm as as long as I'm a very big believer in in the zoning is zoning and if it's an actual hardship of the
land yes then that is that is a variance that should be granted but if it's not and if it's you know and anybody can say we had one member used to say yeah those were the I wants well somebody well that's what I want well no it's not with
zoning so you can't it's the I want and it may be is it the minimus like slightly versus, you know, that makes a difference. That makes a difference, too. I believe that I How egregious is it, right? We we we try in other towns, you know, I I try very hard to catch things before
it gets to that point. Um, you know, but see, when you have an application that's been going on, and that's just not since 22 before 22 with additions in the back. This is this house. I know what the kind of house I think when I first got. So that was um
was this 2025? Maybe four years that's been around. That's been around a long time. That's what I'm saying. They've been working a long time on this house. And uh yeah, you know, when you're working this long on a house and you're having, as I say, different pieces and you have this
permit here and this permit here and then all of a sudden I had that happen on a situation my own house. I had a an applica, you know, what a good zoning. This is 40 years ago and everything was wonderful. The second time around I gave it Julie said fine. He never looked at the first edition. So he gave me
permission. I had it all written up by the buildings. Well, when I became zoning board secretary, I found that I was in violation of the area. It happens. There's mistakes. I've had clients with that. We have to go back because the town approved the second version. They didn't really Right. Right. So, you know, that's what
I'm saying. So, it gets very That's what I'm just asking. Nowadays, people are making very large homes. and they're doing a lot of work on their houses and uh I'm just wondering you know does the town have any guidelines
or should they or zoning wise I don't I believe that an application you make a decision based on if it's going to hurt the town or if it's going to hurt the residents and if it doesn't and you can live with it then you vote yes with it you vote no
and I think it's important whether did anyone come and say anything that that makes but you see no one comes to even town meetings. Well, because it wasn't an important application when we have seasons this place 6 months. So, it it depends on the
application. How simple is that? I was just wondering I was just seeing if there was some but it is it and kind of came up um a couple months ago the same similar discussion as far as that you know when it came to okay zoning board approved
these plans and then they turn around and knock down more of the house it's a similar situation and forcing you know it's up to the council to to decide what the penalties are big deals And
okay, I have I have something I brought up um and it's on the agenda. Two months ago, but I wasn't here last month's meeting. We ran into Ricky. Is it Ricky? Yes, Ricky upstairs. Uh because we voted on
the YouTube and I thought the way I voted was I thought it was saving money to the town by not posting it onto YouTube. He informed Grace and I that it has no additional cost to put it onto YouTube. So if somebody misses a meeting and they want to go back to YouTube,
they can. There's no cost for the town. It's the same cost whether he films it here and puts it on YouTube or he doesn't put it on YouTube. So I didn't know if anybody else had that same confusion as I did because I thought it was an additional cost to the YouTube.
So and I'm asking if whether or not we want to reconsider putting it back onto YouTube. So if somebody misses it the one one of the uh I can't remember the gentleman's name he mentioned Dan Davis
yeah I remember his concern was we don't want to be exposing the event that scientist said that it was incorrect and we get a hang okay but the planning board is going back to how far they going back to when they start September of 24
right when I'm sorry because they started top September 24 is when they started talking about the master plan master plan. So if anybody misses one of those meetings, they can go back and listen to it. Yeah. But that's something very different than what the zoning board
when we look at an application, it stands on its own by itself. I thought we were voting when we were talking about the meeting whether or not we were going to um live stream the meetings. I thought we were going to do we were voting on
the possibility of taking away the live stream. That's not whether it's going to be whether it was going to remain publicly available recorded onto YouTube. So she missed a meeting for historical record so to speak.
Okay. So, if it doesn't cost any, if there's no additional cost to it, I'm saying put it back on and and let people go back to it if they want to. That's I'm bringing that back up on to the board cuz I got I didn't get that impression. Okay.
Until Ricky saw us at the hallway. That's usually why I'm bringing it back up. So, can I make a motion that we could put it back on to YouTube? I need motion. Second. Can I roll call?
Grace. So, you're motioning and you're second, right? Yes. I motion. Okay. And this is to allow recordings of to keep the historical recordings onto YouTube. So if you miss a meeting, you want to go back, you can go see it
like starting like you can look up last month's council meeting on YouTube and and still watch it, right? Like starting with this meeting. So we have a motion in a second. Uh as far as comments, does our attorney have any reason we should or should not that
he can think of from a I don't know other towns do it or not. Uh I mean some towns are still zoom so you know but that doesn't mean that they keep it. I mean obviously the records we have to maintain them for for some period of time and that's all over.
I mean when you have the minutes so either way it's it's all there but it may be you know Mr. Dax's not here to raise his point but I don't know engineer you have heard anything about putting it back on to
YouTube. Well, I I'll tell you this. Um I am in uh Hawthorne for the land use boards in Hawthorne and in Oakland and they do not record their land use meetings. They do record their mayor and council meetings. Uh but they do not
What do you mean by they don't record? They don't it doesn't get taped on when having the live meetings. But precoid we didn't this is all newer since But wait a minute. Isn't it a law that if you do one, you have to do all of your meetings, the town meetings?
No, they interpret the law as being that they have to do the no hybrid is allowed. That's their inter that's the attorneys and their interpretation that either you look separately at the mayor and council, they must do either
uh in person or via hybrid. They cannot do I I mean or Zoom or like or Zoom or virtual virtual. They cannot do a hybrid like you're doing here, but that's their attorney's interpretation. Your attorneys have a
different interpretation. And so when they do in person, they do not record via YouTube or via via camera. They just simply take minutes and that's it. And if the minutes may be wrong, how do
they correct them? They they approve of me. They they do they do things like they did except it's not publicly put over the air. Yeah. So I can't I really can't comment on that because I don't know the pitfalls of of going on you. I haven't
experienced anything. But we've been doing it for all this time. I I think Mr. Dagasino's point was in the age of social media. I think bringing that video back and putting it somewhere on some other platform. I think you know where they'll show
you know maybe it's good enough somebody runs for office or maybe not and just look look what Mary Os let me make one quick statement the the planning board does it right now they went back to September of 24 because of the master plan the main council does it
yes they've been doing it right so they never stop so we're the only board in this town that doesn't do it. So, and we used to do it. So, we only stopped what, a month ago, two months ago. When did you actually post it on YouTube?
Live streaming, right? But you can go on to YouTube and and not I thought we could. No. No, we never. But the other boards are doing it that way. No. Yes. But do we have to do We're supposed to
be our own board and take our own decision. But I just I just brought it up because I had the impression that it was saving us money from the vote and that's the reason why I voted no because it was saving us money. But when Ricky saw us in the hallway, it was no
additional cost. I mean, the other thing to consider with it all is with the with the rapid growth of AI and voiceovers that are are almost as as realistic as you can imagine. it it's something to keep in the back of
your mind that somebody can then take that video and change it um and make it all but looking like it was real. So something to consider. Uh it doesn't have to be effective vote now but okay. So let me let me do this because
there's gentleman waiting. So let me open it up to the public. Motion. Motion. Second. All in favor? I sir. Good evening. Uh John Frelick 960 bridge street. Um,
so the council wanted to save money by not doing whatever they do to record this. Apparently, this is recorded and you can go to the town and request the recording. They wanted to eliminate that and just put it on YouTube to save money. That's and I know that because I
saw it on YouTube when I watched the town council meeting as part of their, you know, six-month budget thing. Um, I prefer it to be on YouTube. Then I don't have to be here tonight. Um, I can watch it,
you know, when I have time to watch it. Sometimes I work during the day and I listen to the council meeting or I listen to the to the planning board meeting or I would like to listen to this just because um I live here. So I was I was um
born in this town. I uh live with my parents and I'm back in my parents house um after being gone for 30 years and I would like to make some improvements and that's why I'm here. I'm trying to get at the gist of the board so I don't make all of
these mistakes that other people are making. I want to make my house look nice, not like it's the worst house on the block. But I would like it to be on YouTube. By not putting it on YouTube, it almost seems like you're hiding something. Not that you are, but that's
what it it feels to me. And I don't think any other people than the people who live in this town are going to be watching it or have any interest in it. And that's what I have to say. Thank you.
Anybody else on motion to close? I just oh yeah public comment I just simply want to state that it's not for hiding sake or anything else I just feel that this board in particular
takes each application on its own merit and I feel that it could be used as a tool to say well you gave it to so and so well you see that's that is a big right but let me ask you this question every they can go back
and look at the Right. So, absolutely. So, there's there's no there's no holding back. They could find out anyway. It just makes it a little bit easier, I guess. Difference of those minutes versus a visual verbatim. Well, visual of somebody's
face, somebody's image likeness being as opposed to what said, you know, and any side comments that may not pertain to what was actually decided. Right. Sure. I see both sides. Yeah. And that's my only side is I just don't
want to make it easier. Those words almost came out of my mouth, but that's not the way I wanted to present. Yes. I want Yes. I wanted to present that, you know, each of these is a story unto itself.
Okay. Property A has reasons for approving or not approving. has no bearing on property C even if there's similar circumstances but it wouldn't hurt you know it it doesn't upset me to the grace the planning board is also hybrid same same with this
so so so motion to close public comment yeah motion to close the public comment second all in favor I okay so I'm still going to ask for a vote motion to vote to put it back onto YouTube. Well, it's on YouTube. So, the motion is
to to to store it. Store it and keep it go. Well, there's no archive it on YouTube. It's not on YouTube. It's not stored. It's just like right now it's on YouTube, but when we're done, it's now that's what you want to go back. I No, that's what it is. Right. I want to go back. The motion is to archive it. Keep it
there and let people be able to see it at any time they want. Definitely. I would go back. I I would keep You know what? Let me ask Okay, hold on a second. There's a there's a question Gary brought up. Let's can we just do it like
for one year a one-year rotation whether or not you want to have a time frame how long it's going to be stored. Let's say let's say yeah let's go back does and I don't know if it's there how long it's there forever. So my understanding is that this was
only going to be till the end of the year and then the council is going to look at how many people are watching those. Right. But again and then they're going to revisit whether they want to continue to fund. So then for now it's basically for now to the end.
But you're saying there's no right involved. Well, there's a fee for someone to do the live stream which is happening now. Yes. Um there's no fee to put it on YouTube. Okay. Mr. Chairman, that's where the confusion was. Mr. Chairman, can I have you amend the mo or can we
amend the motion to archive it via YouTube for the end of the year and then revisit at the reorganization meeting or our annual first annual meeting in January. See what the council does in in December. Okay. Okay. So, I I I redo my motion
that we go Kev that we archive on YouTube for the remainder of the year and then we'll revisit again in January after we get council input as to what they're doing, planning board as to what they're doing and everybody else. That way, we can
kind of all be on the same page, but we don't have to be on the same page. We don't have to, but we can if we choose. Remember, like you said, we're our own individual board. We can use we can use their conversation. It should be our own board. Correct. Because we have, you know, we are under
no one's control, per se. Agreed. Or shouldn't be agreed. I say, do I have a second motion on that? May second. First roll call, please. Mrs. Grimaldi. Yes. Miss Hannah.
Sorry. No. No. Mr. Lrada. Yes. Mr. Zitko. Yes, Mr. Rivera. Yes, Mr. Osman.
Yes. Yes. We got one down and the rest is Okay. Uh motion to adjurnn at 8:27 28. Motion second. All in favor? I I thank you everybody.
Thank you. Thank you.