And this is going on. >> I hope today's meeting shouldn't go that long. >> Okay, we are live. All right, we are live. >> Is that good? >> Are we good?
>> Okay. All right. We are good. Sorry for the delay. We were having some technical difficulties. Um the um meeting was not um broadcasting. So we are live now um at 10:06. I call to order um our budget meeting um
number three, the wrap-up meeting. >> Okay. >> Roll call, please. >> Charles, >> here. >> Gawas, >> here. Jivers >> here. >> Mandel, >> here. >> Weiss here. >> Are we adequately noticed? >> Yes, this meeting was adequately noticed on February 27th, 2026 to the times in the Princeton packet filed with the
municipal clerk posted here at the municipal building and on the township website. Please stand for the salute to the flag. >> Thank you. United States of America. >> Um, thank you. Um, before we start, uh,
mayor, you wanted to give an update >> there. >> Yeah. Uh, I just want to talk about a couple of issues. One is uh uh there are a lot of potholes because of the weather. If you do see the pothole, please do report it on the uh township
website. What the DPW does is they go around and try to fix as many as they can. There are some on village road and certain locations that they have identified which they say is beyond their capability. So we are working with a contractor to get a code and they will
be fixed on an emergency basis uh without going through all the uh song and dance of getting approval from the council and stuff. They are expected to be fixed within next week or so. Uh once uh John Taylor was going to talk to the
contractor uh today I believe. So once we get a quote um once he like the code we are going to get that fixed. So anything that TPW can't uh can't fix uh we are going outside without waiting for the budget and all the normal processes
uh to get it fixed. Um again I just want to set expectation it's not going to be like caram board. Um it is what it is because of the bad weather but we are trying to fix as much as we can and usually it should be fixed within 48 hours once you report it on the website.
uh if it's not then just report again which means that it's probably uh outside DPW's capabilities and then we'll go out and get it fixed from uh uh a contractor and uh I have a partial update on uh
Clarkville Road Bridge. Uh I did talk to the governor's office last Friday morning and as a result I did uh get a call back from the new uh commissioner of uh NJ dot Priya uh Friday evening. She's not confirmed yet. She's going to
be confirmed next week but we had a great conversation. Uh I did tell her all the frustrations that we had. I did uh recommend that uh watch the and talk to NJ DOT folks. Um she has worked in private sector. she has dealt with
Amtrak so she's very much aware of what's involved. Uh but as a result of that on Monday morning there were people on Clarkville road bridge and lo and behold Amtrak did give an outage during the day on Monday morning. Um John Taylor did go and talk to the people
doing the inspection. They told him they will be there until they are finished. Uh I went there just half an hour ago and nobody was there. So I I assume Oh, they're there now. Okay. So, they don't start work as early as we do. So, okay.
So, after the meeting, I may go and take a look. But they have told us uh or they have told John that they will be there until they finish inspection. The next step they said was it will take 4 weeks to figure out the options and I did talk to Miss Jine about that as
well. She's from private sector. So, I'm hoping she will uh uh she will accelerate it further. But before asking for update, I'm just waiting for them to uh finish the inspection. Uh but this is a good progress and I'm very encouraged
that now somebody in NGO at the highest level has taken ownership. Uh it was just me and council members who had ownership and were complaining about the road. But now somebody at the highest level has ownership and I have a cell phone number. And I did tell her because
she called uh Friday evening around 5:36 and uh she apologized for calling late. I told her you call me 2:00 in the morning, I'll answer. Don't worry about it. So uh I'm glad that somebody at the highest level has taken ownership. So as soon as they finish inspection, uh
probably early Monday or Tuesday, I'll ask for an update as to okay now what's the next step and I will update the public on that. >> Okay. Thank you, mayor. Um, mayor, can we also send um the information on uh road repairs up on the website?
>> Yeah, I will. >> Okay. All right. Now, let's move on to our budget meetings. >> Hi, John Water, CFO. John Water, CFO, can you hear it? >> Tilt it up. >> Tilt it up a little bit later. Just want to add to what the mayor said
that um we are declaring emergency for for a certain portion of the roadway in the township and once we um do get the contract or the quote uh we will do a res resolution to approve later on with council. That's usually how it works when you declare emergency.
>> Okay. >> Okay. So just so we'll be getting a resolution the next meeting or two. >> Okay. >> It won't be this meeting. It'll probably be either a first or second meeting in April. >> April. So it's it's not holding up the fix. >> It will not. It's after effect. >> We'll move Yeah. We'll move forward with the fix.
>> Correct. >> Like we did with the sewer and >> same same procedure. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Okay. Um let's start with revenue. You can go to page 65. This is a list of our revenues and our
budget for the last two years. And it gives it a comparison. It's under the revenue tab. Everybody there? >> Yep. Yep. >> Okay. I'm going to start off just um highlighting some of the major differences from the prior year.
Um, the first major difference is we're increasing the anticipation of interest on investment in deposits by 500,000 from 900 to 1.4. >> John, can you move a little move the microphone or something? >> Hello. >> Now we can hear. >> Is that better?
>> Yep. Yeah. >> Okay. Um, so we're increasing the um interest on investment in deposits by 500,000. So 1.4. Uh the prior budget had 900,000, but we did very well with our
interest income um almost $2.5 million. So it allowed us to anticipate a little bit more revenue to help offset any um tax increases. Um I anticipate that figure to be a little less, but not much. Uh because the rates, it looks like they're going to be stable, but I
really can't predict the future. I know the Feds held it flat yesterday. We were anticipating a cut. Um so from our standpoint as far as interest goes that's that's a good thing. That means we'll earn a little bit more interest for the next quarter. Um the reason the um investment income has increased is we
went out and did an RFP um two years ago and we got eight responses and one of the banks was very aggressive and gave us a super deal on interest on for carrying cost and um it's worked out well. It is ocean. Yep.
Um, we uh had a slight increase in anticipation for sewer revenues of $100,000. Um, as you can see, our revenue increased a little bit. It should increase even more this year with the new stuff as they come online. Um, so
we're in pretty good shape there. As you can see, recreation fees are flat. Um, they did anticipate more than what we thought they would. It's just was in different categories because I know they came up in the last uh one of our last meetings. Um
small decrease in cable vision. We know that the more and more people stream the more and more that figure is going to go down each year slightly. The next major increase is capital fund balance. That increase we're
anticipating by 224,000 and change. And that's because we when we went out to do temporary financing for our notes, which is a one-year note for capital, um we had many bids, probably five or six,
which is pretty good. And they they the bids came in so much that people gave us what they call a premium. So they gave us cash plus charges interest. >> Okay. >> So the accounting is it goes into capital fund balance that year and then the following year I anticipated in the
revenue to offset interest cost. So we have like a 1.6 million rough roughly for interest costs on our notes and it's offset by this 500 by this $514,000. So that's how the accounting works for that.
Hey, John, could you scroll back up to the uniform construction code fees? We've got 2 million. Last year's was 4.8 million. Maybe you could just uh >> Yeah, we're anticipating that figure to be less this year because of the growth we had the last two, three years. Um we
still have to do inspections. Usually they take two three years for the big projects. Um we anticipate 2026 to be lower. When I mean lower, it's with in the low 30s. Okay. And then
the following year, we anticipate it may start to creep up again with the new new um permits and things of that nature that are planned in the future. So, we do anticipate we had an all-time high of 5.5 million roughly the year before. As you
can see, it dropped down to um four. So we anticipate this figure to be around three and um this is one of the items that helps generate some of our fund balance. So I don't want to overestimate what we bring into the budget >> to being conservative to generate more
correct >> fund balance to roll over. >> Correct. Because later on when we discussed that our fund balance went down by around 1.7ish, a little less um because some of our addeds um we didn't have as many added taxes for
new construction and the decline in construction fees and a couple other minorities. So, this is just we're planning out. We look out like three, four, three, four, five years to try to have a have a balance as far as um
revenues go. >> Okay. >> Yeah. >> The other item is the Princeton University agreement which is an informal agreement from Princeton University. Um for the last
year we did not receive any money from them. The LA and this is for non-exempt properties. Um they by law they do not have to give us a penny. Um but they want to be good neighbors. So they um they negotiated with us to come up with an agreement. It did take a while and um
uh the mayor did a good job as far as getting them up. Our last revenue that we received from them was in 2024. It was 198,000. So now we we have 800,000 to help offset our expenses and our budgets to how that might be used.
>> We're still kind of negotiating some No, this is this is not we're still negotiating some other things. So we can answer that probably better when we go into close session uh because it's considered negotiations. >> Okay. And we'll give you more details on some of the other items. with the nature
of this agreement is that in lie of taxes that they're exempt from on property. >> Yes. >> But obviously still using services. >> I mean technically it's not pilot because they don't owe you a zero. >> Pilot is when they owe you money and you
make an agreement. This is kind of >> they don't owe us money. >> They don't owe legally. Unfortunately legally they don't owe money. I did go and look at uh other issues. New Brunswick did sue Rudgers and lost. So we didn't go to go that way. So this is
technically not a pilot. This is a negotiated agreement. And as John said, I will talk about it in close session after the Yeah. >> Yeah. It's more of like um they like like like the mayor said, it's not a pilot. All right. Because they're not
obligated to pay anything. >> Alison, can you just um note it down that when we go into close session, we can we can discuss this? We'll discuss it >> because Okay, sound good? >> Yep. Good. >> All right. Our our ambulatoratory fees,
either good or bad, are increased dramatically in the last couple years. Um, we had a slight issue with our billing company. We went out and got a different billing company and they caught up our billings and and we're more in line. The revenue is now more in line of what it should be and and
>> okay, >> that that was part of the issue. It's just because of delayed billing. >> Delayed billing. Correct. So now um it's been a couple years of about a half a million dollars. So I feel comfortable increasing that by 100,000. >> Does that include any insurance payments
we get? >> It's all that is all the insurance payments. >> Okay. >> Um and the and the last item is the amount to be raised that's increasing by $2.2 million.
Um, as I had mentioned on the very first meeting, that's a 3.4 cents increase in taxes. Um, it is our first tax increase in 5 years. Um, in the front of your book is an analysis that gives you that five-year breakdown. Um, and the major
reason for the increases is, you know, the three major one one major increase is healthcare cost, which everybody has been dealing with. That was the largest um increase which was $1.6 million
followed by um salary and wage increase and some other things like uh pensions went up a little bit, insuranceances, things of that nature. But the overall scheme of things, um the cost per household for an average in in the in
the middle 500s comes out to about $180 a month. $180 a year, which is less than $15 a month. >> Yeah, I think you said um >> Yep. >> $14.80. >> It is a month. >> Yep. Um I know it's never a great idea
to raise taxes, but um with fund balance going down this year for the first time in four years, uh unfortunately, it's something we need to do so we don't put ourselves in a hole um going forward next year, the year after. Okay. Is there any other questions about
revenue? >> Um so this is 8.6 63% but um it's 7.96% on the front. So >> it's 7.9 because our assessed value went up. >> Okay. The total assessed value went up. It did >> for all the properties.
>> Correct. So it lowered the impact of the tax rate to 7.90. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> And that was some of the new items coming online >> as you can see. >> Okay. >> Okay. And that's already taking out for some of the assessed values and
commercial went down but o overall our assessed value went up. >> It did. >> Yep. >> Yes. That that includes any appeals that we had settled. >> Mhm. >> There are still some outstanding appeals and in state or commercials and they usually take two to four five years to settle. So
>> we try to settle them earlier >> because it's beneficial to the town. Linda >> page 63. The interlocal service agreement with our school division. >> Yes. >> So revenues for 475.
>> Oh yes. Um when I was reviewing the agreement, which is still good for another couple years, I realized we've been putting 485 in the budget. >> Yeah, >> it's really 475. So that was just an internal housekeeping. Okay. Um we only um if you notice, we only brought in
289,000 last year. Okay. Um, that's based on our actual cost and then the town the school reimbures us. I will say this, toward the end of the year, we finally have a fully booked allocation. We've always been behind officers, so we
should be much closer to um the 485. >> Okay. >> Okay. So, it's looking good. They actually have a full um aotment of officers. We've always been short two or three. It was difficult for them. We are >> now they're 100% booked. That was as of
like a month ago. >> Okay. >> And that's that's net and that's a net zero, right? Whatever we pay >> whatever whatever we pay for class three, we get >> the district pay >> there's a little timing difference at the end of the year. Uh I try to push it in but uh because they run on a fiscal
year July 1 to August we run on a calendar year >> but um yes it's a net cost of zero for the for the township. >> Yeah. No. That's why I had I brought the sound >> I when I realized that we haven't been carrying a 485 for a long time.
Surprised state didn't notice it because I had to send them all the agreements they when they review our budget but nobody picked up on it when I was reviewing I was like well let's let's fix it now. >> When I personel sheets it went from those these officers 300 to 350.
>> Correct. Because now we're fully allocated. And the line item in our budget there's two budgets. We break that out by southern wage and OE. But on the state format which you will get in April when we introduce I only have one line item for this agreement. Okay,
which is the 475 because it's a shared services outside cap and it allows me to move money between OE and soldering invasions. Now that fully allocated for the officers um that's why I put the extra 50,000 there. >> I mean that that's okay. I just didn't
when I saw the revenue was 475 I thought well then it shouldn't be 350. >> It's there's a timing difference. >> We're good. It's there's a net zero cost to the town school pays their bill >> and this is just the Westminster schools
in Westminster has >> they have they actually have their own >> their own school class three. They do their own buildings. They have a contract just like we do, >> right, >> with the school district. And you know, there's a the school has allocated a certain increase each year to the
officers to keep them on. So, uh, we've been passing along for years. We didn't increase it, but then we found out that if if you give them a little bit, you might be able to retain them more and it's kind of worked. So, >> Okay. >> Okay. Anything else on the revenue?
>> Nope. >> Okay. Uh, page 67 is just a historical data. I just didn't want to put it all. I couldn't put it all on one page and it goes all the way back to 16. Um, same thing with 68. You go to to the next tab
that says supplemental information and this is a discussion about fund balance. >> Okay. So in 2025, we started out with $23.4 million in fund balance. Our operations,
which is our excess revenue when everything's paid and received, was 11.7 million. We anticipated 13.425 million in our budget. Um after doing so
that left us with a fund balance of 10 million I'm I'm sorry um left us a fund balance of 10,1479488 for 2026 our fund balance dropped to 21,750,000
and changed and we're keeping the amount anticipated in the budget at 13.425 425 because as you can see our fund balance dropped down about 1.6 million and this is to anticipate a softer revenues in
26. Um with the anticipation at 27 the revenue should bounce back a little bit. Um I can go over our operations which will help tie this out. Um there's only several ways for us into to
um increase fund balance or maintain fund balance. One of them is miscellaneous revenue anticipated. And that's all these revenues that we just went over with in the budget. And in 2024, we ant we received excessive
revenue of 8.2 million compared to what we budgeted for 2025. it was 5.6. So that came down. Most of that was construction and a couple other items. Um the other item that we can um we we
anticipate revenue for is delinquent tax collections. And in 2024 we had 564,000. In 2025 we have 57,000. That number is pretty consistent. Um it's usually around half million. In the last couple years, it had fluctuated
back during COVID, but other than that, it's pretty common. Um, we have very few people that go to tax sale, which takes a year after you're delinquent before you go to tax sale. So, you have a whole year after to pay, but when you do, you pay you pay interest. By state law, we
have to charge interest, and that's that's what that revenue represents. So, it's been pretty consistent at that level. Um, there's another line item. It's kind of complicated. is called required for collection of current taxes. This is the amount that we have to set aside and in our budget there's
that reserve for tax collected collections on the expenditure side. It's the very last item in the budget and it's allows us to keep cash flow because we have to for every dollar we take in that the school and county gets we have to pay them 100% even if we
don't receive 100% of the revenue. So this is an item that keeps us going. We're very fortunate that our collection rate is an high 90 99 percentage which is excellent. It also helps one of the reasons why we're aaa community besides
being very budgeted cons conservative. Um so we don't have to on a $59 million budget. We only have a little over $2 million for that line item. So that that's a really good good thing. The reason why this item dropped from 3.9 to
2.7 is the added and omitted taxes has dropped the price. >> Okay, I'm think I'm a little lost. Where? Which item you looking at? Right. >> This is not in the anywhere. This is just me having a discussion trying to explain the different revenue items and that's what we collect for taxes. We get
added the taxes each year for new construction and they slowed this year. Okay, they should we're going to have an increase again next year because some of the items that we thought would come in this year are not going to be put on the books till next year. There was a little
bit of delay for different reasons. Um so those that's the other item and then you have what we call un miscellaneous revenue that we don't anticipate that usually runs about half a million dollars a year. Um and that helps to replenish fund balance. And the last item is what we call unexpended
appropriation reserves. And that's what we put in the budget two years ago. So each year we generally budget around a little extra about $2 million that we don't spend for whatever reason. Sometimes certain departments don't need as much money, whatever the case may be.
Um open positions. Um and that money goes right back to fund balance. And each year we anticipate about a $2 million for that. And it also gives us extra money in the budget in case we do need have emergency items or things of that nature and we don't have to declare emergency because you have to declare
emergency. Then you have to raise it 100% next year in the budget and the state doesn't allow uh they frown on certain emergencies especially for current stuff when you have sewers or roads and things of that nature. They understand emergencies happen and it's a
different process. It doesn't really affect your operating budget. That's more of a capital life. Um so with that all said and done our fund balance has basically dropped by $1.6 million. Hence and um one of the reasons why we have to
increase our taxes this year. So >> which if you're talking about what our fund balance is >> correct >> uh at the end what which number would you say is the would you take the reserve? Would you take the >> it's 21 million7 and change? That's our
fund balance at the end of the year. And then we're going to use 13.4 in this budget 26 which will leave us a unreserved fund balance of 8.3 million. The year before we had 10 million. So it dropped down from 10 to 8.3
>> because when people hear numbers like these 23 millions they say why aren't you spending this money but that's already dedicated and in and allocated for us. So it's a little confusing to people. I think this is >> it's a snapshot. It's 21 million on
January 1. Our 2026 budget's allocating 13.425 of that. So now we really only have 8 >> 8.3 million million >> of free fun >> which is kind of scary looking at 2001 when they only had 600 sold.
>> Yes. Yes. I mean, we've been fortunate over the years, and that's why um mayor has asked for the tax increase this year because we don't we don't want to get back to that point where we don't, you know, where we're scraping by. This this will give us a clear clear path for the
next couple years. Um, and as long as the revenues trend out this year as as we think they will, we should be good good shape next year. I can't predict if we're going to have a big increase in health care costs or things of that nature, but um that's kind of the theory behind it. I mean, as our fund balance
increased over the years, um we increased the use of that revenue because because it was appropriate and that's why we didn't raise taxes for five years, but now that our fund balance is going down, unfortunately raised tax. >> We have a slight increase after like this is what six years.
>> Six years. Yeah. We had a very very tiny one out of the last six years. There's one year with a tiny one. one point we had like some point 009. >> Yeah, we had a slight increase to one year because the addits came in a little higher. So, >> right. >> Yeah. This is the first time in six years that we have an increase. >> Okay.
>> Okay. >> What are you anticipating the December 31st uh 2026 fund balance to be? >> Um right between 19 and 20 million. >> And is conservative? Last year I thought it was going to be
>> 19 or 20 and it came in at 21. So I'll know more around August to be honest with you. >> Yeah. >> And what is there a target as a percentage of the operating budget or anything like that like to maintain
our AAA rating like what do they the ratings agencies like to see >> around 18%. But we have other reserves that that make that help us make that um that figure besides fund balance that we have some reserves for uh tax appeals. Mhm.
>> Um that really helps out as far as that goes. Um with commercial tax appeals, they're pretty substantial. So um we have set aside money over the years for those tax appeals in case we do lose them. And we it's it's um it's
helped us with our triple. they look at that very positive because of the fact that if we do get hit with a major tax appeal, we use that money to pay for that um allocation and we don't have to uh do an emergency or some other items
of that nature. >> And that's something um the mayor and I and the assessor go over at least once or twice a year to figure out exactly where our appeals are, what they are, what our liability is. And I also have I have to consult with the auditors when they come in because that's a figure
they definitely look at also. And then um we usually get rated in October um because we go out for a note sale at the end of October uh beginning of November. >> Okay. Okay. >> And the 18% you mentioned, how's that calculated? Is that u
>> they just basically on what your appropriations your budget? >> Yeah. So is that the 8 million that's sort of uh >> No, they look at the 21 million plus whatever reserve you had, you know, and then they they um they use another
calculation for um what you use and it's based on it's a very complex figure that they use on on your revenues. So as long as you're not maxing out all your revenues as you can see or not and they can they
have a percent they have a scale and they look at to make sure that you are going to punish fund balance. >> John the easier way to say is which of which one of his 10 11 12 column is should be closer to 18%. >> Different percentage of fun.
>> Very good. Mayor number 10 we're at 14.4%. >> Yeah >> right. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And you noticed the year before we were at 18, but uh we >> So that's that's the reserve. That's the >> that's the reserve. That's what we would
want it to be back to 18%. >> Yeah, because Yes. And we can meet that figure with like I said with some other reserve accounts. >> I think we tend to be fairly conservative in terms of looking at
revenues. Yes, >> we we always assume a little less even if we for a while. You know, >> it's been our history for the last 20 years. >> I mean, >> yeah, by law, I can't budget more than what we take in and we're not allowed to
anticipate any type of receivables. We're very conservative. Um, we're a modified acrruel balance type of accounting. So, you you you underestimate your revenues and you overest or you book all of your expenditures. So that's why we have an encumbumberance system where we have to
book expenditures before they occur. Um we're pretty strict about that. There's a couple items that we don't do on, you know, like repairs, things of that nature that you don't have any control over, but we do blankets to cover those. So the department knows that they're going to spend 40 grand a year in like
repairs, like some of the uh public works equipment, then we'll do a blanket soon as the budget's approved for 40 grand. And if it doesn't get spent in two years, we just cancel it and it goes back to fund balance. So we're very conservative as far as accounting goes. >> So that that blanket already takes that
money and sets it aside. So when you go and you give us a resolution, that money's already taken out of Yes. whatever accounts you tell us the money's in. >> There's a certification of funds that's also provided to council when we do a resolution to award a contract >> and um that's signed by me and the
attorney. Because by law, council does have to know that we have the money before we approve the resolution. >> And so do I. >> Yeah. >> Yes. So do I. >> Otherwise, I wouldn't have a license. >> All right. Any questions with that? >> Oh, cap wardens are favored.
>> Okay. Um, I'll be giving council a a a capital ordinance or they refer to as a cola ordinance for 2026. And what this does is it uh the cola ordinance for 2026 pertains to the budget appropriations cap and serves as
a financial planning tool for subsequent years operating budgets. The ordinance must be adopted adopted prior to the adoption of the 2026 budget. actually it has to be adopted before and introduced. Um and this is a memo and there's an
analysis that I will give you when I give you this ordinance when it's finalized um just before the budget in the first meeting in April. The director of division of local governments has established that the 2027 budget shall be limited to a 2% cap increase of the
amount of the budget subject to cap and that's what they call inside. Local government law provides an increase to 1.5 or a total of 3.5%. Adoption of this ordinance permits an additional 1.39680.21
increase in the final appropriations after everything's said and done. This will allow us to carry over the $291,71957 for use in 27 and or 28 budgets. There's a two-year carryover um that allows us once we adopt this ordinance. If we
don't, then we can't carry over. We'll be over cap if we don't adopt the budget because we have money from prior two years that helps us out for this year. Um >> and that dollar number assumes the budget as is. Correct. It does at 297
which is kind of small. Last year we had 800 something thousand. As Andrea will remember, we only had like 9,000 the one year. >> Oh yeah, I remember. >> Remember that? >> It was like do what you want with the budget, but you only have another thous.
>> Yeah, it was it was kind of hard. It was the first time I've ever seen that to be honest with you. Um but we weren't the only town with that type of issue. Um so you'll get this ordinance with a memo with an analysis uh explaining um the cap ordinance
>> before we introduce right. >> Yep. >> Correct. >> But if you don't approve then the cap >> then I can't the budget fails then >> then then I can't even introduce the budget then we'll have to start over and figure something out. So >> right.
>> Yeah >> it does. I need four votes for this for this or it doesn't pass. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> Everybody's okay with the cola right now? I mean, I I'll send you the information once. >> Yeah. If you could just get that that information to her.
>> Yeah. I try there. It is a little bit further down and then there is an analysis um that explains it and also give you the sheet from the budget. >> Yeah. >> Every year we go through this. It's a little confusing. It is very confusing. um how it works.
>> I mean I'm in the business and it took me about six years to figure it out was doing it. So >> and the fun part is that capital obviously is not part of that number but 5% of the capital has to come from the operating budget and that
>> it comes from the operating but it's actually not part of the cap. It's outside cap. It's one of the exceptions. >> So they'll let you um borrow money outside the cap. So we can borrow we can borrow the the $5,000 pay payment. >> Correct. You still got to pay for it though. So
>> Oh yeah. Well, >> yes. Okay. >> It's one of the exemptions. >> So it's so it is exempted from the operating budget. M >> it's No, it's in the operating budget, >> but it's ex but it's um in the operating budget, but it's not part of the cap. >> Correct.
>> Debt service is not. >> Okay. >> Also, all right. because that's one of the first responsibilities of CFO is I have to make debt service payments on time. >> John, there is a summary sheet as part of the budget that shows what
>> it does. It's broken down in in your state format budget, not in that format. >> Okay. Okay. >> So, it's that document I'll give to you either Thursday or Friday before the meeting. Um, so you can take a look at it. And I usually give you a reconciliation sheet that says we
started, this is what's in the book that I got you. Any changes, most of the changes usually are um any changes we make to capital. And um grants that come in between now and then, I'll I'll put them in into the budget. And remember,
capital is just a a working document. It's a it's a management tool. uh we can amend that at any time we would like and it only becomes spendable and and a a budget item is when we do the capital ordinance that that we send to council.
So um what we have in there can be changed at any time during the year unlike the regular budget where we can only do budget transfers November and December at the end of the year January, February, March the following year. So it's much tighter.
>> Okay. Okay. >> Yeah. >> Okay. And the last item is self-re. Good news is we meet the requirements for self-re this year. Um it's our third year. Um so once we um so I will give you a resolution before we introduce
also stating that um we're going to do the self-re um then we can introduce the budget. It won't be reviewed by the state. They do a general review but not an in-depth review. And then next year I'm on schedule. Every three years you have to be reviewed by the state.
>> So next year I will be reviewed by the state. >> Which group are we in? There's groups one, two, >> we're in three. >> Sounds like you went to a class. >> Yes. >> It's every three years. every fourth year is the the in-depth review
>> unless you can ask for it, which I don't recommend. And if you have certain financial issues, then you're automatically have to get reviewed. And and uh if you can do self-reciate it because uh they have a lot of towns with issues. They review over 200 and
something and they should only be doing about a hundred because there's there's a lot unfortunately there's a lot of towns that have a lot of financial pressures. Any other question? >> We do. >> Yeah, we I've I've
>> really never had any issues. Correct. >> No, >> we've been we have been good. >> Yeah, we've been good when we actually have, you know, you know, we have a good staff that are conscientious and work hard. So, >> yeah, when when we've done the review
with the state that always comes back good. Yep. >> We have a good working relationship with DCA. >> Yep. >> So, any other questions? >> I'm from DCA and I'm here to help you kind of
>> Well, they lost a valuable asset, someone who had been there over 40 years to retire. So, >> be interesting how they how they move forward. >> Okay. >> Okay. >> All right. >> You go to close and then public or
public then? We do a wrap up and then >> do a wrap up then public comment and then we go into close session. >> Correct. >> Okay. >> I think um all of us should have received >> Yes. >> wrap-up sheet.
>> So I I handed out some notes for our >> wrap up items. Um some have been received and um you noted recreation had no followup items >> from council. Yeah, Tony said he'll get
back to you on on that other items. >> Yeah, public works will be working on the uh proposed chart >> and that doesn't actually affect the budget. >> It does not. >> Uh you guys had requested that we get
the bond ordinance to June 22nd meeting. >> Yeah, we'll be diligently working on that to get that to you. >> That that would bring us about a month ahead. >> Yes, it would. because normally it's at the end of July, beginning of August.
>> Um I think you received the next item. >> Council got that on um >> Okay. >> Last Friday. >> Y >> um >> um engineering will is working on that and they'll provide you with a list on
the crosswork improvement for bless you. But that won't affect the the current budget. Well, we have to talk the engineering. Well, I guess it's a capital issue with adding money for um residential road
improvement program, >> right? >> Yep. >> Yeah. >> Um >> so with >> because we wanted to figure out like if you want to put more money in the road improvement program, right? Um yeah,
with so um there were a couple of things here. Um the Van Clee roundabout village that I think there was a there was a certain amount of money in that. Did we ever get the plan the concept plan for that?
>> I don't know. They're working on it as soon as it's available. I think the mayor sent you an email saying he he would share it with you. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. I >> Yeah, he said he'll share it with you once the plan they don't even have a draft plan yet. So once they have that, they'll send it to you. >> Yeah. The only We got a We got an
explanation of the discussion, but we didn't see the plan, >> right? >> That Yeah, that's what you're talking about. >> As far as I know, it is far as I know it is. Like I said, this is capital. It's just a, you know, a
management tool. Well, we can always increase that at a later date. Um, we can go from there. Um, once we get the plan, then we can figure it out from there. >> So, at this point, that's a we haven't we haven't approved it basically. It's a it's a placeholder, if you will. >> Correct.
>> And once they come back with their bid package >> and some sort of a hopefully estimate, >> then we would then we get to look at it the side. I would assume at this point at this point we're not actually approving anything. Correct. >> No,
>> not until we do New York. But >> we're just reserving money for that in the budget in the capital budget there. >> Um I know that >> you're talking about the uh Mary. No, you're talking about the circle by the >> the circle back. >> I think Francis had shared with you that
we're going to use the T money to to uh fund that project, which is u monies that developers put away for road improvements over the years. um and he wasn't sure exactly how much, but part of that will be funded through that.
>> No, there's certain conditions. Um and that's something that Francis uh has good control over and this is one of the projects that does >> maybe to a balance >> there. There is it's certain things and and yes, >> correct.
>> Yep. And each one's a little different. So, but uh Francis has identified funds that could be used to help pay for this project. >> But if we could get a grant, obviously, then we could use that money else. >> They applied for for a dozen different grants and we got one. So,
>> yes, >> I don't know that that's that's my >> So, I mean, I did send you an email there email about that issue. So, I just want to be very clear. Uh
we are the consultant is looking at various options. We the $850,000 is because we hope to do it this year. If we need more money, we'll have to come back to the council and get it from some other account. Uh you will get a say in that. Um we will give you the final
design once it's done and you get to vote on the bid when the bids are received. But it's not a public discussion about what needs to be done at the intersection that whatever the professionals recommend and I agree that's what we are going to bid with. So
I'm not expecting a discussion. I have met with the people in the neighborhood at least twice and several unofficial discussions of the record. I mean know at various functions when I meet with them. So they pretty much know what the options were and what we are looking at
and everybody complains about speed traffic light I mean um circle will slow uh cars down significantly compared to a light and the light will be red for 90% of the time people coming out of Baxter.
So circle is much better from traffic flow point of view for them as well. Uh so that has all been discussed with uh whoever came to those two meetings and one was in this room fairly I think both were in this room fairly highly attended
meetings. Um so it's uh you will get a you will get what we are going to do there and you will get a uh to vote on the bid when the bid comes in but it's not a discussion of what needs to be done at the intersection. We having a design discussion.
>> No, no. I just want to be very clear. >> So, you just want to see >> to see if it's around about 10 times more than the traffic. I I mean I I wanted to see I mean it's not a it's not a hold by local residents because some people want light some people want uh
circle depending on who lives where and what their own preferences are and what their own biases are. >> No not that like from professionals point of view one >> so we will give you we will give you justification as to why we doing what we
doing. Um, if you don't like it, you don't like it. That's perfectly fine. Yeah, >> there's two options. But >> and I will I mean cost is a cost. I mean cost is one I mean unless the cost is like
different by $5 million a light cost 100,000 and the other cost 5.1 million. Cost is only one factor that goes in the whole consideration and it's not as if we can't afford it. If we couldn't afford it, let's say for argument sake circle cost 5 million. I mean that's
outside figure. I'm I'm just >> I I have no idea to be honest. I couldn't come up with a number. I mean >> no he's just using that number. I'm just using >> No, no, he's just >> I think the point being is that um council is not going to participate in the decision process, but we would like
to see the analysis. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah. That I said I will share, but I mean I don't want to leave anybody with a wrong impression that we'll have a full 5 hour debate on what we need to do. >> No, we what council wants to see is just the um analysis and justification as to
why we went with with uh the the option readers. She you I think what Linda is saying is if it's $50,000 to put in a traffic light and it's a million dollars to put in a circle, she wants to know that. And
then if it is that disparit, then there should be some laid out by engineering justification why one works, the other doesn't. That's basically not not not not council sitting here trying to make a design decision or something like
that. It's more it's more it's more an economic decision or something. >> You will get that. >> All right. You'll get that. >> Sound good? >> Okay. >> The amount of money you want to add for the uh residential road improvements.
>> So that's that's like just going down like if you if you go down our our our >> uh well the next one I think is the annual crosswalk improvement program. No, we No, we're at provide a list of completed. >> Oh, okay. Somehow we >> annual way time analysis and and the
mayor can speak to that. >> Um, >> did we do this? >> No, I I'm just looking I'm I'm just going down the the list. >> Yeah. >> After the uh roundabout discussion, it's um provide current balance in annual crosswalk improvement program. >> Right. And we and the engineering said
they would get that to you. >> Right. >> Yeah. Sir, we don't we don't we don't have that. We >> don't have this information. >> So, now we're in neighborhoods, >> which is like I said, the mayor can speak to that. >> Uh the sidewalk repair like I want Yeah.
sidewalk repair program. How much more funds need to be needed to be complete? >> We neighborhoods like mayor, do you have any um discussion points >> on the sidewalk? >> Yeah. Yeah. >> The sidewalk program.
>> Uh yeah. Yeah. sidewalk as I have told I will give you a formal recommendation but um I've told talked to several people informally on council and not on council um nobody else does the sidewalk. No other township does the
sidewalk. We started doing it because we were afraid people fixing the sidewalk would kill the tree. Uh so my recommendation going to be council and everybody in the township will have enough time to give their input is that at some point we say uh if you want your
sidewalk done put it on the list we cut off the list and after that day everybody who is not on the list it's their responsibility to get the sidewalk fixed. So I will I will give you a formal recommendation on that and then we will have a discussion at the council
and we will come up with a policy and say that it's not an ordinance it's a policy by ordinance the homeowner is responsible for fixing the >> correct ordinance the homeowner is responsible >> right so I will I will give you a written recommendation you schedule a
discussion at the council meeting I'll send email and post it on the website let everybody give their input but after that then it's everybody's responsible and doesn't mean everything will get fixed in one year. It may take 10 years uh to get it fixed. But uh we will fix
every just to be fair that uh there are some sidewalks on the list that have not been fixed. But just to be fair because we have been doing it at least for 16 years. I don't know when it started actually the policy. Uh but because we have been doing it for so long, it's
only fair to give people one chance to put it on the list if they want it. And if they don't want it, then it's their responsibility to fix. >> Okay. And that's that's going to be a policy decision that we'll be having discussions on. I think what council
wanted for the budget was um there's a number in the budget right now and and an idea of how much that amount. >> Francis did and >> Francis did mention something that he has enough money to to do the list. >> He could do most of the list up to a
certain date. with last year's money. >> What what in my notes what I have is he has enough money to complete um >> 51 properties that's on the list up to June 2025
>> is when he has enough money to complete that >> on hand and then now >> that he has 49 um on the weight list >> right >> right now. So when you allocate the same amount of money, you cover that list. >> That correct? >> But that doesn't include
>> Yeah, >> I think No, he said 49 on the weight list, but not not including if somebody took like >> this is Yeah, but that's that's next year. >> This is a decision for you guys. >> Listen again, you debated when we have
this discussion. This is not a one-year project. This is at least a fiveyear project, maybe seven-year project to fix all the sidewalks because once you tell that, I do expect that list to grow at least three times what it is today. Okay? Just trust me, it will go at least
three times. So, it's not don't haggle about $25,000 here and there. It's a 5year or a 7-year project and you need set a separate time and decide and then in future budgets you decide how much you want to put in. this whatever we put
in it was put in identical to what was last year right >> so in future year you may say okay we are going to all these sidewalks will take a million dollar to fix and we are going to put $100,000 every year and fix it in over 10 years whatever you decide to decide but this is not the time and
discussion to waste 2 hours to talk about that that's not going to happen >> well yeah but we do need to make a decision pretty much today or at least come up with a I guess a consensus if you will, on what number we're going to put in the budget. >> I mean, >> we just haven't discussed that yet.
>> I mean, if you want to more money for the roads, why are you increasing for the sidewalk when it's going to be fixed over next several years? >> Sidewalk. We do want to increase for the roads, but question is increase for the roads. That money has to come from somewhere. >> If you want to take from the sidewalk,
take from the sidewalk. I mean, that's that's what we're kind of trying to discuss right now. Yeah. So, that's it. that you're too surface of that is is just peeling right off. >> Okay. Well, that's that's a different I think that's a different discussion.
>> Discussion, Linda, >> Linda, that that's a whole different discussion. Right now, we're talking about numbers. >> This is we're just trying to decide what number to put in the budget. >> I I think we move forward with the number we have. It's just a management tool. It won't become spendable or law
until we do the bond ordinance. You can have your discussion even if later on you decide you want to put more money in after we do our original bond ordinance. We can do a supplement. >> We're we're basically looking to see if we can use some of that for something. >> You guys have to come to an agreement on what your policy is going to be. Are you
going to end the program? Give everybody a >> That's another That's a separate discussion. That would be a separate discussion under >> so I think we're in good shape now to take care of the list that we know of and and we can move. >> So that's I'm like from my notes he has
enough money for to cover >> for um what's what's on the list from last year and if we add this money then whatever is on the weight list >> will be taken care >> would be taken care of. >> Correct. That was my understanding.
>> That's my notes. Um now the question is if you want to move on to the roadway um improvement program and discuss how much money we need. >> Well the mayor the mayor has some some thoughts on that also. >> I have thoughts on every subject under
that. So >> we'll we'll take your thoughts. >> So do we if we can put some more money to improve more roads. >> Listen uh the 100,000 is not going to do. It's not it's not it's not touching it.
>> No, I mean don't don't touch the money for the sidewalk because people do expect whoever is on the list will be fixed. So >> don't I mean it's your prerogative but don't uh change the money from the sidewalk. Um as you know the last vendor
who did the analysis of the road in 2022 uh went kaput out of business. We are very close to signing up with a new vendor who not only does roads but does everything on the road and he's very anxious to do it. Um so he will map not
only the roads but the signs uh the trees the uh sewer grade. So we will have a complete inventory of everything on every road and the vendor is very interested in doing it before uh the
trees have leaves. So the visibility is much better. So we're very close. Uh Francis is out this week otherwise I would have asked him but I did talk to John. Um we're very close to signing up once we do that and once he drives everywhere and comes up with an analysis
he will rank all the roads between zero and 100. And I think some of you saw the demo at the league last year. Yeah. So once we do that, I will come to the council with a report saying this is what the roads are and this is what we
can fix based on uh whatever million whatever is in the budget >> and then I will find out depending on how much more you want to fix this year. I will find out money um to to figure
out I do have some thoughts on that. I'll find out money to fix add. We are not going to do all the roads um in one year. It's budgetary concerned. It's also logistical uh constraint as to how many projects we can get done in one
year. But I will find money for you to fix whatever we think can be reasonably done in one year. >> Okay. And we'll we need to set out of that 0 to 100, we'll set a target number and then we can kind of look right.
What my my thinking is that uh what you find acceptable road may be different than what I find acceptable road. Um I mean I grew up in India so uh >> I grew up in Queens it wasn't that much better. >> I have to get that in there. But once we
have then I would recommend every council member take uh the list see a road which is five or 25 45 65 the random numbers and each of you decide what is acceptable road and what's not
acceptable road and if the consensus is 50 is not acceptable then we try to see how much it would take to fix 50 right because right now we don't know what that number 50 or 65 means. So let's you physically drive and you
decide for yourself that okay if I lived on this road and the cost of fixing is 2 million and I was paying out of my pocket would I fix that road or not fix that road. That's a simple test. >> Well that that that discussion we can have once we have the ranking.
>> Yeah. Yeah. And once Francis is back next year I'll give you a timeline when we will sign >> next week. >> Yeah. when Francis is back, I'll give you a timeline when how close we are close to signing a contract and that will be on the agenda
>> and uh uh then when they can finish but they definitely want to finish before so there's a time time constraint because they want to finish before their leaves on the tree. >> Yeah. Because um >> so this is project that's really on top of the list right now. >> Right. Right. And my I I recall from my
conversation with the vendor um at the league, they only work between spring and fall before the leaves are on the road. Um >> so but have they given us an idea of how long it'll take them for getting a
report together once once we >> I don't know that question. I don't know. >> Yeah, it's it's I a lot of that's just done I think automatically. So hopefully it won't take too long, but but they do have ideas about what's generally
considered a normal road or uh so I think well we they have some specs and things that they can show us. Uh so it's not just a matter of whether I drove over the road and my low down car it feels it bumpy and your SUV says what
are you talking about? This is a perfect road. So, um, we would I think we'd want to also see what the professional number is and and whatever those ideas are and then we could take it from there. Do we want to be a little bit better or
something than than uh what the rest of the country sort of accepts. So, uh there's a there's a combination on that. >> I don't know about that. We have spend with the price of gas. >> Linda, can you please move to
>> We are behind on on getting residential roads. >> Yeah, we're allocating um over three $3 million this year alone for roads. Uh like the mayor said, once you get that study, including the grant, it comes to >> close to $3 million, >> right? Uh yeah, that well that's about
what we've I think we upped one of them by a little amount, but essentially that's what we >> 50,000. >> Yeah, it was 250. Uh we up one of them 1.5 and 500 something thousand. >> Oh, okay. You added another set of roads in there somewhere. >> So that's that's some DOT funding that
we you were using. >> Oh, okay. You you added the DOT funding, but but in general, we've we've uh put in just a little bit more than we've been putting in previous years. So, we are looking I think we are looking to throw a substantial amount more in there just to get ahead, but we'll see more
when we get these. >> The mayor the mayor said like like the mayor said there are there will be some funding opportunities to fund that on a one-time basis where we can fully fund. >> So, between the residential and
collector roads right now we have budgeted um 2.25 25 plus we have some funding grants available grant funds available. >> Yeah, I'm I'm saying between the res >> between residential and collect one's
one's a million, one's 1.25. >> I heard all last fall about how horrible res >> but the collector roads are pretty >> that's yeah that's >> everybody uses those collector roads.
Oh, like we did a few years ago and redo that >> will be better and that's that's okay. But you have to have money >> and then >> the mayor is committed to providing some fun. >> So the mayor is committed to adding some money for >> Linda. Glenda the collector roads are
used by everybody in town. Yeah. >> Right. So we do need to fix those as well >> and the mayor's committed to fund. >> I mean All right. So you've committed to add some money this year one way or the other to make this happen. >> I mean you you you need to understand
that money is one thing. Having competent contractors to do the work is another thing. Like we didn't get any bids for the flashing beacon last year. When we asked the contractor he said I was too busy. I didn't have slot available to do that. So we can put we
win a lottery and put $10 million. we may not get contractor to do $10 million worth of work. So, uh let let's first do the analysis. Let's figure out what it is. Let's figure out how much money you can spend in a uh in a reasonable way by
getting competent contractors and then we'll go from there. Not going to be solved today. >> One line to the other. left residential road program at the same amount which is 1.25 million. So
what would you like to do >> from the increase the increase to the residential growth program >> based on speak >> closer to the mic mayor >> you need two mics
>> collector road increase of two 250 and move that to the residential road. So she just wants to move it from >> collector or >> collector to residential. The 250 we increased. You okay with that? >> I mean it's there. >> You guys you want to do that?
>> This we're making this under no >> I mean the the collector roads need more focus than the residential. I'm not saying we don't I say agree we need more for the residential roads. But I think what the mayor's saying is look you're going to do a study. You're going to come back. we're gonna have the
opportunity to, you know, >> to determine what should be spent based on that, right? So, I don't I don't know what shuffling around this 250, you know, does at this point, >> right? Um Dan, you have anything? >> Linda, >> I'm just going to hold on.
>> Once you >> I'm just going to ask everybody. Dan, you have anything to say? >> I just don't have enough data to >> make that decision at this stage. Um I mean the other option would be keep
the 250 and then add another 250. Is there room to increase both? >> No. >> Is there a rationale of why we increased one and not the other? Like that's the kind of question. >> No, I to be very honest I took the money out of some other line and put it in there given that you wanted
>> you wanted more right and again when the data comes out you can look at it and at that point you can move. All it has to do is pass another ordinance and another thing from one line. >> We are not locked in. That is just a management tool.
>> When it comes to capital expenditures, they just want us to put items in the budget so they know that we're looking out six years. For this to be spendable, we have to do a capital bond ordinance that comes to council. So that's when uh we give you copies and sometimes you
tweak it a little bit and then I can just do a resolution of the capital budget to make a change before I introduce the ordinance. They allow you to make any changes you like throughout the year. >> Understood. >> Just like we just did a supplement for the West Windsor Fire Company, we can do a supplement for anything during the
year. Um as long as we have the down payment money, there is a little bit of I keep a little bit of a reserve in there for emergencies. Um, so what if the mayor tells you he'll find the money, he'll find the money once you do that study. And I know that Francis and John are really close to
making a recommendation, uh, probably in the next month or so for this new software program so they can get rolling and get that analysis done before the fall. Um, so moving it, I don't see it would actually change any outcome. >> Um,
you added 250 We have >> Linda. Mayor can't hear you. You need to >> I'm sorry. You have bonding cost. So if you were to add 250 to the annual >> in addition >> in addition to >> increase some bonding cost. >> Okay. Um Andrea, you have anything to add?
>> Okay. At this point, moving this from one place to another and just overruling whatever reason it went there. I have no information to do that. So, um I would like to see I thought we were a little closer with with picking that
software so that we could actually get this going during the spring. >> Yeah, I I'm sure I think they are pretty close. I think >> Yeah, that was that was the impression I got. I think it's a matter of them come up with a contract and get into council for >> looking at in within the month or so we can
>> so I would Yeah, I would like to know how our roads are doing before that and and then try to make some allocations um try to set some standards up. Uh obviously we're not fixing every road no matter what we do this year. I just
would like to know whether we can do it in 10 years or five or 15 or whatever it's going to be. Um, so bottom line is if the mayor says that we can uh he can find a million dollars extra if that's what the council wants to do after we've
seen mayor. >> I mean I I will again without data. I mean it's just >> okay. You know yeah you didn't hear what I was saying. I said once we get the data if it looks
like um we're in trouble here and we're well and we're essentially I want to get to the point where we're not falling backwards. I don't know if we are but that's what I want to see. Um and if it looks like we needed a million dollars however we have to divide it up between
collector residential. you're committed that we can see that this year and John is telling us that we are able to vote that in even if it's not in the current budget. Yeah. Yeah. I mean between everybody >> I'm I'm not committing to a specific number but I'll find maximum money I can
find and maximum work we can reasonably >> we talking I mean >> yeah I mean million dollar is a good estimate. >> I'm just throwing I'm putting a number out about maximum say of what we feel we might want to ask for extra. Yeah. So, >> what I'm looking at is I'm looking at
the two two line items between residential and collective roads. We have roughly 2.7 >> available. >> Sounds about right. >> Um, with the our funding and grant money and all of that. So, I just did the
calculation 2.737. >> Okay. >> To be exact. Um and as Joan mentioned this is we are not locked into this this this number we >> no we bond we can the bond is >> so we do the ordinance
>> right >> correct >> and and we can always do a supplement later like you if you award the contract you get your information back you make your decisions you want to add a million dollars then we can do another supplemental ordinance just for roads for a million dollars >> once we have the data
>> correct >> once we have the data we could either go back and decide to bond if that's the only way it could be done or if there's other money available we could take that money and use that also. >> Correct. >> Correct. >> Yep. >> So >> within the construct of caps and
increase >> yes >> is this >> so >> uh but I would like to see that at least have the project started this year to to get to get this going so we're not putting this off into next year and having the same discussion again. No, no, you're right that the first step is
to get the >> right because we had been Yeah, we um because we've been like I know I've been asking about what are these results meaning and all that for several years now. I'm glad to see we're looking at a new program. I know the whole history about Michelin and the whole thing. And
so I do want to see that happen. >> To Linda's point, um Linda wants to add some more money to the residential. I would without taking from collector road is there any funds available that we could add more to the residential
would is that that >> once you once you bond right I mean you have to stay within the lane of of roadway improvements you can't pull it from some other category and >> correct >> right so so I'm saying we need the product of money
>> and quite frankly we we put this in one line this is just a management tool when you get when you have the bond bonding ordinance. It says roadway improvements which is how the how the bond ordinance goes. >> It's not broken down between collectors. >> It is not
>> and that gives us flexibility for for different reasons. >> Sure. >> Good prices might come in higher, they may come lower in other projects. So it gives gives gives management u leeway as far as pricing goes. So um that's not a
locked in figure. It's just a management tool. If we put that in here now as and add 250 and we don't take it from anywhere else, then we're borrowing another 250 at this point. >> And I would recommend that you wait for the analysis and and as we can probably
come up with some additional >> there. If they can come up with the money from some additional source, then we won't have to borrow it. >> Are you going to take it from some other something else? No, you you can't do there. >> No. Mayor, do you have anything to add
here? >> No, I mean it's it's just you're talking about numbers on the page. I mean, as he said, it's one line. I mean, when you get the data, you can decide. >> Their question is um when we where are we going to get the money to come up with the roads?
>> I'm going to shake my pocket and see what falls out. I mean, it's a $59 million budget. I mean, I if I knew the money was there, I would have added it right now. This year's budget is extraordinarily tough. I I don't like tax increases. You should know that. Uh
and this year's budget is extraordinarily tough. We did look very hard. I mean, John and I have been working for almost 2 3 months trying to find money under every rock. But we will we will we will do it. And uh as I said once you once you decide that this road
is accept this level of road is acceptable this level of road is not acceptable we will we will try to figure out how to fix as much as we can based on how much work we can get done in an year. I mean that I keep reminding you that's also a constraint getting
somebody to actually do the work. So it all depends on how good the economy is. If economy is booming you don't get that many contractors. I mean ideal example when we fixed this building during COVID we got like what 60 bits 50 bits I mean
unheard of it it's so many 50 factors I mean we sit here and talk about as if it's definitive it's not I mean when we are ready to go out to >> the data I don't know >> so I mean it's I just shooting the breeze for >> Marina you have
council recalls we went out for bids and had to reject them for the fire sprinkler system over at um >> 43 >> 43 and >> 45 >> 45 I'm sorry um and we had to come back
this year and we found the money >> as the mayor said last year if you didn't have the funding he would find the money >> and we we basically did an ordinance to bond the delta on on the bid we received and it went
through >> we just passed that on. >> I think that's the concept following. >> Yeah. I mean I just want I mean she reminded me I I just want to make sure that people don't get misconception when I say I find the money I will move from
some account to your account and I'll have to come to the council to move from that account to that account and if you don't like it you don't do it. As simple as that. >> Yeah. Anything supplemental it's not like there's a money sitting there that I'm not using. I will have to say okay
we will not do uh this project or we will allocate for that project in future in 2030 again right uh there are some long-term projects that we have been budgeting for and we will say okay let's not worry about that budget that's
somebody else's headache in future and I will have to come to the council and say there was money for this project and if you want to fix the road I can get you money from project X or project why you choose and we will do it >> and and that at that point that would be
a one-time thing for this year. But if we determine based on these uh ratings that we need more on an ongoing basis for x number of years then we will have to adjust everything else >> just not to give >> we'll have that discussion next year
>> not not I mean not to give any of you or the two ladies heart attack but we have budgeted $500,000 for Cranberry Road sidewalk. If you don't think Granberry Road sidewalk is as important as road, you take the money from them. That's what I mean by finding money. Don't get
an impression that I have hidden the money under the rock somewhere. But >> I I just want to be clear. I I think the sentiment here is that um while we don't have the data, I think we experientially and from what we're
hearing is that we anticipate that the results of this investigation of the of the conditions will result in the fact that there's a lot more roads that need repairs than we're budgeted. >> Then we need to work. trying to be
proactive now and figure out is there things that we can do now and perhaps >> we can't and we maybe we need to wait and look at the the full project schedule as you pointed out. >> It's it's basically >> what that's what the sentiment >> it's basically going to be how much and where.
>> I think the sentiment is we do um need to take a look at all our roads and see the maximum possible that we could fix. Yeah. >> Um understand we can't fix everything in one go. >> Okay.
>> Um but we want to um but without having the data it's tough to figure out how much we need. >> But we're only anticipating in fact that the data is going to show we don't think based on our experience that we're going to need more. And so if we know that now, is there something that we can do
now? Or maybe as the mayor and John has pointed out, >> there is not really anything we do now and we wait until later on and we do have the tools to make those changes. >> That that that's that's what I am I am uh understanding that >> that's what we're recommending the latter.
>> We we don't know how much and we don't know where exactly, but we know we know we're going to need. Yes. So we all know we all know it's coming, right? Okay. Um So the recommendation now is we go with what we have
>> and we will uh we have tools >> to um >> make an amendment or supplement to this if needed later on. >> We do. >> Okay. >> Thank you. >> And that we will plan on doing so and it's not going to
>> it's not going to be sitting in some draw somewhere but >> N sounds like a plan. >> Okay. >> Good. >> Yep. >> Okay. We'll move on to >> council. >> Yeah, I think we can move on. >> Okay. The next one. >> Good. >> Okay.
>> Well, we we we will come back to this. >> I I think we've moved actually if you look at the past and where we didn't know where we were going. I think if this goes through and this whole plan goes through, we've actually moved things in a very good direction. we're
we're going to actually know where we are. We're going to want to know where we want to go and we've got some commitment for money to try to start moving there quickly. So, if that happens, I think we've actually gotten the right direction. >> Okay. All right. Uh moving on.
Uh >> that's a discussion for you in the future. It's the EV versus gas vehicle. >> That Yeah, that discussion is not >> not for now. I I can report that there is an AE AE at
the arts center. >> There is. >> There is. >> Yeah. I mean that AED there is also going to be ad at the at the community park near the >> Finch mentioned that to us at the pavilion. >> Um >> like I just want to go back to the EV
versus gas vehicle because I think there was a discussion on was it health? >> It's the health vehicle. We had a Right. We had 60s something thousand in there. >> I would just say leave >> I would leave them
>> and uh because >> worst case scenario is they have two older vehicles. >> If you decide in the future that you want to go to gas, then we could probably buy two versus >> for the same. You know, some of the numbers we've been seeing for the gas suvs are up there and and I think we
really would need to look not only at the full cost, what's the cost of maintaining, what's the cost of running, what's the cost of gas. >> This is the one department >> that is >> able to do this. >> Correct. >> And and and I think from the point of
view of resilience, I mean, look at what's going on with gas right now. I I've I'm old enough to have lived through a couple of gas shortages where you were standing online for hours just trying to get rationed gasoline. Oh, okay. We don't have to tell everybody.
80s too with 70s and 80s that happened. >> Graduated in 80. I was in those lines >> and it's Yeah. So, it's uh with odd numbers even. So, having vehicles that can um go on electric provides us a resilience that we don't you know by
having some And let's talk about the cleanliness and that maybe we should have something as an example to uh to people for clean air. >> Yeah. I'm just saying like if we want to have a policy discussion between EV and gas, I don't think we we need to do that now. Correct.
>> The only thing is just because we may uh we have a mention that >> to give you the option of EV, I would leave the budget the way it is. >> Right. >> So that's so that's what I was coming to. We have the budget for 61. there's a mention of um acquisition for a hybrid
or a fully fully EV vehicle. That doesn't necessarily mean that we have to purchase an EV vehicle. We >> just when we when it goes into the bond ordinance, it says vehicle. >> Correct. >> We don't designate between >> designate. So we have the funds, we can
have policy discussion and decide if we want to go one way or the other. >> Correct. >> Um >> but that does not affect Like the question is 61,000 for the health department. It could be one vehicle, one EV vehicle or two hybrid
vehicle or two gas gasoline vehicle. >> Electricity prices are up too. >> So I mean maybe at the time you come back and say look you look at the state contract see what's on there you know maybe we get one electric vehicle or maybe you >> for your future discussion where you can
get pricing for both. Yes, that's a good idea. >> That's a good idea. Yeah. >> Okay. >> All right. >> Um, we answered the AED >> AED. We we got that. >> Next one. Um, this is for future discussion because this renewal is
coming up. Um, so >> the hazmat services. Yeah, that's for future discussion. >> Okay. Yeah, because that expires >> that discussion has to happen this year, >> correct? >> Because that expires at the end of the year, >> right? >> And I think that leaves us in to going
into close session. So I don't know if you do a do you do a public comment >> public comment. >> So public comment um 3 minute per individual if anybody wants
to make any public comment this is the time public comment >> opening public y and Clifton 18 Gston Drive. So discussion on um the vehicles at the end. I'm just questioning if we need the
size of the vehicles that we're talking about SUVs, health department. I I'm not saying a health department doesn't need the a vehicle. I just wonder if the size of the vehicle that's in discussion is necessary. Maybe you
can get all-wheel drive, four-wheel drive, and a vehicle for half the price. That That's all I mean. >> Maybe. Um, okay. >> Just vehicles in g just vehicles. Vehicles in general. I'm just wondering if we can get away with smaller >> vehicles that are That's all.
>> Yeah. Then um I think um when we go out um to we have to take into consideration the needs um of the department and what they need to carry and then so >> I'm sure >> take that into consideration. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Thanks
different things when they go to and all of that. I know I know it's not just you know briefcase you get anybody else >> Sylvia Ascarelli 2 at the engineering part of the budget talks we we talked a bit about the
Washington road safety project and engineering thought that it was from the tennis facility to Wallingford is where the sidewalk would be added but actually the sidewalk is already there. Does anybody have any more information about where this project actually would be? >> Oh, yeah. I had reached out asking if we
can get some confirmation on that. Is it from >> I don't know. First time I heard about >> there was an email that was sent out um to the engineering department. Allison, I think I had copied you on that. >> Okay. >> Um we asked engineering. We have not heard anything back. So if anybody can
help us find out what where this project is. Maybe it's Wallingford to they were talking about a W Street and they couldn't quite remember which one. be helpful. >> We'll follow up on that again and um try to get an answer. >> Okay. >> All right. Uh we don't have any anybody
else in the public. So um I close the public comment period now. Um we do need to go into close session. Um can I get a motion to go into close session? >> Moved. Second. >> Okay. Um all in favor.
>> Okay. And I have to do my reading here. Whereas NJSA104-12 allows for a public body to go into close session during a public meeting. And whereas the township council of West Windsor has deemed it necessary to go into close session to discuss certain matters which are exempted from the
public. And whereas the regular meeting of this township council will reconvene and whereas the below stated subject matters shall be made available at such time as the issues discussed therein are resolved and disclosure would not subvert any particular exemption for convening a close session. Now
therefore, it be resolved that the township council of the township of West Windsor will go into close session for the following reason as outlined in NJSA 104-12 for this discussion of personnel and there'll be no action taken when we reconvene.
Okay. So the bathroom >> five minutes. Okay. Thank you.