All right, we'll all stand with the flag. It's the March 31st meeting, the conservation commission, which is being recorded. Pledge algiance to the flag, United States of America, to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice
for all. >> All right, Mr. Chair, those are the COC's over there. >> All right. Thank you. All right, we're going to get a few little housekeeping done first. Did I sign this? >> Yeah, we had a mistake on it.
>> All right. >> Yeah, I printed up last year. That's the mistake. I made it. >> Okay. No big deal. I use the right dates. >> So, it's just one sheet. All right. We have a a bill for East Bay uh media for
advertising $258 and a motion to pay. >> Motion approve. Motion to pay. >> Second. >> Okay. That was uh Jacob Phil. All in favor? I >> opposed. All right, that's unanimous. Uh, what is this? >> Oh, another East Bay advertising um for
6450. >> Thank you. >> Second. >> That was Jake and >> Kevin. >> Kevin. All right. Thank you. All in favor? >> Opposed? All right. That's unanimous. Minutes. We have minutes of 317. Myself,
Jason, Jake, Burton. Is Barton here? Not here. >> Not here. Um, all right. So, this is going to sit. We'll maybe get this at the end. All right. First, uh, hearing for the evening is going to be, what do we have here? Allison Culage,
Thomas Burico, SE8282 2828, notice of intent for 39 Scotch Pine Lane, construct residence, a residential pier on the west branch of the Westport River. Good evening, Dave. Good evening, Mr. Chairman. Three cards.
>> I'll take those. >> Thank you. >> For the record, I'm Dave Dickin from Schneider Devon Leon representing the applicants and owners of the property. Uh this is a uh proposed pier project for their uh property located at 39
Scotch Pine Lane. It formerly was known as 1787F Main Road. Uh so the property is uh nearly 25 acres in size. 21 acres of the property is under a conservation restriction. The
conservation restriction does allow however allow the construction of a proposed uh residential pier. The property does have a um a float and a boat tied to it. Uh this pink little box
here in the corner um exists. They have an access path from the dwelling along this green line all the way to the shoreline and they've utilized the uh the waterway that way. We are proposing to construct a uh fixed pier 4 ft wide
77 ft long uh be a hybrid pier as far as uh the uh support structure partly uh greenhart pilings in the waterway and helical anchors uh in the pathway to get to the beach. The pierce will be uh set uh 20 ft on
center. Um there'll be a float at the end 10 by 20 and aluminum gang way to access that float. The float will have 30-in float stops as required uh by all of the approving authorities that review the pier projects.
Um so the the pier is primarily located in the same general location as the existing float in the very very south west corner of the entire site which again is 25 acres in size. Um the seawwood portion of the pier would be constructed using a crane set on a barge
brought in during uh within two hours of the high tide line and the landwood piece uh would access through the existing uh path woods road if you will to get down to the beach to construct the pier. Um we have received the D file
number. uh it cites that we will need uh chapter 91 waterways uh license for the structure and we'll need uh Army Corps of Engineers authorization. Both of those permits are in progress. Um they're in motion. We filed uh for them
about 6 weeks ago, maybe two months ago. So with that, if you happen to answer any questions. >> Thank you, Chris. >> Mr. Chairman, members, Allison Kulage, Thomas Farico, 39 Scotch Pine Lane. This is a notice of intent application filed by Schneider Devnan and Leon with Dave
Dignen representing. The report date is March 25th, 2026. There is a file number with no adverse comment to test 802828. We also did receive favorable comments from Mass Division of Marine Fisheries.
Uh site visit was on the 25th of March 2026. Description of the work. The applicant has filed to install a fixed pier gangway and float on the west branch of the river. The propose they propose to install a 4tx 70 77 fixed
pier, a 20ft gang way and a 12x30 float. The proposed pier will be constructed using six 12-in green hot piles. The float will be equipped with float stops and maintain a 30-in separation to the bottom of the river. Um the eelgrass
study was provided identifying eel grass uh sparsely about 66 ft away from the end of the float. The pier maintains a 5'4 in height um at mean high and mean low water and satisfies the public
access underneath the structure. The dock is designed complies with the town dock policy. Uh resource areas to be impacted by this project are land containing shellfish land under the ocean river buffer zone and riverfront
recommendations. Westport conservation commission should approve the proposed fixed beer gang weight and float on the west branch with standard dock conditions. That's all. Mr. Chairman, >> any questions from the table? >> Anybody got any questions or comments
from the audience? Dave, you have any questions? >> No, sir. >> All right. I have a question. >> All right. >> The pier maintain the same height at both high and low ties. >> So the pier itself will be fixed. >> Pier maintains a five in 5'4 in height
at mean high water and mean mobile. >> I think it should be minimum 5'4. >> Yes. Yeah. It's at where the well there must provide public egress. In this case there's a 5ft height that's required. They actually have a 5'4 in height right
at that transition. That's where people are allowed to come and fish and fowl and have the allowance to go by the dock. >> Right. >> But it's not above the water. It's just above the the land. Uh what the land once I was thinking is above the water.
>> All right. Any other questions? All right. If not a motion motion to approve. >> Second. >> That was Jake and Don. All in favor? >> Oppos. >> All right. It's unanimous. >> Uh Tom, that's unanimous. All right.
Thank you. >> Uh next we have >> Linda Linda Burch. Notice of intent 329 Brain Point Road. Construct stone rip wrap seaw wall extension on ocean. Thank you, sir.
>> So, again, I'm Dave Dvton from Schneider Devon Leone. I represent the applicants and owners of property or the applicants uh for this evening, Linda M. Anne Lee, and Patricia Burch, three sisters who own this uh family property uh which is
located at the very end of uh Brighton Point. Um you see the area we'll photograph. It's the last house on the right as you go down the road. The last house on southwest quadrant. This is a uh proposed seaw wall
extension project. Um the u the point of the matter is to protect the home that has been there since 1900 and 1930. That those being the two homes in this location and this location. There is an existing seaw wall which uh
wraps around the point but it actually ends right about where my hand is in the westerly direction. The cliff itself continues on quite a ways down to the red island line and it it has
significantly eroded over the last 5 to 10 years. Um the house is now in jeopardy. uh the bank, what's left of the bank to the house is probably 10 12 feet and it's eroding every time we get a winter storm, every time we get waves.
Um, so the proposal is to for access, the sheet one shows the access coming in over the existing driveway around the house through the lawn and then down to create a ramp down to get down towards the beach at a certain elevation specified at 15 at
which point we'll start to build a seaw wall and then work our way back. This is the proposed seaw wall one to one slope. uh we can't make it any softer because we don't have the landscape to work. We're also uh not looking to carve out any of the bank
behind it that exists. We're taking the existing seaw wall and curling it to a point and then feathering it back down the grave. Uh as you can see the paint outlines the existing property boundaries. We're actually offsite. We have the permission from the butter to
construct this uh that was submitted as part of the note intent. And so the wall built from the northwest side, working our way back up the ramp, cleaning things up, and working our way back out of the site.
So the the top of the wall will have a uh splash pad 8 ft wide of stone and uh that will match existing grade on top of the existing bank. The base of the wall will be along contour six, well above the high water line. So, we're not
subject to chapter 91 waterways program for this project. This project has been uh discussed and in the works for pretty much five to six years between this property owner and the abuter um and us
coming up with various designs. Please. We originally stop uh talked about coming through the between these two houses with the help from these neighbors, carving a road down to get to the beach, be able to build it, and then building it back into the bank, but that was that idea was rejected. We then
looked at taking this garage and actually moving it onto this front lawn so that we can access in this way. In the end, uh we've come up with this where it minimizes any activity going on on this property to the northwest. the um the owner of that property, Mr.
Clark, has signed a document that will allow our client to to move forward the project. She does have a uh a local contractor who's very experienced in doing this type of work. Dave Maderas, Madurus and Suns uh construction, Russell's Mills Contracting, I think is
what he goes by, lined up to do it this summer. Um with your blessing. Um we do have a D file number and with that, I'd be happy to answer any questions. Thank you, Kristen. >> Mr. Chairman, Linda Burch, 329 Breaking Point Road. This is a notice of intent
filed by Schneider Dignon and Leon uh with Dave Dignon representing. The report date is March 27th, 2026. The file number for the project with no adverse comments is SC802833. The site visit was also on March 27th,
uh 26, not 37. Description of the work. Um, the applicant is filed to install roof wrap stone seaw wall extension to prevent loss of a structure. The property is located along the Atlantic Ocean is located on the west side of the existing rip wrap seaw wall. The
property is undergoing significant erosion and the landwood edge of that current wall. The erosion places the home 12 to 15 ft from this edge of this deteriorating seaw wall. Photos clearly show the wall is failing and eroding during winter storms. The properties
predate the wetlands protection act regulations and the seaw wall was constructed many years ago. Hurricane Bob in 1991 is the last time I recall stones were added to this area after some significant shifting of those stones uh just shy of Mrs. Burch's
property. Uh the applicant has pres prepared a design to construct a 13- foot wide temporary access over the bank for equipment to build a 67 ft seaw wall extension. The abuing property owner has granted permission for the applicant to
use his property to aid in the access. The coastal bank is considered a buffer to storms and also is providing a sediment source to the existing beach system. Um, what Dave didn't mention, he does have a geologist, coastal geologist
report, Stam Humphre, to uh answer any questions the commission may have, but he does address most of uh the concerns relative to the coastal bank. Uh the again one of the coastal bank is considered a buff of the storms and also
providing a sediment source to the existing beach system being the Goose Wing Beach to the west uh and into Little Compton. The large stones will be placed at the toe and filter fabric utilized behind the stones as they're stacked up the slope. This will prevent
sediments from washing away and collapsing in the wall in the future. Mitigation planting of beach grass along the top will be planted 12-in on center. In addition, 35 cubic yards of beach nourishment will be provided uh in its incompatible material with the existing
area. The existing seaw wall will have stones restacked and aligned to meet the new section. So, they're basically going to take that extension and blend it right in what currently is there and trying their best to place that fabric under the last uh sections of that
existing wall. The alternatives to protect this structure were studied as Dave mentioned over numerous uh times. They determined that the rip wrap seaw wall will provide the best long-term results. Um Stan Humphre the coastal
geologist also supports this um based on him providing some alternative design criteria. This one is most uh likely to withstand forces. Coral logs which are in my opinion are a temporary measure
and a soft coastal structure. Um they would not withstand the forces that are generated during southwest winds that cause the main damage to this area. Um in the construction process, sheet piling be used along the structure to stabilize the area during construction.
Any vibration um all temporary installations will be removed once the wall is complete and they will work their way out. Resource areas in this location land under the ocean uh coastal bank land subject coastal storm flowage and
coastal beach. recommendations for the board. And uh Dave, I want you to know that there's a time of year restriction on this property. So, this would have to happen late summer um because of plug habitat. So, you're looking at August 31st at the
latest that >> okay >> applies April 1st to August 31st. Just for your reference, Westfall Conservation should consider approving the riparrap seaw wall. >> Just a reminder on that, it's September 15th. >> It's September 15th. Okay. Thank you. September 15th
>> um to approve the ripperap seaw wall to protect this historic dwelling uh with the extension from the existing and provide mitigation plantings and beach nourishment as outlined in the design plans. This property should be restricted for a time of year of April
1st to September 15th for the piping clover habitat. That is all, Mr. Chairman. >> So what happens after the 67 ft? It looks like it's a eroding. Is it eroding all the way down or is it >> This is again I just touched briefly on
it. This is actually a coastal bank that provides a sediment source. If there was not a structure being caused harm here, this coastal bank cannot be armored. It is meant to provide a source to the system. Dave is implementing a measure
to protect the house in its best interest for those purposes. Other than that, they cannot armor this embankment um which is approximately 25 to 30 ft high. It's very abrupt. You can see it. But as you stand there, you can hear
stones falling. The unusual thing of this is this is actually um not cobble. This is actually glacial till coming out of this hill. So this isn't virgin mater. This is actually virgin material rather not influenced by anything except
it being eroded by wind and water. and uh precipitation that might drip down that hill. But second to that, there is also some wildlife habitat value on that bank where um swallows nest in the upper section of it all along the upper
perimeter. You can see holes that are in there and the bank swallows like to nest in there in the spring and fall uh late summer. So yes, Paul, th this is only a fix for this is where the contention was with the neighbor that he was afraid, as
we can attest, the end of a seaw wall begins to erode. So again, because of this structure, this is the best that could be done, I think, in this particular area. The previous proposal was to armor that entire 300 ft
embankment with core logs. And as Dave mentioned, they were going to come down through Mr. Clark's property. After he realized that the coral logs had a longevity of 10 years, and the cost was twice that, he didn't feel it was worth his his money. So he after a number of
years conceded he didn't want to do anything, but he in turn has allowed Mrs. Burch after numerous negotiations to proceed. >> All right. Thank you. Any questions? I just wanted to follow up this part of
the conversation in this and because I know that the regs without knowing them verbatim has really strict restrictions on revetment and what makes this unique is because it is um the erosion is
actually creating more buffer down not downstream but down in the direction of the current. Is that what's kind of letting it go through >> the long shore the long shore movement of this shoreline brings it all towards Goosewing. >> Okay.
>> And towards the uh Southshore Beach. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> And so there's no like essentially there's no collateral damage from the >> No. Okay. >> No. So in this case because of being a house from the 1920s or the early 30s
>> um this kind of gives a little pre-existing allowances. Well, there's a certain amount of grandfathering because it's been around for so long. >> This house, again, I grew up in that area. And I can say it has definitely gotten worse, especially on the terminus of that old wall. You can see in my
photos that the old concrete that is like from the very old um time that they deposited materials. Um but it's definitely slumping. And they propose and and also just to contour this similarly, they propose to restack some
of the the stones on that new face that's pre-existing. So >> basically, we're going to come around the corner right about >> before you get to these stones. These stones are key. You can see in this photograph, um let me see if I can show
you. Uh there's one of them. You can see uh this one it's it's on the bank. This one is at the base of the bank. And then when you look at this one, the bank's way back here, but we're we're going to be this way of it. That's going to continue to do serve its purpose. Correct.
>> Yeah. I I just know we'll be we don't want to see this, but we'll be seeing more of beach erosion going forward. And I just >> with with the concern of resiliency. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yes. >> So I just want to make clear this is kind of
a unique situation you know rather than you know creating uh a slippery slope of a lot of eventments where it's not really permitted even if the consequences are that people you know lose their front yards. >> Correct.
>> Okay. >> Thank you. Anybody else have a question? >> Any questions from the audience? Dave also. >> Yes sir. >> All right. Looking for a motion. >> Move to approve. >> Second. >> I guess it's subject to the time of year restriction as
>> noted. >> Yes. >> That was Phil and Kevin. >> All in favor? >> All right. >> Thank you for your time. >> Thanks, Dave. >> Thank you. >> West Y Club notice of intent 193 cherry web lane. Repair existing boat ramp in
the flood zone and buffer zones. steal my stuff. >> I bet you did. >> You have the green cards, Chris? >> Yes, they're in there. >> How you doing? >> Thanks, brother. >> Uh, I'm Gary Swimemer, commodor of the
Westport Yacht Club. Um what we're looking to do is basically repair a small boat ramp that's uh been in service for at least the 35 years that I've been a member there. Um I really don't know the age of it. It consists of uh two cement slabs that were dropped there um you know functioning as the
ramp. Uh the proposal by the contractor which is Capriyotti masonary out of Metapoiset um is to remove the the upper portion slab that you can see has the most damage. Um build a form, refill it with
cement and rebar. Um there's a sidewall you can see there that they would u break out and also build a form and rebuild it. Um the slab that's uh touching the water at low tide um just has a couple of spots where it would get
a patch in it. Um and that's that's about it. >> All right. Thank you, Chris. >> Mr. Chairman, this is Westport Yacht Club 193 Cherry and Web Lane. This is a notice of intent. Uh engineer of record is to Westport Yach Club. They utilize
their former um chapter 91 plans. This is a uh report is dated March 25th, 2026. File number is SC802835 with no adverse comments. The site was also on March 25th, 2026.
Description of the work. The applicant is filed on behalf of the West Yach Club to replace the upper section of the existing boat launch boat ramp. This existing boat launch is located on the west side of the property is approximately 10 ft wide by 24 ft long.
The ramp has become eroded and the concrete deteriorated. As you can see in the photos, you can see the rebar exposed. They are proposing replacing the upper 12t section uh pretty much above the mean high water with a new concrete section installed. As the
commodore mentioned, they would reform it and then they're going to drill into the existing section and try to pull these two together as best they can. Uh with some minor patching of the lower section. They however are not going down into the water area. For the record,
this is all licensed under a chapter 91 waterways license that's on record uh and recorded at the registry of deeds. Uh this work falls within the flood zone and a coastal bank. The work is only to replace and this is not an expansion. As I mentioned, erosion crows should be
placed below work and remain until forms are removed and the concrete is cured. Resource areas to impacted is the flood zone and the coastal bank. Recommendations. The Westport Conservation should approve the repair of a 12-oot section of existing Bolt
launch at the Westport Yach Club with no expansion and with standard conditions applied. >> Thank you. Any questions? Any comments, questions? Table? No. Any questions from the audience?
Do you have any questions, Gary? >> Excuse me. No questions, nothing. All right, looking for a motion then. >> Motion to approve. >> Second. Okay. >> Who was who did the second? >> Phil. >> Bur. Okay. It was Jake and Burke. All in favor? >> I >> I'm abstaining at
>> Okay. >> All right. >> Thank you, sir. >> Thank you. >> All right. Thank you, gentlemen. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Next, we're going to do William and Harley Creelman notice of intent 136 140 Cadmin's Neck Road. Selective pruning, invasive plant removal, and driveway
expansion in the riverfront area. Anybody here for the Creman's? Do you have the green cards with you? You have notification cards. >> Thank you. >> Fantastic. Thank you. Sure.
Some magnets up there. Whenever you're ready, feel free to start. >> Uh I'm Dennis Dayton, one of the landscape architects representing Bill and Harley Pilman. Uh what we're proposing is to do some site improvements including uh removal of non-native
um shrubs and plant material um some reworking of existing driveways and some ecological restoration and vista pruning on their property at 136 and 140's neck.
All right, I'll do it. Mr. Chairman William and Harley Crelman uh 136140 Cadman's Neck Road. This a notice from 10 application filed by design outside with Dennis Stanton representing. Uh the date of the report
is March 26, 2026. I thought we had a file, Mr. Chairman, but I didn't write it down. Not yet. >> Give me just a second. >> It's not there yet. We didn't get one yet. So that's pending. Uh detailed description of the work. The owner has recently acquired the abroading property
at 136 Cadmin's Neck Road. Um they have filed to install a new driveway connecting the two properties. Uh this would also like to conduct some adjacent plant removal and selective trimming to establish a view on the coastal bank.
The site has a wooded stable coastal bank that borders the cove on the east side of Cadman's Neck Road. The selective trimming will raise the crown of the trees providing a view toward the cove. Uh this is more like vista pruning. A 250 ft enhancement planting
will be provided with native species along the top portion of the coastal bank at the lawn's edge. Uh Vista pruning for the record under the wetlands protection act is an exemption as well as the driveway alteration falls under minor activity in the riverfront
area seeing that it's greater thanund probably 160 ft away 100 maybe a little more than that. Uh so this he's described just for the purpose of this application. Uh the main concern was the use uh and the enhancement of the view
along that coastal bank. Uh this proposed activity will done it be done in a manner that work will not destabilize the coastal bank uh with measures taken to selectively remove some invasive plants. Um again this is a heavily wooded
embankment. They currently have an access down to a dock that is just below there. So there is a meandering path uh that already pre-exists for both properties actually. Uh resource areas from impacted. I excluded that would be
riverfront and coastal bank flood zone. Recommendations. Westport Conservation consider approving the Vista pruning selective plant removal and enhancement planting um with standard conditions pending file
number from D. That's all. Mr. Chairman, >> do you have any questions? >> No questions from the uh table comments. >> I only have a comment for uh the applicant. Appreciate you actually
coming for permission. Uh Westpool, we have a tendency to see people ask forgiveness after they cut trees down. So, we appreciate you coming through in advance. Um Chris, are they from the selective trimming standpoint, are they going to mark trees or what what ones out? >> Yeah, we they have kind of a window. So,
we're going to have a pre-construction. I'll make that as a suggestion as well. Okay. >> Pre-construction meeting to identify the selected trees. Yes. >> Thank you. That's it. >> Anybody else have a question? >> Any questions from the audience?
All right. No further questions. Motion. >> Motion to approve. >> Second. >> Jake and Phil. Was that okay? All in favor? >> Opposed? All right. That's unanimous. You're all set. Thank you. >> Thanks very much. Thanks, Dennis.
>> Going to do a little more housekeeping before we get to the last hearing, which is going to take the most amount of time. Have a few certificate of compliances. Um, Alfred Nggera, SC82255 495 American Legion Highway certificate of compliance. >> Mr. Chairman, Alfred Nogaria, 495
American Legion Highway. This is certificate of compliance. Report is dated March 26, 2026. The file number is SE82255. The work The applicant has submitted a request for a certificate of compliance for file number SC8 802255.
The work was conducted to create a gravel parking area in the buffer zone around the existing garage. The work has been completed for a number of years and has actually been clean was completed in accordance with the plan of record. Recommendations. Westbrook Conservation should approve the full release and
issue a certificate of compliance for file number SCE 802255 at 495 American Legion Highway. >> All right. Any questions, guys? Not a motion. >> Motion approves to compliance. >> Second. >> Motion from Jake, second from Phil. All
in favor? >> Opposed. All right. That's unanimous. Uh certificate of compliance for Jill Zjac SE8219610 Heert Way. Jules Jack 10 Heert way certificate compliance request for file
number SE02196. The report is dated March 26, 2026. Description: The applicant is requesting a certificate of compliance for file number SE 8002196 for a septic design repair along Dval
Pond. The property has a summer cottage on Dval Pond that had a new septic design installed in 2015. All work has been completed for a number of years. All disturbed areas are stable and growing with an established lawn. Recommendations: Westport Conservation should approve the certificate of
compliance and issue a full release of file number SC802196 as all work has been completed according to the plan of record. >> Motion approves the compliance. >> Do you have a second? >> Second. >> Okay, that was Jake and uh Kevin. All in
favor? >> Oppos. All right, that's unanimous. Last we have uh what is this? >> Jose Maderas SE8130 85 with Tupper Road. >> It's been
Oh well >> it's it's not typed out. It's written in >> Yeah, I got you. Jose Mandanka 85 with Tupper Road. This a request for certificate compliance. Uh the report is dated March 30th 2026. The file number is SE801311.
Uh again, description, the property is up for sale and the closing attorney identified this outstanding order on file at the registry of deeds. The work was completed many years ago in 2004. All work was completed, as I can tell, in accordance with the plan of record.
This is a buffer zone project. Recommendations. The West Park Conservation should grant the full release and grant the certificate of appliance for file number SC801311. >> All right. Motion. Motion to approve certificate compliance. Second,
>> Jake and Tom, all in favor? >> Opposed? All right, that's unanimous. All right, everybody here should be here for the mass DCR hearing, unless I forgot something. Yeah. All right, so we have Mass DCR notice of intent for John Reed Road, SE80 2822, proposed
widening of beach access road within Coastal Barrier Beach. >> Uh, so chair, I'm going to ask that I recuse myself. If I am in the butter, I would actually ask that if I could speak during the public's testimony. >> You can go sit down sit on it.
>> Thank you. >> Green. >> Before we start, sir, we need the abottom cars if you if you could. That's a lot of the butters. >> It is a lot of you. >> You just keep those aside, Mr. J. try to stick them in there.
>> If it's that thick, then I'd say that's majority. >> You can start whenever you like, sir. >> Good evening, members of the commission. My name is Tom Kio. I'm an environmental scientist with a comp. I'm here tonight on behalf of DCR. Uh there are several staff members of DCR in the audience who
will introduce themselves as the meeting progresses. Um the project we have here before you is the horse neck beach uh roadway maintenance improvement project. It's essentially the same project that the commission had approved back in October of 2023 with a few small changes
of it. Uh the first change being that portions of the work have already been completed. Um over here we have multiple colors on here. We broke the as described in the notice of intent, we broke the work up into different segments, uh, western, central, and
eastern. The western segment is complete. This parking lot here has been resurfaced and this parking lot here measuring over 4 acres in size has been removed. Um, another change from what the commission had previously approved
or uh would be the construction methodology that has shifted to make sure that there's no activity going on outside the roadway towards the dune. Um, during the last iteration of the plan over here in the western section, um, equipment was on top of the dune
removing sand that we're not proposing to do that at this time. It's going to be more of a scrape um, with a bulldozer or a front end loader. scraping along the sides of the roadway, moving that material into the center of the roadway where it will be uh loaded onto trucks.
Trucks will then exit the site. Um once the roadway has been exposed to its original width, uh that area will be milled and paved. Um excuse me, milled and overlaid. Um and fencing will be put
in. The typical dune fencing, we already have some of it out here in the eastern section, will be put in on both sides of the road in order to catch the sand and prevent further um encroachment of the sand into the roadway, trying to minimize all the maintenance activities.
Um, you know, it's just it's such a long length of road that DCR just really can't keep up with the maintenance and that's what's brought us to where we are today. Um the sand removed from there will be brought over and just spread here in the
area where the parking lot has been removed. Um and from DCR can discuss that a little bit. Um that will be uh I believe piping clover habitat after um the sand has been uh spread out through that area.
That is it in a nutshell. relatively straightforward construction methodology, just exposing the existing roadway um to its uh um years ago with prior to the encroachment of the sand from the dunes.
I'd be happy to answer any questions that you have and if I'm not able to answer those questions, as I said earlier, we're joined by multiple DCR staff uh and they should be able to answer them sufficiently. >> Thank you, Chris. >> Um Mr. Chairman, members, Mass DCR,
Horsene Neck Beach facility. This is a nose to intent application filed by ACOM. Uh the report date is March 27th, 2026. The file number for this project with no adverse comments is SE802822.
Um we also had the applicant consult with MEEPA. Uh there is an email provided with their comments um in favor of the project. The site visit date was on March 27th uh 2026. Description of
the project. Mass DCR has filed a notice of intent to widen the existing beach access path from uh basically 14 to 20 ft. The work is proposed to widen and allow better emergency access along the public beach and campground. A portion of the west section was completed and
stopped after the commission was was concerned with the dune alteration. The applicants have filed this application under limited project criteria for work within a public way. Section 310 CMR 10.53F states maintenance and improvement of
existing public roads but limited to widening less than a single lane adding shoulders correcting substandard intersections and improving inadequate drainage systems. Uh the broke uh the project is broken down into west, central and eastern sections. The
applicant has provided photo evidence of asphalt existing under these encroaching dunes. This was discovered in the western portion. Um uh MEA email response providing stating no further permitting is required. The sand removed will be stockpiled in the reclaimed
parking lot located further inland and used to create nesting shorebird habitat as a form of mitigation. Under Massachusetts law, a public way is defined as any road or path that has become public through statute,
prescription, or historical dedication and is therefore required to be maintained by a city or town. The allowance under the limited project criteria for the pros project in my opinion does not apply as this access called the healthy trail is not a public
way. The applicant's proposal does not provide any reveation plantings to restore the altered coastal dune in excess of approximately 132 and 812 square ft. Placing wooden snow fencing as medication does not comply with the
wetland protection act as the dune must not be destabilized. This proposed amount of coastal dune alteration should be minimized and alternatives considered given the western section has been widened. Can that be considered adequate for the
emergency access purposes? The existing width of Bridge Street uh for the record is only 16 ft. Why does this access need to be wider than the existing uh adjacent public way? The impacts will destabilize the dunes and will allow
them to be eroded from wind. Uh if there's specifically not vegetation there, they are very much prone uh to be windb blown in places other than where they are now. Wooden fencing in my again is not a measure to provide stabilization. Only vegetation can
prevent erosion. It's recommended that Mass DCR consider providing alternatives to this proposal to limit the excessive dune alteration. Altering this amount of coastal vegetated dune does not meet the regulations and cannot be permitted as presented. Um, just for the record, I I
don't know if this can be added, but I also observed two new wells that have been installed within the coastal dune barrier beach off of John Reed Road. And I was just curious why this work was not filed for prior to uh being implemented.
That that's just out there for maybe someone to answer. Uh resource areas and impacted a natural heritage habitat, flood zone, coastal dune, buffer zone. Uh recommendations tonight, the West Paul Conservation should request the applicant continue uh this hearing,
provide restoration and vegetation planting, and minimize the amount of alteration to the maximum extent practical. That's all, Mr. Chairman. >> All right. Thank you. Any questions, gentlemen?
>> Oh, is that the I thought maybe there people going to present. I >> Oh, do you have other presentations? If I could respond to a few, there was a lot in there, so I need to hit it all. >> Well, why don't why don't you start with alternatives. >> Well, I got we'll get the public way issue out of the way first. Okay. MGL
chapter 90 public way is a roadway uh that the public has access to and it specifically calls out that's maintained by a public entity such as the MDC or which was a uh predecessor to UCR
specifically called out in MGL chapter 90. So, you can say that it's not a public way, but you're not offering an actual argument other than saying, "Uh-uh." So, and perhaps the commission
would like to go to the town council and get their um opinion on whether MGL chapter 90 applies to this roadway or not. >> Um, all right. In regard to the vegetation, not all of the dune areas or the sand
areas that we're removing are vegetated. There's large swats where it is not vegetated because it's just sand that was blown onto the roadway. So that's why they're not excuse me uh that's why they have not throughout this area here
down. It's mostly just sand that's blown onto the roadway. Um that's why they're not proposing uh mitigation plantings. The installation of the fencing will in fact stabilize the doom and that's the sole purpose of that fencing is to stabilize
the dune. It catches the windb blown sand, drops it in its spot and therefore it just solidifies the dune. It's placed at the toe of the slope of the dune and it fills in. >> Just so you know, the last time when they were there with the machines, there was a lot of vegetation on the on the
dunes that were that was ripped out. I >> so I mean there may not be vegetation there now but there was before >> and I think a lot of that had to do with the construction methodology as well. >> Well there wasn't much methodology. They just went out there and sat in the do and ripped it out. >> Exactly. And we're not proposing that at
this time. That was not the best way to accomplish it. I'm not here to defend that and say that was fine. >> All right. But the way we are proposing to come down and do it will in fact minimize all disturbances. Um in this
area here down here through this the dune is relatively low in height down in this area here. As you can see from the photos um you know it's it's only 12 in tall down in this area here. So when we come by and we do the scrape and you
install that fencing, there's nowhere to plant anything down in that line. Um it's not as if it's a wide dune coming up. It's already vegetated all the way back if you look at the photos rather densely in that area. So there's nowhere to plant
and that is all I can recall from his >> What is the the actual purpose of this road? I mean, it I've heard public safety um I I've never heard of anybody not be able to be taken out by ambulance from a parking lot, whatever the case may be, or taken from a a different type of altering vehicle from the beach to
the parking lot. But what is the actual purpose of the road? >> Uh the purpose of the road is to provide public access to the beach area itself, but I will let Jorge discuss uh some of the public emergency measures. Um he's deeply involved with the entire process and knows quite more than I do.
Uh good evening. Uh my name is Jorge J Aub. I am the senior coastal ecologist for DCR. Uh as an ecologist um you know my science is to protect and learn about all the plants, animals and humans and
their interaction with the physical environment. I lead a team of 25 uh conservation biologists across the state. Some of many of them are staged in Horseneck Beach during the entire spring summer uh protecting the federally and state listed uh
shorebirds. So as such we do have tons of evidence as well as the park supervisor can attest one um I we have seen so many times when an ambulance there's many rescues in
here by the way uh as many as 25 to 30 per year because these waters are they can be very dangerous. So, we have a group of lifeguards that are properly trained, but when they rescue some of these people off the water, unfortunately, some of them have died.
Some of the conditions that they required, it's not they're not these patients are not in a condition where they can just throwing into a gator, you know, or little ATV and be rode up the beach into an ambulance. DCR makes an effort and has an ambulance uh uh on
detail in here especially during the very busy weekends. Sometimes we get eight to 10,000 people in here and prior to the in part of the origin of these um of these uh project when we
came here is to ensure that once the ambulance and it's typically parked in the middle of the of the beach once he has to attend an emergency which they don't happen all of them in front where the ambulance is parked they have to travel a half a mile up to a mile. The
idea is to load the patient as quick as we can into the ambulance and transport it directly to the hospital so we can save this person's life. In many occasions, my team of conservation biologists, usually young biologists as well as uh young operations teams, they
struggle as they're trying to escort an ambulance on reverse as they're trying to move 8 to 10,000 people off the way crossing the roadway with a patient inside. So that is the original the main thing that I can mention in terms of public
safety of why DCR wants to have this roadway properly available for emergencies. Uh in the past the reservation has caught on fire. We got we do collect debris off the ocean. We stockpile it until we can properly evacuate it. In the past, you know,
irresponsible uh patrons have lit up on fire. Those uh stockpiles of debris and we have uncontrolled fires that have taken, you know, portions of the reservation. And I was there one time and I remember
the former chief of the fire department in here saying, you know, it was impossible for us to get there because we can get the fire truck right there. In the past also, we had a uh state police officer that was attending an emergency down that road that got stuck
on the sand. And after responding to the emergency as he tried to get the uh vehicle off the sand, just pushing and pushing pushing on the gas actually overheated the tires and the police guard uh caught on fire. It also required the fire department to
attend that emergency. They couldn't reach. So in terms of public safety, those are the main reasons. The way we designed this project um and when we came back in 2023
is basically to reclaim sand. Of course, we're in a dynamic system, right? Uh sand in here is going to move. There's a lot of wave energy, a lot of wind energy. It's a natural um progression of all dunes. So since these uh unfortunately because of defer maintenance and proper uh
inappropriate um maintenance in the past a lot of the sand have overcovered you know the roadways. So what we did in here, the way we designed this project is by taking the sand off the roadway, there's going to be a place to put it right to place it on the sides just to,
you know, because there's no plantings or um fencing that can, you know, stabilize that dune promptly before it falls down again into the roadway. The idea was to utilize the sand and bring it to the eastern parking lot
on the reservation because we were able to remove 4 acres of underutilized pavement. Prior to the removal of that authorized work by this commission, um
the parking lot of uh Horseneck used to be the second largest public parking lot in the state of Massachusetts after Logan Airport. So, we removed 4 acres of imperous surfaces with the purpose of restoring that back to the reservation and utilizing the sand that we're going to
be reclaiming off the road. Once with that sand is there, my intention is to create a shorebird habitat for lease sterns, not piping clovers, because piping flowers need access to the water. Lease turns, they feed their babies.
they go and actually fish for them, bring it over and fly over. At some times of the year uh in different occasions, we have had up to 70% of the public main beach covered with uh fencing to protect these birds. Up to 15 pairs of piping clovers and up
to 200 pairs of lesns have nested in the public ways of horse beach. So my interest was to reduce the conflict in between the recreational activities and the conservation of the lens by creating a proper nesting habitat
and the rears will also open space for recreation for the public on the main beach. So it will help the conservation of the birds and also improve the recreational activities for the people as well.
So that's kind of like the origin of of the project and uh back in 2023 when we came in front of the commission in October uh you know we did site visits uh with Mr. Capone uh just to at that time you know we all
felt including the commission that this was falling under the existing conservation and management I mean the operations maintenance plan obviously after the logistics took place and some of the construction methodologies were you know uh triggered um you know that's what actually you know created the
stoppage which you know DCR complied with um at that time also was recommended you know that we probably should file a proper NOI which is what led us into here at this time. So, I hope that that >> What is that red the red the road that's
exiting the the beach? What What road is that? Is that bridge? >> The red line? >> Uh this one here? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. What's the name of this road? The one on the western bridge, right? Yeah. Sure. Yes. >> So, you're going to take that gate out that's there, I'm assuming.
>> Uh the gate can remain. It just needs to be open, especially when we have the emergency vehicles. Like right now, for example, like there's no need for that gate to be open because we have no emergency vehicles. >> There's no people swimming right now on the beach. >> So, were there any ecologists involved when they did the first phase of this
plan and they they ripped out all the vegetation off the dune when they had esavators there sitting on top of the dunes. It was nobody's watching. >> No, no, no. Absolutely not. That was also a surprise for me which is why uh we're not here to dispute that that was uh the wrong methodology and the new
filing improve you know uh includes proper methodology to do that but that was definitely not the best way to achieve the goals of the project. >> Do you think maybe the sand could be used for beach nourishment to to cover for the on the beach versus putting it in the old parking lot? I mean I I know
that's not your job but I mean the beach is not in the best of shape. That's a great question and that's uh actually something that we I personally been trying to for many years even when they did the recent dredge of the river to see if we can like actually capture some
of that dred dredge uh to improve the general condition as you probably have noticed if you're a regular visitor the cobble has been migrating all the way from the east to the west and now we have a big cobble burns in the all the way into the main beach so yeah I think
you'll be great for the resiliency uh of the beach to you know get a nourishment. Um >> and that's why you don't fill both parking lots anymore because people don't go to the beach just so you know because it's it's not it's all cobble. >> It's cobble. It >> it it is cobble. Yeah. It has become very very challenging. Yeah. Uh
thankfully and working with you like that those cobble burns also you know have represented an issue under current operations and maintenance plan. We have authorization to use a front and loader so we can flatten some areas so the actual lifeguards can reach to the water
in case there's an emergency in those sections >> and the piping plas fall in between the cobble and die. >> Uh no, they actually they use those flattened areas to reach to the water. >> Maybe those flattened areas but not but the rest of the beach they have a tough time. >> Oh yeah, correct. The little if the little chicks try to walk over those cobble they get trapped in there and they can potentially die. Absolutely.
>> All right. How wide is the after you guys did your first phase of the work? How wide is the road now? Is it 14 16 ft wide? Uh it varies uh based in what we have right and there's some sections that is being well especially the main section on the main beaches there's some sections probably like 8 10 ft left
because obviously the ocean uh is being taken away the pavement it's been eating out the pavement >> but in the main dune area which is down in the red what I >> section on the western it's >> no not that in the red the red section >> on the red section what is it right now is it 6 we reclaim 20 >> 220 >> 220 yeah
>> right why are you going to go to 20 ft when you have a you're going to go down bridge street which is 16 ft wide And the gates probably only 12 ft wide if maybe maybe a little more. So why were you going to go 20 ft? I mean why can't you just take what you did last time which I think was egregious anyway.
Put the snow fence up and then clean it and re and resurface it if if you need to if you need if this road is truly an emergency road. Why does it need to be 20 ft wide? Well, at the time, uh, especially when we first came with the filing, there was a letter provided by the Westport Fire Department that
included some of the regulations, statewide regulations by the fire marshall about the proper width, and that width is 20 ft. >> Well, that's that that's the recommended, but as you but you're going to be going onto a 16T road. So, you know, I I just I just don't know those dunes, as you know. I mean, that's
your job. All those beaches are taking a beating. the town beach, the you know, all those beaches along there as you go down to East Beach, they're all being eroded and destroyed. And those dunes are a central part of of trying to, you know, try to keep the the ocean back before it breaches
>> and then we have multiple entrances into the Westport River. So, >> I just don't know why we have to make it any wider and take any more sand out of there and then to put it into an old parking lot versus on the beach. >> I just I'm, you know, I'm just >> I have a tough time understanding it. I mean, I'm not an ecologist, but I have a tough time understanding. >> No, I but I agree with you, Mr.
determine like as an ecologist if I have to do it all over again I would not put a road in there but you know this that's was done decades ago right >> the road's there and I mean but I just don't know the understand the the the need to go to 20 ft from what you've already done and not just fix what
you've done and be able to use what you you've done the damage is already done so fix what you've you've already done and then but to make it to go to 20 ft I just think is you know to go on to 20 ft to a 12t gate or whatever it is to a 16ft road doesn't make a lot of sense to me you're They'd be getting fire trucks to turn down there anyway to to
>> if if I'm not mistaken based on the surveys, I believe that the original width of the road was 20 ft and that's what they were trying to reclaim to the original. >> But you know, I'm like I'll give you an example. I've been around a lot longer than I thought I'd be around. We did the same project on Beach, which is a chapter 90 road, actually a state Beach
Avenue, which up near the Nubble. And we went down there. We're going to clean it off. There's asphalt underneath. We even had just to be to be as gentle as possible at the fire department ground with hoses to wash off areas versus going down with machines to scrape it. We were stopped by the state stopped by
we they wanted me reviews the the uh D. I never tell you can't do that because you're damaging you're damaging the the um the dunes. The dunes are supposed to be able to move freely and the sand is supposed to flow and you can't do that. And we're doing it for public safety. People do go fishing on the rocks down there. They fall, they get hurt. Um
there was a small public beach down there and we were stopped and you go down there now and people do get stuck because it's tough to maintain that road. Um and I'm just I I just I when I read the letter from Meepa, basically an email saying, "Oh, everything looks great." I just can't believe it when we
have an actual CH chapter 90 approved road that we couldn't do anything even close to this on. >> We presented the same filing that you have to the director. You know, they stated their opinions. >> I I read it. I understand. And I just find that hard I find it hard to believe that they they've done a you know total
turnaround in a matter of like five six years. But I may maybe we'll apply for Beach Avenue again and that maybe they'll let us do it this time since they've changed the way they do things. But does anybody else have any questions? >> I got one. Uh so the yellow section represents the garden waterfront, right?
>> Uh yes, correct. Um yes, the this is the section that doesn't have any uh dune in front of it in between the roadway and >> I mean >> lifeguards. Yes, there there life guards in there. >> Are lifeguards responsible for responding on the red section and the green section? >> Yes, the entire reservation,
>> but they don't we don't have any stands there. >> No, because we can't install them because the main high water gets to right into the dunes. So, we can't keep the chairs in there unless we install them in the dunes, which is not something that we can do. So I mean I just as far as the timelines go for
rescue I'll just is the road even the biggest concern with that or >> well according to the paramedics you know once they take control of a patient you know a lot of our lifeguards are high school kids that receive basic training and they're not capable to you
know provide life support the EMTs do and basing what they say it is once they take the patient is move it to the the hospital as quick as possible is >> is in their benefit and I can tell it's just not there's not a turnaround you
know you cannot turn around the ambulance anywhere so it's very challenging in the middle of the day like backing up an ambulance you know all the way trying to evacuate a patient >> each one of those lifeguards are highly trained >> oh they are trained >> highly trained >> Oh no no they are
>> you have an ambulance right whenever the beach is open it's there >> yep >> jet skis >> well not not every day the EMTs are only there uh during weekends during the >> pretty much all the time. Pretty close. You have jet skis. You have ATVs,
>> right? Multiple. >> You can get anywhere you need to be in seconds. We're going to widen a road a little bit. It doesn't make sense. What what's you or I understand the parameters and how long that beach is.
>> Okay. So, so the assumption being that a person rescue of the water and responsive the best method of transportation will be to in an ATV or in a jet ski. >> Correct. They have the backboards. They are equipped. They have every they even have I believe they have a
Lucas machine. They have everything there for them. Jeff McGee, >> Chris Bole do fantastic jobs. You guys do a fantastic job. You be commended. The way you train your people, it is amazing what they do as a group. >> Yeah. And I'm not disputing that. I
actually think they do. I'm not saying and I'm not challenging anything they do is once they're highly trained and the best training in the state and they are led by some of the best people in the in the state and I think they are very capable at what they do and I Jeeoff I
don't want to speak for you. Mhm. >> Um, >> how do you feel that you guys do >> the issue is after the rescue >> like like I say is once the EMTs take possession of the patient >> that's the issue you can't clear it then if you have
multiple rescues going on you have multiple drownings going on you have we've had ambulances suffer on the beach the idea is to get the buses out there and bring them up a bridge street and that's where the widest part is and they probably took too much of that
corner, but we needed the radius to get that ambulance out to Bridge Street. Never went any fires or so, right? Because there literally has 10 to 11,000 people on it. We cannot clear them out of the way. >> Um, you have people that obviously are drinking out there and people don't want
to listen to you, etc. So that's if you have a 20 foot wide >> area, you can move them over. You have people with wheelchairs. You have people in strollers. You're disabled. You cannot move them out of the way. You have 10 feet >> and you're trying to I can't do it. My little ranger this time of year when you
have three or four people in strollers in front of you. I can't get up and down. >> Yeah. So I I apologize if I didn't make it clear that it's once the EMTs take possession of the patient then but I'm not trying our our lifeguards and the operations picture of how it's done.
>> So the intent was for the the west end was more for the egress purposes. So you won't have to back the ambulance down west and come out. >> Yeah. You know, in the summer there's bicycle riders, there's people in strollers, you know, there's walkers, there's all kinds of people on the
roadway. So you need to have the proper width for those the ambulance and for people to get out of the way as they they go through it. So on the main beach, we've been clearing 10 foot sections. We don't have people that have um
baggages down, umbrellas, so we can drive the UTVs in that section. We didn't even have to be able to clear them off the asphalt, especially if it's electric wheelchair, anything to that regard, but we can't do that within the June system. >> You can't have someone that's in a wheelchair climb a dune, right, to get
out of the way. >> Any other questions from the table before I check with the audience? Phil, you haven't? I'd like to just hear from people to get a better sense of, but it sounds like you didn't realize
that the road that you exposed was there at all. You didn't come before the commission and say there's a 20 foot or 16 foot wide road there that has been covered. We just want to restore what
was already there. You It was just in the process that you found it. That's not I'm just trying to understand. >> No, we did we did we did came in front of the commission. We did submit the plans and everything back in 2023 where we're here in the audience of October 10, 2023 and discuss the plan.
>> Okay. So, it was really just the methodology that you used that was most distressing to the people on the commission just in terms of how how it was disrupted. >> That is correct. But but the
ultimately in order to achieve what you were requesting the vegetation would have to have been removed but in a different manner than it was. So that >> there there are some pioneer vegetation growing in some sections of encroaching sand because you know some ones are like
you Tom mentioned 12 in tall some of them are obviously taller and they're more established over the years. So yeah, there is some disturbance of vegetation the pioneer vegetation mostly like you know beach grass and stuff that is growing in some sections or little portions as you go along the entire
reservation. Yeah, there are some sections of disturb that as an ecologist was beneficial for me to establish vegetation once we put the sand on the other side because I already have pioneer species in there. But that is you know a side benefit. This was
resurfaced at a narrower width. Is that what I'm tracking here? Because when you dug it away, it was, you know, there was the section that was paved and then it was sort of down to some other. >> Yeah. It was inadequate. Yeah. >> This pavement underneath extends the full width even of the new one and
somebody decided to just go narrow it some. >> That is correct. They just decided to repave what was exposed, which is obviously was the wrong thing to do, which what we tried to amend, you know, back in 2023. That's obviously the wrong way. Um, I think a lot of them are retired
because I think the last time, where was the last time they paved that road? Like in 2016, I believe maybe or 2015. >> You could certainly get that information. We don't >> while ago. >> I mean, so it represents a decade's worth of growth. That kind of it seems older to me, but
>> it it I agree with you. It's it's terrible that they we do this kind of deferred maintenance for whatever reason. Lack of resources or lack of proper planning. That is definitely something that this agency as well as mo many of our agencies can do better. That's for sure. And that's what we're trying to rectify with this project.
>> But it was 20 ft across originally. >> Yes. >> And that's what's revealed now after they reclaim the sand. And and so just in terms of the mitigation part, is the sand fence the only >> um mitigation that is feasible there or
could the areas beyond the limits of the road whatever it is? >> Um could that also be reveitated in ways? >> Look, I will definitely bring this into with the entire team and the agency as
an ecologist. I think the stabilizing those dunes on those sides will prevent them from collapsing will actually will be less costly over time. Um so I I shared your sentiment that that's something that I'd like to propose. you
know, if this project gets approved, then we have to seek the funding for it. And as an ecologist, I'm going to try to, you know, improve that. Not only because it will stabilize the dunes on the sides of the roadway, but also what helps with, you know, getting back into
these uh loophole maintenance, you know, that's not properly done. >> Okay. >> All right. We're going to take some public input. If you could just take sit down. >> So, we're going to ask everybody who wants to speak, you can just raise your hand. I'm going to limit it to a couple minutes per person if possible. Um, and
if you have any questions, you can ask me and I'll uh I will ask the DCR for you. >> Miss, >> thank you, Mr. Chair. I might need a few bit more than a couple of minutes could be allowed. Um,
>> thank you. >> Thank you for uh Jorge and your team for coming tonight. I asked that somebody come that was passionate about this project or I'm sorry and because I I can't I can't it still remains to me per a project without a purpose. This was on
a long abandoned road. It turned into a bike path that could be used for emergency egress. Now we want to expand it. I mean if you wanted to expand the road 50% or even 100%. But what went on here was unbelievable.
Now the the letter from um Mr. Kio said that he got a letter or he showed us a letter from um or an email from Tory Kim. This is on the whether there's a MEEP review required or not. Based on your representation that no state agency
permitting is required. I concur that no MEEP review for the project is currently proposed. That's a red flag to me. She didn't do any review. And then I looked at what Mr. Kio sent to her. The proposed project includes exposing
the existing pavement by removing the encroaching sand and the reclamation removal of existing pavement down to 8 8 to 12 in. You removed 8 to 12 feet of doom
which is to complete this. So this is a complete misrepresentation to Meepa and I would suggest that the commission needs to get an a real opinion from Meepa by be by being given the facts about what this project involved. I assume that the parking lot where the
where the habitat is going to be recreated would be something that me would want to review. Correct to the chair. Is that a fair question? >> I we we can find out. Well, just to say it's a jurisdictional issue.
>> If Reaper is going to review that project or or feels as though it's a habitat and worth their review, it's actually material that was removed from a place where they're saying you don't need a review. So, I think there is just primmaacia evidence here that this
project has been misrepresented to Meepa and at a minimum I would suggest that the commission request an opinion based on the actual project and what has occurred. This this woman appears to be misinformed. >> All right. >> If I may respond, chairman.
>> Yes. >> The woman is not misinformed. We had a meeting with her. We discussed the project for well over half hour. We showed her photographs of what happened in the western section. We explained exactly what happened to her, showed her the pictures of it, told her the
construction methodology that was used beforehand, construction methodology that was going to be used afterward. And then we sent her the exact description from the notice of attempt that you see here before you tonight in writing to codify what we had said in
the conversation. I did not misrepresent any of this project. I did not mislead her. I told her the exact truth. She knew exactly what was going to happen. >> I I I trust that you did not try to mislead her. However, this represent >> You just said Mr. Kio said this.
>> Yes. >> Insinuated I misled her. >> Mr. Theo this description is not and this is the description that she sent back with her answer. >> She didn't say it. We consulted. She show you showed me pictures. This is all I have to go on. This is a a
minimization at the least a minimization of what has gone on. If I tried to do that as a as an individual, I would have been thrown out here. That's my request, Mr. chairman is that I I think I think you need a proper
review from MEPA and I and and uh Jorge's explanation of the safety concerns notwithstanding I don't I believe this whole project is a is is way out of bounds for what what supposedly stated is there another
purpose is there another purpose for this road >> to save lives >> how many lives have been lost since the 80 years ago since horse neck >> uh four lives since uh 2020 >> in the whole history it's about six and
all of those and almost all of those six and one guy got shot okay but six six drowned and the history that I was able to come up with almost all of those were in places that were not guarded or were in conditions that were you know they
were told people were told not to be there so I I I >> at the campground and we couldn't get our life saving team down there by beach road because people are there. So they have to drive up to John Road to go down and they were too late.
>> I'm sure there's a safety there's a safety aspect to this that could be addressed by this road. However, the way this went the way that you guys went about doing this is unbelievable. No person in the state of Massachusetts could have done anything onetenth of this and gotten away with it. It needed
to be properly explained and properly vetted. And it still it still needs in my as far as I'm concerned Meepa needs an explanation about what was to go on what went on and what was to go on. >> Okay. All set. >> All right. Thank you.
>> Okay. >> So, Mr. Chairman, um I was also part of those meetings with MEPA. We did not misrepresent this project to MEPA. Okay. Everything that was provided to this conservation commission was provided also to MEEPA and the opinion received by this commission by Meipa is after she
they review this project as proposed. >> Okay. >> Um this project to answer to the member of the public this project has no other purpose than what is proposed. So I don't I don't understand the speculation there.
>> That's fine. Next person speak. I'm going to just state your name, please. Yeah, we know who you are, but that's okay. >> I got some pictures to put. >> So, while I'm putting these pictures up, I want to actually take the time to kind
of address the project from the get-go and really what they're trying to accomplish here, adding a butter to the property. Um, I was just an addition Let me take that down. Leave that to the side. I'm going to need that map.
So, uh Jake Mcwigan, uh a butter to the property that we're in discussion with. I cannot believe within with truth that you can sit there and say this is a public safety issue. We are talking about a location that is unguarded from
here all the way to the property line of Bakers Beach. That's right. We are there is no rescues taking place along that. You know that Jeff don't >> that's where the ambulance is going to be leaving >> from a perpendicular fashion. How are they going to get from the beach access road to the shoreline? Now you're
talking about egress and egress. That's fine. In the four years that I've been managing Baker's Beach, this gate at Bridge Road has not been opened once for an emergency situation. >> That's not true. We are dealing with a situation where
we have signs up and down the dunes that say these dunes aren't ready for walking. Yet, we park a caterpillar excavator on top of the dunes in front of the sign. This is the habitat we're creating at the parking lot at State Beach. It's
basically a moonscape. This is almost right in front of the administration building that has sand on it that a vehicle cannot get through. The issue that we have with this pa pathway is a maintenance issue. We just
received a letter from the fire department saying as long as this pathway would be maintained, they could enter and exit appropriately throughout the entire length of Horses neck beach. the the area we're talking about, this
area right here, our lifeguards end up having to guard people at Horses Neck Beach >> because this is unguarded. At 18 years old, I went into this ocean and pulled someone out dead. That's one of your
deaths you're talking about where none of you were down here to do anything on this unguarded area. So to talk about public safety is a misnomer. We talk about reclaiming sand with this project. The natural progression of sand
is it blows from the ocean into the dune system. It creates a dune system which protects property owners. Back here we are now taking the natural progression of the sand on the dunes moving into a parking lot to create habitat on
asphalt, mind you. And I don't have that picture here with me, but there's asphalt underneath there. not really the best habitat to create. So, what exactly are we doing? We can talk about snow fences. You talked about putting a snow fence on each side. Let me explain to people how snow fences
work. You can come to Vakers and I can show you. We're very good at collecting sand. You put a snow fence down one side, you put a snow fence down the other side. Where does the sand collect? In the middle on the road. So why would we put a snow fence on each side of the road to trap sand in the middle on the
roadway that we need for emergency access which currently is not maintained? That picture is from November. This is not a public way. The Westport Fire Department said recently that it is not an issue. We're talking about un unguarded beachfront which we
actually have to take we take up some liability. My family's own the beach for 43 years and we and I understand this probably better than anyone with respect to what's going on in there. This is unguarded, unmonitored, mind you. We actually have to worry about people
accessing now this widened pathway going down here sitting and drowning while our lifeguards are sitting on this edge. We're going to make this easily or more accessible to get to that beach. You've actually just removed a boulder from the gate at Bridge Road just recently. You
know what's been on the beach right now on Bakers? Ebikes ripping up and down my dunes. >> Fourwheelers on the beach because now they have the access point because I don't know mysteriously where that boulder went. Somebody took it somewhere. I called the highway department. They had nothing to do with
it because technically it's bridge bridge street and that is a town property. So >> what? Excuse me. >> Bring it back. >> I've had people offering to put it back there because of what they've seen happening. This is the problem. We are opening up a situation where it's
unmonitored, unmaintained, unguarded, and then it falls on property owners like I know there are some ab budding neighbors that will be here to probably discuss the issues they have at the end of Bridge Road. So again, the whole project to Mr. Sullivan's point and then thank you for yielding some of your time
is is this is has nothing to do with public safety. You can talk about it all you want. I think I mean you have piping clover ropes from Baker's Beach property line all the way down to the basically
the parking lot and then the beach itself. So are you are you planning on doing this project during pipe and clover season? Is that is that the plan? >> No. >> Okay. Well, that that's good. That's a start at least. Um again, I just I I
have a issue with how it went about in the first place. We as a commission or not me I recuse myself but as a commission it was approved as a maintenance project and the fact that we're talking about uncovering asphalt that was there it is not there the entire length of the way. I will go with
Jeff or I'll go with any one of you and you can show me where the asphalt is starting from Bridge Street all the way to the administration building and I and I know where you're talking about but it's not the entire length of the way. It's not it's not there. Again, it's like a funnel. you have a 16 ft bridge
road going in there. Why do you need a 20 foot wide uh way to get through there? And if and the other issue is because people are going on to the horse neck beach at that end, I have to fight and deal with parking, blocking my
entrance, blocking the gate, blocking the road. There will be times where you try to egress off of your superighway, 20 foot wide path. you're going to get to Bridge Road and they're going to be parked on the side of the road and your ambulance won't be getting anywhere because nobody wants to enforce it and
they're going to your beach because they don't want to pay the fee over at the state. So, that's all I have right now. I I believe this project needs to be looked at and the remediation is my other concern. The project started, there was a cease and desist, there was
an enforcement order. No remediation was done. The the dunes are destroyed. It looks like a moonscape over there. And, you know, it's it it should be enjoyed. It's a natural pristine area that unfortunately is not not that way now. So, thank you. >> All right. Thank you. All right.
I'm going to ask that we refrain from clapping. >> Okay. >> Okay. Um, I'd like to respond to a couple of things. First of all, because uh we appreciate you, you know, recusing yourself from the conservation commission because you are misleading
the public and a lot of your statements. Um the reason why there's a pile of sand in there is because we are not authorized to proceed with the work. So that's where it was p it was piled when we were authorized to do the work by this commission. So that's why it's
there. That's why it's there administration. >> That's why it's there. You put a picture on there in November. Of course they're sending there in November. There's nobody maintaining the the the roadway in November. you be trying to mislead the public >> like that that beach that road needs to
be clear when there's people in there when there's going to be rescues on the beach. If this road if this project moves forward and that becomes a 20ft path or it remains in the state it is at 8 ft somewhere that section of the beach that you just point out to the public
will remain unguarded because the road is not the reason >> why it's not guarded. The reason why it's not guarded is because we cannot install the lifeguard chairs in here because of the intertital zone. The mean high water reaches the dunes. So that's
also a misled to the public. So that has nothing to do with this section not being guarded and you as an should know that. So uh what else? What was the other thing? I think that's all I can recall right
now about multiples. Anything else? asphalt in the parking lot that you >> Oh, yeah. You're saying that we're going to put all that sand on top of pavement. That is incorrect. >> It's currently there. >> It is not there. >> Actually, you want to bet? Let's go tomorrow. I will go with you tomorrow.
>> You're telling me that the 4 acres of pavement that we were approved to remove are still there? >> I will go with you tomorrow. I'll meet you there. >> The only area that has >> Mr. Capone, there's asphalt still under that sand. >> Under the sand only. >> Under the pile of sand. Yes. Yes.
Correct. >> That's what they're referring to. The the >> reclaimed not the for reclaimed sand. >> Oh, so the staging. Got it. Got it. >> Because it was piled on the asphalt before you guys. I >> I apologize for that. Okay. Dad, that's the staging area of the sand. Okay.
Yeah. The area where the sand will be installed. It's been already removed. Almost 4 acres of paper. >> So, you want to come up and just you want to come up make a comment? Not you. No. Then back. Yes. >> Come on up.
>> Just state your name for us, please. >> I will. >> When you get up here, >> uh, my name is John Bullard. I live at Five Nicks Way, uh, little less than a mile from the area that we're talking about. And I would like to comment. I I
second the remarks from Jake and Mike, but I want to comment in in two roles. one as a person who with my wife Lori has walked that path dozens and dozens of times. Uh we're 78 years old. Every
year uh is valuable to us. And when we walked, we loved walking that path because of the dunes, of the birds, of the colors, the Rosa Rivera, all that. It
was gorgeous. It's a wonderful place to walk and and we live here in the winter. We're here 12 months of the year. You work for the public. We're the public 12 months of the year, not just in the summer. And we enjoy that path.
And when we walked down there and saw it destroyed, that that just didn't injure the path. that injured everyone who's who benefited from the beauty of that.
It is Orwellian that the department of conservation and recreation is doing this. We recreate on that path because of the beauty and the ecological importance of
the dunes and they took it away from us for several years now. And as I said, a year is important to us. Now, I I've also been in government a lot of my life. I'm on the planning board in Westport, head the climate resilience committee, work for Noah for 10 years.
When I was at Noah, I said, we regulate. I said, I know we have a lot of laws. We got to follow the laws, but the thing we should do more than anything is focus on do the right thing. If you do the right thing, they're good
lawyers to figure out how to do it. Focus not on the law, but on what's right. This is not right what they've done. And it's not right what they've proposed. You listen to nature. You're not
listening to nature here. When nature puts the sand on the dunes, nature is telling you something. You're not hearing the message. Uh there are as you walk the beach steps from the old beach club under the sand.
I haven't heard anyone say we should build the old beach club because the stairs were there and we used to have a beach club. You know things change the road that was 8 ft wide and DCR which I
in the past have had tremendous respect for. I've worked for them with them on lots of projects. They're great agency. Um they they would maintain it. You would see people walking, people biking,
uh enforcement folks on horses, so you'd have to watch where you stepped, but that was good, too. And now that's been taken away. My experience is the wider you build the road, the more vehicles you attract, the higher speeds you
attract. And uh this is going to be an entirely different place. This is going to look like Route 88 in the middle of the dunes. And I think it's not the right thing. And I think you have the ability to do the right thing. Thank you.
>> Thank you, Mr. DORA. >> If you guys can stop clapping, that'd be great. >> No, >> I'm sorry. >> We don't have to have any more public comment either. That we can go no with that, too. So that that's up to you how you want to proceed. Anybody else like to speak?
>> Ma'am, >> if you could just state your name for us and then please say what you'd like to say. >> Sure. Karen Gonzalez. I'm on Horsene Neck Road. Um I was in Westport when the state of Massachusetts took our beach. Okay. They took it from our town. So for
me to trust the state is a real far reach. Okay. Um, when you walk down the beach now, it's completely different. There's nothing left of the dunes alongside the path. When you guys take those rocks with that
giant machine, where do you put them? You made a huge swath right through the sand dunes. Where what goes to where do those go? Where do those rocks go? What do you do with them? >> You know that big machine to clean the beach? >> You're talking about the beach
breakaker? Yeah. >> Oh, the front and loader. Which one? >> The raker. >> I've watched it in action. So, you got you cut a giant swath through this. The engine ones, I'm assuming to put those rocks. Is that correct? >> So, the beach breakaker does not have
the capacity to pick up rocks. >> Okay. >> The little twines that only picks up papers and >> Well, why is there no more rocks in the beach? >> I'm sorry. >> There's no more rocks in the beach. >> No more rocks. >> There was cobble all winter and now the cobble's gone. How did that happen? There is plenty of cobble when it comes
>> last show you that >> say last week. >> It was cleaned beautifully. >> If you just speaking the microphone, but I I've seen on the beach too where the certain times of the year the sand comes in, covers the cobble, and then next two weeks later, it's just all cobble again.
So, I'm not I I don't think I'm not saying they didn't take any rock out of there, but I've seen in other parts in Palm Beach and everywhere where rock is there, it's gone the next week and back again. Okay. So, the giant path cut through the sand dunes and it says do not enter. So, what is that all about? >> Oh, that's great.
>> I'm not really sure. >> That's where they put their refues that they collect off the beach as he mentioned earlier. >> All right. >> Mhm. >> So, that that that's your answer. So, they put the what the seaweed and different things. >> Exactly. Yes. And any debris, wooden debris and stuff like that that may be
collected during the course of the year. And that's what they talking about the fires would sometimes people light it on fire but they try to take it away before they light it on fire hopefully. >> Is there any state program to plant beach grass >> on some of this these dunes that are naked now?
>> Not that I'm aware of. >> Pretty much. Yeah. I think that I that's a big problem with the dunes especially at the town beach as well where the dunes are being deteriorated from the storms the velocity of the storms and you know especially the town beach where you you have >> you know probably than my lifetime
you'll have you'll have a breach >> and removing these dunes isn't although it's right now it doesn't seem as you know you can't put a lifeguard station there because the beach is gone >> and as you take out the interior of the dunes to put a road it's not really that helpful. Okay. >> But that's that's you know that's my
opinion. >> All right. Thank you. >> I'm not an ecologist, but that's just my observation. >> Anybody else like to speak? >> I Yes, sir. >> You want to come up, sir? >> Yes. >> Just just state your name, please, if you could. >> My name is uh my name is Gary France.
I live at the gate at uh Bridge Road that you're discussing. Uh >> the first house there, >> excuse me. >> You live right near the the first house or >> Yes. Well, my family's lived at 69 Bridge Road for 61 years. >> All right. >> And I'm a personal witness to the activity that happens there day and
night. I sleep there. I live there. Um I have not seen many instances of um uh emergency vehicles being impeded on their um uh access going through that road to access onto Bridge Road. I've
never seen an emergency vehicle uh being stuck. We see them rarely on occasion. Maybe every other year. Um, but I've never seen one have a problem getting through. And that's my personal experience living right there. I can see
the trucks coming down the recreation road. And I've lived there my entire life. >> Okay. >> I've never seen a truck get impeded. Um, and I just as a summary, um, and I think the spirit of the conversation, I think the people of Westport would like to see
a recreational road. It maybe has to serve a dual purpose of it being emergency situation, emergency egress, but I don't think the people of Westport want to see our largecale industrialization of the waterfront area
um, uh, more impervious uh, surface. saw it ruins the appeal of an area that's important to people's sanity. Tough times, people like to walk down that road and escape. It's why we live here. Otherwise, we'd all be in Boston or
places we've been. But, uh, sanity is a big part of this. People go to this place to escape. It's not just a large industrial beach for thousands of people. And you got to kind of have the magic to work these things together
where in the end after all this after all this maybe uh hostilities maybe come together. I think people will come to the consensus that it needs to have the appeal of a recreation road. And I have never seen emergency vehicle impeded and
I'm the only one in this town that lives there. So they're rare occurrences. I've never seen emergency vehicle not getting out. Furthermore, I live on Bridge Road. My mother died in the house in my arms. We've never had a problem with any
emergency vehicle coming to our house um on Bridge Road and we've had every emergency vehicle possible. We've had fire trucks, we've had we've had everything there over 61 years. So, I hope in the end of this discussion that people will take this area back to the
recreational appeal that it needs, desperately needs, yet maybe serve a purpose for vehicles. But please listen to what I say. It's it's not a regular occurrence that vehicles can't leave this recreation road and get under bridge road. I am a witness here.
Period. I'm also a expert witness in the state of Rhode Island and a certified general in the state of Massachusetts. I'm a real I'm a commercial real estate appraiser. All I have to say, we hope that on behalf of the town, we hope that the road can keep the appeal. We've had
a lot of industrial uh development happening on Horses Neck Beach in such a short amount of time. We have over 80 or 90 uh wind turbines. We have erosion uh things in the dunes that are just left there to rot. Now we have this. We're
going in a really wrong direction. I think that people understand that the appeal and the integrity of that area needs to be maintained as a recreation area, not a utility exit for emergency vehicles that I firstly barely rarely
ever see. And I've certainly never seen them being stuck where they can exit. >> Thank you very much. >> Thank you very much. >> Anybody else have a comment? >> Just just briefly, Mr. Chair, I I do want to thank I I requested my letter that I think was passed along. I do want to thank the folks from DCR for coming
here and and try to explain themselves. And I since we have you here, I would I hope that you'll take the time to look at the biggest problem that we have at Horsene Neck Beach and that is that it's turned into stone. And what can be done
to keep that beach usable? I mean, people aren't coming anymore. I live down there and it used to be a pain in the neck. every two, three times a year I couldn't get to my house cuz there was so much traffic. I mean, it's good for me that that I don't have to do that, but I think it's bad for the people that want to visit horsemen. It's no longer
hospitable. So, if you could take that back, I appreciate it. >> All right. Does anybody else have a comment? >> I do. >> Oh, not the public, but >> Go ahead, Phil. Um well, one is a one is just a question
because it seems to me that back in 2023 the commission approved the project and I don't remember whether it had a 20 foot wide road in it or not. Did it did the what what we pre- approved in 2020
had a 20 foot road? >> I'm I'm suggesting yes. I'm not but I do believe the initial was always to go to that 21st. Yes. >> Okay. And so what seems what it seems to me that has happened is that DCR's
credibility has been destroyed maybe pretty an overstatement because of the way that the work was implemented because the commission relied on you to say you've got a plan. We just want to do this under an
existing plan. There was no history with us that indicated that we just shouldn't rely on you to do the right thing and you didn't do the right thing and you're just seeing the response to it now. And but you're all but the opponents are
putting the commission in the position of trying to balance the risk of what I see are credible people who are saving we're trying to save lives here versus the protection of the environment
because if we do nothing here I just speak personally I would not want to be responsible, feel responsible for someone being injured. So, um,
so it seemed to me that maybe the way to, um, get to the issue of whether or not the uh, the road needs to be expanded to address the
public safety problems. is that we need some expertise brought to the issue. Um, and I don't know if that's a solution, but I would feel a lot more confident in my vote knowing that someone who, and
I'm sure there people I think there are people out there who would get the facts from both sides and as we've done in other situations, go out and get our own expert
to come in and and and say, you know, the road needs to be this wide or it doesn't need to be this wide. And um because now it's extremely difficult and I uh uh maybe I should have accused
myself because um you know I worked for state agencies for a long time um and but I do think that people sitting on this side who are concerned about the safety of people just can't be set aside.
Um, and I don't think the people in the audience think that, but I can't base a decision to say, "Leave the road the way it is. Just let it let the sand blow over it because of what people have had
out of their personal experiences." Um, so that's kind of where and so that's kind of where um I'm at right now. >> And I think we could figure out the MEA thing, too. I mean that's something that we could look at but just for people to
understand the in order for me to get involved there has to be a state per involved or a federal permit involved the state permit. So the question is if you're even if so if the problem is the
way they did the work was terrible but there's no state permit required to take sand off one place and put it in a parking lot. Okay, if they were putting it in the water they would need to get permits. But if they're just moving it, even if they were tremendously
destructive, I don't think they'd need a permit if where they put it in didn't have an environmental impact. And uh unfortunately the we don't have any enforcement authority. You know if D had wanted to they could have gone after
them and uh you know taken action under the weapons protection act uh but they didn't it just didn't happen. So, but I think we can clarify what what happened in NEPA and decide okay uh or looking at
the final looking at a proposed plan after we were able to study it a little more does uh uh you know is is a state is MEA required jurisdictionally and so since
you can't do any work until September right maybe there's time to step back, look at uh you know what was talked about about a mitigation plan that doesn't that that does more than just look at uh sand
fences and I don't know take a breather relax you know mistakes were made but we can fix them so that we can protect the public and uh get a path that uh meets what people's desire is was you know
which you know to have a peaceful place to walk. >> I I understand um and I agree with a lot of what you're saying and DCR would like to uh at this you know we could request a continuence and take a look at different mitigation measures for that
and I would like to say that your thoughts on MEPA process are the same ones that we discussed with MEPA and which MEEPA gave us back those responses. If we were to use it for beach nourishment, it's the placement of a
material in an intertitle zone. You need a state permit that triggers me automatically. We're not using it for beach nourishment. And it comes down to what you had mentioned earlier. A lot has to go into beach nourishment. You really just can't go and dump sand down there and hope for the best because
ocean dynamics change all the time. Dunes are either accreting or retreating. It happens all the time. They're all dynamic resources. And you would just mention you take a walk on the beach. One day you see the copple 2 3 weeks later you can't. It's covered by sand. So if we were to do beach
nourishment without understanding the ocean dynamics and the wave refraction and whatnot and just put sand down there, it would be gone in two weeks. That same tidal action that brings sand in and moves it away would do that with the sand that you place down on that
beach because it's a very beach nourishment in the intertitle is a very complex uh undertaking in the the landward side of it. It's not so much. It's just in the recreational area. But to to go ahead place it in an area where
it's dynamic is very complicated. >> Well, I'm just responding to and I'm terrible at names. um Jorge's uh Jorge's perspective that it is worth going back and looking at whether there that
vegetation and other um organic means of uh mitigation can uh substitute for or um you know reduce the you know just give us a better ecological outcome.
What I'm saying is what I'm hearing is the dispute between do you do do we need the road widen or do we not need the road widen that's really one of the fundamental issues and I don't feel comfortable making a decision on that based on what I've heard today but I do
give a lot of credibility to the people who are responsible for lives there who are I'm hearing them say this is something that needs that you can't ignore this it's real you're not making I mean
is it realistic to say that VCR has an in such an interest in in going out and finding money to expand the road that they're coming up with this fantasy that lives are not being protected. I can't I
I don't believe that. >> No, we're a public agency. We can't make those kind of claims if we don't have the fundamental evidence. this safety thing is bogus. >> Well, I don't know that I'm not going to make a decision on that subject. >> Yeah, we have we have the obviously we
as a public agency, we can't we can't make the claims with fundamental evidence that these things are happening. So, >> yeah, >> as an ecologist, I want to like, you know, I I'm going I would like to see a better stabilization plan on the sides
of that roadway. I share your sentiment even as an ecologist because humans are part of my science and the interaction with the physical. I part of the reason why the u I forgot his name the butter that lives in right on the entrance but he pointed
part of the reason why he doesn't see the emergency vehicles because they can't make it there. >> So not from our property for clarification only essential vehicles are authorized in public beaches in Massachusetts.
There's not a single vehicle that is not an essential vehicle owned by DCR or a emergency response vehicle that will be traveling along this road. So that's just to make it clear on the record. This is not a public roadway for vehicles transit to go, you know,
commuting in between locations. I think that definitely um absolutely no work will happen during the time of year restriction that we have in place anyway if we're going to be steering the the shore nesting and of course preparing
for the recreational season. Uh before we can seek funding for this project with our internal uh budgets, we obviously we need to have the permitting in place. Uh it is clear to me that
um DCR had good intentions. I came back I had no intentions to dam I wish I can recreate what you have in Hors and many other of us state beaches that I oversee across the Commonwealth. Uh because it's just it is it is beautiful. But I cannot
also turn my eyes around, you know, from things that my own staff has support operation staff when they're escorting an ambulance on reverse with a patient inside that needs to be taken to the hospital for a life or death situation.
So I think that you know the best is uh to request a continuence. we can work internally and how do we going to prepare the stabilization of the roadway and you know how to move forward and of course take in consideration all of the recommendations and comments that we
received today as well. >> Perfect. Just as a by way of analogy and you know where we had this issue about the revetment. Okay. And in that case the applicant came in and hired an expert who was able to provide the the
expertise to say yes this is actually going to feed the beach. It's not going to it's not going to have a negative impact. it's going to have a positive impact to me sitting here because you know I'm not an expert but that was really critical to my feeling that yeah
this is something even though it was unusual was worthwhile doing and maybe it's not I'd like to be told it's not feasible to get some neutral
professional to come in and look at the situation and say there are different ways to skin this cat that has been proposed that will have less eological impact. >> Yeah. >> And >> all right >> then move forward from there.
>> So what kind of Yes. Hold Jake. Where's sir? >> Say something. >> Sure. >> My name is Jeff Bull. I live in Westport. I am someone that could well need to be rescued.
I surf and wind surf in from Corseneck Beach almost year round. At moments we've been out there and rescue has been called even though we were fine. We're back in the beach. Uh my concern is that well two things. One
is if you make it look like you can actually save people, people are going to assume that you can. And we know that people go in the ocean and do stupid things. We I do not. The people I go wind surfing with, we are
trained. We are careful. We let the harbor master know where we are. There's a float plan and we're not depending on the state to come get us. I could die out there. That is my choice. It I realize that you want to save people and
I appreciate that. But my other concern is if you build that big of a road, I don't think you can actually manage that road or oversee that road. And I think there's going to be injuries on that road that you're going to have to
rescue. I mean I mean it's I'm sure you have injuries all summer long in the parking lot. uh there's going to be people on high-speed bikes and that that's happening all the time and it's going to become a magnet for that and I think you're potentially creating as
much of a rescue situation as you're saving and you know it's on me to take care of myself and if if people go out and do stupid stuff and they will uh it's it's unfortunate and and I also wonder of the
six people who died how many of them actually would have lived if they'd gotten to the hospital. I mean, I don't think that's necessarily a statistic you can look at, but there's got to be some personal responsibility here. And I think that, and I appreciate
that you want to make it as safe as you can. I'm just not clear that in net this makes the situation any safer because I think you potentially create more problems with bicycle accidents, with collisions on that road if you start drawing a lot of traffic to the area.
Um, and so those are my concerns. >> Thank you, Jeff. >> Close it to the >> quick. The chair is going to cut off my microphone. >> Um, as you can see, this has been a very contentious topic, very contentious issue to Westport. Obviously, they feel
like they've lost local control. I know it's a state reservation. It's a DCR reservation, but losing local control and seeing what was happening. If I was sitting on that side of the table and you guys came and said, "Let's do 16 ft wide, same width as what Bridge Street is, come in with a remediation plan, not
fencing." I mean, people walk there for nature. They don't want to feel like they were in a prison walking down walking down the walkway. If you came with a remediation plan, 16 ft, dune grass, put some more of the bushes back in, I think it satisfies everyone's what
everyone needs. And I think that that's if I was sitting on that table, that's what I would have recommended. And it was unfortunate that you guys came with the same exact plan because of how it started. So, you know, I appreciate you guys going back maybe to the drawing board and coming up with a better
option, but I think that that's the option if you came back with that everyone could probably accept even in this room and at this table is remediation. Bring it back to nature, put 16 ft, same width as a public road that accesses it, everyone be happy. So thank you.
>> Thank you. >> All right. What kind of how long continuation would you like? >> Closed to the public, Mr. Chairman. >> Okay. Public comments over. What how long when you want your continuation till >> one month? >> Yeah. One month, Mr. Chairman. >> So what is the uh what's our next what's that meeting at?
>> The next meeting is the 28th of April, Mr. Chairman. We have a big gap. >> Okay. So what's the Yeah, he wants a month. So what's what's the middle meeting in May? >> Uh 28th. It would be the >> 21st. Do do you want at the end of it >> be the 12th? Right. >> You want the end of April or the middle
of May? >> 26th. >> Middle of May would be better. >> Middle of May. >> All right. >> The last one in May, Mr. Chairman. I'm thinking it's the 26th, but I don't know if I'm fine. >> I think that would be uh >> That's fine. >> That's fine. >> All right. So, we're going to we're going to call the >> September anyway.
>> We're going to uh we're going to continue this second meeting in in May, which we believe is the 26th, but it will be on the agenda as a continuence, but it will be the second meeting. We only probably usually have two. Yeah. And I will I will let the applicants know of the exact date. >> Okay.
We have a motion. >> Motion to continue the second meeting in May. >> Oh, motion to continue second meeting. >> Thank you. Do you have a second? Second. That was second from Kevin. >> Okay. >> All in favor? Oppos? All right. That's unanimous. Thank you. >> Thank you. Good night. >> Good night, John.
>> Thank you guys. >> Does not prevent from the motion. Need a motion to have a second.