being uh 6:30 March 26 I'm going to start the zoning board of appeals meeting with the Pledge of Allegiance Pledge of Alle flaged States indice in accordance with Mass General Law chapter 38 section 20f this meeting
is being recorded uh the first hearing tonight is zero Adamsville Road administrative appeal of Saro deleno applicant and Delano Daily Grind incorporate owner from the ceas assist order dated December 30th 2024 by
the zoning enforcement officer application for special permit purum to article 14 zoning and Bol law section 2.6 to place a temporary food trailer Food Service trailer and a variance from article 14 zoning bolaw section 5.1
table of use regulations subject property is located at zero Adamsville Road Westport Mass and shown assessor map 7920 L 21 uh and the way that we are going to uh voting members on the voting members
um Janice day is uh will is uh will not be here because of a uh for ethics reasons so the voting members will be those you see here jeru coutino myself Roger manard Ray Elias uh Cynthia Kazo and George
stellus okay um normally what I do is is I have the applicant come up this way no one gets confused and present whatever information is um is pertinent uh the board then asked questions to the applicant and and then after the board
finishes that the uh I open it up to the public I don't believe there's anybody here from the petitioner is that correct you're all okay because I we did receive this from um Gregory Ester
Brooks uh this office uh of represents the owners of assessors mlot uh map 79 Lot 21 to Land's Daily Grind the client we are writing to inform you that after due consideration we will not be attending the public hearing scheduled
tonight on the appeal of the Season dis order dated uh December 30th 2024 we submit that this appeal is Moot and as a matter of law the season disorder has been superseded in a in full by a subsequent decision from the zoning
officer issued March 14 2025 to determining the use is permissible thus no Vote or action from the zoning board tonight has any legal effect on the rights of my client in addition to to the decision my client also received unanimous approval from
the planning board on on its application for a minor site plan on March 25th 2025 therefore my client has the required status and approvals under the zoning ball has to operate as a temporary Traer as defined by the zoning officer and no relief is required from this board in
some the decision of March 14 2025 supersedes at the ceas and assist order of December 30 2024 and there was nothing in front of the board to act on the board does not have jurisdiction to take any action respectively whether the was the appeal is withdrawn granted or
dismissed is irrelevant and any adverse action tonight or attempt to enforce the ceas dis order uh my client will result in litigation so uh there is not going to be any discussion with the petitioner because they will not be here what I am going to do though is I am going to read
some of the background on this so we all know what's going on so um it's essentially started with get my paperwork here a letter from the zoning enforcement officer Ralph
Souza on December 30th in which he said Dear Mr deleno after a recent site visit to the property known as zero adenville Road Lot 21 cessors map lot 79 it was noticed you have parked a food service trailer on the property with a full
metered electric service where the trailer is plugged in as per the Westport zoning bylaw table of use regulations this use of the the property for Food Service trailer is not allowed you may appeal the determination as Allowed by Master on law 48 so that's
what prompted the uh the petition in the first place what um the the attorney was talking about was a response then from from R Randy bassette who was acting building inspector during Ralph
Ral and and and Randy are both here uh during his medical leave so I will read that because that sort of has bearing on on the uh uh the Cee and assist again uh Dear Mr es Brooks this letter confirms
our meeting conversations and correspondence over the past few weeks it concerns the use of a food service tril on the property located Lot 21 M assessors map 79 otherwise known as zero adenville Road in Westport based upon the
information provided to me in research I have done is my determination that the food service trail that qualifies as an accessory use that the business is defined per section three definitions additionally temporary trailer use falls under Section 5.1 of the Westbard zoning
bylaws is allowed by special permit from the planning board uh and It quotes accessory use a use or building customarily incidental and and subordinate to the principal use or building and allocated on the same lot which US pral use or building in
buildings restricted to resident use the office of a professional man customary family occupations and workshops not conducted for compensation shall be deemed accessory uses there is no definition for temporary trailer in the zoning bylaws therefore I look for similar laws in Mass law under the
Massachusetts Department of Public Health regulations a mobile food establishment is a food service operation permitted under the retail food code that is operated from a movable motor driven or propelled vehicle portable structure or watercraft that is able to change location the term
temporary trailer encompasses a food truck is defined by the department of health because both facilities focus on the movability of structure it is temporary in the sense that is mobile not permanently fixed to the land and is capable of changing location while I
have deem the use permissibly you should proceed with any required approvals by the planning department and any other Reed agencies this determination May obviate your need for appealing a prior determination by the building department and the use that was impermissible so uh
there is the a conflicting view of of our bylaw um we have talked to our attorney Blake since uh based on this letter that we have received them from the petitioner
we um we are going to continue with the hearing because we either have to reject it approve it we have to make a motion on this because it because it is before the board we can't just ignore it we do
have to uh go to go forward with this so what I'm going to do is we're going to first talk about since it's really good that we have both Randy and and Ralph here we're going to go through why or why not uh this is an allowed use uh we
we will discuss that first uh then after that we will discuss other aspects of this the variance and in a special permit as required uh once we get done talking that then I'll open it up to the public you can to for for your
comment so um having said that now Ralph and you started off with a letter that said that it's it's not allowed use you want to you want to sort ofest further before that I I went out on surgery for for January 8th in this
office January 7th the attorney his clients uh Jim hotnet myself and the Board of Health agent were here meeia and they agreed to go through this process for of appeals they were all separate they were
agreed next day I was all done I was in Mass General in Boston when I came out that's when heard everything changed MH going back the way I looked at it was the the main POS question is where the grismill
is that's the the M the Home Port the lot across the street not different lot numbers same map but different lot numbers it's a lot Standalone lot it's in a residential Cal District it's not in a business district they're
creating a business regardless the trail I don't believe the trailer would move in and out I believe the trailer would stay there Perman because it was it was told to me that it was going to be the former operator of the bond restaurant that closed that was going to operate it and
that's where he was going to operat his do business cuz somebody bought the bond and they're doing something else in the restaurant in little in the little comp side so he was going to stay there and they they figured I guess put it put it as a trail on startop with they actually
put power over to it put power over it yeah they powered the the lot didn't have power on it was a vacant lot right from 2015 it shows up on um MTH search of as being starting
to be a lot and in about 2017 2018 it gets improved by gravel they improve it with gravel that's already about the time the new owners took over the property so in my view I don't think that the Tre is
protected um just for the uh for the general public the um are zoning bylaws have What's called the use table uh the use table is defined by by District whether you're in the business uh District or the residential and in that there is a
there's a list of the allowed uses for for each of those Districts The Preamble to that table says that if it is not specifically allowed then it's not allowed so uh I think that's that's part
of what of what Ralph was saying is that since he couldn't find it in the use table as an allowed use then since it's not specifically allowed uh according to our our current bylaw then it is not allowed but Randy
I'd like to hear your side of this sure so uh based on the information I received I was going by that parking lot has is used as a business use because it's been it's been 10 years minimum right that it's been used as a parking
lot for the um restaurant across the street so the food truck is an accessory use to the parking lot which is already business I understand that it's not Zone business however it's been used as such for such a long time that that's where I'm coming from with my determination on
that so the parking lot is accessory to the business you're kind of grandfathering it in is that say yes because of the amount of time it's been 10 years that's been used as a parking lot okay but even even even such where in the table of use does it say that
they're allowed to have uh a so that's where I they said it falls under the temporary trailer use under the Sorting bylaw at 5.1 in the Westport because there since there's no definition there's no definition so it's not specific right so we so that's the best place I could slott it
under as as per the definition and comparing it to the accessory use the definition that you have of temporary trailer so we're trying to squeeze something into no I'm just like this is how I interpreted it and it's like it's totally up to you guys whatever you want to do that was my interpretation based on the all the meetings that I had with
them um and that's this is the decision I came up with and during this 10-year period in 2017 this was segmented into one particular law which took away from that uh your thought process right there during that time I'm Sor it's it's a
single LW now in a residential area agricultural residential area in the beginning prior to that if they hadn't excluded Noone no was made it a separate law across the street it's because that's what you're thinking right right
and prior to that I would say yeah that's your your uh I would agree with what he just said but in 2017 they made out a separate law which is has to go by the same set of regulations as any anywhere else in town
in an agricultural and business district you lose your grandfather once you're separated what's that you lose the grandfather you lose the grandfather up to that point so why do you lose the grandfather because because you're not changing you so why would you lose it you're not you're rezoning oh yes it
was it was changed the zoning never changed no not the zoning he said zoning the lot changed the lot changed yeah but the use didn't change so you don't lose grandfathering if the use doesn't change it has to be for period of two years or more where you lose the grandfathering
status like I said that was just by interpretation you guys do whatever you want I understand I'm not here to argue I'm just telling you where I'm coming from you know what I mean right yeah uh I'd like to ask a different question regarding the 10year uh for a couple of reasons did you see physical
evidence that that coffee shop was operating uh when when did it start the coffee shop start operating yeah I'm not familiar with that so why would you think it was there for because because when they this is what I got from the um owners right when they bought it they
were using that already as part of their overflow parking or CU there's not a lot of off street parking over there I'm I'm talking about when did the coffee shop start yeah but they the you so they didn't if it's whatever whatever business was in there before they were already using that so even when the
coffee shop comes in they're still using that lot there's no no change of use because it's still still the same there's difference between them using it and illegal non-conforming use but as the time goes on it becomes pre-existing non-conforming and it doesn't have to
conform to the now you mentioned the 10e uh that's because Ralph went back to 2015 where he saw it okay yeah uh now we have asked Our Town attorney about that 10year thing and uh what he has told us
we don't have it in writing but what he has told us is that 10 years does not relate to use it relates to structures so in other words after 10 years if somebody's using it uh you can't have
them tear the house down or move it because it's too close to the line statute limitations anything like that what's that please statute limitations yes uh and um but he said it does not uh um um relate to use at all uh it could
be 20 years or 30 years if it's not the right use uh you you can you can do something about it that's fine I I disagree with that but that's where that's I'm just telling you where I came from with my letter he's told us yeah that's totally fine he's up entitled his opinion as well so uh I I don't think
that there was ever any legal um use never came before us uh at the zoning board for a change of use uh the tell you how silly it is uh the uh
the most recent um legal non-conforming use where they came through zono was back in like 1927 uh and they were allowed to
sell uh vegetables and fruits on the the buildings on the other side the same side as the the the the coffeee shop is uh and I found no record that doesn't mean they're not there or whatever but there
was no records but when when there's a a change of use uh for legal legal non-conforming use they are supposed to come before the zoning board for a finding that whatever they're wanting to
do is not substantially more detrimental to the neighborhood the other thing is I would ask you if did you review any prior hearings that related to either the lot we're talking about
across the street or since they are admittedly using that as what they consider an accessory to the coffee shop did you review any prior hearings before this board for the coffee shop or for
the for those properties at all no they asked me for determination on that property and that's that's what I gave them because they uh there are four or five hearings that have been held on
that property and uh uh there were restrictions put in there there were concerns expressed about the safety of of uh that road the lack of parking all of that that was all discussed at prior
hearings before this board and those are all on the record uh so uh so these all kind of relate uh because they're relating it to the coffee shop um the property that we're talking about was uh
at one time long ago um used as a lantern shop I guess they sold and repair dead lanterns uh but that uh non-conforming use uh has long
expired so uh so I'm trying to find out what the justification is for us to find that any kind of business use would be uh legal in the sense of either non-conforming or just as a
variance to uh start out new with with a business use U anyway I'll leave it at that for the moment any else from the board got comments on the um assist I guess I got a question um for procedurally is it
procedurally correct for a zoning enforcement department to reig on decease and assist while an active appeal is pending on that season deist this we've never had been through
this before and and I understand the situation I've been doing it it's this was a case where I made my determination yes it was agreed upon to come to this board and they filed the appeal and then all of a sudden there was a sidebar done
um that yes for right or for wrong perhaps made the original one moot but I don't think it was because the appeal was still pending right it didn't they didn't withdraw the appeal they still haven't withdrawn the appeal correct so uh uh
what what what our job is to deter is to uh there are three sections of this so ask asking for administrative appeal a variance and a special permit and we're going to have to essentially act on those three
separate U uh parts of the petition during during the meeting that Ralph discussed or said with right in this in this yeah the Town Administrator states that the food truck for the Daily Grind is located on a newly residential Zone
pel created a few years ago as a non-buildable lot and need a variance to operate a business in a residential district that's that's what his comment was if you and I still say that that's a
new law it's in a residential agricultural district and if we allowed this even even if we just made this a special a special one what are we opening up throughout
the community for the same kind of thing to happen I I can make my property a parking lot and charge money for it and you know I if I live NE next to the beach where there's always a parking problem what would stop me from putting a little sign out and having parking and and having
people pay for that I mean I think that would be stopped and I think having a parking lot and on a residential lot needs a permit well the parking lot was being used as a parking lot prior to the separation of the law yes right but but once you got separated it LO it lost
that it lost once you didn't change the use but not necessarily us it as a business no but it's an accessories used to the business that's why the parking lot was there you could park there and you could go to the business but it was also used for people that park by the water watch oh yeah and they're not
they're not looking to take that away so you know but it's still parking lot and when Mr Gil when Mr Gil redid that area he he was trying to make it so that it was kind of like original and and so forth try to get people access to the pond right and he wanted yeah people to
enjoy it uh as a recreational area and so forth uh uh we have that in writing from a prior lawyer uh that that was what his intent was uh and um uh do you
know the date that these folks bought this property I don't have that to my head no I don't it's only been a few years that's what I'm saying like it's only been like two or three it's been only about or three years not more than 10 no as he was in no no no I'm just
saying based on Ralph's statement that it's been used as a parking lot for 10 years in 22 2022 okay is when the daily bought it no that's when they bought it but it was used prior to that as a parking lot well
I said it's just my opinion you guys you make up your own mind I'm not here to argue the points no but now it's leading to much more okay and uh well led to the applicant not showing up tonight which I find highly disrespectful considering
that there's all these people in support of this business and the business didn't even have the courtesy to show up today no I I I would like to just inser it at some point here um we have a lot of people here we have Pages pages of
people who are supporting this thing okay and that's wonderful and some of us person personally I also want to support it but this board has to go by what the rules are what the law is otherwise why
have them uh if if we don't uh adhere to them uh so I just want to be clear that we on this board are not running a popularity contest uh for either ourselves or a business oh you like that
business so let's support it I don't like that business won't support it we have to go by what we find in the evidence written what's in the bylaws and so forth and as was mentioned earlier our bylaws work in such a way
that if it's not specifically addressed in in the bylaws it's not allowed if you want it to be allowed then you go through the process of of uh getting the bylaws adjusted so that it meets what
you you want it to meet and you could still do that if you choose to but I just want to let you know that there's lots and lots and lots of people who are supporting this right I'm going to go through I'm going to go through some of that documentation uh the other thing that uh
that you all should understand is is exactly what is an administrative appeal an administrative appeal is in in this particular case Ralph Souza who is the zoning enforcement officer sent essentially a cease and assist letter to the
petitioner saying that you violate the zoning uh the petitioner doesn't agree with that petitioner says no I don't think I violated zoning so so uh Mr zoning enforcement officer we think you're wrong and that's what the administrative appeal is they are
appealing they are essentially saying that we that they do not believe that that the zoning enforcement officer correctly enforced the zoning bylaw and that's the only thing here that we in whether we vote in in
affirmative or or or negative for that part of the petition the only the only thing the only information that we can utilize to make a decision is to look and say did he correctly enforce the B law or not not whether we like it
whether we would like to go forward with the project has nothing to do with was was was the bylaw enforced correctly and and so that's the first part of this and then we'll get into the variance in the in the special permit later uh but I I I
I I sort of wanted to get that out this is a black and white either either we enforced it correctly or we didn't enforce it correctly and and that's what we'll talk about in a minute I do want to read just one uh from uh from Sarah deleno of uh da
really Ryan uh she has a lot of back information there's literally H hundred of people that said they really you know they really for this uh there we did get a couple of emails saying that they were against it um but the asked you like I said we have a petition of literally
hundreds of names I am going to read this it sort of gives a little background on on uh on what the uh what this uh uh project is all about who is that again the owner of the property Sarah Delo Sarah was that part the that
was part of our original yes part of exhibit a I'm familiar with that so I'm going to read this uh because it just gives a little background the co-op food trailer has been positioned in an area that was previously cleared set as far back from the road as possible without disturbing the natural environment the
Old Stone Wall remains intact and previously dilapidated gate has been rebuilt to enhance the site's appearance no new driveways or entrances have been created and the old one Remains the Same Size throughout the season we maintain The Lawns and The Gardens of our
property weekly mowing manually collecting following debris ensuring that trails and walkways are free of potential hazards we do not use uh herbicides pesticides or fertilizers and we maintain a complete natural space we continually enhance the green space with
Native flora and pollinator friendly flowers and shrubs to ensure the most peaceful use of the space we decided to apply for a permit to run electric wires underground to run the food trailer there is no noise pollution no propane gas and no obstructed views permitting
the food trail that to operate for several hours each morning should not negatively impact the flow of traffic in the neighborhood quite conversely by utilizing the limited number of available parking spaces for a longer period we would be decreasing the number of people in and out of the Lots seating
in the area also allows pedrons to eat and drink while remaining stationary which decreases the likelihood of distracted driving moreover allowing the food trailer to operate would encourage customers to spend more time in the parking lot allowing them to explore the
passive Recreation Area and learn about their surroundings they would observe local Wildlife thriving in the pond such as otter Turtles frogs trout blue herand ostes white eits geese Etc ET visitors will learn about the fish ladder that
rises through the dam and observe the the Fisheries impact on the ecosystem they will also notice that the pond is used by the fire departments of Westport and neighboring towns to combat local fire as indicated by the special attachment for fire hoses along the road they will
observe they will observe stone walls and the plantings as well as learn about the natural path of the water from the pond as it flows towards the coast of this beautiful town as patrons walk back to the cars they'll notice the expanse of land on the curve of Adamsville and
the Curiosity about the Westport Land Trust May grow potentially leading to increased donations in Greater public interest the general use of the lot will not change for many years this primary purpose has been parking and that will continue it will remain the space and
equipment to ensure that patrons and public alike can enjoy a clean natural environment s l out uh grave daily BL so I wanted to read that because sort of gives a little background on this particular project I'm certainly not going to read you know 30 pages of of uh
people uh petition to uh either approve or disapprove uh but it it it is all on public record um the other aspect of this um Ralph um
they're also asking for a variance and a special permit and the variance I is for is for use use variance the use variance now if if we were
to um reject a petition on the on the appeal meaning that we agree with with with your initial determination are those is the variance and special permit still uh valid or or would they be
treated separately they' be treated SE okay so even if we dis disagree with their with their Appeal on the uh the administrative appeal uh
we could still go past and either Grant or reject the special perm the uh the U the variance because the variance is a change of use variance okay uh any other would we need the
petitioner here for the variant yeah no oh no we I wouldn't say so no they don't want to come they don't have and and that alone would mean that we unless we found something in this paperwork that compl with the hardship
requirement the topography Etc uh if it's not in here we couldn't pass it a variance uh so what they described is that there they want to use variance the lot is unique unbuildable and not
suitable for residential use because adjacent um whatever uh Pond oh Pond uh little enforcement results in substantial hardship requires use by owner who also owns grad's uh uh
existing non-conforming business for parking Recreation and extension of commercial use it's consistent with the condition of the neighborhood one of the things that is required for a variance is a a hardship but the hardship has to
be based on uh the the some aspect of the land like um there's a Ledge that you can't build on or a stream running through the middle of it or whatever uh they sort of hint at I
assume that their hardship would be based mostly on I mean I I have a hard time saying that the adjacent Pond is is really hardship but uh that would be the only thing that I could even
um there's nothing in there in in their description that describes what the hardship is other than enforcing reinforcement of our regulation caused them a substantial hardship well that's well just bear in mind what was said uh
earlier when when they divided that law it was clearly stated it's a non-buildable law non buildable lot correct right um then there's Mr chairman do you want to uh continue
talking about the variance at this point or do you want to take the first half of the thing um I suppose what I'd like to sort of is is get the cease and assist order out of the way that's why I'm asking and and then so that we can continue with
that uh is is anybody in the any the audience want to discuss the cease and assist order not the okay because that's like I said that's a yes or no that's a how do you interpret the bylaw yes go ahead name and address when you come
up David O'Brien 374 Cornell Road um i m m Ralph I'm yeah not remembering your last name soua soua um one of you had asked how often a ceas and assist had ever been done in town is that a common
occurrence for this sort of situation well well ceent assist order is quite common quite common for a variety of reasons so this isn't unique okay but coming from that position to a a person who might be an applicant it's not
uncommon to just say stop what you're doing correct okay what's uncommon is the fact that it was after the appeal was filed that it was reversed by the
acting zoning enforce enforcement like Ralph would if Ralph had still been in and not been on medical leave I would severely doubt that anything that they brought to his attention would have reversed his decision he would have waited for us to to rule on it and he
would have as he is tonight would have come and would if he thought his decision might have been an error he would say so at that meeting but he would let us he would let us decide and that's was asking I don't because I'm
relatively still new to the zoning board only a few years and I was asking Jerry if at any different time has this happened before and I I speak that it does happen quite often anytime anytime anywhere anytime there's a new I mean here Westport anytime there's a new commissioner in right everybody hits them with the same stuff there's a
different yes interpretation different interpretation so that's why that happened yes so it is Comm but as it relates to the appeal there there was in fact a memorandum issued to the property owner to say you can proceed is that correct there would yes and with that
memorandum to proceed that person the individual the couple who own the Grace's Daily Grind spent money invested in developing their business and no no it was already there it's a timing issue
okay it's a timing issue just want to talking about three days ago okay and this may be later in your three bullets that you have to deal with but this is not a popularity contest and I I admire you all for taking on what what I assume is a volunteer position so thank
you as a new person to this community thank you for what you do I guess my basic question would be well it's not a popularity contest do the communities in town and do we as Citizens and voters in this town are we
Pro business do we want to expand businesses I think that matters and to the extent that there's an opportunity to expand an existing business I think we should be all for that I I get that there are rules and there are there are procedures and steps and process and that sort of thing but the
timing issue strikes me just since I've been here as there's got to be a way to fix this and if changes owning law and if part of what we're doing is to try and let this one business expand and make a variance for this one
and I hear you on well if you do this for this when we going to have to do it for everybody change the zoning law after this but there's a VAR opportunity to be had here and I hope you take it no there no there's a difference here we will get to the variance part of this because that will be a change of views the Seas this is part of this is
straightforward either we either we we agree that that Ralph correctly administered the by law or he didn't yes or no that's that's so that that has you know that's not a a business sensitive that's that's just did we interpret the
rule correctly right so the other aspects of this are a little different if Rand I I don't know your last name I'm sorry if bass Basset if Randy Basset issued a memorandum and Ralph was on medical leave and isn't that the indication to
the property owner and the business owner to proceed yes and then about two days later it was uh Ralph sent out another email saying that no I still believe that this that this is that this is not IL legal use right so that's going to be decided in and on top that
plan got approved at the planning board last night right they can't approve four to nothing correct they can't approve the use okay but that got approved minor site plan change for nothing we both Jerry and I attended that right right okay thank
you any other comment on the cease and assist no I I generally agree with with having the business there I'm a bu I I work 48 years next door at the supermarket so I'm Pro business and this food truck
thing is going to be around it's it's it's in local communities approved on a regular basis if we were across the line artment this would be okay I'm I'm just assuming if we were in New Bedford and Westport yeah they they talked about
this at the planning board last night they do it at the vineyard yeah at the Westport Vineyard they have the it's a farm that's allowed that's an allowed use it's under it's under agricultur exemp that that's a specifically allowed
use but I guess my point is lot right it's residential but it's non it's it's residential non-buildable right surrounded by businesses yes roughly yes that were all
there pre-existing they all there like Jer said using it for parking excuse me Mr Guild was yes but and he also has a stipulation that it's supposed to still be run as a Mill and it's not right in the par everybody
feelings heard about that that's the real issue we have no everybody's feel okay we really can't we don't have any feelings about that we have feelings about our bylaws dialoging back and forth if you have something to say we have to go to the mic and we're dealing with the ceas and assist at this moment
right get to the other P after right but um I really can't close the hearing Jerry no until we get all three of these discussed I wouldn't want to close the hearing myself I don't depending on what we hear I don't
see any reason to close the hearing tonight because I we're we're closing it tonight well you can close it tonight but I think there's nothing we've got some definitions that need to be I said depends on what we yeah he tonight okay so we're going to move on and discuss
the have somebody that want oh just I just I'm Steven Bates I live in dmouth but I shop at Le and I go to the Daily Grind I'm just curious that when uh the interim director issued
aort rebuttal yes that when Ralph sent an email does that negate his opinion it it depends on how you look at it oh that was not above my not an official letter they they both sent official letters and that's really what what um what the
lawyers actually go as interim he has full Authority yes and then the email while he was still on leave is an opinion yeah he was he was back from Le back the email on duty on duty okay okay
all right what about the fact that a trailer excuse me would you speak at the mic please absolutely Matt Santos Main Street what about the fact that he's assuming that the trailer is not town please Westport well that man just from Dartmouth so I can't
assume okay take it easy please I think you should take it easy all right you're all everybody no you're all assuming we're going to vote some way and you're actually getting very hostile to us which is actually in my opinion making me want to vote the way you don't want okay let's sounds very professional calm
down go ahead part of what Ralph said was he assumed that this trailer wasn't going to move anymore as part of his decision who is he even to assume that the the trailer on Wheels isn't going to move anymore I'm we're talking about cease and assist
order cease assist order yes so Ral Ralph go ahead there was there was an expensive elaborate service put on the property for that trailer wasn't going to move who approved that again speak at the mic please who approve the electrical
service permit to be put on the property the electrician pulled the perit through my office and he got it he shouldn't have got it and then but endar or what you know went and put the new poll in and then ran the service and
that was an expense I think of several thousand doll okay okay we can discuss the um the variance as by um and once again the only information we have is what was handwritten on the um
application and the use variants so I'm used variance mean that that it started off at something and we're varying it to something else uh because we
are yeah okay are we still on Seas this no no unless you got something else you want to um what what I would say is uh that Ralph uh reviewed bylaws and by the way
there are building there are U Town bylaws that affect uh uh food trailers okay but there are no zoning bylaws that affect uh so Ralph reviewed the zoning things as a zoning enforcement officer
and he did not find anything that said that could operate and F so uh from that point of view I say that he did the right thing right and we'll come to a vote on that after we get done with because we can't vote on these things separately we can't vote until I close
the hearing for Jerry I know it I mean I'd love to vote on these things all separately and close the hearing separately but they really uh technically we can't do that we have to uh we actually have to hear the all aspects of it and but we vote on
each aspect of this separately Roger yes just so I understand it you granted the electrical permit the offic electrician license electricians commit P permit one of the secretaries
writes the permit out for so we're all online now this has been back when we WR permits out so the permit got written out by the time I found out about it was already in place already in the ground so that that was service was already in the ground so that was that's when the
trailer showed up and the trailer got plugged into the but if you're if if if your office not you but your office approved the electrical then if if I was him I would
think that I had would the next step there's been other incidents that involved that property come through my office that you had to stop in the past okay this is in the first up I'm sure that every electrical permit
plumbing permit or whatever that um is applied for in the building department they do not research uh the zoning bylaws to see whether that particular property would
uh pass muster or not they there's no way they could do that um we've had that happen on occasion in the past where um we had some units all had to come before this
board conditions were placed people go to the building department uh from that complex a life to put a uh let say a toilet on the second floor uh
and they don't know unless they had to research every piece of property coming in for a permit they'd have to research it and see what the zoning board did it come before was owning Bo and so forth u i
um I've been trying to get for years where we'd have a town system that showed uh each property if it came before this board so that it would be at least a heads up so that they would look
further but in this case it wouldn't matter because this particular lot has never come before this board but the other ones have across the street that they're using as as a an accessory connection to do it and as far as the
parking uh on there when Mr Gil had it uh his idea was so people could go there recreationally and Park and watch the water and watch the animals and so forth I don't think it was necessarily for the
Gris Mill or the uh Daily Grind Coffee shop but it was a parking lot it was parking okay so the only thing I want to speak on that electrical permit uh anybody can put electrical permit they can put a pedestal wherever they want whatever they do with it after that is irrelevant right they follow the correct
procedure they filed for billing permit to get for electric permit I apologize they got their permit and they did what they said they were going to do with all applicable inspections there's absolutely no problem with that electrical permit being issued I just want to clarify that okay thank you Mr
chairman yes David O'Brien 374 Cornell wrote again um as part of that permit permit being issued was it then inspected by the town well the Electoral inspectors it was yes okay so they issued
it didn't agree that it should be be issued then it was inspected and approved so like I said anybody can pull electric pedestal on your property we don't know what you're going to do with it it's up to you do with it after that but it's inspected after it's installed
it get the trench gets inspected there inspect yeah so all all the electric permit does is it'll it it makes sure that you complied with all the the the the codes for electrical for electrical right that's all they care about y they
don't care about what you use it for okay so they play it's not a zoning issue but they played by the rules for the permitting for the electrical with the understanding based on what I understand that they were going to try to put something over there like a
trailer they weren't lighting a parking lot no so they were putting a trailer in because my understanding as they told the town they were doing this they didn't they didn't pop the trailer out of thin air did they was that not understood there's
nothing in the record to say that they didn't okay they just asked for they asked for lighting and again that was with the building there the electric department so there's three there's the building department and Ralph is the building inspector yeah then there's the
electric depart under that there is the electrical inspector and the plumbing inspector different individuals okay Ralph as the building dep the building inspector he also wears a second hat which is the zoning Enforcement office officer and
that was wearing that hat is when he issued the cease and desist okay thank you and they certainly did not know uh that the uh not only that they were going to put a trailer but there was going to be running a business there is a
difference they already have the business extension of the business that's what they are contending for the interim director was an extension of the business that's what they're saying not me but I here I have already asked tonight about the length
of time and there there is a question about that because you can't just start a business run it for a couple of years and then oh I got a legal non-conforming business not true that's why I use the
term legal nonconforming we have a lot a fair amount of that in this town hey um my name is Nicole Wardell I've been a resident of Adamsville 29 Main Street for 30 years I'm a patron of The
Daily Grind every day um I also went there when Mary Misa R ran it um I think that that property is Zone commercial correct no residential no so I used to
do farmers markets there is that one of the issues that they had beforehand of doing over there or was it other things what do you mean by that well someone had said that there was issues with other what did you run there you
said you ran i h they had farmers markets at different points and I am basically seven driveways down from The Daily Grind and I sell culinary herbs on the side of the road where was the F Mar it was in the parking lot this lot the
parking lot there were horse rides there were um right before yes before yes and um just I think it's a brand new
Airstream it's not it looks quaint it doesn't look like you know someone pulled it off of the side of Sanford road with mildew all over it you know it's is the issue is is that it seemed like Mary and her husband Mr Simmons
could do whatever they pleased there and this seems that Sarah and Bruce are getting nothing but people trying to block everything they're doing to increase their business as small business young owners and for me having
a stand there if they don't have like we don't even basically have a bre breakfast restaurant the only thing in Little Compton is Common's lunch and that's for sale we lost G store we lost Simmons store we lost you
know the barn everything so to make breakfast sandwiches in a little trailer that basically the whole neighborhood has no problem with whether it's on Rhode Island side or Massachusetts side but there's nothing to draw people to
town anymore you know you know what I mean it's like a ghost town aren't they redoing the uh the other one tearing it down they they redid it and now they're tearing it down cuz the woman had bought all the property up to the post office but that has nothing to do with this and
she also it has to do with you said there isn't anything more yes there's nothing basically so they're not going to redo that where uh they redid it but now they're supposed to rip it down yeah used to make the ice cream
yes yes yes there were but the issue here now is that is that property is now zoned as residential and they want to run a business on on residential property so that's where we get into conflict because when you look at the use table it doesn't
it's there's nothing in there that says you can do that so this was at one point commercial residential no no no no never was never was but the thing of it was you could run a farmers market there and so and unless someone complains
complains right uh we're never going to hear about it but once somebody complains or brings a thing like this uh that's when it has to come but yes your your farman Market probably would have had to come before this board but I it
it it didn't so because they just asked me to do it and I'm sure was a day permit so you were violating the law well I didn't know cuz you know I live in the country and I thought it was you could sell on the side of the road what you grow or cook in your own house I
grow culinary herbs and I sell them on the side of the road you can do right you can do that as a farm stand on your and remember now Farms have quite a different set of P see the thing is it's like it used to be the Old tabber Mill which was my family from Westport and
the manchesters and I'm a Wardell so the thing is and it's not by marriage I'm a true Wardell and the thing is is that there used to be you know Penny Candy here shopping here this here and it's
like I don't see how they could get a smaller like Airstream to like not be visible over there like who are they really hurting can I ask this question to to everybody here you're here all in support that's great great to support
our own businesses but don't you find it a little odd that the people whose businesses here are not here no no they still need a variance but I Me Maybe laer well you know all the all the workers are here
yeah of course but I'm but I'm saying is that in addition to the there's as as the chairman has says there's three issues on the plate tonight was Ralph ceas and assist legal or not two regardless if it's legal or not
they're still asking for a variance which they're still going to need because it's in a commercial it's it's in a residential zone so at minimum they should have been here for the variance in the special permit and minim talking about that happened prior to all this is prior to them subdividing that lot that
lot being subdivided causes it to be separate from everything else going on see I mean I I was under this understanding since a long time ago that basically everyone on Main Street to f e Bron's was commercial residential our
house is commerci commercial residential well we don't actually have commercial residential it's either commercial or it's residential yes you can't be both okay so um when you're commercial you can have residences but if you're a resident you can't have commercial yes
well if if most of you have probably been a bit of speed at one time that's nonr that's that's not in the residential that's not in a business room they have to come here for this they which is similar to what we're talking about but the thing is not in the business Zone they have to come here for alcohol they have to come here for
food they have to come here for come here to even establish a restaurant okay but like say the other say the other half of the building that you guys aren't letting them use to let people go in and enjoy their coffee
I've seen this space with pictures there's you know a window along the whole back wall with stools that look out over the back like how come they can't have people sit in there and drink their coffee that's not us that's not zoning that's probably uh the building
office or perhaps the health department they've been told that they it came here fting use of that area would be more detrimental they refuse to do it well I mean the thing is I'm sure there's a
reason that Bruce and Sarah aren't here because they are stand hand up people and they would show up to a meeting I mean they must have had someone tell them maybe it was better off that just the people that signed the petition came we can't guess why they're not here
no no but I didn't ask you to guess I just just wanted to State the point that it's unusual for that not to happen this is unusual let's keep moving here yes okay thank you anybody else could I address your I didn't really open it up
par by we oh I just want to say I said earlier about changing you try to get the rules changed well I want to let you know something for last couple of years I've been discussing with the planning board they're the ones who originate most of these
bylaws and we've been talking about uh trying to do uh get some what what we're calling Village zoning uh in this town um the head the uh intersection of uh
southwestport which is the where the gas station is Hicks bridge and and so forth Adamsville and so forth the The Villages what used to be Villages and get special Zoning for them for them to put uh
little things like you're talking about a small coffee shop or even a gas station if it's necessary uh and we've been talking about this we talked about about it again last night after the meeting just just informally talking about it but they've got so much on
their plate over there and they've only recently gotten a planner and an assistant planner uh so what I'm going to suggest is that all of you go to the planning board and talk that up and say
that's an area that would be perfect for this and and you you could get what you're looking for can I ask another question for those who are Westport residents here who goes to the the annual town meeting not that many that that's where
that's that's where this CH this that is where we can change things that's what happen you got to go to the planning board first to start the war arle but yes that's where it really I said originally that we had um three aspects of this um I'm going to jump ahead very
quickly to the special permit part of this because I think we can resolve this very quickly it is a special permit for a temporary trailer which is allowed by and I'll give you the code y slpa PB all right what that means is yes
it's allowed you need a special permit from the planning board it shouldn't even come in front of us because we are not authorized to uh to act on a special permit for the temporary trailer use
so but I also say that part of it is not really under our jurisdiction this is not a temporary uh they're asking I know they're asking for AAL perm for a temporary trailer when they met with you they tied that to the temporary trailer
byon it's the only byon that even comes close and it's not very close but this is not meant to be a temporary anything well temporary means it's movable not permanent yeah right so the trailer temporary it is movable so yeah we can argue that one if you want that that's
how it is but that means that it can be moved but it's also going to be moved out uh I'll give you a quick example our B Our Town bylaw not the zoning Our Town bylaw has one place in there where they're allow from one day to uh 14 14
days within a 30-day period they're notay based on the planning board's decision wouldn't it I'm sorry put that stipulation on there because it's a special perent through them as far as number of days Etc no no I'm talking about uh a regular Town
bylaw which also is enforcable right but that okay yeah not as a zoning no yeah okay name and address and thank you Valerie Basset 592 Adamsville Road and I think my wife Paul and I are the closest
abuts to this property um we're right on the corner of quail track um I think there's so many layers of what's going on here but I wanted to Echo both what Miss Wardell said and Mr coutinho um for the issue that it's sort of surreal to be talking about this as a
residential neighborhood because apparently all the commercial businesses there must be grandfathered in and you know rooting going back to the 1600s and the you know the mill the Saw Mill the ice plant you know Bakery grocery store
you know Market General Store uh the lamp store so we're in a kind of very artificially constructed situation so I understand your constraints I do think probably the root is to get Village zoning because the the you know the
garage the garage is you know if anything more of a public nuisance than anything we're talking about here um but it's not a zoning issue it's grandfa exactly so it's a kind of surreal contradiction between what is you know what is grandfathered and then what is
facing the current restricted zoning part of the appeal of living in Adamsville is all that you can walk to you know these businesses um as well as the natural beauty um so I mean I certainly hope that the committee will take that into
into advisement in this consideration even with comment as you work within the restrictions of the regulations but I certainly think it comes to town meeting and the planning board um and I would certainly say and I'm sure there are some others who would Echo
that um the laws don't match the situation here the zoning doesn't match the real situation of the character of the neighborhood um and that seems to be a structural flaw with this decision-making process um because it is a quasi commercial neighborhood and
always has been from when Brighton was a blacksmith to now it being a garage um so I think that's a bit of frustration for everybody um I think the other thing to keep in mind I've heard some things about the use of the parking lot in the
lot the you know when when Mr Guild was alive in renting this to Mary Misa to to start gr's Daily Grind he certainly knew about that being used as a parking lot and there was a sign at that time you know parking for Grace Daily Grind um so
just to take a little of the onus off the current owners that that there was precedent even when Mr Guild was alive um for that usage um and I think that the property was probably separated at his death when it was sold so again it wasn't some sort of Mal inent of of you
know Bruce and Sarah but um you know I don't know the details but but it's sort of a bit of a again however that evolved it doesn't seem to accurately match the actual use even at that moment in time
of that lot um so I wanted to just note that uh kind of cognitive dissonance and structural flaw in trying to make these decisions and have this conversation and reiterate reiterate the value of um potential
Village zoning and if there's any way to factor that in that reality into this conversation I think that would be valuable to to most of the neighbors who who support this thank you yeah just just as a comment to that I mean officially this land is is identified as
residential I I understand that I understand that that whole area is commercial but we have to go by what it's zoned as I understand your constraints but there might be that's the that we're in yeah yeah it's that's why I'm saying it's a structural flaw in
the regulations and the in the reality uh Nicole Wardell 29 Main Street so if this is a residential property so if someone pulls in a Winnebago from Sanford Road and has mold all over it you rather see something like that sitting there than what's sitting there
already well that happens all over town yes but this is Adamsville it's historic sorry it happens all over town now I can't segregate Adamsville from from North Westport from any other part of the town they would need to get a permit to to house the trailer there for any length of time uh you can have your own
trail the town bylaw the town has two bylaws one is Town bylaws yeah it has no it has a lot of B but it has two bers on trailers one is for temporary trailers uh from summertime you know may to
November and then there's uh uh another one from um seasonal yeah and then there's emergency somebody's house burns down and they need put a it's not legal to have a mobile home
unlike little comp for example yeah and we can't have mobile homes in Westport but if your house burned down uh and you needed to put one in you go to the selectman and get a special per for for a period of time 6 months or a year uh
and uh and you could put your trailer so there's different types of but we but at the same time we keep bringing it up that Jerry does we need to change the bylaw there is no bylaw for food trucks or this kind of deal right here right we
I I researched everything this morning took my entire morning away from my cars and everything else but so I if everyone here is saying that we're in front of the wrong board right now or we're not we're not in front of the right people to make the decision isn't there no
you're in front of the right board but you just well except for the special permit part of this and that person wouldn't have been able to come here no no no the special permit is a planning board uh um uh task not a uh not a they can issue the perimeter but they can't
issue it on the use right right we're the only ones that can isue that's where that's where the variance comes in they want to change the use they did go there to the planning board last night and they got approved for the site plan for the site plan right for the site plan which is what it says in
the zoning board that's all it says in the Z right but uh some of us don't believe that that's the right uh um part of the bylaw to that bylaw doesn't uh affect this is is uh the
contention that was made yeah well I agree with the last speaker too that maybe it's best if it goes into a a certain Village um zoning because I mean just to sell breakfast breakfast sandwiches out
of a little tiny Airstream is it doesn't seem like that big of a deal I understand that there's laws and the planning board have has to agree with everything and I understand all of this but the the thing is is that business
there brings people in for other businesses like myself and um I just I feel like every time Sarah and Bruce have tried to move forward with stuff there they're constantly put like with
the wall up you know that's what it seems like from the outside looking in I I wouldn't have any idea what you're talking about they've never been before us before before us never before here no no issues that we're aware of on any of that so I don't think anybody's
intention trying put blocks in front of them all right thank you anyone else okay so we're still discussing the use variants um essentially
uh from the use being to to to allow the a food TR use rather than a parking lot uh one of the issues that's going to be uh is identifying a hardship other
than um it creates let me see how do they put it uh in U literal enforcement of the bylaw results in substantial hardship what that means I suppose is hardship to the business uh and that's not really what
bylaws are based on our bylaws are based on hardship based on the land itself we we recently approved a a variant at the 177
for the a for protection well no there was a that was an act I me I'm just saying can can't we use the pond for for this well that's um you could think about I mean that's the only thing that they mention in here that would be related to the land but
they didn't argue that they didn't argue that they haven't brought it up so like we're not to do their jobs for them by giving them yeah we're not putting words in their right um any other comments from that lot no no it's not David O'Brien 374 Cornell Road so
remedy before you tonight in this one instance is the variance right we can talk about the village zoning later on and get to town meeting to Cynthia's Point uh and show up and get the government we vote for right so the one
way to remedy their situation in Adamsville on that parking lot is you taking an affirmative vote for the variance is that correct I'm not really sure how what what what you want to by me again you're voting on three you potentially could
vote on three things tonight you're saying the planning board does the special permit so that's off put that one aside that's out of your purview the ceas and dis desist is still alive yes and the variance is also still alive use variance and you as a board can vote in
this one instance to solve this issue tonight okay affirmative or negative yes yes you can you can vote on this tonight yes and and then they can go on their merry way if you were to vote in the affirmative for the variance correct they would then have to go back to the
planning board to get the special permit yes that correct yes and if they were to do that even though but then we would still run in if we uh if we disagreed with the cease and assist aspect of this y then they still would
be into ceent assist order okay so does even if we approve the variant so that that makes it makes it a little more complicated right okay so an affirmative vote on the variance and you deciding that the cease
and assist is no longer operative would be as a proponent or the coffee shop and the ability to have the Airstream and sell sandwiches that would be the cleanest way for for me as a as a as a proponent for grce that would be the best result
tonight yes okay yes I would like to uh uh clarify something also and that is that uh the U the part of the bylaw which I believe that Randy uh was using was temporary
trailer is that correct yep yeah okay uh I said qualifies as an accessory use to the yeah right but it it was was only in the table of use that's the only place you
found it correct all right what I want to clarify is that we didn't always have a table of use in the in there it was always the bylaw itself as voted word for word at
town meeting that's what the bylaw was quite a number of years ago 20 years ago maybe uh a couple of our secretaries in town they were always getting questions about was was this where to find this so forth in the bylaws so they
decided that they were going to do this table of use thing and I was a part of that uh in terms of clarifying things and clarifying bylaws and so forth so I do remember it and but the concern that
we had was that people were going to use the table of use which is very abbreviated it just just things like temporary trailer okay so at along with that um table of use is a wording um the
chairman uh indicated earlier some of that wording but the rest of that wording was that in the event of any question or definition the um narrative version of the bylaw which was the
original stuff um supersedes anything in the table of use and that's where I personally have an issue with this one where it just says table of use uh temporary trailer
and someplace there has to be the actual vote of town meeting and that is what I want to see uh before I do it and I've done a lot of research hours of this week trying trying to find some of that
fortunately some of it now is searchable on on the computer but some is not um and and I I'm sure that that town meeting would not have approved a bylaw
that just says temporary trailer uh unless they somehow skipped over it or something there there would normally be a definition of of temporary trailer we don't even have that so I'm not
convinced that that is an accurate depiction of our bylaw that that table of use but I can't say that until we've had more time to review what year what
town meeting passed that if in fact it did because I don't believe it ever got passed that way uh we're not that sloppy typically with with our bylaws and so I don't feel that that's something that's
I'm going to base a whole um uh reversal of a of a business Zone uh a business use on something like that and let until I've had the opportunity to uh determine
that it was only very recently that Randy made that determination uh so we're trying to find the you tell you can tell Jerry's been been been on this year for a long time when he can tell you 20 and 30 years ago
this happened yeah I think it's a little separable right I think in one respect but I think I think the two we need to separate the two right is a trailer allowed on the property by our zoning bylaws I think it is by the the letter of our bylaws I I know you want to know
the history but then there's the issue of it's not just a trailer it's it's a food truck it's not it's not it's it's it's not a trailer to live in in residential districts it's a business it's a business about that at all so I think we can separate the two that they
can keep trailer there but they can't run a business out of it but anyway that's uh any other comments before uh any comments from the board then I'll entertain a motion to close the hearing ladies you have
something on sorry name and address yep Cindy zembo 587a River Road um again I I want to Echo thanks for your volunteer work I've been a volunteer in various things it's thankless it's your time I appreciate it um what I
just I sit and listen to all of this and I guess I just think how does a young person starting out in business there's no pathway I mean I I
don't know the Delano well at all and it's not their only business so let's not it's not their only business they're not a small family just starting a business they have a very successful Landscaping Company you're going to hold that no this but no I'm not holding it I am not holding I am not holding it against them
I'm saying I don't want to use it as an excuse of you're you're saying please be so kind to this young family who's just trying to start a business that's not the stop ma'am I'm gonna stop I I'm I'm not here to fight only one at a time please the landscaping business has
nothing to do with this but anybody who is starting a business does so in the business district if you are running a business in a residential district then have by rules they bought coffee shop they bought an existing coffee shop and we're
letting them run the coffee shop not they now want to do something in a residential district and if you want to run a business in a residential I wasn't we can't argue with the fact the fact is they want to run a business business in a residential district I'm
not you're not even letting me finish what I was going to say but I think I won't because there's too much animosity and I'm not here to I want I want to hear it I want to hear it please okay she tried talking the lady on the right won't let hey I'm Sarah Henry 2000 lady
on the Rights Voting I'm talking please yes I just want to say they already had a business they had a business Bruce Delano owns Delano Landscaping Sarah assists we know that I'm just saying I don't want to use the excuse come on I'm just trying to I work
at gy Daily Grind um I have been there since Mary was working there and yes it was a great coffee shop it was it was a fine quaint little business when the delos bought it they upgraded it they brought more people in they brought their their Community they brought
people from New Bedford from Fair Haven from Dartmouth they brought people into Westport got business Simmons shut down the barn shut down what did they do they put a food truck connecting to their business it's connected to gry's it's connected to gry's Daily Grind it's the
coupe with gry's Daily Grind they made that because the barn was shut down they made it for the community and they they got an electrical they got a permit they got multiple permits they didn't necessarily get the okay but they assumed oh we got the electrical permit
we got the electrician stuff in the ground whatever they moved forward they were excited the community that were present they were excited and that's like it's just so frustrating because I saw you in the shop you were so rude you
were so rude to all of us you were I promise I promise you were believe me he was and it was terrible like he was just Mr has a very difficult job but the he walked in it was the first time I ever saw this man the first time he had ever
walked in the building and he just like anger and it was just like this is not how you welcome a new business owner it was very rude and I had been there with Mary and he was never there it was just like this whole thing animosity from the start um so I just wanted to like say that um
there are issues there have been issues but I don't know like cut them some slack they TR they're trying their best it's for the community truly any comments ask of course U what year did you start working there in that
coffee shop 2021 2020 20 okay so something like that more than 10 years ago okay no when Mary msco was was um running it uh Mr Guild was alive still um his family visited they gifted the Delano a plant signifying that they were
open to the new opportunities so I do I do uh in counter to what you're saying uh I would expect that they are an attorney should have looked at uh the background of the zoning
and Zoning hearings that previously taken place and so forth and maybe that might have def definitely but like I think they really just the barn closed and they were like we got to do something so they did it they got the the
permits Henry I'm sorry Henry h e n r y first name Sarah thank you any other questions no thank you anyone else
okay no I guess not okay I'll entertain a motion to close the hearing I'll make a motion to close the hearing we have a second second any discussion all favor say I I I I'll oppose I you you oppose you can say no yes I'm oppose because I
what I said earlier I I really I need time to research some of this for me to be satisfied that we're dealing with the right thing here okay so we have four votes in in affirmative one in the negative so we are closing now the closing hearing just means we're going
to discuss it we don't take any any in information from from the public so we'll start off with the um uh season assist before we before we go there oh by the way um um in order in order to in
both of these situations in the administrative appeal and in the variance it requires uh four votes to uh in the affirmative did legal weigh in what Jerry mentioned legal in in the beginning did legal weigh in on this
through you no they only weighed in saying that we that uh that we can hold the hearing without the petitioner that's the only thing you that's that's all we talked about discussion on cease and
assist okay I'll start you can start okay um what did you say I couldn't me to start I'm letting the chairman start I've read we've been through the uh the use table several times and we've used it in a couple of
of other different petitions and uh uh I have to agree with with Ralph I don't see anything in there that says that we can run a food truck on residential property it's I have to I
have to agree that Ralph interpretation is correct I agree in part I I agree with you that I think Ralph's interpretation was that we can run a that is not in our zoning of bylaws to run a food a food service trailer and I agree in part with
our assistant our interim building inspector that says that a trailer not a food trailer is is an ex that's where the special perit comes in yeah yes but right now we're just talking about The Season's assist for the food truck
on residential property and I guess said might trailer food trailer so just to clarify for the the public if we vote that Ralph was correct and they cannot operate a food service trailer does not
mean that they are forever banned from operating Food Service trailer it means that what they need to do before they can reopen the trailer is to get the variant from us and then the special permit from the planning board so by us
voting in favor of or agreeing with ra Ralph's initial um cease and assist letter doesn't mean we're saying to all of you that this build this this business cannot exist we're just saying that the business owners need to get
other approval from the town before they can move forward any other I I want to say that I think whenever we discuss this I think we we should be saying food truck and True Food trailer
because in some places they're calling a trailer but it also says here the African also seeks to operate a food truck on the lot so I want to make territory or else they want to put a truck no you can't do we got to go
through all this again yeah I want to deal with that and I also agree by the way that Ralph did read it properly okay any other discussion okay um this is one of the
situations where things sound a little bit negative the uh the petition is essentially to overrule the uh uh the cease and assist order so if if we vote in the
affirmative we are agre agreeing with the petitioner that Ralph interpreted it incorrectly so if we reject the uh the uh petition for an administrative appeal
then we are saying that no we agree with with the uh original ceas this order I just want to make sure we understand because sometimes it's a little bit negative um what I what I generally try and do and it's uh under the the
advisement of our lawyer is we always tend to vote in the affirmative first because it's less confusing our bylaw says I need four votes to approve it doesn't say how many votes I need to reject and it it it sort
of sounds obvious but legally it's not so uh anyway the discussion before uh before we take again if I make I'm going to make a motion to uh to Grant Grant the petition on the administrative
appeal saying that that Ralph was incorrect now that doesn't that's not a vote that's a motion everybody understand that okay do I have a second for the motion I'll second it okay the discussion before we
discuss again remember the the motion and and vote are two separate things so so let be clear the uh in the affirmative we are saying that Ralph
um did the wrong thing right I need I need four people to put their hands up and in in the affirmative saying that that Ralph was wrong so if you don't put your hand up to to uh on the motion then
then you're against that so showy hands for those who want to Grant the petition for the ceas assist all those who want to reject it raise your hand it's unanimous okay so that's
that's pretty obvious so the cist order stays in effect as far as the zoning board of appeals is concerned second part of this is the use which is a little bit more complicated you um matter of fact I'm going to skip though take get this out of the way and I want to make and I want to make a a vote from
the from the board to say that the that the special permit for the trailer Allowed by special permanent planning board is not a zoning board issue it's a planning board issue and we and we shouldn't be acting on it here because we don't have authority to do
that do every and I want to make a I want I'm going to make a vote to not act upon the special permit aspect of this because it's not within our jurisdiction to do so do I have a second I'll second
discussion all in favor say I I I Jerry no I'm going to abstain you're going to abstain that's okay so there's four votes that only required a a majority because it's not a it's not a voting on a petition it's voting on a motion so we
are not going to act upon the special perit because again that's a planning under our bylaws that's a planning board uh requirement not a zoning board and if we were to act upon it we would be acting out of uh out of our bounds so I'd like to explain why I had goe
because as I said earlier I have not had the opportunity the time to research that because this is assuming that I agree that that's the bylaw and and I don't because I I just think it's too sloppy and we can't continue this here
well we can okay um variance discussion on the variance I don't think they've met their burden to show a subanal heart ship um so on his face I would say I don't think we should vote for the variance however
I think um I don't know if we can do this legally is that we if we deny the variance but without pre Prejudice so they can come back and reapply for the variant next week if they want to because if we deny the varians tonight
they can't come back to us for two years right I don't think we can do that can we do I'd like to give the the I was like to give the based upon the the the support of the owners of
The Daily Grind and that I'd like to give the Ben the owners a benefit of the doubt of why they weren't here and perhaps they got uh bad advice from Council yes I uh again I don't know if we can do that I don't think we can do
that we either have to Grant or reject we can't put we can put conditions on it uh whenever we Grant something you can always put conditions on granting something uh rejecting is just rejecting you don't re reject with conditions but we if we reject they can't come back in for two years if we reject them they
can't come back for two years and uh unless they go to court and I feel slightly differently for a different reason they had every opportunity to be here tonight talk about this to go back and forth and so forth and they chose through through
their attorney's uh uh recommendation to that they feel that it's all set the way it is the planning board thing is okay even though last night the B planning board made it very clear that their approval of a site plan was not a a
green light for them to go ahead am I correct right yeah yes they said they could approved the site plan but they they couldn't approved the use yeah I mean and the attorney doesn't speak to the variance that was applied they only speak to the
Seas order so again I just think they got bad advice for not being here it's very unusual for us not to have an applic in especially in advant it's never happened in my in my 10 years
first time yeah and we've had a lot of attorneys in front of us yeah they usually respect the fact that we're here that they come even if they don't think they have to come by the way I'm mention that in the lawyer letter which we just got at quarter or
four today okay uh about coming here and not coming here uh and there was no mention whatsoever of Ralph's latest uh letter I don't believe they have it I went to the planning board this morning and was under the impression that that
that they didn't have ral's do we have what again I can remember your Randy we what Randy wrote yeah can I see that it's attached to the attorney's letter okay Mr chair
can I just say Yes um when Ralph issued it wasn't a letter it was an email just reiterating his sist it was sent to Michael burus yesterday no no no Michael City had it I'm talking about their attorney having it no didn't go else there's no way of knowing that didn't go
to them you're tell they found out last night at planning board well that would be Michael said that he didn't believe that the attorney had it even at the meeting last night when they were discussing it that looked like he was like wow I don't know anything about that
yeah there's a there's it's what gets me is in the Randy didn't say he they could operate the temporary trailer that is he he is just stating that or now you say it's sext for use right so you did two things you said it
uh that the temporary trailer is allowed on the resid just start and you believe you believe that the it's an accessory used to the parking lot which is part of the business which is a lot that's how I
came to that conclusion okay yeah okay based on what I just heard which I did not know uh about the thing I I would go along with your argument that uh maybe we should give them the opportunity come back we can't we can't if we
can we either we this is either unless we can we can't even continue it because they're not here and we can't continue it because we closed the hearing yeah can we reopen we can but I don't know what good
that would do with the attorney with the attorney saying that they they believe that the you know we have no authority to do anything why why can't
we make the decision uh without prejudice I don't know what because um if we deny something we can deny it with prejudice so I think with or without prej prejudice I think we can do with
prejudice so they can't come back I'm asking the question I again I don't know we usually deny what president with but but I think we can deny without prejudice right what does that mean that they can they can come back then come
back tomorrow yeah but that on can they don't you're not sure so okay that's what I'm want just I mean the worst case scenario yeah right is
that we deny it without Prejudice and we're wrong that we couldn't do that and then we just denied it and they have to go to court right but who's going to argue
that unless you know we get a we get advice of councel that we did something incorrect they're not going to argue that we did it incorrectly because it still gives them the chance to come back come back yeah right so like if we do something wrong it only ends it basically does what
we're probably I mean I don't know I'm not going to speak for your but I I I don't think the fact that they're next to a pond is AEP subanal hardship as Jerry was I think saying earlier and I think Ry was saying earlier there's lots of reasons why there's a substantial
hardship here but we're not going to make that argument for them because we shouldn't um but I would like to give them the opportunity to come and make those arguments we don't usually do a denial uh with with or without prejudice
we we usually Reserve that for withdrawals withdraw without prejudice and with the idea that they've indicated to us they're going to come back and so we're letting them come back sooner but what
happens in probably 90% of the cases we never see them again they just go and do what they wanted to do anyway yes but if we can withdraw without FR this I'm not sure that we why we can't deny I don't know we've never done
that's I mean I like the uh I like the concept I really would I mean I you know we've got a lot of people here that um the door on things it just keeps things moving and then potentially but we don't know if we can do that well but
we don't do then we just basically what if we what if we say yes slap my hand and you know but what happens to them then they're come back for two more years right so why do we take that chance why don't we just go all right you get the variant no because we don't
we haven't they hav't proven they haven't proven that there's a substantial hardship we still may deny it right but there I have we don't I personally don't have enough information what they have pres what they have presented on the record does not in my
opinion meet a substantial hardship right however given the tremendous Community Support I would like to give the applicants an opportunity to voice that Mr chair yes right I just want to
advise the board to proceed with caution on this because if they're attorney and they were not aware of Ralph's email right and this is the only thing they're going by they were aware there's a video okay then this is what they're going by and could be the reason why they're not here right so I would just exercise
caution with whatever decision you guys make because I don't know if legally they were notified of Ralph's email so I just want to throw that out there okay I'm not sure how relevant that is I just just all I just want to say something that uh I believe that well they were
there at the planning board meeting last night yeah they were there yeah yeah yeah they know they know that that happened the next half that's is a seas and assist I don't know whatever that was only he was keeping nothing to do with
the variant yeah nothing to do with the variant yeah I just advise whatever you guys do whatever you want yeah no no that's right but but but you probably weren't aware that they were there last time no I knew they were there when I say they were there I'm talking about their attorney was there with with the
uh female owner I guess the other thing they could do is reopen the hearing and have one of their employees ask for continuance yeah the only issue with that is and they come back and say we're still not coming because we don't think that we need to right that was then we come back and
then we just vote then we just vote at the next meeting I think we've gone past that point yeah it's unfortunate they're not here this was written written and delivered to us today M they knew last night that Ralph had overturned the overturn right
and in abundance of caution I would have still thred up tonight the attorney I mean because I I mean I I just the fact that they sent a letter to us at well fre it was 245 to Maria and then time we got it was that and there just
assume that it's not necessary and not at least come to at least you know hear what we had to say I mean I I I we're just happy that this
many people are here yeah we okay so if we give them the variance for this one thing thing they still have two negatives no no they still need a special permit from the planning board right so that even if we give the variance they can't operate the food
truck or foodal uh okay so no enlighten me up upon that we give it if we we uphold the cease and assist yep and we approve the variance what does that result in approve the variance of what the trail it um the change of use change of use that means you're letting them
operate right so that nullifies your season to assist right I don't think we have a choice but to deny this it does it does not say that Ralph was incorrect right just we're just simply now because you've convinced us that you have the the
hardship and and we grant that very right and so he was correct at the time that he did that I want to be clear Mr chair just for the record uh as soon as I got the letter I contacted the attorney right away I was put on hold
for about 10 minutes the girl kept coming back oh hold on hold on hold on and then I was finally told that he was in a meeting so I left my name and number and I have yet to get a phone call back so I never did get to speak with him because I was going to suggest
that he should probably come anyway which I've been telling him for the last three weeks right we've been going back and forth oh I I I said I'll see you tomorrow night on the way out of the planing Bo and she said yeah I'll see you tomorrow I I actually opened the door for let
off according to Google you can deny a a a variance without prejudice okay does anybody make me want to make a motion does that Google does it no I'm saying well it's to your favor to your to your your we're trying to do
something to their favor so we're trying to you know we want to give them the benefit of the doubt that they did not come here tonight on bad advice of councel okay variance you give the benefit of the doubt no that's that's that's another story no that's not give me we can't because then then everybody everybody else who wants a variance is going to
ask for the same thing yes make a motion I make a motion to in this in this case we're going to do Grant because you're going to put a condition on it so I mean not Grant you're going to do you got go ahead I
make you make a motion to reject with a I make a motion to reject the petition for a variance without prejudice okay so what you need to okay yeah they can either decide to come or they can decide
to sue right do we I second it uh discussion again we need um do we have to again this is a this is a reverse because we're we're we're rejecting so we're going to need four positive votes which means you know if two people vote
for this then it is it uh uh the variance fails no discussion okay U did we have a second oh I second you second it I did okay so so we vote Yes that fa again I'll uh I'm in favor of rejecting with a
with um Prejudice without prejudice so we're we're so a yes would mean that so that then they apply do we have to read this entire no because it's not even it's not even in here the variance Parts in the variance is so we we were re rejecting a variance from
article six uh zoning B law section 51 table of use regulations uh okay uh have a motion and there's a motion to reject and a second to reject uh all in
favor of rejecting raise your hand without Pres price that's four uh all opposed one it's four to one so uh the variance is rejected with prejudice which means they can reapply at any time
without prejudice without without prejudice right so it's up to them they can either repply they can either reapply to us re variants or they can then they can come back and or they can not show up why there's a hardship why this actually fits in the and take it to
court right the so it's really in their Court of what they want to do so uh that's that concludes the uh and again I say it's 20 days but there's nobody here to so there is a 20-day appeal process thank you all for showing up we really uh this is really important
to uh to hear from everybody I I still want like the opportunity if they were to come back certainly hope I have the opportunity to to uh uh deeper into
this bylaw and see what the narrative say need a VAR or they don't need VAR yeah depending on yeah clear of our don't okay um either way get discuss so
so we would get the discussion okay next order of business is meeting minutes it's February oh by the way uh Randy and and Ralph thanks you both for coming I mean it's it's you know we really couldn't have done this without you guys both of you guys today what I was muddying Andy you know
and what I was muddying it up no no it's well Z is always muddy oh yeah it's so you uh staying on help him out or nope you it on no um him and Jim want me out so I'm leav it as soon as he's back
H really yeah it's truth is that for real yeah that's for real yeah well it is what it is it is what it is thank you anyway thank you Andy I I something personal here I hope you guys know that no no my opinion like whatever
you guys want to think you know and and you know it's tough there because we put you in a situation where you know the these zoning bylaws are really difficult to read and understand and uh you know Ralph been doing it for 15 years I know that's why you've never
seen that before because you've had Ralph here forever you never seen anything return had someone else come sure Len I've seen it from W to him yeah yeah but anytime there's a new guy in here you go what what do you think what do you think it's it's got to be tough yeah because you know how can you really
do the intricacies of of every word in that zoning bylaw you know I've been doing this for 10 years and I still don't know half of it you do a better job thanks because we have an system here West you're at a you're at a
disadvantage coming in you don't have oh yeah I mean I was just going based on the facts that I have and talking you know what I mean and that was just my opinion like I said everybody yeah so that was my interpretation you guys disagree with no problem I don't take it personally it
doesn't matter thank you all right okay uh meet meeting minutes February 19th February 19 2025 uh Maria generated the meeting minutes and they've all been reviewed and and edited and I make a motion to
approve the February 19th 2025 meeting minutes so I have a second I'll second there all in favor say I I I I'll oppose no that's unanimous same with February 26 2025 Maria generated these
uh meeting minutes this was uh I won't vote on either one because that so anyway uh 19th February 19th this is the 26th uh can vot uh so uh I make a motion to approve the meeting minutes for 20 February 26
2025 second all in favor say I I oppose no that's approved any other any other business there's nothing on the agenda that's I I did look um I did April 9th a April 9th which is week after
next um I did get a copy of I talked to Paula this past week and got a copy of the um uh the articles that are going on the next town vote for for zoning to make sure that in fact it represented what the um what the
Committees had done and the uh the select board had to actually include their own because they're responsible for the general by law uh we gave them a write up that they that they used so uh there will be three issues on the uh on
the ballot in U for the town meeting one of them is um actually two of them are shortterm rentals one of them is a zoning bylaw aspect of it and the other is a general bylaw aspect of short-term rentals and the third is um accessory
apartments and complying with complying with state and federal St loss did they have an open meeting again after for this short-term rental the they what did they have an open meeting once the went once the select board was okay with it did they ever have an the board ever have an open meeting yes they did H
missed that yes oh yeah I went to it missed it it did so uh any other I have a question yep someone asked remember I have very bad hearing uh someone asked uh uh the
assistant here if he's staying on yeah I did he said no but but then everybody laughed what because Ralph and Ralph and Jim don't want him here can we Ralph and Jim what doesn't want him oh is that what he
actually okay wow I thought he needed an assistant let's talk about this after we close the hearing yeah oh I make a motion to close the meeting I I make Jour the meeting I second
that's it all in favor I I