Recording in progress. Okay. Welcome to the August 3rd, 2026 meeting the Armouth Board of Health. First up is attendance to see if we have a quorum. Larry, would you be here? >> Here.
>> Hillard's here. Mary >> present. >> Okay, we declare a quorum. That's great. Um, this is the time we usually have public comment if there is someone who wants to address the board on a subject other than the property on 88 and 100 mil lane.
>> I don't see any hands up on Zoom. >> Okay. Nothing on Okay, great. All right. Um let's move on to number three which is 88 and 100 mil lane license
applications that's plural and we have a board deliberation possible vote this evening and the board has really allowed it's over four hours of time for um the applicant to to speak up uh the
experts lawyers neighbors and so we're going to skip the public comment for tonight. I think people have had the opportunity to speak up which I I personally think it's is essential uh that people can express their views, opinions and so on.
One thing is I think it's very helpful. I had asked the town council uh to join us tonight to guide us through uh this process. And so we have Jay Talerman tonight, I think, zoomed in.
>> Yes. >> Jay, are you with us? >> I am. >> Welcome. All right. >> Glad to be here. >> Okay. >> Sorry. I have a point of order just for the board now that council's on the >> very briefly.
>> What are we starting with? Because as I said, there's no public comment tonight. >> Making any public comment. The gentleman who is appearing on >> Okay. If you're going to speak, you need to go to the mic. The public needs to hear what you have to say. Sir >> very very quickly. The gentleman who is
appearing on Zoom. Um, it it's it's I don't I didn't keep track as to whether or not he was present for each of the two prior public hearings. If he was, we're all set. If he was not, um, before he votes, there needs to be a
certification that he has reviewed the proceedings of the prior public hearing. So, I'm just raising that now before you get started. >> He's not voting. >> He's not going to vote. >> Who Who are you referring to? >> Oh, I'm sorry. I thought you had a member on on Zoom. No, >> no, that's the town council.
>> Excuse me. I thought I thought you identified a member in your quorum who was on Zoom. No, if I'm an error, >> I'll see you right there. >> No problem. Wait. Okay. >> Um, so Jay, maybe you could start this off. I think it would be helpful for the
board for sure. This has gone on quite some time and maybe we keep this organized and we can all learn from from you. >> Sure. I'm I'm happy to do it and um I'm kind of parachuting into this but uh at least in the public sense but I've been
kept apprised of this matter for quite some time a few weeks anyway and as I understand it there is an application before you uh for u a license a stable license um related matters
u by a new proprietor of the farm that has been in exist existence for some time. And one of the issues that has arisen is the treatment of the variances that were previously granted
by um previous versions of the board going back quite some time and there's been a contention as to whether or not those variances are still applicable or not applicable and there's been a lot of writing about that and I've had an opportunity to look at that question. I
think an important place to start here is that no one has applied for new variances or to amend the variances. My understanding is that the applicant has applied for the uses that they are trying to do but has not
suggested in any way, shape or form that they are applying for something different. In fact, there's no application and no notice of any application to the public with respect to variances at all. It is certainly true in your stable regulations
that uh that a new applicant on a transfer of a property or a new applicant period is required to address at the time of getting their uh license here or their um their approval from you how they're
going to deal with variances that may exist or may in the future exist. It doesn't require strictly in your regulations that they um have to justify the
existence of those the existing variances that may or may not apply to their property. They just have to address the question along the way to getting their own license to operate their farm. It's been my view and I've
seen a lot written as to whether or not the variances run with the land or don't run with the land. I don't think in the common sense the way we think of zoning permits or v you know variances issued under zoning that they run with the land in that manner. But I also don't think
that every time there there's a transfer of a property those variances are automatically wiped out. nor is there anything in your regulations that says that's the case. All that matters is that the applicant describes their use sufficiently so as to understand whether
or not um and how their um activities will uh continue on or will be with respect to the variances that have previously been given. I think the board of health has a fair bit of juris um discretion in that regard to say whether
or not a use fits in with a particular variance. Here I don't think there's anything before you in terms of a modification of a variance. I suppose the board of health could impose conditions with respect to the the uses of the variance um that exists now.
You're not required to I in my opinion you can proceed with the variances kind of forming the basis the foundation the baseline condition on this property if you so desire and consider those variances
as as existing when you're considering the uses proposed by this particular applicant. So in other words, I don't think that this has to be a a wide-ranging debate as to whether or not the variances should be granted or not. In fact, I don't think you have
jurisdiction tonight as to whether or not to grant variances or not because they haven't been applied for. But I do think you can consider and I do think you should require the applicant's um ability to manage their use within
the constraints of the variance previously given and that is a requirement that they at least talk about their use visav these variances so that you understand whether or not they fit or don't fit with um in with respect to the relief that's been granted by
previous versions of your forward. So, I I hope that's clear and I'm happy to answer any of the board's questions on my uh thinking with respect to that. >> Mary, Larry. So, the the application does not the
application does not directly address that issue. something. >> They haven't applied for variances, >> right? No, I'm talking about the light the uh license
application. Nothing that we have received has addressed that specifically. There's been no language that says >> in acknowledging the existing variances, we intend to address them or honor them
or um keep them in this manner. They they are required under section 2024 of your regulations to address how variances will be addressed and what steps will be taken for compliance of
the intent of the regulations. That's their their requirement. I don't know because I wasn't at the last hearing on this or the last meeting on this. I think it's would be important to hear from them or at least to understand
implicitly how their application as presented to you works with respect to the variance. It's possible that only thing that has to be addressed or at least considered is hey they're complying with the requirements of those variants is they're not doing any new
buildings or any new structures or any new activities closer than is already allowed. It might be peruncter in other word in other words doesn't require much discussion at all because they're not looking to amend or treat their um
activities in any way more rigorously or extensively than has been done in the past. So I leave it to the board on how they answer the question as to whether or not this use fits in with those existing variances. But if they're not
asking for anything in addition uh in terms of activities in the areas where they received a variance then it again could be a fairly straightforward and uh kind of almost again peruncter discussion. >> Thank you.
As far as I know, the only changes to property were actually ones that were required, I guess, by conservation and the DP. Otherwise, I'm not aware of any other changes, Jay, on the property. >> That that's, you know, if the board
feels that just based upon what they're seeing in the application that it's going to be consistent and compatible with the variances granted, then you could consider the issue to be addressed adequately. Certainly just by virtue of reviewing their site plan, it could be
implicit that they are managing the property consistent with prior users that have enjoyed the benefit of those variances. >> Larry, any thoughts? >> So the question I have, >> Larry, if you get closer to the microphone, please. >> Yeah. The question I have is that uh are
the variances in existence now? Does that comply with what you're requesting? >> So, yeah, >> that was a yes from the audience, the applicant. >> Yeah.
>> So, that's a positive response you're pointing. Yes. That's fine. Okay. >> Okay. So, that's that's the big question I had. >> Okay. Um certainly we have they're really two
licenses. Is that correct area? They're being applied for. >> Yes sir. One for the goats, one for the stable and one for the goats, one for the the donkeys. So 30 and and two, which is a total of 32, which meets all the requirements for the land size, the
amount of animals. So that's a maximum number of animals they can have. >> And what is that number now? >> 32. >> 32, >> right? >> And then the issue of course is is breeding then is one thing this board needs to discuss
tonight. >> Uh that I it's probably new for the property as far as I know. Have you come across anything Mary that about breeding or not? I haven't Larry. Okay. >> I the only thing I can comment on is
that you know it as I understand it there were the thought was that the applicants were going to breed three or four goats per year. Is that correct? Yeah. So that basically would present a
minimal impact on the on the uh uh any any uh nitrate contamination to the to this uh project. >> Okay. >> And the applicant did say that she would probably be trying to home some of them.
They they would not remain on the property. >> Yeah. Now in the case where they wanted to expand that would that require them to come back to us for approval
if how would that work? Well, as Jay, in other words, if right now in the application, it's there's a maximum number of animals. Um, does the applicant need a variance in order to be breeding? In other words,
increase the number of animals on the same uh acreage. I >> mean, technically speaking, if they add another animal over the max, then they would be in the position of needing a variance. It does not appear that they need it today, >> right?
>> But they could potentially need it tomorrow unless when they add a new goat or something else then they subtract an animal um in some way. So I think maybe to work with this because it is certainly potentially foreseeable that
because of a good breeding year they may end up in excess of the maximum that your regulations prescribe. Then you just add a bullet point or a note in there that should the number of animals exceed the maximum, the applicant will
be required to apply for and receive a a a variance. or maybe state first that this is the maximum and any exceedence of the maximum will require um a variance from the the board. Right now the variance isn't needed. So we can't
predict the future. >> Sure. >> What that will look like. Um but I think they understand and in my speaking with some of their representatives uh earlier today, they appear to understand that uh limitation.
Thanks for reaching out to them, Jay. >> Well, how would you like to proceed with this, Larry? Mary, what would you what do you think is in order here to move forward? Obviously, we we've put a lot of effort into it. Um, it's not a new subject. We
were aware of it. It first got presented with conservation I think September maybe of last year. So it's not new to us but certainly the last couple months it's it's really been very active in uh issue in the health department
>> and it has passed a lot of scrutiny the um the whole issue. So what is before us is simply the continuation of the variances and the stable license for the animals in the stable.
>> Yeah. So we've all visited the site. >> Yes. >> Um and one thing I did notice that there was some a question about contamination to uh uh the mill pond also contamination possibly to the wetlands.
Um, a couple of comments about that. I noticed as far as the mill pond goes that that pasture slopes away from um that border. It slopes the opposite
direction. So, obviously water flows downhill. It couldn't possibly flow o beyond that u the uh pasture line on on that side of the property. As far as the um I believe it'd be the norththeast
corner where the side of the property where the fencing is and where the pastures are. There's a tremendous [snorts] um nitrogen sink there with those hedges and all that wetland
that produces a tremendous uh nitrate sink that would more than compensate for any uh if if any leakage of of uh nitrates into that wetland. basically I don't really see that happening even
getting past the those huge um hedges. So I felt fairly comfortable. I also was discussed uh by um neighbors that um the uh number of
people and dogs swimming by the bridge also. Uh I see a fair number of people and their dogs swimming at the end of Water Street. In my mind, that would be a much greater risk to nitrate loading than these goats
would present to to this uh area. >> And the D has agreed with that and said, you know, they do not see any harm. And not only that, the applicants did come up with a very sensible
uh plan to eliminate the waste uh from the from the property. So I think that >> which is one of our requirements. >> Yeah. And I think regulations that needs to be taken into consideration. >> Mary, could you bring your microphone down a little bit?
>> Sure. Thank you. I think I'm ready to act on this. Okay. >> Okay. Um I think it's important to keep in mind just about the breeding and additional variance and so on. That's that's all. So sure, let's proceed.
I move that we um approve the stable and animal license for the farm. Um and that uh we take note of the and they take note of the 32 animals that are
being permitted and if there are to be any increase in that number of animals that they will come before us and um and request a variance. >> Mary, are you okay with that? I know you
you're writing quickly. I do. >> Okay, fine. I need a second on that. >> Second that. >> Okay, any further discussion on it. Okay, see there's none. Uh let's vote. All in favor of the motion, just raise your hand, say I. >> I.
>> I. It's unanimous. Okay, that passes. >> Um congratulations. And uh you have questions, you come to us. And for everyone in the audience, be aware the board and the health department is here. It's not going
anywhere. Inspections will continue and if there are issues, we'll address them and correct them if there are errors. >> Okay. Thank you everyone. >> Thank you. That's right.
the blue shirt. >> Yeah. He's shaking. He's shaking his head. He's still shaking. Yeah. >> As if we were discussing. >> Okay. Why don't we move along here then? Uh the fourth item on the agenda is
review and approval of minutes. That's the meeting on July 20th, 2026. Anybody have any edits, corrections? >> Yes. Yes, I do. Um and I I did um discuss it with um Mary and tell her I
had it and she agreed that yes, that that would be appropriate. Um, and it's on page one under item five, the last sentence that we add it. It reads, "Right now, each year in the fall, the
pond is open for commercial shell fishing, adding the words if water testing um approves the water the water quality is good." >> Okay. So any Larry, any edits?
>> Oh, it look great to me. I I I missed that, Mary. >> Yeah. Do you second that motion? >> Second it. Yeah. >> Thank you. Okay. >> Okay. Yeah, it's really well written. Okay. Let me just vote and pass this. >> The only the only question I had about
it was the attorney that spoke did speak at length about variances. I don't know if it's an issue right now, but I didn't see that anywhere in the in the minutes. He spoke at var I think it was the last meeting where he spoke about the old
variances not being applicable to this situation. It's a moot point, but I didn't I didn't I'm not even sure of his name, but he he spoke for quite a bit a long time. Right. >> One that spoke the f the meeting before also. >> Was it? Yeah, he spoke at length about
those variances not being valid, which which was refuted by our town council, so I'm not even sure it's an issue, but I just didn't see it on the minutes. >> This is our time to decide that while we're >> has a comment >> discussing. Great. >> I I couldn't verify whether what he was
saying was like accurate or not, so I didn't include it. >> Okay. Yeah, I couldn't either. So, >> yeah, I appreciate that. There are a lot of things that were stated that were questionable u through the both those meetings. So this is discussion part of >> that's great.
>> So we just need to vote on >> we just need to to vote on passing the minutes. All in favor just say I >> I Okay, that's done. >> Great. And number five, announcements. Does anyone >> have any announcements? Yes. Barry. Oh, Mary. Great.
>> Mary, ladies first. >> Um okay. I I just came from the RACK meeting. Um and the chairman has um asked for us to consider restructuring
um looking at the mission again um submitting a memo slashreport to the select board. So, um, I'd like to know if anyone else would like to be the representation representative for the
board to the rack meeting. Um, >> hearing no, seeing no hands being raised. >> I'm sorry. Could you just reiterate what the duties are? >> Um, it's the wastewater resources advisory committee and the um
just a minute. Sorry, but I I will I will tell you um >> meets at four o'clock on Mondays. That's >> meets at four o'clock the same day that >> that mean you're retiring. >> No, it just means I want to I have to,
you know, report back and say yes, you know, they all wanted to do it instead of me or no one wanted to do it instead of me or whatever. But um the general purpose is to investigate ways to involve and educate the community on issues relating to water resource
initiatives in Yarmouth, including water supply, surface water, groundwater, storm water, and wastewater with the goal of protecting and restoring the town's fresh and saltwater bodies and its drinking water supplies. Specifically, the committee is charged with at the request of the board of
selectmen conduct public workshops, presentations, and other public information sessions for residents and businesses about Yarmouth water resource initiatives and provide the board of selectmen with citizen feedback. Upon receipt of financial plans for water
resource initiatives supported by a majority of the board of selectmen will inform the public and provide the board of selectman with citizen feedback. Meeting as necessary with any multiple member boards to effectuate its purpose at the direction of the board of
selectmen focus on specific areas of implementation or other related wastewater, groundwater, surface water and drinking water manners. As far as number three goes, meeting with other boards, the approach they've taken is to
request a representative from the other boards to actually be at the meetings. Um, and right now the focus has been on the wastewater. >> Um, and I don't know that the selectmen have asked us to address other areas
right at this moment. >> Yeah. >> Because the wastewater project is is huge. So, um, that's basically what our, uh, agenda has been since I've been on it. Anyway, >> what you the time commitment so far besides the meeting? The meeting is an
hour or so. I mean, you seem to get here pretty much on time. >> Well, I some I usually have to leave a little early. >> Okay. >> Um, but I did wait and approve to approve the minutes before I came back into here. Um, it's an hour, an hour and a half. Um, we're going to do a site
visit to the treatment plant. And actually if any of you are interested um the um the construction folks would be willing to you know set up another time but the committee is going to do it and that would probably be nine people. So
that would that would be enough for the this particular visit. Um, and then for example, the re memo that we're going to send to the select board, I'm going to spend some time giving my feedback on what it should say and what my
impressions are of the committee and what it has done. So, that's going to take some time. Um there is also always a report from the um OPM uh the project manager um that I read and look at and
there are slides from the um construction folks um all of which I I have to download from my computer because I'm not there in person. So, um, and then of course try to pass on any
information that I think might be interesting. Um, for example, they've said about the treatment facility, they're no longer going down. They're now going up. So, all of the construction now is going to be what we can see above ground, which is kind of neat. Um the other thing is that some of
the areas that have um shut down for the summer are going to be starting up again in the fall. So there will be some road closures again. Um some of the paving that's been done is what we have for now. Um because the Ravoli contract is I
think um done over with. Um, so >> yeah, in a nutshell, I'd be totally unqualified to do any of that. >> Well, my questions are not of a technical nature when I have questions.
I did ask, you know, what effect this additional discharge is going to have on the golf course and it's something that um the DPW director Yeah. because Yeah. what they the um the effluent discharge site that
was planned the the DP deemed was not or DPW rather um deemed was not sufficient to handle all of the projected sewer sewage. So they picked an alternative site which is Bry Hills Golf Course
which is already re receiving some sewage from the existing you know septic plant that they have. Um and it has been an ongoing process with D for
months and months uh and has required additional drilling and and meetings. They meet every month. Um they're hoping that the hydrogeeological report will be accepted
at at the August 18th meeting. Um and then then they can count on that and start that and the the DPD our DPD director Jeff has been meeting with the golf course committee already. Um it's this
won't even happen till 2028, but you know, they're already discussing it and and explaining it and the construction folks are talking about how they're going to minimize the effect on the golf course so it won't have to close and people will be unhappy about that. So um
>> I mean Okay. So you're also on the plastics committee. I'm on the >> sub plastics no more. That's gone. >> They don't they didn't call they're not calling one back. I thought they were going to have a follow-up meeting >> called for an evaluation. I thought so. >> Um maybe, but I haven't heard anything about it. >> Okay. Y
>> and I'm on the Yarmouth substance abuse committee. Now, if someone doesn't want to attend these, I think probably falls upon me. So, um I would go um if that's what it comes down to. So,
>> you'd like to be on the No, I'm teasing. >> Yeah. No, >> I will. No, I would. I will continue. It's okay. I will continue it >> at at some point. You don't have to. In other words, someone else, right? You know, it comes down to it's either me, Larry, or Scott right now or so. Um, if you're okay
still going, >> right? >> Um, that's fine. If >> Thanks, Mary. >> The only comment I'll make is qualifications has nothing to do with any of this. >> Okay. When I came on, I knew nothing about septic system.
>> Zero. >> Exactly. you do a great job managing the meeting. So, I think >> it's, you know, farm science applies to everything in the world. Okay. >> You're the one with the formal education. Anyway, >> any other announcements? Barry, you're up. >> Yes, we have the International Overdose
Awareness Speech Memorial coming up uh Monday, August 31st, 5:30 at Smugglers Beach. It's a very nice um presentation. They're going to have some speakers. Um the family members get up and talk a little bit about how they're doing and
how it affected them. So that's Monday, August 31st at Smuggler's Beach. Uh August, we are in Sun Safety. Um we have a very nice table right down here. Mary did a great job putting it together. Um all sorts of skin awareness you can get.
We do have some samples that was given to us from Sun Bum. They're very nice to pass out uh some samples. We got some down there. We got coloring books or coloring pages for the kids and word finds for the kids and stuff. It's so it's nice. We got some crayons and stuff
down there. It's very good. Um I guess September we have dental hygiene awareness. We have already have boxes of toothpaste and toothbrushes and we're trying to uh work with the Cape Cod Community College uh dental hygienist uh
program to see if they can come in. So, we got some good stuff going on. And we did hire a new office manager. Um, they will be starting on the 17th. She'll she'll be coming from the um
private sector retail background, but very um attentive. Um doesn't have any bad habits yet, so we can train her, right? And Mary can teach her the the the great ways of the front office. So, thank you for everything you're doing up there,
Mary. We appreciate it. >> Yes. And what is the date that the person's starting? >> The 17th >> of this month. >> Yes, ma'am. >> Oh, okay. >> That's great. >> So, will Mary continue with minutes or will this be the >> No, that's Mary's
>> Mary's. Okay. Oh, great. Makes you happy, right? >> Yeah. >> Yeah. They've been great. >> Anything else? Announcements? Anyone? >> That would bring us to number six, and it's only 20 of seven.
six. Wow. Really? Okay. >> We could stay for a while if you want. I I feel kind of bad. I >> setting records here. Um so any uh anyone want to address number six then the adjournment? >> Make a motion that we adjourn.
>> Second. >> Okay. No discussion. Thank you everyone.