to the Bob. >> Well, good evening. This is the library building committee meeting regular session for October 30th, 2025. And we're going to
start with our hybrid announcement, which is simply that this meeting is being held in person and with public access per the posting. We're going to have a roll call attendance of our members. Dorcas, could you begin?
>> Dorcas McGarin, person Janettos, uh, West Yarmouth, user representative. >> Judy Constusan, planning committee. >> Tom Hamilton, vice chair. John Reco, construction background. >> Joseph Lre, library staff.
>> Library user representative. And also with us we have David Arensson, the the director of the library >> with us. >> Our first item tonight is to go into executive session uh to vote that we
enter executive session pursuant to Massachusetts General Law Chapter 38 paragraph 281A purpose seven. The committee will vote on the minutes of the May 29, 2025 architectural interviews for the library
building project which were conducted in executive session to comply with the provisions of Mass General Law chapter 30 B paragraph six. So I need a vote that motion made please.
>> Thank you Susan and second. Was that Tom? >> Yes. >> Okay. Thank you Tom. And we need to do a roll call vote on this. Um I'll start over here. John >> accepted. >> I I
>> I >> I votes I motion passed. We're going to excuse ourselves and move to executive session. motion to private session. >> Uh public session. Yes.
>> I move that we enter in public session for this this October 30th Thank you. >> Second. Uh, now we're back in hybrid. So, we need do need to do another roll call vote. Dorcas. >> Dorcas.
>> Vote. I >> I >> I >> motion carries. Now, let's move into public comment. And I have this one item here
that I'm choosing to treat as if it were submitted to our library dropbox comments because we have those in the two libraries. And uh it was I it was addressed to me at home. It's not
signed, not dated. There's not much on it. There are um a couple of other members of the committee also received this. So, I'm just going to read it into the record. Please save our neighborhoods. In the Bass River Historic District, Don G
Sears Landscape Company is for sale, selling both its business and its land at 221 Old Main Street in South Yarmouth. The land is a 1.7 acre parcel and is the only business B1 zone parcel in a residential neighborhood with its
backyard abuing Pleasant Street neighbors. The Sears family is currently in talks with a large offkick corporation who has already purchased other landscape companies in Yarmouth and plans to bring more than a dozen dump trucks, trailers, and large pieces of machinery in and out of the yard
daily. The 1.7 acres has only one entrance on Old Main Street and will create more noise pollution and traffic hazards. This 1.7 acre parcel currently has one small antique building, which consists only of an office with no
kitchen or bathroom, no running water, and no septic system. The sheds and garages on the property are in terrible condition, are most almost unusable as they stand. Instead of an offcape big business purchasing another local
company and using it land for big business purposes, this land could be put to a better use. This would be a wonderful park for the neighborhood. There is a sidewalk in both directions and it ab butts the St. David Church back parking lot. There is plenty of
room for green space that could be used for play space for children or a larger farmers market or wedding functions in a I think it means quiet but it says quite location for local towns people. The town of Yarmouth is looking for a
new place for a new location for the library. This land is more than the South Yarmouth and West Yarmouth libraries combined. The library were to be put upon this land. The parking lot could be open to the abuing back parking lot of St. David's Church, which would
make both the 221 Old Main Street parking lot and St. David's Church parking lot more accessible. Please consider what you could do to encourage the town of the Armouth to consider purchasing this land and aid in saving our neighborhood for a better future for
our local residents. So again um it's an anonymous comment and in public comment we do not need to respond. Would it be appropriate to forward that to the deposition just as >> oh maybe just
be something more pertinent to their purposes. >> Okay. >> Okay. Great suggestion. Thank you. Uh, do we have any other public comment from external folks? >> Linda, did you want to participate at
this point? >> Sure. Um, can you hear me? >> Yes, very well. >> Okay. Um, I'm continuing to do the research uh on fundraising for the capital campaign and um I have uh
submitted some uh queries to both law firms um and I've gotten some names from lawyers clearing house. They're in the Boston area then they do um nonprofit uh legal work. And in addition to that,
I've gotten two names from local um consultants who have done fundraising uh in on Cape Cod and in addition to that in in a number of other places and different uh types of um entities and um
we've actually got um I've gotten two I've gotten responses from those two consultants. Um, one consultant is feeling that they probably they might not be able to help us, but possibly they would talk to us a second time. The
second consultant um we've actually um made an appointment to uh have a Zoom meeting and on uh the 17th of November and so we'll see where that goes. Um the um attorneys, I think there were either
four or five firms that I contacted. I've heard from two that they would be interested in talking with us. I made it a very brief um message to them initially and I'm going to wait to see if I hear from any others to see what we
want to pursue. I'd also want to bring it before the board of um the South Yamoth Library Association to see um their thought to hear their thoughts on um the um lawyers. Uh I have brought the other
the consultants before the board and we have decided on a particular that particular date to meet with the consultants. So um we're moving forward. Nothing specific. Um, no decisions have been made, but at least um, we're making
some progress. And that's about all for right now, unless you have any questions. >> All right. Anyone around the table? >> Linda, thank you so much. >> You're welcome. My pleasure.
>> That's wonderful news in progress. And I don't see any other public members up there. So, we're going to move into a minute approval. So, we have the minutes of September 25 meeting. >> And I just need a motion to accept those
minutes. >> I just have one correction. >> Okay. So, we still need the motion first. >> Okay. Motion to >> Okay. And second. >> Okay. Now, conversation on this. Yes.
Corrections. >> I was not on the vote. I was >> Oh, you were there. >> I might have been mentally not here, but >> let's see. Okay. So, that goes out. Um, and then yeah, there was a misspell of
my name and And there was a little apostrophe thing on page two. And then okay, we had some conversation. Let's see. On page three under recent capital
investment, the investment would be lost building is converted to a library. Um but remember what happened here was that then we got the correct information. So here it says that town contribution
of approximately 2.3. Uh so if we can add in there so the so the minutes are accurate for what was discussed that day. However, we
don't want to leave um an incorrect message to the public. >> But technically, >> but technically it's said that was said. What we do is we read it into the minutes tonight. You put the correction in tonight. If that's what was said that night. >> Oh, I see. >> That's what was said. And then the
correct information, we read into the minutes tonight and we reference that. we go back and reference that date and say additional information was was presented regarding the September 25th minutes >> for tonight's minutes. Okay. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Yeah. So that's that doesn't have to be
amended because that is correct. >> Yep. >> As of that night >> and I didn't want to mess with it, but I also wanted to make sure it's what we said. >> Exactly. was the knowledge that he had at that point.
>> Okay. All right. So, with with those minor corrections, um Tom moved this. Vicki seconded. Uh again, we need to do a roll call. Dorcas. >> Dorcas. Both side. Okay. Vicki. Uh
Janetto votes I >> I >> Okay, thank you all. And then we'll move into the minutes for October 7th. Thank you, Susan. Do we have a second? >> Second.
>> Thank you, John. All right. And >> one correction I have. >> Okay. I was not remote again. >> Are you sure? >> Are you sure? >> In my doage. Maybe I'm Maybe I don't know where I am.
>> You know, it reminds me when I was here. I wasn't here a couple of times, you know. It happened. >> All right. >> I think she just in her just left. >> I think she just left it the same. >> Okay. So on page two I have a bracket
around in the first paragraph to capture data needed to make an informed decision. The board asked Mr. Owens to develop a scope of work and a budget to do conditions and structural assessment of the MacArthur school. Now
that means not not this group that means the select board because this is the minutes for when we did the presentation to the select board. >> So do you want to amend this to say ask Mr. Owens
>> to present to be presented to the select board? Did Did the board ask you that night? >> The board would ask >> um >> I think it happened after we left. I well Bob reached out to me after that to get a proposal which we didn't have
because we hadn't we hadn't asked for it yet from our consultants but I and I don't remember I I don't know what the right wording should be for that because they we did talk about that with the select board and I think the understanding coming out of that was that
it would be pursued. I don't know if they specifically said provide us with a B proposal, but but my understanding coming out out of that meeting was that they were expecting us to follow this kind of two-prong approach. >> I think definitely I just um I thought
the request was after our part closed. >> I there was convers there was conversation there was conversation and I think both from the select board and us Mhm. >> about you know coming up with a a compre, you know, a budget and a
comprehensive plan. >> Yeah. >> So they could see the price that happened >> so they can make a fair comparison. >> Just doing I think one piece of the study was not going to be enough. You really need a structure. That was the conversation. >> That was the conversation. >> That was a significant piece because we
were just looking at >> what would the envir uh >> the structural >> right you said you're going to do the whole thing together. >> Right. >> Okay. The board agreed to work on double check move forward with grant requirements and do an assessment on the
retrofit of the MacArthur school. >> Um, okay. I just wasn't sure had that. Okay. So, John, >> my only comment is since it's part of board, what's the the salt board has
meeting minutes? Is there any coordination to make sure there's nothing that conflicts? Well, we we had to post because we had a form and our minutes are only from
our our part. >> But does the select board have any notes on our part? >> Yeah. >> Well, they would have their portion of the minutes for the presentation. >> Yeah. I don't think that it would be >> I don't think it's
not like it would be that no >> anything substantial. >> No, I don't think so. >> Good question. But um you know there's like no contract involved or money compensation. >> Well, there was money. That's why I'm asking
money just Okay. So, all right. So, we have the motion on the table. We've had our conversation. Anybody else have anything to say about this? Okay. Roll call vote. John. >> Hi. >> Hi. >> Hi. >> Susan.
>> Vicki. >> Hi. >> Dorcas. McG. >> Thank you. Stain. And motion carries. Thank you for passing the minutes. We got our housekeeping taken care of. Okay.
Uh, communications is on here again. We talked about this last time a little bit and uh just wanted to talk about how >> excuse me just one thing. This is where you want to enter that additional
information. This is where you >> Oh, thank you. Thank you. Oh my goodness, Susan. Great job here. All right. So, how do we do that? You're just going to make this >> as you know the chair reports that additional information will be presented
to update update. >> Okay. So subsequently it was learned that the 2.3 million was not provided by the town but rather was found was provided by Cape Cod collaborative
through funding sources that they were able to play. >> That's your favorite. Thank you. Thank you. Good. All right. Communications. We're continuing to try to make this
effective with all the players that we have and all the work that we need to do. And uh just want to express real appreciation for everyone who has
stepped up and kind of stretched themselves to meet the needs of this committee. And again, you've heard me say this before, but we were working with the absence of a lot of support. And so,
you know, we were asking for this person at town hall to do this and this person at town hall to do this and this person at town hall and this person at the library to please step up and this other person at the library to please step. So now what we need to do
is kind of take a big deep breath. David's here and I was actually a town hall today because we thought David needed to be appointed and uh he actually doesn't because uh when Pam Barnes went back to look at
the original committee his role was just to come here and sit at the table and advise us without being appointed which is different from Mindy and Joe who even though they're employees
they were listed as particular members and but non- voting members which you know and in a advisory commit uh role. So, uh, we want to kind of get back into
those kind of roles as we're building up the roles, David's role, um, at town hall with the ATA that will take up a lot of things and and just get everybody back where
they belong in terms of their responsibilities. So some of those responsibilities are to the committee, some are to their jobs mostly Joe and Mindy. So um you know what they do for the committee is beyond their work
responsibilities. So we need to be very careful when we ask them to be in an advisory role to be in an advisory role. And that's that's where we can just um maybe pull together more
and use the resources we have at town hall that are starting to shape up to get our work done. So, but thank you everyone who has stretched and you know all the people at town hall who probably aren't watching this but they've been so
so helpful in keeping this so we're going to keep the communication really narrow to to David me and Tom and then we'll distribute it um because there is a ton of communication that goes on um
in terms of billing and all kinds of stuff which will just bog down the committee's progress if we're we're looking at all that stuff. It's just it's a lot. Any comments or questions?
>> Please, what is you have to refresh my mind? What is going to happen on November 17th? Is the library going to make at the town meeting? >> Oh, a town meeting. >> Yeah, the town meeting. What What is our expectation for town meeting? >> I haven't I haven't seen
>> Do we have to do anything cool? Oh, no, no, no, no, >> we don't. Okay. >> No. >> Um, that's a great question. >> I don't know. >> There's no article. The only article is on the McCorm.
>> Okay. >> And that was a newly added one, >> right? No, because this this this has already been covered by a previous town. >> Okay. But that article, the way it stated stating that the MacArthur School could be used as a potential library. There might be there might generate some
questions from the public about that idea and I don't know how that's going to be handled. >> Yeah, I think probably the board will handle that. >> Probably would be the answer because we've asked for a study >> correct >> to be done
>> and that's kind of the answer, isn't it? >> Yeah. Well, also I think Matt really made it pretty clear for us that it it can't be used for a library. >> So I I think going forward that's what we're looking at is potential for
MacArthur school to be actually used for a replacement for Emmy Smoke. >> Ah >> that's what we're looking toward. >> Okay. >> Okay. Lucas would it was very clear that you know it it is an award for the library.
>> So is the article more open-ended? The wording is for potential use or reuse of the MacArthur building as opposed to >> I think it's just left open as to the MacArthur building. I don't think it's specifically for what
>> I I just didn't see the wording of it. I I don't know that we I don't know that we've actually had it. I did also say in uh in uh other future uses because the the collaborative is done in
>> 2029 31 >> 31 >> there's so many there are many dates floating around on that's a great question another one that's not so great um I'm not even sure we should be doing
this but is it time or is it the right time for us to be asking or at least laying out in preparation for when we're going to defend this financial request where we fall on the list of capital projects and
when payment is going to be required, what years um so that at if someone stands up and says when is the library going to start, how much is it going to cost us every year and what else we going to have to be paying for that year because water is looming and the water
is going Um the water thing is going up. So is it I think it'd be great information to have because at some point someone's going to say when are we going to have to start paying for this and when else we're going to have to pay. >> Yeah. >> Who do we do? We who do we get that information from?
>> Well um David presented at the capital budget meeting. >> Oh okay. So you got some framework there and they know we're in the pipeline someplace. >> Oh yeah. Well in Sandy's capital. So she's on like you're going to >> Okay. Um, and
>> we also have the project timeline from >> right down from here. I'm just wondering where that fits into all the other careful projects because that's what we're going to be competing against. Correct. >> The short answer is it's not entered yet on our 10 plan. >> The library isn't >> but other things are right David the I
would assume the 10ear capital plan is the 10ear capital plan. It just could be plugged in at some point. >> I thought last time I looked at it was blank. Is it is it not there now? Um, I didn't I haven't looked. Um,
>> I I think Sandy will confirm that it it's in the 10 year. >> Oh, it is since that So, that's since our meeting. That's okay. >> So, >> Go ahead. I'm sorry. So we we don't have an idea of what else is going to be on
the on the voting dock that night that you know if we're going to be arguing for funds someone's going to stand up and say well you know we got $40 million worth of stuff do for water. How do we we should know what the battle is going to be? Um, and and I think it'd be I
don't know where we should get that information now or just wait till we get a more defined construction schedule because we're still very much in the planning stages, but at some point I think because the citizens are going to ask, >> well, we don't even know if we've been approved by the state. So, I mean, I
think all you can say is that we're really still in a state of limbo, >> right? Well, at this at this town meeting, but town meetings, I think then we'll have an answer for them. But I mean for this town meeting I think we need to do >> and and we and and comes up we're not
even sure we're going to get any money yet. We're not even sure >> as long as we have >> Yeah. >> Right. And so then this >> because we really don't know what the state will be a lot more definitive. >> Okay. >> And then Dorcas has had told us that um
you you as the select board won't be working on that till >> at least January. >> January. Right. Okay. That's >> that's when we start looking at on the budget process. >> Jay, did you have any other
clarification for us? >> Well, I I think uh what was just said uh is correct. you know, it won't go to the select board till after FINCOM. And uh that's the plan. And uh there's still
some additional internal review going on uh that Sandy's coordinating. And uh I did pull up the warrant article. It's article five. It's $130,000. And uh not
let me see if I can't um just the key phrase in there is uh to determine the feasibility and approximate cost of possible future uses of the building including for a possible library or
other public use or take any other action relative there too. So that's the the the final sentence obviously in that warrant article if you find that helpful. Yeah. >> Yes. Thank you.
>> Thank you. >> All right. So Matt, did you want to weigh in on that? You look like you might have had something. >> No, no. I'm I was actually trying to figure out if Marie, who was on the call and needed Okay, let
me There she is. Is she? >> Oh, she is there. Okay. She's maybe not promoted. >> No, she was everybody. >> Maybe she pulled off. Okay.
>> All right. Thank you. Any other discussion on this? >> She raised her hand. >> She raised her hand. >> So, I think she's not visible. >> Um, also I'll need to be promoted to a panelist so I can share. Oh.
>> Oh, did she go back to attendee? >> She if she had to sign off and sign back on >> Thank you. So, that's Sorry about that, guys. I had to log off my computer and get in the car. Um, uh, so I'm listening remotely from the car.
Sorry about that. >> Okay. Thanks, Ma. All right. Um, so why don't we just move into seven in the site updates with N. >> Great. So, I'm going to share my screen. We have Gigi Salt and Stall with us
tonight from G2, our landscape uh architect consultants. >> Hi, everybody. >> Hello. >> Hi. >> Welcome. >> Thanks. Um, just as Matt's teeing things up, um, you all met Jonathan last time
who's in our office who um, uh, nicely stepped up into this meeting. Um, and I that I was not able to be at. Anyway, I I have been here all along. You just haven't met me yet. So, here I am finally seeing my face.
>> I'm seeing you up here. Hold on one second, J. So, we just um I know the last time when Jonathan met with you all, we we put a number of of different options up on screen uh about a number of different
ways to chase the parking, especially I think the other components of the site, the woodland and um the edges. you know, there's con was consistent treatment across the schemes, but really parking is is kind of the big the big item to be
on everybody's minds right now. And what we did was took what we heard from you um working with Matt uh and everybody in his office tried to take the best elements of all those different plans and make it into one. So this is where
we have landed for the moment. Um this uh meets the parking what we believe to be the parking count needs. So this incorporates um 48 spaces that are in the existing lot out there. Um it takes uh 60 for the
library and um really it's a kind of twopart plan. So, um, this first part that Matt's got on screen right now is showing the condition of leaving the 18 parking spaces that are to the west of
the MacArthur building. And, you know, the big yellow arrow is showing how you would circulate through the site. Uh, your arrival to the library, a drop off sequence there, also a drop off sequence for the school. So, we're trying to make the parking lot uh
work for both buildings. Um and then uh you would exit exit back out um the same way you came in. What we are trying to preserve at this point is an option to take this one step further,
which is the next plan, uh which is to move the road away from the west side of the building. And I know this was this was in one of the options last time, but um it would remove the 18 parking spaces uh that are west of MacArthur and have the roads
circulate um between MacArthur and the library so that as you come into site, the library really has a more prominent um position um and is really a kind of feature and uh but keeps the parking and the drop off the same. So it's a there
are a number of ways we could think about it. It could be that it's a phase one and a future phase. It is it could also be considered you know different buckets um in terms of how it gets paid for and constructed. Um, but really we
we were excited about the thought that you could preserve this opportunity to um I think really make this move of the driveway that um would really be beneficial to the library and frankly to the green space uh that's to the west in
addition. Um so that that is the the big overview. I think the other pieces the planted buffers the drop off plaza um remain very similar to what you saw last time. Um, I will explain the bend in the
parking. The reason why we've bent the lot um in the middle is that it gets us the ability to have parking relationships to both the school and the library. If you recall, some of the schemes the last time uh ended up with the parking feeling like it was too far
um from the school for the most part uh but also some of them from the library. And so this bend in the parking swings a number of spaces up closer to that entry plaza. Um but still also preserves that relationship that with the MacArthur
school building. So um that's what you know what I was describing is trying to we're trying to meld all the good things um from the previous schemes. >> I'm not clear on what the bend is. >> Yeah, the bend >> the shape of the parking lot. It's it's sort of two two geometries coming
together. >> So this any additional parking places. >> They're lost. So GI, my question would be the the 18 parking spots that were in front of MacArthur, they're they're no longer there in this >> rendition. Correct. And they're not
they're not absorbed in the new parking lot. I mean, we just lose those. >> No, they are. The new parking lot has um the new parking lot in encompasses all of that. So in terms of the 60 for the library, the 48 that are existing plus
18 for the potential loss west of the building. >> Okay. Thank you. >> So you do the the previous version of this where the parking remains on the west side has 18 more spaces than this lot >> than than needed. Yeah. >> Yeah. Then
>> so is it 48 plus? So 48 spaces exist today and sorry the 48 GG is just in the lot east of the building. Yeah. So it's 48 existing to the east and 18 >> 18 to the west. Y >> so I mean one question that's come up is
what is the right parking count for the school? >> Um and what was the intention of the parking spaces to the west of of the MacArthur building? Are they for the MacArthur school or were they for the field?
>> You know, h how do we determine what our correct parking count is? It it's we're already going to be a little bit up against it with the library trying to argue for a certain parking count. We talked about this last time that
>> zoning, if you go by zoning, you end up with, you know, a hundred plus spaces for the library, which is crazy. Um, and because libraries aren't a listed use, they go it goes by assembly and that makes a kind of broad assumption that
there's one space for every three occupants. So, if we do an occupancy count, it it gives us a quite high parking count. If we use the MBLC formula, which is one space for every 400 g square feet, that suggests a parking count of 60 for a library of
this size, which seems reasonable to us. So the starting point for us was a minimum of 60 plus accommodating the existing 48 and 18. Um and I mean you can see what that yields here and if
that has to grow if we have to incorporate another 40 spaces say it's going to get very difficult and it's going to just feel like that entire area is parking. So, we've been trying to maintain um some green space between the
school and the library um in any of the options that we've looked at. And I I think that's important for the library. I think it would also be a benefit to the MacArthur building. >> Yeah. >> There are the two lots that are south of this. They're off the screen in this
kind of bottom corner. You know, could that be expansion for for more paved parking? Could it be overflow parking that's just on grass for special events? I think that's something that we could look at. GG, I don't know if you guys
considered that at all. It it's a little bit awkward because it's it's kind of this isolated pocket down there. That's >> Yeah, we we looked at it a little bit. It gets tricky because of how to s I mean I I think you're right, Matt. Especially for special events, it would be a good place to park if it's because
it is, you know, potentially parking on lawn. When you get into officially making it parking and paving it, you end up using a lot of space for circulation as opposed to just the parking. And it also just starts getting really far away from everything.
>> Um, which makes it less appealing. Um, but as you said, Matt, I think we're really reluctant to push parking into that green space that's between the MacArthur and the library. It just feels like um this would feel like a very vast
paved space. Um, and so yeah, we we we'd like to keep parking out of that zone. >> Yeah. So, at some point, relatively soon, I think we should set up a conversation with whoever in town we need to. I don't know if that's um Kathy or if it's somebody else in planning and
zoning or the building department or whoever you guys think is the right person to talk to and and just have a conversation about it and explain the situation and try to get a better sense of what the town would be willing to accommodate. We don't want to obviously build more parking than we feel is
>> no reason. >> Did you get any answer to who controls the 18 spaces? >> We we don't know and I don't know who to ask that question either. I mean, is that are those for the field? Are they for the school? And and I think uh it would be useful to do a kind of
parking count analysis for the school, you know, based on zoning. What what would a school require? You know, how many spaces per occupant? How many occupants are there in that building? What's it designed for? How many are actually there? So, getting a better handle on what they need because maybe
the 48 spaces that exist on the right hand side of that building is is more than what they want. Yeah, >> if I think we if if it was an elementary school versus a high school, >> I don't know. >> I don't those 18 to the to the west of
MacArthur. I mean, if they're field parking spots, those that fields never used. I mean, it would seem to me that they're currently probably being used by the school, but the field is rarely used except for an event. Mhm.
>> If you see two people walking on that field during the week, >> it's a lot. >> Although the the recreation people have just done a, you know, they're just doing a study, the open open space, >> so that may lead to some decisions about
use of that in the future. The the only other thing I would think about this rendition here is that shifting the shifting the road from west to east is an additional cost. >> Yeah. >> I mean,
>> well that and that's why we looked at the the kind of phase one call it option that that doesn't shift the road. >> Okay. um because we wanted to see if we could at least preserve the opportunity
for that at some point uh even if it wasn't happening in conjunction with this project but the the the ability to do it at some point and so trying to really minimize you what it's make it so that there's not something that it would have to be redone um and I think some of
the cost implications the questions with that come around with the um the infrastruure ructure projects that are happening in Route 28, the new connections that need to be made to the building for that with the septic system going away. You know, how much of this
is torn up anyway? There might be some efficiencies uh in doing it with this project, but that's, you know, it's too soon to too soon to call that really. >> The only other monkey wrench I'll throw into here is that that road to the south really is an exit only. You cannot enter
from that that side. >> Main Street. Yeah, you cannot enter from main street. >> You're talking about this the >> I think that's we recognize that. >> Okay. >> Yeah. The the road would be two the road would be two-way when it moved to the east the way it is the way it is now.
It's a two-way circulation >> in and out of 28 >> in and out of 28. You can't. Right. Okay. >> Matt, who controls the You talked about parking to the south lot and potential for overflow. Is that all grass or is that actually paved?
>> It's grass. That's correct. It's clear from what I remember. It's very clear, but it's it's flat. It's town owned. They're two >> It's like two residential parcels that are behind two other rescue separate parcels.
>> Is it part of the >> They are town owned, but I don't know if they're part of what's considered the library site. >> They're not part of parcel. But I don't know that we restricted it. Did we when we did the site selection?
>> If it says pass 60 and that's goes on plus 60, forget the conversation because I just don't think we're going to be able to convince the town >> for yes if it is for library specific parking. But if it's for overflow parking for events field, I think that's
fair game. development of the program. It would not be part >> it wouldn't if if what you're saying is true, then it wouldn't be >> we have to convin >> part of it wouldn't be we wouldn't be able to use it to satisfy library parking. >> Okay.
>> Okay. >> We're just going to have to make sure that nobody uses the Simpkins parking lot to go to the library because that will cause all kinds of nightmares. you. >> So, this was our
presentation on June 17, and this looks to me like it is including >> we're talking about this, right? >> Maybe it is. I thought it was over in here in this
area over here. >> We'll find Can I just make one observation? One good thing about moving parking the road to the back of the building. I mean, that's a just taking a road like that through a parking lot with people getting in, kids getting in
and out of the cascade to school. Okay. Back of the building is much safer, I would think. >> Yeah. And the back of the building, by the way, is where the the the accessible entry is for the school. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, it so there are accessible
spaces. You can see where's my cursor? You can see here there there are probably two accessible spaces >> that are across from this entrance, but this entrance is not accessible. You walk in, it's stairs up and down. There's no lift. So, um, so it it
prompted a question in my mind. Is that parking for the school or are those ADA spaces for the field? So, I there just still questions about this that we don't know the answers to. >> That's research. >> In terms of the road, I mean, what what we've talked about with Gigi's team is a
couple of things. One, you know, as she said in in this slide, it it creates a better adjacency between the school building and the field. So >> it does >> you know it for whatever future use of that building that's a fantastic connection without cars you know in
between it. So >> I think that facilitates the you know the the sort of expansion of outdoor programming for that building. >> The other thing it does is it brings the your experience of the library much sooner in >> the overall experience. come into the
site and at this point you'd come into the precinct where you see the library and then you >> you know you still have a good buffer of of landscape and then you move down into the drop off >> and so there's something nice about that instead of coming fully around this other building and then into parking
>> which isn't terrible. It's just it's a more it's a sort of quicker recognition of you are entering this this library. >> As you say the longterm plan much better opportunity for them without the school. >> Yes.
>> Yeah. I think so. Go ahead. >> Oh, sorry. Also, some people could mistake the MacArthur building for the library building if if the road is in front of it and they have to go through the parking of it and they'll they may make a mistake. >> Yeah. if it because it's going to be the
new building there. Some people might not know >> about the MacArthur building and be like, "Oh, this is wrong." >> And not go all the way down the road. >> So, >> okay, John. >> So, I'll go back to if I got Matt's
question, right? >> Who does he talk to to get more definitive stuff in front? >> Well, I I think any any of all this which includes parking circulation. >> Let's ask Jay. Let's ask Jay to weigh in on that.
>> So, who at town hall do we need to connect with? >> I I think you should coordinate through Kathy Williams. Uh and she will >> probably convene a meeting with the building inspector and other people that
typically do site plan review for the town on various projects. And um I do like the shifting of the road by the way. I think it it also calms the traffic down that would be
coming in and out of the site in addition to improving the flow and adjacency between the two uses by having that curve in the road. It's a more gentle approach than what exists in the field today. But uh Kathy Williams is
the go-to person in my opinion. Okay. If anyone provided, she can't ask. >> So, should should we leave it to you guys to organize a meeting then or or is it better for us to reach out to her directly?
>> I can I can start that communication tomorrow. I mean on uh Monday. Yeah. >> Okay. >> Thanks, J. >> Thanks, Jay. >> Yes. >> Matt, has any estimates at all been done on moving the road? No estimates. No, no
cost estimates yet. And actually the we had initially assumed cost estimates would be done before the December deadline. The NBLC has been very specific that they want them done after the review. >> So we won't have our estimator look at this until January
>> probably late January. >> Okay. >> Julie, what with when everything's being done, is it worth it to see about if 28 meets the warrants for a light? Will there traffic light for 28 and or pedestrian since again there would be
more people coming in to the site than previous maybe what could that would get you the pedestrian crossing that would get you everything but warrants would have to be done >> the traffic warranty >> the traffic
is that a state road >> that's a state road >> so I did alert Amanda William to you know, months ago. >> Um, >> so who would talk to me about traffic warrants?
>> The traffic engineer, well, that would be probably Matt's traffic engineer, civil engineer, seeing if there's enough to meet all the traffic warrants to then see if a light is required. Then you would have to go to Masdot to see, you
know, they would have to review it. When you say enough, you mean a traffic study to see sort of count. >> Yeah, there's like nine, eight or nine things that have to be considered criteria they have to meet. Correct. >> I think the issue is going to be is one road coming on the other side
>> because turning coming down road and turning left onto 28. I think there has to be so many feet between that coming on to 28 and we already have the light >> unless we put the light on road. I think
there has to be so many feet. It's like >> um so I think turning left I don't know how how far it would be from >> Wood Road down to the entrance to the library. Probably. How long do you think that would be? >> 100 yards. Maybe
>> it's like a football field. Maybe >> maybe >> without the >> Yeah, without the things going to get revised anyway. I mean, it's all going to get cut up anyway with the sewers and do the interconnection. So, we don't really know where this driveway is going to end. It could end
up in any, you know, we have a rough idea, but they could easily end up getting sewers, >> but it it would be if we have to do it, that would be the time to do it when when they're digging up the road anyway. >> Give the town chance to do something with that wood road intersection, which is
>> Yeah. >> Do we have a resolution on that topic? >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> And an adequate count, an accurate count for the school. That 48 seems awfully high. >> It does to me, too. It >> does seem high. I mean, it's a it's a
28,000t building. It's bigger than the library. U But I I don't know. I don't I don't know what the count would be. >> And I think there's some assembly spaces in there or something. Gross motor area.
>> Yeah. on the lower level down at the southern end. >> Yeah. Yeah. >> Um Okay. Any other >> Wait a second. I need to Sorry, Matt. Okay. So, where are we leaving this traffic business?
>> I I think that can go through Kathy as well who will be coordinating with the engineer and >> and we can put that on the list as well. >> Okay. Very good. Thank you. I don't like loose ends. >> Any other questions for Gigi about
parking and vehicular access? Um, one one thing we should mention is um drop off. I know there were some comments in the last meeting about how far is the drop off from the entry. We've actually moved the drop off closer
>> and the the I think an advantage here is that we have this long covered entry porch along the community wing and so at drop off like immediately off of the drop off area you can get undercover very quickly and then you've got I think it's we say it was 90 feet.
>> Yeah, it's 85 or 90 feet. Yep. >> Yeah. Uh, and for the people that visited Norwell, the drop off at Norwell to the front door of Norwell is about 90 90 ft. >> Yeah, it was 92 feet or something like that. Yeah. So about the same.
>> So frame of reference. I mean, it feels, you know, that's not an uncomfortable distance to walk. Um, so that's I just wanted to mention. >> Great. Yep. Thank you. Any other questions or comments about parking? >> No.
>> Uh, so I I wanted to you had the Norwell library visit on your agenda. Um, I there are only two people here that went, David and Joe. Um, Phoebe was also there. For those of you that have not
been there, I'm assuming everyone else has not. I just have a few slides to kind of orient you quickly. I'm not going to spend time on these just so you see it um and you have some context. Um so this was a 21,000t building, singlestory,
surrounded by wetlands, um surrounded by woods or no other buildings. So unusual context. We organized it around the central rain garden. So all the roofs sloped down to that central garden. The water and we built up the grave to building capacity for storm water
because the water table is so high. >> Yeah. So that courtyard sort of filters the water and moves back out into the wetlands clean behind the building. Um it's organized in this kind of U shape. The top wing is the adult wing. The the
area that's toned blue is the community wing here. This is the entry porch. A drop off is here. You can see it in this rendered view. Drop. There's a drop off here. And then you walk through this uh covered entry porch to the front doors. Um everything that's toned in blue here
is available off hours. So community room, all of the supporting program, bathrooms, uh storage, uh children's wing is in the bottom left corner. And then staff and circulation desk are in this middle area. This is um new books.
Um and around the perimeter, you've got great views out to the woods. Um so approach from parking. Uh again, one-story building. It's um exposed mass timber construction. Exterior materials are green uh slate
from Vermont and yellow cedar. Uh bottom left is that entry courtyard and bottom right too. >> Did they have any solar panels? >> They did not put solar on the building. Um they could, but they did.
>> Uh interior of the adult wing. So, um, similar in scale probably to the adult wing that we're looking at for you guys. It's a similarly scaled building. Um, again, really trying to blur the lines between indoors and outdoors. So, strong connections between uh inside and
outside. We have a couple of covered porches. Those two bottom left images are the porch that's at the end of the adult wing. Uh, there's also a screen porch that's off the periodicals room. Children's room is similar scale to adults. Um, smaller room but same
character, same, you know, great connection to the outdoors. Um, this is a view from the back kind of from the woods looking. Sorry. >> Do any of the windows? >> Yes. Yeah. And and we think that that was a point of discussion with the
staff. Um, it's an operational question, right? At the end of the day, >> yeah, >> you know, it's kind of a hassle to have to go around and close windows that get opened. We've had many conversations about this with different um different library staffs, different communities,
you know, towns about how do you manage that? Some people take the handles off the windows. So, they get opened on a nice day, they take the handle the crank handle off uh and then they put them back on. It's still an operational issue. So, it's a question for the town and for the library staff. We advocate
for it because we think that it's important for people to help to to sort of be able to control their immediate environment. It's nice to get a little fresh air in a building. We do not use it as a way to passively ventilate buildings. I mean, if that's something that that you guys are interested in, we
can pursue that, but that's not why we do it. We do it because it's it just makes for a better sort of personal experience. Um, so there are fewer operable windows in this library than there are in some of our other buildings. For that reason, we minimized the number of them so that the staff
wasn't going, you know, 50 windows around the library and closing them at the end of the day. Um, so I'll I'll leave it at that. David and Joe, I don't know if you guys have any takeaways from that. >> Mindy visited on another and another
point on her own. I'm sorry. How big is this building? >> 21,000. It's a little bit small. >> Close. >> So, Joe, as a employee, >> that's what I was going to bring up. You know, as a 21,000 square foot building
>> gave me an idea of what we as a staff would be facing. >> Okay. And you know, some of the work that we've done with the programming has been about improving sight lines for staff so they can be more easily managed. >> What are your thoughts on windows? >> I'm sorry.
>> What are your thoughts on windows? >> I'm a fan of some manually open >> for that reason. Yeah. Um, but it's beautiful library. It's really comfortable. >> Yeah. I don't know what else.
>> Are we contemplating solar panels on this building? I I well so we are obligated by the new energy code to provide a solar ready building. We we're not obligated to put panels on, but we have to >> consider it and we have to demonstrate that you could put solar panels in the
building. We've got good orientation. The children's wing roof faces south. >> Um I think you could even get decent, it's low pitched roof, so I think you could get good yield on even on an east or west facing roof. Uh we're doing an east west installation out in western
mass and and actually the consultant we're working with said that they even prefer that to south facing because you get a more balanced >> balanced >> um yield over the course of the day. You're not like blasting it with a lot of sun all at once. >> Where must
>> uh shoot? It's a much smaller building 4,500 foot building, >> but it's we have enough solar for it to be net zero. East Ham is net zero. Um and there we had solar on every roof surface irrespective of orientation. So we have south facing, west facing, we
even have north facing, but it's all pretty low pitch. Um and so there's yield on all those services and they're able to generate enough to cover that that building. Um solar I think requires a much longer
conversation because it's an eligible cost. the MBLC will reimburse you for whatever the percentage is that they're reimbursing you for. Um, it's not an inexpensive proposition, especially for a building of this size. >> Um, I I want to say that in Shootsberry,
which is, as I said, 4,500 ft, the solar array was 250,000. I think that was the original budget. I don't know where it came in. They decided to include it in the in the bid. It's a part of the contractor's package. um and get it reimbursed by the state.
>> Reimbured or partially >> partially reimbured, but their their reimbursement was a much higher percentage. They're a small >> small library, so they get like a 75% reimbursement. >> Um there are a lot of different ways to do solar. Um the the benefits the tax
benefits on solar have changed. Now I think municipalities are able to take advantage of tax benefits. It didn't used to be the case. And so what we would find is that there were donors that would come forward and purchase the solar, donate it, get the tax credit. So
it was kind of a win-win. Um that that calculus I think has changed a little bit. And there are a lot of different ways to do it. So we should if you're interested in solar, we should probably set up a time to talk specifically about that with Jay and and Bob probably to understand in the context of the town
how that works. Um, we've worked in communities where there's a like like a huge array over the town dump or something and then >> Yeah. So, so I think understanding this building in the context of the townwide approach to alternative energy and solar would be would be good.
>> Okay. >> There's a huge solar array um over in Nashville at Christ the King Church and they did the entire parking lot >> with panels. Yeah. >> So, not only is it providing protection for the cars, it's generating the prison. >> Yeah. And I mean that's we we see that
too. That's a more expensive proposition because you're you have to then provide the structure to support it here. You've got the roof and you know it's just getting panels on the roof. You have to make sure that the structure takes that into consideration. But we're going to have to do that anyway to be
>> Does it have to be a complete solar roof solar or could you do partial? >> No, it could be partial. >> You could do partial. Okay. >> Yeah. So for to meet the requirements of the code we'll have to provide um a raceway for cabling for a future system. We have
to take it into account in terms of structural design and you know demonstrate that you you can install solar on this prop on this building but it doesn't have to happen as part of the construction >> solar. >> All right. So moving right along. I just want to get back to Joe for a sec
because um I was interested in the way you phrase that of what we would be faced with that size >> as a staff of our size currently. >> Okay. >> You know building of a size like Norwell or larger which is in the case of our
building I'm looking at um you know there's some areas that have out of out of reach of our site. Uhhuh. >> You know, if we're working in a central location, which is >> Yes. >> You know, unavoidable. >> Yes. >> Yeah. Yeah, I mean you we've been having
a lot of these conversations lately with the NBLC and even if you have a clear line of sight, you know, if you could see from one end of the building to the other end of the building, >> but it's 200 feet away, >> that's I don't think realistic to think
that you can have really have visual control of something that's that far away. Even if you can see it, can you get there in time to, >> you know, do anything about it? So I I think for a building of a certain size, this Norwell, you know, anything kind of
in the 20 plus thousand square feet, I I think you have to be thinking about kind of minimum three strategic locations and then figure out it's it's sort of an operational question, I think. You know, how do you make sure that let's say
there's somebody at the children's desk, but then there's a program and so that person is in the children's meeting room. there's nobody at the desk. So, who's covering teens and who's covering the rest of children's and you know, can you pull somebody from, you know, book processing for a couple hours to support
the desk? I that that's where it it's sort of outside of our hands and and I don't know. I mean, you guys have a full-time staff of >> these are those are exactly issues that >> Joe and I have been spending quite a bit of time and we're going to be spending quite a bit more just because as we start to lay out and then, you know,
overlay that with our open hour requirements and what those look like in terms of, you know, staffing because obviously any day that we're open, you know, the days we're open 9 to7, you in essence have a split shift because it's, you know, so you start to look at some
of that staffing service points, you really kind of need two person staffing at all times in in many ways for the reasons that you cite among others. So, you know, all of these things that we think about um even, you know, we were talking about simple things like
processing delivery in the morning, you know, when we get the deliveries, where that goes in, you know, then do you are you pulling someone off of the public service desk to do the delivery? How does that happen? you know, all these things that >> So, um, you know, they're all just
operational considerations as said. So, >> I guess I guess knowing that you can't see everybody at all times in every corner at all times, do you do you focus more on making sure you can see key areas or do you just you would have to have a strong sense of who's coming in
>> almost like a lifeguard knows who >> to know who's in the building at time and making use of some sort of steering. Okay. >> Yeah. Access. >> Yeah. And I I mean, so couple of comments about the plan and um MA and Olivia, you guys should chime in with
any specific questions or comments you want to make, but generally speaking, our effort over the last couple of weeks has been to tighten the building up. Any time we start a new project and we start moving from the kind of bubble diagram to an architectural plan, things tend to
be a little baby and it takes time to sort of work through it, work through it and tighten things up. So, this building was was 3,500 square feet bigger two weeks ago and we've been working over the last two weeks to tighten things up and get that. So, now we're about within
300 square feet of the of the target total area. So, we feel like, you know, we've we've managed to keep the general arrangement, uh, work on the relationships that, um, MA and Libby are going to be here tomorrow to meet with,
uh, David and his staff to go over sort of specific area by specific area um, to talk more specifically about that. So, that that will be super helpful. And then that'll get baked into the the planning as well for our next iteration. um just kind of broadly speaking and so
it's tightened up. Um we've been looking at sightelines. We've also started setting up some interior views which are super preliminary. I'll share them with you tonight. But just to give you a sense of scale, you can kind of see how long things are, how tall spaces are,
that sort of thing. We know that there are still um things that we need to work out in terms of sight lines. you know, the sightelines to the bathrooms, for instance, are not great yet. So, we've got to think about that. We have to do a little more thinking about
how we deal with off-sa how to do it, but it it's at a little bit at odds with the circ desk because the circ desk has to be behind that that closure and so as the circ desk moves one way, you lose sight of something. So, it's it's a trade-off and we're
trying to work through some of those things. But, um, in terms of the the general layout, um, it it has kind of stayed in the same um kind of organization that you've seen. central
lobby uh and and entry off of that covered entry porch. Circulation desk um centrally located right when you walk in the door. Good sight line down the length of of the corridor that gives you access to the children's room. You'll see in the interior view though that the
idea of being able to supervise the children's room from the circulation desk is not realistic in a building as a scale. Um, but you can certainly have eyes on who's going there and sort of, you know, knowing who's coming and going, understanding who's walking into those rooms. Um, similarly, the
sightelines to adults we think is pretty good. It's a straight shot. All of this is low shelving. We have high shelving along the perimeter, low shelving in the middle. Um, there is a reference desk located down at the far end. So that would provide additional coverage at the
end of the adult wing as well as supervision of the study rooms which are located on the right hand side of the plan. Um there's a lot of talk about the print area and computers which are down at this end of the adult wing next to the circulation desk and the staff areas
have been kind of uh we've tried to make that a little bit more efficient. Get rid of some of the interior uh circulating corridors. We now have and and David, I'm sure you guys will talk about this tomorrow, but um we have a kind of centrallylo
staff workroom. So staff work room and tech services off of which we have other staff areas. So similar to Norwell where you walk into that room, then off of that is, you know, a meeting room and a and the break room. Um the director's office is located kind of between the staff area
and the public area. So, I mean, we can talk about where doors are and how you get in there, but wanting to put the the director's office in a spot that was visible, that was accessible so that you're not going back into a staff area. People coming to have meetings uh with David would be able to get there pretty
easily. So, um again, this is a another pass that there will be many many iterations of this. >> Where's the team? >> Oh, sorry. Team room is is here. Let me back up to the color. So, the green is team. So this is the teen room. This is
the STEM uh space here. Uh there's a small study room associated with teens which is here. The the children's and ya staff is here. So there's a desk uh and a room here. And actually I'll go to this 3D plan
easier to see. I know this is kind of small for everybody, but um I can get my cursor there. This is the desk, the the children's and ya desk. There's a glasswalled office space or workspace that supports
that desk. So from that room you can see into teens, you can see into children, you can see from the desk into teens. Um teens is enclosed but it's glazed so you can see into it from outside. Um and the maker space is or the sorry the STEM
space is accessible either by teens or children. and it's sort of outside of either of their rooms off of the public circulation. Um, I'll move to a couple of the interior views and then I'm happy to jump back to the plans if you guys have
questions. So, updated entry view. The drop off actually would be a little closer than than what this suggests. Um, the the edge the end of the drop off sort of corresponds to this second column. So, it would be sort of about where these people are. Um, and then as
GI said, it's about an 80 foot uh walk to the front doors, which are which are back here. Um, meeting room obviously was to the to the right. Um, this is the as you walk through the front doors, this is what you' see. You have a view straight through to the outdoors. You
have you're looking left down the corridor that leads to children's. The teen room is in the foreground uh with book display in front of it in the lobby, but you can yeah clear line of sight into teens from this location. You can see how far away children is and
that you can make you can see the door. Um this person is in the way right now, but you could you can probably also see the desk through that glass from the circ desk. So there should be line of sight between the those two locations, but beyond that, I think it's going to
be very difficult to see just given the distance. >> In the rendering, what's the ceiling height? How >> uh it slopes and I I think it was >> it goes low end to 18 feet at the high end. Is that right?
>> Yeah, that's correct. Right around there. >> Yeah. So that's I mean that's similar to Norwell or East Ham if you guys have been there. It's similar similar height. I think that's actually even a little taller. >> Um you on the right hand side of the image, cir desk is off the screen,
you're looking down the length of the adult wing off to the right. >> So are those windows above the circus? >> Uh yeah. So the way that the roofs work right now, we're showing that as clear story. Whether that can stay clear story, I don't know. Depends
>> on the clearances. It's a little tight right now, so it may not make sense to do it. >> Um, we're still working through the kind of roof geometries of the three wings. >> Um, but yes, that's that's what you're seeing in this image. >> Okay. >> Um,
next view is Cir desk looking towards uh so this is a little further back. This is CIR desk now looking down the length of the children's wing of the teen room. Uh this is inside the children's room. So the desk is on the right. Off the
screen to the right is the the work room that supports the desk. The door that's to the right of that chair is um a staff office. Um and then the children's room is pretty open with the exception of the the enclosed story hour multi-purpose
space. Um adult wing and again these are super preliminary but gives you a sense of the scale. So the right hand side is all the study rooms. The reference desk is um you know twothirds of the way down. This
wing facing those rooms and this is now at the far end of the adult wing looking back out towards the the central green space. So they're super rough and preliminary, but it kind of gives you a sense of the
scale and uh general relationship of things. >> I'll jump back to the plan if anybody has any >> questions. M >> Thank you very much. I had you on here
separately, Ma, but um if you're doing if you're doing a meeting here tomorrow, maybe then that is your update. >> She's on there. >> She's on. >> Sorry. Sorry. I'm I'm kind of um I'm trying hard to hear, but it's a little
bit low. Um I I am planning to come tomorrow. Um, so if you have questions specifically about program and sizes, I'm happy to answer those. Um, but if you have any questions right now, I can try to answer. >> Yeah, I I think I think that is the
update that you're meeting with the staff tomorrow. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Okay. Um, thank you, Ma. So, let's move to
outreach. Um, let's see. John and Linda and I got together. Was Mindy? >> Mindy. >> Mindy was >> Okay. Square when Okay. Um, I think
we've made some progress with uh cleaning up the links between uh the town sites. I know for me I I've tried to go in as if I'm blind and um don't know what I'm looking for and I
seem to get to the library information much more quickly. But just a couple of clicks now >> I did look today. You cannot from the town site, you do not see a trifold like you do on the library site,
>> right? >> So that one place where you can see the same information is still missing. >> Okay. So Jay, was that clear? When you go to the library site, there's a a faximile
of the trifold information. uh not in a trifold format and it's just right there with all the colors and everything. >> But on the town side, >> I can't find that on the town side. >> I guess I went I just went library and
that's why I found it. Okay. >> A couple of things. Uh I I can look into that obviously. Um, but you do need to realize there's a couple of things going on that uh are going to change with the town's website.
Uh, they're going through a process of upgrading and improving uh the overall town website. I also had a preliminary discussion with it and that process is going to stretch
into November tomorrow you know I mean next month and u it won't be completed till the end of the month in November. So uh the other aspect of this is the story
of the library is very confusing on the website. there's so much information and I know with a project of this scale uh when I've been involved elsewhere uh we did have some professional
assistance from the consulting team to maintain you know the website with uh relevant information. It it didn't fall to the the building committee alone. they
actually had someone on the consulting team that uh produced uh information and kept that website uh current, fresh and clear. And I think
uh assuming that you'll be into uh the next phase of the project once you complete the current phase in December um there should be strong consideration to have that capacity uh in the next phase where you're going
through construction design cost estimates and uh looking uh to uh bring this forward in the Springtown meeting and um I I would just defer to the consulting
team to consider that and and uh if there's someone on the team or within your organizations that uh provide those kind of services. So I think a project of this size with
the sensitivity the long story that has gone on uh it's very important to do a major refresh of your page and uh we have the time to do it. Uh and
with the new website being uh implemented, uh this is a good time for the consulting team, town staff and uh obviously building committee member or
members uh to kind of work on on that and uh that that's my recommendation. it does need a a refresh uh and needs to tell the story uh much more clearly
uh particularly when you're looking for a big ask in the Springtown meeting. >> Okay. I I have a point of clarification. When you're saying the consulting teams, are you talking about engaging another consultant or are you talking about know
and um Accenture? Well, in my prior experience, the owner's project manager, uh, their team provided that type of support. I know it wasn't truly built in
to this current phase and and that's not unusual. Um, but it going into the next phase, uh, I see Jennifer, uh, why don't I let you speak to that? Yeah, I I'm actually just uh was listening to Can you guys hear me? Okay,
I'm I'm at my desk. Um I was just actually writing a note to my uh some of my colleagues to ask what projects we may have done that with because I'm thinking, you know, we are Accenture and we're a tech company. So, God knows we
must have the capacity to do that. And I'm sure we've done that before. So, I I think that makes a lot of sense, Jay. I I we'd be happy to do that. I just need to find the right person to assist. But, um, I think that would probably We have We have a lot of youngsters that would
be really good at the tech stuff. So, I think that would be kind of a a great idea to be able to help you in some way. >> It'll it'll keep it fresh and up to date. Yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. So, let me find that and I'll get
back to you guys. Um, like I said, I literally just, you know, pinged my fellow directors and, um, we'll see, you know, what kind of I what I what we might have for a precedent that I can, um, you know, figure out how we can make that work for you. I think it's a great
>> All right, Susan has a question. >> I just have a question for you. You said that it was confusing. Is it because it's too much information or is it because of the way it's organized? What made it was it visually unattractive? What made it confus?
>> Well, I I found that there's information on there that had a relevance that was more important early on in the process, but you've actually reached a watershed moment in this project where you now have a site.
uh you're going to knock on wood be successful in uh getting additional funding through grant through the grant and uh that that story that more recent story I
don't want it to get lost and I think you have a lot more visuals that can be put up there and also with interacting with the public questions are going to arise as you um have already
experienced. It would be nice to have these frequently asked questions or questions that come in, have someone uh techsavvy to uh provide uh real time responses
and and I just think it's very difficult for staff who are going in many directions and actually for the building committee who have other lives, you know, uh pursuits uh to be able the focus uh in that level
of detail and we're talking a very concentrated time frame and that's why I think it's very strategic to get that type of an individual in place. >> All right. So, uh now we come to the
money. So, so are we saying that that's not in the current contract though correct with Accenture or is it I don't >> I would go ahead, >> Jennifer. >> I was just gonna say I don't necessarily
think that that was in the contract, but I I will double check. I will look for you. >> Okay. Um, so then what we would be talking is with the next phase making sure that that is in the contract. >> Yeah,
>> exactly. and and prepare the foundation for that to get implemented quickly once that new contract is in place. >> Okay. >> Yes. >> And we'll make sure because our current
contract tech our task order currently ends December 31st as does Odin's LO. I think probably getting into November, we'll really want to ramp up on that so that we don't have kind of the same delays that we had with the current ones that we both that both firms have in
place. So, um I've got notes about this and I will uh get on that in the next I mean tomorrow, but next couple of days here to find out what it would involve and um how we can get that written into the future contract.
>> Right. that would be just very very helpful to us because it's been a need that we keep identifying and then keep running up against um lack of talent. Um
>> what what what would happen is the OPM would create a page and the town website would link to that through your committee and through you know anything that's interconnected. Uh but it would be maintained by the
OPM. >> All righty. Uh thank you very much >> for that for that info. Um another topic that came up was how do what's the internal
communication within the town so that town employees just know what's going on? Is there is there like an employee newsletter or some something like that that happens or is it up to individuals
to kind of look at the town website, the town calendar or whatever? >> So, for instance, would be like you're going to Kathy, Kathy may have to go to the building department. Does the building department
even have a clue of a brand new library and what's happening? But when that goes when we go to talk to them, they have to hear from beginning to end because they really don't know anything about a Yamoth library. >> So Kathy's role in as town planner, she
also uh chairs the site plan review committee where she convenes representatives from various departments, engineering, building. So she's a logical choice to help coordinate some type of informal
meeting on this project, you know, pre preiling of, you know, plans just at this of conceptual design. So I think that
people are aware of the project, but there isn't any formalized communication. I assume uh Bill Scott pro provided some of that in the past. uh his successor
uh begins on Monday. And part part of what I wish to do is to be able to not hand a big pile of paper, but be able to uh give her current relevant
uh information on where the project is and not have that individual start from square one. and and but eventually I believe that individual will have a more active role
uh as Bill did uh going forward but I'm not sure how that uh we can have that discussion internally with David and uh yourself Judy and uh Tom uh that would
be a good discussion to have um once Bob is back I think we should put that on the to-do list. >> Actually, Kathy could actually um have the planning committee ask the library committee to come and do make a
presentation during that planning committee meeting and invite all the department heads to that meeting, you know, and we could that's one and call it a public meeting. That's one way that they would certainly, >> you know, focus on internal communication
>> and that would be something the planning committee could do. we could ask for public present, you know, we could put you on the agenda and have the library committee come and make a, you know, presentation and we would would open it up to the public and she would invite all of the department heads. So that would be one way at least to give them a
high level sort of 10,000 foot presentation about where it is and the important pieces of it and where we are right now. >> I I think that would work as well. Yes. >> Okay. So, how would we coordinate that?
>> I can ask. >> Well, that >> Yeah, exactly. Yeah, >> I'll ask if she consider putting it on his own and then as >> I would consider having having it as an
agenda. Okay, great. Did you have a follow-up question on that, Vicki? >> Oh, no. I didn't have a question. I was just uh I just wanted to say that uh I've emailed uh the wait that's a new topic though. >> Okay. Um so all right this is great. So
the only other thing that we talked about at the outreach was kind of Susan mentioned getting quick things to various things and then we really thought a video was a a real big thing and being able to put even a five minute
video kind of like the trifold that gets updated on certain milestones so that people when they finally get to a web page that has accurate information can see something. So that was the other thing of trying and then trying to get the right people that may be our people
that do our minute talks on certain areas of what they're wanting to you know the new library to give them stuff like that to to draw excitement >> right so we and we were thinking about um like you know I love to come to the
library and this is what I do and you know like oh wait one minute that kind of thing um or you know if it weren't for the library I wouldn't be able to do blah blah blah um
and then identifying the users who were doing that. So Linda took this is Linda still with us? Linda took >> Okay, Linda took this to Sila the South Library Association.
um that they were wondering if as committee members they could even appear in any kind of of a video, which was interesting because you've all done your conflict of
interest thing. And you know, you can make factual statements, but you can't make promotional statements. So, right, that's Yeah, that's the problem. >> Yeah. Okay. Um,
however, then when it got to uh, so, so I referred her to Mary Masloski as far as this conflict these conflict questions and um, Mary's response was that each individual person
could call Mass State Ethics Commission to ask about their specific situation since everybody's would be a little different. Um, and she was saying to restrict it with the
people on this committee, which wasn't really our idea at all. So, I think this this just needs a little more work. >> Yeah. And clarification about who can do it. >> Yeah. Who can do it and who's organizing
it because again, if this is in Oh, Linda is back. If this is um if this isformational and giving just factual updates on, you know, anybody can do that. But if it's
if it crosses lines and if we want to also use these things for further fundraising reasons, then that leaves us out for sure. >> Leaves them out. >> So So did I did I get it? Okay, Linda.
>> Yeah, pretty much. He also um it was also suggested um getting in touch with Li in the town uh for messaging that she might be able to give a structure or give some advice on how to proceed. Um
but she reiterated many times that she could not inform individuals whether they could do it or not. that they had to speak to the state ethics commission, ask for the attorney of the day, and they would handle each individual case.
Um, and and she reiterated those those things several times. >> Okay. So, that's the message we have to take away. All right. Good. >> Um, and Laura Sullivan has been helpful to us in the past, but when you need to
go to her with a message, she can help us. uh make the message and make it into a radio ad or a a little blurb some for any of the outlets, but we have to go with the message. So
that's back to us. >> Let me make sure I'm clear. Conflict of interest is only from people that may be on something existing. uh Joe public doesn't have conflict of interest in what they wi what they do
and how it may do. So it's really >> like you said maybe anybody on the board >> in certain town employees >> in certain Right. Correct. And and and again if there is a any thought or perceived thought it it's as simple as
going to the ethics to at least file and be able to have documentation of >> you filed a conflict of interest. >> Right. But she also said um she recommended restricting those video clips to members of the committee.
>> This committee. >> Yes. >> Which wasn't that's why I'm saying that's not our idea. Yes. >> So So we've ga, you know, we have to >> Yeah, we got to work on that. >> We don't have to be on the bail, >> do we?
>> No, no, no, no. That's what we have to >> Who said who said that? Mary >> miss. Why are we having these people do it anyway? Why are we just doing a video without people? >> Why do we have to have people? >> Oh, it was just a thought.
>> A mandatory no. >> Okay. >> And who's Mary? >> Maryski is the town clerk. >> So on any of those things, she's the >> she's she's the arbitrator, >> the local. But for more engagement, since we talked about it that we need
more engagement last time with Mindy and Judy and everybody else, um I decided to um wait, you're still not up. >> Sorry. Sorry. >> You get your own place. >> I didn't know. Sorry.
>> Okay. So, anyway, that's that's where that was with the with the videos and Did you guys by any chance see the hyenas video? I know I mentioned it before. >> I did ages ago >> because that I mean it may be helpful to
talk to them too to understand. >> They had a lot of money though. >> Oh, did they? >> I think it was pretty it was pretty polished. >> That was private money. That was private. Then then I knew that was I don't want to know. >> Okay. So then along with outreach when
we had our last meeting oh >> we we talked about Vicki Vicki was um going to get in touch with schools. So >> yes um >> take it away. >> I spoke to the principal of as
innovation school and um sent an email to him and um CC Mindy and you and uh the superintendent. I sent an email to him too. Um and um I informed them about the library
building project. Uh Dr. Martin Smith already knew about it. >> Yes. >> Because he was in all those >> he was supportive in the summer prior notices. Yeah. >> Oh, great. Great. And um the principal was supportive too. And um I had to send
uh the link from the library site to uh Sarah Miller to the executive assistant of u our superintendent of Dennis Yarmouth schools just so that like the parents of the children of Yarmouth and Dennis know about the project because
they deserve to know. >> So this was the link to the um >> and we're waiting for the approval. So, >> the tribal mail ring or whatever. >> Maybe it was approved, but I didn't get the metal. I don't know. >> I think it probably just went.
>> Yeah, I think it was approved. >> Yeah, >> they just maybe it wasn't their newsletter or something. >> They they were so fast in the summer, I I by the time I got the phone call that it was approved, it was already out. >> Perfect. >> So, >> yeah. So, >> I would not be surprised if that
happened again. >> Yes. >> Great. Thank you, Vicki. All right. So, now we can move on to future steps and upcoming meetings. Um, all right. So, as far as Odinello, your future steps, you continue to to
work on programming and how it's fitting into the building and the traffic patterns and >> yeah, we so the programming meeting scheduled for tomorrow. Um we are start we already obviously have been working
with GG's team uh G2 collaborative but also our civil engineer. Civil engineer was also the surveyor. So they've been out here twice to survey the property which they've now finished. We've had a number of conversations with them. We had a long conversation with them about
the septic and the potential future sewer tie in. >> So they're engaged. We are now going to be starting to bring our mechanical plumbing engineers on board as well as our structural engineer now that the plan is starting to settle down a little
bit. Um and so we'll start doing that in the coming weeks. Um we are assuming a week uh sorry a two week um uh next meeting in two weeks. >> I don't know if that's on the calendar. >> I think or not, but
>> we talked about that last time. after that. >> What's two weeks? >> The 13th of November. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. Are you all up to speed on getting that information that Tracy asked for about we have in the building? How much
request do we have to build coming together? >> It's coming together. Ma, um I don't know if you heard that question, you can hear us, but can you give an update on the status of consultant? >> Yeah. Yeah. Um I've I've gotten all except the one from RFS.
>> Okay. >> Um so, but he thought he could get it to me this week, so I'm sort of hoping that he will follow up tomorrow and then it should be complete. >> Was it your understanding that we're going to have to go back in front of the selectment or was this just a document
we were going to? >> What was your out of our hands? It's >> Dus, let me ask Dus. Dus, when when the when the select board asked for um a rendering, not a rendering, a report from Matt about the total cost of the rehab of the building and we need to
nail that down. The building's not going to work and here's the reasons why. Was it your expectation we were going to come back in front of the board or was this just going to be something we could hand to the board as a this is what you asked for. Here's your report. >> Okay. Yeah. Okay. Good. >> Good. Yeah.
>> The followup question though is since there's money on this in the warrant, is that really the ceiling of what Matt's team could ever propose? Because if it comes in higher than that, there isn't >> warrant money available.
>> So related to that, um I had an exchange with Bob Britau about this because the warrant article had to be submitted >> last week, I think. So we went back and forth about the cost >> and I mentioned to him at the time and it sounds like Dorcas this may not be necessary but um at the time I said if
we need to consider this as a study for assessment that's part of it we want to understand what that building condition is. So irrespective of its future use that you know the roof needs replacing and the foundation is cracked or
whatever. Um, and so that's the assessment piece of it. But if if it is going to be looked at as a potential library, a library project and because that that was what I heard in the select
board meeting that that you guys wanted to be able to kind of compare apples to apples, a renovation project versus new construction. If that's the case, and it sounds like it may not be, then there would also have to be a planning study to look at how you fit this library
program into that building in order to develop a cost estimate that gets you to kind of parody between the two schemes. >> I think that's a hard one. I I think really what it is coming down to is that um we just
need more documentation and why it's not feasible to do it as a library. I mean that's really what it's coming down to. >> I think that's >> I can I can check in with our chair and um get back to you on that one. But
>> I mean that that 150 versus 50. Yeah. you know, like these kinds of things. Um, I think we needed to just have an assessment of what the building potentials were. Um, you know, so that going forward when we're looking at the
feasibility for the Emmy small, we can look at it for that. I mean, I I'll check with Tra I'll have Tracy get in touch with me. >> Okay. Yeah, >> I'll have Tracy talk to you. >> It really should come from the chair anyway. >> Okay.
So I don't I don't know what the number >> clarity by the scope. >> Yeah. So so in terms of the number as you're saying I suggested to Bob that he put in you know I gave him a range of like 130 to 150. He had 100 as his number and I said if you want to build
in the potential for us to do this added scope which we may or may not need to do but we don't want to have to fall short right. So I told him if he could up the number that gives us that wiggle room. I don't know what went in the warrant. >> Jay, do you remember what was in the warrant as a dollar figure?
>> Uh 130,000. >> Whoops. What happened? >> I lost it. >> Oh, no. >> It's always the money. It always happens when you mention so we have November 13th and then >> I still have them on my screen like that, right?
Is it not 130? >> Yeah. Final word. 130. >> Yeah. Okay. >> So, so then um what happens is we're starting to bump into the holidays. You know, if we stick with our Thursday
um >> you know, we Yeah. If we if we go two weeks out of Thanksgiving, if we didn't if we try to sneak one in on the 20th or you know,
>> uh is the 13th a Thursday? >> 13th. >> 13th Thursday. >> Yeah. >> The 20th of December >> and then wait till December. >> And so then go on the first week of December. Does that work for people? >> So the first week in December? Yeah,
that'd be the fourth. >> Yeah. >> 124 113 then 1120 or just 11:13. >> Yeah. What What are we thinking, folks? Do we want to set one for 11:20 and then cancel? >> Yeah.
>> Yeah. Put it in your books. Um >> 1120. >> Yeah. 1120. >> Cancel. And then but definitely 124. >> And then 124. >> Okay. >> And actually, why don't we go to 1218? Is that right? Yeah. 12:18
>> just just so we have them all plugged in. >> What day is 124? >> 124 and Thursday. >> These are all Thursday. >> They're all Thursday. >> All right. >> All here. >> All in the library. >> It's just easier. There's so much jockeying for space at town hall that
it's just simply stay here. Yeah. >> Um I guess what we need to do though is make sure that we get the password >> 30,000 that probably is. Yeah. >> Okay.
>> So we we need to get that by 4:30. >> Yeah. >> Right. So at this end, is it always the same person who's going to be doing the deck? No. >> No. Okay. >> Because it depends on who schedule and
who has the day off. Yeah. >> All right. All right. >> Way too simple. >> Yes. >> Way too cont. >> All right. I just I hesitate to put myself in this because I I would just be a rope carrier of that
password. Um >> if we could try to make sure there's three or four people on staff. >> Yeah. Will will we can I mean if we're going to continue to be here >> for each
>> uh well the issue was that it's linked to a particular person's email and other things and I >> um this is the first time that I was in the loop on that. So >> Oh okay. >> That's really I stayed at this is like I
know that much about it but that's good. So, >> but we can we can talk further about >> how we move forward on all of this. >> Okay. Wonderful. All right. So, just to review quickly, 1113, 11:20, 124, 1218.
Uh Susan's going to uh work with Kathy and try and get us a showtime with the planning board. >> Let me ask you something. If we can work it into one of those dates that would take the place of a meeting, >> right?
>> I mean that that would be a good >> use of that. What was that? >> Maybe on Wednesday night take the place of one of these meetings. >> Yeah, >> that would work, right? >> Yeah. >> Is that too much of a I think we've got enough that we can make you can make a very decent presentation. I don't you
know if we had to do this for the next two weeks, you could do it. >> Yeah, I think so. >> Okay. Let me talk to Kathy. Let's see what we can do. They can try to get something done before the uh 18th and 18th, I think, is a little it's too close to Christmas. I'd love to. >> Oh, yeah. Yeah.
>> I'd like to get 124. Yeah. Either 124 or the 12:21. The 11:21. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Okay. >> All right. But actually, it would be the day before. Yeah. Because the Wednesday take the place of that meeting. >> Yeah. I'll leave that on tonight. >> Would work. >> Okay.
>> Yeah. She would uh she would invite all of the you know the department heads the site would be anyone that's interested in >> plus it would be always an open meeting so the public will show up >> and and then that would be a good movement forward for our
responsibilities I think that would be wonderful that >> by the way I'm going to be away for 10 days starting next week so if you guys need anything >> warm >> uh it is going to be warm Yes,
>> we're going to Morocco. >> Okay, >> awesome. >> Um, >> Morocco is a beautiful place. >> All right, we are still in session. >> I've never been. I'm excited. >> Okay, it's a family wedding coming one
question. So, >> when do we have to actually submit it? >> December. >> End of December. December 31st. >> December 31st. >> Yeah. It's an online submission. I mean, we want to be ready to go before December 31st. >> Yeah. The sooner we get it in, the sooner they'll start.
>> It's sort of like all the state reports. They just they go >> So, you just queue up. >> They just queue up. So, the sooner we get it in, the better. But obviously, we have rivers to cross between here and there. So, >> yeah. And and that's why a big push now
is is good for us to be doing. All right. Any other loose ends? Anybody else? Motion to adjourn, please. >> Susan, >> second. >> Okay. Dorcas. All right.
>> Roll call. >> No. >> You know what I'm going to do? All in favor? >> Abstain. Carries. >> Building. Meeting is >> Yeah. Which is really getting in the way. >> Hi everybody. Where are you going, man?
Uh, >> we're going to be in Marrakesh. >> Yeah. And we'll go.