Good evening. >> Recording in progress. >> Uh good evening and welcome to the November 5th, 2025 Yarmouth Planning Board meeting. I am Joan Crowley, chair. Uh the public is welcome to attend this per in person this evening or via alternate public access provided on the
notice of meeting available on the town of Yarmouth website. I'd like to begin by taking roll call. Susan Brida >> here. >> Dearra Aquinen >> here. >> Tom Pendleton >> here. >> Will Rubenstein >> here. >> Peter Slovak. >> Ken Smith >> here.
>> Joanne Crowley present. Seeing that we have a quorum, I will now call the meeting to order. Please join me in the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation
under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you. >> Although not a formal part of our agenda, we are so pleased to welcome Tom Pedleton to the uh planning board um
this evening. This is his first meeting and he rounds out a team of seven that we're very happy um to have him here with us. Tom, thank you so much for joining up. >> Thank you. >> Um you have no idea what you're getting yourself into. Uh but we're a really good group. So I think you'll enjoy
yourself and we have the best town planner in the world. So we do >> uh we are we are we are all well taken care of. Just a couple of words from you maybe on your background a little bit. >> Yeah. So again, my name is Tom Pendleton. I live over on Long Pond
Drive. We've lived there uh probably 10 years, 11 years now. Um but we were married in South Yarmouth. Um my wife and I were former PeaceCore volunteers and I worked I'm a retired federal contracting officer for the US Department of Labor um primarily in job
training and and uh job training programs for atrisisk youth. So that's my background. >> Thank you, Tom. Thank you so much. Um on the agenda this evening, the uh first item is uh Kathy, we have the chapter 40B comprehensive permit application
uh that's still moving around. um for 897 Route 28. Um our our town planner, Kathy Williams, has included in our packets supplemental information provided by the applicant uh for this uh
chapter 40B housing project proposed at the site of the former laundromat on Route 28 uh with the intersection of Pinerove. We most recently discussed this at our September 17th meeting and provided written comments to the zoning board of
appeals for consideration at their October 23rd meeting at which the comprehensive permit was discussed. So Kathy, why don't you walk us through what you've received since then and any conversations you've had with Mr. Clearary. >> Yeah. Um I think it's there's no defined
specific project that is being proposed. It sounds as though they're heard a bunch of different things. They met with affordable housing trust. They they obviously had their initial hearing um with the zoning board of appeals and heard a lot from them with regard to what the architecture looked like, the parking and those similar similar
concerns that I believe that the planning board had in their memo as well as the community housing committee. So what they ended up doing in this particular plan here is that you may remember the originally the um the access came off of Pinerove. Now they're showing it coming off of Route 28. My
understanding is the idea the affordable housing justice is really pushing for some type of mixed use. So that the first floor of this building would be maybe offices for their particular organization. Um and then they would have the um the housing on top. So the buildings would be the this this
scenario shows the continuation of the three buildings of three stories. Um it would be slightly less number of units instead of 27. and it would go down to 25 if you the two units on the first floor turned out to be offices or commercial in some fashion. Um what they
ended up doing here is they were able to provide by going this particular way they were able to provide 39 parking spaces. I believe before they only had 30 and it was you know 1.1 per uh unit. This is kind of showing um additional parking uh being provided. The setback
here from Route 28 is actually pretty pretty high. It's like 31.6. So, there is the possibility of moving that up and maybe moving these buildings further up or maybe joining these buildings. One of the concerns I had is this ends up being a dead end to the dumpster. That's not feasible. You're not going to back out
your your garbage truck and go that way. So, they're going to need to scrunch this up further in order to be able to come around here with some type of maybe it's just an exit only lane um um for people to go and then they can come and get their garbage and and go out this way. fire department probably would also
be interested in something uh along those lines. The concern I kind of have is this is a very narrow lot and it's kind of impacting their their layout quite a bit because I think they only have like four feet of four feet of um buffer on that particular on the west side and then you
have your standard 60 foot wide double loaded and then by the time you take in this 54 foot wide uh structure you end up with only having like 11 foot buffer off of Pinerove which is for a three-story building it's it's kind of heavy in that particular residential
area. Um, so that's of concern. Um, so one of the things I talked about, um, is maybe having them consider, maybe this is an idea of of angled parking. That's something that's we do allow in the VCOD. You could only go so narrow because the fire department is going to want a lane of a certain width. That may
be an issue with them. Um, so those are things that would need to be figured out. Uh, lots of times the fire department likes to have, you know, at least a 20 foot wide, but if they have a hydrant in here, they probably would be okay. Okay. So, there's some discussions along those lines, but by narrowing this up, you might be able to get like a 20
foot buffer off of Pine Grove, which I think would be better. And again, you could if you move these things up forward, you could still come around here, maybe with some angle parking, and still have like maybe a little area for playground. So, there's some opportunities here to make it a little bit better, but unfortunately, once you
go angle parking, you're going to lose spaces. So, it's going to be more like I did a quick look at it, maybe like 33 spaces instead of the 30. >> I think what's the requirement? What was the requirement? Um I know it depended on the project itself. >> They're doing VCOD. The minimum's one,
>> right? >> Maximum 1.5. >> Yeah. >> I mean, I know that we've talked about making some modifications to that, making the minimum 1.5 or something more than one. And then um this is workforce housing. I know they're going to do some comparisons later uh with some of the other housing projects that are all 100%
affordable. That's very different than this where you would have probably the 25% affordable and the rest would be market rate. You are on route 28. There are a lot of studios. There may be some people who um only you know don't have a car or obviously have one car. Um so that's something to to think about. So
those are some of the things just looking at this that I noticed. Uh and then the second scenario that they had >> before we go to the second one um how much of that have have you discussed with Mr. Clearary? um other than I mean this was some this
was something that where he came and dropped it off at the zoning board of appeals and then he came up and handed me a copy and we had like a I don't know maybe a 30 to 40 minute conversation about a bunch of different things. Um but I did mention you know the concerns about about this. I don't know if I had mentioned the ankle parking at that
time. >> Okay. >> Um >> but you have made some suggestions to him on on how it might >> not to that level. I don't want it to be a case quite frankly of it. The town planner told me to >> meaning Kathy Williams said I'm more than >> No, that's why I'm asking.
>> I'm more than comfortable with developers doing a little hand sketch. I certainly did it for Yarmouth Commons. Um but I I'm a little uncomfortable doing this, but I think suggestions like, you know, you might want to look at angled parking. You could probably loop it around and have an exit only.
You might you scrunch things closer and maybe combine two of the buildings. You might be able to put a playground in. Those are generic statements that their designers should certainly be able to take to take. >> But but my my point is I'm trying to protect you a little bit. It's a um and be on the record that um this was a a a
generic conversation with him and there's no attribution to Kathy Williams said no and I know we had this conversation and you you did mention that. So I just wanted to be on the record about that. >> I appreciate that. I have one question, Kathy. Was it a conscious decision just
to have the entrance and exit on 28 and no entrance and exit on Pine Grove? Was there a reason for that? >> I think once they decided that they were interested, and we kind of talked a little bit about this during the mixeduse studies, is um if you're having some type of commercial here, people anticipate and expect a route 28
>> entrance >> entrance versus if you have something there and then people like, "Wait a minute, where do I go? I have to turn here. Is this the right place to go?" It's a little bit more confusing. I just I get concerned about 28 trying to come out here and turning against traffic, >> you know, it especially during the
summer is is really tough. I mean, >> it's not going to be any different than if you went into Pine Grove and came out here. >> Okay. >> Um because you're still there's no light, right? What the suggestion here is they originally um were coming and doing some weird angle like this. I think it's shown on the >> Yeah, because this is where the existing
curb cut is now. Correct. I'm like, why not just straighten it out and you'd be further from this intersection, which Mass DOT would prefer, than being closer. >> Okay. 28 car. >> So, this this is the the one building concept, but I don't think it's just one building, and this is where
I got more information in the conversation, but it's not represented in the materials that were submitted. So, I'll tell you what I understand from my conversation w with Paul and also some of the things he said at the affordable housing trust. this is really just combining two buildings,
>> you know, so that that wouldn't be providing everything he wanted, but he had talked about maybe having a frontage building with some type of arch where you could drive in underneath it and then have parking on the side and above. Um, and I think that would be what would get him to his um density that he
references later uh in his documents. Again, same same scenario. You have the the uh dumpster over here. There's no way you're going to be able to deal with that. The angles there are just way off. and then getting out again. Um, but again, this is a case where, you know, if you straightened it out and you had
one building here, this kind of shows you how combining the two buildings together might give you some space here to come out and then also maybe some area for some type of um playground area, which I know was something that the community housing committee was concerned about because there are three three-bedroom units uh in in this
development. Um, so this is a little weird because this isn't the real plan, I don't think. think there's something else going on in the front that's not represented. Um there he had also talked about maybe taking this this building here and moving it to the center and having you come in and maybe having some
parking underneath. >> So interesting idea. Uh it would get more parking um hidden. It would provide more buffers to to multiple areas. You probably would come out the other end and there might be some additional parking uh in the rear and that type of
thing. So I don't know if that's real. It was just a conversation. It's not represented here in in any particular way. I don't know how you comment on it. >> Yeah. >> Um and I don't want to be commenting on kind of >> speculation and then then he doesn't mention it at the ZBA and they're like what's the planning board talking about?
>> You know um so it gets a little confusing but they also um submitted another a different elevation. I think this would be more for the combined or a larger building still three stories. They had shown this way back when when they were doing their
um initial eligibility letter to to the state. >> Um I I like the fact that there's a little bit more elements to it. I like the pitched roof. Um but I really kind of um I'm not a huge fan.
But you know that is it something we could work with? >> Probably. Probably. And that's the thing that you know Paul was saying is you know once we get some of the layouts I go he goes we can work on the envelope we can work on what the buildings look like after that. Um so that that was a
comforting comment because I think the um the aesthetics of the of the the um the smaller three of the threetory buildings was not necessarily appropriate for Cape Cod. Um I'm not sure how far you can go but I think even just like this little bit of a roof goes a long way. And maybe again if they
overhang it a little bit more, some brackets make it look a little bit more bungalowy, you might have some something there that you might be able to work with. >> Madam Chair, >> uh Mr. >> Just a quick just a process question. So their hearing is on the 13th, >> correct? >> So then when do they have to have they
have to have something way more >> This is what they submitted in preparation for that meeting. >> November. Given that I watched the first hearing >> at the zoning board, can't speak for them, but I would be surprised
if they would be able to approve something. >> Oh, I don't think they're going to approve anything. I think the impression I got was we've they've heard a lot of things from >> This is more of a we're reporting back on what we've done. >> Back on some ideas that we had, you know, where do you think we should be heading? >> Here's a conceptual take.
>> Yes. on it and then have more discussion as they did for almost an hour last maybe 45 minutes. >> I'm assuming that's where this conversation would come in. Would you prefer us to have the building in the center and then have parking underneath? Because I think they can they I don't want to spend a lot of time on something
that that the um ZBA is like, "No, we really didn't want that. We really wanted something different." >> So, what I'm what I guess what I'm getting at is next Thursday's meeting is not a meeting to approve anything. Next Thursday's meeting is a meeting to discuss more concepts and then to be asked to go away and then come back
again. >> That would be my interpretation. Yes. >> Okay. I'm just I'm just sort of checking in on it from our perspective because to comment, as you said earlier, in my opinion, to comment on something that isn't quite fleshed out, I'll use that term, Madam Chair, I don't believe makes
a ton of sense. Although, I do believe we could maybe write a shorter memo to re-emphasize some of our general concerns as we did a month ago. Um, however, it may be better to keep the powder dry for another 30 days until they have the next packet, which
presumably will be more definitive. That's just my >> That's why I want to check in on the timing to sort of maybe open up a discussion, Madam Chair, about what what we should do, which is I assume something you would like to talk about tonight. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you. >> Whether it's tonight or something or
>> Yeah. Or both. >> Or both. I just I just wanted to check in on the is this what the ZBA is going to be talking about? And if that's the case, >> then there's certainly this is only round two of many. >> I think even if you write a comment letter with generically kind of was just reiterating, we understand doesn't seem
like there's a fully fleshed out. There's multiple options. We we're just want you to know we're still keeping an eye on it, but we don't really see anything that we can sink our teeth into with regard to comments. I don't want him to think that you've just gone away that you're fine. >> Of course. I just wanted to try to see if there was a middle ground. It sounds like you've identified. Thank you, Madam
Chair. Uh, Miss Vera, >> Joanne, do we have to comment before um for the November 13th meeting or could we wait till after the zoning board has the hearing and then comment on the totality of what we heard? >> I'll defer to Kathy.
>> Yeah, I mean, you could just send something to say we've received this, but we're really, it seems like there's multiple options here. We would like to def defer our comments until after we hear what they have. >> That might be one way to go. And madam chair, I'd just like to throw in my quick two cents on that is that you know
some of the comments I've heard are some of the stuff I was thinking like for example the very simple one of exit on the Pine Grove because I think number one the fire department is going to want that and two there's no way you're going to get a fire truck backing out onto Route 28 if this thing's full which >> we talked about a year ago.
>> Exactly right. So I guess you know my comment is I I do agree you know wait to see what's coming out of ZBA but I think what might help them is at least some of our generic comments just looking at it tonight. >> Yeah. I can't imagine how serious I mean common sense would tell you you couldn't
back a truck or fire truck or and so that to me is like not a serious >> attempt. That is just common sense. Why would they send that knowing that that's like dead unraveled? Yeah, the fire department would say
there's not enough turnaround. Um, and nix it. Um, and even if there were a hydrant, they still need to be able to >> turn around, >> you know, have appropriate access. >> I mean, imagine, forget about a fire truck. What about a moving truck? People are going to be moving in and out of this place. That's a good point.
>> How you getting them out of there? >> You're not going to back out on 28. That's for sure. >> Yeah. I think that's a good comment. You know, we you need you need some type of egress in order to not have people back. >> 10 feet the 10 feet. Sorry. Go ahead. >> No, no, Ken. >> The access to Pine Grove.
>> The 10 feet is >> they they definitely need two two points of uh um you know, entry and eress. >> And I, you know, as commented, I do have a concern that you're going to have families living here and there's not square one of space for kids to have a little bit of fun, you know.
>> And also the 10 commented on before, right? Yes. Yeah. >> And the 10 ft here is um >> that's going to be really tough. And and and a the neighbors from Pine Grove didn't have an opportunity to say anything at the ZBA meeting because it just never got to that part of the of the discussion. And I assume it may not
even get there um next Thursday. But but I would I would assume the ZBA will take very seriously the concerns of a neighborhood if a plan is eventually submitted, let's say, in December that has a setback of only 10 feet. I just I I'd be really surprised if they weren't
going to take that incredibly seriously. So, those could be some of the ways that we could be a little proactive without being definitive as this process continues. Um, >> Madam Chair, thank you. >> Thank you. Well, >> Susan, did you have something else? >> I was just going to say when they when
they um >> appeared in front of us almost two years ago at this point, it was remember it was mixed use and it looked relatively decent and we were generally supportive of it. And then they came back and said it didn't um they couldn't quote financially make it work.
>> And I have always wondered what that meant. What are they expecting out of that project? And because I think that is driving the the density and the overbuilding on this site is that they expect to make a certain amount of money on this site. Um and and I don't know um
I don't know what it is. I don't know what they expect to do. I don't know what the and and of course I don't if they ever come back I would of course ask them what what is your you know what is your investment plan what do you expect to make because I do think that's driving this density issue which in some cases and all the other problems are
insurmountable I mean you cannot get the amount based on what we would have as a normal parking requirement you're not going to get the the amount of parking spaces they need with a design like this um so there there has to be some modification
Um, and this doesn't seem like a great idea as a modification to have like one row in. So, I just don't know whether, you know, whether it gets to the point where the zoning board basically says, you know, you're not going to get there with this
kind of density. You you need to rethink your investment plan or, you know, do something else because you can't get there from here. um if you want to make x amount of money, you're not going to make it off this site because it's just the density you're going to acquire is just not going to work. And all the
things that go with that density are just not going to work. the the setbacks, the parking, um, and all the other they asked for, I think, nine serious way, uh, variances, the trees, although they kind of poo pooed the trees, which I thought was annoying, but
but um, and at some point someone, and I think that's going to be zoning's job at some point to say to them, you're not going to get there. This is just not going to work. Uh, and I don't know how long they and and the role that we play in all of that. and we obviously would
be supportive of whatever you know zoning issues as we can be be supportive of what you know they've already commented on. Um but I you're right. I don't think we I don't think the planning board needs to be or should get in a position where anything we say is
oh well the planning said you know three stories or the planning said put a fence in or the planning board said because words have consequences and this is just a bad plan and it's not any better now than it was the one they presented you know what was it a month ago or five
weeks ago. Um it's just not any better. this stuff may look a little bit better. You know, the design may look a little bit better, but the guts of the plan is still not a good plan. >> Madam Chair, can I ask a question in terms of if we if we did write a memo
>> in the next couple of days to get to the ZBA? I think one of the things we could just repeat is that this the site itself is 1.07 acres 08 somewhere in there. >> It's a tiny I don't know how else to say it. it's really small and um that
fundamentally has been our issue from the jump and I do agree with you that when we met with them in the fall of 2023 it at least appeared >> that that particular site could absorb the initial design which again notwithstanding anyone's private business and their ability to you know
put a spreadsheet together that shows a plus or you know a black number at the bottom and not a red number um there just seem to be some fundamental issues that, you know, I think we can still be express our deep concern about um not to
mention again as Susan and others have have have brought up uh some more of the operational sides of the site, but but also the lack of I think we could speak as the planning board in terms of the the mixeduse element that seems to be very I'll just use the word vague at
this point. It was pretty clear in the first iteration. It is now gone. It is sort of magically, you know, disappeared, which I guess is their right. >> Remember, it was almost a separate building. >> It was above the top of the shop, wasn't it? >> It was a separate it was a separate
giving the previous design a lot more credit. >> I Well, well, Kathy, this is why this is why your your brain works better than ours. My understanding is that they they were originally um also they were trying to originally I think keep the laundromat building which was in kind of crazy but I think it was going to be an
oyster bar or something because I think Steve Clearary had um done that elsewhere but when we started talking about well you're not going to have enough parking for an oyster bar and residential and that's when it kind of they never I don't think really wanted to do the residential act obviously
chapter 40b is more residential they're happy to have 100% um residential and not have mixed use. I think maybe them having their offices here on the first floor of the front building is not a bad idea. They can keep eyes on things, you know, maybe um and this is again anecdotally that I heard from somebody
else, not from Paul, that that might be a possibility. So there's a lot of different things that are kind of going out there and the general idea I get is that they want to go and make some arguments and some presentations to the ZBA and we'll talk about the next slides
are here um about why that they're not really all that dense. It's really not all that much when you compare it to some other things that they then show. >> Yeah, but that's never that's never a good decision. >> And those sites are literally double the size if I looked at the math right. Correct. Those are over two acres those
other sites whereas this is literally a 1.07 or roughly acre site. It is tiny >> for a lot of residences that >> not to mention. Exactly. Then let's add in the abutters and the proximity therein >> trying to put 55 to 60 people plus 30
plus cars into a 1.07 acre lot. You're gonna have cars parking up and down Pine >> Pine Grover into the back of the neighborhood, which is >> not great. >> If I was a neighbor, I'd say no thanks. >> And I don't know if you saw the previous
ZBA hearing. Um it is worth a watch because I think it was an interesting um adventure for someone who was coming in front of the ZBA who was trying to basically dance um without getting an outright vote which I don't think was
going to go in his favor and sort of buy himself some time but the but the turnout just so you know the turnout was was high in terms of the abutters. So and that will continue. >> Yeah. Um, but I will, it feels like we're just going to be doing more dancing next Thursday and and and and
hopefully we'll be able to support, you know, the continued >> concerns and objection, I won't say objections, concerns that we have we've had for a while. >> I think one of the things that did come out of the affordable housing trust was they were emphasizing the bill of center overlay district zoning. And so I think
Paul actually looked at that much more closely. You may not realize there's a lot of cookies that come with the VCOD and a lot of things that could potentially be allowed here. Uh including up to four stories, 48 feet if you're 50 feet from the property line.
So there is, you know, a piece of land, you know, thing in the center here where you could potentially be four stories. Granted, it's at least 50 feet back from and you have to meet all the other design standards, etc., etc. So it's not it's not
the zoning is not allocart. >> Um but there there are a lot of things that are allowed in the village center overlay district that something significant could happen on this site with our current zoning I guess is what I'm trying to say by right
with our current zoning if done well and done right. >> So just something to think about. It is in the VCOD and we were anticipating a higher level of development on this site than the underlying zoning. But Kathy, wouldn't they still have problems with the parking? >> Even park under the building. They could
park under the building. And you know, you know, that's one of those things. We're talk about finances. That's not cheap. So, they have to really think about that. >> Um, >> but you know, they could go underground a little bit, you know, and dig down a little and whatever. Um, >> sure. They won't hit any water or anything.
>> It's not even hitting water. It's in a flood plane, Kathy. So, >> no, it's not. >> It's not in the velocity zone, but it's in the flood. >> No, it's just outside. >> Really? either it's just out I think it might be just outside the 500 or just pieces of it are in the 500. I looked at it too because I was surprised by how
high they had set the first floor elevation. I didn't know if that was related to that. Um but it's not >> okay. It's it's it's not a good it's not a bad idea per se, but >> yeah, it's right because I know um on the library project I think that entire strip was considered slush slush zone
which is I think every was it every that's not public building so it wouldn't it wouldn't come to into effect I don't think >> and it's slush every hundred years a hurricane every hundred years >> it have to be a category four >> zones is basically the storm surge from different levels of hurricanes
>> and it have to be a category have to a category 4 and if we have category 4 >> and since 1929 or something. Yeah, >> that remember that whole strip along 28 was designated as something wet. >> We saw a big difference between the
previous firm flood maps and when they changed them in 2014. So, a lot of the village center overlay district got put into a flood zone when it hadn't been before when the when the zoning was originally developed. So, not necessarily
something to think about when we're zoning our little village nodes is yes, it's nice to be near the river, but then you also have all these other uh issues to to tend. >> Any any other uh comments or questions? Dear, did you have anything? >> Well, I I wanted to point out that Mary approached me the other day. a lot of
every we've been discussing this at the community housing committee as well and she said that uh some there had been some comments about her statement earlier that there is a they need a lot of studio and
one-bedroom apartments that somebody said that wasn't necessarily true and could I find any Census Bureau data to support that so I spent some time >> digging stuff up and the the Census
Bureau's site isn't working because of the shutdown, but I had stuff on my computer and I found some other sites and I threw this together for Mary and I made copies for everybody because I thought it was interesting. It has to do with uh the you know the size size of
units and everything, but also there's some >> Thank you. >> I think that's what I one two three four. I thought Mary looked at the people who were actually applying for the lottery, what they really needed, and a lot of those were people who were looking for studios.
>> That's what prompted this, that the lottery was 68% looking for studio and onebedrooms. So, she was wondering if there was any data to support that. Oh, I see. Perfect. >> So, I just pulled up this is not all relevant, but I just thought it was a
lot of interesting stuff that everybody might want to have. And uh Mary said I I haven't talked to her since I sent it to her, but I hope it will help her. >> 37% of the households are one person household. That's pretty high. >> That's pretty high. Yeah.
>> And she was also even two person, you know, if you add those two together, that's >> 76%. >> Yeah, it really really does. And that's people that would be looking for a studio in one bedroom. So, >> and Mary did make a very good point. You know, on Route 28, >> studios and one bedrooms are probably
better than anything related to families. She didn't I think if we could avoid having the three bedrooms, she would like that to be uh the case because families, that's not necessarily a great place for families, but it's a great place for someone who wants to work at Stop and Shop or wants to catch the the transit and go into Hyannis or a
lot of different things that that would be beneficial. So, >> so yeah, that's interesting. I think that number right there tells you a lot >> need to know. Yeah. >> But basically that you know this has been a major discussion at that
committee and everybody's pretty much saying the same thing that we're saying that you know the parking playground the the looks of the building and all those kind of things. And uh I'm just kind of intrigued by the fact that the ZBA when
I watched it the first time they really didn't they really kept saying well we want a real plan and so we're going to come back now with something that's still not >> I would I would imagine there'd be some frustration when they have their hearing next Thursday. >> Concerned that I'm concerned about that
>> may not go well. >> Yeah. I mean, they don't typically, >> right, >> they don't typically um get their opinion asked like that judge on a project. >> That's why I asked if this was what was actually submitted. >> Yes. >> Because they can't submit any more. I don't believe
>> the only thing else that they submitted was our reports from BSC groups on mixed use and union studios on mixed use >> and still no letter. >> I no letter updated letter from the state. No letter >> was not in the packet.
>> No. >> No. >> Do you know what we're talking about? >> No. I'm sorry. Sorry. >> Well, when they first came to us in 2023, um it was for 23 units, >> right? >> And then when they went to ZB and Oh, sorry. And it had an expiration date of
approximately Halloween of 2025. >> I did read that in the packet, but I wasn't sure. >> Cut to cut to the ZBA hearing a month ago, but they came to ZBA asking for 27, >> right? >> And the ZBA rightfully said, "What's this?" and they made assurances verbally that everything was fine. And the ZBA
basically said, if I recall, well, let's >> show me, >> go back to the um state department of >> state departments and get what you need. And as Madam Chair just said, they have not submitted that >> a new letter. >> And yet they're still asking for
>> however many units. >> They need a letter from the executive office of housing and affordable. >> Yes, thank you, Madam Chair. Yeah, this says 26. This one's still asking for 26. >> That's not what the literally the permission was for 23, >> right? So, >> thank you.
>> Yeah, you're welcome. >> So, Kathy, do you have enough to try to craft >> Can I just maybe just tell some of the other information? >> Oh, yeah, sure. You have you had given us other information. >> One of the other things that they were trying to do is um we do not have floor area ratio. That's trying to give you an idea of what percentage of the site
should be the gross floor, the gross building area divided by the gross area of the particular lot. We don't have that in the town of Yarmouth, but he did go and look at all the different benchmarking projects in the BSC group and tried to determine, you know, what the floor area ratio is. This is a little skewed, especially like some
things like um some of the projects in Harbor. I mean, the 40% they had 27 parking spaces offsite. I don't know whether he took that into consideration or not, but Peter Slovak sent me an email asking about well what is it for Yarmouth Commons and what is it for Yarmouth Gardens. So I just went on the
assessors and looked at the what they have on there and Yarmouth Commons is 16 units per acre and that was about 38.4%. >> Yarmouth Gardens which is 20 units per acre ended up being like 48.4% floor area ratio. So, looking at the,
you know, Yarmouth Commons does have a nice open green space, which is nice for the kids and everything. Um, even Yarmouth Commons does have where they were able to put in some u playground area for the kids in the back of one of the units. It's really in the corner way in the back, which is nice because it's
isolated, and they were able to put something in there. And then he's showing what he has for his uh 897 uh as being 53.3%. Again, he's trying to show an argument that he's not that far off from a lot of the mixeduse projects that the planning
board liked as part of their assessment. And I did say to him that this information was presented to the planning board. You guys haven't accepted, you haven't digested, you haven't said, "Oh, this is gung-ho. We're going to go with this." Um, but it was, it was a very good analysis and it was good food for thought for something
for the future. Not necessarily any didn't buy in say stamp stamp approved on it is what I tried to tell. >> Gardens is literally twice the size, >> right? Because it says on here 1.07 versus 2.14. >> Yes. >> Literally twice the size. >> Right. >> Yep.
>> How many units at uh >> it's 40 at Yarmouth Gardens and then there's 69 at Yarmouth Commons. >> Okay. >> It's not quite 20 units per acre. It's something >> a little less than. Um and then the other thing which I thought was kind of
interesting argument that he tried to make with regard to the parking um he was taking a look at Yarm 497 is Yarmouth Gardens uh and and this isn't really fair with regard to parking because again it's 100% of for 60% of
median area income and then 10% is even 30%. So there's a lot of people there that may not have cars uh at all or certainly not two cars per per. So he was just kind of going to give you an idea of what the residential density is and then also the bedroom density which
I thought was kind of interesting looking at the number percentage of bedrooms. Um and then his his project isn't that dissimilar from the number of bedrooms in in at Yarmouth Gardens. And then he looked at the total number of parkings and then the parkings per bedroom. He analyzed that and he was
saying well Yarmouth Yarmouth Gardens is fine and has 0.83 parking spaces per unit. But again, that's extremely low uh income, whereas he's only going to have 25% probably 80% area median income and then the rest would be market rate. So, it's not a
it's not a onetoone type of thing, but the idea of maybe having one parking space per bedroom was an interesting argument. I thought it was an interesting argument. Um, so he made that. And then the other even more confusing thing is um he put
in Yarm the Yarmouth Gardens and he showed the night you know the little elevation there. Um and then kind of was saying to me like well you know this is kind of like if we took half this we could maybe do one of the buildings in Yarmouth Gardens and if we did that
maybe we just hired these architects and build something similar. uh Yarmouth Commons or Yarmouth Gardens and is a two-story building. >> So, I think he was thinking, well, he could keep it two stories, but he'd need to stretch it out. >> I put this building on top of the site
and it takes up a lot more. You could only get this size building on there. So, he would have to do a third story to make to make it happen. >> Uh but I thought that was interesting. A totally new idea. he would put put aside the green stacks and do had to hire and do something you know that he knows that
we liked which was Yarmouth Yarmouth Garden. So I appreciated that. Um but again I don't it's in here but it doesn't say why it's in here and I only know this because of the conversation that I had. So I I had the same concerns that Will had that ZBA saying it's not
our job to tell you what to do, right? Uh it's it's it's your job to present a project to us and we'll tell you what our concerns are and then you have to take that and make your project. >> Um >> and and to be quite honest with you, a lot of this process that they're looking for would have come out of a friendly
40B local initiative project where they come and they meet with staff. They come and meet with me. We talk about it. We make suggestions. We make ideas. Um like Yarmouth Commons was definitely done that way. Yarmouth Gardens was definitely done that way. and then we kind of work together to get something that we think is palatable and and would
be a good fit for our community. Um this going directly to the state and not going through the local initiative um kind of bypassed all that interactive conversation and even when we did ask them to come to site plan review and they did come to site plan review they didn't do anything with any of the
comments that were provided. Um but now I think maybe they're thinking let's work a little bit more together with people. So hopefully there's some there were some good things in here with regard in the the conversation that I had. Uh it sounded as though they might be more open. But again, you know, it's
where the tire hit the rubber hits the road and the exact um proposal is what we really need to be concentrating on. And I don't want to keep commenting ad nausea on on something. So I think the idea of maybe um reiter you know just simply stating
there doesn't seem to be a one single defined proposal but these are some of the general comments that we would have and we'd like to hear more from the ZBA and then we might have more comments after that. >> Madam Chair, could I just reiterate one thing? I think it's totally within our purview to in a friendly way remind our
friends at the zoning board who know this but I think it's good to see in writing that this was presented to us as you know with this was presented as permission for 23 units two years ago and now we're here at a second goaround or a third goaround and they're still asking for more and they have as yet
>> provided anything in writing that says they have permission to do anything else or anything more than 23 and I think it'd be important not that the ZBA has forgotten because clearly they won't but I I think it's important to show unity between how both of our boards feel that there seems to be some very fundamental
like before we even discuss anything at all about any >> where's where's the where's the letter >> where's the where's the proof where's the beef as those of us who are old enough to remember >> time on this if they do have a letter >> because I think the ZBA could be within their rights to say do you have a letter no meeting adjourned you know like
that's the kind of vibe I think we should be you know again it's their meeting and I know they run an excellent meeting and they follow an excellent process us. I just think it would be nice to show that we're pretty much aligned in this way and to and maybe just so they know that we have not
received anything. Not that we deserve it, but >> certainly all these things do work together and to shows that we do work in concert >> and and fundamental point of departure is you're going to be authorized to do this, >> right? >> Because what what we don't want to do is come up with a plan and then have it go
back to the state and say, "Gee, Yama thinks this is a fabulous plan. Give now give us a letter." That's what we want to avoid. Yeah, >> they'll get the letter. >> Chair, can I make a small comment? >> Yes. >> Just looking at this from a 30,000 foot level, I'm starting to see that this
appears to me to be a sense of desperation on the developers part because they're trying to get something done because they're losing money and they want somebody to to say pick this, you do it. And I I I just think they're trying to force something down to town.
That's my opinion. >> Thank you, Tom. Paul specifically said, and it's interesting that you use those words, that that he did not want to jam something down. >> Um, and and you know, he may find that maybe the housing isn't right and maybe
now that he knows more about the >> go back to commercial. He'll look at, you know, maybe it's maybe it's a hotel site, it's a hotel, put a Starbucks up there. >> Yeah. >> And, you know, there's a lot of there's a lot of opportunities in the BCOD. Whether the neighbors will be happier with one over the other, I don't know
because I think anything more substantial than what's there now, which is a one-story building with literally half of the property completely wooded. >> It's going to be a jolt jolt. You know, it's just going to be a jolt. >> So, um, did you want to say anything about the parking or I'm glad that they
increased the number of parking spaces and I like and again, I thought that the argument of the one space per bedroom made some sense. So, you don't have to. I'm just throwing it out there. >> We're we're commenting on the three
on the on the three building and the one building, threetory because that's all that we have in front of us. >> Two building. They say 36. Again, he says two building, but he never shows that option with two buildings. You only see the two building
>> here. The the the um paper that we have though has three buildings, >> right? That's this one here. >> So, we've got three buildings and one building, >> right? We don't have a two. >> We don't have a two. >> How can you comment on something that doesn't >> literally say we are reluctant to comment on something that hasn't been
formally submitted >> or we but we still have concerns about the parking and yet we still have not seen anything definitive. >> I think what will brought up is important. I think we really should emphasize uh the fundamental issue right now is are you authorized to do this and
and we and we probably should wait till the state authorizes and then we can have a more fruitful discussion. I don't want to get them in a position where they sort of pump up the plan that everyone thinks is workable and then they run back to the state and say Yamoth thinks this is fabulous. I I I I
I I I agree, U Susan, and I'm hoping we can construct a letter that doesn't put us in a position of being favorable or unfavorable on these plans that we're not sure what they are. We've commented favorably and
unfavorably on what we saw before, >> which to be honest with you is the first version. I mean, >> it's just moved. This this you could probably provide comments on because it's >> assuming everything else is the same as they presented previous but it is
>> but it's essentially the same >> no improvement in fact in many respects it's worse >> right but I think the comments would be the general comments of providing the secondary means of egress out to circulate you know some of those generic comments >> yeah but also the the 10- foot setback
is just >> oh the 10 foot so I just said you know the concerns about the two points of of entry the dead end uh for you know trash, fire, moving trucks, families, no space for the kids, and the 10 to 11 foot buffer is too close. >> Um >> and it looks like the entrances, I'll
call them building two and three, face Pine Grove. >> This facing each other, >> this is the side of the building, >> right? So, but I if I recall bu I'll
call them building two and three before were facing each other. Yes, >> they changed the orientation. >> The entry would be >> the elevation >> face essentially they're facing east. >> The front of the building, >> the front of the building is facing
west. >> Yeah. See, there's those little Yeah, there's a little tiny there's a little tiny walkway sidewalk right there. >> This is an idea. You know, maybe they could do something to make it look like a And we've done this before where people have like a faux something um to
make it look a little bit nicer. This side being facing route 28 is not desirable, but that's a possibility of maybe reorient that that's a possibility of reorienting reorienting this one. >> So the back of the buildings is still
facing Pine Grove. >> Pine Grove. >> Yeah. But I think you can make that look better. >> You know, it's just such a small lot. I mean, no matter what you do there, >> but again, but again, Kathy, we we we
don't know which of these two are being >> submitted as an application to the zoning board of appeals. >> Do they? >> Yeah. So, we could say due to lack of clarity. >> Well, and and that's where they can get away with saying progress plan. You know, I when I first got the packet, I was like, "Okay, well, so now we're just
going to go next Thursday and have another conversation and to see what chairman I go is willing to go for." And I look forward to seeing that hearing because I don't think they're going to be best pleased to have another conversation of uh as they say in
England, jigory pokery. I just it just >> Well, you can look it up. >> Um it's just it's it's just I don't think it's a good use of anybody's time. >> It doesn't. >> I'd be really surprised if the chairman of the ZBA feels like his time is being well used. >> And at this point, I don't think ours is
either. >> Yes, Madam Chair. I'll be quiet. No problem. >> No, no, no. I'm I'm in agreement with you. We I should be Let's wrap it up. >> No, no. >> I'm in agreement with that. >> Um,
>> so Kathy, you have enough to You think uh >> think if you guys put It's not going to be very long. >> It doesn't need to be. >> No, it shouldn't be by Joanne. >> Yes. >> And come to some consensus and then >> Yes, please. >> But you're going to send it to us first,
right? copy of it before. >> I think it should just go to Joanne. Susan, >> Joanne and I work on it together. >> Okay. But I would like to read it before. >> Okay. But Susan, just to say as a point of order, we've had many, many, many memos. >> Yeah, but this one Yeah, but this one, >> please let me finish. We've had many
memos that Madame Chair and Kathy have written on our behalf and we've never had an issue. I'm not disagreeing. I'm just reminding you of the last memo. >> Let's Let's do this. Can I make a comment? The last memo we all looked at. >> That's the only point. I just wanted to be consistent. Yes, because I sent
comments to Kathy. >> Yep. I said I have the I have the email right there. You sent it out and you said this is what we're going to send and I wrote back a couple of comments. >> I don't recall that. But I don't recall a lot of >> Kathy. You don't have to send. >> Okay, let's do let's do this. >> Kathy, send it to everybody. Um you'll
have one hour turnaround because Kathy and I are going to send it to me. >> You do not deliberate. >> And then the final decision needs to be Joanne. >> Yes. >> Okay. Yeah. All good. We're all good with that. >> Okay, great. Um,
next on our agenda, I think we're done with this, Kath, right? Okay. Uh, special town meeting November 17th. >> Kathy and I met with the uh >> select board. >> Um, and I I thought it was a very
favorable meeting. Uh, Kathy did great as always. Uh and the select board seemed to be um pretty much in line with we where we are in terms of >> uh number one on the local comp
comprehensive plan. They they uh were uh very supportive of all the hard work that we put in. Good. and think think of it as a as a really good comprehensive plan that should you know pass through town meeting hopefully um without any uh
objection. Uh they were very pleased with the effort um on the two zoning articles. Uh again there are mixed uh views on them but they I believe are um moved forward with their with the um
with the notion that our our legislative arm is our town meeting and town meeting um should decide although uh there were mixed uh com opinions among the select board members and I mentioned as part of our presentation that there were mixed
opinions on this board. >> Yes. um as well. Uh so, but I I the the review the review with them went uh I think rather well. So, I think we're in good. >> They did vote on things at the end. >> They did. Yeah. We didn't stay >> were unanimous on the LCP and on the
lobster and I think it was um 32 the boat >> on the boat. Jim Sabin did stop by today to say that he is planning on um making an amendment from the floor to eliminate the seasonality bullet. Just you just
wanted me to let you guys know so you won't be surprised. Um, >> how how do amendments I know money amendments you can't have an amendment that increases >> I don't think them doing this would would um
>> but for language amendments it it merely is for us it's just language and and any amendment can be written and presented. I don't think town council would have an issue with that particular amendment, but it might be worth mentioning to him
ahead of time, but I don't think that they would have an issue with that. And the whole idea is you can't change the article so significantly that someone at home when they're just looking at the warrant and said decided not to come, right? >> Don't realize >> or that it's more restrictive, >> but I don't think that's an I think that's a rule of thumb. I don't think
it's an actual thing. >> Yeah. >> In there. So, um, >> so, so I just wanted to to let you guys know that, um, the town moderator will be advised as well, I trust. I hope. >> Yeah. Yeah. That they're, um, they
wanted to have a meeting Monday, um, with they typically have a prep meeting. >> Um, I'm not going to be there, but I can let them know about the um about that as well. Uh and the other uh part of the
discussion with the select board is our presentation uh at town meeting of the local comprehensive plan and >> uh >> I'll take all suggestions. uh my comments my the the basic I think
underlying comment that I made to the board select board was it's important that the public understand that this is not an authorization >> or an appropriation. >> It's neither of those things. >> Right. Exactly. >> It doesn't it doesn't say yes, we're
going to absolutely do these things and yes, we're going to pay for them. >> It does not say that. It's it's a plan that that will change >> all the time. >> Um, and I think that's kind of the important message is they're not voting
to do all these things, >> right? >> Um, >> and why we're doing it. It's a requirement by the state and >> and the benefits. >> The benefits, the ability to get money and all that. >> Exactly. People don't understand the benefits because a lot of it are related to not having to go through the Cape Cot Commission and modifying the thresholds
and people like the Cape Cot Commission thresholds development, regional impact. What does that mean? >> What does that mean? Growth incentive zone and it's just like I don't want to get into a law Toronto. I think the fact that it's required for all communities to have one >> off Cape it's a master plan. On Cape it's a local comprehensive plan.
>> Yeah. >> Um >> Madam Chair, my suggestion would be that Kathy not present every single goal from every single section. I hope so. So I would basically do a version of what you've done here as well as at the select board, but take out the slides
that show all seven, 8, 12, 7, 10, you know, outcomes. Um and and also politely re-emphasize to those that will probably be hearing about the local comprehensive plan for the first time on November 17th that this process started with the
vision plan in 2021 >> and that this is just the culmination not to mention the housing production plan, the open space and w plan etc etc etc. This is just a culmination and in some some ways an amalgamation of a lot of other things. I think it is it's like
it is putting all in one place everything that we're already working on and already doing and already concerned about. Um >> and aren't there some provision didn't aren't you also going to enumerate the fact that there's a yearly check-in not to mention the work of the planning board and other places u you know much
more frequently than yearly. >> I think it would take a look at the executive summary >> and just okay let's just hit that >> and then talk about what what the LCP is and what it isn't. And you're you have made a good point at the select board about um you know lots of times having
action items in the LCP can help boost your grant application. >> So there might be a lot of things in here but it the idea is making sure that we've got things covered so that we can you know use other people's monies to the maximum extent possible. >> I think those are the important points
Kath um and not getting into the the weeds of it. >> Maybe you and I can maybe have a little conversation too as well. I think um would would it be helpful to have the executive summary available at the meeting? >> People walk in.
>> I forget how how many pages. Yeah, I don't I forget how many pages it is. >> How many I'll be nerdy. I read the whole thing. >> Congratulations. >> That means you're a good planning. >> How many cups of coffee did you need, Tom? >> No, I you know, but I read it as where we were, where we are now, and what we
would like to get to. That's exactly >> more of a snapshot of of past, present, and future. >> And it's not it's not fixed in stone. This is a living, breathing document as we move forward. That's how I read it.
But I think the executive summary is >> You summarized it perfectly, Tom. >> Sounds like you're presenting your town meeting manager. Thank you. >> No, I nominate him. >> No, I don't I would never never speak for you. >> Is that we had talked about is that something that everyone's comfortable having Joanne? Typically what happens is
someone needs to move it, read the explanation, and then probably hand it over to me for the very I don't want to be talking for >> no >> 10 minutes max. >> We're at the very end, aren't we? >> No, we're number six. They moved >> They've moved us up so we'll be fully >> panic fidgety at town meeting and they
don't you know they lose we're all too old. We lose track and we you know we start to fall asleep. So >> the zoning articles are still at the end though. >> They are. >> They are. >> Yeah. The last two >> lobster then boat, >> right? >> How many how many uh things on the warrant, Kathy?
>> 15. >> 15. >> Um, and I think one of the other things I I got to update the website. I just wanted to let people maybe be able to look at different just click on the different sections, you know, get right to like
what they might want to look at. Like I just want to look at the implementation matrix. I just want to look at the executive summary so they don't have to open the whole thing if they don't want to. Um, and then I was thinking of maybe doing some type and I don't know if I have time, but some type of like basic frequently asked questions, you know,
and I don't and that's kind of I was thinking maybe a one or two pager like kind of explaining what it is, >> but if we're going to do the executive summary, um, >> I think that's all you need to do. >> 400 executive summary prints outs. >> Yeah. >> Oh, >> so just I mean you need 400. They make
you do 400 copies because you don't know who's going to be at town meeting or not. Could it could we put it on the website? >> It is on the It is on the website now. Yeah. Um >> that's why I was thinking of one backtoback pager that just >> FAQs
>> just Yeah. Just what what's a local comprehensive plan? Why do we need one? A lot of the things. What's included in it? You know, just like how you would >> and then maybe a little QR code. >> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. >> Because that way people don't have to try to pushing the piece of paper with their finger. Yes.
It would just be one piece of paper, Kath. >> Doublesided. >> Yeah. Okay. >> Great. >> Yeah. Just figure out what to include in that, make it fit on that. But that's something that I'm I'm working on. >> Um and and you and I can work on that. Yeah, >> that would be perfect. Great. I'd
appreciate that. >> Um and when we get to a point where we think we've got a product, we'll share it with all of you um and get some >> get some comments back. >> Thank you. I want to make more copies of the the final LCP too so that you guys all have it and get them bound
along. >> Can we um just the final thing is just confirm that Ken would do the motion for the boat parking. Yes. >> I already had said I wanted you right up there. I think >> lobster is
>> I volunteered to do that, Madam Chair. >> Yeah, there I thought so. Okay, great. Anything more on local comprehensive plan? Okay, moving on. Um, committee assignments, >> Mr. Smith, may I start with you?
>> Sure. >> Your preferences? >> Uh, yeah, I was going through it. My my preference actually would to go on to design review, but if Peter's on it, I don't want to step on his toes. I don't know what Will's thoughts about staying on rack.
>> Um I I would say I'm certainly open to moving. I do think that with one exception that you know, Ken and I have each done two capital budget committee cycles and that is a lot. >> So I'd be open to moving anywhere if it pleases the the rest of the group. Um
but but capital budget committee is not for me. Um, I do think it's an important thing that everybody on the planning board, if they have the chance to go through a cycle, >> should do because it is literally the best way to learn about how the town functions
>> inside and out. >> Yeah, it's a great committee. There's a ton of work and process that go into it. >> You know, Sandy, who runs it, who's the chair, >> does a tremendous job. Um, but as Will put it, one of my constraints to it is
the time of pulling out of work to go and do it. >> Is it five? >> Well, no, the meetings are at five, but going to visit all the departments we do during the daytime. >> And so I'm like literally jumping out of work to go visit one of the department heads and then go back to work and then go to a meeting
>> every Monday night now for the last 11 weeks. It's a lot, >> right? On the flip side, once you get to >> it's over December, you're done. Turns into a pump. It's we're done. Yeah. Next week is the last >> is the last meeting that we have to have
until we meet with finance and we meet with the select board. And so we're we're done. It but it there's a lot of tremendous good that comes out of this committee. >> But I just as I had mentioned before two cycles I would like to do something else. >> Yes.
>> So you would stay on board through town meeting? >> I will stay on board through Yeah. I'm I'm committed through this year. I will stay on board through spring town meeting. So, this assignment would begin summer next year. >> That's correct. I will stay on board through spring town meeting and then >> Yeah, that that's the natural time for
for the assignment to switch. >> When does that typically start? >> Um October, September, late September, early October. And the nice part is when you have that first meeting, it's pretty clearly laid out like these are the meetings we're going to have for this
little sprint. September, October, November, >> and then a good idea. >> It's really a sprint and then it takes a break until the end end of the f the end of the calendar year and then it kind of lays dormant >> a little bit until springtime meeting. >> That's right.
>> But as it relates to what Ken was saying, you know, I've done the rack for two years now and it's been incredible. Um, I'd be a little sad to leave only because it's starting to get really interesting as we're about to start talking about phase two and where it's going to go and how.
Um, but of course, if it makes sense for the overall, you know, good of the committee, the planning board, I would be happy to go, you know, somewhere else. >> Okay. So, on that, >> we didn't really answer questions. I just I >> we started with Ken and he sort of went
off >> only because he's was at the top of it's really about the committee the capital budget committee that's why I started uh with him. >> Um uh so having also served on the capital budget committee for uh two or
three years um uh I' I'd like to like to think that this side of the of the table might someone might be interested. It's a really It is a really good way to understand um and now it's much better than one long ago when I was on it. So
I'm wondering if anybody's interested. Tom, you'll give it a shot. >> I'll give it a shot. Thank you, Tom. >> It would start next summer. >> It's like a suspended sentence. >> So I say I was say effective May 1st. >> I'm trying to make it positive. It's
really it's really heavy in from October on. It might start a little earlier. >> Maybe mid September. Yeah, it starts it starts midepptember, Tom. You know, we'll have a couple meetings, but >> October is >> from October 1 till now. It's been every single week. >> Yeah. >> Okay.
>> So, when I say it to to Pam, I'm going to say effective May 1st, 2026, so that they're clear that you're still on. >> Yeah, I will stay on through town spring town meeting. >> Great. Okay, >> we go. >> Um, CEDC Peter has uh sent us a note.
Uh, I think all of us received it. uh he would prefer not to be on CEDC. So we have that opening. Um do I have any interest in that? >> If I'll say it this way, if somebody would really like to dive into the world
of of our of our sewer project and then I would be I'd certainly be open to to switching to CEDC. I just would like to know just as a point of order is what is the status of the CEDC and have they appointed did they not appoint a couple of people recently or No, >> they did. Uh, I thought they did one.
>> They appointed one or two people. >> Who do they appoint? >> Um, >> I'm sorry. I might be speaking. >> I don't think they did. They haven't. >> It's totally new to me. If that's it. Now that Megan Eldridge is the director of community development is, you know, on. She's been here for a whole a whole month. She keeps turning up. Thank God.
Um, >> so I think that's something that they're going to be kind of start to look at reconstituting at the beginning of the year. So, a couple, you know, two to three months to kind of do the interviews and decide on people. But they are reconstituting it and they want to continue with it. They have a different >> sorry
>> leaning that >> maybe as a way to think about it is how about this when the CEDC reforms >> which may be a few months I'd certainly be interested if no one else is. Um I don't know about you Ken >> I've been I was on it for years
>> Peter just did it >> and I also have been on it. So, I would be happy to give it a try, but in the meantime, I could stay on rack. Whatever. I I don't care. >> And I saw your hand raised for rack, Ken. So, you'd be interested.
>> I'd be interested in going back to rack. And then also, if I'll just throw it in now since we're since you mentioned my name, I'd also do land disposition, too. >> Okay. I think that that's actually it's good to have a person, but I I'm not sure how active that >> they only meet twice a year from what >> I don't think they met for years.
>> Really? >> Oh, I thought there was I thought Jim had a >> I thought there was a meeting. No, >> no, I don't. Not to my knowledge. >> Okay. >> Not to my knowledge. >> Wow. Sounds like a great committee assignment. >> Well, that's a perfect assignment. How do we get >> It's good to have someone listed there in case they reconstitute or they have
they do have a meeting. So, I appreciate you. Um, so in terms of the water the rack committee, anyone else, Dearra or Susan, interested in that? Um, I I I know I I I am not um
so uh we'll go with Ken. Yeah. Uh rack. He's going back. >> Okay. Back to the rack. It has a nice little ring to it. And madam chair, if that one want if he wants that to be effective, the >> ones you have effective after >> Why don't we swap? Why don't we swap in May? In other words, I'm happy to
serve on the rack until May. >> I'm fine with that if everyone's okay with that. >> Or if that messes everything up, I can do it until January or something. >> You may have double duty though when CEDC gets back up and running. >> If if by that point capital budget's
quiet, so if CEDC starts up Gen One, for example, I'll step in and rack. >> But otherwise, >> you want to say effective January 1st? >> Sure. >> Sure. Does that work for you, Madam Chair? >> Oh, of course. >> Um, next on the list is community housing. Dearra, you're on that now.
What are you thinking? >> Well, I kind of feel like I've just gotten >> Yeah, there's a lot to learn. >> It makes sense to stay on it from my >> Great. Um, Susan, any interest in that at all or No, >> no. No. Okay. >> Okay. Deedra, you you're staying.
>> Okay. >> Thank you. Um, I I would like to stay on CPA um CPC rather, but am open to anyone else who might be interested in that. Um,
so I can continue with that. Um, so Peter would continue with design review. >> We'll have Yeah. >> What did Peter say? >> He said he Yeah, he said he liked it. >> Oh, he did? Okay. >> Yeah. >> Just wanted to make sure >> continue, but I think he thought that it was he was temporary until Ken
Well, I mean, I'll throw this out there. If we're talking long term, I' couple years down the road since we're talking, I'd like to go on design review. >> I think that actually is one that I think that's an important one that we all should cycle through. I I have never been on it.
>> Um I don't think any of us >> I think it was >> Jim Sim before that it was >> it was um Chris >> Chris, right? >> Yeah, Chris was on it. was on it for years and he was >> he was you know as a builder and an architect and blah blah blah. >> It was it made a big difference. So
>> um this is good. We should we should all kind of think about cycling through. We'll go through this again next year and those assignments that are easier to swap out. Um I'd like everybody to get a shot at design review because there you really get to see what's what's in the works. >> Yeah.
>> Um >> it's one of the first stops, right? >> Almost everything. >> Yeah. Okay. So, Peter has indicated his interest there. Susan, um, do we still have a dice? >> We do. And I think Jim and I, we talked about this. In fact, I think we talked about at the board at one point. I think
the sentiment was we'd keep this we'd keep this a me the concept until it actually is open and handed off to someone in public works just in case something happens and you need a decision. So that so I'll stay on that
until that list and this will I think automatically >> dissolve once um it's formally open and it's you know it's passed on to some department in the >> okay >> the site's passed on to some department in time. >> Great. >> When will that be madam chair? Do you know? >> We I don't know.
>> Susan, do you know? >> No, we it's >> I think the um >> they're hoping for sometime in the summer. >> Yeah, I think the bulk of it will be done this winter, but they got to wait to do the plantings around the restroom in the spring. >> Sure. There's been some talk of maybe um I think the first weekend in May having
a grand opening ribbon cutting. >> Yeah. Yeah. Certainly having an open by Memorial Day weekend. That was the >> at the very latest would be Memorial Day weekend or using Memorial Day weekend as a big kickoff event. >> That would be great. >> Nice. >> Okay.
>> There's a whole bunch of programming that needs to happen there. Um >> who is going to be in charge of programming? See, that's the that's the kind of thing. I mean, I met with Jay Grandandy and then I met we also met with Megan of kind of handing that off of, you know, someone else needs to
figure out that next one. >> I've been working on it for 10 years. I'm tapping out. So, recreation needs to work on it for the next 10 years and then they can tap out. >> You think recreation would have a big say as to what goes on there? >> Or is it also DPW? >> I mean, that was the >> recreation is more like athletic
recreation. This would be more like >> more parks. This is parks, >> right? Right. not recreation. >> Yeah. And parks is just maintaining it. So it needs to be figured out is how are events going to be run at that particular >> one of the concepts was that's the reason we should keep this little committee together because at one point
there was the thought was maybe people would come to the committee with ideas. We would sort of either list them or vet them or somehow make and then pass them on to the appropriate um entity in town. So sort of like be an entry point >> if the committee was still still
constituted. So that was one thing that Jim and I talked about is if the committee stays in existence, that's one of the things it could do is sort of be a filter. >> We need to come up with an an actual use policy. There's an interim one there with no fees at all because we didn't
really have anything to offer. Um, but now that we do, somebody needs to figure out what's the policy. How does it get the solicitation solicitations go out? You know, what's the, you know, edits to any of the licensing agreement that needs to happen and then get it out on the street so that people know that it's available and limiting the number. I
mean, we don't want to have it excessive because there are neighbors nearby. So, it needs to be a reasonable number of events, especially anything with amplified music needs to be restricted to a certain number. >> So, if we if the committee stays um at least that's a that's a focal point for conversation so we can
uh land disposition. Uh obviously Jim was on it. Hardly ever meets. >> Ken's gonna do it. >> Raring to go. >> Thank you, Ken. >> You're welcome. >> We covered rack and Susan library. >> Oh yeah.
>> Everybody okay? >> Good. Great. Thank you so much. >> Madaki's utilization. >> Oh jeez. That's right. Um Sharon Wymer and myself gave an update to the select board last night.
>> Um lots and lots and lots and lots of information. Um there's a there's a there's a nice memo in the packet from last night if anyone's interested. It's on the agenda center. Um just kind of talking about giving them an update of the you know
the survey and the community meeting and the bubble diagrams that we've worked on since then. Also the fact that the muck took all of this information and kind of started to make some preliminary findings on things that and recommendations that they wanted. Um ultimately they they wanted to demolish
all of the school wings of the building. There was a whole uh building reuse u report that was done by catalyst catalyst that as you know will when you did the intermediate school and I do it's it's junk. >> Um >> could we told you that in 2017 here we
are we'll tell you again. >> Yeah. Um but uh they ultimately ended up also voting to demolish the gym and the auditorium because it was going to take $25 million but at least one or more of the uh concept plans need to include some
mechanism for town recreation whether it's a town recreation center or some type of public private partnership that we get access to a sports complex gym. So we want to make sure that they're whole. One of the things that the muck did talk about a lot was um making sure There's going to be no
matter even no matter what we did, whether we were going to renovate or build new or we're going to have a sports center, there's going to be a gap in in services of the programming that they've done an excellent job of building up and using the Madakis gym. So maybe what can we do to kind of keep that program going? Maybe more
conversations with the schools. Maybe there's some different things that could be done to help keep some of that programming uh going. Um sorry I didn't bring the memo with me. I apologize. But there was there's a couple other recommendations. Um the thing that I think that was probably the most controversial had to do with whether we
would have housing included in all three concepts. Um there was some concern um with um having of whether we would have a sports we'd have enough space to have a sports complex facility that would be large enough to meet the demands of a
developer to get the all the different economic development benefits that we're hoping that we would get from it. Um so it was like a five to two vote or vote for that. Um but we basically were showed went through all the different um bubble diagrams and then asked for some
input um from the select board uh specifically regarding you know should housing be in each each each one? What size sports complex would you be interested in? You know any other comments that you might have with regard to the to the design to the bubble diagrams. So that we wanted that input
so that we could talk to BSE group about coming up with a more detailed design three design concepts which that's would show the circulation the roads the parkings more defined buildings and give you a better idea of how the housing might be laid out and what the density might actually um look like. I think there's a lot of discussion with the
board um with regard to um not really knowing what size facility uh and the financial viability of a sports complex. So are you putting the cart before the horse? Um, but in the same token, you kind of need to come up with some design concepts in order to be able to vet that
design concept. And then, and that's what I was trying to get at is it's kind of a re an iterative process where you might try this. Oh, no, now we need to go back and make this change because we found out this new piece of information and kind of keep going that way until you come up with the one preferred uh financially viable um alternative. So um
we are going to get together as a as a staff group tomorrow and kind of talk about that and come up with a strategy u not just to come up with the design concepts but also uh how we move forward with that vetting of the feasibility with the mass development grant that was received uh and we have a marketing
study that's going to be done uh and also financials that are going to be done developing some type of draft RFP for development of the site and then BSC group um would be doing a bunch of like uh detailed information with the site of getting a boundary survey and and
actually mapping the resource areas, doing a true true traffic analysis, identifying what potential mitigation might be needed, moving the thing further along and as well as looking at sewer and how we might be able to connect to sewer and what that might cost to kind of come up with some actual order of magnitude dollars um for this.
I think it's going to be a case of yes, we might have a private developer who's going to be able to do X, Y, and Z, but in order to entice them to come, the town may need to do ABC. and we want want to position ourselves to uh maximize any grant funding that we could get for ABC uh in order to entice
people. But there might be other incentives like a diff a tiff, you know, tax re, you know, the the different tax um abatements or different types of things I might be able to do to attract somebody to come here if that's what the town wants to do. So that's kind of the next phase, phase six and seven. the
phase five kind of gets us through um the three concept designs and a kind of a final report and presentation to to the select board. So, lots and lots of stuff going on. >> Madam Chair, >> yes, Mr. Smith Kathy, my one quick comment. I think it's all great. I saw the part of it and I didn't watch the
whole thing last night but you know one thing you touched on sewer has to be part of this because without no matter what you do >> without sewers up that road and working nothing's going to work. >> So you know and it's not part of the
next phase or at least it wasn't on the original plans. So it's part of what needs to be whether it's discussed whether muck talks to rack or whatever that they really understand that sewers having a sewer pipe going up to that area is hugely important for the
redevelopment of that property whe whether it's mixeduse housing sports complex whatever it is >> madam chair I just like to plus one to that I think literally at the staff level I think there should be an opportunity for someone from the muck to
come to the next one of the next very soon to come to Iraq meeting or or to do something internally. >> Jiren's been chair Wymer's the chair of the muk. She says she's come to the rack meeting. >> I guess I guess it's maybe it's not time yet. Then maybe in
January or No, I'm sorry. It said bar or April was when the next sort of presentations were going to be made. >> The way it was >> by the muck. >> Yeah. I'm only saying that because the conversations have already started to start um at the rack about where phase
two is going to go and I don't know how we sync these things up, but a failure to sync them up will be a failure. Period. End of story. >> I'm sorry. I thought that was already happening. I mean, Bob Written goes to the rack. No, >> he's he has he he is as he is in
attendance at as many as he can be, but he's not at every single one because he's only one person. Should we write a letter? >> Well, madam madam chair, I'll just touch on this is that absolutely should be writing a letter because right now >> it's not only the areas where the sewer
lines are going to go to, but it's also financially how it's going to affect the overall budget. Exactly. >> So all this planning has to be taking place now. >> That's right. Exactly. That's really what it comes down to. And what I'd hate to see is this wonderful opportunity in the town where we all discussed it and
having the fact that we don't have the pipe in the right spot have this all get delayed. >> And to just throw one more curveball in, Madam Chair, because it relates to a little bit what Ken was talking about is as someone who's on the school building committee for the for the Emmy Small School, um I would just like to say in
public very clearly, please do not assume that there will be a school built at Emmy Small. Mhm. >> I'm going to say it very calmly and clearly. Please do not assume that either the taxpayers will agree to vote to to pay for a school to be built at
the Emmy small location or that there should be a school built at the Emmy small location. So, you know, that all connects to the town to the town meeting uh vote which is coming up uh on the 17th. Um, but there's, you know, I saw the muck bubble diagrams and some of
them had school, some of them didn't have school. And I understand again another coordination thing where the school district is going to have to be redistricted. It is coming. And so, and so for that opportunity to then go by the
wayside when it's being connected to sewer and it's being connected to the Madakis site, the all three of these things have to be coordinated. And I know you're giving me a puzzle. Look, I can talk to you more after the meeting. What I'm saying is we're going to we I would say that there is a
reasonable chance that we will be a one elementary school, >> okay, >> town. Um, in fact, I would like to say publicly we should be um but that's another conversation for another committee in another place. But all these things are all this is the planning board. We our job is to fly
higher off the ground. And what we're saying and what we're asking and what we're practically begging for our town departments and our school administration to do is to work together because all of these things are trying to land on the same runway at the same
time. And not to mention the important work that's being done to identify and hopefully build a new library. Not to mention the the work to be done to hopefully potentially build a new fire station. So like it's just all we can do is be these canaries in the coal mine as
volunteers but these things all are coming together >> and it it it would be unfair to say that nobody told us so >> because we've been telling you so for years. So because of the work of the school building committee again I just that as
it relates to muk madam chair and I will get back to the point which is I think it's I don't think everybody should assume that those eight or 10 acres are going to be a school in 2030. I just I'd be really surprised if there
is a school there. Not to mention the fact that it is operating and functioning in a very challenging physical plant as it is. So to to look ahead five years from now and say we'd still be in the school as is, I'd be shocked. Much less the fact that
the school building administration if we get the money can't we can't build a school even in five years. So all these things are coming to a head and I really hope and this is why madam chair you have us farmed out as so efficiently to all these different places. Um and and
and the sewer opportunity really is the thing that I hate to say it, you know, >> it's going to be the driver to this whole thing. It really is >> underpins everything. >> Thank you. >> You're welcome. >> It should be the first step on everything >> where the where the water program fits into whatever they want to do.
>> And also of course we have to not forget that the most important point is of doing the whole sewer program was to you know save our estuaries you know is the environmental reason for doing sewer. It's not just the developmental reason. Um, and so that's where phase two is is
going to shift because we still have to deliver on what we've promised in terms of the permits to the state to keep our water water quality >> uh or to provide water quality where there may not be enough >> and hopefully that Madakis area will >> play a role in that as early as phase
two because if it's not in phase two it's going to get missed >> for a long time in the muck that's going to be 10 years at the earliest. >> Thank you Mr. off the soap box. >> Thank you. >> Um,
>> that was a >> chap from your perspective. Okay, we don't have any meeting minutes, right? >> No, sorry. >> I'm I'm not saying that. >> No, just because I'm further behind. >> Had other things to do. >> No, I that's not what I meant. I just want to make sure I read it. Right.
>> Um, committee updates. Uh, I think we've sort of had some, but let's go through it again. I I do have a rack committee update. Unfortunately, I couldn't be there on Monday. There was a sitewalk at the new
or at the under construction uh facility and also there's been a new YouTube video which I did see which shows the time lapse um of the last I think 30 days. I couldn't really tell but it was a bunch of days. Um however, in the meeting itself, which I did get the
minutes of unfortunately the recording did not work. Um but um there's still the work at Bayberry and the coordination with the state in order to use it as a recharge site and um our consultants have been working very closely with D. And the good news
is that continues to show promise, but we won't really know until January or February if we're going to get the recharge we need in order to um you know start sending water well send water up there when it needs when it's time. Um, other couple things is I'm sure many of
you have noticed there's some paving going on >> under 28. You may have noticed. Um, just uh a couple of reminders. Uh, please say happy thoughts and prayers that the temperatures stay warm enough for the
asphalt to be given so for the permission from Mass Dot um uh to make to to continue paving. So, what you want is it to stay nice and warm, and since there's no global warming, that shouldn't be a problem. Um, that was a
joke. Okay. Um, also, um, contract five, as we know, has started and started a couple weeks ago and working from west of Parker's River towards Winslow Gay, as I'm sure we all know. And they al again, um, we ask, we beg for
forgiveness. We're not asking for permission. We're still begging for forgiveness. It isn't an easy process to keep moving down a really busy street, even in a less busy time of year, and not have inconvenience and disruption. But they are moving um almost a couple
hundred feet. Well, they've already done a couple hundred feet. They're still they're going um the update on contract six is I didn't finish the select board meeting video last night. I didn't see it on the agenda, but apparently the
minutes of this meeting say that uh there is an easement that's going to get signed and I don't know if it was on the agenda last night or if it was discussed because I didn't finish watching the recording >> of last night's select board meeting. >> Pump house 2 was on the agenda. >> It's Yeah, it's on a different >> That's pump house, but that was pump
house two. >> That's Oh, that's it. That's the one question. So, I believe they I believe they very quickly in a voice vote basically said yes. >> Okay. >> But I don't believe a location was actually provided. And again, I'm sorry I wasn't at the meet I wasn't at the
meeting and there's no video of the meeting. >> Okay. >> So, um the good news is I think what we're going to start seeing is we're going to start seeing a conservation commission review and all those processes. Um it does mean unfortunately the contract has to get rebid but again it's going to be the same contractor we hope which is
Digit who's doing contract five. So they'll just get to continue moving west. So that pro unfortunately that project won't start till the spring of 26. We unfortunately because of the time it took to get the pump station located, we weren't we're not going to be able to start that contract this fall. Um but
you know nothing is going in nothing's going into that plant until 2028 anyway. So I think we're I think everything is still on time. >> It's fine with the 0% loans and everything. Yes, that's been and with Levy, we've been talking about that every single month and it's been reconfirmed by the
state. >> Yeah, we're still there. >> Yes. Which is good. Um, also big picture, I would just say for those of you that are worried about phase two of the of the sewer system, remember that half of the 207 million is the plant, right? >> So, there's no way the town is going to
ask a town meeting for 200 million ever again. So, whatever phase two is going to be, it's going to be probably 50% of that at the most. So, I just wanted to kind of put that as context for when you start hearing about phase two. Um, there was some quick discussion about traffic.
Um, if anybody's been at the corner or at the inter the traffic light at Forest and Winslow Gray, >> it's been really bad. What apparently happened is that >> the signal the traffic signal detectors on the in the in the pavement
>> got damaged >> while they were redoing that and repaving that whole intersection. So, it was causing the lights to not function or cycle >> appropriately and react to the traffic. You know, the traffic couldn't set off the signal to then change. >> So, they're under repair right now.
>> So, so please be patient at that intersection, which of course is a very busy detour intersection now because that's where everybody's being detourred to. >> Yes. Exactly. >> So, the good news is they found the problem. Go ahead. >> It was backed up like a half a mile the other day because the light was red for like, >> you know, like 20 minutes. Nobody would
go, you know. Yes. >> So, I I I would assume, and again, I wasn't at the meeting and there is no video, I would assume the Armouth PD will also be involved in perhaps hoping to direct some traffic there if that's what it takes. Um, and also, Madam Chair, because it does relate to not far
from where you live, there's apparently there was a detour sign let up uh that was left up over the weekend at North Main Street near 28. >> Did you know that? >> I did not. I didn't either, but um apparently it's a masdot sign and our friends at masdot um forgot to take the
sign out sign away. Um especially on a weekend when there is no detour, >> right? >> So it wasn't like the Yarmouth could just yank the sign or the contractor couldn't yank the sign. It is a state sign. >> So I you know I apologize. Um
>> that's enough. I think that's enough from the rack. >> All right. Thank you, >> Madam Chair. Just a quick update on capital budget. >> All the projects have been vetted and have been rated. So, that whole thing's behind us now. U next meeting which I think is December 4th is when finance
and then December 16th is our select board presentation. And we'll go from there. So, it was quite the process, but uh we finally got through it all. And >> do you have a meeting on Monday the 10th? >> We do. We have >> is that kind of the final one in terms of running through the >> That's right. is to run through the
stuff to make sure we're ready for >> our finance committee meeting and then get ready for select board. Um I will say this just to throw it out there. The department heads this year you I've only been on it two years so I've last year only to compare it to but they did
unbelievable work getting their submittals correct. Pictures, descriptions, you know why they were why they needed it. It was, you know, I I can't answer for what it was like when you were on it. >> We can tell you, >> but it was they really >> binder after binder after binder. Sorry,
Tom. Good news. It's all on most of it's online now. >> It's all online. All >> streamlined. I'll believe it when I say >> No, it it is. I'm telling you, Tom, it is. I The department heads I just want to put on record should be commended for the work that they did preparing. >> Oh, great. >> Some questions. Can did the library make
it is this is the 2026 capital program, right? >> That is correct. >> Is the library on that list? >> It is. Okay. Yes. >> Committee, anything? >> Uh, no. I was just going to mention I was under board member that as you know, the library committee is coming to the planning committee. I requested to come
and I think we're going to set it up for December December 3rd, right Kathy? Yes. >> And it will be we're hoping it will be a public meeting because one of the one of the goals of this is to >> get people informed about what we're doing. >> But but for sure the they wanted to talk to the planning committee. >> Okay.
So you two will be sitting on either side of the >> We'll be sitting on they'll they'll flip. >> There you go. like Queen Elizabeth changed >> um at housing most of the focus has been on the 40B that we've discussed and also
the Habitat for Humanity development which was uh signed off on I guess at the select board last night and um generally concern that housing isn't getting that worry that housing might
not get enough attention mentioned at MUK and I think that there are uh you know people that don't want any housing and that sort of thing but I think that the um the sentiment generally is that a lot of the money is in housing and and
also that's incentive for the sewer as well which is so necessary. So, I think that it's important to emphasize the the the critical nature of having some housing on that site and that's been part of the discussion too.
>> But basically, I think that's the main thing that we've been talking about. >> All right. Madam Chair, can I ask Kathy one question about the Wood Road project that you just brought up, Gandra? The >> the house or the lot just before which was an old dentist office. Is that part
of this redevelopment? It's not. >> It's around it. >> It's bad. >> It's all around it. >> Bad. >> They have us there. I think there was some discussions of the habitat purchasing it because there is a uh draft future driveway that goes from the culde-sac from the habitat to that
parcel. >> Um really awful. >> Yeah. I don't know what's the >> I mean, we have the great seaside festival and everybody's there walking and parking and, you know, going to the seaside festival and you just walk by this pretty disastrous lot right in front of the seaside festival.
>> I I certainly support Habitat getting in possession of that lot, >> right? Y >> maybe it can get on the blighted list >> as well for you know that now that we might >> super awkward shaped lot >> and super tiny. >> It's like a triangle. It's very strange.
>> Madam Chair, can I ask Dra a question? >> Yes, you may. >> Um, has there been any more discussion? I know it's not at your particular committee, but it's still involved about the parcel on Forest Road. >> It comes up all the time and I have not heard any uh any more resolution. Uh, I
guess the last thing I heard Drew said that they were going to be discussing it again to think of some other alternatives and but you know, I don't know what the details are. >> Okay. I'm assuming when you hear something, you'll let us. O share it with you.
>> He is also on the CPC committee and he did not mention anything today. We had our meeting today. Got it. >> So again there was some radio silence on that. Uh and with regard to that uh today we approved um to recommend for board meeting for the town meeting um uh
all of the housing articles. We annually fund the affordable housing trust in a couple of different ways. uh the Habitat for Humanity. We we approved today um HECH which is um the the um u a
collaboration among uh the ecumenical community in Harwitch Dennis here in Yarmouth that provides um emergency funding um to prevent evictions. So people might need a rent or they becoming close to being homeless. So we
can provide them HCH can provide them with first last month rent that kind of thing. Um so we approved um the funding there. They've been an annual um uh uh uh applicant to the CPC and we approved
them today and um we'll be at our next meeting we'll be looking at the balance of the um of the of the projects. We had one project we're wait we're leaving until January. Um, it has to do with the Yarmouth Port Library where their
request was for the replacement of uh a ADA ramp and the building itself is historic obviously uh but we're working through the ramp >> and the rear madam. >> Yes.
Yes. >> And whether or not CPA funding can be applied to that. It's a we're looking to get all the best opinions on this. Um we're also looking at their financials um and whether or not um there's some
way for them to afford uh afford to do it. So that's the one that we're hanging on to until January um all the other projects will be voted on at our next meeting in two weeks. >> Was Madam Chair, was packet landing on? It was on last week. Um, and that one
um, we will be voting on again at, uh, the the presentation was last week. We'll be voting on that in two weeks. But I, I did not attend that meeting, but I know it was viewed very favorably. >> It's for the park. >> It's to raise the elevation to raise the elevation of the parking lot. Yeah. Um
the other thing I wanted to um bring up was that I did sign up for the housing to protect Cape Cod seminar uh session over at the Emerald Hotel and unfortunately I was unable to attend it. Um but I did get the the slide deck.
There's like n slides that went through it. Um and as I went through it quickly, uh the primary focus was on what we talked about at our last meeting. seasonal housing. Um, and uh, there was
a a a form letter that they would like, you know, people like us, planning boards to write to the executive office of housing and affordable communities in support of of seasonal designation and
tiny houses. and uh the general discussion we had at our last meeting and Julian Seir was there obviously as a as a promoter of that. But the Cape Cod Commission and Hack are really pushing for a regional approach to this. A
regional certax on luxury homes, home sales, a regional approach to managing um uh any kind of u seasonal housing inventory. Uh, so none of this is it's
it's just proposals, but it looks it looked to me from the the slide deck again that the commission and hack are looking to have a regional approach on a lot of these things, which
my first impression is one that it's bad enough when the state takes away our rights to zone and have an ADU the way we like it, but to have a regional approach, We're ve we're all very different towns. >> Um and so and but there are proposals
out there. So it's out there being talked about. Uh but I I think the the again the notion is that the each town would have to opt in. I don't I didn't see anything where they're looking to promote legislation. Although there was
new legislation 40y >> uh that I hadn't heard of before. >> Um I >> home starter home. starter homes. Um I can send the send this slide deck to you guys. >> I was always asked, Madam Chair, could you for send it to you and then you can send it
out. >> That'd be nice. >> I think it, you know, um and I think it was taped as well. >> Um unfortunately, I just couldn't. I wanted to attend. I've attended in the past, >> but I just um I couldn't. So, >> do you know where the short-term rental study where that stands and when we may
see it? >> Um we've been having some trouble. Well, I think the affordable housing trust, they kind of funded it, so UMass Donahue is going to present it to them and get their feedback before they kind of go out. >> Okay. >> And they've had some difficulty, I
think, coordinating the meeting. I believe it's on de December 2nd now. >> Okay. >> In the morning. I can can confirm that, but I'm not positive. Um, but it kept getting delayed and delayed, but I think it's December 2nd. Did you know? Okay. >> I haven't heard of that. might just have
been the affordable housing trust that was in it's going to be at one of their meetings. >> The wheels of justice turn slowly sometimes. Madam chair, >> madam chair, one last question. Do you know how Nucket made out yesterday they had a on their ballot was a referendum on short-term rentals? Has anybody heard how that that
>> which was this? >> No, I I have not. >> A huge battle out there. >> Yeah, I know it is. I just was curious how that turned out. I haven't heard anything or saw anything. No. Okay. Any other uh any other board member items?
Uh Kathy, any correspondence or staff updates that you haven't already covered? >> Was I supposed to remind you of something? >> No, you No, we did it. It was this. Yeah, we're all set. I'm just thinking what else is going to We're working on um we sent out the draft of the hazard
mitigation plan to the team >> uh to get some of their comments on that and hopefully um >> that's due Monday, right? you'd like our comments Monday. >> I think it's the 13th. Yeah. Okay. The 13th. Um and then we would have some type of public comment period and public hearing hopefully sometime in December. Um so
then we can get before the select board um on January 1. They're required to um approve us sending it to MIMA for their review and then MIMA reviews it, comments on it, and then you have to send it to FEMA to get their review. Um
the grant ends on May 2nd, so we just need to keep that. Does that will that become kind of an add-on to the local comprehensive plan? >> One of the action items is to complete the update to the hazard mitigation plan. >> And so once we do um Okay, great.
Uh upcoming meetings. Uh special town meeting is the 17th. Um our next meeting is the 19th. Kathy, do we have anything that we think might be on the agenda for that other Well, the Sorry, go ahead. I
>> I don't think that there's anything there was potentially some conversation about an ANR. Um, and that's something you need to do see within 21 days or we get an extension. But I don't think there's anything that >> we might not have a meeting. >> I would love to not have a meeting. Would you guys love to not have a
meeting? >> A motion for that or do we just decide? >> How does that work? hard. I want to keep >> and then and then our next meeting >> Monday special town meeting >> would be um on December December 3rd. Oh, I forgot to mention uh each of you I sent I took the liberty of sending to
you um and Dedra and and Tom this might be interesting for you as new members. This group, the CPTC is a really good group. >> Is that I saw your email. >> They're I have taken their courses and they're >> they online. Yes, they are.
>> Yep. They're online. Um, so I' encourage you to just uh take a look and see if any of their courses not a great expensive fee, but there is some >> There is a fee. I think it's like 30 >> $35. >> 35 bucks or something. Yeah. >> The first two looked really interesting.
I'm going to try and do those. >> Yeah. >> Um, >> all online, Julian. >> It's all online. Yeah. >> Um, anything else? >> Okay. May I have a motion to adjurnn? >> So moved. >> Second. >> Great. Any discussion? All in favor? I