Recording in progress. >> Good evening everybody and welcome to the Yarmama Select Board meeting of October 7th, 2025. If you would all please kindly join me for the pledge of allegiance. I pledge allegiance to the flag of the
United States of America and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. >> Thank you very much. We're going to start with our 6 pm agenda item, which
is announcements. We'll start with Mark. Do you have any announcements this evening? Not >> tonight. Thank you, >> Dorcas. >> No, I don't. Thank you. I just wanted to say that was a wonderful play reading over the weekend directed by Liz and um
Drew was also in it. >> Yep. He was he did a a remarkable kind of angry scene in it. So all sorts of yarmath tell Oh okay great. >> Congratulations. >> I see Mary at the thing. Bob, do you have any announcements?
>> Um yeah. Yes. Actually, I wanted to um announce and the information is in the packet as well that on Saturday, November 1, 2025, there's the Yarmouth fall community cleanup and coast sweep. And folks that are interested in
volunteering should plan to meet on November 1 here at the town hall at 8:30 a.m. to collect your supplies and check in. And um thanks for everyone's help cleaning up. >> Excellent. Also in our packet for information is a we're hiring. So if you
are looking for employment, please head to the yarmath.mma. us and see what uh is available. And also um there's information here about um the town of Yarmouth participating in uh breast cancer awareness month for October uh
through our health department and that also that information is on our our website. So and with that, Mary. >> Good evening. Mary Mazowski, town clerk. I just have a couple of quick announcements for you. Um, first with special town meeting coming up, just
wanted to put people on notice that the last day to register to vote for the November special town meeting is Friday, November 7th. Um, the clerk's office will be open. Um, obviously there are regular hours, but we will extend until 5:00 p.m. for the special voter
registration. And then the same thing for the what's on your agenda tonight is the Old Kings Highway Warrant for that election and annual meeting. The last day to register to vote for the uh Old Kings Highway meeting is Friday, November 14th. Again, we'll be open
regular hours, but extend our hours until 5:00 p.m. for >> Mary. This says the 17th. >> It's the Friday. It should be Friday the 14th. >> Okay. >> It's November the November 17th special town meeting. The last day to register
to vote is Friday, November 7th. And that first sentence, the last day to register to vote for the November 17th special town meeting is November 7th. >> Okay. And the 14th for Old King. >> Sorry if that was unclear. >> Nope. >> Um and then the last announcement I just
wanted to um let the public know that anybody looking for transfer station stickers, replacement stickers, shellfish permits, beach obviously don't need beach stickers quite yet. We've now officially made that transition to the town clerk's office. So, if anybody is needing those services, please see the
town clerk's um counter as opposed to treasure collectors. >> Excellent. >> That's all I have. Thank you. >> Thank you, Mary. >> Madam Chair, can I just bring up that that microphone sounds like it's echoing. >> It's pretty tiny. >> Yeah.
>> Not usually about it. >> AV people in the back are listening. they will attend to it, but um I don't know how to fix the >> first. Thank you. >> Thank you. >> Okay. Is there any other announcements tonight? We're going to go to public comment. Is there anybody here from the
public would like to address the board? Yes, Dr. Smith. >> Good evening. Uh Mark Smith, superintendent Dennis Dworth Regional School District. Just wanted I know there's a couple items on the agenda tonight that either directly or tangent tangentially uh uh relate to the school
district. So I know you're going to be discussing uh the uh reorganiz or the the board's responsibility to fill an empty seat on the committee. Um so I spoke with the chair last night. If there's anything that the school district can do to support that process, wherever you decide to land on that
process, just want to let you know I'm here. I'll be here all night. So, if there's anything I can do to help in that process, just let me uh let us know. You know, the school district can support the the school committee is willing to participate in any way that you need them to participate. And then, you know, we have a warrant article. I
know you're going to be discussing potentially putting items to the warrant. So, uh when it comes to the small project, if there's any questions that I can answer, I just want to let you know I'll be here to answer any of those questions. Thank you. >> Thank you very much. Is there anybody else who'd like to address the board?
Seeing nobody seeing nobody on Zoom, um we're going to move on to our 6:15 item, which is um an advertised hearing, but it's advertised for 6 PM. So,
just try to Good evening. How are you? Come on forward while I um while I find the public hearing notice and I will read it into the record to open the hearing. Um the town of Yarma Select Board ABCC
application for an amendment change of ownership interest hearing. The Yarma Select Board acting as the local licensing authority has received an application from Neil Kant Package Corporation DBA Paradise Wine and Spirits. Nilish Marfadia. Is that
correct? Yep. Okay. manager for change of stock interest at 451 Station A South Yarmouth, Mass 02664 on the previously approved liquor license. Hearing will be held Tuesday, October 7th, 2025 in the hearing room at
Town Hall 11:46 through 28 South Yarmouth. The select board meeting begins at 6 p.m. Written comments will be accepted until 4:30 p.m. Friday, October 3rd in the select board's office at town hall and could be submitted electronic electronically to public comment at yarmath.mma. us. Verbal
comments will be accepted at the hearing. With that, we will open the hearing. Um Amy, has there been any correspondence received on this application? >> Not received any correspondent. Okay. Thank you. If you'd like to introduce yourself for the record and uh tell us a little bit what what you're trying to do. Sure. Thank you. Good evening. My
name is Patrick Nickerson, attorney for the applicant um employed at the law office of John W. Kenny, whose office is in Centerville. Um to my immediate right is uh Atumar Patel uh who is uh seeking
to uh acquire 50% of the stock ownership interest in Neil Package Corporation, DBA, Paradise Wine and Spirits. Uh Mr. Patel has worked uh at the business for 5 years on a full-time basis and is
essentially seeking to become a partner to the business uh graduating from the rank of full-time employee which he presently is. Um Mr. from our FATIA uh through our office has uh negotiated a
stock purchase agreement which we've submitted in your uh materials which should be in your files for this evening detailing the terms and conditions of the stock purchase agreement and we're asking for your approval this evening to change the ownership ship interest uh
with uh in the form of the ABCC application for amendment. >> That's really the sum and substance of our request this evening. happy to answer any questions to the extent there are any. >> Thank you. Yep. It's um mostly a formality as um the board will see the
packet is complete. Um I've asked Amy um to put the checklist in our packet for information because it's always helpful for us with the requirements. Um your certificate of insurance is here. Uh and everything is complete. Is there anybody
from the public that would like to speak on this application either for or against? Seeing nobody, I will take a motion close the public hearing. >> So moved. >> Second. >> Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor? >> Any opposed? Any board members have any
uh questions or comments? >> No. >> I'll take a recommendation take a a motion to approve. >> I move we approve the application as submitted. >> Second. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor? >> I passes unanimously. Thank you very much. Good luck.
>> Thank you very much. >> Thank you. >> Thank you, board. >> Thank you. >> Sign looks good. >> The sign >> They have a fairly new sign. For a long time there was no sign. It looks great. >> Oh, good. Good to know. All right. We
have one more application before us tonight and I will read the public notice into the record in if anybody wants to come forward on this. The county of Yarma Sele Select Board ABCC application for amendment change of ownership hearing. The Yarma Select Board acting as the local licensing
authority has received an application for a change of ownership interest from Ryan Family Amusement LLC. William Campbell manager located at 1067 Route 28 South Yarmouth, Mass. Ownership will change from Ryan Family Amusement LLC to
FEC Holdings LLC, which has a business address of 1209 Orange Street, Wilmington, Delaware. Hearing will be held on Tuesday, October 7th in the hearing room at at Yarmouth Town Hall, 11:46 through 28 South Yarmouth. The select board meeting begins at 6 PM.
Written comments will be accepted until 4:30 p.m. Friday, October 3rd, in the select board's office at town hall could be submitted electronically. Public comment at yarmath.mma. us. Verbal comments will be accepted at the hearing. Amy, has there been any correspondence on this application?
>> No, there has not. >> Okay. if you'd like to take a moment to introduce yourself. We just had um we're very familiar with this license. We just had it before us for um another action fairly recently. So, if you want to just introduce yourself and tell us what you want to do. >> Sure, Madam Chair, members of the board.
I'm Paul Tardiff, an attorney in Yarmouthport. Seated with me is Bill Campbell with president of Ryan Family Amusements LLC. Um and um uh that entity holds an annual all alcohol license over at 1067 Route 28 right up the street. Um
and you'll see Mike Rossy's name is on most of the applications I'm working with him for these transfers. Um and as you indicated, we were here in June, actually June 24th seemed seems long time ago when there was summer, I
guess. But um we we requested an approval of a change of corporate name. >> What's that? >> The weather's probably nicer now than >> it's beautiful. Yeah. >> We had a uh we had requested an uh an approval for a change of corporate name and structure on that license to go from
Ryan Failing Amusements uh Inc. to LLC at that time. Now we're back before you uh to request approval of change of officers, directors, and LLC managers uh and a change of ownership interest. Um uh first of all, Ryan Family
Amusements LLC will continue to own the license. Um the manager uh of that liquor license, Peter Campbell, is going to continue to be that act in that role. Uh but because of the anticipated and un bittersweet sale of that business, uh
the current request is needed. So uh and just so you'll know why we did this in two steps. This was at at we had approached the ABCC up in Boston first because of the complexity of this deal and they had recommended that we do this in steps um as as we have. So that's why
we're back here now. We've also been working with them uh up in Boston to try to get approval for all of the financial and and organizational matters uh ahead of time. we do have six other location well six locations that um are going to change hands as well. So, um that's why
it's a little complex, but we um we wanted to get back before you and make sure that you understood that there is a nice uh the application's lengthy. I know. U but this >> Amy did a good job of of callulling out of how many pieces of 600 pieces? >> 640 I think I saw. Yeah. This is the
most important one, the flowchart for the uh for the new owners. So, you can take a look at that. But uh um as I indicated, the license is going to stay the same um with the same people involved and uh a lot of the same people from Ryan Family Amusements LLC will will be staying on. So you'll still see
those familiar faces at the facility. So um uh I think that the the transfer can be uh approved. If you have any questions, Mr. Campbell and I are here to uh help you with that. Thank you very much. >> Thank you very much again. Um the packet's complete. Everything's here.
It's merely a formality uh required by the ABCC. Um certificate of insurance is here. I will see if anybody in the public has any comment either for or against this application. >> Chair I move that we close the public hearing.
>> Is there a second? >> Second. All in favor? >> Any opposed? >> Okay. Is there anybody on the board that has any comments or questions on the application? But I had no idea you had six locations. I'm sitting here quite impressed.
>> Yes, it's uh it's growing and uh but you'll never it's not nothing's going to change. It's going to be the same familiar faces, myself, my brother, and others. And uh we're just happy to have this opportunity. >> Take a motion to approve the application as presented.
>> So move. >> Second. Any discussion on the motion? All those in favor? >> Any opposed? Thank you very much for coming. Appreciate it. >> Thank you very much. Good seeing you all. Thank you. >> Um Kathy, are you ready? >> Perfect. We're we're a little ahead of
schedule, but we are going to move to our 6:45 agenda item, which is zoning items with the planning board. >> How are you? >> Good to see you. Good to see you, too. >> You want to be on the side? Good evening, ladies. Good evening.
Bob's going to get you teed up here. Uh, good evening. Um, madam chair and members of the select board. Um, Joan Crowley, chair of the planning board, and I'm joined by our town planner, Kathy Williams, and I believe one of our planning board members, Dearra Gaquin,
is with us tonight. Thank you, Dearra. Um, thank you for this opportunity to review uh the updated draft zoning bylaw amendments that we've prepared for the 2025 special town meeting in November. The planning board would like to also
thank the public who have participated and informed us at many of our meetings on these two articles, including the public hearing we most recently had on September 17th. Their interest in participation uh is gratefully appreciated.
In your packets this evening is a PowerPoint presentation that Kathy will provide for you that provides some background on these two amendments and how they have changed since the last time we met with you on August 12th. Also included is the current draft language for the articles that we
propose to be included in the warrant. The amendments address two provisions in the zoning bylaw. Section 202, retail sales of lobsters in residential zoning districts, and section 401, on-site boat storage, also in residential zoning
districts. The planning board has taken preliminary votes on both of these amendments, but we'll deliberate further at our meeting on October 15th regarding your comments this evening and any other comments we receive from the public. So, with that, I'd like to turn it over to
Kathy uh for a brief presentation on where we are with this. As Joanne mentioned, um, since we met with you on the 12th, the planning board's really been trying to fine-tune the articles to address comments that we have received from both the board as well as residents and then trying to ensure that we're protecting our neighborhood so we have
provisions in for that. And then just kind of working towards an article that we think will get passed at special town meeting. If you turn it on, there we go. So the way the article is written right now is it allows the purpose of it is to allow for retail sale of live lobsters only
via special permit in residential zoning districts with some special provisions as well as the addition of that uh definition for fishing. So special provisions really are is that you're limited to one special permit per parcel. We're allowing it in residential zoning districts except for our more restrictive RS40 which is in our
historic district area along the Bass River. It's limited to sales that are of lobsters that are personally caught by the resident of the property. We don't want to have a live lobster farmers market in in residential neighborhoods. We also want to be sure that they're adhering to all of the applicable local, state, and federal regulations. There's
a lot of state regulations with regard to commercial fishing license, commercial retail, as well as our local uh health department inspections. Uh we want to be sure that the special permit expires upon sale of the property. So, it's really just with the person getting the special permit. It doesn't carry with the property. Uh the sign is is
limited to one non-elilluminated A-frame. I know there's a question about illumination last time. Um basically a sandwich board of six square feet located on the property during hours of operation and those hours will be set via the special permit. So specifically just kind of going over
what were the changes made since August 12th. We limited it to the sale of live lobsters only and not all seafood. We did talk to the Division of Marine Fisheries and got some additional information from them and there were some concerns about um you know smells from dead fish. Also, there's certain
fin fish um like tuna and mackerel that are histamine producing and you need to be extremely careful in how you handle them or you could get people very very sick. That's not something we really wanted to start getting into. And also the sale of mollisks like clams and cohogs and scallops um they can only be
sold by the harvester to a wholesaler. They can't be sold retail. So it was really kind of made that a bit of a moot point. So all those things considered, we just decided that let's get to the problem, solve the problem of the of the live lobsters and limited it to that. We also eliminated a reference to it being
sold whole or not processed as it is limited to live lobsters only at an expiration of the special permit upon transfer of the property and then did specify that the sign uh would be non-illuminated. As Joanne mentioned, we had our public hearing on September 17th. Uh there's
about 25 people online and in person. We had three written comments on this uh zoning article support for the n from a neighbor of Mr. Taly's noting that he hasn't had any particular disturbance. Um there's also uh a written uh comment about article opens up the sale of
lobsters to whomever instead of just just one individual. It would be allowed to anyone who has live lobsters to sell in a retail uh in a residential neighborhood. And then there was someone who was in opposition of the article. They were concerned about neighborhood impact signage. it would be setting a precedent in other regulatory concerns.
Uh three comments that were received at the meeting was attorney Paloni who represents Mr. Tally u supported the amendment. There's also other general comments in support of the article. Uh there's one person, one gentleman who noted that the special permit would create more bureaucracy and then that fee is really just another tax. So the
planning board really felt that this was fairly well vetted. Uh and with little discussion uh the planning board voted to recommend the zoning article 5 to zero. I don't know if you want to talk about each article individually or give go through the presentation.
>> I don't feel we have to talk about them individually. We have spoken about them previously amongst the board. >> Was there any discussion about um traffic um backed up during these times impeding was there any conversation about how you manage traffic?
>> I think that's a lot of it would be regulated through the special permit. I think a lot of it would be related to the specific property that that's an issue. There's some properties where it's not that big of a deal. You come in, you pull into the driveway, you purchase your lobster, and you and you head out. Or maybe you pull to the side of the road and you pick it. And you So,
that didn't really seem to be >> No, it didn't. And the the neighbors of Mr. Tally, and there were many of them um who were in favor of of this particular change, didn't bring up any kind of a a traffic issue at at in the
neighborhood that I recall. Madam Chair, yeah, I first of all, I want to thank you once again for all the time and energy and effort that you put into both of these articles and I'm glad to see that you've narrowed it and you did confirm with the Division of Marine Fisheries that there isn't some other
broader issue that we need to concern ourselves with that I think this is properly done, properly written, and properly structured. And my hope is is that uh it'll go through smoothly at town meeting. So, thank you. Well, we I I would like to thank you uh
Mr. Forest for bringing our attention to the the marine fisheries uh and those regulations because Kathy jumped on it right away and and we got, you know, some really good information back about what can be done and what can't be done. So, that's why we limited to live
lobsters. The rest of it could be very complicated. >> I just wonder if um has any other community had just this? I just worry about it being so specific. You know, when you try to get a a zoning article passed by the AG's office and it being
so specific, I just wonder if it's going to limit our ability. That's why that's why I think we needed to look at all the other ones. Um, and I'm just curious if you know of any other town that has it specific just to one. >> Not that I know, but the article has been vetted by town council and he
didn't we specifically asked that question. Um, but again, it's not, it may be limited to the type of seafood that you can sell, but it is open. It's not spot zoning. It's open to all residential zoning districts, >> but it is very specific. I mean, we're we're when you tailor zoning to a
particular parcel, that's what they pick up on. And although there may be more than one that we're trying to address here, which I think is very important that we need to make sure that people understand that. That's why I worry about, you know, in his situation, obviously the
parking's fine. You're not right off of a main road backing up traffic. But I, you know, I'm concerned about how that would be handled in other situations. So, um, but if the board, >> it is spoken to in the in the um the text that I read that it's all of those
considerations have to be reopened and and re-evaluated for every case. But it's special permit which provides a lot of protections and that's being sure that it doesn't cause any congestion and undue nuisance in the neighborhood. That's part of the criteria that the ZBA would be looking at. Yep.
>> And and the one thing we were careful we what we didn't want it to be is parcel specific >> but it is product specific >> and we we don't know if um there are other you're you're absolutely right u madam chair that there may be other
communities that uh have different you know product specific but we're not aware of them here on the cape. >> Just hope it passes the mustard. Okay, seeing nothing, we'll go to the next one. So, I think the the article that
saw the most change was the boat parking, which we're really trying to get back to resolving the core issue. For people in the public who may not know, right now our current regulations uh for camping and recreation equipment, it needs to either be parked inside a garage or it shall be parked or stored
to the to the rear of the front line of the building. So, basically to the side or the rear of your property. The issue that's come to our attention is that some residents really can't get to that side or rear of their properties due to maybe they don't have any sideyard. Uh maybe they have a beautiful large tree that they don't want to have to cut down. Maybe there's some steep slopes or
some other prohibiting issues that are very unique to their particular property. So the the boat parking as it's currently written would allow parking for one boat in the driveway during the active boating season in residential neighborhoods via a special permit just for those properties with limited or
restrict restricted access to the side or rear of their property. So this isn't just for someone who can do it. They just don't want to do it. This is something that's very specific to someone who has uh a physical feature of their property that prohibits them from doing it. Again, it's via a special permit to allow for that public notification and a butter notification.
It's limited to one boat per parcel, lawfully registered either to the owner of the property or the resident. Um, maximum length of the boat is 28 ft located on a registered trailer and then the boat shall be parked in a driveway without creating any traffic or fire safety issues and making sure that
there's adequate remaining on-site parking for the property. And that can be demonstrated to the ZVA. We don't want people parking their boat in the driveway and then having to park their cars in all these strange locations or in front of their neighbor's house and they and then they would be upset by that. Currently, it is limited to April 1st through November 1st. And one of the
things that was added was again as with the lobster sales, special permit expires upon transfer of the property. So, the key changes is that's related to limited limited to properties with unique features or conditions that prevent people from locating their boat to the side or the rear. Again, it
requires a special permit from the zoning board of appeals. So, it's not by right as the previous one was written. And special permits would expire upon transfer of the property. So, on the 17th of the public hearing, we get did get one written comment regarding allowing the boat storage by
right during the voting season um and then making a special permit during the winter. At the public hearing, um there was support for that by rightight suggestion uh during the voting season, but the majority of the comments were really really related to concerns about that seasonality clause uh and noting
that there's limited uh places for you to store your boat offse. We are a boating community, the cost related to it, and then just creating more enforcement issues um for the building department. So this is the one that the planning board spent the most time deliberating
on for all those particular reasons. Um also taking into consideration concerns of the neighborhood and trying to develop a article that really meets that core issue and has a strong chance of passing at town meeting. So the planning board had preliminary vote to recommend the zoning article as it's written right
now with the seasonality uh 5 to zero. But they did know that we're coming to you. We're looking for some comments um from the select board about that seasonality. The planning board's interested in considering maybe extending it to year round. Uh and we're kind of looking for some input um from
the select board and their comments on that. >> Can I just ask a question about that? Um so this isn't it says boat parking but it talks about camping or recreational equipment. So, how did you carve that out?
It says section 401.1.2 if camping or recreational equipment is parked or stored outside. So, any of these. So, now it's it's eligible to boats only. >> Oh, it's only boats. >> How do you how did you >> It says if a boat cannot be parked or stored to the rear line of the property.
So, it specifically calls out a boat in the article itself. >> Okay. I'm just reading what you gave here. >> Right. And also included in the packet is the actual article that's in the warrant. It says article two boat parking current current regulation. >> That's what it says right now. So people
understand the regul. >> So you changed the definition. >> I'm not changing the definition of recreational equipment which includes boats, but I'm just saying that there's an exception for boats this criteria. >> But not recreational vehicles. >> Correct. Not all recreational vehicles,
just boats. >> Does anybody else have any questions? And you're looking for comments, right, from us? >> Yeah. I I think I I was pretty clear at the last select board meeting that um from my perspective, I'm pretty much uh
in sync with the building inspector and the building department regarding the seasonality. They've recommended that that language be stricken. I think it makes sense. There's a cost. There's an aggravation. They don't have the time. They don't have the personnel. You know, the town having the boat police out and
about hunting down you know, residents, um, I think is a bit of an issue. Um, it has been an issue and from what I heard from the testimony from the building department is they just don't have the resources to
do that. So, um, I don't want to see us at a town meeting having to fund more staff to to to hire the boat police. I think that's that's an issue. Other than that, I think you've done a wonderful job in um looking at this
issue, taking testimony, getting comments, doing an analysis. Um I am uh concerned that Yarmouth would be the only the only community that we can identify that has something like this on the books. So, but I'm I recognize and appreciate the chairman's comments at
the at the planning board. I think you made it very clear you'd be willing to come back and revisit that. So you you had accepted it with a sort of a understanding that you're open to revisiting it and coming back and hopefully thinking that this compromise would be sufficient enough to make it
easier to get through town meetings. So I completely understand uh your rationale for structuring it this way. Uh my preference would be if I were writing it, I would delete that language. And uh like I said, I would I I I I very much appreci appreciate the
work of our inspection department and the work that they do. Um and I fully support their recommendations. So that's that's where I come down on that. So thank you, >> Borcus. >> I like Mark um would support the idea of taking out the seasonality. Um I think
it does put an undue burden onto the building department which is pretty stretched as it is right now. And um a lot of people want access to that boat all year round. I mean, a lot of people out there do use their boats
>> in the offse. I' I've seen it happen. So, um I would prefer to see the seasonality taken out. >> I want um the boats to have a happy place year round. And it does seem that um there are so many boats that there
may not even be places to harbor them in Yarmouth if everybody is forced to store them for the winter. So I guess I I would say I'm in favor of it. Um with the yearround parking ability on the person's property and that would save
the building inspector and his staff the the craziness of having to go around. I mean they have to police so much already and thank you for doing all this. Liz, >> um I'm uh have a question regarding the special permit. Um what's the life uh
time of that special permit >> as long as the person continues to own the property? >> So that means that a boat could be parked and just allowed to fall apart, right? >> That's what's going to happen anyway. If
if it's registered >> registered, >> it's properly registered and is on a registered trailer and we send it an excise tax. >> I guess that's my big concern about um removing the seasonality is that you've
now created an opportunity for everybody to just they don't have to deal with the boat anymore. Just put it on your property and let it fall apart. >> I think they want to use it though. Well, there are many people who are going to want to use it and many people who are not. So, it I think that's the
overarching issue with taking out the seasonality. If it were like a license that you have to renew, but it's not. So, I think yeah, you've you've given um an an a door is now open for
letting boats rot on your property, >> which is an old Cape Cod style. >> Authenticity is what we go for. >> Yeah, if I could respond to that, Madam Chair. >> Um I appreciate the comment. I I I do, but if but the boat has to be
registered. That's what we're talking about is boats that are registered. Correct. The boat has to be registered and it has to be on a registered trailer. >> Exactly. >> It can't be on blocks, >> right? >> Um it needs to be on a registered >> uh trailer. >> I think the planning board has made enough provision in it so that we're not
going to get in the business of in in you know encouraging people to let boats rot. If they're going to let them rot, they're going to let them rot and they're not going to register them. >> Well, quite frankly, right now they can. Under the current zoning, you can park your boat behind the front line of your
house and let it sit there forever. >> That's not going to change. >> That's not changing. >> That is not changing. >> That's that's part of the point that I'm trying to make here that there are aspects of this that are just not going to change. But there's also the difference if I if I can get
clarification that you that in this in this case something that's on the front of the property has to be that that has to be registered every year which is not the case for the side and rear. >> That's true. >> That is correct. >> So that's what you're banking on.
>> And actually they're registered every other year. >> Every two years. The trailers are annual though. >> Yeah. But the boat is registered every two years. Do they have to bring the um trailer to the registry >> or do they just go and basically >> It's a license plate. >> Yeah. Right. Okay.
>> Online. >> Yeah. I appreciate all the work that you've done. I I my position doesn't change on it. I just I I with all due respect to the building department. I I understand they're busy, but we have a lot of eyes in our town that are already a problem. This isn't going to make it
any better or any easier. It's unfortunate, but um they have a job to do and if they need more resources, they need more resources. This isn't going to make or break a full-time person. We have we have people here who have pushed us to have blight policies because we
have so many neighborhoods that look and there's there's it's not it does it's not a good look and I'm very concerned with um adding this. That's no disrespect to the people who've requested it. I am a firm believer that this kind of thing belongs
before town meeting and let them make a decision on what they want in their town. But for me, um, you know, I don't want to look out in my neighbor's front yard and look at a old dilapitated boat because that's what will happen. They're all over town now. And again, >> be in the front yard.
>> Yeah. So that's that's my opinion. And again, I think it's, you know, I think you're making a a a something for a particular uh person. And you know, as I said before, and I'll say it again, there's a lot of people with RVs in this
town that have the same >> restrictions, the same um you know, I understand. We're a boing community. I get it. They have they have to they have undue burdens of having to store it or store it behind the house just like everybody else. Why is a boat different?
>> I just personally I can't see it. And I don't want that all over town because when we do the boat, the next thing is going to be the RVs and and that's not it's it's just they're all they're registered, too. They're all registered. Have you seen what the some of them on the sides of houses look like? It's awful. Some of them are awful. So, it's
just not the look I want for our town. I'm I'm I'm I would I would tend to uh air more towards being more restrictive. Unfortunately, I understand people own their property, but you know, if if we
can't manage some of the real bad properties that we already have, this isn't going to help it. That's how I feel. But that's just me. Again, I believe it goes, it should go before town meeting. I believe it's the people's uh place to make the decision on it. But that's just
my personal feeling. >> Anybody else have anything else to say? I appreciate all your work on this. >> Oh, I just had a question. Um, and there's there's sort of no official way to tell us, but has anybody ever noticed a rotting boat in the visible part of a sideyard? >> Oh, yeah. >> Oh, yeah. I can give you a list of just
wondering because, you know, I'm I'm on a non-boating block. >> Yes. >> It happens. They're all over. >> On the other hand, if they're going to be a mode of escape during sea level rise, um, they're going to have to be
seworthy. So maybe people will start to repair them. >> All right. >> Well, thank you very much on on a >> We will be taking a We don't have a a vote on this. It's just a update. So we at some point in time will >> We'll vote. Yeah. >> A position. I don't know if you have a
final Are you I know you've made a recommendation with where you're at. Are you still >> No, we've had a a preliminary recommendation. We'll be meeting again on the 15th and at that meeting we'll be taking our final vote. Um and you will see that there are planning board members who um are of different opinions
on this. >> Yeah. And that's a great thing. That's how you get I think it is we get we get a better product from it. Our board any board that has differing opinion makes us do better work. So >> um and if I just can make one other comment coming up on your agenda is the your letter to the um zoning board of
appeals with regard to the 40B project. and I'd just like to compliment you on that um and supporting our position on that. I thought it was an outstanding letter um and very forceful and and the planning board really appreciates it. Um
uh so I just wanted to mention that publicly. Thank you. >> Thank you. Thank you. >> Can we also just mention that you do a tremendous amount of work the planning board and we thank each and every one of you for what you do. You're right out there. Thank you. Thank you. We're
having a little bit of fun. >> Yes, we will. >> Back with the local the local comprehensive plan. >> Oh, that's fun. Yeah. Yeah. It's even in two weeks. Thank you. Thanks. >> Appreciate it. Next up, we have the library building committee update.
>> No, you're not coming out. >> Would you guys like to start for presentations? I've got two. >> You want to start with No. >> Yours? >> Yep. >> Okay. How are you? >> Hey, Matt. >> Have a seat.
>> Is this the clicker? >> Yes. >> Evening. >> Hello. >> How are you? Thank you for coming. >> Thank you for having us. Judy Judy Karver. I'm the chair of the library building committee and I have many
members. I haven't really taken headc count but you could all just put your hands up. It's a very active group and Dorcas. So we were here last on June 24th and we were talking about sites. So we're back
here today to give you a runup from what we've done since then. Um, Matt Odens is here from our architectural firm and we have other support people behind me if you have other kinds of questions. So,
uh, here we go. Well, I just want to say, and I know I said it, Judy, at the beginning when you first walked in before the meeting started, a lot of this information, >> um, the RSD associates, >> I believe, um, and some other documentation we just received today.
And so, the board has not had the opportunity to really digest it or go through it. So, I apologize for that. Um, but I'm not sure we're going to be able to really, um, I don't know if anybody's had the opportunity, but I just want the public to know that we may
be a little bit at a loss with that information. So, >> all right. Understood. Um, we we're trying to be sensitive to getting information to you. So, some of that was just rushed this afternoon, so I know it was late to you. Hopefully in our
presentation we'll be able to pick out some of those salient points in that were there and and okay so just where our money has come from at
the annual town meeting in spring 2024 150,000 was approved as the matching portion to the hundred,000 grant that we received from the Massachusetts um library commission to move forward with site selection and
concept design. So that was our charge was to present a design with our application to MBLC by December of this year in order to be eligible to receive additional funding toward this project. So that's kind of the nugget that we've
been working with. And throughout the presentation you'll see dates and dollar amounts in bold. So you have a way to go back and see those if you're looking at those. And what am I doing wrong here? >> It's picky.
>> That one. >> Thank you. >> All right. So, we did um hold a very well attended public hearing on June 17 and then we met as a committee the next day, June 18, and presented the site
across and and we voted and then that resulted in the LBC presenting the parcel across 28 from town hall and at that time we were referring to it as the Simpkins Field. So when you go back
and look at the meetings and documentation, that was the designated term we were using. We've since been corrected and are calling it the Joshua Seals playground.
So the select board approved that site when we came to you last on June 24. Then our next step was the concept designs which were based on information that we had at the time and were presented at two public listening sessions on August 13.
And then these designs were displayed at both libraries and here at town hall and there were comment cards available. We got very few comments back. Uh they were like I like number three, I like number four. um we documented them but there were very few comments um that we got
back in the meantime. Uh there were public speakers who came before you and came directly to the LBC and they presented information that was both very credible and supported. Uh so they were quoting
past town meetings, past uh there was a lot to do with probate court and how we as a town came to acquire the part the main parcel across
and they had information regarding the historical intentions and the restrictions that could apply to part of the site that was designated the Joshua Sears playground. ground. So that's basically parcel 50 which we'll see
later and I think you've seen before the differences between parcel 50 and 60. So on September 8th, uh we received a statement from town council Jo Joseph Routollo and that was shared with the
LBC leadership and it said uh so the question that was posed to him was uh is this restricted and this was from our town manager to get some direction and his response was there is no
specific proverb required to invoke article 97. 7 protection. So that's what he's saying about how article 97 works. But I think from the language in the article to lay out and construct a playground and that it has
been used as a playground is enough to invoke an article 97 protection. So since the LBC has been told that a final legal report would not be forthcoming until December, we had to
re-evaluate our situation and uh we were very fortunate in this, but it seemed like we should respect all of this stuff that had gone on in the past. The property has been owned by the town for hundred years and the restrictions are
there. And personally, I went over to the library and I pulled out old town meeting records and we can find it. It's it's there. Uh and understanding that town council is wanting to do their job
completely, but it's kind of like there are enough red flags here for us to respect that. We also then drew MBLC into conversations, our OPM, which is our owner's project manager, uh, Accenture
and our architects. And through all of these conversations, LBC learned that due to the parameters of the funding we had applied for, the MDLC would consider only the site that we had identified an updated application. However,
that turned out not to be a problem for us because fortunately there was a second parcel in the site. So, the site was this big area and it had another parcel. So, we were able to say, "Oh,
good. Let's look at that." So with that information, the committee and Odinello moved toward a concept design on the remaining portion of the site and um Matt will be presenting that tonight. So for the purposes of a charge we were
given and for the funds allocated the LBC is looking to proceed with this concept phase. we have the money to do this and we want to go forward with this concept uh and our our deadline because we want
to ensure our eligibility for the next phase of the library funding. So that's kind of like what we're working on here. Uh, and I want to just hit the pause button a little because the analogy I've
been using is it's like you have your English term paper due and it's needs to be done by December and we want to keep doing this. However, we're aware that there are other questions out in the community and we want to address those as well. So, that's kind of what the
scurrying was to get you information today. So, the main idea that we've been that we've heard and that was expressed at your board meeting uh was the possibility of reuse of the MacArthur school building. And this has been
reviewed by the library building committee in lengthy and detailed conversations. We've spent a lot of time looking at this and kicking this around. So our proposal to you is tonight and we hope you get your blessing is to
continue the design phase we've been in. So we're using the MBLC funds that have already been approved. These are ours. If we just let them sit, then we won't have done what we could do for the town.
and then to look at the MacArthur building reuse as a separate question that doesn't have the pressure of the December deadline. Have I been clear so far? >> Can I just re spit it back at you? >> Sure thing. >> So you the the grant would not support a
reuse of MacArthur. Thank you. >> Correct. >> Okay. Just the one we've applied for does not >> Right. >> Okay. Does but others might. I don't know. >> This grant is offered every five years
maybe. So, >> okay. >> It's a It's not a once in a-lifetime opportunity, but it is a >> rare opportunity. >> And working on it for two years. >> Yeah. >> Okay. So, we wanted to respect the MBLC process while understanding that there
are the questions in the community. I think that's been our position all along is we've been very open to what the community has to say to us and to listen to that. Um so with respect to the reuse of the MacArthur school building here
are a few of the issues we've uncovered. >> Can you just I'm sorry to you but you keep using a lot of um terms that people may not know or understand at home. So can you I know library building committee is LBC. Can you talk about what MBLC is so people understand?
>> Sure. So the MBLC is the body >> in the Massachusetts library >> library board of library commissioners >> to know what we're saying when when grant makers. >> Yes. Thank you Tracy. Yes. They hold the
purse. Um >> was there anything else that I need to clear up? >> No. The OPM you did say what that was. >> Okay. Thank you. So, while at first glance reuse may seem to be a cost-saving move, there are many
angles to consider. So, we did have an initial assessment on September 30, just last week, and that was uh distributed to you late today. Uh that was done by an engineering team, and the cost of the
for the town was $4,600 to do that assessment. This is a first glance assessment. If we were to go into a full evaluation that would include much more detail and therefore increased cost, um that would
be estimated to be 50,000 maybe up to $100,000 to get the kind of information that would be needed for that kind of reconstruction. So since the MBLC funds the town um would be eligible for
what Matt just said, those funds that we're eligible for only cover new construction. Um they could not be applied to a reuse project. So those would just be gone. Okay. So, we need to take into
consideration that in 2022 over $4 million was poured into that building to make renovations addressing the building's continued use as a school. And I was I received information to correct this slide. So, if you want to get out your pencils and cross this off.
Um, $2 million came from Cape Cod Collaborative and they had another $3 million um in influx, but it did not come from the town of Yarmouth. However, there there was over $4 million poured into that
building just three years ago by Cape Cod Collaborative. They got the funding, they ran the show. So, change of use is a a term that we've come to be familiar with and changing
the use of the building would trigger a long list of modifications, um upgrades due to various code requirements and the needs of a library structure. So, examples of code requirements would be looking at the HVAC,
the heating, ventilation, and air conditioning, plumbing, electrical, energy codes, um, fire suppression needs. The building was built in 1950, so there are potentially hazardous
materials in there that would have to be dealt with. >> This doesn't make any sense to me. So we have we have children in there instead as a school. I mean it's you know what >> but it's a change of use. >> I understand that but a you would think a school would be the most restrictive
change of use and safest part of a a building um than a library but that's just I I understand what you're saying. It just in logical sense it it doesn't make sense to me. >> Understood. So when you when you
initiate a change then you have to come up to present where I think that $4 million brought it up to um >> 2022 code >> depending on what they yes there have been recent code changes and um
brought it up to what would meet their needs at that time. One of the biggest issues is accessibility. And so I want to um stick with that even though I'm talking about I'll talk about that a little more
later. So another concern is when you have a two-story building, there are accessibility issues. that building in particular, and this is explained uh in more detail in the handout that you got today, uh the lower
level is actually 7 ft underground. And so there's a lot of need for uh chair lifts or stair lifts or modifications to get in and out. But one of the other things that goes along with accessibility
is egress. And so when a library has meetings and those kinds of events, uh, egress is also important. So we have a building that would be looking to represent our town, our library, our
main library. And we really want to have a building that people can get in and out of comfortably and in various ways. Um, the last slide had a little bit on it about the live load, too. That's not
exactly a code requirement, but it's an an issue for libraries. So, when you have a school, the live load, in other words, the people moving around load is 50 pounds per square foot. So, you think
of little bodies moving around. Um, in a library, the requirement, and this is fairly recent, is 150 pounds per square foot. So books books are just static, but they're there and they we all know
we've all moved. >> Books are heavy. >> So that's not really a a code thing, but it's it's something that is definitely a factor when we're looking at this. Um, so just a reminder that as Massachusetts
taxpayers, we have already contributed to that money. So the putts that the the MBLC has to distribute, we as a community, we as taxpayers have contributed to. So, we definitely want to use the money we have now, but this
is really our chance to look at this rather than wait for another opportunity. We're really right in line to get this. And if we don't use it, what they do is just take the next applicant and they they would be the ones. >> And then would Yarm go to the bottom of the queue?
>> No. >> No. Just start all over. >> All over >> at the next cycle. >> Five years later. So, any other questions? Okay. So, we do have a presentation from
Matt tonight, too. and he's going to talk about this aspect of staying in the design mode, finishing out our $250,000 worth of money and direction and what
that project is and um how the architects really were able to pivot and look at that second site and say, "All right, what are the opportunities here? a couple of problems, but let's
see what could work on this site. So, that's that's where Matt's going tonight. He has some other info, too, maybe. Thanks, Judy. Thank you, Madam Chair, members of the board. Um, I I I'm going to start actually, I don't want to be too repetitive, but I want to underline some of the points that Judy
made and and recognizing that you just got that report, Madam Chair, that you referenced. Uh that's the structural report from an an analysis that was done, a visual inspection that was done this week. So I just want to sort of summarize that report for you now. Um
and then I'll mention a couple of the architectural considerations and then we'll move into where we are at the moment. So just reiterating a couple of the things that Judy mentioned the the live load requirement um schools actually the 50 pounds a square foot is
a code required structural load and so the structural engineer is quite confident that that is the loading that was used to design it. Um there is no redundancy built into the building based on her assessment. So that that existing structure can't just support more load
than it was designed for. It is unlikely that that's the case. The requirement by the MBLC, again, this is not a code requirement, but it's a a reasonable requirement for library, the 150 pounds of square foot. So, basically tripling the load. The implication here being
that there's a a pretty significant modification of the structure that and this is the upper floor structure. The lower floor is slab on grade. The upper floor is framed. So, it's that upper floor. There isn't a lot of headroom in the lower level. It would mean
increasing the depth of the structure. So, we would reduce the head height further. There are other considerations about that lower level architecturally that that I'll touch on in a minute. But from a structural standpoint, that's one of the key things. Um, building layout
also, it was designed as a school. It has relatively small rooms. The structural system uh combination of columns, loadbearing CMU walls are spaced to allow for easy layout of classrooms and smaller spaces. Libraries
tend to have fewer much larger spaces in order to replan the building to accommodate the library program. We would have to pretty dramatically change the structural layout that supports that upper floor. So again, that that's adding a a significant cost because of
the change in use and bringing the building up to current code. It would need to meet current seismic code. There's no lateral structural system in the building. It's from 1950. That that code didn't exist. Um to bring it up to code today, we would have to add a lateral system. That that means kind of
in layman's terms, we would have to insert welded steel frame inside that existing building to pick up that lateral load. that would have to be tied into the existing structure. It's a it's a costly endeavor and that's that's what it would take to shore that building up
and have it meet the seismic code. Um that seismic code requirement would be triggered by the change of use. So if you simply continue to use it as a school, renovate it, maintain it. Um assuming you're not doing a level three renovation of that building, you're not
triggering the the sort of larger requirement in terms of code. Um, I mentioned the the lower level clearance. In terms of architectural concerns, we would be inheriting all of the physical limitations of that building. Its footprint, its um its floor
relationships, its structural conditions, its bathrooms, its systems. Everything about that building we are either inheriting or we're having to replace or modify in some way to have it meet uh the needs of a of an of a library. Um, Judy touched on
accessibility. I think, and this is not a code requirement, but as a firm that specializes in public buildings and buildings that serve the public good, that are that are important civic buildings for a town, I think fundamentally it's a problem to have a building that is not universally
accessible, that is a public library. And I think the challenge of MacArthur with the kind of split level arrangement, as soon as you walk in the door, you have to make a choice to either go up or down. And there has to be an easy way for patrons to do it. It complicates access. It complicates
egress. Um and and I think we would be fighting that at every turn during the conversion of that to a public library. So again, it satis we could satisfy the code, but I think it would be an unsatisfactory solution to what should
be a really important civic building for the town. Um Judy talked about energy code compliance. Obviously, we would have to comply with all codes. In terms of the investment that was made in 2022, I think a a good portion of that investment would be lost. I think that
the the things like lighting, um ceilings would come out, lighting would come out, you'd have a whole new arrangement of spaces, so the layout of sprinklers, the the routing of HVAC duct work, all of that would come out. So you would lose the investment that was made
by reconfiguring that into a very different building type. Um at the end of the day and and this is based on nothing but our experience, our intuition and conversations that we've had with contractors and our our cost estimator who we work with quite a bit.
Um our our suspicion is that the cost of this project would be very close to if not equal to the cost of new construction. And so it's not a silver bullet. we're going to do this for half the cost of a new building. We think it would be quite close. Now, that that
would have to be borne out by further work. This was an initial assessment that we did for the structural um really what would be required here. And as Judy alluded, this is something that could happen. I mean, we have the time to do this between now and Springtown meeting.
Um what has to happen is a full assessment of the building. We need to have uh an envelope consultant, a mechanical, electrical, plumbing engineer. All of the various disciplines would need to examine that from their perspective and develop a list of improvements that would be that we'd be
obligated to pursue and then price that so we understand what's the cost. Similarly, I think we would need to do a kind of architectural assessment. How you know what would it look like to put a library in here? What would you have to do? What would those spaces look like? Does it fit in that container? do
how much structural reworking would that require? And again, I think if you go through that exercise, that could be quantified at a at a very high level, but it would give you some measure of comfort in terms of the the cost. So, I'll leave MacArthur at that. I I do
want to get into the project itself. Um, >> well, just before you leave and and just remember that that then is not eligible for the funding. So that would be shifting the funding onto the town. >> That's right. And and our our initial
take on the funding is and and we won't know this until we have cost estimates for the proposed project, but based on the funding uh formulas that we've gotten from the MBLC, we're we're projecting the grant amount to be somewhere in the 10 million to 13
million range. So it's not an insignificant amount. On top of that, there's about $400,000 at stake, which would be the reimbursement that the state gives you um for what they call the green the green incentive grant. So,
if you meet certain criteria, it's net zero or it's lead gold or I think there are three different compliance paths that they offer, um they will give you a reimbursement after the fact of another up to uh I think $500,000 is 3% of the
grant award, but in our case, this would be about $400,000. So, that would be on top of the 10 to$13 million grant. So, just to put it in perspective um in in terms of schedule and I just want to make sure that everybody understands kind of where we are in this
process. Building projects take a long time as I'm sure you all know. Um we are in that very first segment there, the feasibility study, six-month study. We're about two months in. We have a December deadline of this year to submit uh the requirements that satisfy the
grant uh to the to the Massachusetts Board of Library Commissioners for their review which will happen in January. We expect to get comments from them uh by the end of January at which point we might have to make some changes, we might not. Uh the build the project will
be estimated at that point and and and then we will have satisfied their requirements and the next step would be to go to town meeting to vote to accept the grant commit the uh additional funding necessary in that time between
the end of December and Springtown meeting. I think there's ample time should the town decide to pursue further study of the MacArthur building. So that that is a possibility. I think there's the time to do that. So by the time we go to spring meeting, we're we're well informed in terms of what what the
various options are. After town meeting, I'm told that the MBLC has a June deadline. So May town meeting, June deadline to sign a contract with the state to accept that money and start design. Design for a project of this type typically is about 12 months. So
that would take us from spring of 2026 to spring of 2027. bidding generally is two months. We'd start construction uh in, you know, fall of 2027 and probably 18 months of construction
roughly finish around middle of 2029. So that gives you a a kind of rough idea of of the schedule and and sort of where we are with a tip of the iceberg here in terms of the amount of time and and also in terms of and I know this is your
interest, it's it's also ours. Um, community engagement is a big piece of designing a public building. There will be many opportunities. We we think there will be more opportunities in this six-month study, but certainly during that 12 month process of design, there
are a lot of opportunities for public engagement, public processes like these kinds of meetings, but also community forums like like we conducted back in August. Okay. So this project when we started we inherited a building program
that was completed uh in 2024. Our first step was to review that program. It's you know a couple hundred pages of information about the library and and digest it and work with the staff and the MBLC to um digest it and and make any
refinements we could that we felt made it more efficient. So we were able to find about 1500 square feet that we could reduce. right off the bat just based on some math errors, some clarifications in the in the written program. So that's the baseline for for
the work that we do that has informed what is now a little bit under a 24,000 square foot building. Um and that's what we've been looking at. So um Judy mentioned this is the the larger property town property. It is combined
of two parcels, parcels 50 and 60, uh with the fields on parcel 50, the MacArthur building on parcel 60. Um as has been discussed, we presented options for that parcel 50. um you know, five different options of
of different configurations for how a library might be located on parcel 50, leave room for a future town common and actually we thought work quite well sort of engaging a town common, you know, having a kind of reciprocal relationship
between those two important things. The article 97 protections obviously made us rethink this. And so we went back to the site and started giving a closer look to parcel 60. We started by ruling out areas that didn't make sense. The area
between MacArthur and the division between parcels 50 and 60, too small to put a building and parking on. Not to mention the fact that the open space kind of overlaps that area. So there was some question about uh the article 97 protections. We looked behind the
MacArthur school building. There's ample space. It's flat. We could fit a building. We could fit parking, but at the end of the day, it's a public building that's kind of hidden behind an old school, and it's it's not visible. It's not all that accessible. We felt it marginalizes the the library in that
location, although there's there's room to put it there. And so, that led us to look at this northeast corner of the property, which um as you may know, is wooded. Um, you probably haven't walked back in there. I have. It's very
difficult. Um, but it it um it it had some things about it that that were appealing to us. One, it's in front of the MacArthur School, too. It is along Route 28. It's it it has the potential for easy access, for visibility. Um,
those are very important things for a public building, especially a public library. and and we think that in that location it could play well with the MacArthur School building. A closer look at that site revealed that there's a lot of topography there.
That's probably why it is still wooded. Um so, but that depression doesn't take up the entire area. The the yellow shaded area is what's dead flat and then it gently slopes down toward the middle. It's not an aggressive depression, but but there is some change in grade.
>> Can I just ask so that's not a hill, it's a depression. depression. Yes. >> Um it is dry. It was confirmed in the original assessment of this site uh during the site selection process that there are no wetlands at play here. This is and and I walked down in there. It's
it is dry. Um so we thought looking at this that there's an opportunity here to actually make that into a benefit. Um a visual amenity potential uh advantage for storm water management. and a range
program around the edges of that depression. Again, keeping sort of forward of the MacArthur school building, having it close to Route 28, allowing for connections from it across sort of laterally to a future town common. Um,
and so we we started to develop a scheme that did just that. Um we this plan proposes uh a new 24,000 foot building arranged around that uh topographic feature and and really using that as a kind of
context that that is special. you come into the library and you kind of discover this hidden gem from inside the library that is a real visual amenity and it it's so important for public buildings to create environments that are memorable that are enjoyable for
staff for patrons that people want to come back to. Um but it also needs to have some presence in the town and so I think having it daylight out to Route 28 I think is a positive. We we didn't think that putting the building fully along 28 uh was going to be that
satisfactory. Route 28 is a busy road. Um we we do think that there should be strong pedestrian connections from Route 28 and I I believe it's it's hard to tell, but from uh from Google Earth, it looks like there's a crosswalk here. If
there isn't, I think it it would benefit public use of things south of Route 28 to encourage that ability. And we we talked about this in the other site, too, that especially with town hall across the road. I think improving those kinds of connections absolutely >> between important public buildings we
think is is really important. Um there is a sidewalk that comes in the access road uh here and it runs along the access road to this point before it turns and then dies out. that could very easily be extended to create an easy um
pedestrian connection. We also think that vehicular circulation could be improved. U there is an existing parking lot here. We think that I mean there's plenty of room here. This is also townowned property, although I don't think we need to go quite that far, but
we think that there could be a shared parking lot that serves both the MacArthur School and the and the library. Um I you know this is a a school that is completely surrounded by asphalt. It's not the best condition for for any building let alone a school. You
know think about at the end of the day discharging kids out you know and their cars circling the building. So drop off and pickup is uh is a challenge and we think that with this project there's actually a chance even to improve vehicular circulation. maybe a new drop
off uh drop off for the library, a drop off for the school that's close to this entrance, which is uh currently the accessible entrance for that building. But also, we think there's a real reciprocity between a school and a public library that that we get excited about. And we think that, you know,
creating more out of the space between them could could be a net positive um for both for both buildings. So, we think there's ample room here to do this to get into the building design a little bit. Um, so we we're still early in the process. As I said, we're 2 months in
and we pivoted uh pretty hard here to to switch our focus to this site. But um this is taking that program document that you saw and starting to arrange that into the site diagram that we developed uh and doing what we call a test fit. So this confirms that the
program fits that the things are generally where they need to be. The three wings are um generally broken out as adult wing, children and teen wing and community wing. So this is meeting room, study rooms um all sort of
supervised by a central service desk which monitors entry and has good sight lines of all of those wings. So it functions well as a library. The NBLC has reviewed this. they they're comfortable with this direction. Um so we we think that we're we're heading in
the right direction. These next slides are are very um preliminary. They look polished because they're 3D renderings, but these are super early concept sketches effectively that just look a little more photorealistic. So this is
an aerial view of the site. This is that building superimposed on that aerial view with the expanded parking. Uh this is the hotel next door. There are a couple of houses here. The edge of the of the lot is along this tree line and then the town property goes off the
screen up at the top here. There's plenty of room, as I said, for expanded parking. Uh there's good separation, we think, between the MacArthur School and and the potential library with the potential for a pedestrian connection along here over to a future town common.
>> What's across the street? >> Um >> South State, please. barracks. Yeah. And town hall is to the right, sort of off the page. >> Um, again, these are concept images. They're they're not welldeveloped, but
these are intended to give you a kind of general sense of scale, right? So, this would be the building as you see it from parking. Um, there's a covered porch that gets you to the entrance, which is here. This is the children's wing that you saw in the plan. Uh, this is the
community wing. So that the main community spaces would be here. Those would be available off hours. So you could still enter through the main door. The rest of the library would be secure, but the community spaces would be accessible as would the lobby, the bathrooms, the support spaces for that
uh for those community spaces. Um this is coming around then to the that sort of central area, the kind of wooded depression that I mentioned. This would be a view from that area looking back towards the library. Um, as you sorry, as you get to the ends of the
wings, the building has an opportunity to kind of project out a little bit over the over the forest, which we think could actually be um quite quite lovely. So, this is the children's wing in the foreground, adult wing in the background. Um,
this is not a dance. There we go. And then a view uh from Route 28. You're seeing the end of the adult wing here, the children's wing visible kind of through the trees. We think at night this could be >> Oh, nice. >> You know, a really inviting thing, but
but um so visible, but also a little bit protected from Route 28. We think there's an opportunity there that is that's unique and kind of special to this particular site. So, that's this is where we are. Um we're hoping to
continue. This is where we would pick up from and take this all the way through to the end of December and submit to the MBLC. >> Thank you. >> My my my I have one question. Well, a couple questions, but what is the um
what is the average square foot for you said this is 24,000. Is that the average that's being built for um other communities in Massachusetts that have a sole individual one? I mean, is is it seems large to me
for some for a town who's going to also keep uh you know have a Yarmouth port and a West Yarmouth library. What >> I I can't speak to that. I don't know uh that statistic. I I do know that and I
don't know the population of Yarmouth. So I don't know how the size of the the kind of combined square footage of the libraries relates to population. The NBLC I'm sure has an opinion about that. >> We have that information, Madam Chair, and I'm happy I I received it from one
of your ear the earlier reports >> and I think it's in the um the programmatic study. It's in there. It's in the appendix. I I I have it right here and um I'm happy to share >> construction >> with members of the board. I can say for example um
>> the town of Brewster has one main library. >> Mhm. >> And that library is 23,418 square feet. >> What's Brewster's population? Just >> um the population >> it's less than that. >> I think it's approximately 16,000
people. >> Yeah. No, that when I was on the library, >> excuse me. No, it's 10,000 people. >> Yeah. >> On the library planning committee, that was one of the first questions that the MBLC asked and imposed and how uh we we
have a 60,000 seasonal population and the 25,000 square feet was what was recommended. >> So, we build for seasonality. No, but even at 30 25,000 uh square feet is is
recommended and >> to get the grant, that's what they're looking at. That's they have requirements. >> What I'm trying to balance I I guess what I I'm just going to get to the meat and potatoes. I I want to see this thing pass. I I don't personally see this thing passing at the size and scope that
we're looking at and the dollar amount. So, I'm just trying to figure out if it's a wish list of what we're hoping >> or if it's really needed, right? >> Because that's what what I want to look at. People have to understand it's and this is no disrespect to any of you,
>> right? >> Um, as Mark has pointed out several times, we have a school coming up. We have other items that the the voters of this town are going to be asked to look at. So, we need to really crunch numbers because we need to we need to get it
passed. I mean, I I believe we need a new library, but I don't I'm not I don't think something of this magnitude is going to pass. I just don't. So, um my next question is for what what is the average right now for commercial or
municipal square footage? You said 24,000 square foot. What's the build? >> What's the average price per foot right now? >> Yeah, for budgeting purposes, we we budget $1,000 a square foot now for a municipal building. Precoid that would
have been >> between $5 and $600 a square foot. >> Uh we saw unprecedented >> talking $24 million. >> $24 million construction and and you're looking at a10 to$13 million >> um grant. >> That's right. >> Okay. Yeah.
>> Um that's construction costs though. So you have to distinguish between hard costs construction and soft costs which are all of the other things that make up the combined project costs. So soft costs would be all the furniture, shelving, shelving is an eligible cost
for the MBLC and and actually some of the soft costs are eligible covered by the grant. Uh the grant is not just for construction dollars, it's for project dollars. So the the um the soft costs include design fees, engineering fees,
uh legal permitting, temporary facilities, you know, anything testing, anything that is not directly related to construction, right? >> Those are generally about authority, right? So they put the plan together and then they itemize what's what's reimburseable and what's not
reimburseable. >> Yeah. and and according to the NBLC's formula about 98% of construction costs are eligible. Um about 50% of project costs or soft costs are eligible and that makes up the combined eligible costs and the grant is
based on on that figure. Um you know the the the construction cost has to be borne out by an estimate. So at the end of this process, at the end of December, we'll have documents that are sufficiently developed at a kind of presematic level to give to an estimator
and get a detailed estimate at which point we'll have a much better idea of costs. Um there's a lot of anecdotal, you know, chatter out there about where costs are and we're constantly talking to contractors and other architects and owners, project managers about where we
see projects coming in. Some are coming in under, some are coming in over. very difficult to predict. $1,000 a square foot is what we budget because we think that's kind of a midpoint. Um we have seen projects come in lower than that on a square foot basis. We've seen
projects come in higher than that. Usually the the greater the square footage, the more economy of scale you have and that number tends to go down a little bit as the building is bigger, right? >> Smaller projects have a premium associated with them and so they're they tend to be higher. Just in terms of your
design, I'm just curious why you took a a a one story layout as opposed to um less lot coverage and uh twotory. >> A couple of reasons. Great question. >> Um one I I mean from a staffing
standpoint, a singlestory library is easier. Twotory libraries, there's also I mean they exist. We've designed them. There many of them in the state. Um, but they require a choice. Who's going to be on the second floor? Who's going to be on the first floor? Sometimes that's a
hard discussion. You know, children, families with kids don't want to have to take an elevator up to story time because there's a hundred of 100 people coming to an event. So, that puts them on the ground floor, but then that displaces other programs. So, there there are programmatic um decisions that have to be made or
priorities that have to be made when you split it into multiple levels. The other thing is supervision by staff. It's much easier to to manage and supervise a singlestory building than it is a two-story building. Um, public libraries are public buildings. They're open and
free to all. Um, sight lines are important. Security is important. Um, bad things happen in public buildings, unfortunately. And so, you want to minimize the potential for that. And so, um, supervision, visual supervision by
staff is a is a key factor when we're looking at design. Um, there's also the need for separation. You know, you need separation between different different programs. You don't want private adult study rooms next to the children's storytime room just because it's
distracting there. You know, noise concerns um access. It's, you know, people getting from one space to another, disruptive. So, generally speaking, the one-story layout allows you to have maximum flexibility in terms of how you accommodate that program and
to have it be as successful as it can be. Um, that's not to say that that's always the right case. We happen to have the ability to do a one-story building uh in terms of the the available area. They also don't have stairs. They don't have elevators. Um, they're easier from
an egress standpoint. They're they don't have the added cost of those items. They don't have redundant things on each floor, multiple bathrooms, multiple janitors, closets, electrical rooms. Um, so there's an efficiency to a one-story building. And when as architects, we
measure efficiency by a ratio of the usable square footage to what's called the gross square footage, the total square footage. The total square footage includes bathrooms, mechanical rooms, storage, corridors, wall thicknesses, all of the space that
isn't uh part of the the sort of net mission of of that institution. The net program is all of the sort of usable program space. The ratio of those two things determines building efficiency from from an architect's standpoint. We expect a singlestory building to be
around 70% efficient. A two-story building typically is less than 65% efficient for the reasons that I mentioned. You have redundant uh corridors, you have stairs, elevators, all the things that are adding. >> So that's a long way of responding to
your question about single story, but that's that's sort of how we arrived where we are. >> All right. I just I I am hopeful that the town will take a dual process. Um I I think that this is a better location than what we were looking at before for a variety of reasons. Um the the
playground um you know we've talked about the seaside festival and all the other things that we could accommodate. I agree with um the reciprocity with between the potential for the school. I think that there's a lot of value to have that school there, but I do think that we as a town need to present the
voters or at least know what the option of that retrofit is. um you know instead of just a a new build I think we should look at both and and give them you know have an option to look at >> book. Thank you Madam Chair. Um first of
all uh I just want to thank everybody that's serving on the committee for all the time, energy and effort that you've spent on this project. It's very much appreciated. And um on behalf of everybody here, I want to thank you all. You're doing a great job. I know it's
frustrating. I know we've thrown some curve balls at you and there's some things maybe we would have liked to have figured out ahead of time like the the legal aspects of the uh the commons area and the public land. I get all that. But the reality is is that we've got a terrific team and I have to say, Matt,
I'm I'm a big fan of you and your firm. You've done a wonderful job. Um every time we throw a curveball at you, you always come back uh with something that's really um well done. Thank you. Architects make great catchers.
>> Okay. Well, the Yankees may need some help. >> Um, so I just have to get that out there because um, as as the chair said, we we have a huge problem on our hands. Uh, we have some major financial challenges and I think it's important that those of us
that serve on the board that are wrestling with these challenges. We need to basically speak on behalf of the people of the community because we're going to be asking them to to spend another hundred million on two phases of wastewater pretty soon. >> We're going to have to ask them to deal
with a new fire station which could cost $50 million. And then we've got the schools around the corner with another $50 million ticket uh for a new school and we have to figure out how we're going to handle that one. So, there's a lot of money that we're going to have to
wrestle with, a lot of costs, a lot of projects that we've never had, we've never had to handle this magnitude of financing before. The reality is we just haven't. Um, we've struggled financially for many, many years. Um, and there are variety of reasons for it, but we're now
because of strong management of the town with uh our management team, we've been able to sort of breathe a little bit financially and now we can tackle some big challenges and there's a lot of them. So, um, I think we all feel I know I feel a very strong obligation to look
at all of the potential angles uh, and to see whether or not the MacArthur school, for example, can be retrofitted for this. I think it's an important option. People are going to ask us questions. They're going to want to know, we have all these extra buildings. Why aren't we using them? That's what I
hear. And uh given all the costs, we better at least put the options in front of the voters. As as the chair said, our job here is to get the best options for the community and give them enough information so that they can make the right choice. And I honestly think the
reuse of the MacArthur I I like what's been said. Let's work on the double track. Let's work down that road. We owe the people of the community an idea of what we're getting into financially with that and what the issues are. On the other hand, um we'd be crazy not to
pursue this other track and look at it. I think what you've done is you've taken a challenging situation and you've actually created something very very interesting and something with great promise uh that still needs to be worked on and flushed out. But um I I just
think that you're it's obvious that you're spending all the right time and a lot of creative energy to help us wrestle through how to build a new facility. And I very much appreciate that. I'm I'm I'm taken away. Every time I go to a meeting and I hear you
present, I'm impressed. And then I never I think, well, he can't top that. Well, you've topped you've topped it. So, I think you've done a great job and I and I feel comfortable with the fact that you and this team are together to help us wrestle through this question and
this challenge together because at some point we're going to have to figure out how we get through this, what the options are and give our best set of recommendations to the to the voters. And I think the direction that you're on with the uh the new build site, the new
build option um you know is a is is a fascinating one. And uh I appreciate your sensitivity to the environment. Um your respect for the trees. We love trees in Yarmouth. Um with the last name forest, you know, it it tends to it it
tends to be part of the u the political >> falls in the forest and nobody's there. Do you hear it? >> I do. I do. I do. No, but I think what what I like is the fact that you've shown great sensitivity to the site every time. I I saw this before when you were looking at the other options. You
saw a site with challenges, but you turned them into opportunities. This area has challenges, but you're looking at ways to make them opportunities. So, I think that approach to addressing our situation is incredibly helpful and um is important. I'm also glad that we can
reassure people that are concerned about the playground and the public land and all that space that we want to protect in this commons project. Uh I'm glad we can reassure people that that's something that they don't have to worry about and that we can move in a
different direction. So I get I think I think the two prong you're coming to us looking for endorsement of a the two to two uh the sort of the parallel approach. Um I think it makes a great deal of sense. I fully support it and I like I said I very much appreciate the
way in which you've tackled uh the the new building option. You've you've you're looking at the right area and with the with the right set of issues and challenges to wrestle with and work out. So uh thank you for that. So I'm all I'm all in favor of what you've done and again impressed with how much you've
accomplished in such such a compressed time frame. So thank you >> well I'm very impressed with you. Thank you. Um like like Mark, I mean I've been blown away when I saw these concepts. Uh what you were able to put together in
such a short period of time is really fascinating. Yes, we do have to follow both approaches because our people in town are going to be asking us to do that. Um I appreciate so much the hard work of this committee. I know how much
time you've put into it. I know how flexible you've had to be. Um and and yet you you kind of come through it all five-star. I mean really fantastic. Um, we
in our process are going to have to be thinking about not only the potential of retrofitting Lawrence MacArthur as an opportunity, but we shouldn't be forgetting the fact that currently Cape Cod Child Development resides in that
location and has put a significant amount of money into that location. Um and and that will I think as well be something that's going to be in in our deliberations. But I certainly support the idea of let's carry on. We have
enough time before Springtown meeting to to come back with some very wellthought out and prepared um ideas. So thank you. Um I had a bureaucratic question before
I before I do my praise dance. Um and and that's um does the MBLC um if we apply for the uh whole design and building grant that with the December deadline and we get that does
the MBLC impose um a very strict you start by this state you finish by this date deadline? >> Oh great question. I don't know the answer. >> My understanding, so just to clarify, um, you've been awarded the planning and design grant, which is funding the
current study. You have also been identified as as one of the immediate recipients of a construction grant assuming successful town meeting vote. So, it's contingent on that. But, but you are first in line that the town of Yarmouth is first in line uh, you know,
with a couple of other communities and and they divide it into tiers. Small tier, medium tier, large tier. Uh there's several other H town of Hansen is is another one of the medium- tier immediately funded towns. Um so after they do their review and you show
compliance with the requirements of the grant through this uh study that we're doing now and provide an estimate then you go to town meeting and you get approval from the town to the community to move ahead and they want you to sign
a contract that June to start. So to answer your question about timing, you need to make a decision. If if you approve it in May, you can't then defer it. You have to use it or lose it is my understanding. And so that could start as soon as as June. And I believe they
want you to be under contract by the end of June of 2026. And then in terms of the the kind of timing, they they do time their distributions. They don't give you the lump sum. It's it's spread out over the course of design and construction,
>> right? Um and and there's a formula for that and I I'm not totally up to speed on that. But um there is an expectation about time, but they also work with you to develop a schedule and they tie their funding to your project schedule. So,
you know, if there's a complicated permit process and you think it's going to take, you know, this town is going to take 20 months instead of 18 or it's we think we can do it in 16 months of construction. um that I think they will work with you, but that's they've got a
model for how that uh distribution works. I don't know if that answers. >> So, there'd be much more pressure about the start date than the completion date, >> I believe. So, yes, >> I I I mean, I think there is pressure about the completion date, but that pressure is going to exist anyway from
the town. The town doesn't want a project. >> Yeah. You don't want it to go on. >> You got that right. Yeah. >> Well, that said, I think it's an extraordinary, beautiful thing to have on have proposed and have on Route 28. I mean, I picture
it just making that whole section of Route 28 and potentially attracting, you know, residents and businesses to locate to Yarmouth. I love that it's on the main street and on the bus line. So, it seems like it's going to be a great
location for people to get to. Um, I love the way you figured in, you know, the the recreation space and the parking space and the shared parking potentially uh with MacArthur. Um, it just seems like it's such a wellthought through
plan. Um, I I really admire it and I I just love the way you just keep getting better and better. I mean, we've just got to give you lots of credit for that. So, thank you for all you've done. Um, everybody who's on the committee, everybody who used to be on earlier
versions of library planning committee. Um, it's great that this many people have put so much work into it. Luke, we're really grateful. >> Thank you. >> Um, so I wanted to uh kind of summarize
for my own brain the renovation or rehabilitation of the existing MacArthur building. um according to the um the review will be likely be close to if not equal to the cost of new construction and if we didn't go for the the the
December deadline, we'd forfeit the grant money. So the plan is to do an assessment while we go forward for the grant money. What's the assess the next assessment going to cost? Was it 40 45? >> Well, just can we just
>> back me up? >> Okay. So, so that oh that the construction cost may be comparable to the new build but there is no money available >> right >> okay so we don't that's important Judy I
hear you >> and all the work that we've done so far on this project then won't apply to the other okay >> so uh all that visualizing and
everything would start again without >> but there is a plan to do the assessment in this >> well that's what we need your direction from tonight so that >> that's sort of where I'm questioning okay >> and did we have a price tag on that
>> we we have a rough idea of what an estimate like that would cost because we've done them before so we did one last year that assessment for for a building that uh is a smaller building but um but it involved the same group of
consultants, the same kind of amount of time to visit the site, make an assessment, write up a report. That was about a $50,000 effort. Um, that does not include any architectural studies of, you know, how would a library how
how could you turn this building into a library? >> That's just for building >> building performance build conditions assessment is what we call it. So, you're looking at the the structure we've looked at. Uh you're looking at the the exterior envelope, you know, the
roof, the walls, windows, uh mechanical systems, >> civil engineering, utilities, all of the things that go into making a building. We have to go back and look what what kind of shape is this in? How much money would we have to spend to make it into
something else? And >> it seems like we might need to do that at any rate. do the assessment >> not for the library perhaps but in general the MacArthur building sounds like in it it's needs that kind of
capital improvement assessment is it on the list for anything >> it does it it does not it's currently leased it so >> that's because of the teny >> and so the town does not need to do that work but but I I would say I I think it
it'd probably be a wise thing to um discuss in a little bit more detail what what the scope that we need in order to compare these things. And I I would say for example um if there is a full and adequate assessment of the building, its
envelope, its structure such that we're able to really hone in on some of the square foot costs that would provide, I think, a real legitimate basis for comparing the two projects short of doing the full design development of the
spaces adjacencies that that type of work. Um I I think you you know you don't you don't need to do so. Um I I I think to uh bring to life the concept that we're talking about now uh you know maybe we'll we'll have to kind of work
out a scope that would uh enable that building envelope assessment to be done just for comparative purposes and and and I I think the budget that we're hearing it it is a lot of money but not in the scheme of making a decision right
uh you know on a permanent >> new structure like that. So I think that um if we don't have to go all the way through design development, we may find a real sweet spot on developing the data that people need to make this decision. >> Bob, I just one clarification. Um the so
the conditions assessment is understanding the existing conditions and how you would have to modify existing conditions, what the cost would be to bring it up to current standards assuming a change of use uh to library occupancy. That's only part of the
puzzle though. the the architectural assessment I think is an important component. If you are going to analyze cost and have a comparison between that as a viable option and a new building is a viable option. You have to go through the architectural study as well to
understand you know it's one thing to talk about it as a library but you you have to try to take the program that we have and fit it into that existing container. What does that mean? What does that obligate us to do to that building? what modifications do we have to do in order to make that work? And so
the condition is one piece of it and the architectural planning study is another piece. I it doesn't have to go as far as this study will. This study because of the state requirements obligates you to what they call the the
MLCP level of design. Massachusetts Public Library Construction Program level of design. It's it's it's their own it's the state's own uh kind of level. It's it falls short of a schematic design package which you know
as as design professionals schematic design development construction documents are kind of the three phases that we go through and those are milestones that we estimate. This falls a little bit short of that early schematic package but it's detailed enough that you can get an estimate. I
think we would need to carry a planning study not that far but far enough that we understand the implications of accommodating this program in that building. >> So it's not it can't I don't think that it's going to serve you well to only do the assessment. The assessment is an
important piece. It'll give you invaluable information moving forward regardless of you know what what that building means for this project. Um but I think for this project you have to do the architectural piece and and we'll have to think about what that is. We should talk about the scope of that and
and I should also mention the $50,000 that's from another library in another community differentiz building. We need to solicit proposals from our consultant team. I think we should be able to do it in that range, but we have to actually get proposals and scope that we can review with you to make sure that that
we're getting everything we need out of them. >> And now we're looking at more like 200,000. >> I don't think it'll be that much. I mean, this this study I I actually don't remember how much this study is. 75 maybe for this study. Um, but I I don't think it'll be that. It could be 100. I
mean, it could be 50 for the assessment and another 50. It might be less than that. It depends a little bit on the scope and the amount of time. >> Okay. Thank you though. That's very helpful. And I had one other comment before I yield. And when you're And I
know these are the ink is still wet. >> Yes. when we are um doing um renderings of Route 28 since the DOT will be making monster hopefully wonderful changes to Route 28. If we can incorporate that so
that you have the sidewalks and the setbacks more their buffer, their bike lanes, all that because I think that will influence what that wing looks like presented to Route 28. I don't think it'll be quite as um woodsy as we might think. Thank
you. >> Thank you. >> Oh, I had a question that I guess is for Bob about this. Um and it's about the uh the tenency. Now, there was the Bridgewater State lease and then Cape Cod Collaborative is subleasasing from
them. Um they've obviously put in several million in I guess what we call capital improvements. They're also taking care of maintenance and utilities while they're there. >> Correct. >> I mean, how long does their lease go?
Because I'm sensitive to the po point raised by Dorcas that um that they really need the site also. Um so that I I would be reluctant to to evict them after they've put in capital
improvements. There's there's no I don't think there's any if Madam Chair if I can just clarify something. I don't think anybody's anticipating evicting them. I think it's a question of their the lease coming up. The lease was sold to the town as a university campus. >> All right. And then when Bridgewater had difficulty
finding uh a way to follow through on their commitments, they they went out and found a tenant and then convinced us that that arrangement with the collaborative made sense and then sold that to us. So, uh, that lease is my my
understanding runs out at the end of the decade. And, um, I think, you know, I think our problem in Yarmouth is we have lots of buildings and, uh, we're struggling with how to put them to use. And I get asked this question, I think I'm sure others do, about what are we doing with all of our buildings? We
should be either unloading them, auctioning them off, or putting them to good municipal use. And I I think it makes sense to, you know, have have a study, but we didn't make a long-term permanent commitment to Bridgewater in their subtenants for the facilities. Yes. And I think quite frankly, it's
been very disappointing that they basically bailed on us because I think we had a lot of hope that, you know, we'd have a university campus here like they have in so many other suburban communities. But we're getting off topic here. Um, I think my hope is is that uh
we can come up you can come up with a a legitimate budget and scope of work that we can review later that helps us do a proper assessment of the MacArthur school because um my hope is is that when we revisit this again with folks we'll have a better idea of what that's
going to cost and uh when that's likely to be done because I think that is going to continue to be part of the conversation. So I don't think it makes sense for us to wait on that. And I think we need to come to some conclusion on that quickly. >> So Mark, do do we feel then that um it
the assessment of MacArthur is worth doing just for its own sake because it's a town building even separate from the whole question of the library um and a separate building. >> Well, from speaking as just this is one selectman here, but uh or select board
member um that lease is coming up. um you know, we we have to build another school, right? So, where's that going to go? Right? That's a $50 million project. Guess what? We might learn something from this study that suggests that you know what? It'll be a it'll be a perfect
place for a new school. I see the uh superintendent still here. >> Um so, yeah, it may it may be a perfect school that solves a school problem that we have >> with renovation or with um >> rehabilitation. What we could do is I would recommend since you've appointed
me to serve on the the the the Margarit school replacement committee, I would suggest that we take that information, uh should there be a decision not to pursue the library at this particular site, then when we get to that point, use that information as part of the the
feasibility study and analysis of a school there >> along with other things that we're going to have to look at. So again, I don't want to, you know, I'm glad the superintendent's here to listen how we're, you know, how challenged we are, but the reality is I don't see any of this money being a waste wasted
investment. >> That's that's our building. The lease comes up at a certain point. We should make a decision on what the best use is for that building in the future that serves the people of Yarmouth. If it turns out that, you know what, we can't do a library there, but it might make a damn good school again,
>> then you know what, >> right? That's let's present that. Let's take that up and deliberate on that at at the appropriate time. >> Yeah. >> Okay. Thank you. >> So, I guess I'll just close out my by saying I support the plan and I um look forward to your um getting meeting the
December deadline. >> Thank you. >> Thanks. >> We have anything else? Thank you all very much. So before we leave, we need some direction from you because we were um as part of our outreach and this
group is very committed to community involvement. We're going to be at Seaside and we'll be um distributing those brochures that you have. The comment on the brochures are that they're limited publication runs because we want to keep
them up to date. So, as information changes, those are kind of going to be uh updated. The QR codes on the back will lead you to correct information and the most current information. So, that's
what we're going to be doing this weekend. We do have this room reserved next week uh for another listening session, but uh I heard in the wind that you may
want to be doing another um hearing here within the context of a select board. So I >> we don't have anything at this point to present to them. That's that's the we have >> Yeah, Madam Chair, I know I've been the one sort of insisting on a public hearing, but obviously this this whole
project has morphed and changed and um I think it would be very helpful if if you and use the forum for your own forum to educate people on where things stand and and get input further input from the public. I don't think there's a necessity for us to partner with you and
do some big public hearing. >> Okay. >> Together. At this point, >> at this point, Madam Chair, >> the the only thing, if I could, is that um proposing a week from now for the public hearing, I don't think is giving you the lead time that you need with the public. So, you'd have to be pushing it
out to a different date. >> So, we'll have to just work on availability and what what's happening here. Um, I did want to go back to Tracy's um, question about how large the library was and wasn't based totally on uh,
population, but it was that study that was done by disruptive construction. Is that their name? >> Yes. >> Yeah. Okay. So, they're the ones who did um the public meetings and the questionnaires. You may know more about that than I do. >> I'm not going to. Yes, that was the
right firm. They did it. >> Okay. So that's where that number came from as a starting point and then as Matt talked it it did get um squeezed in a little bit. So population is one factor but it wasn't the only one. Um
>> and what do you need from us Judy? You I mean I think you got a sense you got a sense of what everybody is I think on on track for the dual uh parallel moving forward. >> Yes. So that that was it. and I didn't know about the public hearing and we
will delay any other because we're going to be out there in the community this weekend. So, we'll put off another kind of listening session. So, that was all we needed. Thank you so much for your time. >> Thank you. >> Thank you. >> I just want to let the community know that these are not just available at the
Seedside Festival. They are available at both libraries and here at town hall. And to show that we've been listening to the community, um I've seen a number of questions and Facebook go to the microphone if you're going to speak so people at home can hear you >> and identify yourself please.
>> Hello, I'm Mindy Harrington, youth services librarian and I just wanted to point out that this trifold that we have created that will evolve is found also at both libraries and town hall and to further enforce that we are listening to comments. This first round of this
trifold does address the questions of how much our programs have grown in the last several years and um addresses a question like we had a question of how many computers are actually used at the library. As you can see on this trifold, you can see the growth that we've had in
the last three years for public computer use. So hopefully that answers some of our community's questions during the first round of this. >> Excellent. Thank you, Mindy. Yep. Thank you all very much. >> It's an extraordinary vision. Thank you. >> Thank you.
>> Next, we have um a vote to approve Old King's Highway election meeting warrant. In our packet, we have a memo from Mary Mazlowski, who's here and prepared to speak on this. And on the third page of
the packet information is um a proposed motion that the board can consider. >> Again, Mary Masowski, town clerk. Um this is our standard annual request for the board to issue a warrant for the Old
Kings Highway annual meeting and uh annual town uh Old Kings Highway election. We are recommending that the date be scheduled for Monday, November 24th and that it be held here from 5 to 6 p.m. in the town hall hearing room. We
have had much luck since we've moved it here. It's better accessibility for for everyone. And for those people that are unfamiliar, anyone who lives in Yarmouth north of Route 6 is considered a part of the Old
Kings Highway District. So those persons are all eligible to register to vote and to participate in the annual meeting in the annual election. Um as most of you know we replace one member of the Yarmouth
annual the Yarmouth Old Kings Highway Committee on an annual basis. >> Excellent. Thank you Mary. Does anybody have any questions for Mary about vote? Is anybody prepared to read the motion? >> I don't have it. I think there are two motions.
>> I hereby move that the select board adopt the warrant for the November 24th, 2025 Old King's Highway annual meeting and election and direct the town clerk to have said warrant duly advertised and posted in
accordance with the charter and bylaws of the town of Yarmouth and the laws of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. I further move that the select board set the date and time of Tuesday, November 18th, 2025 at 4:30 to be the deadline for candidate to obtain nomination paper
from the town clerk's office and Thursday, November 20th, 2025 at 4:30 p.m. as a deadline for candidates to return nomination papers to the town clerk's office for certification to be included on the old
Kings Highway annual meeting ballot. >> Second. >> Any discussion on the motion? >> No. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> Any opposed? Passes unanimously. Is there anything else you need from us, Mary? >> Nothing else on this matter. Thank you.
>> Thank you. Moving on to our budget policy. Um Bob, >> you have the draft select board budget policy statement in front of you this evening. And I would point out um firstly the 2027 budget schedule um is
accompanying that material. And the the key starting factor is that we hope to issue the budget materials to department heads on October 10. So that's um by the end of this week, departments will be working on the budgets. They'll have
those into me by 11:7. And the the draft policy statement um incorporates the guidelines that the select board establishes before we start the budget. And some of the the highlights of that is to ensure that the select board
goals, financial policies are adopted by the board. It covers education increases to have amounts reserved within the limits of Proposition 2 and a half. Um, it ensures that all of the wage increases, overhead items such as
utilities, pension, health shall all be fully funded in the budget. It addresses the issue of retirey health insurance and making contributions to the other post-employment benefits that OPED uh liability that we have. Um, it addresses
using recurring revenues and free cash to support the capital spending. um to maintain road maintenance spending within the property tax, to um conserve a portion of free cash for future
spending needs, and to um also make sure that we set aside recurring funding sources for future capital needs as well as smoothing out the startup of the debt service for the wastewater. and um any new staff positions have to be fully
funded with secure, recurring and sustainable funding sources. And taken together, these policies are um you know, sort of a bumper guard. You know, they protect the town uh in the budget process to ensure that we have
sustainable fully funded budget for fiscal year 2027. Does anybody have any questions on the budget policy? Is there anything really that deviates from >> no previous years? >> We we've kept it on. We've had, you know, it's evolved a little bit over the
years to meet the current needs such as the smoothing of the wastewater, but the key thing is to keep it within the town's financial policies and to make sure that it's sustainable. It doesn't set us on a course that we're going to require, you know, future cuts. There
was a a bit of a attention to free cash as well and there was a policy. Now there were some um notes that I was going to bring forward later about discussions from last year about some changes. Um
and I I don't I don't know that this is the right time. So town bylaw allowing intrabudget transfers with appropriate approvals reducing the need for special town meetings. Um >> that we have. >> Okay. Okay. So that's but I don't want to keep this this is not the right time.
I'll do it in comments or >> Oh, that would be great. >> Okay. And anybody have any questions on the uh the policy budget? >> Madam Chair, I vote I move that we approve the uh budget policy as presented tonight. >> Second. >> Any discussion on that? All those in
favor? >> I I pass unanimous. Thank you for your work on that. And I'm happy to see that >> you're getting an early start. I know it's a little bit abnormal, but hopefully it will position us better. >> Thanks to Jennifer Mullen, our finance director, for cracking the whip on it. I
really feel like we're um we're fully engaged on the on the budget already. >> Uh for everybody's knowledge, uh the next on the agenda is uh our input on uh the chapter 40B proposal, the zoning board of appeals. Um, there's a draft
letter to Sean Iiggo from the Board of Appeals in our packet that outlines our concerns based on commentary that have has already been discussed. Um, I don't know if everybody's had the opportunity to to read it and uh make sure that it
hits all of the points. I think Bob did a great job drafting it. >> Um, >> I think it does. Madam Chair, I move to approve the uh letter uh and uh on the chapter 40B proposal that was presented to us this evening by the town administrator.
>> Second. >> Any discussion on the letter? >> I have a little bit of discussion. I I think I approved the letter. I don't want to hold us up, but I've looked much deeper into this project. and and I probably should have done it before, but
um I I see some um efforts at it being an admirable project from the green energy viewpoint and the sustainability viewpoint. I happen to know the firm and that is what
they specialize in. Um but I do when I look at the design, I can't abide it. So that's where the the for me there's a real problem here. >> So >> 27 units on an acre is >> right. Well, and it's interesting
because I've even got a page here that says 23 rental units. So they one of the issues has been that they um they've got multiple uh proposals in the wind and even what was what I looked at today has typos and differences that who knows
what they're really proposing. May I make one comment, Madam Chair? >> When I look at these plans, to me it was like looking at a size 10 foot being squeezed into a size six shoe. >> Listers to follow.
>> We got a motion on the floor, Madam Chair. >> A motion and a second. Uh, any more discussion on the letter? >> No. >> Enthusiastically support. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> Any opposed? I unanimously vote to send that letter. Next up, we have a review
of our special town meeting articles. Um, if you'd like, I could quickly go through what the articles are and see if there's any questions. >> Yes, sir. >> Um, I would start this. It's a short town meeting. Um, there's 14 articles.
Um, article one, interesting. We just talked about it with the budget policy. It's our oped transfer and those are the other post-employment benefits. there's an unfunded liability for future retiree health care costs that we um are working
and we're actually doing quite well on retiring that and this keeps us um on target. So it's a $500,000 transfer toward that trust fund from free cash. Um article two, >> so this is we're paying as we go full in
full. Correct. We pay in full for the actual retirey >> and a piece towards >> and a piece towards the unfunded liability. >> So that hasn't changed. Okay. Thank you, sir. >> I was also going to ask what is our free cash balance at the at this time?
>> Um I don't have it um exactly. We um have applied for a reertification of the free cash. So it's kind of in flux right now. it, you know, >> should be more, you know, in the $7 million range if it's consistent with, >> you know, what the initial estimates
are. But I I don't want to quote that number because, um, the Department of Revenue goes through a litany of calculations to determine that. >> Deprive them of that. >> And, um, article two is refunding of
$100,000 towards the analysis of the PAS groundwater contamination. And that's the environmental contamination, not specifically related to the water supply, but the continued strong participation in the studies ongoing for
the point source pollution um emanating from areas such as the Barnstable County Fire Training Academy as well as the Gateway Airport. And >> did we ever get a response to our letter at all? >> Um there is a detailed process. They
didn't respond to us directly, but um there has been a tremendous amount of activity and and they're actually um installing at this point um a permeable reactive carbon barrier that's designed to initiate some of the first level
treatment um at the facility. So, they've obviously heard us um uh on on some of that. >> That's good news. Is $100,000 going to keep us give us enough to >> It is a I estimate a little bit more than we'll need for the upcoming year.
Um I researched this and we have sort of a detailed scope from our consultants that is involved with monitoring that work and also the things like we've done the shellfish testing and we're um moving forward on a number of areas and
so um this will take us through to next year and you know we'll have to go kind of on a yearby-year analysis to determine what levels of investment but we do have a scope and a lot of work that I think that this will be put us in a a much better position to understand some of these issues. So that's article
two and and then article three gets into the PAS for um the water treatment under wells 10 and 11. And um this helps us speed up the the process. And I want to point out that
both of these two articles for the PAS are being funded directly from the litigation funds that we've received as part of the proceeds um from the class action lawsuit on POS contamination which the town has received over a
million dollars um to date. and uh this additional design funds we have applied for the um SRF funding to do the design and and what this does is it jumpst starts that effort because the um SRF
funds don't kick in till 2026 and so this way we'll be a little bit ahead of the design for >> this is the same type of treatment program that we did on five and six >> correct >> okay >> and that is article three article Four
is um to refund the airport consultant project in the amount of 75,000. And um this is a particularly important time for this because um we've recently um after all
of the efforts we've put in received the um approval from the airport that they're putting together um some listening sessions with the FAA to have a roundt um to develop the specific standard instrument
departure system that we've ad advocated very strongly for. And this was a recommendation developed by our consultant that has identified that over 90% of the flights are instrument takeoffs from the airport and that we could work jointly with the airport as a
win-win situation to institute this automated departure system which sends the flight path away from the more um heavily developed areas of our community which are directly abuing the airport. Great to hear. But when the manager was
here the last time, she told us she couldn't force a a pilot to fly any particular way. Do you remember that? >> I sure do. And and I I want to point out that there's a new manager who has you know more experience in the um you know the air traffic control end of things.
And and I want to tell you is that that's why it's so important that we have this consulting because we learned that that's not true. that, you know, they're quoting these regulations that that say in an in an emergency situation, right, the pilot gets to make
evasive actions and no one can tell them that they can't do that. Well, sure, everyone knows that's true. But with over 90% of the flights on standard instrument departure, it's all programmed in and they will comply with it. So, the idea that you can't tell
somebody what to do, that, you know, is the most facious argument I've ever heard. >> Good. Mark, >> Madam Chair, I I think it might be helpful or beneficial for us to talk a little bit about maybe adding some language to this particular article uh to get town meeting on board with us
actually presenting recommendations uh to abate noise at the airport within a period of time so that we raise the funds to provide consulting services but that um you know um >> I don't follow I'm sorry
>> I guess what I'm saying is >> impacts you. Yeah, >> that's not enough. >> What's that? It >> says mitigating impacts. >> No, it's what we're doing is we're paying for a study. I think I think to some degree residents want to see us do something. >> All right. >> Well, it says that in the explanation, too. At least it mentions the um
>> then maybe in the explanation we we're very clear that we have a plan to present recommendations on noise abatement having adverse effects on Yarmouth residents by such and such a date. >> Read that last sentence for a sec. It's a really good sentence. It's a really good sentence.
>> I mean, it says exactly what you're saying. >> That's right, Bob. >> All I'm saying, all I'm saying, all I'm suggesting is let's give the the voters a time frame that we want to get this work done by such and such a date so that we can present those recommendations. Um I I don't think people are going to
be thrilled with endless studies, but we have a plan actually present. >> It's a consultant that's working for I mean, we would like it to be done today, but >> yeah, exactly. >> We're asking them. >> Let's put a date in. We can give a date though because we don't know what's going to be. >> Sure we can. >> You don't know what they're going to agree to.
>> Sure. Sure we can. >> Well, well, I think it's arbitrary. You can say we're going to have noise abatement by a certain date. But >> no, I'm not suggesting that we have we should make a request a formal request to the airport commission by such and such a date. That these these are the >> Didn't we already do that? Didn't we
already make the request, Bob? >> Yes, we did. We've requested it multiple times and and it's been a real chore. Maybe we could work in there that we'd like to work to design and implement this system within the next year. >> There you go. Bingo. Within the next 12
months. Bingo. >> And and you know, at least if we're starting to design it. >> Yeah. >> That's the most important thing. >> Yeah. I honestly, you know, I I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but you know, we're studying something. Let's let's get let's let people know that you know what, we're going to not stop
studying and we're actually push abatement recommendations by a certain date. Wish we had done it last year. >> Yeah, exactly. It's sort of this thing drags on and on and on. I'm sick and tired of talking about noise complaints at the Bonstable Gateway Airport. I
really am. Let's Let's stick them a set of recommendations and then let's be calling for meetings and writing cranky letters and urging them to get on board with it. >> I have a comment about it, Bob. Should it say that this is a refund to see if
the town will vote to appropriate and transfer uh to provide a refunding for the consulting service? >> No, it's the article is just an appropriation. If we could in the explanation you can talk about that it's
um additional funds refunding within a year all of that all of the >> continue continue our funding quest. I just think people should know. Well, I mean, people who are new to town meeting are not going to know that this is coming back and coming back and coming back.
>> Well, that's that's that's the frustration that that's the frustration I'm trying to address is we have a I mean, we're going to have a constituency here at town meeting that's going to be saying how how long are we going to keep studying this? So I I do think it's important and incumbent on us to be
clear on our expectation of literally presenting something for adoption within a period of time. >> Mhm. Okay. >> Because if I if I was a resident, I mean, I can think of all the neighborhoods where people have been complaining for about noise, right? Yes.
>> Yeah. They're going to sing, "How long are we going to keep studying this? When are we going to, you know, fish or cut bait on this thing?" Well, I think people have to realize that we're doing the best that we can in in negotiating and trying to, you know, >> I don't want to spend all night at town meeting having to defend why nothing has
happened. All right? Or I shouldn't say very little has come of our efforts. I'd like to at least provide some assurance that um you know some kind of plan will be presented for consideration at a certain point in time. I know we had some we've
had, you know, I think one of the reasons why we're continuing to do this is we the discussions that have gone on with the prior regime at the airport have been somewhat productive. We have a consultant that we have a great deal of confidence and so I'm hopeful that this will lead to something. But again, I
think it would be helpful in the explanation to make it clear that we're going to be pressing to submit something by a certain point in time and then after that pressing for them to adopt the noise abatement measures. So, >> okay, we all set with article four.
>> Is that okay, Bob? >> Yeah. No, that's fine. We got that. Um, good idea. Article five is the ENT elementary school feasibility study. Um, and that's in the amount of 1,500,000. >> Is any of this reimburseable or not?
>> Yes, it is. >> It says it is >> 100%. >> Um, well, our reimbursement rate is 57%. So, 57% of these funds will be reimbursed directly back to the town. >> Why did it go up so much from the last time? I think last time it was like 875.
So $1.5 million for feasibility and that you get nothing for that other than options. That's a lot of money. I know Dr. Smith's chopping at the bit. [Laughter] >> Yeah. Well, you >> That's a lot of money.
>> Good evening. Mark Smith, superintendent DY. Uh so what we did to come up with the number is we um MSBA gives you a bunch of recent data and the library presentation you know confirmed costs have gone up a lot in recent times. So,
we looked at um MSBA gave us costs for elementary schools for the last well, they gave us all the way back to 2014, but so then we looked at projects going back for the last through 2023
through up to they had most recent data was up through 24 projects that are in the pipeline. And so projects range. There's one that's um very that's an outlier piece of data and I've actually contacted that school district and they're actually paying more money now
because their feasibility study was less expensive and they didn't do like testing of the um environment etc. But um every other project um was between 1.1 and 1.1 1.51 million. So we feel
like we're right in the ballpark for what all other districts are paying. >> When do you actually bid a feasibility? So will you have hard numbers prior to to town meeting? >> So no, we have to we have to get town meeting to approve the funding in order
to get through the the phase that we're in now. So we're in the eligibility period. We had a whole bunch of things that we had to accomplish. Um this is really the last one. The rest was a bunch of data pieces around enrollment. We had to talk about some of our initial
um ideas for what like very loose ideas for what a design might be. We had to answer a bunch of questions for MSBA. There's been like a bunch of timeline things that we had to submit to MSBA. We had to form a building committee. That was one of the things that had to be done as part of the eligibility period.
Um and then this is the last big piece during the eligibility period is the town has to approve um the funding for the feasibility study. It all has to be done by December 26th I think is the date if I have off the top of my head I can go look it up but um and then at
that time then MSBA will invite you into the next phase which is feasibility. So when you have the funding in place and they invite you into the next phase and then you start the feasibility phase which includes securing an OPM um doing the feasibility phase which is the OPM
and a designer and then um getting through SK up to schematic design. >> Okay. I see that Bob has this coming through free cash which I think is going to help you. I don't think that happened last time. I think we had to go and borrow the money to get it done. it.
This will this will help us avoid a a lot of the borrowing costs have risen up and um >> just so much money >> but we will get hopefully 57% of it back and that will go right back to free cash. So that >> yeah that's our base rate right now is
57.11%. >> What was it at the intermediate school? >> It ultimately ended up being 58 something 33 I think. I again I could go look it up. >> That's all right. But I and there'll be other opportunities for us to other incentive opportunities for us again
some of the conversations around like lead gold if there are other part points in the design where we'll be able to potentially increase that percentage you know not you know we're not going to get to like 65 or 70 but there'll be some other opportunities for us to increase
the reimbursement rate by a couple of percentage points up to a couple of percentage points. >> Okay. But our base rate is 57.11. >> I just wondered then if the the last sentence these funds are eligible for MSBA reimbursement, should it be at 57%.
>> No. >> No. >> Because we may because we may get more. >> Pardon? You might get more. >> Yep. Yeah. >> But you won't get 100% is what you're saying. >> No. Correct. >> You say there's should say then partial >> reimbursement. >> And I'm happy to answer those questions on town meeting floor if somebody wants
to ask the >> probably get asked. Okay. >> Is that it for feasibility? >> Article six. >> Thank you very much. Dr. Smith, is the um repealing of the plastic reduction
bylaw and the um board of health has approved unanimously the new regulations. So, they're going to start the public outreach on that. Um, article seven is to
amend the bylaw for the guide for town meeting, which is the book Town Meeting Time to reflect the most recent edition. There's a new edition out and bylaws reflect the old edition. So, >> Oh my god.
>> This This will be a um a good >> Where did this come from? Was this from town? >> This came from um No, our town moderator. >> Oh, okay. Okay. >> So, what's the addition now? It just says the most recent edition of >> most recent edition because there may be
in the future yet another edition. >> Yeah. Not another 20 years. And then article eight is the golf capital expenses that um they're a little bit different than a lot of the departments because they need to get a lot of this stuff done over the winter
so that they're not doing it during the season. >> What are they doing to the driving range, Bob? >> 50 grand. >> Are these even real numbers? What are these real numbers, Bob, or are they just numbers that somebody picked? >> No, those are the those are the real
numbers. Um I haven't seen a bathroom renovation on a municipal uh prevailing wage project at that number in oh many years. >> You think it's high or low? >> I think it's low. Yeah. >> Yeah.
>> That's a lot of money to renovate a bathroom these days. >> It really does. Do you remember how much we paid for the get me started? And then we put portaotties outside. We built we built bathrooms at at uh at Oldtown House Park and they're locked. We got portaotties outside. So, go figure.
>> I don't even think the >> I don't even think I don't think this the senior center has the bathrooms done yet. >> They don't have a fund. That's why unfortunately, >> and I can send out the project sheets. I've got a project sheet on each one of these. I don't know exactly what they
>> I just wonder if they're if they're actual >> the cart barn is design funds on on that one. That's a bigger project. >> You should say design. >> Yeah. Then just a card pine design. >> Renovation might be a redesign, too. >> All right.
>> And I see that in the explanation, the total for these improvements is 400,000, but the sum is 300,000. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. That's >> Whoops. >> It's an error. >> Catch. >> We'll have a lot of people standing up
over that one. >> Yeah. >> 5253. They add up to >> typo. It should be 300. Good catch on that. 250 250 Wait a minute. That would have been something. >> That's the Gulf. And then article nine
is the fire department capital expense. And >> so the bottom the explanation gets changed on that one >> in the typo in the explanation >> on are you back on eight or >> Yes, I'm on eight. >> Uhhuh. >> Goes from three.
>> Right. the there's one typo, the 400,000, and then also they're um working on what the um the final retained earnings are as of 2025. >> So that's March. You'll see an update on
that. >> And then article nine is fire department capital expense. Um, and they're putting the ambulance in now in the fall because there's a three-year time on on an ambulance. >> Should we have the ambulance fund on
there as well? The >> It says it at the bottom. >> It doesn't give us the total that's in there retain >> in the explanation. Yeah. What's the total amount? >> Could Could we put that in there, Bob? Sure. >> What do we have in in the ambulance fund?
>> I think that number needs to I would agree with you. It needs to be in there. If it's in the others, >> don't get asked. So, I might as well just put it in >> the balance. >> And then article 10 is the open space acquisition out at Taylor Bray Farm,
Kingsway, and that is a combination with the >> community preservation. Will we I know in the past we've had um
a note about what's in free cash as part of the explanation. Are we going to do that do you think at all in this? >> Um we may not have it by the time this is published but we'll have the free cash by the time the meeting >> we can at least report it.
>> Yes. >> Should it say anything about no taxpayer dollars will be required? Well, I guess you can't if it's free cash because that is taxpayer dollars to some degree. >> This is all taxpayers. >> Yeah. Never mind. >> Okay. >> It's best usually just saying exactly
where the money's coming from. And >> so that's article 10. But there is also um I don't know if we'll hear by the time we get to town meeting there's a major grant application in on this that could um fund most of the town's share. Can I just Can I just ask about town
meeting time? Does that change any of the um the twothirds requirements or anything like that? >> Oh, it's fairly parliamentary. >> Okay. >> How you deal with motions and things like that. It's good in case you get into an argument. >> It's like Robert's rules of order for
town meeting. >> For town meeting. Yeah. >> Just making sure it's not changing any of the >> No. No. >> Substance because I know the zoning got changed but in the state, >> right? Those those are a matter of state law. they would not be in the town meeting time.
>> And article 11 is a revision of the the dog bylaw that the changes there. There was town clerk's office has worked I think for the last year and a half on on this that there's there's a lot of cleanup items but the primary issues
were the um regulations covering the the kennels how the kennels are approved how they're managed and and I think it's a vast upgrade >> has this been to the board of health because that's in their purview.
Mary. Hi. >> Good evening. >> So, no, this doesn't affect the board of health. This only affects the um the dog provisions and it's based on the state enacted uh something called Ali's law last year which now require changed some
count provisions requires us to now do an annual filing with them. So, there are three major changes in here. one um I'm hoping we change the licensing period from July 1st to a calendar year end which will
allow us to capture those applications as a part of the census. So a dog application will go out together with a sticker application and the census in January so that we can kind of capture that is is a threein one um mailing. Um,
in addition to that, we always had a multi-et u provision and definition in our bylaw. That was essentially our equivalent of a personal kennel. Uh, the state law now allows five or more dogs. So, it didn't
make sense to have a multi-et permit and a personal kennel, which um provision, which is different in the state law. So, >> so does the board of health regulations regulate >> doesn't this doesn't affect this doesn't affect board of health at all. Natural
resources is is the um is in charge of dogs. So, this doesn't these changes don't affect anything with the board of health. It's really the natural resources office that goes out and does the inspections for dogs. So it's not it's not really these
changes are only affecting the dog provisions to make it tailored to the um the changes from alli's law. >> So the other than what's in red is already >> correct >> correct. >> Okay. And did you look at any other
towns? >> So the frankly the majority of towns um have a licensing period of January to December. It's it's unusual to be a a fiscal year um in that and really this
was enacted and effective in September of last year. So most towns are still in the situation we're in is trying to tailor them to um to the new state law. So, uh, town council was on the phone with, um, the attorney general's office
and the department of agriculture as late as yesterday trying to confirm one of the provisions. So, um, a lot of it is new and the implementation is new with respect to uh to the kenneling
uh, registry with the Massachusetts Department of Agriculture. >> We have a chance to this is a lot. I I don't think we want to get into it right now, but will we have a chance to really discuss this >> or >> the changes? >> Well, I mean, it's not all this all this
is in red I is is new. >> I looked at it though and it's very uh um housekeeping. >> 99% of it is housekeeping. It is to correct provisions so that we now comply
with the state statute which was put in which was enacted like I said last fall. This was the first year we had to actually register and file a notification with department of agriculture on >> chairman's right that we we need to figure out a way to provide proper
notice and and maybe have a hearing or a meeting some discussion of it where folks can be noticed. So, we were we were hopeful to get this on annual town meeting in the spring and we did not have an opportunity to do that. >> So, unfortunately, um >> Well, I'm not sure.
>> No, no, it's fine. I mean, it's here. We can we can have it on the thing, but I think that we maybe should carve out some time before the town meeting to >> at least um kind of go through it because >> No, happy to. I understand. I understand it's meeting. So, if we can do some of
it and get the questions in advance. >> Absolutely. >> It's tight. Unfortunately, when um I reached back out to town council, the original attorney that had been assigned it back in April had left the firm. So, >> yeah, madam chair, >> kind of fell by the way wayside a little bit. >> I'd like this in as an agenda item with
some notice to the public that we'll be talking about it >> in the interest >> to have a town meeting preview on November 4. Would that be an adequate time? You think >> put it on our agenda as an agenda item >> for like a almost a public hearing? We could discuss it. >> I don't have a problem talking about it.
I just want to make sure that we provide some advanced notice and publicize it so that people are aware that we're taking it up so that we can, you know, it's all about transparency was where I'm >> from a practical standpoint. We've been complying with the state law. So we, you know, we've done the kennel
notifications. We've uh seen all of that >> and we've seen No, I understand that completely. the public, you know, I think it'd be good for us to just talk about a couple times so we don't >> get into answering >> November 4 and we can help do the public,
>> I believe. So, yes, >> I should be. >> Perfect. >> Okay. So, we're going to have a hearing on >> There's just things in here that like Yeah, this like the select board may require like things like that that
>> Yeah. That gets into shall or may. >> Well, how about 79-7-2 where the town administrator, town clerk, select board, chief of police shall all of these folks shall inspect. >> So that is straight out of the state statute. As crazy as that is sign up for
inspecting kennels. >> Appreciate that authorize somebody. It's in our >> So it it's the natural re the natural resources officers are are automatically a part of that list. And they are >> obviously the expectation is that they would do it >> thousands. We have to go say or
>> I vote that Bob go out and inspect. >> Sure. That's just what he wants to do as well. >> All right. So, we'll talk about this again because I we you know I've read it but just once and we've uh it's a lot.
>> Well, we've got a lot of dog lovers in the town of Yamoth. >> We do. >> They do. They should they should have a chance to weigh in before we go to go to town meeting. >> Okay. >> Happy to answer questions and we can also uh reach out to uh council if we need to make changes. >> I think the controversial portion of
this will be the removal of dog waste. >> Don't you think? >> Let me tell you one of the worst things I ever do in all my time here was have a dog hearing. >> That is the the worst. >> Oh yeah. >> So that is one thing we did confirm. We've done it. It does not change
anything with relating to dangerous dog hearings. You folks are still um on board for all of that. Uh >> really, we can't delegate that to >> I'm now the I'm now the person that's responsible as the licensing agent, though. It it just the lost kind of clarified that portion. >> You can't delegate that to the town
clerk? >> I don't believe so. I believe I believe it is specifically listed as >> limited on delegate the authority to handle those matters. >> I think you can, but I think that's something we should talk about. >> Okay. I I think delegating it to somebody like, you know, chief of police,
>> the worst part of dogs, >> dealing with the dangerousness of hearings, >> that's really hard. >> Y All right. Well, thank you for getting all this together, Mary. >> Not a problem. Thank you. >> And then on page 16, article 12 is the
zoning amendment for lobster sales. Discuss that this evening. Article 13 is the zoning amendment for the boat storage. So, we may have a recommended change for next meeting there. Article 14 is the adoption of the local
comprehensive plan. And um Judy and I is Judy's Judy's back there. >> She's here. >> We were just talking a little bit about um it sort of came up um I guess new this evening that it looks like we're going to need between 50 and $100,000
for the MacArthur study. And um I mean I'm certain we could find some funds to transfer them. The question is whether we want to put an article on to try to fund that up so we have adequate money to you know take a strong look. I was
hoping we would get out of it without the design development piece but it looks like >> some work needs to be done on that. Yeah. You might be able to negotiate that number down. >> But I I'm I would agree, Madam Chair. think we should have some money set aside so that the the committee can fulfill its obligations and provide a
report. Um I do think the same question is going to pop up. Let's let's assume for the sake of discussion the town's people want to go forward with the proposed new facility and uh uh there's some concerns about the MacArthur school. Um I would suspect the board's
going to want to at least encourage some consideration of the MacArthur school on the topic of a new school. >> Yeah. >> Because that's coming up. Mhm. >> Um, and hopefully that can yield some information that might be useful for that as well. So, um, I I think we can
leave it up to the administrator and our team to sort of iron out the details, but I do think there's some be some value in having an article. So, I would I would recommend that we add an article. >> Put a placeholder. I mean, we haven't closed the warrant yet, right? >> No, that would be the 21st of October. >> Yeah, >> we can always pull it if we if we have
to, but I think it's we should >> Okay. Yeah. Yeah. So, and that's the other thing that I'd like to consider is maybe moving some of these articles around. Um, >> sure. >> I think there'll be a ton of people leaving after the school feasibility study and then I think there'll be
another exodus after the lobster article. So, if there's a way we can keep them both to the end, >> we'll put our claws in them. >> You know, as much as as much as the school officials and the school committee may not like it, I think, like I said, I think our challenge is going
to be keeping keeping >> people keeping people up at at town meeting. So my pitch would be that we >> move up the LCP and move, >> you know, let's let's give that put that
up closer and then put the lobster one at the end and maybe move the school feasibility stuff study up. I' I'd like to keep >> maybe put the school feasibility study then do the zoning. >> Yeah.
swap and then swap the LCP in earlier. >> Exactly. I think that would make better sense. >> Plastics is going to be big. >> Maybe if you put that Yeah. towards the end >> the plastics >> everybody will be gone. >> No, I I I think plastics is fine. I
don't town meeting time is fine. Golf capital expense fine. Um I think in the past what we've done is we've done the town's business upfront. So, and but I I do think the zoning I would
recommend that keep the lobsters to the end. Leave the best for last. >> And if they bring for live lobsters, we have a if we have a lobster bake, >> you need an example >> then. Right. >> At least get chowder. >> I think we should have
>> lobster bis. lobster bisque should be served at town meeting >> and then I would encourage the LCP to come up earlier so people can have at it. >> People won't be exhausted because the reality is is folks by the time we get to 14 people are going to be like
>> right and I I do think in the >> go pretty fast. Yeah, I I think in fairness to the planning board and the staff and all the people that have worked their tails off on it for so long, I would recommend moving that up, dealing with it early. Let's get let's
get this let's get the discussion up early. So, I don't have a specific spot to recommend, but I wouldn't stick it to the end. I don't think that's fair to them, quite frankly. You >> put it right in where the the elementary school is. It's like article five.
That'd come real quick. Yeah, there you go. >> Whatever Mark wants. >> All right. Well, I want B. I want bisque. Am I going to get that? Am I going to the bisque? You all in favor of bis? >> Robust bis. >> So moved. >> Robust.
>> Second. >> Robust bis. It is. >> Okay. >> All right. Vacancy. Are we done with town meeting warrant? You okay, Bob? >> All set. Thank you very much. >> All right. discussion on fill in the vacancy. Um, did we formally accept the
resignation yet? I think we have to do >> I think we do that in the next >> um maybe we should move that one up and accept it before we discuss. >> Oh, I think that would make sense. >> So moved. >> Okay. >> You don't mind just doing his?
>> Okay. I I move that we accept the uh uh resignation of Joe Glenn from the Yarmouth Housing Authority Board of Commissioners and from the Dennis Yarmouth Regional School District uh school committee. Um as indicated in his
letter of September 29th and we we give him thanks for his service. >> Seconded with reluctance. >> Any discussion? >> Okay. Well, >> all those in favor? I >> I thank you Joe. >> Yes, thank you to Joe. Um but what the
people at home should know is there are um very strict guidelines on appointments because these are both elected positions that he's resigned from. So um also in your packet you have the regional agreement that outlines how vacancies are um are done and if a
vacancy occurs on the committee such vacancies shall be filled within 30 days from the from the board of selectman of the member town in which the vacating office resided at the time of his election. The person so appointed shall be a resident of the town from which the
vacancy occurred and shall serve until the next annual town election at which time a successor shall be elected to serve the balance of the term. So um we have >> we have till October 30th then >> we have it from um yes no from today.
Today we accepted it. >> Yes. >> No we accepted it today. >> So it's from the >> from the date of acceptance. Right. >> So so we have 30 We have 30 days from today. >> No, >> we've had this happen a couple of times
in in my time. Um here and you know I there's different ways we can go about it. Um we can put out to the committee, we can appoint. It's totally up to us. So we need to talk about a process on how we want to do it, but we only have 30 days uh to make the appointment.
Would we ever want to put out some kind of um notice asking for indications of interest for people? >> Yes. Yeah, I think so. But then we we can do that, but then we as a board need to come up with a a way of whittling that down and how what what criteria are
we going to use to see who the top three that we interview potentially would be? So, >> appearance in a dolphin sweatshirt. I think that's how we should judge it. >> Okay. Um last time I I actually was appointed I
don't think I served even as one uh for one meeting but um a select board member. It says you it's it's a different idea. >> I'm sorry. >> That's a great idea. >> Yes. >> It's only till the next election.
>> It's just we need something short term so the board can discuss how they want to do it. But I think we need to discuss it. Mhm. >> So, does that go on the agenda items? >> It is on the We're discussing it now. >> Oh, okay. >> Are you looking for volunteers? >> Oh, no. I'm looking for what the boards
>> I think actually the idea of um having a select board member do it makes sense because they're an elected official. At least you've got, you know, even on a temporary basis, it's still somebody that's been selected by the um >> by the town. I see.
>> So, are you a candidate? it. Oh. >> Um, >> I'd be okay with it. >> You You'd be okay serving? >> Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm interested now, too, because >> Okay. So, one option, I guess it to address the chair's question about process, one option would be to consider
a select board member to do it. Now, what we could do is solicit, but then based on >> we can wait and see >> and see what comes in the door, >> right? And I think um if there's an issue or a problem, it's good to know that we do have some select board members that are willing to step up
>> and help out. Um I'm always a big believer in soliciting community interest and stuff like this, keeping Joyce busy with uh with her appointments, activities. >> I wouldn't say that this was an appointment for Joyce, though. I mean, this is a full >> This is above my pay grade.
>> No, but the point is is no. No, the main main point is is soliciting people to serve on committees. >> Yeah. >> I mean, obviously we make we'll make the appointment. The question is we're looking for three qualified candidates, right, >> to consider. >> Yeah. To consider >> consider. I think we and and but the
question is um you know, >> we can do it several ways. I mean, potentially we don't get three. That would be I guess the >> No. So, what we're going to have to do though is >> we'll have to each come up with our top three and we'll see and then we'll average those amongst ourselves.
>> We'll have to figure Yeah, we'll have >> give me your top three each of you and we can just and see who comes to the top from that. We'll do an interview process. We'll have to set a date aside between now and 30 days. >> Um, so >> and see if there's somebody that's
>> So, would there have to be criteria? I mean, like, >> I think that it I don't I don't think we're gonna have uh the opportunity to put together a um >> I don't think we are we a full-blown thing. I think I think we we solicit, we
advertise, we ask um Lori to put it out. We each uh get all of the applicants given to us and you can each give me the top three and I'll average the top whoever comes. I'm sure there'll be some similarities, but if not, we'll we'll
just say your top three, this one gets this points, and then we'll take the top three out of the five of our, right? >> And we'll interview them. >> Okay. >> So, and looking ahead at our upcoming meetings. >> We may need to set schedule a separate meeting, >> special meeting, >> right? >> The 23rd would be too early.
>> No, but I just don't think we're going to have time within a regular meeting to give >> Oh, if we're going to you're going to have to have a special meeting for this, I think. I think so. Yeah. I think we'll have to come up with something. Let's see what we get. Maybe we get one good one and that's it. And
we don't have much of a decision to make. Or maybe we get five. But let's put it out there and at our next meeting we will discuss a a date. And um I think we need to close the um I think we need to put it out now for the next
what do we say 10 days? >> Mhm. Is 10 days a sufficient enough time, you think, Mark? >> I'm looking at the calendar right now. Um, if it's a 30-day notice, then we have until November 7th >> to make a decision. The board meets on November 4th. I'd like to think that we
could take this up on November 4th as a board. And so perhaps what we do is we get applications. >> Day though, are we meeting on the 4th? >> Are we meeting on the fourth? It's election >> election day for the town of Barnstable. >> I don't know. I have my calendar is election day. Yeah, it's a election day
for cities in Massachusetts. >> Okay. >> We could we could see if Michelle Woo would be interested in doing the schoolboard thing if she doesn't. >> No, I'm all set with that. >> My recommendation is you probably want to get all your applications in by the 28th or the 29th so that they can be
collected, pulled together, and then distributed to the board by the end of the week. Excuse me. >> Right. Don't you think? >> Yeah. No, that sounds like a good time frame. And then I don't think that gives us enough time >> in by the 28th. >> So you're saying interview on the 4th? >> Yeah.
>> And make a decision on the 4th. >> That's what he was saying. >> That's what I just want to make sure. >> I think we're not sure that we'll have multiple candidates. >> Yeah. I'm not sure. I mean, >> right. If we can play it, but you do >> and and and and I'm comfortable with the chair setting the ag I mean you're
setting the agenda and you set the agenda typically what uh on the Thursday >> it would be on uh >> Thursday the 30th. >> Yep. >> Right. So if all the applications come in on the 28th and again I'm comfortable with you perusing them to see
>> that's the problem though. We got to we got to give you all time to peruse them and give me your top three to see if they're even available on that short notice. So, you're going to say on we're going to get them on Thursday on Friday. >> We'll get them on Tuesday the 28th. >> Okay.
>> Or get them on Monday the 27th >> and you and they're going to be available on the 4th for an interview. >> Okay. Well, we can try it. I think that >> yeah I think even in the advertisement you could make it that the board will be anticipates making a decision on the fourth and the candidates
>> that uh you know are interested should be at least notified that the fourth will be a date of interviews. >> Yeah. So that they already know that going >> know ahead of time. >> Yeah. They go know >> and I'm happy to madam chair if if we want to invite others in the audience that might have some thoughts on this.
I'm I'm willing to entertain them, but I think that's a pretty ambitious schedule and we're going to need the support from the school committee, right? Is that what you're suggesting in terms of soliciting applications? >> Is that what you suggest? >> That seems like a good group to ask, but I I assume we would circulate with um
who social media, >> who would be doing the work and providing the notice? Who would be doing the work? >> It's our appointment. >> No, I understand. >> We need to advertise it. >> So, who on our staff then would be doing that? >> We We'll do it. >> Do it. >> Yeah. Yeah, we'll do it. >> Well, I heard someone mention Lori as a name. I
>> Lorie Sullivan. >> We'll have the the communications person help. Put it on the website, put it on their social. >> As long as I know who that is. I mean, I'm just >> talking about our media, our communications team trying to get the information out there. >> Typically, not the thing that a
communications person does, but if that's >> going to need to because we're we need to make an appointment within 30 days. >> And should we ask the superintendent if he has any comments? Sure. >> Been sitting here all evening. He just likes to listen to us. It's fun.
>> Mark Smith, superintendent. >> Um Dennis Yarm with Regional School District. Um yes. So again, as has already been stated, it is your appointment by the regional agreement. So our role uh really and and you're appointing my governance board really.
So my my role is just to support the process as the superintendent and the committee wants to just you know they're obviously looking for their next partner in in providing governance. Um so from my role I just want to be able to
support. So once the the town be uh gets uh the messaging we we have access obviously to folks that you might not have direct access to. So we'd be happy to put it out on our direct messaging to all of our parents. and we and put it
out on our social media just to get the word out as wide and far as possible. Be happy to, you know, augment your your communication channels with ours. >> And last time we did this, it was somebody that would have interest in serving and running um you know, it takes everybody should know it it takes
some time to understand the process and um from you know November to May, April, May um yes you you'll be there. we need, you know, we need our town represented, but at the same time it's it's a lot of
undertaking. So hopefully it was some it will be somebody who will consider and that's what happened the last time we ended up appointing somebody who who was planning on running. Um, >> you know, for some continuity, so to speak. Mhm. >> We have two sitting members, one from
both towns who their original sort of foray into the school committee was through this type of an appointment and then reran and now are, you know, long-standing members and are great contributors to the school district. So,
I agree. This is a great way for somebody who's looking to, you know, get started and and learn and and then become a, you know, an elected member of the group. >> Yeah. I just have one question that I just need to ask. Is there is there obviously all the business of the school committee is important, but is there any
pressing issue that would require us to take that into consideration as we're deliberating on this? Do you have a meeting coming up where >> how's your budget vote? >> The I mean the budget process will start in the the school committee's
um deeper involvement in the in the budget process starts uh in January. >> January. So the the >> to Mark's point, is there anything before that that's critical? >> Nothing super pressing that we have on the burn, some policy changes that are coming. Um >> there's just there's always a
sensitivity in Yarmouth that you know we we if there's a critical vote on important school business that we not let that >> fall by the wayside. >> Yeah. I mean what you know what's been discussed tonight obviously the the me small feasibility is our next sort of
big thing that's coming up but at this point it's regular school business again school committee's got some policies coming up regarding >> graduation requirements that stuff coming down from the state that we need to adopt some things regarding the CTE
um there's some state changes that largely affect the technical schools but middle schools have a piece in it so we have to adopt some policy changes but Again, nothing like super critical or heavy. Um, and then the the big thing will the school committee will get involved in the the the budget
development hot and heavy starting in January. >> All right. >> Okay. That's helpful. Thank you. >> So, any any student at DY who's 18, a resident of Yarmouth, and has registered to vote could run. Maybe we should check with the math department, see who'd be
good for budgets. >> There you go. Okay. Thank you. All right. So, we'll get that out as fast as possible and >> thank you for sharing that information. It'll be helpful and I'm sure we'll get some >> great people.
>> And then on the housing authority that's going to be taken up at a different >> I don't think that there is a um I'm sure that there is a process. I'm not I just don't think it's as critical as our it's very um specific the regional agreement that we have 30 days. I don't
know if there's votes or things that are >> I just need to research that a tiny bit more. >> Okay. >> Yeah. Mary, do you happen I mean I hate to just plug Mary. Mary's hanging out for them. Might as well ask her. She's the town. >> I don't believe there's a time frame on it. However, I do believe it is a a vote
of a of the joint committees. The both the select board and the housing authority I think have to do the vote at a joint meeting. That is my that is my recollection. I will have to double check that as well, but I believe that's typically how those positions get
filled. It's a joint meeting and it is and it is a joint vote of both boards and I don't know I don't recall whether it is >> How many vacancies are on that right now? >> I'd have to double check. I there's definitely more than one. >> I know. >> I think there's a ten I think the tenant
vacancy is still out there and then Joe's vacancy as well. >> There's a And I don't know whether they ever got an appointment for their state appointee because I know that state appointee was a vacancy was a hold over for a while as well. >> That's in the process of being nailed
down. >> So we can check into all of that. But um like I said I I don't remember whether it's a cumulative vote of in total of both boards together or whether it's a it has to be a unanimous vote of both boards, but I can certainly look into that this week for you. >> Yeah, we're going to have to have that
back on the agenda. can also bring up Forest Road too want to serve there, >> right? Why not? Right. >> Not now. >> Why not? >> All right. >> They don't even have any people. >> Board and committee.
>> Okay. On the on the quieter end of personnel replacement, um we have uh um two appointments. Um one is Steven Garner. I nominate him for a full appointment for three years to the
energy committee and that's for a term that would end in uh September um 2028. >> So second all those in favor >> I >> Okay. And then the second one is Mary
Johnson. I nominate her for um an alternate position on the recreation commission and that's an appointment to serve through um July 26. >> Second. >> All in favor? >> I
>> I >> Well, my job was easy this week. >> Great. >> Good. >> You don't want to talk about the policy again? Don't you miss that? Should we should just for old time sake a different one?
>> All right. Next, I move that we accept the minutes for the January 7th, 2025 meeting. >> Second. >> Any discussion on the minutes myths? >> No. All those in favor? >> I. Any opposed? Those pass. Um upcoming coming agenda review. We just added
November 4th to do interviews and uh appointment. panel rules. >> Yep. Well, that's going to be in our um Where is the What was the date that you said we were going to do the pre-town meeting? >> November 4. So, we want to put a
pre-Town meeting >> town meeting preview and the review the dog bylaw >> detail >> and um interview and appoint >> DY. It's a busy one. >> It's going to be a busy schedule. We and
we already put the uh the regional dispatch was on for tonight and we had to move it. We're not going to be able to get to all of it. So I don't know maybe they won't be Were they ready Bob for >> I think they'll be ready for November
4th. They they really appreciated the additional time quite frankly. >> I mean do is it something that we maybe can do December 2nd? Yeah, it absolutely we were keeping the pressure on because the select board requested an update. >> We definitely want them back. I'm just
now that we've we have to do >> December two would be perfect for him. >> And which is that that we're moving >> the um regional dispatch update because we've got a couple irons in the fire meetings we're setting up. So probably going out to December give us more to update on
>> recognments. >> All right. Yep. Anybody? I think we're full up for the next couple of weeks. So, we'll revisit it at our next meeting and see what we got going forward from there because Okay, perfect.
All right. Any individual items? >> I just wanted to um the letter from Conscom. >> Yeah. >> Uh what are we doing with that >> letter that is in our >> regarding the drought? Yes. I think we agreed at a prior meeting that we were
going to take up water conservation and uh enforcement and education um after town meeting. >> So that should be on >> that's that's a future agenda item. >> Yeah, >> we agreed to that at the last meeting. >> We can try the 12th too. >> Okay. Um where is it down there?
>> What? December 12th. >> I don't see it down the bottom. Is it down the bottom? >> It's not on here yet. Yeah, I think we >> have handwritten on >> I think we need to do um drought regulations 122 >> on in on December 2nd
>> 122. Yep. >> Drought regulations. Okay. Um and then the and this is again I I'm I don't know how these are handled. The
Oliver's noise is that a departmental violation of noise ordinance? I should not >> we can't talk we shouldn't be talking about that. >> Um Bob will work it out and if it's um if it's found to be a we it has to be
found to be a violation before we discuss it. So we can't we can't we shouldn't even say that in public because >> um >> it's we don't know what that's at yet. >> Bob, you're looking into that. >> Yes, that is correct. We do have a
complaint regarding noise and we're evaluating it right now. >> So, just looking back on some of the um plans for the future in terms of discussing a cap on free cash, is that something that >> cap? >> A cap?
>> I don't know what you mean by cap. >> So, um cap on free cash usage. There's only so much you can take out of free cash. It was something that was discussed last year. You can't you have to you have to take it, >> right? But there's a limit to how much you can take
>> is what this was recommended. >> There isn't there isn't. What it is is it's it's a percentage of the overall budget that gets put into free cash that's capped. Once you have the free cash certified, you don't you don't have you don't cap that.
>> Okay? This this was from the um CBC and they recommended um discussing a cap on free cash usage to ensure fiscal sustainability. >> Yeah. Well, >> free cash should not be used for recurring expenses. >> No, that's true. And that never has been. That's
already >> I don't support that being an agenda item. >> No, I just wonder but it is a policy. We have financial policies that that govern the free cash and and that there was a slightly different issue that that they were taken up that
>> um you know the I the idea is to we've been working to create a capital stabilization fund and we appropriated a million dollars toward >> and and so you know we're moving in that direction but you can't adopt some rash policy. I think the overall concern is maybe in the future we might not have
enough free cash to do um as many capital improvements, >> but um you know it's it's kind of it's addressed in the town's financial policies. There's nothing that you could vote on it now that would be helpful. >> Gotcha. And and they so what I'm trying
to find out if the policy has changed based on these recommendations. So raising the minimum capital request threshold from 10 grand to 25 grand. Did that >> we we haven't changed the policies are adopted by the board of selectment. >> Okay. So
>> we have not voted on any changes regarding our financial policy. >> Should we talk about it? >> Our financial I would recommend that if you haven't reviewed our financial policies, I would recommend that you look at them. >> No, but the capital >> these are changes that some have been recommended. >> Yeah. last year at the end of the
capital budget um at the they made a presentation and right >> and there was a there was a point in time at the end that they did discuss the fact that the threshold was kind of >> um >> low I believe for for it to be
considered capital and not just a routine expense of the budget >> right >> so >> better reflecting inflation >> yeah but that's a budget policy that's not that's not a financial policy >> I'm I'm trying to get educated, Mark. >> Okay. >> Well, well, what happens is there's a
certain dollar amount that it goes to capital where they request. So, I think that what that's something that Bob needs to kind of figure out how how, you know, if you look at our budget over the past many years, you know, we our our wages
increase by contractual um limits, but but most of the time the expense account does not increase at all. I mean, they don't get an increase. and and so if they need something, the only opportunity for them is to try to get it through a capital um
>> so just so that I understand Liz, what you're what you're asking, was this a set of recommendations from >> CBC? >> The what? The capital budget committee. >> Yes. >> Okay. We have so many committees I can't keep track. >> Well, I don't blame you. That's why I'm asking because I'm CBC. I just don't
know what CBC means. So, it's the capital budget committee. What I would recommend is that we all become reacquainted with whatever those recommendations were. And when we take up the capital budget, >> it's going to be coming in there. The um time frame for the submission of the
capital budget to the select board is November 28. So in December, we'll have them in. And I don't think that it's wise to jump into any financial policy changes in, you know, the intervening time. I mean, I I I think that they were
just concerns that they were raising. We might run out of free cash. Um, some of the capitals are small. I I I don't think right now is the right time to make any of these big financial changes. >> Okay. I'll put I'll put this aside until they come in and then I can raise these questions. Does that make sense?
>> Sort of. Okay. I mean, a little part of it is the look, if I was on the capital budget committee, I' I'd tell you, you know, you guys need to go for an override and and you need to set aside a recurring um we used to have a amount of
money that you're going to use to fund all these capital improvements into the future because you're, you know, you're going to run out of free cash. But, you know, then if I was on the select board, I'd say, well, just hold on a second. Um, >> no. We used to have we used to have a
1.5 million in the >> every year. >> Well, we we have a a 1.5 million >> is um you know, there's the money that we have that goes to the roadway maintenance, you know. So, >> yeah. No, but we had it for capital and
roadway. We had it at one point in time built into our budget, >> right? But you don't have it now. >> No, I know. And if you were to put it in now, you'd you'd either have to cut other budgets or go for an >> override. >> And and so the idea and and it's also,
you know, we have had in recent years a little bit more free cash than the town had previously, right? So the idea that you say, well, well, we're not going to use free cash for capital improvements anymore. You know, it's just it's it's not wise to do
financially. Um but it's certainly advisable to look at the issue of how much free cash is going there and and you know our long-term financial planning is going to have to take that into account. But like a knee-jerk reaction, we're going to set these
artificial policies that make it so that we don't have any money for capital items um or that we're preventing departments from requesting capital items because we're certainly not going to put it in their budget. But a lot of their other recommendations which I you know you should have started with because the first thing they were saying
well well we need to take well you know half the stuff that's people have requested for capital and and I love the capital budget committee I mean they're great they're doing a great job but like I I said well you people need to put this stuff in your operating budget >> you know what I mean right but but we're
up against two and a half so there's no money in the operating budget that so it's it's a it's a balance >> okay >> so I I say Right now, what we focus on, look at the requests, see how much money we have, see what we're recommending. If there's if there's a change you want to
make, make it based on that, not just a general thing that >> policy >> because there's like a double-edged sword. Every action you take has an equal has a ripple. It has a ripple effect. >> Different, right? >> Every year's different. >> If we wanted to change budget policy, we
had it on the agenda at 7:40. >> But she did bring it up at that point in time. >> Oh, at 7:40. >> She did and she said she was going to bring it up later. I didn't think it was appropriate then, so I waited till individual items. >> No, no, it's a it's a budget policy issue. >> So, um, one last one is the Hero Act, is is that being reviewed because that last
year we passed it and we said we'd look at it again this year, so it's going to be coming up and we should consider that one. >> Yeah, that's a good one because we did talk about phasing it in overtime. >> See, I do. >> But that but that'll be for annual, not for
>> Exactly. But it but it's if they're looking at >> the budget, it's going to be next. >> Perfect. >> Any other individual items? >> No. >> Yes. I had a simple request. Um, I was asked um um how to find out when the
select board was meeting and it occurred to me that actually a couple years ago when I wasn't here, when I was up there, I used to wonder about that and I would get in touch with Mary Ellis and ask her and she'd always say it's in the packet but you know it's a chart and and it it looks like
>> the topics on the town. >> What people need is just like simple calendar. if we could put that somewhere on the town website. >> There is a calendar agenda calendar and the meetings are on there and I've I see that every week now they're doing the
list of meetings. >> They're trying to get that calendar higher because it's way it's been way down. You end up scrolling and eventually you just give up. But part of the plan down the hall there is to get it higher so it's >> more relevant. I guess I think the
select board meetings I mean I know we have like the the month calendars that show the different things and it's a list of upcoming is helpful but I think it would be a big help if if we um had just a list of of course it could change because you know like November 4th but
um I think it would be a big help to people because it not agenda items or anything just the dates because we're >> talking about the website >> huh >> the website >> on our on the town website yeah >> I think they're doing a redo I mean we may want to get an update soon. Maybe that's a future agenda. >> Oh, so maybe they're already doing that.
>> They're working on a redo of the website, aren't they, Bob? >> Yes, they are. >> Yes, they are. >> So, >> just that. >> Did you mention that to them as one of the suggestions? >> Because they were soliciting suggestions. >> I'll take that. We'll see if we can get I'll check on the calendar and and I'd
see how far out she's going. I think there's no reason why we can't put on the calendar as far as we've planned. Like, we have the meetings planned through December 30. Right now we know when they're going to be. So we'll put them on the calendar and then when we update the website we'll do even better. >> Yeah. With a separate little I mean
>> because people people want to hear us possibly it's mysterious to be but >> no there are other in other towns for example the select board meetings and their agendas are posted in the local newspaper. So if you are for example a resident of Chadam
>> Uhhuh. >> when you get the chronicle >> I get the chronicle. I love Yeah, it's a great newspaper. >> When you get the chronicle on Wednesday or Thursday, >> um what it has is the agenda for next week's select board meeting. >> Nice. >> So that you're and it's right there. It's very >> You're never going to get that published
on a Wednesday or Thursday because >> we can Well, the registers are pushing it on Friday. >> Well, and the Falmouth Enterprise does it as well. So Falmouth, they will have the following week's >> select board agenda. So that it's in it's in broad
>> broad broad public awareness. >> All right. Uh Dorcas, do you have any items? I do not. >> Mark? >> No. >> All right. Consent agenda. Consent agenda. We have the Division of Natural Resources amendment to the shellfish regulations
and donations for parks and wreck for the Parker River Landing. Oh, boardwalk planks. Yeah, that's really long. I don't know how people like that. >> M. Yeah, I think we should come up with a new name. >> That's a lot of money.
>> I'll do a survey on Facebook under my alias. >> I move the consent agenda. >> Second. >> All those in favor? >> I. >> Okay, Bob, take it away. >> Okay, just a few items I want to make sure you're aware of. Um, and I thank Mark for his efforts on the affordable
housing trust. We had um a meeting today with the proposed developers of the proposed chapter 40B comprehensive permit that's out on 897. the subject of your letter and um you know just I I I'm I'm glad we sent a real strong letter to them and we told them that they were
going to get another strong letter. We kind of hit them over the head and um suffice to say we have an additional meeting that is scheduled for I think it's October 16 is it? And um you know we've asked them quite frankly to
redesign their project and come back to us and and that that you know we pointed out all the problems. So, um, we may have some options. We're trying to investigate and create options for improving that and we're everyone's got their sleeves rolled up and um, you
know, the housing people, planning people and so we're working on that and we'll have more updates for you. >> The onus is on them, if I could just add, Bob, um, the onus is on them to come up with a better plan and um, that's what we're going to hold them to.
And I didn't use any four-letter words in the uh the meeting. No, >> Mark did a great job. We were very strong. We sort of double teamed them and and they got they got the message. We'll see how much it it sinks in, but we're we're working on that. I mean, there's a lot of active work going going
into that. And I and I just want to say on that, having the vision that's created through the comprehensive plan, >> it's very very helpful. I mean, without that vision, it's hard to to talk turkey with folks, but but there clearly we
have a um it's a Cape Cod mixeduse village style development that that we we're pushing. Um another item I I wanted to mention that I I know you've got we've got the Madakis um utilization
committee coming in November 4. Uh we received some great news that when we get to the implementation phase where um it's out of the committee and we're ready to start a project. We were successful in receiving a $225,000
implementation grant >> from the Commonwealth of Mass. And and that's something that >> Where's that from? >> It's from um through Mass Development, the Commonwealth of Massachusetts. >> And um I really need to hand it to Bill Scott put that application in. We sort of planned it before he left and um so
thank you Bill for that and that'll help us. There's a lot of things that we're going to need to do to try to it looks like there's a lot of public private type partnerships that are going to be associated with the MAD. So um I I think that it would be great to to talk to the committee about a time frame for having
the you know their process wrapped up so we could kind of move into the next phase >> of possible implementation. And I think they may be ready to start talking about that when they come in. And I just want to let you know we had a great department head meeting um last
week went over in detail select board goals and and those you know always always are like fabulous with the departments and and everyone is really rallying around the goals and we also welcomed Megan
Eldrich. it was her first department head meeting. So, it's really great to have her on board. Um, last week also, David Aronson, he was with us this evening, started at the library. Um, and in a couple of weeks, few weeks, we've got Amy coming on board. So, things are really shaping up on the staff end of
things. And um finally I wanted to to mention too is that you know we discussed the plastics reduction and um obviously the repeal of the formal petition is just a small piece of that process and we had a a great meeting
today and planned some very detailed public outreach. Now that the board of health has adopted those regulations, um we're going to be doing videos. We're going to be doing um press releases and and I I honestly think that it's a a
cause for celebration to be able to have put together um a communitywide strategy with all of the such diverse stakeholders and the business interests and environmental interests and um also set the tone had some good leadership
for Cape Cod with a similar set of recommendations that are being used in other communities. I think we have Cape Cod really on the um get rid of plastic and food service sort of train at this point and there's a lot to be proud of for our town in that. So we're going to
try to get that word out. So by the time we get to town meeting people know exactly why we're there, what we're going to achieve. Um it it's really a sort of a rallying point. So everyone's working on that. And those are just couple of key issues I wanted to make sure you folks were up on. Another thing
I I wanted to add to, I just got this in late, that um Representative Diggs has proposed a bill that would jumpstart the process for having uh the communities on the Cape that were left out designated as seasonal communities under the
housing um act. And there's a public hearing next Wednesday, the 15th, that's available on Zoom. I just got the notice in. I'll send that out if anyone's interested in making any testimony. I don't think you have to go all the way up to Boston because, you know, they're
having a hybrid public hearing on it, but I wanted to make you aware of that. Um, >> who's holding public hearing? >> It is the committee that it so it's um >> legislative committee that that is holding a public hearing on it. They
have there's a list of hearings that they're having on next Wednesday. >> And that's next Wednesday. Okay. >> And I I've got the notice. I've got the time. I've got everything. I can I can send that. >> Can you forward that to folks? Let us all know. Then we can make a decision as
to whether or not we can chime in. >> Actually, these Zoom hearings are they work. Um I've watched several legislative hearings in which uh people have been given the opportunity to zoom in from distances far and wide and u
they've been very informative. >> That's how we got the changes to the um historic committee. >> Anything else, Bob? >> No, that's all I have. >> Motion to adjurnn. So move second. Second in >> favor. Thank you.